Initiating breast milk, a fortnight after childbirth

[Guest guest]

The gift of immunity through mothers milk is well known, but

discussed in scientific terms here:

 

http://www.promom.org/bf_info/sci_am.htm

 

A lady patient had undergone C-section. The baby could not latch

properly in hospital. the pumping also did not yield more than few

drops of milk. The reasons for this kind of behaviour were discussed

in some posts on C-section related losses to mom and baby, about

three years ago.

 

The baby was started on diluted cow milk as a substitute.

 

After the discharge from the hospital one week thereafter, the

parents, neighbourhood grandmas tried several remedies but milk had

more or less dried up.

 

As ayurvedic protocol, she was advised following:

 

1. Warm both breasts with salt bag fomentation for few minutes and

apply warm aswgandha oil and massage clockwise as seen by observer.

after 15 minutes massage, apply warm soak for another 10 minutes.

 

2. Drink Shatawari Ghrutam 1 tsp in warm milk, at breakfast time and

at bedtime.

 

3, 100 grains of fenugreek, soak at bedtime, grind into paste early

morning and drink.

 

In just eight days, the milk strated in a trickle form. after another

week, baby is now sucking milk twice a day. supplimentation by

diluted cow milk, goat milk is also going on thrice a day. The

ayurvedic protocol is continued and mom hopes that in another one

month, she may be able to satisfy baby fully.

 

The weight gain is also normal now.

 

In addition to the ayurvedic protocol, some marma points were given

to press during massage.

 

It is in such instances, that full spectrum of ayurvedic knowledge of Indian

ancients becomes evident.

 

If anyone has some more suggestions, author will be happy to pass on to the mom.

[Guest guest]

Lucerne tablets - the herbal tablet - has always produced good quantity and

quality of breast milk in my experience

 

Jane

[Guest guest]

" some marma points were given

to press during massage. "

 

would you please share exactly what marama points those were? i am

helping a mother right now with some of the same problems,

 

some other ayurvedic herbs that are good to encourage milk production

are ajwain, fennel, garlic, used in teas and food daily is fine.

 

a more western common herbal to increase milk production is blessed

milk thistle, you can also soak and grind seeds and make a tea.

lavander is also good for calming the central nervous system, i add

it to chamomile tea for my postpartum moms with and without bf

issues:)

 

i look forward to hearing about the maram point info:)

 

jai ma!

[Guest guest]

I have always obtained good relief from breast pains and congestion by

massaging the outer aspect of the patients' thighs - from the knee up to the

hips

 

Jane

[Guest guest]

1. On the midline of the chest, beween 4th and 5th rib

 

2. On the top of the shoulder, a distance between one to two inches

from the side of the neck

 

3. ON the top of the foot, in the valley between smallest and fourth

toes, midway between the separation between the toes and where the

foot joins the legs

 

4. about three centimeters above the separation between the biggest

and second toes, on the top side of the foot.

 

5. 4.5 cemtimeter from the spine midline, between L1 and L2

vertebrae, 3 centimeter above the waist line.

 

The locations above are approximate and a better location can be

pinpointed by soreness at the point. Just knowing the points is just

10% of the work. The amount of pressure, the frequecy, the spread of

the area about the marma point and length of time for which pressure

is applied rhythmically is all the skill one can learn only after

experience and meditation. When a healer touches the body of the

patient, the energy exchange is automatic, unless healer has no

compassion for the patient. And by concentrating the mind, by guiding

the energy flow, the healer is able to send adequate energy into the

channels of the receiving person. Pulse reading, marma manipulation

are arts acquired after years of concentrated efforts.

 

Author shared the info which is easily transferable so that at least

few babies in future need not be deprived of milk.

____________________________

" some marma points were given

to press during massage. "

 

would you please share exactly what marama points those were? i am

helping a mother right now with some of the same problems,

[Guest guest]

Hi Dr. Bhate;

 

Though not having dealt personally with this specific, a few comments

may be helpful if they are not already in place re:

 

> http://health.ayurveda/message/13263

 

1. Warm both breasts with salt bag fomentation for few minutes and

apply warm aswgandha oil and massage clockwise as seen by observer.

after 15 minutes massage, apply warm soak for another 10 minutes.

 

A labor of love, commitment, and undoubtedly great value, sounds

wonderful. (warmth with Salt is known to help dilate the channels).

I've not used these - aRe the salt bags damp or just heated? Is the

mother also receiving the hot oil full body massage, followed by

minimum 1/2 hour nap and then long soak in hot bath? And managing

another nap or more during the day also? I've seen milk supply and

let down jump dramatically with one treatment even. Is there a local

hospital with electric double breast pump for loan? It may be worth

asking. One mama/baby also benefitting greatly when Mom was encouraged

to sing with all her heart and power, while she pumped, being an

opera singer who had not been singing, but singing in general is such

a freeing therapy to the body functions.

 

some mothers here report using fennel essential oil as part of breast

massage greatly helps milk production. Dilute with the ashwaghanda

oil (or if not avail for clients in States right away, any massage

oil. But it can be mail ordered as quickly as the essential oil, from

places like Banyan or the Ayurvedic Insititute.) Source of the oils

is very important, as oils that are not organic, or solvents used in

processing, etc will have concentrations of toxins you do not want on

the breast.

 

Baby is receiving the warm oil infant massage 2X daily? This of

course increases appetite and strength in nursing.

 

2. Drink Shatawari Ghrutam 1 tsp in warm milk, at breakfast time and

at bedtime.

 

for most of the group - ghrutam is a ghee made with shatavari

(sometimes other supportive herbs also added). Most likely you have

assessed her personal prakruti/vikruti if she also needs something

like ashwaghandha, vidari, jatamamsi...And the family/villagers

providing the wonderful mothers' laddus and other nourishing soothing

foods? Mother's appetite is strong?

 

3, 100 grains of fenugreek, soak at bedtime, grind into paste early

morning and drink.

 

Grains, you mean seeds, or what is a grain measure? Sounds very good,

especially prepared with some jaggery and ghee. Being bitter of

course, for most mothers is is very important to balance with sweet

taste for vata, allowing better receptivity and delivery of the

effects. I would be giving warm temp, even in the hot weather.

 

Keep us posted? this is a good success story many will be happy to

hear. The supplementation with other things of course gets Baby used

to faster and more regular milk delivery, and it is often best to have

others feed from bottle, and Mom only from breast, nursing before the

bottle also and to avoid nipple confusion. The supplementation also

easily leads to early weaning, so it is a swimming upstream with much

attention to the priority until breastfeeding is reestablished.

Congratulations to them all for such devotion to Baby's well being.

 

Ysha

[Guest guest]

The discussion continues, several practitioners -

 

http://health.ayurveda/message/13269,

 

/13270 (massaging thighs helping breast congestion), /13272

(description of key marma point - pressure points for lactation), and

more on herbs discussion, western and Indian

[Guest guest]

Hi Dr. Bhate;

 

Though not having dealt personally with this specific, a few comments

may be helpful if they are not already in place -

 

>1. Warm both breasts with salt bag fomentation for few minutes and

apply warm aswgandha oil and massage clockwise as seen by observer.

after 15 minutes massage, apply warm soak for another 10 minutes.

 

A labor of love, commitment, and undoubtedly great value, sounds

wonderful. (warmth with Salt is known to help dilate the channels).

I've not used these - aRe the salt bags damp or just heated? Is the

mother also receiving the hot oil full body abhyanga, followed by

minimum 1/2 hour nap and then long soak in hot bath? And managing

another nap or more during the day also? I've seen milk supply and

let down jump dramatically with one treatment even. Is there a local

hospital with electric double breast pump for loan? It may be worth

asking. One mama/baby also benefitting greatly when Mom was encouraged

to sing with all her heart and power, while she pumped, being an

opera singer who had not been singing, but singing in general is such

a freeing therapy to the body functions.

 

some mothers here report using fennel essential oil as part of breast

massage greatly helps milk production. Dilute with the ashwaghanda

oil (or if not avail for clients in States right away, any massage

oil. But it can be mail ordered as quickly as the essential oil, from

places like Banyan or the Ayurvedic Insititute.) Source of the oils

is very important, as oils that are not organic, or solvents used in

processing, etc will have concentrations of toxins you do not want on

the breast.

 

Baby is receiving the warm oil infant massage 2X daily? This of

course increases appetite and strength in nursing, the demand part of

the supply equation which is so important to build supply. Suckling

at night also?

 

>2. Drink Shatawari Ghrutam 1 tsp in warm milk, at breakfast time and

at bedtime.

 

for some of the group - ghrutam is a ghee made with shatavari

(sometimes other supportive herbs also added). Most likely you have

assessed her personal prakruti/vikruti if she also needs something

like ashwaghandha, vidari, jatamamsi...And the family/villagers

providing the wonderful mothers' laddus and other nourishing,

moist/soupy and soothing foods? Mother's appetite is strong?

 

>3, 100 grains of fenugreek, soak at bedtime, grind into paste early

morning and drink.

 

Grains, you mean seeds, or what is a grain measure? Sounds very good,

especially prepared with some jaggery and ghee. Being bitter of

course, for most mothers is is very important to balance with sweet

taste for vata, allowing better receptivity and delivery of the

effects. I would be giving warm temp, even in the hot weather.

 

The supplementation with other things of course gets Baby used to

faster and more regular milk delivery, and it is often best to have

others feed from bottle, and Mom only from breast, nursing before the

bottle also and to avoid nipple confusion. The supplementation also

easily leads to early weaning, so it is a swimming upstream with much

attention to the priority until breastfeeding is reestablished.

 

Warm congratulations to them all for such devotion to Baby's well

being. Keep us posted? this is a good success story many will be

happy to hear.

 

Ysha

_________________

week, baby is now sucking milk twice a day. supplimentation by

diluted cow milk, goat milk is also going on thrice a day. The

ayurvedic protocol is continued and mom hopes that in another one

month, she may be able to satisfy baby fully.

 

If anyone has some more suggestions, author will be happy to pass on

to the mom.

[Guest guest]

Hi Noel -

 

YES on the garlic. Dr. Shrestha makes an ajwan and roasted garlic

soup, maybe adding fennel or dill weed. It doesn't taste good when I

try, would love a good recipe to share! She soaks the ajwan in cool

water overnight to pull some of the sharpness out, then uses a

HANDFULL in the soup as major ingredient! the thistle is a strong one

except it is also quite bitter, a challenge for vata moms especially,

and of course all postpartum moms are highly vata, so adding the other

more warm ones and tasties, ghee, sweetness, makes it actually work

better and be used more consistently also, I find.

 

Lavender and chamomile though much gentler, still tend toward drying

influences (cool/astring), I'm really picky when able with what we

give my early pp moms. Little things at this time make a huge

difference - " 42 days for 42 years " says Dr. Shrestha. I've had one

person get such a diuretic effect from lavender, I never think of

using it, though there are many moms who need that that's not been my

clientelle and then I'll use gokesura or another more effective and

rasayana one. We lean on rasayana in early postpartum, especially

when there are problems of insufficiency though agni has to be

specially watched. No ashwaghanda? so wonderful at this time if you

have it, for the calming effects. Glad you asked about the marmas.

 

Warm Regards!

Ysha

Postpartum AyurDoula

www.sacredwindow.com (free articles and more care tips there)

www.perinatalayurveda

____________________

a more western common herbal to increase milk production is blessed

milk thistle, you can also soak and grind seeds and make a tea.

lavander is also good for calming the central nervous system, i add

it to chamomile tea for my postpartum moms with and without bf

issues:)

[Guest guest]

Hi Jane -

 

This is Interesting - why does this work, can you tell?

 

Ysha

 

> I have always obtained good relief from breast pains and congestion by

> massaging the outer aspect of the patients' thighs - from the knee up

[Guest guest]

ayurveda , ayurdoula <no_reply wrote:

 

<warmth with Salt is known to help dilate the channels).

I've not used these - aRe the salt bags damp or just heated?>

 

just heated.

 

 

< Is the

mother also receiving the hot oil full body abhyanga, followed by

minimum 1/2 hour nap and then long soak in hot bath? And managing

another nap or more during the day also? I've seen milk supply and

let down jump dramatically with one treatment even. >

 

Due to C-section, these things were impossible in the beginning.

Later, they were strated. Indian mom, does not have that much time

and luxury to afford all VIP treatment, especially in a big family,

especially when she has given birth to a daughter. With son, things

become little different. The major boost in the milk came only after

the ayurvedic intervention. This particular mom was depressed after

delivering a daughter, being muslim was another factor. The status of

muslim women is well known.

 

 

< Is there a local

hospital with electric double breast pump for loan? It may be worth

asking. One mama/baby also benefitting greatly when Mom was

encouraged

to sing with all her heart and power, while she pumped, being an

opera singer who had not been singing, but singing in general is such

a freeing therapy to the body functions.>

 

East and west differ a lot in these approaches, these are

revolutionary ideas. They may take time to be acceptable to

traditional indian culture, due to population and economy, many moms

do not have even privacy to feed their babies in a secluded room.

 

< some mothers here report using fennel essential oil as part of

breast

massage greatly helps milk production. Dilute with the ashwaghanda

oil (or if not avail for clients in States right away, any massage

oil. But it can be mail ordered as quickly as the essential oil,

from

places like Banyan or the Ayurvedic Insititute.) Source of the oils

is very important, as oils that are not organic, or solvents used in

processing, etc will have concentrations of toxins you do not want on

the breast.>

 

Thanks for the suggestion. Essential aromatic oils is one area where

we need to strngthen ourselves.

 

< Baby is receiving the warm oil infant massage 2X daily? This of

course increases appetite and strength in nursing, the demand part of

the supply equation which is so important to build supply. Suckling

at night also?>

 

Baby recives warm oil massage 1x daily. Suckling is strong, it is

supply which is insufficient. Methi laddus etc is now given.

 

< Drink Shatawari Ghrutam 1 tsp in warm milk, at breakfast time and

at bedtime.

if she also needs something

like ashwaghandha, vidari, jatamamsi...And the family/villagers

providing the wonderful mothers' laddus and other nourishing,

moist/soupy and soothing foods? Mother's appetite is strong?>

 

The shatawari ghrutam is also supplimented by ksheerpak containing

aswgandha, satawari, vidarikand, etc, as described in a previous post

on winter rasayanas. Mothers appetite is strong.

 

< Grains, you mean seeds, or what is a grain measure? Sounds very

good,

especially prepared with some jaggery and ghee. Being bitter of

course, for most mothers is is very important to balance with sweet

taste for vata, allowing better receptivity and delivery of the

effects. I would be giving warm temp, even in the hot weather.>

 

other things are there in methi laddus; methi grain means seeds of

methi. soaking gives more benifits. this has been explained in a post

on almonds earlier.

 

 

< The supplementation with other things of course gets Baby used to

faster and more regular milk delivery, and it is often best to have

others feed from bottle, and Mom only from breast, nursing before the

bottle also and to avoid nipple confusion. The supplementation also

easily leads to early weaning, so it is a swimming upstream with much

attention to the priority until breastfeeding is reestablished.>

 

This point is very important. but Indians try to avoid bottle,

outside milk is fed by spoon. slowly, baby snatches the cup and

starts drinking the milk herself, as it grows.

[Guest guest]

ysha, thank you for the advice on lavander! i was unaware of its

diuretic effects!

 

as always your answers are so wise!

 

blessings!

noel

[Guest guest]

Noel - It's not an always - there is SO SO much I don't know and the

disclaimer has to be stated! Just grateful some questions I can help

with come this way.

Namaste - Ysha

>

> as always your answers are so wise!

[Guest guest]

From today's conversation with Dr. Bhate

 

> Indians try to avoid bottle,

> outside milk is fed by spoon. slowly, baby snatches the cup and

> starts drinking the milk herself, as it grows.

 

We can take wisdom advice here! Actually doubly now, with the recent

discovery of the BSP (biasphenol?) found in toxic levels in so many

plastics including most baby bottles and pacifiers.

 

> The discussion continues, several practitioners -

 

Incl note, Dr. Upadye (sp?) does medical astrology and " primary

infertility " remedial help, very reasonable rates payable by paypal.

[Guest guest]

Yes we usually wait a few days, though the 10 days window I was

initially given has mothers begging before that.

 

> < Is the mother also receiving the hot oil full body abhyanga,

followed by minimum 1/2 hour nap and then long soak in hot bath? And

managing another nap or more during the day also? I've seen milk

supply and let down jump dramatically with one treatment even. >

>

> Due to C-section, these things were impossible in the beginning.

 

One woman's midwife asked me to attend the hospital birth (in labor we

discovered sexual abuse issues had not been released and her stalled

labor went into a C). Mom responded VERY well to hot oil application

(no massage) within about 15 minutes of being in the recovery room.

 

The nurse had seen such good instant effect from giving Mom " VATA " tea

of ginger/cinnamon/cardamom and licorice - her post op shakes settled

down immediately when nothing else even prewarmed blanket did not do

it. So Nurse agreed to observe the oil application too, as long as

bandage/belly area was not touched. Mom had said it sounded good, and

was so grateful. Then we used a huge towel to wrap her belly as she

had forgotten the belly wrapping material, and Dad went and put warm

oil on Baby to protect the crown chakra from so many different

vibrations.

 

> Indian mom, does not have that much time and luxury to afford all

VIP treatment, especially in a big family,

 

Very few moms do here either, of course. Yet to discuss the ideal is

a good thing and often shifts family priorities to repeat it, instead

of just saying this is the ayurvedic or wise woman tradition. These

supports, whatever can be done, have so much value. I had the good

fortune with much of it after my third, what a world of difference.

Jyotishi said, " YOU had a baby then? " and mentioned bad aspects for me

yet after about 3 weeks, I felt the inner lights come back on and the

changes daily from the start, so amazing.

 

As Dr. Shrestha says (maybe I repeat myself), choices at this time

influence a mothers health and happiness, ability to mother and

partner well for the next " 42 years " because of the kayakalpa window,

all tissues and systems in such deep transition and programed for deep

reset in direction of ability to serve this little one from all layers

of her being, all guided by the heart strings. Mom is

psychophysiologically as delicate as her baby in spite of abilities

and responsibilities her baby doesn't have. When we share this kind

of info with the family members, priorities shift often very quickly

however they are able. We often work with the mom to strengthen the

community network in how to best support, but those things this

mothers' community knows.

 

So we always give the vision of best choices, then encourage clearly

the dynamics of doing the best we can to organize in this direction

without strain on anyone's emotions or such, and then quietly give the

rest of the organizing to the Divine, which leaves us open to

receiving in the ways we can't see.

 

especially when she has given birth to a daughter. With son, things

> become little different. This particular mom was depressed after

> delivering a daughter, being muslim was another factor. The status

of muslim women is well known.

 

Big sigh, of course.

 

>The major boost in the milk came only after the ayurvedic intervention.

Of course

 

> do not have even privacy to feed their babies in a secluded room.

 

Probably breastfeeding there has much higher success rate than here,

and private room not so needed. We encourage it for first timeers who

are shy, having problems, or with overstimulated babies with tummies

sending the milk back the wrong way.

 

> Baby recives warm oil massage 1x daily. Suckling is strong, it is

> supply which is insufficient. Methi laddus etc is now given.

 

Good - not just strong suckling but frequency at the breast even more

than the usual digest time gaps will stimulate milk supply quickly.

If being spoon (or bottle) fed, very important to let baby suckle as

long as desired first. Sounds like the ayurvedic supports have been

helping to bring Mom back into her body and emotions also. Heat is

such an inexpensive and powerful medicine, oil and self massage also.

 

> Indians try to avoid bottle,

> outside milk is fed by spoon. slowly, baby snatches the cup and

> starts drinking the milk herself, as it grows.

 

We can take wisdom advice here. Actually doubly now, with the recent

discovery of the BSP (biasphenol?) found in toxic levels in so many

plastics including most baby bottles and pacifiers.

 

Warm Regards;

Ysha