Guest guest Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 Dear All With Due respect to Venkata Krishnan, it is inappropriate to be in Om Namah Shivaya Group and speak ill about Lord Shiva. I request you please unsubsribe and make peace in yourselves.N.Ranganathan B.E, C.Eng, FISE, PGDBM Senior Electrical Engineer Doha--- On Wed, 10/8/08, venkata krishnan <bcvk71 wrote: venkata krishnan <bcvk71Re: Re: Why Vaishnavites insult Shaivtes , "BCVENKATAKRISHNANNewsListgroup" <bcvenkatakrishnannewslist >Wednesday, October 8, 2008, 6:34 AM Dear Vijji Bajji, You are totally wrong and misinformed.Who told you that Ramanuja was a Sivaite and Adi Sankara was a Saivite.Ramanuja's first Guru was Yadavaprakasa who was a BedaABeda Acharya and who was a exponent of Advaita who was also a Vaishnavite.Later on Ramanuja became the follower of Alavandar who was a Great Scholar of Sri Vaishnavism.Ramanuja was always a Vaishnava.The only change in his life was that he was a mere Vaishnava by birth who later on converted to Srivaishnavism after becomming the followe of Alavandar.Adi Sankara was also a Vaishnava.The only difference being that in their philosophy. The philosophy of Naadamuni was Visishtaadvaita and that of Gaudapada was Advaita.Gaudapada was the Acharya of Adi Saankara.Even today in Kanchi Sankara \Matam for all official purposes the Samkaraacharya signs only as OM NAMO NAARAAYANAAYA and not Nassivaaya.According to Vedas LORD NAARAAYANA is the Supreme Brahman.And all the Vedantins accept that.According to Vedas there are 11 RUDRAS.And the Naayanmaars combined the 11Rudras as one God and christained that God as Siva.Saivism originated only after the advent of Naayanmaars and there was no God called Siva before the Naayanmaars there was only Rudra.The Lord SANKARA is the first among the 11 Ridras according to Vedas and he is the son of Brahma an d Brahma is the son of PARABRAHMAN LORD NAARAAYANA according to Vedas.The later Advaitins betrayed Adi Sankara and began to follow a new philosophy saying All Gods are one and only their names are different which againszt the original Advaitam established by Adi Sankara.Saivism is against Vedas by claimimg mythical God Siva is the Supreme Brahman a nd not LORD NAARAAYANA.And many of the Saivaites equate Lord Siva with Lord VISHNU and LORD BRAHMA and sayall the 3 are same which is against VEDAS.So, Saivism is a Nastika Religion which does not accept the authority of Vedas.Assuming the current Advaitaacharyas wrong inerpretation of Adi Sankara itszelf as the philosophy of Saivasm and Saakthaism , the Saivaites philosophy is Secularism and their claim that Vaishnavas should follow their Philosophy and ideology does not hold water.Since, Advaitam is not the philosophy of Vaishnavites and Visishtaaddvaitam is the Philosophy of Srivaishnavism.Sorry if I had wounded anyones wrong beliefs in the forumby posting the truths.Vedas are the ultimate.It is the only PRAMAANA. B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN. website: www.vedascience.com genghis1291 <genghis Re: Why Vaishnavites insult Shaivtes Date: Tuesday, October 7, 2008, 8:46 AM There is a lot of misinformation about the beliefs on either sidecontributing to the superficial tensions...In the mix are:1. The Purusha Suktam from the Rig Veda2. The Brahma Sutra of Badrayana (like a commentary on the PurushaSuktam)3. Adi Shankara and his commentary on the Brahma Sutra4. Possible MIS-interpretations /extrapolations by the naive onShankara's commentary - this apparently led to serious intellectual andmoral degradation in Shaivite society in the 200 years after Shankara5. Ramanujacharya, a Shaivite-turned Vaishnavite who came 200 yearsafter Shankara and his commentary on the Brahma Sutra. The naive amongShaivites claim Ramanuja refuted Shankara...he did no such thing...infact, he relied very heavily on Shankara's work,; he also went to theFULL original of the Brahma Sutra (not the abridged 4-page versionrelied on by Shankara and others in his time) and has categoricallystated that he provided further clarity on Shankara's work.If people are interested in this topic, I will provide a brief overviewlaterGenghisom_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.com, mohan dadlani<mohan_dadlani@ ...> wrote:>>> In my view Lord Shiva and Lord Vishnu are 2 sides of the same coin.> God is one, we humans can call in different names.> It is not worthwhile to engage in any arguments on this issue. LetHindus unite and not waste time and energy in unnecessary arguments.> Om Shant, Shanti, Shanti>>>> om_namah_shivaya_ group : bhatnagar_shailendr a: Mon, 6 Oct2008 15:27:48 +0000[om_namah_shivaya_ group] Re: WhyVaishnavites insult Shaivtes>>>>> Om Namah SivayaNamaste, This is a sensitive topic so it is better notto discuss it. This one mantra from Kaivalya Upanishat seals the matterwithout controversy : sa brahmaa sa shivaH sendraH so.aksharaH paramaHsvaraaT .sa eva vishhNuH sa praaNaH sa kaalo.agniH sa chandramaaH(Brahma, Shiv, Indra, Om, Vishnu, Prana, Kaal, Agni, Chandrama etc areall one - the absolute/OM/ infinity) .Secondly, there can be only oneinfinity. regards,Shailendra>>>>>> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn "10 hidden secrets"from Jamie.>http://windowslive. com/connect/ post/jamiethomso n.spaces. live.com- Blog-cn\s!550F681DAD532637! 5295.entry? ocid=TXT_ TAGLM_WL_ domore_092008> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 dear shivbhakts om namo bhagawate rudraya firstly my heartiest vijaya dasami (dasara) greetings to all. the querent and the poster of the messages on the differentiation of shiva and vishnu posed those queries to seek or throw more light on clarification on that understanding and, as devout shivbhakts, it is our duty to give the true understanding of these forms which many members have already contributed. my last word on this differentiation is that, all forms are one and we can pick and choose any which one we like but shall never speak inferior of other. our scriptures have many instances like lord vishnu offering his own eye as the thousandth lotus while doing sahasra kamala archana to lord shiva. we also have instances where lord vishnu came in the form of a mohini and helped lord shiva from bhasmasura. hence, my humble submission to all shivbhakts is that we can praise any one form or all but shall never speak inferior or ill of others. with best wishes and blessings pandit arjun www.rudraksharemedy.com , " N. Ranganathan " <rangvsh wrote: > > > Dear All > > With Due respect to Venkata Krishnan, it is inappropriate to be in Om Namah Shivaya Group and speak ill about Lord Shiva. > > I request you please unsubsribe and make peace in yourselves. > > N.Ranganathan B.E, C.Eng, FISE, PGDBM > Senior Electrical Engineer > Doha > > --- On Wed, 10/8/08, venkata krishnan <bcvk71 wrote: > > venkata krishnan <bcvk71 > Re: Re: Why Vaishnavites insult Shaivtes > To: , " BCVENKATAKRISHNANNewsListgrou p " <bcvenkatakrishnannewslist > > Wednesday, October 8, 2008, 6:34 AM > > > > > Dear Vijji Bajji, > You are totally wrong and misinformed.Who told you that Ramanuja was a Sivaite and Adi Sankara was a Saivite.Ramanuja's first Guru was Yadavaprakasa who was a BedaABeda Acharya and who was a exponent of Advaita who was also a Vaishnavite.Later on Ramanuja became the follower of Alavandar who was a Great Scholar of Sri Vaishnavism.Ramanuja was always a Vaishnava.The only change in his life was that he was a mere Vaishnava by birth who later on converted to Srivaishnavism after becomming the followe of Alavandar.Adi Sankara was also a Vaishnava.The only difference being that in their philosophy. The philosophy of Naadamuni was Visishtaadvaita and that of Gaudapada was Advaita.Gaudapada was the Acharya of Adi Saankara.Even today in Kanchi Sankara \Matam for all official purposes the Samkaraacharya signs only as OM NAMO NAARAAYANAAYA and not Nassivaaya.According to Vedas LORD NAARAAYANA is the Supreme > Brahman.And all the Vedantins accept that.According to Vedas there are 11 RUDRAS.And the Naayanmaars combined the 11Rudras as one God and christained that God as Siva.Saivism originated only after the advent of Naayanmaars and there was no God called Siva before the Naayanmaars there was only Rudra.The Lord SANKARA is the first among the 11 Ridras according to Vedas and he is the son of Brahma an d Brahma is the son of PARABRAHMAN LORD NAARAAYANA according to Vedas.The later Advaitins betrayed Adi Sankara and began to follow a new philosophy saying All Gods are one and only their names are different which againszt the original Advaitam established by Adi Sankara.Saivism is against Vedas by claimimg mythical God Siva is the Supreme Brahman a nd not LORD NAARAAYANA.And many of the Saivaites equate Lord Siva with Lord VISHNU and LORD BRAHMA and sayall the 3 are same which is against VEDAS.So, Saivism is a Nastika Religion which does not accept the > authority of Vedas.Assuming the current Advaitaacharyas wrong inerpretation of Adi Sankara itszelf as the philosophy of Saivasm and Saakthaism , the Saivaites philosophy is Secularism and their claim that Vaishnavas should follow their Philosophy and ideology does not hold water.Since, Advaitam is not the philosophy of Vaishnavites and Visishtaaddvaitam is the Philosophy of Srivaishnavism.Sorry if I had wounded anyones wrong beliefs in the forumby posting the truths.Vedas are the ultimate.It is the only PRAMAANA. > B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN. > website: www.vedascience.com > > > genghis1291 <genghis > Re: Why Vaishnavites insult Shaivtes > > Tuesday, October 7, 2008, 8:46 AM > > > > > There is a lot of misinformation about the beliefs on either side > contributing to the superficial tensions...In the mix are: > > 1. The Purusha Suktam from the Rig Veda > > 2. The Brahma Sutra of Badrayana (like a commentary on the Purusha > Suktam) > > 3. Adi Shankara and his commentary on the Brahma Sutra > > 4. Possible MIS-interpretations /extrapolations by the naive on > Shankara's commentary - this apparently led to serious intellectual and > moral degradation in Shaivite society in the 200 years after Shankara > > 5. Ramanujacharya, a Shaivite-turned Vaishnavite who came 200 years > after Shankara and his commentary on the Brahma Sutra. The naive among > Shaivites claim Ramanuja refuted Shankara...he did no such thing...in > fact, he relied very heavily on Shankara's work,; he also went to the > FULL original of the Brahma Sutra (not the abridged 4-page version > relied on by Shankara and others in his time) and has categorically > stated that he provided further clarity on Shankara's work. > > If people are interested in this topic, I will provide a brief overview > later > > Genghis > > om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.com, mohan dadlani > <mohan_dadlani@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > In my view Lord Shiva and Lord Vishnu are 2 sides of the same coin. > > God is one, we humans can call in different names. > > It is not worthwhile to engage in any arguments on this issue. Let > Hindus unite and not waste time and energy in unnecessary arguments. > > Om Shant, Shanti, Shanti > > > > > > > > om_namah_shivaya_ group@ : bhatnagar_shailendr a: Mon, 6 Oct > 2008 15:27:48 +0000[om_namah_shivaya_ group] Re: Why > Vaishnavites insult Shaivtes > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah SivayaNamaste, This is a sensitive topic so it is better not > to discuss it. This one mantra from Kaivalya Upanishat seals the matter > without controversy : sa brahmaa sa shivaH sendraH so.aksharaH paramaH > svaraaT .sa eva vishhNuH sa praaNaH sa kaalo.agniH sa chandramaaH > (Brahma, Shiv, Indra, Om, Vishnu, Prana, Kaal, Agni, Chandrama etc are > all one - the absolute/OM/ infinity) .Secondly, there can be only one > infinity. regards,Shailendra > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn " 10 hidden secrets " > from Jamie. > > > http://windowslive. com/connect/ post/jamiethomso n.spaces. live.com- Blog-cn\ > s!550F681DAD532637! 5295.entry? ocid=TXT_ TAGLM_WL_ domore_092008 > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 Knowledge without humbleness breeds arrogance, ignorance and ego, All spiritual paths preach two very simple and powerful concepts 1. Humble ness 2. never judge anybody we should not fanatically follow scriptures, scriptures were written to guide people at different time, as times change some of the meaning of scriptures change, we should use our judgement in understanding the concepts for the highest good of the universe, not to compare and judge, all the acts of comparison and judgement is done by ego and it has to be checked. In Divine love, Om Namah Shivaya, Divakar. --- On Wed, 10/8/08, N. Ranganathan <rangvsh wrote: N. Ranganathan <rangvsh Why insult Shaivtes Date: Wednesday, October 8, 2008, 11:11 PM Dear All With Due respect to Venkata Krishnan, it is inappropriate to be in Om Namah Shivaya Group and speak ill about Lord Shiva. I request you please unsubsribe and make peace in yourselves.N.Ranganathan B.E, C.Eng, FISE, PGDBM Senior Electrical Engineer Doha--- On Wed, 10/8/08, venkata krishnan <bcvk71 > wrote: venkata krishnan <bcvk71 >Re: [om_namah_shivaya_ group] Re: Why Vaishnavites insult Shaivtesom_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.com, "BCVENKATAKRISHNANN ewsListgroup" <bcvenkatakrishnanne wslist@grou ps.com>Wednesday, October 8, 2008, 6:34 AM Dear Vijji Bajji, You are totally wrong and misinformed. Who told you that Ramanuja was a Sivaite and Adi Sankara was a Saivite.Ramanuja' s first Guru was Yadavaprakasa who was a BedaABeda Acharya and who was a exponent of Advaita who was also a Vaishnavite. Later on Ramanuja became the follower of Alavandar who was a Great Scholar of Sri Vaishnavism. Ramanuja was always a Vaishnava.The only change in his life was that he was a mere Vaishnava by birth who later on converted to Srivaishnavism after becomming the followe of Alavandar.Adi Sankara was also a Vaishnava.The only difference being that in their philosophy. The philosophy of Naadamuni was Visishtaadvaita and that of Gaudapada was Advaita.Gaudapada was the Acharya of Adi Saankara.Even today in Kanchi Sankara \Matam for all official purposes the Samkaraacharya signs only as OM NAMO NAARAAYANAAYA and not Nassivaaya.Accordin g to Vedas LORD NAARAAYANA is the Supreme Brahman.And all the Vedantins accept that.According to Vedas there are 11 RUDRAS.And the Naayanmaars combined the 11Rudras as one God and christained that God as Siva.Saivism originated only after the advent of Naayanmaars and there was no God called Siva before the Naayanmaars there was only Rudra.The Lord SANKARA is the first among the 11 Ridras according to Vedas and he is the son of Brahma an d Brahma is the son of PARABRAHMAN LORD NAARAAYANA according to Vedas.The later Advaitins betrayed Adi Sankara and began to follow a new philosophy saying All Gods are one and only their names are different which againszt the original Advaitam established by Adi Sankara.Saivism is against Vedas by claimimg mythical God Siva is the Supreme Brahman a nd not LORD NAARAAYANA.And many of the Saivaites equate Lord Siva with Lord VISHNU and LORD BRAHMA and sayall the 3 are same which is against VEDAS.So, Saivism is a Nastika Religion which does not accept the authority of Vedas.Assuming the current Advaitaacharyas wrong inerpretation of Adi Sankara itszelf as the philosophy of Saivasm and Saakthaism , the Saivaites philosophy is Secularism and their claim that Vaishnavas should follow their Philosophy and ideology does not hold water.Since, Advaitam is not the philosophy of Vaishnavites and Visishtaaddvaitam is the Philosophy of Srivaishnavism. Sorry if I had wounded anyones wrong beliefs in the forumby posting the truths.Vedas are the ultimate.It is the only PRAMAANA. B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN . website: www.vedascience. com genghis1291 <genghis (AT) comcast (DOT) net>[om_namah_shivaya_ group] Re: Why Vaishnavites insult Shaivtesom_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comTuesday, October 7, 2008, 8:46 AM There is a lot of misinformation about the beliefs on either sidecontributing to the superficial tensions...In the mix are:1. The Purusha Suktam from the Rig Veda2. The Brahma Sutra of Badrayana (like a commentary on the PurushaSuktam)3. Adi Shankara and his commentary on the Brahma Sutra4. Possible MIS-interpretations /extrapolations by the naive onShankara's commentary - this apparently led to serious intellectual andmoral degradation in Shaivite society in the 200 years after Shankara5. Ramanujacharya, a Shaivite-turned Vaishnavite who came 200 yearsafter Shankara and his commentary on the Brahma Sutra. The naive amongShaivites claim Ramanuja refuted Shankara...he did no such thing...infact, he relied very heavily on Shankara's work,; he also went to theFULL original of the Brahma Sutra (not the abridged 4-page versionrelied on by Shankara and others in his time) and has categoricallystated that he provided further clarity on Shankara's work.If people are interested in this topic, I will provide a brief overviewlaterGenghisom_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.com, mohan dadlani<mohan_dadlani@ ...> wrote:>>> In my view Lord Shiva and Lord Vishnu are 2 sides of the same coin.> God is one, we humans can call in different names.> It is not worthwhile to engage in any arguments on this issue. LetHindus unite and not waste time and energy in unnecessary arguments.> Om Shant, Shanti, Shanti>>>> om_namah_shivaya_ group : bhatnagar_shailendr a: Mon, 6 Oct2008 15:27:48 +0000[om_namah_shivaya_ group] Re: WhyVaishnavites insult Shaivtes>>>>> Om Namah SivayaNamaste, This is a sensitive topic so it is better notto discuss it. This one mantra from Kaivalya Upanishat seals the matterwithout controversy : sa brahmaa sa shivaH sendraH so.aksharaH paramaHsvaraaT .sa eva vishhNuH sa praaNaH sa kaalo.agniH sa chandramaaH(Brahma, Shiv, Indra, Om, Vishnu, Prana, Kaal, Agni, Chandrama etc areall one - the absolute/OM/ infinity) .Secondly, there can be only oneinfinity. regards,Shailendra>>>>>> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn "10 hidden secrets"from Jamie.>http://windowslive. com/connect/ post/jamiethomso n.spaces. live.com- Blog-cn\s!550F681DAD532637! 5295.entry? ocid=TXT_ TAGLM_WL_ domore_092008> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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