[Jagannath] Guru-Sisya

[Guest guest]

Om Saptarshibhyo Namaha

Pranaam Sanjay,

I have no disagreement with what Dina-natha wrote below. One gets a

mantra from guru and it goes back to Maharshis. Maharshis get their knowledge

from Gods. Dina-natha is misrepresenting me and trying to show that I disagree

with you ("If you are not you can start arguing with Sanjay like Narasimha

used to do with me.").

(1) I only argued that you need not show the Saint upto whom you can

trace your parampara to be God for your parampara to be "genuine". When

we trace the knowledge of mantra upto Maharshis, all knowledge is from

Krishna!! Of course, yes. This is true irrespective of whether we take

a saint of a few centuries ago to be an incarnation of Vishnu or one with

Vishnu's amsha. I do not consider my views (understanding) to be against

what Sanjay said. (Of course, if this is wrong, Sanjay could and

can correct me.)

(2) If one says that one's knowledge is perfect because one belongs

to a certain parampara. I do not know what to say. Maharshis were advanced

in buddhi and they could clearly perceive the truth. But knowledge coming

from them can certainly be corrupted by the time it comes to us. This is

true for both Jyotisha and mantra. The pronunciation and intonation of

a mantra can be correct, but the complete understanding of the mantra need

not be perfect.

One's buddhi depends on one's karma. Who one gets as guru depends on

one's karma. Both together decide what one learns, understands and does

in this life.

(3) If you say something to me in a personal mail that seems to be against

Dina-natha's writings, I do not go on mentioning it in my posts to silence

Dina-natha. Mentioning a private discussion with you is incorrect. You

are the person to articulate your views correctly and not me or

Dina-natha. Dina-natha should realize that you can articulate you views

yourself.

(4) Dina-natha said I do not come from any spiritual parampara. But

I was initiated with Gayatri mantra and have some knowledge

of sastras (it may not be perfect though). My father is my diksha guru

and the parampara goes back to Gautama Maharshi.

(5) You told us many times that this list for Jyotish only. But I am

not patient enough to ignore constant provocation, animosity and misrepresentation.

Please forgive me.

Your sishya,

Narasimha

Dear Sanjayji,

Jaya Jagannatha!

I would just like to share with other members of this list what we discussed

today in connection with guru-sisya relationship and parampara.

Some individuals on this list will derive great benefit from this

conversation if they want to accept your words.

First you explained that sisya gets mantra by iccha shakti of the guru

which

can be through few different ways (personally (verbally), or by letter

(writing)).

Then I asked you from where guru gets his mantra? You replied from

his guru.

Then I asked from where that guru gets his mantra and you replied from

his

guru and you said it goes back to Maharishis. Then I asked you from

whom

Maharishis get their mantra and you replied from Devatas. I asked you

from

whom Devatas get their mantra and you replied from Isa or Krishna.

So I really hope that everyone has understood this simple point that

you

made this afternoon including certain individuals on this list who

may hold

different views on this issue and argue pointlessly that parampara

doesn't

have to be started by God or Isa.

Hare Krishna,

Dina-natha Das.

[Guest guest]

Namaste Dina-natha,

 

> No, this is not what you said (Guru-chandala yoga here it

> comes)! Your first argument was that there is no need to

> go beyond one's guru and try to trace back parampara. Than

> you said that parampara doesn't necessary have to come

> from God, and your last point was that there is no need to

> show if a saint (Caitanya Mahaprabhu) was Krishna's avatar.

> After you said in above paragraph that all knowledge is

> from Krishna, then if Caitanya Mahaprabhu wasn't avatar of

> Krishna how do you explain that Acyuta dasa got knowledge

> of Jyotish from him? Don't forget you wrote that all

 

The answer is in your post in which you quoted a private

discussion with Sanjay. All this knowledge originally comes

from maharshis and they get it from Krishna.

 

If you go one level up in the parampara, your direct guru

should be God to you. This is basic part of Hindu ethos. If

you go all the way up to maharshis, the knowledge comes from

God. This is another basic fact. There is no clash between

the two.

 

What I called an unnecessary exercise was to look for an

avatar of Vishnu between these two ends.

 

> knowledge comes from Krishna as you wrote in above

> paragraph.

 

May Jupiter's light shine on us,

Narasimha