Guest guest Posted May 18, 2003 Report Share Posted May 18, 2003 , Therese Hamilton <eastwest@s...> wrote: > I wonder where the parents of the children were coming from if they > realized what was going on with their children? You answered your own question earlier: >> I grew up in a Catholic family, and priests were regarded as >> practically Jesus himself. They were spoken of in hushed >> tones of respect. And the pope WAS God! You must see that one of the Church's largest aims is to control minds and direct the otherwise free wills of their adherents. Mental slavery. > Which is to say that in the majority of cases in the present Pluto should > probably not even be considered in the individual horoscope, and that > includes synastry. I suspect that in almost every case Pluto is a mute note > in the birth chart. I confess to having trouble with this planetoid myself. It sort of hangs there without a counterpart, or we have yet to discover that counterpart. I mean, Uranus has Neppy, Mars has Venus, Jup has Saturn, Sol has Luna, and Merc is neutered and on the fence. Perhaps we will find it soon, as there is an average of 75 years between discoveries of outers. Quoarar may be it, but I have no idea. > Good to hear from you, Ed. A silent EdK is a 'not much is happening' list. Thank you for such a fine compliment. It may make some on this list feel better to know that I was sent out in the hall numerous times, when I was in grade school, for challenging my teachers' alleged wisdom and teachings. The same behavior in college was encouraged. Yet, to me, this intellectual discussion, while necessary and illuminating, lies well below our heart connexions. I hope that all of the folks who I've sparred with know that I love 'em. - Ed > I cannot understand why the regulars on this list don't discuss horoscopes. > I think they used to in the early days of the list. > > (Reply to be continued in another post...) > > Therese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 18, 2003 Report Share Posted May 18, 2003 At 11:20 PM 5/17/03 -0000, Ed wrote: >I confess to having trouble with this planetoid [Pluto] myself. It sort of >hangs there without a counterpart, or we have yet to discover that >counterpart. I mean, Uranus has Neppy, Mars has Venus, Jup has >Saturn, Sol has Luna, and Merc is neutered and on the fence. Perhaps >we will find it soon, as there is an average of 75 years between >discoveries of outers. Quoarar may be it, but I have no idea. In the 80s I wrote a whole book on signs and their supposed ruling planets. the only possible next new planet entry was Kore/Persephone, queen of the underworld, the wife of Pluto. And 'Quoarar' is awfully close to Kore in pronunciation. Time will tell. We still aren't sure what Quoarar is exactly. >Yet, to me, this intellectual discussion, while necessary and >illuminating, lies well below our heart connexions. I hope that all >of the folks who I've sparred with know that I love 'em. I think we all might be getting the idea! Love, Therese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2003 Report Share Posted May 19, 2003 >> I grew up in a Catholic family, and priests were regarded as >> practically Jesus himself. They were spoken of in hushed >> tones of respect. And the pope WAS God! You must see that one of the Church's largest aims is to control minds and direct the otherwise free wills of their adherents. Mental slavery. Gawd..... The goal of every organization(not just the Catholic Church) is to market themselves and gain converts. The Church is not much different from Wal-Mart.... > Good to hear from you, Ed. A silent EdK is a 'not much is happening' list. Thank you for such a fine compliment. It may make some on this list feel better to know that I was sent out in the hall numerous times, when I was in grade school, for challenging my teachers' alleged wisdom and teachings. The same behavior in college was encouraged. Yet, to me, this intellectual discussion, while necessary and illuminating, lies well below our heart connexions. I hope that all of the folks who I've sparred with know that I love 'em. - Ed As one of those who you have " sparred " with I have never felt your love. As for the Uranus transit which has allowed you the opportunity to transform yourself, I'm glad because I do read a different and improved communicating " Ed " . Jivio " How can Pluto be in Sagittarius when it's so close to Antares? " ----- Post message: Subscribe: - Un: - List owner: -owner Shortcut URL to this page: / Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2003 Report Share Posted May 19, 2003 Hi Jivio, Firstly, I wanted to comment on your comment from about a month ago; one which I had to ponder for some time. You said that astrology, if treated like a game, is not only more fun, but also more revealing. I feel that's a fine insight, and that we do tend to take ourselves to seriously at times. Astrologers, after all, are entertainers at a base level, among other things. Yet, no sooner did this sink in when I revisited the classic " Solar and Lunar Returns " by Don Bradley, in which he states: " The odds are even that at any given moment a transiting planet is within 0*27' of a conjunction, square, or opposition of a natal planet -- a fact which gives the lie to any current astrological practices. " This fact is brought to the reader's attention so that he will appreciate the writer's insistance that astrology as a whole, is a science, not a game, and that it is folly to " explain " a misfortune, for example, by merely listing what appears to be an impressive series of bad aspects simultaneously operating in the horoscope.... " [p. 17] This is from a siderealist, too. , John Sarlya <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > >> I grew up in a Catholic family, and priests were regarded as > >> practically Jesus himself. They were spoken of in hushed > >> tones of respect. And the pope WAS God! > > You must see that one of the Church's largest aims is to control > minds and direct the otherwise free wills of their adherents. Mental > slavery. > > Gawd..... > The goal of every organization(not just the Catholic Church) is to market themselves and gain converts. > The Church is not much different from Wal-Mart.... It is very very different from Wally World, my friend. The goals of the Church are to get large masses of people to do things they would not ordinarily do. You nor I would kill, but if we were fed this " infallability " of the priesthood, as Therese mentioned, we can be directed to kill. This is exactly how the Crusades began. Here in the USA, we are accustomed to the separation of church and state, but in the majority of history, the church worked directly with the state to bolster support for empire. (this is the case indirectly with, for instance, the fundamentalist support for the Republican Party.) There's nothing like the interjection of " God " to make the average person do what he would never do otherwise. > As one of those who you have " sparred " with I have never felt your love. Well, in the end, all you are ever allowed to feel from another person is limited to what you feel inside of your own self. Also, as such, one can tell how any person feels about themself by the way they treat others. I never said that my posts came from a place of " love, " but simply that even after you all call me names and attack me, I would never hold that up to mean we are not capable of love. The day may come that we meet up at some astrology convention, or whatever, and we would do well to realize that intellectual sparring is quite detatched from (and secondary to) finding spiritual commonalities and, thus, love. Oh, and yes, the dual transit of Uranus squaring my Sun and Saturn squaring my Moon has foced me to reconsider much of my behavior as shitty. > As for the Uranus transit which has allowed you the opportunity to transform yourself, I'm glad because I do read a different and improved communicating " Ed " . Well, this list has changed lately, and the few real idiots have faded away, which is good. Very best, Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2003 Report Share Posted May 20, 2003 Ed Kohout [sMTP:crumpo] Monday, May 19, 2003 3:11 PM Re: Pluto and Awareness Hi Jivio, Firstly, I wanted to comment on your comment from about a month ago; one which I had to ponder for some time. You said that astrology, if treated like a game, is not only more fun, but also more revealing. I feel that's a fine insight, and that we do tend to take ourselves to seriously at times. Astrologers, after all, are entertainers at a base level, among other things. Yet, no sooner did this sink in when I revisited the classic " Solar and Lunar Returns " by Don Bradley, in which he states: " The odds are even that at any given moment a transiting planet is within 0*27' of a conjunction, square, or opposition of a natal planet -- a fact which gives the lie to any current astrological practices. " This fact is brought to the reader's attention so that he will appreciate the writer's insistance that astrology as a whole, is a science, not a game, and that it is folly to " explain " a misfortune, for example, by merely listing what appears to be an impressive series of bad aspects simultaneously operating in the horoscope.... " [p. 17] This is from a siderealist, too. As I see it, what I wrote and Bradley wrote does not conflict. Jen... Enjoy your adventure... Being a beginner allows you great freedom in making choices and choosing logical directions within the confines of " astrology " . Its much like learning a language or a particular dialect of a language and you will constantly encounter individuals with differing levels of logic or for that matter, understanding of the subject matter. Challenge the " authorities " ... those that " know " what they are talking about.... They are usually well meaning but simply express their " own " particular biased experience. When you look at charts of individuals, transpose the charts on one another... Look at the interrelationships between the planets and the 4 angles(Campanus)... Look at natal charts in relationship to each other but also to each others progressed Charts. I think you will find how each relationship is uniquely " connected " and how the transits work their magic. Time = viva la difference. jivio , John Sarlya <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > >> I grew up in a Catholic family, and priests were regarded as > >> practically Jesus himself. They were spoken of in hushed > >> tones of respect. And the pope WAS God! > > You must see that one of the Church's largest aims is to control > minds and direct the otherwise free wills of their adherents. Mental > slavery. > > Gawd..... > The goal of every organization(not just the Catholic Church) is to market themselves and gain converts. > The Church is not much different from Wal-Mart.... It is very very different from Wally World, my friend. The goals of the Church are to get large masses of people to do things they would not ordinarily do. Such as believing in the love of God and laying down their lives for the amusement of individuals who enjoyed watching hungry lions kill people with faith and conviction. The goals of the Church are many.... are they all sinister? You nor I would kill, but if we were fed this " infallability " of the priesthood, as Therese mentioned, we can be directed to kill. This is exactly how the Crusades began. Catholics are not taught that priests are infallible. They are taught that the " Pope " is infallible in his interpretation of Church doctrine but that's where the " infallibility " ends. The US Government can direct you and me to kill but the Catholic Church lost its ability to do that centuries ago. Here in the USA, we are accustomed to the separation of church and state, but in the majority of history, the church worked directly with the state to bolster support for empire. (this is the case indirectly with, for instance, the fundamentalist support for the Republican Party.) There's nothing like the interjection of " God " to make the average person do what he would never do otherwise. Give us average people credit for being what we are. We do what we want, believe what we want and accept differences if we wish too. Bashing Catholics sounds similar to anti-Semitism or anti-Arabic..... > As one of those who you have " sparred " with I have never felt your love. Well, in the end, all you are ever allowed to feel from another person is limited to what you feel inside of your own self. nahhhhhh... not always! Also, as such, one can tell how any person feels about themself by the way they treat others. Now that I can see happen but I never said that my posts came from a place of " love, " but simply that even after you all call me names and attack me, I would never hold that up to mean we are not capable of love. The day may come that we meet up at some astrology convention, or whatever, and we would do well to realize that intellectual sparring is quite detatched from (and secondary to) finding spiritual commonalities and, thus, love. Oh, and yes, the dual transit of Uranus squaring my Sun and Saturn squaring my Moon has foced me to reconsider much of my behavior as shitty. Is a little religion good for the soul? > As for the Uranus transit which has allowed you the opportunity to transform yourself, I'm glad because I do read a different and improved communicating " Ed " . Well, this list has changed lately, and the few real idiots have faded away, which is good. Very best, Ed " How can Pluto be in Sagittarius when it's so close to Antares? " ----- Post message: Subscribe: - Un: - List owner: -owner Shortcut URL to this page: / Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2003 Report Share Posted May 20, 2003 At 08:11 PM 5/19/03 -0000, Ed wrote: > > The day may come >that we meet up at some astrology convention, or whatever, and we >would do well to realize that intellectual sparring is quite >detatched from (and secondary to) finding spiritual commonalities >and, thus, love. Very nice thought for ALL of us!! Thanks, Ed. One thing I've noticed living in a small town the last few years is that people here cannot separate opinion on a public issue from the person who holds that opinion. So one neighbor hates and harasses another based on two different viewpoints, such as whether there should be an ice rink in the park!! One couple was literally driven out of town by nasty phone calls and letters in the newspaper. Let's hope as astrologers we can have intellectual differences and still respect the person who holds a view entirely different from our own. Love, Therese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2003 Report Share Posted May 25, 2003 , John Sarlya <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > As I see it, what I wrote and Bradley wrote does not conflict. Well, why? It appears you are in direct conflict, but please enlighten me. Thanks, Ed K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2003 Report Share Posted May 26, 2003 Ed I can't perform miracles(for you).... Your manifestations and your perceptions are of your own making....What do you perceive as conflict? Jivio Ed Kohout [sMTP:crumpo] Sunday, May 25, 2003 4:11 PM Re: Pluto and Awareness , John Sarlya <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > As I see it, what I wrote and Bradley wrote does not conflict. Well, why? It appears you are in direct conflict, but please enlighten me. Thanks, Ed K " How can Pluto be in Sagittarius when it's so close to Antares? " ----- Post message: Subscribe: - Un: - List owner: -owner Shortcut URL to this page: / Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2003 Report Share Posted May 27, 2003 A wonderful non-answer, once again. Thanks, Ed , John Sarlya <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > Ed > > I can't perform miracles(for you).... Your manifestations and your perceptions are of your own making....What do you perceive as conflict? > > Jivio > > > Ed Kohout [sMTP:crumpo@e...] > Sunday, May 25, 2003 4:11 PM > > Re: Pluto and Awareness > > , John Sarlya > <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > > > > As I see it, what I wrote and Bradley wrote does not conflict. > > > Well, why? It appears you are in direct conflict, but please > enlighten me. > > Thanks, > Ed K > > > > > > " How can Pluto be in Sagittarius when it's so close to Antares? " --- -- > > Post message: > Subscribe: - > Un: - > List owner: -owner > > Shortcut URL to this page: > / > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2003 Report Share Posted May 27, 2003 You percieve it as a non-answer... I percieve it as " What are you talking about? " You say there is a conflict and I say how? again... If you wish to elaborate on how, what I wrote was in conflict with Bradley explain yourself. To just say " Dude.. you're in conflict with Bradley " does not fully explain your opinion(to me). Jivio PS: Suggest Tracking your PSSR. --- Ed Kohout <crumpo wrote: > A wonderful non-answer, once again. > > Thanks, > Ed > > > > > > , John > Sarlya > <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > Ed > > > > I can't perform miracles(for you).... Your > manifestations and your > perceptions are of your own making....What do you > perceive as > conflict? > > > > Jivio > > > > > > Ed Kohout [sMTP:crumpo@e...] > > Sunday, May 25, 2003 4:11 PM > > > > Re: Pluto and > Awareness > > > > , John > Sarlya > > <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > > > > > > > As I see it, what I wrote and Bradley wrote does > not conflict. > > > > > > Well, why? It appears you are in direct conflict, > but please > > enlighten me. > > > > Thanks, > > Ed K > > > > > > > > > > > > " How can Pluto be in Sagittarius when it's so > close to Antares? " --- > -- > > > > Post message: > > Subscribe: > - > > Un: > - > > List owner: > -owner > > > > Shortcut URL to this page: > > / > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2003 Report Share Posted May 27, 2003 You perceive it as a non-answer... I perceive it as " What are you talking about? " You say there is a conflict and I say how? again... If you wish to elaborate on how, what I wrote was in conflict with Bradley explain yourself. To just say " Dude.. you're in conflict with Bradley " does not fully explain your opinion(to me). Jivio PS: Suggest Tracking your PSSR. --- Ed Kohout <crumpo wrote: > A wonderful non-answer, once again. > > Thanks, > Ed > > > > > > , John > Sarlya > <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > Ed > > > > I can't perform miracles(for you).... Your > manifestations and your > perceptions are of your own making....What do you > perceive as > conflict? > > > > Jivio > > > > > > Ed Kohout [sMTP:crumpo@e...] > > Sunday, May 25, 2003 4:11 PM > > > > Re: Pluto and > Awareness > > > > , John > Sarlya > > <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > > > > > > > As I see it, what I wrote and Bradley wrote does > not conflict. > > > > > > Well, why? It appears you are in direct conflict, > but please > > enlighten me. > > > > Thanks, > > Ed K > > > > > > > > > > > > " How can Pluto be in Sagittarius when it's so > close to Antares? " --- > -- > > > > Post message: > > Subscribe: > - > > Un: > - > > List owner: > -owner > > > > Shortcut URL to this page: > > / > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2003 Report Share Posted May 28, 2003 , Juan Oliver <jivio> wrote: > You perceive it as a non-answer... > I perceive it as " What are you talking about? " > > You say there is a conflict and I say how? > > again... If you wish to elaborate on how, what I wrote > was in conflict with Bradley explain yourself. To just > say " Dude.. you're in conflict with Bradley " does not > fully explain your opinion(to me). > > Jivio And I'm the King of France!! So be it! You are perfect! > > PS: Suggest Tracking your PSSR. I suggest that your suggestions are endlessly worthless. > > > --- Ed Kohout <crumpo@e...> wrote: > > A wonderful non-answer, once again. > > > > Thanks, > > Ed > > > > > > > > > > > > , John > > Sarlya > > <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > > Ed > > > > > > I can't perform miracles(for you).... Your > > manifestations and your > > perceptions are of your own making....What do you > > perceive as > > conflict? > > > > > > Jivio > > > > > > > > > Ed Kohout [sMTP:crumpo@e...] > > > Sunday, May 25, 2003 4:11 PM > > > > > > Re: Pluto and > > Awareness > > > > > > , John > > Sarlya > > > <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > As I see it, what I wrote and Bradley wrote does > > not conflict. > > > > > > > > > Well, why? It appears you are in direct conflict, > > but please > > > enlighten me. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Ed K > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " How can Pluto be in Sagittarius when it's so > > close to Antares? " --- > > -- > > > > > > Post message: > > > Subscribe: > > - > > > Un: > > - > > > List owner: > > -owner > > > > > > Shortcut URL to this page: > > > / > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2003 Report Share Posted May 28, 2003 To the King Of France! Have a nice day! Regards... Perfect --- Ed Kohout <crumpo wrote: > , Juan > Oliver <jivio> > wrote: > > You perceive it as a non-answer... > > I perceive it as " What are you talking about? " > > > > You say there is a conflict and I say how? > > > > again... If you wish to elaborate on how, what I > wrote > > was in conflict with Bradley explain yourself. To > just > > say " Dude.. you're in conflict with Bradley " does > not > > fully explain your opinion(to me). > > > > Jivio > > And I'm the King of France!! So be it! You are > perfect! > > > > > > > > PS: Suggest Tracking your PSSR. > > I suggest that your suggestions are endlessly > worthless. > > > > > > > > > > --- Ed Kohout <crumpo@e...> wrote: > > > A wonderful non-answer, once again. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Ed > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , John > > > Sarlya > > > <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > > > Ed > > > > > > > > I can't perform miracles(for you).... Your > > > manifestations and your > > > perceptions are of your own making....What do > you > > > perceive as > > > conflict? > > > > > > > > Jivio > > > > > > > > > > > > Ed Kohout [sMTP:crumpo@e...] > > > > Sunday, May 25, 2003 4:11 PM > > > > > > > > Re: Pluto and > > > Awareness > > > > > > > > , > John > > > Sarlya > > > > <johnsarlya@p...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I see it, what I wrote and Bradley wrote > does > > > not conflict. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, why? It appears you are in direct > conflict, > > > but please > > > > enlighten me. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Ed K > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " How can Pluto be in Sagittarius when it's so > > > close to Antares? " --- > > > -- > > > > > > > > Post message: > > > > > Subscribe: > > > - > > > > Un: > > > - > > > > List owner: > > > -owner > > > > > > > > Shortcut URL to this page: > > > > > / > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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