what happens after getting moksh

June 28, 2007

i have a seriouse question that is been going in my mind since long.......when one cuts the cycle of death and re-birth and gets moksh or mukti then what happens...then what happens to the atman(the soul)....if one knows that this is his last physical life in this world and he will not be born again since he has now cut/stop the cycle of death & re-birth then what happens to his/her soul after this life....in this specific case where does the soul go after leaving the body...does it get dissolved in the cosmic universe or what...what is the final resting place or final destination for the atman(the soul) in the infinite universe considering the scenario i gave now...any views ... Vikrant

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June 28, 2007

Dear Sriman,

Namaste!!! Though there are many sampradayas in India, many religions,

they can all be classified as either dualism or monism. Dualism mukti

means entering Vaikuntha and associating with Bhagavan...as in

personalism; Monism means merging into the formless impersonal

brahma-jyoti. In the Brahmajyoti there is nothing...no you, no God,

NOTHING.

Hanuman was offered the latter, i.e., sayujya mukti (impersonal) by

Lord Rama Himself, be he prefered " dualism " as in eternally associating

with Bhagavan in Vaikuntha.

Vaikuntha is Sat-Chit-Ananda. It exists within Brahmajyoti.

Lord Krishna says in the Gita, Whatever one thinks of at time of death,

that, and THAT alone, they achieve. So if one thinks of God at time of

death, then they achieve Him; but if one thinks (only) of Brahma jyoti

at time of death then they merge and lose seperate identity.

In both cases there is no more Samsara Chakra to suffer (and enjoy).

Best wishes,

Richard

sacred-objects , Vikrant <free_for_blue

wrote:

--- Vikrant <free_for_blue wrote:

> i have a seriouse question that is been going in my mind since

> long.......

> when one cuts the cycle of death and re-birth and gets moksh or mukti

> then what happens...then what happens to the atman(the soul)....if

> one knows that this is his last physical life in this world and he

> will not be born again since he has now cut/stop the cycle of death &

> re-birth then what happens to his/her soul after this life....in this

> specific case where does the soul go after leaving the body...does it

> get dissolved in the cosmic universe or what...what is the final

> resting place or final destination for the atman(the soul) in the

> infinite universe considering the scenario i gave now...

> any views ...

>

> Vikrant

> Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join 's

> user panel and lay it on us.

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June 28, 2007

Hare Krishna, Dear Vikrant, Iam too having the some doubts regarding the same clarified with other group learned members. Just sharing the same.Hope you get your doubts cleared. May God bless you always. With Love, Sree [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Re:what happens after getting moksh Shree Guruvayurappa Sharanam! There are four kinds of liberation which a living-entity can get when he reaches the zenith of bhakti (devotion). They are: 1) Sarupya - Having the same form as Krishna's. 2) Salokya - Living in the same planet as Krishna's. 3) Samipya - Staying near the Lord always 4) Sarsti - Having the same opulence as the Lord. There is also a kind of liberation which the jnanis (one who is after the knowledge of Brahman) gets and that is called Sayujya (Merging with the Lord's Brahmajyoti effulgence) Hanumanji, who is the param bhakta of Shree Ramachandraji, was totally against Sayujya mukti because that took away from him the opportunity to render personal service to Shree Rama. 2.Depending

upon the school of philosophy (Dwaita, Advaita, Vaishnavaetc) you follow, the technical definition of 'Moksha' varies. But tocommoners like me, the simplistic explanation is as follows- Moksha or Mukti is the liberation from the cycle of death and rebirthand the end to suffering and limitation of worldly existence.Liberation occurs when the individual soul (Jeevatma) dissolves withthe universal soul (Paramatma) or Brahman.So, at the state of Moksha, individual soul dissolves in ParamAtma andour soul cease to exist and becomes a part of the universal 'oneness'. Self-realization (Aatma jnana) is the key to Moksha. There are four ways to self realization; Karma Yoga, Bhakti Yoga,Jnana Yoga, and Raja Yoga. And one must achieve Moksha on his or her own. I request all learned ones to elaborate more.Om Namo Narayanaya:Sunil. HARI

AUMSwamiChitmayanandji's disourses of the Gita has beeninsisting that the different 'yogas' are to be mixedand matched as any one single yoga is not complete initself. To gain knowledge 'action' is a must and onlywhen the 'knowledge' matures 'bhakthi' appears. The'bhakthi' as a 'yoga' comes after 'karma' and 'jnana'.Practise of religion, chanting bhajans, mantras etcare not be confused with the 'bhakthi' at the 'yoga'level but a way to better once 'karma' which willhelp him mature the 'jnana' that he acquires in theprocess.RegardsBalagopal Re: [Guruvayur/Guruvayoor] Re:what happens after getting moksh The Order as follows:-1. Saalokya2. Saameepya3. Saaroopya4. Saayoojya.SAALOKYA : reach to Mahavishnu's Lokam(Vykunda)SAAMEEPYA : reach to very near of MahavishnuSAAROOPYA

: Becomes Mahavishnu (Look like Mahavishnu)SAAYOOJYA : Merge into Mahavishnu.If anybody want more details, please read eitherBhaagavatham or Naarayaneeyam.thanks & regards,K.S.JainVikrant <free_for_blue wrote: i have a seriouse question that is been going in my mind since long.......when one cuts the cycle of death and re-birth and gets moksh or mukti then what happens...then what happens to the atman(the soul)....if one knows that this is his last physical

life in this world and he will not be born again since he has now cut/stop the cycle of death & re-birth then what happens to his/her soul after this life....in this specific case where does the soul go after leaving the body...does it get dissolved in the cosmic universe or what...what is the final resting place or final destination for the atman(the soul) in the infinite universe considering the scenario i gave now...any views ... Vikrant Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join 's user panel and lay it on us.

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June 28, 2007

> So, at the state of Moksha, individual soul dissolves in ParamAtma

and our soul cease to exist and becomes a part of the universal

'oneness'.

---Dear Sriman,

According to Brahma Sutra, in BOTH Shankaracharyas' Advaita Tika as

well as four Vaishnava sampradaya's Dvaita Tikas, the soul does not

" cease to exist " - the soul is eternal, sanatan, sat-chit-ananda, and

cannot cease to exist. What happens in sayujya mukti is the soul merges

with brahman (totality of life) and loses seperate identity, and

becomes ONE with impersonal Brahman --- but does never cease to exist.

This is what differentiates Brahma-jyoti nirakar sayujya mukti, which

is all light (chetan), from the Buddhist concept of SHUNYA " Nirvan "

which is all dark (void). It could be argued that this latter idea is

" spiritual suicide " OR even impossible.

But we know from Shastra that there are 3 bona fide paths to mukti, and

these relate to Brahman, Paramatma, Bhagavan, the three primary aspects

of the Para Brahman. Thus we have jnana (advaita-siddhanta), Yoga

(------- siddhanta??), and Bhakti (dvaita siddhanta).

The Vaishnavas achieve mukhi which is association with God in Vaikuntha

which is within the Brahmajyoti, and while realizing their souls true

identity as eternal servant, friend, parent or lover (Rasa-tattva) they

are eternally seperate from God in quantity, while being identical in

quality (sat-chit-ananda) thus enabling " bhakti-rasa " within mukti.

As it says in the Vedanta-sutra, " Antara bhuta-grama-vat svatmanah " ---

" Within Brahman, (Vaikunta) appears like a village of the material

world (has form and rasa, all made entirely of Chit) to the

self-realized souls " . THIS is a KEY SUTRA used by Vaishnava scholars.

The Yogis, appart from siddhis, attain Paramatma, which I assume to

mean Vaikuntha, but which could be impersonal (I'm not sure!)

The Jnani's eliminate matter (maya) " neti neti " (not this, not that) as

being illusion in order to merge into the sum-total of life (Brahman),

thereby losing identity, but never ceasing to exist.

Best wishes,

Richard

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June 28, 2007

Bravo! Bravo! Well said! JANARDANA DASARichard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote: > So, at the state of Moksha, individual soul dissolves in ParamAtmaand our soul cease to exist and becomes a part of the universal'oneness'. ---Dear Sriman,According to Brahma Sutra, in BOTH Shankaracharyas' Advaita Tika aswell as four Vaishnava sampradaya's Dvaita Tikas, the soul does not"cease to exist" - the soul is eternal, sanatan, sat-chit-ananda,

andcannot cease to exist. What happens in sayujya mukti is the soul mergeswith brahman (totality of life) and loses seperate identity, andbecomes ONE with impersonal Brahman --- but does never cease to exist.This is what differentiates Brahma-jyoti nirakar sayujya mukti, whichis all light (chetan), from the Buddhist concept of SHUNYA "Nirvan"which is all dark (void). It could be argued that this latter idea is"spiritual suicide" OR even impossible.But we know from Shastra that there are 3 bona fide paths to mukti, andthese relate to Brahman, Paramatma, Bhagavan, the three primary aspectsof the Para Brahman. Thus we have jnana (advaita-siddhanta), Yoga(------- siddhanta??), and Bhakti (dvaita siddhanta).The Vaishnavas achieve mukhi which is association with God in Vaikunthawhich is within the Brahmajyoti, and while realizing their souls trueidentity as eternal servant, friend, parent or lover

(Rasa-tattva) theyare eternally seperate from God in quantity, while being identical inquality (sat-chit-ananda) thus enabling "bhakti-rasa" within mukti. As it says in the Vedanta-sutra, "Antara bhuta-grama-vat svatmanah"---"Within Brahman, (Vaikunta) appears like a village of the materialworld (has form and rasa, all made entirely of Chit) to theself-realized souls". THIS is a KEY SUTRA used by Vaishnava scholars.The Yogis, appart from siddhis, attain Paramatma, which I assume tomean Vaikuntha, but which could be impersonal (I'm not sure!)The Jnani's eliminate matter (maya) "neti neti" (not this, not that) asbeing illusion in order to merge into the sum-total of life (Brahman),thereby losing identity, but never ceasing to exist.Best wishes,RichardSend instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

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June 28, 2007

" at the state of Moksha, individual soul dissolves in ParamAtma

and our soul cease to exist "

---If the above was right then what is the meaning of ETERNALLY

liberated? If sayujya mukti means the " soul cease to exist " then they

would call eternally DEAD, rather than eternally liberated.

Trying to make the soul " cease to exist " is Shunyavad (Buddhism), not

advaitavad. And Shunyavad, if possible, is suicide in the final sense.

Any discussion on this subject requires reference to Vedanta Sutras and

Bhagavad-gita, both of which have been explained differently by the

monists and the dualists. Making a clear distinction between dvaitavad

and advaitavad, based on above praman, allows one to make a

knowledgeable choice.

Best wishes,

Richard

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June 28, 2007

namaskar!

vikrant!

our atman merges with the great atman in the light!

the limitless clear light of love whatver name you

want to give it. it remains unnameable! you know

that!

love the question though on my favorite subject! and

my most fav word

moksh

June 29, 2007

ll HARE RAM ll Bhai Richard ji, Sadhuvad! You explained very well,accurate,correct and exact as our Shruti and Segas say about the Moksh but i believe in the verdict of Bharat that he requested/declared in front of Prayaga Raj when he was going to meet Lord Ram.What did he say at that time?As- "ARATH NA DHARAM NA KAAM RUCHI GATI NA CHAHEHUN NIRBAAN, JANAM JANAM RATI RAM PAD YAH VADAANU NA AAN". [Ramcharitmanas,Ayodhya-Kand,Doha No.204] [i have no liking of wealth nor for religious merit nor for sensuous enjoyment nor again do i seek the state of perfact and perpentual calm.Birth after birth let me have devotion of Sri Ram's feet.This the only i ask and nought else.] Regards Shashie Shekhar Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote: Dear Sriman,Namaste!!! Though there are many sampradayas in India, many religions,they can all be classified as either dualism or monism. Dualism

muktimeans entering Vaikuntha and associating with Bhagavan...as inpersonalism; Monism means merging into the formless impersonalbrahma-jyoti. In the Brahmajyoti there is nothing...no you, no God,NOTHING.Hanuman was offered the latter, i.e., sayujya mukti (impersonal) byLord Rama Himself, be he prefered "dualism" as in eternally associatingwith Bhagavan in Vaikuntha.Vaikuntha is Sat-Chit-Ananda. It exists within Brahmajyoti.Lord Krishna says in the Gita, Whatever one thinks of at time of death,that, and THAT alone, they achieve. So if one thinks of God at time ofdeath, then they achieve Him; but if one thinks (only) of Brahma jyotiat time of death then they merge and lose seperate identity.In both cases there is no more Samsara Chakra to suffer (and enjoy).Best wishes,Richardsacred-objects , Vikrant wrote:--- Vikrant

wrote:> i have a seriouse question that is been going in my mind since> long.......> when one cuts the cycle of death and re-birth and gets moksh or mukti> then what happens...then what happens to the atman(the soul)....if> one knows that this is his last physical life in this world and he> will not be born again since he has now cut/stop the cycle of death & > re-birth then what happens to his/her soul after this life....in this> specific case where does the soul go after leaving the body...does it> get dissolved in the cosmic universe or what...what is the final> resting place or final destination for the atman(the soul) in the> infinite universe considering the scenario i gave now...> any views ...> > Vikrant> > > > > > > > Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible

to please? Perfect. Join 's> user panel and lay it on us.Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

June 29, 2007

Dear Shashie bhai,

Dhunyavad and dandavat!!! When Chaitanya Mahaprabhu (500+ years ago)

was asked about his identity, he replied, " I'm not a sannyasi, a

vanaprasta, a grihasta, nor a brahmachari; I'm not a brahmin, nor a

kshatriya, nor vaishya, nor sudra (nor Indian), I am none of these

designations! I am the follower of the servant of the servant of the

lotus Feet of the beloved of the Gopis. " (Gopi-bhartur-pada-kamalayur

dasdasanudasah). It is the same bhav!!! Different Rasa!!! Both same &

different - achintya vedaved, just like our relationship with Bhagavan

is achintya-vedaved. Like a ray of the sun is both same and different

as the sun. Sri Hanuman's Bhav is dasya-rati; Chaitanya's Bhav is

madhurya rati.

But of course you know all this. So I'm just writing to myself.

All the best,

Richard

--- Shashie Shekhar <polite_astro wrote:

> ll HARE RAM ll

> Bhai Richard ji,

> Sadhuvad! You explained very well,accurate,correct and exact as our

> Shruti and Segas say about the Moksh but i believe in the verdict of

> Bharat that he requested/declared in front of Prayaga Raj when he was

> going to meet Lord Ram.What did he say at that time?As-

> " ARATH NA DHARAM NA KAAM RUCHI GATI NA CHAHEHUN NIRBAAN,

> JANAM JANAM RATI RAM PAD YAH VADAANU NA AAN " .

> [Ramcharitmanas,Ayodhya-Kand,Doha No.204]

> [i have no liking of wealth nor for religious merit nor for

> sensuous enjoyment nor again do i seek the state of perfact and

> perpentual calm.Birth after birth let me have devotion of Sri Ram's

> feet.This the only i ask and nought else.]

>

> Regards

> Shashie Shekhar

>

> Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote:

> Dear Sriman,

>

> Namaste!!! Though there are many sampradayas in India, many

> religions,

> they can all be classified as either dualism or monism. Dualism mukti

> means entering Vaikuntha and associating with Bhagavan...as in

> personalism; Monism means merging into the formless impersonal

> brahma-jyoti. In the Brahmajyoti there is nothing...no you, no God,

> NOTHING.

>

> Hanuman was offered the latter, i.e., sayujya mukti (impersonal) by

> Lord Rama Himself, be he prefered " dualism " as in eternally

> associating

> with Bhagavan in Vaikuntha.

>

> Vaikuntha is Sat-Chit-Ananda. It exists within Brahmajyoti.

>

> Lord Krishna says in the Gita, Whatever one thinks of at time of

> death,

> that, and THAT alone, they achieve. So if one thinks of God at time

> of

> death, then they achieve Him; but if one thinks (only) of Brahma

> jyoti

> at time of death then they merge and lose seperate identity.

>

> In both cases there is no more Samsara Chakra to suffer (and enjoy).

>

> Best wishes,

> Richard

>

> sacred-objects , Vikrant

> wrote:

>

> --- Vikrant wrote:

>

> > i have a seriouse question that is been going in my mind since

> > long.......

> > when one cuts the cycle of death and re-birth and gets moksh or

> mukti

> > then what happens...then what happens to the atman(the soul)....if

> > one knows that this is his last physical life in this world and he

> > will not be born again since he has now cut/stop the cycle of death

> &

> > re-birth then what happens to his/her soul after this life....in

> this

> > specific case where does the soul go after leaving the body...does

> it

> > get dissolved in the cosmic universe or what...what is the final

> > resting place or final destination for the atman(the soul) in the

> > infinite universe considering the scenario i gave now...

> > any views ...

> >

> > Vikrant

> >

> > Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join 's

> > user panel and lay it on us.

>

> Send instant messages to your online friends

> http://uk.messenger.

>

June 30, 2007

Kali_Ma , Vikrant <free_for_blue wrote:

>

> i have a seriouse question that is been going in my mind since

long.......

> when one cuts the cycle of death and re-birth and gets moksh or

mukti then what happens...then what happens to the atman(the

soul)....if one knows that this is his last physical life in this

world and he will not be born again since he has now cut/stop the

cycle of death & re-birth then what happens to his/her soul after

this life....in this specific case where does the soul go after

leaving the body...does it get dissolved in the cosmic universe or

what...what is the final resting place or final destination for the

atman(the soul) in the infinite universe considering the scenario i

gave now...

> any views ...

>

> Vikrant

> Hello to all My name is shane and i am nu to this interesting

little site. I have sometimes pondered that question myself and have

only managed to come up with some theories. A) Complete reunification

the Goddess. A utter and total merging so that the soul no longer

exists as a seperate reflection. If this is case then why become

seperate and human in the first place. Perhaps it is 'God " trying to

understand itself. B) Maybe the soul is then free to ascend to

another level of existance where Goddess/God is present in all its

multudinous forms and is also going through its own cyclic existance

of spiritual evolution. It goes on ad infinitum, continuous

expansion: The soul becomes a new god perhaps. None of these

speculations have any particular basis they are simply musings. I

will interested to see what others have to say on this issue.

>

> Get the toolbar and be alerted to new email wherever you're

surfing.

>

June 30, 2007

oh thankyou so much all for the replys!

i had a good laugh with the spiritual jokes! and our

ability t o be devotees and helpful

from nyc

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July 3, 2007

i'm going to post some of the book " Kali's Odiyya " in reply to your

question. I hope it's ok that i'm copying this small part of the

book?

Page 267:

" At the close of each day of Brahma this universe of space-time is

retracted into Brahma's mind, all beings lose their physical forms.

Indeed, matter itself is withdrawn into Brahma. This action is

called pralaya. Then, the night of Brahma begins; it lasts as long

as the day of Brahma. During this period, astral being, who have

evolved to the highest refinement, discard their astral sheathes and

pass beyond the realm of Brahma, into the above of the Divine

Mother. Less evolved beings are suppressed and confined to seed-

forms.

" At the beginning of a new day of Brahma, a new and reconstitued

universed of space-time explodes into being, with the seed-forms

regenerated as new astral beings who continue their ascent. They

evolve to take the place of those who have gone beyond. "

" How long does Brahma live? "

" Well, one hundred of Brahma's years, " she replied. That did not

clarify the time in human terms. Watchming ne strain to compute,

Prabha picked up a rib from a coconut leaf and began scratching

numbers on the sand. After several minutes and having worked over a

large patch of sand before us, she declared.

" You want to know what one hundred years of Brahma is? It is . . . "

She took a moment to glance at the figures on the ground, " three

thousand one hundred and ten trillion, forty billion human years --

the life span of one Brahma, "

" Oh, Divine Mother! It's an inconceivable amount of time! " I

exclaimed.

" Yes, that's one mother of a lifetime. " Prabha said laughing.

" The dying throes of Brahma signal the beginning of the universal

dissolution, or Maha-Pralaya. Even time ceases to exist. Unlike at

the end of a night of Brahma, when the reconstituted universe

emerges, there is nothing to emerge. All realms of awareness are

obliterated. With the death of Brahma, a period of inscrutableness

exists. I use the word 'period' for want of a better term. Nobody

knows what it is as there is no space-time. This is the Transcosmic

Void, the Para Brahmanda Shooniyam. "

" I understand that matter, energy, and all space-times cease to

exist. But what happens to all the beings in the realms? "

" All beings cease to be. They lose their sheaths -- the annamaya,

manomaya, pranamya, vijnanamaya and anandamaya koshas -- all are

obliterated. What remains are the souls, naked and sheathless.

These merge into the Void, to be paramatman, the Supreme Self. "

" One hundred years of Brahma constitute one menstrual cycle of the

Divine Mother. During each menstruation several eggs float out into

this great void. Each such egg is a Brahmanda or cosmic egg, the

precursor to the mighty being of a Brahma. This discussion is

taking on a tangent. Let me explain to you why it was important to

cut Sandhya's boyd. "

*************************

I don't pretend to understand or readily absorb the above but i'm

presenting it - as it's presented in the book - in case it proves

useful to you in relation to your question.

Namaste,

Andy