On Remedial Measures Difference (Resolving Points)

[Guest guest]

Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Narasimha,Regarding the following:The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

However, this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to one who does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully in a mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolved and hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely rare today. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do not work for them as they are supposed to.Thank you for this very original philosophy, I have never heard it put like this. I will try to summarize so my issue is clear.Step 1: Perfectly control your mind.Step 2: Repeat a mantra and experience it fully.Step 3: Internal processes take place that then cause external change.How are we to achieve step 1? Is it not recommended to practice mantra to achieve this?Oh, but then I read this:Any prasiddha mantra (e.g. ashtakshari, panchakshari, dwadasakshari, navakshari, vishnu sahasranaam, rudram, hare krishna maha mantra, chandipath, ganapati atharva seersham, mrityunjaya mantra etc) can help one make progress if one develops the right attitude. Without the right attitude, even an impeaccably picked mantra will do nothing.So now I don't know what you are trying to say. Should we chant mantra's or not? In one instance you are saying it is futile, then you say it can help one make progress *with the right attitude*. Progress to what? Controlling the mind?I only mention this because you said:I hope this sufficiently clarifies my stand.And I don't see how it could. Within a couple of sentences there are totally opposite points.Respectfully,MichalNarasimha P.V.R. Rao <pvrsohamsa ; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao <pvrCc: vedic astrology ; Sent: Sunday, 15 February, 2009 5:03:46 PM On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)

 



Dear Sanjay,

 

> Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that

 

I do have a definition of gandanta, which is Parasara's definition in BPHS.

 

Since some of you are extrapolating it based on the fire embodied in UL and water embodied in tithis, the onus is on you to outline and justify your definition. I got into this thread because statements were made that fasting on particular weekdays or tithis in a chart can cause "insult to Vishnu", "serious doshas" and "danger to spouse", based on these far-fetched extrapolations of gandanta.

 

> Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.

 

Well, you once taught that houses represent Sun/Shiva/truth and arudhas represent Moon/Gouri/percepti on. That was meaningful. Now, you associated UL, an arudha, with Sun and fire and 12th, a house, with Gouri and water. I question whether the new theory on fasting is really in line with everything you have learnt (and taught).

 

BTW, I specifically asked for a clarification on whether this was based on your own thinking or from classics/parampara (see quoted mail below for the full context). Like so many times with similar questions I asked privately and recently publicly, you did not respond.

 

* * *

 

> Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus

> and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by

> Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and

> not of much consequence.

 

First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.

 

For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.

 

Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.

 

Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.

 

Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.

 

Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.

 

Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.

 

* * *

 

> Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless

> and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for

> the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman

> when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can

> take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to

> write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic

> seers.

 

I did not say it is "useless". Instead, I suggest that our ability to use it is limited and we should take our limitations into consideration.

 

The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

However, this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to one who does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully in a mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolved and hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely rare today. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do not work for them as they are supposed to.

 

* * *

 

Just repeating a combination of sounds does not guarantee anything. Some people may think that certain results come when they repeat a mantra certain number of times. That is an incorrect notion. A mantra may work for one person quickly and another may spend the whole life chanting it and nothing may happen. Absorption of the entire mind into a mantra is needed for a mantra to really work and it is much more difficult than one may think.

 

* * *

 

A highly learned scholar in the court of a king may be able to command the king and get whatever he wants from king. An incapable one is better off begging the king, rather than trying to command (and failing for sure).

 

Similarly, most people are better off begging god for what they want rather than trying to use the right mantra to command what they want. A beggar does not need a huge vocabulary or great scholarship or knowledge. Feeling of humility and helplessness, surrender, patience and persistence are what help a beggar succeed. A beggar needs the right attitude rather than knowledge. In this age and time, best bet for most people is to learn to be a good beggar at god's door.

 

What people today need for material and spiritual progress through remedial measures is a better attitude in begging god rather than a better choice of tools such as mantras and other specifics such as weekday, tithi etc to command a specific result from god.

 

It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc. *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.

 

* * *

 

One more thing. We have many mantras given by rishis, but the guidelines from rishis like Parasara on how to pick a mantra based on the horoscope are very limited. Astrologers today do not operate solely based on them. They use all kinds of other rules coming from various traditions. They are not free from corruption and imperfection. Most scriptures associate various mantras with various results, irrespective of horoscope. For example, irrespective of who is the 6th lord and 8th lord and lord of A6 and A8, Rina Vimochaka Angaraka mantra is good for debt control. And so on. Linking of horoscope is overplayed by today's astrologers, way beyond the scope of Parasara's guidelines.

 

If one has a sadguru, I recommend following the word of sadguru rather than that of an astrology theoretician.

 

If not, there is no foolproof way to know the right path. Pick any path (given by an astrologer or one that you feel attracted to) instead of wasting time and then keep working on your attitude. The latter is the key. As I said earlier, learn to be a humble beggar at god's door. Choice of Mantra is secondary and attitude is primary. If you succeed in being a really humble beggar, you stand a better chance of success than great scholars.

 

 

Any prasiddha mantra (e.g. ashtakshari, panchakshari, dwadasakshari, navakshari, vishnu sahasranaam, rudram, hare krishna maha mantra, chandipath, ganapati atharva seersham, mrityunjaya mantra etc) can help one make progress if one develops the right attitude. Without the right attitude, even an impeaccably picked mantra will do nothing.

 

* * *

 

I hope this sufficiently clarifies my stand. I discuss these matters related to spiritual sadhana more on the . Some writings are sampled at http://www.vedicast rologer.org/ homam/writings. htm.

 

Best regards,Narasimha------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpanaSpirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdomFree Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

 

om paramesthi gurave namah

 

Dear Narasimha,

 

Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that and continue with my belief of the junction between Agni and Jala rasi as the case of gandanta and the loka junctions. Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.

 

Two statements you have made contradict standard texts on Jyotish and Mantra Shastra. Please correct me if I am not understanding you well out here -

 

1. Statement 1: *fasting on any day or any tithi* is good so long as the sankalpa has been made for the devata you intend to pray to. Results maybe a bit delayed but will be there.2. Statement 2: *reciting any prayer* will give the desired effects for any ailment we wish to remedy

 

Is this what you intended to say or did I get this wrong?

 

Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and not of much consequence. This sounds like another astrologer I had known some time back whose statements like this coerced me to write Vedic Remedies in Astrology so that people are not misled but such pretexts to knowledge.

 

Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic seers.

 

I think there is something wrong in the way you are saying what you want to say. Please rethink and correct your statements for the sake of good record in this list.

 

With Warm Regards

Sanjay Rath

http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org

15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India

 

-

Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

sohamsa@ .com

Sunday, February 08, 2009 12:03 PM

Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING

 

Namaste Sanjay and friends,

 

My answers are in red and prefixed with "[Narasimha] ".

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?

> > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] We always say that houses (truth) are represented by Sun (aatman) and arudha padas (maya) by Moon (mind).

 

Thus, 12th house is the actual creator and UL is the apparent creator in the field of maya. Houses (truth) should actually be associated with Sun (aatman) and Shiva (and not Gouri), while arudha padas (perception) should actually be associated with Moon (mind) and Gouri. After all, that is what we do in the tripod method in dasa judgment.

 

Thus, it is actually more logical to say that 12th house and 12th lord imbibe the agni tattva of Sun and UL and UL lord imbibe the jala tattva of Moon.

 

Is the above "*more correct* answer" based on your own thinking or is it from a classic or from tradition?

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

> The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Well, if one cannot fast, then one is destined to expend some energy on digestion after all and not focus all energy on the mantra. But the bottomline is that shastras say that one should meditate either without or with very little food (niraahaaro mitaahaaro). In any case, I hope we agree that meditation sessions after heavy eating are heavily restrained in effectiveness.

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<< Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Putting a burning match in a glass of water does indeed kill fire. But the question is of contact. If I am thinking of fire in my mind while standing in water, it does not kill the fire. There is no contact.

 

My point is that the examples given have no real identifiable contact between water and fire.

 

One can be creative and come up with a lot of theories. For example, one can say that Moon and Venus are jala tattva and all rasis show agni tattva (then why are some rasis marked as agni rasis and some as water rasis etc) and hence the sign occupied by Moon and Venus cause contact between water and fire. Then one can say fasting on the weekdays of the dispositors of Moon and Venus causes gandanta and serious danger.

 

It is not enough to show some fire and some water. See what counts as contact. Otherwise, one will engage in illogical extrapolations.

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

 

[Narasimha] Nothing is permanent. What is one's cannot be taken away. And one cannot cling on to what is not one's. Some rejoice when it seems like something comes and cry when it seems like something leaves. Some impassionately observe as things seem to come and go and do what they see as their dharma with the things they seem to have.

Just a factual correction though: I never said I was leaving Jyotish. For a few years after my spiritual master entered my life, my interest in other things went down (though I continued to do other things) and my focus on spiritual sadhana intensified. So I said that my interest in Jyotish was very low. However, my guru gave me a task later. He wanted me to study the teachings of Parasara independently, meditate on them and share my interpretations with the world. He said I was very passionate in my Jyotish activities earlier, and he wanted me to do the same now but dispassionately and without an attachment. He felt that I still have a contribution to make to Jyotish and wants me to do it as an unattached karma. His word is everything for me.

 

What I told you recently is not that I was leaving Jyotish but what I said above.

 

However, if your judgment is correct and if Jyotish is indeed "leaving" me, I am sure my spiritual guru will realize it sooner or later and change his command to me.

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] This is a gross exaggeration.

 

Is all that is being taught and practiced now strictly from "Puranas and other teachings of the seers"?

 

I did not say all days and tithis are the same. Of course, there is some difference. But, it is not as big as being made here.

 

To make khoa, whether one uses cow milk or buffalo milk or milk of a brown cow or a black cow or a Jersey cow or another cow does make some difference. But it is secondary. To say that "danger" and "serious doshas" (see the quoted mails for such claims) can be caused by a wrong choice is wrong. To say that a wrong choice means khoa will take 100 years to make is also a gross exaggeration.

 

The main thing is that you need milk and sugar. If one is confused by endless claims of khoa making consultants and ends up not making khoa at all, that will be sad. In such a case, one can simply pick some milk or the other, take sugar and start cooking khoa. It will take an extra half hour, but the job will be done.

 

I request Jyotishis to behave responsibly and humbly and not engage in scare-mongering and say that a speicifc austerity (fasting on a specific weekday or tithi in a chart) can cause "danger" and "serious doshas". No wonder some spiritual teachers look down upon Jyotish and dismiss it. Such unbalanced attitude and self-importance from us does not help our cause!

 

Yes, Jyotish is helpful, but let us not oversell it or overplay the importance.. .

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Of course, brahmacharya is much more, but also very difficult for most. Even physical celibacy is a good enough austerity. Physical celibacy over an extended period of time increases the efficacy of other austerities such as fasting, mouna vrata, meditation and homam.

 

Best regards,Narasimha------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpanaSpirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdomFree Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

sohamsa@ .com, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath wrote:>> om paramesthi gurave namah> > Dear Narasimha> > Just added a few thoughts and questions since we are on the topic of spirituality, which is not my forte. So I am always seeking to learn.> > With Warm Regards> > Sanjay Rath> > http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha PVR Rao> 06 February 2009 00:48> sohamsa@ .com> Cc: > Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING> > Namaste friends,> > I would like to express my reservations on a couple of issues. It is funny that I should be typing this email on an Ekadashi day, when many Vaishnavas fast irrespective of their horoscopes.> > [sanjay Rath:] I write on dvadasi when so many vasihnava also fast and keep great austerities. J Any difference?> > > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > My dear Zoran, please allow me to express my disagreement.> > Austerities can never be seen as an insult to Vishnu. Self-deprivation of 2nd house matters such as food (fasting) or speech (mouna vrata - vow of silence) are austerities. Giving up food or speech is not an insult to Vishnu just as giving up sex (i.e. brahmacharya) is not an insult to Sukracharya (Venus).> > [sanjay Rath:] I though Brahma was very angry that his sons decided not to have progeny and stayed celibate. So He created others. Why was Brahma angry when his sons remained celibate? Why should Sukracharya be angry if someone is celibate? How is it an insult or not an insult to Sukracharya? You are taking planet signification of Venus for 7H ...and linking this to creation process...which is wrong Narasimha. Brahma is seen from lords of dusthana 6, 8 and 12 from lagna or 7th which is....you know this.There is nothing wrong with the 7th house as it is necessary for procreation. It is only the link of this with the Brahma graha that causes it to become a serious shad-ripu. Married people are as eligible for moksha as unmarried ones and bachelors. It depends on the following of dharma and ashrama.> > Various gods bestow various things on us, some at the gross physical level and some at the subtle spiritual level. As we overcome our dependendency on gross things, we make progress at the subtle level.> > If one eats food, a good amount of internal fire (and subtle internal energy associated with it) is used for digesting it and for generating physical energy from it. If one fasts, that subtle energy is unused and available for other things. This is a tremendous benefit. As a result, one can better digest mantras and spiritual food available all around one.> > The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.> > > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?> > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.> > Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.> > Now one more thing: Marriage is a yoga between two souls and why not suggest fasting on the yoga day of the UL lord?> > [sanjay Rath:] What! What a brilliant suggestion.. .why don’t you start it? > > * * *> > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > Picking tithi based on house (12th house - Dwadashi, 4th house - Chaturthi) is illogical as there are 12 houses only and more tithis.> I have realized one thing over the years - If something is not structurally sound, it is most likely false knowledge.> > [sanjay Rath:] J No comments> > * * *> > I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.> > If you keep such a vrata sincerely, you will make positive progress towards achieving your purpose and definitely not go backwards, irrespective of what is said by technical calculations based on our half-baked Jyotish knowledge.> > * * *> > My friends, use the Jyotish knowledge available, but do realize that it is imperfect and corrupted. Why is only the UL lord important? So many planets may have so many kinds of influence on UL in a chart. And UL is one of several factors showing marriage. There may be various influences in a chart showing marriage. Is our thumb rule of using UL lord's weekday missing some important factors? Quite possible!> > [sanjay Rath:] That is a very nasty statement. Once again you have used adjectives (*imperfect, corrupted*) which is not becoming of you. Why must you use nasty statements? Can’t you say things nicely? > > Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence. > > If you have the time to listen to the Jaimini Lectures at http://sohamsa. com/js/ do so as it will show you the depths of this knowledge you cannot imagine exists in jyotish. The derivation of the chnhandas and what not all. Thumb rules are meant for beginners. The day you decided to give up jyotish, you got stuck in the thumb rules but then its ok with me. I always wished you the best in whatever you do.> > But, despite some arbitrariness and imperfection, if a thumb rule allows you to pick an austerity with confidence and create the mental feeling that you are doing the best possible thing for your situation, it is good. After all, what is critical is to do *some* austerity to burn the blocking karma, with a positive frame of mind about what you are doing.> > [sanjay Rath:] No Narasimha, very happy marriages can happen, without austerities as well.> > But, if endless theorization and complicated technicalities evolving from the thumb rule are creating doubts and confusion in the minds of people as they consider an austerity, that is useless and totally missing the point.> > Some people tend to resort to heavy theorization based on very shaky grounds. I suggest going back to the basics, thinking clearly and keeping things simple.> > [sanjay Rath:] Human brains work differently in seeking the truth and means to remedy the errors. Life is too complicated to keep everything simple. For example, a heavily cursed Venus can block everything and UL fast may not be able to solve the problem. Now would you say that heavy thoerization and complication is happening and we should ignore the other factors completely?> > Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.> > Best regards,> Narasimha> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > sohamsa@ .com <sohamsa% 40. com> , Ajay Zharotia <ajayzharotia@> wrote:> > ||Om Gurave Namah||> > > > Dear Swee, & jyotishis> > > > What Zoran is saying is right. Do not mix the energy of day lord > > (Agni) by choosing the same tithi (jala) that will create serious > > troubles for the spouse.> > Let me explain the principle in a simple way so that there should not > > be any confusion.> > > > In your chart (Swee) Vrishabha lagna, UL is in 2nd house. So lord of > > the UL is the Mercury. Since fasting is prohibited for UL in 2nd > > house see where the lord of the UL has gone. In your case mercury has > > gone to the 11th house hence it is Ekadashi. So rule is to choose the > > tithi is based on the placement of the UL lord.> > > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > > > If you are doing fasting on the basis of tithis it should be done in > > sukla paksha only. But if you are doing in Krishna paksha (Pitris) > > also then it should be combined with the donation.> > > > I hope this will clarify the principal.> > > > Best Regards> > > > Ajay Zharotia> > ajayzharotia@> > > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:51 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran wrote:> > > > > || Om Gurave Namah ||> > > Dear Swee,> > > Can you please tell me the exact rule to use for fasting on > > > tithi?.Do we use the 12th lord tithi?, Like if you are Ta lagna, > > > there 2 tithi one on Triteeya (3) and Ekadasha(11) . If we consider > > > only the paksh in which u are born.> > > Now of the two which to use?.> > >> > > Warm Regards> > > Sanjay p> > >> > > 2009/2/3 Swee Chan <swee@>> > > Jaya Jagannatha> > >> > > Dear Hari, Zoki, et al in this discussion,> > > Namaste> > >> > > The tongue in cheek, I'll excuse ;-)) it's my laugh for the day!!> > > I fast on ekadasi tithi because my UL is in 2nd house (ie 12th lord > > > is in lagna). Since I was born on sukla paksha, Sanjay ji suggests > > > that I fast only on sukla ekadasi.> > > Zoki, if you listen to JUS of Year I, you will note how Sanjay ji > > > came to this conclusion.> > >> > > love,> > >> > > Swee> > >> > > On 3 Feb 2009, at 15:25, Jyotisa Shisya wrote:> > >> > >> |om|> > >> Dear Zoran, namaste> > >>> > >> Would not the general act of fasting be construed as an insult to > > >> Sri MahaVishnu?> > >>> > >> best regards> > >> Hari> > >>> > >> On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 5:30 PM, ahimsavm <ahimsans@> > > >> wrote:> > >> Om Namah Shivaya,> > >> Dear Bojan and others,> > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > >> The simple solution is to do vrata which do not conflict with> > >> rejection of food. So a person may observe the fast on UL in 2nd> > >> day, however, adequate food should be offered as a prasad and eaten> > >> before the Sunrise (not complete fast).In this way, results may come> > >> a bit later, but will certainly come, while a person will not bring> > >> insult to Shri Vishnu by rejecting the food.> > >> This is the way I was taught, and ofcourse others may agree or not.> > >> Best wishes> > >> Zoran Radosavljevic> > >> www.siva-edu. info> > >> www.ahimsazr1. wordpress. com

 

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[Guest guest]

MichaelThis is what I understood from Guru Narasimha's mail, which is different from what you understood. Of course this is not a jyotish remedy topic, and according to me He did not contradict about saying prayers, but said the effectiveness of the prayer not experienced by every one. "However, this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to one who does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully in a mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolved and hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely rare today. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do not work for them as they are supposed to."

few thoughts:Aatma jnana, a concept that knowledge that one's self is identical with Brahman is key to Moksha, and identification of Atman with Brahman results into self-realization, but not lead to God-realization and ultimate liberation, Moksha.The Sanskrit word mantra consists of the root man- "to think", also in manas "mind" and the suffix -tra meaning, tool, hence a literal translation would be "instrument of thought".

Another explanation is that the suffix -tra means "protection", which translates in to protection of "mind".Essentially, before existence and beyond existence is only One reality,

Brahman, and the first manifestation of Brahman in existence is Aum.

For this reason, Aum is considered to be the most fundamental and

powerful mantra, and thus is prefixed and suffixed to all Hindu

prayers. While some mantras may invoke individual Gods or principles,

the most fundamental mantras, like 'Aum,' the 'Shanti Mantra,' the 'Gayatri Mantra' and others all ultimately focus on the One reality.Again beleiving jyotish is a tool to guide one towards moksha, and hence it is some what overlaping with the topic mentioned above.

CheersLakshman

[Guest guest]



Dear Sanjay,

 

> Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc.

> It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this.

 

Some may be fascinated by the texture, color and volume of the chaff and miss the grain.

 

Most people who talk about mantra shastra focus on the chaff and not on the grain.

 

> You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from?

> How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many

> mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is

> *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should

> always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I

> also disagee with him/her.

 

I mentioned the above with respect to the need of thousands of mantras and technicalities. If one does not want to command god and wants to be a beggar who will take whatever is given, there is no need for thousands of mantras and all the umpteen technicalities. These thousands of mantras and umpteen technicalities are for commanding thousands of different results from god. That is why I talked of commanding vs begging. However, this commanding works slightly differently than one may imagine. I will elaborate.

 

Also, commanding god is NOT black magic. Commanding low level beings is black magic, which can be accomplished even by a person not quite elevated spiritually and suffering from a heavy ego. However, commanding higher beings such as gods is possible only for a spiritually elevated person with no or extremely small ego. This commanding that I am referring to is not an egoistic achievement. In fact, an egoist cannot achieve it. Only a person succeeding in completely effacing individual ego can achieve this commanding! I will repeat something from the previous mail to clarify:

 

 

The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness), many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

Each set of "karmic interactions between various objects" is a "result". Various mantras are for various "results". One may term merging self-awareness in a mantra fully and getting a specific result from it as "commanding a result" from god. Whether you like the term or not, it is essentially that.

 

* * *

 

But the bottomline is this: Only a highly purified sadhaka of very low ego can command specific results from god (not for selfishness or even ego satisfaction, but acting as an unattached instrument of Nature fulfilling one's dharma set by Nature). Various mantras and technicalities of mantra shastra taught by rishis are meant for such sadhakas.

 

Those are hardly of use to so many people out there with dense egos seeking specific selfish results. They cannot command specific results from god (because of their heavy attachment to the result, which is in turn due to their own attachment to a limited ego), even if they use all the techniques of mantra shastra and all the associated rules of astrology. Instead of wasting their time with these technicalities, they will be better off learning to be good beggars at God's door.

 

Just pick any prasiddha mantra or a mantra you feel attracted to, without worrying about so many technicalities, and learn to be humble and surrender to the Lord. Patiently wait for him to give you what you want. Like a beggar, take whatever and whenever he gives.

 

Keep praying every day or every second when you are able to. Even when you are not praying, remember him in all of your actions. When you enjoy something in the material world, tell yourself that it is his and that he gave it to you. If you remember him all the time, slowly the dirt in your mind will start to get cleaned. This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).

 

* * *

 

There may be a mountain with thousands of paths (mantra) for climbing it. Each path may lead to a different spot (different experience) on the top and show a different scenery (result). Expert advisors (astrologers) may tell you to use a specific path (mantra) to see a specific scenery (result). But such advice is useless to a handicapped person without legs (a selfish person with dense ego). It is relevant only to person with legs and one who is strong and sturdy, who can successfully climb the mountain (a reasonably detached person with very little ego).

 

Even when you encounter a person who has legs and can actually climb the mountain, the stress should be on how to climb the mountain and traverse the long path, rather than which path to take. The astrologers who are bogged down by all the technicalities and people who take customized mantra advice from astrologers and think that they will get a result quickly by doing that 'powerful' mantra are missing the basic point. The power of a powerful mantra is with respect to the experience and result obtained *after* one succeeds with the mantra. A partcicularly powerful mantra is akin to a path leading to a point atop the mountain where the view shows a particularly beautiful scenery. But the bottomline is that you do have to survive the climb along the long path.

 

We need to emphasize the attitude and approach needed for the long climb, rather than emphasizing the choice of the path based on horoscope. It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc!!!! *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.

 

 

* * *

 

> when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone

> wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this

> worship should be done?

You can do anyday. Parasara does not mention any day for doing homam to a graha.

 

In fact, if one wants, one can do a homam or worship to Mars (or any planet) every day. It is even better that way.

 

If an astrologer suggests doing it on a Tuesday, it is fine. But saying that doing it on so and so day will bring serious dangers because Mars is an enemy of so and so planet would be stretching things.

 

> [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his

> knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?

From Self - from within. That is the source of all knowledge. A sadguru need not specifically teach thousand things, but needs to open the door inside.

 

* * *

 

> OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,

> 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni

> and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.

 

Parasara's definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in a contiguous space having a predominance of fire and water elements. "I see fire and I see water. So there is gandanta" is a wrong approach. One can then call Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery planet, being in a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a contiguous space.

 

In your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no contiguous space where there is a water-fire transition.

 

> Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing.

> You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and

> are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from

> Parashara?

Well, Me10, Ve7 etc theory is based on marrying two different teachings of Parasara (bhava karakas and special lagnas). I do not really consider it as my creation but as understanding Parasara's teachings only.

 

Best regards,NarasimhaDo a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpanaSpirituality: Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org

sohamsa , "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath wrote:>> om paramesthi gurave namah> > Dear Narasimha,> > I read this mail twice. OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg, 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni and jala...I want to her your words if you have any. You keep saying Parasara says so and yet there is nothing forthcoming.> > The rashi is associated with the Aditya as the rashi come into existence because of the Sun, which is the agni tattva. Vara is also agni tattva among the panchanga of Jyotisha. That is why Vaara is related to rashi. Karma has been advised in the vaara of the lords of the rashi or the hora of the lords of the rashi related to a bhaava and for this reason, fasting and other such karma related to rashi are also based on this. [see Prashna Marga for details].> > Moon is the significator of the Aroodha. It is the *emotional content* related to the maya manifestation of everything in life. Suffering is caused as we do not fathom the karma associated that resulted in suffering and fasting is a a means of self punishment and correction related to the raashi where the aroodha is. Just as Agni has the purity to burn the root of sin, fasting on vaara related to the UL is surely going to cleanse the sins associated with the suffering in it. While this may not give a 100% satisfaction as the *moon* content has not been addressed, at least the initiation of the aroodha occurs and people find their partners, get married and get along with life. Proof lies in the pudding and with so many cases where people have fasted on UL days and have got result, we have found faith in these teachings reinforced. Why fast? Fasting on vaara is a means to correcting the flaw associated with the raashi. Raashi is a quantity and hence it is related to the material effects of the bhava and that is what people are looking for when they come to th astrologer. You have done well to recall my teachings in this – remember what I taught – Men should worship a female deity and women shold worship a male deity for the UL fasting. I wonder if they really follow this.> > Why not give fasting at night instead of day? Sun is always good for the Upapada (Jaimini etc) and that is why we have limited this to day fasting and not night fasting as well or 24 hour fast. This is my interpolation. [ satisfied J ] Elders would have given long periods of fast starting from the vaara, like keeping 21 days fast for the birth of child! You think I should be doing that! You think anyone will lsiten. Try it yourself before asking me to advise those hard penance kind of fasts.> > Who says the Moon has nothing to do with the arudha. It is the sustainer. Now people to an astrologer when they are looking for getting married and hardly anyone comes these days asking for prolonging marriage. Either they want to get into one or get out of one and into another...astrologers these days are relegated to helping people make these transitions painless and fast. Of course some have come and I have not failed them. I have a ready shloka for this – start from Taurus in Hamsa gati:> > Gouri, Kaali, Uma, Bhadraa, Durga, Kanti, Saraswati> > Mangalaa, Vaishnavi, Lakshmi, Shivaa, Naraayani> > See I have them ready for the 12 signs in Hamsa Gati from the mool trikona of Moon in hamsa gati> > Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc. It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this. > > You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from? How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I also disagee with him/her.> > Prasiddha mantras always give result, even without initiation and who knows how ready a person is for initation. So I prefer sticking to prasiddha mantras with people who do not have initiations. This is there in VRA also.> > I have some questions where I have doubts about what you say. It is below your mail.> > With Warm Regards> > Sanjay Rath> > http://srath.com http://sohamsa.com http://.org> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> 15 February 2009 09:34> sohamsa ; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> Cc: vedic astrology ; > On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)> >  > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus> > > and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by> > > Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and> > > not of much consequence.> > First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.> > For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.> > [sanjay Rath:] what about the Puranas? Have you gone through the Navagraha mantras given in the Garuda Purana and other puranic literature?> > Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.> > [sanjay Rath:] If Amavasya dosha is to be performed on Amavasya, when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this worship should be done?> > Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.> > [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?> > Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.> > [sanjay Rath:] I am sorry. I missed the context and just saw some mails that were forwarded to me amidst my writing. But them its always a pleasure to talk to you as in that many many have benefitted, and that includes us as well.> > Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.> > [sanjay Rath:] That’s not right...at least people who read this will think. Let’s say Shiva worship on Mondays. Shiva is the pratyadhi devata of the Sun and is not worshipped on Sundays but on Mondays. NOTE – a day after Sunday! Similarly Narayana is the pratyadhi devata of Mercury and is worshipped on Thursdays instead of Wednesdays. NOTE – again a day after! So what happened to the energy equation? J> > Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.> > [sanjay Rath:] To this I can agree as many have not understood even the basics of Sanatana dharma! Some behave as if there is a battle going on between Shiva and Vishnu – it’s hilarious to see how these are just attempts to convert Hinduism into a religion they have left rather than trying to learn what Hinduism means. Being newly converted there is a bellicose patriotism in them to prove their faith to the *new god* they have found and every other God must be the devil in disguise!! It will take years for many to learn that there is no devil. It’s a figment of their imagination and whatever is devilish is the dark side of mankind himself.> > * * *> > > Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless> > > and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for> > > the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman> > > when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can> > > take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to> > > write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic> > > seers.> > [sanjay Rath:] I got your point here. It’s a good point. > > Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing. You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from Parashara? > > I also know what argument you will give me - J You will say I am already working on that and have some spare time to do this as well...to which I will have nothing to say.>

 

- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

sohamsa ; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

Cc: vedic astrology ;

Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:03 PM

On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)

 

Dear Sanjay,

 

> Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that

 

I do have a definition of gandanta, which is Parasara's definition in BPHS.

 

Since some of you are extrapolating it based on the fire embodied in UL and water embodied in tithis, the onus is on you to outline and justify your definition. I got into this thread because statements were made that fasting on particular weekdays or tithis in a chart can cause "insult to Vishnu", "serious doshas" and "danger to spouse", based on these far-fetched extrapolations of gandanta.

 

> Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.

 

Well, you once taught that houses represent Sun/Shiva/truth and arudhas represent Moon/Gouri/perception. That was meaningful. Now, you associated UL, an arudha, with Sun and fire and 12th, a house, with Gouri and water. I question whether the new theory on fasting is really in line with everything you have learnt (and taught).

 

BTW, I specifically asked for a clarification on whether this was based on your own thinking or from classics/parampara (see quoted mail below for the full context). Like so many times with similar questions I asked privately and recently publicly, you did not respond.

 

* * *

 

> Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus

> and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by

> Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and

> not of much consequence.

 

First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.

 

For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.

 

Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.

 

Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.

 

Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.

 

Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.

 

Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.

 

* * *

 

> Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless

> and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for

> the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman

> when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can

> take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to

> write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic

> seers.

 

I did not say it is "useless". Instead, I suggest that our ability to use it is limited and we should take our limitations into consideration.

 

The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness), many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

However, this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to one who does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully in a mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolved and hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely rare today. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do not work for them as they are supposed to.

 

* * *

 

Just repeating a combination of sounds does not guarantee anything. Some people may think that certain results come when they repeat a mantra certain number of times. That is an incorrect notion. A mantra may work for one person quickly and another may spend the whole life chanting it and nothing may happen. Absorption of the entire mind into a mantra is needed for a mantra to really work and it is much more difficult than one may think.

 

* * *

 

A highly learned scholar in the court of a king may be able to command the king and get whatever he wants from king. An incapable one is better off begging the king, rather than trying to command (and failing for sure).

 

Similarly, most people are better off begging god for what they want rather than trying to use the right mantra to command what they want. A beggar does not need a huge vocabulary or great scholarship or knowledge. Feeling of humility and helplessness, surrender, patience and persistence are what help a beggar succeed. A beggar needs the right attitude rather than knowledge. In this age and time, best bet for most people is to learn to be a good beggar at god's door.

 

What people today need for material and spiritual progress through remedial measures is a better attitude in begging god rather than a better choice of tools such as mantras and other specifics such as weekday, tithi etc to command a specific result from god.

 

It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc. *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.

 

* * *

 

One more thing. We have many mantras given by rishis, but the guidelines from rishis like Parasara on how to pick a mantra based on the horoscope are very limited. Astrologers today do not operate solely based on them. They use all kinds of other rules coming from various traditions. They are not free from corruption and imperfection. Most scriptures associate various mantras with various results, irrespective of horoscope. For example, irrespective of who is the 6th lord and 8th lord and lord of A6 and A8, Rina Vimochaka Angaraka mantra is good for debt control. And so on. Linking of horoscope is overplayed by today's astrologers, way beyond the scope of Parasara's guidelines.

 

If one has a sadguru, I recommend following the word of sadguru rather than that of an astrology theoretician.

 

If not, there is no foolproof way to know the right path. Pick any path (given by an astrologer or one that you feel attracted to) instead of wasting time and then keep working on your attitude. The latter is the key. As I said earlier, learn to be a humble beggar at god's door. Choice of Mantra is secondary and attitude is primary. If you succeed in being a really humble beggar, you stand a better chance of success than great scholars.

 

 

Any prasiddha mantra (e.g. ashtakshari, panchakshari, dwadasakshari, navakshari, vishnu sahasranaam, rudram, hare krishna maha mantra, chandipath, ganapati atharva seersham, mrityunjaya mantra etc) can help one make progress if one develops the right attitude. Without the right attitude, even an impeaccably picked mantra will do nothing.

 

* * *

 

I hope this sufficiently clarifies my stand. I discuss these matters related to spiritual sadhana more on the . Some writings are sampled at http://www.vedicastrologer.org/homam/writings.htm.

 

Best regards,NarasimhaDo a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpanaSpirituality: Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org

 

om paramesthi gurave namah

 

Dear Narasimha,

 

Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that and continue with my belief of the junction between Agni and Jala rasi as the case of gandanta and the loka junctions. Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.

 

Two statements you have made contradict standard texts on Jyotish and Mantra Shastra. Please correct me if I am not understanding you well out here -

 

1. Statement 1: *fasting on any day or any tithi* is good so long as the sankalpa has been made for the devata you intend to pray to. Results maybe a bit delayed but will be there.2. Statement 2: *reciting any prayer* will give the desired effects for any ailment we wish to remedy

 

Is this what you intended to say or did I get this wrong?

 

Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and not of much consequence. This sounds like another astrologer I had known some time back whose statements like this coerced me to write Vedic Remedies in Astrology so that people are not misled but such pretexts to knowledge.

 

Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic seers.

 

I think there is something wrong in the way you are saying what you want to say. Please rethink and correct your statements for the sake of good record in this list.

 

With Warm Regards

Sanjay Rath

http://srath.com http://sohamsa.com http://.org

15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India

 

-

Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

sohamsa

Sunday, February 08, 2009 12:03 PM

Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING

 

Namaste Sanjay and friends,

 

My answers are in red and prefixed with "[Narasimha]".

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?

> > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] We always say that houses (truth) are represented by Sun (aatman) and arudha padas (maya) by Moon (mind).

 

Thus, 12th house is the actual creator and UL is the apparent creator in the field of maya. Houses (truth) should actually be associated with Sun (aatman) and Shiva (and not Gouri), while arudha padas (perception) should actually be associated with Moon (mind) and Gouri. After all, that is what we do in the tripod method in dasa judgment.

 

Thus, it is actually more logical to say that 12th house and 12th lord imbibe the agni tattva of Sun and UL and UL lord imbibe the jala tattva of Moon.

 

Is the above "*more correct* answer" based on your own thinking or is it from a classic or from tradition?

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

> The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Well, if one cannot fast, then one is destined to expend some energy on digestion after all and not focus all energy on the mantra. But the bottomline is that shastras say that one should meditate either without or with very little food (niraahaaro mitaahaaro). In any case, I hope we agree that meditation sessions after heavy eating are heavily restrained in effectiveness.

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<< Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Putting a burning match in a glass of water does indeed kill fire. But the question is of contact. If I am thinking of fire in my mind while standing in water, it does not kill the fire. There is no contact.

 

My point is that the examples given have no real identifiable contact between water and fire.

 

One can be creative and come up with a lot of theories. For example, one can say that Moon and Venus are jala tattva and all rasis show agni tattva (then why are some rasis marked as agni rasis and some as water rasis etc) and hence the sign occupied by Moon and Venus cause contact between water and fire. Then one can say fasting on the weekdays of the dispositors of Moon and Venus causes gandanta and serious danger.

 

It is not enough to show some fire and some water. See what counts as contact. Otherwise, one will engage in illogical extrapolations.

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

 

[Narasimha] Nothing is permanent. What is one's cannot be taken away. And one cannot cling on to what is not one's. Some rejoice when it seems like something comes and cry when it seems like something leaves. Some impassionately observe as things seem to come and go and do what they see as their dharma with the things they seem to have.

Just a factual correction though: I never said I was leaving Jyotish. For a few years after my spiritual master entered my life, my interest in other things went down (though I continued to do other things) and my focus on spiritual sadhana intensified. So I said that my interest in Jyotish was very low. However, my guru gave me a task later. He wanted me to study the teachings of Parasara independently, meditate on them and share my interpretations with the world. He said I was very passionate in my Jyotish activities earlier, and he wanted me to do the same now but dispassionately and without an attachment. He felt that I still have a contribution to make to Jyotish and wants me to do it as an unattached karma. His word is everything for me.

 

What I told you recently is not that I was leaving Jyotish but what I said above.

 

However, if your judgment is correct and if Jyotish is indeed "leaving" me, I am sure my spiritual guru will realize it sooner or later and change his command to me.

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] This is a gross exaggeration.

 

Is all that is being taught and practiced now strictly from "Puranas and other teachings of the seers"?

 

I did not say all days and tithis are the same. Of course, there is some difference. But, it is not as big as being made here.

 

To make khoa, whether one uses cow milk or buffalo milk or milk of a brown cow or a black cow or a Jersey cow or another cow does make some difference. But it is secondary. To say that "danger" and "serious doshas" (see the quoted mails for such claims) can be caused by a wrong choice is wrong. To say that a wrong choice means khoa will take 100 years to make is also a gross exaggeration.

 

The main thing is that you need milk and sugar. If one is confused by endless claims of khoa making consultants and ends up not making khoa at all, that will be sad. In such a case, one can simply pick some milk or the other, take sugar and start cooking khoa. It will take an extra half hour, but the job will be done.

 

I request Jyotishis to behave responsibly and humbly and not engage in scare-mongering and say that a speicifc austerity (fasting on a specific weekday or tithi in a chart) can cause "danger" and "serious doshas". No wonder some spiritual teachers look down upon Jyotish and dismiss it. Such unbalanced attitude and self-importance from us does not help our cause!

 

Yes, Jyotish is helpful, but let us not oversell it or overplay the importance...

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Of course, brahmacharya is much more, but also very difficult for most. Even physical celibacy is a good enough austerity. Physical celibacy over an extended period of time increases the efficacy of other austerities such as fasting, mouna vrata, meditation and homam.

 

Best regards,NarasimhaDo a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpanaSpirituality: Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org

sohamsa , "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath wrote:>> om paramesthi gurave namah> > Dear Narasimha> > Just added a few thoughts and questions since we are on the topic of spirituality, which is not my forte. So I am always seeking to learn.> > With Warm Regards> > Sanjay Rath> > http://srath.com http://sohamsa.com http://.org> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of Narasimha PVR Rao> 06 February 2009 00:48> sohamsa > Cc: > Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING> > Namaste friends,> > I would like to express my reservations on a couple of issues. It is funny that I should be typing this email on an Ekadashi day, when many Vaishnavas fast irrespective of their horoscopes.> > [sanjay Rath:] I write on dvadasi when so many vasihnava also fast and keep great austerities. J Any difference?> > > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > My dear Zoran, please allow me to express my disagreement.> > Austerities can never be seen as an insult to Vishnu. Self-deprivation of 2nd house matters such as food (fasting) or speech (mouna vrata - vow of silence) are austerities. Giving up food or speech is not an insult to Vishnu just as giving up sex (i.e. brahmacharya) is not an insult to Sukracharya (Venus).> > [sanjay Rath:] I though Brahma was very angry that his sons decided not to have progeny and stayed celibate. So He created others. Why was Brahma angry when his sons remained celibate? Why should Sukracharya be angry if someone is celibate? How is it an insult or not an insult to Sukracharya? You are taking planet signification of Venus for 7H ...and linking this to creation process...which is wrong Narasimha. Brahma is seen from lords of dusthana 6, 8 and 12 from lagna or 7th which is....you know this.There is nothing wrong with the 7th house as it is necessary for procreation. It is only the link of this with the Brahma graha that causes it to become a serious shad-ripu. Married people are as eligible for moksha as unmarried ones and bachelors. It depends on the following of dharma and ashrama.> > Various gods bestow various things on us, some at the gross physical level and some at the subtle spiritual level. As we overcome our dependendency on gross things, we make progress at the subtle level.> > If one eats food, a good amount of internal fire (and subtle internal energy associated with it) is used for digesting it and for generating physical energy from it. If one fasts, that subtle energy is unused and available for other things. This is a tremendous benefit. As a result, one can better digest mantras and spiritual food available all around one.> > The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.> > > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?> > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.> > Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.> > Now one more thing: Marriage is a yoga between two souls and why not suggest fasting on the yoga day of the UL lord?> > [sanjay Rath:] What! What a brilliant suggestion...why don’t you start it? > > * * *> > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > Picking tithi based on house (12th house - Dwadashi, 4th house - Chaturthi) is illogical as there are 12 houses only and more tithis.> I have realized one thing over the years - If something is not structurally sound, it is most likely false knowledge.> > [sanjay Rath:] J No comments> > * * *> > I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.> > If you keep such a vrata sincerely, you will make positive progress towards achieving your purpose and definitely not go backwards, irrespective of what is said by technical calculations based on our half-baked Jyotish knowledge.> > * * *> > My friends, use the Jyotish knowledge available, but do realize that it is imperfect and corrupted. Why is only the UL lord important? So many planets may have so many kinds of influence on UL in a chart. And UL is one of several factors showing marriage. There may be various influences in a chart showing marriage. Is our thumb rule of using UL lord's weekday missing some important factors? Quite possible!> > [sanjay Rath:] That is a very nasty statement. Once again you have used adjectives (*imperfect, corrupted*) which is not becoming of you. Why must you use nasty statements? Can’t you say things nicely? > > Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence. > > If you have the time to listen to the Jaimini Lectures at http://sohamsa.com/js/ do so as it will show you the depths of this knowledge you cannot imagine exists in jyotish. The derivation of the chnhandas and what not all. Thumb rules are meant for beginners. The day you decided to give up jyotish, you got stuck in the thumb rules but then its ok with me. I always wished you the best in whatever you do.> > But, despite some arbitrariness and imperfection, if a thumb rule allows you to pick an austerity with confidence and create the mental feeling that you are doing the best possible thing for your situation, it is good. After all, what is critical is to do *some* austerity to burn the blocking karma, with a positive frame of mind about what you are doing.> > [sanjay Rath:] No Narasimha, very happy marriages can happen, without austerities as well.> > But, if endless theorization and complicated technicalities evolving from the thumb rule are creating doubts and confusion in the minds of people as they consider an austerity, that is useless and totally missing the point.> > Some people tend to resort to heavy theorization based on very shaky grounds. I suggest going back to the basics, thinking clearly and keeping things simple.> > [sanjay Rath:] Human brains work differently in seeking the truth and means to remedy the errors. Life is too complicated to keep everything simple. For example, a heavily cursed Venus can block everything and UL fast may not be able to solve the problem. Now would you say that heavy thoerization and complication is happening and we should ignore the other factors completely?> > Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.> > Best regards,> Narasimha> -------------------------> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpana> Spirituality: > Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org> ------------------------- > > sohamsa <sohamsa%40> , Ajay Zharotia <ajayzharotia@> wrote:> > ||Om Gurave Namah||> > > > Dear Swee, & jyotishis> > > > What Zoran is saying is right. Do not mix the energy of day lord > > (Agni) by choosing the same tithi (jala) that will create serious > > troubles for the spouse.> > Let me explain the principle in a simple way so that there should not > > be any confusion.> > > > In your chart (Swee) Vrishabha lagna, UL is in 2nd house. So lord of > > the UL is the Mercury. Since fasting is prohibited for UL in 2nd > > house see where the lord of the UL has gone. In your case mercury has > > gone to the 11th house hence it is Ekadashi. So rule is to choose the > > tithi is based on the placement of the UL lord.> > > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > > > If you are doing fasting on the basis of tithis it should be done in > > sukla paksha only. But if you are doing in Krishna paksha (Pitris) > > also then it should be combined with the donation.> > > > I hope this will clarify the principal.> > > > Best Regards> > > > Ajay Zharotia> > ajayzharotia@> > > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:51 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran wrote:> > > > > || Om Gurave Namah ||> > > Dear Swee,> > > Can you please tell me the exact rule to use for fasting on > > > tithi?.Do we use the 12th lord tithi?, Like if you are Ta lagna, > > > there 2 tithi one on Triteeya (3) and Ekadasha(11). If we consider > > > only the paksh in which u are born.> > > Now of the two which to use?.> > >> > > Warm Regards> > > Sanjay p> > >> > > 2009/2/3 Swee Chan <swee@>> > > Jaya Jagannatha> > >> > > Dear Hari, Zoki, et al in this discussion,> > > Namaste> > >> > > The tongue in cheek, I'll excuse ;-)) it's my laugh for the day!!> > > I fast on ekadasi tithi because my UL is in 2nd house (ie 12th lord > > > is in lagna). Since I was born on sukla paksha, Sanjay ji suggests > > > that I fast only on sukla ekadasi.> > > Zoki, if you listen to JUS of Year I, you will note how Sanjay ji > > > came to this conclusion.> > >> > > love,> > >> > > Swee> > >> > > On 3 Feb 2009, at 15:25, Jyotisa Shisya wrote:> > >> > >> |om|> > >> Dear Zoran, namaste> > >>> > >> Would not the general act of fasting be construed as an insult to > > >> Sri MahaVishnu?> > >>> > >> best regards> > >> Hari> > >>> > >> On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 5:30 PM, ahimsavm <ahimsans@> > > >> wrote:> > >> Om Namah Shivaya,> > >> Dear Bojan and others,> > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > >> The simple solution is to do vrata which do not conflict with> > >> rejection of food. So a person may observe the fast on UL in 2nd> > >> day, however, adequate food should be offered as a prasad and eaten> > >> before the Sunrise (not complete fast).In this way, results may come> > >> a bit later, but will certainly come, while a person will not bring> > >> insult to Shri Vishnu by rejecting the food.> > >> This is the way I was taught, and ofcourse others may agree or not.> > >> Best wishes> > >> Zoran Radosavljevic> > >> www.siva-edu.info> > >> www.ahimsazr1.wordpress.com

[Guest guest]

Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Narasimhaaaaaaaaa,This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).I agree: fixing of attitude is needed. 'Questionable sources'? Lets not lose our manners now.Jyotish is the study of time. Right weekday, right tithi etc. is important for Jyotish. Why deny or try to downplay this and promote your own preaching? Do you feel that your skills and proficiency in the subject are lacking so you attack the subject instead of addressing your own shortcomings? You made a bold prediction about the US Presidential election, when it was totally wrong you blamed the birth data despite explicitly stating that you had verified the times satisfactorily. We are all here to learn. But don't start a vendetta against the vedanga.Here is a nice quote about psychological projection:"Psychological projection is a defense mechanism in which one attributes one's own unacceptable or unwanted thoughts

and/or emotions to others. It occurs when a person's own unacceptable or threatening feelings are repressed and then attributed to someone else."An example of such simple behavior would be: blame for failure, making an excuse for your own faults by projecting the cause of said failure onto someone else, hence blaming them and not accepting the reality of the failure."Projection reduces anxiety by allowing the expression of the unwanted subconscious impulses or desires without letting the conscious mind recognize them".The source? The mystical and occult wikipaedia!Warm regards,MichalNarasimha P.V.R. Rao <pvr ; vedic astrology ; ; sohamsa Sent: Monday, 2 March, 2009 11:12:45 AM Re: On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)

 



Dear Sanjay,

 

> Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc.

> It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this.

 

Some may be fascinated by the texture, color and volume of the chaff and miss the grain.

 

Most people who talk about mantra shastra focus on the chaff and not on the grain.

 

> You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from?

> How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many

> mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is

> *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should

> always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I

> also disagee with him/her.

 

I mentioned the above with respect to the need of thousands of mantras and technicalities. If one does not want to command god and wants to be a beggar who will take whatever is given, there is no need for thousands of mantras and all the umpteen technicalities. These thousands of mantras and umpteen technicalities are for commanding thousands of different results from god. That is why I talked of commanding vs begging. However, this commanding works slightly differently than one may imagine. I will elaborate.

 

Also, commanding god is NOT black magic. Commanding low level beings is black magic, which can be accomplished even by a person not quite elevated spiritually and suffering from a heavy ego. However, commanding higher beings such as gods is possible only for a spiritually elevated person with no or extremely small ego. This commanding that I am referring to is not an egoistic achievement. In fact, an egoist cannot achieve it. Only a person succeeding in completely effacing individual ego can achieve this commanding! I will repeat something from the previous mail to clarify:

 

 

The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

Each set of "karmic interactions between various objects" is a "result". Various mantras are for various "results". One may term merging self-awareness in a mantra fully and getting a specific result from it as "commanding a result" from god. Whether you like the term or not, it is essentially that.

 

* * *

 

But the bottomline is this: Only a highly purified sadhaka of very low ego can command specific results from god (not for selfishness or even ego satisfaction, but acting as an unattached instrument of Nature fulfilling one's dharma set by Nature). Various mantras and technicalities of mantra shastra taught by rishis are meant for such sadhakas.

 

Those are hardly of use to so many people out there with dense egos seeking specific selfish results. They cannot command specific results from god (because of their heavy attachment to the result, which is in turn due to their own attachment to a limited ego), even if they use all the techniques of mantra shastra and all the associated rules of astrology. Instead of wasting their time with these technicalities, they will be better off learning to be good beggars at God's door.

 

Just pick any prasiddha mantra or a mantra you feel attracted to, without worrying about so many technicalities, and learn to be humble and surrender to the Lord. Patiently wait for him to give you what you want. Like a beggar, take whatever and whenever he gives.

 

Keep praying every day or every second when you are able to. Even when you are not praying, remember him in all of your actions. When you enjoy something in the material world, tell yourself that it is his and that he gave it to you. If you remember him all the time, slowly the dirt in your mind will start to get cleaned. This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).

 

* * *

 

There may be a mountain with thousands of paths (mantra) for climbing it. Each path may lead to a different spot (different experience) on the top and show a different scenery (result). Expert advisors (astrologers) may tell you to use a specific path (mantra) to see a specific scenery (result). But such advice is useless to a handicapped person without legs (a selfish person with dense ego). It is relevant only to person with legs and one who is strong and sturdy, who can successfully climb the mountain (a reasonably detached person with very little ego).

 

Even when you encounter a person who has legs and can actually climb the mountain, the stress should be on how to climb the mountain and traverse the long path, rather than which path to take. The astrologers who are bogged down by all the technicalities and people who take customized mantra advice from astrologers and think that they will get a result quickly by doing that 'powerful' mantra are missing the basic point. The power of a powerful mantra is with respect to the experience and result obtained *after* one succeeds with the mantra. A partcicularly powerful mantra is akin to a path leading to a point atop the mountain where the view shows a particularly beautiful scenery. But the bottomline is that you do have to survive the climb along the long path.

 

We need to emphasize the attitude and approach needed for the long climb, rather than emphasizing the choice of the path based on horoscope. It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc!!!! *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.

 

 

* * *

 

> when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone

> wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this

> worship should be done?

You can do anyday. Parasara does not mention any day for doing homam to a graha.

 

In fact, if one wants, one can do a homam or worship to Mars (or any planet) every day. It is even better that way.

 

If an astrologer suggests doing it on a Tuesday, it is fine. But saying that doing it on so and so day will bring serious dangers because Mars is an enemy of so and so planet would be stretching things.

 

> [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his

> knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?

From Self - from within. That is the source of all knowledge. A sadguru need not specifically teach thousand things, but needs to open the door inside.

 

* * *

 

> OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,

> 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni

> and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.

 

Parasara's definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in a contiguous space having a predominance of fire and water elements. "I see fire and I see water. So there is gandanta" is a wrong approach. One can then call Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery planet, being in a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a contiguous space.

 

In your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no contiguous space where there is a water-fire transition.

 

> Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing.

> You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and

> are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from

> Parashara?

Well, Me10, Ve7 etc theory is based on marrying two different teachings of Parasara (bhava karakas and special lagnas). I do not really consider it as my creation but as understanding Parasara's teachings only.

 

Best regards,Narasimha------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpanaSpirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdomFree Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

sohamsa@ .com, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath wrote:>> om paramesthi gurave namah> > Dear Narasimha,> > I read this mail twice. OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg, 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni and jala...I want to her your words if you have any. You keep saying Parasara says so and yet there is nothing forthcoming.> > The rashi is associated with the Aditya as the rashi come into existence because of the Sun, which is the agni tattva. Vara is also agni tattva among the panchanga of Jyotisha. That is why Vaara is related to rashi. Karma has been advised in the vaara of the lords of the rashi or the hora of the lords of the rashi related to a bhaava and for this reason, fasting and other such karma related to rashi are also based on this. [see Prashna Marga for details].> > Moon is the significator of the Aroodha. It is the *emotional content* related to the maya manifestation of everything in life. Suffering is caused as we do not fathom the karma associated that resulted in suffering and fasting is a a means of self punishment and correction related to the raashi where the aroodha is. Just as Agni has the purity to burn the root of sin, fasting on vaara related to the UL is surely going to cleanse the sins associated with the suffering in it. While this may not give a 100% satisfaction as the *moon* content has not been addressed, at least the initiation of the aroodha occurs and people find their partners, get married and get along with life. Proof lies in the pudding and with so many cases where people have fasted on UL days and have got result, we have found faith in these teachings reinforced. Why fast? Fasting on vaara is a means to correcting the flaw associated with the raashi. Raashi is a quantity and hence it is related to the material effects of the bhava and that is what people are looking for when they come to th astrologer. You have done well to recall my teachings in this – remember what I taught – Men should worship a female deity and women shold worship a male deity for the UL fasting. I wonder if they really follow this.> > Why not give fasting at night instead of day? Sun is always good for the Upapada (Jaimini etc) and that is why we have limited this to day fasting and not night fasting as well or 24 hour fast. This is my interpolation. [ satisfied J ] Elders would have given long periods of fast starting from the vaara, like keeping 21 days fast for the birth of child! You think I should be doing that! You think anyone will lsiten. Try it yourself before asking me to advise those hard penance kind of fasts.> > Who says the Moon has nothing to do with the arudha. It is the sustainer. Now people to an astrologer when they are looking for getting married and hardly anyone comes these days asking for prolonging marriage. Either they want to get into one or get out of one and into another...astrologe rs these days are relegated to helping people make these transitions painless and fast. Of course some have come and I have not failed them. I have a ready shloka for this – start from Taurus in Hamsa gati:> > Gouri, Kaali, Uma, Bhadraa, Durga, Kanti, Saraswati> > Mangalaa, Vaishnavi, Lakshmi, Shivaa, Naraayani> > See I have them ready for the 12 signs in Hamsa Gati from the mool trikona of Moon in hamsa gati> > Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc. It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this. > > You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from? How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I also disagee with him/her.> > Prasiddha mantras always give result, even without initiation and who knows how ready a person is for initation. So I prefer sticking to prasiddha mantras with people who do not have initiations. This is there in VRA also.> > I have some questions where I have doubts about what you say. It is below your mail.> > With Warm Regards> > Sanjay Rath> > http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> 15 February 2009 09:34> sohamsa@ .com; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> Cc: vedic astrology; > On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)> >  > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus> > > and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by> > > Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and> > > not of much consequence.> > First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.> > For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.> > [sanjay Rath:] what about the Puranas? Have you gone through the Navagraha mantras given in the Garuda Purana and other puranic literature?> > Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.> > [sanjay Rath:] If Amavasya dosha is to be performed on Amavasya, when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this worship should be done?> > Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.> > [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?> > Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.> > [sanjay Rath:] I am sorry. I missed the context and just saw some mails that were forwarded to me amidst my writing. But them its always a pleasure to talk to you as in that many many have benefitted, and that includes us as well.> > Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.> > [sanjay Rath:] That’s not right...at least people who read this will think. Let’s say Shiva worship on Mondays. Shiva is the pratyadhi devata of the Sun and is not worshipped on Sundays but on Mondays. NOTE – a day after Sunday! Similarly Narayana is the pratyadhi devata of Mercury and is worshipped on Thursdays instead of Wednesdays. NOTE – again a day after! So what happened to the energy equation? J> > Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.> > [sanjay Rath:] To this I can agree as many have not understood even the basics of Sanatana dharma! Some behave as if there is a battle going on between Shiva and Vishnu – it’s hilarious to see how these are just attempts to convert Hinduism into a religion they have left rather than trying to learn what Hinduism means. Being newly converted there is a bellicose patriotism in them to prove their faith to the *new god* they have found and every other God must be the devil in disguise!! It will take years for many to learn that there is no devil. It’s a figment of their imagination and whatever is devilish is the dark side of mankind himself.> > * * *> > > Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless> > > and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for> > > the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman> > > when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can> > > take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to> > > write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic> > > seers.> > [sanjay Rath:] I got your point here. It’s a good point. > > Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing. You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from Parashara? > > I also know what argument you will give me - J You will say I am already working on that and have some spare time to do this as well...to which I will have nothing to say.>

 

- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

sohamsa@ .com ; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

Cc: vedic astrology ;

Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:03 PM

On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)

 

Dear Sanjay,

 

> Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that

 

I do have a definition of gandanta, which is Parasara's definition in BPHS.

 

Since some of you are extrapolating it based on the fire embodied in UL and water embodied in tithis, the onus is on you to outline and justify your definition. I got into this thread because statements were made that fasting on particular weekdays or tithis in a chart can cause "insult to Vishnu", "serious doshas" and "danger to spouse", based on these far-fetched extrapolations of gandanta.

 

> Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.

 

Well, you once taught that houses represent Sun/Shiva/truth and arudhas represent Moon/Gouri/percepti on. That was meaningful. Now, you associated UL, an arudha, with Sun and fire and 12th, a house, with Gouri and water. I question whether the new theory on fasting is really in line with everything you have learnt (and taught).

 

BTW, I specifically asked for a clarification on whether this was based on your own thinking or from classics/parampara (see quoted mail below for the full context). Like so many times with similar questions I asked privately and recently publicly, you did not respond.

 

* * *

 

> Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus

> and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by

> Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and

> not of much consequence.

 

First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.

 

For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.

 

Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.

 

Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.

 

Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.

 

Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.

 

Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.

 

* * *

 

> Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless

> and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for

> the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman

> when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can

> take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to

> write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic

> seers.

 

I did not say it is "useless". Instead, I suggest that our ability to use it is limited and we should take our limitations into consideration.

 

The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

However, this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to one who does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully in a mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolved and hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely rare today. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do not work for them as they are supposed to.

 

* * *

 

Just repeating a combination of sounds does not guarantee anything. Some people may think that certain results come when they repeat a mantra certain number of times. That is an incorrect notion. A mantra may work for one person quickly and another may spend the whole life chanting it and nothing may happen. Absorption of the entire mind into a mantra is needed for a mantra to really work and it is much more difficult than one may think.

 

* * *

 

A highly learned scholar in the court of a king may be able to command the king and get whatever he wants from king. An incapable one is better off begging the king, rather than trying to command (and failing for sure).

 

Similarly, most people are better off begging god for what they want rather than trying to use the right mantra to command what they want. A beggar does not need a huge vocabulary or great scholarship or knowledge. Feeling of humility and helplessness, surrender, patience and persistence are what help a beggar succeed. A beggar needs the right attitude rather than knowledge. In this age and time, best bet for most people is to learn to be a good beggar at god's door.

 

What people today need for material and spiritual progress through remedial measures is a better attitude in begging god rather than a better choice of tools such as mantras and other specifics such as weekday, tithi etc to command a specific result from god.

 

It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc. *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.

 

* * *

 

One more thing. We have many mantras given by rishis, but the guidelines from rishis like Parasara on how to pick a mantra based on the horoscope are very limited. Astrologers today do not operate solely based on them. They use all kinds of other rules coming from various traditions. They are not free from corruption and imperfection. Most scriptures associate various mantras with various results, irrespective of horoscope. For example, irrespective of who is the 6th lord and 8th lord and lord of A6 and A8, Rina Vimochaka Angaraka mantra is good for debt control. And so on. Linking of horoscope is overplayed by today's astrologers, way beyond the scope of Parasara's guidelines.

 

If one has a sadguru, I recommend following the word of sadguru rather than that of an astrology theoretician.

 

If not, there is no foolproof way to know the right path. Pick any path (given by an astrologer or one that you feel attracted to) instead of wasting time and then keep working on your attitude. The latter is the key. As I said earlier, learn to be a humble beggar at god's door. Choice of Mantra is secondary and attitude is primary. If you succeed in being a really humble beggar, you stand a better chance of success than great scholars.

 

 

Any prasiddha mantra (e.g. ashtakshari, panchakshari, dwadasakshari, navakshari, vishnu sahasranaam, rudram, hare krishna maha mantra, chandipath, ganapati atharva seersham, mrityunjaya mantra etc) can help one make progress if one develops the right attitude. Without the right attitude, even an impeaccably picked mantra will do nothing.

 

* * *

 

I hope this sufficiently clarifies my stand. I discuss these matters related to spiritual sadhana more on the . Some writings are sampled at http://www.vedicast rologer.org/ homam/writings. htm.

 

Best regards,Narasimha------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpanaSpirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdomFree Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

 

om paramesthi gurave namah

 

Dear Narasimha,

 

Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that and continue with my belief of the junction between Agni and Jala rasi as the case of gandanta and the loka junctions. Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.

 

Two statements you have made contradict standard texts on Jyotish and Mantra Shastra. Please correct me if I am not understanding you well out here -

 

1. Statement 1: *fasting on any day or any tithi* is good so long as the sankalpa has been made for the devata you intend to pray to. Results maybe a bit delayed but will be there.2. Statement 2: *reciting any prayer* will give the desired effects for any ailment we wish to remedy

 

Is this what you intended to say or did I get this wrong?

 

Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and not of much consequence. This sounds like another astrologer I had known some time back whose statements like this coerced me to write Vedic Remedies in Astrology so that people are not misled but such pretexts to knowledge.

 

Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic seers.

 

I think there is something wrong in the way you are saying what you want to say. Please rethink and correct your statements for the sake of good record in this list.

 

With Warm Regards

Sanjay Rath

http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org

15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India

 

-

Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

sohamsa@ .com

Sunday, February 08, 2009 12:03 PM

Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING

 

Namaste Sanjay and friends,

 

My answers are in red and prefixed with "[Narasimha] ".

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?

> > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] We always say that houses (truth) are represented by Sun (aatman) and arudha padas (maya) by Moon (mind).

 

Thus, 12th house is the actual creator and UL is the apparent creator in the field of maya. Houses (truth) should actually be associated with Sun (aatman) and Shiva (and not Gouri), while arudha padas (perception) should actually be associated with Moon (mind) and Gouri. After all, that is what we do in the tripod method in dasa judgment.

 

Thus, it is actually more logical to say that 12th house and 12th lord imbibe the agni tattva of Sun and UL and UL lord imbibe the jala tattva of Moon.

 

Is the above "*more correct* answer" based on your own thinking or is it from a classic or from tradition?

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

> The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Well, if one cannot fast, then one is destined to expend some energy on digestion after all and not focus all energy on the mantra. But the bottomline is that shastras say that one should meditate either without or with very little food (niraahaaro mitaahaaro). In any case, I hope we agree that meditation sessions after heavy eating are heavily restrained in effectiveness.

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<< Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Putting a burning match in a glass of water does indeed kill fire. But the question is of contact. If I am thinking of fire in my mind while standing in water, it does not kill the fire. There is no contact.

 

My point is that the examples given have no real identifiable contact between water and fire.

 

One can be creative and come up with a lot of theories. For example, one can say that Moon and Venus are jala tattva and all rasis show agni tattva (then why are some rasis marked as agni rasis and some as water rasis etc) and hence the sign occupied by Moon and Venus cause contact between water and fire. Then one can say fasting on the weekdays of the dispositors of Moon and Venus causes gandanta and serious danger.

 

It is not enough to show some fire and some water. See what counts as contact. Otherwise, one will engage in illogical extrapolations.

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

 

[Narasimha] Nothing is permanent. What is one's cannot be taken away. And one cannot cling on to what is not one's. Some rejoice when it seems like something comes and cry when it seems like something leaves. Some impassionately observe as things seem to come and go and do what they see as their dharma with the things they seem to have.

Just a factual correction though: I never said I was leaving Jyotish. For a few years after my spiritual master entered my life, my interest in other things went down (though I continued to do other things) and my focus on spiritual sadhana intensified. So I said that my interest in Jyotish was very low. However, my guru gave me a task later. He wanted me to study the teachings of Parasara independently, meditate on them and share my interpretations with the world. He said I was very passionate in my Jyotish activities earlier, and he wanted me to do the same now but dispassionately and without an attachment. He felt that I still have a contribution to make to Jyotish and wants me to do it as an unattached karma. His word is everything for me.

 

What I told you recently is not that I was leaving Jyotish but what I said above.

 

However, if your judgment is correct and if Jyotish is indeed "leaving" me, I am sure my spiritual guru will realize it sooner or later and change his command to me.

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] This is a gross exaggeration.

 

Is all that is being taught and practiced now strictly from "Puranas and other teachings of the seers"?

 

I did not say all days and tithis are the same. Of course, there is some difference. But, it is not as big as being made here.

 

To make khoa, whether one uses cow milk or buffalo milk or milk of a brown cow or a black cow or a Jersey cow or another cow does make some difference. But it is secondary. To say that "danger" and "serious doshas" (see the quoted mails for such claims) can be caused by a wrong choice is wrong. To say that a wrong choice means khoa will take 100 years to make is also a gross exaggeration.

 

The main thing is that you need milk and sugar. If one is confused by endless claims of khoa making consultants and ends up not making khoa at all, that will be sad. In such a case, one can simply pick some milk or the other, take sugar and start cooking khoa. It will take an extra half hour, but the job will be done.

 

I request Jyotishis to behave responsibly and humbly and not engage in scare-mongering and say that a speicifc austerity (fasting on a specific weekday or tithi in a chart) can cause "danger" and "serious doshas". No wonder some spiritual teachers look down upon Jyotish and dismiss it. Such unbalanced attitude and self-importance from us does not help our cause!

 

Yes, Jyotish is helpful, but let us not oversell it or overplay the importance.. .

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Of course, brahmacharya is much more, but also very difficult for most. Even physical celibacy is a good enough austerity. Physical celibacy over an extended period of time increases the efficacy of other austerities such as fasting, mouna vrata, meditation and homam.

 

Best regards,Narasimha------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpanaSpirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdomFree Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

sohamsa@ .com, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath wrote:>> om paramesthi gurave namah> > Dear Narasimha> > Just added a few thoughts and questions since we are on the topic of spirituality, which is not my forte. So I am always seeking to learn.> > With Warm Regards> > Sanjay Rath> > http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha PVR Rao> 06 February 2009 00:48> sohamsa@ .com> Cc: > Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING> > Namaste friends,> > I would like to express my reservations on a couple of issues. It is funny that I should be typing this email on an Ekadashi day, when many Vaishnavas fast irrespective of their horoscopes.> > [sanjay Rath:] I write on dvadasi when so many vasihnava also fast and keep great austerities. J Any difference?> > > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > My dear Zoran, please allow me to express my disagreement.> > Austerities can never be seen as an insult to Vishnu. Self-deprivation of 2nd house matters such as food (fasting) or speech (mouna vrata - vow of silence) are austerities. Giving up food or speech is not an insult to Vishnu just as giving up sex (i.e. brahmacharya) is not an insult to Sukracharya (Venus).> > [sanjay Rath:] I though Brahma was very angry that his sons decided not to have progeny and stayed celibate. So He created others. Why was Brahma angry when his sons remained celibate? Why should Sukracharya be angry if someone is celibate? How is it an insult or not an insult to Sukracharya? You are taking planet signification of Venus for 7H ...and linking this to creation process...which is wrong Narasimha. Brahma is seen from lords of dusthana 6, 8 and 12 from lagna or 7th which is....you know this.There is nothing wrong with the 7th house as it is necessary for procreation. It is only the link of this with the Brahma graha that causes it to become a serious shad-ripu. Married people are as eligible for moksha as unmarried ones and bachelors. It depends on the following of dharma and ashrama.> > Various gods bestow various things on us, some at the gross physical level and some at the subtle spiritual level. As we overcome our dependendency on gross things, we make progress at the subtle level.> > If one eats food, a good amount of internal fire (and subtle internal energy associated with it) is used for digesting it and for generating physical energy from it. If one fasts, that subtle energy is unused and available for other things. This is a tremendous benefit. As a result, one can better digest mantras and spiritual food available all around one.> > The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.> > > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?> > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.> > Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.> > Now one more thing: Marriage is a yoga between two souls and why not suggest fasting on the yoga day of the UL lord?> > [sanjay Rath:] What! What a brilliant suggestion.. .why don’t you start it? > > * * *> > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > Picking tithi based on house (12th house - Dwadashi, 4th house - Chaturthi) is illogical as there are 12 houses only and more tithis.> I have realized one thing over the years - If something is not structurally sound, it is most likely false knowledge.> > [sanjay Rath:] J No comments> > * * *> > I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.> > If you keep such a vrata sincerely, you will make positive progress towards achieving your purpose and definitely not go backwards, irrespective of what is said by technical calculations based on our half-baked Jyotish knowledge.> > * * *> > My friends, use the Jyotish knowledge available, but do realize that it is imperfect and corrupted. Why is only the UL lord important? So many planets may have so many kinds of influence on UL in a chart. And UL is one of several factors showing marriage. There may be various influences in a chart showing marriage. Is our thumb rule of using UL lord's weekday missing some important factors? Quite possible!> > [sanjay Rath:] That is a very nasty statement. Once again you have used adjectives (*imperfect, corrupted*) which is not becoming of you. Why must you use nasty statements? Can’t you say things nicely? > > Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence. > > If you have the time to listen to the Jaimini Lectures at http://sohamsa. com/js/ do so as it will show you the depths of this knowledge you cannot imagine exists in jyotish. The derivation of the chnhandas and what not all. Thumb rules are meant for beginners. The day you decided to give up jyotish, you got stuck in the thumb rules but then its ok with me. I always wished you the best in whatever you do.> > But, despite some arbitrariness and imperfection, if a thumb rule allows you to pick an austerity with confidence and create the mental feeling that you are doing the best possible thing for your situation, it is good. After all, what is critical is to do *some* austerity to burn the blocking karma, with a positive frame of mind about what you are doing.> > [sanjay Rath:] No Narasimha, very happy marriages can happen, without austerities as well.> > But, if endless theorization and complicated technicalities evolving from the thumb rule are creating doubts and confusion in the minds of people as they consider an austerity, that is useless and totally missing the point.> > Some people tend to resort to heavy theorization based on very shaky grounds. I suggest going back to the basics, thinking clearly and keeping things simple.> > [sanjay Rath:] Human brains work differently in seeking the truth and means to remedy the errors. Life is too complicated to keep everything simple. For example, a heavily cursed Venus can block everything and UL fast may not be able to solve the problem. Now would you say that heavy thoerization and complication is happening and we should ignore the other factors completely?> > Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.> > Best regards,> Narasimha> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > sohamsa@ .com <sohamsa% 40. com> , Ajay Zharotia <ajayzharotia@> wrote:> > ||Om Gurave Namah||> > > > Dear Swee, & jyotishis> > > > What Zoran is saying is right. Do not mix the energy of day lord > > (Agni) by choosing the same tithi (jala) that will create serious > > troubles for the spouse.> > Let me explain the principle in a simple way so that there should not > > be any confusion.> > > > In your chart (Swee) Vrishabha lagna, UL is in 2nd house. So lord of > > the UL is the Mercury. Since fasting is prohibited for UL in 2nd > > house see where the lord of the UL has gone. In your case mercury has > > gone to the 11th house hence it is Ekadashi. So rule is to choose the > > tithi is based on the placement of the UL lord.> > > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > > > If you are doing fasting on the basis of tithis it should be done in > > sukla paksha only. But if you are doing in Krishna paksha (Pitris) > > also then it should be combined with the donation.> > > > I hope this will clarify the principal.> > > > Best Regards> > > > Ajay Zharotia> > ajayzharotia@> > > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:51 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran wrote:> > > > > || Om Gurave Namah ||> > > Dear Swee,> > > Can you please tell me the exact rule to use for fasting on > > > tithi?.Do we use the 12th lord tithi?, Like if you are Ta lagna, > > > there 2 tithi one on Triteeya (3) and Ekadasha(11) . If we consider > > > only the paksh in which u are born.> > > Now of the two which to use?.> > >> > > Warm Regards> > > Sanjay p> > >> > > 2009/2/3 Swee Chan <swee@>> > > Jaya Jagannatha> > >> > > Dear Hari, Zoki, et al in this discussion,> > > Namaste> > >> > > The tongue in cheek, I'll excuse ;-)) it's my laugh for the day!!> > > I fast on ekadasi tithi because my UL is in 2nd house (ie 12th lord > > > is in lagna). Since I was born on sukla paksha, Sanjay ji suggests > > > that I fast only on sukla ekadasi.> > > Zoki, if you listen to JUS of Year I, you will note how Sanjay ji > > > came to this conclusion.> > >> > > love,> > >> > > Swee> > >> > > On 3 Feb 2009, at 15:25, Jyotisa Shisya wrote:> > >> > >> |om|> > >> Dear Zoran, namaste> > >>> > >> Would not the general act of fasting be construed as an insult to > > >> Sri MahaVishnu?> > >>> > >> best regards> > >> Hari> > >>> > >> On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 5:30 PM, ahimsavm <ahimsans@> > > >> wrote:> > >> Om Namah Shivaya,> > >> Dear Bojan and others,> > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > >> The simple solution is to do vrata which do not conflict with> > >> rejection of food. So a person may observe the fast on UL in 2nd> > >> day, however, adequate food should be offered as a prasad and eaten> > >> before the Sunrise (not complete fast).In this way, results may come> > >> a bit later, but will certainly come, while a person will not bring> > >> insult to Shri Vishnu by rejecting the food.> > >> This is the way I was taught, and ofcourse others may agree or not.> > >> Best wishes> > >> Zoran Radosavljevic> > >> www.siva-edu. info> > >> www.ahimsazr1. wordpress. com

 

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Dear Michal

 

 

Can you show us ONE jyotish, ANYONE, who has NEVER made a wrong prediction?

 

-Regards

Rajarshi

 

The upsurge (of consciousness) is Bhairava - Shiva Sutra--- On Mon, 2/3/09, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal wrote:

Michal Dziwulski <nearmichalRe: Re: On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)sohamsa Date: Monday, 2 March, 2009, 4:57 AM

 

 

 

 

Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Narasimhaaaaaaaaa,This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).I agree: fixing of attitude is needed. 'Questionable sources'? Lets not lose our manners now.Jyotish is the study of time. Right weekday, right tithi etc. is important for Jyotish. Why deny or try to downplay this and promote your own preaching? Do you feel that your skills and proficiency in the subject are lacking so you attack the subject instead of addressing your own shortcomings? You made a bold prediction about the US Presidential election, when it was totally wrong you blamed the birth data despite explicitly stating that you had verified the times satisfactorily. We are all here to learn. But don't

start a vendetta against the vedanga.Here is a nice quote about psychological projection:"Psychological projection is a defense mechanism in which one attributes one's own unacceptable or unwanted thoughts and/or emotions to others. It occurs when a person's own unacceptable or threatening feelings are repressed and then attributed to someone else."An example of such simple behavior would be: blame for failure, making an excuse for your own faults by projecting the cause of said failure onto someone else, hence blaming them and not accepting the reality of the failure."Projection reduces anxiety by allowing the expression of the unwanted subconscious impulses or desires without letting the conscious mind recognize them".The source? The mystical and occult wikipaedia!Warm regards,Michal

 

 

 

Narasimha P.V.R. Rao <pvr (AT) charter (DOT) net>; vedic astrology; ; sohamsa@ .comMonday, 2 March, 2009 11:12:45 AM Re: On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)

 



Dear Sanjay,

 

> Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc.

> It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this.

 

Some may be fascinated by the texture, color and volume of the chaff and miss the grain.

 

Most people who talk about mantra shastra focus on the chaff and not on the grain.

 

> You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from?

> How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many

> mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is

> *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should

> always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I

> also disagee with him/her.

 

I mentioned the above with respect to the need of thousands of mantras and technicalities. If one does not want to command god and wants to be a beggar who will take whatever is given, there is no need for thousands of mantras and all the umpteen technicalities. These thousands of mantras and umpteen technicalities are for commanding thousands of different results from god. That is why I talked of commanding vs begging. However, this commanding works slightly differently than one may imagine. I will elaborate.

 

Also, commanding god is NOT black magic. Commanding low level beings is black magic, which can be accomplished even by a person not quite elevated spiritually and suffering from a heavy ego. However, commanding higher beings such as gods is possible only for a spiritually elevated person with no or extremely small ego. This commanding that I am referring to is not an egoistic achievement. In fact, an egoist cannot achieve it. Only a person succeeding in completely effacing individual ego can achieve this commanding! I will repeat something from the previous mail to clarify:

 

 

The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

Each set of "karmic interactions between various objects" is a "result". Various mantras are for various "results". One may term merging self-awareness in a mantra fully and getting a specific result from it as "commanding a result" from god. Whether you like the term or not, it is essentially that.

 

* * *

 

But the bottomline is this: Only a highly purified sadhaka of very low ego can command specific results from god (not for selfishness or even ego satisfaction, but acting as an unattached instrument of Nature fulfilling one's dharma set by Nature). Various mantras and technicalities of mantra shastra taught by rishis are meant for such sadhakas.

 

Those are hardly of use to so many people out there with dense egos seeking specific selfish results. They cannot command specific results from god (because of their heavy attachment to the result, which is in turn due to their own attachment to a limited ego), even if they use all the techniques of mantra shastra and all the associated rules of astrology. Instead of wasting their time with these technicalities, they will be better off learning to be good beggars at God's door.

 

Just pick any prasiddha mantra or a mantra you feel attracted to, without worrying about so many technicalities, and learn to be humble and surrender to the Lord. Patiently wait for him to give you what you want. Like a beggar, take whatever and whenever he gives.

 

Keep praying every day or every second when you are able to. Even when you are not praying, remember him in all of your actions. When you enjoy something in the material world, tell yourself that it is his and that he gave it to you. If you remember him all the time, slowly the dirt in your mind will start to get cleaned. This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).

 

* * *

 

There may be a mountain with thousands of paths (mantra) for climbing it. Each path may lead to a different spot (different experience) on the top and show a different scenery (result). Expert advisors (astrologers) may tell you to use a specific path (mantra) to see a specific scenery (result). But such advice is useless to a handicapped person without legs (a selfish person with dense ego). It is relevant only to person with legs and one who is strong and sturdy, who can successfully climb the mountain (a reasonably detached person with very little ego).

 

Even when you encounter a person who has legs and can actually climb the mountain, the stress should be on how to climb the mountain and traverse the long path, rather than which path to take. The astrologers who are bogged down by all the technicalities and people who take customized mantra advice from astrologers and think that they will get a result quickly by doing that 'powerful' mantra are missing the basic point. The power of a powerful mantra is with respect to the experience and result obtained *after* one succeeds with the mantra. A partcicularly powerful mantra is akin to a path leading to a point atop the mountain where the view shows a particularly beautiful scenery. But the bottomline is that you do have to survive the climb along the long path.

 

We need to emphasize the attitude and approach needed for the long climb, rather than emphasizing the choice of the path based on horoscope. It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc!!!! *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.

 

 

* * *

 

> when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone

> wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this

> worship should be done?

You can do anyday. Parasara does not mention any day for doing homam to a graha.

 

In fact, if one wants, one can do a homam or worship to Mars (or any planet) every day. It is even better that way.

 

If an astrologer suggests doing it on a Tuesday, it is fine. But saying that doing it on so and so day will bring serious dangers because Mars is an enemy of so and so planet would be stretching things.

 

> [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his

> knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?

From Self - from within. That is the source of all knowledge. A sadguru need not specifically teach thousand things, but needs to open the door inside.

 

* * *

 

> OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,

> 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni

> and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.

 

Parasara's definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in a contiguous space having a predominance of fire and water elements. "I see fire and I see water. So there is gandanta" is a wrong approach. One can then call Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery planet, being in a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a contiguous space.

 

In your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no contiguous space where there is a water-fire transition.

 

> Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing.

> You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and

> are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from

> Parashara?

Well, Me10, Ve7 etc theory is based on marrying two different teachings of Parasara (bhava karakas and special lagnas). I do not really consider it as my creation but as understanding Parasara's teachings only.

 

Best regards,Narasimha------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpanaSpirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdomFree Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

sohamsa@ .com, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath wrote:>> om paramesthi gurave namah> > Dear Narasimha,> > I read this mail twice. OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg, 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni and jala...I want to her your words if you have any. You keep saying Parasara says so and yet there is nothing forthcoming.> > The rashi is associated with the Aditya as the rashi come into existence because of the Sun, which is the agni tattva. Vara is also agni tattva among the panchanga of Jyotisha. That is why Vaara is related to rashi. Karma has been advised in the vaara of the lords of the rashi or the hora of the lords of the rashi related to a bhaava and for this reason, fasting and other such karma related

to rashi are also based on this. [see Prashna Marga for details].> > Moon is the significator of the Aroodha. It is the *emotional content* related to the maya manifestation of everything in life. Suffering is caused as we do not fathom the karma associated that resulted in suffering and fasting is a a means of self punishment and correction related to the raashi where the aroodha is. Just as Agni has the purity to burn the root of sin, fasting on vaara related to the UL is surely going to cleanse the sins associated with the suffering in it. While this may not give a 100% satisfaction as the *moon* content has not been addressed, at least the initiation of the aroodha occurs and people find their partners, get married and get along with life. Proof lies in the pudding and with so many cases where people have fasted on UL days and have got result, we have found faith in these teachings reinforced. Why fast? Fasting on vaara is a means to

correcting the flaw associated with the raashi. Raashi is a quantity and hence it is related to the material effects of the bhava and that is what people are looking for when they come to th astrologer. You have done well to recall my teachings in this – remember what I taught – Men should worship a female deity and women shold worship a male deity for the UL fasting. I wonder if they really follow this.> > Why not give fasting at night instead of day? Sun is always good for the Upapada (Jaimini etc) and that is why we have limited this to day fasting and not night fasting as well or 24 hour fast. This is my interpolation. [ satisfied J ] Elders would have given long periods of fast starting from the vaara, like keeping 21 days fast for the birth of child! You think I should be doing that! You think anyone will lsiten. Try it yourself before asking me to advise those hard penance kind of fasts.> > Who says the

Moon has nothing to do with the arudha. It is the sustainer. Now people to an astrologer when they are looking for getting married and hardly anyone comes these days asking for prolonging marriage. Either they want to get into one or get out of one and into another...astrologe rs these days are relegated to helping people make these transitions painless and fast. Of course some have come and I have not failed them. I have a ready shloka for this – start from Taurus in Hamsa gati:> > Gouri, Kaali, Uma, Bhadraa, Durga, Kanti, Saraswati> > Mangalaa, Vaishnavi, Lakshmi, Shivaa, Naraayani> > See I have them ready for the 12 signs in Hamsa Gati from the mool trikona of Moon in hamsa gati> > Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc. It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this. > > You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now

where did that come from? How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I also disagee with him/her.> > Prasiddha mantras always give result, even without initiation and who knows how ready a person is for initation. So I prefer sticking to prasiddha mantras with people who do not have initiations. This is there in VRA also.> > I have some questions where I have doubts about what you say. It is below your mail.> > With Warm Regards> > Sanjay Rath> > http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> 15 February 2009 09:34> sohamsa@ .com; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> Cc: vedic astrology; > On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)> >  > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus> > > and has no relevance as the remedial measures

prescribed by> > > Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and> > > not of much consequence.> > First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.> > For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.> > [sanjay Rath:] what about the Puranas? Have you gone through the Navagraha mantras given in the Garuda Purana and other puranic literature?> > Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g.

planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.> > [sanjay Rath:] If Amavasya dosha is to be performed on Amavasya, when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this worship should be done?> > Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.> > [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?> > Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to

spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.> > [sanjay Rath:] I am sorry. I missed the context and just saw some mails that were forwarded to me amidst my writing. But them its always a pleasure to talk to you as in that many many have benefitted, and that includes us as well.> > Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a

rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.> > [sanjay Rath:] That’s not right...at least people who read this will think. Let’s say Shiva worship on Mondays. Shiva is the pratyadhi devata of the Sun and is not worshipped on Sundays but on Mondays. NOTE – a day after Sunday! Similarly Narayana is the pratyadhi devata of Mercury and is worshipped on Thursdays instead of Wednesdays. NOTE – again a day after! So what happened to the energy equation? J> > Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I

question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.> > [sanjay Rath:] To this I can agree as many have not understood even the basics of Sanatana dharma! Some behave as if there is a battle going on between Shiva and Vishnu – it’s hilarious to see how these are just attempts to convert Hinduism into a religion they have left rather than trying to learn what Hinduism means. Being newly converted there is a bellicose patriotism in them to prove their faith to the *new god* they have found and every other God must be the devil in disguise!! It will take years for many to learn that there is no devil. It’s a figment of their imagination and whatever is devilish is the dark side of mankind himself.> > * * *> > > Statement 2 is an arrogance

that the entire mantra shastra is useless> > > and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for> > > the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman> > > when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can> > > take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to> > > write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic> > > seers.> > [sanjay Rath:] I got your point here. It’s a good point. > > Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing. You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from Parashara? > > I also know what argument you will give me - J You will say I am already working on that and have

some spare time to do this as well...to which I will have nothing to say.>

 

- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

sohamsa@ .com ; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

Cc: vedic astrology ;

Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:03 PM

On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)

 

Dear Sanjay,

 

> Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that

 

I do have a definition of gandanta, which is Parasara's definition in BPHS.

 

Since some of you are extrapolating it based on the fire embodied in UL and water embodied in tithis, the onus is on you to outline and justify your definition. I got into this thread because statements were made that fasting on particular weekdays or tithis in a chart can cause "insult to Vishnu", "serious doshas" and "danger to spouse", based on these far-fetched extrapolations of gandanta.

 

> Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.

 

Well, you once taught that houses represent Sun/Shiva/truth and arudhas represent Moon/Gouri/percepti on. That was meaningful. Now, you associated UL, an arudha, with Sun and fire and 12th, a house, with Gouri and water. I question whether the new theory on fasting is really in line with everything you have learnt (and taught).

 

BTW, I specifically asked for a clarification on whether this was based on your own thinking or from classics/parampara (see quoted mail below for the full context). Like so many times with similar questions I asked privately and recently publicly, you did not respond.

 

* * *

 

> Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus

> and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by

> Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and

> not of much consequence.

 

First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.

 

For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.

 

Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.

 

Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.

 

Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.

 

Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.

 

Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.

 

* * *

 

> Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless

> and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for

> the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman

> when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can

> take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to

> write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic

> seers.

 

I did not say it is "useless". Instead, I suggest that our ability to use it is limited and we should take our limitations into consideration.

 

The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

However, this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to one who does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully in a mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolved and hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely rare today. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do not work for them as they are supposed to.

 

* * *

 

Just repeating a combination of sounds does not guarantee anything. Some people may think that certain results come when they repeat a mantra certain number of times. That is an incorrect notion. A mantra may work for one person quickly and another may spend the whole life chanting it and nothing may happen. Absorption of the entire mind into a mantra is needed for a mantra to really work and it is much more difficult than one may think.

 

* * *

 

A highly learned scholar in the court of a king may be able to command the king and get whatever he wants from king. An incapable one is better off begging the king, rather than trying to command (and failing for sure).

 

Similarly, most people are better off begging god for what they want rather than trying to use the right mantra to command what they want. A beggar does not need a huge vocabulary or great scholarship or knowledge. Feeling of humility and helplessness, surrender, patience and persistence are what help a beggar succeed. A beggar needs the right attitude rather than knowledge. In this age and time, best bet for most people is to learn to be a good beggar at god's door.

 

What people today need for material and spiritual progress through remedial measures is a better attitude in begging god rather than a better choice of tools such as mantras and other specifics such as weekday, tithi etc to command a specific result from god.

 

It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc. *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.

 

* * *

 

One more thing. We have many mantras given by rishis, but the guidelines from rishis like Parasara on how to pick a mantra based on the horoscope are very limited. Astrologers today do not operate solely based on them. They use all kinds of other rules coming from various traditions. They are not free from corruption and imperfection. Most scriptures associate various mantras with various results, irrespective of horoscope. For example, irrespective of who is the 6th lord and 8th lord and lord of A6 and A8, Rina Vimochaka Angaraka mantra is good for debt control. And so on. Linking of horoscope is overplayed by today's astrologers, way beyond the scope of Parasara's guidelines.

 

If one has a sadguru, I recommend following the word of sadguru rather than that of an astrology theoretician.

 

If not, there is no foolproof way to know the right path. Pick any path (given by an astrologer or one that you feel attracted to) instead of wasting time and then keep working on your attitude. The latter is the key. As I said earlier, learn to be a humble beggar at god's door. Choice of Mantra is secondary and attitude is primary. If you succeed in being a really humble beggar, you stand a better chance of success than great scholars.

 

 

Any prasiddha mantra (e.g. ashtakshari, panchakshari, dwadasakshari, navakshari, vishnu sahasranaam, rudram, hare krishna maha mantra, chandipath, ganapati atharva seersham, mrityunjaya mantra etc) can help one make progress if one develops the right attitude. Without the right attitude, even an impeaccably picked mantra will do nothing.

 

* * *

 

I hope this sufficiently clarifies my stand. I discuss these matters related to spiritual sadhana more on the . Some writings are sampled at http://www.vedicast rologer.org/ homam/writings. htm.

 

Best regards,Narasimha------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpanaSpirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdomFree Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

 

om paramesthi gurave namah

 

Dear Narasimha,

 

Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that and continue with my belief of the junction between Agni and Jala rasi as the case of gandanta and the loka junctions. Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.

 

Two statements you have made contradict standard texts on Jyotish and Mantra Shastra. Please correct me if I am not understanding you well out here -

 

1. Statement 1: *fasting on any day or any tithi* is good so long as the sankalpa has been made for the devata you intend to pray to. Results maybe a bit delayed but will be there.2. Statement 2: *reciting any prayer* will give the desired effects for any ailment we wish to remedy

 

Is this what you intended to say or did I get this wrong?

 

Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and not of much consequence. This sounds like another astrologer I had known some time back whose statements like this coerced me to write Vedic Remedies in Astrology so that people are not misled but such pretexts to knowledge.

 

Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic seers.

 

I think there is something wrong in the way you are saying what you want to say. Please rethink and correct your statements for the sake of good record in this list.

 

With Warm Regards

Sanjay Rath

http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org

15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India

 

-

Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

sohamsa@ .com

Sunday, February 08, 2009 12:03 PM

Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING

 

Namaste Sanjay and friends,

 

My answers are in red and prefixed with "[Narasimha] ".

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?

> > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct*

answer.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] We always say that houses (truth) are represented by Sun (aatman) and arudha padas (maya) by Moon (mind).

 

Thus, 12th house is the actual creator and UL is the apparent creator in the field of maya. Houses (truth) should actually be associated with Sun (aatman) and Shiva (and not Gouri), while arudha padas (perception) should actually be associated with Moon (mind) and Gouri. After all, that is what we do in the tripod method in dasa judgment.

 

Thus, it is actually more logical to say that 12th house and 12th lord imbibe the agni tattva of Sun and UL and UL lord imbibe the jala tattva of Moon.

 

Is the above "*more correct* answer" based on your own thinking or is it from a classic or from tradition?

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

> The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Well, if one cannot fast, then one is destined to expend some energy on digestion after all and not focus all energy on the mantra. But the bottomline is that shastras say that one should meditate either without or with very little food (niraahaaro mitaahaaro). In any case, I hope we agree that meditation sessions after heavy eating are heavily restrained in effectiveness.

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<< Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Putting a burning match in a glass of water does indeed kill fire. But the question is of contact. If I am thinking of fire in my mind while standing in water, it does not kill the fire. There is no contact.

 

My point is that the examples given have no real identifiable contact between water and fire.

 

One can be creative and come up with a lot of theories. For example, one can say that Moon and Venus are jala tattva and all rasis show agni tattva (then why are some rasis marked as agni rasis and some as water rasis etc) and hence the sign occupied by Moon and Venus cause contact between water and fire. Then one can say fasting on the weekdays of the dispositors of Moon and Venus causes gandanta and serious danger.

 

It is not enough to show some fire and some water. See what counts as contact. Otherwise, one will engage in illogical extrapolations.

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

 

[Narasimha] Nothing is permanent. What is one's cannot be taken away. And one cannot cling on to what is not one's. Some rejoice when it seems like something comes and cry when it seems like something leaves. Some impassionately observe as things seem to come and go and do what they see as their dharma with the things they seem to have.

Just a factual correction though: I never said I was leaving Jyotish. For a few years after my spiritual master entered my life, my interest in other things went down (though I continued to do other things) and my focus on spiritual sadhana intensified. So I said that my interest in Jyotish was very low. However, my guru gave me a task later. He wanted me to study the teachings of Parasara independently, meditate on them and share my interpretations with the world. He said I was very passionate in my Jyotish activities earlier, and he wanted me to do the same now but dispassionately and without an attachment. He felt that I still have a contribution to make to Jyotish and wants me to do it as an unattached karma. His word is everything for me.

 

What I told you recently is not that I was leaving Jyotish but what I said above.

 

However, if your judgment is correct and if Jyotish is indeed "leaving" me, I am sure my spiritual guru will realize it sooner or later and change his command to me.

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra

(any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] This is a gross exaggeration.

 

Is all that is being taught and practiced now strictly from "Puranas and other teachings of the seers"?

 

I did not say all days and tithis are the same. Of course, there is some difference. But, it is not as big as being made here.

 

To make khoa, whether one uses cow milk or buffalo milk or milk of a brown cow or a black cow or a Jersey cow or another cow does make some difference. But it is secondary. To say that "danger" and "serious doshas" (see the quoted mails for such claims) can be caused by a wrong choice is wrong. To say that a wrong choice means khoa will take 100 years to make is also a gross exaggeration.

 

The main thing is that you need milk and sugar. If one is confused by endless claims of khoa making consultants and ends up not making khoa at all, that will be sad. In such a case, one can simply pick some milk or the other, take sugar and start cooking khoa. It will take an extra half hour, but the job will be done.

 

I request Jyotishis to behave responsibly and humbly and not engage in scare-mongering and say that a speicifc austerity (fasting on a specific weekday or tithi in a chart) can cause "danger" and "serious doshas". No wonder some spiritual teachers look down upon Jyotish and dismiss it. Such unbalanced attitude and self-importance from us does not help our cause!

 

Yes, Jyotish is helpful, but let us not oversell it or overplay the importance.. .

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.

>>>>>> End quote >>>>>>

 

[Narasimha] Of course, brahmacharya is much more, but also very difficult for most. Even physical celibacy is a good enough austerity. Physical celibacy over an extended period of time increases the efficacy of other austerities such as fasting, mouna vrata, meditation and homam.

 

Best regards,Narasimha------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpanaSpirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdomFree Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan

nath.org------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

sohamsa@ .com, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath wrote:>> om paramesthi gurave namah> > Dear Narasimha> > Just added a few thoughts and questions since we are on the topic of spirituality, which is not my forte. So I am always seeking to learn.> > With Warm Regards> > Sanjay Rath> > http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On

Behalf Of Narasimha PVR Rao> 06 February 2009 00:48> sohamsa@ .com> Cc: > Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING> > Namaste friends,> > I would like to express my reservations on a couple of issues. It is funny that I should be typing this email on an Ekadashi day, when many Vaishnavas fast irrespective of their horoscopes.> > [sanjay Rath:] I write on dvadasi when so many vasihnava also fast and keep great austerities. J Any difference?> > > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to

Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > My dear Zoran, please allow me to express my disagreement.> > Austerities can never be seen as an insult to Vishnu. Self-deprivation of 2nd house matters such as food (fasting) or speech (mouna vrata - vow of silence) are austerities. Giving up food or speech is not an insult to Vishnu just as giving up sex (i.e. brahmacharya) is not an insult to Sukracharya (Venus).> > [sanjay Rath:] I though Brahma was very angry that his sons decided not to have progeny and stayed celibate. So He created others. Why was Brahma angry when his sons remained celibate? Why should Sukracharya be angry if someone is celibate? How is it an insult or not an insult to Sukracharya? You are taking planet signification of Venus for 7H ...and linking this to creation process...which is wrong Narasimha. Brahma is seen from lords of dusthana 6, 8 and 12 from lagna or 7th which is....you know

this.There is nothing wrong with the 7th house as it is necessary for procreation. It is only the link of this with the Brahma graha that causes it to become a serious shad-ripu. Married people are as eligible for moksha as unmarried ones and bachelors. It depends on the following of dharma and ashrama.> > Various gods bestow various things on us, some at the gross physical level and some at the subtle spiritual level. As we overcome our dependendency on gross things, we make progress at the subtle level.> > If one eats food, a good amount of internal fire (and subtle internal energy associated with it) is used for digesting it and for generating physical energy from it. If one fasts, that subtle energy is unused and available for other things. This is a tremendous benefit. As a result, one can better digest mantras and spiritual food available all around one.> > The mantra one meditates with at the end of a

day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.> > > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> >

>> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?> > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!>

> [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.> > Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.> > Now one more thing: Marriage is a yoga between two souls and why not suggest fasting on the yoga day of the UL lord?> > [sanjay Rath:] What! What a brilliant

suggestion.. .why don’t you start it? > > * * *> > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > Picking tithi based on house (12th house - Dwadashi, 4th house - Chaturthi) is illogical as there are 12 houses only and more tithis.> I have realized one thing over the years - If something is not structurally sound, it is most likely false knowledge.> > [sanjay Rath:] J No comments> > * * *> > I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end

of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.> > If you keep such a vrata

sincerely, you will make positive progress towards achieving your purpose and definitely not go backwards, irrespective of what is said by technical calculations based on our half-baked Jyotish knowledge.> > * * *> > My friends, use the Jyotish knowledge available, but do realize that it is imperfect and corrupted. Why is only the UL lord important? So many planets may have so many kinds of influence on UL in a chart. And UL is one of several factors showing marriage. There may be various influences in a chart showing marriage. Is our thumb rule of using UL lord's weekday missing some important factors? Quite possible!> > [sanjay Rath:] That is a very nasty statement. Once again you have used adjectives (*imperfect, corrupted*) which is not becoming of you. Why must you use nasty statements? Can’t you say things nicely? > > Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you

told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence. > > If you have the time to listen to the Jaimini Lectures at http://sohamsa. com/js/ do so as it will show you the depths of this knowledge you cannot imagine exists in jyotish. The derivation of the chnhandas and what not all. Thumb rules are meant for beginners. The day you decided to give up jyotish, you got stuck in the thumb rules but then its ok with me. I always wished you the best in whatever you do.> > But, despite some arbitrariness and imperfection, if a thumb rule allows you to pick an austerity with confidence and create the mental feeling that you are doing the best possible thing for your

situation, it is good. After all, what is critical is to do *some* austerity to burn the blocking karma, with a positive frame of mind about what you are doing.> > [sanjay Rath:] No Narasimha, very happy marriages can happen, without austerities as well.> > But, if endless theorization and complicated technicalities evolving from the thumb rule are creating doubts and confusion in the minds of people as they consider an austerity, that is useless and totally missing the point.> > Some people tend to resort to heavy theorization based on very shaky grounds. I suggest going back to the basics, thinking clearly and keeping things simple.> > [sanjay Rath:] Human brains work differently in seeking the truth and means to remedy the errors. Life is too complicated to keep everything simple. For example, a heavily cursed Venus can block everything and UL fast may not be able to solve the problem. Now would

you say that heavy thoerization and complication is happening and we should ignore the other factors completely?> > Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.> > Best regards,> Narasimha> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/

homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > sohamsa@ .com <sohamsa% 40. com> , Ajay Zharotia <ajayzharotia@> wrote:> > ||Om Gurave Namah||> > > > Dear Swee, & jyotishis> > > > What Zoran is saying is right. Do not mix the energy of day lord > > (Agni) by choosing the same tithi (jala) that will create serious > > troubles for the spouse.> > Let me explain the principle in a simple way so that there should not > > be any confusion.> > > > In your chart (Swee) Vrishabha lagna, UL is in 2nd house. So lord of > > the UL is the Mercury. Since fasting is prohibited for UL in 2nd > > house see where the lord of the UL has gone. In your case mercury has > > gone to the 11th house hence it is Ekadashi. So rule is to choose the > > tithi is based on the placement of the UL

lord.> > > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > > > If you are doing fasting on the basis of tithis it should be done in > > sukla paksha only. But if you are doing in Krishna paksha (Pitris) > > also then it should be combined with the donation.> > > > I hope this will clarify the principal.> > > > Best Regards> > > > Ajay Zharotia> > ajayzharotia@> > > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:51 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran wrote:> > > > > || Om Gurave Namah ||> > > Dear Swee,> > > Can you please tell me the exact rule to use for

fasting on > > > tithi?.Do we use the 12th lord tithi?, Like if you are Ta lagna, > > > there 2 tithi one on Triteeya (3) and Ekadasha(11) . If we consider > > > only the paksh in which u are born.> > > Now of the two which to use?.> > >> > > Warm Regards> > > Sanjay p> > >> > > 2009/2/3 Swee Chan <swee@>> > > Jaya Jagannatha> > >> > > Dear Hari, Zoki, et al in this discussion,> > > Namaste> > >> > > The tongue in cheek, I'll excuse ;-)) it's my laugh for the day!!> > > I fast on ekadasi tithi because my UL is in 2nd house (ie 12th lord > > > is in lagna). Since I was born on sukla paksha, Sanjay ji suggests > > > that I fast only on sukla ekadasi.> > > Zoki, if you listen to JUS of Year I, you will note

how Sanjay ji > > > came to this conclusion.> > >> > > love,> > >> > > Swee> > >> > > On 3 Feb 2009, at 15:25, Jyotisa Shisya wrote:> > >> > >> |om|> > >> Dear Zoran, namaste> > >>> > >> Would not the general act of fasting be construed as an insult to > > >> Sri MahaVishnu?> > >>> > >> best regards> > >> Hari> > >>> > >> On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 5:30 PM, ahimsavm <ahimsans@> > > >> wrote:> > >> Om Namah Shivaya,> > >> Dear Bojan and others,> > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > >> 2nd

house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > >> The simple solution is to do vrata which do not conflict with> > >> rejection of food. So a person may observe the fast on UL in 2nd> > >> day, however, adequate food should be offered as a prasad and eaten> > >> before the Sunrise (not complete fast).In this way, results may come> > >> a bit later, but will certainly come, while a person will not bring> > >>

insult to Shri Vishnu by rejecting the food.> > >> This is the way I was taught, and ofcourse others may agree or not.> > >> Best wishes> > >> Zoran Radosavljevic> > >> www.siva-edu. info> > >> www.ahimsazr1. wordpress. comGet the world's best email - Xtra Mail

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Namaste,

 

> > This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the

> > right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable

> > knowledge coming from questionable sources!).> > I agree: fixing of attitude is needed. 'Questionable sources'?Â

> Lets not lose our manners now.

 

If reliable and unquestionable sources can be mentioned for claims that fasting on certain weekdays or tithis brings "insult to Vishnu", "serious doshas" and "danger to spouse", I can reconsider my statement.

 

> But don't start a vendetta against the vedanga.

 

This is not a vendetta against the vedanga, but a pushback on a mindless spree of over-theorization and over-selling of unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources, which is corrupting the vedanga.

Best regards,NarasimhaDo a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpanaSpirituality: Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org

sohamsa , rajarshi nandy <rajarshi14 wrote:>> Dear Michal>  >  > Can you show us ONE jyotish, ANYONE, who has NEVER made a wrong prediction? >  > -Regards>  Rajarshi> > > > The upsurge (of consciousness) is Bhairava - Shiva Sutra> > --- On Mon, 2/3/09, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal wrote:> > > Hare Rama Krsna ||> > Dear Narasimhaaaaaaaaa,> > This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).> > I agree: fixing of attitude is needed. 'Questionable sources'? Lets not lose our manners now.> > Jyotish is the study of time. Right weekday, right tithi etc. is important for Jyotish. Why deny or try to downplay this and promote your own preaching? Do you feel that your skills and proficiency in the subject are lacking so you attack the subject instead of addressing your own shortcomings? You made a bold prediction about the US Presidential election, when it was totally wrong you blamed the birth data despite explicitly stating that you had verified the times satisfactorily. We are all here to learn. But don't start a vendetta against the vedanga.> > Here is a nice quote about psychological projection:> > "Psychological projection is a defense mechanism in which one attributes one's own unacceptable or unwanted thoughts and/or emotions to others. It occurs when a person's own unacceptable or threatening feelings are repressed and then attributed to someone else.> "An example of such simple behavior would be: blame for failure, making an excuse for your own faults by projecting the cause of said failure onto someone else, hence blaming them and not accepting the reality of the failure.> "Projection reduces anxiety by allowing the expression of the unwanted subconscious impulses or desires without letting the conscious mind recognize them".> > The source? The mystical and occult wikipaedia!> > Warm regards,> Michal> > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao <pvr (AT) charter (DOT) net>> ; vedic astrology; ; sohamsa@ .com> Monday, 2 March, 2009 11:12:45 AM> Re: On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)> > > >  > Dear Sanjay,>  > > Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc.> > It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this. >  > Some may be fascinated by the texture, color and volume of the chaff and miss the grain.>  > Most people who talk about mantra shastra focus on the chaff and not on the grain.>  > > You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from?> > How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many> > mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is> > *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should> > always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I> > also disagee with him/her.>  > I mentioned the above with respect to the need of thousands of mantras and technicalities. If one does not want to command god and wants to be a beggar who will take whatever is given, there is no need for thousands of mantras and all the umpteen technicalities. These thousands of mantras and umpteen technicalities are for commanding thousands of different results from god. That is why I talked of commanding vs begging. However, this commanding works slightly differently than one may imagine. I will elaborate.>  > Also, commanding god is NOT black magic. Commanding low level beings is black magic, which can be accomplished even by a person not quite elevated spiritually and suffering from a heavy ego. However, commanding higher beings such as gods is possible only for a spiritually elevated person with no or extremely small ego. This commanding that I am referring to is not an egoistic achievement. In fact, an egoist cannot achieve it. Only a person succeeding in completely effacing individual ego can achieve this commanding! I will repeat something from the previous mail to clarify:>  > > The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.>  > Each set of "karmic interactions between various objects" is a "result". Various mantras are for various "results". One may term merging self-awareness in a mantra fully and getting a specific result from it as "commanding a result" from god. Whether you like the term or not, it is essentially that.>  > *       *       *>  > But the bottomline is this: Only a highly purified sadhaka of very low ego can command specific results from god (not for selfishness or even ego satisfaction, but acting as an unattached instrument of Nature fulfilling one's dharma set by Nature). Various mantras and technicalities of mantra shastra taught by rishis are meant for such sadhakas.>  > Those are hardly of use to so many people out there with dense egos seeking specific selfish results. They cannot command specific results from god (because of their heavy attachment to the result, which is in turn due to their own attachment to a limited ego), even if they use all the techniques of mantra shastra and all the associated rules of astrology. Instead of wasting their time with these technicalities, they will be better off learning to be good beggars at God's door.>  > Just pick any prasiddha mantra or a mantra you feel attracted to, without worrying about so many technicalities, and learn to be humble and surrender to the Lord. Patiently wait for him to give you what you want. Like a beggar, take whatever and whenever he gives.>  > Keep praying every day or every second when you are able to. Even when you are not praying, remember him in all of your actions. When you enjoy something in the material world, tell yourself that it is his and that he gave it to you. If you remember him all the time, slowly the dirt in your mind will start to get cleaned. This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).>  > *       *       *>  > There may be a mountain with thousands of paths (mantra) for climbing it. Each path may lead to a different spot (different experience) on the top and show a different scenery (result). Expert advisors (astrologers) may tell you to use a specific path (mantra) to see a specific scenery (result). But such advice is useless to a handicapped person without legs (a selfish person with dense ego). It is relevant only to person with legs and one who is strong and sturdy, who can successfully climb the mountain (a reasonably detached person with very little ego).>  > Even when you encounter a person who has legs and can actually climb the mountain, the stress should be on how to climb the mountain and traverse the long path, rather than which path to take. The astrologers who are bogged down by all the technicalities and people who take customized mantra advice from astrologers and think that they will get a result quickly by doing that 'powerful' mantra are missing the basic point. The power of a powerful mantra is with respect to the experience and result obtained *after* one succeeds with the mantra. A partcicularly powerful mantra is akin to a path leading to a point atop the mountain where the view shows a particularly beautiful scenery. But the bottomline is that you do have to survive the climb along the long path.>  > We need to emphasize the attitude and approach needed for the long climb, rather than emphasizing the choice of the path based on horoscope. It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc!!!! *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.>  > > *       *       *>  > > when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone> > wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this> > worship should be done?>  > You can do anyday. Parasara does not mention any day for doing homam to a graha.>  > In fact, if one wants, one can do a homam or worship to Mars (or any planet) every day. It is even better that way.>  > If an astrologer suggests doing it on a Tuesday, it is fine. But saying that doing it on so and so day will bring serious dangers because Mars is an enemy of so and so planet would be stretching things.>  > > [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his> > knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?>  > From Self - from within. That is the source of all knowledge. A sadguru need not specifically teach thousand things, but needs to open the door inside.>  > *       *       *>  > > OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,> > 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni> > and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.>  > Parasara's definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in a contiguous space having a predominance of fire and water elements. "I see fire and I see water. So there is gandanta" is a wrong approach. One can then call Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery planet, being in a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a contiguous space.>  > In your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no contiguous space where there is a water-fire transition.>  > > Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing.> > You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and> > are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from> > Parashara? >  > Well, Me10, Ve7 etc theory is based on marrying two different teachings of Parasara (bhava karakas and special lagnas). I do not really consider it as my creation but as understanding Parasara's teachings only.>  > Best regards,> Narasimha> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- >  > sohamsa@ .com, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath@> wrote:> >> > om paramesthi gurave namah> > > > Dear Narasimha,> > > > I read this mail twice. OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg, 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni and jala...I want to her your words if you have any. You keep saying Parasara says so and yet there is nothing forthcoming.> > > > The rashi is associated with the Aditya as the rashi come into existence because of the Sun, which is the agni tattva. Vara is also agni tattva among the panchanga of Jyotisha. That is why Vaara is related to rashi. Karma has been advised in the vaara of the lords of the rashi or the hora of the lords of the rashi related to a bhaava and for this reason, fasting and other such karma related to rashi are also based on this. [see Prashna Marga for details].> > > > Moon is the significator of the Aroodha. It is the *emotional content* related to the maya manifestation of everything in life. Suffering is caused as we do not fathom the karma associated that resulted in suffering and fasting is a a means of self punishment and correction related to the raashi where the aroodha is. Just as Agni has the purity to burn the root of sin, fasting on vaara related to the UL is surely going to cleanse the sins associated with the suffering in it. While this may not give a 100% satisfaction as the *moon* content has not been addressed, at least the initiation of the aroodha occurs and people find their partners, get married and get along with life. Proof lies in the pudding and with so many cases where people have fasted on UL days and have got result, we have found faith in these teachings reinforced. Why fast? Fasting on vaara is a means to correcting the flaw associated with the raashi. Raashi is a quantity and hence it> is related to the material effects of the bhava and that is what people are looking for when they come to th astrologer. You have done well to recall my teachings in this – remember what I taught – Men should worship a female deity and women shold worship a male deity for the UL fasting. I wonder if they really follow this.> > > > Why not give fasting at night instead of day? Sun is always good for the Upapada (Jaimini etc) and that is why we have limited this to day fasting and not night fasting as well or 24 hour fast. This is my interpolation. [ satisfied J ] Elders would have given long periods of fast starting from the vaara, like keeping 21 days fast for the birth of child! You think I should be doing that! You think anyone will lsiten. Try it yourself before asking me to advise those hard penance kind of fasts.> > > > Who says the Moon has nothing to do with the arudha. It is the sustainer. Now people to an astrologer when they are looking for getting married and hardly anyone comes these days asking for prolonging marriage. Either they want to get into one or get out of one and into another...astrologe rs these days are relegated to helping people make these transitions painless and fast. Of course some have come and I have not failed them. I have a ready shloka for this – start from Taurus in Hamsa gati:> > > > Gouri, Kaali, Uma, Bhadraa, Durga, Kanti, Saraswati> > > > Mangalaa, Vaishnavi, Lakshmi, Shivaa, Naraayani> > > > See I have them ready for the 12 signs in Hamsa Gati from the mool trikona of Moon in hamsa gati> > > > Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc. It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this. > > > > You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from? How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I also disagee with him/her.> > > > Prasiddha mantras always give result, even without initiation and who knows how ready a person is for initation. So I prefer sticking to prasiddha mantras with people who do not have initiations. This is there in VRA also.> > > > I have some questions where I have doubts about what you say. It is below your mail.> > > > With Warm Regards> > > > Sanjay Rath> > > > http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> > > > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > > > sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> > 15 February 2009 09:34> > sohamsa@ .com; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> > Cc: vedic astrology; > > On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)> > > >  > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus> > > > > and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by> > > > > Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and> > > > > not of much consequence.> > > > First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.> > > > For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] what about the Puranas? Have you gone through the Navagraha mantras given in the Garuda Purana and other puranic literature?> > > > Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] If Amavasya dosha is to be performed on Amavasya, when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this worship should be done?> > > > Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?> > > > Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I am sorry. I missed the context and just saw some mails that were forwarded to me amidst my writing. But them its always a pleasure to talk to you as in that many many have benefitted, and that includes us as well.> > > > Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] That’s not right...at least people who read this will think. Let’s say Shiva worship on Mondays. Shiva is the pratyadhi devata of the Sun and is not worshipped on Sundays but on Mondays. NOTE – a day after Sunday! Similarly Narayana is the pratyadhi devata of Mercury and is worshipped on Thursdays instead of Wednesdays. NOTE – again a day after! So what happened to the energy equation? J> > > > Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] To this I can agree as many have not understood even the basics of Sanatana dharma! Some behave as if there is a battle going on between Shiva and Vishnu – it’s hilarious to see how these are just attempts to convert Hinduism into a religion they have left rather than trying to learn what Hinduism means. Being newly converted there is a bellicose patriotism in them to prove their faith to the *new god* they have found and every other God must be the devil in disguise!! It will take years for many to learn that there is no devil. It’s a figment of their imagination and whatever is devilish is the dark side of mankind himself.> > > > *       *       *> > > > > Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless> > > > > and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for> > > > > the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman> > > > > when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can> > > > > take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to> > > > > write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic> > > > > seers.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I got your point here. It’s a good point. > > > > Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing. You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from Parashara? > > > > I also know what argument you will give me - J You will say I am already working on that and have some spare time to do this as well...to which I will have nothing to say.> >>  > > - > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > sohamsa@ .com ; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > Cc: vedic astrology ; > Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:03 PM> On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)> > > Dear Sanjay,>  > > Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that>  > I do have a definition of gandanta, which is Parasara's definition in BPHS.>  > Since some of you are extrapolating it based on the fire embodied in UL and water embodied in tithis, the onus is on you to outline and justify your definition. I got into this thread because statements were made that fasting on particular weekdays or tithis in a chart can cause "insult to Vishnu", "serious doshas" and "danger to spouse", based on these far-fetched extrapolations of gandanta.>  > > Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.>  > Well, you once taught that houses represent Sun/Shiva/truth and arudhas represent Moon/Gouri/percepti on. That was meaningful. Now, you associated UL, an arudha, with Sun and fire and 12th, a house, with Gouri and water. I question whether the new theory on fasting is really in line with everything you have learnt (and taught).>  > BTW, I specifically asked for a clarification on whether this was based on your own thinking or from classics/parampara (see quoted mail below for the full context). Like so many times with similar questions I asked privately and recently publicly, you did not respond.>  > *       *       *>  > > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus> > and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by> > Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and> > not of much consequence.>  > First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.>  > For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.>  > Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.>  > Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.>  > Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.>  > Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.>  > Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.>  > *       *       *>  > > Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless> > and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for> > the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman> > when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can> > take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to> > write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic> > seers.>  > I did not say it is "useless". Instead, I suggest that our ability to use it is limited and we should take our limitations into consideration.>  > The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.>  > However, this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to one who does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully in a mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolved and hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely rare today. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do not work for them as they are supposed to.>  > *       *       *>  > Just repeating a combination of sounds does not guarantee anything. Some people may think that certain results come when they repeat a mantra certain number of times. That is an incorrect notion. A mantra may work for one person quickly and another may spend the whole life chanting it and nothing may happen. Absorption of the entire mind into a mantra is needed for a mantra to really work and it is much more difficult than one may think.>  > *       *       *>  > A highly learned scholar in the court of a king may be able to command the king and get whatever he wants from king. An incapable one is better off begging the king, rather than trying to command (and failing for sure).>  > Similarly, most people are better off begging god for what they want rather than trying to use the right mantra to command what they want. A beggar does not need a huge vocabulary or great scholarship or knowledge. Feeling of humility and helplessness, surrender, patience and persistence are what help a beggar succeed. A beggar needs the right attitude rather than knowledge. In this age and time, best bet for most people is to learn to be a good beggar at god's door.>  > What people today need for material and spiritual progress through remedial measures is a better attitude in begging god rather than a better choice of tools such as mantras and other specifics such as weekday, tithi etc to command a specific result from god.>  > It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc. *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.>  > *       *       *>  > One more thing. We have many mantras given by rishis, but the guidelines from rishis like Parasara on how to pick a mantra based on the horoscope are very limited. Astrologers today do not operate solely based on them. They use all kinds of other rules coming from various traditions. They are not free from corruption and imperfection. Most scriptures associate various mantras with various results, irrespective of horoscope. For example, irrespective of who is the 6th lord and 8th lord and lord of A6 and A8, Rina Vimochaka Angaraka mantra is good for debt control. And so on. Linking of horoscope is overplayed by today's astrologers, way beyond the scope of Parasara's guidelines.>  > If one has a sadguru, I recommend following the word of sadguru rather than that of an astrology theoretician.>  > If not, there is no foolproof way to know the right path. Pick any path (given by an astrologer or one that you feel attracted to) instead of wasting time and then keep working on your attitude. The latter is the key. As I said earlier, learn to be a humble beggar at god's door. Choice of Mantra is secondary and attitude is primary. If you succeed in being a really humble beggar, you stand a better chance of success than great scholars.>  > > Any prasiddha mantra (e.g. ashtakshari, panchakshari, dwadasakshari, navakshari, vishnu sahasranaam, rudram, hare krishna maha mantra, chandipath, ganapati atharva seersham, mrityunjaya mantra etc) can help one make progress if one develops the right attitude. Without the right attitude, even an impeaccably picked mantra will do nothing.>  > *       *       *>  > I hope this sufficiently clarifies my stand. I discuss these matters related to spiritual sadhana more on the . Some writings are sampled at http://www.vedicast rologer.org/ homam/writings. htm.>  > Best regards,> Narasimha> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- > > > om paramesthi gurave namah>  > Dear Narasimha,>  > Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that and continue with my belief of the junction between Agni and Jala rasi as the case of gandanta and the loka junctions. Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.>  > Two statements you have made contradict standard texts on Jyotish and Mantra Shastra. Please correct me if I am not understanding you well out here ->  > 1. Statement 1: *fasting on any day or any tithi* is good so long as the sankalpa has been made for the devata you intend to pray to. Results maybe a bit delayed but will be there.> 2. Statement 2: *reciting any prayer* will give the desired effects for any ailment we wish to remedy>  > Is this what you intended to say or did I get this wrong?>  > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and not of much consequence. This sounds like another astrologer I had known some time back whose statements like this coerced me to write Vedic Remedies in Astrology so that people are not misled but such pretexts to knowledge.>  > Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic seers.>  > I think there is something wrong in the way you are saying what you want to say. Please rethink and correct your statements for the sake of good record in this list.>  > With Warm Regards> Sanjay Rath> http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India>  > - > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > sohamsa@ .com > Sunday, February 08, 2009 12:03 PM> Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING> > > Namaste Sanjay and friends,>  > My answers are in red and prefixed with "[Narasimha] ".>  > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > > > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?> > > > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.> >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] We always say that houses (truth) are represented by Sun (aatman) and arudha padas (maya) by Moon (mind).>  > Thus, 12th house is the actual creator and UL is the apparent creator in the field of maya. Houses (truth) should actually be associated with Sun (aatman) and Shiva (and not Gouri), while arudha padas (perception) should actually be associated with Moon (mind) and Gouri. After all, that is what we do in the tripod method in dasa judgment.>  > Thus, it is actually more logical to say that 12th house and 12th lord imbibe the agni tattva of Sun and UL and UL lord imbibe the jala tattva of Moon.>  > Is the above "*more correct* answer" based on your own thinking or is it from a classic or from tradition?>  > > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.> > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] Well, if one cannot fast, then one is destined to expend some energy on digestion after all and not focus all energy on the mantra. But the bottomline is that shastras say that one should meditate either without or with very little food (niraahaaro mitaahaaro). In any case, I hope we agree that meditation sessions after heavy eating are heavily restrained in effectiveness.>  > > > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.> > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] Putting a burning match in a glass of water does indeed kill fire. But the question is of contact. If I am thinking of fire in my mind while standing in water, it does not kill the fire. There is no contact.>  > My point is that the examples given have no real identifiable contact between water and fire.>  > One can be creative and come up with a lot of theories. For example, one can say that Moon and Venus are jala tattva and all rasis show agni tattva (then why are some rasis marked as agni rasis and some as water rasis etc) and hence the sign occupied by Moon and Venus cause contact between water and fire. Then one can say fasting on the weekdays of the dispositors of Moon and Venus causes gandanta and serious danger.>  > It is not enough to show some fire and some water. See what counts as contact. Otherwise, one will engage in illogical extrapolations.>  > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > > > Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence. > > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > > [Narasimha] Nothing is permanent. What is one's cannot be taken away. And one cannot cling on to what is not one's. Some rejoice when it seems like something comes and cry when it seems like something leaves. Some impassionately observe as things seem to come and go and do what they see as their dharma with the things they seem to have.> > Just a factual correction though: I never said I was leaving Jyotish. For a few years after my spiritual master entered my life, my interest in other things went down (though I continued to do other things) and my focus on spiritual sadhana intensified. So I said that my interest in Jyotish was very low. However, my guru gave me a task later. He wanted me to study the teachings of Parasara independently, meditate on them and share my interpretations with the world. He said I was very passionate in my Jyotish activities earlier, and he wanted me to do the same now but dispassionately and without an attachment. He felt that I still have a contribution to make to Jyotish and wants me to do it as an unattached karma. His word is everything for me.>  > What I told you recently is not that I was leaving Jyotish but what I said above.>  > However, if your judgment is correct and if Jyotish is indeed "leaving" me, I am sure my spiritual guru will realize it sooner or later and change his command to me.>  > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > > > I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.> > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] This is a gross exaggeration.>  > Is all that is being taught and practiced now strictly from "Puranas and other teachings of the seers"?>  > I did not say all days and tithis are the same. Of course, there is some difference. But, it is not as big as being made here.>  > To make khoa, whether one uses cow milk or buffalo milk or milk of a brown cow or a black cow or a Jersey cow or another cow does make some difference. But it is secondary. To say that "danger" and "serious doshas" (see the quoted mails for such claims) can be caused by a wrong choice is wrong. To say that a wrong choice means khoa will take 100 years to make is also a gross exaggeration.>  > The main thing is that you need milk and sugar. If one is confused by endless claims of khoa making consultants and ends up not making khoa at all, that will be sad. In such a case, one can simply pick some milk or the other, take sugar and start cooking khoa. It will take an extra half hour, but the job will be done.>  > I request Jyotishis to behave responsibly and humbly and not engage in scare-mongering and say that a speicifc austerity (fasting on a specific weekday or tithi in a chart) can cause "danger" and "serious doshas". No wonder some spiritual teachers look down upon Jyotish and dismiss it. Such unbalanced attitude and self-importance from us does not help our cause!>  > Yes, Jyotish is helpful, but let us not oversell it or overplay the importance.. .>  > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > > > Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.> > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] Of course, brahmacharya is much more, but also very difficult for most. Even physical celibacy is a good enough austerity. Physical celibacy over an extended period of time increases the efficacy of other austerities such as fasting, mouna vrata, meditation and homam.>  > Best regards,> Narasimha> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- >  > sohamsa@ .com, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath@> wrote:> >> > om paramesthi gurave namah> > > > Dear Narasimha> > > > Just added a few thoughts and questions since we are on the topic of spirituality, which is not my forte. So I am always seeking to learn.> > > > With Warm Regards> > > > Sanjay Rath> > > > http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> > > > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > > > sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha PVR Rao> > 06 February 2009 00:48> > sohamsa@ .com> > Cc: > > Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING> > > > Namaste friends,> > > > I would like to express my reservations on a couple of issues. It is funny that I should be typing this email on an Ekadashi day, when many Vaishnavas fast irrespective of their horoscopes.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I write on dvadasi when so many vasihnava also fast and keep great austerities. J Any difference?> > > > > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > > > My dear Zoran, please allow me to express my disagreement.> > > > Austerities can never be seen as an insult to Vishnu. Self-deprivation of 2nd house matters such as food (fasting) or speech (mouna vrata - vow of silence) are austerities. Giving up food or speech is not an insult to Vishnu just as giving up sex (i.e. brahmacharya) is not an insult to Sukracharya (Venus).> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I though Brahma was very angry that his sons decided not to have progeny and stayed celibate. So He created others. Why was Brahma angry when his sons remained celibate? Why should Sukracharya be angry if someone is celibate? How is it an insult or not an insult to Sukracharya? You are taking planet signification of Venus for 7H ...and linking this to creation process...which is wrong Narasimha. Brahma is seen from lords of dusthana 6, 8 and 12 from lagna or 7th which is....you know this.There is nothing wrong with the 7th house as it is necessary for procreation. It is only the link of this with the Brahma graha that causes it to become a serious shad-ripu. Married people are as eligible for moksha as unmarried ones and bachelors. It depends on the following of dharma and ashrama.> > > > Various gods bestow various things on us, some at the gross physical level and some at the subtle spiritual level. As we overcome our dependendency on gross things, we make progress at the subtle level.> > > > If one eats food, a good amount of internal fire (and subtle internal energy associated with it) is used for digesting it and for generating physical energy from it. If one fasts, that subtle energy is unused and available for other things. This is a tremendous benefit. As a result, one can better digest mantras and spiritual food available all around one.> > > > The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.> > > > > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > > > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?> > > > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.> > > > Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.> > > > Now one more thing: Marriage is a yoga between two souls and why not suggest fasting on the yoga day of the UL lord?> > > > [sanjay Rath:] What! What a brilliant suggestion.. .why don’t you start it? > > > > * * *> > > > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > > > Picking tithi based on house (12th house - Dwadashi, 4th house - Chaturthi) is illogical as there are 12 houses only and more tithis.> > I have realized one thing over the years - If something is not structurally sound, it is most likely false knowledge.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] J No comments> > > > * * *> > > > I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.> > > > If you keep such a vrata sincerely, you will make positive progress towards achieving your purpose and definitely not go backwards, irrespective of what is said by technical calculations based on our half-baked Jyotish knowledge.> > > > * * *> > > > My friends, use the Jyotish knowledge available, but do realize that it is imperfect and corrupted. Why is only the UL lord important? So many planets may have so many kinds of influence on UL in a chart. And UL is one of several factors showing marriage. There may be various influences in a chart showing marriage. Is our thumb rule of using UL lord's weekday missing some important factors? Quite possible!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] That is a very nasty statement. Once again you have used adjectives (*imperfect, corrupted*) which is not becoming of you. Why must you use nasty statements? Can’t you say things nicely? > > > > Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence. > > > > If you have the time to listen to the Jaimini Lectures at http://sohamsa. com/js/ do so as it will show you the depths of this knowledge you cannot imagine exists in jyotish. The derivation of the chnhandas and what not all. Thumb rules are meant for beginners. The day you decided to give up jyotish, you got stuck in the thumb rules but then its ok with me. I always wished you the best in whatever you do.> > > > But, despite some arbitrariness and imperfection, if a thumb rule allows you to pick an austerity with confidence and create the mental feeling that you are doing the best possible thing for your situation, it is good. After all, what is critical is to do *some* austerity to burn the blocking karma, with a positive frame of mind about what you are doing.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] No Narasimha, very happy marriages can happen, without austerities as well.> > > > But, if endless theorization and complicated technicalities evolving from the thumb rule are creating doubts and confusion in the minds of people as they consider an austerity, that is useless and totally missing the point.> > > > Some people tend to resort to heavy theorization based on very shaky grounds. I suggest going back to the basics, thinking clearly and keeping things simple.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Human brains work differently in seeking the truth and means to remedy the errors. Life is too complicated to keep everything simple. For example, a heavily cursed Venus can block everything and UL fast may not be able to solve the problem. Now would you say that heavy thoerization and complication is happening and we should ignore the other factors completely?> > > > Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.> > > > Best regards,> > Narasimha> > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -> > Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> > Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> > Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> > Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> > Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> > Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > > > sohamsa@ .com <sohamsa% 40. com> , Ajay Zharotia <ajayzharotia@> wrote:> > > ||Om Gurave Namah||> > > > > > Dear Swee, & jyotishis> > > > > > What Zoran is saying is right. Do not mix the energy of day lord > > > (Agni) by choosing the same tithi (jala) that will create serious > > > troubles for the spouse.> > > Let me explain the principle in a simple way so that there should not > > > be any confusion.> > > > > > In your chart (Swee) Vrishabha lagna, UL is in 2nd house. So lord of > > > the UL is the Mercury. Since fasting is prohibited for UL in 2nd > > > house see where the lord of the UL has gone. In your case mercury has > > > gone to the 11th house hence it is Ekadashi. So rule is to choose the > > > tithi is based on the placement of the UL lord.> > > > > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > > > > > If you are doing fasting on the basis of tithis it should be done in > > > sukla paksha only. But if you are doing in Krishna paksha (Pitris) > > > also then it should be combined with the donation.> > > > > > I hope this will clarify the principal.> > > > > > Best Regards> > > > > > Ajay Zharotia> > > ajayzharotia@> > > > > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:51 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran wrote:> > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah ||> > > > Dear Swee,> > > > Can you please tell me the exact rule to use for fasting on > > > > tithi?.Do we use the 12th lord tithi?, Like if you are Ta lagna, > > > > there 2 tithi one on Triteeya (3) and Ekadasha(11) . If we consider > > > > only the paksh in which u are born.> > > > Now of the two which to use?.> > > >> > > > Warm Regards> > > > Sanjay p> > > >> > > > 2009/2/3 Swee Chan <swee@>> > > > Jaya Jagannatha> > > >> > > > Dear Hari, Zoki, et al in this discussion,> > > > Namaste> > > >> > > > The tongue in cheek, I'll excuse ;-)) it's my laugh for the day!!> > > > I fast on ekadasi tithi because my UL is in 2nd house (ie 12th lord > > > > is in lagna). Since I was born on sukla paksha, Sanjay ji suggests > > > > that I fast only on sukla ekadasi.> > > > Zoki, if you listen to JUS of Year I, you will note how Sanjay ji > > > > came to this conclusion.> > > >> > > > love,> > > >> > > > Swee> > > >> > > > On 3 Feb 2009, at 15:25, Jyotisa Shisya wrote:> > > >> > > >> |om|> > > >> Dear Zoran, namaste> > > >>> > > >> Would not the general act of fasting be construed as an insult to > > > >> Sri MahaVishnu?> > > >>> > > >> best regards> > > >> Hari> > > >>> > > >> On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 5:30 PM, ahimsavm <ahimsans@> > > > >> wrote:> > > >> Om Namah Shivaya,> > > >> Dear Bojan and others,> > > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > > >> The simple solution is to do vrata which do not conflict with> > > >> rejection of food. So a person may observe the fast on UL in 2nd> > > >> day, however, adequate food should be offered as a prasad and eaten> > > >> before the Sunrise (not complete fast).In this way, results may come> > > >> a bit later, but will certainly come, while a person will not bring> > > >> insult to Shri Vishnu by rejecting the food.> > > >> This is the way I was taught, and ofcourse others may agree or not.> > > >> Best wishes> > > >> Zoran Radosavljevic> > > >> www.siva-edu. info> > > >> www.ahimsazr1. wordpress. com> Get the world's best email - Xtra Mail

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Jaya JagannathaDear Narasimha,NamasteIf reliable and unquestionable sources can be mentioned for claims that fasting on certain weekdays or tithis brings "insult to Vishnu", "serious doshas" and "danger to spouse", I can reconsider my statement.I can give you a reference that is somewhat related, since King Bhadreshvara was propitiating (and offering many penances to) many deities (verse 2). Despite this, he still suffered leprosy and was told to specifically propitiate the Sun. This implies that the King did not propitiate the correct form of deity and had to suffer the leprosy, until he took advice from the Brahmanas (in the next two verses not provided. Since I have given the reference, you and other learned sanskritists could maybe check out the rest of the chapter) - would be much appreciated by me.The other reference which I have not provided here on Shanishcara stotra, requests his devotees to eulogise him on Saturday, since this day is presided by him. I hope this reference will finally put things in a clearer perspective.love,Swee

On 2 Mar 2009, at 07:40, Narasimha P.V.R. Rao wrote:Namaste, > > This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the> > right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable> > knowledge coming from questionable sources!).> > I agree: fixing of attitude is needed.  'Questionable sources'? > Lets not lose our manners now. If reliable and unquestionable sources can be mentioned for claims that fasting on certain weekdays or tithis brings "insult to Vishnu", "serious doshas" and "danger to spouse", I can reconsider my statement. > But don't start a vendetta against the vedanga. This is not a vendetta against the vedanga, but a pushback on a mindless spree of over-theorization and over-selling of unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources, which is corrupting the vedanga. Best regards,NarasimhaDo a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpanaSpirituality: Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org  --- In sohamsa , rajarshi nandy <rajarshi14 wrote:>> Dear Michal>  >  > Can you show us ONE jyotish, ANYONE, who has NEVER made a wrong prediction? >  > -Regards>  Rajarshi> > > > The upsurge (of consciousness) is Bhairava - Shiva Sutra> > --- On Mon, 2/3/09, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal wrote:> > > Hare Rama Krsna ||> > Dear Narasimhaaaaaaaaa,> > This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).> > I agree: fixing of attitude is needed.  'Questionable sources'?  Lets not lose our manners now.> > Jyotish is the study of time.  Right weekday, right tithi etc. is important for Jyotish.  Why deny or try to downplay this and promote your own preaching?  Do you feel that your skills and proficiency in the subject are lacking so you attack the subject instead of addressing your own shortcomings?  You made a bold prediction about the US Presidential election, when it was totally wrong you blamed the birth data despite explicitly stating that you had verified the times satisfactorily.  We are all here to learn.  But don't start a vendetta against the vedanga.> > Here is a nice quote about psychological projection:> > "Psychological projection is a defense mechanism in which one attributes one's own unacceptable or unwanted thoughts and/or emotions to others.  It occurs when a person's own unacceptable or threatening feelings are repressed and then attributed to someone else.> "An example of such simple behavior would be: blame for failure, making an excuse for your own faults by projecting the cause of said failure onto someone else, hence blaming them and not accepting the reality of the failure.> "Projection reduces anxiety by allowing the expression of the unwanted subconscious impulses or desires without letting the conscious mind recognize them".> > The source?  The mystical and occult wikipaedia!> > Warm regards,> Michal> > > > > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao <pvr (AT) charter (DOT) net>> ; vedic astrology; ; sohamsa@ .com> Monday, 2 March, 2009 11:12:45 AM> Re: On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)> > > >  > Dear Sanjay,>  > > Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc.> > It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this. >  > Some may be fascinated by the texture, color and volume of the chaff and miss the grain.>  > Most people who talk about mantra shastra focus on the chaff and not on the grain.>  > > You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from?> > How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many> > mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is> > *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should> > always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I> > also disagee with him/her.>  > I mentioned the above with respect to the need of thousands of mantras and technicalities. If one does not want to command god and wants to be a beggar who will take whatever is given, there is no need for thousands of mantras and all the umpteen technicalities. These thousands of mantras and umpteen technicalities are for commanding thousands of different results from god. That is why I talked of commanding vs begging. However, this commanding works slightly differently than one may imagine. I will elaborate.>  > Also, commanding god is NOT black magic. Commanding low level beings is black magic, which can be accomplished even by a person not quite elevated spiritually and suffering from a heavy ego. However, commanding higher beings such as gods is possible only for a spiritually elevated person with no or extremely small ego. This commanding that I am referring to is not an egoistic achievement. In fact, an egoist cannot achieve it. Only a person succeeding in completely effacing individual ego can achieve this commanding! I will repeat something from the previous mail to clarify:>  > > The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.>  > Each set of "karmic interactions between various objects" is a "result". Various mantras are for various "results". One may term merging self-awareness in a mantra fully and getting a specific result from it as "commanding a result" from god. Whether you like the term or not, it is essentially that.>  > *        *        *>  > But the bottomline is this: Only a highly purified sadhaka of very low ego can command specific results from god (not for selfishness or even ego satisfaction, but acting as an unattached instrument of Nature fulfilling one's dharma set by Nature). Various mantras and technicalities of mantra shastra taught by rishis are meant for such sadhakas.>  > Those are hardly of use to so many people out there with dense egos seeking specific selfish results. They cannot command specific results from god (because of their heavy attachment to the result, which is in turn due to their own attachment to a limited ego), even if they use all the techniques of mantra shastra and all the associated rules of astrology. Instead of wasting their time with these technicalities, they will be better off learning to be good beggars at God's door.>  > Just pick any prasiddha mantra or a mantra you feel attracted to, without worrying about so many technicalities, and learn to be humble and surrender to the Lord. Patiently wait for him to give you what you want. Like a beggar, take whatever and whenever he gives.>  > Keep praying every day or every second when you are able to. Even when you are not praying, remember him in all of your actions. When you enjoy something in the material world, tell yourself that it is his and that he gave it to you. If you remember him all the time, slowly the dirt in your mind will start to get cleaned. This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).>  > *        *        *>  > There may be a mountain with thousands of paths (mantra) for climbing it. Each path may lead to a different spot (different experience) on the top and show a different scenery (result). Expert advisors (astrologers) may tell you to use a specific path (mantra) to see a specific scenery (result). But such advice is useless to a handicapped person without legs (a selfish person with dense ego). It is relevant only to person with legs and one who is strong and sturdy, who can successfully climb the mountain (a reasonably detached person with very little ego).>  > Even when you encounter a person who has legs and can actually climb the mountain, the stress should be on how to climb the mountain and traverse the long path, rather than which path to take. The astrologers who are bogged down by all the technicalities and people who take customized mantra advice from astrologers and think that they will get a result quickly by doing that 'powerful' mantra are missing the basic point. The power of a powerful mantra is with respect to the experience and result obtained *after* one succeeds with the mantra. A partcicularly powerful mantra is akin to a path leading to a point atop the mountain where the view shows a particularly beautiful scenery. But the bottomline is that you do have to survive the climb along the long path.>  > We need to emphasize the attitude and approach needed for the long climb, rather than emphasizing the choice of the path based on horoscope. It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc!!!! *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.>  > > *        *        *>  > > when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone> > wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this> > worship should be done?>  > You can do anyday. Parasara does not mention any day for doing homam to a graha.>  > In fact, if one wants, one can do a homam or worship to Mars (or any planet) every day. It is even better that way.>  > If an astrologer suggests doing it on a Tuesday, it is fine. But saying that doing it on so and so day will bring serious dangers because Mars is an enemy of so and so planet would be stretching things.>  > > [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his> > knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?>  > From Self - from within. That is the source of all knowledge. A sadguru need not specifically teach thousand things, but needs to open the door inside.>  > *        *        *>  > > OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,> > 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni> > and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.>  > Parasara's definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in a contiguous space having a predominance of fire and water elements. "I see fire and I see water. So there is gandanta" is a wrong approach. One can then call Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery planet, being in a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a contiguous space.>  > In your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no contiguous space where there is a water-fire transition.>  > > Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing.> > You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and> > are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from> > Parashara? >  > Well, Me10, Ve7 etc theory is based on marrying two different teachings of Parasara (bhava karakas and special lagnas). I do not really consider it as my creation but as understanding Parasara's teachings only.>  > Best regards,> Narasimha> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- >  > --- In sohamsa@ .com, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath@> wrote:> >> > om paramesthi gurave namah> > > > Dear Narasimha,> > > > I read this mail twice. OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg, 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni and jala...I want to her your words if you have any. You keep saying Parasara says so and yet there is nothing forthcoming.> > > > The rashi is associated with the Aditya as the rashi come into existence because of the Sun, which is the agni tattva. Vara is also agni tattva among the panchanga of Jyotisha. That is why Vaara is related to rashi. Karma has been advised in the vaara of the lords of the rashi or the hora of the lords of the rashi related to a bhaava and for this reason, fasting and other such karma related to rashi are also based on this. [see Prashna Marga for details].> > > > Moon is the significator of the Aroodha. It is the *emotional content* related to the maya manifestation of everything in life. Suffering is caused as we do not fathom the karma associated that resulted in suffering and fasting is a a means of self punishment and correction related to the raashi where the aroodha is. Just as Agni has the purity to burn the root of sin, fasting on vaara related to the UL is surely going to cleanse the sins associated with the suffering in it. While this may not give a 100% satisfaction as the *moon* content has not been addressed, at least the initiation of the aroodha occurs and people find their partners, get married and get along with life. Proof lies in the pudding and with so many cases where people have fasted on UL days and have got result, we have found faith in these teachings reinforced. Why fast? Fasting on vaara is a means to correcting the flaw associated with the raashi. Raashi is a quantity and hence it>  is related to the material effects of the bhava and that is what people are looking for when they come to th astrologer. You have done well to recall my teachings in this – remember what I taught – Men should worship a female deity and women shold worship a male deity for the UL fasting. I wonder if they really follow this.> > > > Why not give fasting at night instead of day? Sun is always good for the Upapada (Jaimini etc) and that is why we have limited this to day fasting and not night fasting as well or 24 hour fast. This is my interpolation. [ satisfied J ] Elders would have given long periods of fast starting from the vaara, like keeping 21 days fast for the birth of child! You think I should be doing that! You think anyone will lsiten. Try it yourself before asking me to advise those hard penance kind of fasts.> > > > Who says the Moon has nothing to do with the arudha. It is the sustainer. Now people to an astrologer when they are looking for getting married and hardly anyone comes these days asking for prolonging marriage. Either they want to get into one or get out of one and into another...astrologe rs these days are relegated to helping people make these transitions painless and fast. Of course some have come and I have not failed them. I have a ready shloka for this – start from Taurus in Hamsa gati:> > > > Gouri, Kaali, Uma, Bhadraa, Durga, Kanti, Saraswati> > > > Mangalaa, Vaishnavi, Lakshmi, Shivaa, Naraayani> > > > See I have them ready for the 12 signs in Hamsa Gati from the mool trikona of Moon in hamsa gati> > > > Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc. It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this. > > > > You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from? How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is *BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I also disagee with him/her.> > > > Prasiddha mantras always give result, even without initiation and who knows how ready a person is for initation. So I prefer sticking to prasiddha mantras with people who do not have initiations. This is there in VRA also.> > > > I have some questions where I have doubts about what you say. It is below  your mail.> > > > With Warm Regards> > > > Sanjay Rath> > > > http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> > > > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > > >  sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> > 15 February 2009 09:34> > To: sohamsa@ .com; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao> > Cc: vedic astrology; > > On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)> > > >  > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus> > > > > and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by> > > > > Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and> > > > > not of much consequence.> > > > First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.> > > > For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] what about the Puranas? Have you gone through the Navagraha mantras given in the Garuda Purana and other puranic literature?> > > > Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] If Amavasya dosha is to be performed on Amavasya, when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this worship should be done?> > > > Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it from?> > > > Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I am sorry. I missed the context and just saw some mails that were forwarded to me amidst my writing. But them its always a pleasure to talk to you as in that many many have benefitted, and that includes us as well.> > > > Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] That’s not right...at least people who read this will think. Let’s say Shiva worship on Mondays. Shiva is the pratyadhi devata of the Sun and is not worshipped on Sundays but on Mondays. NOTE – a day after Sunday! Similarly Narayana is the pratyadhi devata of Mercury and is worshipped on Thursdays instead of Wednesdays. NOTE – again a day after! So what happened to the energy equation? J> > > > Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] To this I can agree as many have not understood even the basics of Sanatana dharma! Some behave as if there is a battle going on between Shiva and Vishnu – it’s hilarious to see how these are just attempts to convert Hinduism into a religion they have left rather than trying to learn what Hinduism means. Being newly converted there is a bellicose patriotism in them to prove their faith to the *new god* they have found and every other God must be the devil in disguise!! It will take years for many to learn that there is no devil. It’s a figment of their imagination and whatever is devilish is the dark side of mankind himself.> > > > *        *        *> > > > > Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless> > > > > and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for> > > > > the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman> > > > > when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can> > > > > take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to> > > > > write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic> > > > > seers.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I got your point here. It’s a good point. > > > > Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing. You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from Parashara? > > > > I also know what argument you will give me - J You will say I am already working on that and have some spare time to do this as well...to which I will have nothing to say.> >>  > > - > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > To: sohamsa@ .com ; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > Cc: vedic astrology ;  > Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:03 PM> On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)> > > Dear Sanjay,>  > > Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that>  > I do have a definition of gandanta, which is Parasara's definition in BPHS.>  > Since some of you are extrapolating it based on the fire embodied in UL and water embodied in tithis, the onus is on you to outline and justify your definition. I got into this thread because statements were made that fasting on particular weekdays or tithis in a chart can cause "insult to Vishnu", "serious doshas" and "danger to spouse", based on these far-fetched extrapolations of gandanta.>  > > Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.>  > Well, you once taught that houses represent Sun/Shiva/truth and arudhas represent Moon/Gouri/percepti on. That was meaningful. Now, you associated UL, an arudha, with Sun and fire and 12th, a house, with Gouri and water. I question whether the new theory on fasting is really in line with everything you have learnt (and taught).>  > BTW, I specifically asked for a clarification on whether this was based on your own thinking or from classics/parampara (see quoted mail below for the full context). Like so many times with similar questions I asked privately and recently publicly, you did not respond.>  > *        *        *>  > > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus> > and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by> > Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and> > not of much consequence.>  > First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.>  > For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.>  > Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.>  > Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.>  > Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger to spouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I find these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.>  > Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.>  > Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.>  > *        *        *>  > > Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless> > and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for> > the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman> > when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can> > take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to> > write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic> > seers.>  > I did not say it is "useless". Instead, I suggest that our ability to use it is limited and we should take our limitations into consideration.>  > The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them. Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectly control the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.>  > However, this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to one who does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully in a mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolved and hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely rare today. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do not work for them as they are supposed to.>  > *        *        *>  > Just repeating a combination of sounds does not guarantee anything. Some people may think that certain results come when they repeat a mantra certain number of times. That is an incorrect notion. A mantra may work for one person quickly and another may spend the whole life chanting it and nothing may happen. Absorption of the entire mind into a mantra is needed for a mantra to really work and it is much more difficult than one may think.>  > *        *        *>  > A highly learned scholar in the court of a king may be able to command the king and get whatever he wants from king. An incapable one is better off begging the king, rather than trying to command (and failing for sure).>  > Similarly, most people are better off begging god for what they want rather than trying to use the right mantra to command what they want. A beggar does not need a huge vocabulary or great scholarship or knowledge. Feeling of humility and helplessness, surrender, patience and persistence are what help a beggar succeed. A beggar needs the right attitude rather than knowledge. In this age and time, best bet for most people is to learn to be a good beggar at god's door.>  > What people today need for material and spiritual progress through remedial measures is a better attitude in begging god rather than a better choice of tools such as mantras and other specifics such as weekday, tithi etc to command a specific result from god.>  > It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc. *That* is a lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day etc and impress god.>  > *        *        *>  > One more thing. We have many mantras given by rishis, but the guidelines from rishis like Parasara on how to pick a mantra based on the horoscope are very limited. Astrologers today do not operate solely based on them. They use all kinds of other rules coming from various traditions. They are not free from corruption and imperfection. Most scriptures associate various mantras with various results, irrespective of horoscope. For example, irrespective of who is the 6th lord and 8th lord and lord of A6 and A8, Rina Vimochaka Angaraka mantra is good for debt control. And so on. Linking of horoscope is overplayed by today's astrologers, way beyond the scope of Parasara's guidelines.>  > If one has a sadguru, I recommend following the word of sadguru rather than that of an astrology theoretician.>  > If not, there is no foolproof way to know the right path. Pick any path (given by an astrologer or one that you feel attracted to) instead of wasting time and then keep working on your attitude. The latter is the key. As I said earlier, learn to be a humble beggar at god's door. Choice of Mantra is secondary and attitude is primary. If you succeed in being a really humble beggar, you stand a better chance of success than great scholars.>  > > Any prasiddha mantra (e.g. ashtakshari, panchakshari, dwadasakshari, navakshari, vishnu sahasranaam, rudram, hare krishna maha mantra, chandipath, ganapati atharva seersham, mrityunjaya mantra etc) can help one make progress if one develops the right attitude. Without the right attitude, even an impeaccably picked mantra will do nothing.>  > *        *        *>  > I hope this sufficiently clarifies my stand. I discuss these matters related to spiritual sadhana more on the . Some writings are sampled atÂhttp://www.vedicast rologer.org/ homam/writings. htm.>  > Best regards,> Narasimha> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- > > > om paramesthi gurave namah>  > Dear Narasimha,>  > Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that and continue with my belief of the junction between Agni and Jala rasi as the case of gandanta and the loka junctions. Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.>  > Two statements you have made contradict standard texts on Jyotish and Mantra Shastra. Please correct me if I am not understanding you well out here ->  > 1. Statement 1: *fasting on any day or any tithi* is good so long as the sankalpa has been made for the devata you intend to pray to. Results maybe a bit delayed but will be there.> 2. Statement 2: *reciting any prayer* will give the desired effects for any ailment we wish to remedy>  > Is this what you intended to say or did I get this wrong?>  > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and not of much consequence. This sounds like another astrologer I had known some time back whose statements like this coerced me to write Vedic Remedies in Astrology so that people are not misled but such pretexts to knowledge.>  > Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic seers.>  > I think there is something wrong in the way you are saying what you want to say. Please rethink and correct your statements for the sake of good record in this list.>  > With Warm Regards> Sanjay Rath> http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India>  > - > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > To: sohamsa@ .com > Sunday, February 08, 2009 12:03 PM> Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING> > > Namaste Sanjay and friends,>  > My answers are in red and prefixed with "[Narasimha] ".>  > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > > > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?> > > > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.> >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] We always say that houses (truth) are represented by Sun (aatman) and arudha padas (maya) by Moon (mind).>  > Thus, 12th house is the actual creator and UL is the apparent creator in the field of maya. Houses (truth) should actually be associated with Sun (aatman) and Shiva (and not Gouri), while arudha padas (perception) should actually be associated with Moon (mind) and Gouri. After all, that is what we do in the tripod method in dasa judgment.>  > Thus, it is actually more logical to say that 12th house and 12th lord imbibe the agni tattva of Sun and UL and UL lord imbibe the jala tattva of Moon.>  > Is the above "*more correct* answer" based on your own thinking or is it from a classic or from tradition?>  > > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.> > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] Well, if one cannot fast, then one is destined to expend some energy on digestion after all and not focus all energy on the mantra. But the bottomline is that shastras say that one should meditate either without or with very little food (niraahaaro mitaahaaro). In any case, I hope we agree that meditation sessions after heavy eating are heavily restrained in effectiveness.>  > > > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.> > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] Putting a burning match in a glass of water does indeed kill fire. But the question is of contact. If I am thinking of fire in my mind while standing in water, it does not kill the fire. There is no contact.>  > My point is that the examples given have no real identifiable contact between water and fire.>  > One can be creative and come up with a lot of theories. For example, one can say that Moon and Venus are jala tattva and all rasis show agni tattva (then why are some rasis marked as agni rasis and some as water rasis etc) and hence the sign occupied by Moon and Venus cause contact between water and fire. Then one can say fasting on the weekdays of the dispositors of Moon and Venus causes gandanta and serious danger.>  > It is not enough to show some fire and some water. See what counts as contact. Otherwise, one will engage in illogical extrapolations.>  > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > > > Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence. > > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > > [Narasimha] Nothing is permanent. What is one's cannot be taken away. And one cannot cling on to what is not one's. Some rejoice when it seems like something comes and cry when it seems like something leaves. Some impassionately observe as things seem to come and go and do what they see as their dharma with the things they seem to have.> > Just a factual correction though: I never said I was leaving Jyotish. For a few years after my spiritual master entered my life, my interest in other things went down (though I continued to do other things) and my focus on spiritual sadhana intensified. So I said that my interest in Jyotish was very low. However, my guru gave me a task later. He wanted me to study the teachings of Parasara independently, meditate on them and share my interpretations with the world. He said I was very passionate in my Jyotish activities earlier, and he wanted me to do the same now but dispassionately and without an attachment. He felt that I still have a contribution to make to Jyotish and wants me to do it as an unattached karma. His word is everything for me.>  > What I told you recently is not that I was leaving Jyotish but what I said above.>  > However, if your judgment is correct and if Jyotish is indeed "leaving" me, I am sure my spiritual guru will realize it sooner or later and change his command to me.>  > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > > > I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine  statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.> > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] This is a gross exaggeration.>  > Is all that is being taught and practiced now strictly from "Puranas and other teachings of the seers"?>  > I did not say all days and tithis are the same. Of course, there is some difference. But, it is not as big as being made here.>  > To make khoa, whether one uses cow milk or buffalo milk or milk of a brown cow or a black cow or a Jersey cow or another cow does make some difference. But it is secondary. To say that "danger" and "serious doshas" (see the quoted mails for such claims) can be caused by a wrong choice is wrong. To say that a wrong choice means khoa will take 100 years to make is also a gross exaggeration.>  > The main thing is that you need milk and sugar. If one is confused by endless claims of khoa making consultants and ends up not making khoa at all, that will be sad. In such a case, one can simply pick some milk or the other, take sugar and start cooking khoa. It will take an extra half hour, but the job will be done.>  > I request Jyotishis to behave responsibly and humbly and not engage in scare-mongering and say that a speicifc austerity (fasting on a specific weekday or tithi in a chart) can cause "danger" and "serious doshas". No wonder some spiritual teachers look down upon Jyotish and dismiss it. Such unbalanced attitude and self-importance from us does not help our cause!>  > Yes, Jyotish is helpful, but let us not oversell it or overplay the importance.. .>  > <<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<< > > > > Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.> > >>>>>> End quote >>>>>>>  > [Narasimha] Of course, brahmacharya is much more, but also very difficult for most. Even physical celibacy is a good enough austerity. Physical celibacy over an extended period of time increases the efficacy of other austerities such as fasting, mouna vrata, meditation and homam.>  > Best regards,> Narasimha> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- >  > --- In sohamsa@ .com, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath@> wrote:> >> > om paramesthi gurave namah> > > > Dear Narasimha> > > > Just added a few thoughts and questions since we are on the topic of spirituality, which is not my forte. So I am always seeking to learn.> > > > With Warm Regards> > > > Sanjay Rath> > > > http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org> > > > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India> > > >  sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha PVR Rao> > 06 February 2009 00:48> > To: sohamsa@ .com> > Cc: > > Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING> > > > Namaste friends,> > > > I would like to express my reservations on a couple of issues. It is funny that I should be typing this email on an Ekadashi day, when many Vaishnavas fast irrespective of their horoscopes.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I write on dvadasi when so many vasihnava also fast and keep great austerities. J Any difference?> > > > > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > > > My dear Zoran, please allow me to express my disagreement.> > > > Austerities can never be seen as an insult to Vishnu. Self-deprivation of 2nd house matters such as food (fasting) or speech (mouna vrata - vow of silence) are austerities. Giving up food or speech is not an insult to Vishnu just as giving up sex (i.e. brahmacharya) is not an insult to Sukracharya (Venus).> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I though Brahma was very angry that his sons decided not to have progeny and stayed celibate. So He created others. Why was Brahma angry when his sons remained celibate? Why should Sukracharya be angry if someone is celibate? How is it an insult or not an insult to Sukracharya? You are taking planet signification of Venus for 7H ...and linking this to creation process...which is wrong Narasimha. Brahma is seen from lords of dusthana 6, 8 and 12 from lagna or 7th which is....you know this.There is nothing wrong with the 7th house as it is necessary for procreation. It is only the link of this with the Brahma graha that causes it to become a serious shad-ripu. Married people are as eligible for moksha as unmarried ones and bachelors. It depends on the following of dharma and ashrama.> > > > Various gods bestow various things on us, some at the gross physical level and some at the subtle spiritual level. As we overcome our dependendency on gross things, we make progress at the subtle level.> > > > If one eats food, a good amount of internal fire (and subtle internal energy associated with it) is used for digesting it and for generating physical energy from it. If one fasts, that subtle energy is unused and available for other things. This is a tremendous benefit. As a result, one can better digest mantras and spiritual food available all around one.> > > > The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete fasting.> > > > > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > > > Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What is happening?> > > > After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover, Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage (UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water of UL and causes "gandanta"!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.> > > > Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is quite illogical.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.> > > > Now one more thing: Marriage is a yoga between two souls and why not suggest fasting on the yoga day of the UL lord?> > > > [sanjay Rath:] What! What a brilliant suggestion.. .why don’t you start it?  > > > > * * *> > > > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > > > Picking tithi based on house (12th house - Dwadashi, 4th house - Chaturthi) is illogical as there are 12 houses only and more tithis.> > I have realized one thing over the years - If something is not structurally sound, it is most likely false knowledge.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] J No comments> > > > * * *> > > > I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine  statement but then you seem to be saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same) and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or (maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong, so I agree that what you say is right.> > > > If you keep such a vrata sincerely, you will make positive progress towards achieving your purpose and definitely not go backwards, irrespective of what is said by technical calculations based on our half-baked Jyotish knowledge.> > > > * * *> > > > My friends, use the Jyotish knowledge available, but do realize that it is imperfect and corrupted. Why is only the UL lord important? So many planets may have so many kinds of influence on UL in a chart. And UL is one of several factors showing marriage. There may be various influences in a chart showing marriage. Is our thumb rule of using UL lord's weekday missing some important factors? Quite possible!> > > > [sanjay Rath:] That is a very nasty statement. Once again you have used adjectives (*imperfect, corrupted*) which is not becoming of you. Why must you use nasty statements? Can’t you say things nicely? > > > > Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their understanding and intelligence. > > > > If you have the time to listen to the Jaimini Lectures at http://sohamsa. com/js/ do so as it will show you the depths of this knowledge you cannot imagine exists in jyotish. The derivation of the chnhandas and what not all. Thumb rules are meant for beginners. The day you decided to give up jyotish, you got stuck in the thumb rules but then its ok with me. I always wished you the best in whatever you do.> > > > But, despite some arbitrariness and imperfection, if a thumb rule allows you to pick an austerity with confidence and create the mental feeling that you are doing the best possible thing for your situation, it is good. After all, what is critical is to do *some* austerity to burn the blocking karma, with a positive frame of mind about what you are doing.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] No Narasimha, very happy marriages can happen, without austerities as well.> > > > But, if endless theorization and complicated technicalities evolving from the thumb rule are creating doubts and confusion in the minds of people as they consider an austerity, that is useless and totally missing the point.> > > > Some people tend to resort to heavy theorization based on very shaky grounds. I suggest going back to the basics, thinking clearly and keeping things simple.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Human brains work differently in seeking the truth and means to remedy the errors. Life is too complicated to keep everything simple. For example, a heavily cursed Venus can block everything and UL fast may not be able to solve the problem. Now would you say that heavy thoerization and complication is happening and we should ignore the other factors completely?> > > > Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too many calculations.> > > > [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so different.> > > > Best regards,> > Narasimha> > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -> > Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam> > Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana> > Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom> > Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net> > Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org> > Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org> > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - > > > > --- In sohamsa@ .com <sohamsa% 40. com> , Ajay Zharotia <ajayzharotia@> wrote:> > > ||Om Gurave Namah||> > > > > > Dear Swee, & jyotishis> > > > > > What Zoran is saying is right. Do not mix the energy of day lord > > > (Agni) by choosing the same tithi (jala) that will create serious > > > troubles for the spouse.> > > Let me explain the principle in a simple way so that there should not > > > be any confusion.> > > > > > In your chart (Swee) Vrishabha lagna, UL is in 2nd house. So lord of > > > the UL is the Mercury. Since fasting is prohibited for UL in 2nd > > > house see where the lord of the UL has gone. In your case mercury has > > > gone to the 11th house hence it is Ekadashi. So rule is to choose the > > > tithi is based on the placement of the UL lord.> > > > > > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or 4 > > > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same > > > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on these > > > tithis will create serious doshas.> > > > > > If you are doing fasting on the basis of tithis it should be done in > > > sukla paksha only. But if you are doing in Krishna paksha (Pitris) > > > also then it should be combined with the donation.> > > > > > I hope this will clarify the principal.> > > > > > Best Regards> > > > > > Ajay Zharotia> > > ajayzharotia@> > > > > > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:51 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran wrote:> > > > > > > || Om Gurave Namah ||> > > > Dear Swee,> > > > Can you please tell me the exact rule to use for fasting on > > > > tithi?.Do we use the 12th lord tithi?, Like if you are Ta lagna, > > > > there 2 tithi one on Triteeya (3) and Ekadasha(11) . If we consider > > > > only the paksh in which u are born.> > > > Now of the two which to use?.> > > >> > > > Warm Regards> > > > Sanjay p> > > >> > > > 2009/2/3 Swee Chan <swee@>> > > > Jaya Jagannatha> > > >> > > > Dear Hari, Zoki, et al in this discussion,> > > > Namaste> > > >> > > > The tongue in cheek, I'll excuse ;-)) it's my laugh for the day!!> > > > I fast on ekadasi tithi because my UL is in 2nd house (ie 12th lord > > > > is in lagna). Since I was born on sukla paksha, Sanjay ji suggests > > > > that I fast only on sukla ekadasi.> > > > Zoki, if you listen to JUS of Year I, you will note how Sanjay ji > > > > came to this conclusion.> > > >> > > > love,> > > >> > > > Swee> > > >> > > > On 3 Feb 2009, at 15:25, Jyotisa Shisya wrote:> > > >> > > >> |om|> > > >> Dear Zoran, namaste> > > >>> > > >> Would not the general act of fasting be construed as an insult to > > > >> Sri MahaVishnu?> > > >>> > > >> best regards> > > >> Hari> > > >>> > > >> On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 5:30 PM, ahimsavm <ahimsans@> > > > >> wrote:> > > >> Om Namah Shivaya,> > > >> Dear Bojan and others,> > > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd bhava is> > > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day of UL in> > > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food for us.> > > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd lord and> > > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and carries energy> > > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of the 2nd> > > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and gandanta may> > > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the way out.> > > >> The simple solution is to do vrata which do not conflict with> > > >> rejection of food. So a person may observe the fast on UL in 2nd> > > >> day, however, adequate food should be offered as a prasad and eaten> > > >> before the Sunrise (not complete fast).In this way, results may come> > > >> a bit later, but will certainly come, while a person will not bring> > > >> insult to Shri Vishnu by rejecting the food.> > > >> This is the way I was taught, and ofcourse others may agree or not.> > > >> Best wishes> > > >> Zoran Radosavljevic> > > >> www.siva-edu. info> > > >> www.ahimsazr1. wordpress. com> Get the world's best email - Xtra Mail 

[Guest guest]

Hare Rama Krishna

Dear

Rajarshi,

Don’t

get caught in the quagmire of empty conversations. A doctor needs to know about

all the medicines in order to prescribe the appropriate one to his patients. It

does not mean that he prescribes all of them or that he eats all of them himself.

Nevertheless, he needs to study the science. Similarly astrologers need to

become adept in the science of mantras and remedies, even to prescribe that one

correct mantra as well as to understand the subject thoroughly. Whether the

client is practising the mantra or not in good faith depends on his karmas. To

make accusations of questionable sources and corruption of vedangas, without

having a notion or a even a single clue about what that tradtion is prescribing

and talking about regarding mantras is laughable. A lot of bellicose and

uninformed noise is made on the lists by troubled souls. Naturally such

statements shall evoke strong responses.

Best

Regards,

Sarbani

Rath

Homepage:

http://sarbani.com

Sagittarius

Publications: http://sagittariuspublications.com

Sohamsa:

http://sohamsa.com

Sri

Jagannath Centre: http://.org

 

 

 

 

sohamsa

[sohamsa ] On Behalf Of rajarshi nandy

02 March 2009 10:27

sohamsa

Re: Re: On Remedial Measures Difference (Re:

Resolving Points)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Michal

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Can you show us ONE jyotish, ANYONE, who has NEVER made a

wrong prediction?

 

 

 

 

 

-Regards

 

 

Rajarshi

 

 

 

The

upsurge (of consciousness) is Bhairava -

Shiva Sutra

 

 

 

 

--- On Mon, 2/3/09, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal

wrote:

Michal Dziwulski

<nearmichal

Re: Re: On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving

Points)

sohamsa

Monday, 2 March, 2009, 4:57 AM

 

 

 

 

 

Hare

Rama Krsna ||

 

Dear Narasimhaaaaaaaaa,

 

This

fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking the right

mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable

knowledge coming from questionable sources!).

 

I agree: fixing of attitude is needed. 'Questionable sources'?

Lets not lose our manners now.

 

Jyotish is the study of time. Right weekday, right tithi etc. is

important for Jyotish. Why deny or try to downplay this and promote

your own preaching? Do you feel that your skills and proficiency in the

subject are lacking so you attack the subject instead of addressing your own

shortcomings? You made a bold prediction about the US Presidential

election, when it was totally wrong you blamed the birth data despite

explicitly stating that you had verified the times satisfactorily. We

are all here to learn. But don't start a vendetta against the vedanga.

 

Here is a nice quote about psychological projection:

 

" Psychological projection is a defense mechanism in which one

attributes one's own unacceptable or unwanted thoughts and/or emotions to

others. It occurs when a person's own unacceptable or threatening

feelings are repressed and then attributed to someone else.

" An example of such simple behavior would be: blame for failure, making

an excuse for your own faults by projecting the cause of said failure onto

someone else, hence blaming them and not accepting the reality of the

failure.

" Projection reduces anxiety by allowing the expression of the unwanted

subconscious impulses or desires without letting the conscious mind recognize

them " .

 

The source? The mystical and occult wikipaedia!

 

Warm regards,

Michal

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Narasimha P.V.R.

Rao <pvr (AT) charter (DOT) net>

; vedic astrology;

; sohamsa@ .com

Monday, 2 March, 2009 11:12:45 AM

Re: On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving

Points)

 

 



 

 

Dear

Sanjay,

 

 

 

 

 

>

Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc.

 

 

>

It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this.

 

 

 

 

 

Some

may be fascinated by the texture, color and volume of the chaff and miss the

grain.

 

 

 

 

 

Most

people who talk about mantra shastra focus on the chaff and not on the grain.

 

 

 

 

 

>

You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from?

 

 

>

How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many

 

 

>

mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is

 

 

>

*BLACK MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should

 

 

>

always be that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I

 

 

>

also disagee with him/her.

 

 

 

 

 

I

mentioned the above with respect to the need of thousands of mantras and

technicalities. If one does not want to command god and wants to be a beggar

who will take whatever is given, there is no need for thousands of mantras

and all the umpteen technicalities. These thousands of mantras and

umpteen technicalities are

for commanding

thousands of different results from god. That is why I talked of

commanding vs begging. However, this commanding works slightly differently

than one may imagine. I will elaborate.

 

 

 

 

 

Also,

commanding god is NOT black magic. Commanding low level beings is black

magic, which can be accomplished even by a person not quite elevated

spiritually and suffering from a heavy ego. However, commanding higher beings

such as gods is possible only for a spiritually elevated person with no

or extremely small ego. This commanding that I am referring to is not an egoistic

achievement. In fact, an egoist cannot achieve it. Only a person succeeding

in completely effacing individual ego can achieve this commanding! I will

repeat something from the previous mail to clarify:

 

 

 

 

 

 

The

universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many

objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them.

Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to

perfectly control the mind and *fill

it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating

in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect

absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes

by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra)

and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and

corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Each

set of " karmic interactions between various objects " is a

" result " . Various mantras are for various " results " . One

may term merging self-awareness in a mantra fully and getting a specific

result from it as " commanding a result " from god. Whether you like

the term or not, it is essentially that.

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

But

the bottomline is this: Only a highly purified sadhaka of very low ego can

command specific results from god (not for selfishness or even ego

satisfaction, but acting as an unattached instrument of Nature fulfilling

one's dharma set by Nature). Various mantras and technicalities of mantra

shastra taught by rishis are meant for such sadhakas.

 

 

 

 

 

Those

are hardly of use to so many people out there with dense egos seeking

specific selfish results. They cannot command specific results from god

(because of their heavy attachment to the result, which is in turn due to

their own attachment to a limited ego), even if they use all the techniques

of mantra shastra and all the associated rules of astrology. Instead of wasting

their time with these technicalities, they will be better off learning to be

good beggars at God's door.

 

 

 

 

 

Just

pick any prasiddha mantra or a mantra you feel attracted to, without worrying

about so many technicalities, and learn to be humble and surrender to the

Lord. Patiently wait for him to give you what you want. Like a beggar, take

whatever and whenever he gives.

 

 

 

 

 

Keep

praying every day or every second when you are able to. Even when you are not

praying, remember him in all of your actions. When you enjoy something in the

material world, tell yourself that it is his and that he gave it to you.

If you remember him all the time, slowly the dirt in your mind will start to

get cleaned. This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than

picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on

unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

There

may be a mountain with thousands of paths (mantra) for climbing it. Each

path may lead to a different spot (different experience) on the top and show

a different scenery (result). Expert advisors (astrologers) may tell you to

use a specific path (mantra) to see a specific scenery (result). But such

advice is useless to a handicapped person without legs (a selfish person with

dense ego). It is relevant only to person with legs and one who is strong and

sturdy, who can successfully climb the mountain (a reasonably detached person

with very little ego).

 

 

 

 

 

Even

when you encounter a person who has legs and can actually climb the mountain,

the stress should be on how to climb the mountain and traverse the long path,

rather than which path to take. The astrologers who are bogged down by all

the technicalities and people who take customized mantra advice from astrologers

and think that they will get a result quickly by doing that 'powerful' mantra

are missing the basic point. The power of a powerful mantra is with respect

to the experience and result obtained *after*

one succeeds with the mantra. A partcicularly powerful mantra is akin to a

path leading to a point atop the mountain where the view shows a particularly

beautiful scenery. But the bottomline is that you do have to survive the

climb along the long path.

 

 

 

 

 

We

need to emphasize the attitude and approach needed for the long climb, rather

than emphasizing the choice of the path based on horoscope. It is worth

noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or

two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead,

they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission,

devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc!!!! *That* is a lot more

important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra,

day etc and impress god.

 

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

>

when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone

 

 

>

wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this

 

 

>

worship should be done?

 

 

 

You

can do anyday. Parasara does not mention any day for doing homam to a graha.

 

 

 

 

 

In

fact, if one wants, one can do a homam or worship to Mars (or any planet) every day. It is even

better that way.

 

 

 

 

 

If

an astrologer suggests doing it on a Tuesday, it is fine. But saying that

doing it on so and so day will bring serious dangers because Mars is an enemy

of so and so planet would be stretching things.

 

 

 

 

 

>

[sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his

 

 

>

knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it

from?

 

 

 

From

Self - from within. That

is the source of all knowledge. A sadguru need not specifically

teach thousand things, but needs to open the door inside.

 

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

>

OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,

 

 

>

120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni

 

 

>

and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.

 

 

 

 

 

Parasara's

definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in a contiguous

space having a predominance of fire and water elements. " I see fire and

I see water. So there is gandanta " is a wrong approach. One can then

call Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery planet,

being in a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a

contiguous space.

 

 

 

 

 

In

your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no contiguous space where

there is a water-fire transition.

 

 

 

 

 

>

Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing.

 

 

>

You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and

 

 

>

are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from

 

 

>

Parashara?

 

 

 

Well,

Me10, Ve7 etc theory is based on marrying two different teachings of Parasara

(bhava karakas and special lagnas). I do not really consider it as my

creation but as understanding Parasara's teachings only.

 

 

 

 

 

Best

regards,

Narasimha

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam

Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana

Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom

Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net

Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org

Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

---------

 

 

 

---

In sohamsa@

..com, " Sanjay Rath " <sjrath wrote:

>

> om paramesthi gurave namah

>

> Dear Narasimha,

>

> I read this mail twice. OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for

Gandanta being in 0 deg, 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a

junction between agni and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.

You keep saying Parasara says so and yet there is nothing forthcoming.

>

> The rashi is associated with the Aditya as the rashi come into existence

because of the Sun, which is the agni tattva. Vara is also agni tattva among

the panchanga of Jyotisha. That is why Vaara is related to rashi. Karma has

been advised in the vaara of the lords of the rashi or the hora of the lords

of the rashi related to a bhaava and for this reason, fasting and other such

karma related to rashi are also based on this. [see Prashna Marga for

details].

>

> Moon is the significator of the Aroodha. It is the *emotional content*

related to the maya manifestation of everything in life. Suffering is caused

as we do not fathom the karma associated that resulted in suffering and

fasting is a a means of self punishment and correction related to the raashi

where the aroodha is. Just as Agni has the purity to burn the root of sin,

fasting on vaara related to the UL is surely going to cleanse the sins

associated with the suffering in it. While this may not give a 100%

satisfaction as the *moon* content has not been addressed, at least the

initiation of the aroodha occurs and people find their partners, get married

and get along with life. Proof lies in the pudding and with so many cases

where people have fasted on UL days and have got result, we have found faith

in these teachings reinforced. Why fast? Fasting on vaara is a means to

correcting the flaw associated with the raashi. Raashi is a quantity and

hence it is related to the material effects of the bhava and that is what

people are looking for when they come to th astrologer. You have done well to

recall my teachings in this – remember what I taught – Men should worship

a female deity and women shold worship a male deity for the UL fasting. I

wonder if they really follow this.

>

> Why not give fasting at night instead of day? Sun is always good for the

Upapada (Jaimini etc) and that is why we have limited this to day fasting and

not night fasting as well or 24 hour fast. This is my interpolation. [

satisfied J ] Elders would have given long periods of fast starting from the

vaara, like keeping 21 days fast for the birth of child! You think I should

be doing that! You think anyone will lsiten. Try it yourself before asking me

to advise those hard penance kind of fasts.

>

> Who says the Moon has nothing to do with the arudha. It is the

sustainer. Now people to an astrologer when they are looking for getting

married and hardly anyone comes these days asking for prolonging marriage.

Either they want to get into one or get out of one and into

another...astrologe rs these days are relegated to helping people make these

transitions painless and fast. Of course some have come and I have not failed

them. I have a ready shloka for this – start from Taurus in Hamsa gati:

>

> Gouri, Kaali, Uma, Bhadraa, Durga, Kanti, Saraswati

>

> Mangalaa, Vaishnavi, Lakshmi, Shivaa, Naraayani

>

> See I have them ready for the 12 signs in Hamsa Gati from the mool

trikona of Moon in hamsa gati

>

> Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc. It

is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this.

>

> You talk of begging God vs commanding God? Now where did that come from?

How is it related to what is under discussion. Perhaps I have missed many

mails and am not able to get the context. Trying to command God is *BLACK

MAGIC* and this is detestable to say the least. The attitude should always be

that of a beggar in front of God. If anyone has said otherwise, I also

disagee with him/her.

>

> Prasiddha mantras always give result, even without initiation and who

knows how ready a person is for initation. So I prefer sticking to prasiddha

mantras with people who do not have initiations. This is there in VRA also.

>

> I have some questions where I have doubts about what you say. It is

below your mail.

>

> With Warm Regards

>

> Sanjay Rath

>

> http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org

>

> 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India

>

> sohamsa@

..com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

> 15 February 2009 09:34

> sohamsa@

..com; Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

> Cc: vedic astrology@

. com;

> On Remedial Measures Difference (Re: Resolving

Points)

>

>  > Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is

bogus

>

> > and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by

>

> > Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and

>

> > not of much consequence.

>

> First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays

or tithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.

>

> For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or

to get the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals)

and described how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full

of various homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara

himself and I am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can

do them by themselves.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] what about the Puranas? Have you gone through the

Navagraha mantras given in the Garuda Purana and other puranic literature?

>

> Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas

(e.g. planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g.

Amavasya dosha or Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the

dosha and the deity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the

chart.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] If Amavasya dosha is to be performed on Amavasya, when

should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone wishes to worship

Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this worship should be done?

>

> Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got

his knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get

it from?

>

> Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning

complicated principles that are not found in classics or works of rishis and

scaring people that performing austerities such as fasting on certain days

cause " danger to spouse " or " serious doshas " or

" insult to Vishnu " , based on horoscope. I find these principles

illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little difference between

doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that it is smaller

compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all and that doing

it on a " wrong day " does not cause danger as being suggested.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] I am sorry. I missed the context and just saw some mails

that were forwarded to me amidst my writing. But them its always a pleasure

to talk to you as in that many many have benefitted, and that includes us as

well.

>

> Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on

various days, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain

deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is

based on the deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an

analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a

specific day, a beggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule

and mood of the giver is more important.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] That’s not right...at least people who read this will

think. Let’s say Shiva worship on Mondays. Shiva is the pratyadhi devata of

the Sun and is not worshipped on Sundays but on Mondays. NOTE – a day after

Sunday! Similarly Narayana is the pratyadhi devata of Mercury and is

worshipped on Thursdays instead of Wednesdays. NOTE – again a day after! So

what happened to the energy equation? J

>

> Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and

the variations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not

saying there are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more

importantly, I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers

today to apply *reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling

unreliable principles of questionable origin and scaring people on that

basis.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] To this I can agree as many have not understood even the

basics of Sanatana dharma! Some behave as if there is a battle going on

between Shiva and Vishnu – it’s hilarious to see how these are just

attempts to convert Hinduism into a religion they have left rather than

trying to learn what Hinduism means. Being newly converted there is a

bellicose patriotism in them to prove their faith to the *new god* they have

found and every other God must be the devil in disguise!! It will take years

for many to learn that there is no devil. It’s a figment of their

imagination and whatever is devilish is the dark side of mankind himself.

>

> *

* *

>

> > Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is

useless

>

> > and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras

for

>

> > the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or

Hanuman

>

> > when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can

>

> > take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have

to

>

> > write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the

vedic

>

> > seers.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] I got your point here. It’s a good point.

>

> Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing. You

were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and are you doing

that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from Parashara?

>

> I also know what argument you will give me - J You will say I am already

working on that and have some spare time to do this as well...to which I will

have nothing to say.

>

 

 

 

 

-----

Original Message -----

 

Narasimha

P.V.R. Rao

 

 

sohamsa@ .com ; Narasimha

P.V.R. Rao

 

 

Cc: vedic astrology

;

 

 

Saturday, February

14, 2009 11:03 PM

 

 

On Remedial

Measures Difference (Re: Resolving Points)

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear

Sanjay,

 

 

 

 

 

>

Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that

 

 

 

 

 

I

do have a definition of gandanta, which is Parasara's definition in BPHS.

 

 

 

 

 

Since

some of you are extrapolating it based on the fire embodied in UL and water

embodied in tithis, the onus is on you to outline and justify your

definition. I got into this thread because statements were made that fasting

on particular weekdays or tithis in a chart can cause " insult to

Vishnu " , " serious doshas " and " danger to spouse " ,

based on these far-fetched extrapolations of gandanta.

 

 

 

 

 

>

Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.

 

 

 

 

 

Well,

you once taught that houses represent Sun/Shiva/truth and arudhas represent

Moon/Gouri/percepti on. That was meaningful. Now, you associated UL, an

arudha, with Sun and fire and 12th, a house, with Gouri and water. I question

whether the new theory on fasting is really in line with everything you have

learnt (and taught).

 

 

 

 

 

BTW,

I specifically asked for a clarification on whether this was based on your

own thinking or from classics/parampara (see quoted mail below for the full

context). Like so many times with similar questions I asked privately and

recently publicly, you did not respond.

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

>

Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus

 

 

>

and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by

 

 

>

Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and

 

 

>

not of much consequence.

 

 

 

 

 

First

of all, Parasara did *not*

prescribe fasting on specific weekdays or tithis based on any arudhas or

houses in a chart.

 

 

 

 

 

For

doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to get

the blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) and described how to

perform them. His section on remedial measures is full of various homas. I am

not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself and I am in fact

slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them by themselves.

 

 

 

 

 

Parasara

did *not*

specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g. planetary homas).

Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya dosha or Moola

dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and the deity. But

the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.

 

 

 

 

 

Thus,

the principles I am questioning are *not*

from Parasara.

 

 

 

 

 

Second,

I said what I said in a *context*.

People are mentioning complicated principles that are not found in classics

or works of rishis and scaring people that performing austerities such as

fasting on certain days cause " danger to spouse " or " serious

doshas " or " insult to Vishnu " , based on horoscope. I find

these principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a little

difference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that

it is smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all

and that doing it on a " wrong day " does not cause danger as

being suggested.

 

 

 

 

 

Third,

our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on various

days, based on the energy of the *deity*.

For worshipping a certain deity, certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is

better than others. This is based on the deity and irrespective of the person

worshipping. Let me give an analogy. If a rich man comes out with more money

to give to beggars on a specific day, a beggar is better off going and

begging on that day. Schedule and mood of the giver is more important.

 

 

 

 

 

Choosing

the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and the variations

based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not saying there are

no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly, I

question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to

apply *reliably*.

I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principles of

questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

>

Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless

 

 

>

and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for

 

 

>

the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman

 

 

>

when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can

 

 

>

take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to

 

 

>

write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic

 

 

>

seers.

 

 

 

 

 

I

did not say it is " useless " . Instead, I suggest that our ability to

use it is limited and we should take our limitations into consideration.

 

 

 

 

 

The

universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness) , many beings and many

objects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them.

Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to

perfectly control the mind and *fill

it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantra reverberating

in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. This perfect

absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changes

by the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra)

and that causes corresponding external changes in the universe and

corresponding karmic interactions between various objects.

 

 

 

 

 

However,

this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to one who

does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully in

a mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolved

and hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely

rare today. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do

not work for them as they are supposed to.

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

Just

repeating a combination of sounds does not guarantee anything. Some people

may think that certain results come when they repeat a mantra certain number

of times. That is an incorrect notion. A mantra may work for one person

quickly and another may spend the whole life chanting it and nothing may

happen. Absorption of the entire mind into a mantra is needed for a mantra to

really work and it is much more difficult than one may think.

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

A

highly learned scholar in the court of a king may be able to command the king

and get whatever he wants from king. An incapable one is better off begging

the king, rather than trying to command (and failing for sure).

 

 

 

 

 

Similarly,

most people are better off begging god for what they want rather than trying

to use the right mantra to command what they want. A beggar does not need a

huge vocabulary or great scholarship or knowledge. Feeling

of humility and helplessness, surrender, patience and persistence are

what help a beggar succeed. A beggar needs the right attitude rather than

knowledge. In this age and time, best bet for most people is to learn

to be a good beggar at god's door.

 

 

 

 

 

What people today need for material and spiritual progress through

remedial measures is a better attitude in begging god rather than a better

choice of tools such as mantras and other specifics such as weekday, tithi

etc to command a specific result from god.

 

 

 

 

 

It

is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last

century or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope

etc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender,

submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc. *That* is a lot more

important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra,

day etc and impress god.

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

One

more thing. We have many mantras given by rishis, but the guidelines

from rishis like Parasara on how to pick a mantra based on the horoscope are

very limited. Astrologers today do not operate solely based on them. They use

all kinds of other rules coming from various traditions. They are not free

from corruption and imperfection. Most scriptures associate various mantras

with various results, irrespective of horoscope. For example, irrespective of

who is the 6th lord and 8th lord and lord of A6 and A8, Rina Vimochaka

Angaraka mantra is good for debt control. And so on. Linking of horoscope is

overplayed by today's astrologers, way beyond the scope of Parasara's

guidelines.

 

 

 

 

 

If

one has a sadguru, I recommend following the word of sadguru rather than that

of an astrology theoretician.

 

 

 

 

 

If

not, there is no foolproof way to know the right path. Pick any path (given

by an astrologer or one that you feel attracted to) instead of wasting time

and then keep working on your attitude. The latter is the key. As I said

earlier, learn to be a humble beggar at god's door. Choice of Mantra is

secondary and attitude is primary. If you succeed in being a really humble

beggar, you stand a better chance of success than great scholars.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any

prasiddha mantra (e.g. ashtakshari, panchakshari, dwadasakshari, navakshari,

vishnu sahasranaam, rudram, hare krishna maha mantra, chandipath, ganapati

atharva seersham, mrityunjaya mantra etc) can help one make progress if

one develops the right attitude. Without the right attitude, even an

impeaccably picked mantra will do nothing.

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

I

hope this sufficiently clarifies my stand. I discuss these matters related to

spiritual sadhana more on the . Some writings are

sampled at http://www.vedicast rologer.org/ homam/writings. htm.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Best

regards,

Narasimha

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst

rologer.org/ homam

Do Pitri

Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst

rologer.org/ tarpana

Spirituality:

http://groups.

/ group/vedic- wisdom

Free Jyotish

lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.

home.comcast. net

Free Jyotish

software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst

rologer.org

Sri Jagannath

Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan

nath.org

------------

--------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

 

 

 

om

paramesthi gurave namah

 

 

 

 

 

Dear

Narasimha,

 

 

 

 

 

Since

you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that and

continue with my belief of the junction between Agni and Jala rasi as the case

of gandanta and the loka junctions. Which is perfectly in line with

everything I have learnt.

 

 

 

 

 

Two

statements you have made contradict standard texts on Jyotish and Mantra

Shastra. Please correct me if I am not understanding you well out here -

 

 

 

 

 

1. Statement

1: *fasting on any day or any tithi* is good so long as the sankalpa has been

made for the devata you intend to pray to. Results maybe a bit delayed but

will be there.

2. Statement 2: *reciting any prayer* will give the desired effects for

any ailment we wish to remedy

 

 

 

 

 

Is

this what you intended to say or did I get this wrong?

 

 

 

 

 

Statement

1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus and has no

relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by Parasara and others to be

done on specific days are irrlevant and not of much consequence. This sounds

like another astrologer I had known some time back whose statements like this

coerced me to write Vedic Remedies in Astrology so that people are not misled

but such pretexts to knowledge.

 

 

 

 

 

Statement

2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless and the Rishi’s

were wasting time in giving so many mantras for the same devata, like say

thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman when any one mantra would suffice.

OR it is like saying that we can take paracetamol and pray that cancer is

cured. I think I may have to write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the

teachings of the vedic seers.

 

 

 

 

 

I

think there is something wrong in the way you are saying what you want to

say. Please rethink and correct your statements for the sake of good record

in this list.

 

 

 

 

 

With

Warm Regards

 

 

Sanjay

Rath

 

 

http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org

 

 

15B

Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India

 

 

 

 

 

-----

Original Message -----

 

 

Narasimha

P.V.R. Rao

 

 

sohamsa@ .com

 

 

Sunday, February

08, 2009 12:03 PM

 

 

Re: ALTERNATIVE TO

UPAPADA FASTING

 

 

 

 

 

Namaste Sanjay and friends,

 

 

 

 

 

My answers are in red and prefixed with " [Narasimha] " .

 

 

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote <<<<<<

 

 

> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a

rashi and carries energy

> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of

the 2nd

> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and

gandanta may

> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the

way out.

>

> Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the

tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?

>

> [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so

Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What

is happening?

 

 

>

> After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the

element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover,

Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that

UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi

brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage

(UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be

prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water

of UL and causes " gandanta " !

>

> [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi

Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother

Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are

created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi

lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.

 

 

>>>>>> End

quote >>>>>>

 

 

 

 

 

[Narasimha] We always say that houses (truth) are represented by

Sun (aatman) and arudha padas (maya) by Moon (mind).

 

 

 

 

 

Thus, 12th house is the actual creator and UL is the apparent

creator in the field of maya. Houses (truth) should actually be associated

with Sun (aatman) and Shiva (and not Gouri), while arudha padas (perception)

should actually be associated with Moon (mind) and Gouri. After all, that is

what we do in the tripod method in dasa judgment.

 

 

 

 

 

Thus, it is actually more logical to say that 12th house and 12th

lord imbibe the agni tattva of Sun and UL and UL lord imbibe the jala tattva

of Moon.

 

 

 

 

 

Is the above " *more correct* answer " based on your own

thinking or is it from a classic or from tradition?

 

 

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote

<<<<<<

 

 

 

 

> The mantra one meditates

with at the end of a day's fasting is far more effective than at other times.

The conservation of energy otherwise spent on digestion or speech will enable

far more effective mantra meditation. So fast or keep mouna and then meditate

with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the mantra.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best

blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is troubled

by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs mantra

japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than complete

fasting.

 

>>>>>> End

quote >>>>>>

 

 

 

 

 

[Narasimha] Well, if one cannot fast, then one is destined to

expend some energy on digestion after all and not focus all energy on the

mantra. But the bottomline is that shastras say that one should meditate

either without or with very little food (niraahaaro mitaahaaro). In any case,

I hope we agree that meditation sessions after heavy eating are heavily

restrained in effectiveness.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote

<<<<<<

 

> Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta

concepts is quite illogical.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of gandanta

– the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a glass of

water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but they are

not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.

 

>>>>>> End

quote >>>>>>

 

 

 

 

 

[Narasimha] Putting a burning match in a glass of water

does indeed kill fire. But the question is of contact. If I am thinking

of fire in my mind while standing in water, it does not kill the fire. There

is no contact.

 

 

 

 

 

My point is that the examples given have no real identifiable

contact between water and fire.

 

 

 

 

 

One can be creative and come up with a lot of theories. For

example, one can say that Moon and Venus are jala tattva and all rasis show

agni tattva (then why are some rasis marked as agni rasis and some as water

rasis etc) and hence the sign occupied by Moon and Venus cause contact

between water and fire. Then one can say fasting on the weekdays of the

dispositors of Moon and Venus causes gandanta and serious danger.

 

 

 

 

 

It is not enough to show some fire and some water. See what counts

as contact. Otherwise, one will engage in illogical extrapolations.

 

 

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote

<<<<<<

 

 

 

 

 

 

> Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then

again you told me two years back and again recently that you are leaving

jyotish. Now it is getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The

knowledge of Jyotish is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels

of their understanding and intelligence.

 

>>>>>> End

quote >>>>>>

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Narasimha] Nothing is permanent. What is one's cannot be taken

away. And one cannot cling on to what is not one's. Some rejoice when it

seems like something comes and cry when it seems like something leaves. Some

impassionately observe as things seem to come and go and do what they see as

their dharma with the things they seem to have.

 

 

 

Just a factual correction though

 

: I never said I was leaving Jyotish. For a few years after my

spiritual master entered my life, my interest in other things went down

(though I continued to do other things) and my focus on spiritual sadhana

intensified. So I said that my interest in Jyotish was very low. However, my

guru gave me a task later. He wanted me to study the teachings of Parasara

independently, meditate on them and share my interpretations with

the world. He said I was very passionate in my Jyotish activities

earlier, and he wanted me to do the same now but dispassionately and without

an attachment. He felt that I still have a contribution to make to Jyotish

and wants me to do it as an unattached karma. His word is

everything for me.

 

 

 

 

 

What I told you recently is not

that I was leaving Jyotish but what I said above.

 

 

 

 

 

However, if your judgment is

correct and if Jyotish is indeed " leaving " me, I am sure my

spiritual guru will realize it sooner or later and change his command to me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote

<<<<<<

 

 

 

 

 

 

> I can categorically declare one thing with utmost

confidence. You pick any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna

vrata (remain silent) on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular

mantra (any) at the end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice

for a certain duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific

purpose. Take a vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can

be kept for the duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!

>

> [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be

saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much

relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For

example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should

choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same)

and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or

(maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not

say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong,

so I agree that what you say is right.

 

>>>>>> End

quote >>>>>>

 

 

 

 

 

[Narasimha] This is a gross exaggeration.

 

 

 

 

 

Is all that is being taught and practiced now strictly from

" Puranas and other teachings of the seers " ?

 

 

 

 

 

I did not say all days and tithis

are the same. Of course, there is some difference. But, it is not as big as

being made here.

 

 

 

 

 

To make khoa, whether one uses cow

milk or buffalo milk or milk of a brown cow or a black cow or a Jersey cow or

another cow does make some difference. But it is secondary. To say that

" danger " and " serious doshas " (see the quoted mails for

such claims) can be caused by a wrong choice is wrong. To say that a

wrong choice means khoa will take 100 years to make is also a

gross exaggeration.

 

 

 

 

 

The main thing is that you need

milk and sugar. If one is confused by endless claims of khoa making

consultants and ends up not making khoa at all, that will be sad. In such a

case, one can simply pick some milk or the other, take sugar and

start cooking khoa. It will take an extra half hour, but the job will be

done.

 

 

 

 

 

I request Jyotishis to behave

responsibly and humbly and not engage in scare-mongering and say that a

speicifc austerity (fasting on a specific weekday or tithi in a chart)

can cause " danger " and " serious doshas " . No wonder some

spiritual teachers look down upon Jyotish and dismiss it. Such unbalanced

attitude and self-importance from us does not help our cause!

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, Jyotish is helpful, but let

us not oversell it or overplay the importance.. .

 

 

 

 

 

<<<<<< Begin quote

<<<<<<

 

 

 

 

 

 

> Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities

like prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any

harm. If your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi

without too many calculations.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby

or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the

appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you

are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so

different.

 

>>>>>> End

quote >>>>>>

 

 

 

 

 

[Narasimha] Of course, brahmacharya is much more, but also very

difficult for most. Even physical celibacy is a good enough austerity.

Physical celibacy over an extended period of time increases the efficacy of

other austerities such as fasting, mouna vrata, meditation and homam.

 

 

 

 

 

Best regards,

Narasimha

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam

Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ tarpana

Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom

Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net

Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst rologer.org

Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan nath.org

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

---------

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

---

In sohamsa@

..com, " Sanjay Rath " <sjrath wrote:

>

> om paramesthi gurave namah

>

> Dear Narasimha

>

> Just added a few thoughts and questions since we are on the topic of

spirituality, which is not my forte. So I am always seeking to learn.

>

> With Warm Regards

>

> Sanjay Rath

>

> http://srath. com http://sohamsa. com http:// .org

>

> 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India

>

> sohamsa@

..com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Narasimha PVR Rao

> 06 February 2009 00:48

> sohamsa@

..com

> Cc: @

. com

> Re: ALTERNATIVE TO UPAPADA FASTING

>

> Namaste friends,

>

> I would like to express my reservations on a couple of issues. It is

funny that I should be typing this email on an Ekadashi day, when many

Vaishnavas fast irrespective of their horoscopes.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] I write on dvadasi when so many vasihnava also fast and

keep great austerities. J Any difference?

>

> > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd

bhava is

> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day

of UL in

> > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food

for us.

>

> My dear Zoran, please allow me to express my disagreement.

>

> Austerities can never be seen as an insult to Vishnu. Self-deprivation

of 2nd house matters such as food (fasting) or speech (mouna vrata - vow of

silence) are austerities. Giving up food or speech is not an insult to Vishnu

just as giving up sex (i.e. brahmacharya) is not an insult to Sukracharya

(Venus).

>

> [sanjay Rath:] I though Brahma was very angry that his sons decided not

to have progeny and stayed celibate. So He created others. Why was Brahma

angry when his sons remained celibate? Why should Sukracharya be angry if

someone is celibate? How is it an insult or not an insult to Sukracharya? You

are taking planet signification of Venus for 7H ...and linking this to

creation process...which is wrong Narasimha. Brahma is seen from lords of

dusthana 6, 8 and 12 from lagna or 7th which is....you know this.There is

nothing wrong with the 7th house as it is necessary for procreation. It is only

the link of this with the Brahma graha that causes it to become a serious

shad-ripu. Married people are as eligible for moksha as unmarried ones and

bachelors. It depends on the following of dharma and ashrama.

>

> Various gods bestow various things on us, some at the gross physical

level and some at the subtle spiritual level. As we overcome our

dependendency on gross things, we make progress at the subtle level.

>

> If one eats food, a good amount of internal fire (and subtle internal

energy associated with it) is used for digesting it and for generating

physical energy from it. If one fasts, that subtle energy is unused and

available for other things. This is a tremendous benefit. As a result, one

can better digest mantras and spiritual food available all around one.

>

> The mantra one meditates with at the end of a day's fasting is far more

effective than at other times. The conservation of energy otherwise spent on

digestion or speech will enable far more effective mantra meditation. So fast

or keep mouna and then meditate with a mantra, to maximize the effect of the

mantra.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] I do not agree with this. Correct eating is the best

blessing for good mantra practise. On days when one fasts the mind is

troubled by hunger causing the stomach to burn and churn and this disturbs

mantra japa. Correct eating (alpa aahaara) is many many times better than

complete fasting.

>

> > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd

lord and

> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and

carries energy

> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of

the 2nd

> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and

gandanta may

> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the

way out.

>

> Why does a rashi carry the energy of vaara only and not that of the

tithi???? Why does rashi represent vaara or fire?

>

> [sanjay Rath:] Because Raashi were created by Surya and for doing so

Surya took 12 forms called the Dvadasa Aditya...Narasimha you ask this?? What

is happening?

>

> After all, Rudra rules over the element of fire and Gouri rules over the

element of water and one worships Gouri at the time of marriage. Moreover,

Venus (water) is the karaka for marriage. So one could even say that

UL/marriage is represented by water element and fasting on UL lord's tithi

brings the element of water (prosperity and well-being) to one's marriage

(UL)? One could even say that fasting on the weekday of UL lord should be

prohibited as it brings the fire element represented by weekday to the water

of UL and causes " gandanta " !

>

> [sanjay Rath:] UL is the Maya and is associated with the Raashi

Narasimha. It is the 12L which is the creator of the UL...just as the mother

Gouri creates everything through the shakti of the graha, all the arudha are

created by her due to the lordships of the planets. So fasting on the tithi

lorded by the 12th lord will be a *more correct* answer.

>

> Seriously, however, this kind of stretching of gandanta concepts is

quite illogical.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] It is not stretching ... it is the very definition of

gandanta – the interface between fire and water. Put a burning match in a

glass of water, the fire dies...There are other Ganda’s in the chart but

they are not anta (ends). Take Chitra ganda between Kanya and Tula.

>

> Now one more thing: Marriage is a yoga between two souls and why not

suggest fasting on the yoga day of the UL lord?

>

> [sanjay Rath:] What! What a brilliant suggestion.. .why don’t you

start it?

>

> * * *

>

> > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or

4

> > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same

> > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on

these

> > tithis will create serious doshas.

>

> Picking tithi based on house (12th house - Dwadashi, 4th house -

Chaturthi) is illogical as there are 12 houses only and more tithis.

> I have realized one thing over the years - If something is not

structurally sound, it is most likely false knowledge.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] J No comments

>

> * * *

>

> I can categorically declare one thing with utmost confidence. You pick

any weekday or tithi and take a vow to fast or do mouna vrata (remain silent)

on that weekday or tithi and meditate with a particular mantra (any) at the

end of the day. You can take a vow to keep that practice for a certain

duration of time (say, a few months or years) for a specific purpose. Take a

vow and keep the vrata for the duration. If brahmacharya can be kept for the

duration of the vrata, there is nothing like it!

>

> [sanjay Rath:] This is a fine statement but then you seem to be

saying that the Puranas and other teachings of the seers is of not much

relevance. Of course you are right as it will be spiritually beneficial. For

example, a person wishing to marry should not fast on UL days and should

choose any day (all days are the same) or any tithi (all tithi are the same)

and start fasting and do a mantra (any mantra!!) and then in a few days, or

(maybe) a few months (or maybe) a few years ... or maybe (what you did not

say), a few lifetimes, the marriage will happen! I cannot say you are wrong,

so I agree that what you say is right.

>

> If you keep such a vrata sincerely, you will make positive progress

towards achieving your purpose and definitely not go backwards, irrespective

of what is said by technical calculations based on our half-baked Jyotish

knowledge.

>

> * * *

>

> My friends, use the Jyotish knowledge available, but do realize that it

is imperfect and corrupted. Why is only the UL lord important? So many

planets may have so many kinds of influence on UL in a chart. And UL is one

of several factors showing marriage. There may be various influences in a

chart showing marriage. Is our thumb rule of using UL lord's weekday missing

some important factors? Quite possible!

>

> [sanjay Rath:] That is a very nasty statement. Once again you have used

adjectives (*imperfect, corrupted*) which is not becoming of you. Why must

you use nasty statements? Can’t you say things nicely?

>

> Three years back you said you are leaving jyotish....then again you told

me two years back and again recently that you are leaving jyotish. Now it is

getting very evident that *jyotish is leaving you*. The knowledge of Jyotish

is PERFECT – individuals embody it in different levels of their

understanding and intelligence.

>

> If you have the time to listen to the Jaimini Lectures at http://sohamsa. com/js/ do

so as it will show you the depths of this knowledge you cannot imagine exists

in jyotish. The derivation of the chnhandas and what not all. Thumb rules are

meant for beginners. The day you decided to give up jyotish, you got stuck in

the thumb rules but then its ok with me. I always wished you the best in

whatever you do.

>

> But, despite some arbitrariness and imperfection, if a thumb rule allows

you to pick an austerity with confidence and create the mental feeling that

you are doing the best possible thing for your situation, it is good. After

all, what is critical is to do *some* austerity to burn the blocking karma,

with a positive frame of mind about what you are doing.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] No Narasimha, very happy marriages can happen, without

austerities as well.

>

> But, if endless theorization and complicated technicalities evolving

from the thumb rule are creating doubts and confusion in the minds of people

as they consider an austerity, that is useless and totally missing the point.

>

> Some people tend to resort to heavy theorization based on very shaky

grounds. I suggest going back to the basics, thinking clearly and keeping

things simple.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] Human brains work differently in seeking the truth and

means to remedy the errors. Life is too complicated to keep everything

simple. For example, a heavily cursed Venus can block everything and UL fast

may not be able to solve the problem. Now would you say that heavy

thoerization and complication is happening and we should ignore the other

factors completely?

>

> Gem stones may harm when used incorrectly. But, austerities like

prayers, fasting, mouna vrata and brahmacharya will NEVER do you any harm. If

your body can take fasting, you can do it on any weekday or tithi without too

many calculations.

>

> [sanjay Rath:] Brahmacharya is good for someone planning to have a baby

or one who cannot conceive and this is kept for some period before the

appointed date of nisheka. Brahmacharya is good for marriage?! I think you

are mistaking abstinence from physical union as Brahmacharya. Oh no its so

different.

>

> Best regards,

> Narasimha

> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -

> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAst rologer.org/ homam

> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAst

rologer.org/ tarpana

> Spirituality: http://groups. / group/vedic- wisdom

> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro. home.comcast. net

> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAst

rologer.org

> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagan

nath.org

> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -

>

> sohamsa@

..com <sohamsa%

40. com> , Ajay Zharotia <ajayzharotia@> wrote:

> > ||Om Gurave Namah||

> >

> > Dear Swee, & jyotishis

> >

> > What Zoran is saying is right. Do not mix the energy of day lord

> > (Agni) by choosing the same tithi (jala) that will create serious

> > troubles for the spouse.

> > Let me explain the principle in a simple way so that there should

not

> > be any confusion.

> >

> > In your chart (Swee) Vrishabha lagna, UL is in 2nd house. So lord

of

> > the UL is the Mercury. Since fasting is prohibited for UL in 2nd

> > house see where the lord of the UL has gone. In your case mercury

has

> > gone to the 11th house hence it is Ekadashi. So rule is to choose

the

> > tithi is based on the placement of the UL lord.

> >

> > Now suppose instead of 11th house if Mercury goes to 12th house or

4

> > house then you cannot choose Dwadashi or Chaturthi for the same

> > because these thithis are ruled by Mercury only and fasting on

these

> > tithis will create serious doshas.

> >

> > If you are doing fasting on the basis of tithis it should be done

in

> > sukla paksha only. But if you are doing in Krishna paksha (Pitris)

> > also then it should be combined with the donation.

> >

> > I hope this will clarify the principal.

> >

> > Best Regards

> >

> > Ajay Zharotia

> > ajayzharotia@

> >

> > On Feb 4, 2009, at 12:51 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran wrote:

> >

> > > || Om Gurave Namah ||

> > > Dear Swee,

> > > Can you please tell me the exact rule to use for fasting on

> > > tithi?.Do we use the 12th lord tithi?, Like if you are Ta

lagna,

> > > there 2 tithi one on Triteeya (3) and Ekadasha(11) . If we consider

 

> > > only the paksh in which u are born.

> > > Now of the two which to use?.

> > >

> > > Warm Regards

> > > Sanjay p

> > >

> > > 2009/2/3 Swee Chan <swee@>

> > > Jaya Jagannatha

> > >

> > > Dear Hari, Zoki, et al in this discussion,

> > > Namaste

> > >

> > > The tongue in cheek, I'll excuse ;-)) it's my laugh for the

day!!

> > > I fast on ekadasi tithi because my UL is in 2nd house (ie 12th

lord

> > > is in lagna). Since I was born on sukla paksha, Sanjay ji

suggests

> > > that I fast only on sukla ekadasi.

> > > Zoki, if you listen to JUS of Year I, you will note how Sanjay

ji

> > > came to this conclusion.

> > >

> > > love,

> > >

> > > Swee

> > >

> > > On 3 Feb 2009, at 15:25, Jyotisa Shisya wrote:

> > >

> > >> |om|

> > >> Dear Zoran, namaste

> > >>

> > >> Would not the general act of fasting be construed as an

insult to

> > >> Sri MahaVishnu?

> > >>

> > >> best regards

> > >> Hari

> > >>

> > >> On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 5:30 PM, ahimsavm <ahimsans@>

 

> > >> wrote:

> > >> Om Namah Shivaya,

> > >> Dear Bojan and others,

> > >> Here is my point and view about the question raised. 2nd

bhava is

> > >> the bhava of Vishnu, sustainer, and if we fast on the day

of UL in

> > >> 2nd house, we bring insult to Vishnu who provides the food

for us.

> > >> However, to be honest, I have not heard this about 2nd

lord and

> > >> tithi. The basic point is that Upapada is a rashi and

carries energy

> > >> of Vara or day. If you fast on the day ruled by tithi of

the 2nd

> > >> lord, you are bringing the jala energy to vara, and

gandanta may

> > >> occur, and spouse may come into a danger. So, what is the

way out.

> > >> The simple solution is to do vrata which do not conflict

with

> > >> rejection of food. So a person may observe the fast on UL

in 2nd

> > >> day, however, adequate food should be offered as a prasad

and eaten

> > >> before the Sunrise (not complete fast).In this way,

results may come

> > >> a bit later, but will certainly come, while a person will

not bring

> > >> insult to Shri Vishnu by rejecting the food.

> > >> This is the way I was taught, and ofcourse others may

agree or not.

> > >> Best wishes

> > >> Zoran Radosavljevic

> > >> www.siva-edu.

info

> > >> www.ahimsazr1. wordpress. com

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

om paramesthi gurave namah

Dear Narasimha

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

>

Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc.

 

 

>

It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this.

 

 

 

 

 

Some

may be fascinated by the texture, color and volume of the chaff and miss the

grain.

 

 

 

 

 

Most

people who talk about mantra shastra focus on the chaff and not on the grain.

[sanjay Rath:] This sounds like saying that Einsten is bogus as

Newtons theory can explain everything! Viewpoint is very important. Perhaps

what you call the grain is the tree itself! That is the depth of knowledge

which decides whether you have the ability to reach the grain or are still

searching for the tree.

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

But

the bottomline is this: Only a highly purified sadhaka of very low ego can

command specific results from god (not for selfishness or even ego

satisfaction, but acting as an unattached instrument of Nature fulfilling

one's dharma set by Nature). Various mantras and technicalities of mantra

shastra taught by rishis are meant for such sadhakas.

[sanjay Rath:] When will you start learning this?

 

 

 

 

 

Those

are hardly of use to so many people out there with dense egos seeking specific

selfish results. They cannot command specific results from god (because of

their heavy attachment to the result, which is in turn due to their own

attachment to a limited ego), even if they use all the techniques of mantra

shastra and all the associated rules of astrology. Instead of wasting their

time with these technicalities, they will be better off learning to be good

beggars at God's door.

[sanjay Rath:] This is wrong. There was a time when there were

only a few very qualified doctors and they alone could cure. When the knowledge

is shared, more doctors arrive in the planet and they too can heal.

Secondly, whether someone is training to be a beggar at Gods

door is the work of his/her spiritual master and NOT that of the Jyotishi. An

astrologer is *required to be humble* and not arrogate to himself this task of

asking people to be humble before God or such things. The path that every

creature takes is that of the spiritual master they seek and follow. And it is

the humility to the Guru alone that brings the ego under control and makes it

humble. One who cannot be humble before the Guru is a gross failure when he

tries to be humble before God and submit. So what you are saying is actually *not

fully correct*

The first step is to be a beggar before the teacher/guru and

then alone can you be ready to be a beggar at the doors of God.

 

 

 

 

 

Just

pick any prasiddha mantra or a mantra you feel attracted to, without worrying

about so many technicalities, and learn to be humble and surrender to the Lord.

Patiently wait for him to give you what you want. Like a beggar, take whatever

and whenever he gives.

[sanjay Rath:] I have done this for about 30 years now, and I

believe many people in this list have done this for maybe even longer periods.

What is the new thing you are saying?

 

 

 

 

 

Keep

praying every day or every second when you are able to. Even when you are not

praying, remember him in all of your actions. When you enjoy something in the

material world, tell yourself that it is his and that he gave it to you.

If you remember him all the time, slowly the dirt in your mind will start to

get cleaned. This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than

picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on

unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).

[sanjay Rath:] Stop giving a sermon Narasimha?? I know all this,

so what is it that you are talking about? Come to the point.

It is pathetic that what you say as *unreliable source* is what

you practised for a decade and never questioned it until suddenly when you are

*not a part of the Jaimini scholar program* !!

Vaara/Weekday prayers -

Forget the first batch of Jaimini scholars, just ask anyone in

the second batch in year-2/3 and they can easily explain –

 

Why is Lord

Shiva worshipped on Mondays?

Why is Lord

Vishnu worshipped on Thursdays?

 

Now don’t try to tell me you did not know that Lord Shiva is

worshipped by millions of Indians on Mondays!

Tithi Prayers

Fasting on tithi’s concerned to the birth anniversary of the devata

on the days of the tithi are too well known. And you are a software maker, have

written papers on this also. So why this sudden volta-face?

Ekadashi fasting is done by a few millions of people for Krishna

for Yuga santarana i.e. tiding over the Yuga effects.

Why is ekadashi fasting advocated for this? What link does

Ekadashi have to Kali yuga? You do not know the answer does not mean that it is

wrong. And if you know the answer, then why do you say that the tithi fasting

is wrong??!

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

There

may be a mountain with thousands of paths (mantra) for climbing it. Each

path may lead to a different spot (different experience) on the top and show a

different scenery (result). Expert advisors (astrologers) may tell you to use a

specific path (mantra) to see a specific scenery (result). But such advice is

useless to a handicapped person without legs (a selfish person with dense ego).

It is relevant only to person with legs and one who is strong and sturdy, who

can successfully climb the mountain (a reasonably detached person with very

little ego).

[sanjay Rath:] Another Sermon about being selfish

.....since the letter is addressed to me it implies that you mean

*I am selfish*. ...and now people will be wondering about what am I selfish? Is

it because I did not share the Jaimni scholar lectures? I invited you and een

was prepard to shift dates, but you were too busy filming about Krishna’s birth

or something.

 

 

 

 

 

Even

when you encounter a person who has legs and can actually climb the mountain,

the stress should be on how to climb the mountain and traverse the long path,

rather than which path to take. The astrologers who are bogged down by all the

technicalities and people who take customized mantra advice from astrologers

and think that they will get a result quickly by doing that 'powerful' mantra

are missing the basic point. The power of a powerful mantra is with respect to

the experience and result obtained *after*

one succeeds with the mantra. A partcicularly powerful mantra is akin to a path

leading to a point atop the mountain where the view shows a particularly

beautiful scenery. But the bottomline is that you do have to survive the climb

along the long path.

[sanjay Rath:] No No Narasimha, mantra is beautiful. It is not *ardous*

like climbing mountain. It is beautiful like a dance – yes a dance on top of

Kailash with Lord Shiva.

So this sermn is very wrong really. I have mantra lord Moon in

12th house, so it s a dance for me, you have 5th lord

(mantra) in 8th house (hard) in debility in Aries (mountain), so it like

climbing a mountain for you.

You see here also the karma plays out.

 

 

 

 

 

We

need to emphasize the attitude and approach needed for the long climb, rather

than emphasizing the choice of the path based on horoscope. It is worth noting

that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did

not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they

emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion,

patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc!!!! *That* is a lot more

important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day

etc and impress god.

[sanjay Rath:] Really and how do you wish to *STANDADIZE* this?

You have a given formula for the approach and attitude or is it borrowed from

another, and if so then why are you assuming that the people in this list do

not know about *surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence,

discipline, humility etc!!!! *

No one is trying to be over smart. They are being smart.

They are only using certain rules to approach based on available

knowledge. And that knowledge seems to be bothering you like your problem with

Upapada fasting.

 

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

>

when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone

 

 

>

wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this

 

 

>

worship should be done?

 

 

 

You

can do anyday. Parasara does not mention any day for doing homam to a graha.

 

 

In

fact, if one wants, one can do a homam or worship to Mars (or any planet) every day. It is even

better that way.

 

 

If

an astrologer suggests doing it on a Tuesday, it is fine. But saying that doing

it on so and so day will bring serious dangers because Mars is an enemy of so

and so planet would be stretching things.

[sanjay Rath:] Read the PURANAS. What you write clearly shows lack

of understanding  of the Puranas. Why would the Rishi advise a particular day?

Are they wrong? Why is the Gayatri initiation done on Wednesdays and Thursdays?

Why is it not done on Saturday?

You earlier said that this can be done on any day, then why did

they advise a particular day for this?

 

 

 

 

 

 

>

[sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his

 

 

>

knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it

from?

 

 

 

From

Self - from within. That

is the source of all knowledge. A sadguru need not specifically

teach thousand things, but needs to open the door inside.

[sanjay Rath:] THAT IS AHAMKARA speaking.

The correct answer in complete humility is “The knowledge comes

from one source – Bhagavan.†Surrender to Him and he is the one who will have

the door opened, and then the self will gradually fade away like a mist coming

over a house.

 

 

 

 

 

 

*

* *

 

 

 

 

 

>

OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,

 

 

>

120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni

 

 

>

and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.

 

 

 

 

 

Parasara's

definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in a contiguous

space having a predominance of fire and water elements. " I see fire and I

see water. So there is gandanta " is a wrong approach. One can then call

Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery planet, being in

a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a contiguous

space.

 

 

In

your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no contiguous space where there

is a water-fire transition.

[sanjay Rath:] There is something called Tithi Gandanta! Gandanta

exists between Purna and nanda tithi.

What is wrong with tithi fasting related to the devata of the

planet associated with the Upapada? While Vara vrata will bring about marriage,

tithi vrata associated with the devata should sustain it? Similarly, malefic in

the 12th house can also be pacified either by their devata or if

there are planets in the 8th house, then these planets shall

support.

 

 

 

 

 

>

Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing.

 

 

>

You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and

 

 

>

are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from

 

 

>

Parashara?

 

 

 

Well,

Me10, Ve7 etc theory is based on marrying two different teachings of Parasara

(bhava karakas and special lagnas). I do not really consider it as my creation

but as understanding Parasara's teachings only.

 

 

 

[sanjay Rath:] Special Lagna are derived on the principle of

circular motion and the Sun as the Lagna in the first place is derived from the

Sun.

What you have done is to treat every planet like the Sun which

is wrong.

The normal procedure for looking at the karaka bhava is Me10 =

10th house from Mercury; Ve7 is 7th house from Venus and

so on...in the rasi and varga charts.

Narasimha, this is your creation and NOT taught in BPHS. Please

do not twist.

 

With Warm Regards

Sanjay Rath

http://srath.com http://sohamsa.com http://.org

15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India

 

[Guest guest]

Respected Gurujis,Sorry to intrude.The Rakshas like mahishusura and narakusura would have not received Boons with great penance.With upasana and hard work the manthras will yield and the powers will be acquired.With the acquired power whether one progresses further in sadhana or use the same for sensual gratification it depends.If the power is  used for spiritual growth then he can attain mukthi or in contrary he will end up in chain of births and deaths.After all how is the ego to be destroyed?where to start?   VrkOn 2 Mar 2009, at 12:35, "Sanjay Rath" <sjrath wrote:

 

 

 

 

om paramesthi gurave namah

Dear Narasimha

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

>

Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc.

 

 

>

It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this.

 

 

 

 

 

Some

may be fascinated by the texture, color and volume of the chaff and miss the

grain.

 

 

 

 

 

Most

people who talk about mantra shastra focus on the chaff and not on the grain.

[sanjay Rath:] This sounds like saying that Einsten is bogus as

Newtons theory can explain everything! Viewpoint is very important. Perhaps

what you call the grain is the tree itself! That is the depth of knowledge

which decides whether you have the ability to reach the grain or are still

searching for the tree.

 

 

 

 

 

*       

*        *

 

 

 

 

 

But

the bottomline is this: Only a highly purified sadhaka of very low ego can

command specific results from god (not for selfishness or even ego

satisfaction, but acting as an unattached instrument of Nature fulfilling

one's dharma set by Nature). Various mantras and technicalities of mantra

shastra taught by rishis are meant for such sadhakas.

[sanjay Rath:] When will you start learning this?

 

 

 

 

 

Those

are hardly of use to so many people out there with dense egos seeking specific

selfish results. They cannot command specific results from god (because of

their heavy attachment to the result, which is in turn due to their own

attachment to a limited ego), even if they use all the techniques of mantra

shastra and all the associated rules of astrology. Instead of wasting their

time with these technicalities, they will be better off learning to be good

beggars at God's door.

[sanjay Rath:] This is wrong. There was a time when there were

only a few very qualified doctors and they alone could cure. When the knowledge

is shared, more doctors arrive in the planet and they too can heal.

Secondly, whether someone is training to be a beggar at Gods

door is the work of his/her spiritual master and NOT that of the Jyotishi. An

astrologer is *required to be humble* and not arrogate to himself this task of

asking people to be humble before God or such things. The path that every

creature takes is that of the spiritual master they seek and follow. And it is

the humility to the Guru alone that brings the ego under control and makes it

humble. One who cannot be humble before the Guru is a gross failure when he

tries to be humble before God and submit. So what you are saying is actually *not

fully correct*

The first step is to be a beggar before the teacher/guru and

then alone can you be ready to be a beggar at the doors of God.

 

 

 

 

 

Just

pick any prasiddha mantra or a mantra you feel attracted to, without worrying

about so many technicalities, and learn to be humble and surrender to the Lord.

Patiently wait for him to give you what you want. Like a beggar, take whatever

and whenever he gives.

[sanjay Rath:] I have done this for about 30 years now, and I

believe many people in this list have done this for maybe even longer periods.

What is the new thing you are saying?

 

 

 

 

 

Keep

praying every day or every second when you are able to. Even when you are not

praying, remember him in all of your actions. When you enjoy something in the

material world, tell yourself that it is his and that he gave it to you.

If you remember him all the time, slowly the dirt in your mind will start to

get cleaned. This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than

picking the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on

unreliable knowledge coming from questionable sources!).

[sanjay Rath:] Stop giving a sermon Narasimha?? I know all this,

so what is it that you are talking about? Come to the point.

It is pathetic that what you say as *unreliable source* is what

you practised for a decade and never questioned it until suddenly when you are

*not a part of the Jaimini scholar program* !!

Vaara/Weekday prayers -

Forget the first batch of Jaimini scholars, just ask anyone in

the second batch in year-2/3 and they can easily explain –

 

Why is Lord

Shiva worshipped on Mondays?

Why is Lord

Vishnu worshipped on Thursdays?

 

Now don’t try to tell me you did not know that Lord Shiva is

worshipped by millions of Indians on Mondays!

Tithi Prayers

Fasting on tithi’s concerned to the birth anniversary of the devata

on the days of the tithi are too well known. And you are a software maker, have

written papers on this also. So why this sudden volta-face?

Ekadashi fasting is done by a few millions of people for Krishna

for Yuga santarana i.e. tiding over the Yuga effects.

Why is ekadashi fasting advocated for this? What link does

Ekadashi have to Kali yuga? You do not know the answer does not mean that it is

wrong. And if you know the answer, then why do you say that the tithi fasting

is wrong??!

 

 

 

 

 

*       

*        *

 

 

 

 

 

There

may be a mountain with thousands of paths (mantra) for climbing it. Each

path may lead to a different spot (different experience) on the top and show a

different scenery (result). Expert advisors (astrologers) may tell you to use a

specific path (mantra) to see a specific scenery (result). But such advice is

useless to a handicapped person without legs (a selfish person with dense ego).

It is relevant only to person with legs and one who is strong and sturdy, who

can successfully climb the mountain (a reasonably detached person with very

little ego).

[sanjay Rath:] Another Sermon about being selfish

.....since the letter is addressed to me it implies that you mean

*I am selfish*. ...and now people will be wondering about what am I selfish? Is

it because I did not share the Jaimni scholar lectures? I invited you and een

was prepard to shift dates, but you were too busy filming about Krishna’s birth

or something.

 

 

 

 

 

Even

when you encounter a person who has legs and can actually climb the mountain,

the stress should be on how to climb the mountain and traverse the long path,

rather than which path to take. The astrologers who are bogged down by all the

technicalities and people who take customized mantra advice from astrologers

and think that they will get a result quickly by doing that 'powerful' mantra

are missing the basic point. The power of a powerful mantra is with respect to

the experience and result obtained *after*

one succeeds with the mantra. A partcicularly powerful mantra is akin to a path

leading to a point atop the mountain where the view shows a particularly

beautiful scenery. But the bottomline is that you do have to survive the climb

along the long path.

[sanjay Rath:] No No Narasimha, mantra is beautiful. It is not *ardous*

like climbing mountain. It is beautiful like a dance – yes a dance on top of

Kailash with Lord Shiva.

So this sermn is very wrong really. I have mantra lord Moon in

12th house, so it s a dance for me, you have 5th lord

(mantra) in 8th house (hard) in debility in Aries (mountain), so it like

climbing a mountain for you.

You see here also the karma plays out.

 

 

 

 

 

We

need to emphasize the attitude and approach needed for the long climb, rather

than emphasizing the choice of the path based on horoscope. It is worth noting

that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did

not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they

emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion,

patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc!!!! *That* is a lot more

important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day

etc and impress god.

[sanjay Rath:] Really and how do you wish to *STANDADIZE* this?

You have a given formula for the approach and attitude or is it borrowed from

another, and if so then why are you assuming that the people in this list do

not know about *surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence,

discipline, humility etc!!!! *

No one is trying to be over smart. They are being smart.

They are only using certain rules to approach based on available

knowledge. And that knowledge seems to be bothering you like your problem with

Upapada fasting.

 

 

 

 

 

 

*       

*        *

 

 

 

 

 

>

when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone

 

 

>

wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this

 

 

>

worship should be done?

 

 

 

You

can do anyday. Parasara does not mention any day for doing homam to a graha.

 

 

 In

fact, if one wants, one can do a homam or worship to Mars (or any planet) every day. It is even

better that way.

 

 

 If

an astrologer suggests doing it on a Tuesday, it is fine. But saying that doing

it on so and so day will bring serious dangers because Mars is an enemy of so

and so planet would be stretching things.

[sanjay Rath:] Read the PURANAS. What you write clearly shows lack

of understanding  of the Puranas. Why would the Rishi advise a particular day?

Are they wrong? Why is the Gayatri initiation done on Wednesdays and Thursdays?

Why is it not done on Saturday?

You earlier said that this can be done on any day, then why did

they advise a particular day for this?

 

 

 

 

 

 

>

[sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his

 

 

>

knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it

from?

 

 

 

From

Self - from within. That

is the source of all knowledge. A sadguru need not specifically

teach thousand things, but needs to open the door inside.

[sanjay Rath:] THAT IS AHAMKARA speaking.

The correct answer in complete humility is “The knowledge comes

from one source – Bhagavan.†Surrender to Him and he is the one who will have

the door opened, and then the self will gradually fade away like a mist coming

over a house.

 

 

 

 

 

 

*       

*        *

 

 

 

 

 

>

OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,

 

 

>

120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni

 

 

>

and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.

 

 

 

 

 

Parasara's

definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in a contiguous

space having a predominance of fire and water elements. "I see fire and I

see water. So there is gandanta" is a wrong approach. One can then call

Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery planet, being in

a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a contiguous

space.

 

 

In

your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no contiguous space where there

is a water-fire transition.

[sanjay Rath:] There is something called Tithi Gandanta! Gandanta

exists between Purna and nanda tithi.

What is wrong with tithi fasting related to the devata of the

planet associated with the Upapada? While Vara vrata will bring about marriage,

tithi vrata associated with the devata should sustain it? Similarly, malefic in

the 12th house can also be pacified either by their devata or if

there are planets in the 8th house, then these planets shall

support.

 

 

 

 

 

>

Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing.

 

 

>

You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and

 

 

>

are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from

 

 

>

Parashara? 

 

 

 

Well,

Me10, Ve7 etc theory is based on marrying two different teachings of Parasara

(bhava karakas and special lagnas). I do not really consider it as my creation

but as understanding Parasara's teachings only.

 

 

 

[sanjay Rath:] Special Lagna are derived on the principle of

circular motion and the Sun as the Lagna in the first place is derived from the

Sun.

What you have done is to treat every planet like the Sun which

is wrong.

The normal procedure for looking at the karaka bhava is Me10 =

10th house from Mercury; Ve7 is 7th house from Venus and

so on...in the rasi and varga charts.

Narasimha, this is your creation and NOT taught in BPHS. Please

do not twist.

 

With Warm Regards

Sanjay Rath

http://srath.com http://sohamsa.com http://.org

15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Check out the all-new Messenger 9.0!

[Guest guest]

Dear Swee,

 

As you say, this is only " somewhat related " .

 

A result from a specific karma may indeed require a specific remedy. But my main

points are as follows:

 

(1) The knowledge needed for judging specific karmas responsible for specific

results and suggesting specific remedies is partly lost and partly corrupted

today. What we have is a non-coherent collage of some good knowledge and a lot

of corruptions.

 

The way gandanta is being stretched and people are talking of insult to Vishnu

by fasting etc, it should be clear that knowledge is being corrupted based on

fancy imagination (without acknowledging that it is a research proposal).

 

(2) Many people today are unable to use many specific remedies given in shastras

today. Just because one worships a specific form with a specific mantra, things

do not necessarily happen. There is a lot more needed and most of it is not

external (e.g. choice of weekday or tithi or color of clothes, direction faced

etc) but internal (e.g. discipline, patience, surrender, humility, low ego etc).

In the old days, these internal issues were pretty much under control and

mantras worked well. Now, people lack big time and mantras do not work the way

they are supposed to.

 

Given the above two points, best path for one today is to surrender to a deity,

try to instill discipline, humility and patience and pray for mercy, rather than

running after astrologers for customized remedies.

 

(3) *Austerities* like fasting do *not* harm one. For example, the king in the

story did not get leprosy because he fasted on a wrong day. Claims that fasting

causes dangers and that there are formulas for calculating it are quite wrong.

 

Best regards,

Narasimha

 

Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homam

Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpana

Spirituality:

Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net

Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org

Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org

 

 

sohamsa , Swee Chan <swee wrote:

>

> Jaya Jagannatha

>

> Dear Narasimha,

> Namaste

>

> > If reliable and unquestionable sources can be mentioned for claims

> > that fasting on certain weekdays or tithis brings " insult to

> > Vishnu " , " serious doshas " and " danger to spouse " , I can reconsider

> > my statement.

>

> I can give you a reference that is somewhat related, since King

> Bhadreshvara was propitiating (and offering many penances to) many

> deities (verse 2). Despite this, he still suffered leprosy and was

> told to specifically propitiate the Sun. This implies that the King

> did not propitiate the correct form of deity and had to suffer the

> leprosy, until he took advice from the Brahmanas (in the next two

> verses not provided. Since I have given the reference, you and other

> learned sanskritists could maybe check out the rest of the chapter) -

> would be much appreciated by me.

>

> The other reference which I have not provided here on Shanishcara

> stotra, requests his devotees to eulogise him on Saturday, since this

> day is presided by him.

>

> I hope this reference will finally put things in a clearer perspective.

>

> love,

>

> Swee

>

> 

>

> On 2 Mar 2009, at 07:40, Narasimha P.V.R. Rao wrote:

>

> > Namaste,

> >

> > > > This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than

> > picking the

> > > > right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on

> > unreliable

> > > > knowledge coming from questionable sources!).

> > >

> > > I agree: fixing of attitude is needed.Ã, 'Questionable sources'?Ã,

> > > Lets not lose our manners now.

> >

> > If reliable and unquestionable sources can be mentioned for claims

> > that fasting on certain weekdays or tithis brings " insult to

> > Vishnu " , " serious doshas " and " danger to spouse " , I can reconsider

> > my statement.

> >

> > > But don't start a vendetta against the vedanga.

> >

> > This is not a vendetta against the vedanga, but a pushback on a

> > mindless spree of over-theorization and over-selling of unreliable

> > knowledge coming from questionable sources, which is corrupting the

> > vedanga.

> >

> > Best regards,

> > Narasimha

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Sanjay,

 

> No No Narasimha, mantra is beautiful. It is not *ardous* like

> climbing mountain. It is beautiful like a dance â? " yes a dance

> on top of Kailash with Lord Shiva.

 

Well, if mantra is really like a dance on top of Kailasha for you, you are

fortunate. However, most people do have to engage in an arduous climbing to

enjoy such a dance. If I (or anybody else) were to tell people that mantras work

magically without a lot of discipline and effort and internal maturing, I would

be misleading them. If I were to tell people that their problems will be

magically solved because they came to me and got the perfect mantra to the

perfect deity, I would be misleading them.

 

> So this sermn is very wrong really. I have mantra lord Moon in

> 12th house, so it s a dance for me, you have 5th lord (mantra) in

> 8th house (hard) in debility in Aries (mountain), so it like

> climbing a mountain for you.

> You see here also the karma plays out.

 

Karma does indeed play out, but the question is whether we are reading it

correctly or not!

 

Yes, my 5th lord is indeed in 8th but with several planets and aspected by

Jupiter and giving many yogas. Are we sure we are judging it correctly? Yes,

your 5th lord is in 12th, but he is in marana karaka sthana from 5th and

aspected closely by Rahu. Are we sure we are judging it correctly?

 

Bottomline is that judging the play of karmas is not a simple thing and one can

always make mistakes. In any case, I suggest that we should not get personal

under the pretext of demonstrating how karmas play out.

 

> Secondly, whether someone is training to be a beggar at Gods door

> is the work of his/her spiritual master and NOT that of the Jyotishi.

> An astrologer is *required to be humble* and not arrogate to himself

> this task of asking people to be humble before God or such things.

 

OK, so what then is the task of this " humble " astrologer? If telling people to

surrender to god and pray is arrogance, what do you call telling people that one

has knowledge which will let them get what they want from god? Also, is it

really humble to make statements that austerities can bring dangers and insult

to Vishnu? When an astrologer recommends mantras and makes statements like

these, one is already encroaching on the space of a spiritual master somewhat.

 

> ....since the letter is addressed to me it implies that you mean *I am

selfish*

 

Though the mail is addressed to you, a lot of portions inside are addressed to

all. The above point is not about any specific person. I apologize for any

confusion.

 

> > > OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,

> > > 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni

> > > and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.

> >

> > Parasara's definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in

a

> > contiguous space having a predominance of fire and water elements. " I see

> > fire and I see water. So there is gandanta " is a wrong approach. One can

> > then call Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery

planet,

> > being in a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a

> > contiguous space. In your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no

> > contiguous space where there is a water-fire transition.

> >

> There is something called Tithi Gandanta! Gandanta exists between

> Purna and nanda tithi.

 

Yes, but we do have a contiguous space here. The contiguous 0-360 deg space of

Sun-Moon angle has portions with predominance of different elements. When there

are transitions between portioins having a predominance of fire and water,

Parasara gave a tithi gandanta there.

 

When you are talking about the tithi of UL lord, what is the contiguous space,

what are its portions and what are the transitions? It is an illogical extension

of gandanta.

 

* * *

 

In conclusion, I will sum up my main points. [This is copied from the other mail

from today and slightly edited.]

 

(1) The knowledge needed for judging specific karmas responsible for specific

results and suggesting specific remedies is partly lost and partly corrupted

today. What we have is a non-coherent collage of some good knowledge and a lot

of corruptions.

 

The way gandanta is being stretched and people are talking of insult to Vishnu

by fasting etc, it should be clear that knowledge is being corrupted based on

fancy imagination. People are presenting their ideas without making it clear

that those are their ideas.

 

(2) Many people today are unable to use many specific remedies given in shastras

today. Just because one worships a specific form with a specific mantra, things

do not necessarily happen. There is a lot more needed and most of it is not

external (e.g. choice of weekday or tithi or color of clothes, direction faced

etc) but internal (e.g. discipline, patience, surrender, humility, low ego etc).

In the old days, these internal issues were pretty much under control and

mantras worked well. Now, people lack on those big time and mantras do not work

the way they are supposed to.

 

Given the above two points, best path for one today is to surrender to a deity,

try to instill discipline, humility and patience and pray for mercy, rather than

running after astrologers for customized remedies.

 

(3) *Austerities* like fasting do *not* harm one.

 

Best regards,

Narasimha

 

Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homam

Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpana

Spirituality:

Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net

Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org

Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org

 

 

sohamsa , " Sanjay Rath " <sjrath wrote:

 

om paramesthi gurave namah

 

Dear Narasimha

 

 

 

> Mantra Shastra is a very detailed work and includes mantra dosha etc.

 

> It is very scientific and accurate. It takes a lifetime to master this.

 

 

Some may be fascinated by the texture, color and volume of the chaff and miss

the grain.

 

 

Most people who talk about mantra shastra focus on the chaff and not on the

grain.

 

[sanjay Rath:] This sounds like saying that Einsten is bogus as Newtons theory

can explain everything! Viewpoint is very important. Perhaps what you call the

grain is the tree itself! That is the depth of knowledge which decides whether

you have the ability to reach the grain or are still searching for the tree.

 

 

* * *

 

 

But the bottomline is this: Only a highly purified sadhaka of very low ego can

command specific results from god (not for selfishness or even ego satisfaction,

but acting as an unattached instrument of Nature fulfilling one's dharma set by

Nature). Various mantras and technicalities of mantra shastra taught by rishis

are meant for such sadhakas.

 

[sanjay Rath:] When will you start learning this?

 

 

Those are hardly of use to so many people out there with dense egos seeking

specific selfish results. They cannot command specific results from god (because

of their heavy attachment to the result, which is in turn due to their own

attachment to a limited ego), even if they use all the techniques of mantra

shastra and all the associated rules of astrology. Instead of wasting their time

with these technicalities, they will be better off learning to be good beggars

at God's door.

 

[sanjay Rath:] This is wrong. There was a time when there were only a few very

qualified doctors and they alone could cure. When the knowledge is shared, more

doctors arrive in the planet and they too can heal.

 

Secondly, whether someone is training to be a beggar at Gods door is the work of

his/her spiritual master and NOT that of the Jyotishi. An astrologer is

*required to be humble* and not arrogate to himself this task of asking people

to be humble before God or such things. The path that every creature takes is

that of the spiritual master they seek and follow. And it is the humility to the

Guru alone that brings the ego under control and makes it humble. One who cannot

be humble before the Guru is a gross failure when he tries to be humble before

God and submit. So what you are saying is actually *not fully correct*

 

The first step is to be a beggar before the teacher/guru and then alone can you

be ready to be a beggar at the doors of God.

 

 

Just pick any prasiddha mantra or a mantra you feel attracted to, without

worrying about so many technicalities, and learn to be humble and surrender to

the Lord. Patiently wait for him to give you what you want. Like a beggar, take

whatever and whenever he gives.

 

[sanjay Rath:] I have done this for about 30 years now, and I believe many

people in this list have done this for maybe even longer periods. What is the

new thing you are saying?

 

 

Keep praying every day or every second when you are able to. Even when you are

not praying, remember him in all of your actions. When you enjoy something in

the material world, tell yourself that it is his and that he gave it to you. If

you remember him all the time, slowly the dirt in your mind will start to get

cleaned. This fixing of attitude is faaaaaaaaaaaar more important than picking

the right mantra, right weekday, right tithi etc (that too based on unreliable

knowledge coming from questionable sources!).

 

[sanjay Rath:] Stop giving a sermon Narasimha?? I know all this, so what is it

that you are talking about? Come to the point.

 

It is pathetic that what you say as *unreliable source* is what you practised

for a decade and never questioned it until suddenly when you are *not a part of

the Jaimini scholar program* !!

 

Vaara/Weekday prayers -

 

Forget the first batch of Jaimini scholars, just ask anyone in the second batch

in year-2/3 and they can easily explain â? "

 

1.. Why is Lord Shiva worshipped on Mondays?

2.. Why is Lord Vishnu worshipped on Thursdays?

Now donâ?Tt try to tell me you did not know that Lord Shiva is worshipped by

millions of Indians on Mondays!

 

Tithi Prayers

 

Fasting on tithiâ?Ts concerned to the birth anniversary of the devata on the

days of the tithi are too well known. And you are a software maker, have written

papers on this also. So why this sudden volta-face?

 

Ekadashi fasting is done by a few millions of people for Krishna for Yuga

santarana i.e. tiding over the Yuga effects.

 

Why is ekadashi fasting advocated for this? What link does Ekadashi have to Kali

yuga? You do not know the answer does not mean that it is wrong. And if you know

the answer, then why do you say that the tithi fasting is wrong??!

 

 

* * *

 

 

There may be a mountain with thousands of paths (mantra) for climbing it. Each

path may lead to a different spot (different experience) on the top and show a

different scenery (result). Expert advisors (astrologers) may tell you to use a

specific path (mantra) to see a specific scenery (result). But such advice is

useless to a handicapped person without legs (a selfish person with dense ego).

It is relevant only to person with legs and one who is strong and sturdy, who

can successfully climb the mountain (a reasonably detached person with very

little ego).

 

[sanjay Rath:] Another Sermon about being selfish

 

.....since the letter is addressed to me it implies that you mean *I am selfish*.

....and now people will be wondering about what am I selfish? Is it because I did

not share the Jaimni scholar lectures? I invited you and een was prepard to

shift dates, but you were too busy filming about Krishnaâ?Ts birth or something.

 

 

Even when you encounter a person who has legs and can actually climb the

mountain, the stress should be on how to climb the mountain and traverse the

long path, rather than which path to take. The astrologers who are bogged down

by all the technicalities and people who take customized mantra advice from

astrologers and think that they will get a result quickly by doing that

'powerful' mantra are missing the basic point. The power of a powerful mantra is

with respect to the experience and result obtained *after* one succeeds with the

mantra. A partcicularly powerful mantra is akin to a path leading to a point

atop the mountain where the view shows a particularly beautiful scenery. But the

bottomline is that you do have to survive the climb along the long path.

 

[sanjay Rath:] No No Narasimha, mantra is beautiful. It is not *ardous* like

climbing mountain. It is beautiful like a dance â? " yes a dance on top of

Kailash with Lord Shiva.

 

So this sermn is very wrong really. I have mantra lord Moon in 12th house, so it

s a dance for me, you have 5th lord (mantra) in 8th house (hard) in debility in

Aries (mountain), so it like climbing a mountain for you.

 

You see here also the karma plays out.

 

 

We need to emphasize the attitude and approach needed for the long climb, rather

than emphasizing the choice of the path based on horoscope. It is worth noting

that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the last century or two did

not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscope etc. Instead, they

emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender, submission, devotion,

patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc!!!! *That* is a lot more

important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice of mantra, day

etc and impress god.

 

[sanjay Rath:] Really and how do you wish to *STANDADIZE* this? You have a given

formula for the approach and attitude or is it borrowed from another, and if so

then why are you assuming that the people in this list do not know about

*surrender, submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility

etc!!!! *

 

No one is trying to be over smart. They are being smart.

 

They are only using certain rules to approach based on available knowledge. And

that knowledge seems to be bothering you like your problem with Upapada fasting.

 

 

* * *

 

 

> when should the worship of a graha be done? Let us say someone

 

> wishes to worship Mars (Mangala graha). When do you think this

 

> worship should be done?

 

 

You can do anyday. Parasara does not mention any day for doing homam to a graha.

 

In fact, if one wants, one can do a homam or worship to Mars (or any planet)

every day. It is even better that way.

 

If an astrologer suggests doing it on a Tuesday, it is fine. But saying that

doing it on so and so day will bring serious dangers because Mars is an enemy of

so and so planet would be stretching things.

 

[sanjay Rath:] Read the PURANAS. What you write clearly shows lack of

understanding  of the Puranas. Why would the Rishi advise a particular day? Are

they wrong? Why is the Gayatri initiation done on Wednesdays and Thursdays? Why

is it not done on Saturday?

 

You earlier said that this can be done on any day, then why did they advise a

particular day for this?

 

 

 

> [sanjay Rath:] Where do you think Veda Vyasa (Krishna dvaipaayana) got his

 

> knowledge and those who wrote it as scribes for him, where did they get it

from?

 

 

From Self - from within. That is the source of all knowledge. A sadguru need not

specifically teach thousand things, but needs to open the door inside.

 

[sanjay Rath:] THAT IS AHAMKARA speaking.

 

The correct answer in complete humility is â?oThe knowledge comes from one

source â? " Bhagavan.â? Surrender to Him and he is the one who will have the

door opened, and then the self will gradually fade away like a mist coming over

a house.

 

 

* * *

 

 

> OK, just spell it out. What is the reason for Gandanta being in 0 deg,

 

> 120 deg and 240 deg of the zodiac if it is not a junction between agni

 

> and jala...I want to her your words if you have any.

 

 

Parasara's definition of gandanta is restricted to two neighboring areas in a

contiguous space having a predominance of fire and water elements. " I see fire

and I see water. So there is gandanta " is a wrong approach. One can then call

Venus, a watery planet, being in a fiery sign or Mars, a fiery planet, being in

a watery sign as gandanta. Gandanta requires a *transition* in a contiguous

space.

 

In your example of upapada lord's tithi, there is no contiguous space where

there is a water-fire transition.

 

[sanjay Rath:] There is something called Tithi Gandanta! Gandanta exists between

Purna and nanda tithi.

 

What is wrong with tithi fasting related to the devata of the planet associated

with the Upapada? While Vara vrata will bring about marriage, tithi vrata

associated with the devata should sustain it? Similarly, malefic in the 12th

house can also be pacified either by their devata or if there are planets in the

8th house, then these planets shall support.

 

 

> Now somewhere you talked of wasting time!!! Look what you are doing.

 

> You were asked to work on Parashara by your Spiritual Master, and

 

> are you doing that? Me10, Ve7, Ve6...good research but is that from

 

> Parashara?

 

 

Well, Me10, Ve7 etc theory is based on marrying two different teachings of

Parasara (bhava karakas and special lagnas). I do not really consider it as my

creation but as understanding Parasara's teachings only.

 

 

[sanjay Rath:] Special Lagna are derived on the principle of circular motion and

the Sun as the Lagna in the first place is derived from the Sun.

 

What you have done is to treat every planet like the Sun which is wrong.

 

The normal procedure for looking at the karaka bhava is Me10 = 10th house from

Mercury; Ve7 is 7th house from Venus and so on...in the rasi and varga charts.

 

Narasimha, this is your creation and NOT taught in BPHS. Please do not twist.