Guest guest Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat!Accept my respectful pranams and Namaste!The answer is that Rudra is a very terrifying force to an average mortal (when you begin to worship, you literally can hear him howling when he is near. By virtue of his power he makes men cry literally).>> Jiva knows very Rudra and have personally got many Rudra-deekshas...have experienced HIM at various levels. Some in the group who know me personally know this.I worship many lingas and saligramas together whenever HE allows me. My jiva is neither a vaishnava, nor a shaivaite nor shaktha ... yes my jiva had the blessing to spend some nights at graveyards as well. My jiva is trying to find out the -self- in HIM...When you begin Japa and meditation on Rudra, it is only the most powerful people physically and mentally that can withstand the energy of Rudra. When you come into direct contact with this energy (in a universal sense), it is enough to send you stark raving mad, if you cannot bear the descent of power (shakti pat). I have performed this and can tell you (according to my experience) that when the Rudra Mantra activates, it is like a bomb going off in side of you at a volume that is deafening ( this is not being theatrical but as accurate as I can be, I also acknowledge this may not be everyone's experience).>> Have experienced these at many levels when in smashan and now at home very often.In order to get to the point where you are qualified for this, it takes a hardening of your senses. Now consider that if you wish to get to this, how would you ever hope to develop, if you continue with self imposed mental restrictions and social conditioning ?>> I disagree...HE decides when your-self- is qualified and hence I do not have the right to say I am qualified.The Aghoris spend twelve years in the Crematorium worship Siva to become an accomplished one ! The Tibetan Yogis spend fifty years in practice and are then called "men of little knowledge ".>> Yes, I know well about my Aghori friends...You see I think we are pursuing two different philosophies /systems of worship and trying very hard to use the Bhagavad Gita to be accomodating to both.>> To me there is only one...In my experience Vaishnavas are usually very peaceful, soft persons, though when they get annoyed they can be quite a handful.>> Mistaken I do not believe all these sects...there is one and only source...all are different energy levels. My jiva takes Sri Krishna as Guru, Guide to reach Rudran...for Sri Krishna is the perfect Karma Yogi.Make no mistake of this, the way of a Saiva and Shakta are the most intense ofall religious pursuits. It is only the strongest , hardest , toughest Sadhakas thatwill achieve success ultimately.>> It is but there are jivas in every sect who take the intense worship. It all depends on how the jiva does it. I do know some of my Vishnu bhakthas who do worship Rudra, observe very strict Shiva Ratri every month than some shaivaites who do only observe the maha shiva ratri.Why this is important to the previous discussion is that persons whoare soft, who refuse to accept the harsh reality of what awaits and who refuse to think and act intelligently WILL perish. This is about protecting the religion and its followers and is bigger than individual aspirations and notions about the worship of God.>> A sadhu looks soft, but when provoked will emit more energy...Additionally, I am going through the Bhagavad Gita to find the Shlokas where lord Krishna is advising to GET UP and FIGHT to Protect Dharma.>> Yes but Sri Krishna did not ask Arjuna to fight as soon as HE met Arjuna. Everything has time, even Swayam Rudran functions in Mahakal as time driven...You see when this is known, you will then see persons now disagreeing withLord Krishna and they all of a sudden they don't believe that and it doesn't fit into their personal ideas and ... and .... ( anything to justify personal cowardice )>> As for as my jiva is concerned it is ALL ONE...Jivas prefer the paths...but once you realize you find they are all the same...My rudra deeksha is helping my jiva to realize faster...I wear many rudraksha malas and tulsi malas and visit Shri Vishnu temples, where they show their disgust...but my jiva remains quiet for why my father, mother Shri Lord Shri Maha Rudra advises. I purposely type Sri Krishna in my messages in Rudra groups and do the opposite in other. It is a sin to differentiate Rudra and HIS own forms...I do not know who came from who, but all came from ONE hence has to be respected and admired equally...SubhaDinamAstu!SarvamSriKrishnaArpanamAstu!Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj Sent: Sunday, 15 July, 2007 10:58:02 AMRe: Re-Dev Maharaj NamasteThe answer is that Rudra is a very terrifying force to an average mortal (when you begin to worship, you literally can hear him howling when he is near. By virtue of his power he makes men cry literally).When you begin Japa and meditation on Rudra, it is only the most powerful people physically and mentally that can withstand the energy of Rudra. When you come into direct contact with this energy (in a universal sense), it is enough to send you stark raving mad, if you cannot bear the descent of power (shakti pat). I have performed this and can tell you (according to my experience) that when the Rudra Mantra activates, it is like a bomb going off in side of you at a volume that is deafening ( this is not being theatrical but as accurate as I can be, I also acknowledge this may not be everyone's experience).In order to get to the point where you are qualified for this, it takes a hardening of your senses. Now consider that if you wish to get to this, how would you ever hope to develop, if you continue with self imposed mental restrictions and social conditioning ?The Aghoris spend twelve years in the Crematorium worship Siva to become an accomplished one ! The Tibetan Yogis spend fifty years in practice and are then called "men of little knowledge ".You see I think we are pursuing two different philosophies /systems of worship and trying very hard to use the Bhagavad Gita to be accomodating to both.In my experience Vaishnavas are usually very peaceful, soft persons, though when they get annoyed they can be quite a handful.Make no mistake of this, the way of a Saiva and Shakta are the most intense ofall religious pursuits. It is only the strongest , hardest , toughest Sadhakas that will achieve success ultimately. Why this is important to the previous discussion is that persons who are soft, who refuse to accept the harsh reality of what awaits and who refuse to think and act intelligently WILL perish. This is about protecting the religion and its followers and is bigger than individual aspirations and notions about the worship of God.Additionally, I am going through the Bhagavad Gita to find the Shlokas where lord Krishna is advising to GET UP and FIGHT to Protect Dharma. You see when this is known, you will then see persons now disagreeing with Lord Krishna and they all of a sudden they don't believe that and it doesn't fit into their personal ideas and ... and .... ( anything to justify personal cowardice )Pradeep Balakrishnan <balakrishnanpradeep @> wrote: Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat! I do not know the answer what your-self- expects. SubhaDinamAstu! SarvamSriKrishnaArp anamAstu! Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj@ >om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comFriday, 13 July, 2007 3:30:17 PMRe: [om_namah_shivaya_ group] Re-Dev Maharaj Please tell why Rudra means the Howler and he who makes men cryPradeep Balakrishnan <balakrishnanpradeep @> wrote: Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat!Dear Shri Rudra Maharaj, pranams and namaste!Prabhu, -HE- asks the questions in your-self, HE in my-self- answers.My -self- did not understand the question your's asked. Can you please re-iterate your question?SubhaDinamAstu!SarvamSriKrishnaArp anamAstu! Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj@ >om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comFriday, 13 July, 2007 10:45:07 AMRE: [om_namah_shivaya_ group] Re-Dev Maharaj Namaste PradeepThank you so much for these replies, I am now very much aware of why things are the way that they are. I would like you to ponder on one thing " why Rudra means the Howler and he who makes men cry "Namah SivayaBest RegardsPandit Devindra Maharaj.Pradeep Balakrishnan <balakrishnanpradeep @> wrote: Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat! Dear Shri Rudra Maharaja Namaste! Prabhu let me try to answer to extent my jiva knows... I have read a number of articles, where it is estimated that some80-100 million Hindus have been slaughtered, millions of women rapedand butchered over the last thousand years. ( supplied in my responsebelow, please read carefully ) >> There is nothing called Hindus, it is all men and women, Rudran did not create religion, it is man. History repeats so the actions done yesterday become reactions today. Here the reacting part is Maha Kal and HE cleans in a swipe... My questions are :Seeing that we all came from the same source, and all is Brahman.1) How come Brahman seems to be doing this to primarily to Hinduswhen many of the Hindus have been engaged in worship of Brahmanfor all these thousands of years ? >> Brahman is a witness for this entire episode which has no interval nor beginning. Brahman’s prakrithi is the doer or called maya which has demi-gods etc. Who wants the jivas suffer in the samsara, but still Brahman is the witness. Why do we expect Brahman to help, bhakthi with no expectation makes the –self- align with the supreme-self. This is exactly what Bholenath wants...is it not? 2) Is Sri Krishna having some kind of murderous fit against those thatworship him to be replaced by Allah and Jesus ? >> Atman does not have any guna, They are the manifestations of prakrithi that came from the same seed. 3) What are the lessons we are supposed to learn from getting murderedby the millions ? >> How many times has your jiva spared a mosquito? Or any other helpless insect. Your jiva might have murdered millions of jivas which we do not know ... Lord Pashupathi is a witness...my point is -we- think we have control over things, the point is there is no control of anything over anything...No one can murder anyone, the atma leaves the body but is not dead...the prakrithi makes it appear real...for nothing is real...4) When the women are raped, buggered and kept as slaves do youthink they are being treated with high respects ? >>No they are not. 5) With all the millions of Holy men of India, including however manyGOD men, how come none have been able to stop this from occurring daily for 1000 years ? Is this the Karma of people of India only ? >> Because the holy men and GOD men are never holy nor near GOPD. They do not –self- nor will realise. It is maya that makes the mind feel the other side is green. Prabhu the mightly Rudran does not wish anything but imagine the thousands in the group who ask HIM things everyday and every minute. The day the same jivas do service to HIM or HIS devotees or society in a good way, then the jiva becomes Rudra.6) How has the various saints who controlled their mind and engagedin Brahman been able to lift the people out of poverty, hopelessness and make them live more productive, meaningful lives ? >> because poverty does not exist. What “it” belongs to you is not yours, what belongs to you today is belonging to one tomorrow, what you think you are is not what you will be, what your jiva thinks it knows will be forgotten, your jiva is not yours, which womb our jivas will enter we do not know, we do not remember the past, we die nine times after sleep before waking up, we do not know if we will witness this drama the next minute, we do not control the number of times we breathe, nor we control the air inside the body which has so many holes, we do not know the future, for all these are not in the same people hands who think they have the power to judge other jivas. The same saints do not know what is for them the next instant. The Atman is the silent witness and tries to help the –self- in the jivaI patiently await your response on these questions. >> my –self- answered to the best it knows... SubhaDinamAstu! SarvamSriKrishnaArp anamAstu! Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.Try the Mail Beta. Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story.Play Sims Stories at Games. Get the toolbar and be alerted to new email wherever you're surfing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat!Namaste Shri Bhupendraji, pleasure to talk again.Very interesting indeed, now whether the story of the sannyasi isfact or fiction is another matter. But tell me...since you know thisstory and therefore have narrated it to us...are you able topractice the same kind of pacifism that you are talking about? >> If you think this is story, then it is. If the faith in you is strong then the story is the final word. My jiva is trying prabhu, some day my jiva will be guided by Shri Bhagavadham to be like the brahmin HE describes.If your child is sick or your wife or yourself, do you take medicine ordo you just let things run their course? Do you have a house of doyou live without a house and let yourself be nurtured bynature?...after all wind rain heat is all a result of sense inducedmental condition, just like anger and lust and hatred, and shouldn'treally affect the realised soul. What is the need forclothes...afterall, shame is just another mental condition like hateand anger.>> All our jiva has to do Brahma Dharmam, Vishnu Dharmam and Rudra Dharmam.Now the jiva is going through Vishnu dharmam, in Rudra Dharmam, with HIS blessings my jiva can reach...What is the purpose of law courts, hospitals, schools andgovernments when we should all let things be taken care of by thelord? What is the purpose of getting a job or getting educationtowards a better job? Earth provides enough bounty to fulfill ourneeds, we could survive on fruits available free from trees, wedon't really need cooked food do we?>> Hmm...very often people in law courts, hospitals, schools and goverments run to God only for help...even you do the same...Once upon a time, long time ago, what we know today as Sri Lanka wasmainly Saiva....but they are all gone today. Their pacifist attitudewas the reason for it....they never gacve a fight, took things as itcame taking all as the will of god. A lot of knowledge about Saivismif lost today as a result. Who is to take responsibility for notprotecting this knowledge and way of life?>> Nothing is lost, nothing is gained...it is all there but will be visiblewhen Rudra wants to.What is being talked about is not anger or hatred...but aboutprotecting the knowledge... a way of life to leave something for thefuture generation. What we know today is a result of what ourforefathers retained, and what we give to the future generationdepends on what we retain. If we decide to turn a blind eye topersection in kasmir or the to encroachment that is happeningthroughout the country as the result of vote bank politics, I don'tthink turning a blind eye to such development is the way to god.>> When you and I were not born how was this "knowledge" protected?It will be protected the same way. For Shri Maha Vishnu if to appearas Shri Kalki then knowledge has to be hidden and HE has to reveal itis it not? why do you want to do Shri Vishnu's karmam? Let us do ourkarmam as proper grihastras or whatever we were asked by Rudran as...The story of the sannyasi that you narrated...probably he attainedmoksha(if the story is real), but his presence nor his absence norhis perseverance made the society any better, the cruel remainedcruel and never learnt. If you were on the scene and saw the peoplehumiliating the sanyassi, what would you do? Would you let himsuffer looking it all as gods will or would you ACT to help him?>> How do you define real? Are you real? What did you see when you werein the womb of your mother? No offense? How many times did you reallybreathe yesterday night? What if you have seen incidents, do you remember perfectly? Do you remember how many times you car stopped in various traffic signals and for how long?I do not know if my jiva was there during this Sanyasi time framebut if it happens today, jiva will try to help, but it is unto the Sanyasi to accept or reject.That which you preach, you simply will not be able to practiceyourself otherwise you will not be writing this posts but livingsomewhere at the mercy of elements.>> This is your judgement and wishful thinking. I am not preaching...nor do I know the profound knowledge you think you posses. But I am confidentthat someday either in this birth or another birth my father Shri Rudran willguide me there...my faith drives my jiva...SarvamSriKrishnaArpanamAstu!b_jamnadas <b_jamna> Sent: Sunday, 15 July, 2007 8:10:41 AM Re: Re-Dev Maharaj Dear Pradeep Ji, Very interesting indeed, now whether the story of the sannyasi is fact or fiction is another matter. But tell me...since you know this story and therefore have narrated it to us...are you able to practice the same kind of pacifism that you are talking about? If your child is sick or your wife or yourself, do you take medicine or do you just let things run their course? Do you have a house of do you live without a house and let yourself be nurtured by nature?...after all wind rain heat is all a result of sense induced mental condition, just like anger and lust and hatred, and shouldn't really affect the realised soul. What is the need for clothes...afterall, shame is just another mental condition like hate and anger. What is the purpose of law courts, hospitals, schools and governments when we should all let things be taken care of by the lord? What is the purpose of getting a job or getting education towards a better job? Earth provides enough bounty to fulfill our needs, we could survive on fruits available free from trees, we don't really need cooked food do we? Once upon a time, long time ago, what we know today as Sri Lanka was mainly Saiva....but they are all gone today. Their pacifist attitude was the reason for it....they never gacve a fight, took things as it came taking all as the will of god. A lot of knowledge about Saivism if lost today as a result. Who is to take responsibility for not protecting this knowledge and way of life? What is being talked about is not anger or hatred...but about protecting the knowledge... a way of life to leave something for the future generation. What we know today is a result of what our forefathers retained, and what we give to the future generation depends on what we retain. If we decide to turn a blind eye to persection in kasmir or the to encroachment that is happening throughout the country as the result of vote bank politics, I don't think turning a blind eye to such development is the way to god. The story of the sannyasi that you narrated...probably he attained moksha(if the story is real), but his presence nor his absence nor his perseverance made the society any better, the cruel remained cruel and never learnt. If you were on the scene and saw the people humiliating the sanyassi, what would you do? Would you let him suffer looking it all as gods will or would you ACT to help him? That which you preach, you simply will not be able to practice yourself otherwise you will not be writing this posts but living somewhere at the mercy of elements. I profoundly apologize if I have hurt your sentiments in this post, that is not my intention. Regards, Bhupendra. om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.com, Pradeep Balakrishnan <balakrishnanpradee p wrote: > > Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat! > > Dear Shri Hari and Hara's bows to HIS-self in you. > > Please prabhu's do not fire words like arrows on anyone for we all came from the same ... Satyam Shivam Sundaram.... > > Here is a page extracted from Sri Krishna's teachings... it moved my-self-; For all Rudras replace Krishna with Rudra but the message is still the same .. Tat-vama-Shi. .. > > Uddhava said: "It is very difficult to discard or endure the insults of > the wicked and keep peace of mind. Except your devotees who have firm faith > in your grace, who have taken shelter at Thy feet, who practice the religion > taught by Thee, who are even-minded, no others including even the learned > can overcome the frailties of nature or the force of Your Maya. Human nature > is human nature, O Lord. It is too strong or powerful for men. Therefore, > O best of teachers! O Lord of the universe, Antaryamin of all, kindly explain, > how even an ordinary mortal can attain such tranquility of mind to disregard > the taunts and insults of the wicked. Please explain to me in such a way > that I may grasp it." > > The Lord said: "O disciple of Brihaspati there is not in the world a sage > who can control his mind when he is pierced by harsh words of the wicked. > > > > > > Even arrows aimed and directed with force at the most vital parts of a > man will not give so much pain as the cruel harsh words of the wicked which > rankle in the heart for ever. > > > > > > O Uddhava, I shall narrate to you a very sacred story of ancient times. > Listen to it with rapt attention. It was recited by an ascetic who was > ill-treated by the wicked, but who bore it with great patience and fortitude, > and who thought it was all due to his own past actions. This was sung by > him. > > > > > > There lived in Avanti a very wealthy Brahmin. But he led a very miserable > life. He earned money by the evil ways of the world. He did business. He > was miserly, covetous and very irritable. He did not spend anything in > charity. He did not greet his relations or guest with kind words even. > He never even attended to the comforts of himself, his wife, children or > servants. He was a human iron-safe hoarding and guarding money. He dwelt > in a house unknown to all religious activities. > > > > As he led such a miserly and impure life, his sons and relatives did not > like him. His wife, daughters and servants got so much disgusted that they > would not do what he liked. He took pleasure only in hoarding money. He > was destitute of righteousness. He never enjoyed his life. So he lost both > this life and the next. The gods presiding over the five Yajnas or daily > sacrifices grew very angry. > > > > > > O liberal Uddhava, his stock of merits was exhausted through his neglect > of the five claimants. Even the wealth which he had hoarded with great > pains and exertion was lost. > > > > > > O Uddhava, some of his wealth was taken by his relatives. Thieves laid > their hands on some. He lost another portion by the anger of the gods or > calamities or accidents and by the lapse of time. Some of it was taken > by men and kings. When his wealth was thus lost he was neglected and cast > away by his own people. He was very much afflicted at heart when he reflected > that his wealth had never been used for the satisfaction of his own desires > or for righteousness. > > > > > > He shed tears when he reflected on his pitiable condition and his voice > was choked. He developed intense disgust for the world. He attained Vairagya > or distaste for worldly possessions and enjoyments like an ascetic. > > > > > > He said to himself, "My experience has indeed been bitter. Alas! Woe unto > me! I deserve it. I have tormented my body in hoarding wealth. I have not > utilised the wealth for the attainment of my desires or righteousness. > I have gained neither righteousness nor my own pleasures. > > > > > > Generally the wealth of the miserly does not contribute to their comfort > or happiness. It only leads to their affliction in this world and leads > them to hell and loss of their soul after their death. > > > > > > The spotless fame of a renowned man and the excellent qualities of a virtuous > man are spoiled by greed, however little it may be, just as a small patch > of white skin or leucoderma spoils even the most beautiful forms. > > > > In acquiring wealth, in improving it when got, in protecting it, in spending > it, in its loss and use, men experience only exertion, fear, anxiety and > delusion. > > > > > > Theft, injury to others, falsehood, hypocrisy, lust, anger, pride, haughtiness, > discord, enmity, distrust, envy, over-indulgence in women, wine and gamblings—these > fifteen evils pertaining to men have indeed, their source in wealth. Therefore > one who is desirous of obtaining the highest good should abandon the evil > known as wealth from a distance. > > > > Also brothers, wives, fathers and friends fall out and soon become enemies > for the sake of a small sum of money. > > > > For the sake of a little money they quarrel and become enraged. They abandon > all prior remembrance and affection, and out of jealousy stand in the way > of one another, attack and kill one another. > > > > Having attained a human birth which is covetable even by gods and a high > place viz., the foremost life of a Brahmin, those who neglect this and > spoil their own interests (viz., Self-realisation) surely reach the most > miserable end. > > > > Having attained this human body, the gateway to heaven and emancipation, > which mortal man would be attached to wealth, the abode of all evil? > > > > > > The miser who hoards and guards his wealth like a Yaksha, who does not > share it with the gods, the Rishis, the Pitris, relatives, friends, lower > animals who all deserve a share, and does not use it for his own self, > falls down. > > > > My life and strength were carelessly spent in the vain acquisition of wealth, > by which men of discrimination attain their goal. What can I do now in > my old age? > > > > > > Why do even learned men who know that wealth is the source of all evils > exert much to obtain wealth which tends to no good purpose? Surely this > world is totally deluded by the Maya of someone. > > > > > > What is the use of wealth or other acquisitions, desire or objects of desire, > for a man who is in the grip of death? What is the use of Karma as it will > only involve him in a never-ending series of births and deaths? > > > > > > Certainly that glorious Lord Hari, who is the Lord of the universe, who > is the embodiment of all the gods, is immensely pleased with me, for He > has brought me to this state in which I am endowed with Vairagya or dispassion > which is a raft or a boat for me to cross the ocean of Samsara or ocean > of births and deaths. > > > > > > I shall lead the rest of my life, if at all there is any left, in penance, > I shall find delight in Atman only. I shall do all that tends to the attainment > of highest good. I shall lead a virtuous life and strive for my salvation. > May the gods, the rulers of the three worlds bless me to attain this state. > Raja Katwanga, attained the abode of Brahma within an hour." > > > > > > The Lord said: "Having thus resolved in his mind, the great Brahmin of > Avanti cut off all desires and also the knot of egoism in his heart and > became a Sannyasin. He also became tranquil in mind. > > > > > > He wandered alone over the earth with perfect control over his mind, senses > and Pranas and he just entered towns and villages for the sake of alms. > No one knew who he was. Wicked people surrounded, mocked and ill- treated > the old and ugly monk in various ways. > > > > > > Some took away his bamboo staff, some his begging bowl and water pot, some > his seat and someone his rosary and some again, his torn clothes. > > > > > > They would offer to give them back and when he came near laugh at him and > refuse to give them. Sometimes they returned those things but again snatched > them from him. At other times when he was eating his alms near a lake or > a tank, they would pour excretions or spit over his head. They made him > speak when he was observing silence and beat him if he did not do so. > > > > > > Others said, `This man is a thief.' Some tied him with a rope and some > said, `Kill him, Kill him.' Some abused and taunted him and said, `He is > a rogue posing himself to be a righteous man. Having lost all his wealth > and being abandoned by his relatives, he has taken to this course of life.' > > > > > > > > > > `Oh, he is very strong. He endures all taunts and remains unshaken like > a mountain. He is very resolute like a heron. He wants to gain his purpose > by silence.Some mocked him often, while others tied him with ropes to a pillar or > a tree, making sport of him as if he were a toy or a bird. Whatever affliction or trouble thus befell him caused by the elements or > the gods or his own body, he thought they were predestined and therefore > must be patiently borne. > > > > > > Even though he was insulted and treated with contempt by wicked men, even > though they tried to make him abandon his saintly course he stuck to his > path of righteousness, quite steadily and sang the following song. > > > > > > The Brahmin said, `Neither this body nor these people nor the gods, nor > the Atman, nor planets, nor Karma nor time is the cause of my pleasure > or pain. The wise say or the Srutis declare that it is the mind that is > the true cause of pleasure and pain, as it sets in motion the wheel of > Samsara. > > > > > > The mind creates desire and the like. It makes the various Gunas function > and through them brings about various Karmas, good, bad or indifferent > for the attainment of such desires. By such actions man gets into bondage > or Samsara (chain of births and deaths) and attains different kinds of > birth according to the nature of his actions. > > > > > > Atman is the self-effulgent, inactive, silent witness of the activities > of the mind. He is the friend of the Jiva. The Jiva identifies himself > with the mind on account of ignorance, and thinks he is the actor. In reality > it is the mind that does everything, who enjoys sense-objects through desires > and mind's active qualities and thus becomes bound. > > > > Charity, the performance of duties of his own Varna and Ashrama, the observance > of Yamas and Niyamas, the study of the Vedas, virtuous actions and the > good observances as fasting on Ekadasi—all these lead to the control of > mind. The control of the mind is the highest form of Yoga. > > > > > > When one's mind is controlled and tranquil, of what use are charity and > the rest for him? If his mind is uncontrolled and restless, of what use, > again, are this charity and the rest? > > > > > > The gods and the organs presided over by them, are under the control of > the mind, but the mind never comes under the control of any one else. This > is a formidable God stronger than the strongest. Therefore, he who can > control the mind is indeed the God of gods. > > > > > > Without curbing or conquering this strong invincible enemy of irresistible > force within, that cuts the very vital parts, some foolish people try to > achieve victories outside creating friends, enemies, or neutrals. Those > who do not conquer the mind make friends and enemies. > > > > > > Deluded men think, `This is my body' and they go astray. They mistake this > body, a mere creation of the mind to be their own and their selves. They > are deluded by the wrong notions of `I', `thine' and `he'. They think `He > is different' and thus wander in the unlimited wilderness of ignorance. > > > > > > If the body is the cause of pleasure and pain, the Atman has nothing to > do with it, because it concerns the two bodies which are made up of the > same earth. The two bodies are really one body. If people are the cause > of my pleasure and pain, the Atman or source of bliss immanent in me as > the only real eternal factor, is present in all of them. If sometimes any > one bites his own lips or tongue with his own teeth inadvertently, with > whom should he be angry for the pain? > > > > > > If the deity is the cause of pain, the Atman has nothing to do with it, > because it is related to two deities i.e., to the two organs presided over > by the two deities. The Devatas who guide the senses are the same in all > beings. If you beat another man in his hand, the presiding deity of the > hand viz., Indra is the same in both. What has this to do with the Atman? > It always remains unaffected. If sometimes, in the same body of a man one > limb strikes against another, with whom should he become angry? > > > > > > If the Atman is the cause of pleasure and pain, such experience must be > considered unreal as the Vedas declare that the essence of Atman is bliss > and that all things but Atman are unreal and transitory. > > > > > > If the Atman or one's own Self is the cause of pleasure and pain, evidently > nothing in that case happens from another. In that case the cause is one's > own nature, pleasure and pain are of the essence of itself, because there > is nothing besides the Atman. If there be, it must be unreal. Therefore > how could there be then any occasion for anger? With whom should one become > angry? There is neither pleasure nor pain. Atman only really exists. > > > > > > If the planets be the cause of pleasure and pain, what have they then to > do with Atman who is unborn, because the planets affect the body only? > Further, one planet exercise an adverse influence on another planet. The > Atman is entirely different from either the planet or the body. With whom > then should one become angry? > > > > > > If work be the cause of pleasure and pain, how can it affect or touch the > pure, actionless and Immortal Atman, because work is possible to any agency > which happens to be unintelligent and intelligent? But the body is unintelligent > and the Atman is pure intelligence. Therefore Karma which is supposed to > be the cause for pleasure and pain does not exist at all. Then with whom > should one become angry? > > > > > > If Time be the cause of pleasure and pain, how can it affect the Atman, > because Atman is Himself Time. Certainly fire cannot be adversely affected > by heat, nor snow by cold. The pairs of opposites cannot affect the immortal > Atman which is beyond them. Therefore who should be angry with whom? > > > > > > He who has attained illumination has fear from no one else. The Atman which > is beyond Prakriti is not affected by the pairs of opposites. Ahamkara > only is the cause of Samsara. Ahamkara only is affected by the pairs of > opposites. > > > > So I shall practise this devotion to the Supreme Self which the most ancient > Rishis had, and I shall cross the unlimited ocean of ignorance. > > > > > > The Lord said: "This was the song sung by that sage who lost his wealth > and attained dispassion, who roamed over the earth as a Sannyasin free > from anxiety and who remained unshaken from his righteous course, though > he was thus ill-treated and insulted by the wicked. > > > > > > The cause of happiness or misery is no other than one's self. It is a delusion > of the mind. This world consisting of friends, neutrals and enemies which > affects a man with pleasure and pain is a delusion of the mind caused by > ignorance. > > > > Therefore, O child! Control the mind perfectly by fixing it on Me. Restrain > the activities of the mind by the force of your intellect. This is the > very gist of Yoga. This is in brief all Yoga. This is the highest aim and > end of Yoga. > > > > > Whoever with a serene mind studies, recites before others or hears this > song of the tranquil, self-restrained Sannyasi immersed in Brahman is not > overpowered by the pairs of opposites. > > Subham DinamAstu! > SarvamSriKrishnaArp anamAstu! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 I purposely type Sri Krishna in my messages in Rudra groups and do the opposite in other. It is a sin to differentiate Rudra and HIS own forms...I do not know who came from who, but all came from ONE hence has to be respected and admired equally...Agreed and this is why we must work together to defeat the threats to our religion and way of life. We do not need to promote hatred, it does not mean we must start the fight ..... we just have to finish it in our favor. !Namah SivayaBest RegardsPandit Devindra MaharajPradeep Balakrishnan <balakrishnanpradeep wrote: Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat!Accept my respectful pranams and Namaste!The answer is that Rudra is a very terrifying force to an average mortal (when you begin to worship, you literally can hear him howling when he is near. By virtue of his power he makes men cry literally).>> Jiva knows very Rudra and have personally got many Rudra-deekshas...have experienced HIM at various levels. Some in the group who know me personally know this.I worship many lingas and saligramas together whenever HE allows me. My jiva is neither a vaishnava, nor a shaivaite nor shaktha ... yes my jiva had the blessing to spend some nights at graveyards as well. My jiva is trying to find out the -self- in HIM...When you begin Japa and meditation on Rudra, it is only the most powerful people physically and mentally that can withstand the energy of Rudra. When you come into direct contact with this energy (in a universal sense), it is enough to send you stark raving mad, if you cannot bear the descent of power (shakti pat). I have performed this and can tell you (according to my experience) that when the Rudra Mantra activates, it is like a bomb going off in side of you at a volume that is deafening ( this is not being theatrical but as accurate as I can be, I also acknowledge this may not be everyone's experience).>> Have experienced these at many levels when in smashan and now at home very often.In order to get to the point where you are qualified for this, it takes a hardening of your senses. Now consider that if you wish to get to this, how would you ever hope to develop, if you continue with self imposed mental restrictions and social conditioning ?>> I disagree...HE decides when your-self- is qualified and hence I do not have the right to say I am qualified.The Aghoris spend twelve years in the Crematorium worship Siva to become an accomplished one ! The Tibetan Yogis spend fifty years in practice and are then called "men of little knowledge ".>> Yes, I know well about my Aghori friends...You see I think we are pursuing two different philosophies /systems of worship and trying very hard to use the Bhagavad Gita to be accomodating to both.>> To me there is only one...In my experience Vaishnavas are usually very peaceful, soft persons, though when they get annoyed they can be quite a handful.>> Mistaken I do not believe all these sects...there is one and only source...all are different energy levels. My jiva takes Sri Krishna as Guru, Guide to reach Rudran...for Sri Krishna is the perfect Karma Yogi.Make no mistake of this, the way of a Saiva and Shakta are the most intense ofall religious pursuits. It is only the strongest , hardest , toughest Sadhakas thatwill achieve success ultimately.>> It is but there are jivas in every sect who take the intense worship. It all depends on how the jiva does it. I do know some of my Vishnu bhakthas who do worship Rudra, observe very strict Shiva Ratri every month than some shaivaites who do only observe the maha shiva ratri.Why this is important to the previous discussion is that persons whoare soft, who refuse to accept the harsh reality of what awaits and who refuse to think and act intelligently WILL perish. This is about protecting the religion and its followers and is bigger than individual aspirations and notions about the worship of God.>> A sadhu looks soft, but when provoked will emit more energy...Additionally, I am going through the Bhagavad Gita to find the Shlokas where lord Krishna is advising to GET UP and FIGHT to Protect Dharma.>> Yes but Sri Krishna did not ask Arjuna to fight as soon as HE met Arjuna. Everything has time, even Swayam Rudran functions in Mahakal as time driven...You see when this is known, you will then see persons now disagreeing withLord Krishna and they all of a sudden they don't believe that and it doesn't fit into their personal ideas and ... and .... ( anything to justify personal cowardice )>> As for as my jiva is concerned it is ALL ONE...Jivas prefer the paths...but once you realize you find they are all the same...My rudra deeksha is helping my jiva to realize faster...I wear many rudraksha malas and tulsi malas and visit Shri Vishnu temples, where they show their disgust...but my jiva remains quiet for why my father, mother Shri Lord Shri Maha Rudra advises. I purposely type Sri Krishna in my messages in Rudra groups and do the opposite in other. It is a sin to differentiate Rudra and HIS own forms...I do not know who came from who, but all came from ONE hence has to be respected and admired equally...SubhaDinamAstu!SarvamSriKrishnaArpanamAstu!Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj > Sent: Sunday, 15 July, 2007 10:58:02 AMRe: Re-Dev Maharaj NamasteThe answer is that Rudra is a very terrifying force to an average mortal (when you begin to worship, you literally can hear him howling when he is near. By virtue of his power he makes men cry literally).When you begin Japa and meditation on Rudra, it is only the most powerful people physically and mentally that can withstand the energy of Rudra. When you come into direct contact with this energy (in a universal sense), it is enough to send you stark raving mad, if you cannot bear the descent of power (shakti pat). I have performed this and can tell you (according to my experience) that when the Rudra Mantra activates, it is like a bomb going off in side of you at a volume that is deafening ( this is not being theatrical but as accurate as I can be, I also acknowledge this may not be everyone's experience).In order to get to the point where you are qualified for this, it takes a hardening of your senses. Now consider that if you wish to get to this, how would you ever hope to develop, if you continue with self imposed mental restrictions and social conditioning ?The Aghoris spend twelve years in the Crematorium worship Siva to become an accomplished one ! The Tibetan Yogis spend fifty years in practice and are then called "men of little knowledge ".You see I think we are pursuing two different philosophies /systems of worship and trying very hard to use the Bhagavad Gita to be accomodating to both.In my experience Vaishnavas are usually very peaceful, soft persons, though when they get annoyed they can be quite a handful.Make no mistake of this, the way of a Saiva and Shakta are the most intense ofall religious pursuits. It is only the strongest , hardest , toughest Sadhakas that will achieve success ultimately. Why this is important to the previous discussion is that persons who are soft, who refuse to accept the harsh reality of what awaits and who refuse to think and act intelligently WILL perish. This is about protecting the religion and its followers and is bigger than individual aspirations and notions about the worship of God.Additionally, I am going through the Bhagavad Gita to find the Shlokas where lord Krishna is advising to GET UP and FIGHT to Protect Dharma. You see when this is known, you will then see persons now disagreeing with Lord Krishna and they all of a sudden they don't believe that and it doesn't fit into their personal ideas and ... and .... ( anything to justify personal cowardice )Pradeep Balakrishnan <balakrishnanpradeep @> wrote: Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat! I do not know the answer what your-self- expects. SubhaDinamAstu! SarvamSriKrishnaArp anamAstu! Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj@ >om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comFriday, 13 July, 2007 3:30:17 PMRe: [om_namah_shivaya_ group] Re-Dev Maharaj Please tell why Rudra means the Howler and he who makes men cryPradeep Balakrishnan <balakrishnanpradeep @> wrote: Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat!Dear Shri Rudra Maharaj, pranams and namaste!Prabhu, -HE- asks the questions in your-self, HE in my-self- answers.My -self- did not understand the question your's asked. Can you please re-iterate your question?SubhaDinamAstu!SarvamSriKrishnaArp anamAstu! Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj@ >om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comFriday, 13 July, 2007 10:45:07 AMRE: [om_namah_shivaya_ group] Re-Dev Maharaj Namaste PradeepThank you so much for these replies, I am now very much aware of why things are the way that they are. I would like you to ponder on one thing " why Rudra means the Howler and he who makes men cry "Namah SivayaBest RegardsPandit Devindra Maharaj.Pradeep Balakrishnan <balakrishnanpradeep @> wrote: Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat! Dear Shri Rudra Maharaja Namaste! Prabhu let me try to answer to extent my jiva knows... I have read a number of articles, where it is estimated that some80-100 million Hindus have been slaughtered, millions of women rapedand butchered over the last thousand years. ( supplied in my responsebelow, please read carefully ) >> There is nothing called Hindus, it is all men and women, Rudran did not create religion, it is man. History repeats so the actions done yesterday become reactions today. Here the reacting part is Maha Kal and HE cleans in a swipe... My questions are :Seeing that we all came from the same source, and all is Brahman.1) How come Brahman seems to be doing this to primarily to Hinduswhen many of the Hindus have been engaged in worship of Brahmanfor all these thousands of years ? >> Brahman is a witness for this entire episode which has no interval nor beginning. Brahman’s prakrithi is the doer or called maya which has demi-gods etc. Who wants the jivas suffer in the samsara, but still Brahman is the witness. Why do we expect Brahman to help, bhakthi with no expectation makes the –self- align with the supreme-self. This is exactly what Bholenath wants...is it not? 2) Is Sri Krishna having some kind of murderous fit against those thatworship him to be replaced by Allah and Jesus ? >> Atman does not have any guna, They are the manifestations of prakrithi that came from the same seed. 3) What are the lessons we are supposed to learn from getting murderedby the millions ? >> How many times has your jiva spared a mosquito? Or any other helpless insect. Your jiva might have murdered millions of jivas which we do not know ... Lord Pashupathi is a witness...my point is -we- think we have control over things, the point is there is no control of anything over anything...No one can murder anyone, the atma leaves the body but is not dead...the prakrithi makes it appear real...for nothing is real...4) When the women are raped, buggered and kept as slaves do youthink they are being treated with high respects ? >>No they are not. 5) With all the millions of Holy men of India, including however manyGOD men, how come none have been able to stop this from occurring daily for 1000 years ? Is this the Karma of people of India only ? >> Because the holy men and GOD men are never holy nor near GOPD. They do not –self- nor will realise. It is maya that makes the mind feel the other side is green. Prabhu the mightly Rudran does not wish anything but imagine the thousands in the group who ask HIM things everyday and every minute. The day the same jivas do service to HIM or HIS devotees or society in a good way, then the jiva becomes Rudra.6) How has the various saints who controlled their mind and engagedin Brahman been able to lift the people out of poverty, hopelessness and make them live more productive, meaningful lives ? >> because poverty does not exist. What “it” belongs to you is not yours, what belongs to you today is belonging to one tomorrow, what you think you are is not what you will be, what your jiva thinks it knows will be forgotten, your jiva is not yours, which womb our jivas will enter we do not know, we do not remember the past, we die nine times after sleep before waking up, we do not know if we will witness this drama the next minute, we do not control the number of times we breathe, nor we control the air inside the body which has so many holes, we do not know the future, for all these are not in the same people hands who think they have the power to judge other jivas. The same saints do not know what is for them the next instant. The Atman is the silent witness and tries to help the –self- in the jivaI patiently await your response on these questions. >> my –self- answered to the best it knows... SubhaDinamAstu! SarvamSriKrishnaArp anamAstu! Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.Try the Mail Beta. Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story.Play Sims Stories at Games. Get the toolbar and be alerted to new email wherever you're surfing. Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play Sims Stories at Games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Thank you, but all praises are to be directed to Lord Siva only for I am only a channel of what HE says !Namah SivayaBest RegardsPandit Devindra Maharajprasadarao madhunapantula <prasadaraom wrote: Respected Dev Maharaj ji, Pranams. Whenever I read your replies and explanations in this forum, I am really happy at your profound knowledge and gift of educating people with "apt" examples & quotes. Knowledge appropriate use of same are essential. I once again offer my salutations, Sir. M.B.PrasadaRa,Visakhapatnam. --- Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj > wrote: > Namaste Rajeeva > > You know there is " none so blind as those that > refuse to see" > > A very simple fact, these Jihadists are deliberately > bred to hunt and kill you, in the false belief that > they are somehow serving God or religion. > If you wish to allow yourself to become a victim, no > one can stop you.. by all means do so. Don't engage > in trifling talk about me and my silly beliefs. > > You have been informed and warned repeatedly. If you > want to forgive, vizualize and project divine love > while guns are trained on you and bullets are fired > at you... > no one can stop you... you go right ahead. > > I do hope that what Lord Krishna and Lord Shiva and > or any other God did in some other texts will help > you in stopping a bullet with your body, being > kidnapped, raped or beheaded. > > The first rule of life is survival, have you ever > heard the saying : > "If common sense was so common, > a lot more people would have a lot more of it ? > > ponder on this....... > > > Namah Sivaya > Best regards > Pandit Devindra Maharaj > > > > rajeeva ranjan <rajeeva_ranjan2002 > wrote: > > Dear Bhupendra, > > Hypothetical questions are difficult to answer. > But there was a lady in Orissa, whose husband and > sons were burnt alive in a jeep, by devoted hindus, > and she did not file a case. You might say it was a > cowardice, as she might have feared for her own > life, I call it forgivenmess. What one feels > oneself, one attributes it to the world. > > Osama bin laden is also having his jehad, why > blame him then? > > rgds > > rajeeva > > Bhupendra Jamnadas <b_jamnadas (AT) (DOT) ca> wrote: > Dear Rajeeva Ji, > > Yes, you are correct, Mahabharata was enacted by > Lord Krishna to teach the world action. Here is the > story of Balarama, his brother. Before the war > started, Panadavas came to ask for his assistance > and he refused. His logic was that disputes between > kinsmen was not good. The dispute should be > resolved peacefully. And he left for pilgrimage > during this war. Towards the end of the war, during > the final battle between Bhima and Duryodhana, > Balarama comes to witness the battle between the 2. > Balrama is upset that Bhima broke the thigh of > Duryodhana when the ethics of gadaa yuddh was that > no attack shoul; be made below the waistline. This > time Krishna chastises Balarama....that first he > decides to go to pilgimage when the fact is that > during the war between evil and dharama, the > battlefield is the true pilgrimage. Secondly, > balarama was exposing his soft spot for > Duryodhana...for all the wrong that Duryodhana did, > never once did Balarama oppose him and one error by > Bhima > and immediately Balarama was up in arms against > him. This soft spot for Duyodhana was the REAL > reason why Balarama avoided this war going to > pilgrimage instead, he had no particular interest in > peace. > > Another thing...as I mentioned in my previous > posting, Krishna goes at length to explain why Arjun > should fight. He tells Arjun clearly that the peace > Arjun is talking about is nothing but a weak heart > which is refusing to take action against those who > were his kinsmen, when fact is that in a dharma > yuddh, such feelings have no place. Action without > any personal gain is what Gita teaches us. The love > we all talk about is not really but our cowardice > that we try to hide. > > And I do not wish to offend you, but if your wife > or your daughter were to be molested, raped by > some, would you still be able to forgive them and > love them just becuase they are humans? If an animal > is mutilating your child, would you still not do > anything to protect you kid? It is very much easy to > talk about drinking poison you are not having to > drink it. > > True, Siva exist in all, humans and animals and we > should love all life without any discrimination but > neither you nor me is capable of that. Such love > requires zero discrimination and as such, you treat > all beings as the same. The respect that you give to > your mother is that same that you give to your > sister. And you give that same respoect to > everybodies mother, sister, daughter, son, father > brother etc. In such a scenario, marrying someones > daughter and being sexually intimate is completely > out of question. This is the level of love that is > required and you will generate the aura to melt the > hatred your attacker. Are you capable of that? > > Siva gulped the poison, but he also slew Tripur > Asuras. Look at Rama...he was an ocean of mercy, > none in this group can compare with him, yet he had > to kill Ravana. You do not see Rama forgiving and > forgetting the abduction of his wife. But what you > are indirectly suggesting is that let Sita be > abducted by Ravana, Rama should complete his 14 > years in vanvaas and go back to rule ayodhya as if > nothing has happened. This would demonstrate > corwadice, not love. > > Regards, > Bhupendra. > > rajeeva ranjan <rajeeva_ranjan2002 > wrote: > Dear Bhupendra, > > Realising God also is difficult. Why we still try > that? > > The play of Mahabharat was enacted by Krishna to > deliver a lesson to the masses, for teaching. But > even in that, who was the victor - all perished, > including those from Pandava's side, as well. > > The well read doctors from Bangalore trying to rip > Glasgow are also convinced about their acts. But > what do we get at the end. Has violence any chance > of stopping, if we keep on reacting? > > Somebody has to gulp the venom, like Shiva did > during the ocean churning. > > rgds > > ranjan > > Bhupendra Jamnadas <b_jamnadas (AT) (DOT) ca> wrote: > Dear Rajeeva Ranjan, > > What you talking about seems nice in theory but > difficult to practice. In mahabharata, it is finally > Krishna that urges rjun to fight and uproot evil, > that is what his dharma at that time was. Arjun was > more willing to give up his kingdom and not fight > his cousins but Krisna would not let him do it. As > oper what you are saying, Kishna was wrong in > instisting Arjun to fight. Please clarify is that > what you are saying? > > Regards, > bhupendra. > > rajeeva ranjan <rajeeva_ranjan2002 > wrote: > Dear Dev Maharaj, > > What you visualise, you attract. You visualise AK > 47, you get that. You visualise love you get that. > Unfortunately, we have been conditioned right from > our childhood to have mistrust in the universe, and > so misfortunes keep on coming to us because we keep > on thinking of them. The world is caught in a > vicious circle. Keep on thinking of love, which is > God, and you will never have a misfortune. we have > the power to change our own reality. > > Worshipping God, with a heart full of hatred, will > not take you to God, as the same God has made > everybody, including you, me and them. > > rgds > > ranjan > > Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj > wrote: > Namaste > > Dear Dear Dear Ec > > I don't know if you actually saw the movie clips > that were sent to you but I truly hope you will > express === message truncated === ________ Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out. http://answers./dir/?link=list & sid=396545469 Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Sarvam sivam Dear friends, A holy feast indeed, this thread had been a long one, but very informative and it makes sense. Being a silent observant of this group, I am happy that at last our two dear friends balakrishnan and dev Maharaj ji, came to a agreeable point. Debates on religions are not new. But this debate is a good one. I myself a peace lover, I do oppose the very thought of taking weapon against people. But Love is a biggest weapon than all. When we unite and stand on to protect our religion there is no need for us to fight with weapons, rather we could show how mentally stronger. Well, as far as our dev maharaj ji's arguments, our dear father who is a karuna moorthy has the quality of Rudra also. But the underlying truth is love and truthfulness. One who is strong in his love for Paramathman, is above all fears and threats. Any evil or threat directed to him, will be destroyed by itself. A ball hits the strong wall, bounce back and hits the thrower. Sivaya namaha, punith balu Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj wrote: Thank you, but all praises are to be directed to Lord Siva only for I am only a channel of what HE says !Namah SivayaBest RegardsPandit Devindra Maharajprasadarao madhunapantula <prasadaraom > wrote: Respected Dev Maharaj ji, Pranams.Whenever I read your replies and explanations in thisforum, I am really happy at your profound knowledgeand gift of educating people with "apt" examples & quotes. Knowledge appropriate use of same areessential. I once again offer my salutations, Sir.M.B.PrasadaRa,Visakhapatnam.--- Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj > wrote:> Namaste Rajeeva> > You know there is " none so blind as those that> refuse to see"> > A very simple fact, these Jihadists are deliberately> bred to hunt and kill you, in the false belief that> they are somehow serving God or religion.> If you wish to allow yourself to become a victim, no> one can stop you.. by all means do so. Don't engage> in trifling talk about me and my silly beliefs.> > You have been informed and warned repeatedly. If you> want to forgive, vizualize and project divine love> while guns are trained on you and bullets are fired> at you...> no one can stop you... you go right ahead.> > I do hope that what Lord Krishna and Lord Shiva and> or any other God did in some other texts will help> you in stopping a bullet with your body, being> kidnapped, raped or beheaded.> > The first rule of life is survival, have you ever> heard the saying :> "If common sense was so common,> a lot more people would have a lot more of it ?> > ponder on this.......> > > Namah Sivaya > Best regards> Pandit Devindra Maharaj> > > > rajeeva ranjan <rajeeva_ranjan2002 > wrote:> > Dear Bhupendra,> > Hypothetical questions are difficult to answer.> But there was a lady in Orissa, whose husband and> sons were burnt alive in a jeep, by devoted hindus,> and she did not file a case. You might say it was a> cowardice, as she might have feared for her own> life, I call it forgivenmess. What one feels> oneself, one attributes it to the world.> > Osama bin laden is also having his jehad, why> blame him then?> > rgds> > rajeeva> > Bhupendra Jamnadas <b_jamnadas (AT) (DOT) ca> wrote:> Dear Rajeeva Ji,> > Yes, you are correct, Mahabharata was enacted by> Lord Krishna to teach the world action. Here is the> story of Balarama, his brother. Before the war> started, Panadavas came to ask for his assistance> and he refused. His logic was that disputes between> kinsmen was not good. The dispute should be > resolved peacefully. And he left for pilgrimage> during this war. Towards the end of the war, during> the final battle between Bhima and Duryodhana,> Balarama comes to witness the battle between the 2.> Balrama is upset that Bhima broke the thigh of> Duryodhana when the ethics of gadaa yuddh was that> no attack shoul; be made below the waistline. This> time Krishna chastises Balarama....that first he> decides to go to pilgimage when the fact is that> during the war between evil and dharama, the> battlefield is the true pilgrimage. Secondly,> balarama was exposing his soft spot for> Duryodhana...for all the wrong that Duryodhana did,> never once did Balarama oppose him and one error by> Bhima> and immediately Balarama was up in arms against> him. This soft spot for Duyodhana was the REAL> reason why Balarama avoided this war going to> pilgrimage instead, he had no particular interest in> peace.> > Another thing...as I mentioned in my previous> posting, Krishna goes at length to explain why Arjun> should fight. He tells Arjun clearly that the peace> Arjun is talking about is nothing but a weak heart> which is refusing to take action against those who> were his kinsmen, when fact is that in a dharma> yuddh, such feelings have no place. Action without> any personal gain is what Gita teaches us. The love> we all talk about is not really but our cowardice> that we try to hide. > > And I do not wish to offend you, but if your wife> or your daughter were to be molested, raped by> some, would you still be able to forgive them and> love them just becuase they are humans? If an animal> is mutilating your child, would you still not do> anything to protect you kid? It is very much easy to> talk about drinking poison you are not having to> drink it.> > True, Siva exist in all, humans and animals and we> should love all life without any discrimination but> neither you nor me is capable of that. Such love> requires zero discrimination and as such, you treat> all beings as the same. The respect that you give to> your mother is that same that you give to your> sister. And you give that same respoect to> everybodies mother, sister, daughter, son, father> brother etc. In such a scenario, marrying someones> daughter and being sexually intimate is completely> out of question. This is the level of love that is> required and you will generate the aura to melt the> hatred your attacker. Are you capable of that?> > Siva gulped the poison, but he also slew Tripur> Asuras. Look at Rama...he was an ocean of mercy,> none in this group can compare with him, yet he had> to kill Ravana. You do not see Rama forgiving and> forgetting the abduction of his wife. But what you> are indirectly suggesting is that let Sita be> abducted by Ravana, Rama should complete his 14> years in vanvaas and go back to rule ayodhya as if> nothing has happened. This would demonstrate> corwadice, not love.> > Regards,> Bhupendra.> > rajeeva ranjan <rajeeva_ranjan2002 > wrote:> Dear Bhupendra,> > Realising God also is difficult. Why we still try> that?> > The play of Mahabharat was enacted by Krishna to> deliver a lesson to the masses, for teaching. But> even in that, who was the victor - all perished,> including those from Pandava's side, as well. > > The well read doctors from Bangalore trying to rip> Glasgow are also convinced about their acts. But> what do we get at the end. Has violence any chance> of stopping, if we keep on reacting?> > Somebody has to gulp the venom, like Shiva did> during the ocean churning.> > rgds> > ranjan> > Bhupendra Jamnadas <b_jamnadas (AT) (DOT) ca> wrote:> Dear Rajeeva Ranjan,> > What you talking about seems nice in theory but> difficult to practice. In mahabharata, it is finally> Krishna that urges rjun to fight and uproot evil,> that is what his dharma at that time was. Arjun was> more willing to give up his kingdom and not fight> his cousins but Krisna would not let him do it. As> oper what you are saying, Kishna was wrong in> instisting Arjun to fight. Please clarify is that> what you are saying?> > Regards,> bhupendra.> > rajeeva ranjan <rajeeva_ranjan2002 > wrote:> Dear Dev Maharaj,> > What you visualise, you attract. You visualise AK> 47, you get that. You visualise love you get that.> Unfortunately, we have been conditioned right from> our childhood to have mistrust in the universe, and> so misfortunes keep on coming to us because we keep> on thinking of them. The world is caught in a> vicious circle. Keep on thinking of love, which is> God, and you will never have a misfortune. we have> the power to change our own reality.> > Worshipping God, with a heart full of hatred, will> not take you to God, as the same God has made> everybody, including you, me and them.> > rgds> > ranjan> > Dev Maharaj <dev_maharaj > wrote:> Namaste> > Dear Dear Dear Ec> > I don't know if you actually saw the movie clips> that were sent to you but I truly hope you will> express === message truncated ===________Be a better Globetrotter. 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Guest guest Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Namaste Pradeep Ji, Pleasure is mine as well. There are atleast 2 days a week....everyweek that I remember you if you could remember what it would be for. , Pradeep Balakrishnan <balakrishnanpradeep wrote: > > Hari Om! Hari Om Tat Sat! > > Namaste Shri Bhupendraji, pleasure to talk again. > > Very interesting indeed, now whether the story of the sannyasi is > fact or fiction is another matter. But tell me...since you know this > story and therefore have narrated it to us...are you able to > practice the same kind of pacifism that you are talking about? > > >> If you think this is story, then it is. If the faith in you > is strong then the story is the final word. My jiva is trying prabhu, > some day my jiva will be guided by Shri Bhagavadham to be like the > brahmin HE describes. > > If your child is sick or your wife or yourself, do you take medicine or > do you just let things run their course? Do you have a house of do > you live without a house and let yourself be nurtured by > nature?...after all wind rain heat is all a result of sense induced > mental condition, just like anger and lust and hatred, and shouldn't > really affect the realised soul. What is the need for > clothes...afterall, shame is just another mental condition like hate > and anger. > >> All our jiva has to do Brahma Dharmam, Vishnu Dharmam and Rudra Dharmam. > Now the jiva is going through Vishnu dharmam, in Rudra Dharmam, with HIS > blessings my jiva can reach... > > What is the purpose of law courts, hospitals, schools and > governments when we should all let things be taken care of by the > lord? What is the purpose of getting a job or getting education > towards a better job? Earth provides enough bounty to fulfill our > needs, we could survive on fruits available free from trees, we > don't really need cooked food do we? > >> Hmm...very often people in law courts, hospitals, schools and goverments > run to God only for help...even you do the same... I never disclaim that I go to GOD for help, but you have sidestepped the question here. > The story of the sannyasi that you narrated...probably he attained > moksha(if the story is real), but his presence nor his absence nor > his perseverance made the society any better, the cruel remained > cruel and never learnt. If you were on the scene and saw the people > humiliating the sanyassi, what would you do? Would you let him > suffer looking it all as gods will or would you ACT to help him? > >> How do you define real? Are you real? What did you see when you were > in the womb of your mother? No offense? How many times did you really > breathe yesterday night? What if you have seen incidents, do you > remember perfectly? Do you remember how many times you car stopped > in various traffic signals and for how long? > > I do not know if my jiva was there during this Sanyasi time frame > but if it happens today, jiva will try to help, but it is unto the > Sanyasi to accept or reject. > > So you would help! You have hit the nail here. Whatever be the Gods will....it is not something we know, so in the meantime, we need to do what we believe is right. We all die, yet we take medicine when we are sick...even you do that for yourself and your family members do that to....and there are many others things we daily even if we believe that GOD has decided everything. > That which you preach, you simply will not be able to practice > yourself otherwise you will not be writing this posts but living > somewhere at the mercy of elements. > >> This is your judgement and wishful thinking. I am not preaching... > nor do I know the profound knowledge you think you posses. But I am confident > that someday either in this birth or another birth my father Shri Rudran will > guide me there...my faith drives my jiva... > > SarvamSriKrishnaArpanamAstu! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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