Guest guest Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Friends There seems to be similarities between Kalpadruma Yoga which Mrs Wendyji has explained beautifully and Parijata Yoga. Will someone deliberate on this. savithri jyotishi <jyotishi wrote: I believe this was intended for the jyotishvidya group and got sent to me by the email option accidentally by Mr, Bhaskar. - " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish " jyotishi " <jyotishi Friday, February 01, 2008 3:07 PM Re: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear all, Most of the work including the work by the Westerners in last 200 years has been copied from the Indian astology works,is commmon knowledge. The westerners have expanded the character generalisations is appreciable contribution. But the predictive part has been missing. Whether MC jain has copied or not,this statemnet has to be supported by facts and authenticity, and not just by hearsay. There is no doubt that the Parashar Vedic Astrology has been the source for all this copying and pasting, whether from the Indians or the Westerners. Period. Therefore, let us not comment on any individual and focus on learning and sharing. rgrds/Bhaskar. jyotish-vidya , " jyotishi " <jyotishi wrote: > > Hi Wendy, > > I think Rick Houk was very taken by M.C. Jain as he mentioned him quite a bit in his article in the 36 Teachers series that came out in 90s (the Charubel -- degrees of zodiac simplified approach of MC Jain) and I think I read some posts in Finn Wandahl's posts that someone sent me from an archieved jyotish proto-list. > > And absolutely! Final dispositor does not have to be only the planet that is in own sign! We have recently seen an example here where there was a loop at the end -- such as would be the case if jupiter were in libra and venus in pisces as final dispositors! Interestingly, they remind me not as the spear-point that some think a final dispositor is, but more like a lasoo or more morbidly the final noose ;-) > > Please pardon my levity, I know I am in the presence of senior and serious company and must behave! > - > Wendy Vasicek > jyotish-vidya > Sunday, January 27, 2008 5:50 AM > Re: Re: Final Dispositor in Vargottama > > > Dear Manas, > > Unfortunately I'm not familiar with the work of Jain, except for some > critical comments I've read that say the bulk of his work was not his own > but copied from other sources such as Isadore Kozminsky, Raphael, Mohan > Koparkar etc.. I personally cannot comment on this, of course, not having > read any of his books. > However, I do know that the sages themselves have given us adequate > guidelines regarding the use of dispositors. Yogas such as Parvata, Kakala, > Parijatha, Kalpadruma, Mridanga etc being clear examples. See BPHS below... > > 33-34. KALPADRUMA YOGA: > http://jyotishvidya.com/ch36.htm > *Note the following four planets: a) the ascendant lord, b) the dispositor > of the ascendant lord, c) the dispositor of the planet at " b " , d) the > Navamsa dispositor of the planet at " c " . > If all these are disposed in angles and trines from the ascendant, or be > exalted, Kalpadruma yoga exists. One with this yoga will be endowed with all > kinds of wealth, be a king, pious, strong, fond of war, and merciful.* > > Just from this yoga alone, which incorporates the dispositor of ascendant > lord's dispositor etc; we can logically follow the same principle in regards > to other house lords. > > In Ernst Wilhelm's 'Core Yogas' we read: > *The first four dispositor yogas given: Parvata Yoga, Kahala Yoga, > Parijatha Yoga, and Kalpadruma Yoga are all centered on the lagna > lord, therefore, they further the native in life. The principles > illustrated by these four yogas, however, may be extended to other > house lords as well; these other houses being furthered and a benefit > to the native in the event that their lord's dispositors are well situated > as illustrated by these yogas.* > > I think it would be wrong therefore to claim this to be a (new) theory put > forward by any modern author. Perhaps Jain has been responsible for > popularising/modernising this principle, but not, I feel, for developing the > principle/theory itself. You've mentioned Jain several times here. Can you > tell me what impresses you about his work? > > ///The final dispositor, one planet control theory refers to the planet > which is one in own sign and ends up being the last planet in the dispositor > counting./// > > It can be of course that there is not one final dispositor. I was looking at > a tentative chart for Heath Ledger, the actor who died recently at the age > of 28. In this chart, JU is final dispositor of all except MO & ME who are > their own final dispositor...neither of which occupy their own sign... > In fact no planet occupies own sign in this chart (including Jupiter). > > Comments welcome :-) > > Best Wishes, > Mrs. Wendy > http://JyotishVidya.com > jyotish-vidya > ___ > > - > " Jyotish Volunteers " <jyotishi > <jyotish-vidya > > Sunday, January 27, 2008 2:11 PM > Re: Final Dispositor in Vargottama > > The final dispositor, one planet control theory (MC Jain, unless I am > remembering wrongly) refers to the planet which is one in own sign > and ends up being the last planet in the dispositor counting. In your > example Venus. If it is vargottama (or other significant roles such > as atmakaraka or lagnesha, dashamesha etc) that gives it additional > attributes but even without those it remains the final dispositor. > > It is good to have the final dispositor strong and benefic on several > counts, since it is carrying a lot of responsibility. A weak final > dispositor, logically would represent problems. Just being in own > sign, is not enough to make a planet strong and beneficial. > > A vargottama planet is more transparent. Since it is sattwika. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Dear SAVITHRI MAHESH, Please share YOUR thoughts on these two yogas. Thanks, MKuP - SAVITHRI MAHESH jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 12:46 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Friends There seems to be similarities between Kalpadruma Yoga which Mrs Wendyji has explained beautifully and Parijata Yoga. Will someone deliberate on this. savithri jyotishi <jyotishi wrote: I believe this was intended for the jyotishvidya group and got sent to me by the email option accidentally by Mr, Bhaskar. - " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish " jyotishi " <jyotishi Friday, February 01, 2008 3:07 PM Re: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear all, Most of the work including the work by the Westerners in last 200 years has been copied from the Indian astology works,is commmon knowledge. The westerners have expanded the character generalisations is appreciable contribution. But the predictive part has been missing. Whether MC jain has copied or not,this statemnet has to be supported by facts and authenticity, and not just by hearsay. There is no doubt that the Parashar Vedic Astrology has been the source for all this copying and pasting, whether from the Indians or the Westerners. Period. Therefore, let us not comment on any individual and focus on learning and sharing. rgrds/Bhaskar. jyotish-vidya , " jyotishi " <jyotishi wrote: > > Hi Wendy, > > I think Rick Houk was very taken by M.C. Jain as he mentioned him quite a bit in his article in the 36 Teachers series that came out in 90s (the Charubel -- degrees of zodiac simplified approach of MC Jain) and I think I read some posts in Finn Wandahl's posts that someone sent me from an archieved jyotish proto-list. > > And absolutely! Final dispositor does not have to be only the planet that is in own sign! We have recently seen an example here where there was a loop at the end -- such as would be the case if jupiter were in libra and venus in pisces as final dispositors! Interestingly, they remind me not as the spear-point that some think a final dispositor is, but more like a lasoo or more morbidly the final noose ;-) > > Please pardon my levity, I know I am in the presence of senior and serious company and must behave! > - > Wendy Vasicek > jyotish-vidya > Sunday, January 27, 2008 5:50 AM > Re: Re: Final Dispositor in Vargottama > > > Dear Manas, > > Unfortunately I'm not familiar with the work of Jain, except for some > critical comments I've read that say the bulk of his work was not his own > but copied from other sources such as Isadore Kozminsky, Raphael, Mohan > Koparkar etc.. I personally cannot comment on this, of course, not having > read any of his books. > However, I do know that the sages themselves have given us adequate > guidelines regarding the use of dispositors. Yogas such as Parvata, Kakala, > Parijatha, Kalpadruma, Mridanga etc being clear examples. See BPHS below... > > 33-34. KALPADRUMA YOGA: > http://jyotishvidya.com/ch36.htm > *Note the following four planets: a) the ascendant lord, b) the dispositor > of the ascendant lord, c) the dispositor of the planet at " b " , d) the > Navamsa dispositor of the planet at " c " . > If all these are disposed in angles and trines from the ascendant, or be > exalted, Kalpadruma yoga exists. One with this yoga will be endowed with all > kinds of wealth, be a king, pious, strong, fond of war, and merciful.* > > Just from this yoga alone, which incorporates the dispositor of ascendant > lord's dispositor etc; we can logically follow the same principle in regards > to other house lords. > > In Ernst Wilhelm's 'Core Yogas' we read: > *The first four dispositor yogas given: Parvata Yoga, Kahala Yoga, > Parijatha Yoga, and Kalpadruma Yoga are all centered on the lagna > lord, therefore, they further the native in life. The principles > illustrated by these four yogas, however, may be extended to other > house lords as well; these other houses being furthered and a benefit > to the native in the event that their lord's dispositors are well situated > as illustrated by these yogas.* > > I think it would be wrong therefore to claim this to be a (new) theory put > forward by any modern author. Perhaps Jain has been responsible for > popularising/modernising this principle, but not, I feel, for developing the > principle/theory itself. You've mentioned Jain several times here. Can you > tell me what impresses you about his work? > > ///The final dispositor, one planet control theory refers to the planet > which is one in own sign and ends up being the last planet in the dispositor > counting./// > > It can be of course that there is not one final dispositor. I was looking at > a tentative chart for Heath Ledger, the actor who died recently at the age > of 28. In this chart, JU is final dispositor of all except MO & ME who are > their own final dispositor...neither of which occupy their own sign... > In fact no planet occupies own sign in this chart (including Jupiter). > > Comments welcome :-) > > Best Wishes, > Mrs. Wendy > http://JyotishVidya.com > jyotish-vidya > ___ > > - > " Jyotish Volunteers " <jyotishi > <jyotish-vidya > > Sunday, January 27, 2008 2:11 PM > Re: Final Dispositor in Vargottama > > The final dispositor, one planet control theory (MC Jain, unless I am > remembering wrongly) refers to the planet which is one in own sign > and ends up being the last planet in the dispositor counting. In your > example Venus. If it is vargottama (or other significant roles such > as atmakaraka or lagnesha, dashamesha etc) that gives it additional > attributes but even without those it remains the final dispositor. > > It is good to have the final dispositor strong and benefic on several > counts, since it is carrying a lot of responsibility. A weak final > dispositor, logically would represent problems. Just being in own > sign, is not enough to make a planet strong and beneficial. > > A vargottama planet is more transparent. Since it is sattwika. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Manas, ///I believe this was intended for the jyotishvidya group and got sent to me by the email option accidentally by Mr, Bhaskar./// I have little doubt this was intended for you personally as I'm sure Bhaskar would not wish to send it (openly) to the group... Dear Bhaskar, ///Whether MC jain has copied or not,this statemnet has to be supported by facts and authenticity, and not just by hearsay./// It's of little interest to me whether Jain (or anyone else) copied/modified others work and presented it as his own. As I said earlier, I personally am unfamiliar with his work and cannot therefore offer a personal opinion. Instead I have to rely on the critical surveys of astrological books offered by certain book suppliers. The below cut & paste from 'Astrology Centre of America' should satisfy you that the comments I made were supported by fact. I am not in the habit of repeating hearsay, Bhaskar! From Astroamerica.com: *Lunar Nodes, by Mohan Koparkar, was copyright 1977. M.C. Jain's Karmic Control Planets appeared sometime after 1980 & presumably before Jain's demise in 1984 (the only date in this book is for the publisher's " revised edition " of 2001). We note: Koparkar, pg. 7: ....it (the nodes) acts as a vacuum tube connecting the Unknown Past (Karma) and the Known Present. In other words, nodes bridge the gap between previous form of soul to the present soul structure. It also enables us to extrapolate the present soul structure & its possible connection to the future soul form. This automatically ties us down with a concept of some form of reincarnation process. Jain, pgs. 18-19: Rahu & Ketu act as a vacuum tube connecting the Unknown Past (Karma) and the Known Present. In other words, Rahu/Ketu bridge the gap between the previous form of soul to the present soul structure. It also enables us to extrapolate the present soul structure & its possible connection to the future soul form. This automatically ties us down with a concept of some form of the process of reincarnation.* There are other examples but (again) I'm a little pushed for time so the above example will have to suffice for now, I'm afraid. PS: One thing I can give a personal opinion on is the underhanded practice of commenting behind the scenes on what's said openly (on this forum). Such practices speak volumes about a persons honesty and sincerity...or lack thereof. Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " jyotishi " <jyotishi <jyotish-vidya > Saturday, February 02, 2008 10:22 AM Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama I believe this was intended for the jyotishvidya group and got sent to me by the email option accidentally by Mr, Bhaskar. - " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish " jyotishi " <jyotishi Friday, February 01, 2008 3:07 PM Re: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear all, Most of the work including the work by the Westerners in last 200 years has been copied from the Indian astology works,is commmon knowledge. The westerners have expanded the character generalisations is appreciable contribution. But the predictive part has been missing. Whether MC jain has copied or not,this statemnet has to be supported by facts and authenticity, and not just by hearsay. There is no doubt that the Parashar Vedic Astrology has been the source for all this copying and pasting, whether from the Indians or the Westerners. Period. Therefore, let us not comment on any individual and focus on learning and sharing. rgrds/Bhaskar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Savithri, To the best of my understanding... Parijatha yoga: Is formed when the dispositor of lagna lord's dispositor (OR) the lord of navamsha occupied by said dispositor is in a kendra, trine, own house or exaltation. For Kalpadruma yoga: Lagna lord himself, his dispositor and his dispositor's dispositor (as well as) lord of navamsha occupied by said dispositor must all be in either a kendra or trine or be exalted. Others may correct me if I'm in error here. Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " SAVITHRI MAHESH " <savithri_mahesh2000 <jyotish-vidya > Saturday, February 02, 2008 2:46 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Friends There seems to be similarities between Kalpadruma Yoga which Mrs Wendyji has explained beautifully and Parijata Yoga. Will someone deliberate on this. savithri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Wendy, The message began with, " Dear All " and was addressing the issue about plagiarism which I had not raised, or am interested in. I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally? Anyway, my interest in this thread is over! MKuP - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 8:20 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Manas, ///I believe this was intended for the jyotishvidya group and got sent to me by the email option accidentally by Mr, Bhaskar./// I have little doubt this was intended for you personally as I'm sure Bhaskar would not wish to send it (openly) to the group... Dear Bhaskar, ///Whether MC jain has copied or not,this statemnet has to be supported by facts and authenticity, and not just by hearsay./// It's of little interest to me whether Jain (or anyone else) copied/modified others work and presented it as his own. As I said earlier, I personally am unfamiliar with his work and cannot therefore offer a personal opinion. Instead I have to rely on the critical surveys of astrological books offered by certain book suppliers. The below cut & paste from 'Astrology Centre of America' should satisfy you that the comments I made were supported by fact. I am not in the habit of repeating hearsay, Bhaskar! From Astroamerica.com: *Lunar Nodes, by Mohan Koparkar, was copyright 1977. M.C. Jain's Karmic Control Planets appeared sometime after 1980 & presumably before Jain's demise in 1984 (the only date in this book is for the publisher's " revised edition " of 2001). We note: Koparkar, pg. 7: ....it (the nodes) acts as a vacuum tube connecting the Unknown Past (Karma) and the Known Present. In other words, nodes bridge the gap between previous form of soul to the present soul structure. It also enables us to extrapolate the present soul structure & its possible connection to the future soul form. This automatically ties us down with a concept of some form of reincarnation process. Jain, pgs. 18-19: Rahu & Ketu act as a vacuum tube connecting the Unknown Past (Karma) and the Known Present. In other words, Rahu/Ketu bridge the gap between the previous form of soul to the present soul structure. It also enables us to extrapolate the present soul structure & its possible connection to the future soul form. This automatically ties us down with a concept of some form of the process of reincarnation.* There are other examples but (again) I'm a little pushed for time so the above example will have to suffice for now, I'm afraid. PS: One thing I can give a personal opinion on is the underhanded practice of commenting behind the scenes on what's said openly (on this forum). Such practices speak volumes about a persons honesty and sincerity...or lack thereof. Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " jyotishi " <jyotishi <jyotish-vidya > Saturday, February 02, 2008 10:22 AM Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama I believe this was intended for the jyotishvidya group and got sent to me by the email option accidentally by Mr, Bhaskar. - " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish " jyotishi " <jyotishi Friday, February 01, 2008 3:07 PM Re: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear all, Most of the work including the work by the Westerners in last 200 years has been copied from the Indian astology works,is commmon knowledge. The westerners have expanded the character generalisations is appreciable contribution. But the predictive part has been missing. Whether MC jain has copied or not,this statemnet has to be supported by facts and authenticity, and not just by hearsay. There is no doubt that the Parashar Vedic Astrology has been the source for all this copying and pasting, whether from the Indians or the Westerners. Period. Therefore, let us not comment on any individual and focus on learning and sharing. rgrds/Bhaskar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Manas, ///I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally?/// You're probably right and I, in my haste, jumped to a wrong conclusion. However the matter of plagiarism is less of an issue as is the source of the material... Isidore Kozminsky, I believe, was a well-known Melbourne (Australian) esotericist and jeweller reputed to have been involved with the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn - or one of its offshoots. Certainly he was not a vedic scholar... It should not be too difficult to trace the source of these esoteric concepts such as the nodes being " Karmic Control Planets " which is spreading like wildfire with the help of authors such as MC Jain (and the like) who blend these Western (esoteric) concepts into traditional Vedic astrology. Over time people begin to accept these concepts as having their basis in Vedic astrology...this is NOT so! Obviously this corruption of traditional teachings is a sign of the times we live in. Purity per se is no longer deemed necessary, in fact it's considered undesirable in many instances. I've had many heated discussions with my husband recently regarding the purity of the food we eat today. Life is such that city dwellers, unable to grow their own fruit and vegetables, are unwittingly buying fruit saturated with alarmingly high levels of pesticides. The irradiation of grain, fruits and vegetables (for longer shelf life) means that our so-called fresh food can be more than a year old before we buy it...what to speak of the harm caused from the radiation itself. It's alarming how quickly purity (in all things) can be lost. We are what we eat; Well the world is very sick! Sadly, we see the same breakdown in traditional teachings, traditional morals etc, etc.. I personally have little power to turn the tide as far as society's values are concerned. However, I can continue to press the traditional dictums of vedic astrology as taught by Parashara. Members will be (or should be) aware that Jyotish-Vidya is, first and foremost, a " Parashara Discussion Group " . The authenticity of modern concepts, taken from Western astrology (whether tropicalists or siderialists) and propogated by so-called modern Hindu authors, will continue to be questioned here as long as the group remains. Thank You, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " jyotishi " <jyotishi <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:24 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Wendy, The message began with, " Dear All " and was addressing the issue about plagiarism which I had not raised, or am interested in. I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally? Anyway, my interest in this thread is over! MKuP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Wendy Vasicek <jyotishvidya wrote: Dear Manas, ///I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally?/// You're probably right and I, in my haste, jumped to a wrong conclusion. However the matter of plagiarism is less of an issue as is the source of the material... Isidore Kozminsky, I believe, was a well-known Melbourne (Australian) esotericist and jeweller reputed to have been involved with the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn - or one of its offshoots. Certainly he was not a vedic scholar... It should not be too difficult to trace the source of these esoteric concepts such as the nodes being " Karmic Control Planets " which is spreading like wildfire with the help of authors such as MC Jain (and the like) who blend these Western (esoteric) concepts into traditional Vedic astrology. Over time people begin to accept these concepts as having their basis in Vedic astrology...this is NOT so! Obviously this corruption of traditional teachings is a sign of the times we live in. Purity per se is no longer deemed necessary, in fact it's considered undesirable in many instances. I've had many heated discussions with my husband recently regarding the purity of the food we eat today. Life is such that city dwellers, unable to grow their own fruit and vegetables, are unwittingly buying fruit saturated with alarmingly high levels of pesticides. The irradiation of grain, fruits and vegetables (for longer shelf life) means that our so-called fresh food can be more than a year old before we buy it...what to speak of the harm caused from the radiation itself. It's alarming how quickly purity (in all things) can be lost. We are what we eat; Well the world is very sick! Sadly, we see the same breakdown in traditional teachings, traditional morals etc, etc.. I personally have little power to turn the tide as far as society's values are concerned. However, I can continue to press the traditional dictums of vedic astrology as taught by Parashara. Members will be (or should be) aware that Jyotish-Vidya is, first and foremost, a " Parashara Discussion Group " . The authenticity of modern concepts, taken from Western astrology (whether tropicalists or siderialists) and propogated by so-called modern Hindu authors, will continue to be questioned here as long as the group remains. Thank You, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " jyotishi " <jyotishi <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:24 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Wendy, The message began with, " Dear All " and was addressing the issue about plagiarism which I had not raised, or am interested in. I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally? Anyway, my interest in this thread is over! MKuP Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Wendy Vasicek <jyotishvidya wrote: Dear Manas, ///I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally?/// You're probably right and I, in my haste, jumped to a wrong conclusion. However the matter of plagiarism is less of an issue as is the source of the material... Isidore Kozminsky, I believe, was a well-known Melbourne (Australian) esotericist and jeweller reputed to have been involved with the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn - or one of its offshoots. Certainly he was not a vedic scholar... It should not be too difficult to trace the source of these esoteric concepts such as the nodes being " Karmic Control Planets " which is spreading like wildfire with the help of authors such as MC Jain (and the like) who blend these Western (esoteric) concepts into traditional Vedic astrology. Over time people begin to accept these concepts as having their basis in Vedic astrology...this is NOT so! Obviously this corruption of traditional teachings is a sign of the times we live in. Purity per se is no longer deemed necessary, in fact it's considered undesirable in many instances. I've had many heated discussions with my husband recently regarding the purity of the food we eat today. Life is such that city dwellers, unable to grow their own fruit and vegetables, are unwittingly buying fruit saturated with alarmingly high levels of pesticides. The irradiation of grain, fruits and vegetables (for longer shelf life) means that our so-called fresh food can be more than a year old before we buy it...what to speak of the harm caused from the radiation itself. It's alarming how quickly purity (in all things) can be lost. We are what we eat; Well the world is very sick! Sadly, we see the same breakdown in traditional teachings, traditional morals etc, etc.. I personally have little power to turn the tide as far as society's values are concerned. However, I can continue to press the traditional dictums of vedic astrology as taught by Parashara. Members will be (or should be) aware that Jyotish-Vidya is, first and foremost, a " Parashara Discussion Group " . The authenticity of modern concepts, taken from Western astrology (whether tropicalists or siderialists) and propogated by so-called modern Hindu authors, will continue to be questioned here as long as the group remains. Thank You, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " jyotishi " <jyotishi <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:24 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Wendy, The message began with, " Dear All " and was addressing the issue about plagiarism which I had not raised, or am interested in. I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally? Anyway, my interest in this thread is over! MKuP Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear RR, ///AND, what do I need to give up?/// Facetiousness might be a good start... Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:21 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Wendy, Not sure I understand. Please explain ... But after reading the thought poems that I posted before I read this message! RR - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:42 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear RR, ///AND, what do I need to give up?/// Facetiousness might be a good start... Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:21 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 My Dear Friend If you need help to find out what is it that your need to gave up, you are confused. If you need help to find out how to be included that is not need for such ridiculous statementi . " WE " as I wrote stands for the persons who believe and will support the ancient astrology, I don,t understand why? such offense i had caused to your person in trying to indicate the support without any equivocation for traditional astrology. RR <rohini_ranjan wrote: Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Wendy Vasicek <jyotishvidya wrote: Dear Manas, ///I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally?/// You're probably right and I, in my haste, jumped to a wrong conclusion. However the matter of plagiarism is less of an issue as is the source of the material... Isidore Kozminsky, I believe, was a well-known Melbourne (Australian) esotericist and jeweller reputed to have been involved with the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn - or one of its offshoots. Certainly he was not a vedic scholar... It should not be too difficult to trace the source of these esoteric concepts such as the nodes being " Karmic Control Planets " which is spreading like wildfire with the help of authors such as MC Jain (and the like) who blend these Western (esoteric) concepts into traditional Vedic astrology. Over time people begin to accept these concepts as having their basis in Vedic astrology...this is NOT so! Obviously this corruption of traditional teachings is a sign of the times we live in. Purity per se is no longer deemed necessary, in fact it's considered undesirable in many instances. I've had many heated discussions with my husband recently regarding the purity of the food we eat today. Life is such that city dwellers, unable to grow their own fruit and vegetables, are unwittingly buying fruit saturated with alarmingly high levels of pesticides. The irradiation of grain, fruits and vegetables (for longer shelf life) means that our so-called fresh food can be more than a year old before we buy it...what to speak of the harm caused from the radiation itself. It's alarming how quickly purity (in all things) can be lost. We are what we eat; Well the world is very sick! Sadly, we see the same breakdown in traditional teachings, traditional morals etc, etc.. I personally have little power to turn the tide as far as society's values are concerned. However, I can continue to press the traditional dictums of vedic astrology as taught by Parashara. Members will be (or should be) aware that Jyotish-Vidya is, first and foremost, a " Parashara Discussion Group " . The authenticity of modern concepts, taken from Western astrology (whether tropicalists or siderialists) and propogated by so-called modern Hindu authors, will continue to be questioned here as long as the group remains. Thank You, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " jyotishi " <jyotishi <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:24 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Wendy, The message began with, " Dear All " and was addressing the issue about plagiarism which I had not raised, or am interested in. I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally? Anyway, my interest in this thread is over! MKuP Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Eligio, You did not cause me any offense or pain! Your messages just felt like it may have made some feel excluded. Like the line in sand ...! I care about that possibility particularly in view of the second the more recent poem I posted recently. The scenario bothers me!! Love and Light! Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Sunday, February 03, 2008 12:06 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama My Dear Friend If you need help to find out what is it that your need to gave up, you are confused. If you need help to find out how to be included that is not need for such ridiculous statementi . " WE " as I wrote stands for the persons who believe and will support the ancient astrology, I don,t understand why? such offense i had caused to your person in trying to indicate the support without any equivocation for traditional astrology. RR <rohini_ranjan wrote: Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Wendy Vasicek <jyotishvidya wrote: Dear Manas, ///I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally?/// You're probably right and I, in my haste, jumped to a wrong conclusion. However the matter of plagiarism is less of an issue as is the source of the material... Isidore Kozminsky, I believe, was a well-known Melbourne (Australian) esotericist and jeweller reputed to have been involved with the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn - or one of its offshoots. Certainly he was not a vedic scholar... It should not be too difficult to trace the source of these esoteric concepts such as the nodes being " Karmic Control Planets " which is spreading like wildfire with the help of authors such as MC Jain (and the like) who blend these Western (esoteric) concepts into traditional Vedic astrology. Over time people begin to accept these concepts as having their basis in Vedic astrology...this is NOT so! Obviously this corruption of traditional teachings is a sign of the times we live in. Purity per se is no longer deemed necessary, in fact it's considered undesirable in many instances. I've had many heated discussions with my husband recently regarding the purity of the food we eat today. Life is such that city dwellers, unable to grow their own fruit and vegetables, are unwittingly buying fruit saturated with alarmingly high levels of pesticides. The irradiation of grain, fruits and vegetables (for longer shelf life) means that our so-called fresh food can be more than a year old before we buy it...what to speak of the harm caused from the radiation itself. It's alarming how quickly purity (in all things) can be lost. We are what we eat; Well the world is very sick! Sadly, we see the same breakdown in traditional teachings, traditional morals etc, etc.. I personally have little power to turn the tide as far as society's values are concerned. However, I can continue to press the traditional dictums of vedic astrology as taught by Parashara. Members will be (or should be) aware that Jyotish-Vidya is, first and foremost, a " Parashara Discussion Group " . The authenticity of modern concepts, taken from Western astrology (whether tropicalists or siderialists) and propogated by so-called modern Hindu authors, will continue to be questioned here as long as the group remains. Thank You, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " jyotishi " <jyotishi <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:24 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Wendy, The message began with, " Dear All " and was addressing the issue about plagiarism which I had not raised, or am interested in. I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally? Anyway, my interest in this thread is over! MKuP Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear RR, ///Not sure I understand. Please explain .../// The subtle nuance behind humorous comments can sometimes convey sarcasm where none (perhaps) was intended. I do believe Elgio was quite sincere in his message of support and I understand completely the intention behind his words. Facetiousness is a characteristic of Mercury who revels in humour, as we well know. Unfortunately this can, all too easily, be misinterpreted as sarcasm... You alone know what you wished to convey with the following words? ///Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up?/// I'm intrigued now to see this Mercury that gives rise to such wit and, dare I say, facetiousness. Would you care to shed some light on this? ///But after reading the thought poems that I posted before I read this message!/// I enjoyed reading it :-) Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:55 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, Not sure I understand. Please explain ... But after reading the thought poems that I posted before I read this message! RR - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:42 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear RR, ///AND, what do I need to give up?/// Facetiousness might be a good start... Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:21 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Eligio, Absolutely not need to apologize! I would rather hear thoughts and feelings of my fellow human beings and be able to communicate with them like we two strangers have been able to in two or three messages here:-) Silence may be golden as some have said, but Silence can also be deadly as we have seen in recent times when pockets of cultures that did not communicate for one reason or another for decades have demonstrated to the world, in recent times! It is sad that they finally to chose to communicate through hatred and not conversation that include polite words, compassion, understanding and not aggression, attacks, judgments and misunderstandings that sadly we see even on spiritual and philosophical modern internet forums/fora! Namastay, Love and Light Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Sunday, February 03, 2008 12:22 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Understand, my apology to you, and the group RR <rohini_ranjan wrote: Eligio, You did not cause me any offense or pain! Your messages just felt like it may have made some feel excluded. Like the line in sand ...! I care about that possibility particularly in view of the second the more recent poem I posted recently. The scenario bothers me!! Love and Light! Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Sunday, February 03, 2008 12:06 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama My Dear Friend If you need help to find out what is it that your need to gave up, you are confused. If you need help to find out how to be included that is not need for such ridiculous statementi . " WE " as I wrote stands for the persons who believe and will support the ancient astrology, I don,t understand why? such offense i had caused to your person in trying to indicate the support without any equivocation for traditional astrology. RR <rohini_ranjan wrote: Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Wendy Vasicek <jyotishvidya wrote: Dear Manas, ///I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally?/// You're probably right and I, in my haste, jumped to a wrong conclusion. However the matter of plagiarism is less of an issue as is the source of the material... Isidore Kozminsky, I believe, was a well-known Melbourne (Australian) esotericist and jeweller reputed to have been involved with the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn - or one of its offshoots. Certainly he was not a vedic scholar... It should not be too difficult to trace the source of these esoteric concepts such as the nodes being " Karmic Control Planets " which is spreading like wildfire with the help of authors such as MC Jain (and the like) who blend these Western (esoteric) concepts into traditional Vedic astrology. Over time people begin to accept these concepts as having their basis in Vedic astrology...this is NOT so! Obviously this corruption of traditional teachings is a sign of the times we live in. Purity per se is no longer deemed necessary, in fact it's considered undesirable in many instances. I've had many heated discussions with my husband recently regarding the purity of the food we eat today. Life is such that city dwellers, unable to grow their own fruit and vegetables, are unwittingly buying fruit saturated with alarmingly high levels of pesticides. The irradiation of grain, fruits and vegetables (for longer shelf life) means that our so-called fresh food can be more than a year old before we buy it...what to speak of the harm caused from the radiation itself. It's alarming how quickly purity (in all things) can be lost. We are what we eat; Well the world is very sick! Sadly, we see the same breakdown in traditional teachings, traditional morals etc, etc.. I personally have little power to turn the tide as far as society's values are concerned. However, I can continue to press the traditional dictums of vedic astrology as taught by Parashara. Members will be (or should be) aware that Jyotish-Vidya is, first and foremost, a " Parashara Discussion Group " . The authenticity of modern concepts, taken from Western astrology (whether tropicalists or siderialists) and propogated by so-called modern Hindu authors, will continue to be questioned here as long as the group remains. Thank You, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " jyotishi " <jyotishi <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:24 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Wendy, The message began with, " Dear All " and was addressing the issue about plagiarism which I had not raised, or am interested in. I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally? Anyway, my interest in this thread is over! MKuP Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Wendy, I recently posted my bio at an editor's dogged insistence to go with an article that is under consideration of publication in a new magazine. Here is what I wrote: " Stimulating, Provocative, sarcastic, arrogant, humble, knowledgeable and heretic -- he has been called many more names!! " Please trust me, I was not being self-promoting when I wrote that because what is there to promote? Like all of you, I have always been very serious and sincere about Astrology (I prefer that INCLUSIVE term than jyotish or even more exclusive term Parashari or Jaimini or KP Jyotish! My writings in print and in silicon realities will vouch for my sincerity of nearly four+ decades. And yet my awareness and public acceptance of my open-mouthed awe expressed at the potential that Divination is capable of even without claiming mastery of it -- may be hastily judged as my innocense at which a mother or grandmother may smile at but not misinterpret it as facetiousness, I hope! If I may venture a diverse view -- a happy saturn must not be underestimated when it comes to judging contentment and mirth and that misunderstood sarcastic flair! Afterall, when libra rises (with saturn the yogakaraka) it is the mercury, lord of 12th that gets blamed and maybe it is the bhagya (9th ruled by mercury), but let us refrain from getting personal! After all both of us are professional! Namastey, Rohiniranjan - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Sunday, February 03, 2008 12:22 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear RR, ///Not sure I understand. Please explain .../// The subtle nuance behind humorous comments can sometimes convey sarcasm where none (perhaps) was intended. I do believe Elgio was quite sincere in his message of support and I understand completely the intention behind his words. Facetiousness is a characteristic of Mercury who revels in humour, as we well know. Unfortunately this can, all too easily, be misinterpreted as sarcasm... You alone know what you wished to convey with the following words? ///Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up?/// I'm intrigued now to see this Mercury that gives rise to such wit and, dare I say, facetiousness. Would you care to shed some light on this? ///But after reading the thought poems that I posted before I read this message!/// I enjoyed reading it :-) Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:55 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, Not sure I understand. Please explain ... But after reading the thought poems that I posted before I read this message! RR - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:42 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear RR, ///AND, what do I need to give up?/// Facetiousness might be a good start... Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:21 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 PS: Transit Mercury is currently in retrograde motion, suffering combustion and aspected by Mars... The potential for misunderstanding (rashness) in communications is certainly something we should all be aware of :-)) All, by the way, are inimically placed in transit chart...caution is certainly needed! _______ Dear RR, ///Not sure I understand. Please explain .../// The subtle nuance behind humorous comments can sometimes convey sarcasm where none (perhaps) was intended. I do believe Elgio was quite sincere in his message of support and I understand completely the intention behind his words. Facetiousness is a characteristic of Mercury who revels in humour, as we well know. Unfortunately this can, all too easily, be misinterpreted as sarcasm... You alone know what you wished to convey with the following words? ///Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up?/// I'm intrigued now to see this Mercury that gives rise to such wit and, dare I say, facetiousness. Would you care to shed some light on this? ///But after reading the thought poems that I posted before I read this message!/// I enjoyed reading it :-) Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:55 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, Not sure I understand. Please explain ... But after reading the thought poems that I posted before I read this message! RR - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:42 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear RR, ///AND, what do I need to give up?/// Facetiousness might be a good start... Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:21 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Namaste RR <rohini_ranjan wrote: Dear Eligio, Absolutely not need to apologize! I would rather hear thoughts and feelings of my fellow human beings and be able to communicate with them like we two strangers have been able to in two or three messages here:-) Silence may be golden as some have said, but Silence can also be deadly as we have seen in recent times when pockets of cultures that did not communicate for one reason or another for decades have demonstrated to the world, in recent times! It is sad that they finally to chose to communicate through hatred and not conversation that include polite words, compassion, understanding and not aggression, attacks, judgments and misunderstandings that sadly we see even on spiritual and philosophical modern internet forums/fora! Namastay, Love and Light Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Sunday, February 03, 2008 12:22 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Understand, my apology to you, and the group RR <rohini_ranjan wrote: Eligio, You did not cause me any offense or pain! Your messages just felt like it may have made some feel excluded. Like the line in sand ...! I care about that possibility particularly in view of the second the more recent poem I posted recently. The scenario bothers me!! Love and Light! Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Sunday, February 03, 2008 12:06 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama My Dear Friend If you need help to find out what is it that your need to gave up, you are confused. If you need help to find out how to be included that is not need for such ridiculous statementi . " WE " as I wrote stands for the persons who believe and will support the ancient astrology, I don,t understand why? such offense i had caused to your person in trying to indicate the support without any equivocation for traditional astrology. RR <rohini_ranjan wrote: Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Wendy Vasicek <jyotishvidya wrote: Dear Manas, ///I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally?/// You're probably right and I, in my haste, jumped to a wrong conclusion. However the matter of plagiarism is less of an issue as is the source of the material... Isidore Kozminsky, I believe, was a well-known Melbourne (Australian) esotericist and jeweller reputed to have been involved with the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn - or one of its offshoots. Certainly he was not a vedic scholar... It should not be too difficult to trace the source of these esoteric concepts such as the nodes being " Karmic Control Planets " which is spreading like wildfire with the help of authors such as MC Jain (and the like) who blend these Western (esoteric) concepts into traditional Vedic astrology. Over time people begin to accept these concepts as having their basis in Vedic astrology...this is NOT so! Obviously this corruption of traditional teachings is a sign of the times we live in. Purity per se is no longer deemed necessary, in fact it's considered undesirable in many instances. I've had many heated discussions with my husband recently regarding the purity of the food we eat today. Life is such that city dwellers, unable to grow their own fruit and vegetables, are unwittingly buying fruit saturated with alarmingly high levels of pesticides. The irradiation of grain, fruits and vegetables (for longer shelf life) means that our so-called fresh food can be more than a year old before we buy it...what to speak of the harm caused from the radiation itself. It's alarming how quickly purity (in all things) can be lost. We are what we eat; Well the world is very sick! Sadly, we see the same breakdown in traditional teachings, traditional morals etc, etc.. I personally have little power to turn the tide as far as society's values are concerned. However, I can continue to press the traditional dictums of vedic astrology as taught by Parashara. Members will be (or should be) aware that Jyotish-Vidya is, first and foremost, a " Parashara Discussion Group " . The authenticity of modern concepts, taken from Western astrology (whether tropicalists or siderialists) and propogated by so-called modern Hindu authors, will continue to be questioned here as long as the group remains. Thank You, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " jyotishi " <jyotishi <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:24 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Wendy, The message began with, " Dear All " and was addressing the issue about plagiarism which I had not raised, or am interested in. I do not understand why would that message be intended towards me personally? Anyway, my interest in this thread is over! MKuP Never miss a thing. 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Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Wendy, Saturn = Dry humour/humor! The bane <sigh> at times, even when Hermes was not looking back ...! As far as much touted (by some schools) retrogrades are concerned I offer the following, if I may: http://www.boloji.com/astro/00316.htm Thanks for the cautionary note, but has this repetitive *transit* influence the first occurance or has it presented earlier too, a few times, many times? That is an important consideration, a seasoned divinator like you must consider, I hope? Or am I not understanding your pronouncements and these kind warnings? RR - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Sunday, February 03, 2008 12:50 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama PS: Transit Mercury is currently in retrograde motion, suffering combustion and aspected by Mars... The potential for misunderstanding (rashness) in communications is certainly something we should all be aware of :-)) All, by the way, are inimically placed in transit chart...caution is certainly needed! _______ Dear RR, ///Not sure I understand. Please explain .../// The subtle nuance behind humorous comments can sometimes convey sarcasm where none (perhaps) was intended. I do believe Elgio was quite sincere in his message of support and I understand completely the intention behind his words. Facetiousness is a characteristic of Mercury who revels in humour, as we well know. Unfortunately this can, all too easily, be misinterpreted as sarcasm... You alone know what you wished to convey with the following words? ///Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up?/// I'm intrigued now to see this Mercury that gives rise to such wit and, dare I say, facetiousness. Would you care to shed some light on this? ///But after reading the thought poems that I posted before I read this message!/// I enjoyed reading it :-) Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:55 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, Not sure I understand. Please explain ... But after reading the thought poems that I posted before I read this message! RR - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:42 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear RR, ///AND, what do I need to give up?/// Facetiousness might be a good start... Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:21 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Elgio, Who is/can be included in this club of " WE? " Where do I line up for becoming a member? What do I need to do to be accepted? AND, what do I need to give up? Rohiniranjan - ELIGIO MARIN jyotish-vidya Saturday, February 02, 2008 11:12 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, , I know that I have not been very active with the group, I had been studying and trying to understand this science. I want you to know that I had read every mail since i become a member without been proactive. This time I want to speak up and support you in pro of ancient & traditional astrology. You are correct, you don't have the power to turn our present society values. But we can continue to be the vanguard like our ancestors had done before us. So Mote Be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear RR, ///but let us refrain from getting personal!/// You really need have no fear of that at all! I was simply curious to see the source of such humour...but I understand your need to maintain privacy. I have an affinity with Mercury (and Mars) that goes back to the days I was in residence at a Jesuit monastery whilst on a 10 day Maharishi jyotish course. I spent one amazing night, alone in my room, in the company of the grahas who paid me a visit. I know it probably sounds quite unbelievable (ridiculous even) but it was very real at the time. They were all there, crowded into my small room, but the two who eagerly made themselves known were Mercury and Mars. I was introduced to the humorous nature of Mercury that captured my attention throughout the night and I certainly felt the heat of Mars whenever he pushed his way to the front...I thought I had a fever, a dry fever, my skin even felt hot to the touch (although I felt quite well physically). When morning came and I had to go to class I expected to be too tired to concentrate, having (I believed) not slept a wink all night. But, to the contrary, I was vibrant with energy, physically and intellectually. Of course, the question begs to be asked; Was it real or was I dreaming? I really don't know, but certainly it was very real to me... So, yes! I feel I have this affinity with Mercury I love to see him in the charts of those who seem to express his qualities of wit and humour in abundance :-)) Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:45 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, I recently posted my bio at an editor's dogged insistence to go with an article that is under consideration of publication in a new magazine. Here is what I wrote: " Stimulating, Provocative, sarcastic, arrogant, humble, knowledgeable and heretic -- he has been called many more names!! " Please trust me, I was not being self-promoting when I wrote that because what is there to promote? Like all of you, I have always been very serious and sincere about Astrology (I prefer that INCLUSIVE term than jyotish or even more exclusive term Parashari or Jaimini or KP Jyotish! My writings in print and in silicon realities will vouch for my sincerity of nearly four+ decades. And yet my awareness and public acceptance of my open-mouthed awe expressed at the potential that Divination is capable of even without claiming mastery of it -- may be hastily judged as my innocense at which a mother or grandmother may smile at but not misinterpret it as facetiousness, I hope! If I may venture a diverse view -- a happy saturn must not be underestimated when it comes to judging contentment and mirth and that misunderstood sarcastic flair! Afterall, when libra rises (with saturn the yogakaraka) it is the mercury, lord of 12th that gets blamed and maybe it is the bhagya (9th ruled by mercury), but let us refrain from getting personal! After all both of us are professional! Namastey, Rohiniranjan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear RR, ///Thanks for the cautionary note, but has this repetitive *transit* influence the first occurance or has it presented earlier too, a few times, many times?/// Of course, for those undergoing dasas of Mercury, unfavourable transits will no doubt be felt... ///As far as much touted (by some schools) retrogrades are concerned I offer the following, if I may:/// I have saved the article to my desktop and will settle down to read it as soon as I can find a few spare minutes :-) Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 3:06 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, Saturn = Dry humour/humor! The bane <sigh> at times, even when Hermes was not looking back ...! As far as much touted (by some schools) retrogrades are concerned I offer the following, if I may: http://www.boloji.com/astro/00316.htm Thanks for the cautionary note, but has this repetitive *transit* influence the first occurance or has it presented earlier too, a few times, many times? That is an important consideration, a seasoned divinator like you must consider, I hope? Or am I not understanding your pronouncements and these kind warnings? RR - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Sunday, February 03, 2008 12:50 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama PS: Transit Mercury is currently in retrograde motion, suffering combustion and aspected by Mars... The potential for misunderstanding (rashness) in communications is certainly something we should all be aware of :-)) All, by the way, are inimically placed in transit chart...caution is certainly needed! _______ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2008 Report Share Posted February 2, 2008 Dear Wendy, What a wonderful sharing! Thank you very much indeed!! I have never really experienced anything similar, given my reality... There was that time when I had to paint my newly installed fence before the Canadian Winter made it impossible to do (take this from a brother who has just sustained 30+ centimetres of SNOW and cleared up Ma's Blessing (?) (while you are probably enjoying summer down there!) and before I catch a few winks before going out and clearing the rest again come tomorrow! I always hated painting fences -- pretty much like Mark Twain (Sammy Clements)'s Tom Sawyer -- but I had no one to delegate it to back in 1994 so there I was, me and the fence and the cans of wood stain! After the first gallon (of STAIN!), suddenly I gave in and began to forget the chore and all the angst and pain it had caused me during the preceding hour! Suddenly -- the pain and angst and restlessness vanished, completely! The wasp buzzing scaringly around me suddenly stopped annoying me and turned into a friend and companion who was not there to sting or hurt or threaten or challenge me but just to give me company -- to just say and affirm that what I was doing was the right thing to do and the Universe was with me all the way! I had my doubts, given my background! But it could not have been the *fumes* because the stain was labelled NON TOXIC and had low VOC content };-) I learned a lot that day, spiritually -- while I was doing something useful and commonplace, namely painting my fence! To each his or her own!! Rohiniranjan <<MA GIVE ME eyes to see, a mind to understand what the eyes see, and a heart to keep the eyes and mind alive and engaged in serving YOU FOREVER.>> - Wendy Vasicek jyotish-vidya Sunday, February 03, 2008 1:24 AM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear RR, ///but let us refrain from getting personal!/// You really need have no fear of that at all! I was simply curious to see the source of such humour...but I understand your need to maintain privacy. I have an affinity with Mercury (and Mars) that goes back to the days I was in residence at a Jesuit monastery whilst on a 10 day Maharishi jyotish course. I spent one amazing night, alone in my room, in the company of the grahas who paid me a visit. I know it probably sounds quite unbelievable (ridiculous even) but it was very real at the time. They were all there, crowded into my small room, but the two who eagerly made themselves known were Mercury and Mars. I was introduced to the humorous nature of Mercury that captured my attention throughout the night and I certainly felt the heat of Mars whenever he pushed his way to the front...I thought I had a fever, a dry fever, my skin even felt hot to the touch (although I felt quite well physically). When morning came and I had to go to class I expected to be too tired to concentrate, having (I believed) not slept a wink all night. But, to the contrary, I was vibrant with energy, physically and intellectually. Of course, the question begs to be asked; Was it real or was I dreaming? I really don't know, but certainly it was very real to me... So, yes! I feel I have this affinity with Mercury I love to see him in the charts of those who seem to express his qualities of wit and humour in abundance :-)) Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:45 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, I recently posted my bio at an editor's dogged insistence to go with an article that is under consideration of publication in a new magazine. Here is what I wrote: " Stimulating, Provocative, sarcastic, arrogant, humble, knowledgeable and heretic -- he has been called many more names!! " Please trust me, I was not being self-promoting when I wrote that because what is there to promote? Like all of you, I have always been very serious and sincere about Astrology (I prefer that INCLUSIVE term than jyotish or even more exclusive term Parashari or Jaimini or KP Jyotish! My writings in print and in silicon realities will vouch for my sincerity of nearly four+ decades. And yet my awareness and public acceptance of my open-mouthed awe expressed at the potential that Divination is capable of even without claiming mastery of it -- may be hastily judged as my innocense at which a mother or grandmother may smile at but not misinterpret it as facetiousness, I hope! If I may venture a diverse view -- a happy saturn must not be underestimated when it comes to judging contentment and mirth and that misunderstood sarcastic flair! Afterall, when libra rises (with saturn the yogakaraka) it is the mercury, lord of 12th that gets blamed and maybe it is the bhagya (9th ruled by mercury), but let us refrain from getting personal! After all both of us are professional! Namastey, Rohiniranjan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 3, 2008 Report Share Posted February 3, 2008 Dear Rohini, ///Suddenly -- the pain and angst and restlessness vanished, completely! The wasp buzzing scaringly around me suddenly stopped annoying me and turned into a friend and companion who was not there to sting or hurt or threaten or challenge me but just to give me company -- to just say and affirm that what I was doing was the right thing to do and the Universe was with me all the way!/// A lovely experience! We're certainly blessed when, even for a brief time, we experience such incredible 'Support of Nature'. According to the teachings of Maharishi, 9th house holds this portfolio...support of nature, natural law, solutions to problems, good-fortune, vedas, remedies, guru etc, etc.. Certainly it's our good-fortune to experience Guru in nature...even in the form of a wasp:-)) Your story reminds me of one told by ShantiMayi. She was talking to a group about what it means to be close to nature. She shared a lovely story about a little bird that came to her door one morning whilst she was in deep meditation. The bird said; " I will help you and I'll have all my friends help you to reach every being " . He told her that whoever hears his song will be blessed. Of course, since hearing that story, hearing the song of a bird brings a smile and a silent, 'Thank You'. Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com jyotish-vidya ___ - " RR " <rohini_ranjan <jyotish-vidya > Sunday, February 03, 2008 3:47 PM Re: Fw: Final Dispositor in Vargottama Dear Wendy, What a wonderful sharing! Thank you very much indeed!! I have never really experienced anything similar, given my reality... There was that time when I had to paint my newly installed fence before the Canadian Winter made it impossible to do (take this from a brother who has just sustained 30+ centimetres of SNOW and cleared up Ma's Blessing (?) (while you are probably enjoying summer down there!) and before I catch a few winks before going out and clearing the rest again come tomorrow! I always hated painting fences -- pretty much like Mark Twain (Sammy Clements)'s Tom Sawyer -- but I had no one to delegate it to back in 1994 so there I was, me and the fence and the cans of wood stain! After the first gallon (of STAIN!), suddenly I gave in and began to forget the chore and all the angst and pain it had caused me during the preceding hour! Suddenly -- the pain and angst and restlessness vanished, completely! The wasp buzzing scaringly around me suddenly stopped annoying me and turned into a friend and companion who was not there to sting or hurt or threaten or challenge me but just to give me company -- to just say and affirm that what I was doing was the right thing to do and the Universe was with me all the way! I had my doubts, given my background! But it could not have been the *fumes* because the stain was labelled NON TOXIC and had low VOC content };-) I learned a lot that day, spiritually -- while I was doing something useful and commonplace, namely painting my fence! To each his or her own!! Rohiniranjan <<MA GIVE ME eyes to see, a mind to understand what the eyes see, and a heart to keep the eyes and mind alive and engaged in serving YOU FOREVER.>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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