Guest guest Posted April 10, 2000 Report Share Posted April 10, 2000 Hi Amanda, First of all, I'd like to apologize for taking so long to respond to your answers, but I wanted to address as many of the situations you have brought to light, as completely as I could. Secondly, thank you, for your honest responses to my questions. I hope, and will do my utmost to help you with my advice that follows. The most difficult job I have here is to decide where to begin and how to answer you without writing a book and yet I must be comprehensive enough whereby my advice really is beneficial to you. The following are my observations in regards to "Total Health" and how you can attain it for yourself. So here goes: Man is basically a composite of Spirit (Spiritual), Mind, (Mental), and Body (Physical). And so it would seem that a road to "Total Health" must encompass a program which includes all three. Spiritual Health: Since it is generally accepted, that "function" monitors "form" especially in regards human beings, "Spiritual, Mental, and Physical" are given in their relative order of importance. Unfortunately - Spiritual Health, the most important of the three, is the one that I must say the least about for fear of trespassing on the sacred beliefs of the individual and to avoid a potential for endless debate of philosophical ideologies which however interesting would prove useless and most likely confusing to you at this time. In the past, I have immediately banned without recourse, a couple of list members for being critical and/or intolerant of the religious beliefs of others. People of all faiths are most welcome to be members of this list, and I know for a fact (due to past discussions) that we have a minimum of, LDS (Latter-day Saints - Mormons), Baptists, Catholics, Ba'hai, Scientologists, Wiccans, and Buddhists, and each and every one are treasured by me. Therefore, the only Spiritual advice I will give you is general in nature, and that is: Whatever your religion, get more involved in it. Connect up with others of your own faith and practice it, embrace it, and revel in it. If you have no religion then search for it, reach out for and learn of it, wherever and whatever it may be, for experience has taught me that any religious philosophy is better than none. About a year and a half ago, Rusty Taylor (one of our LDS list members), and I (a Scientologist) started discussing cures of the body brought about by faith alone. I was amazed (and pleased) to discover through our posts to the list and through independent research, that every religion known has witnessed and documented dramatic spiritual healing. As far as I know and have been able to observe, if one were to concentrate on only one of the three (Spiritual, Mental, and Physical), only "Spiritual" has the potential to bring about a complete "cure" without any help from the other two. It seems the other two can not stand alone and need help from this powerful 1/3rd of our makeup, so please don't neglect it. Mental Health: Boy, this is the one to get my blood boiling. This particular field has been messed up more than any other "Science", and Psychiatrists and Psychologists have completely betrayed the job entrusted to them. Psychiatry has brought the people of Earth nothing but pain and suffering with their lobotomies and shock treatments. In fact, their legacy includes the greatest wave of drug addiction the world has ever seen. One out of five Americans is on Psychiatric Psychotropic drugs. Talk about an epidemic. Psychologists have all but destroyed our school and educational systems, and turned these once proud halls of learning, into war zones. Both the Psychiatrist and the Psychologist have been preying on our children and turning them into destructive Zombies. Again, with drugs (Ritalin & Prozac), so that incidents such as Columbine are becoming common place every day occurrences. I personally have had experience with, and been able to investigate over 2,000 children (Ritalin and Prozac cases) in this field, and know what I'm talking about. Unless it is reversed, this one factor alone will bring about the downfall of American society. Psychotherapy has proven time and again that it does not work, and what little truth was originally there, has been twisted and warped beyond all recognition and ultimately is now used to degrade and destroy. Psychoanalysis and hypnotism do nothing but put people to sleep, but it seems as if too many people in the world are already asleep and need to be woken up. I do have some suggestions for you Amanda, but since this area is just slightly less potentially volatile than the Spiritual, my major Mental Health suggestions for you will be sent by private e-mail. The rest of them are as follows in point form and I think agreeable by most: 1. Learn to love yourself (your body, your personality, even your deformities). 2. Admire everything about your self, especially any body part which is ill. 3. The first thing you should do when you get up in the morning is go look out a window and yell to the world, "It's great to be alive!" 4. Tell yourself the following each day at least 7 times: "I'm great! I'm beautiful! And I can lick the whole cockeyed universe! I'm tough! I'm the greatest! And I am Cause over everything that happens to me and around me!" 5. Admit and acknowledge to yourself that you are responsible for the condition you are in, and that you created this condition in the first place. 6. Disconnect from anything or anyone who is negative and not supportive of you. There are negative people who specialize in doing wrong and who glory in bringing others down. These are the rumor mongers who criticize and never encourage. If you feel like your life is a roller coaster, up one day and then down the next, then you are most likely connected to one or more of these negative types. To hell with them, get them out of your life. Just because there are rattlesnakes in the world doesn't mean one has to live with them. 7. Connect up to and communicate only with positive people. 8. Love and love some more. 9. There are probably a dozen more, and I'll let others contribute from this point on. Physical Health: Physical Health Axiom I discovered that you can carve in stone: ALL ILLNESS AND/OR DISEASE IS A RESULT OF STRESS (SUPPRESSION) EFFECTING STOPPAGE. Well - now we're down to the nitty gritty mechanics of bodies and what makes 'em tick. We know full well that the Spiritual and Mental aspects are crucial to ensuring the physical body does well, but from this point on I'll be mostly talking on the physical level, while assuming you are also at the same time working on the Spiritual and Mental. In all my research, I have found that attaining awesome Physical Health is dependent upon only four things: 1. Great Nutrition (Food). 2. Excellent Bio Chemistry (Vitamins, Minerals, Water, Amino Acids, Anti-Oxidants, Enzymes, Natural Food Supplements and Herbs) 3. Effective and Proper Exercise. 4. Use the Physical Health Axiom: ALL ILLNESS AND/OR DISEASE IS A RESULT OF STRESS (SUPPRESSION) EFFECTING STOPPAGE. Get rid of the stress, and use #1, #2 & #3 above to get rid of the stoppage and your optimum health level will quickly return to you. Grab a handle on this and combine with a good Spiritual and Mental program as mentioned above and you will attain your optimum physical health. Every cell in your body is replaced within two years. Why are you continuing to build the same body if you'd rather really change a few things??? You can create for yourself a totally new body within two years regardless of what condition you're in today. Tomorrow, I'll post #1: Data you should know in regards your Food Program (I promise, you won't starve and you can eat as much as you want). I'll follow this up on Tuesday with your Bio Chemical Program (you'll be amazed how a few herbs can unblock and start up areas of your body which have been stopped), and end Weds with a do-able exercise program for you (No you won't have to run a 4 minute mile. I'm talking about a gradient that you can easily do) and wrap up some final notes on stress and stoppage. Love, Ian zimmermann wrote: Before I begin... I would like to state for the record that telling this information to people who are health nuts (said with great affection and envy!! ) is gonna be seriously humiliating. So here goes... and keep in mind that however I have failed in my life, I have surely tried with all my heart to succeed. It just does not come naturally to some of us. I will take this point by point. > My dear Amanda, Thanks...hope you are not being too sarcastic here? LOL > > I'd like to know what you eat??? I can't be totally acurate in retrospect... but I can give you a general idea of the kind of foods I eat. I have terrible eating habits. I almost never eat breakfast. Maybe once or twice every two weeks. A bad habit I developed from years and years of unsuccessful dieting. I rarely eat a good lunch. I will start with today and work backwards for a few days as far as I can remember. 4/4/00 6 am. Coffee w/non-dairy creamer. ..2 cups. 12 noon Two buttermilk biscuits. Home made. with butter. Plan for supper Rice with green and red bell peppers, mushrooms, chicken broth, salsa, onions,and cheddar cheese. I plan to eat at least two cups of the above, with a half cup of refied beans, rolled in two large flour tortillas. Salad with lettuce,tomatoes and Ranch dressing. two big glasses of diet coke. 4/3/00 6 am 1 cup coffee w/creamer. 1pm 1/2 a pound of carrots, raw, with ranch dressing for dip. 3pm big glass of diet coke and a biscuit plain. Dinner Fried Perch sandwich with lettuce, tartar,one slice of american cheese on a regular hamburger sized bun with sesame seeds. about three oz french fires w/ catsup 1/3 c cabbage slaw chocolate shake (gasp!) 4/2/00 8 am coffee w/creamer one cup. 11 am About 1 cup hashbrown potatoes with onions, mushrooms, bacon(for flavor...about 1/2 a strip) two eggs over easy 16 oz glass of skim milk (unusual for me... but I have been long for it lately.) 3 pm corn chips and (fake stuff in a jar) con queso dip Big diet coke 7 pm one cup of chicken broth (was too nauseous for food.) 10pm 1/2 c skim milk 4/1/00 8 am 1 cup Earl Grey tea w/creamer 9 am diet coke 11 or 12 am two boiled eggs in egg salad made w/ mayo crackers... those crappy garden veggie ones you get at walmart for a buck diet coke Dinner About 2 oz. boneless skinless chicken breast with1and 1/2 cup rice, mushrooms, and chicken broth baked in the oven. Two cups broccoli lg glass ice water with dash of orange juice. 3/31/00 6 am 32 oz glass of ice water w/one oz. of koolaid. (one of my favorite things... LOL) 12 ish one dry toast. (nausea again.) I was sick to my stomach this whole day... so the only thing I ate after the toast was a milkshake at 8 pm. (also unusual for me... but it was what I really wanted.) 3/30/00 Ok we are getting into memory problems here... I will do my best. 6 am Coffee--1 cup w/creamer. 8 am ice water w/ koolaid... 9 am A big fresh pear. 12 ish a toast again... same reason. 4 ish a small bite of chocolate... because I am stupid. 7 ish chicken broth. Before this I have a terrible time remembering what we had. I know that on two days i ate two oranges for breakfast. I had broccoli twice that week... corn once, one supper was salad with tomatoes green bell peppers, cheddar shreds and chopped boiled eggs. Ranch. one supper was (don't freak I have kids!) corn dogs with tater tots w/ raw carrots I had three oreos on one day and a few glasses of milk. Popcorn once. Buttered and salted of course. Something with ground beef... and pasta... don't recall what. ********** I know that my eating habits stink. I try to get fruit regularly and veggies but fail miserably. Lets just move on... I will try to think of more food that I have eaten. > > Please give me your detailed menu for the last two weeks. Everything! Did not do so well remembering... sorry. > > Do you smoke??? NO! I quit two years ago. > Drink coffee??? Yup. >Alcohol??? Very very rarely. Never to excess. > Chocolate??? I love it. try to eat some every week. >Soda Pop??? Diet Coke. (did switch to regular coke for about two months... but it makes my stomach sick. Back to chemicals. Ugh.) > Twinkies??? NO. Ick. > > What kind of meat do you eat??? Where do you buy it??? What ever is on sale... mostly chicken, some beef. Too much ground beef. Occaisional pork... but it makes my feet swell if I eat too much. All bought at the grocery store. I am most definately not a meat eater... and would likely eat it only once in a while if it was not for neanderthal hubby who is big meat and potato man. > > What kind of stress is in your life at this time??? I have a mild clutter problem... but am presently very motivated to deal with it. I live in an apartment which stinks but we will be moving to a place with a yard in June. Horray!! My weight problem is a constant stress. > Are you connected to >anyone > who is extremely negative??? Only myself. LOL > > What kind of exercise do you get on a daily basis??? Very little. Nearly none. Just house stuff. > How tall are you and >how much > do you weigh??? I could tell you but then I would have to kill you..... LOL No really... Please don't judge me on this. I have always been big. Never quite this big but still... it has not affected my ability to be happy and healthy before. So tread lightly when hollering at me about this issue... and know that if i could afford to have half my guts ripped out the way most of us are doing these days i probably would even though i think its just an awful thing to do. Gee... would you say i have a poor self image? Sorry. here goes. 5 foot six inches 350 lbs. > > What is your job like??? and, do you get along with all your fellow co-workers??? I am a stay at home mom... and I teach my kids at home. I love my 'co-workers' ! > > Where do you live and how are your familial relations??? I am lucky to have the best husband I could hope for!... loves me like the sun. I love him like the wind loves the snow. Ok too much information I guess. I have wonderful children... ages 9, 8, and 6. they are all beautiful incredibly intelligent children. Oldest has ADHD and a problem with being oppositional. A sweet boy just the same. Ok that does it for your questions. now I will add a couple of things. Meds I take... Prozac 40 mgs daily for depression. Have taken for 8 years with success. Loestrin (birth control... as normal now) Zantac occaisionally Tums daily at least once. medical conditions Depression ADD Sleep apnea (use CPAP machine) Seasonal allergies. unusual situations... Moved from Marquette Michigan to Wisconsin four years ago. I miss it there. Noticed today... My temperature starts out in the AM at 98.2. It goes up to 99.2 to 99.8 during the day. Every day for two weeks I have been monitoring this. I did not notice the pattern till today. i have had a temp for nearly a month. I just had a complete blood count yesterday... results all normal... and a urinalysis... normal. My doctor has no further recomendations but to wait it out. I had the same tests plus thyroid test in OCT 99. All normal. I panicked when my doctor called with these normal test results. I was sure it was an infection. Now I don't know what to do or where to go! My husband wants me to go to the Mayo clinic... but what would I tell them... I need an appt because my lab tests are normal? I am at the end of my rope. thanks for caring Amanda Ok this has about killed me to do.... so I will send it before I decide to delete it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2000 Report Share Posted April 10, 2000 Dear Ian, I want to thank you from the bottom of my heart for the time and effort that you have put into this. You are very kind and considerate of the feelings of myself and others... and this is one of the most admirable traits a person can have. As to the time it took you to answer... I really did not expect you to drop everything in your life to do me a favor. Spiritual Health is very important to me... and honestly one of the things I have neglected since I moved here four years ago. Part of the reason for that is a general dissatisfaction for the religious choice I made when I became involved with my very dear husband. He was raised Catholic and I was a protestant 'floater'... going from church to church. So I converted. I was never fully happy with that choice... and have been thinking for a year that it is time for a change. Your advice to immerse myself in my spirituality is advice that I have been giving myself for quite some time now! So perhaps it is true that we know what is best for our own selves. I too have seen the the Spiritual healing of others. Recently my grandpa died of cancer of the brain that had spread through his body. He was a penticostal minister... a devout christian all his life. By rights the cancer that ravaged his body should have been causing him terrible pain, but he was happy and smiling and nearly pain free the whole time. I consider that a gift of the Spirit... even his last words were of his faith. I hope that was not too much to say on the subject? Mental Health: I am with you on this one... Psychiatrists and Psychologists having completely betrayed the job entrusted to them. I have been a victim of this in the past... having seen many couselors, psychologists, and psychiatrists. I really no longer believe in the profession. This being an intelligent choice I have made from knowledge and experience. I will confess without shame that I do take Prozac and feel it has saved me. I am always open to suggestions and comments. I can only tell you that I suffered from a RAGING depression for all my life until finding it. I guess that is all I should say on the subject on list... as I know that it can be a BIG debate. Being new I am not sure of the tollerence levels here yet... LOL. I did want to talk a little about the list you included... I enjoyed reading it very much. I see the Truths contained in it... why is it I have such a hard time with these things? 1. Learn to love yourself....2. Admire everything about yourself.... I want to desperately!! Why is it such a difficult thing to do? I love so many things about me... I am smart, compassionate, loving, artistic, silly, comical, a great mother and teacher... I know these things to be true. Why do I insist on ignoring all those things and focusing on the part of me that is most in need of change? In reality if I had not grown up with this weight problem I believe I would not be the truly wonderful human being that I am today. The pain I suffered and still suffer for so long because of it is what has taught me the value of the traits I mentioned above. 3. and 4..... being positive. Being kind to myself. Ok... I will. A bit at a time I will change my attitude. Give me some time though... it may take a while. 5... taking responsibility... I will do my best. 6. Disconnect from negative people.... Ok this one is hard for me. I am always afraid to hurt people. I really have a hard time with this. I have managed to do so in many cases... now I just have one or two to go. I have a son who is very negative... of course I will NOT disconnect from him! I am trying to find ways to make his life positive for him. I feel that he and I are kindred spirits in so many ways. He is a wonderful 9 yr old.... with such sadness inside him. I take special care with him. 7... Connect with positive people.. lots of positive people here... 8.... Love and love some more.... I am especially good at this. Physical Health: First... I am unclear what you mean by 'effecting stoppage'... are we talking about the systems of the body? I am under some stress. I know that it effects me. I have already decided and made some changes to the food this family eats. I have made an initial decision to take away very little... but add very much. We were not getting enough fruits and veggies. I went out and bought a lot of stuff. I encourage the kids and even my husband (who is a fruit bigot...LOL) to eat them as often as they like. As a result we all eat way less of the foods I hope to avoid. I actually went for a walk last week... this is a big step to someone who is nearly completely sedentary. I just felt like going out. I took the kids and we went. It was wonderful to feel the cool air and bright sun. I stopped buying pop and started buying juice. Ok... perhaps its not the best juice and not all organic stuff... but it has to be better than pop. I bought veggies for snacks for the hockey game this weekend... and it was greeted enthusiastically. So I guess there is hope that we can all change what we do. I have nearly no knowledge on proper bio chemestry... I have no idea what vitamins I should be getting... etc. Money can be tight and I kno0w that stuff can cost an arm and a leg... but I will find a way. Activity I need. I used to be so active... I would downhill ski, walk, swim, putz in the garden, etc. I am a Nature Girl and love the outdoors. When I moved here to the apartment much of the activity stopped. For a while I replaced it with my out of the house jobs... I worked at a Mc Donalds (YUK never eat that stuff trust me) for a year (it was walking distance and we needed extra cash...) and let me tell you I ran my BUTT off! Then I worked for a large art and craft supply store... this also involved much walking and physical activity. When stress became too high I decided to stay home... and my activity stopped. So I need to replace that. I want to include my kids in that activity as much as possible... and find a way for my husband to also get with us... although he is always so tired after working. I will make an effort to walk at least. Stress... I will do my best. When you are where we are in our lives... stress sort of goes with the territory. Some stress I would not trade for anything... such as teaching the kids at home. The advantages far outweigh the risks! I anxiously await your advice in all these areas. I will do my best to work on it... I have to to get myself back together. I am so thankful that you have taken this time out of your life to bother with mine. Frankly, I did not have much hope left. I feel quite renewed... just knowing that I may be able to help myself. Thanks Amanda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 11, 2000 Report Share Posted April 11, 2000 Phewwww. Very well done on jumping into this before I even had a chance to get off my food program to you. You're on the right track girl, but please take it slowly. A dramatic change in diet can cause a major detox which could be very dangerous for you in your condition. You hit the nail on the head. The secret is to add more of the right things rather than to just get rid of the bad. You'll do just fine kiddo. We're with you all the way. Love, Ian PS. I once thought that all illness was caused by blockage (I got this from one of my mentors - Dr. Richard Schulze) but kept running into scenarios where this just didn't fit or lead to a handling of an illness. There were cases where there was no blockage and yet the particular body area was not flowing. I then had a light go off in my head (like being slapped aside the head with a 2X4) and realized that the key word was "Stoppage". This now led to a resolution of all problems. All "blockages are "stoppages", but not all "stoppages" are blockages". IE. Coffee will annihilate your adrenals and eventually shut them down. There is no "blocked" flow here, only a "stopped" flow. If one was trying to only remove a blockage he would never get anywhere with a cleansing treatment for example. The key to the above example is to stimulate the adrenals using herbs so they work again while at the same time building them back up to function on their own. Hope that clarifies that for you. zimmermann wrote: Dear Ian, I want to thank you from the bottom of my heart for the time and effort that you have put into this. You are very kind and considerate of the feelings of myself and others... and this is one of the most admirable traits a person can have. As to the time it took you to answer... I really did not expect you to drop everything in your life to do me a favor. Spiritual Health is very important to me... and honestly one of the things I have neglected since I moved here four years ago. Part of the reason for that is a general dissatisfaction for the religious choice I made when I became involved with my very dear husband. He was raised Catholic and I was a protestant 'floater'... going from church to church. So I converted. I was never fully happy with that choice... and have been thinking for a year that it is time for a change. Your advice to immerse myself in my spirituality is advice that I have been giving myself for quite some time now! So perhaps it is true that we know what is best for our own selves. :)I too have seen the the Spiritual healing of others. Recently my grandpa died of cancer of the brain that had spread through his body. He was a penticostal minister... a devout christian all his life. By rights the cancer that ravaged his body should have been causing him terrible pain, but he was happy and smiling and nearly pain free the whole time. I consider that a gift of the Spirit... even his last words were of his faith.I hope that was not too much to say on the subject? Mental Health:I am with you on this one... Psychiatrists and Psychologists having completely betrayed the job entrusted to them. I have been a victim of this in the past... having seen many couselors, psychologists, and psychiatrists. I really no longer believe in the profession. This being an intelligent choice I have made from knowledge and experience. I will confess without shame that I do take Prozac and feel it has saved me. I am always open to suggestions and comments. I can only tell you that I suffered from a RAGING depression for all my life until finding it. I guess that is all I should say on the subject on list... as I know that it can be a BIG debate. Being new I am not sure of the tollerence levels here yet... LOL.I did want to talk a little about the list you included... I enjoyed reading it very much. I see the Truths contained in it... why is it I have such a hard time with these things?1. Learn to love yourself....2. Admire everything about yourself....I want to desperately!! Why is it such a difficult thing to do? I love so many things about me... I am smart, compassionate, loving, artistic, silly, comical, a great mother and teacher... I know these things to be true. Why do I insist on ignoring all those things and focusing on the part of me that is most in need of change? In reality if I had not grown up with this weight problem I believe I would not be the truly wonderful human being that I am today. The pain I suffered and still suffer for so long because of it is what has taught me the value of the traits I mentioned above.3. and 4..... being positive. Being kind to myself. Ok... I will. A bit at a time I will change my attitude. Give me some time though... it may take a while.5... taking responsibility... I will do my best.6. Disconnect from negative people.... Ok this one is hard for me. I am always afraid to hurt people. I really have a hard time with this. I have managed to do so in many cases... now I just have one or two to go.I have a son who is very negative... of course I will NOT disconnect from him! I am trying to find ways to make his life positive for him. I feel that he and I are kindred spirits in so many ways. He is a wonderful 9 yr old.... with such sadness inside him. I take special care with him.7... Connect with positive people.. lots of positive people here... :)8.... Love and love some more.... I am especially good at this. Physical Health:First... I am unclear what you mean by 'effecting stoppage'... are we talking about the systems of the body? I am under some stress. I know that it effects me. I have already decided and made some changes to the food this family eats. I have made an initial decision to take away very little... but add very much. We were not getting enough fruits and veggies. I went out and bought a lot of stuff. I encourage the kids and even my husband (who is a fruit bigot...LOL) to eat them as often as they like. As a result we all eat way less of the foods I hope to avoid. I actually went for a walk last week... this is a big step to someone who is nearly completely sedentary. I just felt like going out. I took the kids and we went. It was wonderful to feel the cool air and bright sun. I stopped buying pop and started buying juice. Ok... perhaps its not the best juice and not all organic stuff... but it has to be better than pop. I bought veggies for snacks for the hockey game this weekend... and it was greeted enthusiastically. So I guess there is hope that we can all change what we do.I have nearly no knowledge on proper bio chemestry... I have no idea what vitamins I should be getting... etc. Money can be tight and I kno0w that stuff can cost an arm and a leg... but I will find a way.Activity I need. I used to be so active... I would downhill ski, walk, swim, putz in the garden, etc. I am a Nature Girl and love the outdoors. When I moved here to the apartment much of the activity stopped. For a while I replaced it with my out of the house jobs... I worked at a Mc Donalds (YUK never eat that stuff trust me) for a year (it was walking distance and we needed extra cash...) and let me tell you I ran my BUTT off! Then I worked for a large art and craft supply store... this also involved much walking and physical activity. When stress became too high I decided to stay home... and my activity stopped. So I need to replace that. I want to include my kids in that activity as much as possible... and find a way for my husband to also get with us... although he is always so tired after working. I will make an effort to walk at least. Stress... I will do my best. When you are where we are in our lives... stress sort of goes with the territory. Some stress I would not trade for anything... such as teaching the kids at home. The advantages far outweigh the risks! I anxiously await your advice in all these areas. I will do my best to work on it... I have to to get myself back together. I am so thankful that you have taken this time out of your life to bother with mine. Frankly, I did not have much hope left. I feel quite renewed... just knowing that I may be able to help myself.ThanksAmanda Federal Law requires that we warn you of the following: 1. Natural methods can sometimes backfire. 2. If you are pregnant, consult your physician before using any natural remedy. 3. The Constitution guarantees you the right to be your own physician and to prescribe for your own health. We are not doctors although doctors are welcome to post here as long as they behave themselves. Any opinions put forth by the list members are exactly that, and any person following the advice of anyone posting here do so at their own risk. It is up to you to educate yourself. By accepting advice from list members, and by accepting any products from Organic Solutions, you are agreeing to be fully responsible for your own health, and hold the List Owner and Organic Solutions free of any liability. Organic Solutions 1844 Springtime Ave., Clearwater FL 33755 Phone: 727-447-6863 FAX: 727-447-6491 e-mail: ian_shillington Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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