Guest guest Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 >Juan Oliver wrote: > >> Why do you think that you have had good results with the Cap Solar? >> >> I ask this because you write that 7 Sag would seem to be the " logical >> position " to cast charts..... How do you explain the (in my opinion) >> remarkable results utilizing the Cap-Can-Ari and Lib Solars... I've >> seen everything from Columbine to earthquakes rationalized through >> these charts. > >Steve wrote: >A good question--I wish I had an answer for it!! Perhaps you have one >of your own. Logic of course, may not have to necessarily enter into it....: >Grasping at straws... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Steve and all, Since the Capsolar has never really been tested over time for similar events, in reality it may not give better results than other types of cyclic charts such as the equinox or monthly solar ingress charts. Some brilliant hits could quite possibly be only chance. Even Donald Bradley wrote that you could see an earthquake in charts using even fictitions ayanamsas. The only final answer to any cyclic chart would be controlled research over time, and astrologers are not equipped to perform this kind of research. So 'to each his own' continues to be the mode of operation in all the astrological camps, both tropical and sidereal. There are even varying camps in Jyotish, though the Jyotish astrologers all refer to the same ancient texts. Therese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 11, 2004 Report Share Posted July 11, 2004 Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote: Since the Capsolar has never really been tested over time for similar events,in reality it may not give better results than other types of cyclic charts such as the equinox or monthly solar ingress charts. Juan Oliver writes: The CapSolar has been tested and utilized repeatedly for years. However your stipulation " similar events " renders your assertion plausible. I for one do not track " similar events " only. There may be others who do? I track what the charts reveal... Whatever that might be... earthquake or windfall profits.... " similar events " means? ('to each his own')... The CapSolar(Cardinal Ingress Charts) are used with other charts... ie. lunar, solar returns, as well as other planetary cyclical charts. The most important forecasting " base " chart is the CapSolar. I can think of six sidereal astrologers(Bert being one of them) that knows the value of tracking sidereal cardinal ingress charts. I am sure there are others. These individuals have repeatedly demonstrated credible results especially with the CapSolar. Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote: The only final answer to any cyclic chart would be controlled research over time, and astrologers are not equipped to perform this kind of research. Juan Oliver wrote: Well we're stuck with us doing the " controlled " research because we are the the only ones interested. We are the best equipped to do so since we have the knowledge.... As for the " final answer " , it will be revealed to you at your death and not a moment sooner. Keep in mind though that is not a statistical fact. Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote So 'to each his own' continues to be the mode of operation in all the astrological camps, both tropical and sidereal. There are even varying camps in Jyotish, though the Jyotish astrologers all refer to the same ancient texts. Juan Oliver wrote: I don't share this perspective " to each his own " though I understand everyone has an opinion. Too many numerous learning opportunities in my life would have been missed had I formed a conclusion prior to testing the waters. Can't fly the plane unless you fire up the engines. >Juan Oliver wrote: > >> Why do you think that you have had good results with the Cap Solar? >> >Steve wrote: >A good question--I wish I had an answer for it!! Perhaps you have one >of your own. Logic of course, may not have to necessarily enter into it....: Juan Oliver wrote: It always seemed natural to me that the Solar Apex was associated with CapSolar and it still does.. however we move on... Before I began studying Sidereal, I was researching metaphysics and came across a book titled " the Light of Egypt " . It was written by an individual around the 1900's who gave me a perspective on Capricorn which I still hold on to today. Simply put... its the nadir of the human zodiacal cycle... the author writes " It is the lowest arc of the cycle that reveals the new birth of death unto life. The CapSolar seemed like a natural....All bets are off though as far as the Southern Hemisphere are concerned... haven't done the research(experience) to say yea or nay.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 At 10:17 PM 7/10/04 -0700, Juan wrote: >The CapSolar has been tested and utilized repeatedly for years. Not in any controlled way. Only individual astrologers using it for single events. >However your stipulation " similar events " renders your assertion plausible. I for one do not track " similar events " only. There may be others who do? I'm working on it, but mostly astrologers haven't look at similar events over many yearss time. > " similar events " means? ('to each his own')... Like 50 major earthquake or 50 major floods. For starters. >>I can think of six sidereal astrologers(Bert being one of them) that knows the value of tracking sidereal cardinal ingress charts. I am sure there are others. These individuals have repeatedly demonstrated credible results especially with the CapSolar. For real research, demonstrating that the Capsolar works for isolated events doesn't tell the entire story. Astrologers also have to show that the major indicators don't occur when **nothing** happens. This is the problem, and why Donald Bradley said that quakes could be seen in charts with a fictitions ayanamsa. The question still is: Can you predict with the Capsolar? What party will be in the White House when January rolls around? When will a major traumatic event (quake?) hit California? And so on. (You couldn't answer that one without checking quakes in the past and cataloging what was going on at the time.) >>Well we're stuck with us doing the " controlled " research because we are the the only ones interested. It may be that one day a math professional might join forces with us. Bradley made a start in that direction, but the guy he was working with inconveniently died. >The CapSolar seemed like a natural....All bets are off though as far as the Southern >Hemisphere are concerned... haven't done the research(experience) to say yea or nay.... It wouldn't be too difficult to compare the fall equinox charts (Tropical Capricorn) with the Capsolars for a few years, checking major events. Therese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote: At 10:17 PM 7/10/04 -0700, Juan wrote: >The CapSolar has been tested and utilized repeatedly for years. Not in any controlled way. Only individual astrologers using it for single events. Control? Open to interpretation and accessible with knowledge. >However your stipulation " similar events " renders your assertion plausible. I for one do not track " similar events " only. There may be others who do? I track what the charts reveal... I'm working on it, but mostly astrologers haven't look at similar events over many yearss time. You're working your agenda.... and I hope you find it. Astrologers look at what cause " similar events " . They also simply look at what the symbols tell them. In other words, They read the script and document " similar events " . > " similar events " means? ('to each his own')... Like 50 major earthquake or 50 major floods. For starters. When you cast a cardinal ingress chart it is done for a particular location. NYC, Washington or Bagdad for instance... These charts allow the astrologer to forecast events for the upcoming year. How many charts would one have to cast to determine when and where 50 major earthquakes or 50 major floods would occur? Keep in mind that these charts are not just cast zodiacal but also in mundo.... Also keep in mind that typically every disaster has its own unique personality. >>I can think of six sidereal astrologers(Bert being one of them) that knows the value of tracking sidereal cardinal ingress charts. I am sure there are others. These individuals have repeatedly demonstrated credible results especially with the CapSolar. For real research, demonstrating that the Capsolar works for isolated events doesn't tell the entire story. Astrologers also have to show that the major indicators don't occur when **nothing** happens. Astrologers are not responsible for showing anything except reality... ... Granted astrologers can have good days and/or bad days.... I have never witnessed the planets screw up.... Their interpretation... well that's another story.... When humans operate machinery you gotta expect screw-ups..... This is the problem, and why Donald Bradley said that quakes could be seen in charts with a fictitions ayanamsa. The problem with quoting someone is that one never really knows in what context they were speaking. If Bradley were here today, do you think he would be running CapSolars or running them down? The question still is: Can you predict with the Capsolar? What party will be in the White House when January rolls around? When will a major traumatic event (quake?) hit California? And so on. (You couldn't answer that one without checking quakes in the past and cataloging what was going on at the time.) Logic dictates that one learns how to read a chart. That is done by learning what the symbols mean and how they interact with themselves. That is how one determines the potential of quakes by learning how the symbols(planets & angles) acted during times of past quakes. No one disputes that.... The best place to look for potential quakes is when you first view the cardinal ingress charts. One can predict with the Capsolar! The November election? Simply check the cardinal ingress charts with the principals involved. Be sure to look at Dubya's Solar for 2004 & 2005..... As for what party in January rolls in the White House? Imagine they're white! >>Well we're stuck with us doing the " controlled " research because we are the the only ones interested. It may be that one day a math professional might join forces with us. Bradley made a start in that direction, but the guy he was working with inconveniently died. The world would revolve with the aid of one math professor.... >The CapSolar seemed like a natural....All bets are off though as far as the Southern >Hemisphere are concerned... haven't done the research(experience) to say yea or nay.... It wouldn't be too difficult to compare the fall equinox charts (Tropical Capricorn) with the Capsolars for a few years, checking major events. Therese Ah... you don't know CapSolars..... Jivio PS: Therese... From your own account... you have not run cardinal ingress charts in the manner I have suggested. Your comparing them to any other type of chart is without merit until you have tested the process. Of course it will require the use of progressions..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 Juan: That is what the Astro-map is for. It allows you to cast only one chart and have an over view of the world from the focus of a particular ingress. Note what Matthiew did with the Cansolar and 911. Sidereally, Bert Bert W. Fannin Western Sidereal Astrologer Location and Timing Astrology ltastrology www.ltastrology.com " Where you should be and when you should be there. " _______ - " Juan Oliver " <jivio Monday, July 12, 2004 1:25 AM Re: Re: More on CapSolar Ingress Charts > > > Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote: > At 10:17 PM 7/10/04 -0700, Juan wrote: > >The CapSolar has been tested and utilized repeatedly for years. > > Not in any controlled way. Only individual astrologers using it for single > events. > > > Control? Open to interpretation and accessible with knowledge. >However your stipulation " similar events " renders your assertion > plausible. I for one do not track " similar events " only. There may be > others who do? I track what the charts reveal... > > I'm working on it, but mostly astrologers haven't look at similar events > over many yearss time. > > > You're working your agenda.... and I hope you find it. Astrologers look at what cause " similar events " . They also simply look at what the symbols tell them. In other words, They read the script and document " similar events " . > > > > " similar events " means? ('to each his own')... > > Like 50 major earthquake or 50 major floods. For starters. > > > When you cast a cardinal ingress chart it is done for a particular location. NYC, Washington or Bagdad for instance... These charts allow the astrologer to forecast events for the upcoming year. How many charts would one have to cast to determine when and where 50 major earthquakes or 50 major floods would occur? Keep in mind that these charts are not just cast zodiacal but also in mundo.... Also keep in mind that typically every disaster has its own unique personality. > > > >>I can think of six sidereal astrologers(Bert being one of them) that > knows the value of tracking sidereal cardinal ingress charts. I am sure > there are others. These individuals have repeatedly demonstrated credible > results especially with the CapSolar. > > For real research, demonstrating that the Capsolar works for isolated > events doesn't tell the entire story. Astrologers also have to show that > the major indicators don't occur when **nothing** happens. > > Astrologers are not responsible for showing anything except reality... ... Granted astrologers can have good days and/or bad days.... I have never witnessed the planets screw up.... Their interpretation... well that's another story.... When humans operate machinery you gotta expect screw-ups..... > > This is the > problem, and why Donald Bradley said that quakes could be seen in charts > with a fictitions ayanamsa. > > The problem with quoting someone is that one never really knows in what context they were speaking. If Bradley were here today, do you think he would be running CapSolars or running them down? > > > > The question still is: Can you predict with the > Capsolar? What party will be in the White House when January rolls around? > When will a major traumatic event (quake?) hit California? And so on. (You > couldn't answer that one without checking quakes in the past and cataloging > what was going on at the time.) > > > > Logic dictates that one learns how to read a chart. That is done by learning what the symbols mean and how they interact with themselves. That is how one determines the potential of quakes by learning how the symbols(planets & angles) acted during times of past quakes. No one disputes that.... The best place to look for potential quakes is when you first view the cardinal ingress charts. > > One can predict with the Capsolar! The November election? Simply check the cardinal ingress charts with the principals involved. > Be sure to look at Dubya's Solar for 2004 & 2005..... > > As for what party in January rolls in the White House? Imagine they're white! > > > >>Well we're stuck with us doing the " controlled " research because we are > the the only ones interested. > > It may be that one day a math professional might join forces with us. > Bradley made a start in that direction, but the guy he was working with > inconveniently died. > > > The world would revolve with the aid of one math professor.... > > > > > >The CapSolar seemed like a natural....All bets are off though as far as > the Southern >Hemisphere are concerned... haven't done the > research(experience) to say yea or nay.... > > It wouldn't be too difficult to compare the fall equinox charts (Tropical > Capricorn) with the Capsolars for a few years, checking major events. > > Therese > > Ah... you don't know CapSolars..... > > Jivio > > PS: Therese... From your own account... you have not run cardinal ingress charts in the manner I have suggested. Your comparing them to any other type of chart is without merit until you have tested the process. Of course it will require the use of progressions..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 Bert Fannin <bwfannin wrote: Juan: That is what the Astro-map is for. It allows you to cast only one chart and have an over view of the world from the focus of a particular ingress. Note what Matthiew did with the Cansolar and 911. Sidereally, Bert Bert W. Fannin Western Sidereal Astrologer Location and Timing Astrology ltastrology www.ltastrology.com " Where you should be and when you should be there. " Astro-Maps provides a " general " overview... Are you offering to gather data on 50 incidents of earthquakes or 50 incidents of floods? Or offering to compare equinox charts with cardinal ingress charts? Jivio PS: Why note Matthew when I did the the CanSolar prior to 911 myself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 As a forecasting tool the astro-map technique is rather more time-efferent then doing a bunch of charts for other locations. I mentioned Mathew's work because some one directed me to his web page. Sidereally, Bert Bert W. Fannin Western Sidereal Astrologer Location and Timing Astrology ltastrology www.ltastrology.com " Where you should be and when you should be there. " ____ - " Juan Oliver " <jivio Monday, July 12, 2004 3:02 AM Re: Re: More on CapSolar Ingress Charts > > > Bert Fannin <bwfannin wrote: > Juan: > That is what the Astro-map is for. It allows you to cast only one chart > and have an over view of the world from the focus of a particular ingress. > Note what Matthiew did with the Cansolar and 911. > > Sidereally, > Bert > Bert W. Fannin > Western Sidereal Astrologer > Location and Timing Astrology > ltastrology > www.ltastrology.com > " Where you should be and when you should be there. " > > > Astro-Maps provides a " general " overview... Are you offering to gather data on 50 incidents of earthquakes or 50 incidents of floods? Or offering to compare equinox charts with cardinal ingress charts? > > Jivio > > PS: Why note Matthew when I did the the CanSolar prior to 911 myself? > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 At 01:25 AM 7/12/04 -0700, Juan wrote: >Like 50 major earthquake or 50 major floods. For starters. > > >When you cast a cardinal ingress chart it is done for a particular location. NYC, Washington or Bagdad for instance... These charts allow the astrologer to forecast events for the upcoming year. How many charts would one have to cast to determine when and where 50 major earthquakes or 50 major floods would occur? Whoa!! You're jumping way ahaead. First we study the charts of similar events. Then...of course, supposing we had a predictive model, either world locales would have to be computerized or (best scenario) employed astrologers for each locale would keep an eye on the 12 monthly charts or ingress charts or whatever the model dictated. >One can predict with the Capsolar! The November election? Simply check the cardinal ingress charts with the principals involved. >Be sure to look at Dubya's Solar for 2004 & 2005..... What's your prediction, Juan, since you are accustomed to doing progressions? Therese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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