Fear Mongering About Kali and Her Worship

[Guest guest]

Namaste:Did anyone ever run across some websites/books/gurus who tell you to be very afraid of Kali? I have run across these plenty. My question is if our goal in life is to achieve moksha which requires a cutting down of the ego wouldn't meditation on Kali be the best way to accomplish this? Why the fear? I just don't get it.Shanti Om,Shankari Kali

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[Guest guest]

Kali is a very interesting deity because she has many different

sides/facets about herself. In some areas - such as Kolkata

(previously Calcutta) - Kali is generally worshipped as a loving

benevolent mother. However, there are aspects of Kali that have

drawn a negative worship and following as well. The thugees were a

band of murderers that exists in India a couple of hundred years ago

(don't quote me on the timeframe though) and they worshipped Kali

and sought her for guidance and further, from what I've read, it was

not uncommon for them to sacrifice their human victims (at times) to

Kali. The movie " Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom " was actually

very loosely based on the thugee cult).

 

Just look at her symbology - she's naked barring what - a necklace

of skulls, a garland of severed arms, a severed head. This is not

symbology that the average westerner might necessarily be expected

to understand - unless they took the time to understand the

beautiful underlying aspects of what these things are symbolic of.

So, to many people - out of ignorance, all that is seen is the

warrior, violent nature of Kali - not realizing those as apsects of

each of us fighting demons with ourselves.

 

It also depends, i suppose, on the philosophy that you follow. It's

my understanding that in Hare Krishna - in the strictest sense of

interpretation - devotees are not to pray/worship any demigods

because in truth, it is Vishnu/Vasyadeva (if i said that correctly)

that is transcendental to all - whereas the demigods are of

subjugation to Vishnu. Generally, it is looked at that when someone

prays to a demigod, that they are praying for some type of material

gain. Notice the term " demigod " - because in Hare Krishna - Kali

would in fact be seen as a demigod. Whereas for Kali devotees - she

is not seen as a demigod, but rather she is thus identified as the

all permeating and transcendental figure of Godhead. Speaking for

myself, my worship of Kali is not with material gains in mind - but

more for spiritual realization.

 

Kali is also well known in pagan circles - but i believe she's more

celebrated for her " female spirit " than as the loving benevolent

mother of all.

 

So for reasons mentioned above, her warrior nature, her sybmolism,

different philosophical interpretations, ignorance spread in western

media - Kali is often times depicted as something to be feared.

 

In reading " Kali: The Black Goddess of Dakshineswar " - the book

talked quite a bit about one of Kali's most well known devotees -

Ramakrishna. Bear in mind that when following the guidance of a

particular master, Ramakrishna even - to experience true

enlightenment - had to go .. beyond Kali. In his meditation, upon

experiencing Kali - he forced himself to slice through Kali (if you

would) to get beyond that of even what the reverend mother was

representative of.

 

Namaste,

Andy

 

Kali_Ma , Shankari Kali <shankari_kali

wrote:

>

>

> Namaste:

>

> Did anyone ever run across some websites/books/gurus who tell you

to be very afraid of Kali? I have run across these plenty. My

question is if our goal in life is to achieve moksha which requires

a cutting down of the ego wouldn't meditation on Kali be the best

way to accomplish this? Why the fear? I just don't get it.

>

> Shanti Om,

> Shankari Kali

>

>

>

> Finding fabulous fares is fun.

> Let FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find

flight and hotel bargains.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Shankari Kali,

 

I'm the furthest thing from an expert but i don't believe the

thuggees were Muslims. I believe that in Islam, it is forbidden to

worship any deities in the form of idols and Kali worship would seem

to me, to be entrenched with idols (murtis).

 

Some westerners indeed, probably perceive of Kali as a demonic

figure but then again, some western religions are so strict - that

any interpretation outside of the confines of what is dictated as

acceptable - are then denotable to " demonic figures " .

 

Hmmm, how can evil be associated with one that defeats evil? Well

gee, if you're going to be all logical about it - hehehe. Seriously

though, i think it's just ignorance and interpretation. Based on

yours and my interpretation - it would not be logical to associate

Kali with evil, but someone else may form their own interpretation.

I guess ideally, it would do best to find someone that denotes Kali

in a negative connotation and then ask that person directly - as

they would be most adept to answer such a question.

 

Oooh - I actually have the Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna but i have yet

to read it - so many books on my reading list and i'm a slow reader

at that *sighs*. I agree, that indeed the deity is a type of

crutch, but it's a known cruth - not something that people would

necessarily deny. It's a given that in hinduism, deities, murtis,

images are used as tools/instruments to help focus the mind

on " God " .

 

I'll be happy to share two personal incidents with you. For a few

months straight, i had been attending Hare Krishna service in a

small local gathering. During that timeframe, i had not attended

Hindu temple. At some point, i decided i need a change of pace and

decided to once attend hindu temple more often and forego Hare

Krishna for a short spell. After service at the temple, prasadam is

provided. The second week I was back at temple, during prasadam -

there happened to be an empty seat next to a lady that i had

befriended a few months prior. In making small idle chit chat, I

asked her what part of India she was from, and she replied

Calcutta. In knowing that Kolkata was the major center of Kali

worship in India - i asked her if she was familiar with Kali. She

advised that yes, she was very familiar with Kali and that Kali, in

addition to Krishna, were her personal deities. Needless to say, I

was getting very excited over this conversation. At that time, i

pulled out my Kali pendant that i was wearing around my neck (i had

it hidden under my shirt because i wasn't sure if anyone in this

temple worshipped Kali and I was afraid of possibly offending

anyone).

 

Here is where it gets more interesting. All of this was taking

place on a Sunday. It just so happens that the very next Saturday

was actually the day of the annual Kali puja. Not only that, but

there was an indian doctor in Nashville that was holding Kali puja

services in his residence. I normally work Saturday nights but i

made sure to get time off to attend the service. I won't pretend

that i understood anything that took place at the service - but

hopefully I was exactly where I was supposed to be at that very

moment.

 

What makes this story so interesting is a few different factors.

First, that unbeknowngst to me at the time, but the lady that i

befriended months earlier was from Kolkata and into Kali worship.

Second that of all the tables for prasadam, there happened to be a

seat available next to this lady (most tables are very occupied).

Third, the impeccable timing of events. To have randomly decided to

shift gears from Hare Krishna to instead attend hindu temple and

only the second week back at temple to learn of the Kali Puja just

in time to be able to attend the service the very next weekened. I

couldn't help but remark (and share with my friend) how incredible

was the feeling of being pulled towards Kali. This is something

that i'll never forget my whole life - because i don't believe in

coincidencs and truly - what are the odds.

 

On another personal but interesting note, my last name - is

actually " Olk " and funny enough that my last name exists with the

name of the city " Kolkata " where Kali is most revered. I don't want

to read too much into that, but it's funny nonetheless .. hehehe.

 

The other miracle I referred to ... i had been dating a woman for

only a short time before she decided to break up with me. The break

up was very disheartening and very difficult to get through -

without doubt.

 

The miracle came in the form of a friend. There was a different

lady whose acquaintance I had made prior, actually from the Hare

Krishna group. We were just passing friends really, nothing major -

and had not chatted in about a month or so. At right about the same

time of the breakup, a random series of events brought this girl

into my life. As luck would have it (and sadly, for the girl) she

was going through a very similar situation in her own life.

 

Now, the type of person that I am, i find it very difficult to reach

out to people. So under normal circumstances, in spite of my

heightened emotional pain, i would not have reached out to this

person. However, this lady is more social, less resevered then me.

So, as she was going through something very similar - she in fact

reached out to me for support. Because of her actions - it also in

turn provided me similar support from her that I otherwise never

would have had.

 

It was a friendship only, nothing romantic. But to have a friend

there, at the absolute exact moment that i needed her most - and to

have her going through a similiar situation that all but assured a

mutual comfort for one another - the timing of which was beyond

coincidence - and to me, for what i needed at that time in my life -

was nothing short of a miracle.

 

That too is something that I'll never forget.

 

Namaste,

Andy

 

 

 

 

Kali_Ma , Shankari Kali <shankari_kali

wrote:

>

> Namaste Andy:

>

> Weren't the thuggees Muslims who used her as a symbol of some

sort?

>

> I realize that some of the followers have misinterpreted her

symbology and have done things like human sacrifice. Some Westerners

think she is a demon, because of the way she looks.

>

> When you read the stories, though, she is defeating evil. How can

evil be associated with one who defeats it so completely?

>

> Sri Ramakrishna is quite a unique saint. Another book about him

is " The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna " which is very good. In the end he

must get past, the murti (image of god) to final oneness. This is

quite common in Hinduism to reach past the deity to final oneness.

The deity is in some way a type of crutch.

>

> I would like to hear any stories, miracles that you might have to

tell. Usually this forum is rather quiet. I'm sure others would not

mind either.

>

> Shanti Om,

> Shankari Kali

>

> Andy <happytheclown37 wrote:

Kali is a very interesting deity because she has many different

> sides/facets about herself. In some areas - such as Kolkata

> (previously Calcutta) - Kali is generally worshipped as a loving

> benevolent mother. However, there are aspects of Kali that have

> drawn a negative worship and following as well. The thugees were

a

> band of murderers that exists in India a couple of hundred years

ago

> (don't quote me on the timeframe though) and they worshipped Kali

> and sought her for guidance and further, from what I've read, it

was

> not uncommon for them to sacrifice their human victims (at times)

to

> Kali. The movie " Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom " was

actually

> very loosely based on the thugee cult).

>

> Just look at her symbology - she's naked barring what - a

necklace

> of skulls, a garland of severed arms, a severed head. This is

not

> symbology that the average westerner might necessarily be

expected

> to understand - unless they took the time to understand the

> beautiful underlying aspects of what these things are symbolic

of.

> So, to many people - out of ignorance, all that is seen is the

> warrior, violent nature of Kali - not realizing those as apsects

of

> each of us fighting demons with ourselves.

>

> It also depends, i suppose, on the philosophy that you follow.

It's

> my understanding that in Hare Krishna - in the strictest sense of

> interpretation - devotees are not to pray/worship any demigods

> because in truth, it is Vishnu/Vasyadeva (if i said that

correctly)

> that is transcendental to all - whereas the demigods are of

> subjugation to Vishnu. Generally, it is looked at that when

someone

> prays to a demigod, that they are praying for some type of

material

> gain. Notice the term " demigod " - because in Hare Krishna - Kali

> would in fact be seen as a demigod. Whereas for Kali devotees -

she

> is not seen as a demigod, but rather she is thus identified as

the

> all permeating and transcendental figure of Godhead. Speaking

for

> myself, my worship of Kali is not with material gains in mind -

but

> more for spiritual realization.

>

> Kali is also well known in pagan circles - but i believe she's

more

> celebrated for her " female spirit " than as the loving benevolent

> mother of all.

>

> So for reasons mentioned above, her warrior nature, her

sybmolism,

> different philosophical interpretations, ignorance spread in

western

> media - Kali is often times depicted as something to be feared.

>

> In reading " Kali: The Black Goddess of Dakshineswar " - the book

> talked quite a bit about one of Kali's most well known devotees -

> Ramakrishna. Bear in mind that when following the guidance of a

> particular master, Ramakrishna even - to experience true

> enlightenment - had to go .. beyond Kali. In his meditation,

upon

> experiencing Kali - he forced himself to slice through Kali (if

you

> would) to get beyond that of even what the reverend mother was

> representative of.

>

> Namaste,

> Andy

>

> Kali_Ma , Shankari Kali <shankari_kali@>

> wrote:

> >

> >

> > Namaste:

> >

> > Did anyone ever run across some websites/books/gurus who tell

you

> to be very afraid of Kali? I have run across these plenty. My

> question is if our goal in life is to achieve moksha which

requires

> a cutting down of the ego wouldn't meditation on Kali be the best

> way to accomplish this? Why the fear? I just don't get it.

> >

> > Shanti Om,

> > Shankari Kali

> >

> >

> >

> > Finding fabulous fares is fun.

> > Let FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find

> flight and hotel bargains.

> >

 

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