2-MARK & All re....time for realization & --Moksha? & free will & predicting? Mark Kincaid, 4/23

[Guest guest]

Jai Jinendra Mark,Sameer and All,

 

what your norms are more signifying,more balances in

materialism than in spiritualism.Everyone of us has

vindictive attitude.As to get even moksha we require

Body for that,that is very true and everyone knows it

and believes it.

 

What I understand by free will,Karma and fate is...

 

1)Planets shows our Karmas and our physical existense

and prolictive mind towards achievement of that.

 

2)Free will is first to control our emotions

,anger,lust,never getting satisfied,love,money etc

etc.so everyone has a free will to control such a

thing ,if he really wants,or atleast he can start on

this.so more and more he does control on these things

in Life and treat them like a enemy and than you will

definately see a sudden change in your ohysical

existense in this world.Tapasvi people do what,control

there body for food,cloth,maya,lobh etc etc.In order

to get Moksha or Unknown.

 

3)relating above with astrology.As I said planets

denotes our existencs and we are bounded with time.So

they want us to be more mor prone to

materialistic.even doing or dharma is also

materialism,No one wants grief or pain in one's

Life.Those people who has taken grief a,pain in Life

with smile on a face and accpted at heart and not

mind,are know we know they are Mahatmas and what they

are and what they have to go through.

 

4)So I have accepted fact that to nullify our

Karmas,is to go against time,may be Mark what you are

saying is right about changing a nature or maleficness

of palnets.Still even an exalted Guru if gives you car

or Horses or planes,but never Moksha ro even Ketu.Ti

is something which is above all these things and

acting against one's Karma,it is like treating you

Karmas as enmy and going against them,for which we get

in return lots of grief,pain,because there cause is us

only as w are accumulating it all our lives and we

need to nullify it know and end everyone konow is

" Moksha " .

 

So spiritualism,Moksha is above planets or devatas.Tt

is against them as they too are striving for it and in

attaining that path got lost somewhere and again

bounded with a job or arth or karmas,Time and every

existence of ourselves.

 

Karaktawa may change,a king of Devata(Indra) may

change.....

 

--- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid wrote:

 

> Dear Shripal & All:

> Jai Jinendra,

> >

> > I don't think from one's chart anyone can

> determine

> > that individual is going to go Moksha.Because it

> is

> > more for a free will rather than boundage effect

> of

> > planets.

> Shripal

>

>

> Shripal & All:

>

>

> I'd just like to add one thing to what you were

> saying, here.

>

> I don't know why the topic of Moksha, should be

> different then any other

> aspect of one's chart.

> I mean liberation, it's there, in the 5th, 9th and

> especially 12th houses.

>

> So, predictions of 'their' nature should be

> possible.

>

> Moksha, even though it's a transcendental thing,

> beyond the relative and

> therefore beyond the stars, does get pointed to

> especially by the 12th

> house.

>

> The 12th house they call the house of loss, or

> expenditures, should be more

> accurately called the house of transcendental God!

>

> I know people who have just the lord of the 12th,

> there in the 12th, and

> they have no physical losses to speak of, in fact

> they even know how to

> save!

>

> And, their inward side of life is sooo well

> developed.

>

>

> I do find, however, (Shripal) that prediction is

> tricky when you know more

> and more about freedom and free will.

>

> It seems the more 'bound' people are, and the less

> Jupiter things they do,

> the easier it is for the ancient Vedic Jyotishees to

> make predictions.

>

> I heard one time when I was in India that the

> Jyotishees were very confused

> about this.

>

> They went up to the Guru of Transcendental

> Mediation, Maharishi Mahesh Yogi,

> and said to him:

>

> 'Maharishiee, we're confused your meditators are not

> following their

> charts! " And Maharishi said: " What do you mean? "

>

> " Well, in the past when we did people's charts,

> whether they were 10, 30 or

> 60 we could literally predict everything. We'd know

> what they would take in

> school, what careers they'd get in to and even when

> they'd marry, have

> children and how many! But, your meditators they're

> not following their

> charts. We make predictions and they don't turn out

> to be true! "

>

> Maharishi laughed and said, " This is because they've

> learned how to change

> their stars! "

>

> I've thought about this story for many years now.

> It was part of the

> inspiration that I got into Jyotish with. Over the

> years, (that was 1988),

> now, I've noticed that those who progress the most

> in their Vedic or Jyotish

> remedies, including meditation, ayurved, yoga, etc.

> these people seem to be

> less bound by their karmas.

>

> Now, I think of the debts of our Karmas, like bills.

> Maybe we have a 100$

> bill coming. But we still have freedom of will to

> change our bank account.

> So, instead of that bill hitting are account with

> only 200$ in the bank, we

> put more attention on making and saving money and

> voila! we've got 2000$ in

> the bank. Then that same, predicatable 'bill' hits

> our account, and we

> hardly notice!

>

> This in fact, is exactly what's happened to me.

>

> Having the Moon & Saturn both in my 12th house, very

> early on in my life, I

> didn't care about savings. In fact I thought it was

> better, a sign of more

> evolution, hehehe, to not worry about money. But,

> after 2 marriages and two

> divorces and 2 bankruptacies, I thought, mmmmm

> maybe there's a lesson here

> in my chart that I'm missing.

>

> I then decided to study the economics of money. I

> discovered these rules

> that they have for gaining wealth in the World.

>

> First one was that you should create an emergency

> fun of no less then

> 6-months of your expenses! I first read this and I

> was shocked! I never

> had 6 weeks, maybe a week or two, so I thought,

> instead of treating money

> less like a sannyasi person, maybe I should treat it

> differently.

>

> The first year, it took me many months to save up

> even 1,000$. It was like

> I was battling this huge flow of water, swimming up

> stream.

>

> But I'll never forget the day when I got that first

> 1,000$ saved. I felt

> liberated! I felt so happy, and secure. For months

> afterward, no matter

> what bills came up, I just paid them, and then

> focused on bringing that

> money up to the 1,000$ amount. I was in bliss.

>

> Later I realized I had discovered the Saturn

> 'balance' of money.

>

> Now, I understand that money saved, is to the World,

> what rest and silence,

> accumulated, is to the body.

>

> When we're well rested and fresh, no matter what

> comes our way, nothing

> fazes us.

>

> We have an expression for this, oh yes, " It rolls

> off our backs " !

>

> Now, I know that saving money is 'liberating' to the

> debts of the relative,

> and saving silence,

> is restful to the relative's stresses,....

>

> both of these have allowed me to glimpse, 'moksha'

> as a result.

>

> What a shock where the impulse of renunciation was

> dominant before now I've

> discovered how to find 'liberation' through the

> flows of the World!

>

>

> Sincerely,

>

>

>

> Mark Kincaid

>

>

> ps...you also said:

>

> > Planets shows karma and nullifying Karmas means

> going

> > against them and it is more of strong free will

> than

> > anything else.

>

> And I thought you might like to hear what I've heard

> said about this from a

> Vedic scholar.

>

> " Yaguas are those performances, that take an action,

> and a karma, and create

> a situation,

> where the goal of all performances, al actions,

> finds it's fulfillment in

> the transcendental realm.

>

> Any action that leads to transcendence is a yagua

> and is therefore not

> binding as karma normally can be, but instead leads

> to liberation. "

>

>

> I love this expression....

>

> take care!

>

>

>

>

>

> > Shripal <d_shripal

> > Sat, 23 Apr 2005 04:10:12 -0700 (PDT)

> > vedic astrology

> > Re:8th lord from Saturn -> Partha garu

> :-)) realised--Moksha

> >

> >

> > Jai Jinendra,

> >

> > I don't think from one's chart anyone can

> determine

> > that individual is going to go Moksha.Because it

> is

> > more for a free will rather than boundage effect

> of

> > planets.It is against them and not with help of

> them.

> >

> > Planets shows karma and nullifying Karmas means

> going

> > against them and it is more of strong free will

> than

> > anything else.

> >

> > --- Partha Sarathy <partvinu wrote:

> >

> >> Dear Utpal

> >> I just realised what about those poor fellows who

> >> have Saturn in gemini and

> >> Cancer!!

> >> best wishes

> >> partha

> >>

> >>

> >> On 4/23/05, Partha Sarathy <partvinu

> >> wrote:

> >>>

> >>> Dear Utpal

> >>> No, i am not aware of such a dictum. I have not

> >> read in classics also.

> >>> Best of luck for such people who have this,

> >> atleast this will make them

> >>> feel happy :-))))

> >>> Do you seriously think that Moksha is a laddu to

> >> be eaten or some prize to

> >>> be won, or the end of all??

> >>> I am deviating, sorry.

> >>> best wishes

> >>> partha

> >>>

> >>>

> >>> On 4/23/05, utpal pathak

> <vedic_pathak

> >> wrote:

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>>

> >>>> Dear Partha Garu & all others,

> >>>>

> >>>> I just now came to know an intresting 'Sutra'

> >> from an Reputed Jyotish

> >>>> magazine.

> >>>>

> >>>> Sutra --> If the 8th house from Saturn is

> >> Occupied by it's Own lord,

> >>>> there is NO Rebirth and Final Salvation is

> >> shown.

> >>>>

> >>>> are you aware of such dictum?

> >>>>

> >>>> Pathak

> >>>>

> >>>>