Guest guest Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 Dear Revati Ji, Namaskar, Thanks for your response, But I find that you have diverted the direction, whereas I am very particular about any point and we must limited to that point for concluding some answer. Because you are a practitioner astrologer though you claim that >>>> I have left all worldly matters for years for this knowledge. I only can say:Astrology is THE science of reality.<<<<< hence in the interest of your business you will always try to divert the point of issue. I am again picking some point from your mail for further discussion. >>>> we need a new science in this new millenium - just look into this world with open eyes, and what you see is a consequence of this 19th/20th century science.<<<< No, because science is not limited to 19-20 the century. Any systematic knowledge which can not be questioned and answerable beyond doubt is science. Hence when our sages used to lit the fire with the help of rubbing wooden stick then it was also science or when our ancestral design the wheel then it was also science though they were not able to make the wheel of aeroplane. >>>>>>Did you make a muhurtha of your very first mail to me? Do see the planetary constellations? What can you derive from " our " future (our current small correspondance) from this muhurtha?<<<<< Yes, it is evident that our correspondence will not last for a long time because you are expert in diverting the issue and I am stick to explore the roots of astrological principles. Refer my first blog " Astrology a science or myth " >>>>>>> " Vedic " Astrology indeed is an " Astrology of the Seers " <<<<< How Vedic ? when there is no astrological principles or sign etc in any Ved. This word is used just to exploit the sentiments of general public towards Ved. >>>>>it is necessary that you leave most worldly matters for at least three years - leaving job, marriage, strife for worldly success and fame, richness. There is no other way. I have done it.<<<<<<< OK, even then you are not able to answer my pointed questions as to how astrological principles were formulated. Refer my blog " Astrology a science or myth " . >>>>>Step by step you'll discover that planetary effects are the root behind all material and immaterial reality.<<<< There is no effect of planet for carving our future. It is only psychological affect by which it appears that prediction is right. I have studied astrology for long +35 years and after that I am saying that it is wrong. Because principles are basically wrong and not founded on right information. That's why I come out with two original books, highlighting as to how principles were formulated on wrong concept. >>>>>And you are absolutely right: the fundaments of astrology are indeed logical, the more you study it, the more deeper.<<<<<< Do not pick my words. Because fundamentals of astrology was based on primitive information hence they were logical and right in view of the then knowledge. But in view of modern information, all astrological principles are bogus including BPHS. Though there is no original BPHS. Do you know that in Primitive age it was believed that Earth is stationary and Sun is nearer to Earth, whereas Moon is far away from the Earth and so on. Unfortunately all astrological principles are based on such typy of information. But now when we know that Earth is not resting and Moon is nearer then Moon and so on. Then how you can say the astrological principles are correct and astrology is science of reality. I hope we will remain within the parameter of astrological principles and you may also go through the blog " Astrology a science or myth " for more pointed discussion. Remember nothing is personal and it is only academic discussion. Thanks Yours truly, Sanat 0751 2626868 Gwalior Dear Sanat, it is end of weekend, so I will answer you right now because this week will be very laborious. This mail is about astrological roots. I send it to you while Moon transits in Ashvini, 3rd pada (Ge) and Lagna 2° Sagittarius, in Moola. Both are Ketu Nakshatras, both link us to the roots of all existence and reality. You have to be very very aware of not overtaking a " scientific " approach of 20th century - which in its roots is based on limited 19th century knowledge (I am speaking of the philosophical " theory of science " - the imagination how science must be). As I have written in my first response we need a new science in this new millenium - just look into this world with open eyes, and what you see is a consequence of this 19th/20th century science. For the first time in history we have reached a never known distance to our own nature, our spiritual roots (traditional Indians may call this Kali Yuga, the culmination of it. They are right). We even have forgotten what this " nature " is - we have lost orientation. Modern physics was forced to leave this " old " scientific approach, discovering that in certain " realms " (I may call it so for our purpose) totally other laws of nature are existing (or no laws, or still undiscovered laws). I am not supporting at all old science with all its desastrous consequences. A 21st century science has to - and will - integrate spiritual dimensions, for example parapsychological phenomena (like channelings which exist). You ask me from where I do have my knowledge. This question is justified. Here is my response: (1) Studying Ancient and Modern Scriptures. Chart Interpretations. Daily Experience. Each day studying planetary energies and their effects in my life. Meditation and Contemplation. Don't you know how to judge each day in which you are living? The experiences of tomorrow - the main direction of them (at least this - it is indeed very difficult to predict very concrete events)? What will occur? After studying many astrological systems, it was the sincere study of BPHS which led me to certainty. It is *the* system really working - many studies and observations (as said in own life) are necessary to come to this conclusion. Did you make a muhurtha of your very first mail to me? Do see the planetary constellations? What can you derive from " our " future (our current small correspondance) from this muhurtha? This practice is needed, from many chart interpretations and daily integration of astrology. Including the whole range of divisional charts, planetary avasthas, different Dasha systems and other essential methods. And, this practice will give the certainty you are seeking for. Since now I did not see even one single astrologer really integrating all these factors - and it is a relatively limited number of factors which necessarily must be included. If you would do so, you would obtain the same security and sincerity as I did (and have). This leads me to (2) Astrology is a very particular knowledge. If you are acquinted with the phenomena of channelings (but I am no medium in the literal meaning) you are better equipped to understand that " Vedic " Astrology (Parashara Astrology) is based on one, perhaps more, human beings having a unique link to higher realms, to divine realms (which science denies - only " materialism " is true and " scientific " ). " Vedic " Astrology indeed is an " Astrology of the Seers " (a wonderful and true book title of David Frawley). You intention to grasp these roots is truly acknowledgable - but if you aren't a medium you won't archieve it. None of us can do this. We cannot understand spiritual truths with modern science (which has been failed in so many ways). You do appreciate theWestern science approach far too much. You surely must have a strong emphasis on Virgo Rashi and Mercury Nakshatras (foremost Aashlesha), and/or a prominent Mercury (yuti Lagna, yuti Moon, yuti Ghati or Bhava Lagna). Western - traditional science - is Virgo based, with all its strengths and weaknesses. It must not integrate the 7th from it - Pisces (lorded by Jupiter *and* Ketu). Virgo has Rahu as Co-Lord; look at Western World, and look what happens in your country - the best way to understand Rahu. Modern science is Mercury and Rahu based (Virgo) - and we need re-integration of Jupiter and Ketu (Pisces). As said your intention is acknowledgable - but it is an impossible aim if you do not heavily modify the tradtional concept of science (of 19th/20th century). Of course, modern science is mainly sponsored and paid by rich, very rich and powerful people. Do not forget this. " Truth " depends on money and on their spreading in mass media (which are governed by the same people, by the way). What must occur in astrology is the consequent application of a relative limited chart factors - a clear methodology. I am working on that, and this work will take my whole life. I know that before my last breath I will have archieved this. (3) You need to get a connection to these higher realms of existence - if not all will remain only theory, without being linked to your deepest personality and daily life. For this it is necessary that you leave most worldly matters for at least three years - leaving job, marriage, strife for worldly success and fame, richness. There is no other way. I have done it. If you leave all this you'll receive a really great gift - the connection to realms of existence which exist. But not reachable with traditional scientific methods. In future - after establishing astrology in society - this won't be necessary any more (leaving worldly matters). Step by step you'll discover that planetary effects are the root behind all material and immaterial reality. I am working on re-integration of astrology in daily life. All is based on pure practice, experience, and receptiveness from my soul family. I have left all worldly matters for years for this knowledge. I only can say: Astrology is THE science of reality. Even modern scientists are living in a world of maya, of illusions. Do you want to take part of this? I do not think so. Yours Respectfully Revati P.S. Track transit of Moon. In all 10 essential Vargas (Dasha Vargas). Do this for months and you will understand this mail in a far more better way. Dear Sanat, next response will be a bit more sociable (but I am really tired of classical " science " with all its limitations and restrictions). Astrology will be accepted when it brings results, very good results. And you are absolutely right: the fundaments of astrology are indeed logical, the more you study it, the more deeper. I found this depth only in BPHS, nowhere else (other scriptures just giving additional footnotes). It is simply the most reliable scripture and it indeed works perfectly - if we really use it, with special lagnas, upagrahas, strengths/avasthas, vargas. Joining grahas, rashis, nakshatras to this we have all the components we need! You surely have a dominant Virgo and Mercury placement, it cannot be different. Therefore Moon's Taurus' transit (first exalted, then in Moolatrikona) will be excellent for you (Moon then in 9th from Virgo) - mainly excellent (now Moon is dispositor of Ketu). Next change of Moon into Taurus will be Feb 3rd 22:50 (Delhi Time). Unfortunately at night, so Moon's Ta Drekkana transit will be during night - nevertheless, following Virgo Drekkana is favourable, too. Now Mars is exalted in Capricorn (more exactly: in exaltation Rashi), Venus in Pisces - exaltation Rashi. Use it for the best! Every transit of Moon in Taurus, then in Cancer is a blessing! Best Wishes, and a successful and peaceful week! Respectfully, Revati P.S. As said - track daily transits, track Vimshottari, Kalachakra, Sudarshana Chakra, Varnada and Conditional Dashas. They work, indeed. This " they work " is the best scientific proof you can get - I you get more knowledge about the origins and sources of the given horoscope factors I'd appreciate if you would share this. But in my view *this* is a impossible task - how to see the roots of a revelation? , " sanat2221 " <sanatkumar_jain wrote: > > Resp. Members, > Recently my discussion with Sh. Revati ji is going on through email. > Though I have invited him to join our forum, but he is busy in > astrological consultations. However he want that his msg. may be > posted in our forum. Hence I am posting our interaction in this > forum. Members may pickup any point for further discussion. As and > when I will receive any reply from Sh. Revati ji, that will also be > posted in the forum to maintain a continuity. > > Thanks, > Yours truly, > sanat > > > ========================== > > Dear Revati Ji, > Namaskar, > Thanks for your quick response despite your busy schedule. > I can wait till March when you will be free from your professional > duties (predictive business). Till then we may exchange emails. No > problem. > > >>>>>>Furthermore I want to add that a scientific astrology must be > valid world-wide, the term " Vedic " (or " Indian " ) would be a too far > reaching restriction <<<<< > Yes, knowledge belongs to humans living on the Earth and it is minor > bifurcation to say it is Indian, Vedic, western etc. Because by > saying so we unknowingly became a party to support our socalled > system. Whereas I am discussing astrology as a knowledge and > analyzing its roots irrespective of any demarcation. > > >>>>>>- although the best working astrology is the one practized in > India, based on ancient teachings.<<<<<<< > > How you can say that it is best, because practitioners of KP, > western, Indian, Nadi, palmistry, numerology etc. always support > their own field. So if you want to say then you must have some solid > logic in support of your socalled system. How you can say that > formation of sign is ancient Indian teaching. (waiting for your > comments) > > > >>>>>>>> Of course the source and historical origins of all given > ancient teachings are interesting. How the ancient masters knew that > Jupiter is lording Sagittarius and Pisces? How they got to the Dasha > sequences? To the aspects? And so on... > > I assume that all these things will remain in the invisible side of > ancient history. It is indeed " occult " (= hidden) knowledge, and in > its > fundament given by one or more Seers (in literal meaning). Maharishi > Parashara surely was a Seer, perhaps *the* only one (I do have this > opinion).<<<<<<<< > > Yes, I want to know as to how our sages came to know that > Jupiter is lording Sagittarius and Pisces? How they got to the Dasha > sequences? To the aspects? And so on... > But I can say that this knowledge is neither hidden not divine nor on > invisible side of ancient history. As every fundamental principle is > based on very simple logic, which can be expected from any sage. You > can find procedure adopted for formulation in various principles in > my book, but for your time problem. Hence I am waiting for your stand > in support of formulation. > > >>>>> Planetary effects are not visible, therefore not accepted by > modern science (as one " reason " ). (of cause they are visible, e.g. a > marriage or a new job).<<<<<<< > NO, I have already pointed out that when invisible gravity can be > studied under science and used in day to day use then why science can > not study the socalled invisible effect of planets. If it is > actually affecting marriage and new job. Let me know as to how a > planet who is responsible for marriage may know that some one is > Muslim hence he may have 4 wives and some one is Hindu hence he may > have only one wife and some one is western and he / she may have many > partners one by one. Or how a planet may know that till 19th century > one must be married before the age of 10 or so and now that planet > is permitting some tribal societies in the same age whereas educated > population is being permitted after the age of 30 or so. I can put > many more questions but let us have some starting points. > > >>>>>> my approach is basically using teachings given in BPHS. I > want to prove that these fundamental rules are sufficient for > successful astrological work.<<<<<< > > How you can say that BPHS is right till you came out with explanation > as to how basic fundamental astrological principles like lord, > aspect, friendship, exalted, dasha, rahu etc are logically, > astronomically and scientifically right. > > >>>>>> If you want to, I can add you to the rs.<<<<< > No problem. > > Thanks for good exchange of views. Hope to have more exchanges. > Remember nothing is personal and it is only academic discussion. > > Yours > > sanat > > > ================================================================== > > Dearest Sanat, > > thank you very much for your notes and your very kind invitation. > Seems > to become a very interesting discussion, indeed, I highly respect > your > view and your knowledge. I will join the group end of March (if you > guess there is timing behind this you are right, but also current > professional duties). > > I agree with you! The term " Vedic " Astrology is misleading for the > reason you gave. But one could give the argument that the Deities > described in ancient vedic astrology scriptures are a link to the > vedic > scriptures - so both have the same spiritual fundament (and therefore > no > need for mentioning of Grahas in vedic scriptures). > The three Gunas are mentioned in Vedic Scriptures, in Bhagavad- Gita - > and they are the three main energies working in this world. They are > the > fundament of all. > > Furthermore I want to add that a scientific astrology must be valid > world-wide, the term " Vedic " (or " Indian " ) would be a too far > reaching > restriction - although the best working astrology is the one > practized > in India, based on ancient teachings. > > In my work I prefer " Sidereal " or " Energetic " Astrology. > > I do not have time to visit your blog - I ask you honestly not to > interpret this as disrespect or disinterest, it is only due to my > huge > lack of time. The current financial crisis reaches me in that way > that > many new clients ask for consultation right now. > > A last note: Of course the source and historical origins of all given > ancient teachings are interesting. How the ancient masters knew that > Jupiter is lording Sagittarius and Pisces? How they got to the Dasha > sequences? To the aspects? And so on... > > I assume that all these things will remain in the invisible side of > ancient history. It is indeed " occult " (= hidden) knowledge, and in > its > fundament given by one or more Seers (in literal meaning). Maharishi > Parashara surely was a Seer, perhaps *the* only one (I do have this > opinion). > > There is knowledge existing in this material plane which is coming > from > another plane of existence. Future science must open itself to this > truth. > > Most important is practical proof of theories. Many many chart > interpretations are necessary. > This is mainly possible for full-time astrologers, researchers. > > It is exactly as you have written: " Like Gravity is not visible but > affect is studied and some principles were also formulated. And every > principle is open to further study, modification etc. " Planetary > effects > are not visible, therefore not accepted by modern science (as one > " reason " ). (of cause they are visible, e.g. a marriage or a new job). > > I am working on a fundamental introduction on Energetic Sidereal > Astrology and publish it step by step in my newsletter, starting in > February. There are many many theories, by many astrologers - my > approach is basically using teachings given in BPHS. I want to prove > that these fundamental rules are sufficient for successful > astrological > work. We do not need any other astrological work, even not Jaimini - > their worth is mainly elaborating Parashara's teachings. I will give > very fundamental principles - leaving out all modern (and mostly > useless > stuff). Like Tithis, Karanas, strange Dashas and so on. > > If you want to, I can add you to the rs. > > You have my permission to post this newsletter and this conversation > in > your group. > > Yours Respectfully, > Revati > > > > Dear Revati Ji, > Namaskar, > Thanks for your response. > I fully agree with your short note on science. But I will like to > comment on your following statements. > > >>>>>>Vedic Astrology is based on spirituality, principally laid down > in the Vedas (but in many other holy scriptures of other religions, > too). <<<<<<< > > Term Vedic astrology is wrong like saying that astrology is science. > Because there is no astrological principle in any Ved. > > > >>>>>Planetary energies are spiritual energies - we have to explore > and declare their effects in present, past and future. These energies > can come from bodily planets (e.g. " Surya " ) or from non-bodily > planets (e.g. " Upaketu " or " Rahu " ).<<<<<<< > > Any energy visible or non visible has effect on material, Thus every > energy which affect matter is studied under science. Like Gravity is > not visible but affect is studied and some principles were also > formulated. And every principle is open to further study, > modification etc. But I want to know as to what was the procedure by > which many astrological principles like lord, aspect, friendship, > dasha etc were formulated (more detail in my blog " astrology a > science or myth " ). I hope you will come out with your views in near > future after going through entire blog. > > If you want then you can join our forum " Scienceofastrology " for > exchange of views. > Thanks, > > > Sanat > Gwalior > > ====================================== > Dear Sanat, > > thank you very much for your mail, your invitation and for the > abundant information you give. You are touching very essential themes > indeed, and I cannot do justice to you right now as you deserve > because of some health problems and professional duties (I am > professional vedic astrological consultant, focusing on Parashara > astrology). > > For some reasons I have decided few months ago to stay away from > groups - even from good ones - and to focus on my own work, > elaborating a reasonable access to astrology - which must in the very > end result in successful predictions, you are very right stating > this. Only this way astrology can be taken seriously as science - but > this will happen, I see many capable people working in this field > (e.g. Narasimha Rao). > > Due to serious time problems - please accept my apologies! - I just > was able to took a quick glance on your article (and he deserves far > more attention) and you are raising important questions. Just reading > some few passage I could write a long article as reply (not too > critical), but it isn't possible right now. I expect betterment in my > Ketu Vimshottari PD starting March 2009. > > May I kindly request for your birth details? > If you are interested in mine, I am open for exchange of DOB's, of > course. > > Allow me just a short note on " science " : > (1) We are living in a scientific area. > (2) The term " science " is mainly defined by the natural sciences > (physics, biology, chemistry and so on). > (3) A " scientific " astrology has to take over some definitions > of " science " in this meaning. > (4) The definition of " science " done nowadays is far too limited - it > is based on a materialistic view on world only. > (A provocative comment: We even could say that philosophy of > communism - which is materialism - has won, although economically and > politically it failed). > (5) Materialistic foundation of science is wrong. A spiritual > completion is highly demanded nowadays. This spiritual change will > take place in this century. > > Vedic Astrology is based on spirituality, principally laid down in > the Vedas (but in many other holy scriptures of other religions, > too). > > Planetary energies are spiritual energies - we have to explore and > declare their effects in present, past and future. > These energies can come from bodily planets (e.g. " Surya " ) or from > non-bodily planets (e.g. " Upaketu " or " Rahu " ). > > Applying materialistic mental concepts on knowledge like astrology is > one of the greatest errors committed in last centuries, particularly > in the last two centuries. This error must be recognized and > corrected. > > In 19th century there was a russian doctor declaring: " I have opened > many bodies of dead people. I never found an eternal soul. " > > This is the poor understanding of natural sciences (which explore > natural material laws of existence). > > The truth is: All material existence ( " maya " ) is based and founded on > spiritual energies, effective in the various planetary energies. > > Mind rules Material. > > This the core truth, the first truth. > > Respectfully, > Revati > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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