Pluto and stuff - My final words

October 1, 1999

JAYA JAGANNATH

Dear Purushottama,

Do consider the following:

1. The DASA_AVATAR represented by the nineplanets and Lagna which has formed

the foundation of mathematics as the Decimal system. (Counting Zero to

Nine).

2. The Bhumandala ends at the outer circle of saturn and is limited by the

Lokaloka mountains with the imaginary Meru extending from the North pole to

the polestar. This is clearly explained in the Srimad Bhagavatam.

I am stating this because you are a Vaishnava.

Hare Krishna

Sanjay Rath

-

Pursottam Dabasia <pursottam_dabasia

<GJList

Friday, October 01, 1999 9:51 PM

Pluto and stuff - My final words

> Om Krishnaay Namah

>

> Dear All.

>

> This morning, when I checked my Email, I was quite

> Shocked. Forty mails, more or less all on this Pluto

> thing. I don't have the time to answer each and every

> single individual one, and this debate has also taken

> place before, and as I don't have time to waste

> arguing (although, fortunately what we've had has been

> more a discussion than an argument. Let's keep it that

> way), I am going to deal with all the various points

> from those mails in this single post. I am also gonna

> make this my last post on the subject, because:

>

> 1) I have a lot on my plate this weekend.

> 2) It's been nice as a discussion. Before it turns

> into an argument, we must end it. Invariably, when a

> subject which people feel differently on, lingers

> around, it always ends up being an argument, causing

> other's to feel distressed and leave and leaving Raghu

> wondering about who to and whether or not

> to stop the list for a while. So, this is my final

> mail on this topic.

>

October 3, 1999

- Sanjay Rath <srath

<GJList; Pursottam Dabasia <pursottam_dabasia

Cc: SJVC Astrology Class <varahamihira >

Saturday, October 02, 1999 12:04 AM

Re: Pluto and stuff - My final words

> JAYA JAGANNATH> Dear Purushottama,> Do consider the following:> 1. The DASA_AVATAR represented by the nineplanets and Lagna which has formed> the foundation of mathematics as the Decimal system. (Counting Zero to> Nine).> 2. The Bhumandala ends at the outer circle of saturn and is limited by the> Lokaloka mountains with the imaginary Meru extending from the North pole to> the polestar. This is clearly explained in the Srimad Bhagavatam.

Here is the 3D rendering of the computer model of Bhumandala. Size of the planets are magnified for the sake of visibility: At the back is visible Lokaloka mountain in the region of Golden land.

(Please note that all pictures used herein are copyrighted material and cannot be used for any other purpose than personal study and are not to be publicly used in any form or manner)

However Bhagavatam never mentions that Mount Meru is imaginary mountain, on contrary, describes it as an abode of Lord Brahma and is describing few other interesting things about Mount Sumeru which you'll find out if you read further:

esam madhye ilavrtam namabhyantara-varsam yasya nabhyam avasthitah sarvatah sauvarnah kula-giri-rajo merur dvipayama-samunnahah karnika-bhutah kuvalaya-kamalasya murdhani dva-trimsat sahasra-yojana-vitato mule sodasa-sahasram tavat antar-bhumyam pravistah.

SYNONYMSesam-all these divisions of Jambudvipa; madhye-among; ilavrtam nama-named Ilavrta-varsa; abhyantara-varsam-the inner division; yasya-of which; nabhyam-in the navel; avasthitah-situated; sarvatah-entirely; sauvarnah-made of gold; kula-giri-rajah-the most famous among famous mountains; meruh-Mount Meru; dvipa-ayama-samunnahah-whose height is the same measurement as the width of Jambudvipa; karnika-bhutah-existing as the pericarp; kuvalaya-of this planetary system; kamalasya-like a lotus flower; murdhani-on the top; dva-trimsat-thirty-two; sahasra-thousand; yojana-yojanas (eight miles each; vitatah-expanded; mule-at the base; sodasa-sahasram-sixteen thousand yojanas; tavat-so much; antah-bhumyam-within the earth; pravistah-entered.TRANSLATION Amidst these divisions, or varsas, is the varsa named Ilavrta, which is situated in the middle of the whorl of the lotus. Within Ilavrta-varsa is Sumeru Mountain, which is made of gold. Sumeru Mountain is like the pericarp of the lotuslike Bhu-mandala planetary system. The mountain's height is the same as the width of Jambudvipa, or, in other words, 100,000 yojanas [800,000 miles]. Of that, 16,000 yojanas [128,000 miles] are within the earth, and therefore the mountain's height above the earth is 84,000 yojanas [672,000 miles]. The mountain's width is 32,000 yojanas [256,000 miles] at its summit and 16,000 yojanas at its base. [srimad Bhagavatam 5.16.7]

mandaro merumandarah suparsvah kumuda ity ayuta-yojana-vistaronnaha meros catur-disam avastambha-giraya upaklptah.

SYNONYMSmandarah-the mountain named Mandara; meru-mandarah-the mountain named Merumandara; suparsvah-the mountain named Suparsva; kumudah-the mountain named Kumuda; iti-thus; ayuta-yojana-vistara-unnahah-which measure ten thousand yojanas high and wide; meroh-of Sumeru; catuh-disam-the four sides; avastambha-girayah-mountains that are like the belts of Sumeru; upaklptah-situated.TRANSLATIONOn the four sides of the great mountain known as Sumeru are four mountains-Mandara, Merumandara, Suparsva and Kumuda-which are like its belts. The length and height of these mountains are calculated to be 10,000 yojanas [80,000 miles]. [srimad Bhagavatam 5.16.11]

meror murdhani bhagavata atma-yoner madhyata upaklptam purim ayuta-yojana-sahasrim sama-caturasram satakaumbhim vadanti.

SYNONYMSmeroh-of Sumeru Mountain; murdhani-on the head; bhagavatah-of the most powerful being; atma-yoneh-of Lord Brahma; madhyatah-in the middle; upaklptam-situated; purim-the great township; ayuta-yojana-ten thousand yojanas; sahasrim-one thousand; sama-caturasram-of the same length on all sides; sata-kaumbhim-made entirely of gold; vadanti-the great learned sages say.TRANSLATIONIn the middle of the summit of Meru is the township of Lord Brahma. Each of its four sides is calculated to extend for ten million yojanas [eighty million miles]. It is made entirely of gold, and therefore learned scholars and sages call it Satakaumbhi. [srimad Bhagavatam 5.16.28]

Here are pictures of Bhumandala at different scales. Yellow pivot in the center of Bhumandala on the island (dvipa) called Jambudvipa situated in the region called Ilavrta is Mount Sumeru (Meru) which is made of gold. On the first part of the picture below on the horizon you can see Lokaloka mountain which prevents spreading of the sunlight beyond it's boundaries, because of that no sunlight reaches Neptune, Pluto and Uranus which are outside of the boundaries of Lokaloka mountain and therefore these planets have no significance in Jyotisha or Vedic Astrology.

(Please note that all pictures used herein are copyrighted material and cannot be used for any other purpose than personal study and are not to be publicly used in any form or manner)

tato 'neka-sahasra-koti-vimananika-sankula-deva-yanenavatar-antindu mandalam avarya brahma-sadane nipatati.

SYNONYMStatah-after purifying the seven planets of the seven great sages; aneka-many; sahasra-thousands; koti-of millions; vimana-anika-with contingents of airplanes; sankula-congested; deva-yanena-by the spaceways of the demigods; avataranti-descending; indu-mandalam-the moon planet; avarya-inundated; brahma-sadane-to the abode of Lord Brahma atop Sumeru-parvata; nipatati-falls down.TRANSLATIONAfter purifying the seven planets near Dhruvaloka [the polestar], the Ganges water is carried through the spaceways of the demigods in billions of celestial airplanes. Then it inundates the moon [Candraloka] and finally reaches Lord Brahma's abode atop Mount Meru.

[srimad Bhagavatam 5.17.4]

tatra caturdha bhidyamana caturbhir namabhis catur-disam abhispandanti nada-nadi-patim evabhinivisati sitalakananda caksur bhadreti.

SYNONYMStatra-there (on top of Mount Meru); caturdha-into four branches; bhidyamana-being divided; caturbhih-with four; namabhih-names; catuh-disam-the four directions (east, west, north and south); abhispandanti-profusely flowing; nada-nadi-patim-the reservoir of all great rivers (the ocean); eva-certainly; abhinivisati-enters; sita-alakananda-Sita and Alakananda; caksuh-Caksu; bhadra-Bhadra; iti-known by these names.TRANSLATIONOn top of Mount Meru, the Ganges divides into four branches, each of which gushes in a different direction [east, west, north and south]. These branches, known by the names Sita, Alakananda, Caksu and Bhadra, flow down to the ocean. [srimad Bhagavatam 5.17.5]

3D rendering of Jambudvipa is below on the left with Mount Sumeru in the middle. On the right is top view on Jampudvipa, also showing four branches of the Ganga known as Sita, Alakananda, Caksu and Bhadra flowing into the ocean of salt water (represented with the blue colour).

(Please note that all pictures used herein are copyrighted material and cannot be used for any other purpose than personal study and are not to be publicly used in any form or manner)

tad-dvipa-madhye manasottara-namaika evarvacina-paracina-varsayor maryadacalo 'yuta-yojanocchrayayamo yatra tu catasrsu diksu catvari purani loka-palanam indradinam yad-uparistat surya-rathasya merum paribhramatah samvatsaratmakam cakram devanam aho-ratrabhyam paribhramati.

SYNONYMStat-dvipa-madhye-within that island; manasottara-Manasottara; nama-named; ekah-one; eva-indeed; arvacina-on this side; paracina-and beyond, or outside; varsayoh-of tracts of land; maryada-indicating the boundary; acalah-a great mountain; ayuta-ten thousand; yojana-eight miles; ucchraya-ayamah-whose height and width; yatra-where; tu-but; catasrsu-in the four; diksu-directions; catvari-four; purani-cities; loka-palanam-of the directors of planetary systems; indra-adinam-headed by Indra; yat-of which; uparistat-on the top; surya-rathasya-of the chariot of the sun-god; merum-Meru Mountain; paribhramatah-while circumambulating; samvatsara-atmakam-consisting of one samvatsara; cakram-wheel or orbit; devanam-of the demigods; ahah-ratrabhyam-by the day and night; paribhramati-moves around.TRANSLATIONIn the middle of that island is a great mountain named Manasottara, which forms the boundary between the inner side and the outer side of the island. Its breadth and height are 10,000 yojanas [80,000 miles]. On that mountain, in the four directions, are the residential quarters of demigods such as Indra. In the chariot of the sun-god, the sun travels on the top of the mountain in an orbit called the Samvatsara, encircling Mount Meru. The sun's path on the northern side is called Uttarayana, and its path on the southern side is called Daksinayana. One side represents a day for the demigods, and the other represents their night. [srimad Bhagavatam 5.20.30]

Below is the Sun's metaphorical chariot, made of parts of the year. Here we see this chariot in action. However, here the Sun’s chariot is not to scale. One end of Sun's chariot is fixed on the central axis of the Mount Sumeru while the wheel of the Sun's chariot is orbiting Mount Sumeru following path called Samvatsara which is situated on the top of the Manasottara mountain located in the center the island called Puskaradvipa, which is situated between oceans of yoghurt and sweet water in the plane of Bhumandala.

(Please note that all pictures used herein are copyrighted material and cannot be used for any other purpose than personal study and are not to be publicly used in any form or manner)

yavan manasottara-mervor antaram tavati bhumih kancany anyadarsa-talopama yasyam prahitah padartho na kathancit punah pratyupalabhyate tasmat sarva-sattva-parihrtasit.

SYNONYMSyavat-as much as; manasottara-mervoh antaram-the land between Manasottara and Meru (beginning from the middle of Mount Sumeru); tavati-that much; bhumih-land; kancani-made of gold; anya-another; adarsa-tala-upama-whose surface is just like the surface of a mirror; yasyam-on which; prahitah-dropped; padarthah-a thing; na-not; kathancit-in any way; punah-again; pratyupalabhyate-is found; tasmat-therefore; sarva-sattva-by all living entities; parihrta-abandoned; asit-was.TRANSLATIONBeyond the ocean of sweet water is a tract of land as broad as the area between the middle of Mount Sumeru and the boundary of Manasottara Mountain. In that tract of land there are many living beings. Beyond it, extending to Lokaloka Mountain, is another land, which is made of gold. Because of its golden surface, it reflects light like the surface of a mirror, and any physical article that falls on that land can never be perceived again. All living entities, therefore, have abandoned that golden land. [srimad Bhagavatam 5.20.35]

sa loka-trayante parita isvarena vihito yasmat suryadinam dhruvapavarganam jyotir-gananam gabhastayo 'rvacinams triu lokan avitanvana na kadacit paracina bhavitum utsahante tavad un-nahanayamah.

SYNONYMSsah-that mountain; loka-traya-ante-at the end of the three lokas (Bhurloka, Bhuvarloka and Svarloka); paritah-all around; isvarena-by the Supreme personality of Godhead, Krsna; vihitah-created; yasmat-from which; surya-adinam-of the sun planet; dhruva-apavarganam-up to Dhruvaloka and other, inferior luminaries; jyotih-gananam-of all the luminaries; gabhastayah-the rays; arvacinan-on this side; trin-the three; lokan-planetary systems; avitanvanah-spreading throughout; na-not; kadacit-at any time; paracinah-beyond the jurisdiction of that mountain; bhavitum-to be; utsahante-are able; tavat-that much; unnahana-ayamah-the measure of the height of the mountain.TRANSLATIONBy the supreme will of Krishna, the mountain known as Lokaloka has been installed as the outer border of the three worlds-Bhurloka, Bhuvarloka and Svarloka-to control the rays of the sun throughout the universe. All the luminaries, from the sun up to Dhruvaloka, distribute their rays throughout the three worlds, but only within the boundary formed by this mountain. Because it is extremely high, extending even higher than Dhruvaloka, it blocks the rays of the luminaries, which therefore can never extend beyond it. [srimad Bhagavatam 5.20.37]

t

ad-uparistac catasrsv asasvatma-yoninakhila-jagad-gurunadhinivesita ye dvirada-pataya rsabhah puskaracudo vamano 'parajita iti sakala-loka-sthiti-hetavah.

SYNONYMStat-uparistat-on the top of Lokaloka Mountain; catasrsu asasu-in the four directions; atma-yonina-by Lord Brahma; akhila-jagat-guruna-the spiritual master of the whole universe; adhinivesitah-established; ye-all those; dvirada-patayah-the best of elephants; rsabhah-Rsabha; puskara-cudah-Puskaracuda; vamanah-Vamana; aparajitah-Aparajita; iti-thus; sakala-loka-sthiti-hetavah-the causes of the maintenance of the different planets within the universe.TRANSLATIONOn the top of Lokaloka Mountain are the four gaja-patis, the best of elephants, which were established in the four directions by Lord Brahma, the supreme spiritual master of the entire universe. The names of those elephants are Rsabha, Puskaracuda, Vamana and Aparajita. They are responsible for maintaining the planetary systems of the universe. [srimad Bhagavatam 5.20.39]

tatratyanam divasa-madhyangata eva sadadityas tapati savyenacalam daksinena karoti. yatrodeti tasya ha samana-sutra-nipate nimlocati yatra kvacana syandenabhitapati tasya haisa samana-sutra-nipate prasvapayati tatra gatam na pasyanti ye tam samanupasyeran.

SYNONYMStatratyanam-for the living entities residing on Mount Meru; divasa-madhyangatah-being positioned as at midday; eva-indeed; sada-always; adityah-the sun; tapati-heats; savyena-to the left side; acalam-Sumeru Mountain; daksinena-to the right (being forced by wind blowing to the right, the sun moves to the right); karoti-moves; yatra-the point where; udeti-it rises; tasya-of that position; ha-certainly; samana-sutra-nipate-at the diametrically opposite point; nimlocati-the sun sets; yatra-where; kvacana-somewhere; syandena-with perspiration; abhitapati-heats (at midday); tasya-of that; ha-certainly; esah-this (the sun); samana-sutra-nipate-at the diametrically opposite point; prasvapayati-the sun causes to sleep (as at midnight); tatra-there; gatam-gone; na pasyanti-do not see; ye-who; tam-the sunset; samanupasyeran-seeing.TRANSLATIONThe living entities residing on Sumeru Mountain are always very warm, as at midday, because for them the sun is always overhead. Although the sun moves counterclockwise, facing the constellations, with Sumeru Mountain on its left, it also moves clockwise and appears to have the mountain on its right because it is influenced by the daksinavarta wind. People living in countries at points diametrically opposite to where the sun is first seen rising will see the sun setting, and if a straight line were drawn from a point where the sun is at midday, the people in countries at the opposite end of the line would be experiencing midnight. Similarly, if people residing where the sun is setting were to go to countries diametrically opposite, they would not see the sun in the same condition. [srimad Bhagavatam 5.21.8-9]

Hare are few more slokas mentioned in Srimad Bhagavatam and Bhagavad Gita in connection with Mount Meru:

sukumara-vanam meroradhastat pravivesa hayatraste bhagavan charvoramamanah sahomaya

SYNONYMSsukumara-vanam-the forest known as Sukumara; meroh adhastat-at the foot of Mount Meru; pravivesa ha-he entered; yatra-wherein; aste-was; bhagavan-the most powerful (demigod); sarvah-Lord Siva; ramamanah-engaged in enjoyment; saha umaya-with Uma, his wife.TRANSLATIONThere in the north, at the bottom of Mount Meru, is a forest known as Sukumara where Lord Siva always enjoys with Uma. Sudyumna entered that forest. [srimad Bhagavatam 9.1.25]

tenasta-lokapa-vihara-kulacalendra-dronisv ananga-sakha-maruta-saubhagasusiddhair nuto dyudhuni-pata-siva-svanasureme ciram dhanadaval-lalana-varuthi

SYNONYMStena-by that airplane; asta-loka-pa-of the predominating deities of the eight heavenly planets; vihara-the pleasure grounds; kula-acala-indra-of the king of the mountains (Meru); dronisu-in the valleys; ananga-of passion; sakha-the companions; maruta-with breezes; saubhagasu-beautiful; siddhaih-by the Siddhas; nutah-being praised; dyu-dhuni-of the Ganges; pata-of the downfall; siva-svanasu-vibrating with auspicious sounds; reme-he enjoyed; ciram-for a long time; dhanada-vat-like Kuvera; lalana-by damsels; varuthi-surrounded.TRANSLATIONIn that aerial mansion he traveled to the pleasure valleys of Mount Meru, which were rendered all the more beautiful by cool, gentle, fragrant breezes that stimulated passion. In these valleys, the treasurer of the gods, Kuvera, surrounded by beautiful women and praised by the Siddhas, generally enjoys pleasure. Kardama Muni also, surrounded by the beautiful damsels and his wife, went there and enjoyed for many, many years. [srimad Bhagavatam. 3.29.39]

vaisrambhake surasanenandane puspabhadrakemanase caitrarathye casa reme ramaya ratah

SYNONYMSvaisrambhake-in the Vaisrambhaka garden; surasane-in Surasana; nandane-in Nandana; puspabhadrake-in Puspabhadraka; manase-by the Manasa-sarovara Lake; caitrarathye-in Caitrarathya; ca-and; sah-he; reme-enjoyed; ramaya-by his wife; ratah-satisfied.TRANSLATIONSatisfied by his wife, he enjoyed in that aerial mansion not only on Mount Meru but in different gardens known as Vaisrambhaka, Surasana, Nandana, Puspabhadraka and Caitrarathya, and by the Manasa-sarovara Lake. [srimad Bhagavatam. 3.29.40]

suparna-skandham arudhomeru-srngam ivambudahpita-vasa mani-grivahkurvan vitimira disah

SYNONYMSsuparna-of Garuda, the carrier of Lord Visnu; skandham-the shoulder; arudhah-sitting on; meru-of the mountain named Meru; srngam-on the summit; iva-like; ambudah-a cloud; pita-vasah-wearing yellow garments; mani-grivah-His neck decorated with the Kaustubha jewel; kurvan-making; vitimirah-free from darkness; disah-all directions.TRANSLATIONThe Personality of Godhead, appearing on the shoulder of Garuda, seemed like a cloud resting on the summit of the mountain known as Meru. The transcendental body of the Personality of Godhead was covered by attractive yellow garments, and His neck was decorated with the jewel known as Kaustubha-mani. The bodily effulgence of the Lord dissipated all the darkness of the universe. [srimad Bhagavatam. 4.30.5]

rudranam sankaras casmivitteso yaksa-raksasamvasunam pavakas casmimeruh sikharinam aham

SYNONYMS

rudranam-of all the Rudras; sankarah-Lord Siva; ca-also; asmi-I am; vitta-isah-the lord of the treasury of the demigods; yaksa-raksasam-of the Yaksas and Raksasas; vasunam-of the Vasus; pavakah-fire; ca-also; asmi-I am; meruh-Meru; sikharinam-of all mountains; aham-I am.TRANSLATION

Of all the Rudras I am Lord Siva, of the Yaksas and Raksasas I am the Lord of wealth [Kuvera], of the Vasus I am fire [Agni], and of mountains I am Meru. [bhagavad Gita 10.23]

I hope that this was helpful,

Dina-natha Das.