Guest guest Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 Hello Martha and All, Though I haven't written in for a while, I have enjoyed and benefited from all of the posted information. Thank you for the time and energy you all invest in this group. I have a situation that perhaps you can shed light on: Thank you, Hakim. Baby has been eating solid foods for over a year, but Mom continued to nurse her for optimal health physically, mentally and emotionally. What Mom needs to find out is: what happens to Mom when She stops nursing Baby, i.e. How that can affect hormones. How that affects menstruation. Mom's body feels almost like being pregnant again, in that She gets hot/cold/hot/cold nauseaus, tired, hard to sleep, not hungry (except She is ALWAYS very hungry in the morning!) deeply emotional as if deeply stored and untended to emotions are coming to the surface. Depressed and sad. Baby seems to be doing really well, it is Mom who is having the hard time. Best Wishes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 I also have a question in this regard. My baby is now 11 months old, when she gets to be one year old, I would like to start weaning her off the breast since I am very tired all the time and would like to lose the excess weight gain. Any suggestions on how to transition her without too much trauma? What about at night. If I want to stop nursing at night so I can sleep (for a change!), what can I use instead of the breast at night, or should I give her nothing at night and let her cry it out until she learns she won't get it at night? Please let me know, I'm in a critical point with Syamali now, as I need to get my sleep! Thanks Martha. With lots of love Krishna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 Hi Hakim, and Krishna Always to great to hear from you. I don't know much science about hormones, will defer to Vicky or Adrienne perhaps there. But your skill, Hakim, with the ayurvedic pulse and herbs will serve her well, I personally would'nt concern much beyond that on the assessments. And to know that rejuvenative therapies are indicated for mothers here. Gradual is my usual advice, though I know of one mom who put a strong tasting essential oil on teh nipple and it created a natural aversion /diversion to other things. If more quick weaning is needed, upping apropriate foods for Baby including bedtime nutritious drink/snack such as tahini milk, or dairy with nut butter, cardamom, ghee, and dark natural sugar should help. and taking strong turmeric or sage (more vata increasing) teas 1 - 3 cups a day will dry the milk up, I understand. Re Krishna's question, it is slightly different, but we need to focus on both mom and what Symali is eating in way of solids, and how to give satisfactory healthy substitutes to help go thru the night (protein/fat rich in addition to carbs). I would not be dramatic about it, and am assuming your fatigue is in spite of using the Shatavari preparation Rasa sells? Ashwaghanda, shatavari, some bitters even kutki a bit would be my call in your herbals, in addition to other meda dhatu reducing herbs like chitrak while the weather is still cool. Perhaps adding kutki to your formula in some strength for a few days will deter her interest some? > what happens to Mom when She stops nursing Baby, This is an excellent time to do some panchakarma, highly recommended now by ayurveda, even a home pk routine (I understand Saraswati did not teach one apropriate, we c an talk about this) followed by rejuvenative tonic herbs. > > How that affects menstruation. I reccommend the Billings Ovulation method of Natural FAmily planning to know before first bleed when it is coming, and safe sex days. Hakim, your client could be pregnant without experiencing a menses, I assume you all know. She has been so lulcky as not to have menstruated alal this time? The heaviness and quality of flow will have more to do with her doshic impurities, specif heavy red flow high pitta. I have not heard of any other correlates tho there may be some ..... anyone know? Billings method will also offer info. for about $15 you can purchase a video/charting booklet and explanation on the lactation rules for knowing/safe intercourse days etc. The charting is very handy to use for a few months to get to know one's changing cycles and natural patterns. > > Mom's body feels almost like being pregnant again, in that She gets > hot/cold/hot/cold nauseaus, tired, hard to sleep, not hungry (except She is > ALWAYS very hungry in the morning!) deeply emotional as if deeply > stored and untended to emotions are coming to the surface. I'd be using tonic/rejuv herbs like shatavari and some bitters even before some PK (panchakarma, for those who don't know), though with spring coming this is soon good time for that. AFter first doublechecking with pregnancy kit?! And the essential oils will serve so well right now! Sounds like she is quite depleeted if not or if pregnant? Your training as to pulse, other ayurvedic assessments is more than mine on some of these questions - but my call is to look to the whole terrain for influences from candida, ama, agni, pets/parasites, food combining, exercise/prana, fats intake/quality, water, home/relationship, et al. > > Depressed and sad. Undoubtedly depleted hormonally and ojas and will respond well to such appropriate herbs. She will have much vata? What was her postpartum initial weeks like? Ashwaghanda also, , and I'd be inclined to call on shatavari, maybe W. Yam, Gotu Kola, amalaki, carminative to handle the roots, plus some bitters. > > Baby seems to be doing really well, Yea! it is Mom who is having the hard > time. SOOOO common a scenario, particularly with commited long term breastfeeding moms, and much worse with vegan moms. Keep us posted on her progress and what you are doing? I'm sure all would be interested. Blessings; Martha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 I don't know much about the hormonal effects of weaning but I know it is common for moms to feel a bit sad and depressed about it understandably. Lord, I hope they don't start prescribing antidepressants for this too. I have attached the handout I usually give moms who want to know how to go about drying up the breastmilk. It is not my most favorite handout to give to anyone:) Vicky ---- Martha Oakes 02/25/05 11:21:21 ayurveda Re: Weaning Baby Hi Hakim, and Krishna Always to great to hear from you. I don't know much science about hormones, will defer to Vicky or Adrienne perhaps there. But your skill, Hakim, with the ayurvedic pulse and herbs will serve her well, I personally would'nt concern much beyond that on the assessments. And to know that rejuvenative therapies are indicated for mothers here. Gradual is my usual advice, though I know of one mom who put a strong tasting essential oil on teh nipple and it created a natural aversion /diversion to other things. If more quick weaning is needed, upping apropriate foods for Baby including bedtime nutritious drink/snack such as tahini milk, or dairy with nut butter, cardamom, ghee, and dark natural sugar should help. and taking strong turmeric or sage (more vata increasing) teas 1 - 3 cups a day will dry the milk up, I understand. Re Krishna's question, it is slightly different, but we need to focus on both mom and what Symali is eating in way of solids, and how to give satisfactory healthy substitutes to help go thru the night (protein/fat rich in addition to carbs). I would not be dramatic about it, and am assuming your fatigue is in spite of using the Shatavari preparation Rasa sells? Ashwaghanda, shatavari, some bitters even kutki a bit would be my call in your herbals, in addition to other meda dhatu reducing herbs like chitrak while the weather is still cool. Perhaps adding kutki to your formula in some strength for a few days will deter her interest some? > what happens to Mom when She stops nursing Baby, This is an excellent time to do some panchakarma, highly recommended now by ayurveda, even a home pk routine (I understand Saraswati did not teach one apropriate, we c an talk about this) followed by rejuvenative tonic herbs. > > How that affects menstruation. I reccommend the Billings Ovulation method of Natural FAmily planning to know before first bleed when it is coming, and safe sex days. Hakim, your client could be pregnant without experiencing a menses, I assume you all know. She has been so lulcky as not to have menstruated alal this time? The heaviness and quality of flow will have more to do with her doshic impurities, specif heavy red flow high pitta. I have not heard of any other correlates tho there may be some ...... anyone know? Billings method will also offer info. for about $15 you can purchase a video/charting booklet and explanation on the lactation rules for knowing/safe intercourse days etc. The charting is very handy to use for a few months to get to know one's changing cycles and natural patterns. > > Mom's body feels almost like being pregnant again, in that She gets > hot/cold/hot/cold nauseaus, tired, hard to sleep, not hungry (except She is > ALWAYS very hungry in the morning!) deeply emotional as if deeply > stored and untended to emotions are coming to the surface. I'd be using tonic/rejuv herbs like shatavari and some bitters even before some PK (panchakarma, for those who don't know), though with spring coming this is soon good time for that. AFter first doublechecking with pregnancy kit?! And the essential oils will serve so well right now! Sounds like she is quite depleeted if not or if pregnant? Your training as to pulse, other ayurvedic assessments is more than mine on some of these questions - but my call is to look to the whole terrain for influences from candida, ama, agni, pets/parasites, food combining, exercise/prana, fats intake/quality, water, home/relationship, et al. > > Depressed and sad. Undoubtedly depleted hormonally and ojas and will respond well to such appropriate herbs. She will have much vata? What was her postpartum initial weeks like? Ashwaghanda also, , and I'd be inclined to call on shatavari, maybe W. Yam, Gotu Kola, amalaki, carminative to handle the roots, plus some bitters. > > Baby seems to be doing really well, Yea! it is Mom who is having the hard > time. SOOOO common a scenario, particularly with commited long term breastfeeding moms, and much worse with vegan moms. Keep us posted on her progress and what you are doing? I'm sure all would be interested. Blessings; Martha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 27, 2005 Report Share Posted February 27, 2005 in response to Krisna's question about what to offer instead at night, my son is 2 and a half, he started on sippy cups of water at about 6 months so this is what he takes to bed at nite. Since we weaned (almost a year ago) on most nites he takes a hot milk tonic sweetened with stevia and spiced with cinnamon, cardamom, ginger and ghee before bed, and sleeps thru the night. We use fresh raw unhomog. cow milk....this he absolutely loves! We brush teeth of course after the milky and then he just has a cup of water by the bed. This is how things work for us, hopefully the idea is helpful to you in this time of transition. Bless Rebecca Vicky York <vmyork wrote: I don't know much about the hormonal effects of weaning but I know it is common for moms to feel a bit sad and depressed about it understandably. Lord, I hope they don't start prescribing antidepressants for this too. I have attached the handout I usually give moms who want to know how to go about drying up the breastmilk. It is not my most favorite handout to give to anyone:) Vicky ---- Martha Oakes 02/25/05 11:21:21 ayurveda Re: Weaning Baby Hi Hakim, and Krishna Always to great to hear from you. I don't know much science about hormones, will defer to Vicky or Adrienne perhaps there. But your skill, Hakim, with the ayurvedic pulse and herbs will serve her well, I personally would'nt concern much beyond that on the assessments. And to know that rejuvenative therapies are indicated for mothers here. Gradual is my usual advice, though I know of one mom who put a strong tasting essential oil on teh nipple and it created a natural aversion /diversion to other things. If more quick weaning is needed, upping apropriate foods for Baby including bedtime nutritious drink/snack such as tahini milk, or dairy with nut butter, cardamom, ghee, and dark natural sugar should help. and taking strong turmeric or sage (more vata increasing) teas 1 - 3 cups a day will dry the milk up, I understand. Re Krishna's question, it is slightly different, but we need to focus on both mom and what Symali is eating in way of solids, and how to give satisfactory healthy substitutes to help go thru the night (protein/fat rich in addition to carbs). I would not be dramatic about it, and am assuming your fatigue is in spite of using the Shatavari preparation Rasa sells? Ashwaghanda, shatavari, some bitters even kutki a bit would be my call in your herbals, in addition to other meda dhatu reducing herbs like chitrak while the weather is still cool. Perhaps adding kutki to your formula in some strength for a few days will deter her interest some? > what happens to Mom when She stops nursing Baby, This is an excellent time to do some panchakarma, highly recommended now by ayurveda, even a home pk routine (I understand Saraswati did not teach one apropriate, we c an talk about this) followed by rejuvenative tonic herbs. > > How that affects menstruation. I reccommend the Billings Ovulation method of Natural FAmily planning to know before first bleed when it is coming, and safe sex days. Hakim, your client could be pregnant without experiencing a menses, I assume you all know. She has been so lulcky as not to have menstruated alal this time? The heaviness and quality of flow will have more to do with her doshic impurities, specif heavy red flow high pitta. I have not heard of any other correlates tho there may be some ...... anyone know? Billings method will also offer info. for about $15 you can purchase a video/charting booklet and explanation on the lactation rules for knowing/safe intercourse days etc. The charting is very handy to use for a few months to get to know one's changing cycles and natural patterns. > > Mom's body feels almost like being pregnant again, in that She gets > hot/cold/hot/cold nauseaus, tired, hard to sleep, not hungry (except She is > ALWAYS very hungry in the morning!) deeply emotional as if deeply > stored and untended to emotions are coming to the surface. I'd be using tonic/rejuv herbs like shatavari and some bitters even before some PK (panchakarma, for those who don't know), though with spring coming this is soon good time for that. AFter first doublechecking with pregnancy kit?! And the essential oils will serve so well right now! Sounds like she is quite depleeted if not or if pregnant? Your training as to pulse, other ayurvedic assessments is more than mine on some of these questions - but my call is to look to the whole terrain for influences from candida, ama, agni, pets/parasites, food combining, exercise/prana, fats intake/quality, water, home/relationship, et al. > > Depressed and sad. Undoubtedly depleted hormonally and ojas and will respond well to such appropriate herbs. She will have much vata? What was her postpartum initial weeks like? Ashwaghanda also, , and I'd be inclined to call on shatavari, maybe W. Yam, Gotu Kola, amalaki, carminative to handle the roots, plus some bitters. > > Baby seems to be doing really well, Yea! it is Mom who is having the hard > time. SOOOO common a scenario, particularly with commited long term breastfeeding moms, and much worse with vegan moms. Keep us posted on her progress and what you are doing? I'm sure all would be interested. Blessings; Martha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 27, 2005 Report Share Posted February 27, 2005 HI Martha. What sort of foods should I start giving Syamali as we wean off the breast to ensure she gets all her nutrients. Being vegetarian this of course is a big concern for me. Can I give her dairy, if so which kinds? Should I give her a bottle to drink at night, or nothing at all (during the night)? Just want to do it right, and don't have the support to make right choices..... need experts like you to guide us! Thanks Martha. Love Krishna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 27, 2005 Report Share Posted February 27, 2005 Thanks Rebecca. Great advice! Love Krishna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 27, 2005 Report Share Posted February 27, 2005 Hi Vicky; Try again on the handout? You have to cut paste, deletes attachments. Marth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 Krishna, you flatter me too much. YOur mother instincts and some familiarity with ayurveda should be serving you? I'd have tried her on various easiest forms/temperature digest dairy like first boiled milk dilute half with water and add slice ginger, pinch turmeric/fennel/cardamom to be sure and succanat, molasses, rapadura, sorghum type mineral rich sweetener, then quickly at her age reduce water etc. That formula with these things and the succanat (whole milk not homogenized!) should work well. Let me know if it doesn't there are certainly many options. I'd puree some little almond or toasted sesame butter in water/little lecithin and little sweet, with or without the diary (thicker on the nutbutter without). Especially at night, make it rich, include some ghee also. She will need her good fats and protein, as well as the minerals, calcium et al, and quick soothe taste/healthy carbs to help hold her thru. My babies needed something in the evening besides dinner for quite a while, don;t remember now. PS, this isn't my specialty, just sharing between what I know, experienced and understand. Not that they are equivalent proteins (dairy/nut!), but I believe/have seen diversity is good. nut/grain milks warm not hot with some flax oil and spices will also be nice? How about a little panir soon, warm, and be sure to have at her age some gentle digestive seasonings plus salt and ghee in her foods. Appetite is important! If she will take a sippy cup, then you can avoid the bottle, but I don't personally think it is such a big problem if this is what gets you some rest and rejuv and her good nourishinment. Is she eating mung dhal, kitchari, etc? With that she at her age might soon handle lassi (no white sugar of course). What is she eating now, remind us? Dried fruits (soaked usually) will be good muscle devel foods, they say, walnuts and pecans and chick peas (cook/puree well) esp good for the brain as are efas and lecithin. soak, puree/grind as needed for her chewing/eating skill level. She probably wants some well cooked pieces for her hands too while you feed her the purees (okra, asparagus, etc etc, start with the same veggies on your postpartum list of gentlest ones!. Martha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 Thanks for the great info Martha, that was really wonderful........... I'm set! YOu're an angel! Sorry about yesterday, I had some eye surgery which took longer than expected and I of course felt lousy afterwards! Lots of love Krishna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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