pls discuss KALSARP YOG

August 21, 2008

Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi,

Quote: >>Once it is recognized as a valid astrological yog, the matter

ends there.<<

No, not in my book it doesn't. My personal opinion is that Kala Sarpa

Yoga is a big hoax, used by greedy astrologers to cheat the innocent

people for money by selling them fake yantras, mantras, upayas, etc.

As I have already said, I have never seen any indication that KSY has

any kind of malefic effect, that need to be remedied. I also seriously

doubt that any other astrologer of true merits has ever been able to

observe any evil effect of KSY.

It is true that I accept Kala Sarpa Yoga as an astrological yoga,

since it is being mentioned by the late Pt. Gopala Krishna Rao in his

book 'Nadi Jyotisha' from the 1950's. I am open to the suggestion that

KSY might be considered as a part of the parampara of that school of

astrology and their followers. It might even be considered as a part

of the KP-school if they say so, since KP was the disciple of Pt.

Gopala Krishna Rao. But I never heard any such claim from any of these

people.

However, it is very wrong to indiscriminately mix together one

astrological system with another. It would be like mixing honey and

ghee, which can be poisonous. Each astrological school is based on its

own independent fundamental principles, and the great Lal Kitab is no

exception. The mixed concepts will lead us no where. There should be

no such thing as Gandhian Socialism.

Quote: >>The Yog exists in spite of pt. Roopchandji not mentioning it

in his book. (...) whether Pt. Roopchand ji talks about it or not in

the Lal Kitab.<<

I can see from these lines that you actually agree with me that it was

none other than Pundit Roop Chand Joshi who wrote the great Lal Kitab.

Very good!

Best regards,

Finn Wandahl

, " varun_trvd "

<varun_trvd wrote:

>

> Respected Finn sahib,

>

> If Kal Sarp Yog is an astrological yog, as you have already

> accepted, then it doesnâ€™t matter whether Pt. Roopchand ji talks

> about it or not in the Lal Kitab. Once it is recognized as a valid

> astrological yog, the matter ends there.

>

> The Yog exists in spite of pt. Roopchandji not mentioning it in his

> book. No astrology yog depends on the acceptance or the denial of

> its existence by one particular scholar.

>

> That being so, it will be absolutely justified to look for the

> possible remedies of this dosh [ affliction] as Pt. Krishna Ashant

> ji has done in his book.

>

> With great regards,

>

> Varun Trivedi

>

, " Finn Wandahl "

> <finn.wandahl@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Mr. V. Shukla,

> >

> > Yes, I agree with you that KSY is also a yoga that can be found in

> the

> > charts of the people. However, to in order to get the proper

> knowledge

> > about Kala Sarpa Yoga you need to look for it in the right places,

> not

> > in the wrong places.

> >

> > I have already told that no information about KSY can be found in

> any

> > of the classical texts. Like I said, KSY was mentioned for the

> first

> > time in the book " Naadi Joytisha " (3 vols) by the late hindu

> > astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao, with the pen-name " Meena " . This is

> > where I suggest you to focus your attention in the first place.

> Only

> > this way you may get the right and truthful information about KSY.

> >

> > Like I said earlier, Pt. Gopala Krishna Raho had two disciples,

> one of

> > whom was the late Prof. K.S. Krishnamurthi, the founder of the

> > KP-school, I forgot the name of the other one, except that it was a

> > Brahmin name, a rather short one, but he is perhaps also worth

> looking

> > into. Therefore to find out more about KSY, you need to read

> carefully

> > all the five KP-readers and study the old issues of their

> astrological

> > magazine as well. There might be some information on KSY hitten

> somewhere.

> >

> > Now I have told you where to start, but I have no wish to serve the

> > information to you on a silver-plate. You need to do your own

> > research, if you really want to find out about this matter.

> >

> > This is how I got my knowledge, by deep study, careful research and

> > contemplating the results over a period of nearly 30 years.

> >

> > Best regards,

> > Finn Wandahl

> >

> > , " lalkitabee "

> > <lalkitabee@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Respected Mr. Wandahl

> > > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be

> decided in a

> > > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in lalkitab

> without

> > > any name with some other definations,

> > > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz no

> other

> > > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are in

> Africa &

> > > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no

> contradiction

> > > about the use of the word " elephant " . In the same way reading

> about

> > > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of the

> text, not

> > > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep dive

> into the

> > > sea. The " read-out " theory cant be assumed without " read-into "

> > > fundamentals.At other side - " about the fear of general peoples "

> is a

> > > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this category of

> > > fear-generator group. But it

> > >

> > > doesn't mean to stop read or learn about this or type of these

> yogas.

> > > Today u r saying not to support this Kaal Sarp Yog, after some

> days

> > > other will say -not to support VISHKANYA YOG etc. After all how a

> > > scholar can stop his readings or researches ?

> > > Electricity is hazardous , but the theory of

> > > electricity is not hazardous & reading of this theory can be

> helpful

> > > from safety-point of view from electricity.

> > > With Regards

> > > Pt.Lalkitabee

> > > V.Shukla

> > > www.lalkitabee.com

> > > , " Finn Wandahl "

> > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Mr. KP Miglani,

> > > >

> > > > There is absolutely NOTHING about Kala Sarpa Yoga in the great

> Lal

> > > > Kitab, no matter how much we twist or bend the text.

> > > >

> > > > Please always remember, we are supposed to read out of the

> text, not

> > > > into the text. After all, we are not the writers of the great

> Lal

> > > > Kitab, Pt. Roop Chand Joshi was.

> > > >

> > > > Best regards,

> > > > Finn Wandahl

> > > >

> > > > , " kpmiglani "

> > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Varun Ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > I agree with you. I was wondering if you have read the

> section on

> > > > > Rahu + Ketu in the 1952 edition on page 323 of Arun Sanhita.

> I do

> > > > > not have the Urdu edition because I can not read urdu. I do

> not

> > know

> > > > > why, but it sounds to me that the book is talking about the

> kalsarp

> > > > > yog in that context.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sincerely,

> > > > >

> > > > > KP Miglani

> > > > >

> > > > > , " varun_trvd "

> > > > > <varun_trvd@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Respected Miglani ji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your point is well taken.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I accept that all planets hemmed by rahu and ketu and

> half the

> > > > > > horoscope going empty does give the horoscope a different

> look.

> > > > > What

> > > > > > I am against is the scare that has been caused by this; or

> > > > > treating

> > > > > > this placement as a curse.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Secondly, it has not been proved beyond doubt that

> whatever ills,

> > > > > if

> > > > > > at all, accrue are because of this placement. Till such

> time that

> > > > > > the ills in the horoscope get associated with this

> placement, I

> > > > > > would personally like to keep this in the grey area of

> research.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In academic research all possibilities are examined and

> > evaluated.

> > > > > > Those not found tenable are left; they are not dumped. You

> never

> > > > > > know some body else comes up with a better explanation

> later

> > which

> > > > > > proves the existence of a Kal Sarp Yog.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I can not dump Kal Sarp Yog simply because this placement

> did not

> > > > > > find a mention in the classics. In other fields of life

> there are

> > > > > > quite a few things which did not find a mention in old

> texts and

> > > > > are

> > > > > > a reality today. Therefore we can not dump a thing on the

> basis

> > > > > that

> > > > > > classics are silent about it. Similarly I will not accept

> it

> > to be

> > > > > a

> > > > > > reality till such time that it is proved beyond doubt that

> a Yog

> > > > > > like Kal Sarp Yog exists and these are the effects of it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Therefore I do not dump the Kal Sarp Yog as a figment of

> > > > > > imagination, nor would give more credence then what it

> deserves.

> > > > > > When I said that I treat it a matter of grey area

> research, it

> > > > > means

> > > > > > that I accept its possible existence.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Varun Trivedi

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , " kpmiglani "

> > > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Finn and Varun,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I hope you agree that if all the planets are on one side

> of

> > Rahu-

> > > > > > > ketu axis and consequently half the horoscope stays

> empty, it

> > > > > > > presents an abnormal distribution of planets. This

> abnormality

> > > > > > could

> > > > > > > not have gone unnoticed by the great astrology Savants,

> > > > > including

> > > > > > > Roopchandra ji. What name was given to this abnormality,

> or how

> > > > > > was

> > > > > > > it understood, or what it was taken to mean could be a

> > matter of

> > > > > > > debate. Whatever name we assign to it, it definitely

> needs our

> > > > > > > attention. We can not ignore it and sweep it under the

> carpet.

> > > > > > > As you both seem to suggest that this so called Kal Sarp

> Yog

> > has

> > > > > > > been used by unscrupulous astrologers to intimidate

> gullible

> > > > > > seekers

> > > > > > > and used as a money spinner, then it becomes all the

> more

> > > > > > imperative

> > > > > > > on our part to bring out the truth such that it explains

> the

> > > > > > > phenomenon logically. By just saying that it does not

> exist is

> > > > > > like

> > > > > > > wishing some thing away. The phenomenon of all the

> planets

> > > > > hemmed

> > > > > > > between rahu-ketu does exist, neither of you can deny.

> Give it

> > > > > > > whatever name you want, but a plausible well reasoned

> response

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > expected before dumping it into the waste paper basket.

> > > > > > > I am sorry if I have hurt any body's feelings, that has

> never

> > > > > been

> > > > > > > my intention.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sincerely,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > KP Miglani

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , " Finn

> Wandahl "

> > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee),

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Please, I mean nothing personal by this. I agree with

> you

> > that

> > > > > > many

> > > > > > > > statements of Lal Kitab has a number of hidden meanings

> > hidden

> > > > > > > within

> > > > > > > > them. No doubt about that.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > However, I think we should always be very careful that

> our

> > > > > great

> > > > > > > Lal

> > > > > > > > Kitab is not being misused to support something

> malefic like

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > general peoples fear, which I think is the case here.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > In my honest opinion this whole Kala Sarpa yoga thing

> > should be

> > > > > > > > considered to be within the evil circle of Mercury.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > Finn

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > careful not to

> > > > > > > > --- In

> , " lalkitabee "

> > > > > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl

> > > > > > > > > Yes u r absolutly right, Descriptions of planets are

> > usually

> > > > > > > based on

> > > > > > > > > religious cosmology but my explanations are based

> upon the

> > > > > > > predective &

> > > > > > > > > remedial astrology of lalkitab.This is a reading

> into the

> > > > > > > text ,to

> > > > > > > > > search out the vision about kalsarp yog in perview

> of

> > > > > > lalkitab.I

> > > > > > > tried

> > > > > > > > > to answer - does lalkitab includes kalsarp yog

> directly or

> > > > > > > indirectly?

> > > > > > > > > . & i found it indirect state in lalkitab.(Here i

> want to

> > > > > say --

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > the word

> > > > > > > > > KAALSARP has been used as a real snake by some

> astrologers,

> > > > > In

> > > > > > > fact this

> > > > > > > > > word was used to explain a YOG, like gajkesri YOG,

> sunafaa

> > > > > > YOG,

> > > > > > > anafaa

> > > > > > > > > YOG, etc. .Here the 1st word KAAL = TIME used as

> KAAL=

> > > > > HORROR,

> > > > > > > DEATH ,by

> > > > > > > > > some half baked quacksalvers.otherwise there r so

> much

> > > > > > > horoscopes having

> > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog with a cheerful life.)

> > > > > > > > > Symbolic imaginations are very useful to

> > understand to

> > > > > > any

> > > > > > > stream

> > > > > > > > > of predective & remedial astrology while analyzing

> any

> > > > > > > horoscope.But my

> > > > > > > > > views focused only to the horoscope for the purpose

> of

> > > > > > > predective or

> > > > > > > > > remedial astrology . Im not trying to prove how are

> rahu

> > > > > ketu

> > > > > > > explained

> > > > > > > > > astronomically or in other style, bcoz whole

> lalkitab is

> > > > > based

> > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > > logical predective & logical remedial theory, no

> other

> > > > > system

> > > > > > i

> > > > > > > found

> > > > > > > > > like this. Otherwise Rahu ketu r accepted as shadow

> planets

> > > > > > > (CHHAYAA

> > > > > > > > > GRAH)also. I think u wil be agree with my point of

> > > > > view ,what

> > > > > > i

> > > > > > > want to

> > > > > > > > > say.We cant deny symbolic imaginations while reading

> > > > > lalkitab.

> > > > > > > This is

> > > > > > > > > y- in very begining the author of this book Pt.

> roop Chand

> > > > > > > Joshi ji

> > > > > > > > > adviced this book to read as a noval.

> > > > > > > > > With Regards

> > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee

> > > > > > > > > V.Shukla

> > > > > > > > > , " Finn

> Wandahl "

> > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee),

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Descriptions of planets are usually based on

> religious

> > > > > > > cosmology, and

> > > > > > > > > > in many religious texts Rahu is pictured as a big

> snake

> > > > > > > swallowing the

> > > > > > > > > > Sun and causing eclipse to happen.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > It is a matter of fact, than in Varaha

> Mihira's " Brihat

> > > > > > > Samhita " (6th

> > > > > > > > > > century AD) the very word " Rahu " is used for

> eclipse and

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > word

> > > > > > > > > > " Ketu " is the word for comets and meteors, since

> comets

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > meteors

> > > > > > > > > > look like tails when observed in the sky.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > However there mere fact that Lal Kitab also

> describes

> > Rahu

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > Ketu

> > > > > > > > > > something like this, cannot be used to

> legitimate " Kala

> > > > > > Sarpa

> > > > > > > Yoga " as

> > > > > > > > > > somehow being linked to Lal Kitab. No way! I think

> we

> > > > > should

> > > > > > > be honest

> > > > > > > > > > about this - at least to our own good selves.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > When dealing with the great Lal Kitab, I think we

> should

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > careful to read out of the text, not into the

> text.

> > > > > > Otherwise

> > > > > > > we may

> > > > > > > > > > end up with some serious misunderstandings. At

> least this

> > > > > > > happens to

> > > > > > > > > > be my own humble opinion.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > --- In

> , " lalkitabee "

> > > > > > > > > > lalkitabee@ wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl & Members

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Your keen observations r absolutly right that

> > Nowhere any

> > > > > > > > > description

> > > > > > > > > > > with the name as " Kalsarp Yoga " in lalkitab. So

> we can

> > > > > say

> > > > > > > lalkitab

> > > > > > > > > does

> > > > > > > > > > > not consider Kalsarp yoga. But with humble words

> I want

> > > > > to

> > > > > > > share

> > > > > > > > > some

> > > > > > > > > > > own views in this perview..This article was

> written by

> > > > > me

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > past in

> > > > > > > > > > > other group.I think it will be helpfull to under

> stand

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > topic-

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > RESPECTED MEMBERS lalkitab accepts Rahu as the

> > > > > > > > > > > head of snake & ketu as the tail of snake &

> saturn is

> > > > > > > elaborated as

> > > > > > > > > > > snake in lalkitab.As example in the very

> begining of

> > > > > > > lalkitab says

> > > > > > > > > about

> > > > > > > > > > > rahu ketu--

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 1. EK NE INSAAN KO SIR SE PAKDAA HAI DOOSRE NE

> PAIR SE.

> > > > > TO

> > > > > > > KHUD BA

> > > > > > > > > > KHUD UNKO JAGAH MIL GAYEE (Means ;- Rahu will be

> treated

> > > > > as

> > > > > > > head &

> > > > > > > > > > Ketu as tail)

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 2. About saturn - shani khana no 4 addressed as

> PANI KA

> > > > > > > SAANP, Shani

> > > > > > > > > > > khana no.5 as BACHCHEY KHANE WALAA SAANP, Shani

> khana

> > > > > no.

> > > > > > 6

> > > > > > > as RAAT

> > > > > > > > > > KA ANDHAA SAANP.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > So much use of this word prooves that saturn is

> called

> > > > > as

> > > > > > > snake in

> > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Now an opinion of mine is that Kalsarp means

> kal=

> > > > > > > time ,SAMAY Sarp -

> > > > > > > > > > > snake. As defination we can say that the cycle

> of time

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > which all

> > > > > > > > > > > planets come between Rahu & Ketu in any

> horoscope will

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > treated as

> > > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog. It is declared name in Jyotish.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > At other side when i saw in lalkitab-- i found

> some

> > > > > > > discriptions &

> > > > > > > > > > > definations as below

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 1.PEHLEY GHARON MAIN DUM KETU HOTE

> ICHCHHAADHAARI SHANI

> > > > > > > HOTAA HO

> > > > > > > > > > > ULAT MAGAR JAB TEVE BAITHA AZDAHAA KHOONI BANTAA

> HO

> > > > > (here

> > > > > > > ajdahaa is

> > > > > > > > > > > AJGAR SNAKE)SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY

> MUKHDAA

> > > > > > (Head)

> > > > > > > RAHU

> > > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA HO (Page no. 585 oroginal book 1952)

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 2.SANICHCHAR KO AGAR SAANP MAANAA JAYE TO USKI

> DUM KETU

> > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE

> > > > > > > > > > > WALE GHAR MAIN HOGI AUR SIR USKAA RAHU BAITHAA

> HONE

> > WALE

> > > > > > > GHAR MAIN

> > > > > > > > > > GINAA JAYEGAA YA SANICHCHAR KA SIR RAHU HOGAA AUR

> > > > > SANICHCHAR

> > > > > > > KI DUM

> > > > > > > > > > KETU HOGI

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > (PAGE NO. 588 at no. 5 in the chapter of AAM

> HAALAT)

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 3. Shani ka swabhav is specially counted by RAHU

> > KETU in

> > > > > > > lalkitab.

> > > > > > > > > As

> > > > > > > > > > > well as at page no. 590 ---MANDI HAALAT MAIN

> AMOOMAN

> > > > > > > SANICHCHAR

> > > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE WALE GHAR KE DONO TARAF HEE DAAYAIN

> (RIGHT)

> > > > > > > BAAYAIN

> > > > > > > > > > (LEFT) RAHU KETU BAITHAA HONE KE VAQT UNKAA BHEE

> MANDAA

> > > > > ASAR

> > > > > > > HOGAA.

> > > > > > > > > > > (after this a chart has been written at page 590

> > showing

> > > > > > BAD

> > > > > > > effects

> > > > > > > > > > > of SAANP (Shani)

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 4.At page no. 623 I saw the defination about bad

> saturn

> > > > > as

> > > > > > > below

> > > > > > > > > > > HEADING:- SANICHCHAR KE MANDE ASAR KA RUKH

> KIDHAR HOGAA

> > > > > > > > > > > RAHU KO SIR AUR KETU KO DUM (tail) SAMAJHKAR EK

> SAANP

> > > > > KEE

> > > > > > > SHAKAL

> > > > > > > > > > (shape)BANAYAIN TO RAHU BAITHAA HONE WAALE GHAR SE

> AAGE

> > > > > > JAHAAN

> > > > > > > KAHIN

> > > > > > > > > > BHI YAANI JIS KHAANE MAIN REKHAA NIKAL KAR SEEDHEE

> HEE

> > JAA

> > > > > > > SAKTEE HO ,

> > > > > > > > > > US GHAR PAR SHANI KA ASAR PADEGAA (Here also

> pandit ji

> > > > > > assumed

> > > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > > > snake).Even this line has been said for saturn

> khana 8.

> > > > > But

> > > > > > in

> > > > > > > other

> > > > > > > > > > context also saturn treated as snake & rahu called

> as

> > head

> > > > > &

> > > > > > > ketu as

> > > > > > > > > > tail. As said above

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > :--- SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA

> (Head)

> > > > > RAHU

> > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA

> > > > > > > > > HO.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > It means we can create a shape of snake in each

> > > > > horoscope.

> > > > > > > > > > > Here my only view is that lalkitab already

> persues Rahu

> > > > > > ketu

> > > > > > > as head

> > > > > > > > > > & tail of Saturn (Snake) & if a horoscope comes

> befor us

> > > > > > > including all

> > > > > > > > > > planets between Rahu & Ketu ,then as per

> lalkitab ,a

> > > > > picture

> > > > > > > appears

> > > > > > > > > > that all planets controlled at one side (left or

> > right) by

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > snake

> > > > > > > > > > (Saturn) placing his head rahu & tail Ketu. So

> even

> > > > > lalkitab

> > > > > > > does not

> > > > > > > > > > used the word KALSARP YOG directly.But above said

> > > > > situation

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > planets

> > > > > > > > > > gives us an image of Horoscope as Kal = Time or

> SAMAY &

> > > > > Sarp

> > > > > > =

> > > > > > > Snake

> > > > > > > > > > Yog,created in horoscope.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Yaani ki Samay ke ya vaqt ke mutabik sabhi

> > > > > > > > > > > grah saanp ke sir (head) aur dum (Tail) ko paar

> nahi

> > kar

> > > > > > > sake aur ek

> > > > > > > > > > > aisa yog ban baithaa jiskaa naam kalsarp yog ke

> alawaa

> > > > > aur

> > > > > > > kuchh

> > > > > > > > > bolnaa

> > > > > > > > > > > sateek nahee maaloom hotaa.Bhaley hee laalkitab

> main

> > ise

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > naam se

> > > > > > > > > > > naheen kahaa gayaa hai lekin rahu aur ketu ko to

> saanp

> > > > > > > (Saturn) ka

> > > > > > > > > sir

> > > > > > > > > > > aur dum kahaa gayaa hai.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > All this is my view as per understanding of

> quotes of

> > > > > > revered

> > > > > > > > > lalkitab.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > But knowledge & research has no limit.I m owed

> to all

> > > > > > learned

> > > > > > > > > > members & there views.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > With Regards

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee

> > > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > --- In

> , " Finn

> > > > > Wandahl "

> > > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Kala sarpa Yoga and its opposite, the so called

> > " Sweet

> > > > > > > Sarpa

> > > > > > > > > Yoga " ,

> > > > > > > > > > > > are by no means ancient. Both these Yogas were

> > > > > > introduced

> > > > > > > by the

> > > > > > > > > late

> > > > > > > > > > > > Hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao (Meena) in

> his

> > > > > > > book 'Naadi

> > > > > > > > > > > > Joytisha', written somewhere in the 1950-ties.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > However, Mr. Gopala Krishna Rao never

> mentioned

> > > > > anything

> > > > > > > about an

> > > > > > > > > > > > Upaya for this Yoga.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Kalasarpa Yoga is not being mentioned in any

> of the

> > > > > > > traditional

> > > > > > > > > > > > classics of Hindu astrology. It is also not

> being

> > > > > > mentioned

> > > > > > > > > anywhere

> > > > > > > > > > > > in our great Lal Kitab.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I also like to mention that my good friend Mr.

> K.N.

> > > > > Rao

> > > > > > > from Delhi

> > > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > > > > very critical about Kala Sarpa Yoga, since it

> has

> > been

> > > > > > > misused a

> > > > > > > > > lot

> > > > > > > > > > > > to scare the people, very much like the way

> Mangal-

> > > > > dosha

> > > > > > > and the

> > > > > > > > > > > > 7Â½-years of Saturn are being used to exploit

> people

> > > > > all

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > time.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > --- In

> > > > > , " varun_trvd "

> > > > > > > > > > > > varun_trvd@ wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Rakesh ji,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Go to the files section of the following

> group.

> > Read

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > article

> > > > > > > > > on

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Kal Sarp yog and its upaya. You will know

> about our

> > > > > > > views on it.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> /

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In

> > > > > > > , " rakesh.behal "

> > > > > > > > > > > > > <rakesh.behal@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir,

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > i request you all that please

> discuss

> > > > > KALSARP

> > > > > > > YOG what

> > > > > > > > > lal

> > > > > > > > > > > > > kitab

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > says about this and does it really affect a

> > person.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > waht upayas one can do to get rid of its

> adverse

> > > > > > > effects.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > rakesh

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

August 21, 2008

Respected Finn saheb,

Strange: You accept that KSY exists and in the same breath you say that it doesn't in your book.

We do not insist that you include it in your book; none of our business

A malady is a malady which ever tool is used to diagnose. If a system doesn't have a tool then we have to create one.

We have said time and again that we do not consider the Lal Kitab as a separate system different from the Indian Vedic astrology. We consider Lal Kitab as an integral part of the Indian astrology.

There is no mixing of the tools as you seem to be suggesting. Therefore all tools of analysis used in the traditional astrology can be and should be applied to the Lal Kitab also.

Regards,

Varun Trivedi

, "Finn Wandahl" <finn.wandahl wrote:>> Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi,> > Quote: >>Once it is recognized as a valid astrological yog, the matter> ends there.<<> > No, not in my book it doesn't. My personal opinion is that Kala Sarpa> Yoga is a big hoax, used by greedy astrologers to cheat the innocent> people for money by selling them fake yantras, mantras, upayas, etc.> As I have already said, I have never seen any indication that KSY has> any kind of malefic effect, that need to be remedied. I also seriously> doubt that any other astrologer of true merits has ever been able to> observe any evil effect of KSY. > > It is true that I accept Kala Sarpa Yoga as an astrological yoga,> since it is being mentioned by the late Pt. Gopala Krishna Rao in his> book 'Nadi Jyotisha' from the 1950's. I am open to the suggestion that> KSY might be considered as a part of the parampara of that school of> astrology and their followers. It might even be considered as a part> of the KP-school if they say so, since KP was the disciple of Pt.> Gopala Krishna Rao. But I never heard any such claim from any of these> people.> > However, it is very wrong to indiscriminately mix together one> astrological system with another. It would be like mixing honey and> ghee, which can be poisonous. Each astrological school is based on its> own independent fundamental principles, and the great Lal Kitab is no> exception. The mixed concepts will lead us no where. There should be> no such thing as Gandhian Socialism. > > Quote: >>The Yog exists in spite of pt. Roopchandji not mentioning it> in his book. (...) whether Pt. Roopchand ji talks about it or not in> the Lal Kitab.<<> > I can see from these lines that you actually agree with me that it was> none other than Pundit Roop Chand Joshi who wrote the great Lal Kitab.> Very good!> > Best regards,> Finn Wandahl > > > , "varun_trvd"> varun_trvd@ wrote:> >> > Respected Finn sahib,> > > > If Kal Sarp Yog is an astrological yog, as you have already > > accepted, then it doesnâ€™t matter whether Pt. Roopchand ji talks > > about it or not in the Lal Kitab. Once it is recognized as a valid > > astrological yog, the matter ends there.> > > > The Yog exists in spite of pt. Roopchandji not mentioning it in his > > book. No astrology yog depends on the acceptance or the denial of > > its existence by one particular scholar.> > > > That being so, it will be absolutely justified to look for the > > possible remedies of this dosh [ affliction] as Pt. Krishna Ashant > > ji has done in his book.> > > > With great regards,> > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Finn Wandahl" > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla,> > > > > > Yes, I agree with you that KSY is also a yoga that can be found in > > the> > > charts of the people. However, to in order to get the proper > > knowledge> > > about Kala Sarpa Yoga you need to look for it in the right places, > > not> > > in the wrong places.> > > > > > I have already told that no information about KSY can be found in > > any> > > of the classical texts. Like I said, KSY was mentioned for the > > first> > > time in the book "Naadi Joytisha" (3 vols) by the late hindu> > > astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao, with the pen-name "Meena". This is> > > where I suggest you to focus your attention in the first place. > > Only> > > this way you may get the right and truthful information about KSY.> > > > > > Like I said earlier, Pt. Gopala Krishna Raho had two disciples, > > one of> > > whom was the late Prof. K.S. Krishnamurthi, the founder of the> > > KP-school, I forgot the name of the other one, except that it was a> > > Brahmin name, a rather short one, but he is perhaps also worth > > looking> > > into. Therefore to find out more about KSY, you need to read > > carefully> > > all the five KP-readers and study the old issues of their > > astrological> > > magazine as well. There might be some information on KSY hitten > > somewhere.> > > > > > Now I have told you where to start, but I have no wish to serve the> > > information to you on a silver-plate. You need to do your own> > > research, if you really want to find out about this matter.> > > > > > This is how I got my knowledge, by deep study, careful research and> > > contemplating the results over a period of nearly 30 years. > > > > > > Best regards,> > > Finn Wandahl> > > > > > > > > , "lalkitabee"> > > <lalkitabee@> wrote:> > > >> > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl> > > > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be > > decided in a> > > > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in lalkitab > > without> > > > any name with some other definations, > > > > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz no > > other> > > > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are in > > Africa & > > > > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no > > contradiction> > > > about the use of the word "elephant". In the same way reading > > about > > > > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of the > > text, not> > > > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep dive > > into the> > > > sea. The "read-out" theory cant be assumed without "read-into"> > > > fundamentals.At other side - "about the fear of general peoples" > > is a > > > > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this category of> > > > fear-generator group. But it > > > > > > > > doesn't mean to stop read or learn about this or type of these > > yogas.> > > > Today u r saying not to support this Kaal Sarp Yog, after some > > days> > > > other will say -not to support VISHKANYA YOG etc. After all how a> > > > scholar can stop his readings or researches ? > > > > Electricity is hazardous , but the theory of> > > > electricity is not hazardous & reading of this theory can be > > helpful> > > > from safety-point of view from electricity. > > > > With Regards> > > > Pt.Lalkitabee> > > > V.Shukla> > > > www.lalkitabee.com > > > > , "Finn Wandahl"> > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear Mr. KP Miglani,> > > > > > > > > > There is absolutely NOTHING about Kala Sarpa Yoga in the great > > Lal> > > > > Kitab, no matter how much we twist or bend the text.> > > > > > > > > > Please always remember, we are supposed to read out of the > > text, not> > > > > into the text. After all, we are not the writers of the great > > Lal> > > > > Kitab, Pt. Roop Chand Joshi was.> > > > > > > > > > Best regards,> > > > > Finn Wandahl> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "kpmiglani"> > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Varun Ji,> > > > > > > > > > > > I agree with you. I was wondering if you have read the > > section on > > > > > > Rahu + Ketu in the 1952 edition on page 323 of Arun Sanhita. > > I do > > > > > > not have the Urdu edition because I can not read urdu. I do > > not> > > know > > > > > > why, but it sounds to me that the book is talking about the > > kalsarp > > > > > > yog in that context.> > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely,> > > > > > > > > > > > KP Miglani> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "varun_trvd" > > > > > > <varun_trvd@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Respected Miglani ji,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your point is well taken.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I accept that all planets hemmed by rahu and ketu and > > half the > > > > > > > horoscope going empty does give the horoscope a different > > look. > > > > > > What > > > > > > > I am against is the scare that has been caused by this; or > > > > > > treating > > > > > > > this placement as a curse.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, it has not been proved beyond doubt that > > whatever ills, > > > > > > if > > > > > > > at all, accrue are because of this placement. Till such > > time that > > > > > > > the ills in the horoscope get associated with this > > placement, I > > > > > > > would personally like to keep this in the grey area of > > research.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > In academic research all possibilities are examined and> > > evaluated. > > > > > > > Those not found tenable are left; they are not dumped. You > > never > > > > > > > know some body else comes up with a better explanation > > later> > > which > > > > > > > proves the existence of a Kal Sarp Yog.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can not dump Kal Sarp Yog simply because this placement > > did not > > > > > > > find a mention in the classics. In other fields of life > > there are > > > > > > > quite a few things which did not find a mention in old > > texts and > > > > > > are > > > > > > > a reality today. Therefore we can not dump a thing on the > > basis > > > > > > that > > > > > > > classics are silent about it. Similarly I will not accept > > it> > > to be > > > > > > a > > > > > > > reality till such time that it is proved beyond doubt that > > a Yog > > > > > > > like Kal Sarp Yog exists and these are the effects of it.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefore I do not dump the Kal Sarp Yog as a figment of > > > > > > > imagination, nor would give more credence then what it > > deserves. > > > > > > > When I said that I treat it a matter of grey area > > research, it > > > > > > means > > > > > > > that I accept its possible existence.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "kpmiglani" > > > > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Dear Finn and Varun,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I hope you agree that if all the planets are on one side > > of> > > Rahu-> > > > > > > > ketu axis and consequently half the horoscope stays > > empty, it > > > > > > > > presents an abnormal distribution of planets. This > > abnormality > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > not have gone unnoticed by the great astrology Savants, > > > > > > including > > > > > > > > Roopchandra ji. What name was given to this abnormality, > > or how > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > it understood, or what it was taken to mean could be a> > > matter of > > > > > > > > debate. Whatever name we assign to it, it definitely > > needs our > > > > > > > > attention. We can not ignore it and sweep it under the > > carpet.> > > > > > > > As you both seem to suggest that this so called Kal Sarp > > Yog> > > has > > > > > > > > been used by unscrupulous astrologers to intimidate > > gullible > > > > > > > seekers > > > > > > > > and used as a money spinner, then it becomes all the > > more > > > > > > > imperative > > > > > > > > on our part to bring out the truth such that it explains > > the > > > > > > > > phenomenon logically. By just saying that it does not > > exist is > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > wishing some thing away. The phenomenon of all the > > planets > > > > > > hemmed > > > > > > > > between rahu-ketu does exist, neither of you can deny. > > Give it > > > > > > > > whatever name you want, but a plausible well reasoned > > response > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > expected before dumping it into the waste paper basket.> > > > > > > > I am sorry if I have hurt any body's feelings, that has > > never > > > > > > been > > > > > > > > my intention.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > KP Miglani> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Finn > > Wandahl" > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee),> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please, I mean nothing personal by this. I agree with > > you> > > that > > > > > > > many> > > > > > > > > statements of Lal Kitab has a number of hidden meanings> > > hidden > > > > > > > > within> > > > > > > > > them. No doubt about that.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I think we should always be very careful that > > our > > > > > > great > > > > > > > > Lal> > > > > > > > > Kitab is not being misused to support something > > malefic like > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > general peoples fear, which I think is the case here.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my honest opinion this whole Kala Sarpa yoga thing> > > should be> > > > > > > > > considered to be within the evil circle of Mercury.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,> > > > > > > > > Finn> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > careful not to > > > > > > > > > > > , "lalkitabee"> > > > > > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl> > > > > > > > > > Yes u r absolutly right, Descriptions of planets are> > > usually > > > > > > > > based on> > > > > > > > > > religious cosmology but my explanations are based > > upon the > > > > > > > > predective & > > > > > > > > > > remedial astrology of lalkitab.This is a reading > > into the > > > > > > > > text ,to> > > > > > > > > > search out the vision about kalsarp yog in perview > > of > > > > > > > lalkitab.I > > > > > > > > tried> > > > > > > > > > to answer - does lalkitab includes kalsarp yog > > directly or > > > > > > > > indirectly?> > > > > > > > > > . & i found it indirect state in lalkitab.(Here i > > want to > > > > > > say --> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the word> > > > > > > > > > KAALSARP has been used as a real snake by some > > astrologers, > > > > > > In > > > > > > > > fact this> > > > > > > > > > word was used to explain a YOG, like gajkesri YOG, > > sunafaa > > > > > > > YOG, > > > > > > > > anafaa> > > > > > > > > > YOG, etc. .Here the 1st word KAAL = TIME used as > > KAAL= > > > > > > HORROR, > > > > > > > > DEATH ,by> > > > > > > > > > some half baked quacksalvers.otherwise there r so > > much > > > > > > > > horoscopes having> > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog with a cheerful life.)> > > > > > > > > > Symbolic imaginations are very useful to> > > understand to > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > stream> > > > > > > > > > of predective & remedial astrology while analyzing > > any > > > > > > > > horoscope.But my> > > > > > > > > > views focused only to the horoscope for the purpose > > of > > > > > > > > predective or> > > > > > > > > > remedial astrology . Im not trying to prove how are > > rahu > > > > > > ketu > > > > > > > > explained> > > > > > > > > > astronomically or in other style, bcoz whole > > lalkitab is > > > > > > based > > > > > > > on> > > > > > > > > > logical predective & logical remedial theory, no > > other > > > > > > system > > > > > > > i > > > > > > > > found> > > > > > > > > > like this. Otherwise Rahu ketu r accepted as shadow > > planets > > > > > > > > (CHHAYAA> > > > > > > > > > GRAH)also. I think u wil be agree with my point of > > > > > > view ,what > > > > > > > i > > > > > > > > want to> > > > > > > > > > say.We cant deny symbolic imaginations while reading > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > This is> > > > > > > > > > y- in very begining the author of this book Pt. > > roop Chand > > > > > > > > Joshi ji> > > > > > > > > > adviced this book to read as a noval.> > > > > > > > > > With Regards> > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee> > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla> > > > > > > > > > , "Finn > > Wandahl"> > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee),> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Descriptions of planets are usually based on > > religious > > > > > > > > cosmology, and> > > > > > > > > > > in many religious texts Rahu is pictured as a big > > snake > > > > > > > > swallowing the> > > > > > > > > > > Sun and causing eclipse to happen.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > It is a matter of fact, than in Varaha > > Mihira's "Brihat > > > > > > > > Samhita" (6th> > > > > > > > > > > century AD) the very word "Rahu" is used for > > eclipse and > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > word> > > > > > > > > > > "Ketu" is the word for comets and meteors, since > > comets > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > meteors> > > > > > > > > > > look like tails when observed in the sky.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > However there mere fact that Lal Kitab also > > describes> > > Rahu > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > Ketu> > > > > > > > > > > something like this, cannot be used to > > legitimate "Kala > > > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > > > Yoga" as> > > > > > > > > > > somehow being linked to Lal Kitab. No way! I think > > we > > > > > > should > > > > > > > > be honest> > > > > > > > > > > about this - at least to our own good selves.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > When dealing with the great Lal Kitab, I think we > > should > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > very> > > > > > > > > > > careful to read out of the text, not into the > > text. > > > > > > > Otherwise > > > > > > > > we may> > > > > > > > > > > end up with some serious misunderstandings. At > > least this > > > > > > > > happens to> > > > > > > > > > > be my own humble opinion.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,> > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > , "lalkitabee"> > > > > > > > > > > lalkitabee@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl & Members> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Your keen observations r absolutly right that> > > Nowhere any> > > > > > > > > > description> > > > > > > > > > > > with the name as "Kalsarp Yoga" in lalkitab. So > > we can > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > lalkitab> > > > > > > > > > does> > > > > > > > > > > > not consider Kalsarp yoga. But with humble words > > I want > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > share> > > > > > > > > > some> > > > > > > > > > > > own views in this perview..This article was > > written by > > > > > > me > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > past in> > > > > > > > > > > > other group.I think it will be helpfull to under > > stand > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > topic-> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > RESPECTED MEMBERS lalkitab accepts Rahu as the> > > > > > > > > > > > head of snake & ketu as the tail of snake & > > saturn is > > > > > > > > elaborated as> > > > > > > > > > > > snake in lalkitab.As example in the very > > begining of > > > > > > > > lalkitab says> > > > > > > > > > about> > > > > > > > > > > > rahu ketu--> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 1. EK NE INSAAN KO SIR SE PAKDAA HAI DOOSRE NE > > PAIR SE. > > > > > > TO > > > > > > > > KHUD BA> > > > > > > > > > > KHUD UNKO JAGAH MIL GAYEE (Means ;- Rahu will be > > treated > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > head & > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu as tail)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 2. About saturn - shani khana no 4 addressed as > > PANI KA > > > > > > > > SAANP, Shani> > > > > > > > > > > > khana no.5 as BACHCHEY KHANE WALAA SAANP, Shani > > khana > > > > > > no. > > > > > > > 6 > > > > > > > > as RAAT> > > > > > > > > > > KA ANDHAA SAANP.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > So much use of this word prooves that saturn is > > called > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > snake in> > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Now an opinion of mine is that Kalsarp means > > kal= > > > > > > > > time ,SAMAY Sarp -> > > > > > > > > > > > snake. As defination we can say that the cycle > > of time > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > which all> > > > > > > > > > > > planets come between Rahu & Ketu in any > > horoscope will > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > treated as> > > > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog. It is declared name in Jyotish.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > At other side when i saw in lalkitab-- i found > > some > > > > > > > > discriptions & > > > > > > > > > > > > definations as below> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 1.PEHLEY GHARON MAIN DUM KETU HOTE > > ICHCHHAADHAARI SHANI > > > > > > > > HOTAA HO> > > > > > > > > > > > ULAT MAGAR JAB TEVE BAITHA AZDAHAA KHOONI BANTAA > > HO > > > > > > (here > > > > > > > > ajdahaa is> > > > > > > > > > > > AJGAR SNAKE)SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY > > MUKHDAA > > > > > > > (Head)> > > > > > > > RAHU> > > > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA HO (Page no. 585 oroginal book 1952)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 2.SANICHCHAR KO AGAR SAANP MAANAA JAYE TO USKI > > DUM KETU > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE> > > > > > > > > > > > WALE GHAR MAIN HOGI AUR SIR USKAA RAHU BAITHAA > > HONE> > > WALE > > > > > > > > GHAR MAIN> > > > > > > > > > > GINAA JAYEGAA YA SANICHCHAR KA SIR RAHU HOGAA AUR > > > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > > > KI DUM> > > > > > > > > > > KETU HOGI> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > (PAGE NO. 588 at no. 5 in the chapter of AAM > > HAALAT)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Shani ka swabhav is specially counted by RAHU> > > KETU in > > > > > > > > lalkitab.> > > > > > > > > > As> > > > > > > > > > > > well as at page no. 590 ---MANDI HAALAT MAIN > > AMOOMAN > > > > > > > > SANICHCHAR> > > > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE WALE GHAR KE DONO TARAF HEE DAAYAIN > > (RIGHT) > > > > > > > > BAAYAIN> > > > > > > > > > > (LEFT) RAHU KETU BAITHAA HONE KE VAQT UNKAA BHEE > > MANDAA > > > > > > ASAR > > > > > > > > HOGAA.> > > > > > > > > > > > (after this a chart has been written at page 590> > > showing > > > > > > > BAD > > > > > > > > effects> > > > > > > > > > > > of SAANP (Shani)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 4.At page no. 623 I saw the defination about bad > > saturn > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > below> > > > > > > > > > > > HEADING:- SANICHCHAR KE MANDE ASAR KA RUKH > > KIDHAR HOGAA> > > > > > > > > > > > RAHU KO SIR AUR KETU KO DUM (tail) SAMAJHKAR EK > > SAANP > > > > > > KEE > > > > > > > > SHAKAL> > > > > > > > > > > (shape)BANAYAIN TO RAHU BAITHAA HONE WAALE GHAR SE > > AAGE > > > > > > > JAHAAN > > > > > > > > KAHIN> > > > > > > > > > > BHI YAANI JIS KHAANE MAIN REKHAA NIKAL KAR SEEDHEE > > HEE> > > JAA > > > > > > > > SAKTEE HO ,> > > > > > > > > > > US GHAR PAR SHANI KA ASAR PADEGAA (Here also > > pandit ji > > > > > > > assumed > > > > > > > > a> > > > > > > > > > > snake).Even this line has been said for saturn > > khana 8. > > > > > > But > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > other> > > > > > > > > > > context also saturn treated as snake & rahu called > > as> > > head > > > > > > & > > > > > > > > ketu as> > > > > > > > > > > tail. As said above> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > :--- SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA > > (Head)> > > > > > RAHU > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA> > > > > > > > > > HO.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > It means we can create a shape of snake in each > > > > > > horoscope.> > > > > > > > > > > > Here my only view is that lalkitab already > > persues Rahu > > > > > > > ketu > > > > > > > > as head> > > > > > > > > > > & tail of Saturn (Snake) & if a horoscope comes > > befor us > > > > > > > > including all> > > > > > > > > > > planets between Rahu & Ketu ,then as per > > lalkitab ,a > > > > > > picture > > > > > > > > appears> > > > > > > > > > > that all planets controlled at one side (left or> > > right) by > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > snake> > > > > > > > > > > (Saturn) placing his head rahu & tail Ketu. So > > even > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > > > does not> > > > > > > > > > > used the word KALSARP YOG directly.But above said > > > > > > situation > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > planets> > > > > > > > > > > gives us an image of Horoscope as Kal = Time or > > SAMAY & > > > > > > Sarp > > > > > > > = > > > > > > > > Snake> > > > > > > > > > > Yog,created in horoscope.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Yaani ki Samay ke ya vaqt ke mutabik sabhi> > > > > > > > > > > > grah saanp ke sir (head) aur dum (Tail) ko paar > > nahi> > > kar > > > > > > > > sake aur ek> > > > > > > > > > > > aisa yog ban baithaa jiskaa naam kalsarp yog ke > > alawaa > > > > > > aur > > > > > > > > kuchh> > > > > > > > > > bolnaa> > > > > > > > > > > > sateek nahee maaloom hotaa.Bhaley hee laalkitab > > main> > > ise > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > naam se> > > > > > > > > > > > naheen kahaa gayaa hai lekin rahu aur ketu ko to > > saanp> > > > > > > > (Saturn) ka> > > > > > > > > > sir> > > > > > > > > > > > aur dum kahaa gayaa hai.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > All this is my view as per understanding of > > quotes of > > > > > > > revered> > > > > > > > > > lalkitab.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > But knowledge & research has no limit.I m owed > > to all > > > > > > > learned> > > > > > > > > > > members & there views.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > With Regards> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee> > > > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Finn > > > > > > Wandahl"> > > > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi,> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Kala sarpa Yoga and its opposite, the so called> > > "Sweet > > > > > > > > Sarpa> > > > > > > > > > Yoga",> > > > > > > > > > > > > are by no means ancient. Both these Yogas were > > > > > > > introduced > > > > > > > > by the> > > > > > > > > > late> > > > > > > > > > > > > Hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao (Meena) in > > his > > > > > > > > book 'Naadi> > > > > > > > > > > > > Joytisha', written somewhere in the 1950-ties.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > However, Mr. Gopala Krishna Rao never > > mentioned > > > > > > anything > > > > > > > > about an> > > > > > > > > > > > > Upaya for this Yoga.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Kalasarpa Yoga is not being mentioned in any > > of the > > > > > > > > traditional> > > > > > > > > > > > > classics of Hindu astrology. It is also not > > being > > > > > > > mentioned> > > > > > > > > > anywhere> > > > > > > > > > > > > in our great Lal Kitab.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > I also like to mention that my good friend Mr. > > K.N. > > > > > > Rao > > > > > > > > from Delhi> > > > > > > > > > is> > > > > > > > > > > > > very critical about Kala Sarpa Yoga, since it > > has> > > been > > > > > > > > misused a> > > > > > > > > > lot> > > > > > > > > > > > > to scare the people, very much like the way > > Mangal-> > > > > > dosha > > > > > > > > and the> > > > > > > > > > > > > 7Â½-years of Saturn are being used to exploit > > people > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > time.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "varun_trvd"> > > > > > > > > > > > > varun_trvd@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Rakesh ji,> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Go to the files section of the following > > group.> > > Read > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > article> > > > > > > > > > on> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kal Sarp yog and its upaya. You will know > > about our > > > > > > > > views on it.> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > /> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "rakesh.behal"> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <rakesh.behal@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i request you all that please > > discuss > > > > > > KALSARP > > > > > > > > YOG what> > > > > > > > > > lal> > > > > > > > > > > > > > kitab> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > says about this and does it really affect a> > > person.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > waht upayas one can do to get rid of its > > adverse > > > > > > > > effects.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rakesh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>

August 22, 2008

Respected Kalsi ji,

Jaaki rahi bhawana jaisi... the rest is obvious.

Regards,

Varun Trivedi

, " Shivdev Kalsi "

<shivdev.kalsi wrote:

>

> Respected Trivedi Ji,

>

> I am learning too much from the discussion and to how to twist the

meanings

> of word.

>

> I feel you know what the Kanya means in Hindi. A lot of times the

word is

> used in LK. Kanya Poojan, Kanya seva, even in Durga ashtami all of

us do

> Kanya poojan.

>

> I dont think this word is used for woman.

>

> Regards

>

> On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 10:36 PM, varun_trvd <varun_trvd

wrote:

>

> > Respected Kalsi ji,

> >

> > If that is how you understand the word Vishkanya, then all I can

do

> > is to pity myself.

> >

> > Regards,

> >

> > Varun Trivedi

> >

> > <%

40>,

> > " Shivdev Kalsi "

> > <shivdev.kalsi@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Respected Trivedi Ji,

> > >

> > > Vishkanyas do not have husbands. I remember the story of " The

Wolf

> > and the

> > > Lamb " .

> > >

> > > In my opinion, here Lamb is contents of Lalkitab. Come what

may ,

> > all of KSY

> > > & VKY preachers started one or other pretext to force the war

to

> > justify

> > > these yogas with LK contents.

> > >

> > > I feel let the contents of Lalkitab be treated in right way

> > >

> > > Regards

> > >

> > > On 8/21/08, varun_trvd <varun_trvd@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Respected Kalsi ji,

> > > >

> > > > Lal Kitab has mentioned the *Vish Kanya yog* on page 1066 of

> > 1952 urdu ed

> > > > :

> > > >

> > > > Shatru shukra budh har do dekhen, milti baithak khwah alheda

ho

> > > > Surya ketu aa budh pe chamke, khasam khani voh aurat ho

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > >

> > > > Varun Trivedi

> > > >

> > > > --- In

<%

40>,

> > " Shivdev Kalsi "

> > > > <shivdev.kalsi@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Shukla Ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > In this case Elephant does not exist neither in Africa nor

in

> > Asia. I

> > > > mean

> > > > > there is no mention of this yoga in Hora Prashara the main

> > collection of

> > > > > astrological systems. There is no mention of this yoga in

> > Ashtakvarga,

> > > > nor

> > > > > there is any deduction of Bindus/rekhas on this position of

> > planets.

> > > > >

> > > > > In Jaimini I donot find any mention there in also in Horary

> > there is no

> > > > > mention of it.

> > > > >

> > > > > There is no harm to do research in any field. But it is

not a

> > right

> > > > practice

> > > > > to force unethical practices on innocent people in the

name of

> > holy

> > > > > shashtras.

> > > > >

> > > > > Almost all the practising astrologers create fear

psychosis in

> > the name

> > > > of

> > > > > KalaSarpa Yoga. this is not a good practice to grab money

from

> > poor

> > > > innocent

> > > > > people.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regarding Vishkanya and other yogas, One shall keep

himself to

> > the system

> > > > he

> > > > > is studying. these yogas should be discussed where the

shastras

> > > > containing

> > > > > these yogas are discussed and should not be intermingled

with

> > others.

> > > > >

> > > > > Every system has his own rules and regulations. If I want

to

> > justify

> > > > > allopathy with ayurvedic or homoeopathy formulation then

it is

> > not called

> > > > a

> > > > > good pratice. all these system have there own course of

> > remedies and

> > > > > diagonose.

> > > > >

> > > > > If ih this group Lalkitab is discussed then all should

discuss

> > lalkitab.

> > > > Not

> > > > > to insert other ideologies.

> > > > >

> > > > > Let us keep ourselves away from this human nature to

justify

> > our wrong

> > > > > doings in the name of research or something else.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards

> > > > >

> > > > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 7:24 AM, lalkitabee lalkitabee@

wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl

> > > > > > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be

> > decided in a

> > > > > > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in

> > lalkitab without

> > > > > > any name with some other definations,

> > > > > > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz

no

> > other

> > > > > > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are

in

> > Africa &

> > > > > > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no

> > contradiction

> > > > > > about the use of the word " elephant " . In the same way

> > reading about

> > > > > > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of

the

> > text, not

> > > > > > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep

dive

> > into the

> > > > > > sea. The " read-out " theory cant be assumed without " read-

> > into "

> > > > > > fundamentals.At other side - " about the fear of general

> > peoples " is a

> > > > > > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this

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