Guest guest Posted September 17, 2000 Report Share Posted September 17, 2000 JAYA JAGANNATHA! Dear Jyotisha, Namaste. I'm studying the BPHS and I was thinking about Bhava Lagna. We know something about Hora Lagna and Ghati Lagna. The first is to be used for determining the materila benefits of the natvie, and the second for his power and influence. But what is the Bhava Lagna for? Could anyone enlighten me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 18, 2000 Report Share Posted September 18, 2000 Jaya Jagannath Dear Gauranga, NOTE ON BHAVA LAGNA. The Lagna is the movement of the eastern Horizon due to the rotation of the earth. This is Satya. The Rasi's are demarcated as houses and their boundaries are like the fences between houses. The question is " You live in a particular building, call this Lagna, and this has a definite boundary wall. But did this boundary wall exist from time immemorial? The answer is no. This boundary wall/fence has existed only as much as the building has existed and God alone knows which building stood there earlier and where its boundary wall/fence was. " Thus we infer that what we consider as a solid house today is actually a figment of our imagination and it is only as solid as our physical bodies. The physical zodiac is the fixed zodiac and hence the signs with the fixed boundaries is representative of the physical body or the creation of Maya. The enlightened Jyotisha also know that the atma is like the Paramatma and is constantly endeavoring to have union with it. Now, the Paramatma is represented by the Bha-chakra (Zodiac) starting from zero degrees Aries. If we have a mathematical model where the Lagna is made equal to the first degree of Aries and every Bhava is equal to 30 Degrees, then this model will match the definition of the Paramatma. Such a model will represent our ASTRAL BODY. Some spiritualists have seen this astral body as different colors of physical light extendiong outside the physical body of the human being. I believe that there is a machine in singapore where this can also be photographed! There are different mathematical models for equating the Lagna to the Natural Zodiac for understanding the effect of the planets on the ASTRAL PLANE. This can only be recommended by the Maharishi's who were very enlightened souls. We follow the model of Parasara as we believe that His vision was the most clear and untainted. By adding 15 degrees on either side of the Lagna degree we arrive at the ASTRAL BOUNDARIES which form the BHAVA CHAKRA. How to study this is beyond the scope of my teachings at this stage. Suffice is to say that " JYOTISHA SHOULD NOT MAKE A FOOL OF THEMSELVES BY SUGGESTING RESULTS ON THE BASIS OF THIS BHAVA CHAKRA WITHOUT UNDERSTANDING THE FLOW OF THE TEN SHAKTI AND THEIR YOGA WITH NARAYANA " . Unless we are at a level to understand the colors of the astral light, their blending and influence, we should not tamper with this tool of Vedic Astrology. All Jyotisha may kindly take a note of this. I will teach this at a later date to the Jyotisha Guru's. Blessings of Sri Jagannath Mahaprabhu to my favorite Gauranga who has asked such a vital question..May you have that Divine Vision we all yearn for. Sanjay Rath - Gauranga Das <gauranga <varahamihira > Sunday, September 17, 2000 22:01 Rath [sri Guru] Bhava Lagna > > JAYA JAGANNATHA! > > Dear Jyotisha, > > Namaste. > > I'm studying the BPHS and I was thinking about Bhava Lagna. We know something about Hora > Lagna and Ghati Lagna. The first is to be used for determining the materila benefits of > the natvie, and the second for his power and influence. But what is the Bhava Lagna for? > Could anyone enlighten me > > > OM TAT SAT > Archive: varahamihira > Info: varahamihira/info.html > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 25, 2000 Report Share Posted September 25, 2000 Dear Sanjay, If I understood correctly we are talking of Bhava Lagna which is one among three special lagnas, and Bhava Chakra which is extanded 15 degrees over both sides of ascending degree. The letter signifies our astral body, in comparison to lagna which stands for a physical body. Is this correct? In my attempt to comprehend these concept, I would refer to a shloka of Parashara... " If Bhava extands to two rashis, the rectification should be done as per both lords " ... So he is reffering to dual lordship of a bhava. If we take a cusp of a bhava as ascending degree, plus 30 degrees, the lords would remain the same as in rashi chart. If we take shripati method, then bhava madhya would fall into different rashis, thus permitting dual lordship.Could you explain this? The only obvious reason I can see so far, is to take a method of bhava cusp calculation as per difference between lagna degree and Medium coelli degree, and calculate the cusps accordingly.. As per the use of Bhava Astal Chakra, it is obivious that a graha may fall into different bhavas as per this chart. For example if we take a bhava on the 15 degrees on both sides of lagna degree, and calculate eqaul house system and other madhyas by adding 30 degrees on lagna degree. For example, chandra is in 7th house in bhava chakra, while in rashi chart it may be placed in 8th house. What could it mean on the astral level? IT could mean that on the astral level,the mind is strongly influenced by other people behaviour, and parthership in particular. However, rashi chart stands physical level of existance. So these influence may produce physical suffering due to chandra position in 8th house. So materialisation seems somewhat difficult. Or is it just my own speculation? What do you and other learned members opine? Best wishes, Zoran > > My Dear Narasimha, > Like the shirt and the body, the BL Chakra and Bhava Chakra for Lagna > try to fit into one another. There is a mismatch and this is largely due to > the various bodies of differnt sizes that we occupy from one life to > another. The Astral body does not change much (rather it is mostly > negligible as most of us waste our lives in trivial pursuits), but the > pysical body changes from life to life. The Bhava Chakra from Lagna is the > SHIRT that God has given for this life. The REAL astral light is not visible > to ANY Camera, but what is visible is the physical manifestation of that > light - just like the shirt covering the body. People may look very good at > times with different shirts (Some genuinely believe they are good looking!!) > and these are the NARCISSUS like fools who think they look handsome, little > do they know what awaits them in the next birth. This knowledge of the > astral body and its slight mismatch in " fitting into " the physical body is > what we know as Bhava Chakra and Bhava Lagna Chakra respectively. > THE NEXT QUESTION: WHAT IS THE USE OF THIS KNOWLEDGE??? I leave it here. > Blessings to the Best > Sanjay > PS. Perhaps I will copy this to Varahamihira class also > - > Narasimha Rao <pvr > SJVC Gurus <achyuta > > Monday, September 25, 2000 08:55 Rath > [achyuta] Re: Bhava Lagna > > > > > Om Om Om Om Om > > Hare Rama Krishna > > Pranaam Sanjay, > > > > I am confused about how you are linking BL with the bhava > > chakra of lagna. Just as lagna shows true self that exists > > in the physical world, HL shows the self from the point of > > view of money, GL shows the self from the point of view of > > power and AL shows the perceived self, I thought BL shows > > the astral self. Many people have BL and lagna close > > together or atleast in the same rasi. I thought the > > situation of BL in divisions was important. Good yogas in > > BL in D-24, for example, may show a person engaging in > > activities related to knowledge for which he will be > > remembered decades or centuries after the maya of material > > existence ends. Good yogas in BL in D-10 may show a person > > engaging in activities in society for which he will be > > remembered. > > > > I thought BL lord Saturn exalted in the 9th from it aspected > > by Jupiter was the reason for Sir Ashutosh Mukherjee being > > remembered as an ocean of knowledge, even after his death. > > I thought the conjunction of 1st, 5th and 9th lords in BL in > > Aq was the reason of Aurobindo remembered as a great scholar > > even long after his material existence ended. I thought the > > 1st lord in 5th aspected by 5th lord, from BL in D-20, was > > the reason for the everlasting fame of Aurobindo for his > > spiritual activities. > > > > While lagna shows physical existence, the 5th house shows > > the fame and GL shows the power enjoyed during life, BL shows > > the astral self. Only the astral self can be behind fame or > > impressions that lasts after death. I thought BL shows this. > > > > I understood BL as another special lagna like HL and GL that > > sheds light on a particular aspect of self. > > > > But you are now talking about a link between this BL and the > > bhava chakra w.r.t. standard lagna. I do not understand. I do > > realize that bhava chakra based on +/- 15 deg attempts to do > > something similar to BL, as BL is based on a uniform motion > > unlike lagna. But I would think that these bhava chakras were > > the result of people misunderstanding the concept of BL. > > > > In any case, I need to meditate over this more to consolidate > > my thoughts. BTW, why did you associate HL with Rama??? > > > > Your sishya, > > Narasimha > > > > > Dear Narasimha, > > > The Bhava Chakra is the impact of the Bhava Lagna Chakra on the > > Lagna. There > > > is an astral influence and this is manifesting on the physical body > > in a > > > slightly different lag. The source of the astral influence is the > > Bhava > > > Lagna. just like the source for the funds is Hora lagna and the > > source for > > > Power is the Ghatika Lagna. Source is different from the actual > > > manifestation. The Narayana Dasa associating with the HL gives money > > to the > > > person, but he will get this from the planets in the 11th from AL. > > Thus, > > > although the real giver is HL (Rama), the apparant giver can be > > somebody > > > else. The event of the money coming takes place at the astral level > > before > > > its actual physical occurence. > > > Best wishes > > > Sanjay > > > P.S. Send these to Achyuta Group in future > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 25, 2000 Report Share Posted September 25, 2000 Om Om Om Om Om Hayagreevaaya Namah Pranaam Sanjay and Zoran, Here are my thoughts: (1) Regarding Zoran's quote from Parasara: Parasara did not say " if a house *extends* to 2 rasis " . This wording makes it sound like a house starts in one rasi and ends in another. But Parasara only said " if a house is in 2 rasis " . Considering Parasara's teaching in the chapter on Sudarsana Chakra dasa that each house can be in one or two or three rasis (from lagna, Moon and Sun), this can be explained without taking recourse to any house division methods in which houses can start in one sign and end in another. (2) After defining BL, HL and GL, Parasara clearly taught that houses must be reckoned from these special lagnas just like in the case of lagna, by " counting rasis starting from the rasi containing " the reference. The whole rasi containing the reference is the first house. Next rasi is second house. (3) So, I see absolutely no Sastric basis for any house division from lagna or BL. Except vague references (such as Zoran's quote), one cannot give a clear reference from Parasara recommending +15/-15 deg division. Parasara only talked about counting houses by *counting rasis* from the reference. (4) Sanjay wrote: " The Rasi's are demarcated as houses and their boundaries are like the fences between houses. The question is " You live in a particular building, call this Lagna, and this has a definite boundary wall. But did this boundary wall exist from time immemorial? The answer is no. " No, I cannot agree. The answer is yes. Zodiac and its rasis are a manifestation of Parabrahma (or Mahavishnu) and they existed before everything else existed. Zodiac existed before even the planets and Brahma existed. It existed before Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva were born from the Supreme Essence/Mahavishnu (or Parabrahma or Paramashiva) and before Brahma created planets and our astral selves from the Supreme Essence. I do not see why it is necessary to dismantle the basic factor of natural zodiac to explain the concept of astral self. Houses related to astral self in rasi and divisional charts *do* have to obey the rasi division of the natural zodiac. I do not see any basis for finding a bhava chakra by adding +/- 15 deg to either lagna or BL. May Hayagreeva bless us with pure knowledge, Your sishya, Narasimha > Dear Sanjay, > If I understood correctly we are talking of Bhava Lagna > which is one among three special lagnas, and Bhava Chakra > which is extanded 15 degrees over both sides of ascending degree. > The letter signifies our astral body, in comparison to lagna which > stands for a physical body. Is this correct? > In my attempt to comprehend these concept, I would refer to > a shloka of Parashara... " If Bhava extands to two rashis, the rectification > should be done as per both lords " ... > So he is reffering to dual lordship of a bhava. If we take a cusp of a bhava > as ascending degree, plus 30 degrees, the lords would remain the same as > in rashi chart. If we take shripati method, then bhava madhya would fall into > different rashis, thus permitting dual lordship.Could you explain this? > The only obvious reason I can see so far, is to take a method of bhava > cusp calculation as per difference between lagna degree and Medium coelli > degree, and calculate the cusps accordingly.. > As per the use of Bhava Astal Chakra, it is obivious that a graha may > fall into different bhavas as per this chart. For example if we take a bhava > on the 15 degrees on both sides of lagna degree, and calculate eqaul house > system and other madhyas by adding 30 degrees on lagna degree. For example, > chandra is in 7th house in bhava chakra, while in rashi chart it may be placed in 8th house. > What could it mean on the astral level? IT could mean that on the astral level,the > mind is strongly influenced by other people behaviour, and parthership in > particular. However, rashi chart stands physical level of existance. So these > influence may produce physical suffering due to chandra position in 8th house. > So materialisation seems somewhat difficult. Or is it just my own speculation? > What do you and other learned members opine? > Best wishes, > Zoran > > > > > My Dear Narasimha, > > Like the shirt and the body, the BL Chakra and Bhava Chakra for Lagna > > try to fit into one another. There is a mismatch and this is largely due to > > the various bodies of differnt sizes that we occupy from one life to > > another. The Astral body does not change much (rather it is mostly > > negligible as most of us waste our lives in trivial pursuits), but the > > pysical body changes from life to life. The Bhava Chakra from Lagna is the > > SHIRT that God has given for this life. The REAL astral light is not visible > > to ANY Camera, but what is visible is the physical manifestation of that > > light - just like the shirt covering the body. People may look very good at > > times with different shirts (Some genuinely believe they are good looking!!) > > and these are the NARCISSUS like fools who think they look handsome, little > > do they know what awaits them in the next birth. This knowledge of the > > astral body and its slight mismatch in " fitting into " the physical body is > > what we know as Bhava Chakra and Bhava Lagna Chakra respectively. > > THE NEXT QUESTION: WHAT IS THE USE OF THIS KNOWLEDGE??? I leave it here. > > Blessings to the Best > > Sanjay > > PS. Perhaps I will copy this to Varahamihira class also > > - > > Narasimha Rao <pvr@m...> > > SJVC Gurus <achyuta > > > Monday, September 25, 2000 08:55 Rath > > [achyuta] Re: Bhava Lagna > > > > > > > > Om Om Om Om Om > > > Hare Rama Krishna > > > Pranaam Sanjay, > > > > > > I am confused about how you are linking BL with the bhava > > > chakra of lagna. Just as lagna shows true self that exists > > > in the physical world, HL shows the self from the point of > > > view of money, GL shows the self from the point of view of > > > power and AL shows the perceived self, I thought BL shows > > > the astral self. Many people have BL and lagna close > > > together or atleast in the same rasi. I thought the > > > situation of BL in divisions was important. Good yogas in > > > BL in D-24, for example, may show a person engaging in > > > activities related to knowledge for which he will be > > > remembered decades or centuries after the maya of material > > > existence ends. Good yogas in BL in D-10 may show a person > > > engaging in activities in society for which he will be > > > remembered. > > > > > > I thought BL lord Saturn exalted in the 9th from it aspected > > > by Jupiter was the reason for Sir Ashutosh Mukherjee being > > > remembered as an ocean of knowledge, even after his death. > > > I thought the conjunction of 1st, 5th and 9th lords in BL in > > > Aq was the reason of Aurobindo remembered as a great scholar > > > even long after his material existence ended. I thought the > > > 1st lord in 5th aspected by 5th lord, from BL in D-20, was > > > the reason for the everlasting fame of Aurobindo for his > > > spiritual activities. > > > > > > While lagna shows physical existence, the 5th house shows > > > the fame and GL shows the power enjoyed during life, BL shows > > > the astral self. Only the astral self can be behind fame or > > > impressions that lasts after death. I thought BL shows this. > > > > > > I understood BL as another special lagna like HL and GL that > > > sheds light on a particular aspect of self. > > > > > > But you are now talking about a link between this BL and the > > > bhava chakra w.r.t. standard lagna. I do not understand. I do > > > realize that bhava chakra based on +/- 15 deg attempts to do > > > something similar to BL, as BL is based on a uniform motion > > > unlike lagna. But I would think that these bhava chakras were > > > the result of people misunderstanding the concept of BL. > > > > > > In any case, I need to meditate over this more to consolidate > > > my thoughts. BTW, why did you associate HL with Rama??? > > > > > > Your sishya, > > > Narasimha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 26, 2000 Report Share Posted September 26, 2000 Jaya Jagannath Dear Zoran, The correct chakra for the Physical Body is the RASI CHAKRA. The Atma resides in the heart and its light shines through the sahasrara Chakra in the head. This is the BL or Bhava Lagna which is calculated like HL & GL. This light of the Atma is akin to a huge GEMSTONE emiting light on its own. People have different ways to try to draw the influence of this light which does not obey the boundaries of the signs. They take 15 Deg +/- from the BL for defining its shape. What is really important to the Jyotish is the influence of the light of this ASTRAL Body on the Physical body. Even if someone loses a hand, the astral boby continues to exist and if a dummy hand is placed in the place of the physical hand, it starts functioning to the best of the abilities of the hand. this ASTRAL BODY cannot be destroyed. Now, we need to have some system to correlate the BL with its 15 Deg +/- (Again some say this is 30+ only) with the Physical Rasi's. After all we are concerned with this life. That is why some Jyotisha have devised the system of 15Deg +/- for the Bhava Lagna to be computed. What is this indicative of? It would indicate the Astral Body as seen from the exterior or the outward manifestation of this light in this particular body in this life. Honestly, this is not of much consequence to the normal jyotisha as it has little say on the physical body which is controlled by the AK and Lagnesh. So, just use this, rather experiment with this for spiritual knowledge. Best Wishes Sanjay Rath - Zoran Radosavljevic <ahimsa <varahamihira > Cc: <achyuta > Monday, September 25, 2000 19:47 Rath [sri Guru] Re: Bhava Lagna > > Dear Sanjay, > If I understood correctly we are talking of Bhava Lagna > which is one among three special lagnas, and Bhava Chakra > which is extanded 15 degrees over both sides of ascending degree. > The letter signifies our astral body, in comparison to lagna which > stands for a physical body. Is this correct? > In my attempt to comprehend these concept, I would refer to > a shloka of Parashara... " If Bhava extands to two rashis, the rectification > should be done as per both lords " ... > So he is reffering to dual lordship of a bhava. If we take a cusp of a bhava > as ascending degree, plus 30 degrees, the lords would remain the same as > in rashi chart. If we take shripati method, then bhava madhya would fall into > different rashis, thus permitting dual lordship.Could you explain this? > The only obvious reason I can see so far, is to take a method of bhava > cusp calculation as per difference between lagna degree and Medium coelli > degree, and calculate the cusps accordingly.. > As per the use of Bhava Astal Chakra, it is obivious that a graha may > fall into different bhavas as per this chart. For example if we take a bhava > on the 15 degrees on both sides of lagna degree, and calculate eqaul house > system and other madhyas by adding 30 degrees on lagna degree. For example, > chandra is in 7th house in bhava chakra, while in rashi chart it may be placed in 8th house. > What could it mean on the astral level? IT could mean that on the astral level,the > mind is strongly influenced by other people behaviour, and parthership in > particular. However, rashi chart stands physical level of existance. So these > influence may produce physical suffering due to chandra position in 8th house. > So materialisation seems somewhat difficult. Or is it just my own speculation? > What do you and other learned members opine? > Best wishes, > Zoran > > > > > My Dear Narasimha, > > Like the shirt and the body, the BL Chakra and Bhava Chakra for Lagna > > try to fit into one another. There is a mismatch and this is largely due to > > the various bodies of differnt sizes that we occupy from one life to > > another. The Astral body does not change much (rather it is mostly > > negligible as most of us waste our lives in trivial pursuits), but the > > pysical body changes from life to life. The Bhava Chakra from Lagna is the > > SHIRT that God has given for this life. The REAL astral light is not visible > > to ANY Camera, but what is visible is the physical manifestation of that > > light - just like the shirt covering the body. People may look very good at > > times with different shirts (Some genuinely believe they are good looking!!) > > and these are the NARCISSUS like fools who think they look handsome, little > > do they know what awaits them in the next birth. This knowledge of the > > astral body and its slight mismatch in " fitting into " the physical body is > > what we know as Bhava Chakra and Bhava Lagna Chakra respectively. > > THE NEXT QUESTION: WHAT IS THE USE OF THIS KNOWLEDGE??? I leave it here. > > Blessings to the Best > > Sanjay > > PS. Perhaps I will copy this to Varahamihira class also > > - > > Narasimha Rao <pvr > > SJVC Gurus <achyuta > > > Monday, September 25, 2000 08:55 Rath > > [achyuta] Re: Bhava Lagna > > > > > > > > Om Om Om Om Om > > > Hare Rama Krishna > > > Pranaam Sanjay, > > > > > > I am confused about how you are linking BL with the bhava > > > chakra of lagna. Just as lagna shows true self that exists > > > in the physical world, HL shows the self from the point of > > > view of money, GL shows the self from the point of view of > > > power and AL shows the perceived self, I thought BL shows > > > the astral self. Many people have BL and lagna close > > > together or atleast in the same rasi. I thought the > > > situation of BL in divisions was important. Good yogas in > > > BL in D-24, for example, may show a person engaging in > > > activities related to knowledge for which he will be > > > remembered decades or centuries after the maya of material > > > existence ends. Good yogas in BL in D-10 may show a person > > > engaging in activities in society for which he will be > > > remembered. > > > > > > I thought BL lord Saturn exalted in the 9th from it aspected > > > by Jupiter was the reason for Sir Ashutosh Mukherjee being > > > remembered as an ocean of knowledge, even after his death. > > > I thought the conjunction of 1st, 5th and 9th lords in BL in > > > Aq was the reason of Aurobindo remembered as a great scholar > > > even long after his material existence ended. I thought the > > > 1st lord in 5th aspected by 5th lord, from BL in D-20, was > > > the reason for the everlasting fame of Aurobindo for his > > > spiritual activities. > > > > > > While lagna shows physical existence, the 5th house shows > > > the fame and GL shows the power enjoyed during life, BL shows > > > the astral self. Only the astral self can be behind fame or > > > impressions that lasts after death. I thought BL shows this. > > > > > > I understood BL as another special lagna like HL and GL that > > > sheds light on a particular aspect of self. > > > > > > But you are now talking about a link between this BL and the > > > bhava chakra w.r.t. standard lagna. I do not understand. I do > > > realize that bhava chakra based on +/- 15 deg attempts to do > > > something similar to BL, as BL is based on a uniform motion > > > unlike lagna. But I would think that these bhava chakras were > > > the result of people misunderstanding the concept of BL. > > > > > > In any case, I need to meditate over this more to consolidate > > > my thoughts. BTW, why did you associate HL with Rama??? > > > > > > Your sishya, > > > Narasimha > > > > > > > Dear Narasimha, > > > > The Bhava Chakra is the impact of the Bhava Lagna Chakra on the > > > Lagna. There > > > > is an astral influence and this is manifesting on the physical body > > > in a > > > > slightly different lag. The source of the astral influence is the > > > Bhava > > > > Lagna. just like the source for the funds is Hora lagna and the > > > source for > > > > Power is the Ghatika Lagna. Source is different from the actual > > > > manifestation. The Narayana Dasa associating with the HL gives money > > > to the > > > > person, but he will get this from the planets in the 11th from AL. > > > Thus, > > > > although the real giver is HL (Rama), the apparant giver can be > > > somebody > > > > else. The event of the money coming takes place at the astral level > > > before > > > > its actual physical occurence. > > > > Best wishes > > > > Sanjay > > > > P.S. Send these to Achyuta Group in future > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 26, 2000 Report Share Posted September 26, 2000 Dear Narasimha, You made the point. What I am saying is that there can be no proof for such things and we can only experiment, but that too has no real utility at the present state. The Physical chart..Rasi Chakra is the most correct chart used universally by all Jyotisha in the tradition. Astral body is different from the physical body and continues to exist even if the part of the physical body is destroyed. Thus if the third house is damaged and a person loses a hand, the third from the BL chart continues to exist. There was a need to make this demarcation to explain the difference between the physical body and the astral self. One is destructible, the other lives beyond the physical death but till the .Lord Shiva (Maheswara) delivers the soul..leave it here. Best Wishes Sanjay - Narasimha Rao <pvr <varahamihira > Monday, September 25, 2000 22:50 Rath [sri Guru] Re: Bhava Lagna > > Om Om Om Om Om > Hayagreevaaya Namah > Pranaam Sanjay and Zoran, > > Here are my thoughts: > > (1) Regarding Zoran's quote from Parasara: > > Parasara did not say " if a house *extends* to 2 rasis " . This > wording makes it sound like a house starts in one rasi and ends > in another. But Parasara only said " if a house is in 2 rasis " . > Considering Parasara's teaching in the chapter on Sudarsana > Chakra dasa that each house can be in one or two or three rasis > (from lagna, Moon and Sun), this can be explained without taking > recourse to any house division methods in which houses can start > in one sign and end in another. > > (2) After defining BL, HL and GL, Parasara clearly taught that > houses must be reckoned from these special lagnas just like in > the case of lagna, by " counting rasis starting from the rasi > containing " the reference. The whole rasi containing the > reference is the first house. Next rasi is second house. > > (3) So, I see absolutely no Sastric basis for any house > division from lagna or BL. Except vague references (such as > Zoran's quote), one cannot give a clear reference from Parasara > recommending +15/-15 deg division. Parasara only talked about > counting houses by *counting rasis* from the reference. > > (4) Sanjay wrote: " The Rasi's are demarcated as houses and their > boundaries are like the fences between houses. The question is > " You live in a particular building, call this Lagna, and this > has a definite boundary wall. But did this boundary wall exist > from time immemorial? The answer is no. " > > No, I cannot agree. The answer is yes. Zodiac and its rasis are > a manifestation of Parabrahma (or Mahavishnu) and they existed > before everything else existed. Zodiac existed before even the > planets and Brahma existed. It existed before Brahma, Vishnu and > Shiva were born from the Supreme Essence/Mahavishnu (or > Parabrahma or Paramashiva) and before Brahma created planets and > our astral selves from the Supreme Essence. > > I do not see why it is necessary to dismantle the basic factor > of natural zodiac to explain the concept of astral self. Houses > related to astral self in rasi and divisional charts *do* have > to obey the rasi division of the natural zodiac. I do not see > any basis for finding a bhava chakra by adding +/- 15 deg to > either lagna or BL. > > May Hayagreeva bless us with pure knowledge, > Your sishya, > Narasimha > > > Dear Sanjay, > > If I understood correctly we are talking of Bhava Lagna > > which is one among three special lagnas, and Bhava Chakra > > which is extanded 15 degrees over both sides of ascending degree. > > The letter signifies our astral body, in comparison to lagna which > > stands for a physical body. Is this correct? > > In my attempt to comprehend these concept, I would refer to > > a shloka of Parashara... " If Bhava extands to two rashis, the > rectification > > should be done as per both lords " ... > > So he is reffering to dual lordship of a bhava. If we take a cusp > of a bhava > > as ascending degree, plus 30 degrees, the lords would remain the > same as > > in rashi chart. If we take shripati method, then bhava madhya would > fall into > > different rashis, thus permitting dual lordship.Could you explain > this? > > The only obvious reason I can see so far, is to take a method of > bhava > > cusp calculation as per difference between lagna degree and Medium > coelli > > degree, and calculate the cusps accordingly.. > > As per the use of Bhava Astal Chakra, it is obivious that a graha > may > > fall into different bhavas as per this chart. For example if we > take a bhava > > on the 15 degrees on both sides of lagna degree, and calculate > eqaul house > > system and other madhyas by adding 30 degrees on lagna degree. For > example, > > chandra is in 7th house in bhava chakra, while in rashi chart it > may be placed in 8th house. > > What could it mean on the astral level? IT could mean that on the > astral level,the > > mind is strongly influenced by other people behaviour, and > parthership in > > particular. However, rashi chart stands physical level of > existance. So these > > influence may produce physical suffering due to chandra position in > 8th house. > > So materialisation seems somewhat difficult. Or is it just my own > speculation? > > What do you and other learned members opine? > > Best wishes, > > Zoran > > > > > > > > My Dear Narasimha, > > > Like the shirt and the body, the BL Chakra and Bhava Chakra > for Lagna > > > try to fit into one another. There is a mismatch and this is > largely due to > > > the various bodies of differnt sizes that we occupy from one life > to > > > another. The Astral body does not change much (rather it is mostly > > > negligible as most of us waste our lives in trivial pursuits), > but the > > > pysical body changes from life to life. The Bhava Chakra from > Lagna is the > > > SHIRT that God has given for this life. The REAL astral light is > not visible > > > to ANY Camera, but what is visible is the physical manifestation > of that > > > light - just like the shirt covering the body. People may look > very good at > > > times with different shirts (Some genuinely believe they are good > looking!!) > > > and these are the NARCISSUS like fools who think they look > handsome, little > > > do they know what awaits them in the next birth. This knowledge > of the > > > astral body and its slight mismatch in " fitting into " the > physical body is > > > what we know as Bhava Chakra and Bhava Lagna Chakra respectively. > > > THE NEXT QUESTION: WHAT IS THE USE OF THIS KNOWLEDGE??? I > leave it here. > > > Blessings to the Best > > > Sanjay > > > PS. Perhaps I will copy this to Varahamihira class also > > > - > > > Narasimha Rao <pvr@m...> > > > SJVC Gurus <achyuta > > > > Monday, September 25, 2000 08:55 Rath > > > [achyuta] Re: Bhava Lagna > > > > > > > > > > > Om Om Om Om Om > > > > Hare Rama Krishna > > > > Pranaam Sanjay, > > > > > > > > I am confused about how you are linking BL with the bhava > > > > chakra of lagna. Just as lagna shows true self that exists > > > > in the physical world, HL shows the self from the point of > > > > view of money, GL shows the self from the point of view of > > > > power and AL shows the perceived self, I thought BL shows > > > > the astral self. Many people have BL and lagna close > > > > together or atleast in the same rasi. I thought the > > > > situation of BL in divisions was important. Good yogas in > > > > BL in D-24, for example, may show a person engaging in > > > > activities related to knowledge for which he will be > > > > remembered decades or centuries after the maya of material > > > > existence ends. Good yogas in BL in D-10 may show a person > > > > engaging in activities in society for which he will be > > > > remembered. > > > > > > > > I thought BL lord Saturn exalted in the 9th from it aspected > > > > by Jupiter was the reason for Sir Ashutosh Mukherjee being > > > > remembered as an ocean of knowledge, even after his death. > > > > I thought the conjunction of 1st, 5th and 9th lords in BL in > > > > Aq was the reason of Aurobindo remembered as a great scholar > > > > even long after his material existence ended. I thought the > > > > 1st lord in 5th aspected by 5th lord, from BL in D-20, was > > > > the reason for the everlasting fame of Aurobindo for his > > > > spiritual activities. > > > > > > > > While lagna shows physical existence, the 5th house shows > > > > the fame and GL shows the power enjoyed during life, BL shows > > > > the astral self. Only the astral self can be behind fame or > > > > impressions that lasts after death. I thought BL shows this. > > > > > > > > I understood BL as another special lagna like HL and GL that > > > > sheds light on a particular aspect of self. > > > > > > > > But you are now talking about a link between this BL and the > > > > bhava chakra w.r.t. standard lagna. I do not understand. I do > > > > realize that bhava chakra based on +/- 15 deg attempts to do > > > > something similar to BL, as BL is based on a uniform motion > > > > unlike lagna. But I would think that these bhava chakras were > > > > the result of people misunderstanding the concept of BL. > > > > > > > > In any case, I need to meditate over this more to consolidate > > > > my thoughts. BTW, why did you associate HL with Rama??? > > > > > > > > Your sishya, > > > > Narasimha > > > > OM TAT SAT > Archive: varahamihira > Info: varahamihira/info.html > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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