Guest guest Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 We all know that there are three aspects of the supreme undivided truth, viz., brahman, paramatma, and Bhagavan. Accordingly the advaita-vadins merge into Brahman the brahma-jyoti and lose identity, thus MONISM ... " Aham brahmasmi so-aham tat-tvamasi " And the Dvaita vadins enter Vaikuntha by thinking about it at the moment of death, when they realize BOTH God and their own actual spiritual form as individual devotee of God, always different as in DUALISM So the Shankarites and the Vaishnavas both have opposing views, advaitavaad v/s Dvaitavad. One view is nastick (Godless), the latter view is astick (Godfull). So here's the QUESTION: The Astanga Yogins, like TM, etc., they meditate on Paramatma in the heart, and use pranayam to bring the atma to the crown chakra, and then, at good time, the Astanga Yogi leaves his body and...??? Is the goal monism OR dualism??? Dvaitavad OR Advaitavad??? If a successful Yogin doesn't get side tracked by asta siddhis, and gets liberated, then what is that liberation? Personal or impersonal??? Any in sight would be appreciated... Best wishes, Richard Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Dear Richard, I have slightly different views. Advaita is not Godless ness. Brahma Jyoti/Purush/Brahman is God. Monotheism is more a word for it. Krishna does state in the Gita that he is Brahman. Am I wrong? Secondly I find that in Dvaita you have God and Worshiper while in Advaita you have only God. If I look around I often find (controversial) articles on the net about Jesus and his years in India and references to The Prophet (PBUH) visiting Kashmir where Shaivism is somewhat a deviant of Advaita. The influence of monotheism is very clearly reflected in Christianity and Islam. Again all Dvaitas dont go to Vaikunth as Shaiva advaita might prefer accomodation in less glamorous Kailash While Advaitavaadis pefer to see themselves liberated by merging to that divine soul called Brahmajyoti. On Astanga yoga the focus is to raise the kundalini to sahasra. Once the Kundalini is in Sahasra the state of samadhi is irreversible till HIS wish. Probably this is the merging of ones identity in the divine soul hence closer to Advaita. Though if you see each chakra has its own deities so somewhere there is a hint of Dvaita. And in my first experiments with Tantra my mentor did mention that Ashta Siddhis and Shat karmas are to throw you off track. Sort of a bunker on the golf course. Best Regards, Jay Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote: We all know that there are three aspects of the supreme undividedtruth, viz., brahman, paramatma, and Bhagavan.Accordingly the advaita-vadins merge into Brahman the brahma-jyoti andlose identity, thus MONISM ... "Aham brahmasmi so-aham tat-tvamasi"And the Dvaita vadins enter Vaikuntha by thinking about it at themoment of death, when they realize BOTH God and their own actualspiritual form as individual devotee of God, always different as inDUALISMSo the Shankarites and the Vaishnavas both have opposing views,advaitavaad v/s Dvaitavad. One view is nastick (Godless), the latterview is astick (Godfull).So here's the QUESTION: The Astanga Yogins, like TM, etc., theymeditate on Paramatma in the heart, and use pranayam to bring the atmato the crown chakra, and then, at good time, the Astanga Yogi leaveshis body and...??? Is the goal monism OR dualism??? Dvaitavad ORAdvaitavad???If a successful Yogin doesn't get side tracked by asta siddhis, andgets liberated, then what is that liberation? Personal or impersonal???Any in sight would be appreciated...Best wishes,RichardSend instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger. Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles.Visit the Auto Green Center. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 , Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote: > > We all know that there are three aspects of the supreme undivided > truth, viz., brahman, paramatma, and Bhagavan. > > Accordingly the advaita-vadins merge into Brahman the brahma-jyoti and > lose identity, thus MONISM ... " Aham brahmasmi so-aham tat-tvamasi " > > And the Dvaita vadins enter Vaikuntha by thinking about it at the > moment of death, when they realize BOTH God and their own actual > spiritual form as individual devotee of God, always different as in > DUALISM > > So the Shankarites and the Vaishnavas both have opposing views, > advaitavaad v/s Dvaitavad. One view is nastick (Godless), the latter > view is astick (Godfull). > > So here's the QUESTION: The Astanga Yogins, like TM, etc., they > meditate on Paramatma in the heart, and use pranayam to bring the atma > to the crown chakra, and then, at good time, the Astanga Yogi leaves > his body and...??? Is the goal monism OR dualism??? Dvaitavad OR > Advaitavad??? > If a successful Yogin doesn't get side tracked by asta siddhis, and > gets liberated, then what is that liberation? Personal or impersonal??? > > Any in sight would be appreciated... > > Best wishes, > Richard > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger. > hello richard, if u know about aakshara gnana the answer is very simple dwaityamu kanidi adwaityamu means dwaityamu atma and jeewa adwaityamu apart from atma and jeewa that is put together tatwa means what ever u feel whwther it is two or one thinking is difference PRAJA KA PITA BRAHAMAN {HERE BRAHAMAN MENS THE ONE SPEAKS ,DO'S,SEE,HEAR'S GOOD ,NOT HARMING ANY THING WHICH IS UNDER SUPREMES CUSTODY} BRAHAMAN KA PITA SADHU { HERE SADHU MEANS SADHAK SADHU WILL BE ALWAYS UNDER GURU'S CUSTODY HE CAN'T TAKE DISSISION} SADHU KA PITA NIRAHAN KARI{ ONE WHO PRAYS TO NIRHANKARA RUPA THAT IS ATMAY PERMATAMA} NIRHANKARI KA PITA AHANKARI { THE ONE WHO FEELS HIS (SUPREEME) TOUCH } AHANKARIKA PITA AHAM BRAHMA AHAM BRAHAMA KA PITA JYOTIRMAYEE GNANA THEN HUMAN HE DIES Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Dear Jay, Namaste!!! Your " view " OR my " view " are of little importance. The important thing is that one understands Shastra, such as Upanishads, Brahma Sutra, Bhagavad Gita. If our view is supported by shastra, then it is not OUR view, but Shastra's view; OR, if our view goes against Shastra then it is worthless. That is the meaning of " praman. " Everything I have said is taken from Shastra. Krishna says, Divyam dadami te chakshuh paishy-me- yogameshwarm, well 39 years ago Krishna gave me that " Divya chakshu " so you can rest assured that I'm making perfect bona fide sense simply by repeating Shastra praman. Best wishes, Richard sacred-objects , Jay Munshi <jaymunshi wrote: > > Dear Richard, > > I have slightly different views. > > Advaita is not Godless ness. Brahma Jyoti/Purush/Brahman is God. Monotheism is more a word for it. Krishna does state in the Gita that he is Brahman. Am I wrong? > > Secondly I find that in Dvaita you have God and Worshiper while in Advaita you have only God. If I look around I often find (controversial) articles on the net about Jesus and his years in India and references to The Prophet (PBUH) visiting Kashmir where Shaivism is somewhat a deviant of Advaita. The influence of monotheism is very clearly reflected in Christianity and Islam. > > Again all Dvaitas dont go to Vaikunth as Shaiva advaita might prefer accomodation in less glamorous Kailash While Advaitavaadis pefer to see themselves liberated by merging to that divine soul called Brahmajyoti. > > On Astanga yoga the focus is to raise the kundalini to sahasra. Once the Kundalini is in Sahasra the state of samadhi is irreversible till HIS wish. Probably this is the merging of ones identity in the divine soul hence closer to Advaita. Though if you see each chakra has its own deities so somewhere there is a hint of Dvaita. > > And in my first experiments with Tantra my mentor did mention that Ashta Siddhis and Shat karmas are to throw you off track. Sort of a bunker on the golf course. > > > Best Regards, > > Jay > > > Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote: > We all know that there are three aspects of the supreme undivided > truth, viz., brahman, paramatma, and Bhagavan. > > Accordingly the advaita-vadins merge into Brahman the brahma-jyoti and > lose identity, thus MONISM ... " Aham brahmasmi so-aham tat-tvamasi " > > And the Dvaita vadins enter Vaikuntha by thinking about it at the > moment of death, when they realize BOTH God and their own actual > spiritual form as individual devotee of God, always different as in > DUALISM > > So the Shankarites and the Vaishnavas both have opposing views, > advaitavaad v/s Dvaitavad. One view is nastick (Godless), the latter > view is astick (Godfull). > > So here's the QUESTION: The Astanga Yogins, like TM, etc., they > meditate on Paramatma in the heart, and use pranayam to bring the atma > to the crown chakra, and then, at good time, the Astanga Yogi leaves > his body and...??? Is the goal monism OR dualism??? Dvaitavad OR > Advaitavad??? > If a successful Yogin doesn't get side tracked by asta siddhis, and > gets liberated, then what is that liberation? Personal or impersonal??? > > Any in sight would be appreciated... > > Best wishes, > Richard > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger. > > > > > > > Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles. > Visit the Auto Green Center. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Hi Jay, Namase!!! I forgot to mention, I know well what is Adi Shankaracharya's concept of advaita vad Vedanta means (Ved=knowledge, anta=goal or end), and in the current and ultimate sense it is athiesm, because Shankar's Bhasya of Brahma Sutra denies the eternal existance of The Supreme Person, which they claim is ultimately just a formless, thoughtless void. The soul becomes ONE with Brahman, and loses identity and everything else. That is advaitavad. The drop of water merges with the ocean. And the ocean is without personality (just a body of H2O). That is modern day interpretation and teachings of current and past Shankaracharyas, of which there are always 4 Shankaracharyas at all times. Some people cite the Bhaja-Govinda prayers by the Adi Shankaracharya as showing he was, after all, a dvaitavadi (dualist or Thiest). Others swear he is incarnation of Lord Shiva Himself. In that case it has been established, " Naa vaishnavanam yatha shamboo " explaining Lord Shiva as the best Vaishnava, without equal. In Vrindavan, no one enters Rasa Lila stahali without FIRST worshipping " Gopesahar " Mahadeva, same in Nanadagram with Lord Shiva as Nandeshawar Mahadev. At least according to the Vaishnavas, Lord Shiva is the best. So we know there are currently two opposing schools or " muths " , viz., advaitavad and dvaitavad In Sanatan Dharma. I have studied them both and clearly understand them both... so my question is about Astanga Yogis, what is their " goal " or prayojan? Are they advaitavad Vedanta OR dvaita Vedanta? After the Astanga yogi passes from his crown chakra, then WHERE does he go? This is one thing I cannot understand. Best wishes, Richard sacred-objects , Jay Munshi <jaymunshi wrote: > > Dear Richard, > > I have slightly different views. > > Advaita is not Godless ness. Brahma Jyoti/Purush/Brahman is God. Monotheism is more a word for it. Krishna does state in the Gita that he is Brahman. Am I wrong? > > Secondly I find that in Dvaita you have God and Worshiper while in Advaita you have only God. If I look around I often find (controversial) articles on the net about Jesus and his years in India and references to The Prophet (PBUH) visiting Kashmir where Shaivism is somewhat a deviant of Advaita. The influence of monotheism is very clearly reflected in Christianity and Islam. > > Again all Dvaitas dont go to Vaikunth as Shaiva advaita might prefer accomodation in less glamorous Kailash While Advaitavaadis pefer to see themselves liberated by merging to that divine soul called Brahmajyoti. > > On Astanga yoga the focus is to raise the kundalini to sahasra. Once the Kundalini is in Sahasra the state of samadhi is irreversible till HIS wish. Probably this is the merging of ones identity in the divine soul hence closer to Advaita. Though if you see each chakra has its own deities so somewhere there is a hint of Dvaita. > > And in my first experiments with Tantra my mentor did mention that Ashta Siddhis and Shat karmas are to throw you off track. Sort of a bunker on the golf course. > > > Best Regards, > > Jay > > > Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote: > We all know that there are three aspects of the supreme undivided > truth, viz., brahman, paramatma, and Bhagavan. > > Accordingly the advaita-vadins merge into Brahman the brahma-jyoti and > lose identity, thus MONISM ... " Aham brahmasmi so-aham tat-tvamasi " > > And the Dvaita vadins enter Vaikuntha by thinking about it at the > moment of death, when they realize BOTH God and their own actual > spiritual form as individual devotee of God, always different as in > DUALISM > > So the Shankarites and the Vaishnavas both have opposing views, > advaitavaad v/s Dvaitavad. One view is nastick (Godless), the latter > view is astick (Godfull). > > So here's the QUESTION: The Astanga Yogins, like TM, etc., they > meditate on Paramatma in the heart, and use pranayam to bring the atma > to the crown chakra, and then, at good time, the Astanga Yogi leaves > his body and...??? Is the goal monism OR dualism??? Dvaitavad OR > Advaitavad??? > If a successful Yogin doesn't get side tracked by asta siddhis, and > gets liberated, then what is that liberation? Personal or impersonal??? > > Any in sight would be appreciated... > > Best wishes, > Richard > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger. > > > > > > > Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles. > Visit the Auto Green Center. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Sriman, Liberation is neither Personal or impersonal. Direct experience is very vital. Let us assume a Textbook Vaishanava dies keeping in mind Vaikuntha. Have you ever received communication from him/her from Vaikuntha. Please let us know from where this antnenna can be procured. We would love to wach it live. That would be Praman!!! Conversely, a copybook Ashtanga Yogi merging into Brahman there is no live coverage of that either!!! Well if Shankara believed in the formless god, he established shrines with form's at Badrinath/Kedarnath, Kanchi, Sringeri, Puri, Pashupati, Dwarka & innumerable more across South-East Asia. In my opinion only, Liberated Souls from all known paths should come down & discuss this most honourable topic... So you write a mail to Vaikunth-Vasis, ,while i get hold of soul merged in brahman & ask him to oblige you. Namo Narayana Abhishek Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote: We all know that there are three aspects of the supreme undividedtruth, viz., brahman, paramatma, and Bhagavan.Accordingly the advaita-vadins merge into Brahman the brahma-jyoti andlose identity, thus MONISM ... "Aham brahmasmi so-aham tat-tvamasi"And the Dvaita vadins enter Vaikuntha by thinking about it at themoment of death, when they realize BOTH God and their own actualspiritual form as individual devotee of God, always different as inDUALISMSo the Shankarites and the Vaishnavas both have opposing views,advaitavaad v/s Dvaitavad. One view is nastick (Godless), the latterview is astick (Godfull).So here's the QUESTION: The Astanga Yogins, like TM, etc., theymeditate on Paramatma in the heart, and use pranayam to bring the atmato the crown chakra, and then, at good time, the Astanga Yogi leaveshis body and...??? Is the goal monism OR dualism??? Dvaitavad ORAdvaitavad???If a successful Yogin doesn't get side tracked by asta siddhis, andgets liberated, then what is that liberation? Personal or impersonal???Any in sight would be appreciated...Best wishes,RichardSend instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger. Send free SMS to your Friends on Mobile from your Messenger. Download Now! http://messenger./download.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Hi Abhi, Namaste!!! Here is some information from Lord Brahma,... That there can be form without (material) substance is best described as in a dream... the body is resting, but the atma, the soul, is experiencing sight,form, action, pleasure, emotions, all WITHOUT a material body... simply by theconsciousness. The Vaikuntha is sat-cit-ananda, it IS Brahma Jyoti, because itis pure consciouness. There for we have Achintya vedaved Vaad Vedanta. In Sri Brahma Samhita: There is nothing vague about Brahma's description of the Lord and His abode. No dim, nihilistic nothingness, no blinding bright lights, no wispy, dreamy visions of harps and clouds; rather, a vibrant, luminescent world in transcendental color, form, and sound- a sublimely variegated spiritual landscape populated by innumerable blissful, eternally liberated souls reveling in spiritual cognition, sensation, and emotion, all in relationship with the all-blissful, all-attractive Personality of Godhead. Here is a sample: I worship Govinda [Krsna], the primeval Lord, the first progenitor who is tending the cows, yielding all desire, in abodes built with spiritual gems, surrounded by millions of purpose trees, always served with great reverence and affection by hundreds of thousands of laksmis or gopis.I worship Govinda, the primeval Lord, who is adept in playing on His flute, with blooming eyes like lotus petals, with head decked with peacock's feather, with the figure of beauty tinged with the hue of blue clouds, and His unique loveliness charming millions of Cupids. ...I worship [Goloka Vrndavana]...where every tree is a transcendental purpose tree; where the soil is the purpose gem, all water is nectar, every word is a song, every gait is a dance, the flute is the favorite attendant....where numberless milk cows always emit transcendental oceans of milk. The commentator reminds us (p. 104) that in the transcendental region of Goloka are found the same elements as are found in the mundane worlds, but in their highest purity and beauty: " ...trees and creepers, mountains, rivers and forests, water, speech, movement, music of the flute, the sun and the moon, tasted and taste.... " Krsna's divine abode, Goloka Vrndavana, is a world in the fullest and realest sense. There are those who will have difficulty with Brahma's highly graphic and personalistic depiction of the spiritual world and of the liberated state. Some, for instance, whose conception of transcendence is determined by a certain logical fallacy based on the arbitrary assumption that spirit is the literal opposite of matter (and thus that because matter has form and variety, spirit must necessarily be formless and unvariegated), conceive of ultimate reality as some sort of divine emptiness. However, any conception of transcendence that projects or analogizes from our limited sensory and cognitive experience within the material world is, by its very nature, limited and speculative and thus unreliable. No accumulated quantity of sense data within this world can bring us to knowledge of what lies beyond it. Residents of the material world cannot get even a clue of transcendence, argues our Brahma-samhita commentator, " by moving heaven and earth through their organic senses " (p.xix). The Brahma-samhita teaches that transcendence, truth, ultimate reality can be apprehended only by the mercy of the supreme transcendent entity, the Absolute Truth Himself, and that perception of ultimate reality is a function not of speculative reason but of direct spiritual cognition through divine revelation. This revelation is evolved through bhakti, pure, selfless love of God. Only by such spiritual devotion can Krsna be seen: " I worship Govinda, the primeval Lord...whom the pure devotees see in their heart of hearts with the eye of devotion tinged with the salve of love " (verse 38). sacred-objects , Abhishek Dutta <benarsibabu wrote: > > Sriman, > > Liberation is neither Personal or impersonal. Direct experience is very vital. Let us assume a Textbook Vaishanava dies keeping in mind Vaikuntha. Have you ever received communication from him/her from Vaikuntha. Please let us know from where this antnenna can be procured. We would love to wach it live. That would be Praman!!! > > Conversely, a copybook Ashtanga Yogi merging into Brahman there is no live coverage of that either!!! > > Well if Shankara believed in the formless god, he established shrines with form's at Badrinath/Kedarnath, Kanchi, Sringeri, Puri, Pashupati, Dwarka & innumerable more across South-East Asia. > > In my opinion only, Liberated Souls from all known paths should come down & discuss this most honourable topic... So you write a mail to Vaikunth-Vasis, ,while i get hold of soul merged in brahman & ask him to oblige you. > > Namo Narayana > Abhishek > > > Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote: > We all know that there are three aspects of the supreme undivided > truth, viz., brahman, paramatma, and Bhagavan. > > Accordingly the advaita-vadins merge into Brahman the brahma-jyoti and > lose identity, thus MONISM ... " Aham brahmasmi so-aham tat-tvamasi " > > And the Dvaita vadins enter Vaikuntha by thinking about it at the > moment of death, when they realize BOTH God and their own actual > spiritual form as individual devotee of God, always different as in > DUALISM > > So the Shankarites and the Vaishnavas both have opposing views, > advaitavaad v/s Dvaitavad. One view is nastick (Godless), the latter > view is astick (Godfull). > > So here's the QUESTION: The Astanga Yogins, like TM, etc., they > meditate on Paramatma in the heart, and use pranayam to bring the atma > to the crown chakra, and then, at good time, the Astanga Yogi leaves > his body and...??? Is the goal monism OR dualism??? Dvaitavad OR > Advaitavad??? > If a successful Yogin doesn't get side tracked by asta siddhis, and > gets liberated, then what is that liberation? Personal or impersonal??? > > Any in sight would be appreciated... > > Best wishes, > Richard > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger. > > > > > Send free SMS to your Friends on Mobile from your Messenger. Download Now! http://messenger./download.php > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Sir, Shukriya for sharing the esoteric description of Golok Dham. Lord Brahma's mellifluous description enriches the soul many times over. Goloka-Vrindavana Dham is the epicentre of the cosmos. A select few at the apex of spiritual hierarchy are able to catch a glimpse. & Only Bhakts steeped in the highest pedestal of ceaseless Raganuga Bhakti can be its residents. Sir, also tell us how does Lord Brahma define "Bhakti". I guess it is easier said than done. Can Bhakti be "standardized". Let me illustrate; In Bhakti Marga one has to be krsna intoxicated 24x7. The Pain from separation from the beloved is like a constant pricking of a 1000 nettles ( i am sure a gross under-estimation). Food, Shelter, Clothing etc are no longer of any consequense... A true Bhakta appears like a lunatic to the outer world, every action of his directed towards union with Lord. He/She reaches a stage where where he perceives Krsna in everything. They create a state of such untenable internal penury that at times they survive by eating cowdung/ dog-litter as though it is Mishti-Doi. To get hold of the attention of Krsna constitutes as one of the most cumbersome examination. It is the examination of Life. But once he catches you, he will make you !!!, the bhakta is made!!! The Bhakta experiences a state which Brahma cannot describe in any Samhita. Adi Shakara wrote these most Esoteric lines; which was revealed to the world as Shiv Manasa Puja; The Fourth Verse encapsulates the essence of Advaitya; Ratnaih kalpitamaasanam himajalaih snaanam cha divyaambaram Naanaaratnavibhuushhitam mrigamadaamodaankitam chandanam.Jaatiichampakabilvapatrarachitam pushhpam cha dhuupam tathaa Deepam deva dayaanidhe pashupate hritkalpitam grihyataam.h .. 1Sauvarne navaratnakhandarachite paatre ghritam paayasam Bhakshyam pajnchavidham payodadhiyutam rambhaaphalam paanakam. Shaakaanaamayutam jalam ruchikaram karpuurakhandojjvalam Taambuulam manasaa mayaa virachitam bhaktyaa prabho sviikuru .. 2 Chhatram chaamarayoryugam vyajanakam chaadarshakam nirmalam Veenaabherimridangakaahalakalaa giitam cha nrityam tathaa . Saashhtaangam pranatih stutirbahuvidhaa hyetatsamastam mayaa Sankalpena samarpitam tava vibho puujaam grihaana prabho .. 3 Aatmaa tvam girijaa matih sahacharaah praanaah shariiram griham Poojaa te vishhayopabhogarachanaa nidraa samaadhisthitih . Sajnchaarah padayoh pradakshinavidhih stotraani sarvaa giro Yadyatkarma karomi tattadakhilam shambho tavaaraadhanam.h .. 4 Karacharana kritam vaakkaayajam karmajam vaa . Shravananayanajam vaa maanasam vaaparaadham. Vihitamavihitam vaa sarvametatkshamasva . Jaya jaya karunaabdhe shriimahaadevashambho .. 5 Advaitya is not bereft of Bhakti, rather it is the highest form of Bhakti. The Vedantin perceives no difference between himself & the Lord. This does not constitute to say That Lord I am you, but rather to exemplify that Lord nothing exists in this Multi-Verse but you. This act of complete dissolution into Ishwara, is the spiritual apex of Raja Yoga. A path constituted by none other than Sri. Radha Parthasarathy. This is termed as Nisarga Raganuga Bhakti. Your friend, Abhishek Richard Shaw-Brown <rsbj66 wrote: Hi Abhi,Namaste!!! Here is some information from Lord Brahma,...That there can be form without (material) substance is best describedas in a dream... the body is resting, but the atma, the soul, isexperiencing sight,form, action, pleasure, emotions, all WITHOUT amaterial body... simply by theconsciousness. The Vaikuntha issat-cit-ananda, it IS Brahma Jyoti, because itis pure consciouness.There for we have Achintya vedaved Vaad Vedanta.In Sri Brahma Samhita: There is nothing vague about Brahma'sdescription of the Lord and His abode. No dim, nihilistic nothingness,no blinding bright lights, no wispy, dreamy visions of harps andclouds; rather, a vibrant, luminescent world in transcendental color,form, and sound- a sublimely variegated spiritual landscape populatedby innumerable blissful, eternally liberated souls reveling inspiritual cognition, sensation, and emotion, all in relationship withthe all-blissful, all-attractive Personality of Godhead. Here is a sample:I worship Govinda [Krsna], the primeval Lord, the first progenitor whois tending the cows, yielding all desire, in abodes built withspiritual gems, surrounded by millions of purpose trees, always servedwith great reverence and affection by hundreds of thousands of laksmisor gopis.I worship Govinda, the primeval Lord, who is adept in playingon His flute, with blooming eyes like lotus petals, with head deckedwith peacock's feather, with the figure of beauty tinged with the hueof blue clouds, and His unique loveliness charming millions of Cupids...I worship [Goloka Vrndavana]...where every tree is a transcendentalpurpose tree; where the soil is the purpose gem, all water is nectar,every word is a song, every gait is a dance, the flute is the favoriteattendant....where numberless milk cows always emit transcendentaloceans of milk.The commentator reminds us (p. 104) that in the transcendental regionof Goloka are found the same elements as are found in the mundaneworlds, but in their highest purity and beauty: "...trees andcreepers, mountains, rivers and forests, water, speech, movement,music of the flute, the sun and the moon, tasted and taste...."Krsna's divine abode, Goloka Vrndavana, is a world in the fullest andrealest sense.There are those who will have difficulty with Brahma's highly graphicand personalistic depiction of the spiritual world and of theliberated state. Some, for instance, whose conception of transcendenceis determined by a certain logical fallacy based on the arbitraryassumption that spirit is the literal opposite of matter (and thusthat because matter has form and variety, spirit must necessarily beformless and unvariegated), conceive of ultimate reality as some sortof divine emptiness. However, any conception of transcendence thatprojects or analogizes from our limited sensory and cognitiveexperience within the material world is, by its very nature, limitedand speculative and thus unreliable. No accumulated quantity of sensedata within this world can bring us to knowledge of what lies beyondit. Residents of the material world cannot get even a clue oftranscendence, argues our Brahma-samhita commentator, "by movingheaven and earth through their organic senses" (p.xix).The Brahma-samhita teaches that transcendence, truth, ultimate realitycan be apprehended only by the mercy of the supreme transcendententity, the Absolute Truth Himself, and that perception of ultimatereality is a function not of speculative reason but of directspiritual cognition through divine revelation. This revelation isevolved through bhakti, pure, selfless love of God. Only by suchspiritual devotion can Krsna be seen: "I worship Govinda, the primevalLord...whom the pure devotees see in their heart of hearts with theeye of devotion tinged with the salve of love" (verse 38).sacred-objects , Abhishek Dutta<benarsibabu wrote:>> Sriman,> > Liberation is neither Personal or impersonal. Direct experience isvery vital. Let us assume a Textbook Vaishanava dies keeping in mindVaikuntha. Have you ever received communication from him/her fromVaikuntha. Please let us know from where this antnenna can beprocured. We would love to wach it live. That would be Praman!!! > > Conversely, a copybook Ashtanga Yogi merging into Brahman there isno live coverage of that either!!! > > Well if Shankara believed in the formless god, he establishedshrines with form's at Badrinath/Kedarnath, Kanchi, Sringeri, Puri,Pashupati, Dwarka & innumerable more across South-East Asia.> > In my opinion only, Liberated Souls from all known paths shouldcome down & discuss this most honourable topic... So you write a mailto Vaikunth-Vasis, ,while i get hold of soul merged in brahman & askhim to oblige you.> > Namo Narayana> Abhishek> > > Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote:> We all know that there are three aspects of the supremeundivided> truth, viz., brahman, paramatma, and Bhagavan.> > Accordingly the advaita-vadins merge into Brahman the brahma-jyoti and> lose identity, thus MONISM ... "Aham brahmasmi so-aham tat-tvamasi"> > And the Dvaita vadins enter Vaikuntha by thinking about it at the> moment of death, when they realize BOTH God and their own actual> spiritual form as individual devotee of God, always different as in> DUALISM> > So the Shankarites and the Vaishnavas both have opposing views,> advaitavaad v/s Dvaitavad. One view is nastick (Godless), the latter> view is astick (Godfull).> > So here's the QUESTION: The Astanga Yogins, like TM, etc., they> meditate on Paramatma in the heart, and use pranayam to bring the atma> to the crown chakra, and then, at good time, the Astanga Yogi leaves> his body and...??? Is the goal monism OR dualism??? Dvaitavad OR> Advaitavad???> If a successful Yogin doesn't get side tracked by asta siddhis, and> gets liberated, then what is that liberation? Personal or impersonal???> > Any in sight would be appreciated...> > Best wishes,> Richard> > Send instant messages to your online friendshttp://uk.messenger. > > > > > Send free SMS to your Friends on Mobile from your Messenger.Download Now! http://messenger./download.php> Send free SMS to your Friends on Mobile from your Messenger. Download Now! http://messenger./download.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.