Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Chandrashekhar ji Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was thinking and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha sector was given by Bhaskar ji. Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of transiting planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell them that these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are wrong understandings,will trust. I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all importance and what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. Respect Pradeep , Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46 wrote: > > Dear Pradeep, > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree is right. But > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability of the nadi > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the navamshesha. That is the > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava lord. I trust > this is clear. > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and do not claim to > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have corrected a wrong > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the principle as > understood by me earlier but with the type of language flying on the > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish to do so. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is Guru.Its > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some navamsha.It is in > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo navamsha.As far > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to see the > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the mother/father > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see whether a > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its placement.transiting > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara rashi,leo > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector within makara > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's 3.2 degree > > span. > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi justifying bhavas in > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have to correct > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > Respect > > Pradeep > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > > shlokas, > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So Prafulla > > is right. > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a sage > > well > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > > sagelike > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not > > english > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in Sanskrit > > with > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the same > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits can > > only > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > rashi.Whether you > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > rashi,they are > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > > amiguity > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - while > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > > Saravali > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which certainly > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert back. > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) in > > the > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 chart > > in > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > > referred > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > > document; > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D > > charts > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma > > clearly > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half > > aspect > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that > > these are > > > > non- > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > too > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan > > Varma > > > > has > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury > > > > aspecting > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > > obvious > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > >> > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with > > current > > > > age > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > >> > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > >>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important? > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making > > comment, > > > > be > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the > > > > > > application > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the > > wrong > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read in correct > > way). > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > relevance in > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case > > studies - > > > > > > then at > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > but my > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > > business " > > > > > > with my > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following > > better > > > > > > quality > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > >>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important? > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts > > every > > > > one > > > > > > is > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is > > every > > > > > > chance > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true results - your > > > > > > argument is > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - > > when > > > > > > you > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and > > > > > > understand > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow > > > > someone > > > > > > who > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice > > or > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there > > not been > > > > > > any > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts > > must > > > > not > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know > > better > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the > > forum > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the > > people - > > > > > > must > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great > > sanskrit > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > > have any > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > > right > > > > > > to > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > >>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important? > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > chart) " just > > > > > > like > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of > > > > > > planets > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when > > planets > > > > > > are > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the > > > > > > sages; > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using > > navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 > > charts - > > > > > > can be > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 > > chart. > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include > > the > > > > > > right > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > >>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. > > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > > because > > > > > > it > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other > > > > amsas > > > > > > due > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > > overall > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the > > strength of > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > > > > importance. > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > chart > > > > > > like > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in > > Navamsa. > > > > > > (There > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > treated > > > > > > as > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only > > > > means > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. > > It is > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as > > well? > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. > > But > > > > yes > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > > Because it > > > > > > is > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to > > predict > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are > > not > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > > > > considered > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts > > about > > > > > > aspect > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to > > Rasi > > > > > > chart. > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > Seetharama > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > importance of > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that > > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > > experience > > > > > > so > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not > > understood > > > > > > what > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being > > so > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > > overall > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > chart > > > > > > like > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > treated > > > > > > as > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as > > well? > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make > > up two > > > > > > equal > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa > > Chart. > > > > > > What I > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > importance? > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of > > many > > > > > > varga > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and > > both > > > > of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > > valuable > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I > > would > > > > > > like > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa > > chart > > > > > > alone > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found > > both the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > > separate > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi > > chart), > > > > since > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results > > if the > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the > > Rasi > > > > > > chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in > > > > several > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that > > yogas > > > > > > viewed > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > > chart for > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a > > > > > > separate > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of > > > > > > checking > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) > > in > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana > > should > > > > be > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual > > influence > > > > at > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. > > span. of > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own > > house > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa > > chart, it > > > > is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the > > Rasi. > > > > Why > > > > > > is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, > > even > > > > > > though > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > > weakened > > > > > > it; > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the > > > > weakest > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it > > loses its > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > > strengths > > > > > > for > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The > > > > navamsa > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement > > within > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to > > both > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak > > in one > > > > > > of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not > > give > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > > Navamsa; > > > > > > but > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent > > that > > > > it > > > > > > can > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the > > promise > > > > > > given > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in > > the > > > > rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I > > have > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both > > in > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in > > the > > > > rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the > > karakamsa > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by > > > > Chandra) > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the > > karakamsa > > > > is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > > sequence > > > > > > of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider > > karakamsa > > > > > > lagna > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > > opinion > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > > considered on > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao > > always > > > > > > says. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in > > the > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my > > Sukra is > > > > in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful > > house, > > > > > > and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > traditional > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > > summarize > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > necessarily in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. > > N. > > > > Rao. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka > > though > > > > > > it > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered > > that in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > understood in > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning > > karakamsha > > > > and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > > results of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > > karakamsha > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two > > different > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > > versed in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention > > of > > > > mine > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the > > > > results > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > > potential > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > > grahas in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for > > whatever it > > > > is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is > > pointing to > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > says,Karakamsha > > > > has > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not > > pointing to > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are > > some > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting > > his view > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded > > by > > > > > > proper > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > > previews > > > > > > at > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Finally nothing happens in the rashi chart too. That is history. The Rashi charts just give the pointers the degrees of the natal planets, and the Navamsha points, of these degrees, which again is converted into degrees for transit purpose and observations, and all this happens in the sky above. Now we are talking of 2 approaches. a) Transits with reference to natal points. b) transits with reference to nakshatra points. And aspects also same a) In natal Chart. b) In navamsha Chart ???? So back to square one. regards, Bhaskar. , " vijayadas_pradeep " <vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was thinking > and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha sector was > given by Bhaskar ji. > > Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of transiting > planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. > > Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell them that > these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are wrong > understandings,will trust. > > I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all importance and > what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. > > Respect > Pradeep > > > > , Chandrashekhar > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree is right. > But > > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability of the nadi > > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the navamshesha. That is > the > > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava lord. I > trust > > this is clear. > > > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and do not > claim to > > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have corrected a wrong > > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the principle as > > understood by me earlier but with the type of language flying on > the > > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish to do so. > > > > Take care, > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is Guru.Its > > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some navamsha.It is in > > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo navamsha.As far > > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to see the > > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the mother/father > > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see whether a > > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its placement.transiting > > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara rashi,leo > > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector within > makara > > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's 3.2 degree > > > span. > > > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi justifying bhavas in > > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have to correct > > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > > > Respect > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > > > shlokas, > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So > Prafulla > > > is right. > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a > sage > > > well > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > > > sagelike > > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not > > > english > > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in > Sanskrit > > > with > > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the > same > > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits > can > > > only > > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > > rashi.Whether you > > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > > rashi,they are > > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > > > amiguity > > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > <jyotish@> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - > while > > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > > > Saravali > > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which > certainly > > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert > back. > > > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) > in > > > the > > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 > chart > > > in > > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > > > referred > > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > > > document; > > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D > > > charts > > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > important? > > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma > > > clearly > > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half > > > aspect > > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that > > > these are > > > > > non- > > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > too > > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan > > > Varma > > > > > has > > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or > mercury > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > > > obvious > > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with > > > current > > > > > age > > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > > >>> > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > important? > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making > > > comment, > > > > > be > > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with > the > > > > > > > application > > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly > the > > > wrong > > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read in > correct > > > way). > > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > > relevance in > > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case > > > studies - > > > > > > > then at > > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > > but my > > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the > views > > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > > > business " > > > > > > > with my > > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following > > > better > > > > > > > quality > > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > > >>>> > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > important? > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts > > > every > > > > > one > > > > > > > is > > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is > > > every > > > > > > > chance > > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true results - > your > > > > > > > argument is > > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your > choice - > > > when > > > > > > > you > > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, > and > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to > follow > > > > > someone > > > > > > > who > > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > >>>> > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > <jyotish@> > > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become > choice > > > or > > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there > > > not been > > > > > > > any > > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many > stalwarts > > > must > > > > > not > > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know > > > better > > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the > > > forum > > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the > > > people - > > > > > > > must > > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great > > > sanskrit > > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > > > have any > > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include > the > > > > > right > > > > > > > to > > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > important? > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > > chart) " just > > > > > > > like > > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results > for " aspects of > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when > > > planets > > > > > > > are > > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by > the > > > > > > > sages; > > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > <jyotish@> > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using > > > navamsa > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 > > > charts - > > > > > > > can be > > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 > > > chart. > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically > include > > > the > > > > > > > right > > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > >>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > important? > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > > > because > > > > > > > it > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than > other > > > > > amsas > > > > > > > due > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > the > > > > > overall > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the > > > strength of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > > > > > importance. > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > chart > > > > > > > like > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > (There > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > treated > > > > > > > as > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it > only > > > > > means > > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means > that. > > > It is > > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > as > > > well? > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in > Navamsa 'chart'. > > > But > > > > > yes > > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > > > Because it > > > > > > > is > > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to > > > predict > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses > are > > > not > > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts > > > about > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to > > > Rasi > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > > Seetharama > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > > importance of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > > > experience > > > > > > > so > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not > > > understood > > > > > > > what > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart > being > > > so > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > the > > > > > overall > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > chart > > > > > > > like > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > treated > > > > > > > as > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > as > > > well? > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to > Navamsa > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make > > > up two > > > > > > > equal > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa > > > Chart. > > > > > > > What I > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > > importance? > > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one > of > > > many > > > > > > > varga > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa > and > > > both > > > > > of > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > > > valuable > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. > I > > > would > > > > > > > like > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa > > > chart > > > > > > > alone > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found > > > both the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as > very > > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > > > separate > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi > > > chart), > > > > > since > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent > results > > > if the > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if > the > > > Rasi > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned > in > > > > > several > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that > > > yogas > > > > > > > viewed > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > > > chart for > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart > as a > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the > purpose of > > > > > > > checking > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and > aspects) > > > in > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana > > > should > > > > > be > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual > > > influence > > > > > at > > > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. > > > span. of > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own > > > house > > > > > in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa > > > chart, it > > > > > is > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the > > > Rasi. > > > > > Why > > > > > > > is > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that > because, > > > even > > > > > > > though > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still > its > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > > > weakened > > > > > > > it; > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is > the > > > > > weakest > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it > > > loses its > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > > > strengths > > > > > > > for > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. > The > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement > > > within > > > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to > > > both > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is > weak > > > in one > > > > > > > of > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not > > > give > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > > > Navamsa; > > > > > > > but > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the > extent > > > that > > > > > it > > > > > > > can > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the > > > promise > > > > > > > given > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in > > > the > > > > > rasi > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; > I > > > have > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra > both > > > in > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in > > > the > > > > > rasi > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the > > > karakamsa > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented > by > > > > > Chandra) > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the > > > karakamsa > > > > > is > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > > > sequence > > > > > > > of > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > > > opinion > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > > > considered on > > > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao > > > always > > > > > > > says. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi > in > > > the > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my > > > Sukra is > > > > > in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice > beautiful > > > house, > > > > > > > and > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > > traditional > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > > > summarize > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > > necessarily in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > <%40> > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or > K. > > > N. > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and > Amshaka > > > though > > > > > > > it > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered > > > that in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > > understood in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning > > > karakamsha > > > > > and > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > > > results of > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two > > > different > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > > > versed in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this > contention > > > of > > > > > mine > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that > the > > > > > results > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > > > potential > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > > > grahas in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for > > > whatever it > > > > > is > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is > > > pointing to > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > > says,Karakamsha > > > > > has > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another > meaning. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not > > > pointing to > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there > are > > > some > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting > > > his view > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > > the > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not > preceded > > > by > > > > > > > proper > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > > > previews > > > > > > > at > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? > platform=120121 > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 //Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points.// Re-read above as - b) transit with reference to Navamsha points. , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish wrote: > > Finally nothing happens in the rashi chart too. > That is history. The Rashi charts just give the > pointers the degrees of the natal planets, > and the Navamsha points, of these degrees, which again > is converted into degrees for transit purpose and > observations, and all this happens in the > sky above. > > Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points. > > And aspects also same > > a) In natal Chart. > b) In navamsha Chart ???? > > So back to square one. > > regards, > Bhaskar. > > > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was thinking > > and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha sector was > > given by Bhaskar ji. > > > > Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of transiting > > planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. > > > > Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell them that > > these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are wrong > > understandings,will trust. > > > > I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all importance and > > what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. > > > > Respect > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > , Chandrashekhar > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree is right. > > But > > > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability of the nadi > > > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the navamshesha. That is > > the > > > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava lord. I > > trust > > > this is clear. > > > > > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and do not > > claim to > > > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have corrected a wrong > > > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the principle as > > > understood by me earlier but with the type of language flying on > > the > > > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish to do so. > > > > > > Take care, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is Guru.Its > > > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some navamsha.It is in > > > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo navamsha.As far > > > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to see the > > > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the mother/father > > > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see whether a > > > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its placement.transiting > > > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara rashi,leo > > > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector within > > makara > > > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's 3.2 degree > > > > span. > > > > > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi justifying bhavas in > > > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have to correct > > > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > > > > shlokas, > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So > > Prafulla > > > > is right. > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a > > sage > > > > well > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > > > > sagelike > > > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not > > > > english > > > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in > > Sanskrit > > > > with > > > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the > > same > > > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits > > can > > > > only > > > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > > > rashi.Whether you > > > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > > > rashi,they are > > > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > > > > amiguity > > > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - > > while > > > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > > > > Saravali > > > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which > > certainly > > > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert > > back. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) > > in > > > > the > > > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 > > chart > > > > in > > > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > > > > referred > > > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > > > > document; > > > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D > > > > charts > > > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important? > > > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma > > > > clearly > > > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that > > > > these are > > > > > > non- > > > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan > > > > Varma > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or > > mercury > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > > > > obvious > > > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with > > > > current > > > > > > age > > > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > > > >>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making > > > > comment, > > > > > > be > > > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with > > the > > > > > > > > application > > > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly > > the > > > > wrong > > > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read in > > correct > > > > way). > > > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > > > relevance in > > > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case > > > > studies - > > > > > > > > then at > > > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > > > but my > > > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the > > views > > > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > > > > business " > > > > > > > > with my > > > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following > > > > better > > > > > > > > quality > > > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts > > > > every > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is > > > > every > > > > > > > > chance > > > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true results - > > your > > > > > > > > argument is > > > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your > > choice - > > > > when > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, > > and > > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to > > follow > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become > > choice > > > > or > > > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there > > > > not been > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many > > stalwarts > > > > must > > > > > > not > > > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know > > > > better > > > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the > > > > forum > > > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the > > > > people - > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great > > > > sanskrit > > > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > > > > have any > > > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include > > the > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > > > chart) " just > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results > > for " aspects of > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when > > > > planets > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by > > the > > > > > > > > sages; > > > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 > > > > charts - > > > > > > > > can be > > > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 > > > > chart. > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically > > include > > > > the > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > >>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > > > > because > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than > > other > > > > > > amsas > > > > > > > > due > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > > the > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the > > > > strength of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > > > > > > importance. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > > chart > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in > > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > > (There > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > > treated > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it > > only > > > > > > means > > > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means > > that. > > > > It is > > > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > > as > > > > well? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in > > Navamsa 'chart'. > > > > But > > > > > > yes > > > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > > > > Because it > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to > > > > predict > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses > > are > > > > not > > > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts > > > > about > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > > > Seetharama > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > > > importance of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > > > > experience > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not > > > > understood > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart > > being > > > > so > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > > the > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > > chart > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > > treated > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > > as > > > > well? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make > > > > up two > > > > > > > > equal > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa > > > > Chart. > > > > > > > > What I > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > > > importance? > > > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one > > of > > > > many > > > > > > > > varga > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa > > and > > > > both > > > > > > of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > > > > valuable > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. > > I > > > > would > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa > > > > chart > > > > > > > > alone > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found > > > > both the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as > > very > > > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi > > > > chart), > > > > > > since > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent > > results > > > > if the > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if > > the > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned > > in > > > > > > several > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that > > > > yogas > > > > > > > > viewed > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > > > > chart for > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart > > as a > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the > > purpose of > > > > > > > > checking > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and > > aspects) > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana > > > > should > > > > > > be > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual > > > > influence > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. > > > > span. of > > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own > > > > house > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa > > > > chart, it > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > Why > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that > > because, > > > > even > > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still > > its > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > > > > weakened > > > > > > > > it; > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is > > the > > > > > > weakest > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it > > > > loses its > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > > > > strengths > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. > > The > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement > > > > within > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to > > > > both > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is > > weak > > > > in one > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not > > > > give > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > > > > Navamsa; > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the > > extent > > > > that > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the > > > > promise > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in > > > > the > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; > > I > > > > have > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra > > both > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in > > > > the > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented > > by > > > > > > Chandra) > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > > > > sequence > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > > > > opinion > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > > > > considered on > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao > > > > always > > > > > > > > says. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi > > in > > > > the > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my > > > > Sukra is > > > > > > in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice > > beautiful > > > > house, > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > > > > summarize > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > > > necessarily in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or > > K. > > > > N. > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and > > Amshaka > > > > though > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered > > > > that in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > > > understood in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > > > > results of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two > > > > different > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > > > > versed in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this > > contention > > > > of > > > > > > mine > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that > > the > > > > > > results > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > > > > potential > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > > > > grahas in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for > > > > whatever it > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is > > > > pointing to > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > > > says,Karakamsha > > > > > > has > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another > > meaning. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not > > > > pointing to > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there > > are > > > > some > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting > > > > his view > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not > > preceded > > > > by > > > > > > > > proper > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > > > > previews > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? > > platform=120121 > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Ultimately, all the calculations of the other Chakras, Charts, Shadvargas , are based on the original Natal degreecal position of the planets , a) At time of the birth OR b) in the Natal Chart (One and the same thing, whether one makes a chart or not)) and when we talk of conjunctions, aspects and transits, it again come back, or co- relates with reference to the a) Rasi Chakra b) Natal planetary positions at birth (whether one makes a Rasi Chakra or not,it does not make any difference), c) wrt the navamsha chart, whether one makes a representation in form of graph/chart it does not make a difference. But there are few issues to be reckoned, when we talk of events timings in future ,or after the birth has taken place- a) The natal conjunction,placements,occupations with reference to sign position and house position , AND when we talk of transits a) with reference to the Navamsha chakra -whether you prepare a chart or not, it is immaterial, the quarter pada of transit would remain same only, which would effect change in mans life. b) with reference to the Natal Chart, whether one prepares or not the chart is immaterial, the transits on important degrees would only effect change in mans life. c) with reference to the shadvargas, the amsa, which would not change because again , the critical degreecal positions of transit have been prepared, wrt the Natal positions at birth. We all should be discussing, how to use such important points for predictive purposes, which will help the people like me, to learn more from the wise members here, like Shri Pradeepji,Shri Chandrasekharji, Shri Prafullaji and the others whom I have not named. I would be more interested, not in what is right or wrong, with respect to the ancient wisdome, or interpretation of the same, but how to use your knowledge which you have learnt from your interpretation,when i sit down to read charts in future, for the natives who come for help,to me. I mean THE APPLICATION PART. regards, Bhaskar. , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish wrote: > > Finally nothing happens in the rashi chart too. > That is history. The Rashi charts just give the > pointers the degrees of the natal planets, > and the Navamsha points, of these degrees, which again > is converted into degrees for transit purpose and > observations, and all this happens in the > sky above. > > Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points. > > And aspects also same > > a) In natal Chart. > b) In navamsha Chart ???? > > So back to square one. > > regards, > Bhaskar. > > > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was thinking > > and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha sector was > > given by Bhaskar ji. > > > > Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of transiting > > planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. > > > > Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell them that > > these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are wrong > > understandings,will trust. > > > > I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all importance and > > what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. > > > > Respect > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > , Chandrashekhar > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree is right. > > But > > > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability of the nadi > > > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the navamshesha. That is > > the > > > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava lord. I > > trust > > > this is clear. > > > > > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and do not > > claim to > > > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have corrected a wrong > > > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the principle as > > > understood by me earlier but with the type of language flying on > > the > > > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish to do so. > > > > > > Take care, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is Guru.Its > > > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some navamsha.It is in > > > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo navamsha.As far > > > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to see the > > > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the mother/father > > > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see whether a > > > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its placement.transiting > > > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara rashi,leo > > > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector within > > makara > > > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's 3.2 degree > > > > span. > > > > > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi justifying bhavas in > > > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have to correct > > > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > > > > shlokas, > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So > > Prafulla > > > > is right. > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a > > sage > > > > well > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > > > > sagelike > > > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not > > > > english > > > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in > > Sanskrit > > > > with > > > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the > > same > > > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits > > can > > > > only > > > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > > > rashi.Whether you > > > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > > > rashi,they are > > > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > > > > amiguity > > > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - > > while > > > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > > > > Saravali > > > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which > > certainly > > > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert > > back. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) > > in > > > > the > > > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 > > chart > > > > in > > > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > > > > referred > > > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > > > > document; > > > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D > > > > charts > > > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important? > > > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma > > > > clearly > > > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that > > > > these are > > > > > > non- > > > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan > > > > Varma > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or > > mercury > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > > > > obvious > > > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with > > > > current > > > > > > age > > > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > > > >>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making > > > > comment, > > > > > > be > > > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with > > the > > > > > > > > application > > > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly > > the > > > > wrong > > > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read in > > correct > > > > way). > > > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > > > relevance in > > > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case > > > > studies - > > > > > > > > then at > > > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > > > but my > > > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the > > views > > > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > > > > business " > > > > > > > > with my > > > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following > > > > better > > > > > > > > quality > > > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts > > > > every > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is > > > > every > > > > > > > > chance > > > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true results - > > your > > > > > > > > argument is > > > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your > > choice - > > > > when > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, > > and > > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to > > follow > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become > > choice > > > > or > > > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there > > > > not been > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many > > stalwarts > > > > must > > > > > > not > > > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know > > > > better > > > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the > > > > forum > > > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the > > > > people - > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great > > > > sanskrit > > > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > > > > have any > > > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include > > the > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > > > chart) " just > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results > > for " aspects of > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when > > > > planets > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by > > the > > > > > > > > sages; > > > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 > > > > charts - > > > > > > > > can be > > > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 > > > > chart. > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically > > include > > > > the > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > >>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > > > > because > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than > > other > > > > > > amsas > > > > > > > > due > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > > the > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the > > > > strength of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > > > > > > importance. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > > chart > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in > > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > > (There > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > > treated > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it > > only > > > > > > means > > > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means > > that. > > > > It is > > > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > > as > > > > well? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in > > Navamsa 'chart'. > > > > But > > > > > > yes > > > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > > > > Because it > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to > > > > predict > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses > > are > > > > not > > > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts > > > > about > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > > > Seetharama > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > > > importance of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > > > > experience > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not > > > > understood > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart > > being > > > > so > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > > the > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > > chart > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > > treated > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > > as > > > > well? > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make > > > > up two > > > > > > > > equal > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa > > > > Chart. > > > > > > > > What I > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > > > importance? > > > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one > > of > > > > many > > > > > > > > varga > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa > > and > > > > both > > > > > > of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > > > > valuable > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. > > I > > > > would > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa > > > > chart > > > > > > > > alone > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found > > > > both the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as > > very > > > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi > > > > chart), > > > > > > since > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent > > results > > > > if the > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if > > the > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned > > in > > > > > > several > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that > > > > yogas > > > > > > > > viewed > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > > > > chart for > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart > > as a > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the > > purpose of > > > > > > > > checking > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and > > aspects) > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana > > > > should > > > > > > be > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual > > > > influence > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. > > > > span. of > > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own > > > > house > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa > > > > chart, it > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > Why > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that > > because, > > > > even > > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still > > its > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > > > > weakened > > > > > > > > it; > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is > > the > > > > > > weakest > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it > > > > loses its > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > > > > strengths > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. > > The > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement > > > > within > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to > > > > both > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is > > weak > > > > in one > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not > > > > give > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > > > > Navamsa; > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the > > extent > > > > that > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the > > > > promise > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in > > > > the > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; > > I > > > > have > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra > > both > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in > > > > the > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented > > by > > > > > > Chandra) > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > > > > sequence > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > > > > opinion > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > > > > considered on > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao > > > > always > > > > > > > > says. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi > > in > > > > the > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my > > > > Sukra is > > > > > > in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice > > beautiful > > > > house, > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > > > > summarize > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > > > necessarily in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or > > K. > > > > N. > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and > > Amshaka > > > > though > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered > > > > that in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > > > understood in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > > > > results of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two > > > > different > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > > > > versed in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this > > contention > > > > of > > > > > > mine > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that > > the > > > > > > results > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > > > > potential > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > > > > grahas in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for > > > > whatever it > > > > > > is > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is > > > > pointing to > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > > > says,Karakamsha > > > > > > has > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another > > meaning. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not > > > > pointing to > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there > > are > > > > some > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting > > > > his view > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not > > preceded > > > > by > > > > > > > > proper > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > > > > previews > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? > > platform=120121 > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Bhaskar ji yes - we all know that it is degree position - that derives all charts. The degrees of planet is, of course the base for chart construction. So there is no confusion on this. Kindly - do not divert the thread. Else, we may miss the important opportunity to learn Shri Pradeep's interpretation model. regards / Prafulla , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish wrote: > > Ultimately, all the calculations of the other Chakras, > Charts, Shadvargas , are based on the original Natal > degreecal position of the planets , > > a) At time of the birth OR > b) in the Natal Chart (One and the same thing, whether > one makes a chart or not)) > > and when we talk of conjunctions, aspects and transits, > it again come back, or co- relates with reference to > the a) Rasi Chakra b) Natal planetary positions at birth > (whether one makes a Rasi Chakra or not,it does not make any > difference), c) wrt the navamsha chart, whether one makes > a representation in form of graph/chart it does not make a > difference. > > But there are few issues to be reckoned, when we talk of > events timings in future ,or after the birth has taken > place- > > a) The natal conjunction,placements,occupations with > reference to sign position and house position , AND > > when we talk of transits > > a) with reference to the Navamsha chakra -whether you > prepare a chart or not, it is immaterial, the quarter > pada of transit would remain same only, which would > effect change in mans life. > > b) with reference to the Natal Chart, whether one prepares > or not the chart is immaterial, the transits on > important degrees would only effect change in mans life. > > c) with reference to the shadvargas, the amsa, which would > not change because again , the critical degreecal positions > of transit have been prepared, wrt the Natal positions > at birth. > > We all should be discussing, how to use such important > points for predictive purposes, which will help the > people like me, to learn more from the > wise members here, like Shri Pradeepji,Shri Chandrasekharji, > Shri Prafullaji and the others whom I have not named. > > I would be more interested, not in what is right or wrong, > with respect to the ancient wisdome, or interpretation of > the same, but how to use your knowledge which you have learnt > from your interpretation,when i sit down to read charts in > future, for the natives who come for help,to me. > > I mean THE APPLICATION PART. > > regards, > Bhaskar. > > > > , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > wrote: > > > > Finally nothing happens in the rashi chart too. > > That is history. The Rashi charts just give the > > pointers the degrees of the natal planets, > > and the Navamsha points, of these degrees, which again > > is converted into degrees for transit purpose and > > observations, and all this happens in the > > sky above. > > > > Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points. > > > > And aspects also same > > > > a) In natal Chart. > > b) In navamsha Chart ???? > > > > So back to square one. > > > > regards, > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was thinking > > > and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha sector was > > > given by Bhaskar ji. > > > > > > Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of transiting > > > planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. > > > > > > Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell them that > > > these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are wrong > > > understandings,will trust. > > > > > > I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all importance and > > > what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. > > > > > > Respect > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > , Chandrashekhar > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree is right. > > > But > > > > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability of the nadi > > > > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the navamshesha. That is > > > the > > > > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava lord. I > > > trust > > > > this is clear. > > > > > > > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and do not > > > claim to > > > > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have corrected a wrong > > > > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the principle as > > > > understood by me earlier but with the type of language flying on > > > the > > > > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish to do so. > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is Guru.Its > > > > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some navamsha.It is in > > > > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo navamsha.As far > > > > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to see the > > > > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the mother/father > > > > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > > > > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see whether a > > > > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its placement.transiting > > > > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > > > > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara rashi,leo > > > > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector within > > > makara > > > > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > > > > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's 3.2 degree > > > > > span. > > > > > > > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi justifying bhavas in > > > > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have to correct > > > > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > > > > > shlokas, > > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So > > > Prafulla > > > > > is right. > > > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a > > > sage > > > > > well > > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > > > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > > > > > sagelike > > > > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not > > > > > english > > > > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in > > > Sanskrit > > > > > with > > > > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the > > > same > > > > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits > > > can > > > > > only > > > > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > > > > rashi.Whether you > > > > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > > > > rashi,they are > > > > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > > > > > amiguity > > > > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - > > > while > > > > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > > > > > Saravali > > > > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which > > > certainly > > > > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert > > > back. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) > > > in > > > > > the > > > > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 > > > chart > > > > > in > > > > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > > > > > referred > > > > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > > > > > document; > > > > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D > > > > > charts > > > > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > important? > > > > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > > > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma > > > > > clearly > > > > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that > > > > > these are > > > > > > > non- > > > > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan > > > > > Varma > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or > > > mercury > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > > > > > obvious > > > > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with > > > > > current > > > > > > > age > > > > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making > > > > > comment, > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with > > > the > > > > > > > > > application > > > > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly > > > the > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read in > > > correct > > > > > way). > > > > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > > > > relevance in > > > > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case > > > > > studies - > > > > > > > > > then at > > > > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > > > > but my > > > > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the > > > views > > > > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > > > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > > > > > business " > > > > > > > > > with my > > > > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > quality > > > > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts > > > > > every > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is > > > > > every > > > > > > > > > chance > > > > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true results - > > > your > > > > > > > > > argument is > > > > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your > > > choice - > > > > > when > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, > > > and > > > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to > > > follow > > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become > > > choice > > > > > or > > > > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there > > > > > not been > > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many > > > stalwarts > > > > > must > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know > > > > > better > > > > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the > > > > > forum > > > > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great > > > > > sanskrit > > > > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > > > > > have any > > > > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include > > > the > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > > > > chart) " just > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results > > > for " aspects of > > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by > > > the > > > > > > > > > sages; > > > > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 > > > > > charts - > > > > > > > > > can be > > > > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically > > > include > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than > > > other > > > > > > > amsas > > > > > > > > > due > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > > > the > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the > > > > > strength of > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > > > > > > > importance. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in > > > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > > > (There > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it > > > only > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means > > > that. > > > > > It is > > > > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > > > as > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in > > > Navamsa 'chart'. > > > > > But > > > > > > > yes > > > > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > > > > > Because it > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to > > > > > predict > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses > > > are > > > > > not > > > > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > > > > Seetharama > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > > > > importance of > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > > > > > experience > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not > > > > > understood > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart > > > being > > > > > so > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > > > the > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > > > as > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make > > > > > up two > > > > > > > > > equal > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa > > > > > Chart. > > > > > > > > > What I > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > > > > importance? > > > > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one > > > of > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > varga > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa > > > and > > > > > both > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > > > > > valuable > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. > > > I > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > alone > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found > > > > > both the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as > > > very > > > > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi > > > > > chart), > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent > > > results > > > > > if the > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if > > > the > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned > > > in > > > > > > > several > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that > > > > > yogas > > > > > > > > > viewed > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > > > > > chart for > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart > > > as a > > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > checking > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and > > > aspects) > > > > > in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana > > > > > should > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual > > > > > influence > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. > > > > > span. of > > > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own > > > > > house > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > Why > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that > > > because, > > > > > even > > > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still > > > its > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > > > > > weakened > > > > > > > > > it; > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is > > > the > > > > > > > weakest > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it > > > > > loses its > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > > > > > strengths > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. > > > The > > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement > > > > > within > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to > > > > > both > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is > > > weak > > > > > in one > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not > > > > > give > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > > > > > Navamsa; > > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the > > > extent > > > > > that > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the > > > > > promise > > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in > > > > > the > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; > > > I > > > > > have > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra > > > both > > > > > in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in > > > > > the > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented > > > by > > > > > > > Chandra) > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > > > > > sequence > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > > > > > opinion > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > > > > > considered on > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao > > > > > always > > > > > > > > > says. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi > > > in > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my > > > > > Sukra is > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice > > > beautiful > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > > > > > summarize > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > > > > necessarily in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or > > > K. > > > > > N. > > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and > > > Amshaka > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered > > > > > that in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > > > > understood in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > > > > > results of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two > > > > > different > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > > > > > versed in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this > > > contention > > > > > of > > > > > > > mine > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that > > > the > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > > > > > potential > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > > > > > grahas in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for > > > > > whatever it > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > > > > says,Karakamsha > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another > > > meaning. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there > > > are > > > > > some > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting > > > > > his view > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > > > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not > > > preceded > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > proper > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > > > > > previews > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? > > > platform=120121 > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Prafullaji, I am nor diverting the thread Sir. Certain mails were addressed to me,and my name appeared in few,therefore I had to reply. They were all saying the same thing, that ultimately the Rasi chart is important, and all transits aspects have to be countered from the Rasi chart, and not the amsa, so all I was trying to put across was, that I and the others all know this basic fact that every other chart is based on the natal chart and degreecal positions of the planets therein. I too am interested in learning the ineterpretation of these expositions, which will help me in my behavior towards my own clients whose charts I am into. If You notice , at the end of the last mail, below your mail, I have clearly and explicitly memntioned that I am only interested in THE APPLICATION PART., and not interested in theories. regards, Bhaskar. , " Prafulla Gang " <jyotish wrote: > > > Dear Bhaskar ji > > yes - we all know that it is degree position - that derives all > charts. The degrees of planet is, of course the base for chart > construction. > > So there is no confusion on this. Kindly - do not divert the thread. > Else, we may miss the important opportunity to learn Shri Pradeep's > interpretation model. > > regards / Prafulla > > , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > wrote: > > > > Ultimately, all the calculations of the other Chakras, > > Charts, Shadvargas , are based on the original Natal > > degreecal position of the planets , > > > > a) At time of the birth OR > > b) in the Natal Chart (One and the same thing, whether > > one makes a chart or not)) > > > > and when we talk of conjunctions, aspects and transits, > > it again come back, or co- relates with reference to > > the a) Rasi Chakra b) Natal planetary positions at birth > > (whether one makes a Rasi Chakra or not,it does not make any > > difference), c) wrt the navamsha chart, whether one makes > > a representation in form of graph/chart it does not make a > > difference. > > > > But there are few issues to be reckoned, when we talk of > > events timings in future ,or after the birth has taken > > place- > > > > a) The natal conjunction,placements,occupations with > > reference to sign position and house position , AND > > > > when we talk of transits > > > > a) with reference to the Navamsha chakra -whether you > > prepare a chart or not, it is immaterial, the quarter > > pada of transit would remain same only, which would > > effect change in mans life. > > > > b) with reference to the Natal Chart, whether one prepares > > or not the chart is immaterial, the transits on > > important degrees would only effect change in mans life. > > > > c) with reference to the shadvargas, the amsa, which would > > not change because again , the critical degreecal positions > > of transit have been prepared, wrt the Natal positions > > at birth. > > > > We all should be discussing, how to use such important > > points for predictive purposes, which will help the > > people like me, to learn more from the > > wise members here, like Shri Pradeepji,Shri Chandrasekharji, > > Shri Prafullaji and the others whom I have not named. > > > > I would be more interested, not in what is right or wrong, > > with respect to the ancient wisdome, or interpretation of > > the same, but how to use your knowledge which you have learnt > > from your interpretation,when i sit down to read charts in > > future, for the natives who come for help,to me. > > > > I mean THE APPLICATION PART. > > > > regards, > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Finally nothing happens in the rashi chart too. > > > That is history. The Rashi charts just give the > > > pointers the degrees of the natal planets, > > > and the Navamsha points, of these degrees, which again > > > is converted into degrees for transit purpose and > > > observations, and all this happens in the > > > sky above. > > > > > > Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points. > > > > > > And aspects also same > > > > > > a) In natal Chart. > > > b) In navamsha Chart ???? > > > > > > So back to square one. > > > > > > regards, > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > > > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was thinking > > > > and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha sector > was > > > > given by Bhaskar ji. > > > > > > > > Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of transiting > > > > planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. > > > > > > > > Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell them > that > > > > these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are wrong > > > > understandings,will trust. > > > > > > > > I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all importance and > > > > what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Chandrashekhar > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree is right. > > > > But > > > > > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability of the > nadi > > > > > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the navamshesha. That is > > > > the > > > > > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava lord. I > > > > trust > > > > > this is clear. > > > > > > > > > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and do not > > > > claim to > > > > > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have corrected a wrong > > > > > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the > principle as > > > > > understood by me earlier but with the type of language flying on > > > > the > > > > > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish to do so. > > > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is Guru.Its > > > > > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some navamsha.It is in > > > > > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo > navamsha.As far > > > > > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to see the > > > > > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the > mother/father > > > > > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see whether a > > > > > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its > placement.transiting > > > > > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara rashi,leo > > > > > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector within > > > > makara > > > > > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > > > > > > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's 3.2 > degree > > > > > > span. > > > > > > > > > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi justifying > bhavas in > > > > > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have to > correct > > > > > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > > > > > > shlokas, > > > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So > > > > Prafulla > > > > > > is right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a > > > > sage > > > > > > well > > > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to > what you > > > > > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in > varga > > > > > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > > > > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > > > > > > sagelike > > > > > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not > > > > > > english > > > > > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in > > > > Sanskrit > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots > back to > > > > > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For > the > > > > same > > > > > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits > > > > can > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > > > > > rashi.Whether you > > > > > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > > > > > rashi,they are > > > > > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > > > > > > amiguity > > > > > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - > > > > while > > > > > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > > > > > > Saravali > > > > > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which > > > > certainly > > > > > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert > > > > back. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular > rashis) > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 > > > > chart > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > > > > > > referred > > > > > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > > > > > > document; > > > > > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the > use of D > > > > > > charts > > > > > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > > > > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan > Varma > > > > > > clearly > > > > > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that > > > > > > these are > > > > > > > > non- > > > > > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - > kalyan > > > > > > Varma > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli > - the > > > > > > obvious > > > > > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with > > > > > > current > > > > > > > > age > > > > > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making > > > > > > comment, > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove > with > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > application > > > > > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly > > > > the > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read in > > > > correct > > > > > > way). > > > > > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > > > > > relevance in > > > > > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case > > > > > > studies - > > > > > > > > > > then at > > > > > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > > > > > but my > > > > > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the > > > > views > > > > > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > > > > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on > " shloka > > > > > > > > business " > > > > > > > > > > with my > > > > > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > > quality > > > > > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case > studies. > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts > > > > > > every > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, > there is > > > > > > every > > > > > > > > > > chance > > > > > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true results - > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > argument is > > > > > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your > > > > choice - > > > > > > when > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to > > > > follow > > > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become > > > > choice > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had > there > > > > > > not been > > > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many > > > > stalwarts > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us > on the > > > > > > forum > > > > > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to > contest the > > > > > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great > > > > > > sanskrit > > > > > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments > may not > > > > > > have any > > > > > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically > include > > > > the > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > > > > > chart) " just > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results > > > > for " aspects of > > > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as > taught by > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > sages; > > > > > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 > > > > > > charts - > > > > > > > > > > can be > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just > like D1 > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically > > > > include > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart > is so > > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa > chart is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. > > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can > never be, > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than > > > > other > > > > > > > > amsas > > > > > > > > > > due > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa > determines > > > > the > > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the > > > > > > strength of > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per > their > > > > > > > > > > importance. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in > > > > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > > > > (There > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart > can be > > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it > > > > only > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means > > > > that. > > > > > > It is > > > > > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa > chart > > > > as > > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in > > > > Navamsa 'chart'. > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > yes > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > > > > > > Because it > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to > > > > > > predict > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and > houses > > > > are > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses > should be > > > > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are > referring to > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > > > > > Seetharama > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > > > > > importance of > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that > > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > > > > > > experience > > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not > > > > > > understood > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart > > > > being > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa > determines > > > > the > > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart > can be > > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa > chart > > > > as > > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa > chart make > > > > > > up two > > > > > > > > > > equal > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa > > > > > > Chart. > > > > > > > > > > What I > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > > > > > importance? > > > > > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is > one > > > > of > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > > varga > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa > > > > and > > > > > > both > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you > for your > > > > > > > > valuable > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological > community. > > > > I > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > alone > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found > > > > > > both the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa > chart as > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi > > > > > > chart), > > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent > > > > results > > > > > > if the > > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if > > > > the > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also > mentioned > > > > in > > > > > > > > several > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and > books that > > > > > > yogas > > > > > > > > > > viewed > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > > > > > > chart for > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa > chart > > > > as a > > > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > checking > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and > > > > aspects) > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or > veekshana > > > > > > should > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual > > > > > > influence > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. > > > > > > span. of > > > > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or > in own > > > > > > house > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown > in the > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > Why > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that > > > > because, > > > > > > even > > > > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, > still > > > > its > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here > navamsa) has > > > > > > weakened > > > > > > > > > > it; > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is > > > > the > > > > > > > > weakest > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it > > > > > > loses its > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a > gradation of > > > > > > > > strengths > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. > > > > The > > > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined > placement > > > > > > within > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal > weightage to > > > > > > both > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is > > > > weak > > > > > > in one > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We > may not > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we > give to > > > > > > Navamsa; > > > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the > > > > extent > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the > > > > > > promise > > > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, > yogas in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected > results; > > > > I > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra > > > > both > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart > (not in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi > (represented > > > > by > > > > > > > > Chandra) > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be > explained. The > > > > > > sequence > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting > Pradeep's > > > > > > opinion > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > > > > > > considered on > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri > KN Rao > > > > > > always > > > > > > > > > > says. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific > rasi > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my > > > > > > Sukra is > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice > > > > beautiful > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge > only to > > > > > > > > summarize > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > > > > > necessarily in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either > Sanjay or > > > > K. > > > > > > N. > > > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and > > > > Amshaka > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered > > > > > > that in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > > > > > understood in > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > > > > > > results of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other > places in > > > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two > > > > > > different > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > > > > > > versed in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this > > > > contention > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > mine > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that > > > > the > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference > to the > > > > > > > > potential > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > > > > > > grahas in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big > storm in > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for > > > > > > whatever it > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is > > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > > > > > says,Karakamsha > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another > > > > meaning. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not > > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as > there > > > > are > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has > overlooked,contradicting > > > > > > his view > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > > > > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not > > > > preceded > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > proper > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 > news and > > > > > > > > previews > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? > > > > platform=120121 > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Bhaskar ji But the transit that you are talking w.r to navamsha points are exact natal positions.Sphuta of a planet.On the other hand when you see navamsha arrangement you are studying the link and not astronomical placement as Dr.Raman has said. Aspects are not based on such imaginary patterns.Amsha Rashi link is through tattwa sambandha.For aspects rules are clear and they are based on Rashi dispositions. Regds Pradeep -- In , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish wrote: > > //Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points.// > > Re-read above as - > b) transit with reference to Navamsha points. > > > > > > , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > wrote: > > > > Finally nothing happens in the rashi chart too. > > That is history. The Rashi charts just give the > > pointers the degrees of the natal planets, > > and the Navamsha points, of these degrees, which again > > is converted into degrees for transit purpose and > > observations, and all this happens in the > > sky above. > > > > Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points. > > > > And aspects also same > > > > a) In natal Chart. > > b) In navamsha Chart ???? > > > > So back to square one. > > > > regards, > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was thinking > > > and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha sector was > > > given by Bhaskar ji. > > > > > > Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of transiting > > > planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. > > > > > > Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell them that > > > these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are wrong > > > understandings,will trust. > > > > > > I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all importance and > > > what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. > > > > > > Respect > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > , Chandrashekhar > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree is right. > > > But > > > > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability of the nadi > > > > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the navamshesha. That is > > > the > > > > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava lord. I > > > trust > > > > this is clear. > > > > > > > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and do not > > > claim to > > > > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have corrected a wrong > > > > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the principle as > > > > understood by me earlier but with the type of language flying on > > > the > > > > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish to do so. > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is Guru.Its > > > > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some navamsha.It is in > > > > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo navamsha.As far > > > > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to see the > > > > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the mother/father > > > > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > > > > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see whether a > > > > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its placement.transiting > > > > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > > > > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara rashi,leo > > > > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector within > > > makara > > > > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > > > > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's 3.2 degree > > > > > span. > > > > > > > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi justifying bhavas in > > > > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have to correct > > > > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > > > > > shlokas, > > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So > > > Prafulla > > > > > is right. > > > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a > > > sage > > > > > well > > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > > > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > > > > > sagelike > > > > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not > > > > > english > > > > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in > > > Sanskrit > > > > > with > > > > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the > > > same > > > > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits > > > can > > > > > only > > > > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > > > > rashi.Whether you > > > > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > > > > rashi,they are > > > > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > > > > > amiguity > > > > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - > > > while > > > > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > > > > > Saravali > > > > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which > > > certainly > > > > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert > > > back. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) > > > in > > > > > the > > > > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 > > > chart > > > > > in > > > > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > > > > > referred > > > > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > > > > > document; > > > > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D > > > > > charts > > > > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > important? > > > > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > > > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma > > > > > clearly > > > > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that > > > > > these are > > > > > > > non- > > > > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan > > > > > Varma > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or > > > mercury > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > > > > > obvious > > > > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with > > > > > current > > > > > > > age > > > > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making > > > > > comment, > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with > > > the > > > > > > > > > application > > > > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly > > > the > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read in > > > correct > > > > > way). > > > > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > > > > relevance in > > > > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case > > > > > studies - > > > > > > > > > then at > > > > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > > > > but my > > > > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the > > > views > > > > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > > > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > > > > > business " > > > > > > > > > with my > > > > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > quality > > > > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts > > > > > every > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is > > > > > every > > > > > > > > > chance > > > > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true results - > > > your > > > > > > > > > argument is > > > > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your > > > choice - > > > > > when > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, > > > and > > > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to > > > follow > > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become > > > choice > > > > > or > > > > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there > > > > > not been > > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many > > > stalwarts > > > > > must > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know > > > > > better > > > > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the > > > > > forum > > > > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great > > > > > sanskrit > > > > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > > > > > have any > > > > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include > > > the > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > > > > chart) " just > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results > > > for " aspects of > > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by > > > the > > > > > > > > > sages; > > > > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 > > > > > charts - > > > > > > > > > can be > > > > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically > > > include > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than > > > other > > > > > > > amsas > > > > > > > > > due > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > > > the > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the > > > > > strength of > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > > > > > > > importance. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in > > > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > > > (There > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it > > > only > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means > > > that. > > > > > It is > > > > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > > > as > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in > > > Navamsa 'chart'. > > > > > But > > > > > > > yes > > > > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > > > > > Because it > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to > > > > > predict > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses > > > are > > > > > not > > > > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > > > > Seetharama > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > > > > importance of > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > > > > > experience > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not > > > > > understood > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart > > > being > > > > > so > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines > > > the > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart > > > as > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make > > > > > up two > > > > > > > > > equal > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa > > > > > Chart. > > > > > > > > > What I > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > > > > importance? > > > > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one > > > of > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > varga > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa > > > and > > > > > both > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > > > > > valuable > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. > > > I > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > alone > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found > > > > > both the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as > > > very > > > > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi > > > > > chart), > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent > > > results > > > > > if the > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if > > > the > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned > > > in > > > > > > > several > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that > > > > > yogas > > > > > > > > > viewed > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > > > > > chart for > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart > > > as a > > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > checking > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and > > > aspects) > > > > > in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana > > > > > should > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual > > > > > influence > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. > > > > > span. of > > > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own > > > > > house > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > Why > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that > > > because, > > > > > even > > > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still > > > its > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > > > > > weakened > > > > > > > > > it; > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is > > > the > > > > > > > weakest > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it > > > > > loses its > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > > > > > strengths > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. > > > The > > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement > > > > > within > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to > > > > > both > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is > > > weak > > > > > in one > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not > > > > > give > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > > > > > Navamsa; > > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the > > > extent > > > > > that > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the > > > > > promise > > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in > > > > > the > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; > > > I > > > > > have > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra > > > both > > > > > in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in > > > > > the > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented > > > by > > > > > > > Chandra) > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > > > > > sequence > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > > > > > opinion > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > > > > > considered on > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao > > > > > always > > > > > > > > > says. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi > > > in > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my > > > > > Sukra is > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice > > > beautiful > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > > > > > summarize > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > > > > necessarily in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or > > > K. > > > > > N. > > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and > > > Amshaka > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered > > > > > that in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > > > > understood in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > > > > > results of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two > > > > > different > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > > > > > versed in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this > > > contention > > > > > of > > > > > > > mine > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that > > > the > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > > > > > potential > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > > > > > grahas in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for > > > > > whatever it > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > > > > says,Karakamsha > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another > > > meaning. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there > > > are > > > > > some > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting > > > > > his view > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > > > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not > > > preceded > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > proper > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > > > > > previews > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? > > > platform=120121 > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Chandrashekhar ji I respect your views.Me too gives importance to what is being said than who is saying,though who is talking has its own share of importance. Thus my intention was not to rate sages.I had to do this as ,i am no man.My views are not considered worth by many,even if i am logically presenting with the help of paramanas.Thus i have to rely on scholars who lived before contemporary astrologers. Even though this is your personal opinion,i respect it as it is the correct approach and we should not rate them.we have to see what they are talking. Respect Pradeep , Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46 wrote: > > Dear Pradeep, > > Everyone of them is worthy of respect, as far as I am concerned. However > I do not get into the habit of giving more importance to one or the > other. If you do that on the basis of who praises whom, then with the > list you have suggested, you will have to accept Satyacharya whom Varaha > Mihira quotes as authority. same with Yavanacharya and Jeevsharma. > > Once we get into the habit of rating authorities in jyotish, we may get > into the habit of assuming that Jyotish knowledge is restricted to only > a few texts. that is certainly not the case. it is said that " laxaM > vyakaranam proktaM chaturlaxam tu jyotisham " . > > Of course this is my personal opinion and others can hold a different view. > > take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > How about shrutakeerthi and jeevasharma.How about dashadhyayi which > > prashnamarga is praising.How about Varhamihira,which shri Rath too > > agrees(he cannot disgree as they are so evident) that amshaka has to > > be seen from rashi. > > > > Respect > > Pradeep > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > > shlokas, > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So Prafulla > > is right. > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a sage > > well > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > > sagelike > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not > > english > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in Sanskrit > > with > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the same > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits can > > only > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > rashi.Whether you > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > rashi,they are > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > > amiguity > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - while > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > > Saravali > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which certainly > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert back. > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) in > > the > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 chart > > in > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > > referred > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > > document; > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D > > charts > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma > > clearly > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half > > aspect > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that > > these are > > > > non- > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > too > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan > > Varma > > > > has > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury > > > > aspecting > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > > obvious > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > >> > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with > > current > > > > age > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > >> > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > >>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important? > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making > > comment, > > > > be > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the > > > > > > application > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the > > wrong > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read in correct > > way). > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > relevance in > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case > > studies - > > > > > > then at > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > but my > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > > business " > > > > > > with my > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following > > better > > > > > > quality > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > >>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important? > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts > > every > > > > one > > > > > > is > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is > > every > > > > > > chance > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true results - your > > > > > > argument is > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - > > when > > > > > > you > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and > > > > > > understand > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow > > > > someone > > > > > > who > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice > > or > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there > > not been > > > > > > any > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts > > must > > > > not > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know > > better > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the > > forum > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the > > people - > > > > > > must > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great > > sanskrit > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > > have any > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > > right > > > > > > to > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > >>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important? > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > chart) " just > > > > > > like > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of > > > > > > planets > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when > > planets > > > > > > are > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the > > > > > > sages; > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using > > navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 > > charts - > > > > > > can be > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 > > chart. > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include > > the > > > > > > right > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > >>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. > > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > > because > > > > > > it > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other > > > > amsas > > > > > > due > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > > overall > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the > > strength of > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > > > > importance. > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > chart > > > > > > like > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in > > Navamsa. > > > > > > (There > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > treated > > > > > > as > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only > > > > means > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. > > It is > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as > > well? > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. > > But > > > > yes > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > > Because it > > > > > > is > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to > > predict > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are > > not > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > > > > considered > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts > > about > > > > > > aspect > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to > > Rasi > > > > > > chart. > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > Seetharama > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > importance of > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that > > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > > experience > > > > > > so > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not > > understood > > > > > > what > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being > > so > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > > overall > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > > chart > > > > > > like > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > treated > > > > > > as > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as > > well? > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make > > up two > > > > > > equal > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa > > Chart. > > > > > > What I > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > importance? > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of > > many > > > > > > varga > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and > > both > > > > of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > > valuable > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I > > would > > > > > > like > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa > > chart > > > > > > alone > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found > > both the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > > separate > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi > > chart), > > > > since > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results > > if the > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the > > Rasi > > > > > > chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in > > > > several > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that > > yogas > > > > > > viewed > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > > chart for > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a > > > > > > separate > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of > > > > > > checking > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) > > in > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana > > should > > > > be > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual > > influence > > > > at > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. > > span. of > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own > > house > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa > > chart, it > > > > is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the > > Rasi. > > > > Why > > > > > > is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, > > even > > > > > > though > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > > weakened > > > > > > it; > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the > > > > weakest > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it > > loses its > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > > strengths > > > > > > for > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The > > > > navamsa > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement > > within > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to > > both > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak > > in one > > > > > > of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not > > give > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > > Navamsa; > > > > > > but > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent > > that > > > > it > > > > > > can > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the > > promise > > > > > > given > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in > > the > > > > rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I > > have > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both > > in > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in > > the > > > > rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the > > karakamsa > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by > > > > Chandra) > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the > > karakamsa > > > > is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > > sequence > > > > > > of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider > > karakamsa > > > > > > lagna > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > > opinion > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > > considered on > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao > > always > > > > > > says. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in > > the > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my > > Sukra is > > > > in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful > > house, > > > > > > and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > traditional > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > > summarize > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > necessarily in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. > > N. > > > > Rao. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka > > though > > > > > > it > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered > > that in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > understood in > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning > > karakamsha > > > > and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > > results of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > > karakamsha > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two > > different > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > > versed in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention > > of > > > > mine > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the > > > > results > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > > potential > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > > grahas in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for > > whatever it > > > > is > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is > > pointing to > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > says,Karakamsha > > > > has > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not > > pointing to > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are > > some > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting > > his view > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded > > by > > > > > > proper > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > > previews > > > > > > at > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Pradeepji, All transits would naturally be seen through some or the other Rashi only in the sky.These rashis of the sky can be again interpolated in the Natal Chart in some or the other sign (Rashi). Since the zodiac is made of 360degrees divided by 12 compartment, leaving no space for any other compartment,tge transit has to be in some or the other Rashi. But the above is not what youa told me about and neither our contention. I have nowhere mentioned that aspects happen in imaginary positions, but always mantained, that the intensity would be felt by native in transit through the pada or quarter of the mentioned,planet. //Aspects are based on rashi dispositions?? Partly the above statement may be right, but does not contain the whole story. Aspects are also based on Raashi dispositors. (Example- Saturn crossing the exact degrees of Natal Sun in transit, is going to produce either death or ill health to one of the elder male members of the family. In this case Sun is the dispositor of some Raashi. Same addects may be experienced in disposition of above in trine aspects too.) (I can give you this shloka from Chandrakala Nadi within 5 minutes but spare me the trouble. Most of the members who know me, also know that I do not talk without base) What is aspect ? Aspect can also be a conjunction. Is it not ? A conjunction can also be deemed as a close aspect. Is it not ? Anyway,Chandrakala Nadi- verse 3124, verse 2044,verse 2045 and verse 2385 (I can quote the shlokas here with their translations) have exclusively given predictive rules through CHANDRA NAVAMSA RASI) regards, Bhaskar. , " vijayadas_pradeep " <vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > Dear Bhaskar ji > > But the transit that you are talking w.r to navamsha points are > exact natal positions.Sphuta of a planet.On the other hand when you > see navamsha arrangement you are studying the link and not > astronomical placement as Dr.Raman has said. > > Aspects are not based on such imaginary patterns.Amsha Rashi link is > through tattwa sambandha.For aspects rules are clear and they are > based on Rashi dispositions. > > Regds > Pradeep > > -- In , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > wrote: > > > > //Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points.// > > > > Re-read above as - > > b) transit with reference to Navamsha points. > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Finally nothing happens in the rashi chart too. > > > That is history. The Rashi charts just give the > > > pointers the degrees of the natal planets, > > > and the Navamsha points, of these degrees, which again > > > is converted into degrees for transit purpose and > > > observations, and all this happens in the > > > sky above. > > > > > > Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points. > > > > > > And aspects also same > > > > > > a) In natal Chart. > > > b) In navamsha Chart ???? > > > > > > So back to square one. > > > > > > regards, > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > > > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was > thinking > > > > and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha > sector was > > > > given by Bhaskar ji. > > > > > > > > Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of > transiting > > > > planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. > > > > > > > > Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell > them that > > > > these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are > wrong > > > > understandings,will trust. > > > > > > > > I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all > importance and > > > > what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Chandrashekhar > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree is > right. > > > > But > > > > > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability of > the nadi > > > > > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the navamshesha. > That is > > > > the > > > > > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava > lord. I > > > > trust > > > > > this is clear. > > > > > > > > > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and do > not > > > > claim to > > > > > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have corrected a > wrong > > > > > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the > principle as > > > > > understood by me earlier but with the type of language > flying on > > > > the > > > > > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish to > do so. > > > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is Guru.Its > > > > > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some navamsha.It > is in > > > > > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo > navamsha.As far > > > > > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to see > the > > > > > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the > mother/father > > > > > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see > whether a > > > > > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its > placement.transiting > > > > > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara > rashi,leo > > > > > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector > within > > > > makara > > > > > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > > > > > > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's 3.2 > degree > > > > > > span. > > > > > > > > > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi justifying > bhavas in > > > > > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have to > correct > > > > > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi > Sanskrit > > > > > > shlokas, > > > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas > of the > > > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So > > > > Prafulla > > > > > > is right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but > was a > > > > sage > > > > > > well > > > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to > what you > > > > > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects > in varga > > > > > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > > > > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma > and > > > > > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi > but by > > > > > > sagelike > > > > > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were > not > > > > > > english > > > > > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in > > > > Sanskrit > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots > back to > > > > > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other > rashis.For the > > > > same > > > > > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi > chart.Transits > > > > can > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > > > > > rashi.Whether you > > > > > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > > > > > rashi,they are > > > > > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there > is no > > > > > > amiguity > > > > > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial > aspect - > > > > while > > > > > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for > reference in > > > > > > Saravali > > > > > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion > (which > > > > certainly > > > > > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and > revert > > > > back. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular > rashis) > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess > Vahanas > > > > > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use > of D9 > > > > chart > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where > aspects are > > > > > > referred > > > > > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive > astrology > > > > > > document; > > > > > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the > use of D > > > > > > charts > > > > > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important? > > > > > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > > > > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter > Kalyan Varma > > > > > > clearly > > > > > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter > aspect,half > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear > that > > > > > > these are > > > > > > > > non- > > > > > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - > kalyan > > > > > > Varma > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; > or > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi > Kundli - the > > > > > > obvious > > > > > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at > par with > > > > > > current > > > > > > > > age > > > > > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is > so > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person > making > > > > > > comment, > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they > prove with > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > application > > > > > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - > firstly > > > > the > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read > in > > > > correct > > > > > > way). > > > > > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > > > > > relevance in > > > > > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by > case > > > > > > studies - > > > > > > > > > > then at > > > > > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " > to > > > > > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > > > > > but my > > > > > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to > accept the > > > > views > > > > > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > > > > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - > as I do > > > > > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time > on " shloka > > > > > > > > business " > > > > > > > > > > with my > > > > > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be > following > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > > quality > > > > > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case > studies. > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is > so > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient > texts > > > > > > every > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, > there is > > > > > > every > > > > > > > > > > chance > > > > > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true > results - > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > argument is > > > > > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your > > > > choice - > > > > > > when > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your > self, > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have > to > > > > follow > > > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues > become > > > > choice > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. > Had there > > > > > > not been > > > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many > > > > stalwarts > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them > know > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us > on the > > > > > > forum > > > > > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to > contest the > > > > > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts > are the > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many > great > > > > > > sanskrit > > > > > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments > may not > > > > > > have any > > > > > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically > include > > > > the > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart > is so > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > > > > > chart) " just > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results > > > > for " aspects of > > > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be > predicted when > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa > lagna " > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as > taught by > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > sages; > > > > > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts > using > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to > assess D9 > > > > > > charts - > > > > > > > > > > can be > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just > like D1 > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not > automatically > > > > include > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa > Chart is so > > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa > chart is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only > Navamsa. > > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can > never be, > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important > than > > > > other > > > > > > > > amsas > > > > > > > > > > due > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa > determines > > > > the > > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines > the > > > > > > strength of > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as > per their > > > > > > > > > > importance. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects > in > > > > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > > > > (There > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa > chart can be > > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in > Navamsa, it > > > > only > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only > means > > > > that. > > > > > > It is > > > > > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa > chart > > > > as > > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in > > > > Navamsa 'chart'. > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > yes > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken > yoga. > > > > > > Because it > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are > used to > > > > > > predict > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and > houses > > > > are > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses > should be > > > > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient > texts > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are > referring to > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > > > > > Seetharama > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > > > > > importance of > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view > that > > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based > on my > > > > > > experience > > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still > not > > > > > > understood > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga > chart > > > > being > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa > determines > > > > the > > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa > chart can be > > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa > chart > > > > as > > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given > to > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa > chart make > > > > > > up two > > > > > > > > > > equal > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of > Navamsa > > > > > > Chart. > > > > > > > > > > What I > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains > such an > > > > > > > > importance? > > > > > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it > is one > > > > of > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > > varga > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on > karakamsa > > > > and > > > > > > both > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you > for your > > > > > > > > valuable > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological > community. > > > > I > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own > experience). > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or > Navamsa > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > alone > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I > found > > > > > > both the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is > making as > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa > chart as > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the > Rasi > > > > > > chart), > > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give > independent > > > > results > > > > > > if the > > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not > exist if > > > > the > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also > mentioned > > > > in > > > > > > > > several > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and > books that > > > > > > yogas > > > > > > > > > > viewed > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the > Navamsa > > > > > > chart for > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa > chart > > > > as a > > > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > checking > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction > and > > > > aspects) > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or > veekshana > > > > > > should > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as > mutual > > > > > > influence > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a > 30 deg. > > > > > > span. of > > > > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated > or in own > > > > > > house > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the > Navamsa > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown > in the > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > Why > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that > > > > because, > > > > > > even > > > > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, > still > > > > its > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here > navamsa) has > > > > > > weakened > > > > > > > > > > it; > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular > sector is > > > > the > > > > > > > > weakest > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; > hence it > > > > > > loses its > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a > gradation of > > > > > > > > strengths > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last > navamsa. > > > > The > > > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined > placement > > > > > > within > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal > weightage to > > > > > > both > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a > planet is > > > > weak > > > > > > in one > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We > may not > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we > give to > > > > > > Navamsa; > > > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to > the > > > > extent > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to > confirm the > > > > > > promise > > > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, > yogas in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected > results; > > > > I > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and > Sukra > > > > both > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart > (not in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as > the > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi > (represented > > > > by > > > > > > > > Chandra) > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). > If the > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be > explained. The > > > > > > sequence > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I > consider > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting > Pradeep's > > > > > > opinion > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to > be > > > > > > considered on > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri > KN Rao > > > > > > always > > > > > > > > > > says. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the > specific rasi > > > > in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa > lagna, my > > > > > > Sukra is > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice > > > > beautiful > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to > other > > > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge > only to > > > > > > > > summarize > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > > > > > necessarily in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either > Sanjay or > > > > K. > > > > > > N. > > > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha > and > > > > Amshaka > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be > remembered > > > > > > that in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > > > > > understood in > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara > mentioning > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while > indicating the > > > > > > results of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other > places in > > > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about > two > > > > > > different > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is > also well > > > > > > versed in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this > > > > contention > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > mine > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think > that > > > > the > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without > reference to the > > > > > > > > potential > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived > by the > > > > > > grahas in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not > likely to > > > > > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big > storm in > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, > for > > > > > > whatever it > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected > members > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka > is > > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > > > > > says,Karakamsha > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has > another > > > > meaning. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is > not > > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as > there > > > > are > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has > overlooked,contradicting > > > > > > his view > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > > > > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not > > > > preceded > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > proper > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 > news and > > > > > > > > previews > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? > > > > platform=120121 > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Bhaskar ji Thanks again for the encouragement given in other mails. Now regarding this mail -We should understand the context of this discussion. 1)Can aspects be seen from navamsha arrangement?Does the rules allow that? No.I cannot see such from the usage of giants who lived 1000's of years ago.Even BPHS translator had the same view. 2)During analysis ,does amshas have to be seen w.r to root rashis.Yes,bhavas are always from Rashi.It has been demonstrated in numerous examples.Lagna shadvargake shloka is the perfect example. 3)Transits -Your mail clearly says -Chandra Navamsha Rashi.Thus transit can be seen from the RASHI -on to which chandra is having amsha.This has been the whole topic that i have been discussing.I told chandrashekhar ji that Parashara has mentioned ''Meshadi rashige Swamshe''. Now the question is why should transit over the rashi on to which Chandra is having navamsha effect in certain results.they have amsha- Rashi sambandha.If this is understood ,then we will know why K.N.Raoji takes karakamsha from Lagna.What Lagna shadvargake shloka means etc etc. I hope it is clear now. I am talking about the definition of drishti (which includes 7th normal plus special aspects). Pls read my mail to chandrashekhar ji -where i have clearly told - transit to be seen from Leo Rashi is the common way. On the other hand what you have demonstrated is another usage of transit conjunction. Both of these does not need navamsha arrangement.On the other hand if you try to see aspects ,it is imaginary.You are trying to start an aspect from a rashi where the graha is not placed.Graha is elsewheer ,and relates to that rashi.This sambandha itself is a kind of ''aspect''.You cannot see drishti from there. Regds Pradeep , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish wrote: > > Dear Pradeepji, > > All transits would naturally be seen through some > or the other Rashi only in the sky.These > rashis of the sky can be again > interpolated in the Natal Chart > in some or the other sign (Rashi). Since the zodiac > is made of 360degrees divided by 12 compartment, > leaving no space for any other compartment,tge > transit has to be in some or the other Rashi. > But the above is not what youa told me about > and neither our contention. > > I have nowhere mentioned that aspects happen in > imaginary positions, but always mantained, that the > intensity would be felt by native in transit through > the pada or quarter of the mentioned,planet. > > //Aspects are based on rashi dispositions?? > Partly the above statement may be right, > but does not contain the whole story. > > Aspects are also based on Raashi dispositors. > (Example- Saturn crossing the exact degrees of > Natal Sun in transit, > is going to produce either death or ill health > to one of the elder male members of the family. > In this case Sun is the dispositor of some Raashi. > Same addects may be experienced in disposition of > above in trine aspects too.) > (I can give you this shloka from Chandrakala Nadi > within 5 minutes but spare me the trouble. Most of > the members who know me, also know that I do not > talk without base) > > What is aspect ? > Aspect can also be a conjunction. Is it not ? > A conjunction can also be deemed as a close aspect. > Is it not ? > > Anyway,Chandrakala Nadi- > verse 3124, verse 2044,verse 2045 and verse > 2385 (I can quote the shlokas here with their > translations) have exclusively given predictive > rules through CHANDRA NAVAMSA RASI) > > regards, > Bhaskar. > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > Dear Bhaskar ji > > > > But the transit that you are talking w.r to navamsha points are > > exact natal positions.Sphuta of a planet.On the other hand when you > > see navamsha arrangement you are studying the link and not > > astronomical placement as Dr.Raman has said. > > > > Aspects are not based on such imaginary patterns.Amsha Rashi link is > > through tattwa sambandha.For aspects rules are clear and they are > > based on Rashi dispositions. > > > > Regds > > Pradeep > > > > -- In , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > > wrote: > > > > > > //Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points.// > > > > > > Re-read above as - > > > b) transit with reference to Navamsha points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Finally nothing happens in the rashi chart too. > > > > That is history. The Rashi charts just give the > > > > pointers the degrees of the natal planets, > > > > and the Navamsha points, of these degrees, which again > > > > is converted into degrees for transit purpose and > > > > observations, and all this happens in the > > > > sky above. > > > > > > > > Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points. > > > > > > > > And aspects also same > > > > > > > > a) In natal Chart. > > > > b) In navamsha Chart ???? > > > > > > > > So back to square one. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > > > > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was > > thinking > > > > > and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha > > sector was > > > > > given by Bhaskar ji. > > > > > > > > > > Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of > > transiting > > > > > planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. > > > > > > > > > > Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell > > them that > > > > > these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are > > wrong > > > > > understandings,will trust. > > > > > > > > > > I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all > > importance and > > > > > what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. > > > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Chandrashekhar > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree is > > right. > > > > > But > > > > > > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability of > > the nadi > > > > > > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the navamshesha. > > That is > > > > > the > > > > > > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava > > lord. I > > > > > trust > > > > > > this is clear. > > > > > > > > > > > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and do > > not > > > > > claim to > > > > > > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have corrected a > > wrong > > > > > > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the > > principle as > > > > > > understood by me earlier but with the type of language > > flying on > > > > > the > > > > > > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish to > > do so. > > > > > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is Guru.Its > > > > > > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some navamsha.It > > is in > > > > > > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo > > navamsha.As far > > > > > > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to see > > the > > > > > > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the > > mother/father > > > > > > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see > > whether a > > > > > > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its > > placement.transiting > > > > > > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara > > rashi,leo > > > > > > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector > > within > > > > > makara > > > > > > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's 3.2 > > degree > > > > > > > span. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi justifying > > bhavas in > > > > > > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have to > > correct > > > > > > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi > > Sanskrit > > > > > > > shlokas, > > > > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas > > of the > > > > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So > > > > > Prafulla > > > > > > > is right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but > > was a > > > > > sage > > > > > > > well > > > > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to > > what you > > > > > > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects > > in varga > > > > > > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > > > > > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma > > and > > > > > > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi > > but by > > > > > > > sagelike > > > > > > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were > > not > > > > > > > english > > > > > > > > > translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in > > > > > Sanskrit > > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots > > back to > > > > > > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other > > rashis.For the > > > > > same > > > > > > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi > > chart.Transits > > > > > can > > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > > > > > > rashi.Whether you > > > > > > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > > > > > > rashi,they are > > > > > > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there > > is no > > > > > > > amiguity > > > > > > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial > > aspect - > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for > > reference in > > > > > > > Saravali > > > > > > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion > > (which > > > > > certainly > > > > > > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and > > revert > > > > > back. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular > > rashis) > > > > > in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess > > Vahanas > > > > > > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use > > of D9 > > > > > chart > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where > > aspects are > > > > > > > referred > > > > > > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive > > astrology > > > > > > > document; > > > > > > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred the > > use of D > > > > > > > charts > > > > > > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > > > > > > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter > > Kalyan Varma > > > > > > > clearly > > > > > > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter > > aspect,half > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear > > that > > > > > > > these are > > > > > > > > > non- > > > > > > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - > > kalyan > > > > > > > Varma > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; > > or > > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi > > Kundli - the > > > > > > > obvious > > > > > > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at > > par with > > > > > > > current > > > > > > > > > age > > > > > > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > > >> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is > > so > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person > > making > > > > > > > comment, > > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they > > prove with > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > application > > > > > > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - > > firstly > > > > > the > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to read > > in > > > > > correct > > > > > > > way). > > > > > > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > > > > > > > relevance in > > > > > > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by > > case > > > > > > > studies - > > > > > > > > > > > then at > > > > > > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " > > to > > > > > > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > > > > > > but my > > > > > > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to > > accept the > > > > > views > > > > > > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late > > > > > > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - > > as I do > > > > > > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time > > on " shloka > > > > > > > > > business " > > > > > > > > > > > with my > > > > > > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be > > following > > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > > > quality > > > > > > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case > > studies. > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net > > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is > > so > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient > > texts > > > > > > > every > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, > > there is > > > > > > > every > > > > > > > > > > > chance > > > > > > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true > > results - > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > > argument is > > > > > > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your > > > > > choice - > > > > > > > when > > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your > > self, > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you have > > to > > > > > follow > > > > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues > > become > > > > > choice > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. > > Had there > > > > > > > not been > > > > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many > > > > > stalwarts > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them > > know > > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us > > on the > > > > > > > forum > > > > > > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to > > contest the > > > > > > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts > > are the > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many > > great > > > > > > > sanskrit > > > > > > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments > > may not > > > > > > > have any > > > > > > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net > > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically > > include > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart > > is so > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not > > > > > > > chart) " just > > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results > > > > > for " aspects of > > > > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be > > predicted when > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa > > lagna " > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as > > taught by > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > sages; > > > > > > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla Gang > > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts > > using > > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to > > assess D9 > > > > > > > charts - > > > > > > > > > > > can be > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just > > like D1 > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net > > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not > > automatically > > > > > include > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa > > Chart is so > > > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa > > chart is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can > > never be, > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important > > than > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > amsas > > > > > > > > > > > due > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa > > determines > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines > > the > > > > > > > strength of > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as > > per their > > > > > > > > > > > importance. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in > > Navamsa > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects > > in > > > > > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > > > > > (There > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa > > chart can be > > > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in > > Navamsa, it > > > > > only > > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only > > means > > > > > that. > > > > > > > It is > > > > > > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa > > chart > > > > > as > > > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in > > > > > Navamsa 'chart'. > > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > > yes > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken > > yoga. > > > > > > > Because it > > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are > > used to > > > > > > > predict > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and > > houses > > > > > are > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses > > should be > > > > > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient > > texts > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are > > referring to > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > > > > > > Seetharama > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > > > > > > > importance of > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view > > that > > > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based > > on my > > > > > > > experience > > > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still > > not > > > > > > > understood > > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga > > chart > > > > > being > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa > > determines > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in > > Navamsa > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa > > chart can be > > > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa > > chart > > > > > as > > > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given > > to > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa > > chart make > > > > > > > up two > > > > > > > > > > > equal > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of > > Navamsa > > > > > > > Chart. > > > > > > > > > > > What I > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains > > such an > > > > > > > > > importance? > > > > > > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it > > is one > > > > > of > > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > > > varga > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on > > karakamsa > > > > > and > > > > > > > both > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you > > for your > > > > > > > > > valuable > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological > > community. > > > > > I > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own > > experience). > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or > > Navamsa > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > alone > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I > > found > > > > > > > both the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is > > making as > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa > > chart as > > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the > > Rasi > > > > > > > chart), > > > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give > > independent > > > > > results > > > > > > > if the > > > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not > > exist if > > > > > the > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also > > mentioned > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > several > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and > > books that > > > > > > > yogas > > > > > > > > > > > viewed > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the > > Navamsa > > > > > > > chart for > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa > > chart > > > > > as a > > > > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the > > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > > checking > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction > > and > > > > > aspects) > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or > > veekshana > > > > > > > should > > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as > > mutual > > > > > > > influence > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a > > 30 deg. > > > > > > > span. of > > > > > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated > > or in own > > > > > > > house > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the > > Navamsa > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown > > in the > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > > Why > > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that > > > > > because, > > > > > > > even > > > > > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, > > still > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here > > navamsa) has > > > > > > > weakened > > > > > > > > > > > it; > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular > > sector is > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > weakest > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; > > hence it > > > > > > > loses its > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a > > gradation of > > > > > > > > > strengths > > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last > > navamsa. > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined > > placement > > > > > > > within > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal > > weightage to > > > > > > > both > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a > > planet is > > > > > weak > > > > > > > in one > > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We > > may not > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we > > give to > > > > > > > Navamsa; > > > > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to > > the > > > > > extent > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to > > confirm the > > > > > > > promise > > > > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, > > yogas in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected > > results; > > > > > I > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and > > Sukra > > > > > both > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart > > (not in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as > > the > > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi > > (represented > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > Chandra) > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). > > If the > > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be > > explained. The > > > > > > > sequence > > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I > > consider > > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting > > Pradeep's > > > > > > > opinion > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to > > be > > > > > > > considered on > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri > > KN Rao > > > > > > > always > > > > > > > > > > > says. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the > > specific rasi > > > > > in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa > > lagna, my > > > > > > > Sukra is > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice > > > > > beautiful > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to > > other > > > > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge > > only to > > > > > > > > > summarize > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > > > > > > > necessarily in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either > > Sanjay or > > > > > K. > > > > > > > N. > > > > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha > > and > > > > > Amshaka > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be > > remembered > > > > > > > that in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > > > > > > > understood in > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara > > mentioning > > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while > > indicating the > > > > > > > results of > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other > > places in > > > > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about > > two > > > > > > > different > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is > > also well > > > > > > > versed in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this > > > > > contention > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > mine > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think > > that > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without > > reference to the > > > > > > > > > potential > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived > > by the > > > > > > > grahas in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not > > likely to > > > > > > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big > > storm in > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, > > for > > > > > > > whatever it > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected > > members > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka > > is > > > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > > > > > > > says,Karakamsha > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has > > another > > > > > meaning. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is > > not > > > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as > > there > > > > > are > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has > > overlooked,contradicting > > > > > > > his view > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > > > > > > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not > > > > > preceded > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > > proper > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 > > news and > > > > > > > > > previews > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? > > > > > platform=120121 > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform? platform=120121 > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Shri Pradeepji,. I appreciate your knowledge.I have understood your point very well, You may not be wrong,but neither am I wrong. 1) Aspects can be seen from Navamsha arrangement, in the sense that the Lord of the navamsha, in whichever sign it is placed at time of birth, when the other planet transits through it, or becomes trine to it ,causes effect to the,culmination , of the effects mentioned in the shloka, we are taking in consideration (Any). There is a catch here, which you may understand, I will not mention that. But the trine is what ? It is a form of aspect only. Hence the establishment of the fact that aspects can be seen from the Navamsha. Now O am not mentioning the Trine aspect (Shloka in Chandrakala Nadi is mentioning the same). 2)amsas may be seen wrt Root rashi, but how does one reach that root rashi, is it not wrt the amsa ? 3)Transits- Okay we will consider that what you are saying is right,but how did one reach the RASHI onto which Chandra is having amsha ? Is it not through the calculation of the amsa ? So how can we say that the amsa chart is not to be taken in consideration, when all are values are coming from the same ? Whether one makes a chart or notes down the amsa and relates Rashis, what does it matter ? Ultimately help has been taken from the amsa to reach the Rashi in question , to be judged for transit . By the way, after 30 years of age, if one wishes to see the effects of transit, we need not go to the Rashi chart to see the Rashis. One just needs calculated inputs. So we can say that the chart is not needed. I am looking for the transits in the sky through the panchang. But ultimately the help has been taken initially in preparing the calculated data, from the Rasi chart only. So it cannot be discounted. In the same way Navamsha chart cannot be discounted. Now you have yourself said that the amsa raashi sambandha is there, so the whole issue and argument stands over. Because this is the fact that amsa raashi sambandha has to be there, they cannot be demarcated from each other. But I am not negating or arguing on that point at all. That is what is been trying to be established that. Rashi amda sambandha has to be there and vice-versa, The amsa cannot come without the Rashi and the transit cannot be checked in the Rashi, without the knowledge of the amsa Lord. So does not that make the amsa important ? Or the navamsha chart important, which shows the amsa Lords, or the other Vargas and their charts ? KN Rao Sahab is a great personality. I am no one to comment, accentuate, or negate or supplicate about his way of working in any manner, we are dwarfs in front of his towering Persona. I have high regards for him, but everyone has his own style of swimming, the point is to succesfully reach the other end, the way or style is not that important. The graha is else where and relates to the rashi, but the Sambandha can be formed through many ways, including aspect by Trine, which again I am not mentioning, I have given earlier two sperate sources one ancient, and one modern Navamsha expert who have written this. For you the glass is half empty, for me the glass is half full. I just know that the help of amsas is taken, even if you relate the sambandha and the aspect, to the Rashi, but would not reach to the Rashi without the amsa, which makes the amsas mandatorily, an importnat part of astrology,, whether they are shown in graphical presentation, or noted down on a sheet of paper, all this does not matter. regards, Bhaskar. , " vijayadas_pradeep " <vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > Dear Bhaskar ji > > Thanks again for the encouragement given in other mails. > > Now regarding this mail -We should understand the context of this > discussion. > > 1)Can aspects be seen from navamsha arrangement?Does the rules allow > that? No.I cannot see such from the usage of giants who lived 1000's > of years ago.Even BPHS translator had the same view. > > 2)During analysis ,does amshas have to be seen w.r to root > rashis.Yes,bhavas are always from Rashi.It has been demonstrated in > numerous examples.Lagna shadvargake shloka is the perfect example. > > 3)Transits -Your mail clearly says -Chandra Navamsha Rashi.Thus > transit can be seen from the RASHI -on to which chandra is having > amsha.This has been the whole topic that i have been discussing.I > told chandrashekhar ji that Parashara has mentioned ''Meshadi > rashige Swamshe''. > > Now the question is why should transit over the rashi on to which > Chandra is having navamsha effect in certain results.they have amsha- > Rashi sambandha.If this is understood ,then we will know why > K.N.Raoji takes karakamsha from Lagna.What Lagna shadvargake shloka > means etc etc. > > I hope it is clear now. > > I am talking about the definition of drishti (which includes 7th > normal plus special aspects). > > Pls read my mail to chandrashekhar ji -where i have clearly told - > transit to be seen from Leo Rashi is the common way. > On the other hand what you have demonstrated is another usage of > transit conjunction. > > Both of these does not need navamsha arrangement.On the other hand > if you try to see aspects ,it is imaginary.You are trying to start > an aspect from a rashi where the graha is not placed.Graha is > elsewheer ,and relates to that rashi.This sambandha itself is a kind > of ''aspect''.You cannot see drishti from there. > > > Regds > Pradeep > > , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > wrote: > > > > Dear Pradeepji, > > > > All transits would naturally be seen through some > > or the other Rashi only in the sky.These > > rashis of the sky can be again > > interpolated in the Natal Chart > > in some or the other sign (Rashi). Since the zodiac > > is made of 360degrees divided by 12 compartment, > > leaving no space for any other compartment,tge > > transit has to be in some or the other Rashi. > > But the above is not what youa told me about > > and neither our contention. > > > > I have nowhere mentioned that aspects happen in > > imaginary positions, but always mantained, that the > > intensity would be felt by native in transit through > > the pada or quarter of the mentioned,planet. > > > > //Aspects are based on rashi dispositions?? > > Partly the above statement may be right, > > but does not contain the whole story. > > > > Aspects are also based on Raashi dispositors. > > (Example- Saturn crossing the exact degrees of > > Natal Sun in transit, > > is going to produce either death or ill health > > to one of the elder male members of the family. > > In this case Sun is the dispositor of some Raashi. > > Same addects may be experienced in disposition of > > above in trine aspects too.) > > (I can give you this shloka from Chandrakala Nadi > > within 5 minutes but spare me the trouble. Most of > > the members who know me, also know that I do not > > talk without base) > > > > What is aspect ? > > Aspect can also be a conjunction. Is it not ? > > A conjunction can also be deemed as a close aspect. > > Is it not ? > > > > Anyway,Chandrakala Nadi- > > verse 3124, verse 2044,verse 2045 and verse > > 2385 (I can quote the shlokas here with their > > translations) have exclusively given predictive > > rules through CHANDRA NAVAMSA RASI) > > > > regards, > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Bhaskar ji > > > > > > But the transit that you are talking w.r to navamsha points are > > > exact natal positions.Sphuta of a planet.On the other hand when > you > > > see navamsha arrangement you are studying the link and not > > > astronomical placement as Dr.Raman has said. > > > > > > Aspects are not based on such imaginary patterns.Amsha Rashi > link is > > > through tattwa sambandha.For aspects rules are clear and they > are > > > based on Rashi dispositions. > > > > > > Regds > > > Pradeep > > > > > > -- In , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > //Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > > > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > > > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points.// > > > > > > > > Re-read above as - > > > > b) transit with reference to Navamsha points. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Bhaskar " > <bhaskar_jyotish@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Finally nothing happens in the rashi chart too. > > > > > That is history. The Rashi charts just give the > > > > > pointers the degrees of the natal planets, > > > > > and the Navamsha points, of these degrees, which again > > > > > is converted into degrees for transit purpose and > > > > > observations, and all this happens in the > > > > > sky above. > > > > > > > > > > Now we are talking of 2 approaches. > > > > > a) Transits with reference to natal points. > > > > > b) transits with reference to nakshatra points. > > > > > > > > > > And aspects also same > > > > > > > > > > a) In natal Chart. > > > > > b) In navamsha Chart ???? > > > > > > > > > > So back to square one. > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " vijayadas_pradeep " > > > > > <vijayadas_pradeep@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for the info regarding sphuta.As you see i too was > > > thinking > > > > > > and generally referring to exact conjunction,but navamsha > > > sector was > > > > > > given by Bhaskar ji. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus as you see,it is pointing to exact conjunction of > > > transiting > > > > > > planet,with navamsha lord of a bhavalord or planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes ,i can understand,your feelings.But still you may tell > > > them that > > > > > > these are happening in rashi chakra so that people who are > > > wrong > > > > > > understandings,will trust. > > > > > > > > > > > > I somehow feel,some feel that who is talking has all > > > importance and > > > > > > what is being said has no importance.This is not the case. > > > > > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Chandrashekhar > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your understanding of the transit over a certain degree > is > > > right. > > > > > > But > > > > > > > you have perhaps some confusion about the applicability > of > > > the nadi > > > > > > > principles. it talks about the sphuta of the > navamshesha. > > > That is > > > > > > the > > > > > > > exact degree of the lord of navamsha occupied by a bhava > > > lord. I > > > > > > trust > > > > > > > this is clear. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am as much a student of astrology as anybody else and > do > > > not > > > > > > claim to > > > > > > > be more knowledgeable than others. I might have > corrected a > > > wrong > > > > > > > interpretation of some principle, on the basis of the > > > principle as > > > > > > > understood by me earlier but with the type of language > > > flying on > > > > > > the > > > > > > > list and challenges being thrown around, I have no wish > to > > > do so. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Navamshesha of a bhava lord.Say my lagna lord is > Guru.Its > > > > > > > > navamshesha is Mercury.Mercury will be in some > navamsha.It > > > is in > > > > > > > > Makara rashi in my case.Within Makara it is in Leo > > > navamsha.As far > > > > > > > > as i have seen the usage of amsha transits,one has to > see > > > the > > > > > > > > transit from Leo rashi.I have explained this in the > > > mother/father > > > > > > > > navamsha/dwadashamsha shloka. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now there is another principle.In that you have to see > > > whether a > > > > > > > > planet is transiting the exact degrees of its > > > placement.transiting > > > > > > > > amshas is identical to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my case if a planet say saturn is transiting makara > > > rashi,leo > > > > > > > > amsha(as you have quoted) that is a 3.2 degree sector > > > within > > > > > > makara > > > > > > > > rashi,certain results can be predicted. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is physical transit exactly over my natal mercury's > 3.2 > > > degree > > > > > > > > span. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How is this physical transit over natal rashi > justifying > > > bhavas in > > > > > > > > navamsha chakra.You are a learned scholar and you have > to > > > correct > > > > > > > > them if some one is making mistakes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respect > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi > > > Sanskrit > > > > > > > > shlokas, > > > > > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the > amshas > > > of the > > > > > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given > therein. So > > > > > > Prafulla > > > > > > > > is right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like > but > > > was a > > > > > > sage > > > > > > > > well > > > > > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you may note,there were couple of cases similar > to > > > what you > > > > > > > > > > talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as > aspects > > > in varga > > > > > > > > > > chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > > > > > > > > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on > kemadruma > > > and > > > > > > > > > > chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Those cases too were explined not onlyin > dashadhayayi > > > but by > > > > > > > > sagelike > > > > > > > > > > figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those > were > > > not > > > > > > > > english > > > > > > > > > > translations as you have given from > Devakeralam.But in > > > > > > Sanskrit > > > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > > > clear reeference to rashi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas > roots > > > back to > > > > > > > > > > rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other > > > rashis.For the > > > > > > same > > > > > > > > > > reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So what you are saying have to read in Rashi > > > chart.Transits > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > > > be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > > > > > > > rashi.Whether you > > > > > > > > > > see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full > navamshaka > > > > > > > > rashi,they are > > > > > > > > > > both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits > there > > > is no > > > > > > > > amiguity > > > > > > > > > > at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla > Gang > > > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many thanks for your pointer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial > > > aspect - > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > > referring to D chart aspect. let me search for > > > reference in > > > > > > > > Saravali > > > > > > > > > > and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion > > > (which > > > > > > certainly > > > > > > > > > > carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and > > > revert > > > > > > back. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I quote another reference: > > > > > > > > > > > Satyacharya: > > > > > > > > > > > " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. > angular > > > rashis) > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess > > > Vahanas > > > > > > > > > > (conveyances). " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on > use > > > of D9 > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > transit analysis as well natal analysis - where > > > aspects are > > > > > > > > referred > > > > > > > > > > and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive > > > astrology > > > > > > > > document; > > > > > > > > > > as many equally respectable sages - have referred > the > > > use of D > > > > > > > > charts > > > > > > > > > > and aspects therein. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.prafulla.net > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > > > > > > > > > Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart > is so > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > > Quarter/Half > > > > > > > > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mentioned aspects are clearly for > placement in > > > > > > > > Rashis.Please > > > > > > > > > > > > check Saravali again.Also in another chapter > > > Kalyan Varma > > > > > > > > clearly > > > > > > > > > > > > mentions about every planet having ,quarter > > > aspect,half > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > > etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty > clear > > > that > > > > > > > > these are > > > > > > > > > > non- > > > > > > > > > > > > full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > > > > > had given similr explanations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regds > > > > > > > > > > > > Pradeep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla > Gang > > > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> Another important issue - In D9 charts > reference - > > > kalyan > > > > > > > > Varma > > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > > given hints for results for Sun aspecting > venus; > > > or > > > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > > > > venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi > > > Kundli - the > > > > > > > > obvious > > > > > > > > > > > > reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated > at > > > par with > > > > > > > > current > > > > > > > > > > age > > > > > > > > > > > > scholars !! > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > >> http://www.prafulla.net > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > > > >> > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> jyotish@ > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart > is > > > so > > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the > person > > > making > > > > > > > > comment, > > > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > > >>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they > > > prove with > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > application > > > > > > > > > > > >>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - > > > > firstly > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > > >>> application of others; and secondly how to > read > > > in > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > way). > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Theorists without predictive support - has > little > > > > > > > > relevance in > > > > > > > > > > > > jyotish. > > > > > > > > > > > >>> But yes - if you can justify your statements > by > > > case > > > > > > > > studies - > > > > > > > > > > > > then at > > > > > > > > > > > >>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Understandably, I have been quoted to > be " blind " > > > to > > > > > > > > > > commentaries - > > > > > > > > > > > > but my > > > > > > > > > > > >>> submission is that - give me one reason to > > > accept the > > > > > > views > > > > > > > > > > > > of " less read > > > > > > > > > > > >>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like > Late > > > > > > > > Santhanam / Shri > > > > > > > > > > > > KN Rao / > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More > so - > > > as I do > > > > > > > > > > > > not " pretend " to > > > > > > > > > > > >>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time > > > on " shloka > > > > > > > > > > business " > > > > > > > > > > > > with my > > > > > > > > > > > >>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be > > > following > > > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > > > > quality > > > > > > > > > > > >>> commentaries - who are expalining with the > case > > > studies. > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net > > > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa > Chart is > > > so > > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> * Even if those things are not there in > ancient > > > texts > > > > > > > > every > > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> free to make or follow there own choice - > yes, > > > there is > > > > > > > > every > > > > > > > > > > > > chance > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> that even such new methods might give true > > > results - > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > > > argument is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> right. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is > your > > > > > > choice - > > > > > > > > when > > > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit > your > > > self, > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> what is there and what not, of course you > have > > > to > > > > > > follow > > > > > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> says they see - you are right in that as > well. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla > Gang > > > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues > > > become > > > > > > choice > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> prejudices in our own form of reading > model. > > > Had there > > > > > > > > not been > > > > > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot > many > > > > > > stalwarts > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of > them > > > know > > > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all > of us > > > on the > > > > > > > > forum > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to > > > contest the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> interpretation - then many of those > stalwarts > > > are the > > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not > many > > > great > > > > > > > > sanskrit > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the > arguments > > > may not > > > > > > > > have any > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> relevance. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net > > > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> " The right to be heard does not > automatically > > > include > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa > Chart > > > is so > > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha > (not > > > > > > > > chart) " just > > > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> D1 > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the > same. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results > > > > > > for " aspects of > > > > > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be > > > predicted when > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa > > > lagna " > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology > as > > > taught by > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > sages; > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> If > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, Prafulla > Gang > > > > > > <jyotish@> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish > stalwarts > > > using > > > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to > > > assess D9 > > > > > > > > charts - > > > > > > > > > > > > can be > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - > just > > > like D1 > > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I request members to share their > experience. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net > > > <http://www.prafulla.net> > > > > > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not > > > automatically > > > > > > include > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > right > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> to > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa > > > Chart is so > > > > > > > > > > important? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I too to the view that > Navamsa > > > chart is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but > only > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it > can > > > never be, > > > > > > > > because > > > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more > important > > > than > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > amsas > > > > > > > > > > > > due > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa > > > determines > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth > determines > > > the > > > > > > > > strength of > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas > as > > > per their > > > > > > > > > > > > importance. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider > aspects in > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider > aspects > > > in > > > > > > > > Navamsa. > > > > > > > > > > > > (There > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa > > > chart can be > > > > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi > chart? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in > > > Navamsa, it > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> that. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it > only > > > means > > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > It is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> wrong > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ==> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in > navamsa > > > chart > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <== > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in > > > > > > Navamsa 'chart'. > > > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > > > yes > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> yoga in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be > taken > > > yoga. > > > > > > > > Because it > > > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that > are > > > used to > > > > > > > > predict > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> result > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) > and > > > houses > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> applicable > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and > Houses > > > should be > > > > > > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in > ancient > > > texts > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> or > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are > > > referring to > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Love, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, > Krishnamurthy > > > > > > > > > > Seetharama > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your > comments on > > > > > > > > importance of > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the > view > > > that > > > > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is > based > > > on my > > > > > > > > experience > > > > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have > still > > > not > > > > > > > > understood > > > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a > varga > > > chart > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> important. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa > > > determines > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > overall > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider > aspects in > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa > > > chart can be > > > > > > > > treated > > > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> if > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi > chart? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in > navamsa > > > chart > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > well? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance > given > > > to > > > > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and > Navamsa > > > chart make > > > > > > > > up two > > > > > > > > > > > > equal > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance > of > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > Chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > What I > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa > gains > > > such an > > > > > > > > > > importance? > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> What > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all > it > > > is one > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > > > > varga > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri > Chandrasekhar, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on > > > karakamsa > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > both > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> your > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of > you > > > for your > > > > > > > > > > valuable > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological > > > community. > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own > > > experience). > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either > Rasi or > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > > alone > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> most > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, > as I > > > found > > > > > > > > both the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is > > > making as > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > > valuable; > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using > Navamsa > > > chart as > > > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of > the > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > chart), > > > > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give > > > independent > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > if the > > > > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not > > > exist if > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > > > chart > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao > also > > > mentioned > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > several > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles > and > > > books that > > > > > > > > yogas > > > > > > > > > > > > viewed > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in > the > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart for > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the > Navamsa > > > chart > > > > > > as a > > > > > > > > > > > > separate > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For > the > > > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > > > checking > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> some > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana > (conjunction > > > and > > > > > > aspects) > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti > or > > > veekshana > > > > > > > > should > > > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level > (as > > > mutual > > > > > > > > influence > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within > a > > > 30 deg. > > > > > > > > span. of > > > > > > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is > exlated > > > or in own > > > > > > > > house > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the > > > Navamsa > > > > > > > > chart, it > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength > shown > > > in the > > > > > > > > Rasi. > > > > > > > > > > Why > > > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like > that > > > > > > because, > > > > > > > > even > > > > > > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated > rasi, > > > still > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here > > > navamsa) has > > > > > > > > weakened > > > > > > > > > > > > it; > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular > > > sector is > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > weakest > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; > > > hence it > > > > > > > > loses its > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a > > > gradation of > > > > > > > > > > strengths > > > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last > > > navamsa. > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> position > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its > refined > > > placement > > > > > > > > within > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal > > > weightage to > > > > > > > > both > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a > > > planet is > > > > > > weak > > > > > > > > in one > > > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> them > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is > lost. We > > > may not > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> same > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as > we > > > give to > > > > > > > > Navamsa; > > > > > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; > to > > > the > > > > > > extent > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> be > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to > > > confirm the > > > > > > > > promise > > > > > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa > chart, > > > yogas in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give > expected > > > results; > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra > and > > > Sukra > > > > > > both > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa > chart > > > (not in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > rasi > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa > considering as > > > the > > > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi > > > (represented > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > Chandra) > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by > Sukra). > > > If the > > > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be > > > explained. The > > > > > > > > sequence > > > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I > > > consider > > > > > > > > karakamsa > > > > > > > > > > > > lagna > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not > discounting > > > Pradeep's > > > > > > > > opinion > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need > to > > > be > > > > > > > > considered on > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as > Sri > > > KN Rao > > > > > > > > always > > > > > > > > > > > > says. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the > > > specific rasi > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > Rasi > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa > > > lagna, my > > > > > > > > Sukra is > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a > nice > > > > > > beautiful > > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition > to > > > other > > > > > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your > knowledge > > > only to > > > > > > > > > > summarize > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but > not > > > > > > > > necessarily in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > <%40> > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either > > > Sanjay or > > > > > > K. > > > > > > > > N. > > > > > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> First > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of > Amsha > > > and > > > > > > Amshaka > > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be > > > remembered > > > > > > > > that in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are > to be > > > > > > > > understood in > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara > > > mentioning > > > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while > > > indicating the > > > > > > > > results of > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many > other > > > places in > > > > > > > > > > karakamsha > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking > about > > > two > > > > > > > > different > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is > > > also well > > > > > > > > versed in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm > this > > > > > > contention > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > mine > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I > think > > > that > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without > > > reference to the > > > > > > > > > > potential > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength > derived > > > by the > > > > > > > > grahas in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not > > > likely to > > > > > > > > > > > > materialize. I > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> this > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a > big > > > storm in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal > opinion, > > > for > > > > > > > > whatever it > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and > Respected > > > members > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly > says ,Amshaka > > > is > > > > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He > also > > > > > > > > says,Karakamsha > > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> one > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has > > > another > > > > > > meaning. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka > is > > > not > > > > > > > > pointing to > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> in > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is > prudent as > > > there > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> which > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has > > > overlooked,contradicting > > > > > > > > his view > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to > tell > > > > > > > > this.Sometimes > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are > not > > > > > > preceded > > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > > > proper > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________ > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest > PS3 > > > news and > > > > > > > > > > previews > > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Games. > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform? > > > > > > platform=120121 > > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform? > platform=120121 > > > > > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Yogesh, The question is that does it predate Lord Krishna, whose Kulguru was Garga, if my memory serves me right? I do not think that is so. Of course I have not studied that religion in depth. Chandrashekhar. Yogesh Shah wrote: > > Hi Chandrashekhar Ji, > > I agree that Garga predates Mahavira. Just one clarification, Jain > religion predates Mahavira. > > Thank You, > > Yogesh Shah > > > > > > Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46 > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote: > Dear Prafulla, > > Garga referred to in jyotish was not a jain muni, as he predates Mahavira. > > Chandrashekhar. > > Prafulla Gang wrote: > > > > Dear Chandrersekhar ji and Pradeep ji, > > > > Many thanks for refrence. Since, i do not have Deva keralam handy with > > me right now - I am not in position to quote specific shloka. But over > > the periods, I do not know - if anyone has doubted the relevance of > > Chandra kala nadi. > > > > Well, a small reference on garga - I recently heard that, many > > scholars have linked him to Jain astrology (just because Garga was > > Jain Saint). No - jainism does not have its explored Jyotish for natal > > readings) - though the references are there for constellations and > > spcific significance in its literature. > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > chandrashekhar46 > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk> > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk> > > > Sun, 08 Jul 2007 00:45:08 +0530 > > > > <%40> > <%40> > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important?Quarter/Half > > > aspects > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit shlokas, > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So Prafulla is > > > right. > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a sage well > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > >> > > >> Dear Prafulla ji > > >> > > >> If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > >> talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > >> chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > >> Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > >> chandranavmshaka rashi. > > >> > > >> Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by sagelike > > >> figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not english > > >> translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in Sanskrit with > > >> clear reeference to rashi. > > >> > > >> Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > >> rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the same > > >> reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > >> > > >> So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits can only > > >> be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha rashi.Whether you > > >> see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka rashi,they are > > >> both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no amiguity > > >> at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > >> > > >> Regds > > >> Pradeep > > >> > > >> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish > > >> wrote: > > >>> > > >>> Dear Pradeep, > > >>> > > >>> many thanks for your pointer. > > >>> > > >>> Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - while > > >> referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in Saravali > > >> and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which certainly > > >> carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert back. > > >>> > > >>> I quote another reference: > > >>> Satyacharya: > > >>> " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) in the > > >> navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > >> (conveyances). " > > >>> > > >>> There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 chart in > > >> transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are referred > > >> and navamsa chakras are referred. > > >>> > > >>> BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology document; > > >> as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D charts > > >> and aspects therein. > > >>> > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > >>> > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > >>> ************************************************ > > >>> > > >>> > > >>>> > > >>>> vijayadas_pradeep > > >>>> Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > >>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40> > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > >> Quarter/Half > > >>>> aspects > > >>>> > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji > > >>>> > > >>>> The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in Rashis.Please > > >>>> check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma clearly > > >>>> mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half aspect > > >>>> etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that these are > > >> non- > > >>>> full aspects in rashi chart. > > >>>> > > >>>> Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and Chandrashekhar ji > > >> too > > >>>> had given similr explanations. > > >>>> > > >>>> Regds > > >>>> Pradeep > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > >>>> wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan Varma > > >> has > > >>>> given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury > > >> aspecting > > >>>> venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the obvious > > >>>> reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with current > > >> age > > >>>> scholars !! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> jyotish@ > > >>>>>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > >>>>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40> > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, > > >> be > > >>>>>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the > > >>>> application > > >>>>>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong > > >>>>>> application of others; and secondly how to read in correct way). > > >>>>>> Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in > > >>>> jyotish. > > >>>>>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies - > > >>>> then at > > >>>>>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > >> commentaries - > > >>>> but my > > >>>>>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views > > >>>> of " less read > > >>>>>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri > > >>>> KN Rao / > > >>>>>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > >>>> not " pretend " to > > >>>>>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > >> business " > > >>>> with my > > >>>>>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better > > >>>> quality > > >>>>>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > >>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > >>>>>> ************************************************ > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> sreesog@ > > >>>>>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > >>>>>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40> > > >>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > >>>>>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every > > >> one > > >>>> is > > >>>>>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every > > >>>> chance > > >>>>>>> that even such new methods might give true results - your > > >>>> argument is > > >>>>>>> right. > > >>>>>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when > > >>>> you > > >>>>>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and > > >>>> understand > > >>>>>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow > > >> someone > > >>>> who > > >>>>>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > >>>>>>> Love, > > >>>>>>> Sreenadh > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > >>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or > > >>>>>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been > > >>>> any > > >>>>>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must > > >> not > > >>>>>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better > > >>>>>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum > > >>>>>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > >>>>>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - > > >>>> must > > >>>>>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit > > >>>>>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any > > >>>>>>> relevance. > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > >>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > >> right > > >>>> to > > >>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > >>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > >>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > >>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40> > > >>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just > > >>>> like > > >>>>>>> D1 > > >>>>>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of > > >>>> planets > > >>>>>>> in > > >>>>>>>>> Navamasa " > > >>>>>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets > > >>>> are > > >>>>>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the > > >>>> sages; > > >>>>>>> If > > >>>>>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> Love, > > >>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa > > >>>> chart > > >>>>>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - > > >>>> can be > > >>>>>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart. > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > >>>>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > >>>> right > > >>>>>>> to > > >>>>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > >>>>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > >>>>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > >>>>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40> > > >>>>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > >> important? > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > >>>>>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa > > >>>> chart > > >>>>>>>>> is > > >>>>>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because > > >>>> it > > >>>>>>> is > > >>>>>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other > > >> amsas > > >>>> due > > >>>>>>>>> to > > >>>>>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > >> overall > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > >>>>>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of > > >>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > >>>> importance. > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart > > >>>> like > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. > > >>>> (There > > >>>>>>>>> is > > >>>>>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated > > >>>> as > > >>>>>>> if > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only > > >> means > > >>>>>>> that. > > >>>>>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is > > >>>>>>> wrong > > >>>>>>>>> to > > >>>>>>>>>>> mix the two. > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well? > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But > > >> yes > > >>>>>>>>> yoga in > > >>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it > > >>>> is > > >>>>>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict > > >> the > > >>>>>>>>> result > > >>>>>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not > > >>>>>>>>> applicable > > >>>>>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > >>>> considered > > >>>>>>> in > > >>>>>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about > > >>>> aspect > > >>>>>>> or > > >>>>>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi > > >>>> chart. > > >>>>>>>>>>> Love, > > >>>>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > >> Seetharama > > >>>>>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of > > >>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa > > >>>> chart > > >>>>>>> is > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience > > >>>> so > > >>>>>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood > > >>>> what > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so > > >>>>>>>>>>>> important. > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > >> overall > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart > > >>>> like > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated > > >>>> as > > >>>>>>> if > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well? > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa > > >>>> chart, it > > >>>>>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two > > >>>> equal > > >>>>>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. > > >>>> What I > > >>>>>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > >> importance? > > >>>>>>> What > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many > > >>>> varga > > >>>>>>>>>>>> charts! > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Regards, > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Krishna > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both > > >> of > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> your > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > >> valuable > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> inputs > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would > > >>>> like > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart > > >>>> alone > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> most > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> approaches > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very > > >>>> valuable; > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> at the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > >> separate > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), > > >> since > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> any of > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the > > >>>> Rasi > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi > > >>>> chart > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in > > >> several > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas > > >>>> viewed > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> confirming > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a > > >>>> separate > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of > > >>>> checking > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> some > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in > > >> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should > > >> be > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence > > >> at > > >>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of > > >>>> Rasi. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house > > >> in > > >>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it > > >> is > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> condiered > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. > > >> Why > > >>>> is > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even > > >>>> though > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> positioning > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened > > >>>> it; > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> means, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the > > >> weakest > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point for > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> strength > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > >> strengths > > >>>> for > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The > > >> navamsa > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> position > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within > > >>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both > > >> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one > > >>>> of > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> them > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give > > >> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; > > >>>> but > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that > > >> it > > >>>> can > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> be > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise > > >>>> given > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> by the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the > > >> rasi > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> observed > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in > > >> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 12th > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the > > >> rasi > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by > > >> Chandra) > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa > > >> is > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> brought > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence > > >>>> of > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> my life > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa > > >>>> lagna > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on > > >>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always > > >>>> says. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the > > >>>> Rasi > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is > > >> in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, > > >>>> and > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > >> traditional > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education). > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > >> summarize > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the other. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. > > >> Rao. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> First > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> there is > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though > > >>>> it > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> astrological > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in > > >>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> context that > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha > > >> and > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > >> karakamsha > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of > > >> mine > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> if he > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the > > >> results > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > >> potential > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> promised by > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > >>>> materialize. I > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> hope > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it > > >> is > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> worth. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to > > >> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha > > >> has > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> one > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to > > >> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> which > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes > > >>>> the > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> answer and > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by > > >>>> proper > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>> > > >> ________ > > >>>>>>>>>>> ______________ > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > >> previews > > >>>> at > > >>>>>>>>>>> Games. > > >>>>>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > >> <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Prafulla, That may be so and yet Garga that is referred to in Jyotish was certainly not Jain. I do not think many think of Lord Krishna as a Jain Tirthankar. Lord Krishna explains his various rupas in Bhagavad Geeta but there does not appear to be any reference o his being one. Of course this is not a place to begin theological discussion. Neither do I claim to be an expert in this subject. Chandrashekhar. Prafulla Gang wrote: > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji > > Jain religion is as old as vedas are. There are explicit reference of > Jain Tirthankars (first three one) in Vedas. > > Lord Mahaveera was 24th Jain Tirthankars (last one until now) and as > per Jain Shashtras, Ravan and then Lord Krishna will be next > Tirthnakrs in next yuga. > > regards / Prafulla > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > <chandrashekhar46 wrote: > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > Garga referred to in jyotish was not a jain muni, as he predates > Mahavira. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > Prafulla Gang wrote: > > > > > > Dear Chandrersekhar ji and Pradeep ji, > > > > > > Many thanks for refrence. Since, i do not have Deva keralam handy > with > > > me right now - I am not in position to quote specific shloka. But > over > > > the periods, I do not know - if anyone has doubted the relevance of > > > Chandra kala nadi. > > > > > > Well, a small reference on garga - I recently heard that, many > > > scholars have linked him to Jain astrology (just because Garga was > > > Jain Saint). No - jainism does not have its explored Jyotish for > natal > > > readings) - though the references are there for constellations and > > > spcific significance in its literature. > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > chandrashekhar46 > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk> > > > > Sun, 08 Jul 2007 00:45:08 +0530 > > > > > <%40> > <%40> > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > important?Quarter/Half > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > shlokas, > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So Prafulla is > > > > right. > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a > sage well > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > >> > > > >> Dear Prafulla ji > > > >> > > > >> If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > >> talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > >> chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > >> Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > >> chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > >> > > > >> Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > sagelike > > > >> figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not english > > > >> translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in Sanskrit > with > > > >> clear reeference to rashi. > > > >> > > > >> Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > >> rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the same > > > >> reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > >> > > > >> So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits can > only > > > >> be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > rashi.Whether you > > > >> see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > rashi,they are > > > >> both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > amiguity > > > >> at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > >> > > > >> Regds > > > >> Pradeep > > > >> > > > >> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > >> wrote: > > > >>> > > > >>> Dear Pradeep, > > > >>> > > > >>> many thanks for your pointer. > > > >>> > > > >>> Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - while > > > >> referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > Saravali > > > >> and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which certainly > > > >> carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert back. > > > >>> > > > >>> I quote another reference: > > > >>> Satyacharya: > > > >>> " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) in the > > > >> navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > >> (conveyances). " > > > >>> > > > >>> There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 chart in > > > >> transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > referred > > > >> and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > >>> > > > >>> BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > document; > > > >> as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D > charts > > > >> and aspects therein. > > > >>> > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>> > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > >>>> Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > >>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > >> Quarter/Half > > > >>>> aspects > > > >>>> > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji > > > >>>> > > > >>>> The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in Rashis.Please > > > >>>> check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma clearly > > > >>>> mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half aspect > > > >>>> etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that these are > > > >> non- > > > >>>> full aspects in rashi chart. > > > >>>> > > > >>>> Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and Chandrashekhar ji > > > >> too > > > >>>> had given similr explanations. > > > >>>> > > > >>>> Regds > > > >>>> Pradeep > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > >>>> wrote: > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan Varma > > > >> has > > > >>>> given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury > > > >> aspecting > > > >>>> venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > obvious > > > >>>> reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with current > > > >> age > > > >>>> scholars !! > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> jyotish@ > > > >>>>>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > >>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, > > > >> be > > > >>>>>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the > > > >>>> application > > > >>>>>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong > > > >>>>>> application of others; and secondly how to read in correct > way). > > > >>>>>> Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in > > > >>>> jyotish. > > > >>>>>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies - > > > >>>> then at > > > >>>>>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > >> commentaries - > > > >>>> but my > > > >>>>>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views > > > >>>> of " less read > > > >>>>>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / > Shri > > > >>>> KN Rao / > > > >>>>>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > >>>> not " pretend " to > > > >>>>>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > >> business " > > > >>>> with my > > > >>>>>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better > > > >>>> quality > > > >>>>>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > >>>>>> ************************************************ > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > >>>>>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > >>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > >>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > >>>>>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every > > > >> one > > > >>>> is > > > >>>>>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every > > > >>>> chance > > > >>>>>>> that even such new methods might give true results - your > > > >>>> argument is > > > >>>>>>> right. > > > >>>>>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when > > > >>>> you > > > >>>>>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and > > > >>>> understand > > > >>>>>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow > > > >> someone > > > >>>> who > > > >>>>>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > >>>>>>> Love, > > > >>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > >>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > >>>>>>> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or > > > >>>>>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not > been > > > >>>> any > > > >>>>>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must > > > >> not > > > >>>>>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better > > > >>>>>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum > > > >>>>>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > >>>>>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - > > > >>>> must > > > >>>>>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit > > > >>>>>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > have any > > > >>>>>>> relevance. > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > >> right > > > >>>> to > > > >>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > >>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > >>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > >>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > important? > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just > > > >>>> like > > > >>>>>>> D1 > > > >>>>>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of > > > >>>> planets > > > >>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamasa " > > > >>>>>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets > > > >>>> are > > > >>>>>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the > > > >>>> sages; > > > >>>>>>> If > > > >>>>>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> Love, > > > >>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa > > > >>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - > > > >>>> can be > > > >>>>>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart. > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>>>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > >>>> right > > > >>>>>>> to > > > >>>>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > >>>>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > >> important? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa > > > >>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > because > > > >>>> it > > > >>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other > > > >> amsas > > > >>>> due > > > >>>>>>>>> to > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > >> overall > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > >>>> importance. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart > > > >>>> like > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. > > > >>>> (There > > > >>>>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > treated > > > >>>> as > > > >>>>>>> if > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only > > > >> means > > > >>>>>>> that. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. > It is > > > >>>>>>> wrong > > > >>>>>>>>> to > > > >>>>>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But > > > >> yes > > > >>>>>>>>> yoga in > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > Because it > > > >>>> is > > > >>>>>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>> result > > > >>>>>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not > > > >>>>>>>>> applicable > > > >>>>>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > >>>> considered > > > >>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about > > > >>>> aspect > > > >>>>>>> or > > > >>>>>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi > > > >>>> chart. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Love, > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > >> Seetharama > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa > > > >>>> chart > > > >>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > experience > > > >>>> so > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood > > > >>>> what > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> important. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > >> overall > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart > > > >>>> like > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > treated > > > >>>> as > > > >>>>>>> if > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well? > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa > > > >>>> chart, it > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two > > > >>>> equal > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. > > > >>>> What I > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > >> importance? > > > >>>>>>> What > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many > > > >>>> varga > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> charts! > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both > > > >> of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> your > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > >> valuable > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would > > > >>>> like > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart > > > >>>> alone > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> most > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very > > > >>>> valuable; > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> at the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > >> separate > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), > > > >> since > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> any of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results > if the > > > >>>> Rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi > > > >>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in > > > >> several > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas > > > >>>> viewed > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > chart for > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a > > > >>>> separate > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of > > > >>>> checking > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> some > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should > > > >> be > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence > > > >> at > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of > > > >>>> Rasi. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house > > > >> in > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it > > > >> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. > > > >> Why > > > >>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even > > > >>>> though > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > weakened > > > >>>> it; > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> means, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the > > > >> weakest > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point for > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> strength > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > >> strengths > > > >>>> for > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The > > > >> navamsa > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> position > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak > in one > > > >>>> of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> them > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > Navamsa; > > > >>>> but > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that > > > >> it > > > >>>> can > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> be > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise > > > >>>> given > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> by the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the > > > >> rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> observed > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the > > > >> rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by > > > >> Chandra) > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa > > > >> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> brought > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > sequence > > > >>>> of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> my life > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa > > > >>>> lagna > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > opinion > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > considered on > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always > > > >>>> says. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the > > > >>>> Rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is > > > >> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful > house, > > > >>>> and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > >> traditional > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education). > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > >> summarize > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. > > > >> Rao. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> First > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> there is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka > though > > > >>>> it > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> context that > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha > > > >> and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > results of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > >> karakamsha > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > versed in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of > > > >> mine > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> if he > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the > > > >> results > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > >> potential > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > grahas in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > >>>> materialize. I > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> hope > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it > > > >> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha > > > >> has > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> one > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> which > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his > view > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by > > > >>>> proper > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> > > > >>>> > > > >> ________ > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ______________ > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > >> previews > > > >>>> at > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Games. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > >> <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Dear Chandrasekharji, We are entering into a banned territory and a tabooo one. I do not wish you to be stained by unnecessary discussions and arguments.I am already ill-reputed. Let me do the saying part., and You will remain clean thus. Lets desist from commenting on such subjects. Jainism is a branch of Hinduism just like Buddhism is., and has come later . Its the branch of the same Tree- Hinduism. Period. Matter closed. No more comments, otherwise brothers of the same fold would start fighting and the others would enjoy. regards, Bhaskar. , Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46 wrote: > > Dear Prafulla, > > That may be so and yet Garga that is referred to in Jyotish was > certainly not Jain. I do not think many think of Lord Krishna as a Jain > Tirthankar. Lord Krishna explains his various rupas in Bhagavad Geeta > but there does not appear to be any reference o his being one. > > Of course this is not a place to begin theological discussion. Neither > do I claim to be an expert in this subject. > > Chandrashekhar. > > Prafulla Gang wrote: > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji > > > > Jain religion is as old as vedas are. There are explicit reference of > > Jain Tirthankars (first three one) in Vedas. > > > > Lord Mahaveera was 24th Jain Tirthankars (last one until now) and as > > per Jain Shashtras, Ravan and then Lord Krishna will be next > > Tirthnakrs in next yuga. > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > Garga referred to in jyotish was not a jain muni, as he predates > > Mahavira. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > Prafulla Gang wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrersekhar ji and Pradeep ji, > > > > > > > > Many thanks for refrence. Since, i do not have Deva keralam handy > > with > > > > me right now - I am not in position to quote specific shloka. But > > over > > > > the periods, I do not know - if anyone has doubted the relevance of > > > > Chandra kala nadi. > > > > > > > > Well, a small reference on garga - I recently heard that, many > > > > scholars have linked him to Jain astrology (just because Garga was > > > > Jain Saint). No - jainism does not have its explored Jyotish for > > natal > > > > readings) - though the references are there for constellations and > > > > spcific significance in its literature. > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > chandrashekhar46@ > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk> > > > > > Sun, 08 Jul 2007 00:45:08 +0530 > > > > > > > <%40> > > <%40> > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important?Quarter/Half > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > > shlokas, > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So Prafulla is > > > > > right. > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a > > sage well > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > >> > > > > >> Dear Prafulla ji > > > > >> > > > > >> If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > > >> talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > > >> chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > >> Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > >> chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > >> > > > > >> Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > > sagelike > > > > >> figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not english > > > > >> translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in Sanskrit > > with > > > > >> clear reeference to rashi. > > > > >> > > > > >> Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > > >> rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the same > > > > >> reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > >> > > > > >> So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits can > > only > > > > >> be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > > rashi.Whether you > > > > >> see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > > rashi,they are > > > > >> both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > > amiguity > > > > >> at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > >> > > > > >> Regds > > > > >> Pradeep > > > > >> > > > > >> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > >> wrote: > > > > >>> > > > > >>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > >>> > > > > >>> many thanks for your pointer. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - while > > > > >> referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > > Saravali > > > > >> and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which certainly > > > > >> carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert back. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> I quote another reference: > > > > >>> Satyacharya: > > > > >>> " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) in the > > > > >> navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > >> (conveyances). " > > > > >>> > > > > >>> There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 chart in > > > > >> transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > > referred > > > > >> and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > > document; > > > > >> as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D > > charts > > > > >> and aspects therein. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > >>>> Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > >>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > > >> Quarter/Half > > > > >>>> aspects > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in Rashis.Please > > > > >>>> check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma clearly > > > > >>>> mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half aspect > > > > >>>> etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that these are > > > > >> non- > > > > >>>> full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and Chandrashekhar ji > > > > >> too > > > > >>>> had given similr explanations. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Regds > > > > >>>> Pradeep > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan Varma > > > > >> has > > > > >>>> given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury > > > > >> aspecting > > > > >>>> venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > > obvious > > > > >>>> reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with current > > > > >> age > > > > >>>> scholars !! > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> jyotish@ > > > > >>>>>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > >>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, > > > > >> be > > > > >>>>>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the > > > > >>>> application > > > > >>>>>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong > > > > >>>>>> application of others; and secondly how to read in correct > > way). > > > > >>>>>> Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in > > > > >>>> jyotish. > > > > >>>>>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies - > > > > >>>> then at > > > > >>>>>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > >> commentaries - > > > > >>>> but my > > > > >>>>>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views > > > > >>>> of " less read > > > > >>>>>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / > > Shri > > > > >>>> KN Rao / > > > > >>>>>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > >>>> not " pretend " to > > > > >>>>>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > > >> business " > > > > >>>> with my > > > > >>>>>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better > > > > >>>> quality > > > > >>>>>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > >>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > >>>>>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > >>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > >>>>>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every > > > > >> one > > > > >>>> is > > > > >>>>>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every > > > > >>>> chance > > > > >>>>>>> that even such new methods might give true results - your > > > > >>>> argument is > > > > >>>>>>> right. > > > > >>>>>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when > > > > >>>> you > > > > >>>>>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and > > > > >>>> understand > > > > >>>>>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow > > > > >> someone > > > > >>>> who > > > > >>>>>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > >>>>>>> Love, > > > > >>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > >>>>>>> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or > > > > >>>>>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not > > been > > > > >>>> any > > > > >>>>>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must > > > > >> not > > > > >>>>>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better > > > > >>>>>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum > > > > >>>>>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > > >>>>>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - > > > > >>>> must > > > > >>>>>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit > > > > >>>>>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > > have any > > > > >>>>>>> relevance. > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > > >> right > > > > >>>> to > > > > >>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > >>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > >>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > important? > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just > > > > >>>> like > > > > >>>>>>> D1 > > > > >>>>>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of > > > > >>>> planets > > > > >>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > >>>>>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets > > > > >>>> are > > > > >>>>>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the > > > > >>>> sages; > > > > >>>>>>> If > > > > >>>>>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Love, > > > > >>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa > > > > >>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - > > > > >>>> can be > > > > >>>>>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart. > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>>>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > > >>>> right > > > > >>>>>>> to > > > > >>>>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > >>>>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > >> important? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa > > > > >>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > > because > > > > >>>> it > > > > >>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other > > > > >> amsas > > > > >>>> due > > > > >>>>>>>>> to > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > > >> overall > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > > >>>> importance. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart > > > > >>>> like > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. > > > > >>>> (There > > > > >>>>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > treated > > > > >>>> as > > > > >>>>>>> if > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only > > > > >> means > > > > >>>>>>> that. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. > > It is > > > > >>>>>>> wrong > > > > >>>>>>>>> to > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But > > > > >> yes > > > > >>>>>>>>> yoga in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > > Because it > > > > >>>> is > > > > >>>>>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>> result > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not > > > > >>>>>>>>> applicable > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > > >>>> considered > > > > >>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about > > > > >>>> aspect > > > > >>>>>>> or > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi > > > > >>>> chart. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Love, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > >> Seetharama > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa > > > > >>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > > experience > > > > >>>> so > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood > > > > >>>> what > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> important. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > > >> overall > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart > > > > >>>> like > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > > treated > > > > >>>> as > > > > >>>>>>> if > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa > > > > >>>> chart, it > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two > > > > >>>> equal > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. > > > > >>>> What I > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > >> importance? > > > > >>>>>>> What > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many > > > > >>>> varga > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both > > > > >> of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> your > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > > >> valuable > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would > > > > >>>> like > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart > > > > >>>> alone > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> most > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very > > > > >>>> valuable; > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > > >> separate > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), > > > > >> since > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results > > if the > > > > >>>> Rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi > > > > >>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in > > > > >> several > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas > > > > >>>> viewed > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > > chart for > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a > > > > >>>> separate > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of > > > > >>>> checking > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> some > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should > > > > >> be > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence > > > > >> at > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of > > > > >>>> Rasi. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house > > > > >> in > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it > > > > >> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. > > > > >> Why > > > > >>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even > > > > >>>> though > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > > weakened > > > > >>>> it; > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the > > > > >> weakest > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > > >> strengths > > > > >>>> for > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The > > > > >> navamsa > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> position > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak > > in one > > > > >>>> of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> them > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > > Navamsa; > > > > >>>> but > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that > > > > >> it > > > > >>>> can > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> be > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise > > > > >>>> given > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the > > > > >> rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the > > > > >> rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by > > > > >> Chandra) > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa > > > > >> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > > sequence > > > > >>>> of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa > > > > >>>> lagna > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > > opinion > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > > considered on > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always > > > > >>>> says. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the > > > > >>>> Rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is > > > > >> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful > > house, > > > > >>>> and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > >> traditional > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > > >> summarize > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. > > > > >> Rao. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> First > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka > > though > > > > >>>> it > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha > > > > >> and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > > results of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > > >> karakamsha > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > > versed in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of > > > > >> mine > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the > > > > >> results > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > > >> potential > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > > grahas in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > >>>> materialize. I > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it > > > > >> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha > > > > >> has > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> one > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> which > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his > > view > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by > > > > >>>> proper > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >> ________ > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > > >> previews > > > > >>>> at > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Games. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > >> <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 Dear Chandrasekhar ji Yes, It predates Krishna. I clarified earlier - that first three Jain Tirthankar's names are explicitly mentioned in Vedas. Lord Krishna is mentioned as likely 26th Tirthankar in coming yuga (24th was Lord Mahaveera; 25th will be Ravana). regards / Prafulla , Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46 wrote: > > Dear Yogesh, > > The question is that does it predate Lord Krishna, whose Kulguru was > Garga, if my memory serves me right? I do not think that is so. Of > course I have not studied that religion in depth. > > Chandrashekhar. > > Yogesh Shah wrote: > > > > Hi Chandrashekhar Ji, > > > > I agree that Garga predates Mahavira. Just one clarification, Jain > > religion predates Mahavira. > > > > Thank You, > > > > Yogesh Shah > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46 > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote: > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > Garga referred to in jyotish was not a jain muni, as he predates Mahavira. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > Prafulla Gang wrote: > > > > > > Dear Chandrersekhar ji and Pradeep ji, > > > > > > Many thanks for refrence. Since, i do not have Deva keralam handy with > > > me right now - I am not in position to quote specific shloka. But over > > > the periods, I do not know - if anyone has doubted the relevance of > > > Chandra kala nadi. > > > > > > Well, a small reference on garga - I recently heard that, many > > > scholars have linked him to Jain astrology (just because Garga was > > > Jain Saint). No - jainism does not have its explored Jyotish for natal > > > readings) - though the references are there for constellations and > > > spcific significance in its literature. > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > chandrashekhar46 > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk> > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk> > > > > Sun, 08 Jul 2007 00:45:08 +0530 > > > > > > <%40> > > <%40> > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > important?Quarter/Half > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit shlokas, > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So Prafulla is > > > > right. > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a sage well > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > >> > > > >> Dear Prafulla ji > > > >> > > > >> If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > >> talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > >> chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > >> Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > >> chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > >> > > > >> Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by sagelike > > > >> figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not english > > > >> translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in Sanskrit with > > > >> clear reeference to rashi. > > > >> > > > >> Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > >> rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the same > > > >> reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > >> > > > >> So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits can only > > > >> be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha rashi.Whether you > > > >> see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka rashi,they are > > > >> both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no amiguity > > > >> at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > >> > > > >> Regds > > > >> Pradeep > > > >> > > > >> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > >> wrote: > > > >>> > > > >>> Dear Pradeep, > > > >>> > > > >>> many thanks for your pointer. > > > >>> > > > >>> Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - while > > > >> referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in Saravali > > > >> and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which certainly > > > >> carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert back. > > > >>> > > > >>> I quote another reference: > > > >>> Satyacharya: > > > >>> " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) in the > > > >> navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > >> (conveyances). " > > > >>> > > > >>> There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 chart in > > > >> transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are referred > > > >> and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > >>> > > > >>> BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology document; > > > >> as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of D charts > > > >> and aspects therein. > > > >>> > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>> > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > >>>> Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > >>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > >> Quarter/Half > > > >>>> aspects > > > >>>> > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji > > > >>>> > > > >>>> The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in Rashis.Please > > > >>>> check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma clearly > > > >>>> mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half aspect > > > >>>> etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that these are > > > >> non- > > > >>>> full aspects in rashi chart. > > > >>>> > > > >>>> Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and Chandrashekhar ji > > > >> too > > > >>>> had given similr explanations. > > > >>>> > > > >>>> Regds > > > >>>> Pradeep > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > >>>> wrote: > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan Varma > > > >> has > > > >>>> given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury > > > >> aspecting > > > >>>> venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the obvious > > > >>>> reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with current > > > >> age > > > >>>> scholars !! > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> jyotish@ > > > >>>>>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > >>>>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making comment, > > > >> be > > > >>>>>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the > > > >>>> application > > > >>>>>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the wrong > > > >>>>>> application of others; and secondly how to read in correct way). > > > >>>>>> Theorists without predictive support - has little relevance in > > > >>>> jyotish. > > > >>>>>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case studies - > > > >>>> then at > > > >>>>>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > >> commentaries - > > > >>>> but my > > > >>>>>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views > > > >>>> of " less read > > > >>>>>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam / Shri > > > >>>> KN Rao / > > > >>>>>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > >>>> not " pretend " to > > > >>>>>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > >> business " > > > >>>> with my > > > >>>>>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better > > > >>>> quality > > > >>>>>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > >>>>>> ************************************************ > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > >>>>>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > >>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > >>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > >>>>>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every > > > >> one > > > >>>> is > > > >>>>>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is every > > > >>>> chance > > > >>>>>>> that even such new methods might give true results - your > > > >>>> argument is > > > >>>>>>> right. > > > >>>>>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - when > > > >>>> you > > > >>>>>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and > > > >>>> understand > > > >>>>>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow > > > >> someone > > > >>>> who > > > >>>>>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > >>>>>>> Love, > > > >>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > >>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > >>>>>>> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or > > > >>>>>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there not been > > > >>>> any > > > >>>>>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts must > > > >> not > > > >>>>>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better > > > >>>>>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum > > > >>>>>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > >>>>>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the people - > > > >>>> must > > > >>>>>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit > > > >>>>>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not have any > > > >>>>>>> relevance. > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > >> right > > > >>>> to > > > >>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > >>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > >>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > >>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) " just > > > >>>> like > > > >>>>>>> D1 > > > >>>>>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of > > > >>>> planets > > > >>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamasa " > > > >>>>>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when planets > > > >>>> are > > > >>>>>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the > > > >>>> sages; > > > >>>>>>> If > > > >>>>>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> Love, > > > >>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa > > > >>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - > > > >>>> can be > > > >>>>>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 chart. > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > >>>>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > >>>> right > > > >>>>>>> to > > > >>>>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > >>>>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > >> important? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. Navamsa > > > >>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, because > > > >>>> it > > > >>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other > > > >> amsas > > > >>>> due > > > >>>>>>>>> to > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > >> overall > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the strength of > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > >>>> importance. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart > > > >>>> like > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. > > > >>>> (There > > > >>>>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated > > > >>>> as > > > >>>>>>> if > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only > > > >> means > > > >>>>>>> that. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means that. It is > > > >>>>>>> wrong > > > >>>>>>>>> to > > > >>>>>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well? > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But > > > >> yes > > > >>>>>>>>> yoga in > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. Because it > > > >>>> is > > > >>>>>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>> result > > > >>>>>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses are not > > > >>>>>>>>> applicable > > > >>>>>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > >>>> considered > > > >>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about > > > >>>> aspect > > > >>>>>>> or > > > >>>>>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi > > > >>>> chart. > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Love, > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > >> Seetharama > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on importance of > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa > > > >>>> chart > > > >>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my experience > > > >>>> so > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not understood > > > >>>> what > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> important. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > >> overall > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa chart > > > >>>> like > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be treated > > > >>>> as > > > >>>>>>> if > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as well? > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa > > > >>>> chart, it > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make up two > > > >>>> equal > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. > > > >>>> What I > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > >> importance? > > > >>>>>>> What > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of many > > > >>>> varga > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> charts! > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and both > > > >> of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> your > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > >> valuable > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I would > > > >>>> like > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa chart > > > >>>> alone > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> most > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found both the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very > > > >>>> valuable; > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> at the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > >> separate > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), > > > >> since > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> any of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results if the > > > >>>> Rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the Rasi > > > >>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in > > > >> several > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that yogas > > > >>>> viewed > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa chart for > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a > > > >>>> separate > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of > > > >>>> checking > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> some > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana should > > > >> be > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual influence > > > >> at > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. span. of > > > >>>> Rasi. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own house > > > >> in > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa chart, it > > > >> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. > > > >> Why > > > >>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, even > > > >>>> though > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has weakened > > > >>>> it; > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> means, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the > > > >> weakest > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point for > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it loses its > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> strength > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > >> strengths > > > >>>> for > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The > > > >> navamsa > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> position > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement within > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak in one > > > >>>> of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> them > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to Navamsa; > > > >>>> but > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent that > > > >> it > > > >>>> can > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> be > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise > > > >>>> given > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> by the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the > > > >> rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I have > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> observed > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the > > > >> rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the karakamsa > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by > > > >> Chandra) > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the karakamsa > > > >> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> brought > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The sequence > > > >>>> of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> my life > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider karakamsa > > > >>>> lagna > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's opinion > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be considered on > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao always > > > >>>> says. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi in the > > > >>>> Rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my Sukra is > > > >> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful house, > > > >>>> and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > >> traditional > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education). > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > >> summarize > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not necessarily in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > >> <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. > > > >> Rao. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> First > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> there is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka though > > > >>>> it > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered that in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be understood in > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> context that > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha > > > >> and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the results of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > >> karakamsha > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well versed in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of > > > >> mine > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> if he > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the > > > >> results > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > >> potential > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the grahas in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > >>>> materialize. I > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> hope > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for whatever it > > > >> is > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is pointing to > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also says,Karakamsha > > > >> has > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> one > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not pointing to > > > >> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there are some > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> which > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting his view > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell this.Sometimes > > > >>>> the > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by > > > >>>> proper > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>> > > > >>>> > > > >> ________ > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ______________ > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > >> previews > > > >>>> at > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Games. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > >> <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 Dear Pradeep ji I presume that thread has reached at maturity stage, where all explanations will be just repetition from either side. So - my humble suggestion that we may have more meaningful discussion on it - once we learn from you the predictive model on your interpretation of shloka through case studies. > 1)Can aspects be seen from navamsha arrangement? Does the rules allow > that? No.I cannot see such from the usage of giants who lived 1000's > of years ago.Even BPHS translator had the same view. For the sake of clarifications: I have produced few explanation of Late Santhanam ji, which explains the use of aspects in Navamsa chart. and Late Santhanam was a BPHS translator. regards / Prafulla www.prafulla.net __________ KEEP SPYWARE OFF YOUR COMPUTER - Protect your computer with Spyware Terminator! Visit http://www.spywareterminator.com/install and find out more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 Dear friends, First of all, let me make it clear that I am not attempting to prolonging this thread, as we all understood the opinions expressed by various astrologers on this forum. I am just trying to give you one of the most recent case studies done by Sri KN Rao, on Musharraf and posted it just a few days ago. In that article, he clearly used aspects and bhavas in the Dasamsa chart, not only the navamsa chart. Interestd people may read that article at www.journalofastrology.com site. From my own experience and understanding the knowledge showered on us by Sri KN Rao and and other similar great astrologers, I am convinced to use Navamsa chart and other charts, however, in conjunction with Rasi chart. Certainly the amsa charts do not exist without the rasi chart. Best regards, Satya S Kolachina , Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote: > > Dear Pradeep ji > > I presume that thread has reached at maturity stage, where all explanations will be just repetition from either side. > > So - my humble suggestion that we may have more meaningful discussion on it - once we learn from you the predictive model on your interpretation of shloka through case studies. > > > 1)Can aspects be seen from navamsha arrangement? Does the rules allow > > that? No.I cannot see such from the usage of giants who lived 1000's > > of years ago.Even BPHS translator had the same view. > > > For the sake of clarifications: > I have produced few explanation of Late Santhanam ji, which explains the use of aspects in Navamsa chart. and Late Santhanam was a BPHS translator. > > regards / Prafulla > www.prafulla.net > > __________ > KEEP SPYWARE OFF YOUR COMPUTER - Protect your computer with Spyware Terminator! > Visit http://www.spywareterminator.com/install and find out more! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 Shri Satya Sai ji, Good observation and the best reference till date. I agree with almost all your views in this and some previous mail too. regards, Bhaskar. In , " Satya Sai Kolachina " <skolachi wrote: > > Dear friends, > > First of all, let me make it clear that I am not attempting to > prolonging this thread, as we all understood the opinions expressed > by various astrologers on this forum. > > I am just trying to give you one of the most recent case studies > done by Sri KN Rao, on Musharraf and posted it just a few days ago. > In that article, he clearly used aspects and bhavas in the Dasamsa > chart, not only the navamsa chart. Interestd people may read that > article at www.journalofastrology.com site. > > From my own experience and understanding the knowledge showered on > us by Sri KN Rao and and other similar great astrologers, I am > convinced to use Navamsa chart and other charts, however, in > conjunction with Rasi chart. Certainly the amsa charts do not exist > without the rasi chart. > > Best regards, > > Satya S Kolachina > > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > wrote: > > > > Dear Pradeep ji > > > > I presume that thread has reached at maturity stage, where all > explanations will be just repetition from either side. > > > > So - my humble suggestion that we may have more meaningful > discussion on it - once we learn from you the predictive model on > your interpretation of shloka through case studies. > > > > > 1)Can aspects be seen from navamsha arrangement? Does the rules > allow > > > that? No.I cannot see such from the usage of giants who lived > 1000's > > > of years ago.Even BPHS translator had the same view. > > > > > > For the sake of clarifications: > > I have produced few explanation of Late Santhanam ji, which > explains the use of aspects in Navamsa chart. and Late Santhanam was > a BPHS translator. > > > > regards / Prafulla > > www.prafulla.net > > > > __________ > > KEEP SPYWARE OFF YOUR COMPUTER - Protect your computer with > Spyware Terminator! > > Visit http://www.spywareterminator.com/install and find out more! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 Dear Satya ji Thanks a lot for your views.As i have said before,i would agree with all points in this mail save for ,navamsha chart in conjunction with rashi chart. I would prefer to say amshas in conjunction with Rashi chart.Ofcourse this is my opinion and you have your own experience and reasons to beleive otherwise. I respect shri Raoji,but if we have doubts regarding his explanations ,then we may raise it,without showing any disrespect. I will take the Swamsha example - ''Meshadi rashi ge Swamshe'' - Raoji is only the person i feel,who has translated Swamshe from a totally different angle. He took Swamshe as a group of all navamshas.But the succeeding shlokas asks us to see 4th from Swamsha/Karakamsha ,in Swamsha,10th from etc. If sage had full chart in mind,then we do not know where to start from and hence the interpretation is failing.You can seek explanation with Shri Raoji or any others in this group regarding this. On the other hand Karaka grahas amsha will satisfy all the conditions.This is very evident. Similarly regarding aspects ,i have expressed my views. Your views are respected and we are only seeking views from Raoji.On the other hand Raoji has rightly identified,from where Karakamsha has to be seen. As you may see,i am not taking sides with anyone.As a student ,i am just saying as it is seen. Regds Pradeep , " Satya Sai Kolachina " <skolachi wrote: > > Dear friends, > > First of all, let me make it clear that I am not attempting to > prolonging this thread, as we all understood the opinions expressed > by various astrologers on this forum. > > I am just trying to give you one of the most recent case studies > done by Sri KN Rao, on Musharraf and posted it just a few days ago. > In that article, he clearly used aspects and bhavas in the Dasamsa > chart, not only the navamsa chart. Interestd people may read that > article at www.journalofastrology.com site. > > From my own experience and understanding the knowledge showered on > us by Sri KN Rao and and other similar great astrologers, I am > convinced to use Navamsa chart and other charts, however, in > conjunction with Rasi chart. Certainly the amsa charts do not exist > without the rasi chart. > > Best regards, > > Satya S Kolachina > > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > wrote: > > > > Dear Pradeep ji > > > > I presume that thread has reached at maturity stage, where all > explanations will be just repetition from either side. > > > > So - my humble suggestion that we may have more meaningful > discussion on it - once we learn from you the predictive model on > your interpretation of shloka through case studies. > > > > > 1)Can aspects be seen from navamsha arrangement? Does the rules > allow > > > that? No.I cannot see such from the usage of giants who lived > 1000's > > > of years ago.Even BPHS translator had the same view. > > > > > > For the sake of clarifications: > > I have produced few explanation of Late Santhanam ji, which > explains the use of aspects in Navamsa chart. and Late Santhanam was > a BPHS translator. > > > > regards / Prafulla > > www.prafulla.net > > > > __________ > > KEEP SPYWARE OFF YOUR COMPUTER - Protect your computer with > Spyware Terminator! > > Visit http://www.spywareterminator.com/install and find out more! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 Dear Prafulla, As I said, I am not an expert on this but it appears Vardhman Mahavira, as I understand, was born around 599 b.c. Lord Krishna of Dwarka died around 3102 B.C. and Ravana is from Dvapara yuga. So the order of appearance does not seem to fit or the reference is to some other Krishna and Ravana. Chandrashekhar. Prafulla Gang wrote: > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji > > Yes, It predates Krishna. I clarified earlier - that first three Jain > Tirthankar's names are explicitly mentioned in Vedas. Lord Krishna is > mentioned as likely 26th Tirthankar in coming yuga (24th was Lord > Mahaveera; 25th will be Ravana). > > regards / Prafulla > > > <%40>, Chandrashekhar > <chandrashekhar46 wrote: > > > > Dear Yogesh, > > > > The question is that does it predate Lord Krishna, whose Kulguru was > > Garga, if my memory serves me right? I do not think that is so. Of > > course I have not studied that religion in depth. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > Yogesh Shah wrote: > > > > > > Hi Chandrashekhar Ji, > > > > > > I agree that Garga predates Mahavira. Just one clarification, Jain > > > religion predates Mahavira. > > > > > > Thank You, > > > > > > Yogesh Shah > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar <chandrashekhar46 > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk>> wrote: > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > Garga referred to in jyotish was not a jain muni, as he predates > Mahavira. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > Prafulla Gang wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrersekhar ji and Pradeep ji, > > > > > > > > Many thanks for refrence. Since, i do not have Deva keralam > handy with > > > > me right now - I am not in position to quote specific shloka. > But over > > > > the periods, I do not know - if anyone has doubted the relevance of > > > > Chandra kala nadi. > > > > > > > > Well, a small reference on garga - I recently heard that, many > > > > scholars have linked him to Jain astrology (just because Garga was > > > > Jain Saint). No - jainism does not have its explored Jyotish for > natal > > > > readings) - though the references are there for constellations and > > > > spcific significance in its literature. > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > > > > > " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > ************************************************ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > chandrashekhar46 > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk> > > > > <chandrashekhar46%40.co.uk> > > > > > Sun, 08 Jul 2007 00:45:08 +0530 > > > > > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > > Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > important?Quarter/Half > > > > > aspects > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pradeep, > > > > > > > > > > I do not know whether you have read Chandrakalanadi Sanskrit > shlokas, > > > > > but the reference to transit identical with the amshas of the > > > > > navamshesha of a bhava lord is clearly given therein. So > Prafulla is > > > > > right. > > > > > > > > > > For the record, Garga was not considered sage like but was a > sage well > > > > > respected by even Parashara himself. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > >> > > > > >> Dear Prafulla ji > > > > >> > > > > >> If you may note,there were couple of cases similar to what you > > > > >> talk,where Chandrashsekhar ji feels those as aspects in varga > > > > >> chakras.Those cases are clealry explained in > Dashadhayayi.Moreover > > > > >> Chandrashekhar ji had different opinion on kemadruma and > > > > >> chandranavmshaka rashi. > > > > >> > > > > >> Those cases too were explined not onlyin dashadhayayi but by > sagelike > > > > >> figures,Garga,Jeevasharma and sruthakeerthi.Those were not > english > > > > >> translations as you have given from Devakeralam.But in > Sanskrit with > > > > >> clear reeference to rashi. > > > > >> > > > > >> Thus ,the basic principle is amshas and amshakas roots back to > > > > >> rashis.Within a Rashi we have amshas of other rashis.For the same > > > > >> reason amshas and rashis are lorded by same planet. > > > > >> > > > > >> So what you are saying have to read in Rashi chart.Transits > can only > > > > >> be seen w.r to Rashi chart.How do you find navamsha > rashi.Whether you > > > > >> see it from 3.2 degre sector or from a full navamshaka > rashi,they are > > > > >> both pointing to Rashi chakra.Thus for transits there is no > amiguity > > > > >> at all.You can ask any Jyotishi. > > > > >> > > > > >> Regds > > > > >> Pradeep > > > > >> > > > > >> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > >> wrote: > > > > >>> > > > > >>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > >>> > > > > >>> many thanks for your pointer. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> Well, kalyan Varma must have hinted at partial aspect - while > > > > >> referring to D chart aspect. let me search for reference in > Saravali > > > > >> and also search for Shri Rohini Ranjan's opinion (which certainly > > > > >> carries more weight than my layman's opinion ) and revert back. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> I quote another reference: > > > > >>> Satyacharya: > > > > >>> " " As mercury and venus are in kendra (i.e. angular rashis) > in the > > > > >> navamsa chakra from each other, the native possess Vahanas > > > > >> (conveyances). " > > > > >>> > > > > >>> There are huge references in Deva Keralam - on use of D9 > chart in > > > > >> transit analysis as well natal analysis - where aspects are > referred > > > > >> and navamsa chakras are referred. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> BPHS in current version - may not be conclusive astrology > document; > > > > >> as many equally respectable sages - have referred the use of > D charts > > > > >> and aspects therein. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > >>> ************************************************ > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> vijayadas_pradeep@ > > > > >>>> Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:04:44 -0000 > > > > >>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > > >> Quarter/Half > > > > >>>> aspects > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Dear Prafulla ji > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> The mentioned aspects are clearly for placement in > Rashis.Please > > > > >>>> check Saravali again.Also in another chapter Kalyan Varma > clearly > > > > >>>> mentions about every planet having ,quarter aspect,half aspect > > > > >>>> etc,apart from full aspect.Thus it is pretty clear that > these are > > > > >> non- > > > > >>>> full aspects in rashi chart. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Shri Ranjan did raise this question before and > Chandrashekhar ji > > > > >> too > > > > >>>> had given similr explanations. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Regds > > > > >>>> Pradeep > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > >>>> wrote: > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> Another important issue - In D9 charts reference - kalyan > Varma > > > > >> has > > > > >>>> given hints for results for Sun aspecting venus; or mercury > > > > >> aspecting > > > > >>>> venus. Since they can never " aspect " in Rashi Kundli - the > obvious > > > > >>>> reference was to Navamsa " chart " . > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> I do not think, kalyan varma can be treated at par with > current > > > > >> age > > > > >>>> scholars !! > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>>> > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > >>>>> ************************************************ > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> jyotish@ > > > > >>>>>> Thu, 5 Jul 2007 20:23:15 -0800 > > > > >>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so important? > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> Well - who knows the truth? - Should the person making > comment, > > > > >> be > > > > >>>>>> construed to be as truth seeker - until they prove with the > > > > >>>> application > > > > >>>>>> of the principles on the charts ( both ways - firstly the > wrong > > > > >>>>>> application of others; and secondly how to read in > correct way). > > > > >>>>>> Theorists without predictive support - has little > relevance in > > > > >>>> jyotish. > > > > >>>>>> But yes - if you can justify your statements by case > studies - > > > > >>>> then at > > > > >>>>>> least, I will hear with open mind. > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> Understandably, I have been quoted to be " blind " to > > > > >> commentaries - > > > > >>>> but my > > > > >>>>>> submission is that - give me one reason to accept the views > > > > >>>> of " less read > > > > >>>>>> scholars " than to " well read scholars like Late Santhanam > / Shri > > > > >>>> KN Rao / > > > > >>>>>> Shri Sanjay rath / many others " . and More so - as I do > > > > >>>> not " pretend " to > > > > >>>>>> know the sanskrit and do not " waste " my time on " shloka > > > > >> business " > > > > >>>> with my > > > > >>>>>> " incomplete knowledge " . So I am happy to be following better > > > > >>>> quality > > > > >>>>>> commentaries - who are expalining with the case studies. > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> Of course - each one makes his choice. > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>>> > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> " Men who never get carried away should be. " > > > > >>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > >>>>>>> Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:00:31 -0000 > > > > >>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > important? > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > >>>>>>> * Even if those things are not there in ancient texts every > > > > >> one > > > > >>>> is > > > > >>>>>>> free to make or follow there own choice - yes, there is > every > > > > >>>> chance > > > > >>>>>>> that even such new methods might give true results - your > > > > >>>> argument is > > > > >>>>>>> right. > > > > >>>>>>> * As far Sanskrit is concerned: Yes, it is your choice - > when > > > > >>>> you > > > > >>>>>>> are blind to read and understand Sanskrit your self, and > > > > >>>> understand > > > > >>>>>>> what is there and what not, of course you have to follow > > > > >> someone > > > > >>>> who > > > > >>>>>>> says they see - you are right in that as well. > > > > >>>>>>> Love, > > > > >>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > >>>>>>> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> Well Sreenadh ji - at times, these issues become choice or > > > > >>>>>>> prejudices in our own form of reading model. Had there > not been > > > > >>>> any > > > > >>>>>>> substance in interpreting D9 charts - lot many stalwarts > must > > > > >> not > > > > >>>>>>> have explored it - and I presume - many of them know better > > > > >>>>>>> sanskrit / jyotish (rather both) than all of us on the forum > > > > >>>>>>> collectively. So if at all - anyone wish to contest the > > > > >>>>>>> interpretation - then many of those stalwarts are the > people - > > > > >>>> must > > > > >>>>>>> be debated with. On the forum, where not many great sanskrit > > > > >>>>>>> scholars / jyotish researchers - the arguments may not > have any > > > > >>>>>>> relevance. > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > > >> right > > > > >>>> to > > > > >>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > >>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > >>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 13:56:36 -0000 > > > > >>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > important? > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Dear Prafulla ji, > > > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text ask us to read Navamsha (not chart) > " just > > > > >>>> like > > > > >>>>>>> D1 > > > > >>>>>>>>> chart " ; nor they provide slokas for the same. > > > > >>>>>>>>> * No ancient text provide as the results for " aspects of > > > > >>>> planets > > > > >>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>> Navamasa " > > > > >>>>>>>>> * Nor they give us the results to be predicted when > planets > > > > >>>> are > > > > >>>>>>>>> placed " x house with reference to navamsa lagna " > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> I hope we are trying to study astrology as taught by the > > > > >>>> sages; > > > > >>>>>>> If > > > > >>>>>>>>> not I don't have anything to say. > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Love, > > > > >>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > > > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dear Sreenadh ji > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I have also observed many jyotish stalwarts using navamsa > > > > >>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>> (along with other D charts). Now how to assess D9 charts - > > > > >>>> can be > > > > >>>>>>>>> perspective. But - as most authors say - just like D1 > chart. > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I request members to share their experience. > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > >>>>>>>>>> http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>> > > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>> > > > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net> > <http://www.prafulla.net <http://www.prafulla.net>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> " The right to be heard does not automatically include the > > > > >>>> right > > > > >>>>>>> to > > > > >>>>>>>>> be taken seriously. " > > > > >>>>>>>>>> ************************************************ > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> sreesog@ > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Tue, 03 Jul 2007 07:56:49 -0000 > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Re: Why Navamsa Chart is so > > > > >> important? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Krishna ji, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I too to the view that Navamsa chart is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * There is not Navamsa " chart " , but only Navamsa. > Navamsa > > > > >>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> not as important as Rasi chart and it can never be, > because > > > > >>>> it > > > > >>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> only an amsa. But yes, it is more important than other > > > > >> amsas > > > > >>>> due > > > > >>>>>>>>> to > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the prior said reasons. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > > >> overall > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * Because the quality of earth determines the > strength of > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> plant. This is applicable to all amsas as per their > > > > >>>> importance. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > chart > > > > >>>> like > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, it is not allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa. > > > > >>>> (There > > > > >>>>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> no navamsa 'chart'.) > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > treated > > > > >>>> as > > > > >>>>>>> if > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, when planets have sambandha in Navamsa, it only > > > > >> means > > > > >>>>>>> that. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> When they have sombandha in Rasi, it only means > that. It is > > > > >>>>>>> wrong > > > > >>>>>>>>> to > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> mix the two. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ==> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as > well? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <== > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> * No, Yogas should not be looked in Navamsa 'chart'. But > > > > >> yes > > > > >>>>>>>>> yoga in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa (not navamsa 'chart') can be taken yoga. > Because it > > > > >>>> is > > > > >>>>>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> same principles as used in Rasi that are used to predict > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>> result > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> in Amsas as well - But Aspect(Drishti) and houses > are not > > > > >>>>>>>>> applicable > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> to amsas. Both Aspect(Drishti) and Houses should be > > > > >>>> considered > > > > >>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Rasi chart itself. Any reference in ancient texts about > > > > >>>> aspect > > > > >>>>>>> or > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> houses essentially mean that they are referring to Rasi > > > > >>>> chart. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Love, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Sreenadh > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Krishnamurthy > > > > >> Seetharama > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> <krishna_1998@> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Kolachina ji, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> It was interesting to read your comments on > importance of > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa chart. I too to the view that Navamsa > > > > >>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> as important as Rasi chart. This is based on my > experience > > > > >>>> so > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> far reading charts. However, I have still not > understood > > > > >>>> what > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons for a varga chart being so > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> important. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why strength of a planet is Navamsa determines the > > > > >> overall > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> strength of a planet? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why it is allowed to consider aspects in Navamsa > chart > > > > >>>> like > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> aspects in a Rasi chart? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why sambandha of planets in Navamsa chart can be > treated > > > > >>>> as > > > > >>>>>>> if > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the planets have a sambandha in Rasi chart? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Why yogas should be looked at in navamsa chart as > well? > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> By looking at the kind of importance given to Navamsa > > > > >>>> chart, it > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> appears that the Rasi chart and Navamsa chart make > up two > > > > >>>> equal > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> halves representing the native. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I have no doubts about the importance of Navamsa Chart. > > > > >>>> What I > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> would like to know is why Navamsa gains such an > > > > >> importance? > > > > >>>>>>> What > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> are the fundamental reasons? After all it is one of > many > > > > >>>> varga > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> charts! > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Regards, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Krishna > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi@> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Sri Pradeep and Sri Chandrasekhar, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been following this thread on karakamsa and > both > > > > >> of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> your > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> contributions. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I whole-heartedly appreciate both of you for your > > > > >> valuable > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> inputs > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> you are providing to the astrological community. I > would > > > > >>>> like > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> share my opinion (through my own experience). > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Considering Karakamsa from either Rasi or Navamsa > chart > > > > >>>> alone > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> most > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> probably leads to erroneous results, as I found > both the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> approaches > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> working. I see the point Pradeep is making as very > > > > >>>> valuable; > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> at the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same time I am not against using Navamsa chart as > > > > >> separate > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart (of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> course without losing the context of the Rasi chart), > > > > >> since > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> any of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the varga charts will not give independent results > if the > > > > >>>> Rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is ignored, as they themselves do not exist if the > Rasi > > > > >>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't exist. In fact Sri KN Rao also mentioned in > > > > >> several > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occassions in many of his articles and books that > yogas > > > > >>>> viewed > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the Rasi chart should also exist in the Navamsa > chart for > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> confirming > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the results. If we do not see the Navamsa chart as a > > > > >>>> separate > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> how can we see the yogas therein? For the purpose of > > > > >>>> checking > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> some > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> yogas, Yuti and Veekshana (conjunction and aspects) in > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> navamsa > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart make sense. This kind of yuti or veekshana > should > > > > >> be > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered on a hypothetical level (as mutual > influence > > > > >> at > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> amsha level) rather than being within a 30 deg. > span. of > > > > >>>> Rasi. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Take an example. If a planet is exlated or in own > house > > > > >> in > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart and attains debilitation in the Navamsa > chart, it > > > > >> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> condiered > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> as weakening of the actual strength shown in the Rasi. > > > > >> Why > > > > >>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered so? It is considered like that because, > even > > > > >>>> though > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet is within its own or exlated rasi, still its > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> positioning > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within that particular sector (here navamsa) has > weakened > > > > >>>> it; > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> means, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> within its own rasi, this particular sector is the > > > > >> weakest > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point for > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the planet within the strongest rasi; hence it > loses its > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> strength > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considerably. This means there is a gradation of > > > > >> strengths > > > > >>>> for > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> planet from first navamsa to the last navamsa. The > > > > >> navamsa > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> position > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> of a planet, thus indicates its refined placement > within > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> In fact, Sri KN Rao also gives equal weightage to both > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rasi and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa placement of a planet. If a planet is weak > in one > > > > >>>> of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> them > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that means half the weightage is lost. We may not give > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> same > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> level of treatment to other vargas as we give to > Navamsa; > > > > >>>> but > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Navamsa is as important as the Rasi; to the extent > that > > > > >> it > > > > >>>> can > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> be > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> viewed as an independent chart (to confirm the promise > > > > >>>> given > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> by the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi chart). > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Without a confirmation of Navamsa chart, yogas in the > > > > >> rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> alone cannot and will not give expected results; I > have > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> observed > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this phenomenon in several charts. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> My own experience is; I have Chandra and Sukra both in > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 12th > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house from Karakamsa in the Navamsa chart (not in the > > > > >> rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> with the rasi of karakamsa considering as the > karakamsa > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> lagna). I am > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> a deep devotee of Goddess Parvathi (represented by > > > > >> Chandra) > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Goddess Lakshmi (represented by Sukra). If the > karakamsa > > > > >> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> brought > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to the Rasi chart, this cannot be explained. The > sequence > > > > >>>> of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> my life > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> events are better explained only if I consider > karakamsa > > > > >>>> lagna > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the navamsa chart; I am not discounting Pradeep's > opinion > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> here; I am > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> just saying that both approaches need to be > considered on > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and a composite opinion be formed, as Sri KN Rao > always > > > > >>>> says. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On the other hand, considering the specific rasi > in the > > > > >>>> Rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that holds karakamsa as the karakamsa lagna, my > Sukra is > > > > >> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the 4th > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> house indicating my possession of a nice beautiful > house, > > > > >>>> and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education/skills in arts (in addition to other > > > > >> traditional > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> education). > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I am bringing this to both your knowledge only to > > > > >> summarize > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> both your theories give results; but not > necessarily in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> isolation of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the other. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all your contribution. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Best regards, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Satya S Kolachina > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > <%40> > > > <%40> > > > > <%40> > > > > >> <%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> <chandrashekhar46@> wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Pradeep, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can not comment on views of either Sanjay or K. N. > > > > >> Rao. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> First > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> there is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> no difference in the meaning of Amsha and Amshaka > though > > > > >>>> it > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> perhaps > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> being confused. It also needs to be remembered > that in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> astrological > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> translations many a times words are to be > understood in > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> context that > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> they used. So we find Parashara mentioning karakamsha > > > > >> and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Swamsha > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> alternate lines (almost) while indicating the > results of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> occupation of > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Karakamsha by Sun etc. and many other places in > > > > >> karakamsha > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> adhyaaya. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> This does not mean he is speaking about two different > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> parameters. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> think if any Sanskrit scholar who is also well > versed in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> interpretation > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of astrological texts will confirm this contention of > > > > >> mine > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> if he > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> watching this discussion. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want my personal opinion, I think that the > > > > >> results > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> indicated on > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the basis of Karakamsha without reference to the > > > > >> potential > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> promised by > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rasi chart and the strength derived by the > grahas in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rasi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> chart, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> through the Navamsha chart, are not likely to > > > > >>>> materialize. I > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> hope > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> this > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> opinion of mine does not create a big storm in the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> discussion on > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> list. But this is my personal opinion, for > whatever it > > > > >> is > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> worth. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Take care, > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> vijayadas_pradeep wrote: > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Respected members > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shri Sanjay Rath clearly says ,Amshaka is > pointing to > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha.He also > says,Karakamsha > > > > >> has > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> one > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> meaning ,while Karakamsha KA has another meaning. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chandrashekhar jis view is Amshaka is not > pointing to > > > > >> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rashi > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which a graha is having amsha. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Now Chandraekhar jis view is prudent as there > are some > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> shlokas > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> which > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shri Rath somehow has overlooked,contradicting > his view > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> point. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I respect shri Rath ,but i have to tell > this.Sometimes > > > > >>>> the > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> answer and > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> explanations given by shri Rath are not preceded by > > > > >>>> proper > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> === message truncated === > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >> ________ > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ______________ > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Be a PS3 game guru. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and > > > > >> previews > > > > >>>> at > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Games. > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>>> > > > > >> <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>> > > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121> > > > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121 > <http://videogames./platform?platform=120121>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 Dear Sri Bhaskar, Thanks for your encouraging words. I am a practical astrologer. Sri KN Rao himself forwarned in several occassions, not to use the shlokas from classics VERBATIM, unless tested on hundreds of horoscopes. So, he is also a practical astrologer. His approach is: take a principle; test it on hundreds of horoscopes and finally use it with CONFIDENCE. Here the word confidence is important; it comes only after testing and blind-testing the principle. Either we shd do the testing on hundreds of horoscopes by ourselves (I doubt if any of the Internet astrologers do that), or we can take the guiding path shown by pioneers like him; the choice is ours. Best regards, Satya S Kolachina , " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish wrote: > > Shri Satya Sai ji, > > Good observation and the best > reference till date. > I agree with almost all your views in > this and some previous mail too. > > regards, > Bhaskar. > > > In , " Satya Sai Kolachina " <skolachi@> > wrote: > > > > Dear friends, > > > > First of all, let me make it clear that I am not attempting to > > prolonging this thread, as we all understood the opinions expressed > > by various astrologers on this forum. > > > > I am just trying to give you one of the most recent case studies > > done by Sri KN Rao, on Musharraf and posted it just a few days ago. > > In that article, he clearly used aspects and bhavas in the Dasamsa > > chart, not only the navamsa chart. Interestd people may read that > > article at www.journalofastrology.com site. > > > > From my own experience and understanding the knowledge showered on > > us by Sri KN Rao and and other similar great astrologers, I am > > convinced to use Navamsa chart and other charts, however, in > > conjunction with Rasi chart. Certainly the amsa charts do not exist > > without the rasi chart. > > > > Best regards, > > > > Satya S Kolachina > > > > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Pradeep ji > > > > > > I presume that thread has reached at maturity stage, where all > > explanations will be just repetition from either side. > > > > > > So - my humble suggestion that we may have more meaningful > > discussion on it - once we learn from you the predictive model on > > your interpretation of shloka through case studies. > > > > > > > 1)Can aspects be seen from navamsha arrangement? Does the rules > > allow > > > > that? No.I cannot see such from the usage of giants who lived > > 1000's > > > > of years ago.Even BPHS translator had the same view. > > > > > > > > > For the sake of clarifications: > > > I have produced few explanation of Late Santhanam ji, which > > explains the use of aspects in Navamsa chart. and Late Santhanam was > > a BPHS translator. > > > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > www.prafulla.net > > > > > > __________ > > > KEEP SPYWARE OFF YOUR COMPUTER - Protect your computer with > > Spyware Terminator! > > > Visit http://www.spywareterminator.com/install and find out more! > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 11, 2007 Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 Dear Kolachina ji, Thanks for this reference. It once for all clarifies what is the opinion of Rao ji on whether one should look for aspects in Navamsha or not. Regards, Krishna --- Satya Sai Kolachina <skolachi wrote: > Dear friends, > > First of all, let me make it clear that I am not attempting to > > prolonging this thread, as we all understood the opinions > expressed > by various astrologers on this forum. > > I am just trying to give you one of the most recent case > studies > done by Sri KN Rao, on Musharraf and posted it just a few days > ago. > In that article, he clearly used aspects and bhavas in the > Dasamsa > chart, not only the navamsa chart. Interestd people may read > that > article at www.journalofastrology.com site. > > From my own experience and understanding the knowledge > showered on > us by Sri KN Rao and and other similar great astrologers, I am > > convinced to use Navamsa chart and other charts, however, in > conjunction with Rasi chart. Certainly the amsa charts do not > exist > without the rasi chart. > > Best regards, > > Satya S Kolachina > > , Prafulla Gang > <jyotish > wrote: > > > > Dear Pradeep ji > > > > I presume that thread has reached at maturity stage, where > all > explanations will be just repetition from either side. > > > > So - my humble suggestion that we may have more meaningful > discussion on it - once we learn from you the predictive model > on > your interpretation of shloka through case studies. > > > > > 1)Can aspects be seen from navamsha arrangement? Does the > rules > allow > > > that? No.I cannot see such from the usage of giants who > lived > 1000's > > > of years ago.Even BPHS translator had the same view. > > > > > > For the sake of clarifications: > > I have produced few explanation of Late Santhanam ji, which > explains the use of aspects in Navamsa chart. and Late > Santhanam was > a BPHS translator. > > > > regards / Prafulla > > www.prafulla.net > > > > __________ > > KEEP SPYWARE OFF YOUR COMPUTER - Protect your computer with > Spyware Terminator! > > Visit http://www.spywareterminator.com/install and find out > more! > > > > > ______________________________\ ____ Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with FareChase. http://farechase./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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