Synthasis across systems

[Guest guest]

Vaidya Upadhye, wrote

 

> Chala characteristic is only of Vata dosha. Due to this Chala

characteristic the Vata dosha gets stimulated very easily. Vyana

vayu's function is to circulate blood flow with appropriate pressure.>

 

A few more comments about this point the Vaidya is making along with

the other point of translating concepts across systems.

 

In recent posts I was referring to the ANS (Autonomic Nervous System)

and Vaidya Upadhye asked me to translate these symbols into Ayurvedic

terms. In ancient times the observers did not know about certain

structures in the human body but they did know about their functions,

through observation of the effects of these functions. So although

they did not know about the physiological structure of the nervous

system they very extensively commented on the functions of the nervous

system, in fact many schools of thought arose around many of the

issues. In Ayurveda many of the functions of the nervous system were

described through elaboration of the Gunas and the Gurvadi Gunas, the

qualities of the effects. So in the case of Sthira/Chala Gunas this

describes the stability or mobility of functions, which is equivalent

to the major functions of the ANS.

 

Another system, the Chakra System elaborated very extensively on the

many functions of the ANS, through descriptions of the various

plexuses, these plexuses correlate very closely to the plexuses of the

ANS and their ganglia ( branches). So anyone who understands the

Chakra system can understand the ANS in general. In fact they will

understand it in more depth than most western scientists because

western science has not gone into these issues in near the depth that

ancient observers did, this is slowly changing though as western

scientists begin the process of understanding the relationship of

these plexuses and our evolutional progress. In western terminology

this has a great deal to do with the organs and their functions, the

relationship of the organs to each other, the relationship of the top

to the bottom, the front and the back, and the relationship of the

nervous system to the mind. This also relates to what in modern

terminology is called the Endocrine system.

 

Vaidya Upadhye mentioned Vyana Vayu; this is interesting since in the

Chakra system Vyana Vayu is related to the Manipura Chakra, the site

from which the Prana flows from the center to the periphery, and since

the Manipuri Chakra is related to the adrenal glands and especially

the adrenal cortex we see the relationship of the functions of the

Manipuri Chakra to the ANS. It the release of the adrenal hormones

that is responsible for the activation of the SNS (Sympathetic Nervous

System), the activating function of the ANS (Chala Vayu). I realize

there is some controversy on these points, some people make different

distinctions concerning the site of Vyana Vayu as it relates to the

Manipuri Chakra, the heart, and the liver, but in my opinion these are

only apparent contradictions and in fact all of those ideas can be

easily reconciled with each other. Nevertheless the point is that the

role of the circulation of the Prana is very closely related to the

ANS and two of its three divisions. The two divisions we are referring

to now are the Sympathetic Nervous System and the Parasympathetic

Nervous System, which are symbolized in Ayurveda through the

Sthira/Chala Vayu functions, stabilization versus activation.

 

Students of Astrology can make the same types of correspondences

through the symbols of the planets. The nervous system is generally

under the rule of Mercury but its many functions are modified by the

symbols of Jupiter, Saturn, Moon, Uranus, etc. In the Indian and

western systems of Astrology both schools have elaborated medical

Astrology to a very high level

 

So a basic translation across systems is not really that difficult for

anyone who has a pretty good knowledge of one system and a little

knowledge in the other system. But as I mentioned in another post the

in depth analysis of these correspondences between Ayurveda and

western systems has yet to be done. It will take a great genius in

both systems to do it, but I expect it to be done sometime in the near

future. Someone has told me that there are brilliant western medical

doctors working in the Maharishi Ayurveda movement who are becoming

great scholars in Ayurveda, perhaps such people will do the synthesis

work.

 

Liz

[Guest guest]

Dear Dr Liz

Nervous System, which are symbolized in Ayurveda through the

Sthira/Chala Vayu functions, stabilization versus activation

 

It is brilliant co relation I have came across until now. You have shown me a

direction for thinking and for new concept.

Thanks a lot

You have also mentioned about astrology. I have tried to co relate Astrology

and Ayurveda in my site. If you can spare some time then please go through the

pages of the my website and my analysis. I will appreciate if you can through

some light on some of the hypothesis such as Mercury is co related with Rasa

dhatu etc.

Best

Vaidya Upadhye

Please see www.astroayurvedalogy.com

__________________

Vaidya Upadhye, wrote

 

> Chala characteristic is only of Vata dosha. Due to this Chala

characteristic the Vata dosha gets stimulated very easily. Vyana

vayu's function is to circulate blood flow with appropriate pressure.>

[Guest guest]

Dear Vd Upadhye,

 

Regarding the theory you describe in your website of how an afflicted Mercury

can relate to heart attacks (instead of the Sun), I wanted to tell that in TCM,

the heart is closely linked to mental activity ( " Xin zhu shenzhi " ) which is

astrologically attributed to Mercury. This is due to the fact that the heart

blood, irrigating the brain, is very important for mental activity.

 

According to dr Frawley, there is probably not a one-to-one correlation between

the planets and the dhatus even though it seems to be the case in the

astrological treatises. For instance the Moon, being a watery planet, governs

the bodily fluid and can also be linked to the plasma and Rasa dhatu, along with

Mercury, its traditional ruler. The association of Rasa dhatu with Mercury is

actually less evident than it is with the Moon, even though there is a link

between this tissue and the skin, which is governed by Mercury. You may confirm

but I think that if the lymphatic tissue is healthy, the skin will glow. And

skin diseases often arise from a sensitive mind (Mercury ... and the Moon).

 

Best regards

Thierry

_________________

............... I have tried to co relate Astrology and Ayurveda in my site.

............ I will appreciate if you can through some light on some of the

hypothesis such as Mercury is co related with Rasa dhatu etc.

[Guest guest]

ayurveda , " Elizabeth Anne Hall "

<lizahallny wrote:

 

> Another system, the Chakra System elaborated very extensively on the

> many functions of the ANS, through descriptions of the various

> plexuses, these plexuses correlate very closely to the plexuses of

the

> ANS and their ganglia ( branches). So anyone who understands the

> Chakra system can understand the ANS in general. In fact they will

> understand it in more depth than most western scientists because

> western science has not gone into these issues in near the depth

that

> ancient observers did, this is slowly changing though as western

> scientists begin the process of understanding the relationship of

> these plexuses and our evolutional progress. In western terminology

> this has a great deal to do with the organs and their functions, the

> relationship of the organs to each other, the relationship of the

top

> to the bottom, the front and the back, and the relationship of the

> nervous system to the mind. This also relates to what in modern

> terminology is called the Endocrine system.

 

The correspondence between the ganglia and the chakras has been

hinted at in the Iron rules of the health posts. That is the reason

that while a surgeon is trying to give painless c-section, but

creates incontinence or many other side effects later. That is also

the reason, some of the organs in the proximity are " no entry " areas

for surgeons, especially in pelvic cavity. such organs are treated

marmas of highest order by acharyas. and since all glands act as an

orchestra, link between obesity, pcos, diabetes and thyroid

depression is implied, rather than direct. It will take decades for

modern science to understand the complex relationships between

glands. One must study the " minds of the cells " . Though we

intuitively feel mind to be housed in the brain, mind is spread all

over the body:

 

http://www.auroville.org/education/edu_centres/Ron_anastasia.htm

 

http://speakingoffaith.publicradio.org/programs/stress/mindbodyessay.shtml

[Guest guest]

We were discussing the " nature of mind " on another list - what IS mind? -

mind function and brain function, although connected are not the same thing

at all as we would all acknowledge - don't they say that the brain thinks in

the gut which is why a healthy gut is so very important - while " mind "

being, in essence - " consciousness " would naturally exist in all the body's

cells - terminology is a little vague in these subtle areas isn't it.

 

Can you explain it for us please Dr Bhate - I would be interested to hear

how you view these two aspects of man's expression of his being.

 

Best,

 

Jane

 

-

" Shirish Bhate " <shirishbhate

 

.. It will take decades for

> modern science to understand the complex relationships between

> glands. One must study the " minds of the cells " . Though we

> intuitively feel mind to be housed in the brain, mind is spread all

> over the body:

>

> http://www.auroville.org/education/edu_centres/Ron_anastasia.htm

>

> http://speakingoffaith.publicradio.org/programs/stress/mindbodyessay.shtml

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Thierry

You are absolutely right about skin and Mercury. I have corelated Mercury with

Rasadhatu. Rasa sarata[ good quality] is observed in relation with the texture

of the skin.

Second thing the Mercury is said to be impotent planet in Astrology. Klyabbya

i.e. impotency is of two types one is related with physical abnormality and

another with psychological abnormality. In natural horoscope i.e. of Langa sign

Arise, the third house is of Gemini whose signifactore is Mercury. Third house

signifies thinking process. Hence Psychological impotency is in relation with

Mercury and the status of Rasa dhatu.

Chintanat chati chintanat Rasavahini dushanti II

That means due to continuous thinking Rasa Vaha srotas [ Lymphatic system]

dushti takes place

 

Heart disease and Mercury

The Pathogenesis of Rhudroga [ Heart diseases]

Ayurveda has clearly stated that Rasa dhatu dusti due to Tridosha is the basic

Pathogenesis of Rhudroga.

The Sun do have influence on Heart. I co relate SA node with Sun. As the Sun

who is continuously radiating energy SA node is too generating impulses

continuously. Hence when the Sun is affected with Saturn or Jupiter [ though

both are friends] or Mars one will experience Arrhythmia, complete heart block,

bradycardia etc.

Best

Vaidya Upadhye

 

_________________

 

Regarding the theory you describe in your website of how an afflicted Mercury

can relate to heart attacks (instead of the Sun), I wanted to tell that in TCM,

the heart is closely linked to mental activity ( " Xin zhu shenzhi " ) which is

astrologically attributed to Mercury.

[Guest guest]

ayurveda , " Jane MacRoss " <highfield1

wrote:

>

> We were discussing the " nature of mind " on another list - what IS

mind? -

> mind function and brain function, although connected are not the

same thing

> at all as we would all acknowledge - don't they say that the brain

thinks in

> the gut which is why a healthy gut is so very important -

 

Mind as it is commonly referred to is an aspect of Ego (Ahamkara),

which was considered to be false because it is nothing more than a

synthasis or approximation of the reality that it refers and relates

to. Every atom, molecule, cell, Dhatu, organism, has it's own

intelligence or mind under which it manifests and functions. There is

the phenomenal world and it's intelligence and there is Maya and it's

intelligence. Here are a couple of links that give an overview of

these issues.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahamkara

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_%28illusion%29

 

Liz

[Guest guest]

This is a very brilliant analysis. Vayu is in constant motion but this

motion is relative and becomes more or less and changes it's

qualities, according to influences. Thanks.

 

Liz

____________

> The Sun do have influence on Heart. I co relate SA node with Sun.

As the Sun who is continuously radiating energy SA node is too

generating impulses continuously. Hence when the Sun is affected with

Saturn or Jupiter [ though both are friends] or Mars one will

experience Arrhythmia, complete heart block, bradycardia etc.

[Guest guest]

for me, mind is the sum total of body-brain interactions

the result of sensory input, processing and output

all this is mind

 

for what its worth, here is a short excerpt from my book on the

subject of mind (with diacritics removed):

 

" The underlying aspect of consciousness in Ayurvedic thought is

called the chitta, the total potential field of conditioned

consciousness. It is the repository of all aspects of conditioned

existence, and records these influences upon itself. It includes the

presence of subliminal activators called samskaras, the psychic

imprints that underlie our mental and emotional traits, derived from

our experience over many lifetimes. These psychic imprints propel

consciousness into action, regardless of whether the imprint is

unconscious or conscious, internal or external, desirable or

undesirable.

 

At the heart of this concept is the idea that it is these samskaras

that bind us to the wheel of samsara. The chain of cause and effect

that defines the existence of samsara is called pratityasamutpada

(pratitya 'dependent,' samutpada, 'origination'), first enunciated by

Gotama Buddha soon after he had attained nirvana. The Buddha

indicated that these samskaras exist and are created because of

avidya or 'ignorance,' that what we hold to be reality is in fact a

misconception that ultimately leads to dukha ('unhappiness').

 

According to the yogic tradition there are two forms of samskaras:

namely, those that promote the direction of consciousness externally

and generate further samskaras, called vyutthana ('waking

consciousness'); and those that stem the flow of consciousness and

thereby prevent the generation of further samskaras, called nirodha

('conscious restriction'). Nirodha is said to be synonymous with the

attainment of samadhi ('perfect concentration'), the highest limb of

ashtanga yoga, an absorptive state in which subject and object become

one.

 

Schematically, the yogic tradition indicates that the chitta is

comprised of the ahamkara, the manas and the buddhi. The ahamkara is

for the most part considered synonymous with the Western concept of

the ego, or that part of consciousness that retains a sense of

individuality, that responds to perceptions, feelings and thoughts

and thereby initiates a variety of activities. According to the

Ayurvedic perspective the ahamkara is the process of ahamkara is said

to arise because of a failure of our innate intelligence (buddhi),

whose correct orientation directs us to our true Self, that we are

Brahman. When the buddhi fails to perceive this it will mistake the

body for the Self, and the limits of human sensory perception (and

scientific instrumentation) for the whole of reality. The buddhi

then becomes a tool of the ahamkara, which uses this intelligence to

rationalize its existence, creating a mental illusion of reality.

This tool is the manas, or 'lower' mind, which concerns itself with

the organization of information received from the five senses. For

this reason manas is often referred to as the 'sixth' sense, and with

the five senses (jnana indriyas) forms the six-fold base (ayatana)

described in the Buddhist concept called pratityasamutpada

('dependent origination'). According to the schemata of

pratityasamutpada, the six-fold base undergoes 'contact' (sparsha)

with corporeal phenomena (i.e. the tanmatras and pancabuthas). This,

in turn, gives rise to 'sensory impressions' (vedana),

'desire' (trishna), 'attachment' (upadana), and then finally,

'becoming' (bhava). According to the Buddha this process of becoming

(i.e. the ahamkara) provides the impetus for birth, which ultimately

results in aging, disease and death (jaramarana), and thus dukha

('unhappiness'). "

Caldecott

todd

www.toddcaldecott.com

 

On 11-Mar-08, at 3:52 AM, ayurveda wrote:

 

> Re: Synthasis across systems

> Posted by: " Jane MacRoss " highfield1 janemacross

> Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:01 am (PDT)

>

> We were discussing the " nature of mind " on another list - what IS

> mind? -

> mind function and brain function, although connected are not the

> same thing

> at all as we would all acknowledge - don't they say that the brain

> thinks in

> the gut which is why a healthy gut is so very important - while " mind "

> being, in essence - " consciousness " would naturally exist in all

> the body's

> cells - terminology is a little vague in these subtle areas isn't it.

>

> Can you explain it for us please Dr Bhate - I would be interested

> to hear

> how you view these two aspects of man's expression of his being.

>

> Best,

>

> Jane