Guest guest Posted July 26, 2008 Report Share Posted July 26, 2008 Namaste. Excerpt from our review of the book -- Renowned Goddess of Desire; Women, Sex and Speech in Tantra by Loriliai Biernacki Do tantric writings glorify women as embodied divinity? Or do they instead treat women as a resource for the male practitioner? The answers to these two questions are yes and yes, according to feminist historian Loriliai Biernacki. Her point is that not all tantras are the same - they're 'by no means uniform in their attitude towards women...' (p 30) Biernacki indicates (pp 8-9) that she was favorably surprised by what is said about women in a particular group of Sanskrit texts, which in her view express 'a particular strand of Tantra' (p10). Texts of this strand include the _Brihannila Tantra_, which is the primary text used in Biernacki's study. These texts describe a way of worshipping and living which is called in Sanskrit the _Kali sadhana_; or, as Bieracki translates, the 'Kali Practice'...(p 31) According to this particular strand of Tantra, women as a group are powerful beings, with natural aptitude for use of mantras either to bless or curse. (p 45) They can be excellent gurus. (p 46) Men in the path of Kali Practice are instructed to honour women -- all women, regardless of their age, or appearance, or ancestry, or character -- to honour women not only in ritual, but also in daily life... The rest of this book review can be found at http://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/bier.html Om Santih Colin of Ferment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 Howdy Colin. That was a informative review. Loriliai's book seems like a worthwhile read, but i was more interested in the Tantric texts you mentioned. It is a good 'to read' list if they are available. I finally had a good look at the ferment website the other day and saw the photos. Funny thing is people never look like you would imagine them to, which is probably a good thing. Its actually quite well set up and generally good for a gander. Otherwise not a lot out of the ordinary happening down here. One question, me and my friends from Esoteric Bookshop in Murrumbeena were discussing the whole Ouija board thang and came to a concensus that they are too unpredictable and sometimes not safe to use. Now Spellcraft have just included one in the latest edition with a how to use guide. Wot do u think about this? Is it Ok or irresponsible, given that there are much safer methods of divination available. Anyways thanks again, Cheers, Blessed Be and Om Kali-ma.colin777au <colinr wrote: Namaste.Excerpt from our review of the book --Renowned Goddess of Desire; Women, Sex and Speech in Tantra by Loriliai BiernackiDo tantric writings glorify women as embodied divinity? Or do they instead treat women as a resource for the male practitioner? The answers to these two questions are yes and yes, according to feminist historian Loriliai Biernacki. Her point is that not all tantras are the same - they're 'by no means uniform in their attitude towards women...' (p 30) Biernacki indicates (pp 8-9) that she was favorably surprised by what is said about women in a particular group of Sanskrit texts, which in her view express 'a particular strand of Tantra' (p10). Texts of this strand include the _Brihannila Tantra_, which is the primary text used in Biernacki's study. These texts describe a way of worshipping and living which is called in Sanskrit the _Kali sadhana_; or, as Bieracki translates, the 'Kali Practice'...(p 31)According to this particular strand of Tantra, women as a group are powerful beings, with natural aptitude for use of mantras either to bless or curse. (p 45) They can be excellent gurus. (p 46) Men in the path of Kali Practice are instructed to honour women -- all women, regardless of their age, or appearance, or ancestry, or character -- to honour women not only in ritual, but also in daily life...The rest of this book review can be found athttp://home.pacific.net.au/~ferment/bier.htmlOm SantihColin of Ferment Find a better answer, faster with the new 7 Search - Start Here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Kali_Ma , Shane Gray <geminiacal999 wrote: > > Howdy Colin. That was a informative review. Loriliai's book seems like a worthwhile read, but i was more interested in the Tantric texts you mentioned. It is a good 'to read' list if they are available. I finally had a good look at the ferment website the other day and saw the photos. Funny thing is people never look like you would imagine them to, which is probably a good thing. Its actually quite well set up and generally good for a gander. Howdy Shane. I wonder how you imagined we'd look? Anyway, thanks for your comment on the website. I will put a copy of what you've written on one of our feedback sections, assuming that's ok with you. Regarding availability of the Tantric texts mentioned in my review... An easy one to get hold of is the Devi Mahatmyam. You can get an inexpensive copy of Jagadiswarananda's translation (which is quite literal and reliable) through the Vedanta Book Agency in Sydney. Their address is PO Box 817, Strathfield NSW 2135 or you can phone them on 02 9745 4320. Woodroffe's book Hymns to the Goddess is obtainable as a paperback through Amazon at http://www.amazon.com/Hymns-Goddess-Hymn-Kali-Woodroffe/dp/8185988161 The Kularnava Tantra is a slightly trickier question. There is a Motilal Banarsidass edition by Avalon, Pandit and Vidyaratna, which does _not_ provide the full text in English. What it does contain is * an _abridged_ English translation by M.P.Pandit, * a short discussion of the text by Woodroffe, * the complete text in Sanskrit You can get it thru Amazon at http://www.amazon.com/Kularnava-Tantra-Arthur-Avalon/dp/8120809734 An apparently complete English translation of the Kularnava Tantra (with accompanying Sanskrit text) has been made by Ram Kumar Rai and published by Prachya Prakashan of Varanasi. Haven't actually read this one myself, so cannot comment on how satisfactory the translation is. The following website provides information and a means to buy a copy http://www.exoticindiaart.com/book/details/IDI580/ I don't think many of the other tantras mentioned by Biernacki are available in English. Except the comparatively short Yoni Tantra, of which there is a translation on the web at http://www.religiousworlds.com/mandalam/ftp/yoni.pdf > Otherwise not a lot out of the ordinary happening down here. One question, me and my friends from Esoteric Bookshop in Murrumbeena were discussing the whole Ouija board thang and came to a concensus that they are too unpredictable and sometimes not safe to use. Now Spellcraft have just included one in the latest edition with a how to use guide. Wot do u think about this? Is it Ok or irresponsible, given that there are much safer methods of divination available. Interesting question. I've neither used an ouija board, nor done much research on them; but I do know they have been around for a while, which suggests to me that there's a constituency of people who find them useful. I have also heard anecdotes about people getting seriously troubled by messages that reached them via an ouija board... Then again, haven't people also been troubled by messages that reached them through the internet? Does that mean we shouldn't use the internet? >given that there are much safer methods of divination available. What forms of divination would you recommend? May the Goddess bless your path, Om Shantih Colin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 6, 2008 Report Share Posted August 6, 2008 Hey colin thanks for the reply. Its funny i had this impression of you being one of those business, conservative looking or sort of nerdy academic pagans with glasses and stuff. Bet you find that funny. Ta for the info on the tantras. My preferred form of divination is the pendulum which is simply a medium through which My higher self/Kali can give me guidance. And yes i have heard of Pendulums being hijacked by mischevious spiritual beings but i've had nothing but a genuine feeling of connection when using it and Ma' has actually encouraged me to use it to chat with her, i believe as a means of connection as much as providing me answers to my questions no matter how inane they sometimes are. I've not really had much experience with Tarot, runes and other forms of divination, but in regards to Ouija i have heard of rather disturbing accounts of people attracting unwanted attention. Having said that practitioners of Voodoo and similar traditions have been using them for yonks and seem to know how to deal with them and the spirits they contact through them. I just think that coz u have no control of who your contacting that they are tools best left to those folk with a lot of spirit experience. Other forms of div. seem to have less problems in this regard, which i understand from having discussions with Taroists etc. Anyway bye for now, B B and Om Kali-Ma, Shane.colin777au <colinr wrote: Kali_Ma , Shane Gray <geminiacal999 wrote: > > Howdy Colin. That was a informative review. Loriliai's book seems like a worthwhile read, but i was more interested in the Tantric texts you mentioned. It is a good 'to read' list if they are available. I finally had a good look at the ferment website the other day and saw the photos. Funny thing is people never look like you would imagine them to, which is probably a good thing. Its actually quite well set up and generally good for a gander. Howdy Shane. I wonder how you imagined we'd look? Anyway, thanks for your comment on the website. I will put a copy of what you've written on one of our feedback sections, assuming that's ok with you. Regarding availability of the Tantric texts mentioned in my review... An easy one to get hold of is the Devi Mahatmyam. You can get an inexpensive copy of Jagadiswarananda's translation (which is quite literal and reliable) through the Vedanta Book Agency in Sydney. Their address is PO Box 817, Strathfield NSW 2135 or you can phone them on 02 9745 4320. Woodroffe's book Hymns to the Goddess is obtainable as a paperback through Amazon at http://www.amazon.com/Hymns-Goddess-Hymn-Kali-Woodroffe/dp/8185988161 The Kularnava Tantra is a slightly trickier question. There is a Motilal Banarsidass edition by Avalon, Pandit and Vidyaratna, which does _not_ provide the full text in English. What it does contain is * an _abridged_ English translation by M.P.Pandit, * a short discussion of the text by Woodroffe, * the complete text in Sanskrit You can get it thru Amazon at http://www.amazon.com/Kularnava-Tantra-Arthur-Avalon/dp/8120809734 An apparently complete English translation of the Kularnava Tantra (with accompanying Sanskrit text) has been made by Ram Kumar Rai and published by Prachya Prakashan of Varanasi. Haven't actually read this one myself, so cannot comment on how satisfactory the translation is. The following website provides information and a means to buy a copy http://www.exoticindiaart.com/book/details/IDI580/ I don't think many of the other tantras mentioned by Biernacki are available in English. Except the comparatively short Yoni Tantra, of which there is a translation on the web at http://www.religiousworlds.com/mandalam/ftp/yoni.pdf > Otherwise not a lot out of the ordinary happening down here. One question, me and my friends from Esoteric Bookshop in Murrumbeena were discussing the whole Ouija board thang and came to a concensus that they are too unpredictable and sometimes not safe to use. Now Spellcraft have just included one in the latest edition with a how to use guide. Wot do u think about this? Is it Ok or irresponsible, given that there are much safer methods of divination available. Interesting question. I've neither used an ouija board, nor done much research on them; but I do know they have been around for a while, which suggests to me that there's a constituency of people who find them useful. I have also heard anecdotes about people getting seriously troubled by messages that reached them via an ouija board... Then again, haven't people also been troubled by messages that reached them through the internet? Does that mean we shouldn't use the internet? >given that there are much safer methods of divination available. What forms of divination would you recommend? May the Goddess bless your path, Om Shantih Colin Find a better answer, faster with the new 7 Search - Start Here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 9, 2008 Report Share Posted August 9, 2008 Hey Shane. >Its funny i had this impression of you being one of those business, conservative looking or sort of nerdy academic pagans with glasses and stuff. Bet you find that funny. You're right, in a way -- I do spend a lot of time reading, not to mention writing. Haven't had to get glasses yet, but quite likely will one day. >My preferred form of divination is the pendulum which is simply a medium through which My higher self/Kali can give me guidance. I like the way you expressed that. Perhaps there is a sense in which each of us has his/her own source of guidance, as is suggested by the phrase 'My higher self'... Reflecting on my own experiences and those of others, I've come to think that Kali has a different face or voice - a different aspect - for each of Her mystics. The Sanskrit term ishta devata comes to mind... How do you see the relation between this form of guidance and the thought processes of your everyday self? Does divination replace thinking, or do they work together? Om Shantih Colin Kali_Ma , Shane Gray <geminiacal999 wrote: > > Hey colin thanks for the reply. Its funny i had this impression of you being one of those business, conservative looking or sort of nerdy academic pagans with glasses and stuff. Bet you find that funny. Ta for the info on the tantras. My preferred form of divination is the pendulum which is simply a medium through which My higher self/Kali can give me guidance. And yes i have heard of Pendulums being hijacked by mischevious spiritual beings but i've had nothing but a genuine feeling of connection when using it and Ma' has actually encouraged me to use it to chat with her, i believe as a means of connection as much as providing me answers to my questions no matter how inane they sometimes are. I've not really had much experience with Tarot, runes and other forms of divination, but in regards to Ouija i have heard of rather disturbing accounts of people attracting unwanted attention. Having said that practitioners of Voodoo and similar traditions have been using them for > yonks and seem to know how to deal with them and the spirits they contact through them. I just think that coz u have no control of who your contacting that they are tools best left to those folk with a lot of spirit experience. Other forms of div. seem to have less problems in this regard, which i understand from having discussions with Taroists etc. Anyway bye for now, B B and Om Kali-Ma, Shane. > > colin777au <colinr wrote: --- In Kali_Ma , Shane Gray <geminiacal999@> wrote: > > > > Howdy Colin. That was a informative review. Loriliai's book seems like a worthwhile read, but i was more interested in the Tantric texts you mentioned. It is a good 'to read' list if they are available. I finally had a good look at the ferment website the other day and saw the photos. Funny thing is people never look like you would imagine them to, which is probably a good thing. Its actually quite well set up and generally good for a gander. > > Howdy Shane. I wonder how you imagined we'd look? > > Anyway, thanks for your comment on the website. I will put a copy of what you've written on one of our feedback sections, assuming that's ok with you. > > Regarding availability of the Tantric texts mentioned in my review... An easy one to get hold of is the Devi Mahatmyam. You can get an inexpensive copy of Jagadiswarananda's translation (which is quite literal and reliable) through the Vedanta Book Agency in Sydney. Their address is PO Box 817, Strathfield NSW 2135 or you can phone them on 02 9745 4320. > > Woodroffe's book Hymns to the Goddess is obtainable as a paperback through Amazon at > http://www.amazon.com/Hymns-Goddess-Hymn-Kali-Woodroffe/dp/8185988161 > > The Kularnava Tantra is a slightly trickier question. There is a Motilal Banarsidass edition by Avalon, Pandit and Vidyaratna, which does _not_ provide the full text in English. What it does contain is > * an _abridged_ English translation by M.P.Pandit, > * a short discussion of the text by Woodroffe, > * the complete text in Sanskrit > You can get it thru Amazon at > http://www.amazon.com/Kularnava-Tantra-Arthur-Avalon/dp/8120809734 > > An apparently complete English translation of the Kularnava Tantra (with accompanying Sanskrit text) has been made by Ram Kumar Rai and published by Prachya Prakashan of Varanasi. Haven't actually read this one myself, so cannot comment on how satisfactory the translation is. The following website provides information and a means to buy a copy > http://www.exoticindiaart.com/book/details/IDI580/ > > I don't think many of the other tantras mentioned by Biernacki are available in English. Except the comparatively short Yoni Tantra, of which there is a translation on the web at > http://www.religiousworlds.com/mandalam/ftp/yoni.pdf > > > Otherwise not a lot out of the ordinary happening down here. One question, me and my friends from Esoteric Bookshop in Murrumbeena were discussing the whole Ouija board thang and came to a concensus that they are too unpredictable and sometimes not safe to use. Now Spellcraft have just included one in the latest edition with a how to use guide. Wot do u think about this? Is it Ok or irresponsible, given that there are much safer methods of divination available. > > Interesting question. I've neither used an ouija board, nor done much research on them; but I do know they have been around for a while, which suggests to me that there's a constituency of people who find them useful. I have also heard anecdotes about people getting seriously troubled by messages that reached them via an ouija board... Then again, haven't people also been troubled by messages that reached them through the internet? Does that mean we shouldn't use the internet? > > >given that there are much safer methods of divination available. > > What forms of divination would you recommend? > > May the Goddess bless your path, > Om Shantih > Colin > Find a better answer, faster with the new 7 Search - Start Here. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 28, 2008 Report Share Posted August 28, 2008 Hey Colin how goes thangs.1) Div. does not replace thinking, well for me it doesn't. I'm sure that here are folks out there who use Div. techniques as a quick fix/answer type of thing but i would consider that more then a tad negligent.In fact my Pendulum divining is as much a way for me to maintain a close relationship with Ma' as it is a Q+A session. Sometimes i get answers i don't expect which spurs me into thinking about my questions in different ways. Some of my Q's are often trivial or at least not uber-deep and mystic in nature and Ma' is just as happy to answer those Q's as she is the more esoteric stuff. 2) I reckon it makes plenty sense that Divinity presents itself in a manner that suits the induvidual: what better way to encourage a closer personnel relationship. 3) My Higher self is that part of me which knows duality not, and is therefore Kali: Undifferentiated and absolute. 4) Did u ever think the idea of us as manifested divinity worshipping divinity was funny and a bit narcissistic? Pieces of God worshipping Itself, i love that idea. 5) My house has been recieving a unusual amount of spirit activity of late which i div'ed about and its got somethin to do with Ma's energies. Do u get alot of spookies visitin u? Thats it for now: B.B, Om Kali and Byyeee for now, Shane.colin777au <colinr wrote: Hey Shane. >Its funny i had this impression of you being one of those business, conservative looking or sort of nerdy academic pagans with glasses and stuff. Bet you find that funny. You're right, in a way -- I do spend a lot of time reading, not to mention writing. Haven't had to get glasses yet, but quite likely will one day. >My preferred form of divination is the pendulum which is simply a medium through which My higher self/Kali can give me guidance. I like the way you expressed that. Perhaps there is a sense in which each of us has his/her own source of guidance, as is suggested by the phrase 'My higher self'... Reflecting on my own experiences and those of others, I've come to think that Kali has a different face or voice - a different aspect - for each of Her mystics. The Sanskrit term ishta devata comes to mind... How do you see the relation between this form of guidance and the thought processes of your everyday self? Does divination replace thinking, or do they work together? Om Shantih Colin Kali_Ma , Shane Gray <geminiacal999 wrote: > > Hey colin thanks for the reply. Its funny i had this impression of you being one of those business, conservative looking or sort of nerdy academic pagans with glasses and stuff. Bet you find that funny. Ta for the info on the tantras. My preferred form of divination is the pendulum which is simply a medium through which My higher self/Kali can give me guidance. And yes i have heard of Pendulums being hijacked by mischevious spiritual beings but i've had nothing but a genuine feeling of connection when using it and Ma' has actually encouraged me to use it to chat with her, i believe as a means of connection as much as providing me answers to my questions no matter how inane they sometimes are. I've not really had much experience with Tarot, runes and other forms of divination, but in regards to Ouija i have heard of rather disturbing accounts of people attracting unwanted attention. Having said that practitioners of Voodoo and similar traditions have been using them for > yonks and seem to know how to deal with them and the spirits they contact through them. I just think that coz u have no control of who your contacting that they are tools best left to those folk with a lot of spirit experience. Other forms of div. seem to have less problems in this regard, which i understand from having discussions with Taroists etc. Anyway bye for now, B B and Om Kali-Ma, Shane. > > colin777au <colinr wrote: Kali_Ma , Shane Gray <geminiacal999@> wrote: > > > > Howdy Colin. That was a informative review. Loriliai's book seems like a worthwhile read, but i was more interested in the Tantric texts you mentioned. It is a good 'to read' list if they are available. I finally had a good look at the ferment website the other day and saw the photos. Funny thing is people never look like you would imagine them to, which is probably a good thing. Its actually quite well set up and generally good for a gander. > > Howdy Shane. I wonder how you imagined we'd look? > > Anyway, thanks for your comment on the website. I will put a copy of what you've written on one of our feedback sections, assuming that's ok with you. > > Regarding availability of the Tantric texts mentioned in my review... An easy one to get hold of is the Devi Mahatmyam. You can get an inexpensive copy of Jagadiswarananda's translation (which is quite literal and reliable) through the Vedanta Book Agency in Sydney. Their address is PO Box 817, Strathfield NSW 2135 or you can phone them on 02 9745 4320. > > Woodroffe's book Hymns to the Goddess is obtainable as a paperback through Amazon at > http://www.amazon.com/Hymns-Goddess-Hymn-Kali-Woodroffe/dp/8185988161 > > The Kularnava Tantra is a slightly trickier question. There is a Motilal Banarsidass edition by Avalon, Pandit and Vidyaratna, which does _not_ provide the full text in English. What it does contain is > * an _abridged_ English translation by M.P.Pandit, > * a short discussion of the text by Woodroffe, > * the complete text in Sanskrit > You can get it thru Amazon at > http://www.amazon.com/Kularnava-Tantra-Arthur-Avalon/dp/8120809734 > > An apparently complete English translation of the Kularnava Tantra (with accompanying Sanskrit text) has been made by Ram Kumar Rai and published by Prachya Prakashan of Varanasi. Haven't actually read this one myself, so cannot comment on how satisfactory the translation is. The following website provides information and a means to buy a copy > http://www.exoticindiaart.com/book/details/IDI580/ > > I don't think many of the other tantras mentioned by Biernacki are available in English. Except the comparatively short Yoni Tantra, of which there is a translation on the web at > http://www.religiousworlds.com/mandalam/ftp/yoni.pdf > > > Otherwise not a lot out of the ordinary happening down here. One question, me and my friends from Esoteric Bookshop in Murrumbeena were discussing the whole Ouija board thang and came to a concensus that they are too unpredictable and sometimes not safe to use. Now Spellcraft have just included one in the latest edition with a how to use guide. Wot do u think about this? Is it Ok or irresponsible, given that there are much safer methods of divination available. > > Interesting question. I've neither used an ouija board, nor done much research on them; but I do know they have been around for a while, which suggests to me that there's a constituency of people who find them useful. I have also heard anecdotes about people getting seriously troubled by messages that reached them via an ouija board... Then again, haven't people also been troubled by messages that reached them through the internet? Does that mean we shouldn't use the internet? > > >given that there are much safer methods of divination available. > > What forms of divination would you recommend? > > May the Goddess bless your path, > Om Shantih > Colin > > > > > > > > Find a better answer, faster with the new 7 Search - Start Here. > Win a MacBook Air or iPod touch with 7- Find out more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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