A clarification sought

[Guest guest]

Respected Sirs,

In the process of seeing alliance for our daughter, we find from the

books on matching and horosocope reading that some stars are stated as

PORUNTHATHM STARS but there is " NO star porutham " . In the pampu

panchangam it is stated that Star Porutham is a must for brahmins.

However, in Karnataka I find that the astologers do not reject

horoscopes on account of star alone. what is the real position for us,

Tamil Brahmins. Should we reject a horosopce if there is no star

porutham even if we have other porutham. I request leanrned readers to

advise me.

Respectfully,

GJ

[Guest guest]

Dear Srimathy Janaki :

 

Oppiliappan List is not the right group

to pose this academic question . Kumudham

Josyam or Vaideekam group is

better forum to tackle this kind of

Question . Astrology is different from

JyOthisham . As in the case of Economists ,

if there are 8 Jyothishars , there will be

nine opinions . Very rarely , you find

some one who is truly trained .

 

It is sad that some girls' or boy's life is

adversely affected by these prouttham based matches

and other similar things . Because

some one has Moolam , Aayilyam or some other

Nakshathram , people reject proposals

immediately . What is a parent to do ?

Blame the poor girl or the boy ? There are only

27 Nakshathrams after all .

 

It is also difficult to distiniguish between

Tamil Brahmins and Karnataka Brahmins .

Karnataka is a land blessed by the foot steps

of Bhagavath RaamAnuja . Also , let us

recognize that in these days of outsourcing

and globolization driven , overheated

environment of India that many Tamilians are

economic refuges in Karnataka ,

MaharAshtra and elsewhere .

 

Sorry to be blunt in my message .

Please consult with Your AchAryans

and leave the rest to the Dhivya Dampathis ,

whose children we are .

 

V.Sadagopan

 

 

 

 

 

-

" srivijanaki " <srivijanaki

<Oppiliappan >

Monday, October 29, 2007 3:00 AM

A clarification sought

 

 

> Respected Sirs,

> In the process of seeing alliance for our daughter, we find from the

> books on matching and horosocope reading that some stars are stated as

> PORUNTHATHM STARS but there is " NO star porutham " . In the pampu

> panchangam it is stated that Star Porutham is a must for brahmins.

> However, in Karnataka I find that the astologers do not reject

> horoscopes on account of star alone. what is the real position for us,

> Tamil Brahmins. Should we reject a horosopce if there is no star

> porutham even if we have other porutham. I request leanrned readers to

> advise me.

> Respectfully,

> GJ

>

[Guest guest]

Oppiliappan , " srivijanaki " <srivijanaki

wrote:

>

> Respected Sirs,

> In the process of seeing alliance for our daughter, we find from the

> books on matching and horosocope reading that some stars are stated

as

> PORUNTHATHM STARS but there is " NO star porutham " . In the pampu

> panchangam it is stated that Star Porutham is a must for brahmins.

> However, in Karnataka I find that the astologers do not reject

> horoscopes on account of star alone. what is the real position for

us,

> Tamil Brahmins. Should we reject a horosopce if there is no star

> porutham even if we have other porutham. I request leanrned readers

to

> advise me.

> Respectfully,

> GJ

>

[Guest guest]

According to our tradition, Star Poruttham is the most important & only those horoscopes which have star poruttham can be further studied for other porutthams, which are listed in Srirangam Panchangam. Out of ten poruthams if there are maximum poruthams then only we can proceed further. The second important porutham is Rajju porutham, which if it is negative, then also no further progress. The above is the traditionally followed by all. As per the olden procedure, for Brahmins star porutham & Rajju porutham are enough for further progress. But, it is optional to parents to see Dasas of both the boy & girl to ensure their married life is long enough, smooth & fruitful. Srinivasan (non-karnatic) srivijanaki <srivijanaki wrote: Respected Sirs,In the process of seeing alliance for our daughter, we find from the books on matching and horosocope reading that some stars are stated as PORUNTHATHM STARS but there is "NO star porutham". In the pampu panchangam it is stated that Star Porutham is a must for brahmins. However, in Karnataka I find that the astologers do not reject horoscopes on account of star alone. what is the real position for us, Tamil Brahmins. Should we reject a horosopce if there is no star porutham even if we have other porutham. I request leanrned readers to advise

me.Respectfully,GJ

[Guest guest]

Dear all,

Sri Kazhiyur Narayanan, a famous astrologers in India (Chennai) , hailin from a renowned astrological family,very often advocates the theory of not rejecting horoscopes merely on the ground of Nakshatra Porutham alone. Even those who do not have any knowledge of basics of astrology, simply count the fingers ( sometimes on telephone itself) and ourightly reject the proposals thus spoiling the opportunities to many boys and girls (as of now, I would say boys, since, it appears that there are more boys available than girls). Beyond this I have nothing to say, since I donot know astrology. I am merely quoting from what he use to say.

Pranams,

devanatha dasan Chennai

 

 

 

On Mon, 29 Oct 2007 srivijanaki wrote :

>Respected Sirs,

>In the process of seeing alliance for our daughter, we find from the

>books on matching and horosocope reading that some stars are stated as

>PORUNTHATHM STARS but there is " NO star porutham " . In the pampu

>panchangam it is stated that Star Porutham is a must for brahmins.

>However, in Karnataka I find that the astologers do not reject

>horoscopes on account of star alone. what is the real position for us,

>Tamil Brahmins. Should we reject a horosopce if there is no star

>porutham even if we have other porutham. I request leanrned readers to

>advise me.

>Respectfully,

>GJ

>

[Guest guest]

Namaskaram, I really appreciate your reply to this mail. This site should be operated exclusively for oppiliappan and we should learn and listen only messages related to Lord Rama. The concept of this website should never be diluted or commercialised. I hope I am right at my thinking. Regards RAVI NARAYAN"Dr. Sadagopan" <yennappan wrote: Dear Srimathy Janaki :Oppiliappan List is not the right group to pose

this academic question . Kumudham Josyam or Vaideekam group is better forum to tackle this kind of Question . Astrology is different fromJyOthisham . As in the case of Economists ,if there are 8 Jyothishars , there will be nine opinions . Very rarely , you findsome one who is truly trained .It is sad that some girls' or boy's life is adversely affected by these prouttham based matches and other similar things . Because some one has Moolam , Aayilyam or some otherNakshathram , people reject proposals immediately . What is a parent to do ?Blame the poor girl or the boy ? There are only 27 Nakshathrams after all . It is also difficult to distiniguish betweenTamil Brahmins and Karnataka Brahmins .Karnataka is a land blessed by the foot steps of Bhagavath RaamAnuja . Also , let usrecognize that in these days of outsourcingand globolization driven , overheated environment of India

that many Tamilians are economic refuges in Karnataka ,MaharAshtra and elsewhere .Sorry to be blunt in my message .Please consult with Your AchAryans and leave the rest to the Dhivya Dampathis ,whose children we are .V.Sadagopan - "srivijanaki" <srivijanaki (AT) (DOT) co.in><Oppiliappan >Monday, October 29, 2007 3:00 AM A clarification sought> Respected Sirs,> In the process of seeing alliance for our daughter, we find from the > books on matching and horosocope reading that some stars are stated as > PORUNTHATHM STARS but there is "NO star porutham". In the pampu > panchangam it is stated that Star Porutham is a must for brahmins. > However, in Karnataka I find that

the astologers do not reject > horoscopes on account of star alone. what is the real position for us, > Tamil Brahmins. Should we reject a horosopce if there is no star > porutham even if we have other porutham. I request leanrned readers to > advise me.> Respectfully,> GJ>

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[Guest guest]

Dear Sri Ravi Narayanan :

 

Thanks very much for your comments .

I agree with you and will try my best

to stay away from all distractions :

 

irrelevant topics , intellectual exercises

and misintrepretations , commercial

attempts to advertise company products and

all kinds of unnecessary intrusions

that distort the execution of the stated

mission of the groups I have the privelege

to moderate ( Saranagathy , Malolan ,

Vaideekam , Raama Bhakthi) . Please do not be

upset if I reject any postings in the above categories

for all other groups in the context of their missions .

 

NamO SrI VenkatEsAya ,

V.Sadagopan

 

 

-

ravi narayan

Oppiliappan

Tuesday, October 30, 2007 1:27 AM

Re: A clarification sought

 

Namaskaram,

 

I really appreciate your reply to this mail. This site should be operated exclusively for oppiliappan and we should learn and listen only messages related to Lord Rama. The concept of this website should never be diluted or commercialised. I hope I am right at my thinking.

 

Regards

 

RAVI NARAYAN"Dr. Sadagopan" <yennappan wrote:

 

 

Dear Srimathy Janaki :Oppiliappan List is not the right group to pose this academic question . Kumudham Josyam or Vaideekam group is better forum to tackle this kind of Question . Astrology is different fromJyOthisham . As in the case of Economists ,if there are 8 Jyothishars , there will be nine opinions . Very rarely , you findsome one who is truly trained .It is sad that some girls' or boy's life is adversely affected by these prouttham based matches and other similar things . Because some one has Moolam , Aayilyam or some otherNakshathram , people reject proposals immediately . What is a parent to do ?Blame the poor girl or the boy ? There are only 27 Nakshathrams after all . It is also difficult to distiniguish betweenTamil Brahmins and Karnataka Brahmins .Karnataka is a land blessed by the foot steps of Bhagavath RaamAnuja . Also , let usrecognize that in these days of outsourcingand globolization driven , overheated environment of India that many Tamilians are economic refuges in Karnataka ,MaharAshtra and elsewhere .Sorry to be blunt in my message .Please consult with Your AchAryans and leave the rest to the Dhivya Dampathis ,whose children we are .V.Sadagopan - "srivijanaki" <srivijanaki (AT) (DOT) co.in><Oppiliappan >Monday, October 29, 2007 3:00 AM A clarification sought> Respected Sirs,> In the process of seeing alliance for our daughter, we find from the > books on matching and horosocope reading that some stars are stated as > PORUNTHATHM STARS but there is "NO star porutham". In the pampu > panchangam it is stated that Star Porutham is a must for brahmins. > However, in Karnataka I find that the astologers do not reject > horoscopes on account of star alone. what is the real position for us, > Tamil Brahmins. Should we reject a horosopce if there is no star > porutham even if we have other porutham. I request leanrned readers to > advise me.> Respectfully,> GJ>

 

 

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[Guest guest]

SrI:

 

Dear Members of the Groups I moderate:

 

FYI.

V.Sadagopan

 

 

-

Dr. Sadagopan

Oppiliappan

Tuesday, October 30, 2007 10:24 AM

Re: A clarification sought

 

 

Dear Sri Ravi Narayanan :

 

Thanks very much for your comments .

I agree with you and will try my best

to stay away from all distractions :

 

irrelevant topics , intellectual exercises

and misintrepretations , commercial

attempts to advertise company products and

all kinds of unnecessary intrusions

that distort the execution of the stated

mission of the groups I have the privelege

to moderate ( Saranagathy , Malolan ,

Vaideekam , Raama Bhakthi) . I am

moderating Vaideekam group for

a limited time , while the owner/Moderator

is tied up .

 

Members:Please do not be upset if I reject any

postings of yours in the above categories

for all other groups in the context of

their missions .

 

NamO SrI VenkatEsAya ,

V.Sadagopan

 

-

ravi narayan

Oppiliappan

Tuesday, October 30, 2007 1:27 AM

Re: A clarification sought

 

 

Namaskaram,

 

I really appreciate your reply to this mail. This site should be operated

exclusively for oppiliappan and we should learn and listen only messages related

to Lord Rama. The concept of this website should never be diluted or

commercialised. I hope I am right at my thinking.

 

Regards

 

RAVI NARAYAN

 

" Dr. Sadagopan " <yennappan wrote:

Dear Srimathy Janaki :

 

Oppiliappan List is not the right group

to pose this academic question . Kumudham

Josyam or Vaideekam group is

better forum to tackle this kind of

Question . Astrology is different from

JyOthisham . As in the case of Economists ,

if there are 8 Jyothishars , there will be

nine opinions . Very rarely , you find

some one who is truly trained .

 

It is sad that some girls' or boy's life is

adversely affected by these prouttham based matches

and other similar things . Because

some one has Moolam , Aayilyam or some other

Nakshathram , people reject proposals

immediately . What is a parent to do ?

Blame the poor girl or the boy ? There are only

27 Nakshathrams after all .

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Adiyen fully agree with the point that this site should confine to the Lord & our poorvaachaaryaas only. Pardon me for the clarification adiyen gave regarding horoscope-matching, which adiyen did out of pity. Regards, Srinivasan ravi narayan <ravi070563 wrote: Namaskaram, I really appreciate your reply to this mail. This site should be operated exclusively for oppiliappan and we should learn and listen only messages related to Lord

Rama. The concept of this website should never be diluted or commercialised. I hope I am right at my thinking. Regards RAVI NARAYAN"Dr. Sadagopan" <yennappan (AT) computer (DOT) net> wrote: Dear Srimathy Janaki :Oppiliappan List is not the right group to pose this academic question . Kumudham Josyam or Vaideekam group is better forum to tackle this kind of Question . Astrology is different fromJyOthisham . As in the case of Economists ,if there are 8 Jyothishars , there will be nine opinions . Very rarely , you findsome one who is truly trained .It is sad that some girls' or boy's life is adversely affected by these prouttham based matches and other similar things . Because some one has Moolam , Aayilyam or some

otherNakshathram , people reject proposals immediately . What is a parent to do ?Blame the poor girl or the boy ? There are only 27 Nakshathrams after all . It is also difficult to distiniguish betweenTamil Brahmins and Karnataka Brahmins .Karnataka is a land blessed by the foot steps of Bhagavath RaamAnuja . Also , let usrecognize that in these days of outsourcingand globolization driven , overheated environment of India that many Tamilians are economic refuges in Karnataka ,MaharAshtra and elsewhere .Sorry to be blunt in my message .Please consult with Your AchAryans and leave the rest to the Dhivya Dampathis ,whose children we are .V.Sadagopan - "srivijanaki" <srivijanaki (AT) (DOT) co.in><Oppiliappan >Monday, October 29, 2007 3:00 AM A clarification sought> Respected Sirs,> In the process of seeing alliance for our daughter, we find from the > books on matching and horosocope reading that some stars are stated as > PORUNTHATHM STARS but there is "NO star porutham". In the pampu > panchangam it is stated that Star Porutham is a must for brahmins. > However, in Karnataka I find that the astologers do not reject > horoscopes on account of star alone. what is the real position for us, > Tamil Brahmins. Should we reject a horosopce if there is no star > porutham even if we have other porutham. I request leanrned readers to > advise me.> Respectfully,> GJ> Get the

freedom to save as many mails as you wish. Click here to know how.

[Guest guest]

I agree fully with Dr.Sadagopan that this site should be exclusively devoted to bakthi. Of course Sri Sowmya narayanan only answered the question about astrology since it is natural to give areplywhen you know the facts . But as Mr.ravi Narayanan says this sir te is not restricted to the subject of Oppipliappan or Rama alone. I do not think that as a devotee one should distinguish between one form of the Lord and another as all are His manifestations only. In fact Dr.Sadgopan has very knindly asked me to write on yadhavabhyuadhaya , krishna karnamrtha and Ramyana etc.in this site and I have been doing so.When we know that God is one, why to distinguish between even Rama and krishna etc.? saroja ramanujam Dr. Saroja Ramanujam, M.A., Ph.D, Siromani in sanskrit. Please visit www.freewebs.com/sarojaramanujam www.freewebs.com/asrama3

[Guest guest]

Respectful Bhagavathas, It was very kind of Dr Srimathi Ramanujam to justify adiyen's response to the original query, but adiyen has apololgised for it. As for distinction between Rama, Krishna etc., it occurs to adiyen's mind, that is a unque aspect of our sampradaya. In this prakriti life, living beings are all differ one from another even within one category like plant, animal and human forms. The Lord also appears in different forms so that everyone of His beings is attracted towards Him. In this way even Aasthikas can be brought. We also see difference in the time frame like morning, day evening & night, winter, summer etc. These are all to be transcended to get absorbed into the Lord Who is one and one alone. His Divyaathma is one only, but with countless Divya mangala vigrahas. One Acharya indicated, for quick progress we have to confine ourselves to One Acharya, One Deva, One Murthi and One

Nama. It is to keep our mind in total concentration so that there is no chalanam. Sri Krishna agrees, our mind is sanchalah. Only through constant practice it can be controlled. To start with one has to choose one murthy of the Lord with all His leelas in that form according to the initial nature of our mental position. Kindly excuse me if anything wrong adiyen said. After all adiyen is ignorant basically. With regards, Srinivasan Saroja Ramanujam <sarojram18 wrote: I agree

fully with Dr.Sadagopan that this site should be exclusively devoted to bakthi. Of course Sri Sowmya narayanan only answered the question about astrology since it is natural to give areplywhen you know the facts . But as Mr.ravi Narayanan says this sir te is not restricted to the subject of Oppipliappan or Rama alone. I do not think that as a devotee one should distinguish between one form of the Lord and another as all are His manifestations only. In fact Dr.Sadgopan has very knindly asked me to write on yadhavabhyuadhaya , krishna karnamrtha and Ramyana etc.in this site and I have been doing so.When we know that God is one, why to distinguish between even Rama and krishna etc.? saroja ramanujam Dr. Saroja Ramanujam, M.A., Ph.D, Siromani in sanskrit. Please visit www.freewebs.com/sarojaramanujam www.freewebs.com/asrama3

[Guest guest]

Sri :

 

Dear Sriman Sowmianarayanan :

 

Thanks very much for your thoughtful note .

Your points are well made . Bhagavath Bhakthi

and Ishta DevathA UpAsanam are two big

themes for AzhwArs , AchAryAs and NaadhOpaasakAs

and blessed poets .

 

The Chadal Pasasurams of Thirumangai

debate about the Vaibhavam of Raam and

KrishNa in the form of two ghOshtis of Gopis .

 

One KrishNa Bhakthar addresses Lord Raamachandra

and makes this request :

 

Oh SeethApathi! Please set aside Your bow named

KodhaNDam and the arrows and adorn the beautiful flute

in Your hand and decorate Your tresses with the peacock

feather . I will prostrate before You thereafter ( PascchAth

ThvAm praNamAmi) .

 

An ardent Raama Bhathar started the Aarabhi Pancha Rathnam:

SaadhinchanE to praise KrishNa ; halfway thru , his KrishNa-

dhyAnam was disturbed and the krithi vAkyams shifted to

his ishta Dhaivam , Sri Raama chandran . Elsewhere

this Saintly Bard says : Tava DaasOham and RaamachadrAth

anyam na jaanE .

 

Ditto for SrI Nrusimha and Sri HayagrIva BhakthAs .

 

As the goal of Oppiliappan Group , all celebrations

of Sriman NaarAyaNa is totally acceptable .

 

NamO SrIman NaarAyaNAya ,

V.Sadagopan

 

 

-

srinivasan sowmianarayanan

Oppiliappan

Thursday, November 01, 2007 8:05 PM

Re: A clarification sought

 

Respectful Bhagavathas,

It was very kind of Dr Srimathi Ramanujam to justify adiyen's response to the original query, but adiyen has apololgised for it.

As for distinction between Rama, Krishna etc., it occurs to adiyen's mind, that is a unque aspect of our sampradaya. In this prakriti life, living beings are all differ one from another even within one category like plant, animal and human forms. The Lord also appears in different forms so that everyone of His beings is attracted towards Him. In this way even Aasthikas can be brought. We also see difference in the time frame like morning, day evening & night, winter, summer etc. These are all to be transcended to get absorbed into the Lord Who is one and one alone. His Divyaathma is one only, but with countless Divya mangala vigrahas.

One Acharya indicated, for quick progress we have to confine ourselves to One Acharya, One Deva, One Murthi and One Nama. It is to keep our mind in total concentration so that there is no chalanam. Sri Krishna agrees, our mind is sanchalah. Only through constant practice it can be controlled. To start with one has to choose one murthy of the Lord with all His leelas in that form according to the initial nature of our mental position.

Kindly excuse me if anything wrong adiyen said. After all adiyen is ignorant basically.

With regards,

Srinivasan Saroja Ramanujam <sarojram18 wrote:

 

 

 

I agree fully with Dr.Sadagopan that this site should be exclusively devoted to bakthi. Of course Sri Sowmya narayanan only answered the question about astrology since it is natural to give areplywhen you know the facts . But as Mr.ravi Narayanan says this sir te is not restricted to the subject of Oppipliappan or Rama alone. I do not think that as a devotee one should distinguish between one form of the Lord and another as all are His manifestations only. In fact Dr.Sadgopan has very knindly asked me to write on yadhavabhyuadhaya , krishna karnamrtha and Ramyana etc.in this site and I have been doing so.When we know that God is one, why to distinguish between even Rama and krishna etc.?

saroja ramanujam

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dr. Saroja Ramanujam, M.A., Ph.D, Siromani in sanskrit. Please visit www.freewebs.com/sarojaramanujam

www.freewebs.com/asrama3

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Somyanarayanan, Dr.Sadagopan has expressed clearly what I wanted to say I would like to add af ew lines though.It is true that you must have a particular form of deity etc. for upasana. But it is my opinion and experience that you do not have to choose the form of ishtadevata but it comes to you of its own accord. 'YamaiveshavrNuthe thena labhyathe' When you go on worshipping Him in all forms suddenly He comes to you in one form and settles in your heart.For those saints like Kabir and Thyagaraja, they got fixed to one form due to their poorvajanma sukrtha.But Thyagaraja has sung on all deities and that does not make him a less devotee of Rama.He had the jnana and so did all the saints and azvars that all are the different forms of the same God. We have different photos of our beloved ones, father, mother, son, etc. But there is surely one particular photo in a particular dress and expression you love

most and would like to place on your table or car.That does not make you love the others less. Similarly the particular form that steals your heart is that of your ishtadevata.As I said your ishtadevata and also your acharya are something that happens to you by God's grace when the proper time comes. That is why it is said that if you have ardent aspiration and faith the guru seeks you out to impart instruction. All the azvars say in their hymns about the Lord in various divyadesams that "it is He who appeared as Rama, (or Krishna, trivikrama, vamana etc.) is seen in this divyadesam. All are like defferent photos of the Lord in different costumes, as Desika puts it. Personally speaking my ishtadevata is Lakshminarasimha but I did not choose Him. He chose me.When I see or worship any other form of Narayana it is only a diffferent form of Narasimha, who is Lord Narayana.Oothukkadu Venkatasubbaiarsays in his song 'munseidhathavappayane,'

that 'sangodu saarngamum aaziyum kudai kamandalamum kodari kodhandamum ingivai aagaadhena vanamalarmaalaiyum ponthugilum mayiliragum,' by which he has mentioned all the incarnations in one line! ( type pannumpodhe pullarikkiradhu) Mukkur swami has said in his 'kuraiyonrum illai' that the Lord is present even in Thirupparkadal as Narasimha and threw away His chata etc and became Krishna. Desika says in his varadarajasthava that the whole world is even now nrsimhagarbham except the one pillar in the courthall of Hiranyakasipu because the Lord pervaded everywhere as Narasimha because He did not know where Hiranya kasipu was going to point out and He had the responsibilty to prove the words of His bhaktha Prahlada who said that the Lord is everywhere.He appears to you in what ever form you want to see Him and manifests in all forms for His devotees which are the different costumes of the kapatanatakasuthradhari. Dr. Saroja Ramanujam, M.A., Ph.D, Siromani in sanskrit. Please visit www.freewebs.com/sarojaramanujam www.freewebs.com/asrama3 Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection

around

[Guest guest]

Respectful Swamin, Your statement rekindled adiyen's thoughts. When adiyen & a bhgavatha used to recite Prabhantha pAsurams, we come across reference to different leelas of the Lord in different incarnations within the same pAsurams, especially of Kaliyan, we used to enjoy the divine grace of the Azhvars. If one wants to enijoy Sri Rama's leelas, he has to read Sri Ramayanam, that too, at full length. Similarly, if he wants to enjoy Sri Krishna's leelas immediately, he has to forsake the Ramayana and take up Srimad Bhagavatham. However, when we recite Prabantham, such needs will not arise as it contains all the leelas of all incarnations not only in that same work, but in the same Patthu, and also in the same single pasuram. How blessed we are! Regards, Srinivasa Dasan "Dr. Sadagopan" <yennappan

wrote: Sri : Dear Sriman Sowmianarayanan : Thanks very much for your thoughtful note . Your points are well made . Bhagavath Bhakthi and Ishta DevathA UpAsanam are two big themes for AzhwArs , AchAryAs and NaadhOpaasakAs

and blessed poets . The Chadal Pasasurams of Thirumangai debate about the Vaibhavam of Raam and KrishNa in the form of two ghOshtis of Gopis . One KrishNa Bhakthar addresses Lord Raamachandra and makes this request : Oh SeethApathi! Please set aside Your bow named KodhaNDam and the arrows and adorn the beautiful flute in Your hand and decorate Your tresses with the peacock feather . I will prostrate before You thereafter ( PascchAth ThvAm praNamAmi) . An ardent Raama Bhathar started the Aarabhi Pancha Rathnam: SaadhinchanE to praise KrishNa ; halfway thru , his KrishNa- dhyAnam was disturbed and the krithi vAkyams shifted to his ishta Dhaivam , Sri Raama chandran . Elsewhere this Saintly Bard says : Tava DaasOham and RaamachadrAth anyam na jaanE . Ditto for SrI Nrusimha and Sri HayagrIva BhakthAs . As the goal of Oppiliappan Group , all celebrations of Sriman NaarAyaNa is totally acceptable . NamO SrIman NaarAyaNAya , V.Sadagopan - srinivasan sowmianarayanan Oppiliappan Thursday, November 01, 2007 8:05 PM Re: A clarification sought Respectful Bhagavathas, It was very kind of Dr Srimathi Ramanujam to justify adiyen's response to the original query, but adiyen has apololgised for it. As for distinction between Rama, Krishna etc., it occurs to adiyen's mind, that is a unque aspect of our sampradaya. In this prakriti life, living beings are all differ one from another even within one category like plant, animal and human forms. The Lord also appears in different forms so that everyone of His beings is attracted towards Him. In this way even Aasthikas can be brought. We also see difference in the time frame like morning, day evening & night, winter, summer etc. These are all to be transcended to get absorbed into the Lord Who is one and one alone. His Divyaathma is one only, but with countless Divya mangala vigrahas. One Acharya indicated, for quick progress we have to confine ourselves to One Acharya, One Deva, One Murthi and One Nama. It is to keep our mind in total

concentration so that there is no chalanam. Sri Krishna agrees, our mind is sanchalah. Only through constant practice it can be controlled. To start with one has to choose one murthy of the Lord with all His leelas in that form according to the initial nature of our mental position. Kindly excuse me if anything wrong adiyen said. After all adiyen is ignorant basically. With regards, Srinivasan Saroja Ramanujam <sarojram18 > wrote: I agree fully with Dr.Sadagopan that this site should be exclusively devoted to bakthi. Of course Sri Sowmya narayanan only answered the question about astrology since it is natural to give areplywhen you know the facts . But as Mr.ravi Narayanan says this sir te is not restricted to the subject of Oppipliappan or Rama alone. I do not think that as a

devotee one should distinguish between one form of the Lord and another as all are His manifestations only. In fact Dr.Sadgopan has very knindly asked me to write on yadhavabhyuadhaya , krishna karnamrtha and Ramyana etc.in this site and I have been doing so.When we know that God is one, why to distinguish between even Rama and krishna etc.? saroja ramanujam Dr. Saroja Ramanujam, M.A., Ph.D, Siromani in sanskrit. Please visit www.freewebs.com/sarojaramanujam www.freewebs.com/asrama3

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Respectful Madam & Bhagavathas, Adien offers apologies if anything contradiction stated by me. Adiyen wanted to express adiyen's thoughts that arose after going through your one sentence on the subject. Everything that happens automatically is due to our karma, no doubt. But, as Sri Krishna states in Gita, the jiva has freedom upto taking the first step according to which He leads him till the destination. For tha first step only He has provided us the sareera, the kulam, the tradition of worship and the opportunities that come before us. It all depends on using our buddhi which is also a gift of the Lord. Many a time we miss to take the right step and realise the mistake at later stage. Some fortunate jivas catch it at the earliest stage. It is also stated by Sri Krishna in the Gita. But, He does not rule out the freedom to choose the first step and proceed which in case is discontiuend take us to the next birth

in the right family so that that journey is continued further by the jiva. Even then due to our missing the opportunities despite being in the right family, tradition we go astray and cotinue our birth circle. Thinking a lot over this problem adiyen felt that it is all due to our failure to listen to our own conscience. But there are a few fortunate jivas like you madam who are able to catch the indication given by their conscience, that is, the Antharyami, the Lord. Pl. pardon if adiyen has blurred. Regards, Srinivasa dasan Saroja Ramanujam <sarojram18 wrote: Dear Somyanarayanan, Dr.Sadagopan has expressed clearly what I wanted to say I would like to add af ew lines though.It is true that you must have a particular form of deity etc. for upasana. But it is my opinion and experience that you do not have to choose the form of ishtadevata but it comes to you of its own accord. 'YamaiveshavrNuthe thena labhyathe' When you go on worshipping Him in all forms suddenly He comes to you in one form and settles in your heart.For those saints like Kabir and Thyagaraja, they got fixed to one form due to their poorvajanma sukrtha.But Thyagaraja has sung on all deities and that does not make him a less devotee of Rama.He had the jnana and so did all the saints and azvars that all are the different forms of the same God. We have different photos of

our beloved ones, father, mother, son, etc. But there is surely one particular photo in a particular dress and expression you love most and would like to place on your table or car.That does not make you love the others less. Similarly the particular form that steals your heart is that of your ishtadevata.As I said your ishtadevata and also your acharya are something that happens to you by God's grace when the proper time comes. That is why it is said that if you have ardent aspiration and faith the guru seeks you out to impart instruction. All the azvars say in their hymns about the Lord in various divyadesams that "it is He who appeared as Rama, (or Krishna, trivikrama, vamana etc.) is seen in this divyadesam. All are like defferent photos of the Lord in different costumes, as Desika puts it. Personally speaking my ishtadevata is Lakshminarasimha but I did not choose Him. He chose me.When I see or worship any other form of Narayana it

is only a diffferent form of Narasimha, who is Lord Narayana.Oothukkadu Venkatasubbaiarsays in his song 'munseidhathavappayane,' that 'sangodu saarngamum aaziyum kudai kamandalamum kodari kodhandamum ingivai aagaadhena vanamalarmaalaiyum ponthugilum mayiliragum,' by which he has mentioned all the incarnations in one line! ( type pannumpodhe pullarikkiradhu) Mukkur swami has said in his 'kuraiyonrum illai' that the Lord is present even in Thirupparkadal as Narasimha and threw away His chata etc and became Krishna. Desika says in his varadarajasthava that the whole world is even now nrsimhagarbham except the one pillar in the courthall of Hiranyakasipu because the Lord pervaded everywhere as Narasimha because He did not know where Hiranya kasipu was going to point out and He had the responsibilty to prove the words of His bhaktha Prahlada who said that the Lord is everywhere.He appears to you in what ever form you want to see Him and manifests in all

forms for His devotees which are the different costumes of the kapatanatakasuthradhari. Dr. Saroja Ramanujam, M.A., Ph.D, Siromani in sanskrit. Please visit www.freewebs.com/sarojaramanujam www.freewebs.com/asrama3

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Dear Sowmyanarayanan, You have hit the nail on the head. It is because we do not listen to our conscience we get o ito trouble. When you have full faith in God and do your duty surrendering all your actions, thoughts and words to HIm and look up to Him for guidance the voice of your conscience is recognised as the voice of God. He never forsake one who surrenders to Him, no matter what lapses are there in our behaviour due to ignorance. As Krishna says in Gita, 'kountheya prthijaaneehi na me bhalkthah praNaSyathi.' We think we are getting into trouble because we lavk full faith. No doubt, our propensities depend on our past karma but b not our actions.We do have free will, as you have rightly said and it means that we should choose actions and entertain thoughts that will take us towards Him and not away from Him.What the sentence 'yamaivesha vrnuthe thena labhyathe' means is that you can take steps to attain Him but when that happens is His will.But the

faith that He will certainly do it propels one to carry on. To surrender means you place the burden on Him bharasamrpana with full faith mahaavivasa and he will do the rest.His grace may descend on you the next moment itself you never know. But all that one has to do is to be ready when that comes. Suppose you are debating which form of the lord to worship or about the right acharya for you, or any other action, put the burden on Him and tell Him that it is your look out and then do not worry about it. The solution comes of its own accord. I was also uncertain once upon a time and was worshipping all forms of God and following all gurus with otu knowing which is th best for me but when the right time came for me suddenly I got a guru who definitely showed me the path that is riight for me and thence forward I had no doubt. This is what I meant by saying that You do not have to choose your guru or form of

Ishtadevata but they come to you naturally at the right time. saroja Ramanujam Dr. Saroja Ramanujam, M.A., Ph.D, Siromani in sanskrit. Please visit www.freewebs.com/sarojaramanujam www.freewebs.com/asrama3