Guest guest Posted April 14, 2007 Report Share Posted April 14, 2007 Om Sai Ram Dear Kartikiyer ji,Well, there are two different ways that this could be explained-- The first one is that we all agree that we see dreams in the night while we are sleeping but we also agree that we all do not remember everything that we see when we wake up in the morning and thus are able to continue with our daily so called 'real lives' that we beleive it to be without having any confusions. Since we just sometimes remember bits and pieces of one dream that was over whelming to us, the fact is that it can not make us rule out the possibility of whether indeed we do have a continuity of our dreams in our sleeping state just like our lives continue normally when we wake up in the morning.So the fact remains, everything is maya- what we experience during our waking state and what we see during our sleeping state.Nothing is real-its all maya.The only thing that is real is ur soul which is waiting for you to realize that all what u see around you is maya and to come out of it and only then u will be able to see something that is actually real and that is the great power -- the bright light---God ,who created this universe and something to fascinate all of us which is nothing but MAYA... Another logical explaination could also be this -- We all know that what ever we see in our dreams during the sleeping state is representing our so called real lives. The feelings and emotions that for some reason remain supressed in our normal day to day life -are experienced in our sleeping state. King Janaka dreampt that he was a beggar and was alone in a jungle, he had lost his mind and was hungry for food ---- Well, this could be interpreted as his hunger for spiritual knowledge .In the path of spiritual knowledge , are'nt we all alone loosing our minds with what is right and what is wrong - what is real and what is unreal--- our desires pull us one way and temptations attract us making us do things which only a mad person can do .. If u go to think of it -we all are in a jungle-it is just that we are trying to save ourselves not from tigers ,lions and other wild animals instead we are all trying to be away from the wild beast which actually are nothing but bad temptations like greed ,ego ,selfishness ,pride , cheating and the list goes on and on.. King Janaka dreampt that he saw some men washing dishes and vessels after a feast which they shared and that he ran towards them seeking some crumbs,some little quantity of rice scraped from the vessels ,that he was about to eat but a bird swooped it out of his grasp and so he was left hungry ,angry and in pain--- this could be interpreted as:: the men whom he met who were washing dishes after a feast were the learned men in his court whom he gained spiritual knowledge from and who had the pleasure of being with the king and getting a royal treatment. The learned men did share a little knowledge with the king which were the crumbs but maya swooped it all when the king went to sleep. The pain and grief of the king were nothing but his disappointments in the path of gaining spiritual knowledge. In the end , it is just God what is real and the rest is all a dream.A dream that sometimes we see when we are sleeping and sometimes we see when we are awake. Allaah Maalik! "Gurur Brahma Gurur Vishnu Gurur Devoh Maheshwar; Gurur Shakshat Parambramha Tashmai Shri Gurur Veh Namah" May the Merciful Sri Sai Baba always shower His grace on us and our families and remove our problems and anxieties by giving us all - strength , goodluck, success and happiness with peace of mind. Sai bhakt, Deepa H debu7366 Leeladhar <leedharart wrote: ""King Janaka used to gather many rishis in his palace and take delight> in discussing with them about spiritual problems; he was a great adept at> sadhana and he attained the highest stage of samadhi through Raja yoga.One> day, while in the midst of the court, with the Queen and the maids, even> while he was conversing with them, he fell asleep. He had a dream. Hedreamt> that he was deprived of his kingdom, that he was roaming half-mad, hungry> and deserted in the jungle, begging for food from whoever he met, that he> came upon some men washing dishes and vessels after a feast which they had> shared, that he ran towards them seeking some crumbs, that they gave him> some little quantity of rice scraped from the vessels, that he was aboutto> put it into his mouth when a big bird flew in and swooped it out of his> grasp; so, he yelled in pain and grief, and the Queen heard it and shewoke> him up.> Of course, when he woke, he knew he was the King. He remembered that a> second previously, he was a beggar. He questioned within himself, which is> real, this or that? To every one who inquired what the matter was, he put> the same question. "Am I a king or a beggar?" The queen and others were> frightened at this behaviour; they sent for the ministers and with them> came, Ashtavakra, the preceptor. He discovered the situation as soon as he> saw the King; so, to the question that the King put him, he answered,"Raja!> This is unreal; that is unreal; you, who experienced this as well as that,> you alone are real."> The waking stage is real until the sleeping stage; the sleeping stage is> real, until the waking stage. But, both are unreal, because one cancelsthe> other."">> I just read this story and could understand everything except that one> question keeps bothering me....> How can we explain the continuity of the waking state and the> discontinuity of the dream state... if both are as unreal as the other,then> how is it that life is continuous when we wake up every morning... also in> the dream state we do not continue our dream we had the previous night....> please help me understand this..>>>>> *LOVE,*> *KARTIK IYER* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2007 Report Share Posted April 15, 2007 Jai Sai Ram, I am going to try for this one...May be I am wrong but I had pondered over this one before...(May be I am wrong - no harm to brain storm) I think what the minister answered was wrong...Your argument is right...Coz if dream was real then it should also be continues. If we die in dream then too due to the nature of the dream one can go on dreaming further about what one soul is doing after death. One the other side if we are hurt in the waking state then we feel the pain in great detail and intensity as compared to the dreaming stage where we usually get a shock but can feel it in great detail. Okay, the answer that I had come across was: What is Real depends on one's level of " AWARENESS " ...In dream stage one is not aware that one is dreaming and hence one feels it to be totally real...When waking stage comes, dream stage becomes unreal, cause be ones " awareness level " is higher...Dream cannot be the real this cause of one of the arguments that you have already made...If the dream was indeed as real as the waking stage and if both were real then we all would be so careless about our dream...I would ask Baba to make me a millionaire even in a dream (smilesss..hehe)...Nay, I would ask for his darshan and salvation even in the dream world... Buttttt, there is a higher level of awareness than the waking stage as welll.....Which the yogi's and the self-realised souls experience....They " know " that even the waking stage is like a dream and is not real...hence they dont cry when death comes, cause they know that it all untrue....They are on a higher level of " awareness " than a normal human being...Baba is one of those...We haven't yet achieved that level of awareness, Baba wants us to have that level of awareness and see beyond life and death, and thus we think that this worldddd is the only REAL world and deathhh is the most painfull painfulllll.. This is not to what you have asked but at times I think that God has given all of these things to us to learn from it...Like dream to understand the dream nature of this real world, mother to see mother in the Divine and he pure love, father also for the same pupose - to see God as him who protects, this vast cosmic creation to understand that we are so tiny that we should carry a big " EGO " cause what are we?....I could have seen the divine mother in Baba if God would have created any such thing as a " mother " . Jai Sai Ram On 14 Apr 2007 15:56:27 -0700, Leeladhar <saileelas wrote: " " King Janaka used to gather many rishis in his palace and take delight> in discussing with them about spiritual problems; he was a great adept at> sadhana and he attained the highest stage of samadhi through Raja yoga. One> day, while in the midst of the court, with the Queen and the maids, even> while he was conversing with them, he fell asleep. He had a dream. Hedreamt> that he was deprived of his kingdom, that he was roaming half-mad, hungry > and deserted in the jungle, begging for food from whoever he met, that he> came upon some men washing dishes and vessels after a feast which they had> shared, that he ran towards them seeking some crumbs, that they gave him > some little quantity of rice scraped from the vessels, that he was aboutto> put it into his mouth when a big bird flew in and swooped it out of his> grasp; so, he yelled in pain and grief, and the Queen heard it and she woke> him up.> Of course, when he woke, he knew he was the King. He remembered that a> second previously, he was a beggar. He questioned within himself, which is> real, this or that? To every one who inquired what the matter was, he put > the same question. " Am I a king or a beggar? " The queen and others were> frightened at this behaviour; they sent for the ministers and with them> came, Ashtavakra, the preceptor. He discovered the situation as soon as he > saw the King; so, to the question that the King put him, he answered, " Raja!> This is unreal; that is unreal; you, who experienced this as well as that,> you alone are real. " > The waking stage is real until the sleeping stage; the sleeping stage is > real, until the waking stage. But, both are unreal, because one cancelsthe> other. " " >> I just read this story and could understand everything except that one> question keeps bothering me.... > How can we explain the continuity of the waking state and the> discontinuity of the dream state... if both are as unreal as the other,then> how is it that life is continuous when we wake up every morning... also in > the dream state we do not continue our dream we had the previous night....> please help me understand this..>>>>> *LOVE,*> *KARTIK IYER*> -- " Let Noble thoughts come to us from every side " . - RigVeda (1-89-i) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2007 Report Share Posted April 16, 2007 Dear Kartikiyer ji,I read a quote from a history of japan. Some great person said " Life is a dream with in a dream " . . i am trying to apply it to your question. om sairam,venkatOn 14 Apr 2007 20:16:20 -0700, Deepa H <debu7366 wrote: Om Sai Ram Dear Kartikiyer ji,Well, there are two different ways that this could be explained-- The first one is that we all agree that we see dreams in the night while we are sleeping but we also agree that we all do not remember everything that we see when we wake up in the morning and thus are able to continue with our daily so called 'real lives' that we beleive it to be without having any confusions. Since we just sometimes remember bits and pieces of one dream that was over whelming to us, the fact is that it can not make us rule out the possibility of whether indeed we do have a continuity of our dreams in our sleeping state just like our lives continue normally when we wake up in the morning.So the fact remains, everything is maya- what we experience during our waking state and what we see during our sleeping state.Nothing is real-its all maya.The only thing that is real is ur soul which is waiting for you to realize that all what u see around you is maya and to come out of it and only then u will be able to see something that is actually real and that is the great power -- the bright light---God ,who created this universe and something to fascinate all of us which is nothing but MAYA... Another logical explaination could also be this -- We all know that what ever we see in our dreams during the sleeping state is representing our so called real lives. The feelings and emotions that for some reason remain supressed in our normal day to day life -are experienced in our sleeping state. King Janaka dreampt that he was a beggar and was alone in a jungle, he had lost his mind and was hungry for food ---- Well, this could be interpreted as his hunger for spiritual knowledge .In the path of spiritual knowledge , are'nt we all alone loosing our minds with what is right and what is wrong - what is real and what is unreal--- our desires pull us one way and temptations attract us making us do things which only a mad person can do .. If u go to think of it -we all are in a jungle-it is just that we are trying to save ourselves not from tigers ,lions and other wild animals instead we are all trying to be away from the wild beast which actually are nothing but bad temptations like greed ,ego ,selfishness ,pride , cheating and the list goes on and on.. King Janaka dreampt that he saw some men washing dishes and vessels after a feast which they shared and that he ran towards them seeking some crumbs,some little quantity of rice scraped from the vessels ,that he was about to eat but a bird swooped it out of his grasp and so he was left hungry ,angry and in pain--- this could be interpreted as:: the men whom he met who were washing dishes after a feast were the learned men in his court whom he gained spiritual knowledge from and who had the pleasure of being with the king and getting a royal treatment. The learned men did share a little knowledge with the king which were the crumbs but maya swooped it all when the king went to sleep. The pain and grief of the king were nothing but his disappointments in the path of gaining spiritual knowledge. In the end , it is just God what is real and the rest is all a dream.A dream that sometimes we see when we are sleeping and sometimes we see when we are awake. Allaah Maalik! " Gurur Brahma Gurur Vishnu Gurur Devoh Maheshwar; Gurur Shakshat Parambramha Tashmai Shri Gurur Veh Namah " May the Merciful Sri Sai Baba always shower His grace on us and our families and remove our problems and anxieties by giving us all - strength , goodluck, success and happiness with peace of mind. Sai bhakt, Deepa H debu7366 Leeladhar <leedharart (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: " " King Janaka used to gather many rishis in his palace and take delight> in discussing with them about spiritual problems; he was a great adept at > sadhana and he attained the highest stage of samadhi through Raja yoga.One> day, while in the midst of the court, with the Queen and the maids, even> while he was conversing with them, he fell asleep. He had a dream. Hedreamt> that he was deprived of his kingdom, that he was roaming half-mad, hungry> and deserted in the jungle, begging for food from whoever he met, that he> came upon some men washing dishes and vessels after a feast which they had > shared, that he ran towards them seeking some crumbs, that they gave him> some little quantity of rice scraped from the vessels, that he was aboutto> put it into his mouth when a big bird flew in and swooped it out of his > grasp; so, he yelled in pain and grief, and the Queen heard it and shewoke> him up.> Of course, when he woke, he knew he was the King. He remembered that a> second previously, he was a beggar. He questioned within himself, which is > real, this or that? To every one who inquired what the matter was, he put> the same question. " Am I a king or a beggar? " The queen and others were> frightened at this behaviour; they sent for the ministers and with them> came, Ashtavakra, the preceptor. He discovered the situation as soon as he> saw the King; so, to the question that the King put him, he answered, " Raja!> This is unreal; that is unreal; you, who experienced this as well as that,> you alone are real. " > The waking stage is real until the sleeping stage; the sleeping stage is> real, until the waking stage. But, both are unreal, because one cancels the> other. " " >> I just read this story and could understand everything except that one> question keeps bothering me....> How can we explain the continuity of the waking state and the > discontinuity of the dream state... if both are as unreal as the other,then> how is it that life is continuous when we wake up every morning... also in> the dream state we do not continue our dream we had the previous night....> please help me understand this..>>>>> *LOVE,*> *KARTIK IYER* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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