Science (Reply to Matthew)

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At 02:59 AM 2/7/04 -0000, Matthew wrote:

 

>Therese, you may not use any of these techniques yourself, but other

>astrologers do. I feel that your minimizing them presents a picture

>that they are less valuable or even bogus, which you may not mean,

>but it certainly seems that way.

 

Hi Matthew,

 

I think the best way to reply to all the points in your post is to simply

post the charts for the ingress and quake charts. I don't use a lot of the

techniques that western astrologers use, but I do use some Jyotish

techniques in their place. We all have our own individual brains, and

brains work differently, **especially** male and female brains. Men see

points; Women see patterns (in general).

 

I apologize if I sound like some techniques are unimportant. It would be

more accurate to say that they have not been important **for me.** Just

like the navamsa hasn't been important for you. My female brain can't

handle all those different charts and midpoints and progressions all at

once. Too many individual details. (Although I've spent a lot of time

studying the charts you posted.) So if something simple works for me and

has predictive value....well, the ladies will like it even if the men

don't. (Except that maybe Dark*Star can utilize the western sidereal

techniques.)

 

What we're looking for is predictive ability with our techniques. I've seen

similar patterns in the K quake ingress charts. If the same kinds of

patterns continue to replicate, then it's a technique that can work for

prediction. Of course those patterns wouldn't be the whole story, but they

may be an important foundation.

 

I've set up some ingress charts for F-B, Lahiri, and Krishnamurti. A lot of

the charts look like quake charts no matter what ayanamsa is used. So then

the criteria has to get tighter. If there's a close tie-in with the ingress

and quake chart with a particular ayanamsa, then we should look at that

ayanamsa more carefully.

 

Incidentally, I don't think I mentioned that the Moon in the ingress charts

is rather critical--how it relates to planets and the Moon in the quake

chart. I'm trying to work out a system for this, so it can be explained

easily.

 

>[MQ] The same goes for your insistence that we need to replicate Bradley's

>rainfall, et al., studies, as if you are calling into question his

>methodology, or saying that his results are false.

 

Matthew, sometimes you are prone to overstatements!! Just because I want to

see Bradley's work replicated doesn't mean the results are false. They're

just not proven yet by replication. Why should I trust research I've never

seen?? Especially since I've seen another ayanamsa work with micro

charts--and I see what is happening with the K ingress charts for quakes.

 

>[MQ] Since you favor

>the Krishnamurti ayanamsa, I can understand this...

 

I used the Fagan ayanamsa for years. Likewise Lahiri before finally

settling on K. Even now I often look at charts with both L and K, feeling

that perhaps one or the other is more accurate. The earthquake charts are

the first consistent use of K (aside from a lot of work with navamsa

charts) I've seen in event charts. I wasn't looking for the results I

found. I was setting up the charts with all three ayanamsas and it simply

jumped out at me that there were close tie-ins with the K charts.

 

>[MQ] I, personally, really don't care whether my work

>is acceptable to a scientific community that is already biased

>against astrology in the first place.

 

Ah, Matthew! I've heard this statment so often from astrologers, both

Tropical and Sidereal. I'm not looking for the approval of the scientific

community. But that community does understand how to do research. We do

need to use their professional understanding of research techniques.

(Didn't Bradley claim to use scientific techniques?)

 

Would you expect a scientist who wanted to learn astrology to simply set

about studying in his own way? " Heck, that planetary symbol (Pluto) looks

like a turtle standing on one leg. I'll call it turtle! Let's see...Turtles

are slow. So this planet must mean slowness. "

 

>[MQ] As for earthquakes, I think it may well depend on whether you are

>looking for indicators of the geological phenomenon itself or for a

>disaster that effects a mass of people.

 

I've been looking at patterns for the geological phenomenon, and of course

there would be a difference between a quake that affected many people and a

quake that happened in the hinterlands.

 

>[MQ] Well, Therese, keep setting up the charts. If I recall

>correctly, when I looked at quake charts I had run somewhere around

>100 with CapSolars and CapLunars, some that hit highly populated

>areas and some that didn't.

 

I wish you still had the disk files! But the F-B and K ingress charts will

be quite different, especially since I use all 12 solar ingress charts and

only consider the ingress prior to the quake. (This isn't to say that lunar

ingresses don't work. But I believe it's necessary to stay with one type of

chart at a time.)

 

>[MQ] I must admit that I am intrigued by the Krishnamurti Solar ingress

>charts, particularly since I like to see the Moon involved for an

>important event. But I can't get around the statistical work that

>Bradley and Duncan did on the SVP.

 

If the research was all laid out there, I couldn't get around it either.

However (to my mind) it's a nebulous area. Although Bradley apparently had

professional help, he wasn't professionally trained in scientific methods

and statistics. And the professionals he quoted are phantoms. We have no

idea who they were. Let's suppose that the rainfall research was entirely

correct. We'd still need a number of other kinds of studies before we could

say definitely that the F-B ayanamsa is infallible. That's how science works.

 

It just isn't quite that easy to isolate an ayanamsa. Look at all the

conflicting studies that are done on dietary trends. " Carbs make you fat. "

" No it's not carbs--it's fat that makes you fat. " " No, that's not it. If

you combine fats and protein, that will really add weight. "

 

O.K. so maybe that's a poor analogy. It's late and I'm tired.

 

Is Gary Duncan's work (with all the figures and details) available anywhere?

 

[MQ] The best data is from the USGS websites. I use

>neic.usgs.gov/current_seismicity.html. Times are listed in UTC...

 

Thanks for the links. I'll look into them.

 

By the way, there was another quake in Indonesia today. According to a news

item posted on the Judy Johns Political board, the largest tremor, 6.9

happened at 6:05 am (local time) though the tremors began at 4:05. Closest

town was Nabire. Around 23 died, 500 injured. Not so bad.

 

The critical degree in the K Capricorn ingress is 23:

Foreground nodes: South node in first house--23 Libra

----------

Mars (quincunx) at 23Pis45

Moon just opposite Mars at 23 Vir 10

Jupiter (sextile SN/qx Mars at 24 Leo 54

 

Quake chart for 6:05:

---------------------

Ascendant 22 Capricorn

Sun 22 Cap 35

Neptune 19 Cap 11

MC 25 Lib 44

Moon's south node 22 Lib

Jupiter (qx Asc/sextile MC) 23 Leo

 

Ascendant in K ingress is 16 Libra

Moon in Quake chart is 16 Cancer 50. (All K longitudes)

 

I'm seeing the ascendant/Moon/MC/IC connection in the K ingress to quake

charts.

 

Moon at 17 Cancer has moved from opposite Mars in the ingress to square

Mars in the quake chart and opposes the ascendant planets. Not exact

degrees, but remember that I use only a few major aspects. And India

considers wide orbs if the planets are in the appropriate related signs.

Mars is at 8 Aries, the Moon at 17 Cancer.

 

" The largest, of magnitude 6.9, was felt at 6:05 a.m. Friday (4:05 p.m. EST

Thursday). It was centered four miles east of Nabire and 50 miles deep. "

 

There were two Nabire towns listed in my astro Atlas, close together. I

chose one of them, not knowing which Nabire was meant in the news articles.

3S22 135E29

 

It's interesting that if you take the ascendant for the start of the milder

quakes, the 23rd degree is still hit, but in a milder way. The 4:05

ascedant is 23 Sag, trine Jupiter (23) and sextile/trine the nodes (22).

 

(F-B Cap ingress positions (K long): Asc 4 Libra; Moon 6.5 Libra; MC 29.5

Gemini, Mars 24 Pis trine MC)

 

Sincerely,

Therese