Guest guest Posted December 17, 2008 Report Share Posted December 17, 2008 Boy (as my nonogerian revered teacher calls out), Mleccha Desa Kalinga was yet another independent entitity. The Matsya Purana says, even after a pilgrimage to Kalinga, one has to undertake acts expitiation !! However, mighty Kalinga did have Rik Vedic Brahmans on dt. c.400A.D. This is hard evidenced based. i come from a Kalinga/Odra PRATIPALITA authentic Siddhant brahmin (?) house, belonging to Mandana Misra school. Dr. db Bhubaneswar ======================== - Kishore patnaik Wednesday, December 17, 2008 12:19 PM Re: Some musings on Ancient Indian Geography hinducivilization , "Bhalchandra Thattey"<tobhalgt wrote:You are right.Marathi langugae is nearest to Sanskrit, but Maharashtra is one of thePanch_Dravidas including Karnataka, Andhra, TamilNadu and Kerala.The regions to the north are home to the Pancha_Gaudas.Traditionally Pancha_Dravidas intermarry but they do not marry with thePanch_Gaudas. and vice-a-versaOn 12/7/08, Kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09 wrote:>> The most intriguing factor is the commonality and the differences> between North Indians and South Indians.>> I am a Telugu and I think my language is "Aryan", In fact, I place it> in the sub group of Dardic languages. The Linguists differ.>> Pali langauge, an Aryan language, was prevalent in south India> Relationship fo the language of Pisaci, from which modern Telugu> evolved, with Pali is to be explored.>> All said and done, we have to reject the existing prejudices and start> afresh looking into the 'Aryan" and "Dravidian" definitions.>> Kishore patnaik>> --- Inhinducivilization <hinducivilization%40>,> Vedaprakash Vedaprakash> <vedamvedaprakash@> wrote:> >> > The so-called "Dravidians" have "Sangam literature", just like> "Aryans" who have "Sanskrit literature".> >> > Like the research conducted by the Indologists on "Sanskrit> literature" to discover or invent Aryans and Dravidians, enough> research have not been conducted on "Sangam literature".> >> > If you read "Ancient Tamil / Sangam literature", you cannot find any> reference implicitly or explicitly that they were called themselves> "Dravidians" or they came from outside, as the "geographical> description" as described in it, it locates within the boundaries of> South India or perhaps beyond South India!> >> > --- On Sat, 12/6/08, kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@> wrote:> > kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@>> > [hc] Re: Some musings on Ancient Indian Geography> > <%40>,> ""> < <%40>>,> "indiaarchaeology"> <IndiaArchaeology <IndiaArchaeology%40>>,>bharatiyaexpertsforum <bharatiyaexpertsforum%40>> ,> hinducivilization <hinducivilization%40>,> akandabaratam <akandabaratam%40>> > Saturday, December 6, 2008, 9:28 PM> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Another route by which Aryans seem to have gone to South> > India was by sea � from Indus to Kutch and from there, by sea coast to> > Saurashtra or Kathiawar. From Kathiawar, they went to Modern Broach> , from> > where they proceeded to Sopara (Supparaka) in Thane district,> Maharashtra.> >> > After Mahabharata war, there was a declinein Aryan civilzation and> > there was a mix of various tribes, just as feared by Arjuna in thefirst> > chapter of Bhagavad Gita that there will be destruction of Varna> Dharma and the> > women folk will become daring in their marriage with men from other> Varnas.> >> > �> >> > Baudhayana� in his Dharmasutras> > quotes a verse from the Bhallavan school fo Law, which tells us that> >> > The inhabitants of Sindhu , Sauvira and Surashtra like those> > of Deccan were of mixed origin. It is possible that Aryans were> recolonizing> > these parts, much time after Mbh. Towards the end of period of> Dharma sutras,> > they seem to have advanced as far south as Sopara.� Since no mention> is traceable of any inland> > countries or towns between� the sea coast> > and Deccan, it is clear that they must have taken a sea route.> >> > Kittel� in his Kannada> > English Dictionary gives a long list of Sanskrit words which seems> to have been> > derived from Dravidian languages.> >> > For eg., Matachi (Chandogya 1.10.1) occuring in the passage "matachi> > hateshu Kurushu atikya saha jayaya ushastir , ha chakrayana� ibhya> �grame pradranaka uvasa"> >> > The verse speaks of devastation of crops in Kuru country due> > to matachi, which is nothing but locusts(red colored winged creatures)> > (JRAS,1911, p 510), which is equivalent to midiche in Kannada or> midatha in> > Telugu. (grasshopper or locust)� It is> > astonishing that how a dravidian word is found in a purely northIndian> > Upanishad, which was supposed to have composed primarily in Punjab.> That some> > explanations that� Dravidian languages> > were present in NI prior to Aryanization, say as evidenced by the> language of> > Brahuii does not explain this fact very well.�> > This only can be explained by a) the antiquity of the Upanishads,taking> > them much before the times of IVC and b) the interaction between the> NI and SI.> >> >> > The Aryan words or langauge supplanting in a �Dravidian country> rather superficially �can not be really argued because for eg., thenames> > of even lowly goldsmiths or leather workers �in Bhattiprolu and> Amaravati inscriptions of> > early periods were totally sanskrit names and not dravidian, as> evidenced by> > the early inscriptions. �The names> > mentioned are Siddhartha, Vriddhika , Naga, Kanha and so on.� One> curious thing happens here that Kanha, an> > Aryan by name, calls himself a Damila (ASSI, I p 104) This shows> that Damila is> > not a race distinct from Aryans.> >> > Coupled this with the fact we find Pali inscriptions of much> > early periods show that Aryans were settled in South India for a> very long time> > than that is being thought today.� Pali was> > in fact continued to be the official langauge in "dravidian "> kingdoms and this> > shows that Pali was not a which was supplanted at a later date must> have been a> > natural langauge of the area. �Here, we> > are talking of Malavalli inscriptions, Karnataka by Chutukalanamda> satakarni of> > Kadamba dynasty , king of Vaijayanti or Banavasi of North canarese> district,> > Karnataka. Another king connected to this dynasty is Mulanamda ,> both of who> > have issued coins. Jayavarman, Pallavan king of Kanchi issued copper> plate> > grants in Pali language, as did Vijayadevavarman.> >> > �> >> > That fact that every one of these is a title deed and has> > been drawn up in Pali shows that this Aryan langauge must have been> known not> > only to officials but also to literate and semi literate people,> since these> > grants went even to villagers and guards and cowherds.� By no> stretch of imagination, you can think> > that these common people could understand a foreign language, thus> making Pali> > a local and natural language in South India at that time.> >> > �> >> > �> >> > �> >>> >-- Bhalchandra G. ThatteyShubham BhavatuSvalpasya Yogasya Trayate Mahato Bhayat--- End forwarded message --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2008 Report Share Posted December 17, 2008 There is a place in modern Orissa which is a forest and hilly region called VedaVyas.The great Ithihaasa Mahaabharata was written by Krishnaddwaipaayana Veda Vyasa in this place.Veda Vyasa was a witness of the Mahaabharata.The Great War of Mahabharata took place in the year 3065 BC.This has been scientifically and historically proved including me.For scientific evidence read the work of Prof Narahari Acharya. B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN. website: www.vedascience.com ODDISILAB <oddisilab1 Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 12:52:31 PM Mleccha Desa Kalinga Boy (as my nonogerian revered teacher calls out), Mleccha Desa Kalinga was yet another independent entitity. The Matsya Purana says, even after a pilgrimage to Kalinga, one has to undertake acts expitiation !! However, mighty Kalinga did have Rik Vedic Brahmans on dt. c.400A.D. This is hard evidenced based. i come from a Kalinga/Odra PRATIPALITA authentic Siddhant brahmin (?) house, belonging to Mandana Misra school. Dr. db Bhubaneswar ============ ========= === - Kishore patnaik Wednesday, December 17, 2008 12:19 PM Re: Some musings on Ancient Indian Geography hinducivilization, "Bhalchandra Thattey"<tobhalgt@.. .> wrote:You are right.Marathi langugae is nearest to Sanskrit, but Maharashtra is one of thePanch_Dravidas including Karnataka, Andhra, TamilNadu and Kerala.The regions to the north are home to the Pancha_Gaudas.Traditionally Pancha_Dravidas intermarry but they do not marry with thePanch_Gaudas. and vice-a-versaOn 12/7/08, Kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ ...> wrote:>> The most intriguing factor is the commonality and the differences> between North Indians and South Indians.>> I am a Telugu and I think my language is "Aryan", In fact, I place it> in the sub group of Dardic languages. The Linguists differ.>> Pali langauge, an Aryan language, was prevalent in south India> Relationship fo the language of Pisaci, from which modern Telugu> evolved, with Pali is to be explored.>> All said and done, we have to reject the existing prejudices and start> afresh looking into the 'Aryan" and "Dravidian" definitions.>> Kishore patnaik>> --- Inhinducivilization<hinducivilization% 40. com>,> Vedaprakash Vedaprakash> <vedamvedaprakash@ > wrote:> >> > The so-called "Dravidians" have "Sangam literature", just like> "Aryans" who have "Sanskrit literature".> >> > Like the research conducted by the Indologists on "Sanskrit> literature" to discover or invent Aryans and Dravidians, enough> research have not been conducted on "Sangam literature".> >> > If you read "Ancient Tamil / Sangam literature", you cannot find any> reference implicitly or explicitly that they were called themselves> "Dravidians" or they came from outside, as the "geographical> description" as described in it, it locates within the boundaries of> South India or perhaps beyond South India!> >> > --- On Sat, 12/6/08, kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ > wrote:> > kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ >> > [hc] Re: Some musings on Ancient Indian Geography> > <% 40. com>,> ""> < <% 40. com>>,> "indiaarchaeology"> <IndiaArchaeology <IndiaArchaeology% 40. com>>,>bharatiyaexpertsfor um <bharatiyaexpertsfo rum%40 s.com>> ,> hinducivilization <hinducivilization% 40. com>,> akandabaratam <akandabaratam% 40. com>> > Saturday, December 6, 2008, 9:28 PM> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Another route by which Aryans seem to have gone to South> > India was by sea � from Indus to Kutch and from there, by sea coast to> > Saurashtra or Kathiawar. From Kathiawar, they went to Modern Broach> , from> > where they proceeded to Sopara (Supparaka) in Thane district,> Maharashtra.> >> > After Mahabharata war, there was a declinein Aryan civilzation and> > there was a mix of various tribes, just as feared by Arjuna in thefirst> > chapter of Bhagavad Gita that there will be destruction of Varna> Dharma and the> > women folk will become daring in their marriage with men from other> Varnas.> >> > �> >> > Baudhayana� in his Dharmasutras> > quotes a verse from the Bhallavan school fo Law, which tells us that> >> > The inhabitants of Sindhu , Sauvira and Surashtra like those> > of Deccan were of mixed origin. It is possible that Aryans were> recolonizing> > these parts, much time after Mbh. Towards the end of period of> Dharma sutras,> > they seem to have advanced as far south as Sopara.� Since no mention> is traceable of any inland> > countries or towns between� the sea coast> > and Deccan, it is clear that they must have taken a sea route.> >> > Kittel� in his Kannada> > English Dictionary gives a long list of Sanskrit words which seems> to have been> > derived from Dravidian languages.> >> > For eg., Matachi (Chandogya 1.10.1) occuring in the passage "matachi> > hateshu Kurushu atikya saha jayaya ushastir , ha chakrayana� ibhya> �grame pradranaka uvasa"> >> > The verse speaks of devastation of crops in Kuru country due> > to matachi, which is nothing but locusts(red colored winged creatures)> > (JRAS,1911, p 510), which is equivalent to midiche in Kannada or> midatha in> > Telugu. (grasshopper or locust)� It is> > astonishing that how a dravidian word is found in a purely northIndian> > Upanishad, which was supposed to have composed primarily in Punjab.> That some> > explanations that� Dravidian languages> > were present in NI prior to Aryanization, say as evidenced by the> language of> > Brahuii does not explain this fact very well.�> > This only can be explained by a) the antiquity of the Upanishads,taking> > them much before the times of IVC and b) the interaction between the> NI and SI.> >> >> > The Aryan words or langauge supplanting in a �Dravidian country> rather superficially �can not be really argued because for eg., thenames> > of even lowly goldsmiths or leather workers �in Bhattiprolu and> Amaravati inscriptions of> > early periods were totally sanskrit names and not dravidian, as> evidenced by> > the early inscriptions. �The names> > mentioned are Siddhartha, Vriddhika , Naga, Kanha and so on.� One> curious thing happens here that Kanha, an> > Aryan by name, calls himself a Damila (ASSI, I p 104) This shows> that Damila is> > not a race distinct from Aryans.> >> > Coupled this with the fact we find Pali inscriptions of much> > early periods show that Aryans were settled in South India for a> very long time> > than that is being thought today.� Pali was> > in fact continued to be the official langauge in "dravidian "> kingdoms and this> > shows that Pali was not a which was supplanted at a later date must> have been a> > natural langauge of the area. �Here, we> > are talking of Malavalli inscriptions, Karnataka by Chutukalanamda> satakarni of> > Kadamba dynasty , king of Vaijayanti or Banavasi of North canarese> district,> > Karnataka. Another king connected to this dynasty is Mulanamda ,> both of who> > have issued coins. Jayavarman, Pallavan king of Kanchi issued copper> plate> > grants in Pali language, as did Vijayadevavarman.> >> > �> >> > That fact that every one of these is a title deed and has> > been drawn up in Pali shows that this Aryan langauge must have been> known not> > only to officials but also to literate and semi literate people,> since these> > grants went even to villagers and guards and cowherds.� By no> stretch of imagination, you can think> > that these common people could understand a foreign language, thus> making Pali> > a local and natural language in South India at that time.> >> > �> >> > �> >> > �> >>> >-- Bhalchandra G. ThatteyShubham BhavatuSvalpasya Yogasya Trayate Mahato Bhayat--- End forwarded message --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2008 Report Share Posted December 17, 2008 Lord Krishna left his mortal frame in 3102 BCE. How could the Mahabharata war take place 37 years after Lord left his mortal frame? Sunil K. bhattacharjya --- On Wed, 12/17/08, venkata krishnan <bcvk71 wrote: venkata krishnan <bcvk71Re: Mleccha Desa Kalinga Cc: "kishore patnaik" <kishorepatnaik09, oddisilab1Date: Wednesday, December 17, 2008, 4:14 AM There is a place in modern Orissa which is a forest and hilly region called VedaVyas.The great Ithihaasa Mahaabharata was written by Krishnaddwaipaayana Veda Vyasa in this place.Veda Vyasa was a witness of the Mahaabharata. The Great War of Mahabharata took place in the year 3065 BC.This has been scientifically and historically proved including me.For scientific evidence read the work of Prof Narahari Acharya. B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN . website: www.vedascience. com ODDISILAB <oddisilab1 (AT) dataone (DOT) in>Wednesday, December 17, 2008 12:52:31 PM Mleccha Desa Kalinga Boy (as my nonogerian revered teacher calls out), Mleccha Desa Kalinga was yet another independent entitity. The Matsya Purana says, even after a pilgrimage to Kalinga, one has to undertake acts expitiation !! However, mighty Kalinga did have Rik Vedic Brahmans on dt. c.400A.D. This is hard evidenced based. i come from a Kalinga/Odra PRATIPALITA authentic Siddhant brahmin (?) house, belonging to Mandana Misra school. Dr. db Bhubaneswar ============ ========= === - Kishore patnaik Wednesday, December 17, 2008 12:19 PM Re: Some musings on Ancient Indian Geography hinducivilization, "Bhalchandra Thattey"<tobhalgt@.. .> wrote:You are right.Marathi langugae is nearest to Sanskrit, but Maharashtra is one of thePanch_Dravidas including Karnataka, Andhra, TamilNadu and Kerala.The regions to the north are home to the Pancha_Gaudas.Traditionally Pancha_Dravidas intermarry but they do not marry with thePanch_Gaudas. and vice-a-versaOn 12/7/08, Kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ ...> wrote:>> The most intriguing factor is the commonality and the differences> between North Indians and South Indians.>> I am a Telugu and I think my language is "Aryan", In fact, I place it> in the sub group of Dardic languages. The Linguists differ.>> Pali langauge, an Aryan language, was prevalent in south India> Relationship fo the language of Pisaci, from which modern Telugu> evolved, with Pali is to be explored.>> All said and done, we have to reject the existing prejudices and start> afresh looking into the 'Aryan" and "Dravidian" definitions.>> Kishore patnaik>> --- Inhinducivilization<hinducivilization% 40. com>,> Vedaprakash Vedaprakash> <vedamvedaprakash@ > wrote:> >> > The so-called "Dravidians" have "Sangam literature", just like> "Aryans" who have "Sanskrit literature".> >> > Like the research conducted by the Indologists on "Sanskrit> literature" to discover or invent Aryans and Dravidians, enough> research have not been conducted on "Sangam literature".> >> > If you read "Ancient Tamil / Sangam literature", you cannot find any> reference implicitly or explicitly that they were called themselves> "Dravidians" or they came from outside, as the "geographical> description" as described in it, it locates within the boundaries of> South India or perhaps beyond South India!> >> > --- On Sat, 12/6/08, kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ > wrote:> > kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ >> > [hc] Re: Some musings on Ancient Indian Geography> > <% 40. com>,> ""> < <% 40. com>>,> "indiaarchaeology"> <IndiaArchaeology <IndiaArchaeology% 40. com>>,>bharatiyaexpertsfor um <bharatiyaexpertsfo rum%40 s.com>> ,> hinducivilization <hinducivilization% 40. com>,> akandabaratam <akandabaratam% 40. com>> > Saturday, December 6, 2008, 9:28 PM> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Another route by which Aryans seem to have gone to South> > India was by sea � from Indus to Kutch and from there, by sea coast to> > Saurashtra or Kathiawar. From Kathiawar, they went to Modern Broach> , from> > where they proceeded to Sopara (Supparaka) in Thane district,> Maharashtra.> >> > After Mahabharata war, there was a declinein Aryan civilzation and> > there was a mix of various tribes, just as feared by Arjuna in thefirst> > chapter of Bhagavad Gita that there will be destruction of Varna> Dharma and the> > women folk will become daring in their marriage with men from other> Varnas.> >> > �> >> > Baudhayana� in his Dharmasutras> > quotes a verse from the Bhallavan school fo Law, which tells us that> >> > The inhabitants of Sindhu , Sauvira and Surashtra like those> > of Deccan were of mixed origin. It is possible that Aryans were> recolonizing> > these parts, much time after Mbh. Towards the end of period of> Dharma sutras,> > they seem to have advanced as far south as Sopara.� Since no mention> is traceable of any inland> > countries or towns between� the sea coast> > and Deccan, it is clear that they must have taken a sea route.> >> > Kittel� in his Kannada> > English Dictionary gives a long list of Sanskrit words which seems> to have been> > derived from Dravidian languages.> >> > For eg., Matachi (Chandogya 1.10.1) occuring in the passage "matachi> > hateshu Kurushu atikya saha jayaya ushastir , ha chakrayana� ibhya> �grame pradranaka uvasa"> >> > The verse speaks of devastation of crops in Kuru country due> > to matachi, which is nothing but locusts(red colored winged creatures)> > (JRAS,1911, p 510), which is equivalent to midiche in Kannada or> midatha in> > Telugu. (grasshopper or locust)� It is> > astonishing that how a dravidian word is found in a purely northIndian> > Upanishad, which was supposed to have composed primarily in Punjab.> That some> > explanations that� Dravidian languages> > were present in NI prior to Aryanization, say as evidenced by the> language of> > Brahuii does not explain this fact very well.�> > This only can be explained by a) the antiquity of the Upanishads,taking> > them much before the times of IVC and b) the interaction between the> NI and SI.> >> >> > The Aryan words or langauge supplanting in a �Dravidian country> rather superficially �can not be really argued because for eg., thenames> > of even lowly goldsmiths or leather workers �in Bhattiprolu and> Amaravati inscriptions of> > early periods were totally sanskrit names and not dravidian, as> evidenced by> > the early inscriptions. �The names> > mentioned are Siddhartha, Vriddhika , Naga, Kanha and so on.� One> curious thing happens here that Kanha, an> > Aryan by name, calls himself a Damila (ASSI, I p 104) This shows> that Damila is> > not a race distinct from Aryans.> >> > Coupled this with the fact we find Pali inscriptions of much> > early periods show that Aryans were settled in South India for a> very long time> > than that is being thought today.� Pali was> > in fact continued to be the official langauge in "dravidian "> kingdoms and this> > shows that Pali was not a which was supplanted at a later date must> have been a> > natural langauge of the area. �Here, we> > are talking of Malavalli inscriptions, Karnataka by Chutukalanamda> satakarni of> > Kadamba dynasty , king of Vaijayanti or Banavasi of North canarese> district,> > Karnataka. Another king connected to this dynasty is Mulanamda ,> both of who> > have issued coins. Jayavarman, Pallavan king of Kanchi issued copper> plate> > grants in Pali language, as did Vijayadevavarman.> >> > �> >> > That fact that every one of these is a title deed and has> > been drawn up in Pali shows that this Aryan langauge must have been> known not> > only to officials but also to literate and semi literate people,> since these> > grants went even to villagers and guards and cowherds.� By no> stretch of imagination, you can think> > that these common people could understand a foreign language, thus> making Pali> > a local and natural language in South India at that time.> >> > �> >> > �> >> > �> >>> >-- Bhalchandra G. ThatteyShubham BhavatuSvalpasya Yogasya Trayate Mahato Bhayat--- End forwarded message --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2008 Report Share Posted December 18, 2008 Adi Sankaracharya established the Govardhana Math in Puri in the early part of the 5th century BCE. This Math was supposed to teach the Rig Veda and this makes it obvious that Rig Vedic brahmins came to be there in Kalinga in those days, if not earlier. skb--- On Tue, 12/16/08, ODDISILAB <oddisilab1 wrote: ODDISILAB <oddisilab1 Mleccha Desa Kalinga Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 11:22 PM Boy (as my nonogerian revered teacher calls out), Mleccha Desa Kalinga was yet another independent entitity. The Matsya Purana says, even after a pilgrimage to Kalinga, one has to undertake acts expitiation !! However, mighty Kalinga did have Rik Vedic Brahmans on dt. c.400A.D. This is hard evidenced based. i come from a Kalinga/Odra PRATIPALITA authentic Siddhant brahmin (?) house, belonging to Mandana Misra school. Dr. db Bhubaneswar ============ ========= === - Kishore patnaik Wednesday, December 17, 2008 12:19 PM Re: Some musings on Ancient Indian Geography hinducivilization, "Bhalchandra Thattey"<tobhalgt@.. .> wrote:You are right.Marathi langugae is nearest to Sanskrit, but Maharashtra is one of thePanch_Dravidas including Karnataka, Andhra, TamilNadu and Kerala.The regions to the north are home to the Pancha_Gaudas.Traditionally Pancha_Dravidas intermarry but they do not marry with thePanch_Gaudas. and vice-a-versaOn 12/7/08, Kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ ...> wrote:>> The most intriguing factor is the commonality and the differences> between North Indians and South Indians.>> I am a Telugu and I think my language is "Aryan", In fact, I place it> in the sub group of Dardic languages. The Linguists differ.>> Pali langauge, an Aryan language, was prevalent in south India> Relationship fo the language of Pisaci, from which modern Telugu> evolved, with Pali is to be explored.>> All said and done, we have to reject the existing prejudices and start> afresh looking into the 'Aryan" and "Dravidian" definitions.>> Kishore patnaik>> --- Inhinducivilization<hinducivilization% 40. com>,> Vedaprakash Vedaprakash> <vedamvedaprakash@ > wrote:> >> > The so-called "Dravidians" have "Sangam literature", just like> "Aryans" who have "Sanskrit literature".> >> > Like the research conducted by the Indologists on "Sanskrit> literature" to discover or invent Aryans and Dravidians, enough> research have not been conducted on "Sangam literature".> >> > If you read "Ancient Tamil / Sangam literature", you cannot find any> reference implicitly or explicitly that they were called themselves> "Dravidians" or they came from outside, as the "geographical> description" as described in it, it locates within the boundaries of> South India or perhaps beyond South India!> >> > --- On Sat, 12/6/08, kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ > wrote:> > kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ >> > [hc] Re: Some musings on Ancient Indian Geography> > <% 40. com>,> ""> < <% 40. com>>,> "indiaarchaeology"> <IndiaArchaeology <IndiaArchaeology% 40. com>>,>bharatiyaexpertsfor um <bharatiyaexpertsfo rum%40 s.com>> ,> hinducivilization <hinducivilization% 40. com>,> akandabaratam <akandabaratam% 40. com>> > Saturday, December 6, 2008, 9:28 PM> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Another route by which Aryans seem to have gone to South> > India was by sea � from Indus to Kutch and from there, by sea coast to> > Saurashtra or Kathiawar. From Kathiawar, they went to Modern Broach> , from> > where they proceeded to Sopara (Supparaka) in Thane district,> Maharashtra.> >> > After Mahabharata war, there was a declinein Aryan civilzation and> > there was a mix of various tribes, just as feared by Arjuna in thefirst> > chapter of Bhagavad Gita that there will be destruction of Varna> Dharma and the> > women folk will become daring in their marriage with men from other> Varnas.> >> > �> >> > Baudhayana� in his Dharmasutras> > quotes a verse from the Bhallavan school fo Law, which tells us that> >> > The inhabitants of Sindhu , Sauvira and Surashtra like those> > of Deccan were of mixed origin. It is possible that Aryans were> recolonizing> > these parts, much time after Mbh. Towards the end of period of> Dharma sutras,> > they seem to have advanced as far south as Sopara.� Since no mention> is traceable of any inland> > countries or towns between� the sea coast> > and Deccan, it is clear that they must have taken a sea route.> >> > Kittel� in his Kannada> > English Dictionary gives a long list of Sanskrit words which seems> to have been> > derived from Dravidian languages.> >> > For eg., Matachi (Chandogya 1.10.1) occuring in the passage "matachi> > hateshu Kurushu atikya saha jayaya ushastir , ha chakrayana� ibhya> �grame pradranaka uvasa"> >> > The verse speaks of devastation of crops in Kuru country due> > to matachi, which is nothing but locusts(red colored winged creatures)> > (JRAS,1911, p 510), which is equivalent to midiche in Kannada or> midatha in> > Telugu. (grasshopper or locust)� It is> > astonishing that how a dravidian word is found in a purely northIndian> > Upanishad, which was supposed to have composed primarily in Punjab.> That some> > explanations that� Dravidian languages> > were present in NI prior to Aryanization, say as evidenced by the> language of> > Brahuii does not explain this fact very well.�> > This only can be explained by a) the antiquity of the Upanishads,taking> > them much before the times of IVC and b) the interaction between the> NI and SI.> >> >> > The Aryan words or langauge supplanting in a �Dravidian country> rather superficially �can not be really argued because for eg., thenames> > of even lowly goldsmiths or leather workers �in Bhattiprolu and> Amaravati inscriptions of> > early periods were totally sanskrit names and not dravidian, as> evidenced by> > the early inscriptions. �The names> > mentioned are Siddhartha, Vriddhika , Naga, Kanha and so on.� One> curious thing happens here that Kanha, an> > Aryan by name, calls himself a Damila (ASSI, I p 104) This shows> that Damila is> > not a race distinct from Aryans.> >> > Coupled this with the fact we find Pali inscriptions of much> > early periods show that Aryans were settled in South India for a> very long time> > than that is being thought today.� Pali was> > in fact continued to be the official langauge in "dravidian "> kingdoms and this> > shows that Pali was not a which was supplanted at a later date must> have been a> > natural langauge of the area. �Here, we> > are talking of Malavalli inscriptions, Karnataka by Chutukalanamda> satakarni of> > Kadamba dynasty , king of Vaijayanti or Banavasi of North canarese> district,> > Karnataka. Another king connected to this dynasty is Mulanamda ,> both of who> > have issued coins. Jayavarman, Pallavan king of Kanchi issued copper> plate> > grants in Pali language, as did Vijayadevavarman.> >> > �> >> > That fact that every one of these is a title deed and has> > been drawn up in Pali shows that this Aryan langauge must have been> known not> > only to officials but also to literate and semi literate people,> since these> > grants went even to villagers and guards and cowherds.� By no> stretch of imagination, you can think> > that these common people could understand a foreign language, thus> making Pali> > a local and natural language in South India at that time.> >> > �> >> > �> >> > �> >>> >-- Bhalchandra G. ThatteyShubham BhavatuSvalpasya Yogasya Trayate Mahato Bhayat--- End forwarded message --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2008 Report Share Posted December 18, 2008 There is a place called Mana Cave in the Himalayan region which is known as Vyasa Gufa. Nearby is Ganesha Gufa. It is said that in Ganesha Gufa, Shri Ganesha was requested to help Vyasa write the Mahabharata. Vyasa retired in the Mana cave and wrote the Epic. So, here we find contradictory ideas. Kamlesh On Behalf Of venkata krishnan Wednesday, December 17, 2008 7:15 AM Cc: kishore patnaik; oddisilab1 Re: Mleccha Desa Kalinga There is a place in modern Orissa which is a forest and hilly region called VedaVyas.The great Ithihaasa Mahaabharata was written by Krishnaddwaipaayana Veda Vyasa in this place.Veda Vyasa was a witness of the Mahaabharata.The Great War of Mahabharata took place in the year 3065 BC.This has been scientifically and historically proved including me.For scientific evidence read the work of Prof Narahari Acharya. B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN. website: www.vedascience.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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