2-Annick & All, re....How to judge....according to Ved and Jyotish.... Mark Kincaid

[Guest guest]

Dear Annick & All:

 

I would partly agree. We're trying to 'judge' or understand and values, 'things' so that we learn to be better human beings.

 

What we see are our actions....

 

But, we also value and are trying to understand what are 'right' thoughts....

 

Ved teaches us that what is 'right' ....is 'that' which leads to more and better evolution...

 

Jyotish teaches 'this' in many and fascinating ways....

 

This Planet is 'good' because it's.....something called 'benefic'....and this planet is not so good, because it's 'maleific'.....

 

What these depictions are really about, are trying to show us, what is right and wrong, in life.

 

Not that 'we' are wrong,.... but our actions,....or states of being, and Physiology....

 

The Sun in Libra, which is the closest to what's not 'right' about ourselves.... is described as being maleific, because....

 

it's often symbolic of some'one' who feels, insecure, or inadequate, with lack of self-worth, esteem, or self-confidence.

 

The Sun exalted, however, is thought to be the most 'powerful', 'benefic',....'good',.... or right,..

because it's closest to the true full potential value of the Self, within....

 

But, we should be very careful, because no, one, Astrological configuration is enough.

 

Look at Hitler, and Saddam Hussein's charts, both of which had Sun exalted, in Aries....!

 

They felt tremendous self-worth, but they were very jaded because they felt they were superior to others....

 

So a good Jupiter and Saturn are also very important,....because these give appreciation of the greater, and greater, 'I', or self,....or God...within,....which keeps us humble, even,...in our great nature,....of being a child of God, filled with all kinds of positive values of self-worth!

 

Sincerely,

 

 

Mark Kincaid

 

 

 

 

" AnnB " <annick.bidreman

 

Mon, 24 Jan 2005 18:17:52 +0100 (Paris, Madrid)

 

The Astrology of Roe v. Wade: Three Decades Later

 

 

 

 

 

>But to judge a persons actions is to judge the person themselves.

 

No, Debbie, no !

 

>A persons actions are what contributes to making them the unique individual they are, especially if we accept that >the natal chart may provide a predisposition to act or be in some way.

 

We are unique not because of our charts, but because of the Self in us. We must take a great care of That, in us, and in everybody, and... in babies to be born !!!

 

Each Self has an infinite worth.

 

>By judging a person by their actions is imposing our own often culturally driven values on them, in a different time, >place or culture, those values may be/have been different.

 

Life is life, in Europe, in the East, in Peru or... where you want ; life is and we must respect it. How difficult has it been for two human cells to meet and create a child ? It is merely wonderful !

 

>Ah, " Truth " ... that old chestnut ... realism versus relativism eh? Or, is there one ultimate, universal " truth " out >there that governs us all, and if so who decides it or is the " Truth " relative to us as individuals ... and taking that to >a more esoteric leaning providing us all with the propensity for free will within which we can all create or resolve >karma?

 

I will stop this thread here, as to me ; " Truth " is that babies to be born are very, very, very weak and cannot at all defend themselves ; they are treasures... this is real.

 

Ann

 

 

 

 

 

 

>Is not being non-judgemental towards people and non-judgemental about their actions not the same thing though?

 

It is not the same at all. One may disapprove a tendency, a crime, and may also be full of compassion for the feeble person who has committed it...

 

May we be compassionate about ourselves in order to be the same with others ; but it is of an absolute necessity to know, see, and tell the truth. In any case we must never leave babies been killed in their mother's womb :-(((

 

Ann

 

 

 

In this Kali Yuga, all the true values are reversed :-((

 

>As astrologers should we be non-judgemental ?

 

We can be non-judgemental as to people, but not as to actions ! Each abortion is a murder !!!

 

What can we think about people killing their own babies in their womb ??? Such atrocities... These childs are only victims. And aborting women bring karma on themselves whatever they are " judged " or not.

 

With such views, where can this world go, but to hell ??? Is it a law of the Nature to kill infants ?

 

Ann

 

 

 

A fascinating piece.

 

I am involved in conducting funeral services as an Independent Funeral Officiant. I work very closely with the deceased's family and time and time again hear stories that have convinced me of the soul's " free will " to chose when to leave the physical body.

 

I have no strong opinions either pro-life or pro-abortion. Could it be though that abortion is just one of the many " mechanics " of the universe that support the soul in exercising its free will? From a karmic point of view, does such a situation not offer valuable growth and learning for all who are part of the process? As astrologers should we be non-judgemental?

 

Just musing

 

Debbie

 

----

 

 

01/24/05 08:25:24

 

The Astrology of Roe v. Wade: Three Decades Later

 

 

The Astrology of Roe v. Wade: Three Decades Later

 

2:14 AM 1/23/05 Sun

 

This weekend marks the 32nd anniversary of the landmark Roe v. Wade

Supreme Court ruling, which grants medically safe abortions to any

woman who wants them, nationwide. It was and is, the sine qa

non " wedge issue " of our time, and generates opinions and feelings

accross the spectrum. In the main, the issue has divided the country

into two distinct camps: the " Pro-Choice " movement, made up

primarily of women's advocacy groups such as NOW and others, who

posits that abortion - the ability to choose it as an option - is a

fundament of women's rights. On the other side, is the " Pro-Life "

movement, made up of mainly rightwing politicians and religious

groups, who takes the position that not only is abortion morally

wrong, but it also negates the human rights of the unborn. Both

sides have been locked in what can only be described as a mortal

battle for the hearts, minds and votes of the American public - and

with President George W. Bush firmly in place for a 2nd term, with

Supreme Court appointments being a certainty during his " 2nd watch "

and with a GOP majority in both Houses of Congress, it seems all but

assured that Roe V. Wade, as we know it, is likely to change.

 

And indeed it has - in just over the past 4 years (the span of

Bush's first term) the GOP have made inroads in this direction,

bringing much attention and focus on the so-called " partial-birth

abortion " (actually very late term abortion procedures, still

something that is hotly debated at various levels in the political,

religious and medical communities), and, last year, passed the " Laci

and Connor Law " , so named after Laci Peterson and her unborn son

Connor, for which Scott Peterson was accused and convicted of

murdering. The law would now bring added punitive penalties to

anyone who killed a pregnant woman - in essence, the ! ! ! assa il an t would

be charged with double murder. This move was and is seen by those on

the pro-choice side as an attempt to whittle away at the core

premise of the Roe v. Wade decision, doing an end-run around the

Supreme Court. With so much at stake for all concerned, it is most

interesting indeed to see what Astrology - and perhaps at least as

importantly - what Astrologers - have to say about this most

pressing issue.

 

OK, Full Disclosure - my personal position is that I am what would

be considered, for the most part, " pro-life " - I feel that Life

begins at conception, the joining of sperm and egg, and that this is

truly a Sign of the Divine at work. Therefore, while I am a strong

advocate of birth control, I do not regard abortion as such nor do I

condone or endorse it. That being said, I do recognize times when

abortion is understandable, such as in the cases of rape, incest

and/or situations where the mother and/or baby's life is in grave

danger as a result of a medical condition. Most Americans " in the

middle " would tend to agree with my stance, according to the many

opinion polls conducted in recent months and years. Still, those on

the fringes of the debate - who are far and away more influential

than their more moderate countrymen/women - continue to define the

issue in the most narrow of terms (the pro-choice side demanding

that a woman has a right to an abortion under any circumstance she

chooses, while the pro-life side demands that a woman must go

through with her pregnancy regardless of the circumstances). Such

shrill voices cloud an already murky topic.

 

Astrology's premise rests on the notion that something - or in this

case, someone - is born with the qualities inherent in that moment,

and we capture this moment in terms of the current positions of the

planets at the location where the birth takes place. For us,

conception or gestation is not the focus of our work - ! it ! is ! whe n

the person is born, that concerns us most. But that's only one part

of the story, at least as far as the Human element of Astrology

goes. Because, while the mechanics of Astrology operates in terms of

the born, we astrologers are often called upon to deal with the

unborn as well. Think about it - if you're a working astrologer, you

know you have been consulted in these matters more than once in your

career - and if you're an aspiring astrologer, you can be certain

that you deal with such cases in the times to come. So it's

important to know what your approach and rationale will be in such

instances.

 

In our post-Rudhyarian, New Ager times, many among us seem to feel

that it is not our place as astrologers to judge, moralize or

otherwise " tell " the client what to do; many of the more " helping

profession " enhanced in our ranks are of the view that to do any of

this is to lose objectivity, to bring personal judgements, morally

and otherwise, into the equation, potentially demoralizing the

client. It is my position, that not only is such a stance dishonest

with respect to Astrology's premise, history and position, but that

it is also cowardly not to take a position, one side or the other,

opting out instead for a metaphysical rela