Silent Man

[Guest guest]

At 08:49 AM 6/26/05 +0300, Sari wrote:

>...The data of my colleague is 3th June 1968 7.56 EET -2 Helsinki, Finland

>60N10 024E58...All I know is that he loves watching sports, especially ice

hockey, and

>cross-country cycling is his passion...He owns I think four bicycles for

different purposes and he cycles his way to work in all the seasons and

weather...

>

>Using Lahiri ayanamsa, Mercury is in its own sign Gemini, but using

>whole sign houses it's in the twelfth, which may tell something...

 

Hi Sari,

 

Thanks for this information on Quiet Man. First,let's take the fact that

he's quiet. Let's assume that Mercury is the planet that tells us how we

communicate. Mercury is in Gemini, but in the sidereal zodiac Gemini isn't

one of the big communication signs. Gemini seems to be more physical--the

reason would be that Gemini is the sign of the shoulders, hands and arms.

This is why Jyotish places 'courage' in Gemini's house, the 3rd. We'd

expect emphasis here for wrestlers, for example. Or ballet dancers who use

the arms so much. Or any art form that uses the hands or any occupation

that is a 'man's work' in the physical sense.

 

I also place Quiet Man's Mercury in the 12th house. This is the house of

Pisces, Mercury's fall. Something I'm discovering that seems to work is

that it that the natural house of a sign has as much to do with how the

house works for planets as the sign itself. So Mercury is in 'Pisces' (in a

way), and Pisces is said to be 'mute.' Two other examples: I have Mercury

in the 12th, and as a child I refused to speak in school. Even now I

practice silence most of the day, but I write. A young friend of mine has

Mercury in the 12th in the sign of Pisces. His communication is generally

limied to, " Yeah, right. " " Rad, man! " " Uh...huh.. "

 

So that's something to test: Does Mercury in the 12th tend to be quiet and

say no more than is absolutely necessary?

 

Now let's take the cross-country cycling. The friend above happens to have

the ascendant lord (Mars) and 10th lord (Saturn) in Gemini in the 3rd

(sign). He makes his living by touring in bike shows! It happens that the

Quiet Man has the Sun and Moon in the navamsa of Gemini. Put these on top

of Mercury in Gemini, and you have Mer-Sun-Moon in Gemini--sign of the

shoulders, hands and arms in the house of Pisces, sign of movement and

travel (the feet). And Quiet Man has Mercury as his 3rd house lord. So my

biking friend and quiet man both have Mercury as 3rd lord in 12th, house of

the feet.

 

Now, where is Mars for his love of watching sports? Well, first Mars is

with the Sun in a lunar mansion of Mars. But why Taurus? I don't consider

detriment in the sidereal zodiac because of the Jyotish doctrine that a

planet in the opposite sign from itself is strong if it aspects a planet in

its own sign. So we just have Mars in a sign of Venus. You're right. That

doesn't do anything for Mars! Except that Taurus might have something to do

with the passive watching of sports on TV rather than for example, being a

hockey player himself.

 

But look at the navamsa chart. Scorpio is the ascendant (the friend above

also has a Scorpio navamsa ascendant), and Mars is right at the top of the

chart in Leo. Looking at the natal chart, Jupiter and the Moon are in Leo.

So this translates to a Jupiter-Moon-Mars conjunction in a sign that's

strong for Mars.

 

As for what your friend would actually end up doing as his job or

profession, since Mars is the 10th lord, this goes to the Mars-Sun-Venus

conjunction in Taurus. This is where we's see the sign of Taurus manifest

in some way. If you learn anything more about the 'Quiet Man,' let us know.

 

>In the chart of my colleague the Moon and Jupiter in Leo sextile Mercury

>in Gemini...

 

I wouldn't count the influence on Mercury as the sextile is backwards in

the zodiac. But Mercury would influence Jupiter and the Moon.

 

>There's a certain aura of pride around him - he doesn't talk

>because he doesn't want to and he wants to keep his things private.

I think Leo might play a role here being a masculine fire sign ruled by

>the hero, the Sun.

 

Yes, and we have Leo emphasized again in the navamsa because Mars is in Leo

at the top of the chart.

 

>For example Sergio Leone, who had made these classic

>westerns about strong, silent men in their long coats, has five planets

>including the Sun in sidereal fire signs.

 

Do you have the birth data for Sergio Leone? (Interesting...LEO-ne!

 

> On the other hand the Cancer

>ascendant might have an effect here too - this protecting capsule thing.

 

Drop this--it's Tropical stuff. :) If any planet relates specifically to

keeping things internal, it's Pluto. In the navamsa Pluto is with Mercury,

planet of communication.

 

>Then there's a preponderance of earth, that is practicality and

>physical, concrete things.

 

Not in the sidereal zodiac. Consider going back and reading the element

article: http://users.snowcrest.net/sunrise/LostZodiac.htm

 

It's the masculine fire signs that deal with the concrete and down-to-earth

affairs, just like men like to tinker with gadgets, are the computer

whizzes, and so forth. Mars is the most physical and down-to-earth of the

planets, and it's the leader (Aries) of the most masculine trigon.

 

He's always ready to help if you ask him and

>he's basically friendly if you reach him first.

 

This would be one expression of Taurus, ruled by Venus and the exaltation

of the friendly Moon. Taurus tends to be many sided (like Tropical Gemini),

but Quiet Man's communication is ruled by Mercury.

 

>I've been wondering about the qualities of the elements: water being wet

>and cold, air being wet and hot, fire being hot and dry and earth being

>dry and cold...

 

This belongs to Classical astrology, yes? I'm not at all sure signs can be

classified in this way, either Tropical or sidereal. Mars is fire, yes. Hot

and dry. Venus is water, wet, but cold?? This classification is medieval,

and may not apply very well to astrology. We won't know for a long time.

 

>Because hot means active, diurnal and outreaching

>( " masculine " ) and cold means passive, nocturnal and absorbing

>( " feminine " ); and wet means connecting and whole-making ( " feminine " -

>right hemisphere)

 

These are not good definitions in my opinion.

 

>and dry means analytical and separating ( " masculine " -

>left hemisphere), that would mean that fire is a kind of " wholly

>masculine " element and water is a kind of " wholly feminine " element and

>earth and air are kind of mixed.

 

Where do these definitions come from? They're not Vedic or sidereal. (I

know they're from medieval astrology somewhere....) I'm just wondering what

your reference is. Yes, I'd agree that the Aries-Leo-Sag sidereal trigon of

planets is the most masculine and 'fixed', and that the sidereal Cancer

trigon Cancer-Scorpio-Pisces is the most feminine because it's heavily

changeable and emotional. But in the sidereal zodiac the four trigons

aren't called fire, earth, air and water. Please check the article on the

elements on the site mentioned above. It's really hard to break away from

the Tropical constructs because we've all been taught that certain ideas

are true.

 

It's true that some modern Jyotish/Vedic books have copied the meanings of

the Tropical elements, but in my opinion this is incorrect.

 

>My own experience is that when we think about the traditional rulers and

>qualities of the signs, they generally fit to the sidereal signs finely.

>I would almost say that it's the tropicalists who have to make mental

>switches to make the signs fit.

 

I would have to agree! The ruling and exaltation planets fit the sidereal

signs very well. But we have to 'lose' some Tropical concepts such as the

idea that Taurus is 'fixed,' for example. Since Tauarus is the home of

Venus and the exaltation of the Moon, it can be very 'spring like' in that

it's perky and friendly and often changeable. Sidereal Taurus also tends to

be a thinker because it belongs to Mercury's trigon. (Virgo being Mercury's

primary home sign and also exalted in Virgo.)

 

Therese