RE: Marriage, Dharma and more - Sri Prafulla

[Guest guest]

Dear Bharat ji and Shri Chandrasekhar ji,

 

Many thanks for your wonderful posts.

 

Yes - my mail was just a perspective - which author shared. and Yes - her

interpretation does not answer Shri Bharat's query.

 

In some formk or other - marriage does indicate karmic bandhan with spouse; so

if spouse dies early (or say when she dies) - will it indicate the termination

of karmic bandhan (mutual between husband / wife) of past lives. But in female

nativity - mangalya is seen from 8th house.

 

regards / Prafulla Gang

http://www.prafulla.net

 

Diplomacy - n. the patriotic act of lying for one's country / community.

************************************************

 

 

>

> astrologyhindu

> Fri, 20 Jul 2007 15:24:52 +0530

>

> Marriage, Dharma and more - Sri Prafulla

>

> Namaste Prafullaji

>

> The view that you have suggested is a more modern view. Perhaps it is

> shedding light on the happenings in today's world. When I try to take a

> view, I depend upon the Upanishads for the same. Jyotish as a subject,

> being

> a Vedanga, has to be in line with the Upanishadic teaching. Therefore, a

> traditional view holds much more importance for me. It helps me see a

> chart

> from that perspective.

>

> The main role of marriage is to identify with an another. This breaks the

> egocentric view and nurtures acceptance. That is why family (first

> identification) and wife and her family (2nd identification) are very

> important steps in one's life in the spiritual journey. The Vedas give

> great

> significance to the human birth. It is a celebration. It is a god gift to

> overcome ignorance and be free from all assumed bindings. They view each

> and

> every ashrama of life in that manner. Similarly, when 7th house is viewed

> as

> a house of identification, it makes sense to me. Malefics will not let

> you

> identify and instead become very controlling as if in a master-slave

> relationship. While viewing the 7th house, it is also better to look at

> 9th

> house. This will show whether or not that person understands the dharma.

> If

> the 9th house and 9th lord are afflicted, we would have a genuine major

> problem at hand as regards marriage, especially if 7th is afflicted too.

> Generally, when I come across such a combination, I check the other two

> trikona sthanas and see if the person gets some support.

>

> So the principle of Dharma-Artha-Kama becomes relevant. The principle

> states

> that Artha and Kama are to be pursued keeping Dharma in mind. By

> following

> Dharma, one becomes free of likes and dislikes and is able to perform

> karma

> that burns it and does not create fresh karma. This brings forth a

> meditative mind fit for knowledge and mukumshatvam. It is for this

> reason,

> in our four purusharthas Dharma comes first and foremost. It is to

> reaffirm

> its importance. The same principle when applied to Jyotish, can help us

> check clearly, whether a problem is with pursuing kama with right means

> or

> wrong means.

>

> When we talk of modern happenings, we are referring to an experience. An

> experience is defined as subject-object relationship. The subject is

> oneself. Each subject has a different level of knowledge and hence a

> different interpretation of the same happening. Therefore, the experience

> depends upon the knowledge of the subject. If two subjects, husband and

> wife, are experiencing some problems in marriage, check their thinking

> and

> maturity. How are they interpreting their happenings? This is how every

> graha is responsible directly or indirectly to the happenings of the 7th

> house. Again, we get the subject-object knowledge from the Vedas and can

> apply it to Jyotish.

>

> I did read Sri Mridula Trivedi's comments in one of her books, but, did

> not

> agree to it. It is more of a " populist " statement rather than a deep

> thought-out reply to someone's question. I hope you understand what I

> mean.

>

> Coming back to our topic, if we take the principles of Chakra from

> Tantra,

> we can very quickly check the diseases that can afflict a

> person. Traditional views, in my view, open avenues for research,

> rethinking

> and loads of knowledge.

>

> Thanks and Regards

> Bharat

>

>

> On 7/20/07, Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote:

>>

>> Dear Bharat ji and Chandrasekhar ji,

>>

>> Though Parashar has rferred 7th house for marriage, but Uttarkalammrit

>> has hinted 7th house to0 decide construction and sensitivity of his

>> sexual organs.

>>

>> Mridula Trivedi has once gave an interesting view on 7th house as

>> marriage house:

>>

>> marriage has strong relationship with social discipline born out of an

>> individual need for companionship and love and the urge to procreate.

>> It is the middle house in horoscope sandwitched between house of enemy

>> and death. After marriage, native enters into another realm of life. A

>> host of factors compel him to view his life from different

>> perspective. The family must be protected, nurtured, flourished and

>> saved from a host of enemies (so man has to gear up to a defensive

>> posture for social, economic and external factors). Ans he has to keep

>> his stance up throughout his life and is liberated only after his death.

>>

>> if one looks at swyamwar marriage, king has to fight with enemies to

>> get his bride; and failure might mean his death.

>>

>> regards / Prafulla

>>

>> <%40>,

>> Chandrashekhar

>> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>>>

>>> Dear Bharat,

>>>

>>> There is no authority which has explained why this is so. However as

>> you

>>> asked me to throw some light on this, I shall give my opinion on why

>>> this is so.

>>>

>>> Marriage in true hindu sense is when two individual not only marry but

>>> get transformed into each other's image. That is why lagna and 7th

>> bhava

>>> are opposite each other and though opposing they are complimentary. So

>>> after marriage the groom gives up some of his likes and dislikes and so

>>> does the bride. They also accept each other's traits. That is when they

>>> merge. Once the merger takes place the marriage is complete in real

>>> sense. We see that occupants of both the bhavas aspect each other by

>>> full 7th house aspect and thus are capable of mutual influence. having

>>> merged, it becomes necessary to find the initiation of rasi dasha by

>>> finding out which is the stronger of the two bhavas as both become

>>> material but the one that has changed the least will be the guiding

>>> light for events to unfold in future.

>>>

>>> These are my personal views on the subject and others could view it

>> in a

>>> different manner.

>>>

>>> Take care,

>>> Chandrashekhar.

>>>

>>>

>>>

>>> Bharat - Hindu Astrology wrote:

>>>>

>>>> Namaste Sri Chandrashekharji

>>>>

>>>> Can you please expand upon it and give me a deeper understanding?

>>>>

>>>> Thanks and Regards

>>>> Bharat

>>>>

>>>> On 7/18/07, Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46

>>>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote:

>>>>>

>>>>> Dear Bharat,

>>>>>

>>>>> You may also like to think about the fact that in rasi dashas, the

>>>>> stronger between the Lagna and the 7th bhava is considered to

>> give the

>>>>> first dasha. So they do represent each other as do two partners in

>>>>> marriage.

>>>>>

>>>>> regards,

>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

>>>>>

>>>>> Bharat - Hindu Astrology wrote:

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Namaste Sri Chandrashekharji

>>>>>>

>>>>>> True, I misread his email.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> 7th house interpretation bugged me for a long time : Why would

>> Rishis

>>>>>> call the house of marriage also as the house of markesh. One

>> day this

>>>>> came

>>>>>> as a thought to me, which made sense.

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Thanks and Regards

>>>>>> Bharat

>>>>>>

>>>>>> On 7/18/07, Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46

>>>>

>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk><chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>

>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote:

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Dear Bharat,

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I think Venkatachala asked, in the original thread, what

>> constitutes

>>>>>>> marriage in astrology in the modern days. I do not remember he

>>>> writing

>>>>>>> about how marriage should be lived, or if he did then that

>> question

>>>>>>> should go to the Dharma shastra lists if any.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Your point of the reason for 7th being marakesha and also

>> bhava of

>>>>>>> spouse is an interesting interpretation.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> Bharat - Hindu Astrology wrote:

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Namaste Sri Chandrashekharji and Sri Venkatachalaji

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> The role of marriage is to expand from the lower I thinking

>>>>> (egoistic,

>>>>>>>> individualistic and selfish thinking) to a slightly bigger I

>>>>> (wherein

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>> " I " encompasses both the person and his/her spouse). The

>>>>>>>> identification with

>>>>>>>> another breaks the singular individuality into a slightly

>> larger

>>>>>>>> " duality " .

>>>>>>>> The purpose of a human life is to understand the whole as

>> true

>>>> " I " .

>>>>>>>> Marriage

>>>>>>>> becomes a very important step in the same. I agree with Sri

>>>>>>>> Venkatachalaji's

>>>>>>>> thinking that the marriage needs to " lived " successfully

>> to be

>>>> known

>>>>>>>> so. It

>>>>>>>> is this that would serve the true purpose of a marriage.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Perhaps, because of its killing of " individuality " nature,

>> it is

>>>>> given

>>>>>>> the

>>>>>>>> same house as is the markesh.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Just the desire to have a long marriage would not suffice for

>>>>> marriage

>>>>>>> if

>>>>>>>> one does not renounce one's likes and dislikes and follow what

>>>>>> needs to

>>>>>>> be

>>>>>>>> done and what needs to be accepted OR does not perform actions

>>>>>>> supporting

>>>>>>>> one's desires. Maybe we can alter by saying - That the

>> desire is

>>>>> there

>>>>>>> and

>>>>>>>> the understanding of the necessity of action and acceptance,

>>>>> wherever

>>>>>>>> required.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> I may be wrong too

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Thanks and Regards

>>>>>>>> Bharat

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> On 7/18/07, Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46

>>>>

>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk><chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>

>>>>>>

>>>>

>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk><chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>

>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote:

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Dear Venkatachala Pathi,

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I am younger than you and if my response pleases you it is

>>>> my good

>>>>>>>>> fortune. I am yet a student of this divine science and

>> hope to

>>>>>> remain

>>>>>>> so

>>>>>>>>> till the end of my life.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I have replied, in the way that I did, for a very specific

>>>> reason.

>>>>>>> Your

>>>>>>>>> query was about how to look at marriage as understood by

>> Vedic

>>>>>>> scholars

>>>>>>>>> with reference to the present day scenario, or words to that

>>>>> effect.

>>>>>>> And

>>>>>>>>> then though Kanyaa is given in Dana the Putra is not and

>> both do

>>>>> get

>>>>>>>>> married. So I think the loss and gain part may not be

>>>> universally

>>>>>>>>> applicable.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Then how to relate this to the modern trend of live-in

>> partners

>>>>> and

>>>>>>> same

>>>>>>>>> sex marriages? The last two of the variety of them can not

>>>> begin a

>>>>>>>>> Kutumba at all. And then there are casual relationships

>> that are

>>>>>> based

>>>>>>>>> on income to one and loss to other. So I would not think

>>>>>> that2nd, 11th

>>>>>>>>> and 7th need necessarily have to be involved in

>> marriages in the

>>>>>>> modern

>>>>>>>>> reference.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> As you say, the marriage begins when they live together, no

>>>> doubt

>>>>>>> about

>>>>>>>>> that. But then the question is whether we consider a

>>>> marriage that

>>>>>>>>> breaks within a week or a day as a marriage or an affair?

>>>> This is

>>>>> so

>>>>>>>>> because in modern days some may live for some days together

>>>>>> purely on

>>>>>>>>> financial consideration and with no intention of getting

>>>> married.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> That is why, I think the necessary element is the desire to

>>>>>> spend life

>>>>>>>>> together has to be there at the time of marriage of living

>>>>> together,

>>>>>>> for

>>>>>>>>> that to be considered as a marriage.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> I think this definition is more appropriate as the

>> jataka and

>>>>> Spouse

>>>>>>> are

>>>>>>>>> in 1 and 7 bhava and these two bhava cause a sort of

>> merger or

>>>>>>> exchange

>>>>>>>>> of habits over a sufficiently long period spent

>> together. So the

>>>>>>> husband

>>>>>>>>> gives up some of his dislikes and likes and accepts

>> those of the

>>>>>> wife

>>>>>>>>> and vice-a-versa. The lagna is the bhava of birth which

>> is the

>>>>> state

>>>>>>>>> after death and the 7th is the Maraka sthana so

>> equivalent of

>>>>> death,

>>>>>>>>> which leads to beginning of the process of birth. Or if the

>>>>>>> terminology

>>>>>>>>> is too harsh, lagna is the rise of Sun, that has to set at

>>>> the 7th

>>>>>>> bhava

>>>>>>>>> and the 7th bhava is the setting of Sun that has to rise

>> in the

>>>>>> Lagna.

>>>>>>>>> So the bhavas have to merge and so do the parties to the

>>>> marriage.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> So in the example provided by you, if the person did not

>>>> have any

>>>>>>>>> intention to remain with his partner for life, I would

>> not treat

>>>>>> that

>>>>>>> as

>>>>>>>>> marriage, but an affair. Some astrologers prefer to look at

>>>>> affairs

>>>>>>> from

>>>>>>>>> A7 and spouse from UL. I think they are right.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Of course these are my personal views and I could be wrong.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Regards,

>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> venkatachala pathi wrote:

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Mr. Chandrasekarji,

>>>>>>>>>> Sir,

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> This is a great day in my 78 years of age to have a

>>>> message from

>>>>> a

>>>>>>>>>> great astrologer like you.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Your reply is 'partially' correct. While in Vedic

>>>> Astrology, the

>>>>>>> term

>>>>>>>>>> 'marriage' is the 'Union " of two people of opposite

>> sex to be

>>>>>>> traced.

>>>>>>>>>> (now a days we also have to look into variety of 'unions'

>>>>>> crept into

>>>>>>>>>> modern society - and, is it possible to find in Vedic

>>>> Astrology

>>>>> of

>>>>>>>>>> these strange 'unions'?). this is referred to by one

>> of us as

>>>>>>> 'Kannika

>>>>>>>>>> Dhan'.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> 'Dhan' itself is loss ( or moving away from ones

>> ownership) to

>>>>> one

>>>>>>> and

>>>>>>>>>> gain to other. That is the reason along with 2nd house

>>>> (Kudumba)

>>>>> +

>>>>>>> 7th

>>>>>>>>>> House (Partnership) and 11 house the house of gain is

>>>> 'largely'

>>>>>>>>>> considered. But that DOES NOT COMPLETE THE MARRIAGE.

>>>>>>>>>> The 'marriage' is complete only when they 'live' together,

>>>>> 'unite'

>>>>>>>>>> together' and 'progress' together. So the ceremony of

>>>>>> 'marriage' and

>>>>>>>>>> in any religion it is a formal declaration and not

>> 'complete'

>>>>>> in all

>>>>>>>>>> respects as quoted above.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> My request is if these three segments are necessary to

>>>>>> 'complete' a

>>>>>>>>>> marriage, how you find these together to happen on the

>> given

>>>>>> time in

>>>>>>> a

>>>>>>>>>> horoscope, and what are the contributions by position, by

>>>>>> portfolio,

>>>>>>>>>> and by inter relationship among Planets, Star Zone etc in

>>>>>>> combination

>>>>>>>>>> as reached in DP,BP,SP,ASP to arrive at it?

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> This is because, one male involved in one segment of three

>>>>> listed

>>>>>>>>>> above and claimed that he is not married. I explained his

>>>>>> period of

>>>>>>>>>> involvement and the troubles he will experience (which

>> has

>>>> been

>>>>>>> proved

>>>>>>>>>> beyond any iota of doubt) in last 1 year 2 months. His

>> parent

>>>>>>> (unaware

>>>>>>>>>> of this) is planning for his marriage. In my parlance his

>>>>>> 'marriage'

>>>>>>>>>> or 'marriages' are over (and one segment of said

>>>> 'marriage' will

>>>>>>> have

>>>>>>>>>> to continue) and only the spouse could not be 'fixed',

>> and the

>>>>>>> result

>>>>>>>>>> of the (2nd house portfolio) could not be fulfilled.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> So, I am greatly involved in further deductions to him,

>>>> and look

>>>>>>>>>> forward to all in this forum to help me how further

>> this could

>>>>> be

>>>>>>>>>> analyzed. (I think the details of horoscope is not

>>>> necessary, as

>>>>>>> this

>>>>>>>>>> a 'generalized' analysis). I will take this thereon

>> from your

>>>>>> guide

>>>>>>>>> lines.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Sorry to take your precious time, and your advise will

>> be of

>>>>> great

>>>>>>>>>> help to all in this.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Regards,

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Pathi

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> A.V.Pathi,

>>>>>>>>>> Hindu Vedic Astrologer,

>>>>>>>>>> 103, Black Tie Lane, Chapal Hill,

>>>>>>>>>> NC 27514.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Presently at Chennai India

>>>>>>>>>> Ph 044-23710500

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>> Park yourself in front of a world of choices in

>> alternative

>>>>>>> vehicles.

>>>>>>>>>> Visit the Auto Green Center.

>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Prafulla,

 

Do not forget that Saubhagya of a lady is seen from the 7th as is

Mangalya seen from the 8th.

 

Chandrashekhar.

 

Prafulla Gang wrote:

>

> Dear Bharat ji and Shri Chandrasekhar ji,

>

> Many thanks for your wonderful posts.

>

> Yes - my mail was just a perspective - which author shared. and Yes -

> her interpretation does not answer Shri Bharat's query.

>

> In some formk or other - marriage does indicate karmic bandhan with

> spouse; so if spouse dies early (or say when she dies) - will it

> indicate the termination of karmic bandhan (mutual between husband /

> wife) of past lives. But in female nativity - mangalya is seen from

> 8th house.

>

> regards / Prafulla Gang

> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>

>

> Diplomacy - n. the patriotic act of lying for one's country / community.

> ************************************************

>

> >

> > astrologyhindu <astrologyhindu%40gmail.com>

> > Fri, 20 Jul 2007 15:24:52 +0530

> > <%40>

> > Marriage, Dharma and more - Sri Prafulla

> >

> > Namaste Prafullaji

> >

> > The view that you have suggested is a more modern view. Perhaps it is

> > shedding light on the happenings in today's world. When I try to take a

> > view, I depend upon the Upanishads for the same. Jyotish as a subject,

> > being

> > a Vedanga, has to be in line with the Upanishadic teaching. Therefore, a

> > traditional view holds much more importance for me. It helps me see a

> > chart

> > from that perspective.

> >

> > The main role of marriage is to identify with an another. This

> breaks the

> > egocentric view and nurtures acceptance. That is why family (first

> > identification) and wife and her family (2nd identification) are very

> > important steps in one's life in the spiritual journey. The Vedas give

> > great

> > significance to the human birth. It is a celebration. It is a god

> gift to

> > overcome ignorance and be free from all assumed bindings. They view each

> > and

> > every ashrama of life in that manner. Similarly, when 7th house is

> viewed

> > as

> > a house of identification, it makes sense to me. Malefics will not let

> > you

> > identify and instead become very controlling as if in a master-slave

> > relationship. While viewing the 7th house, it is also better to look at

> > 9th

> > house. This will show whether or not that person understands the dharma.

> > If

> > the 9th house and 9th lord are afflicted, we would have a genuine major

> > problem at hand as regards marriage, especially if 7th is afflicted too.

> > Generally, when I come across such a combination, I check the other two

> > trikona sthanas and see if the person gets some support.

> >

> > So the principle of Dharma-Artha-Kama becomes relevant. The principle

> > states

> > that Artha and Kama are to be pursued keeping Dharma in mind. By

> > following

> > Dharma, one becomes free of likes and dislikes and is able to perform

> > karma

> > that burns it and does not create fresh karma. This brings forth a

> > meditative mind fit for knowledge and mukumshatvam. It is for this

> > reason,

> > in our four purusharthas Dharma comes first and foremost. It is to

> > reaffirm

> > its importance. The same principle when applied to Jyotish, can help us

> > check clearly, whether a problem is with pursuing kama with right means

> > or

> > wrong means.

> >

> > When we talk of modern happenings, we are referring to an experience. An

> > experience is defined as subject-object relationship. The subject is

> > oneself. Each subject has a different level of knowledge and hence a

> > different interpretation of the same happening. Therefore, the

> experience

> > depends upon the knowledge of the subject. If two subjects, husband and

> > wife, are experiencing some problems in marriage, check their thinking

> > and

> > maturity. How are they interpreting their happenings? This is how every

> > graha is responsible directly or indirectly to the happenings of the 7th

> > house. Again, we get the subject-object knowledge from the Vedas and can

> > apply it to Jyotish.

> >

> > I did read Sri Mridula Trivedi's comments in one of her books, but, did

> > not

> > agree to it. It is more of a " populist " statement rather than a deep

> > thought-out reply to someone's question. I hope you understand what I

> > mean.

> >

> > Coming back to our topic, if we take the principles of Chakra from

> > Tantra,

> > we can very quickly check the diseases that can afflict a

> > person. Traditional views, in my view, open avenues for research,

> > rethinking

> > and loads of knowledge.

> >

> > Thanks and Regards

> > Bharat

> >

> >

> > On 7/20/07, Prafulla Gang <jyotish

> <jyotish%40inbox.com>> wrote:

> >>

> >> Dear Bharat ji and Chandrasekhar ji,

> >>

> >> Though Parashar has rferred 7th house for marriage, but Uttarkalammrit

> >> has hinted 7th house to0 decide construction and sensitivity of his

> >> sexual organs.

> >>

> >> Mridula Trivedi has once gave an interesting view on 7th house as

> >> marriage house:

> >>

> >> marriage has strong relationship with social discipline born out of an

> >> individual need for companionship and love and the urge to procreate.

> >> It is the middle house in horoscope sandwitched between house of enemy

> >> and death. After marriage, native enters into another realm of life. A

> >> host of factors compel him to view his life from different

> >> perspective. The family must be protected, nurtured, flourished and

> >> saved from a host of enemies (so man has to gear up to a defensive

> >> posture for social, economic and external factors). Ans he has to keep

> >> his stance up throughout his life and is liberated only after his

> death.

> >>

> >> if one looks at swyamwar marriage, king has to fight with enemies to

> >> get his bride; and failure might mean his death.

> >>

> >> regards / Prafulla

> >>

> >>

> <%40> <%40>,

> >> Chandrashekhar

> >> <chandrashekhar46 wrote:

> >>>

> >>> Dear Bharat,

> >>>

> >>> There is no authority which has explained why this is so. However as

> >> you

> >>> asked me to throw some light on this, I shall give my opinion on why

> >>> this is so.

> >>>

> >>> Marriage in true hindu sense is when two individual not only marry but

> >>> get transformed into each other's image. That is why lagna and 7th

> >> bhava

> >>> are opposite each other and though opposing they are complimentary. So

> >>> after marriage the groom gives up some of his likes and dislikes

> and so

> >>> does the bride. They also accept each other's traits. That is when

> they

> >>> merge. Once the merger takes place the marriage is complete in real

> >>> sense. We see that occupants of both the bhavas aspect each other by

> >>> full 7th house aspect and thus are capable of mutual influence. having

> >>> merged, it becomes necessary to find the initiation of rasi dasha by

> >>> finding out which is the stronger of the two bhavas as both become

> >>> material but the one that has changed the least will be the guiding

> >>> light for events to unfold in future.

> >>>

> >>> These are my personal views on the subject and others could view it

> >> in a

> >>> different manner.

> >>>

> >>> Take care,

> >>> Chandrashekhar.

> >>>

> >>>

> >>>

> >>> Bharat - Hindu Astrology wrote:

> >>>>

> >>>> Namaste Sri Chandrashekharji

> >>>>

> >>>> Can you please expand upon it and give me a deeper understanding?

> >>>>

> >>>> Thanks and Regards

> >>>> Bharat

> >>>>

> >>>> On 7/18/07, Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46

> >>>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote:

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Dear Bharat,

> >>>>>

> >>>>> You may also like to think about the fact that in rasi dashas, the

> >>>>> stronger between the Lagna and the 7th bhava is considered to

> >> give the

> >>>>> first dasha. So they do represent each other as do two partners in

> >>>>> marriage.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> regards,

> >>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> >>>>>

> >>>>> Bharat - Hindu Astrology wrote:

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Namaste Sri Chandrashekharji

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> True, I misread his email.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> 7th house interpretation bugged me for a long time : Why would

> >> Rishis

> >>>>>> call the house of marriage also as the house of markesh. One

> >> day this

> >>>>> came

> >>>>>> as a thought to me, which made sense.

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> Thanks and Regards

> >>>>>> Bharat

> >>>>>>

> >>>>>> On 7/18/07, Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46

> >>>>

> >> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk><chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>

> >>>>>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote:

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Dear Bharat,

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> I think Venkatachala asked, in the original thread, what

> >> constitutes

> >>>>>>> marriage in astrology in the modern days. I do not remember he

> >>>> writing

> >>>>>>> about how marriage should be lived, or if he did then that

> >> question

> >>>>>>> should go to the Dharma shastra lists if any.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Your point of the reason for 7th being marakesha and also

> >> bhava of

> >>>>>>> spouse is an interesting interpretation.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> >>>>>>>

> >>>>>>> Bharat - Hindu Astrology wrote:

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Namaste Sri Chandrashekharji and Sri Venkatachalaji

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> The role of marriage is to expand from the lower I thinking

> >>>>> (egoistic,

> >>>>>>>> individualistic and selfish thinking) to a slightly bigger I

> >>>>> (wherein

> >>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>>> " I " encompasses both the person and his/her spouse). The

> >>>>>>>> identification with

> >>>>>>>> another breaks the singular individuality into a slightly

> >> larger

> >>>>>>>> " duality " .

> >>>>>>>> The purpose of a human life is to understand the whole as

> >> true

> >>>> " I " .

> >>>>>>>> Marriage

> >>>>>>>> becomes a very important step in the same. I agree with Sri

> >>>>>>>> Venkatachalaji's

> >>>>>>>> thinking that the marriage needs to " lived " successfully

> >> to be

> >>>> known

> >>>>>>>> so. It

> >>>>>>>> is this that would serve the true purpose of a marriage.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Perhaps, because of its killing of " individuality " nature,

> >> it is

> >>>>> given

> >>>>>>> the

> >>>>>>>> same house as is the markesh.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Just the desire to have a long marriage would not suffice for

> >>>>> marriage

> >>>>>>> if

> >>>>>>>> one does not renounce one's likes and dislikes and follow what

> >>>>>> needs to

> >>>>>>> be

> >>>>>>>> done and what needs to be accepted OR does not perform actions

> >>>>>>> supporting

> >>>>>>>> one's desires. Maybe we can alter by saying - That the

> >> desire is

> >>>>> there

> >>>>>>> and

> >>>>>>>> the understanding of the necessity of action and acceptance,

> >>>>> wherever

> >>>>>>>> required.

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> I may be wrong too

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> Thanks and Regards

> >>>>>>>> Bharat

> >>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>> On 7/18/07, Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46

> >>>>

> >> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk><chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>

> >>>>>>

> >>>>

> >> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk><chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>

> >>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote:

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Dear Venkatachala Pathi,

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> I am younger than you and if my response pleases you it is

> >>>> my good

> >>>>>>>>> fortune. I am yet a student of this divine science and

> >> hope to

> >>>>>> remain

> >>>>>>> so

> >>>>>>>>> till the end of my life.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> I have replied, in the way that I did, for a very specific

> >>>> reason.

> >>>>>>> Your

> >>>>>>>>> query was about how to look at marriage as understood by

> >> Vedic

> >>>>>>> scholars

> >>>>>>>>> with reference to the present day scenario, or words to that

> >>>>> effect.

> >>>>>>> And

> >>>>>>>>> then though Kanyaa is given in Dana the Putra is not and

> >> both do

> >>>>> get

> >>>>>>>>> married. So I think the loss and gain part may not be

> >>>> universally

> >>>>>>>>> applicable.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Then how to relate this to the modern trend of live-in

> >> partners

> >>>>> and

> >>>>>>> same

> >>>>>>>>> sex marriages? The last two of the variety of them can not

> >>>> begin a

> >>>>>>>>> Kutumba at all. And then there are casual relationships

> >> that are

> >>>>>> based

> >>>>>>>>> on income to one and loss to other. So I would not think

> >>>>>> that2nd, 11th

> >>>>>>>>> and 7th need necessarily have to be involved in

> >> marriages in the

> >>>>>>> modern

> >>>>>>>>> reference.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> As you say, the marriage begins when they live together, no

> >>>> doubt

> >>>>>>> about

> >>>>>>>>> that. But then the question is whether we consider a

> >>>> marriage that

> >>>>>>>>> breaks within a week or a day as a marriage or an affair?

> >>>> This is

> >>>>> so

> >>>>>>>>> because in modern days some may live for some days together

> >>>>>> purely on

> >>>>>>>>> financial consideration and with no intention of getting

> >>>> married.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> That is why, I think the necessary element is the desire to

> >>>>>> spend life

> >>>>>>>>> together has to be there at the time of marriage of living

> >>>>> together,

> >>>>>>> for

> >>>>>>>>> that to be considered as a marriage.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> I think this definition is more appropriate as the

> >> jataka and

> >>>>> Spouse

> >>>>>>> are

> >>>>>>>>> in 1 and 7 bhava and these two bhava cause a sort of

> >> merger or

> >>>>>>> exchange

> >>>>>>>>> of habits over a sufficiently long period spent

> >> together. So the

> >>>>>>> husband

> >>>>>>>>> gives up some of his dislikes and likes and accepts

> >> those of the

> >>>>>> wife

> >>>>>>>>> and vice-a-versa. The lagna is the bhava of birth which

> >> is the

> >>>>> state

> >>>>>>>>> after death and the 7th is the Maraka sthana so

> >> equivalent of

> >>>>> death,

> >>>>>>>>> which leads to beginning of the process of birth. Or if the

> >>>>>>> terminology

> >>>>>>>>> is too harsh, lagna is the rise of Sun, that has to set at

> >>>> the 7th

> >>>>>>> bhava

> >>>>>>>>> and the 7th bhava is the setting of Sun that has to rise

> >> in the

> >>>>>> Lagna.

> >>>>>>>>> So the bhavas have to merge and so do the parties to the

> >>>> marriage.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> So in the example provided by you, if the person did not

> >>>> have any

> >>>>>>>>> intention to remain with his partner for life, I would

> >> not treat

> >>>>>> that

> >>>>>>> as

> >>>>>>>>> marriage, but an affair. Some astrologers prefer to look at

> >>>>> affairs

> >>>>>>> from

> >>>>>>>>> A7 and spouse from UL. I think they are right.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Of course these are my personal views and I could be wrong.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> Regards,

> >>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> >>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>> venkatachala pathi wrote:

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Mr. Chandrasekarji,

> >>>>>>>>>> Sir,

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> This is a great day in my 78 years of age to have a

> >>>> message from

> >>>>> a

> >>>>>>>>>> great astrologer like you.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Your reply is 'partially' correct. While in Vedic

> >>>> Astrology, the

> >>>>>>> term

> >>>>>>>>>> 'marriage' is the 'Union " of two people of opposite

> >> sex to be

> >>>>>>> traced.

> >>>>>>>>>> (now a days we also have to look into variety of 'unions'

> >>>>>> crept into

> >>>>>>>>>> modern society - and, is it possible to find in Vedic

> >>>> Astrology

> >>>>> of

> >>>>>>>>>> these strange 'unions'?). this is referred to by one

> >> of us as

> >>>>>>> 'Kannika

> >>>>>>>>>> Dhan'.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> 'Dhan' itself is loss ( or moving away from ones

> >> ownership) to

> >>>>> one

> >>>>>>> and

> >>>>>>>>>> gain to other. That is the reason along with 2nd house

> >>>> (Kudumba)

> >>>>> +

> >>>>>>> 7th

> >>>>>>>>>> House (Partnership) and 11 house the house of gain is

> >>>> 'largely'

> >>>>>>>>>> considered. But that DOES NOT COMPLETE THE MARRIAGE.

> >>>>>>>>>> The 'marriage' is complete only when they 'live' together,

> >>>>> 'unite'

> >>>>>>>>>> together' and 'progress' together. So the ceremony of

> >>>>>> 'marriage' and

> >>>>>>>>>> in any religion it is a formal declaration and not

> >> 'complete'

> >>>>>> in all

> >>>>>>>>>> respects as quoted above.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> My request is if these three segments are necessary to

> >>>>>> 'complete' a

> >>>>>>>>>> marriage, how you find these together to happen on the

> >> given

> >>>>>> time in

> >>>>>>> a

> >>>>>>>>>> horoscope, and what are the contributions by position, by

> >>>>>> portfolio,

> >>>>>>>>>> and by inter relationship among Planets, Star Zone etc in

> >>>>>>> combination

> >>>>>>>>>> as reached in DP,BP,SP,ASP to arrive at it?

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> This is because, one male involved in one segment of three

> >>>>> listed

> >>>>>>>>>> above and claimed that he is not married. I explained his

> >>>>>> period of

> >>>>>>>>>> involvement and the troubles he will experience (which

> >> has

> >>>> been

> >>>>>>> proved

> >>>>>>>>>> beyond any iota of doubt) in last 1 year 2 months. His

> >> parent

> >>>>>>> (unaware

> >>>>>>>>>> of this) is planning for his marriage. In my parlance his

> >>>>>> 'marriage'

> >>>>>>>>>> or 'marriages' are over (and one segment of said

> >>>> 'marriage' will

> >>>>>>> have

> >>>>>>>>>> to continue) and only the spouse could not be 'fixed',

> >> and the

> >>>>>>> result

> >>>>>>>>>> of the (2nd house portfolio) could not be fulfilled.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> So, I am greatly involved in further deductions to him,

> >>>> and look

> >>>>>>>>>> forward to all in this forum to help me how further

> >> this could

> >>>>> be

> >>>>>>>>>> analyzed. (I think the details of horoscope is not

> >>>> necessary, as

> >>>>>>> this

> >>>>>>>>>> a 'generalized' analysis). I will take this thereon

> >> from your

> >>>>>> guide

> >>>>>>>>> lines.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Sorry to take your precious time, and your advise will

> >> be of

> >>>>> great

> >>>>>>>>>> help to all in this.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Regards,

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Pathi

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> A.V.Pathi,

> >>>>>>>>>> Hindu Vedic Astrologer,

> >>>>>>>>>> 103, Black Tie Lane, Chapal Hill,

> >>>>>>>>>> NC 27514.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Presently at Chennai India

> >>>>>>>>>> Ph 044-23710500

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>> Park yourself in front of a world of choices in

> >> alternative

> >>>>>>> vehicles.

> >>>>>>>>>> Visit the Auto Green Center.

> >>>>>>>>>>

> >>>>>>>>>>

[Guest guest]

Dear Shri Chandrasekhar ji

 

Many thanks for clarification. I was under the impression that even

saubhaya is also seen from 8th house for femal nativity.

 

regards / Prafulla

 

, Chandrashekhar

<chandrashekhar46 wrote:

>

> Dear Prafulla,

>

> Do not forget that Saubhagya of a lady is seen from the 7th as is

> Mangalya seen from the 8th.

>

> Chandrashekhar.

>

> Prafulla Gang wrote:

> >

> > Dear Bharat ji and Shri Chandrasekhar ji,

> >

> > Many thanks for your wonderful posts.

> >

> > Yes - my mail was just a perspective - which author shared. and Yes -

> > her interpretation does not answer Shri Bharat's query.

> >

> > In some formk or other - marriage does indicate karmic bandhan with

> > spouse; so if spouse dies early (or say when she dies) - will it

> > indicate the termination of karmic bandhan (mutual between husband /

> > wife) of past lives. But in female nativity - mangalya is seen from

> > 8th house.

> >

> > regards / Prafulla Gang

> > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>

> >

> > Diplomacy - n. the patriotic act of lying for one's country /

community.

> > ************************************************

> >

> > >

> > > astrologyhindu <astrologyhindu%40gmail.com>

> > > Fri, 20 Jul 2007 15:24:52 +0530

> > >

<%40>

> > > Marriage, Dharma and more - Sri Prafulla

> > >

> > > Namaste Prafullaji

> > >

> > > The view that you have suggested is a more modern view. Perhaps

it is

> > > shedding light on the happenings in today's world. When I try to

take a

> > > view, I depend upon the Upanishads for the same. Jyotish as a

subject,

> > > being

> > > a Vedanga, has to be in line with the Upanishadic teaching.

Therefore, a

> > > traditional view holds much more importance for me. It helps me

see a

> > > chart

> > > from that perspective.

> > >

> > > The main role of marriage is to identify with an another. This

> > breaks the

> > > egocentric view and nurtures acceptance. That is why family (first

> > > identification) and wife and her family (2nd identification) are

very

> > > important steps in one's life in the spiritual journey. The

Vedas give

> > > great

> > > significance to the human birth. It is a celebration. It is a god

> > gift to

> > > overcome ignorance and be free from all assumed bindings. They

view each

> > > and

> > > every ashrama of life in that manner. Similarly, when 7th house is

> > viewed

> > > as

> > > a house of identification, it makes sense to me. Malefics will

not let

> > > you

> > > identify and instead become very controlling as if in a master-slave

> > > relationship. While viewing the 7th house, it is also better to

look at

> > > 9th

> > > house. This will show whether or not that person understands the

dharma.

> > > If

> > > the 9th house and 9th lord are afflicted, we would have a

genuine major

> > > problem at hand as regards marriage, especially if 7th is

afflicted too.

> > > Generally, when I come across such a combination, I check the

other two

> > > trikona sthanas and see if the person gets some support.

> > >

> > > So the principle of Dharma-Artha-Kama becomes relevant. The

principle

> > > states

> > > that Artha and Kama are to be pursued keeping Dharma in mind. By

> > > following

> > > Dharma, one becomes free of likes and dislikes and is able to

perform

> > > karma

> > > that burns it and does not create fresh karma. This brings forth a

> > > meditative mind fit for knowledge and mukumshatvam. It is for this

> > > reason,

> > > in our four purusharthas Dharma comes first and foremost. It is to

> > > reaffirm

> > > its importance. The same principle when applied to Jyotish, can

help us

> > > check clearly, whether a problem is with pursuing kama with

right means

> > > or

> > > wrong means.

> > >

> > > When we talk of modern happenings, we are referring to an

experience. An

> > > experience is defined as subject-object relationship. The subject is

> > > oneself. Each subject has a different level of knowledge and hence a

> > > different interpretation of the same happening. Therefore, the

> > experience

> > > depends upon the knowledge of the subject. If two subjects,

husband and

> > > wife, are experiencing some problems in marriage, check their

thinking

> > > and

> > > maturity. How are they interpreting their happenings? This is

how every

> > > graha is responsible directly or indirectly to the happenings of

the 7th

> > > house. Again, we get the subject-object knowledge from the Vedas

and can

> > > apply it to Jyotish.

> > >

> > > I did read Sri Mridula Trivedi's comments in one of her books,

but, did

> > > not

> > > agree to it. It is more of a " populist " statement rather than a deep

> > > thought-out reply to someone's question. I hope you understand

what I

> > > mean.

> > >

> > > Coming back to our topic, if we take the principles of Chakra from

> > > Tantra,

> > > we can very quickly check the diseases that can afflict a

> > > person. Traditional views, in my view, open avenues for research,

> > > rethinking

> > > and loads of knowledge.

> > >

> > > Thanks and Regards

> > > Bharat

> > >

> > >

> > > On 7/20/07, Prafulla Gang <jyotish

> > <jyotish%40inbox.com>> wrote:

> > >>

> > >> Dear Bharat ji and Chandrasekhar ji,

> > >>

> > >> Though Parashar has rferred 7th house for marriage, but

Uttarkalammrit

> > >> has hinted 7th house to0 decide construction and sensitivity of his

> > >> sexual organs.

> > >>

> > >> Mridula Trivedi has once gave an interesting view on 7th house as

> > >> marriage house:

> > >>

> > >> marriage has strong relationship with social discipline born

out of an

> > >> individual need for companionship and love and the urge to

procreate.

> > >> It is the middle house in horoscope sandwitched between house

of enemy

> > >> and death. After marriage, native enters into another realm of

life. A

> > >> host of factors compel him to view his life from different

> > >> perspective. The family must be protected, nurtured, flourished and

> > >> saved from a host of enemies (so man has to gear up to a defensive

> > >> posture for social, economic and external factors). Ans he has

to keep

> > >> his stance up throughout his life and is liberated only after his

> > death.

> > >>

> > >> if one looks at swyamwar marriage, king has to fight with

enemies to

> > >> get his bride; and failure might mean his death.

> > >>

> > >> regards / Prafulla

> > >>

> > >>

> > <%40>

<%40>,

> > >> Chandrashekhar

> > >> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote:

> > >>>

> > >>> Dear Bharat,

> > >>>

> > >>> There is no authority which has explained why this is so.

However as

> > >> you

> > >>> asked me to throw some light on this, I shall give my opinion

on why

> > >>> this is so.

> > >>>

> > >>> Marriage in true hindu sense is when two individual not only

marry but

> > >>> get transformed into each other's image. That is why lagna and 7th

> > >> bhava

> > >>> are opposite each other and though opposing they are

complimentary. So

> > >>> after marriage the groom gives up some of his likes and dislikes

> > and so

> > >>> does the bride. They also accept each other's traits. That is

when

> > they

> > >>> merge. Once the merger takes place the marriage is complete in

real

> > >>> sense. We see that occupants of both the bhavas aspect each

other by

> > >>> full 7th house aspect and thus are capable of mutual

influence. having

> > >>> merged, it becomes necessary to find the initiation of rasi

dasha by

> > >>> finding out which is the stronger of the two bhavas as both become

> > >>> material but the one that has changed the least will be the

guiding

> > >>> light for events to unfold in future.

> > >>>

> > >>> These are my personal views on the subject and others could

view it

> > >> in a

> > >>> different manner.

> > >>>

> > >>> Take care,

> > >>> Chandrashekhar.

> > >>>

> > >>>

> > >>>

> > >>> Bharat - Hindu Astrology wrote:

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Namaste Sri Chandrashekharji

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Can you please expand upon it and give me a deeper understanding?

> > >>>>

> > >>>> Thanks and Regards

> > >>>> Bharat

> > >>>>

> > >>>> On 7/18/07, Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > >>>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote:

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Dear Bharat,

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> You may also like to think about the fact that in rasi

dashas, the

> > >>>>> stronger between the Lagna and the 7th bhava is considered to

> > >> give the

> > >>>>> first dasha. So they do represent each other as do two

partners in

> > >>>>> marriage.

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> regards,

> > >>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> > >>>>>

> > >>>>> Bharat - Hindu Astrology wrote:

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Namaste Sri Chandrashekharji

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> True, I misread his email.

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> 7th house interpretation bugged me for a long time : Why would

> > >> Rishis

> > >>>>>> call the house of marriage also as the house of markesh. One

> > >> day this

> > >>>>> came

> > >>>>>> as a thought to me, which made sense.

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> Thanks and Regards

> > >>>>>> Bharat

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>>> On 7/18/07, Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > >>>>

> > >>

<chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk><chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>

> > >>>>>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Dear Bharat,

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> I think Venkatachala asked, in the original thread, what

> > >> constitutes

> > >>>>>>> marriage in astrology in the modern days. I do not remember he

> > >>>> writing

> > >>>>>>> about how marriage should be lived, or if he did then that

> > >> question

> > >>>>>>> should go to the Dharma shastra lists if any.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Your point of the reason for 7th being marakesha and also

> > >> bhava of

> > >>>>>>> spouse is an interesting interpretation.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> > >>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>> Bharat - Hindu Astrology wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Namaste Sri Chandrashekharji and Sri Venkatachalaji

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> The role of marriage is to expand from the lower I thinking

> > >>>>> (egoistic,

> > >>>>>>>> individualistic and selfish thinking) to a slightly bigger I

> > >>>>> (wherein

> > >>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>> " I " encompasses both the person and his/her spouse). The

> > >>>>>>>> identification with

> > >>>>>>>> another breaks the singular individuality into a slightly

> > >> larger

> > >>>>>>>> " duality " .

> > >>>>>>>> The purpose of a human life is to understand the whole as

> > >> true

> > >>>> " I " .

> > >>>>>>>> Marriage

> > >>>>>>>> becomes a very important step in the same. I agree with Sri

> > >>>>>>>> Venkatachalaji's

> > >>>>>>>> thinking that the marriage needs to " lived " successfully

> > >> to be

> > >>>> known

> > >>>>>>>> so. It

> > >>>>>>>> is this that would serve the true purpose of a marriage.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Perhaps, because of its killing of " individuality " nature,

> > >> it is

> > >>>>> given

> > >>>>>>> the

> > >>>>>>>> same house as is the markesh.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Just the desire to have a long marriage would not suffice for

> > >>>>> marriage

> > >>>>>>> if

> > >>>>>>>> one does not renounce one's likes and dislikes and follow

what

> > >>>>>> needs to

> > >>>>>>> be

> > >>>>>>>> done and what needs to be accepted OR does not perform

actions

> > >>>>>>> supporting

> > >>>>>>>> one's desires. Maybe we can alter by saying - That the

> > >> desire is

> > >>>>> there

> > >>>>>>> and

> > >>>>>>>> the understanding of the necessity of action and acceptance,

> > >>>>> wherever

> > >>>>>>>> required.

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> I may be wrong too

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> Thanks and Regards

> > >>>>>>>> Bharat

> > >>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>> On 7/18/07, Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46@

> > >>>>

> > >>

<chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk><chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>

> > >>>>>>

> > >>>>

> > >>

<chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk><chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>

> > >>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Dear Venkatachala Pathi,

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> I am younger than you and if my response pleases you it is

> > >>>> my good

> > >>>>>>>>> fortune. I am yet a student of this divine science and

> > >> hope to

> > >>>>>> remain

> > >>>>>>> so

> > >>>>>>>>> till the end of my life.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> I have replied, in the way that I did, for a very specific

> > >>>> reason.

> > >>>>>>> Your

> > >>>>>>>>> query was about how to look at marriage as understood by

> > >> Vedic

> > >>>>>>> scholars

> > >>>>>>>>> with reference to the present day scenario, or words to that

> > >>>>> effect.

> > >>>>>>> And

> > >>>>>>>>> then though Kanyaa is given in Dana the Putra is not and

> > >> both do

> > >>>>> get

> > >>>>>>>>> married. So I think the loss and gain part may not be

> > >>>> universally

> > >>>>>>>>> applicable.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Then how to relate this to the modern trend of live-in

> > >> partners

> > >>>>> and

> > >>>>>>> same

> > >>>>>>>>> sex marriages? The last two of the variety of them can not

> > >>>> begin a

> > >>>>>>>>> Kutumba at all. And then there are casual relationships

> > >> that are

> > >>>>>> based

> > >>>>>>>>> on income to one and loss to other. So I would not think

> > >>>>>> that2nd, 11th

> > >>>>>>>>> and 7th need necessarily have to be involved in

> > >> marriages in the

> > >>>>>>> modern

> > >>>>>>>>> reference.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> As you say, the marriage begins when they live together, no

> > >>>> doubt

> > >>>>>>> about

> > >>>>>>>>> that. But then the question is whether we consider a

> > >>>> marriage that

> > >>>>>>>>> breaks within a week or a day as a marriage or an affair?

> > >>>> This is

> > >>>>> so

> > >>>>>>>>> because in modern days some may live for some days together

> > >>>>>> purely on

> > >>>>>>>>> financial consideration and with no intention of getting

> > >>>> married.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> That is why, I think the necessary element is the desire to

> > >>>>>> spend life

> > >>>>>>>>> together has to be there at the time of marriage of living

> > >>>>> together,

> > >>>>>>> for

> > >>>>>>>>> that to be considered as a marriage.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> I think this definition is more appropriate as the

> > >> jataka and

> > >>>>> Spouse

> > >>>>>>> are

> > >>>>>>>>> in 1 and 7 bhava and these two bhava cause a sort of

> > >> merger or

> > >>>>>>> exchange

> > >>>>>>>>> of habits over a sufficiently long period spent

> > >> together. So the

> > >>>>>>> husband

> > >>>>>>>>> gives up some of his dislikes and likes and accepts

> > >> those of the

> > >>>>>> wife

> > >>>>>>>>> and vice-a-versa. The lagna is the bhava of birth which

> > >> is the

> > >>>>> state

> > >>>>>>>>> after death and the 7th is the Maraka sthana so

> > >> equivalent of

> > >>>>> death,

> > >>>>>>>>> which leads to beginning of the process of birth. Or if the

> > >>>>>>> terminology

> > >>>>>>>>> is too harsh, lagna is the rise of Sun, that has to set at

> > >>>> the 7th

> > >>>>>>> bhava

> > >>>>>>>>> and the 7th bhava is the setting of Sun that has to rise

> > >> in the

> > >>>>>> Lagna.

> > >>>>>>>>> So the bhavas have to merge and so do the parties to the

> > >>>> marriage.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> So in the example provided by you, if the person did not

> > >>>> have any

> > >>>>>>>>> intention to remain with his partner for life, I would

> > >> not treat

> > >>>>>> that

> > >>>>>>> as

> > >>>>>>>>> marriage, but an affair. Some astrologers prefer to look at

> > >>>>> affairs

> > >>>>>>> from

> > >>>>>>>>> A7 and spouse from UL. I think they are right.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Of course these are my personal views and I could be wrong.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> Regards,

> > >>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar.

> > >>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>> venkatachala pathi wrote:

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Mr. Chandrasekarji,

> > >>>>>>>>>> Sir,

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> This is a great day in my 78 years of age to have a

> > >>>> message from

> > >>>>> a

> > >>>>>>>>>> great astrologer like you.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Your reply is 'partially' correct. While in Vedic

> > >>>> Astrology, the

> > >>>>>>> term

> > >>>>>>>>>> 'marriage' is the 'Union " of two people of opposite

> > >> sex to be

> > >>>>>>> traced.

> > >>>>>>>>>> (now a days we also have to look into variety of 'unions'

> > >>>>>> crept into

> > >>>>>>>>>> modern society - and, is it possible to find in Vedic

> > >>>> Astrology

> > >>>>> of

> > >>>>>>>>>> these strange 'unions'?). this is referred to by one

> > >> of us as

> > >>>>>>> 'Kannika

> > >>>>>>>>>> Dhan'.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> 'Dhan' itself is loss ( or moving away from ones

> > >> ownership) to

> > >>>>> one

> > >>>>>>> and

> > >>>>>>>>>> gain to other. That is the reason along with 2nd house

> > >>>> (Kudumba)

> > >>>>> +

> > >>>>>>> 7th

> > >>>>>>>>>> House (Partnership) and 11 house the house of gain is

> > >>>> 'largely'

> > >>>>>>>>>> considered. But that DOES NOT COMPLETE THE MARRIAGE.

> > >>>>>>>>>> The 'marriage' is complete only when they 'live' together,

> > >>>>> 'unite'

> > >>>>>>>>>> together' and 'progress' together. So the ceremony of

> > >>>>>> 'marriage' and

> > >>>>>>>>>> in any religion it is a formal declaration and not

> > >> 'complete'

> > >>>>>> in all

> > >>>>>>>>>> respects as quoted above.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> My request is if these three segments are necessary to

> > >>>>>> 'complete' a

> > >>>>>>>>>> marriage, how you find these together to happen on the

> > >> given

> > >>>>>> time in

> > >>>>>>> a

> > >>>>>>>>>> horoscope, and what are the contributions by position, by

> > >>>>>> portfolio,

> > >>>>>>>>>> and by inter relationship among Planets, Star Zone etc in

> > >>>>>>> combination

> > >>>>>>>>>> as reached in DP,BP,SP,ASP to arrive at it?

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> This is because, one male involved in one segment of three

> > >>>>> listed

> > >>>>>>>>>> above and claimed that he is not married. I explained his

> > >>>>>> period of

> > >>>>>>>>>> involvement and the troubles he will experience (which

> > >> has

> > >>>> been

> > >>>>>>> proved

> > >>>>>>>>>> beyond any iota of doubt) in last 1 year 2 months. His

> > >> parent

> > >>>>>>> (unaware

> > >>>>>>>>>> of this) is planning for his marriage. In my parlance his

> > >>>>>> 'marriage'

> > >>>>>>>>>> or 'marriages' are over (and one segment of said

> > >>>> 'marriage' will

> > >>>>>>> have

> > >>>>>>>>>> to continue) and only the spouse could not be 'fixed',

> > >> and the

> > >>>>>>> result

> > >>>>>>>>>> of the (2nd house portfolio) could not be fulfilled.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> So, I am greatly involved in further deductions to him,

> > >>>> and look

> > >>>>>>>>>> forward to all in this forum to help me how further

> > >> this could

> > >>>>> be

> > >>>>>>>>>> analyzed. (I think the details of horoscope is not

> > >>>> necessary, as

> > >>>>>>> this

> > >>>>>>>>>> a 'generalized' analysis). I will take this thereon

> > >> from your

> > >>>>>> guide

> > >>>>>>>>> lines.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Sorry to take your precious time, and your advise will

> > >> be of

> > >>>>> great

> > >>>>>>>>>> help to all in this.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Regards,

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Pathi

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> A.V.Pathi,

> > >>>>>>>>>> Hindu Vedic Astrologer,

> > >>>>>>>>>> 103, Black Tie Lane, Chapal Hill,

> > >>>>>>>>>> NC 27514.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Presently at Chennai India

> > >>>>>>>>>> Ph 044-23710500

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>> Park yourself in front of a world of choices in

> > >> alternative

> > >>>>>>> vehicles.

> > >>>>>>>>>> Visit the Auto Green Center.

> > >>>>>>>>>>

> > >>>>>>>>>>