Birth time rectification- Mr. Luther

August 22, 2008

|| Om Gurave Namah ||Om SreeMahaGanaadhipataye Namah Hari Om,

Dear Dr Luther,

Post is for you.

interesting request indeed.

sex of next twin is not mentioned by Hariharan.Iinformation could have been helpful.

Looking forward your working.

with regards.

OM TATSAT------------------------Swami_RCS

-----------------------" Let us meditate on the glorious effulgence of that Divine Being who hascreated the three worlds.May He Direct our understanding."--

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Hariharan.S

Friday, August 22, 2008 10:32 AM

Birth time rectification- Mr. Luther

Dear Mr. Luther,

Could you pl do the birth Time rectification for me

DOB: 20/11/1968 , Twins

Time : 5.29 A.M : Brothers Birth Time:5.39 A.M

Place Of Birth : Mavelikara, Allpey Dist Kerala, India

Thanks,

Regards,

S. Hariharan+91-020-32940623+91-0-93710 03246+91-0-98231 29984hariharan (AT) headhunterindia (DOT) com

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Luther Rath

Thursday, August 21, 2008 7:44 PM

Re: Birth time rectification

Thank you Neeraj for your mesage.

Dr. Luther

Neeraj Chowksey <chowkseyneeraj > Cc: rathluther Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2008 11:55:14 PMRe: Birth time rectification

Dear Sir,

charan sparsh.

Thanks for confirming my ascendant . according to my own check, also it comes VIRGO .

whenever I checked it through RP , and the method RP MOON= BIRTH ASCENDANT

RP ASCENDANT=BIRTH MOON , it gives me VIRGO. only by Asc's Sublord + SS lord = Moon's Starlord +Sublord gives me leo.

Any way now VIRGO is confirmed.

thanks ones again .

with regards,

Neeraj.

--- On Wed, 8/20/08, Luther Rath <rathluther > wrote:

Luther Rath <rathluther >Re: Birth time rectification@gro ups.comWednesday, August 20, 2008, 1:15 AM

Dear Neeraj,

According to me your Ascendant should be in Virgo 24-07-41.While I was judging Sun and Moon did not appear in the ruling planets. Sun had no connection in any maner with any of the significators.

Dr. Luther--- On Mon, 8/18/08, Neeraj Chowksey <chowkseyneeraj@ > wrote:

Neeraj Chowksey <chowkseyneeraj@ >Re: Birth time rectification@gro ups.comCc: kpmk_astrology@ Monday, August 18, 2008, 7:51 AM

Dear Sir,

I am member of this group since last@ four month.basically I am civil engineer working in Dubai as factory manager.

I have some confusion regarding my birth time.

As per the information it is in between 20:15 to 20:45.

when I checked it through the method 1) Asc's Sublord + SS lord = Moon's Starlord +Sublord it comes 20:18:30.when I checked it through 2) RP it gives me 20:43:03.

I checked three time by RP. it gives me VIRGO LAGNA. while by method one it gives me LEO LAGNA. I am studying Kp since last 4 years before that I was practisizing only on vedic.

please flash some light on my correct birth time.

events say that I am virgo.

According to data given by hospital and my grand mother(late) it is @ 20:30.

My detail is as follows.

DATE OF BIRTH- 11-02-1971

DOB- Between 20:15 TO 20:45

PLACE- BURHANPUR MP 21N18; 76E08.

Some of event details

Marrage- 27/01/2005

baby(girl) birth-19/09/ 2006

FIRST Dubai arrival- 14/01/2006

gone back to India-02/03/ 2006

Second dubai job-07/02/2007 tiil now

So many hurddles in education ( B.E. civil) done in 1997 ,failed two time.

Eldest in family, No sister , two brothers.

please confirm it.I would be very thanksfull to all my senior members of group.

Thanks & Regards,

Neeraj--- On Tue, 8/12/08, Mohan Kumar Ragunathan <kpmk_astrology@ > wrote:

Mohan Kumar Ragunathan <kpmk_astrology@ ..com>Re: Birth time rectification@gro ups.comTuesday, August 12, 2008, 10:00 AM

Mohan Kumar Ragunathan <kpmk_astrology@ >Re: BTR by a KP Student"Yogesh Rao Lajmi" <lyrastro1 (AT) (DOT) co.in>Friday, August 1, 2008, 6:58 AM

Dear Rao Ji,

Thank you for the response. I expected something from Mr.Dhanapalan - the purpose of his collection and study of text material on The Rahu/Kethu's signification. (Or was it all yours?) It's alright. To the point, now.

Your formula, as said, Asc's Sublord + SS lord = Moon's Starlord +Sublord seems to be very precise and "Congrats to you on the success rate you get out of it". Just go along with it.... Don't be disturbed by my intervention.

May I put a question: 'Do you put it in the order as it shows above, or do they - the Moon's (more stable) Starlord + Sublord - get interchanged in Asc's position as Asc. Sublord + SS lord.... i.e. whether Asc. Sublord can be Moon's Starlord OR Moon's Sublord, or do you want it to be the same as Moon's Starlord.. I suppose the latter is your choice. That's good if I have understood you correctly. Well, anyway, go ahead.

Why should we get the ASC position connected to that of Moon by way of Planets as such? Just because it has been said so in KP by our Guruji. Yes, I do accept. But WHY? I had this question in the year 2000, when I took up this issue to get into KP principles.

Guruji had said, "Lagna should, in any way, be connected to the Moon of the Birth Chart".

"HOW?" is the question for KP followers. But "WHY?" was the first question for me then.

My thinking and derived answer came out like this:

"HUMAN BIRTH.

The Seed Of Life was received by Mother from Father. Father means Sun. Lagna is calculated from Sun's position. So, LAGNA means our SOUL (or Life given by Father).

MOON represents Mother who received Seed from Father. Mother gave us physical form or body. So, MOON means our BODY (given by Mother).

Divine Science says: SOUL and BODY should agree with each other.

My body would not accept someone else's Soul AND my Soul would not get into someone else's body.

So, in one's chart, "ONE'S SOUL SHOULD MATCH WITH ONE'S OWN BODY".

Hence, LAGNA should show connection to MOON.

This is what our Guruji would have meant by his formula: "Lagna should, in any manner. be connected to Moon."

"In any manner" - not very precisely as you mean it should be, Rao Ji. I don't mean any harm by my words. Don't mistake me. Bye now! will be back soon!

MOHAN KUMAR.R.--- On Wed, 8/6/08, Yogesh Rao Lajmi <lyrastro1 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote:Yogesh Rao Lajmi <lyrastro1 (AT) (DOT) co.in>Fw: BTR by a KP Student"Mohan Kumar" <kpmk_astrology@ >Wednesday, August 6, 2008, 7:20 AM

Dear Mohan Kumar,

Am keenly looking forward to your formula which you have promised to post to the group....

Best wishes,

L.Y.Rao.

----- Forwarded Message ----Yogesh Rao Lajmi <lyrastro1 (AT) (DOT) co.in>MOHAN KUMAR. R. <kpmk_astrology@ >Thursday, 31 July, 2008 12:15:00 PMRe: BTR by a KP Student

Dear Mohan Kumar,

I have been working with the theory that if the Ascendant sub-lord appears as the Moon's star-lord,the TOB is correct...and have slightly modified it to say..."If the sublord and the sub-sub-lord of the Ascendant appear as the Moon's St.lord and sub-lord,respective ly,such a TOB is the exact one upto the fraction of a minute...... "

This has given me remarkable success...in atleast 90 - 95 % of cases,provided the TOB given for correction is within + or - 30 minutes from the actual TOB...

Am looking forward to your formula which you say is more accurate...

With best wishes,

L.Y.Rao.

MOHAN KUMAR. R. <kpmk_astrology@ ..com>Yogesh Rao Lajmi <lyrastro1 (AT) (DOT) co.in>Wednesday, 30 July, 2008 8:34:36 PMRe: BTR by a KP StudentDear Friends,Pranams to GURUJI KSK AND ALL STALWARTS OF KP ASTRLOGY. My respects toall KP seniors and my best wishes to all junior aspirants.Let me join your group and share my points. I am MOHAN KUMAR.R.Pleasecall me just 'MK'. At Salem, the secrets of KP has been lying under sofar. Now it is goona come out. get ready to cherish the fruits of thesecrets.I have researched and developed a "KP-MK Formula for Birth TimeVerification" and predictions thereof, based on KP principles. My NewTheory (Modified Theory, rather) by name "KP-MK FORMULA"with "CUSPALPOINT SIGNIFICATIONS" extended upto Sub-Sub-Sub (SSS) level is doingreal wonders in practice. This is with me for the last FOUR YEARS. Nowis the time to bring it out for the betterment of the science of KPAstrology.I'll do it slowly in due course. Can any one explain "WHY DO WE RELATETHE LAGNA SUBLORD WITH THE MOON SIGNLORD OR STARLORD, SO TO SAY?" HOWMANY OF YOU ARE CONFIDENT OR AT LEAST CLEAR ENOUGH WITH A LOGIC TO DOSO? PL COME OUT WITH A OPEN HEART AND BE BROAD-MINDED TO ACCEPT ANYTHINGTHAT HAS SOME MEANING- A REAL MEANING.Shri.M.P.Shanmugam' s Birth Time Verification formula is the eye openerin this regard.Shri.KSK's Sublord, Dr.KAR's MST Formulas, Shri. Khullar's (or is itShri.K.Bhaskaran' s really) Cuspal Interlinks are all wonders in theirown dimensions. But, how far have we all understood each one. Whateach of it lacks? How to fill in the blanks in those theories? Let'sgive a try.GOD BE WITH US.In anticipation, I remain a humble man of KP Astrology.--- On Tue, 8/12/08, Dhanabalan R <r.dhanabalan@ > wrote:

Dhanabalan R <r.dhanabalan@ > Birth time rectification"kpsystem groups" <@gro ups.com>Tuesday, August 12, 2008, 6:49 AM

Dear members

In the Reader II page 32 and in page 31 of k.p.Original volume I (1966), Mr..KSK says like this,

“It is my finding that the sub and constellation in which moon will be transiting at the time of the birth of the child will be governed by the dasanatha and bhukthinatha or the lords of the constellation in which they were found in the parent’s charts.”

Though it is Mr.KSK’s findings, there is no sufficient study in this line.

Below given are my collection from the earlier messages in this forum’s group discussion for easy reference.

Dhanabalan

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"The lagna cusp sublord in the birth chart of a native should tell the birth star of the native correctly, in one way or the other.. Such a lagna sublord that reveals the birth star of the native, and the birth chart prepared according to that time is the true and correct birth time.".... (p.237,Vol II, Astrosecrets and K.P.)

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Accuracy of Birth time (Jun 25, 2005 10:19am)

The KP system requires that the birth time be indicated very accurately to get correct predictions. This requirement stems from the fact the Bhava cusp lord would decide whether the native would get desirable results from that Bhava. As a result of this if the birth time is not accurate the predicted result may be 100% wrong.

There has been very intense discussion at this forum regarding birth time rectification. Two methods were discussed and conclusion was that the moon connection to Lagna was totally unreliable. The other method discussed was based on Ruling Planets. I am personally not for this method as this is likely to give different results if the same method is repeated at different points of time.... The greatest handicap in astrological predictions is the difficulty in reproduction of results for experiments conducted under identical conditions.

One suggestion was to check the birth time with respect to mothers chart. This would require that mothers chart would have to be rectified. Then we will have to look at mother's mother's chart…..! This is obviously not practicable.

The other suggestion that came in the forum from many a member is to check the birth time with respect to life events. Though this appears to be the best method, it has its fare share of difficulties. First is the difficulty in choosing an event that would take place in majority of people, which would take place at as early age as possible. The second difficulty is that this method cannot be chosen for babies that are just born.

In any case, the last method appears to be most practicable and accurate, provided we are able standardize some events and method to verify the same.

What is the accuracy required? The fastest moving point in the zodiac is the Lagna. Sun as Lagna sub lord will prevail for the shortest time. All Lagnas are not of equal duration. Meena Lagna is just about 90 minutes in duration. That is, for the Lagna to advance by one degree of longitude it would take only 3 minutes. That is, the shortest cusp duration (that of Sun, the cusp longitudinal distance of 40') will be only 2 minutes. Two minutes of difference can change the cusp from Sun either to Venus or Moon. Hence, when Moon or Venus is cusp lord of any Bhava, KP astrologer should become alert towards the birth time even more.

Considering that the accuracy required is very crucial to correct predictions, I think that we should continue the discussions and arrive at a list of events and an agreed method to verify these events. Otherwise, there is always the danger of we misleading our clients.

The events may have to be chosen which have relevance to different Bhavas, and check with the cusp lords for their correctness. This may be easier said than done, but since there are many experienced members in the forum, finding correct birth time might still be a good possibility.

I request the enlightened members to give their views. Regards, Udupa

T he following were also noted by some members:

1) Since birth time is crucial to prediction based on natal charts, horary is generally preferred in a majority of the cases.

2) In addition to life events, one can also use personality traits and physical characteristics to rectify birth time.

I feel that even if we are not able to apply event-based rectification to babies, to the extent the technique is applicable, we should perfect it and apply it in those cases where it is applicable. I feel sad that even after so many years we have not found a reliable technique (other than RP). Regards, Rangarajan

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On the issue of Birth time rectification , Mr.Gondhalekar mentioned that after trying several methods, he has accepted RP methodology. The success rate has been around 80%, and was happy with this level. He is an ardent devotee of KP for nearly 30 years.

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@gro ups..com, GURUMURTHY SUBRAMANIAN

Dear members,

My purpose in putting up this case of rectifiction on the board is ,as I have already stated, because different timings ranging from 8-12 A.M to 8-30 A.M have been given as corrected birthtime by astrologers to whom the case was referred for clarification. So I was in a fix and sought refuge in this forum for eliciting the correct reply..

I heartily thank the senior astrologers for having spared their valuable time in analysing this birth rectification question,and giving their views and observations. It may be observed that the replies are as under: My problem remains unsolved....

Anant Raichur..... 8-14.A.M

Kanak Bosmia...8-20. A.M (also given 8-15 and 8-17 as correct)

Ron Gaunt .......8-12- 28 A.M.

Unfortunately, here also there is no general agreement on the correct time of birth, which makes the position still confusing. Does it mean that our rules for birth rectification are not fully reliable?. I request someone in the forum to crack this hard nut by giving me onlyone answer for this porblem.

G.Subramanian

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For best Result of Birth Rectification as per our Guruji Mr krishnamoorthy, the lagna sublord should be coincided with the Moon Transiting Star or Sub , that is when u are urging to find out these Thinks in the Ruling planet ie is at present moment .

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i dont think it is right method to check birth timeV pls refer Book " SECRETS

OF R.P. & THE BIRTH TIME By: K.Baskaran Publishe KRISHMAN & CO 804 Mount Road ,

Chhennai 600 002 "

according to him RP MOON = Bith Asc. and RP Asc. = Birth Moon.( ksk himself

wrote in any one reader about RP Moon = Birth Asc. but i dont remember no: and

Page No.)

frist you go up to birth Mon Sub-Sub-Sub level . and calcutet asc for that

time you can found Bith asc as RP MOON most of case.

i found very accuret result by this method. and it is my personal view .

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dear sri nemani raghunath rao garu,

i am very happy to see your research paper on birth time rectification (btr). hitherto i have come across the following methods for birth time rectification on different forums/books.

1 rp method: (sri kanakji n sri rangarajan krishnamurthy has submitted their research papers with 300 aa rated birth charts)

rp moon should tally with birth ascendant and rp ascendent should tally with birth moon.

2 sri shnmugam’s method (sri. rangarajan has made research reg.connection from aa rated charts)

birth asc. star lord/ sub lord should have a connection with birth moon star/sub. apart from this blood relations (relatives) birth stars should be tallied with the relavent cusps eg. mother, father, spouse, elder brother, younger brother, first child, second child, etc,

3. gender method (sri c.kadirivelu)

wherein lagna gender of the baby, 4th cusp mother, 9th cusp father plus any other relatives who's genders would tally with relavent cusp str.lord or sub lord or the preceding planets in whose star lords/sublords there are tenated.

4. sri andrew’s btr - apart from rp method the rule of origin that is 9th cusp star lord/sub lord should have a connection with first cusp.

5. sri kundanthai nathan btr - wherein 9th csl have connection with either sun/jupiter/ venus who are karekas for human births.

6 sri nemani's method of btr: now brought up for verification.

in your method rp moon sign/star/sub lords should have a connecton with birth asc. sign/star/sub lords. no natal chart should be taken for connection. third party connection that is asc sign/star/sub lords in a star or sub of another planet who is tenated in the star/sub of rp moon.

i request the forum members should enlighten the other members with their experiences and practical experiences.

regards

ovn murthy hyderabad www.saibhavishyavan i.com

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NEW APPROACH TO BIRTH TIME RECTIFICATION

By Subhash Ektare 4090 Crandall Cir. Santa Clara , California USA

In recent past two papers were published on this subject. They are:

1. Birth_Time_Rectific ation_Article By Dr. Andrew Dutta published in June 2007 issue of Express Star Teller

2. Rectification of Birth Time using Ruling Planets (Krishnamurthy Padhdhati) Ver. 2.0 by Mr..... Raghunath Rao Nemani which is available in file section of @ . Both of the authors have done commendable work. Presentation is Excellent. Step by step explanation makes it self explanatory and can be easily understood even by newcomer. Methods are similar in approach except that Dr. Dutta uses Natal Chart for establishing the linkage between planets while Mr. Nemani uses Chart at the time of Judgment. However Dr.Andrew Dutta had introduced an innovative Rule of Origin to test the accuracy of the corrected birth time. Hats off to him. On detailed study of these methods I would like to share my observations with everybody. These are my personal opinions, which may be wrong. And I hope that these observations may not be mistaken as criticism.

a) Rectification up to sub level gives a variation of around 3 to 20 minutes. This variation

can be reduced by taking sub-sub level into consideration.

b) Only RP Moon is considered while correcting Natal Ascendant. Other stronger RPs i.e.

Ascendant sign lord and Ascendant star lord could have been put to effective use for

rectification.

c) There is no doubt that the Moon is the fastest moving Planet. But movement of Lagna

(Ascendant) is 25 to 28 times faster than that of Moon. In this process of rectification, the

longitude of the Natal Ascendant (fast moving body) is being corrected with the help of

longitude of the RP Moon (comparatively much slow moving body). In my opinion the

process should be reverse.

After giving due weightage to all these points, I would like to present a simple and reliable technique for birth time rectification. It is explained in following paragraphs..

Step 1.

Cast the chart for the time and place of judgment. Note down the RP Ascendant and RP

Moon correct up to sub-sub level. Also note down whom Rahu/Ketu represent.

Step 2

Calculate the position of Natal Moon at unrectified birth time up to sub-sub level. Then with the help of RP Ascendant and given time of birth correct the longitude of Natal Moon up to sub-sub level. Note that here we are using RP Ascendant (fast moving object) to correct the longitude of Natal Moon (comparatively slow moving object). Thus strongest Ruling Planets – ascendant sign lord and ascendant star lord- are used in correcting the birth time.

Step 3

Corresponding to this corrected Natal moon position find out the Natal Ascendant(s) . Now, check and correct the Natal Ascendant(s) with the RP moon. Here we are using pair of next powerful Ruling Planets- Moon sign lord and the star lord- to fine tune corrected Natal Ascendant(s) . The time when this ascendant rises is found to be most accurate astrological birth time.

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Birth time correction

These are very important but generally we neglect these points.

The moment you sit for to do the rectifications of a person, pl check the time chart of that moment. If Moon signifies 6th, 8th & 12th houses then don’t do the rectification on that time, stop your calculation, do it any other time or any other day.. Because that calculation, what you have started, does not give you the right answer. So wait for the right moment.

Clarify: Will you pl elaborate on " Moon signifies 6th, 8 & 12 " ? whehter all the three houses, or any two out of three or any one of the three to be signified by Moon ? Signification upto what level ? sign, star, sub sub sub ? whether conjunction and aspect also to be considered for signification ? What should be orbit range 3..33deg or hindu aspect and conjunction ?

Yes you are right , when Moon will Signifying any two of the 6th,8th & 12th, and it's upto the Sign and Star level. If any planet, basically the outer planets, aspect( hindu aspect) on Moon and that (outer) planet signifying any two of these houses then also the time will be negetive. Orbit range is 3.33degree. If any way Moon signifying any two of these three abd aspect or conjunct with any planets who is signifying any two of these three then the time is negetive, so , don't continue the calculation on that time. Pl do it some other time when your time will be positive.

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Dear Tranquas,

That is precisely why I personally match the Lagna sub and sub-sub to appear as Moon's st.lord,and sub-lord respectively. ..which ensures correction upto the level of seconds,further accuracy upto can be obtained by extending upto the level of sub-sub-sub of the Ascendant... . .and so on...

LY.Rao.

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August 22, 2008

He is also Male.

Thanks,

Regards,

S. Hariharan+91-020-32940623+91-0-93710 03246+91-0-98231 29984hariharan

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swami

Friday, August 22, 2008 11:03 AM

Re: Birth time rectification- Mr. Luther