Guest guest Posted May 5, 2008 Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 Dear Rajni Khan, What a hope ? Boosting the morale of your members is one thing...and telling LIES is another... The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU A COPY... L.Y.Rao. > > Girishji, > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally will > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the following > reasons: > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by asking > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will help us > decode the LK more. > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent mails is > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is possible > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is retaliating > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from Rahim: > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, keep him > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step way of > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will oblige us - > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for Vimshottri was sent > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has received > it, please forward it. > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of girish_raheja > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little sanity > please > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya fark > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi na > bhi mane to kya. > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi mante, > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab aj > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > Sincerely, > > Girish Raheja > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " <lyrastro1@> > wrote: > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > ANSWERED... > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > & > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > such...by > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > people > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > RATIONALE > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF THE > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > RATIONALE... > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > UMESH > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first sort > the > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - first > > let us sort > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of kulbir > bance > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > venus > > for > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that i > am > > karak of > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > kundali; > > the list > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > what > > is the > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain the > > rational of > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > were > > published > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, now > he > > is side > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, please > ask > > him what > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the truth > > before him. > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my behalf > as > > to what > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of proof > > can satisfy > > > him. > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > guess > > you have > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > criticizing > > them all > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness to > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > ignore > > it or > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > rationale of > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > embrace > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > give > > the > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I have > > been > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as you > > have not > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of LK. > As > > mentioned > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings to > > tackle the > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough for > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run away) > > provided we > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK itself > does > > not > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > it. > > At least > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For instance, > > Rahu in > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > planets) - if > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > police > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what LK > > says. Now > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can only > > make > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of varshphal? > To > > my best > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use it. > It > > works > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > extremely > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan and > in > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and then > > write > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > earning > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was by > > sheer > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > about > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By the > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > remedies... > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > REMEDIES....? > > If > > > so,what ? > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > remedies > > > help at all ? " > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them with > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since then, > they > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > rationale > > for > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I DID > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi is a > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the Moon > on a > > > particular day...and so on... > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY ADMITTING > > THAT > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE ANY > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT VERY > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied astrology > > > since 1960's... > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > CONVERSATIONS > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE STILL > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > FRIENDS > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > ABILITY > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I DO > NOT > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF THAT > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > needlessly > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > With best wishes, > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > could be > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > raises > > > can > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like myself > who > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and put > > off > > > by > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > senior > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > following: > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and jeers > the > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to keep > > quiet, > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh (though > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), Yograj > try > > to > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the book > and > > > then > > > > question. > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator Pt. > Rup > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in the > same > > > league. > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > right > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager to > know > > > all > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight amongst > the > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with uncertain > > > results, > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > remedies) > > > and > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the remedies > or > > > just > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the forums > where > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's chance > to > > > you > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the opportunity. > This > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss the > > issue > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to join > the > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if he > > > practices > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he will > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional astrolger > who > > has > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > participating > > > in > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is banned > > from > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. At > > least > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 5, 2008 Report Share Posted May 5, 2008 Girish ji, Rao sahib jage hue kahan hain, he says that pt ji could write the book only in persian. as u would be knowing the books were written in urdu. he needs to be awakened. sincerely kulbirbance lalkitab , " Rajni Khan " <rajni.khan wrote: > > Girishji, > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally will > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the following > reasons: > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by asking > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will help us > decode the LK more. > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent mails is > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is possible > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is retaliating > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from Rahim: > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, keep him > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step way of > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will oblige us - > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for Vimshottri was sent > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has received > it, please forward it. > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of girish_raheja > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little sanity > please > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya fark > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi na > bhi mane to kya. > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi mante, > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab aj > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > Sincerely, > > Girish Raheja > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " <lyrastro1@> > wrote: > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > ANSWERED... > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > & > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > such...by > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > people > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > RATIONALE > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF THE > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > RATIONALE... > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > UMESH > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first sort > the > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - first > > let us sort > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of kulbir > bance > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > venus > > for > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that i > am > > karak of > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > kundali; > > the list > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > what > > is the > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain the > > rational of > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > were > > published > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, now > he > > is side > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, please > ask > > him what > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the truth > > before him. > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my behalf > as > > to what > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of proof > > can satisfy > > > him. > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > guess > > you have > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > criticizing > > them all > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness to > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > ignore > > it or > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > rationale of > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > embrace > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > give > > the > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I have > > been > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as you > > have not > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of LK. > As > > mentioned > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings to > > tackle the > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough for > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run away) > > provided we > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK itself > does > > not > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > it. > > At least > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For instance, > > Rahu in > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > planets) - if > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > police > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what LK > > says. Now > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can only > > make > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of varshphal? > To > > my best > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use it. > It > > works > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > extremely > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan and > in > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and then > > write > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > earning > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was by > > sheer > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > about > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By the > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > remedies... > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > REMEDIES....? > > If > > > so,what ? > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > remedies > > > help at all ? " > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them with > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since then, > they > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > rationale > > for > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I DID > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi is a > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the Moon > on a > > > particular day...and so on... > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY ADMITTING > > THAT > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE ANY > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT VERY > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied astrology > > > since 1960's... > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > CONVERSATIONS > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE STILL > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > FRIENDS > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > ABILITY > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I DO > NOT > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF THAT > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > needlessly > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > With best wishes, > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > could be > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > raises > > > can > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like myself > who > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and put > > off > > > by > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > senior > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > following: > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and jeers > the > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to keep > > quiet, > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh (though > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), Yograj > try > > to > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the book > and > > > then > > > > question. > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator Pt. > Rup > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in the > same > > > league. > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > right > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager to > know > > > all > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight amongst > the > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with uncertain > > > results, > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > remedies) > > > and > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the remedies > or > > > just > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the forums > where > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's chance > to > > > you > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the opportunity. > This > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss the > > issue > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to join > the > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if he > > > practices > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he will > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional astrolger > who > > has > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > participating > > > in > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is banned > > from > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. At > > least > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 My email address is rajni.khan lalkitab [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 lalkitab [lalkitab] Re: LK debate Dear Rajni Khan, What a hope ? Boosting the morale of your members is one thing...and telling LIES is another... The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU A COPY... L.Y.Rao. > > Girishji, > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally will > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the following > reasons: > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by asking > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will help us > decode the LK more. > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent mails is > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is possible > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is retaliating > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from Rahim: > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, keep him > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step way of > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will oblige us - > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for Vimshottri was sent > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has received > it, please forward it. > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of girish_raheja > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little sanity > please > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya fark > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi na > bhi mane to kya. > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi mante, > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab aj > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > Sincerely, > > Girish Raheja > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " <lyrastro1@> > wrote: > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > ANSWERED... > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > & > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > such...by > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > people > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > RATIONALE > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF THE > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > RATIONALE... > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > UMESH > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first sort > the > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - first > > let us sort > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of kulbir > bance > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > venus > > for > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that i > am > > karak of > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > kundali; > > the list > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > what > > is the > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain the > > rational of > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > were > > published > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, now > he > > is side > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, please > ask > > him what > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the truth > > before him. > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my behalf > as > > to what > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of proof > > can satisfy > > > him. > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > guess > > you have > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > criticizing > > them all > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness to > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > ignore > > it or > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > rationale of > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > embrace > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > give > > the > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I have > > been > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as you > > have not > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of LK. > As > > mentioned > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings to > > tackle the > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough for > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run away) > > provided we > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK itself > does > > not > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > it. > > At least > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For instance, > > Rahu in > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > planets) - if > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > police > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what LK > > says. Now > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can only > > make > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of varshphal? > To > > my best > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use it. > It > > works > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > extremely > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan and > in > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and then > > write > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > earning > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was by > > sheer > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > about > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By the > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > remedies... > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > REMEDIES....? > > If > > > so,what ? > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > remedies > > > help at all ? " > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them with > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since then, > they > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > rationale > > for > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I DID > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi is a > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the Moon > on a > > > particular day...and so on... > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY ADMITTING > > THAT > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE ANY > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT VERY > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied astrology > > > since 1960's... > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > CONVERSATIONS > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE STILL > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > FRIENDS > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > ABILITY > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I DO > NOT > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF THAT > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > needlessly > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > With best wishes, > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > could be > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > raises > > > can > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like myself > who > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and put > > off > > > by > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > senior > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > following: > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and jeers > the > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to keep > > quiet, > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh (though > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), Yograj > try > > to > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the book > and > > > then > > > > question. > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator Pt. > Rup > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in the > same > > > league. > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > right > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager to > know > > > all > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight amongst > the > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with uncertain > > > results, > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > remedies) > > > and > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the remedies > or > > > just > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the forums > where > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's chance > to > > > you > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the opportunity. > This > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss the > > issue > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to join > the > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if he > > > practices > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he will > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional astrolger > who > > has > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > participating > > > in > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is banned > > from > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. At > > least > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 Dear Rajni Khan, From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious that the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is simply beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest of you ignoramuses... The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just anything else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you are nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT CONSISTENTLY AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... L.Y.Rao. > > My email address is rajni.khan > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > What a hope ? > Boosting the morale of your members is one > thing...and telling LIES is another... > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU A > COPY... > L.Y.Rao. > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally > will > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the following > > reasons: > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > asking > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will > help us > > decode the LK more. > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent mails > is > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > possible > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is > retaliating > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from > Rahim: > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, keep > him > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > way of > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will oblige > us - > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for Vimshottri > was sent > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has > received > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > girish_raheja > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > sanity > > please > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya fark > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi > na > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi mante, > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab aj > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > Sincerely, > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > <lyrastro1@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > ANSWERED... > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > & > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > such...by > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > > people > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > RATIONALE > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF > THE > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > RATIONALE... > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > UMESH > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first > sort > > the > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > first > > > let us sort > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of kulbir > > bance > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > little > > > sanity > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > > venus > > > for > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that i > > am > > > karak of > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > kundali; > > > the list > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > > what > > > is the > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain > the > > > rational of > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > > were > > > published > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, now > > he > > > is side > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, please > > ask > > > him what > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the truth > > > before him. > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my behalf > > as > > > to what > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of > proof > > > can satisfy > > > > him. > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > > guess > > > you have > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > criticizing > > > them all > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness to > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > > ignore > > > it or > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > > rationale of > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > embrace > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > > give > > > the > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I > have > > > been > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as > you > > > have not > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of LK. > > As > > > mentioned > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings > to > > > tackle the > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough > for > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run away) > > > provided we > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK itself > > does > > > not > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > > it. > > > At least > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > instance, > > > Rahu in > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > > planets) - if > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > > police > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what LK > > > says. Now > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can > only > > > make > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > varshphal? > > To > > > my best > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use > it. > > It > > > works > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > > sanity > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > > extremely > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan > and > > in > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and then > > > write > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > > earning > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was by > > > sheer > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > > about > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By > the > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > remedies... > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > REMEDIES....? > > > If > > > > so,what ? > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > remedies > > > > help at all ? " > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them with > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since then, > > they > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > rationale > > > for > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I DID > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi is > a > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the Moon > > on a > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > ADMITTING > > > THAT > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE ANY > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT VERY > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > astrology > > > > since 1960's... > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE STILL > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > > FRIENDS > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > > ABILITY > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I DO > > NOT > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF > THAT > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > needlessly > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > With best wishes, > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > > could be > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > > raises > > > > can > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > myself > > who > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and > put > > > off > > > > by > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > > senior > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > following: > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and jeers > > the > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to keep > > > quiet, > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > (though > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), Yograj > > try > > > to > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the book > > and > > > > then > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator Pt. > > Rup > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in the > > same > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > > right > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager to > > know > > > > all > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > amongst > > the > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with uncertain > > > > results, > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > > remedies) > > > > and > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the remedies > > or > > > > just > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the forums > > where > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > chance > > to > > > > you > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the opportunity. > > This > > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss > the > > > issue > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to join > > the > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if he > > > > practices > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he will > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional astrolger > > who > > > has > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > participating > > > > in > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > banned > > > from > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. > At > > > least > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 See below. lalkitab [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 lalkitab [lalkitab] Re: LK debate Dear Rajni Khan, From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious that the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is simply beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest of you ignoramuses... maybe you are right – may be you are not. Let me first see it, still waiting for it. cannot speak for others. The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just anything else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? One of the thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see his financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. Again I say: As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published by Panditji or not? This is important as you can at any time say that there are different books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books of Panditji only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of moving step by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help resolve the issue. It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you are nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who are not willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT CONSISTENTLY AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows once we have a system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated allegations. ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our correspondence shall say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is not willing to move in the method suggested, what can we do. A simple mail from you saying let’s move in the method suggested will help a lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you Mr. Rao is not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to unravel the LK is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, tear to shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their own views – only in the last few years has LK seen an English language interest and there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. Most elderly and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or are not on internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided there is a motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by step else we can keep going in round circles like this. L.Y.Rao. > > My email address is rajni.khan > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > What a hope ? > Boosting the morale of your members is one > thing...and telling LIES is another... > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU A > COPY... > L.Y.Rao. > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally > will > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the following > > reasons: > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > asking > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will > help us > > decode the LK more. > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent mails > is > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > possible > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is > retaliating > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from > Rahim: > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, keep > him > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > way of > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will oblige > us - > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for Vimshottri > was sent > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has > received > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > girish_raheja > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > sanity > > please > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya fark > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi > na > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi mante, > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab aj > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > Sincerely, > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > <lyrastro1@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > ANSWERED... > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > & > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > such...by > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > > people > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > RATIONALE > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF > THE > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > RATIONALE... > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > UMESH > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first > sort > > the > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > first > > > let us sort > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of kulbir > > bance > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > little > > > sanity > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > > venus > > > for > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that i > > am > > > karak of > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > kundali; > > > the list > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus .. > > what > > > is the > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain > the > > > rational of > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > > were > > > published > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, now > > he > > > is side > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, please > > ask > > > him what > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the truth > > > before him. > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my behalf > > as > > > to what > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of > proof > > > can satisfy > > > > him. > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > > guess > > > you have > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > criticizing > > > them all > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness to > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > > ignore > > > it or > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > > rationale of > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > embrace > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > > give > > > the > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I > have > > > been > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as > you > > > have not > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of LK. > > As > > > mentioned > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings > to > > > tackle the > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough > for > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run away) > > > provided we > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK itself > > does > > > not > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > > it. > > > At least > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > instance, > > > Rahu in > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > > planets) - if > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > > police > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what LK > > > says. Now > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can > only > > > make > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > varshphal? > > To > > > my best > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use > it. > > It > > > works > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > > sanity > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > > extremely > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan > and > > in > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and then > > > write > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > > earning > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was by > > > sheer > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > > about > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By > the > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > remedies... > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > REMEDIES....? > > > If > > > > so,what ? > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > remedies > > > > help at all ? " > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them with > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since then, > > they > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > rationale > > > for > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I DID > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi is > a > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the Moon > > on a > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > ADMITTING > > > THAT > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE ANY > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT VERY > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > astrology > > > > since 1960's... > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE STILL > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > > FRIENDS > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > > ABILITY > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I DO > > NOT > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF > THAT > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > needlessly > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > With best wishes, > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > > could be > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > > raises > > > > can > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > myself > > who > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and > put > > > off > > > > by > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > > senior > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > following: > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and jeers > > the > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to keep > > > quiet, > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > (though > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), Yograj > > try > > > to > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the book > > and > > > > then > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator Pt. > > Rup > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in the > > same > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > > right > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager to > > know > > > > all > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > amongst > > the > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with uncertain > > > > results, > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > > remedies) > > > > and > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the remedies > > or > > > > just > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the forums > > where > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > chance > > to > > > > you > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the opportunity. > > This > > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss > the > > > issue > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to join > > the > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if he > > > > practices > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he will > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional astrolger > > who > > > has > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > participating > > > > in > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > banned > > > from > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. > At > > > least > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Rao sahib, persian/pharsi and urdu are indeed different languages. script may be same but not the language plz check the information about linguistics; about evolution of urdu. rationale will be explained after we settle the issue of authorship publication and role of pt roop chand joshi ji. lets first of all settle your fundamental objection, then we will move ahead. sincerely kulbirbance On 5/6/08, L.Y.Rao. <lyrastro1 wrote: Dear Rajni Khan,From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious that the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is simply beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest of you ignoramuses...The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just anything else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... !It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you are nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters...Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT CONSISTENTLY AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB...THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW...AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT...ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE...REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB...IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME...L.Y.Rao.>> My email address is rajni.khan > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao.> Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > Dear Rajni Khan,> What a hope ?> Boosting the morale of your members is one > thing...and telling LIES is another...> The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ...> YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU A > COPY...> L.Y.Rao.> >> > Girishji,> > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally > will> > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the following> > reasons:> > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > asking> > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will > help us> > decode the LK more.> > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no> > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent mails > is> > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > possible> > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is > retaliating> > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from > Rahim:> > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, keep > him> > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > way of> > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will oblige > us -> > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for Vimshottri > was sent> > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has > received> > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > girish_raheja > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06> > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > sanity> > please> > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs,> > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > > usko ap kaise jagayenge.> > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya fark > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi > na > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi mante, > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab aj > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts.> > > > Sincerely,> > > > Girish Raheja > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > <lyrastro1@> > > wrote:> > >> > > Dear Rajni Khan,> > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately...> > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN-> > ANSWERED...> > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > & > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > such...by > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > > people > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > RATIONALE > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P.,> > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF > THE > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > RATIONALE...> > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > UMESH > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY...> > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! !> > > L.Y.Rao.> > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first > sort > > the> > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > first > > > let us sort > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of kulbir > > bance> > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09> > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > little > > > sanity> > > > please> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions.> > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > > venus > > > for > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that i > > am > > > karak of> > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > kundali; > > > the list> > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > > what > > > is the> > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain > the > > > rational of> > > > astrology in one reply.> > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > > were > > > published > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, now > > he > > > is side> > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, please > > ask > > > him what> > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the truth > > > before him.> > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my behalf > > as > > > to what> > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of > proof > > > can satisfy> > > > him.> > > > > > > > sincerely> > > > > > > > kulbirbance> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > > guess > > > you have> > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > criticizing > > > them all> > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness to > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > > ignore > > > it or > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > > rationale of > > > > astrology itself?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > embrace > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > > give > > > the> > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I > have > > > been> > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as > you > > > have not> > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of LK. > > As > > > mentioned> > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings > to > > > tackle the> > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough > for > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run away) > > > provided we> > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK itself > > does > > > not> > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > > it. > > > At least> > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > instance, > > > Rahu in> > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > > planets) - if> > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > > police> > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what LK > > > says. Now> > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can > only > > > make> > > > conjectures. But LK works.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > varshphal? > > To > > > my best> > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use > it. > > It > > > works> > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao.> > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08> > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > > sanity> > > > please> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha,> > > > Thank you for joining in...> > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > > extremely > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan > and > > in > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and then > > > write > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > > earning > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ?> > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was by > > > sheer > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > > about > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By > the > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > remedies...> > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > REMEDIES....? > > > If > > > > so,what ? > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > remedies > > > > help at all ? " > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED...> > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them with > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since then, > > they > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > rationale > > > for > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I DID > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED...> > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi is > a > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the Moon > > on a > > > > particular day...and so on...> > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > ADMITTING > > > THAT > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE ANY > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT VERY > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...)> > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased...> > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > astrology > > > > since 1960's...> > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE STILL > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > > FRIENDS > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > > ABILITY > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I DO > > NOT > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF > THAT > > > > PLEASES YOU...> > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > needlessly > > > > provoked especially by foul language...> > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR...> > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ?> > > > With best wishes,> > > > L.Y.Rao.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > > could be> > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > > raises > > > > can> > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > myself > > who> > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and > put > > > off > > > > by> > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > > senior> > > > > citizen?)> > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > following:> > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and jeers > > the> > > > > followers to prove it.> > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to keep > > > quiet, > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > (though> > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), Yograj > > try > > > to > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the book > > and > > > > then> > > > > question.> > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator Pt. > > Rup> > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in the > > same > > > > league.> > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > > right> > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager to > > know > > > > all> > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > amongst > > the> > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with uncertain > > > > results,> > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > > remedies) > > > > and> > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the remedies > > or > > > > just> > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the forums > > where> > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > chance > > to > > > > you> > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the opportunity. > > This> > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss > the > > > issue> > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global> > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to join > > the> > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away?> > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if he > > > > practices > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he will> > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional astrolger > > who > > > has > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > participating > > > > in> > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > banned > > > from> > > > > there. Whatever!> > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. > At > > > least > > > > > we can try.> > > > >> > > >> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Dear Rajni Khan, You can and will have my fullest cooperation in unravelling the mystery of Lalkitab...but FIRST YOU WILL HAVE TO ACEEPT THAT " LAL KITAB " AS IT IS PRESENTLY BEING MARKETED IS WITHOUT ANY RATIONALE... Then I shall whole-heartedly participate in the search for the true Rationale for Lal Kitab...and help you to the best of my ability... L.Y.Rao. > > See below. > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have > received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious that > the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is simply > beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest of > you ignoramuses... > > maybe you are right - may be you are not. Let me first see it, still waiting > for it. cannot speak for others. > > > The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " > at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a > peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just anything > else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! > > Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? One of the > thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see his > financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. > > Again I say: > > As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published by Panditji or > not? This is important as you can at any time say that there are different > books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books of Panditji > only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. > > It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of moving step > by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help resolve the > issue. > > > It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your > site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? > > Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. > > > All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence > tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you are > nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... > > Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who are not > willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. > > > Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are > greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT CONSISTENTLY > AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... > AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... > > As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows once we have a > system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated allegations. > > > ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE > FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... > REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... > > All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our correspondence shall > say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is not willing to > move in the method suggested, what can we do. > > A simple mail from you saying let's move in the method suggested will help a > lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you Mr. Rao is > not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to unravel the LK > is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, tear to > shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their own views - > only in the last few years has LK seen an English language interest and > there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. Most elderly > and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or are not on > internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided there is a > motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by step else we > can keep going in round circles like this. > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > My email address is rajni.khan@ > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > What a hope ? > > Boosting the morale of your members is one > > thing...and telling LIES is another... > > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU > A > > COPY... > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally > > will > > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the > following > > > reasons: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > > asking > > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will > > help us > > > decode the LK more. > > > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent > mails > > is > > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > > possible > > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is > > retaliating > > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from > > Rahim: > > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, > keep > > him > > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > > way of > > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will > oblige > > us - > > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for > Vimshottri > > was sent > > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has > > received > > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > girish_raheja > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya > fark > > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi > > na > > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi > mante, > > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab > aj > > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > > <lyrastro1@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > > ANSWERED... > > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > > & > > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > > such...by > > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > > > people > > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > > RATIONALE > > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF > > THE > > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > > RATIONALE... > > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > > UMESH > > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first > > sort > > > the > > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > > first > > > > let us sort > > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > kulbir > > > bance > > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > > > venus > > > > for > > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that > i > > > am > > > > karak of > > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > > kundali; > > > > the list > > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > > > what > > > > is the > > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain > > the > > > > rational of > > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > > > were > > > > published > > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, > now > > > he > > > > is side > > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, > please > > > ask > > > > him what > > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the > truth > > > > before him. > > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my > behalf > > > as > > > > to what > > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of > > proof > > > > can satisfy > > > > > him. > > > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > > > guess > > > > you have > > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > > criticizing > > > > them all > > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness > to > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > > > ignore > > > > it or > > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > > > rationale of > > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > > embrace > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > > > give > > > > the > > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I > > have > > > > been > > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as > > you > > > > have not > > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of > LK. > > > As > > > > mentioned > > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings > > to > > > > tackle the > > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough > > for > > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run > away) > > > > provided we > > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK > itself > > > does > > > > not > > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > > > it. > > > > At least > > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > > instance, > > > > Rahu in > > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > > > planets) - if > > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > > > police > > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what > LK > > > > says. Now > > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can > > only > > > > make > > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > > varshphal? > > > To > > > > my best > > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use > > it. > > > It > > > > works > > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > > > extremely > > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan > > and > > > in > > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and > then > > > > write > > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > > > earning > > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was > by > > > > sheer > > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > > > about > > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By > > the > > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > > remedies... > > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > > REMEDIES....? > > > > If > > > > > so,what ? > > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > > remedies > > > > > help at all ? " > > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them > with > > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since > then, > > > they > > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > > rationale > > > > for > > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I > DID > > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi > is > > a > > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the > Moon > > > on a > > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > > ADMITTING > > > > THAT > > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE > ANY > > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT > VERY > > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > > astrology > > > > > since 1960's... > > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE > STILL > > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > > > FRIENDS > > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > > > ABILITY > > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I > DO > > > NOT > > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF > > THAT > > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > > needlessly > > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > > With best wishes, > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > > > could be > > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > > > raises > > > > > can > > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > > myself > > > who > > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and > > put > > > > off > > > > > by > > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > > > senior > > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > > following: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and > jeers > > > the > > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to > keep > > > > quiet, > > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > > (though > > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), > Yograj > > > try > > > > to > > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the > book > > > and > > > > > then > > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator > Pt. > > > Rup > > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in > the > > > same > > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > > > right > > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager > to > > > know > > > > > all > > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > > amongst > > > the > > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with > uncertain > > > > > results, > > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > > > remedies) > > > > > and > > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the > remedies > > > or > > > > > just > > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the > forums > > > where > > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > > chance > > > to > > > > > you > > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the > opportunity. > > > This > > > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss > > the > > > > issue > > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to > join > > > the > > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if > he > > > > > practices > > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he > will > > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional > astrolger > > > who > > > > has > > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > > participating > > > > > in > > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > > banned > > > > from > > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. > > At > > > > least > > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Dear Rajni Khan ji, I am a very optimistic and positive guy, I always try to find a positive thing even in the most negative and adverse situations. I am following this ongoing debate for quite a while and even tried to poke my nose to present the case. But I preferred to remain a silent spectator because of the stubborn approach adopted by Mr .Rao and the frequent use of unparliamentary slang (not by all) during the discussion. Anyways, although I am not completely agree or disagree what Mr .Rao has said, but I cannot afford to ignore one of his point that todays Lal Kitabist are simply trying to imitate the great Sage Pundit Roop Chand joshi ji, isn't it true? Do we possess even one per cent of the power and energy that Pundit ji was having? I am afraid the answer is in plain NO, we are certainly lacking those qualities. Isn't it true that most of us are poorly equipped as far as the knowledge of this divine scripture is concerned? How many of us are having a spiritual backing, a guru, deep study of the subject, or the formal training? As such, how can we claim of being the " healers " without acquiring these blessings and qualities? We should not blame Mr. Rao since his knowledge about Lal Kitab is an open secret, we must rather focus on our own shortcomings and try to find out " Remedies " for ourselves first before recommending anything to anyone. Respectfully Yograj Prabhakar lalkitab , " Rajni Khan " <rajni.khan wrote: > > See below. > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have > received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious that > the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is simply > beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest of > you ignoramuses... > > maybe you are right - may be you are not. Let me first see it, still waiting > for it. cannot speak for others. > > > The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " > at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a > peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just anything > else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! > > Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? One of the > thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see his > financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. > > Again I say: > > As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published by Panditji or > not? This is important as you can at any time say that there are different > books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books of Panditji > only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. > > It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of moving step > by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help resolve the > issue. > > > It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your > site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? > > Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. > > > All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence > tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you are > nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... > > Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who are not > willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. > > > Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are > greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT CONSISTENTLY > AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... > AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... > > As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows once we have a > system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated allegations. > > > ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE > FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... > REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... > > All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our correspondence shall > say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is not willing to > move in the method suggested, what can we do. > > A simple mail from you saying let's move in the method suggested will help a > lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you Mr. Rao is > not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to unravel the LK > is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, tear to > shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their own views - > only in the last few years has LK seen an English language interest and > there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. Most elderly > and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or are not on > internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided there is a > motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by step else we > can keep going in round circles like this. > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > My email address is rajni.khan@ > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > What a hope ? > > Boosting the morale of your members is one > > thing...and telling LIES is another... > > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU > A > > COPY... > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally > > will > > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the > following > > > reasons: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > > asking > > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will > > help us > > > decode the LK more. > > > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent > mails > > is > > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > > possible > > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is > > retaliating > > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from > > Rahim: > > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, > keep > > him > > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > > way of > > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will > oblige > > us - > > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for > Vimshottri > > was sent > > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has > > received > > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > girish_raheja > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya > fark > > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi > > na > > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi > mante, > > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab > aj > > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > > <lyrastro1@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > > ANSWERED... > > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > > & > > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > > such...by > > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > > > people > > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > > RATIONALE > > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF > > THE > > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > > RATIONALE... > > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > > UMESH > > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first > > sort > > > the > > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > > first > > > > let us sort > > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > kulbir > > > bance > > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > > > venus > > > > for > > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that > i > > > am > > > > karak of > > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > > kundali; > > > > the list > > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > > > what > > > > is the > > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain > > the > > > > rational of > > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > > > were > > > > published > > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, > now > > > he > > > > is side > > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, > please > > > ask > > > > him what > > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the > truth > > > > before him. > > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my > behalf > > > as > > > > to what > > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of > > proof > > > > can satisfy > > > > > him. > > > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > > > guess > > > > you have > > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > > criticizing > > > > them all > > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness > to > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > > > ignore > > > > it or > > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > > > rationale of > > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > > embrace > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > > > give > > > > the > > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I > > have > > > > been > > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as > > you > > > > have not > > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of > LK. > > > As > > > > mentioned > > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings > > to > > > > tackle the > > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough > > for > > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run > away) > > > > provided we > > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK > itself > > > does > > > > not > > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > > > it. > > > > At least > > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > > instance, > > > > Rahu in > > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > > > planets) - if > > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > > > police > > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what > LK > > > > says. Now > > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can > > only > > > > make > > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > > varshphal? > > > To > > > > my best > > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use > > it. > > > It > > > > works > > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > > > extremely > > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan > > and > > > in > > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and > then > > > > write > > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > > > earning > > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was > by > > > > sheer > > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > > > about > > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By > > the > > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > > remedies... > > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > > REMEDIES....? > > > > If > > > > > so,what ? > > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > > remedies > > > > > help at all ? " > > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them > with > > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since > then, > > > they > > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > > rationale > > > > for > > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I > DID > > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi > is > > a > > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the > Moon > > > on a > > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > > ADMITTING > > > > THAT > > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE > ANY > > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT > VERY > > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > > astrology > > > > > since 1960's... > > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE > STILL > > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > > > FRIENDS > > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > > > ABILITY > > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I > DO > > > NOT > > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF > > THAT > > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > > needlessly > > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > > With best wishes, > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > > > could be > > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > > > raises > > > > > can > > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > > myself > > > who > > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and > > put > > > > off > > > > > by > > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > > > senior > > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > > following: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and > jeers > > > the > > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to > keep > > > > quiet, > > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > > (though > > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), > Yograj > > > try > > > > to > > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the > book > > > and > > > > > then > > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator > Pt. > > > Rup > > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in > the > > > same > > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > > > right > > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager > to > > > know > > > > > all > > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > > amongst > > > the > > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with > uncertain > > > > > results, > > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > > > remedies) > > > > > and > > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the > remedies > > > or > > > > > just > > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the > forums > > > where > > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > > chance > > > to > > > > > you > > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the > opportunity. > > > This > > > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss > > the > > > > issue > > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to > join > > > the > > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if > he > > > > > practices > > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he > will > > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional > astrolger > > > who > > > > has > > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > > participating > > > > > in > > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > > banned > > > > from > > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. > > At > > > > least > > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 Dear Rao Sahib, This is unacceptable. You are free to believe so. For myself and many others, LK remedies have worked. There are few for whom they have not as well. No answers for this. But the %age of its working is very favourable. Rationale is a very debatable subject. It is almost indefensible. What is the rationale of this existence? There are many views, no unanimously accepted answers. Each person chooses what appeals to him. But we are willing to try. LK principles can be explained to you. How they are to be applied can be shown. What is the logic or rationale behind in many cases can be given. But a critic can always say this is all nonsense. As Kulbir bhai in earlier mail pointed out, critics of astrology, any astrology can use the argument that in a horoscope where is Earth or what is the logic of Venus representing female. It is endless and futile. As Kulbir bhai has pointed out, first accept that LK was published by Panditji or atleast the LK we will discuss is by Panditji. This is important as there are many LK’s in circulation and the efforts of all of these internet forums is to point out the difference. In accepting this does no way imply that you have been converted to LK. It is just a starting point – so as further in discussions you or others will not cite any other book as reference. We are just establishing the book for reference. This is a simple requirement otherwise what is there to discuss. lalkitab [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. Wednesday, May 07, 2008 11:55 lalkitab [lalkitab] Re: LK debate Dear Rajni Khan, You can and will have my fullest cooperation in unravelling the mystery of Lalkitab...but FIRST YOU WILL HAVE TO ACEEPT THAT " LAL KITAB " AS IT IS PRESENTLY BEING MARKETED IS WITHOUT ANY RATIONALE... Then I shall whole-heartedly participate in the search for the true Rationale for Lal Kitab...and help you to the best of my ability... L.Y.Rao. > > See below. > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have > received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious that > the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is simply > beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest of > you ignoramuses... > > maybe you are right - may be you are not. Let me first see it, still waiting > for it. cannot speak for others. > > > The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " > at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a > peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just anything > else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! > > Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? One of the > thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see his > financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. > > Again I say: > > As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published by Panditji or > not? This is important as you can at any time say that there are different > books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books of Panditji > only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. > > It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of moving step > by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help resolve the > issue. > > > It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your > site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? > > Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. > > > All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence > tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you are > nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... > > Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who are not > willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. > > > Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are > greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT CONSISTENTLY > AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... > AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... > > As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows once we have a > system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated allegations. > > > ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE > FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... > REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... > > All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our correspondence shall > say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is not willing to > move in the method suggested, what can we do. > > A simple mail from you saying let's move in the method suggested will help a > lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you Mr. Rao is > not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to unravel the LK > is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, tear to > shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their own views - > only in the last few years has LK seen an English language interest and > there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. Most elderly > and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or are not on > internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided there is a > motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by step else we > can keep going in round circles like this. > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > My email address is rajni.khan@ > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > What a hope ? > > Boosting the morale of your members is one > > thing...and telling LIES is another... > > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU > A > > COPY... > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally > > will > > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the > following > > > reasons: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > > asking > > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will > > help us > > > decode the LK more. > > > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent > mails > > is > > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > > possible > > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is > > retaliating > > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from > > Rahim: > > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, > keep > > him > > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > > way of > > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will > oblige > > us - > > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for > Vimshottri > > was sent > > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has > > received > > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > girish_raheja > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya > fark > > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi > > na > > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi > mante, > > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab > aj > > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > > <lyrastro1@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > > ANSWERED... > > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > > & > > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > > such...by > > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > > > people > > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > > RATIONALE > > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF > > THE > > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > > RATIONALE... > > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > > UMESH > > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first > > sort > > > the > > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > > first > > > > let us sort > > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > kulbir > > > bance > > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > > > venus > > > > for > > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that > i > > > am > > > > karak of > > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > > kundali; > > > > the list > > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > > > what > > > > is the > > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain > > the > > > > rational of > > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > > > were > > > > published > > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, > now > > > he > > > > is side > > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, > please > > > ask > > > > him what > > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the > truth > > > > before him. > > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my > behalf > > > as > > > > to what > > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of > > proof > > > > can satisfy > > > > > him. > > > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > > > guess > > > > you have > > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > > criticizing > > > > them all > > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness > to > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > > > ignore > > > > it or > > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > > > rationale of > > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > > embrace > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > > > give > > > > the > > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I > > have > > > > been > > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as > > you > > > > have not > > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of > LK. > > > As > > > > mentioned > > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings > > to > > > > tackle the > > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough > > for > > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run > away) > > > > provided we > > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK > itself > > > does > > > > not > > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > > > it. > > > > At least > > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > > instance, > > > > Rahu in > > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > > > planets) - if > > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > > > police > > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what > LK > > > > says. Now > > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can > > only > > > > make > > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > > varshphal? > > > To > > > > my best > > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use > > it. > > > It > > > > works > > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > > > extremely > > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan > > and > > > in > > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and > then > > > > write > > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > > > earning > > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was > by > > > > sheer > > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > > > about > > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By > > the > > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > > remedies... > > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > > REMEDIES....? > > > > If > > > > > so,what ? > > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > > remedies > > > > > help at all ? " > > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them > with > > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since > then, > > > they > > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > > rationale > > > > for > > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I > DID > > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi > is > > a > > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the > Moon > > > on a > > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > > ADMITTING > > > > THAT > > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE > ANY > > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT > VERY > > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > > astrology > > > > > since 1960's... > > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE > STILL > > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > > > FRIENDS > > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > > > ABILITY > > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I > DO > > > NOT > > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF > > THAT > > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > > needlessly > > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > > With best wishes, > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > > > could be > > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > > > raises > > > > > can > > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > > myself > > > who > > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and > > put > > > > off > > > > > by > > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > > > senior > > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > > following: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and > jeers > > > the > > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to > keep > > > > quiet, > > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > > (though > > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), > Yograj > > > try > > > > to > > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the > book > > > and > > > > > then > > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator > Pt. > > > Rup > > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in > the > > > same > > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > > > right > > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager > to > > > know > > > > > all > > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > > amongst > > > the > > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with > uncertain > > > > > results, > > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > > > remedies) > > > > > and > > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the > remedies > > > or > > > > > just > > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the > forums > > > where > > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > > chance > > > to > > > > > you > > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the > opportunity. > > > This > > > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss > > the > > > > issue > > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to > join > > > the > > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if > he > > > > > practices > > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he > will > > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional > astrolger > > > who > > > > has > > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > > participating > > > > > in > > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > > banned > > > > from > > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. > > At > > > > least > > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 Yograj bhai, Thank you for participation. My comments below. lalkitab [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of Yograj Prabhakar Wednesday, May 07, 2008 14:59 lalkitab [lalkitab] Re: LK debate Dear Rajni Khan ji, I am a very optimistic and positive guy, I always try to find a positive thing even in the most negative and adverse situations. I am following this ongoing debate for quite a while and even tried to poke my nose to present the case. But I preferred to remain a silent spectator because of the stubborn approach adopted by Mr .Rao and the frequent use of unparliamentary slang (not by all) during the discussion. yes, Mr. Rao has not allowed the discussion to flourish so as to allow many others, like yourself to participate regularly. Anyways, although I am not completely agree or disagree what Mr .Rao has said, but I cannot afford to ignore one of his point that todays Lal Kitabist are simply trying to imitate the great Sage Pundit Roop Chand joshi ji, isn't it true? Do we possess even one per cent of the power and energy that Pundit ji was having? I am afraid the answer is in plain NO, we are certainly lacking those qualities. Isn't it true that most of us are poorly equipped as far as the knowledge of this divine scripture is concerned? How many of us are having a spiritual backing, a guru, deep study of the subject, or the formal training? As such, how can we claim of being the " healers " without acquiring these blessings and qualities? What you say is probably true. But does this make the pursuit of it untenable? Everything is up for discussion. You say Panditji has spiritual powers. Critics will say this is incorrect or show proof. Even Jesus or Socrates were not spared. This is how man’s mind works. My view is that we, as humans, need solutions for many things. We move from one to another and settle for that which appeals to us most. Whether Panditji had spiritual powers or not is perhaps not relevant. People who use his books, marvel at his insight and cannot but conclude that Panditji had something extra or “spiritual power”. But people who have not benefited by it, will ridicule this. Very soon you will see Mr. Rao do the same. My submission is simple – try the remedies and see if they work or not. That’s all. Mr. Rao says, all remedies work due to placebo effect. Really? I doubt that. In some instances, suggestions or placebo effect comes into play but for all – cannot be. I have a doubting mind, yet many remedies have worked. Few have not. My current conclusion - astrologers are blessed with different insights, hence their strengths are different, their interpretations different. We should not blame Mr. Rao since his knowledge about Lal Kitab is an open secret, we must rather focus on our own shortcomings and try to find out " Remedies " for ourselves first before recommending anything to anyone. This is acceptable. The remedies for ourselves, as you point out is not just restricted to LK. The remedy is to be honest, brutally honest with one’s own self and others, stick to the straight path and continuously strive to allow our impurities to leave us on their own accord. Love and patience is the way forward. Respectfully Yograj Prabhakar lalkitab , " Rajni Khan " <rajni.khan wrote: > > See below. > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have > received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious that > the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is simply > beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest of > you ignoramuses... > > maybe you are right - may be you are not. Let me first see it, still waiting > for it. cannot speak for others. > > > The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " > at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a > peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just anything > else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! > > Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? One of the > thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see his > financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. > > Again I say: > > As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published by Panditji or > not? This is important as you can at any time say that there are different > books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books of Panditji > only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. > > It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of moving step > by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help resolve the > issue. > > > It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your > site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? > > Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. > > > All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence > tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you are > nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... > > Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who are not > willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. > > > Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are > greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT CONSISTENTLY > AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... > AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... > > As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows once we have a > system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated allegations. > > > ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE > FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... > REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... > > All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our correspondence shall > say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is not willing to > move in the method suggested, what can we do. > > A simple mail from you saying let's move in the method suggested will help a > lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you Mr. Rao is > not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to unravel the LK > is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, tear to > shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their own views - > only in the last few years has LK seen an English language interest and > there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. Most elderly > and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or are not on > internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided there is a > motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by step else we > can keep going in round circles like this. > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > My email address is rajni.khan@ > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > What a hope ? > > Boosting the morale of your members is one > > thing...and telling LIES is another... > > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU > A > > COPY... > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally > > will > > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the > following > > > reasons: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > > asking > > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will > > help us > > > decode the LK more. > > > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent > mails > > is > > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > > possible > > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is > > retaliating > > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from > > Rahim: > > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, > keep > > him > > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > > way of > > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will > oblige > > us - > > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for > Vimshottri > > was sent > > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has > > received > > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > girish_raheja > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > sanity > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya > fark > > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi > > na > > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi > mante, > > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab > aj > > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > > <lyrastro1@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > > ANSWERED... > > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > > & > > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > > such...by > > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > > > people > > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > > RATIONALE > > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF > > THE > > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > > RATIONALE... > > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > > UMESH > > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first > > sort > > > the > > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > > first > > > > let us sort > > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > kulbir > > > bance > > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > > > venus > > > > for > > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that > i > > > am > > > > karak of > > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > > kundali; > > > > the list > > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > > > what > > > > is the > > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain > > the > > > > rational of > > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > > > were > > > > published > > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, > now > > > he > > > > is side > > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, > please > > > ask > > > > him what > > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the > truth > > > > before him. > > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my > behalf > > > as > > > > to what > > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of > > proof > > > > can satisfy > > > > > him. > > > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > > > guess > > > > you have > > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > > criticizing > > > > them all > > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness > to > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > > > ignore > > > > it or > > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > > > rationale of > > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > > embrace > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > > > give > > > > the > > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I > > have > > > > been > > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as > > you > > > > have not > > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of > LK. > > > As > > > > mentioned > > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings > > to > > > > tackle the > > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough > > for > > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run > away) > > > > provided we > > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK > itself > > > does > > > > not > > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > > > it. > > > > At least > > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > > instance, > > > > Rahu in > > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > > > planets) - if > > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > > > police > > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what > LK > > > > says. Now > > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can > > only > > > > make > > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > > varshphal? > > > To > > > > my best > > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use > > it. > > > It > > > > works > > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > > > extremely > > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan > > and > > > in > > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and > then > > > > write > > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > > > earning > > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was > by > > > > sheer > > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > > > about > > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By > > the > > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > > remedies... > > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > > REMEDIES....? > > > > If > > > > > so,what ? > > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > > remedies > > > > > help at all ? " > > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them > with > > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since > then, > > > they > > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > > rationale > > > > for > > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I > DID > > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi > is > > a > > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the > Moon > > > on a > > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > > ADMITTING > > > > THAT > > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE > ANY > > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT > VERY > > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > > astrology > > > > > since 1960's... > > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE > STILL > > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > > > FRIENDS > > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > > > ABILITY > > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I > DO > > > NOT > > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF > > THAT > > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > > needlessly > > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > > With best wishes, > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > > > could be > > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > > > raises > > > > > can > > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > > myself > > > who > > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and > > put > > > > off > > > > > by > > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > > > senior > > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > > following: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and > jeers > > > the > > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to > keep > > > > quiet, > > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > > (though > > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), > Yograj > > > try > > > > to > > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the > book > > > and > > > > > then > > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator > Pt. > > > Rup > > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in > the > > > same > > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > > > right > > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager > to > > > know > > > > > all > > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > > amongst > > > the > > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with > uncertain > > > > > results, > > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > > > remedies) > > > > > and > > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the > remedies > > > or > > > > > just > > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the > forums > > > where > > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > > chance > > > to > > > > > you > > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the > opportunity. > > > This > > > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss > > the > > > > issue > > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to > join > > > the > > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if > he > > > > > practices > > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he > will > > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional > astrolger > > > who > > > > has > > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > > participating > > > > > in > > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > > banned > > > > from > > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. > > At > > > > least > > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 Rao Sir, please follow the correct approach; 1. firstly u said that Lalkitab was written after death of Pt.ji. 2. u said pt ji could have written only in persian. 3. u said that urdu and persian are the same languages. i have sent in the information with me; why are u silent please accept or deny; then only can we move to the rationale part. if u don't have that much knowledge of lalkitab what COOPERATION CAN U PROVIDE TO UNRAVEL THE MYSTERY OF LALKITAB; we have also seen the level of ur vedic astrology knowledge as u failed to answer even one of Dr. Aggarwal's questions. i gave my reply in the period/timelimit fixed by ur gudeslf; why are u not responding. sincerely kulbirbance lalkitab , " L.Y.Rao. " <lyrastro1 wrote: > > Dear Rajni Khan, > You can and will have my fullest cooperation in > unravelling the mystery of Lalkitab...but FIRST YOU WILL HAVE TO > ACEEPT THAT " LAL KITAB " AS IT IS PRESENTLY BEING MARKETED IS WITHOUT > ANY RATIONALE... > Then I shall whole-heartedly participate in the > search for the true Rationale for Lal Kitab...and help you to the > best of my ability... > L.Y.Rao. > > > > See below. > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 > > lalkitab > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have > > received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious > that > > the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is simply > > beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest of > > you ignoramuses... > > > > maybe you are right - may be you are not. Let me first see it, > still waiting > > for it. cannot speak for others. > > > > > > The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " > > at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a > > peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just > anything > > else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! > > > > Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? One of > the > > thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see his > > financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. > > > > Again I say: > > > > As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published by > Panditji or > > not? This is important as you can at any time say that there are > different > > books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books of > Panditji > > only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. > > > > It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of > moving step > > by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help > resolve the > > issue. > > > > > > It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your > > site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? > > > > Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. > > > > > > All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence > > tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you are > > nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... > > > > Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who are > not > > willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. > > > > > > Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are > > greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT CONSISTENTLY > > AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... > > AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... > > > > As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows once > we have a > > system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated > allegations. > > > > > > ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE > > FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... > > REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... > > > > All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our correspondence > shall > > say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is not > willing to > > move in the method suggested, what can we do. > > > > A simple mail from you saying let's move in the method suggested > will help a > > lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you Mr. > Rao is > > not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to > unravel the LK > > is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, > tear to > > shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their own > views - > > only in the last few years has LK seen an English language interest > and > > there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. > Most elderly > > and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or are > not on > > internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided there > is a > > motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by step > else we > > can keep going in round circles like this. > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > My email address is rajni.khan@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > What a hope ? > > > Boosting the morale of your members is one > > > thing...and telling LIES is another... > > > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > > > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > > > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > > > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > > > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND > YOU > > A > > > COPY... > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I > personally > > > will > > > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the > > following > > > > reasons: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > > > asking > > > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This > will > > > help us > > > > decode the LK more. > > > > > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent > > mails > > > is > > > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > > > possible > > > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and > is > > > retaliating > > > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet > from > > > Rahim: > > > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, > > keep > > > him > > > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your > house. > > > > > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > > > way of > > > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will > > oblige > > > us - > > > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for > > Vimshottri > > > was sent > > > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member > has > > > received > > > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > girish_raheja > > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > > sanity > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua > hai > > > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya > > fark > > > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek > admi > > > na > > > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi > > mante, > > > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab > > aj > > > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > > > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > > > <lyrastro1@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > > > ANSWERED... > > > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > > > & > > > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > > > such...by > > > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > > > > people > > > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > > > RATIONALE > > > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & > K.P., > > > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON- RECEIPT > OF > > > THE > > > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > > > RATIONALE... > > > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > > > UMESH > > > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first > > > sort > > > > the > > > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > > > first > > > > > let us sort > > > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > [lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > kulbir > > > > bance > > > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - > a > > > > little > > > > > sanity > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for > brother, > > > > venus > > > > > for > > > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak > that > > i > > > > am > > > > > karak of > > > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > > > kundali; > > > > > the list > > > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any > fus . > > > > what > > > > > is the > > > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body > explain > > > the > > > > > rational of > > > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 > editions > > > > were > > > > > published > > > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, > > now > > > > he > > > > > is side > > > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, > > please > > > > ask > > > > > him what > > > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the > > truth > > > > > before him. > > > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my > > behalf > > > > as > > > > > to what > > > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of > > > proof > > > > > can satisfy > > > > > > him. > > > > > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. > I > > > > guess > > > > > you have > > > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > > > criticizing > > > > > them all > > > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness > > to > > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose > to > > > > ignore > > > > > it or > > > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > > > > rationale of > > > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > > > embrace > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You > will > > > > give > > > > > the > > > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I > > > have > > > > > been > > > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you > as > > > you > > > > > have not > > > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of > > LK. > > > > As > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human > beings > > > to > > > > > tackle the > > > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good > enough > > > for > > > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run > > away) > > > > > provided we > > > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK > > itself > > > > does > > > > > not > > > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. > That's > > > > it. > > > > > At least > > > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > > > instance, > > > > > Rahu in > > > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? > Fictious > > > > > planets) - if > > > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong > to > > > > police > > > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what > > LK > > > > > says. Now > > > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can > > > only > > > > > make > > > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > > > varshphal? > > > > To > > > > > my best > > > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just > use > > > it. > > > > It > > > > > works > > > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > [lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > little > > > > > sanity > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > > > > extremely > > > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni > Khan > > > and > > > > in > > > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and > > then > > > > > write > > > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he > was > > > > > earning > > > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was > > by > > > > > sheer > > > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims > made > > > > about > > > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK. ( > By > > > the > > > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > > > remedies... > > > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > > > REMEDIES....? > > > > > If > > > > > > so,what ? > > > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > > > remedies > > > > > > help at all ? " > > > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them > > with > > > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since > > then, > > > > they > > > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > > > rationale > > > > > for > > > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I > > DID > > > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi > > is > > > a > > > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the > > Moon > > > > on a > > > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > > > ADMITTING > > > > > THAT > > > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE > > ANY > > > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT > > VERY > > > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > > > astrology > > > > > > since 1960's... > > > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE > > STILL > > > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY > YOUR > > > > > FRIENDS > > > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > > > > ABILITY > > > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT > MAY...I > > DO > > > > NOT > > > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF > > > THAT > > > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > > > needlessly > > > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > > > With best wishes, > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > > > > could be > > > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points > he > > > > raises > > > > > > can > > > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > > > myself > > > > who > > > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared > and > > > put > > > > > off > > > > > > by > > > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really > a > > > > senior > > > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > > > following: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and > > jeers > > > > the > > > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to > > keep > > > > > quiet, > > > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > > > (though > > > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), > > Yograj > > > > try > > > > > to > > > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the > > book > > > > and > > > > > > then > > > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator > > Pt. > > > > Rup > > > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in > > the > > > > same > > > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. > The > > > > right > > > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager > > to > > > > know > > > > > > all > > > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > > > amongst > > > > the > > > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with > > uncertain > > > > > > results, > > > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > > > > remedies) > > > > > > and > > > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the > > remedies > > > > or > > > > > > just > > > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the > > forums > > > > where > > > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > > > chance > > > > to > > > > > > you > > > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the > > opportunity. > > > > This > > > > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and > discuss > > > the > > > > > issue > > > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to > be > > > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the > global > > > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to > > join > > > > the > > > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if > > he > > > > > > practices > > > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he > > will > > > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional > > astrolger > > > > who > > > > > has > > > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > > > participating > > > > > > in > > > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > > > banned > > > > > from > > > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the > agenda. > > > At > > > > > least > > > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 9, 2008 Report Share Posted May 9, 2008 Dear Mr.Yograj, I thank you and respect you for your very frank expression of your desire that ALL LK followers should engage in serious INTROSPECTION...and devote themselves to attain atleast a decent fraction of the Great Seer's Powers...by intense meditation and selfless devotion to the Almighty and intense Saadhana... Implied in your letter Mr.Yograj,clearly, is the observation that " todays LK-ists...try to simply imitate the GURU... " without the requisite Saadhana or devotion to God...only using LK to mint money as seen on some of the prominent " LK sites " ... I am also glad that you realise,(better late than never),that I bear no ill-will towards LK,it's creator,the Great SEER...or any of the members of LK... As said earlier,the initial,quite offensive reaction, by some members to my initial query,which,by the way,STILL REMAINS UNANSWERED TILL DATE...has triggerred this long drawn and needless debate... I guess Yograjji and his friends will now have no hesitation in " hunting " for the rationale,or even possible rationale, and I am quite willing to help,if you all so desire... Surely Yojraj ji I can see in you a " GOOD MANAGER " with excrllent Personnel Management and HR skills... With best wishes, L.Y.Rao. > > Yograj bhai, > > > > Thank you for participation. My comments below. > > > > > > lalkitab > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of Yograj Prabhakar > Wednesday, May 07, 2008 14:59 > lalkitab > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > Dear Rajni Khan ji, > > I am a very optimistic and positive guy, I always try to find a > positive thing even in the most negative and adverse situations. I am > following this ongoing debate for quite a while and even tried to poke > my nose to present the case. But I preferred to remain a silent > spectator because of the stubborn approach adopted by Mr .Rao and the > frequent use of unparliamentary slang (not by all) during the discussion. > > yes, Mr. Rao has not allowed the discussion to flourish so as to allow many > others, like yourself to participate regularly. > > > > Anyways, although I am not completely agree or disagree what Mr .Rao > has said, but I cannot afford to ignore one of his point that todays > Lal Kitabist are simply trying to imitate the great Sage Pundit Roop > Chand joshi ji, isn't it true? Do we possess even one per cent of the > power and energy that Pundit ji was having? I am afraid the answer is > in plain NO, we are certainly lacking those qualities. Isn't it true > that most of us are poorly equipped as far as the knowledge of this > divine scripture is concerned? How many of us are having a spiritual > backing, a guru, deep study of the subject, or the formal training? As > such, how can we claim of being the " healers " without acquiring these > blessings and qualities? > > What you say is probably true. But does this make the pursuit of it > untenable? Everything is up for discussion. You say Panditji has spiritual > powers. Critics will say this is incorrect or show proof. Even Jesus or > Socrates were not spared. This is how man's mind works. My view is that we, > as humans, need solutions for many things. We move from one to another and > settle for that which appeals to us most. > > Whether Panditji had spiritual powers or not is perhaps not relevant. People > who use his books, marvel at his insight and cannot but conclude that > Panditji had something extra or " spiritual power " . But people who have not > benefited by it, will ridicule this. Very soon you will see Mr. Rao do the > same. My submission is simple - try the remedies and see if they work or > not. That's all. Mr. Rao says, all remedies work due to placebo effect. > Really? I doubt that. In some instances, suggestions or placebo effect comes > into play but for all - cannot be. I have a doubting mind, yet many remedies > have worked. Few have not. My current conclusion - astrologers are blessed > with different insights, hence their strengths are different, their > interpretations different. > > We should not blame Mr. Rao since his knowledge about Lal Kitab is an > open secret, we must rather focus on our own shortcomings and try to > find out " Remedies " for ourselves first before recommending anything > to anyone. > > This is acceptable. The remedies for ourselves, as you point out is not just > restricted to LK. The remedy is to be honest, brutally honest with one's own > self and others, stick to the straight path and continuously strive to allow > our impurities to leave us on their own accord. Love and patience is the way > forward. > > > > Respectfully > Yograj Prabhakar > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> , " Rajni Khan " > <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > See below. > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have > > received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious that > > the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is simply > > beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest of > > you ignoramuses... > > > > maybe you are right - may be you are not. Let me first see it, still > waiting > > for it. cannot speak for others. > > > > > > The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " > > at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a > > peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just anything > > else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! > > > > Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? One of the > > thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see his > > financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. > > > > Again I say: > > > > As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published by > Panditji or > > not? This is important as you can at any time say that there are > different > > books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books of > Panditji > > only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. > > > > It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of > moving step > > by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help > resolve the > > issue. > > > > > > It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your > > site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? > > > > Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. > > > > > > All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence > > tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you are > > nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... > > > > Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who are not > > willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. > > > > > > Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are > > greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT CONSISTENTLY > > AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... > > AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... > > > > As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows once we > have a > > system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated allegations. > > > > > > ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE > > FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... > > REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... > > > > All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our correspondence shall > > say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is not > willing to > > move in the method suggested, what can we do. > > > > A simple mail from you saying let's move in the method suggested > will help a > > lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you Mr. > Rao is > > not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to unravel > the LK > > is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, tear to > > shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their own > views - > > only in the last few years has LK seen an English language interest and > > there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. Most > elderly > > and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or are > not on > > internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided there is a > > motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by step > else we > > can keep going in round circles like this. > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > My email address is rajni.khan@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > What a hope ? > > > Boosting the morale of your members is one > > > thing...and telling LIES is another... > > > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > > > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > > > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > > > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > > > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND YOU > > A > > > COPY... > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I personally > > > will > > > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the > > following > > > > reasons: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > > > asking > > > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This will > > > help us > > > > decode the LK more. > > > > > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent > > mails > > > is > > > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > > > possible > > > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and is > > > retaliating > > > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet from > > > Rahim: > > > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who criticises, > > keep > > > him > > > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your house. > > > > > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > > > way of > > > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will > > oblige > > > us - > > > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for > > Vimshottri > > > was sent > > > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member has > > > received > > > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > girish_raheja > > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a little > > > sanity > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua hai > > > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se kya > > fark > > > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek admi > > > na > > > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi > > mante, > > > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal Kitab > > aj > > > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We had > > > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > > > <lyrastro1@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > > > ANSWERED... > > > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > > > & > > > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > > > such...by > > > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN ACE...most > > > > people > > > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > > > RATIONALE > > > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & K.P., > > > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON-RECEIPT OF > > > THE > > > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > > > RATIONALE... > > > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > > > UMESH > > > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us first > > > sort > > > > the > > > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > > > first > > > > > let us sort > > > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > kulbir > > > > bance > > > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > > > little > > > > > sanity > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for brother, > > > > venus > > > > > for > > > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak that > > i > > > > am > > > > > karak of > > > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > > > kundali; > > > > > the list > > > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any fus . > > > > what > > > > > is the > > > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body explain > > > the > > > > > rational of > > > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 editions > > > > were > > > > > published > > > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his death, > > now > > > > he > > > > > is side > > > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, > > please > > > > ask > > > > > him what > > > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the > > truth > > > > > before him. > > > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my > > behalf > > > > as > > > > > to what > > > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type of > > > proof > > > > > can satisfy > > > > > > him. > > > > > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can be. I > > > > guess > > > > > you have > > > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > > > criticizing > > > > > them all > > > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any impoliteness > > to > > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose to > > > > ignore > > > > > it or > > > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is the > > > > > rationale of > > > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > > > embrace > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You will > > > > give > > > > > the > > > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. I > > > have > > > > > been > > > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you as > > > you > > > > > have not > > > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale of > > LK. > > > > As > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human beings > > > to > > > > > tackle the > > > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good enough > > > for > > > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run > > away) > > > > > provided we > > > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK > > itself > > > > does > > > > > not > > > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. That's > > > > it. > > > > > At least > > > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > > > instance, > > > > > Rahu in > > > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? Fictious > > > > > planets) - if > > > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong to > > > > police > > > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is what > > LK > > > > > says. Now > > > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we can > > > only > > > > > make > > > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > > > varshphal? > > > > To > > > > > my best > > > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just use > > > it. > > > > It > > > > > works > > > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > [lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > > > lalkitab > <lalkitab%40> > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > little > > > > > sanity > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by some > > > > > extremely > > > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni Khan > > > and > > > > in > > > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first and > > then > > > > > write > > > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he was > > > > > earning > > > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it was > > by > > > > > sheer > > > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims made > > > > about > > > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK.( By > > > the > > > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > > > remedies... > > > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a simple > > > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > > > REMEDIES....? > > > > > If > > > > > > so,what ? > > > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > > > remedies > > > > > > help at all ? " > > > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them > > with > > > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since > > then, > > > > they > > > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > > > rationale > > > > > for > > > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT I > > DID > > > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that tithi > > is > > > a > > > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the > > Moon > > > > on a > > > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > > > ADMITTING > > > > > THAT > > > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE MADE > > ANY > > > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT > > VERY > > > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > > > astrology > > > > > > since 1960's... > > > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE > > STILL > > > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY YOUR > > > > > FRIENDS > > > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING MY > > > > ABILITY > > > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT MAY...I > > DO > > > > NOT > > > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I HAVE...IF > > > THAT > > > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > > > needlessly > > > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > > > With best wishes, > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. Rao > > > > could be > > > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points he > > > > raises > > > > > > can > > > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > > > myself > > > > who > > > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared and > > > put > > > > > off > > > > > > by > > > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao really a > > > > senior > > > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > > > following: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and > > jeers > > > > the > > > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to > > keep > > > > > quiet, > > > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > > > (though > > > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), > > Yograj > > > > try > > > > > to > > > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read the > > book > > > > and > > > > > > then > > > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK originator > > Pt. > > > > Rup > > > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not in > > the > > > > same > > > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. The > > > > right > > > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was eager > > to > > > > know > > > > > > all > > > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > > > amongst > > > > the > > > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with > > uncertain > > > > > > results, > > > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer any > > > > > remedies) > > > > > > and > > > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the > > remedies > > > > or > > > > > > just > > > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the > > forums > > > > where > > > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > > > chance > > > > to > > > > > > you > > > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the > > opportunity. > > > > This > > > > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and discuss > > > the > > > > > issue > > > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue to be > > > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the global > > > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others to > > join > > > > the > > > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well as > > > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and if > > he > > > > > > practices > > > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, he > > will > > > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional > > astrolger > > > > who > > > > > has > > > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > > > participating > > > > > > in > > > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > > > banned > > > > > from > > > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the agenda. > > > At > > > > > least > > > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 Dear Umesh Sharma, As you have very recently assumed the editorship of this column,may I draw your attention to Mr.Yograj's letter to Rajni Khan...and my reply to Shri Yograj... All of you need to INTROSPECT,as suggested by Shri Yograj...I truly admire him for the great moral strength he has shown to suggest that ALL of you introspect,rather than just blindly follow the Great Seer,the late Pt.Roop Chand Joshiji...and trying to " blame Mr.Rao... " Any way,I wish to humbly offer my help to you all,in whatever way you think I can,to help... I had,in the fist place,never said a single word against the late Pt.Poop Chandji,at any time...but perhaps,the ego of some of his " more-loyal-than-the-king " followers was surely bruised resulting in this needlessly long discussion,which was unfortunately developing into some sort of a " prestige issue " for some...or perhaps it was due to my " aggressive " language,as perceived by some...making them to equate it to " an affront " to their Guru... Anyway...All's well that ends well...! My help/suggestions,if needed,is always at your disposal...pl. do not hesitate to ask... Wishing you all,the very best, L.Y.Rao. > > Dear Mr.Yograj, > I thank you and respect you for your very frank > expression of your desire that ALL LK followers should engage in > serious INTROSPECTION...and devote themselves to attain atleast a > decent fraction of the Great Seer's Powers...by intense meditation > and selfless devotion to the Almighty and intense Saadhana... > Implied in your letter Mr.Yograj,clearly, is the > observation that " todays LK-ists...try to simply imitate the GURU... " > without the requisite Saadhana or devotion to God...only using LK to > mint money as seen on some of the prominent " LK sites " ... > I am also glad that you realise,(better late than > never),that I bear no ill-will towards LK,it's creator,the Great > SEER...or any of the members of LK... > As said earlier,the initial,quite offensive reaction, > by some members to my initial query,which,by the way,STILL REMAINS > UNANSWERED TILL DATE...has triggerred this long drawn and needless > debate... > I guess Yograjji and his friends will now have no > hesitation in " hunting " for the rationale,or even possible rationale, > and I am quite willing to help,if you all so desire... > Surely Yojraj ji I can see in you a " GOOD MANAGER " > with excrllent Personnel Management and HR skills... > With best wishes, > L.Y.Rao. > > > > Yograj bhai, > > > > > > > > Thank you for participation. My comments below. > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of Yograj > Prabhakar > > Wednesday, May 07, 2008 14:59 > > lalkitab > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan ji, > > > > I am a very optimistic and positive guy, I always try to find a > > positive thing even in the most negative and adverse situations. I > am > > following this ongoing debate for quite a while and even tried to > poke > > my nose to present the case. But I preferred to remain a silent > > spectator because of the stubborn approach adopted by Mr .Rao and > the > > frequent use of unparliamentary slang (not by all) during the > discussion. > > > > yes, Mr. Rao has not allowed the discussion to flourish so as to > allow many > > others, like yourself to participate regularly. > > > > > > > > Anyways, although I am not completely agree or disagree what Mr .Rao > > has said, but I cannot afford to ignore one of his point that todays > > Lal Kitabist are simply trying to imitate the great Sage Pundit Roop > > Chand joshi ji, isn't it true? Do we possess even one per cent of > the > > power and energy that Pundit ji was having? I am afraid the answer > is > > in plain NO, we are certainly lacking those qualities. Isn't it true > > that most of us are poorly equipped as far as the knowledge of this > > divine scripture is concerned? How many of us are having a spiritual > > backing, a guru, deep study of the subject, or the formal training? > As > > such, how can we claim of being the " healers " without acquiring > these > > blessings and qualities? > > > > What you say is probably true. But does this make the pursuit of it > > untenable? Everything is up for discussion. You say Panditji has > spiritual > > powers. Critics will say this is incorrect or show proof. Even > Jesus or > > Socrates were not spared. This is how man's mind works. My view is > that we, > > as humans, need solutions for many things. We move from one to > another and > > settle for that which appeals to us most. > > > > Whether Panditji had spiritual powers or not is perhaps not > relevant. People > > who use his books, marvel at his insight and cannot but conclude > that > > Panditji had something extra or " spiritual power " . But people who > have not > > benefited by it, will ridicule this. Very soon you will see Mr. Rao > do the > > same. My submission is simple - try the remedies and see if they > work or > > not. That's all. Mr. Rao says, all remedies work due to placebo > effect. > > Really? I doubt that. In some instances, suggestions or placebo > effect comes > > into play but for all - cannot be. I have a doubting mind, yet many > remedies > > have worked. Few have not. My current conclusion - astrologers > are blessed > > with different insights, hence their strengths are different, their > > interpretations different. > > > > We should not blame Mr. Rao since his knowledge about Lal Kitab is > an > > open secret, we must rather focus on our own shortcomings and try to > > find out " Remedies " for ourselves first before recommending anything > > to anyone. > > > > This is acceptable. The remedies for ourselves, as you point out is > not just > > restricted to LK. The remedy is to be honest, brutally honest with > one's own > > self and others, stick to the straight path and continuously strive > to allow > > our impurities to leave us on their own accord. Love and patience > is the way > > forward. > > > > > > > > Respectfully > > Yograj Prabhakar > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> , " Rajni Khan " > > <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > See below. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have > > > received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious > that > > > the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is > simply > > > beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest > of > > > you ignoramuses... > > > > > > maybe you are right - may be you are not. Let me first see it, > still > > waiting > > > for it. cannot speak for others. > > > > > > > > > The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " > > > at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a > > > peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just > anything > > > else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! > > > > > > Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? One > of the > > > thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see > his > > > financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. > > > > > > Again I say: > > > > > > As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published by > > Panditji or > > > not? This is important as you can at any time say that there are > > different > > > books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books of > > Panditji > > > only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. > > > > > > It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of > > moving step > > > by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help > > resolve the > > > issue. > > > > > > > > > It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your > > > site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? > > > > > > Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. > > > > > > > > > All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence > > > tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you > are > > > nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... > > > > > > Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who are > not > > > willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are > > > greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT > CONSISTENTLY > > > AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > > THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... > > > AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... > > > > > > As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows once > we > > have a > > > system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated > allegations. > > > > > > > > > ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE > > > FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... > > > REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > > IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... > > > > > > All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our > correspondence shall > > > say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is not > > willing to > > > move in the method suggested, what can we do. > > > > > > A simple mail from you saying let's move in the method suggested > > will help a > > > lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you > Mr. > > Rao is > > > not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to > unravel > > the LK > > > is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, > tear to > > > shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their own > > views - > > > only in the last few years has LK seen an English language > interest and > > > there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. > Most > > elderly > > > and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or > are > > not on > > > internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided there > is a > > > motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by > step > > else we > > > can keep going in round circles like this. > > > > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My email address is rajni.khan@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > L.Y.Rao. > > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > What a hope ? > > > > Boosting the morale of your members is one > > > > thing...and telling LIES is another... > > > > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > > > > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > > > > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > > > > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU A > > > > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND > YOU > > > A > > > > COPY... > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I > personally > > > > will > > > > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the > > > following > > > > > reasons: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > > > > asking > > > > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This > will > > > > help us > > > > > decode the LK more. > > > > > > > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > > > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from recent > > > mails > > > > is > > > > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > > > > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > > > > possible > > > > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK and > is > > > > retaliating > > > > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet > from > > > > Rahim: > > > > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who > criticises, > > > keep > > > > him > > > > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your > house. > > > > > > > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > > > > way of > > > > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will > > > oblige > > > > us - > > > > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for > > > Vimshottri > > > > was sent > > > > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member > has > > > > received > > > > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > > girish_raheja > > > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua > hai > > > > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > > > > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > > > > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se > kya > > > fark > > > > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek > admi > > > > na > > > > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > > > > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi > > > mante, > > > > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal > Kitab > > > aj > > > > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > > > > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We > had > > > > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > > > > <lyrastro1@> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > > > > ANSWERED... > > > > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > > > > & > > > > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > > > > such...by > > > > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN > ACE...most > > > > > people > > > > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > > > > RATIONALE > > > > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & > K.P., > > > > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > > > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON- RECEIPT > OF > > > > THE > > > > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > > > > RATIONALE... > > > > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > > > > UMESH > > > > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us > first > > > > sort > > > > > the > > > > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. Rao - > > > > > first > > > > > > let us sort > > > > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > [lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > kulbir > > > > > bance > > > > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - > a > > > > > little > > > > > > sanity > > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for > brother, > > > > > venus > > > > > > for > > > > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak > that > > > i > > > > > am > > > > > > karak of > > > > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > > > > kundali; > > > > > > the list > > > > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any > fus . > > > > > what > > > > > > is the > > > > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body > explain > > > > the > > > > > > rational of > > > > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 > editions > > > > > were > > > > > > published > > > > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his > death, > > > now > > > > > he > > > > > > is side > > > > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, > > > please > > > > > ask > > > > > > him what > > > > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring the > > > truth > > > > > > before him. > > > > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my > > > behalf > > > > > as > > > > > > to what > > > > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type > of > > > > proof > > > > > > can satisfy > > > > > > > him. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can > be. I > > > > > guess > > > > > > you have > > > > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > > > > criticizing > > > > > > them all > > > > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any > impoliteness > > > to > > > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You choose > to > > > > > ignore > > > > > > it or > > > > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is > the > > > > > > rationale of > > > > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or not > > > > > embrace > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You > will > > > > > give > > > > > > the > > > > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run away. > I > > > > have > > > > > > been > > > > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with you > as > > > > you > > > > > > have not > > > > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale > of > > > LK. > > > > > As > > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human > beings > > > > to > > > > > > tackle the > > > > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good > enough > > > > for > > > > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not run > > > away) > > > > > > provided we > > > > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK > > > itself > > > > > does > > > > > > not > > > > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. > That's > > > > > it. > > > > > > At least > > > > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > > > > instance, > > > > > > Rahu in > > > > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? > Fictious > > > > > > planets) - if > > > > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not belong > to > > > > > police > > > > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is > what > > > LK > > > > > > says. Now > > > > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we > can > > > > only > > > > > > make > > > > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > > > > varshphal? > > > > > To > > > > > > my best > > > > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just > use > > > > it. > > > > > It > > > > > > works > > > > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > [lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > > > > lalkitab > > <lalkitab%40> > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > > little > > > > > > sanity > > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by > some > > > > > > extremely > > > > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni > Khan > > > > and > > > > > in > > > > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first > and > > > then > > > > > > write > > > > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he > was > > > > > > earning > > > > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it > was > > > by > > > > > > sheer > > > > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims > made > > > > > about > > > > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK. ( > By > > > > the > > > > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > > > > remedies... > > > > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a > simple > > > > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > > > > REMEDIES....? > > > > > > If > > > > > > > so,what ? > > > > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > > > > remedies > > > > > > > help at all ? " > > > > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided them > > > with > > > > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since > > > then, > > > > > they > > > > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > > > > rationale > > > > > > for > > > > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back off...BUT > I > > > DID > > > > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that > tithi > > > is > > > > a > > > > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and the > > > Moon > > > > > on a > > > > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > > > > ADMITTING > > > > > > THAT > > > > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE > MADE > > > ANY > > > > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS NOT > > > VERY > > > > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > > > > astrology > > > > > > > since 1960's... > > > > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > > > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE > > > STILL > > > > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY > YOUR > > > > > > FRIENDS > > > > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING > MY > > > > > ABILITY > > > > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT > MAY...I > > > DO > > > > > NOT > > > > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I > HAVE...IF > > > > THAT > > > > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > > > > needlessly > > > > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > > > > With best wishes, > > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. > Rao > > > > > could be > > > > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the points > he > > > > > raises > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people like > > > > myself > > > > > who > > > > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared > and > > > > put > > > > > > off > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao > really a > > > > > senior > > > > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > > > > following: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity and > > > jeers > > > > > the > > > > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao to > > > keep > > > > > > quiet, > > > > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, Umesh > > > > (though > > > > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), > > > Yograj > > > > > try > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read > the > > > book > > > > > and > > > > > > > then > > > > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK > originator > > > Pt. > > > > > Rup > > > > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not > in > > > the > > > > > same > > > > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. > The > > > > > right > > > > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was > eager > > > to > > > > > know > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > > > > amongst > > > > > the > > > > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with > > > uncertain > > > > > > > results, > > > > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer > any > > > > > > remedies) > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the > > > remedies > > > > > or > > > > > > > just > > > > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the > > > forums > > > > > where > > > > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your Karma's > > > > chance > > > > > to > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the > > > opportunity. > > > > > This > > > > > > > > statement can be true for everything including medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and > discuss > > > > the > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue > to be > > > > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the > global > > > > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others > to > > > join > > > > > the > > > > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well > as > > > > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and > if > > > he > > > > > > > practices > > > > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, > he > > > will > > > > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional > > > astrolger > > > > > who > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > > > > participating > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he is > > > > banned > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the > agenda. > > > > At > > > > > > least > > > > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 Dear Kulbir, I fervently hope that Shri Yograj's recent mail to Rajni Khan will have OPENED YOUR EYES WIDE AND CLEAR...! As suggested by him,INTROSPECT DEEPLY instead of just parrotting the late Shri Roop Chand Joshiji's sayings and perform Sadhana and develop atleast some of the powers of Pt.Joshiji... Don't waste your time defending your indefensible stand. May God Bless you... L.Y.Rao. > > Rao Sir, > please follow the correct approach; > 1. firstly u said that Lalkitab was written after death of Pt.ji. > 2. u said pt ji could have written only in persian. > 3. u said that urdu and persian are the same languages. > i have sent in the information with me; why are u silent please > accept or deny; then only can we move to the rationale part. > if u don't have that much knowledge of lalkitab what COOPERATION CAN > U PROVIDE TO UNRAVEL THE MYSTERY OF LALKITAB; we have also seen the > level of ur vedic astrology knowledge as u failed to answer even one > of Dr. Aggarwal's questions. > i gave my reply in the period/timelimit fixed by ur gudeslf; why are > u not responding. > sincerely > kulbirbance > > > lalkitab , " L.Y.Rao. " <lyrastro1@> > wrote: > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > You can and will have my fullest cooperation in > > unravelling the mystery of Lalkitab...but FIRST YOU WILL HAVE TO > > ACEEPT THAT " LAL KITAB " AS IT IS PRESENTLY BEING MARKETED IS > WITHOUT > > ANY RATIONALE... > > Then I shall whole-heartedly participate in the > > search for the true Rationale for Lal Kitab...and help you to the > > best of my ability... > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > See below. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 > > > lalkitab > > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have > > > received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious > > that > > > the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is > simply > > > beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest > of > > > you ignoramuses... > > > > > > maybe you are right - may be you are not. Let me first see it, > > still waiting > > > for it. cannot speak for others. > > > > > > > > > The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " > > > at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a > > > peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just > > anything > > > else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! > > > > > > Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? One > of > > the > > > thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see > his > > > financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. > > > > > > Again I say: > > > > > > As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published by > > Panditji or > > > not? This is important as you can at any time say that there are > > different > > > books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books > of > > Panditji > > > only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. > > > > > > It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of > > moving step > > > by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help > > resolve the > > > issue. > > > > > > > > > It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your > > > site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? > > > > > > Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. > > > > > > > > > All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence > > > tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you > are > > > nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... > > > > > > Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who > are > > not > > > willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are > > > greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT > CONSISTENTLY > > > AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > > THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... > > > AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... > > > > > > As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows > once > > we have a > > > system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated > > allegations. > > > > > > > > > ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE > > > FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... > > > REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > > IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... > > > > > > All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our > correspondence > > shall > > > say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is not > > willing to > > > move in the method suggested, what can we do. > > > > > > A simple mail from you saying let's move in the method suggested > > will help a > > > lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you > Mr. > > Rao is > > > not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to > > unravel the LK > > > is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, > > tear to > > > shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their > own > > views - > > > only in the last few years has LK seen an English language > interest > > and > > > there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. > > Most elderly > > > and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or > are > > not on > > > internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided > there > > is a > > > motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by > step > > else we > > > can keep going in round circles like this. > > > > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My email address is rajni.khan@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > L.Y.Rao. > > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > > > > lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > What a hope ? > > > > Boosting the morale of your members is one > > > > thing...and telling LIES is another... > > > > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > > > > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > > > > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > > > > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU > A > > > > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO SEND > > YOU > > > A > > > > COPY... > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I > > personally > > > > will > > > > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the > > > following > > > > > reasons: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > > > > asking > > > > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This > > will > > > > help us > > > > > decode the LK more. > > > > > > > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of no > > > > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from > recent > > > mails > > > > is > > > > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > > > > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > > > > possible > > > > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK > and > > is > > > > retaliating > > > > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a couplet > > from > > > > Rahim: > > > > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who > criticises, > > > keep > > > > him > > > > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your > > house. > > > > > > > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > > > > way of > > > > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao will > > > oblige > > > > us - > > > > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for > > > Vimshottri > > > > was sent > > > > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other member > > has > > > > received > > > > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > > girish_raheja > > > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > > > > lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > little > > > > sanity > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga hua > > hai > > > > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > > > > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > > > > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se > kya > > > fark > > > > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, ek > > admi > > > > na > > > > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > > > > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi > > > mante, > > > > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal > Kitab > > > aj > > > > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > > > > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We > had > > > > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > > > > <lyrastro1@> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > > > > ANSWERED... > > > > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > > > > & > > > > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > > > > such...by > > > > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN > ACE...most > > > > > people > > > > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > > > > RATIONALE > > > > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & > > K.P., > > > > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > > > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON- > RECEIPT > > OF > > > > THE > > > > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > > > > RATIONALE... > > > > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > > > > UMESH > > > > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us > first > > > > sort > > > > > the > > > > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. > Rao - > > > > first > > > > > > let us sort > > > > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > [lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > kulbir > > > > > bance > > > > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's > views - > > a > > > > > little > > > > > > sanity > > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for > > brother, > > > > > venus > > > > > > for > > > > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets speak > > that > > > i > > > > > am > > > > > > karak of > > > > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth in > > > > > kundali; > > > > > > the list > > > > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any > > fus . > > > > > what > > > > > > is the > > > > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body > > explain > > > > the > > > > > > rational of > > > > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 > > editions > > > > > were > > > > > > published > > > > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his > death, > > > now > > > > > he > > > > > > is side > > > > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, > > > please > > > > > ask > > > > > > him what > > > > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring > the > > > truth > > > > > > before him. > > > > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on my > > > behalf > > > > > as > > > > > > to what > > > > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type > of > > > > proof > > > > > > can satisfy > > > > > > > him. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can > be. > > I > > > > > guess > > > > > > you have > > > > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > > > > criticizing > > > > > > them all > > > > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any > impoliteness > > > to > > > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You > choose > > to > > > > > ignore > > > > > > it or > > > > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is > the > > > > > > rationale of > > > > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or > not > > > > > embrace > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? You > > will > > > > > give > > > > > > the > > > > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run > away. I > > > > have > > > > > > been > > > > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with > you > > as > > > > you > > > > > > have not > > > > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale > of > > > LK. > > > > > As > > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human > > beings > > > > to > > > > > > tackle the > > > > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good > > enough > > > > for > > > > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not > run > > > away) > > > > > > provided we > > > > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK > > > itself > > > > > does > > > > > > not > > > > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. > > That's > > > > > it. > > > > > > At least > > > > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > > > > instance, > > > > > > Rahu in > > > > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? > > Fictious > > > > > > planets) - if > > > > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not > belong > > to > > > > > police > > > > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is > what > > > LK > > > > > > says. Now > > > > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we > can > > > > only > > > > > > make > > > > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > > > > varshphal? > > > > > To > > > > > > my best > > > > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We just > > use > > > > it. > > > > > It > > > > > > works > > > > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > [lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > > little > > > > > > sanity > > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by > some > > > > > > extremely > > > > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni > > Khan > > > > and > > > > > in > > > > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first > and > > > then > > > > > > write > > > > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that he > > was > > > > > > earning > > > > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it > was > > > by > > > > > > sheer > > > > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the claims > > made > > > > > about > > > > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK. > ( > > By > > > > the > > > > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in LK > > > > > remedies... > > > > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a > simple > > > > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > > > > REMEDIES....? > > > > > > If > > > > > > > so,what ? > > > > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How can > > > > > remedies > > > > > > > help at all ? " > > > > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided > them > > > with > > > > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now appears...since > > > then, > > > > > they > > > > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > > > > rationale > > > > > > for > > > > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back > off...BUT I > > > DID > > > > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that > tithi > > > is > > > > a > > > > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and > the > > > Moon > > > > > on a > > > > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > > > > ADMITTING > > > > > > THAT > > > > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE > MADE > > > ANY > > > > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS > NOT > > > VERY > > > > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > > > > astrology > > > > > > > since 1960's... > > > > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > > > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU ARE > > > STILL > > > > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT MY > > > > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED BY > > YOUR > > > > > > FRIENDS > > > > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING > MY > > > > > ABILITY > > > > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT > > MAY...I > > > DO > > > > > NOT > > > > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I > HAVE...IF > > > > THAT > > > > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > > > > needlessly > > > > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > > > > With best wishes, > > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. > Rao > > > > > could be > > > > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the > points > > he > > > > > raises > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people > like > > > > myself > > > > > who > > > > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are scared > > and > > > > put > > > > > > off > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao > really > > a > > > > > senior > > > > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > > > > following: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity > and > > > jeers > > > > > the > > > > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao > to > > > keep > > > > > > quiet, > > > > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, > Umesh > > > > (though > > > > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is tedious), > > > Yograj > > > > > try > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read > the > > > book > > > > > and > > > > > > > then > > > > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK > originator > > > Pt. > > > > > Rup > > > > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not > in > > > the > > > > > same > > > > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in solutions. > > The > > > > > right > > > > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was > eager > > > to > > > > > know > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a fight > > > > amongst > > > > > the > > > > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with > > > uncertain > > > > > > > results, > > > > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer > any > > > > > > remedies) > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the > > > remedies > > > > > or > > > > > > > just > > > > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the > > > forums > > > > > where > > > > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your > Karma's > > > > chance > > > > > to > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the > > > opportunity. > > > > > This > > > > > > > > statement can be true for everything including > medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and > > discuss > > > > the > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can continue > to > > be > > > > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the > > global > > > > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others > to > > > join > > > > > the > > > > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as well > as > > > > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims and > if > > > he > > > > > > > practices > > > > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he can, > he > > > will > > > > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional > > > astrolger > > > > > who > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > > > > participating > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he > is > > > > banned > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the > > agenda. > > > > At > > > > > > least > > > > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Rao sir, Shri yograj has been my guide for years, i understand what he means to say but on what account do u say that my stand is indefensible? sadhna, awakeniking of kundali is integral part, no dispute regarding that but what about my rebutals that u don't even have basic knowledge regarding lalkitab. how can i accept that u knew much about pandit ji. please give answers to my 3 questions that i raised in question to ur baseless comments. it is on record. do u accept or deny the information denied by me. it was yourgoodself who raised these objections, i only replied and know u say it is wastage of time. i doubt ur seriousness. when u have drwan a line for debate, lets debate that part first, u cannot blow hot and cold in the same breath. thanks for ur blessings. kulbirbance lalkitab , " L.Y.Rao. " <lyrastro1 wrote: > > Dear Kulbir, > I fervently hope that Shri Yograj's recent mail to Rajni > Khan will have OPENED YOUR EYES WIDE AND CLEAR...! > As suggested by him,INTROSPECT DEEPLY instead of just > parrotting the late Shri Roop Chand Joshiji's sayings and perform > Sadhana and develop atleast some of the powers of Pt.Joshiji... > Don't waste your time defending your indefensible stand. > May God Bless you... > L.Y.Rao. > > > > Rao Sir, > > please follow the correct approach; > > 1. firstly u said that Lalkitab was written after death of Pt.ji. > > 2. u said pt ji could have written only in persian. > > 3. u said that urdu and persian are the same languages. > > i have sent in the information with me; why are u silent please > > accept or deny; then only can we move to the rationale part. > > if u don't have that much knowledge of lalkitab what COOPERATION > CAN > > U PROVIDE TO UNRAVEL THE MYSTERY OF LALKITAB; we have also seen the > > level of ur vedic astrology knowledge as u failed to answer even > one > > of Dr. Aggarwal's questions. > > i gave my reply in the period/timelimit fixed by ur gudeslf; why > are > > u not responding. > > sincerely > > kulbirbance > > > > > > lalkitab , " L.Y.Rao. " <lyrastro1@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > You can and will have my fullest cooperation in > > > unravelling the mystery of Lalkitab...but FIRST YOU WILL HAVE TO > > > ACEEPT THAT " LAL KITAB " AS IT IS PRESENTLY BEING MARKETED IS > > WITHOUT > > > ANY RATIONALE... > > > Then I shall whole-heartedly participate in the > > > search for the true Rationale for Lal Kitab...and help you to the > > > best of my ability... > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > See below. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > [lalkitab ] On Behalf Of L.Y.Rao. > > > > Tuesday, May 06, 2008 20:49 > > > > lalkitab > > > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > From the " level of intelligence " of the mails I have > > > > received from you and your members,so far...it is quite obvious > > > that > > > > the rationale of Vimshottari Dasa and even K.P.Astrology is > > simply > > > > beyond the comprehension of you Rajni,Umesh,Kulbir and the rest > > of > > > > you ignoramuses... > > > > > > > > maybe you are right - may be you are not. Let me first see it, > > > still waiting > > > > for it. cannot speak for others. > > > > > > > > > > > > The last time one of you threw his " 7-figure salary " > > > > at me...in vain,this time I think,I can expect anything from a > > > > peevish lot like you all... you are capable of throwing just > > > anything > > > > else... EXCEPT THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... ! > > > > > > > > Often you throw the 7 figure salary. Is this bothering you? > One > > of > > > the > > > > thumb rules to know if the astrologer is right or not is to see > > his > > > > financial success. Most LK astrologers are very well off. > > > > > > > > Again I say: > > > > > > > > As Kulbir said : first do you accept the books were published > by > > > Panditji or > > > > not? This is important as you can at any time say that there > are > > > different > > > > books in the market. We are restricting ourselves to the books > > of > > > Panditji > > > > only. Only after this shall we move on to the next question. > > > > > > > > It is proving to be difficult to discuss with you as instead of > > > moving step > > > > by step, tangents are more welcome to you. This shall not help > > > resolve the > > > > issue. > > > > > > > > > > > > It is with Umesh Sharma,and has been sent to your > > > > site,and still you pretend you have not received it...! ? > > > > > > > > Send it to me. I shall post it in the forum. > > > > > > > > > > > > All that you people are fit for,is to play confidence > > > > tricks on innocent victims and exploit their gullibility...you > > are > > > > nothing but a bunch of sophisticated confidence tricksters... > > > > > > > > Unsubstantiated allegations are wont and refuge of people who > > are > > > not > > > > willing to broaden their horizons. World is full of them. > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bance has made out that Pharsi and Urdu are > > > > greatly different languages...just to make a point,BUT > > CONSISTENTLY > > > > AVOIDS GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > > > THERE IS NO RATIONALE,I AM FIRMLY CONVINCED NOW... > > > > AT LEAST NONE OF YOU KNOW IT... > > > > > > > > As mentioned earlier, step by step. Rationale debate follows > > once > > > we have a > > > > system of debate in place, not hurling of unsubstantiated > > > allegations. > > > > > > > > > > > > ALSO I THINK THAT ALL OF YOU ARE PLAYING A HUGE > > > > FRAUD...ON INNOCENT AND GULLIBLE PEOPLE... > > > > REPLY IF YOU CAN GIVING THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB... > > > > IF YOU CANNOT HANG DOWN YOUR HEADS IN SHAME... > > > > > > > > All this is irrelevant. Anyone who will look at our > > correspondence > > > shall > > > > say, we have been trying to go about this but if a person is > not > > > willing to > > > > move in the method suggested, what can we do. > > > > > > > > A simple mail from you saying let's move in the method > suggested > > > will help a > > > > lot, make others participate in the debate. For, satisfying you > > Mr. > > > Rao is > > > > not the objective. Getting others to participate in order to > > > unravel the LK > > > > is the objective. Your role is important as you shall question, > > > tear to > > > > shred all agreements which will inspire members to offer their > > own > > > views - > > > > only in the last few years has LK seen an English language > > interest > > > and > > > > there is no material available. All this will contribute in it. > > > Most elderly > > > > and able LK astrolgers are not good communicators in English or > > are > > > not on > > > > internet. Their views will be sought and presented provided > > there > > > is a > > > > motivation to do so. Hope you will co-operate and move step by > > step > > > else we > > > > can keep going in round circles like this. > > > > > > > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My email address is rajni.khan@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 20:52 > > > > > lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: LK debate > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > > What a hope ? > > > > > Boosting the morale of your members is one > > > > > thing...and telling LIES is another... > > > > > The Rationale of Vimshottari Dasa has been sent to > > > > > Umesh Sharma and " ALL MEMBERS LAL KITAB ASTROLOGY " ... > > > > > YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ANSWERS DO NOT GIVE SILLY > > > > > EXCUSES...GIVE ME YOUR PERSONAL E-MAIL ID AND I WILL SEND YOU > > A > > > > > COPY....OR ELSE ASK UMESH SHARMA YOUR PRESENT EDITOR...TO > SEND > > > YOU > > > > A > > > > > COPY... > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > Girishji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While your sentiment is understood and appreciated, I > > > personally > > > > > will > > > > > > request the moderator that this thread to continue for the > > > > following > > > > > > reasons: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mr. Rao in his zeal to disprove LK will do LK good by > > > > > asking > > > > > > questions and forcing members to come up with answers. This > > > will > > > > > help us > > > > > > decode the LK more. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. It is true, whether Mr. Rao believes in it or not is of > no > > > > > > consequence. Moderator should and as I understand from > > recent > > > > mails > > > > > is > > > > > > stopping or asking Mr. Rao to correct his language. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Mr. Rao can always be stopped. Why now? My guess - It is > > > > > possible > > > > > > that he has been professionally hurt by the success of LK > > and > > > is > > > > > retaliating > > > > > > in this manner. LK is much above such criticisms. (a > couplet > > > from > > > > > Rahim: > > > > > > nindak nere raakhiye, aagan kuti chabhai). One who > > criticises, > > > > keep > > > > > him > > > > > > close and if possible let him build his house next to your > > > house. > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. I am hopeful that once Mr. Rao will come to step by step > > > > > way of > > > > > > approaching, much benefit shall happen. Only if Mr. Rao > will > > > > oblige > > > > > us - > > > > > > which seems unlikely at present. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Furthermore, Mr. Rao is claiming that his rationale for > > > > Vimshottri > > > > > was sent > > > > > > to all members. I have not received any, if any other > member > > > has > > > > > received > > > > > > it, please forward it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > [lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > > > girish_raheja > > > > > > Monday, May 05, 2008 11:06 > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - a > > little > > > > > sanity > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > > > > > > > Soye huye ko to jagaya ja sakta hai. jo pahle se hi jaga > hua > > > hai > > > > > > usko ap kaise jagayenge. > > > > > > > > > > > > isliye Rao saheb ka peechha chhor kar kam ki baten karen. > > > > > > > > > > > > agar ek admi Lal Kitab ka virodhi hai to uske na man ne se > > kya > > > > fark > > > > > > pad ta hai. Lakhon log Lal Kitab ko shrddha se mante hen, > ek > > > admi > > > > > na > > > > > > bhi mane to kya. > > > > > > > > > > > > Rao saheb hi kya, aur bahut se log hen jo Lal Kitab ko nahi > > > > mante, > > > > > > to is se Lal Kitab ka prasangik hona to kam nahi hua. Lal > > Kitab > > > > aj > > > > > > bhi utni hi prasangik hai jitni Pandit ji ke samay men thi. > > > > > > > > > > > > I request the moderator to stop this thread altogether. We > > had > > > > > > enough of Lal Kitab bashing. Now it hurts. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > > > Girish Raheja > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > <lalkitab% 40> , " L.Y.Rao. " > > > > > <lyrastro1@> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rajni Khan, > > > > > > > I think that you are all looking desperately for > > > > > > > excuses to side-track the issue deliberately... > > > > > > > Even if we accept for the moment,that the SEER > > > > > > > himself HAD written a book...MY MAIN QUESTION REMAINS UN- > > > > > > ANSWERED... > > > > > > > WHAT IS THE RATIONALE FOR THE PREDICTIONS TOTKAS > > > > > > & > > > > > > > REMEDIES ETC...? ! > > > > > > > Regarding the rationale for astrology as > > > > > > such...by > > > > > > > asking for which Mr Kulbir thinks he has SCORED AN > > ACE...most > > > > > > people > > > > > > > reading this will certainly LAUGH...! > > > > > > > COME ON,RAJNI & KULBIR I HAVE POSTED THE > > > > > > RATIONALE > > > > > > > FOR VIMSHOTTARI DASA...PUBLISHED YEARS AGO IN ASTROLOGY & > > > K.P., > > > > > > > NOW UMESH SHARMA,KULBIR AND YOU RAJNI KHAN,IT IS > > > > > > > YOUR TURN TO GIVE ME THE RATIONALE OF LAL KITAB > > > > > > REMEDIES,PREDICTIONS > > > > > > > & TOTKAS ETC...UMESH SHARMA HAD EARLIER PLEADED NON- > > RECEIPT > > > OF > > > > > THE > > > > > > > RATIONALE OF THE VIMSHOTTARI DASA...AND DID NOT GIVE ANY > > > > > > RATIONALE... > > > > > > > THIS TIME I HAVE E-MAILED IT TO ALL MEMBERS & > > > > > > UMESH > > > > > > > SHARMA SEPARATELY... > > > > > > > DO NOT GIVE ANY MORE STUPID EXCUSES...IF YOU DO > > > > > > > SO...YOU LOSE WHATEVER LITTLE CREDIBILITY YOU HAD...! ! > > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbirji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bingo. You have said it better. I am with you. Let us > > first > > > > > sort > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > authenticity of the books and then move further. Mr. > > Rao - > > > > > first > > > > > > > let us sort > > > > > > > > this out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > > [lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > > kulbir > > > > > > bance > > > > > > > > Saturday, May 03, 2008 22:09 > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > > Re: [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's > > views - > > > a > > > > > > little > > > > > > > sanity > > > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected rajni ji, there is no end to such questions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > why do traditional astrology takes mangal karak for > > > brother, > > > > > > venus > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > spouse etc, is there any rational, did the planets > speak > > > that > > > > i > > > > > > am > > > > > > > karak of > > > > > > > > such and such objects, where is the position of earth > in > > > > > > kundali; > > > > > > > the list > > > > > > > > is endless. when such concepts are accepted without any > > > fus . > > > > > > what > > > > > > > is the > > > > > > > > problem about lakitab. u r indeed right can any body > > > explain > > > > > the > > > > > > > rational of > > > > > > > > astrology in one reply. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rao sir is still not ready to accept that lalkitab 5 > > > editions > > > > > > were > > > > > > > published > > > > > > > > by pt ji. first he says they were written after his > > death, > > > > now > > > > > > he > > > > > > > is side > > > > > > > > tracking the issue. lets settle this issue on priority, > > > > please > > > > > > ask > > > > > > > him what > > > > > > > > type of proof he needs. it is our moral duty to bring > > the > > > > truth > > > > > > > before him. > > > > > > > > he doesn't understands my language, please ask him on > my > > > > behalf > > > > > > as > > > > > > > to what > > > > > > > > proof does he have to deny the authorship and what type > > of > > > > > proof > > > > > > > can satisfy > > > > > > > > him. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sincerely > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kulbirbance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/1/08, Rajni Khan <rajni.khan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Rao, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have I been really impolite? In my mails, never nor can > > be. > > > I > > > > > > guess > > > > > > > you have > > > > > > > > confused everyone to be a part of a big group and are > > > > > > criticizing > > > > > > > them all > > > > > > > > in one go. For the record, I have not done any > > impoliteness > > > > to > > > > > > you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The rationale was explained to you many times. You > > choose > > > to > > > > > > ignore > > > > > > > it or > > > > > > > > this is how I and perhaps understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asking a question like this is asking too much. What is > > the > > > > > > > rationale of > > > > > > > > astrology itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a logic in LK. You are free to embrace it or > > not > > > > > > embrace > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine the same question - what is the logic to KP? > You > > > will > > > > > > give > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > explanations. May be they are not valid enough for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You say that every one has run away. No one has run > > away. I > > > > > have > > > > > > > been > > > > > > > > keeping quiet as it is no use debating the issue with > > you > > > as > > > > > you > > > > > > > have not > > > > > > > > taken the discussion further than what is the rationale > > of > > > > LK. > > > > > > As > > > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > > > earlier, what is the rationale of astrology? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My view is that astrology is a method devised by human > > > beings > > > > > to > > > > > > > tackle the > > > > > > > > unknown of which most human beings are scared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever will help us to alleviate this fear, is good > > > enough > > > > > for > > > > > > > us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am still willing to debate this issue with you (not > > run > > > > away) > > > > > > > provided we > > > > > > > > can move step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me and many others, LK works. As simple as that. LK > > > > itself > > > > > > does > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > offer much explanation. It says, if this is so, do it. > > > That's > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > At least > > > > > > > > most of the times. I am no great LK expert myself. For > > > > > instance, > > > > > > > Rahu in > > > > > > > > 11th (what is the rationale of Rahu & Ketu I wonder? > > > Fictious > > > > > > > planets) - if > > > > > > > > the native wears a police uniform when he does not > > belong > > > to > > > > > > police > > > > > > > > department, he will be behind bars in no time. This is > > what > > > > LK > > > > > > > says. Now > > > > > > > > what can be the rationale to this? LK has no answer, we > > can > > > > > only > > > > > > > make > > > > > > > > conjectures. But LK works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To add fuel to fire: You can ask what is the logic of > > > > > varshphal? > > > > > > To > > > > > > > my best > > > > > > > > knowledge, I know of no one who can answer this. We > just > > > use > > > > > it. > > > > > > It > > > > > > > works > > > > > > > > that's all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > > [lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > <lalkitab%40> ] On Behalf Of > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > Thursday, May 01, 2008 21:08 > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > <lalkitab%40> > > > > > > > > [lalkitab] Re: Mr. L Y Rao's views - > a > > > > little > > > > > > > sanity > > > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Savitha, > > > > > > > > Thank you for joining in... > > > > > > > > Allow me to remind you that this entire series of > > > > > > > > stern and severely critical replies by me,was begun by > > some > > > > > > > extremely > > > > > > > > impolite replies to my queries by the then editor Rajni > > > Khan > > > > > and > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > particular by Yograj...Kindly read their replies first > > and > > > > then > > > > > > > write > > > > > > > > back...Yograj also tried to impress me by saying that > he > > > was > > > > > > > earning > > > > > > > > a 7-figure salary...! ? > > > > > > > > Secondly,I am a member of only the K.P. Astrology > > > > > > > > Group,and have been involved in research in K.P.,and it > > was > > > > by > > > > > > > sheer > > > > > > > > chance that I logged on to this site and read the > claims > > > made > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > LK and it's " remedies " ...by some of the followers of LK. > > ( > > > By > > > > > the > > > > > > > > way,I have a lot of friends who repose their faith in > LK > > > > > > remedies... > > > > > > > > I asked all of them if there was any literature > > > > > > > > written by the Great SEER himself...and asked them a > > simple > > > > > > > > query...IS THERE ANY RATIONALE FOR LK PREDICTIONS & > > > > > > REMEDIES....? > > > > > > > If > > > > > > > > so,what ? > > > > > > > > I also asked them... " since you all strongly believe > > > > > > > > in the Karma theory,every thing is predestined...How > can > > > > > > remedies > > > > > > > > help at all ? " > > > > > > > > THAT STARTED IT ALL...I HAD LET LOOSE A BEE IN THEIR > > > > > > > > HATS...IT SEEMED... > > > > > > > > Then Umesh Sharma,as a rejoinder asked me the > > > > > > > > rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa...which I provided > > them > > > > with > > > > > > > > promptly TO THEIR GREAT CHAGRIN...it now > appears...since > > > > then, > > > > > > they > > > > > > > > became hostile...because it was their turn to provide a > > > > > > rationale > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > LK... Hostility they thought would make me back > > off...BUT I > > > > DID > > > > > > > > NOT...EVERYBODY THEN RAN TO THEIR RESCUE...WITH BIZARRE > > > > > > > EXPLANATIONS, > > > > > > > > WHICH WERE PROMPTLY DEMOLISHED... > > > > > > > > One person asked me what is mant by TITHI...I replied > > > > > > > > that K.P. does not recognise or use Tithis...and that > > tithi > > > > is > > > > > a > > > > > > > > method of expressing the distance between the Sun and > > the > > > > Moon > > > > > > on a > > > > > > > > particular day...and so on... > > > > > > > > INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO MY FIRST QUERY,THEY THEN > > > > > > > > CONTINUED TO BE ON THE OFFENSIVE... INSTEAD OF PLAINLY > > > > > ADMITTING > > > > > > > THAT > > > > > > > > THE GREAT SEER HIMSELF HAD WRITTEN NO BOOK NOR HAD HE > > MADE > > > > ANY > > > > > > > > NOTES...(WHICH FACT I WAS ALREADY AWARE OF... BUT WAS > > NOT > > > > VERY > > > > > > > > CERTAIN ABOUT...) > > > > > > > > You seem totally silent about...the language of Mike > > > > > > > > M's mails...you are certainly biased... > > > > > > > > Whether people like you,Savitha,recognise me as a K.P. > > > > > > > > Astrologer or not,I don't really care...I have studied > > > > > astrology > > > > > > > > since 1960's... > > > > > > > > But from whatever you have written TWO FACTS > > > > > > > > EMERGE...ONE IS THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF THE ENTIRE > > > > > > CONVERSATIONS > > > > > > > > BETWEEN ME AND YOUR FRIENDS....THE OTHER IS THAT YOU > ARE > > > > STILL > > > > > > > > BIASED ...AND OF ALL THINGS,YOU HAVE TAKEN UMBRAGE AT > MY > > > > > > > > LANGUAGE,,,BUT ARE LOUDLY SILENT ON THE LANGUAGE USED > BY > > > YOUR > > > > > > > FRIENDS > > > > > > > > SUCH AS MIKE M.,AND TAKING POTSHOT AT ME BY QUESTIONING > > MY > > > > > > ABILITY > > > > > > > > AND PROFICIENCY AS A K.P. ASTROLOGER...BE THAT AS IT > > > MAY...I > > > > DO > > > > > > NOT > > > > > > > > NEED ANY CERTIFICATES FROM ANYBODY...NEITHER DO I > > HAVE...IF > > > > > THAT > > > > > > > > PLEASES YOU... > > > > > > > > I agree with you,I certainly CAN be gentler,and AM... > > > > > > > > but I reserve my right to react strongly and wiftly if > > > > > > needlessly > > > > > > > > provoked especially by foul language... > > > > > > > > I gues Savitha pl. go through the entire > > > > > > > > correspondence,and try to be FAIR... > > > > > > > > Let me ask you,frankly...who put you up to this ? > > > > > > > > With best wishes, > > > > > > > > L.Y.Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been following this exchange avidly. While Mr. > > Rao > > > > > > could be > > > > > > > > > gentler and non-offensive in his mannerisms, the > > points > > > he > > > > > > raises > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > be discussed, not to justify anyone but for people > > like > > > > > myself > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > would want to participate in the debate but are > scared > > > and > > > > > put > > > > > > > off > > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > the uncivilized language on occasions. (Is Mr. Rao > > really > > > a > > > > > > senior > > > > > > > > > citizen?) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I could understand, the debate can be summed up as > > > > > > following: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Initially Mr. Rao questions Lal Kitab's veracity > > and > > > > jeers > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > followers to prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. A flood of response from LK lovers asking Mr. Rao > > to > > > > keep > > > > > > > quiet, > > > > > > > > > get out or irrelevant responses. Few, from Rajni, > > Umesh > > > > > (though > > > > > > > > > keeping track of hindi in capital letters is > tedious), > > > > Yograj > > > > > > try > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > sanely present the case. They simply ask him to read > > the > > > > book > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > then > > > > > > > > > question. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. A lot of unnecessary emails (hate). Very > disturbing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Mr. Rao changes tack or accepts that the LK > > originator > > > > Pt. > > > > > > Rup > > > > > > > > > Chandji was a seer but today's LK practioners are not > > in > > > > the > > > > > > same > > > > > > > > league. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have not read the book. My interest is in > solutions. > > > The > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > solution ofcourse. When this topic opened up, I was > > eager > > > > to > > > > > > know > > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > sides of the arguments. Sadly, as this becomes a > fight > > > > > amongst > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > professional astrolgers, which was not needed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As a user I seek solutions. I have used vedic with > > > > uncertain > > > > > > > > results, > > > > > > > > > KP with questionable readings (and they do not offer > > any > > > > > > > remedies) > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > LK remedies with results (though are they due to the > > > > remedies > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > just > > > > > > > > > existence was playing a game with me). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I particularly like someone's statement in one of the > > > > forums > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > he/she said that performing LK remedies is your > > Karma's > > > > > chance > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > to correct the imbalance. Not everyone gets the > > > > opportunity. > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > statement can be true for everything including > > medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My request: Can the parties involved be polite and > > > discuss > > > > > the > > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > > here. If you choose to disagree, then you can > continue > > to > > > be > > > > > > > > > participant with your views as those views add to the > > > global > > > > > > > > > knowledge. Hopefully we will be able to invite others > > to > > > > join > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > debate and share their experiences - rewarding as > well > > as > > > > > > > > > disappointing. Do we want to put them away? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am confused. If Mr. Rao is as elder as he claims > and > > if > > > > he > > > > > > > > practices > > > > > > > > > KP then he cannot use such language or even if he > can, > > he > > > > will > > > > > > > > > certainly refrain from so. Is it a KP professional > > > > astrolger > > > > > > who > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > been hurt by LK's fan following? I do not see Mr. Rao > > > > > > > participating > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > other forums - either he is not a member there or he > > is > > > > > banned > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > there. Whatever! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Neverthless, we still can be civil and stick to the > > > agenda. > > > > > At > > > > > > > least > > > > > > > > > we can try. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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