[Jagannath] Srila

[Guest guest]

OM VISHNAVE NAMAH

 

Dear Dina-nath Prabhu,

You have raised some very nice questions and I have also had the good

fortune of reading the Bhagavat Gita-As it is. In fact understanding Srila

is not as easy as it may seem. I have given the example of the poem

Daffodils by Wordsworth. When I was a child the words

 

" Oft when on my couch I lie,

In vacant or in pensive mood.

They flash upon that inward eye

Which is the bliss of solitude

And then my heart with pleasure fills

and dances with the daffodils "

 

These words have a very profound spiritual meaning that comes only when our

own consciousness is open to its real meaning, else it will simply mean

sleeping and reflecting on past thoughts. In this context, please allow me

to try to understand the teachings of the Parampara, which I again say is

subject to the limitations of our little intellect.

 

As regards Narasimha, let me recount an important incident which took

place in the Jyotish-List in 1996. When someone asked why the name of

Prabhupada was " Srila " , nobody could answer it. Not even all the ISKCON or

other followers of the Gaudiya Math. It was then that the brilliant

Narasimha spoke so well. He said " SRILA IS COMPOSED OF TWO PARTS " SRI " AND

" LA " . SRI REFERS TO THE LORD HIMSELF AND LA IS FROM LASYANTI OR THE GIVER OF

ENLIGHTENMENT OR KNOWLEDGE. THUS SRILA MEANS " HE WHO GIVES THE KNOWLEDGE OF

VISHNU/KRISHNA " AND HE WHO IS ALSO QUALIFIED TO DO SO. "

 

Even today I remember how I had called my colleagues in the food

Ministry and had discussed this profound statement made by such a young man.

I was full of admiration for him...the rest you all know. The remaining

parts of the discussions I shall try to answer:-

 

YOU WROTE: -

 

> You are giving only half of the context and ignoring

> the crucial part. Even after I and Sanjay suggested

> that Chanakya's Kutila neeti is not representative of

> Vedic thought (this relates to your sweeping comment

> on ladies), you kept quoting from Puranas about

> Chanakya. It was exactly under that paragraph that I

> mentioned the ambiguities in Puranas and different

> interpretations.

 

First of all Chanakya Pandit was a brahmin and brahmins exist only in Vedic

culture in the true sense of the meaning of the word brahmin. Brahmins are

also representatives of the Vedic culture and they are considered to be a

head of varna-ashrama Vedic society. Canakya Niti Shastra was also

applicable to the common man and previous acaryas like Srila Prabhuapada

were referring to it that context, and not only for kings or politicians

(I've already send relevant quotes by Srila Prabhupada from Bhagavad Gita

about that).

The point that you are trying to make is that I am ignoring crucial part of

our exchange and giving half of the context is misleading. Those who have

studies Vedas know that statement of Chanakya Pandit regarding women is true

and is applicable to common man not only politicians or kings.

I will refer to the message of Robert Koch from 22nd February 2000 to

Varahamihira list:

 

" Namaskara Sanjay and Dina-natha dasa,

 

Sri Krsna, in the Bhagavad-gita, underscores what Dina-natha has been

saying and quoting from Srila Prabhupada's Srimad Bhagavatam purports.

Bhagavan Sri Krsna, being transcendental to any gunas (material

qualities), is neither political, nor Vedic, but stands as the undisputed

authority on all subjects. This is because He is the source of the

Vedas, as well as the three qualities of nature, indeed the entire

creation itself. (Aham sarvasya prabhavah).

 

RATH: TRUE, BUT THE STATEMENT OF BHAGAVAN IN THE GITA IS QUALIFIED, AND SO

IS THE EXPLANATION OF SRILA. THUS, A SOUL WHO HAPPENS TO BE BORN IN A FEMALE

BODY CANNOT BE FAULTED FOR SUCH A BIRTH AS IT IS THE DECISION OF BHAGAVAN

WHICH IS AGAIN BASED ON THE PAST LIFE KARMA. SO LONG AS THE SOUL IS AWARE

THAT IT IS IN A BODY OF A FEMALE OR HAS FEMININE FUNCTION OF PROCREATION IT

FALLY IN THE CATEGORY OF STRI. WHEN THE SOUL RISES ABOVE THIS DESIRE AND

SHALL REALISE THAT IT IS THE MEDIUM OF RE-BIRTH THEN IT SHALL CEASE TO BE A

STRI.

THIS EXPLANATION GIVEN BY ME BASED ON MY LITTLE UNDERSTANDING HAS TWO

IMPLICATIONS:-

1) FOR MANY YEARS ISKCON PEOPLE HAVE BEEN TELLING ME THAT THEY ARE NOT BEING

ALLOWED TO ENTER THE JAGANNATH TEMPLE. WHY? BECAUSE THEY WERE BORN AS

MLECCHA. NOW THEY HAVE RISEN ABOVE THEIR PAST KARMA BY RECITING THE

MAHAMANTRA FOR A FEW YEARS AND SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO ENTER. THEY GIVE THE

EXAMPLE THAT SOME PEOPLE OF INDIA WHO ARE HINDU'S, ESPECIALLY BENGALI PEOPLE

WHO EAT FISH ARE BEING ALLOWED TO ENTER, AND HENCE THEY SHOULD ALSO BE

ALLOWED.

IF I AGREE WITH YOUR ARGUMENT THAT THERE IS NO HOPE FOR A STRI TO CHANGE

THE FACT OF HER BEING A STRI OR FOR A MAN OF A LOWER CASTE TO IMPROVE, THEN

YOU SHOULD QUIETLY ACCEPT THE FACT OF NOT BEING ALLOWED TO ENTER THE

JAGANNTH TEMPLE. AFTERALL, THESE PEOPLE WHO EAT FLESH HAVE FALLEN AND

THEREAFTER BY ENTERING THE JAGANNATH TEMPLE THEY INCUR FURTHER SIN FOR WHICH

THEY ARE PUNISHED. NOW YOU SEE THE PATHETIC STATE OF AFFAIRS OF ORISSA AND

THE RECENT STORM WARNING...

SO DINANATH PRABHU, KINDLY THINK. WHAT WAS SRILA TELLING? WHAT IS THE

REAL MEANING OF THE WORD STRI.

 

IN FACT I ALSO LOVE THESE DISCUSSIONS ON VEDANTA (I REALLY BELIEVE IN THE

GITA AND AM CONSTANTLY TRYING TO UNDERSTAND IT). I HAVE REQUESTED SRI

PATRAKA DAS TO START THE SPIRITUAL CLASSES FOR SJVC WHERE WE CAN HAVE ALL

THESE DISCUSSIONS. THIS IS NECESSARY FOR OUR OWN PERSONAL SPIRITUAL GROWTH

AND I AM LOOKING FORWARD TO YOUR CONTRIBUTIONS ON THAT LIST. ROBERT HAS

PROMISED TO START THIS AT THE EARLIEST. BY THE WAY, THIS DISCUSIION IS NOT

OVER AS WHAT I HAVE WRITTEN IS NOT A FINAL STATEMENT, BUT ONLY A SMALL PUSH

FOR EVERYBODY TO START THINKING. I SHALL RESERVE IT FOR THAT LIST, AND STILL

WONDER IF I WILL REALLY BE CORRECT FOR WHO ELSE BUT SRILA HIMSELF CAN

UNDERSTAND THE FULL IMPLICATIONS OF SIMPLE WORDS THAT HE USED.

 

In Chapter nine, verse 32 of the Gita, Krsna teaches Arjuna about the

unqualified and complete protection given to His devotees, regardless of

what classification of society they may come in:

 

Mam hi partha vyapasritya

Ye 'pi syuh papa-yonayah

Striyo vaisyas tatha sudras

Te 'pi yanti param gatim

 

" O son of Prtha, those who take shelter in Me, though they be of lower

birth -- women, merchants, and workers -- can attain the supreme

destination " .

 

The word " papa-yonayah " is significant here, as it means in

effect " those born of a lower family " . Now, if there were no distinction

in Krsna's mind between the status of man and woman, why would He include

women, as a class, in the same category as vaisyas

(mercantile class), or Sudras laborer class)?

In fact, " Papa " refers to those impious activities they may direct one to

a lower birth in future lifetimes. The point Krsna makes, however, is

that one may be of any classification in society, but if he/she is

surrendered to the Supreme Absolute, then there really are no

distinctions. Materially there are, but spiritually there are not.... "

 

Best Wishes,

Sanjay Rath

 

p.s. wHEN ARE YOU LANDING? i have told Shiv Pujan to receive you at the

Airport on the 28th. Please send a message to him about the timings.