Guest guest Posted June 1, 2004 Report Share Posted June 1, 2004 Hi Ann, It was you wasn't it who was so interested in the disc found in Germany? I found an article and here it is below, enjoy, Morgana From Tara Astrology, under articles: On Thursday 29th January 2004 at 21.00 GMT BBC2 televised a programme called Secrets of The Star Disc on its Horizon series. It revealed that civilization had reached Europe earlier than previously thought, centuries before Egypt or Greece. This was truly astonishing! It all began in 1999 in a forest near Nebra in East Germany when grave robbers using metal detectors and picks dug up a treasure containing among other things, a circular disc showing the Sun and Moon and a number of stars. Little did they know that this disc would change how we think about one of the most important periods in all human history, the Bronze Age. They spirited the disc away and tried to sell it on the black market for a quarter of a million pounds. In May 2001 Dr Harald Meller was appointed Head Archaeologist at the Museum of Halle in Eastern Germany. One day a colleague showed him some photographs that would change his life. The robbers had taken the photos, which showed jewels, tools and swords. But it was the photo of the bronze disc that caused the greatest interest. Dr Meller decided that he would find this disc and somehow do all he could to place it in its rightful home in the Halle Museum. After a year he finally contacted the thieves and offered to buy the Nebra disc. A meeting was set up at the Hilton hotel in Basel Switzerland. Unknown to the thieves Dr Meller had already contacted the Swiss police. He was met by a blond woman at the hotel and then introduced to an older man in the restaurant. The police had them under surveillance. After some time the disc was produced and at the appropriate moment Chief Inspector Peter Gill and his men swooped and arrested the older man and blond woman. The Nebra disc was now safe at last. Authenticating the Nebra Disc The first to scrutinise the disc was Dr Heinrich Wunderlich, the Chief Scientist at the museum. He examined it for corrosion. Corrosion happens when metal comes into contact with oxygen from the air. Although there was a green layer of corrosion on the disc it did not mean it was authentic, corrosion can always be faked! To be certain, he examined the crystals, which appeared like bubbles. These bubbles were much larger than usual and proved that they could not be faked. They were real since only time could have produced them and as Dr Wunderlich said, “You can’t fake time”. The Moon and the Sun were clearly visible, as were a number of dots that may have been stars. Prof Wolfhard Schlosser of the University of Bochum examined them and noted a group of seven stars placed between the Sun and Moon. He concluded that these were the Pleiades. He then examined the oldest images of the Pleiades he could find, tablets and scrolls from the east. Eventually he saw an image just like that on the disc, the Pleiades drawn with seven stars. Such an image would certainly be expected in Egypt or Mesopotamia but not in Central Europe! A further test was needed, but since the disc was made of metal, carbon dating was out of the question. They then turned to another method called associative dating. The disc had been found along with two swords in the same hole at the same soil level. The age of the disc and the swords could be fixed. All they had to do was compare them with similar objects that had already been successfully carbon dated. It turned out that the disc and swords dated to 1600 BC. The Nebra sky disc was “the oldest accurate picture of the night sky in all history”. Underneath the images of the Sun and Moon appears a gold curved symbol. According to Dr Flemming Kaul of the National Museum of Denmark this was a ship. Similar images were carved on rocks all over Northern Europe; they were religious images. Dr Kaul believed this was the Sun ship. The Sun ship was believed to have originated in Ancient Egypt. This brought up the possibility that the Nebra disc was not European at all but had come from Egypt. It may have been carried from there into central Europe. This was a disturbing possibility, yet all was not lost, further tests could still be carried out. The arc shaped band behind the Moon and to the right of the disc covers an area of 82 degrees and represents the distance between the rising Sun at the winter solstice and the rising Sun at the summer solstice. These 82 degrees can only be measured at Nebra in present day Germany and not Egypt or Greece, which are further south, producing an approximate arc of 70 degrees. Further north this arc would measure 90 degrees. The disc’s metal was proven to have been mined in the area around Nebra by Prof Ernst Pernicka of the University of Tubingen. He showed that the metal could only have come from a local mine. It had not originated and been transported from either Egypt or Greece. It belonged to Nebra, the 82 degrees and the metal proved so. Now they had to find out what the disc meant. An expert on Bronze Age religions, Prof Miranda Aldhouse Green of the University of Wales, was consulted. She observed that, “the Sun is absolutely central to northern European Bronze Age religion. There’s a clear connection between the Sun and life. If the Sun disappears then life comes to an end”. She also stated that the Moon symbolised time and if you can control and understand time then you are a powerful person. The Sun, Moon, the solstices, a Sun ship and the Pleiades are all religious symbols, and putting them all together for the first time three thousand five hundred years ago was truly amazing. She concluded, “We’re dealing with people who had tremendous ability, not only a technological skill, but also immense intellectual ability. They were able to conceive of their world, they were able to represent it. There is tremendous imagination here, and there is an ability to encode information and beliefs and pass them down from generation to generation”. For full transcript of the programme: http://www.bbc.co.uk/print/science/horizon/2004/stardisctrans.shtml For further details: http://www3.sympatico.ca/hpohland/docs/Nebra.html Updated 4th December 2002 by John (Hans) Pohland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2004 Report Share Posted June 1, 2004 Hi Morgana! Thank you very much for the tip! Anne , " morgana " <morganaspirit@t...> wrote: > Hi Ann, It was you wasn't it who was so interested in the disc found in Germany? > I found an article and here it is below, enjoy, Morgana > > From Tara Astrology, under articles: > On Thursday 29th January 2004 at 21.00 GMT BBC2 televised a programme called Secrets of The Star Disc on its Horizon series. It revealed that civilization had reached Europe earlier than previously thought, centuries before Egypt or Greece. This was truly astonishing! > > > > It all began in 1999 in a forest near Nebra in East Germany when grave robbers using metal detectors and picks dug up a treasure containing among other things, a circular disc showing the Sun and Moon and a number of stars. Little did they know that this disc would change how we think about one of the most important periods in all human history, the Bronze Age. They spirited the disc away and tried to sell it on the black market for a quarter of a million pounds. > > > > In May 2001 Dr Harald Meller was appointed Head Archaeologist at the Museum of Halle in Eastern Germany. One day a colleague showed him some photographs that would change his life. The robbers had taken the photos, which showed jewels, tools and swords. But it was the photo of the bronze disc that caused the greatest interest. > > > > Dr Meller decided that he would find this disc and somehow do all he could to place it in its rightful home in the Halle Museum. After a year he finally contacted the thieves and offered to buy the Nebra disc. A meeting was set up at the Hilton hotel in Basel Switzerland. Unknown to the thieves Dr Meller had already contacted the Swiss police. He was met by a blond woman at the hotel and then introduced to an older man in the restaurant. The police had them under surveillance. After some time the disc was produced and at the appropriate moment Chief Inspector Peter Gill and his men swooped and arrested the older man and blond woman. The Nebra disc was now safe at last. > > Authenticating the Nebra Disc > The first to scrutinise the disc was Dr Heinrich Wunderlich, the Chief Scientist at the museum. He examined it for corrosion. Corrosion happens when metal comes into contact with oxygen from the air. Although there was a green layer of corrosion on the disc it did not mean it was authentic, corrosion can always be faked! To be certain, he examined the crystals, which appeared like bubbles. These bubbles were much larger than usual and proved that they could not be faked. They were real since only time could have produced them and as Dr Wunderlich said, " You can't fake time " . > > > > > > The Moon and the Sun were clearly visible, as were a number of dots that may have been stars. Prof Wolfhard Schlosser of the University of Bochum examined them and noted a group of seven stars placed between the Sun and Moon. He concluded that these were the Pleiades. He then examined the oldest images of the Pleiades he could find, tablets and scrolls from the east. Eventually he saw an image just like that on the disc, the Pleiades drawn with seven stars. Such an image would certainly be expected in Egypt or Mesopotamia but not in Central Europe! > > > > A further test was needed, but since the disc was made of metal, carbon dating was out of the question. They then turned to another method called associative dating. The disc had been found along with two swords in the same hole at the same soil level. The age of the disc and the swords could be fixed. All they had to do was compare them with similar objects that had already been successfully carbon dated. It turned out that the disc and swords dated to 1600 BC. The Nebra sky disc was " the oldest accurate picture of the night sky in all history " . > > > > > Underneath the images of the Sun and Moon appears a gold curved symbol. According to Dr Flemming Kaul of the National Museum of Denmark this was a ship. Similar images were carved on rocks all over Northern Europe; they were religious images. Dr Kaul believed this was the Sun ship. > > > The Sun ship was believed to have originated in Ancient Egypt. This brought up the possibility that the Nebra disc was not European at all but had come from Egypt. It may have been carried from there into central Europe. This was a disturbing possibility, yet all was not lost, further tests could still be carried out. > > > > The arc shaped band behind the Moon and to the right of the disc covers an area of 82 degrees and represents the distance between the rising Sun at the winter solstice and the rising Sun at the summer solstice. These 82 degrees can only be measured at Nebra in present day Germany and not Egypt or Greece, which are further south, producing an approximate arc of 70 degrees. Further north this arc would measure 90 degrees. > > > > The disc's metal was proven to have been mined in the area around Nebra by Prof Ernst Pernicka of the University of Tubingen. He showed that the metal could only have come from a local mine. It had not originated and been transported from either Egypt or Greece. It belonged to Nebra, the 82 degrees and the metal proved so. > > > > Now they had to find out what the disc meant. An expert on Bronze Age religions, Prof Miranda Aldhouse Green of the University of Wales, was consulted. She observed that, " the Sun is absolutely central to northern European Bronze Age religion. There's a clear connection between the Sun and life. If the Sun disappears then life comes to an end " . She also stated that the Moon symbolised time and if you can control and understand time then you are a powerful person. > > > > The Sun, Moon, the solstices, a Sun ship and the Pleiades are all religious symbols, and putting them all together for the first time three thousand five hundred years ago was truly amazing. > > > > She concluded, " We're dealing with people who had tremendous ability, not only a technological skill, but also immense intellectual ability. They were able to conceive of their world, they were able to represent it. There is tremendous imagination here, and there is an ability to encode information and beliefs and pass them down from generation to generation " . > > > > For full transcript of the programme: > > http://www.bbc.co.uk/print/science/horizon/2004/stardisctrans.shtml > > > > For further details: > > http://www3.sympatico.ca/hpohland/docs/Nebra.html > > Updated 4th December 2002 by John (Hans) Pohland > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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