Guest guest Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Dear Mr. V. Shukla, Yes, I agree with you that KSY is also a yoga that can be found in the charts of the people. However, to in order to get the proper knowledge about Kala Sarpa Yoga you need to look for it in the right places, not in the wrong places. I have already told that no information about KSY can be found in any of the classical texts. Like I said, KSY was mentioned for the first time in the book " Naadi Joytisha " (3 vols) by the late hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao, with the pen-name " Meena " . This is where I suggest you to focus your attention in the first place. Only this way you may get the right and truthful information about KSY. Like I said earlier, Pt. Gopala Krishna Raho had two disciples, one of whom was the late Prof. K.S. Krishnamurthi, the founder of the KP-school, I forgot the name of the other one, except that it was a Brahmin name, a rather short one, but he is perhaps also worth looking into. Therefore to find out more about KSY, you need to read carefully all the five KP-readers and study the old issues of their astrological magazine as well. There might be some information on KSY hitten somewhere. Now I have told you where to start, but I have no wish to serve the information to you on a silver-plate. You need to do your own research, if you really want to find out about this matter. This is how I got my knowledge, by deep study, careful research and contemplating the results over a period of nearly 30 years. Best regards, Finn Wandahl , " lalkitabee " <lalkitabee wrote: > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be decided in a > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in lalkitab without > any name with some other definations, > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz no other > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are in Africa & > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no contradiction > about the use of the word " elephant " . In the same way reading about > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of the text, not > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep dive into the > sea. The " read-out " theory cant be assumed without " read-into " > fundamentals.At other side - " about the fear of general peoples " is a > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this category of > fear-generator group. But it > > doesn't mean to stop read or learn about this or type of these yogas. > Today u r saying not to support this Kaal Sarp Yog, after some days > other will say -not to support VISHKANYA YOG etc. After all how a > scholar can stop his readings or researches ? > Electricity is hazardous , but the theory of > electricity is not hazardous & reading of this theory can be helpful > from safety-point of view from electricity. > With Regards > Pt.Lalkitabee > V.Shukla > www.lalkitabee.com > , " Finn Wandahl " > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > Dear Mr. KP Miglani, > > > > There is absolutely NOTHING about Kala Sarpa Yoga in the great Lal > > Kitab, no matter how much we twist or bend the text. > > > > Please always remember, we are supposed to read out of the text, not > > into the text. After all, we are not the writers of the great Lal > > Kitab, Pt. Roop Chand Joshi was. > > > > Best regards, > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > , " kpmiglani " > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Varun Ji, > > > > > > I agree with you. I was wondering if you have read the section on > > > Rahu + Ketu in the 1952 edition on page 323 of Arun Sanhita. I do > > > not have the Urdu edition because I can not read urdu. I do not know > > > why, but it sounds to me that the book is talking about the kalsarp > > > yog in that context. > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " varun_trvd " > > > <varun_trvd@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Respected Miglani ji, > > > > > > > > Your point is well taken. > > > > > > > > I accept that all planets hemmed by rahu and ketu and half the > > > > horoscope going empty does give the horoscope a different look. > > > What > > > > I am against is the scare that has been caused by this; or > > > treating > > > > this placement as a curse. > > > > > > > > Secondly, it has not been proved beyond doubt that whatever ills, > > > if > > > > at all, accrue are because of this placement. Till such time that > > > > the ills in the horoscope get associated with this placement, I > > > > would personally like to keep this in the grey area of research. > > > > > > > > In academic research all possibilities are examined and evaluated. > > > > Those not found tenable are left; they are not dumped. You never > > > > know some body else comes up with a better explanation later which > > > > proves the existence of a Kal Sarp Yog. > > > > > > > > I can not dump Kal Sarp Yog simply because this placement did not > > > > find a mention in the classics. In other fields of life there are > > > > quite a few things which did not find a mention in old texts and > > > are > > > > a reality today. Therefore we can not dump a thing on the basis > > > that > > > > classics are silent about it. Similarly I will not accept it to be > > > a > > > > reality till such time that it is proved beyond doubt that a Yog > > > > like Kal Sarp Yog exists and these are the effects of it. > > > > > > > > Therefore I do not dump the Kal Sarp Yog as a figment of > > > > imagination, nor would give more credence then what it deserves. > > > > When I said that I treat it a matter of grey area research, it > > > means > > > > that I accept its possible existence. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " kpmiglani " > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Finn and Varun, > > > > > > > > > > I hope you agree that if all the planets are on one side of Rahu- > > > > > ketu axis and consequently half the horoscope stays empty, it > > > > > presents an abnormal distribution of planets. This abnormality > > > > could > > > > > not have gone unnoticed by the great astrology Savants, > > > including > > > > > Roopchandra ji. What name was given to this abnormality, or how > > > > was > > > > > it understood, or what it was taken to mean could be a matter of > > > > > debate. Whatever name we assign to it, it definitely needs our > > > > > attention. We can not ignore it and sweep it under the carpet. > > > > > As you both seem to suggest that this so called Kal Sarp Yog has > > > > > been used by unscrupulous astrologers to intimidate gullible > > > > seekers > > > > > and used as a money spinner, then it becomes all the more > > > > imperative > > > > > on our part to bring out the truth such that it explains the > > > > > phenomenon logically. By just saying that it does not exist is > > > > like > > > > > wishing some thing away. The phenomenon of all the planets > > > hemmed > > > > > between rahu-ketu does exist, neither of you can deny. Give it > > > > > whatever name you want, but a plausible well reasoned response > > > is > > > > > expected before dumping it into the waste paper basket. > > > > > I am sorry if I have hurt any body's feelings, that has never > > > been > > > > > my intention. > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > Please, I mean nothing personal by this. I agree with you that > > > > many > > > > > > statements of Lal Kitab has a number of hidden meanings hidden > > > > > within > > > > > > them. No doubt about that. > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I think we should always be very careful that our > > > great > > > > > Lal > > > > > > Kitab is not being misused to support something malefic like > > > the > > > > > > general peoples fear, which I think is the case here. > > > > > > > > > > > > In my honest opinion this whole Kala Sarpa yoga thing should be > > > > > > considered to be within the evil circle of Mercury. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > Finn > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > careful not to > > > > > > , " lalkitabee " > > > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > > > > > > Yes u r absolutly right, Descriptions of planets are usually > > > > > based on > > > > > > > religious cosmology but my explanations are based upon the > > > > > predective & > > > > > > > remedial astrology of lalkitab.This is a reading into the > > > > > text ,to > > > > > > > search out the vision about kalsarp yog in perview of > > > > lalkitab.I > > > > > tried > > > > > > > to answer - does lalkitab includes kalsarp yog directly or > > > > > indirectly? > > > > > > > . & i found it indirect state in lalkitab.(Here i want to > > > say -- > > > > > > > > > the word > > > > > > > KAALSARP has been used as a real snake by some astrologers, > > > In > > > > > fact this > > > > > > > word was used to explain a YOG, like gajkesri YOG, sunafaa > > > > YOG, > > > > > anafaa > > > > > > > YOG, etc. .Here the 1st word KAAL = TIME used as KAAL= > > > HORROR, > > > > > DEATH ,by > > > > > > > some half baked quacksalvers.otherwise there r so much > > > > > horoscopes having > > > > > > > kalsarp yog with a cheerful life.) > > > > > > > Symbolic imaginations are very useful to understand to > > > > any > > > > > stream > > > > > > > of predective & remedial astrology while analyzing any > > > > > horoscope.But my > > > > > > > views focused only to the horoscope for the purpose of > > > > > predective or > > > > > > > remedial astrology . Im not trying to prove how are rahu > > > ketu > > > > > explained > > > > > > > astronomically or in other style, bcoz whole lalkitab is > > > based > > > > on > > > > > > > logical predective & logical remedial theory, no other > > > system > > > > i > > > > > found > > > > > > > like this. Otherwise Rahu ketu r accepted as shadow planets > > > > > (CHHAYAA > > > > > > > GRAH)also. I think u wil be agree with my point of > > > view ,what > > > > i > > > > > want to > > > > > > > say.We cant deny symbolic imaginations while reading > > > lalkitab. > > > > > This is > > > > > > > y- in very begining the author of this book Pt. roop Chand > > > > > Joshi ji > > > > > > > adviced this book to read as a noval. > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Descriptions of planets are usually based on religious > > > > > cosmology, and > > > > > > > > in many religious texts Rahu is pictured as a big snake > > > > > swallowing the > > > > > > > > Sun and causing eclipse to happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is a matter of fact, than in Varaha Mihira's " Brihat > > > > > Samhita " (6th > > > > > > > > century AD) the very word " Rahu " is used for eclipse and > > > the > > > > > word > > > > > > > > " Ketu " is the word for comets and meteors, since comets > > > and > > > > > meteors > > > > > > > > look like tails when observed in the sky. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However there mere fact that Lal Kitab also describes Rahu > > > > and > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > something like this, cannot be used to legitimate " Kala > > > > Sarpa > > > > > Yoga " as > > > > > > > > somehow being linked to Lal Kitab. No way! I think we > > > should > > > > > be honest > > > > > > > > about this - at least to our own good selves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When dealing with the great Lal Kitab, I think we should > > > be > > > > > very > > > > > > > > careful to read out of the text, not into the text. > > > > Otherwise > > > > > we may > > > > > > > > end up with some serious misunderstandings. At least this > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > be my own humble opinion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > > lalkitabee@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl & Members > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your keen observations r absolutly right that Nowhere any > > > > > > > description > > > > > > > > > with the name as " Kalsarp Yoga " in lalkitab. So we can > > > say > > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > > does > > > > > > > > > not consider Kalsarp yoga. But with humble words I want > > > to > > > > > share > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > own views in this perview..This article was written by > > > me > > > > in > > > > > past in > > > > > > > > > other group.I think it will be helpfull to under stand > > > the > > > > > topic- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RESPECTED MEMBERS lalkitab accepts Rahu as the > > > > > > > > > head of snake & ketu as the tail of snake & saturn is > > > > > elaborated as > > > > > > > > > snake in lalkitab.As example in the very begining of > > > > > lalkitab says > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > rahu ketu-- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. EK NE INSAAN KO SIR SE PAKDAA HAI DOOSRE NE PAIR SE. > > > TO > > > > > KHUD BA > > > > > > > > KHUD UNKO JAGAH MIL GAYEE (Means ;- Rahu will be treated > > > as > > > > > head & > > > > > > > > Ketu as tail) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. About saturn - shani khana no 4 addressed as PANI KA > > > > > SAANP, Shani > > > > > > > > > khana no.5 as BACHCHEY KHANE WALAA SAANP, Shani khana > > > no. > > > > 6 > > > > > as RAAT > > > > > > > > KA ANDHAA SAANP. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So much use of this word prooves that saturn is called > > > as > > > > > snake in > > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now an opinion of mine is that Kalsarp means kal= > > > > > time ,SAMAY Sarp - > > > > > > > > > snake. As defination we can say that the cycle of time > > > in > > > > > which all > > > > > > > > > planets come between Rahu & Ketu in any horoscope will > > > be > > > > > treated as > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog. It is declared name in Jyotish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At other side when i saw in lalkitab-- i found some > > > > > discriptions & > > > > > > > > > definations as below > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.PEHLEY GHARON MAIN DUM KETU HOTE ICHCHHAADHAARI SHANI > > > > > HOTAA HO > > > > > > > > > ULAT MAGAR JAB TEVE BAITHA AZDAHAA KHOONI BANTAA HO > > > (here > > > > > ajdahaa is > > > > > > > > > AJGAR SNAKE)SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA > > > > (Head) > > > > > RAHU > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA HO (Page no. 585 oroginal book 1952) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2.SANICHCHAR KO AGAR SAANP MAANAA JAYE TO USKI DUM KETU > > > > > BAITHAA HONE > > > > > > > > > WALE GHAR MAIN HOGI AUR SIR USKAA RAHU BAITHAA HONE WALE > > > > > GHAR MAIN > > > > > > > > GINAA JAYEGAA YA SANICHCHAR KA SIR RAHU HOGAA AUR > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > KI DUM > > > > > > > > KETU HOGI > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (PAGE NO. 588 at no. 5 in the chapter of AAM HAALAT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Shani ka swabhav is specially counted by RAHU KETU in > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > As > > > > > > > > > well as at page no. 590 ---MANDI HAALAT MAIN AMOOMAN > > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE WALE GHAR KE DONO TARAF HEE DAAYAIN (RIGHT) > > > > > BAAYAIN > > > > > > > > (LEFT) RAHU KETU BAITHAA HONE KE VAQT UNKAA BHEE MANDAA > > > ASAR > > > > > HOGAA. > > > > > > > > > (after this a chart has been written at page 590 showing > > > > BAD > > > > > effects > > > > > > > > > of SAANP (Shani) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4.At page no. 623 I saw the defination about bad saturn > > > as > > > > > below > > > > > > > > > HEADING:- SANICHCHAR KE MANDE ASAR KA RUKH KIDHAR HOGAA > > > > > > > > > RAHU KO SIR AUR KETU KO DUM (tail) SAMAJHKAR EK SAANP > > > KEE > > > > > SHAKAL > > > > > > > > (shape)BANAYAIN TO RAHU BAITHAA HONE WAALE GHAR SE AAGE > > > > JAHAAN > > > > > KAHIN > > > > > > > > BHI YAANI JIS KHAANE MAIN REKHAA NIKAL KAR SEEDHEE HEE JAA > > > > > SAKTEE HO , > > > > > > > > US GHAR PAR SHANI KA ASAR PADEGAA (Here also pandit ji > > > > assumed > > > > > a > > > > > > > > snake).Even this line has been said for saturn khana 8. > > > But > > > > in > > > > > other > > > > > > > > context also saturn treated as snake & rahu called as head > > > & > > > > > ketu as > > > > > > > > tail. As said above > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :--- SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA (Head) > > > RAHU > > > > > KHUD HOTAA > > > > > > > HO. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It means we can create a shape of snake in each > > > horoscope. > > > > > > > > > Here my only view is that lalkitab already persues Rahu > > > > ketu > > > > > as head > > > > > > > > & tail of Saturn (Snake) & if a horoscope comes befor us > > > > > including all > > > > > > > > planets between Rahu & Ketu ,then as per lalkitab ,a > > > picture > > > > > appears > > > > > > > > that all planets controlled at one side (left or right) by > > > > the > > > > > snake > > > > > > > > (Saturn) placing his head rahu & tail Ketu. So even > > > lalkitab > > > > > does not > > > > > > > > used the word KALSARP YOG directly.But above said > > > situation > > > > of > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > gives us an image of Horoscope as Kal = Time or SAMAY & > > > Sarp > > > > = > > > > > Snake > > > > > > > > Yog,created in horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yaani ki Samay ke ya vaqt ke mutabik sabhi > > > > > > > > > grah saanp ke sir (head) aur dum (Tail) ko paar nahi kar > > > > > sake aur ek > > > > > > > > > aisa yog ban baithaa jiskaa naam kalsarp yog ke alawaa > > > aur > > > > > kuchh > > > > > > > bolnaa > > > > > > > > > sateek nahee maaloom hotaa.Bhaley hee laalkitab main ise > > > > is > > > > > naam se > > > > > > > > > naheen kahaa gayaa hai lekin rahu aur ketu ko to saanp > > > > > (Saturn) ka > > > > > > > sir > > > > > > > > > aur dum kahaa gayaa hai. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All this is my view as per understanding of quotes of > > > > revered > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But knowledge & research has no limit.I m owed to all > > > > learned > > > > > > > > members & there views. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Finn > > > Wandahl " > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kala sarpa Yoga and its opposite, the so called " Sweet > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > > Yoga " , > > > > > > > > > > are by no means ancient. Both these Yogas were > > > > introduced > > > > > by the > > > > > > > late > > > > > > > > > > Hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao (Meena) in his > > > > > book 'Naadi > > > > > > > > > > Joytisha', written somewhere in the 1950-ties. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, Mr. Gopala Krishna Rao never mentioned > > > anything > > > > > about an > > > > > > > > > > Upaya for this Yoga. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kalasarpa Yoga is not being mentioned in any of the > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > > classics of Hindu astrology. It is also not being > > > > mentioned > > > > > > > anywhere > > > > > > > > > > in our great Lal Kitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I also like to mention that my good friend Mr. K.N. > > > Rao > > > > > from Delhi > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > very critical about Kala Sarpa Yoga, since it has been > > > > > misused a > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > to scare the people, very much like the way Mangal- > > > dosha > > > > > and the > > > > > > > > > > 7½-years of Saturn are being used to exploit people > > > all > > > > > the > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > , " varun_trvd " > > > > > > > > > > varun_trvd@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Rakesh ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Go to the files section of the following group. Read > > > > the > > > > > article > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > Kal Sarp yog and its upaya. You will know about our > > > > > views on it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > , " rakesh.behal " > > > > > > > > > > > <rakesh.behal@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > i request you all that please discuss > > > KALSARP > > > > > YOG what > > > > > > > lal > > > > > > > > > > > kitab > > > > > > > > > > > > says about this and does it really affect a person. > > > > > > > > > > > > waht upayas one can do to get rid of its adverse > > > > > effects. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > rakesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Dear Mr. Shivdev Kalsi, Well spoken ! Best regards, Finn Wandahl , " Shivdev Kalsi " <shivdev.kalsi wrote: > > Dear Shukla Ji, > > In this case Elephant does not exist neither in Africa nor in Asia. I mean > there is no mention of this yoga in Hora Prashara the main collection of > astrological systems. There is no mention of this yoga in Ashtakvarga, nor > there is any deduction of Bindus/rekhas on this position of planets. > > In Jaimini I donot find any mention there in also in Horary there is no > mention of it. > > There is no harm to do research in any field. But it is not a right practice > to force unethical practices on innocent people in the name of holy > shashtras. > > Almost all the practising astrologers create fear psychosis in the name of > KalaSarpa Yoga. this is not a good practice to grab money from poor innocent > people. > > Regarding Vishkanya and other yogas, One shall keep himself to the system he > is studying. these yogas should be discussed where the shastras containing > these yogas are discussed and should not be intermingled with others. > > Every system has his own rules and regulations. If I want to justify > allopathy with ayurvedic or homoeopathy formulation then it is not called a > good pratice. all these system have there own course of remedies and > diagonose. > > If ih this group Lalkitab is discussed then all should discuss lalkitab. Not > to insert other ideologies. > > Let us keep ourselves away from this human nature to justify our wrong > doings in the name of research or something else. > > Regards > > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 7:24 AM, lalkitabee <lalkitabee wrote: > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be decided in a > > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in lalkitab without > > any name with some other definations, > > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz no other > > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are in Africa & > > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no contradiction > > about the use of the word " elephant " . In the same way reading about > > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of the text, not > > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep dive into the > > sea. The " read-out " theory cant be assumed without " read-into " > > fundamentals.At other side - " about the fear of general peoples " is a > > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this category of > > fear-generator group. But it > > > > doesn't mean to stop read or learn about this or type of these yogas. > > Today u r saying not to support this Kaal Sarp Yog, after some days > > other will say -not to support VISHKANYA YOG etc. After all how a > > scholar can stop his readings or researches ? > > Electricity is hazardous , but the theory of > > electricity is not hazardous & reading of this theory can be helpful > > from safety-point of view from electricity. > > With Regards > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > V.Shukla > > www.lalkitabee.com > > --- In <%40>, > > " Finn Wandahl " > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Mr. KP Miglani, > > > > > > There is absolutely NOTHING about Kala Sarpa Yoga in the great Lal > > > Kitab, no matter how much we twist or bend the text. > > > > > > Please always remember, we are supposed to read out of the text, not > > > into the text. After all, we are not the writers of the great Lal > > > Kitab, Pt. Roop Chand Joshi was. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " kpmiglani " > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Varun Ji, > > > > > > > > I agree with you. I was wondering if you have read the section on > > > > Rahu + Ketu in the 1952 edition on page 323 of Arun Sanhita. I do > > > > not have the Urdu edition because I can not read urdu. I do not know > > > > why, but it sounds to me that the book is talking about the kalsarp > > > > yog in that context. > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " varun_trvd " > > > > <varun_trvd@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Respected Miglani ji, > > > > > > > > > > Your point is well taken. > > > > > > > > > > I accept that all planets hemmed by rahu and ketu and half the > > > > > horoscope going empty does give the horoscope a different look. > > > > What > > > > > I am against is the scare that has been caused by this; or > > > > treating > > > > > this placement as a curse. > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, it has not been proved beyond doubt that whatever ills, > > > > if > > > > > at all, accrue are because of this placement. Till such time that > > > > > the ills in the horoscope get associated with this placement, I > > > > > would personally like to keep this in the grey area of research. > > > > > > > > > > In academic research all possibilities are examined and evaluated. > > > > > Those not found tenable are left; they are not dumped. You never > > > > > know some body else comes up with a better explanation later which > > > > > proves the existence of a Kal Sarp Yog. > > > > > > > > > > I can not dump Kal Sarp Yog simply because this placement did not > > > > > find a mention in the classics. In other fields of life there are > > > > > quite a few things which did not find a mention in old texts and > > > > are > > > > > a reality today. Therefore we can not dump a thing on the basis > > > > that > > > > > classics are silent about it. Similarly I will not accept it to be > > > > a > > > > > reality till such time that it is proved beyond doubt that a Yog > > > > > like Kal Sarp Yog exists and these are the effects of it. > > > > > > > > > > Therefore I do not dump the Kal Sarp Yog as a figment of > > > > > imagination, nor would give more credence then what it deserves. > > > > > When I said that I treat it a matter of grey area research, it > > > > means > > > > > that I accept its possible existence. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " kpmiglani " > > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Finn and Varun, > > > > > > > > > > > > I hope you agree that if all the planets are on one side of Rahu- > > > > > > ketu axis and consequently half the horoscope stays empty, it > > > > > > presents an abnormal distribution of planets. This abnormality > > > > > could > > > > > > not have gone unnoticed by the great astrology Savants, > > > > including > > > > > > Roopchandra ji. What name was given to this abnormality, or how > > > > > was > > > > > > it understood, or what it was taken to mean could be a matter of > > > > > > debate. Whatever name we assign to it, it definitely needs our > > > > > > attention. We can not ignore it and sweep it under the carpet. > > > > > > As you both seem to suggest that this so called Kal Sarp Yog has > > > > > > been used by unscrupulous astrologers to intimidate gullible > > > > > seekers > > > > > > and used as a money spinner, then it becomes all the more > > > > > imperative > > > > > > on our part to bring out the truth such that it explains the > > > > > > phenomenon logically. By just saying that it does not exist is > > > > > like > > > > > > wishing some thing away. The phenomenon of all the planets > > > > hemmed > > > > > > between rahu-ketu does exist, neither of you can deny. Give it > > > > > > whatever name you want, but a plausible well reasoned response > > > > is > > > > > > expected before dumping it into the waste paper basket. > > > > > > I am sorry if I have hurt any body's feelings, that has never > > > > been > > > > > > my intention. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please, I mean nothing personal by this. I agree with you that > > > > > many > > > > > > > statements of Lal Kitab has a number of hidden meanings hidden > > > > > > within > > > > > > > them. No doubt about that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I think we should always be very careful that our > > > > great > > > > > > Lal > > > > > > > Kitab is not being misused to support something malefic like > > > > the > > > > > > > general peoples fear, which I think is the case here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my honest opinion this whole Kala Sarpa yoga thing should be > > > > > > > considered to be within the evil circle of Mercury. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > Finn > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > careful not to > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > > > > > > > Yes u r absolutly right, Descriptions of planets are usually > > > > > > based on > > > > > > > > religious cosmology but my explanations are based upon the > > > > > > predective & > > > > > > > > remedial astrology of lalkitab.This is a reading into the > > > > > > text ,to > > > > > > > > search out the vision about kalsarp yog in perview of > > > > > lalkitab.I > > > > > > tried > > > > > > > > to answer - does lalkitab includes kalsarp yog directly or > > > > > > indirectly? > > > > > > > > . & i found it indirect state in lalkitab.(Here i want to > > > > say -- > > > > > > > > > > > the word > > > > > > > > KAALSARP has been used as a real snake by some astrologers, > > > > In > > > > > > fact this > > > > > > > > word was used to explain a YOG, like gajkesri YOG, sunafaa > > > > > YOG, > > > > > > anafaa > > > > > > > > YOG, etc. .Here the 1st word KAAL = TIME used as KAAL= > > > > HORROR, > > > > > > DEATH ,by > > > > > > > > some half baked quacksalvers.otherwise there r so much > > > > > > horoscopes having > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog with a cheerful life.) > > > > > > > > Symbolic imaginations are very useful to understand to > > > > > any > > > > > > stream > > > > > > > > of predective & remedial astrology while analyzing any > > > > > > horoscope.But my > > > > > > > > views focused only to the horoscope for the purpose of > > > > > > predective or > > > > > > > > remedial astrology . Im not trying to prove how are rahu > > > > ketu > > > > > > explained > > > > > > > > astronomically or in other style, bcoz whole lalkitab is > > > > based > > > > > on > > > > > > > > logical predective & logical remedial theory, no other > > > > system > > > > > i > > > > > > found > > > > > > > > like this. Otherwise Rahu ketu r accepted as shadow planets > > > > > > (CHHAYAA > > > > > > > > GRAH)also. I think u wil be agree with my point of > > > > view ,what > > > > > i > > > > > > want to > > > > > > > > say.We cant deny symbolic imaginations while reading > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > This is > > > > > > > > y- in very begining the author of this book Pt. roop Chand > > > > > > Joshi ji > > > > > > > > adviced this book to read as a noval. > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Descriptions of planets are usually based on religious > > > > > > cosmology, and > > > > > > > > > in many religious texts Rahu is pictured as a big snake > > > > > > swallowing the > > > > > > > > > Sun and causing eclipse to happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is a matter of fact, than in Varaha Mihira's " Brihat > > > > > > Samhita " (6th > > > > > > > > > century AD) the very word " Rahu " is used for eclipse and > > > > the > > > > > > word > > > > > > > > > " Ketu " is the word for comets and meteors, since comets > > > > and > > > > > > meteors > > > > > > > > > look like tails when observed in the sky. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However there mere fact that Lal Kitab also describes Rahu > > > > > and > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > > something like this, cannot be used to legitimate " Kala > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > Yoga " as > > > > > > > > > somehow being linked to Lal Kitab. No way! I think we > > > > should > > > > > > be honest > > > > > > > > > about this - at least to our own good selves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When dealing with the great Lal Kitab, I think we should > > > > be > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > careful to read out of the text, not into the text. > > > > > Otherwise > > > > > > we may > > > > > > > > > end up with some serious misunderstandings. At least this > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > > be my own humble opinion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > > > lalkitabee@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl & Members > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your keen observations r absolutly right that Nowhere any > > > > > > > > description > > > > > > > > > > with the name as " Kalsarp Yoga " in lalkitab. So we can > > > > say > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > > > does > > > > > > > > > > not consider Kalsarp yoga. But with humble words I want > > > > to > > > > > > share > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > own views in this perview..This article was written by > > > > me > > > > > in > > > > > > past in > > > > > > > > > > other group.I think it will be helpfull to under stand > > > > the > > > > > > topic- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RESPECTED MEMBERS lalkitab accepts Rahu as the > > > > > > > > > > head of snake & ketu as the tail of snake & saturn is > > > > > > elaborated as > > > > > > > > > > snake in lalkitab.As example in the very begining of > > > > > > lalkitab says > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > rahu ketu-- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. EK NE INSAAN KO SIR SE PAKDAA HAI DOOSRE NE PAIR SE. > > > > TO > > > > > > KHUD BA > > > > > > > > > KHUD UNKO JAGAH MIL GAYEE (Means ;- Rahu will be treated > > > > as > > > > > > head & > > > > > > > > > Ketu as tail) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. About saturn - shani khana no 4 addressed as PANI KA > > > > > > SAANP, Shani > > > > > > > > > > khana no.5 as BACHCHEY KHANE WALAA SAANP, Shani khana > > > > no. > > > > > 6 > > > > > > as RAAT > > > > > > > > > KA ANDHAA SAANP. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So much use of this word prooves that saturn is called > > > > as > > > > > > snake in > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now an opinion of mine is that Kalsarp means kal= > > > > > > time ,SAMAY Sarp - > > > > > > > > > > snake. As defination we can say that the cycle of time > > > > in > > > > > > which all > > > > > > > > > > planets come between Rahu & Ketu in any horoscope will > > > > be > > > > > > treated as > > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog. It is declared name in Jyotish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At other side when i saw in lalkitab-- i found some > > > > > > discriptions & > > > > > > > > > > definations as below > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.PEHLEY GHARON MAIN DUM KETU HOTE ICHCHHAADHAARI SHANI > > > > > > HOTAA HO > > > > > > > > > > ULAT MAGAR JAB TEVE BAITHA AZDAHAA KHOONI BANTAA HO > > > > (here > > > > > > ajdahaa is > > > > > > > > > > AJGAR SNAKE)SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA > > > > > (Head) > > > > > > RAHU > > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA HO (Page no. 585 oroginal book 1952) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2.SANICHCHAR KO AGAR SAANP MAANAA JAYE TO USKI DUM KETU > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE > > > > > > > > > > WALE GHAR MAIN HOGI AUR SIR USKAA RAHU BAITHAA HONE WALE > > > > > > GHAR MAIN > > > > > > > > > GINAA JAYEGAA YA SANICHCHAR KA SIR RAHU HOGAA AUR > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > KI DUM > > > > > > > > > KETU HOGI > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (PAGE NO. 588 at no. 5 in the chapter of AAM HAALAT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Shani ka swabhav is specially counted by RAHU KETU in > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > As > > > > > > > > > > well as at page no. 590 ---MANDI HAALAT MAIN AMOOMAN > > > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE WALE GHAR KE DONO TARAF HEE DAAYAIN (RIGHT) > > > > > > BAAYAIN > > > > > > > > > (LEFT) RAHU KETU BAITHAA HONE KE VAQT UNKAA BHEE MANDAA > > > > ASAR > > > > > > HOGAA. > > > > > > > > > > (after this a chart has been written at page 590 showing > > > > > BAD > > > > > > effects > > > > > > > > > > of SAANP (Shani) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4.At page no. 623 I saw the defination about bad saturn > > > > as > > > > > > below > > > > > > > > > > HEADING:- SANICHCHAR KE MANDE ASAR KA RUKH KIDHAR HOGAA > > > > > > > > > > RAHU KO SIR AUR KETU KO DUM (tail) SAMAJHKAR EK SAANP > > > > KEE > > > > > > SHAKAL > > > > > > > > > (shape)BANAYAIN TO RAHU BAITHAA HONE WAALE GHAR SE AAGE > > > > > JAHAAN > > > > > > KAHIN > > > > > > > > > BHI YAANI JIS KHAANE MAIN REKHAA NIKAL KAR SEEDHEE HEE JAA > > > > > > SAKTEE HO , > > > > > > > > > US GHAR PAR SHANI KA ASAR PADEGAA (Here also pandit ji > > > > > assumed > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > snake).Even this line has been said for saturn khana 8. > > > > But > > > > > in > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > context also saturn treated as snake & rahu called as head > > > > & > > > > > > ketu as > > > > > > > > > tail. As said above > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :--- SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA (Head) > > > > RAHU > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA > > > > > > > > HO. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It means we can create a shape of snake in each > > > > horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > Here my only view is that lalkitab already persues Rahu > > > > > ketu > > > > > > as head > > > > > > > > > & tail of Saturn (Snake) & if a horoscope comes befor us > > > > > > including all > > > > > > > > > planets between Rahu & Ketu ,then as per lalkitab ,a > > > > picture > > > > > > appears > > > > > > > > > that all planets controlled at one side (left or right) by > > > > > the > > > > > > snake > > > > > > > > > (Saturn) placing his head rahu & tail Ketu. So even > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > does not > > > > > > > > > used the word KALSARP YOG directly.But above said > > > > situation > > > > > of > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > gives us an image of Horoscope as Kal = Time or SAMAY & > > > > Sarp > > > > > = > > > > > > Snake > > > > > > > > > Yog,created in horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yaani ki Samay ke ya vaqt ke mutabik sabhi > > > > > > > > > > grah saanp ke sir (head) aur dum (Tail) ko paar nahi kar > > > > > > sake aur ek > > > > > > > > > > aisa yog ban baithaa jiskaa naam kalsarp yog ke alawaa > > > > aur > > > > > > kuchh > > > > > > > > bolnaa > > > > > > > > > > sateek nahee maaloom hotaa.Bhaley hee laalkitab main ise > > > > > is > > > > > > naam se > > > > > > > > > > naheen kahaa gayaa hai lekin rahu aur ketu ko to saanp > > > > > > (Saturn) ka > > > > > > > > sir > > > > > > > > > > aur dum kahaa gayaa hai. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All this is my view as per understanding of quotes of > > > > > revered > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But knowledge & research has no limit.I m owed to all > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > members & there views. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " Finn > > > > Wandahl " > > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kala sarpa Yoga and its opposite, the so called " Sweet > > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > > > Yoga " , > > > > > > > > > > > are by no means ancient. Both these Yogas were > > > > > introduced > > > > > > by the > > > > > > > > late > > > > > > > > > > > Hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao (Meena) in his > > > > > > book 'Naadi > > > > > > > > > > > Joytisha', written somewhere in the 1950-ties. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, Mr. Gopala Krishna Rao never mentioned > > > > anything > > > > > > about an > > > > > > > > > > > Upaya for this Yoga. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kalasarpa Yoga is not being mentioned in any of the > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > > > classics of Hindu astrology. It is also not being > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > > > anywhere > > > > > > > > > > > in our great Lal Kitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I also like to mention that my good friend Mr. K.N. > > > > Rao > > > > > > from Delhi > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > very critical about Kala Sarpa Yoga, since it has been > > > > > > misused a > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > to scare the people, very much like the way Mangal- > > > > dosha > > > > > > and the > > > > > > > > > > > 7½-years of Saturn are being used to exploit people > > > > all > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > <%40>, > > " varun_trvd " > > > > > > > > > > > varun_trvd@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Rakesh ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Go to the files section of the following group. Read > > > > > the > > > > > > article > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > Kal Sarp yog and its upaya. You will know about our > > > > > > views on it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > <%40>, > > " rakesh.behal " > > > > > > > > > > > > <rakesh.behal@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > i request you all that please discuss > > > > KALSARP > > > > > > YOG what > > > > > > > > lal > > > > > > > > > > > > kitab > > > > > > > > > > > > > says about this and does it really affect a person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > waht upayas one can do to get rid of its adverse > > > > > > effects. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > rakesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Dr. Shiv Dev Kalsi, > Jyotish Rishi (AIFAS) > Consultant (Vedic Astrology) > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Respected Finn sahib, If Kal Sarp Yog is an astrological yog, as you have already accepted, then it doesn’t matter whether Pt. Roopchand ji talks about it or not in the Lal Kitab. Once it is recognized as a valid astrological yog, the matter ends there. The Yog exists in spite of pt. Roopchandji not mentioning it in his book. No astrology yog depends on the acceptance or the denial of its existence by one particular scholar. That being so, it will be absolutely justified to look for the possible remedies of this dosh [ affliction] as Pt. Krishna Ashant ji has done in his book. With great regards, Varun Trivedi , " Finn Wandahl " <finn.wandahl wrote: > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla, > > Yes, I agree with you that KSY is also a yoga that can be found in the > charts of the people. However, to in order to get the proper knowledge > about Kala Sarpa Yoga you need to look for it in the right places, not > in the wrong places. > > I have already told that no information about KSY can be found in any > of the classical texts. Like I said, KSY was mentioned for the first > time in the book " Naadi Joytisha " (3 vols) by the late hindu > astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao, with the pen-name " Meena " . This is > where I suggest you to focus your attention in the first place. Only > this way you may get the right and truthful information about KSY. > > Like I said earlier, Pt. Gopala Krishna Raho had two disciples, one of > whom was the late Prof. K.S. Krishnamurthi, the founder of the > KP-school, I forgot the name of the other one, except that it was a > Brahmin name, a rather short one, but he is perhaps also worth looking > into. Therefore to find out more about KSY, you need to read carefully > all the five KP-readers and study the old issues of their astrological > magazine as well. There might be some information on KSY hitten somewhere. > > Now I have told you where to start, but I have no wish to serve the > information to you on a silver-plate. You need to do your own > research, if you really want to find out about this matter. > > This is how I got my knowledge, by deep study, careful research and > contemplating the results over a period of nearly 30 years. > > Best regards, > Finn Wandahl > > > , " lalkitabee " > <lalkitabee@> wrote: > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be decided in a > > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in lalkitab without > > any name with some other definations, > > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz no other > > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are in Africa & > > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no contradiction > > about the use of the word " elephant " . In the same way reading about > > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of the text, not > > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep dive into the > > sea. The " read-out " theory cant be assumed without " read-into " > > fundamentals.At other side - " about the fear of general peoples " is a > > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this category of > > fear-generator group. But it > > > > doesn't mean to stop read or learn about this or type of these yogas. > > Today u r saying not to support this Kaal Sarp Yog, after some days > > other will say -not to support VISHKANYA YOG etc. After all how a > > scholar can stop his readings or researches ? > > Electricity is hazardous , but the theory of > > electricity is not hazardous & reading of this theory can be helpful > > from safety-point of view from electricity. > > With Regards > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > V.Shukla > > www.lalkitabee.com > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Mr. KP Miglani, > > > > > > There is absolutely NOTHING about Kala Sarpa Yoga in the great Lal > > > Kitab, no matter how much we twist or bend the text. > > > > > > Please always remember, we are supposed to read out of the text, not > > > into the text. After all, we are not the writers of the great Lal > > > Kitab, Pt. Roop Chand Joshi was. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > , " kpmiglani " > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Varun Ji, > > > > > > > > I agree with you. I was wondering if you have read the section on > > > > Rahu + Ketu in the 1952 edition on page 323 of Arun Sanhita. I do > > > > not have the Urdu edition because I can not read urdu. I do not > know > > > > why, but it sounds to me that the book is talking about the kalsarp > > > > yog in that context. > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " varun_trvd " > > > > <varun_trvd@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Respected Miglani ji, > > > > > > > > > > Your point is well taken. > > > > > > > > > > I accept that all planets hemmed by rahu and ketu and half the > > > > > horoscope going empty does give the horoscope a different look. > > > > What > > > > > I am against is the scare that has been caused by this; or > > > > treating > > > > > this placement as a curse. > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, it has not been proved beyond doubt that whatever ills, > > > > if > > > > > at all, accrue are because of this placement. Till such time that > > > > > the ills in the horoscope get associated with this placement, I > > > > > would personally like to keep this in the grey area of research. > > > > > > > > > > In academic research all possibilities are examined and > evaluated. > > > > > Those not found tenable are left; they are not dumped. You never > > > > > know some body else comes up with a better explanation later > which > > > > > proves the existence of a Kal Sarp Yog. > > > > > > > > > > I can not dump Kal Sarp Yog simply because this placement did not > > > > > find a mention in the classics. In other fields of life there are > > > > > quite a few things which did not find a mention in old texts and > > > > are > > > > > a reality today. Therefore we can not dump a thing on the basis > > > > that > > > > > classics are silent about it. Similarly I will not accept it > to be > > > > a > > > > > reality till such time that it is proved beyond doubt that a Yog > > > > > like Kal Sarp Yog exists and these are the effects of it. > > > > > > > > > > Therefore I do not dump the Kal Sarp Yog as a figment of > > > > > imagination, nor would give more credence then what it deserves. > > > > > When I said that I treat it a matter of grey area research, it > > > > means > > > > > that I accept its possible existence. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " kpmiglani " > > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Finn and Varun, > > > > > > > > > > > > I hope you agree that if all the planets are on one side of > Rahu- > > > > > > ketu axis and consequently half the horoscope stays empty, it > > > > > > presents an abnormal distribution of planets. This abnormality > > > > > could > > > > > > not have gone unnoticed by the great astrology Savants, > > > > including > > > > > > Roopchandra ji. What name was given to this abnormality, or how > > > > > was > > > > > > it understood, or what it was taken to mean could be a > matter of > > > > > > debate. Whatever name we assign to it, it definitely needs our > > > > > > attention. We can not ignore it and sweep it under the carpet. > > > > > > As you both seem to suggest that this so called Kal Sarp Yog > has > > > > > > been used by unscrupulous astrologers to intimidate gullible > > > > > seekers > > > > > > and used as a money spinner, then it becomes all the more > > > > > imperative > > > > > > on our part to bring out the truth such that it explains the > > > > > > phenomenon logically. By just saying that it does not exist is > > > > > like > > > > > > wishing some thing away. The phenomenon of all the planets > > > > hemmed > > > > > > between rahu-ketu does exist, neither of you can deny. Give it > > > > > > whatever name you want, but a plausible well reasoned response > > > > is > > > > > > expected before dumping it into the waste paper basket. > > > > > > I am sorry if I have hurt any body's feelings, that has never > > > > been > > > > > > my intention. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please, I mean nothing personal by this. I agree with you > that > > > > > many > > > > > > > statements of Lal Kitab has a number of hidden meanings > hidden > > > > > > within > > > > > > > them. No doubt about that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I think we should always be very careful that our > > > > great > > > > > > Lal > > > > > > > Kitab is not being misused to support something malefic like > > > > the > > > > > > > general peoples fear, which I think is the case here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my honest opinion this whole Kala Sarpa yoga thing > should be > > > > > > > considered to be within the evil circle of Mercury. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > Finn > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > careful not to > > > > > > > --- In , " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > > > > > > > Yes u r absolutly right, Descriptions of planets are > usually > > > > > > based on > > > > > > > > religious cosmology but my explanations are based upon the > > > > > > predective & > > > > > > > > remedial astrology of lalkitab.This is a reading into the > > > > > > text ,to > > > > > > > > search out the vision about kalsarp yog in perview of > > > > > lalkitab.I > > > > > > tried > > > > > > > > to answer - does lalkitab includes kalsarp yog directly or > > > > > > indirectly? > > > > > > > > . & i found it indirect state in lalkitab.(Here i want to > > > > say -- > > > > > > > > > > > the word > > > > > > > > KAALSARP has been used as a real snake by some astrologers, > > > > In > > > > > > fact this > > > > > > > > word was used to explain a YOG, like gajkesri YOG, sunafaa > > > > > YOG, > > > > > > anafaa > > > > > > > > YOG, etc. .Here the 1st word KAAL = TIME used as KAAL= > > > > HORROR, > > > > > > DEATH ,by > > > > > > > > some half baked quacksalvers.otherwise there r so much > > > > > > horoscopes having > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog with a cheerful life.) > > > > > > > > Symbolic imaginations are very useful to > understand to > > > > > any > > > > > > stream > > > > > > > > of predective & remedial astrology while analyzing any > > > > > > horoscope.But my > > > > > > > > views focused only to the horoscope for the purpose of > > > > > > predective or > > > > > > > > remedial astrology . Im not trying to prove how are rahu > > > > ketu > > > > > > explained > > > > > > > > astronomically or in other style, bcoz whole lalkitab is > > > > based > > > > > on > > > > > > > > logical predective & logical remedial theory, no other > > > > system > > > > > i > > > > > > found > > > > > > > > like this. Otherwise Rahu ketu r accepted as shadow planets > > > > > > (CHHAYAA > > > > > > > > GRAH)also. I think u wil be agree with my point of > > > > view ,what > > > > > i > > > > > > want to > > > > > > > > say.We cant deny symbolic imaginations while reading > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > This is > > > > > > > > y- in very begining the author of this book Pt. roop Chand > > > > > > Joshi ji > > > > > > > > adviced this book to read as a noval. > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Descriptions of planets are usually based on religious > > > > > > cosmology, and > > > > > > > > > in many religious texts Rahu is pictured as a big snake > > > > > > swallowing the > > > > > > > > > Sun and causing eclipse to happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is a matter of fact, than in Varaha Mihira's " Brihat > > > > > > Samhita " (6th > > > > > > > > > century AD) the very word " Rahu " is used for eclipse and > > > > the > > > > > > word > > > > > > > > > " Ketu " is the word for comets and meteors, since comets > > > > and > > > > > > meteors > > > > > > > > > look like tails when observed in the sky. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However there mere fact that Lal Kitab also describes > Rahu > > > > > and > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > > something like this, cannot be used to legitimate " Kala > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > Yoga " as > > > > > > > > > somehow being linked to Lal Kitab. No way! I think we > > > > should > > > > > > be honest > > > > > > > > > about this - at least to our own good selves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When dealing with the great Lal Kitab, I think we should > > > > be > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > careful to read out of the text, not into the text. > > > > > Otherwise > > > > > > we may > > > > > > > > > end up with some serious misunderstandings. At least this > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > > be my own humble opinion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > > > lalkitabee@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl & Members > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your keen observations r absolutly right that > Nowhere any > > > > > > > > description > > > > > > > > > > with the name as " Kalsarp Yoga " in lalkitab. So we can > > > > say > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > > > does > > > > > > > > > > not consider Kalsarp yoga. But with humble words I want > > > > to > > > > > > share > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > own views in this perview..This article was written by > > > > me > > > > > in > > > > > > past in > > > > > > > > > > other group.I think it will be helpfull to under stand > > > > the > > > > > > topic- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RESPECTED MEMBERS lalkitab accepts Rahu as the > > > > > > > > > > head of snake & ketu as the tail of snake & saturn is > > > > > > elaborated as > > > > > > > > > > snake in lalkitab.As example in the very begining of > > > > > > lalkitab says > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > rahu ketu-- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. EK NE INSAAN KO SIR SE PAKDAA HAI DOOSRE NE PAIR SE. > > > > TO > > > > > > KHUD BA > > > > > > > > > KHUD UNKO JAGAH MIL GAYEE (Means ;- Rahu will be treated > > > > as > > > > > > head & > > > > > > > > > Ketu as tail) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. About saturn - shani khana no 4 addressed as PANI KA > > > > > > SAANP, Shani > > > > > > > > > > khana no.5 as BACHCHEY KHANE WALAA SAANP, Shani khana > > > > no. > > > > > 6 > > > > > > as RAAT > > > > > > > > > KA ANDHAA SAANP. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So much use of this word prooves that saturn is called > > > > as > > > > > > snake in > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now an opinion of mine is that Kalsarp means kal= > > > > > > time ,SAMAY Sarp - > > > > > > > > > > snake. As defination we can say that the cycle of time > > > > in > > > > > > which all > > > > > > > > > > planets come between Rahu & Ketu in any horoscope will > > > > be > > > > > > treated as > > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog. It is declared name in Jyotish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At other side when i saw in lalkitab-- i found some > > > > > > discriptions & > > > > > > > > > > definations as below > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.PEHLEY GHARON MAIN DUM KETU HOTE ICHCHHAADHAARI SHANI > > > > > > HOTAA HO > > > > > > > > > > ULAT MAGAR JAB TEVE BAITHA AZDAHAA KHOONI BANTAA HO > > > > (here > > > > > > ajdahaa is > > > > > > > > > > AJGAR SNAKE)SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA > > > > > (Head) > > > > > > RAHU > > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA HO (Page no. 585 oroginal book 1952) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2.SANICHCHAR KO AGAR SAANP MAANAA JAYE TO USKI DUM KETU > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE > > > > > > > > > > WALE GHAR MAIN HOGI AUR SIR USKAA RAHU BAITHAA HONE > WALE > > > > > > GHAR MAIN > > > > > > > > > GINAA JAYEGAA YA SANICHCHAR KA SIR RAHU HOGAA AUR > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > KI DUM > > > > > > > > > KETU HOGI > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (PAGE NO. 588 at no. 5 in the chapter of AAM HAALAT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Shani ka swabhav is specially counted by RAHU > KETU in > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > As > > > > > > > > > > well as at page no. 590 ---MANDI HAALAT MAIN AMOOMAN > > > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE WALE GHAR KE DONO TARAF HEE DAAYAIN (RIGHT) > > > > > > BAAYAIN > > > > > > > > > (LEFT) RAHU KETU BAITHAA HONE KE VAQT UNKAA BHEE MANDAA > > > > ASAR > > > > > > HOGAA. > > > > > > > > > > (after this a chart has been written at page 590 > showing > > > > > BAD > > > > > > effects > > > > > > > > > > of SAANP (Shani) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4.At page no. 623 I saw the defination about bad saturn > > > > as > > > > > > below > > > > > > > > > > HEADING:- SANICHCHAR KE MANDE ASAR KA RUKH KIDHAR HOGAA > > > > > > > > > > RAHU KO SIR AUR KETU KO DUM (tail) SAMAJHKAR EK SAANP > > > > KEE > > > > > > SHAKAL > > > > > > > > > (shape)BANAYAIN TO RAHU BAITHAA HONE WAALE GHAR SE AAGE > > > > > JAHAAN > > > > > > KAHIN > > > > > > > > > BHI YAANI JIS KHAANE MAIN REKHAA NIKAL KAR SEEDHEE HEE > JAA > > > > > > SAKTEE HO , > > > > > > > > > US GHAR PAR SHANI KA ASAR PADEGAA (Here also pandit ji > > > > > assumed > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > snake).Even this line has been said for saturn khana 8. > > > > But > > > > > in > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > context also saturn treated as snake & rahu called as > head > > > > & > > > > > > ketu as > > > > > > > > > tail. As said above > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :--- SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA (Head) > > > > RAHU > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA > > > > > > > > HO. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It means we can create a shape of snake in each > > > > horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > Here my only view is that lalkitab already persues Rahu > > > > > ketu > > > > > > as head > > > > > > > > > & tail of Saturn (Snake) & if a horoscope comes befor us > > > > > > including all > > > > > > > > > planets between Rahu & Ketu ,then as per lalkitab ,a > > > > picture > > > > > > appears > > > > > > > > > that all planets controlled at one side (left or > right) by > > > > > the > > > > > > snake > > > > > > > > > (Saturn) placing his head rahu & tail Ketu. So even > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > does not > > > > > > > > > used the word KALSARP YOG directly.But above said > > > > situation > > > > > of > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > gives us an image of Horoscope as Kal = Time or SAMAY & > > > > Sarp > > > > > = > > > > > > Snake > > > > > > > > > Yog,created in horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yaani ki Samay ke ya vaqt ke mutabik sabhi > > > > > > > > > > grah saanp ke sir (head) aur dum (Tail) ko paar nahi > kar > > > > > > sake aur ek > > > > > > > > > > aisa yog ban baithaa jiskaa naam kalsarp yog ke alawaa > > > > aur > > > > > > kuchh > > > > > > > > bolnaa > > > > > > > > > > sateek nahee maaloom hotaa.Bhaley hee laalkitab main > ise > > > > > is > > > > > > naam se > > > > > > > > > > naheen kahaa gayaa hai lekin rahu aur ketu ko to saanp > > > > > > (Saturn) ka > > > > > > > > sir > > > > > > > > > > aur dum kahaa gayaa hai. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All this is my view as per understanding of quotes of > > > > > revered > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But knowledge & research has no limit.I m owed to all > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > members & there views. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " Finn > > > > Wandahl " > > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kala sarpa Yoga and its opposite, the so called > " Sweet > > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > > > Yoga " , > > > > > > > > > > > are by no means ancient. Both these Yogas were > > > > > introduced > > > > > > by the > > > > > > > > late > > > > > > > > > > > Hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao (Meena) in his > > > > > > book 'Naadi > > > > > > > > > > > Joytisha', written somewhere in the 1950-ties. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, Mr. Gopala Krishna Rao never mentioned > > > > anything > > > > > > about an > > > > > > > > > > > Upaya for this Yoga. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kalasarpa Yoga is not being mentioned in any of the > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > > > classics of Hindu astrology. It is also not being > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > > > anywhere > > > > > > > > > > > in our great Lal Kitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I also like to mention that my good friend Mr. K.N. > > > > Rao > > > > > > from Delhi > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > very critical about Kala Sarpa Yoga, since it has > been > > > > > > misused a > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > to scare the people, very much like the way Mangal- > > > > dosha > > > > > > and the > > > > > > > > > > > 7½-years of Saturn are being used to exploit people > > > > all > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > , " varun_trvd " > > > > > > > > > > > varun_trvd@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Rakesh ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Go to the files section of the following group. > Read > > > > > the > > > > > > article > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > Kal Sarp yog and its upaya. You will know about our > > > > > > views on it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > , " rakesh.behal " > > > > > > > > > > > > <rakesh.behal@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > i request you all that please discuss > > > > KALSARP > > > > > > YOG what > > > > > > > > lal > > > > > > > > > > > > kitab > > > > > > > > > > > > > says about this and does it really affect a > person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > waht upayas one can do to get rid of its adverse > > > > > > effects. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > rakesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Respected Kalsi ji, Lal Kitab has mentioned the Vish Kanya yog on page 1066 of 1952 urdu ed : Shatru shukra budh har do dekhen, milti baithak khwah alheda hoSurya ketu aa budh pe chamke, khasam khani voh aurat ho Regards, Varun Trivedi , "Shivdev Kalsi" <shivdev.kalsi wrote:>> Dear Shukla Ji,> > In this case Elephant does not exist neither in Africa nor in Asia. I mean> there is no mention of this yoga in Hora Prashara the main collection of> astrological systems. There is no mention of this yoga in Ashtakvarga, nor> there is any deduction of Bindus/rekhas on this position of planets.> > In Jaimini I donot find any mention there in also in Horary there is no> mention of it.> > There is no harm to do research in any field. But it is not a right practice> to force unethical practices on innocent people in the name of holy> shashtras.> > Almost all the practising astrologers create fear psychosis in the name of> KalaSarpa Yoga. this is not a good practice to grab money from poor innocent> people.> > Regarding Vishkanya and other yogas, One shall keep himself to the system he> is studying. these yogas should be discussed where the shastras containing> these yogas are discussed and should not be intermingled with others.> > Every system has his own rules and regulations. If I want to justify> allopathy with ayurvedic or homoeopathy formulation then it is not called a> good pratice. all these system have there own course of remedies and> diagonose.> > If ih this group Lalkitab is discussed then all should discuss lalkitab. Not> to insert other ideologies.> > Let us keep ourselves away from this human nature to justify our wrong> doings in the name of research or something else.> > Regards> > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 7:24 AM, lalkitabee lalkitabee wrote:> > > Respected Mr. Wandahl> > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be decided in a> > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in lalkitab without> > any name with some other definations,> > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz no other> > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are in Africa & > > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no contradiction> > about the use of the word "elephant". In the same way reading about> > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of the text, not> > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep dive into the> > sea. The "read-out" theory cant be assumed without "read-into"> > fundamentals.At other side - "about the fear of general peoples" is a> > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this category of> > fear-generator group. But it> >> > doesn't mean to stop read or learn about this or type of these yogas.> > Today u r saying not to support this Kaal Sarp Yog, after some days> > other will say -not to support VISHKANYA YOG etc. After all how a> > scholar can stop his readings or researches ?> > Electricity is hazardous , but the theory of> > electricity is not hazardous & reading of this theory can be helpful> > from safety-point of view from electricity.> > With Regards> > Pt.Lalkitabee> > V.Shukla> > www.lalkitabee.com> > <%40>,> > "Finn Wandahl"> > finn.wandahl@ wrote:> > >> > > Dear Mr. KP Miglani,> > >> > > There is absolutely NOTHING about Kala Sarpa Yoga in the great Lal> > > Kitab, no matter how much we twist or bend the text.> > >> > > Please always remember, we are supposed to read out of the text, not> > > into the text. After all, we are not the writers of the great Lal> > > Kitab, Pt. Roop Chand Joshi was.> > >> > > Best regards,> > > Finn Wandahl> > >> > >> > > <%40>,> > "kpmiglani"> > > <kpmiglani@> wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear Varun Ji,> > > >> > > > I agree with you. I was wondering if you have read the section on> > > > Rahu + Ketu in the 1952 edition on page 323 of Arun Sanhita. I do> > > > not have the Urdu edition because I can not read urdu. I do not know> > > > why, but it sounds to me that the book is talking about the kalsarp> > > > yog in that context.> > > >> > > > Sincerely,> > > >> > > > KP Miglani> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > <%40>,> > "varun_trvd"> > > > <varun_trvd@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Respected Miglani ji,> > > > >> > > > > Your point is well taken.> > > > >> > > > > I accept that all planets hemmed by rahu and ketu and half the> > > > > horoscope going empty does give the horoscope a different look.> > > > What> > > > > I am against is the scare that has been caused by this; or> > > > treating> > > > > this placement as a curse.> > > > >> > > > > Secondly, it has not been proved beyond doubt that whatever ills,> > > > if> > > > > at all, accrue are because of this placement. Till such time that> > > > > the ills in the horoscope get associated with this placement, I> > > > > would personally like to keep this in the grey area of research.> > > > >> > > > > In academic research all possibilities are examined and evaluated.> > > > > Those not found tenable are left; they are not dumped. You never> > > > > know some body else comes up with a better explanation later which> > > > > proves the existence of a Kal Sarp Yog.> > > > >> > > > > I can not dump Kal Sarp Yog simply because this placement did not> > > > > find a mention in the classics. In other fields of life there are> > > > > quite a few things which did not find a mention in old texts and> > > > are> > > > > a reality today. Therefore we can not dump a thing on the basis> > > > that> > > > > classics are silent about it. Similarly I will not accept it to be> > > > a> > > > > reality till such time that it is proved beyond doubt that a Yog> > > > > like Kal Sarp Yog exists and these are the effects of it.> > > > >> > > > > Therefore I do not dump the Kal Sarp Yog as a figment of> > > > > imagination, nor would give more credence then what it deserves.> > > > > When I said that I treat it a matter of grey area research, it> > > > means> > > > > that I accept its possible existence.> > > > >> > > > > Regards,> > > > >> > > > > Varun Trivedi> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > <%40>,> > "kpmiglani"> > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Finn and Varun,> > > > > >> > > > > > I hope you agree that if all the planets are on one side of Rahu-> > > > > > ketu axis and consequently half the horoscope stays empty, it> > > > > > presents an abnormal distribution of planets. This abnormality> > > > > could> > > > > > not have gone unnoticed by the great astrology Savants,> > > > including> > > > > > Roopchandra ji. What name was given to this abnormality, or how> > > > > was> > > > > > it understood, or what it was taken to mean could be a matter of> > > > > > debate. Whatever name we assign to it, it definitely needs our> > > > > > attention. We can not ignore it and sweep it under the carpet.> > > > > > As you both seem to suggest that this so called Kal Sarp Yog has> > > > > > been used by unscrupulous astrologers to intimidate gullible> > > > > seekers> > > > > > and used as a money spinner, then it becomes all the more> > > > > imperative> > > > > > on our part to bring out the truth such that it explains the> > > > > > phenomenon logically. By just saying that it does not exist is> > > > > like> > > > > > wishing some thing away. The phenomenon of all the planets> > > > hemmed> > > > > > between rahu-ketu does exist, neither of you can deny. Give it> > > > > > whatever name you want, but a plausible well reasoned response> > > > is> > > > > > expected before dumping it into the waste paper basket.> > > > > > I am sorry if I have hurt any body's feelings, that has never> > > > been> > > > > > my intention.> > > > > >> > > > > > Sincerely,> > > > > >> > > > > > KP Miglani> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > <%40>,> > "Finn Wandahl"> > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee),> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Please, I mean nothing personal by this. I agree with you that> > > > > many> > > > > > > statements of Lal Kitab has a number of hidden meanings hidden> > > > > > within> > > > > > > them. No doubt about that.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > However, I think we should always be very careful that our> > > > great> > > > > > Lal> > > > > > > Kitab is not being misused to support something malefic like> > > > the> > > > > > > general peoples fear, which I think is the case here.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > In my honest opinion this whole Kala Sarpa yoga thing should be> > > > > > > considered to be within the evil circle of Mercury.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Best regards,> > > > > > > Finn> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > careful not to> > > > > > > <%40>,> > "lalkitabee"> > > > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl> > > > > > > > Yes u r absolutly right, Descriptions of planets are usually> > > > > > based on> > > > > > > > religious cosmology but my explanations are based upon the> > > > > > predective & > > > > > > > > remedial astrology of lalkitab.This is a reading into the> > > > > > text ,to> > > > > > > > search out the vision about kalsarp yog in perview of> > > > > lalkitab.I> > > > > > tried> > > > > > > > to answer - does lalkitab includes kalsarp yog directly or> > > > > > indirectly?> > > > > > > > . & i found it indirect state in lalkitab.(Here i want to> > > > say --> > > > >> > > > > > the word> > > > > > > > KAALSARP has been used as a real snake by some astrologers,> > > > In> > > > > > fact this> > > > > > > > word was used to explain a YOG, like gajkesri YOG, sunafaa> > > > > YOG,> > > > > > anafaa> > > > > > > > YOG, etc. .Here the 1st word KAAL = TIME used as KAAL=> > > > HORROR,> > > > > > DEATH ,by> > > > > > > > some half baked quacksalvers.otherwise there r so much> > > > > > horoscopes having> > > > > > > > kalsarp yog with a cheerful life.)> > > > > > > > Symbolic imaginations are very useful to understand to> > > > > any> > > > > > stream> > > > > > > > of predective & remedial astrology while analyzing any> > > > > > horoscope.But my> > > > > > > > views focused only to the horoscope for the purpose of> > > > > > predective or> > > > > > > > remedial astrology . Im not trying to prove how are rahu> > > > ketu> > > > > > explained> > > > > > > > astronomically or in other style, bcoz whole lalkitab is> > > > based> > > > > on> > > > > > > > logical predective & logical remedial theory, no other> > > > system> > > > > i> > > > > > found> > > > > > > > like this. Otherwise Rahu ketu r accepted as shadow planets> > > > > > (CHHAYAA> > > > > > > > GRAH)also. I think u wil be agree with my point of> > > > view ,what> > > > > i> > > > > > want to> > > > > > > > say.We cant deny symbolic imaginations while reading> > > > lalkitab.> > > > > > This is> > > > > > > > y- in very begining the author of this book Pt. roop Chand> > > > > > Joshi ji> > > > > > > > adviced this book to read as a noval.> > > > > > > > With Regards> > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee> > > > > > > > V.Shukla> > > > > > > > <%40>,> > "Finn Wandahl"> > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee),> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Descriptions of planets are usually based on religious> > > > > > cosmology, and> > > > > > > > > in many religious texts Rahu is pictured as a big snake> > > > > > swallowing the> > > > > > > > > Sun and causing eclipse to happen.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > It is a matter of fact, than in Varaha Mihira's "Brihat> > > > > > Samhita" (6th> > > > > > > > > century AD) the very word "Rahu" is used for eclipse and> > > > the> > > > > > word> > > > > > > > > "Ketu" is the word for comets and meteors, since comets> > > > and> > > > > > meteors> > > > > > > > > look like tails when observed in the sky.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > However there mere fact that Lal Kitab also describes Rahu> > > > > and> > > > > > Ketu> > > > > > > > > something like this, cannot be used to legitimate "Kala> > > > > Sarpa> > > > > > Yoga" as> > > > > > > > > somehow being linked to Lal Kitab. No way! I think we> > > > should> > > > > > be honest> > > > > > > > > about this - at least to our own good selves.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > When dealing with the great Lal Kitab, I think we should> > > > be> > > > > > very> > > > > > > > > careful to read out of the text, not into the text.> > > > > Otherwise> > > > > > we may> > > > > > > > > end up with some serious misunderstandings. At least this> > > > > > happens to> > > > > > > > > be my own humble opinion.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Best regards,> > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > <%40>,> > "lalkitabee"> > > > > > > > > lalkitabee@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl & Members> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Your keen observations r absolutly right that Nowhere any> > > > > > > > description> > > > > > > > > > with the name as "Kalsarp Yoga" in lalkitab. So we can> > > > say> > > > > > lalkitab> > > > > > > > does> > > > > > > > > > not consider Kalsarp yoga. But with humble words I want> > > > to> > > > > > share> > > > > > > > some> > > > > > > > > > own views in this perview..This article was written by> > > > me> > > > > in> > > > > > past in> > > > > > > > > > other group.I think it will be helpfull to under stand> > > > the> > > > > > topic-> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > RESPECTED MEMBERS lalkitab accepts Rahu as the> > > > > > > > > > head of snake & ketu as the tail of snake & saturn is> > > > > > elaborated as> > > > > > > > > > snake in lalkitab.As example in the very begining of> > > > > > lalkitab says> > > > > > > > about> > > > > > > > > > rahu ketu--> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > 1. EK NE INSAAN KO SIR SE PAKDAA HAI DOOSRE NE PAIR SE.> > > > TO> > > > > > KHUD BA> > > > > > > > > KHUD UNKO JAGAH MIL GAYEE (Means ;- Rahu will be treated> > > > as> > > > > > head & > > > > > > > > > Ketu as tail)> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > 2. About saturn - shani khana no 4 addressed as PANI KA> > > > > > SAANP, Shani> > > > > > > > > > khana no.5 as BACHCHEY KHANE WALAA SAANP, Shani khana> > > > no.> > > > > 6> > > > > > as RAAT> > > > > > > > > KA ANDHAA SAANP.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > So much use of this word prooves that saturn is called> > > > as> > > > > > snake in> > > > > > > > > > lalkitab.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Now an opinion of mine is that Kalsarp means kal=> > > > > > time ,SAMAY Sarp -> > > > > > > > > > snake. As defination we can say that the cycle of time> > > > in> > > > > > which all> > > > > > > > > > planets come between Rahu & Ketu in any horoscope will> > > > be> > > > > > treated as> > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog. It is declared name in Jyotish.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > At other side when i saw in lalkitab-- i found some> > > > > > discriptions & > > > > > > > > > > definations as below> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > 1.PEHLEY GHARON MAIN DUM KETU HOTE ICHCHHAADHAARI SHANI> > > > > > HOTAA HO> > > > > > > > > > ULAT MAGAR JAB TEVE BAITHA AZDAHAA KHOONI BANTAA HO> > > > (here> > > > > > ajdahaa is> > > > > > > > > > AJGAR SNAKE)SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA> > > > > (Head)> > > > > > RAHU> > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA HO (Page no. 585 oroginal book 1952)> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > 2.SANICHCHAR KO AGAR SAANP MAANAA JAYE TO USKI DUM KETU> > > > > > BAITHAA HONE> > > > > > > > > > WALE GHAR MAIN HOGI AUR SIR USKAA RAHU BAITHAA HONE WALE> > > > > > GHAR MAIN> > > > > > > > > GINAA JAYEGAA YA SANICHCHAR KA SIR RAHU HOGAA AUR> > > > SANICHCHAR> > > > > > KI DUM> > > > > > > > > KETU HOGI> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > (PAGE NO. 588 at no. 5 in the chapter of AAM HAALAT)> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > 3. Shani ka swabhav is specially counted by RAHU KETU in> > > > > > lalkitab.> > > > > > > > As> > > > > > > > > > well as at page no. 590 ---MANDI HAALAT MAIN AMOOMAN> > > > > > SANICHCHAR> > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE WALE GHAR KE DONO TARAF HEE DAAYAIN (RIGHT)> > > > > > BAAYAIN> > > > > > > > > (LEFT) RAHU KETU BAITHAA HONE KE VAQT UNKAA BHEE MANDAA> > > > ASAR> > > > > > HOGAA.> > > > > > > > > > (after this a chart has been written at page 590 showing> > > > > BAD> > > > > > effects> > > > > > > > > > of SAANP (Shani)> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > 4.At page no. 623 I saw the defination about bad saturn> > > > as> > > > > > below> > > > > > > > > > HEADING:- SANICHCHAR KE MANDE ASAR KA RUKH KIDHAR HOGAA> > > > > > > > > > RAHU KO SIR AUR KETU KO DUM (tail) SAMAJHKAR EK SAANP> > > > KEE> > > > > > SHAKAL> > > > > > > > > (shape)BANAYAIN TO RAHU BAITHAA HONE WAALE GHAR SE AAGE> > > > > JAHAAN> > > > > > KAHIN> > > > > > > > > BHI YAANI JIS KHAANE MAIN REKHAA NIKAL KAR SEEDHEE HEE JAA> > > > > > SAKTEE HO ,> > > > > > > > > US GHAR PAR SHANI KA ASAR PADEGAA (Here also pandit ji> > > > > assumed> > > > > > a> > > > > > > > > snake).Even this line has been said for saturn khana 8.> > > > But> > > > > in> > > > > > other> > > > > > > > > context also saturn treated as snake & rahu called as head> > > > & > > > > > > ketu as> > > > > > > > > tail. As said above> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > :--- SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA (Head)> > > > RAHU> > > > > > KHUD HOTAA> > > > > > > > HO.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > It means we can create a shape of snake in each> > > > horoscope.> > > > > > > > > > Here my only view is that lalkitab already persues Rahu> > > > > ketu> > > > > > as head> > > > > > > > > & tail of Saturn (Snake) & if a horoscope comes befor us> > > > > > including all> > > > > > > > > planets between Rahu & Ketu ,then as per lalkitab ,a> > > > picture> > > > > > appears> > > > > > > > > that all planets controlled at one side (left or right) by> > > > > the> > > > > > snake> > > > > > > > > (Saturn) placing his head rahu & tail Ketu. So even> > > > lalkitab> > > > > > does not> > > > > > > > > used the word KALSARP YOG directly.But above said> > > > situation> > > > > of> > > > > > planets> > > > > > > > > gives us an image of Horoscope as Kal = Time or SAMAY & > > > > Sarp> > > > > => > > > > > Snake> > > > > > > > > Yog,created in horoscope.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Yaani ki Samay ke ya vaqt ke mutabik sabhi> > > > > > > > > > grah saanp ke sir (head) aur dum (Tail) ko paar nahi kar> > > > > > sake aur ek> > > > > > > > > > aisa yog ban baithaa jiskaa naam kalsarp yog ke alawaa> > > > aur> > > > > > kuchh> > > > > > > > bolnaa> > > > > > > > > > sateek nahee maaloom hotaa.Bhaley hee laalkitab main ise> > > > > is> > > > > > naam se> > > > > > > > > > naheen kahaa gayaa hai lekin rahu aur ketu ko to saanp> > > > > > (Saturn) ka> > > > > > > > sir> > > > > > > > > > aur dum kahaa gayaa hai.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > All this is my view as per understanding of quotes of> > > > > revered> > > > > > > > lalkitab.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > But knowledge & research has no limit.I m owed to all> > > > > learned> > > > > > > > > members & there views.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > With Regards> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee> > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > <%40>,> > "Finn> > > > Wandahl"> > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi,> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Kala sarpa Yoga and its opposite, the so called "Sweet> > > > > > Sarpa> > > > > > > > Yoga",> > > > > > > > > > > are by no means ancient. Both these Yogas were> > > > > introduced> > > > > > by the> > > > > > > > late> > > > > > > > > > > Hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao (Meena) in his> > > > > > book 'Naadi> > > > > > > > > > > Joytisha', written somewhere in the 1950-ties.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > However, Mr. Gopala Krishna Rao never mentioned> > > > anything> > > > > > about an> > > > > > > > > > > Upaya for this Yoga.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Kalasarpa Yoga is not being mentioned in any of the> > > > > > traditional> > > > > > > > > > > classics of Hindu astrology. It is also not being> > > > > mentioned> > > > > > > > anywhere> > > > > > > > > > > in our great Lal Kitab.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > I also like to mention that my good friend Mr. K.N.> > > > Rao> > > > > > from Delhi> > > > > > > > is> > > > > > > > > > > very critical about Kala Sarpa Yoga, since it has been> > > > > > misused a> > > > > > > > lot> > > > > > > > > > > to scare the people, very much like the way Mangal-> > > > dosha> > > > > > and the> > > > > > > > > > > 7½-years of Saturn are being used to exploit people> > > > all> > > > > > the> > > > > > > > time.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,> > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > --- In> > > > <%40>,> > "varun_trvd"> > > > > > > > > > > varun_trvd@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Rakesh ji,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Go to the files section of the following group. Read> > > > > the> > > > > > article> > > > > > > > on> > > > > > > > > > > > Kal Sarp yog and its upaya. You will know about our> > > > > > views on it.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > /> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > --- In> > > > > > <%40>,> > "rakesh.behal"> > > > > > > > > > > > <rakesh.behal@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir,> > > > > > > > > > > > > i request you all that please discuss> > > > KALSARP> > > > > > YOG what> > > > > > > > lal> > > > > > > > > > > > kitab> > > > > > > > > > > > > says about this and does it really affect a person.> > > > > > > > > > > > > waht upayas one can do to get rid of its adverse> > > > > > effects.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > > > rakesh> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >> > > >> > > > -- > Dr. Shiv Dev Kalsi,> Jyotish Rishi (AIFAS)> Consultant (Vedic Astrology)> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Respected Kalsi Ji Desease is desease & Ayurved, Allopathy & Homeopathy are only tools to cure any desease ,if desease exists.For ur kind information all three pathies use same words for diagnoses of any desease. Same way can be used in astrological deseases.If anyone finds treatment for the desease of KSY (If itseems as desease) with the help of lalkitab as per lalkitab rules .Then what is problem.A practising astrologer or scholar will read & understand accordingly. There no rectification or certification is needed from anyone.If u r really welwisher of innocent peoples, read my article carefully about " LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG " after that go through the discussion.It will be helpful for innocent peoples.Otherwise our participation in this discussion is only a waste practice. If anyone found a position of planets between the axis of Rahu & Ketu & named it KSY bfor some decades .It means it is relevant at astrological grounds. What u want to say ? Is Mr.Meena was a foolish or a cheater who introduced this name in astrological world ? Only the person u or like u r authentic & one shud read as per ur perceptions with closed eyes. At next step about other yogas like Vishkanya etc. ur objection again prooves that u never read lalkitab carefully. If u do so -how u forgot the lines of lalkitab " KHASAMKHANI VO AURAT HO " . Bcoz u r a beginner (as u claimed in past) ur vision is but natural. Thanx for ur kind suggestions.Keep it up. With Regards Pt.Lalkitabee V.Shukla , " Shivdev Kalsi " <shivdev.kalsi wrote: > > Dear Shukla Ji, > > In this case Elephant does not exist neither in Africa nor in Asia. I mean > there is no mention of this yoga in Hora Prashara the main collection of > astrological systems. There is no mention of this yoga in Ashtakvarga, nor > there is any deduction of Bindus/rekhas on this position of planets. > > In Jaimini I donot find any mention there in also in Horary there is no > mention of it. > > There is no harm to do research in any field. But it is not a right practice > to force unethical practices on innocent people in the name of holy > shashtras. > > Almost all the practising astrologers create fear psychosis in the name of > KalaSarpa Yoga. this is not a good practice to grab money from poor innocent > people. > > Regarding Vishkanya and other yogas, One shall keep himself to the system he > is studying. these yogas should be discussed where the shastras containing > these yogas are discussed and should not be intermingled with others. > > Every system has his own rules and regulations. If I want to justify > allopathy with ayurvedic or homoeopathy formulation then it is not called a > good pratice. all these system have there own course of remedies and > diagonose. > > If ih this group Lalkitab is discussed then all should discuss lalkitab. Not > to insert other ideologies. > > Let us keep ourselves away from this human nature to justify our wrong > doings in the name of research or something else. > > Regards > > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 7:24 AM, lalkitabee <lalkitabee wrote: > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be decided in a > > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in lalkitab without > > any name with some other definations, > > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz no other > > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are in Africa & > > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no contradiction > > about the use of the word " elephant " . In the same way reading about > > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of the text, not > > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep dive into the > > sea. The " read-out " theory cant be assumed without " read-into " > > fundamentals.At other side - " about the fear of general peoples " is a > > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this category of > > fear-generator group. But it > > > > doesn't mean to stop read or learn about this or type of these yogas. > > Today u r saying not to support this Kaal Sarp Yog, after some days > > other will say -not to support VISHKANYA YOG etc. After all how a > > scholar can stop his readings or researches ? > > Electricity is hazardous , but the theory of > > electricity is not hazardous & reading of this theory can be helpful > > from safety-point of view from electricity. > > With Regards > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > V.Shukla > > www.lalkitabee.com > > --- In <%40>, > > " Finn Wandahl " > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Mr. KP Miglani, > > > > > > There is absolutely NOTHING about Kala Sarpa Yoga in the great Lal > > > Kitab, no matter how much we twist or bend the text. > > > > > > Please always remember, we are supposed to read out of the text, not > > > into the text. After all, we are not the writers of the great Lal > > > Kitab, Pt. Roop Chand Joshi was. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " kpmiglani " > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Varun Ji, > > > > > > > > I agree with you. I was wondering if you have read the section on > > > > Rahu + Ketu in the 1952 edition on page 323 of Arun Sanhita. I do > > > > not have the Urdu edition because I can not read urdu. I do not know > > > > why, but it sounds to me that the book is talking about the kalsarp > > > > yog in that context. > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " varun_trvd " > > > > <varun_trvd@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Respected Miglani ji, > > > > > > > > > > Your point is well taken. > > > > > > > > > > I accept that all planets hemmed by rahu and ketu and half the > > > > > horoscope going empty does give the horoscope a different look. > > > > What > > > > > I am against is the scare that has been caused by this; or > > > > treating > > > > > this placement as a curse. > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, it has not been proved beyond doubt that whatever ills, > > > > if > > > > > at all, accrue are because of this placement. Till such time that > > > > > the ills in the horoscope get associated with this placement, I > > > > > would personally like to keep this in the grey area of research. > > > > > > > > > > In academic research all possibilities are examined and evaluated. > > > > > Those not found tenable are left; they are not dumped. You never > > > > > know some body else comes up with a better explanation later which > > > > > proves the existence of a Kal Sarp Yog. > > > > > > > > > > I can not dump Kal Sarp Yog simply because this placement did not > > > > > find a mention in the classics. In other fields of life there are > > > > > quite a few things which did not find a mention in old texts and > > > > are > > > > > a reality today. Therefore we can not dump a thing on the basis > > > > that > > > > > classics are silent about it. Similarly I will not accept it to be > > > > a > > > > > reality till such time that it is proved beyond doubt that a Yog > > > > > like Kal Sarp Yog exists and these are the effects of it. > > > > > > > > > > Therefore I do not dump the Kal Sarp Yog as a figment of > > > > > imagination, nor would give more credence then what it deserves. > > > > > When I said that I treat it a matter of grey area research, it > > > > means > > > > > that I accept its possible existence. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " kpmiglani " > > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Finn and Varun, > > > > > > > > > > > > I hope you agree that if all the planets are on one side of Rahu- > > > > > > ketu axis and consequently half the horoscope stays empty, it > > > > > > presents an abnormal distribution of planets. This abnormality > > > > > could > > > > > > not have gone unnoticed by the great astrology Savants, > > > > including > > > > > > Roopchandra ji. What name was given to this abnormality, or how > > > > > was > > > > > > it understood, or what it was taken to mean could be a matter of > > > > > > debate. Whatever name we assign to it, it definitely needs our > > > > > > attention. We can not ignore it and sweep it under the carpet. > > > > > > As you both seem to suggest that this so called Kal Sarp Yog has > > > > > > been used by unscrupulous astrologers to intimidate gullible > > > > > seekers > > > > > > and used as a money spinner, then it becomes all the more > > > > > imperative > > > > > > on our part to bring out the truth such that it explains the > > > > > > phenomenon logically. By just saying that it does not exist is > > > > > like > > > > > > wishing some thing away. The phenomenon of all the planets > > > > hemmed > > > > > > between rahu-ketu does exist, neither of you can deny. Give it > > > > > > whatever name you want, but a plausible well reasoned response > > > > is > > > > > > expected before dumping it into the waste paper basket. > > > > > > I am sorry if I have hurt any body's feelings, that has never > > > > been > > > > > > my intention. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please, I mean nothing personal by this. I agree with you that > > > > > many > > > > > > > statements of Lal Kitab has a number of hidden meanings hidden > > > > > > within > > > > > > > them. No doubt about that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I think we should always be very careful that our > > > > great > > > > > > Lal > > > > > > > Kitab is not being misused to support something malefic like > > > > the > > > > > > > general peoples fear, which I think is the case here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my honest opinion this whole Kala Sarpa yoga thing should be > > > > > > > considered to be within the evil circle of Mercury. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > Finn > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > careful not to > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > > > > > > > Yes u r absolutly right, Descriptions of planets are usually > > > > > > based on > > > > > > > > religious cosmology but my explanations are based upon the > > > > > > predective & > > > > > > > > remedial astrology of lalkitab.This is a reading into the > > > > > > text ,to > > > > > > > > search out the vision about kalsarp yog in perview of > > > > > lalkitab.I > > > > > > tried > > > > > > > > to answer - does lalkitab includes kalsarp yog directly or > > > > > > indirectly? > > > > > > > > . & i found it indirect state in lalkitab.(Here i want to > > > > say -- > > > > > > > > > > > the word > > > > > > > > KAALSARP has been used as a real snake by some astrologers, > > > > In > > > > > > fact this > > > > > > > > word was used to explain a YOG, like gajkesri YOG, sunafaa > > > > > YOG, > > > > > > anafaa > > > > > > > > YOG, etc. .Here the 1st word KAAL = TIME used as KAAL= > > > > HORROR, > > > > > > DEATH ,by > > > > > > > > some half baked quacksalvers.otherwise there r so much > > > > > > horoscopes having > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog with a cheerful life.) > > > > > > > > Symbolic imaginations are very useful to understand to > > > > > any > > > > > > stream > > > > > > > > of predective & remedial astrology while analyzing any > > > > > > horoscope.But my > > > > > > > > views focused only to the horoscope for the purpose of > > > > > > predective or > > > > > > > > remedial astrology . Im not trying to prove how are rahu > > > > ketu > > > > > > explained > > > > > > > > astronomically or in other style, bcoz whole lalkitab is > > > > based > > > > > on > > > > > > > > logical predective & logical remedial theory, no other > > > > system > > > > > i > > > > > > found > > > > > > > > like this. Otherwise Rahu ketu r accepted as shadow planets > > > > > > (CHHAYAA > > > > > > > > GRAH)also. I think u wil be agree with my point of > > > > view ,what > > > > > i > > > > > > want to > > > > > > > > say.We cant deny symbolic imaginations while reading > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > This is > > > > > > > > y- in very begining the author of this book Pt. roop Chand > > > > > > Joshi ji > > > > > > > > adviced this book to read as a noval. > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Descriptions of planets are usually based on religious > > > > > > cosmology, and > > > > > > > > > in many religious texts Rahu is pictured as a big snake > > > > > > swallowing the > > > > > > > > > Sun and causing eclipse to happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is a matter of fact, than in Varaha Mihira's " Brihat > > > > > > Samhita " (6th > > > > > > > > > century AD) the very word " Rahu " is used for eclipse and > > > > the > > > > > > word > > > > > > > > > " Ketu " is the word for comets and meteors, since comets > > > > and > > > > > > meteors > > > > > > > > > look like tails when observed in the sky. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However there mere fact that Lal Kitab also describes Rahu > > > > > and > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > > something like this, cannot be used to legitimate " Kala > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > Yoga " as > > > > > > > > > somehow being linked to Lal Kitab. No way! I think we > > > > should > > > > > > be honest > > > > > > > > > about this - at least to our own good selves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When dealing with the great Lal Kitab, I think we should > > > > be > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > careful to read out of the text, not into the text. > > > > > Otherwise > > > > > > we may > > > > > > > > > end up with some serious misunderstandings. At least this > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > > be my own humble opinion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > > > lalkitabee@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl & Members > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your keen observations r absolutly right that Nowhere any > > > > > > > > description > > > > > > > > > > with the name as " Kalsarp Yoga " in lalkitab. So we can > > > > say > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > > > does > > > > > > > > > > not consider Kalsarp yoga. But with humble words I want > > > > to > > > > > > share > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > own views in this perview..This article was written by > > > > me > > > > > in > > > > > > past in > > > > > > > > > > other group.I think it will be helpfull to under stand > > > > the > > > > > > topic- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RESPECTED MEMBERS lalkitab accepts Rahu as the > > > > > > > > > > head of snake & ketu as the tail of snake & saturn is > > > > > > elaborated as > > > > > > > > > > snake in lalkitab.As example in the very begining of > > > > > > lalkitab says > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > rahu ketu-- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. EK NE INSAAN KO SIR SE PAKDAA HAI DOOSRE NE PAIR SE. > > > > TO > > > > > > KHUD BA > > > > > > > > > KHUD UNKO JAGAH MIL GAYEE (Means ;- Rahu will be treated > > > > as > > > > > > head & > > > > > > > > > Ketu as tail) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. About saturn - shani khana no 4 addressed as PANI KA > > > > > > SAANP, Shani > > > > > > > > > > khana no.5 as BACHCHEY KHANE WALAA SAANP, Shani khana > > > > no. > > > > > 6 > > > > > > as RAAT > > > > > > > > > KA ANDHAA SAANP. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So much use of this word prooves that saturn is called > > > > as > > > > > > snake in > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now an opinion of mine is that Kalsarp means kal= > > > > > > time ,SAMAY Sarp - > > > > > > > > > > snake. As defination we can say that the cycle of time > > > > in > > > > > > which all > > > > > > > > > > planets come between Rahu & Ketu in any horoscope will > > > > be > > > > > > treated as > > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog. It is declared name in Jyotish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At other side when i saw in lalkitab-- i found some > > > > > > discriptions & > > > > > > > > > > definations as below > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.PEHLEY GHARON MAIN DUM KETU HOTE ICHCHHAADHAARI SHANI > > > > > > HOTAA HO > > > > > > > > > > ULAT MAGAR JAB TEVE BAITHA AZDAHAA KHOONI BANTAA HO > > > > (here > > > > > > ajdahaa is > > > > > > > > > > AJGAR SNAKE)SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA > > > > > (Head) > > > > > > RAHU > > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA HO (Page no. 585 oroginal book 1952) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2.SANICHCHAR KO AGAR SAANP MAANAA JAYE TO USKI DUM KETU > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE > > > > > > > > > > WALE GHAR MAIN HOGI AUR SIR USKAA RAHU BAITHAA HONE WALE > > > > > > GHAR MAIN > > > > > > > > > GINAA JAYEGAA YA SANICHCHAR KA SIR RAHU HOGAA AUR > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > KI DUM > > > > > > > > > KETU HOGI > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (PAGE NO. 588 at no. 5 in the chapter of AAM HAALAT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Shani ka swabhav is specially counted by RAHU KETU in > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > As > > > > > > > > > > well as at page no. 590 ---MANDI HAALAT MAIN AMOOMAN > > > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE WALE GHAR KE DONO TARAF HEE DAAYAIN (RIGHT) > > > > > > BAAYAIN > > > > > > > > > (LEFT) RAHU KETU BAITHAA HONE KE VAQT UNKAA BHEE MANDAA > > > > ASAR > > > > > > HOGAA. > > > > > > > > > > (after this a chart has been written at page 590 showing > > > > > BAD > > > > > > effects > > > > > > > > > > of SAANP (Shani) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4.At page no. 623 I saw the defination about bad saturn > > > > as > > > > > > below > > > > > > > > > > HEADING:- SANICHCHAR KE MANDE ASAR KA RUKH KIDHAR HOGAA > > > > > > > > > > RAHU KO SIR AUR KETU KO DUM (tail) SAMAJHKAR EK SAANP > > > > KEE > > > > > > SHAKAL > > > > > > > > > (shape)BANAYAIN TO RAHU BAITHAA HONE WAALE GHAR SE AAGE > > > > > JAHAAN > > > > > > KAHIN > > > > > > > > > BHI YAANI JIS KHAANE MAIN REKHAA NIKAL KAR SEEDHEE HEE JAA > > > > > > SAKTEE HO , > > > > > > > > > US GHAR PAR SHANI KA ASAR PADEGAA (Here also pandit ji > > > > > assumed > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > snake).Even this line has been said for saturn khana 8. > > > > But > > > > > in > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > context also saturn treated as snake & rahu called as head > > > > & > > > > > > ketu as > > > > > > > > > tail. As said above > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :--- SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA (Head) > > > > RAHU > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA > > > > > > > > HO. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It means we can create a shape of snake in each > > > > horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > Here my only view is that lalkitab already persues Rahu > > > > > ketu > > > > > > as head > > > > > > > > > & tail of Saturn (Snake) & if a horoscope comes befor us > > > > > > including all > > > > > > > > > planets between Rahu & Ketu ,then as per lalkitab ,a > > > > picture > > > > > > appears > > > > > > > > > that all planets controlled at one side (left or right) by > > > > > the > > > > > > snake > > > > > > > > > (Saturn) placing his head rahu & tail Ketu. So even > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > does not > > > > > > > > > used the word KALSARP YOG directly.But above said > > > > situation > > > > > of > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > gives us an image of Horoscope as Kal = Time or SAMAY & > > > > Sarp > > > > > = > > > > > > Snake > > > > > > > > > Yog,created in horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yaani ki Samay ke ya vaqt ke mutabik sabhi > > > > > > > > > > grah saanp ke sir (head) aur dum (Tail) ko paar nahi kar > > > > > > sake aur ek > > > > > > > > > > aisa yog ban baithaa jiskaa naam kalsarp yog ke alawaa > > > > aur > > > > > > kuchh > > > > > > > > bolnaa > > > > > > > > > > sateek nahee maaloom hotaa.Bhaley hee laalkitab main ise > > > > > is > > > > > > naam se > > > > > > > > > > naheen kahaa gayaa hai lekin rahu aur ketu ko to saanp > > > > > > (Saturn) ka > > > > > > > > sir > > > > > > > > > > aur dum kahaa gayaa hai. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All this is my view as per understanding of quotes of > > > > > revered > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But knowledge & research has no limit.I m owed to all > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > members & there views. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > " Finn > > > > Wandahl " > > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kala sarpa Yoga and its opposite, the so called " Sweet > > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > > > Yoga " , > > > > > > > > > > > are by no means ancient. Both these Yogas were > > > > > introduced > > > > > > by the > > > > > > > > late > > > > > > > > > > > Hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao (Meena) in his > > > > > > book 'Naadi > > > > > > > > > > > Joytisha', written somewhere in the 1950-ties. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, Mr. Gopala Krishna Rao never mentioned > > > > anything > > > > > > about an > > > > > > > > > > > Upaya for this Yoga. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kalasarpa Yoga is not being mentioned in any of the > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > > > classics of Hindu astrology. It is also not being > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > > > anywhere > > > > > > > > > > > in our great Lal Kitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I also like to mention that my good friend Mr. K.N. > > > > Rao > > > > > > from Delhi > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > very critical about Kala Sarpa Yoga, since it has been > > > > > > misused a > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > to scare the people, very much like the way Mangal- > > > > dosha > > > > > > and the > > > > > > > > > > > 7½-years of Saturn are being used to exploit people > > > > all > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > <%40>, > > " varun_trvd " > > > > > > > > > > > varun_trvd@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Rakesh ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Go to the files section of the following group. Read > > > > > the > > > > > > article > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > Kal Sarp yog and its upaya. You will know about our > > > > > > views on it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > <%40>, > > " rakesh.behal " > > > > > > > > > > > > <rakesh.behal@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > i request you all that please discuss > > > > KALSARP > > > > > > YOG what > > > > > > > > lal > > > > > > > > > > > > kitab > > > > > > > > > > > > > says about this and does it really affect a person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > waht upayas one can do to get rid of its adverse > > > > > > effects. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > rakesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Dr. Shiv Dev Kalsi, > Jyotish Rishi (AIFAS) > Consultant (Vedic Astrology) > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi, Quote: >>Strange: You accept that KSY exists and in the same breath you say that it doesn't in your book...<< The answer is actually very simple. I accept that KSY exist, since it has been described in Gopala Krishna Rao's book from the 1950's, but since I have tested it myself and found that it doesn't give any malefic effect, I never use it. Thats all! Best regards, Finn Wandahl , " varun_trvd " <varun_trvd wrote: > > > Respected Finn saheb, > > Strange: You accept that KSY exists and in the same breath you say that > it doesn't in your book. > > We do not insist that you include it in your book; none of our business > > A malady is a malady which ever tool is used to diagnose. If a system > doesn't have a tool then we have to create one. > > We have said time and again that we do not consider the Lal Kitab as a > separate system different from the Indian Vedic astrology. We consider > Lal Kitab as an integral part of the Indian astrology. > > There is no mixing of the tools as you seem to be suggesting. Therefore > all tools of analysis used in the traditional astrology can be and > should be applied to the Lal Kitab also. > > Regards, > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Finn Wandahl " > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi, > > > > Quote: >>Once it is recognized as a valid astrological yog, the matter > > ends there.<< > > > > No, not in my book it doesn't. My personal opinion is that Kala Sarpa > > Yoga is a big hoax, used by greedy astrologers to cheat the innocent > > people for money by selling them fake yantras, mantras, upayas, etc. > > As I have already said, I have never seen any indication that KSY has > > any kind of malefic effect, that need to be remedied. I also seriously > > doubt that any other astrologer of true merits has ever been able to > > observe any evil effect of KSY. > > > > It is true that I accept Kala Sarpa Yoga as an astrological yoga, > > since it is being mentioned by the late Pt. Gopala Krishna Rao in his > > book 'Nadi Jyotisha' from the 1950's. I am open to the suggestion that > > KSY might be considered as a part of the parampara of that school of > > astrology and their followers. It might even be considered as a part > > of the KP-school if they say so, since KP was the disciple of Pt. > > Gopala Krishna Rao. But I never heard any such claim from any of these > > people. > > > > However, it is very wrong to indiscriminately mix together one > > astrological system with another. It would be like mixing honey and > > ghee, which can be poisonous. Each astrological school is based on its > > own independent fundamental principles, and the great Lal Kitab is no > > exception. The mixed concepts will lead us no where. There should be > > no such thing as Gandhian Socialism. > > > > Quote: >>The Yog exists in spite of pt. Roopchandji not mentioning it > > in his book. (...) whether Pt. Roopchand ji talks about it or not in > > the Lal Kitab.<< > > > > I can see from these lines that you actually agree with me that it was > > none other than Pundit Roop Chand Joshi who wrote the great Lal Kitab. > > Very good! > > > > Best regards, > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > , " varun_trvd " > > varun_trvd@ wrote: > > > > > > Respected Finn sahib, > > > > > > If Kal Sarp Yog is an astrological yog, as you have already > > > accepted, then it doesn’t matter whether Pt. Roopchand ji > talks > > > about it or not in the Lal Kitab. Once it is recognized as a valid > > > astrological yog, the matter ends there. > > > > > > The Yog exists in spite of pt. Roopchandji not mentioning it in his > > > book. No astrology yog depends on the acceptance or the denial of > > > its existence by one particular scholar. > > > > > > That being so, it will be absolutely justified to look for the > > > possible remedies of this dosh [ affliction] as Pt. Krishna Ashant > > > ji has done in his book. > > > > > > With great regards, > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla, > > > > > > > > Yes, I agree with you that KSY is also a yoga that can be found in > > > the > > > > charts of the people. However, to in order to get the proper > > > knowledge > > > > about Kala Sarpa Yoga you need to look for it in the right places, > > > not > > > > in the wrong places. > > > > > > > > I have already told that no information about KSY can be found in > > > any > > > > of the classical texts. Like I said, KSY was mentioned for the > > > first > > > > time in the book " Naadi Joytisha " (3 vols) by the late hindu > > > > astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao, with the pen-name " Meena " . This is > > > > where I suggest you to focus your attention in the first place. > > > Only > > > > this way you may get the right and truthful information about KSY. > > > > > > > > Like I said earlier, Pt. Gopala Krishna Raho had two disciples, > > > one of > > > > whom was the late Prof. K.S. Krishnamurthi, the founder of the > > > > KP-school, I forgot the name of the other one, except that it was > a > > > > Brahmin name, a rather short one, but he is perhaps also worth > > > looking > > > > into. Therefore to find out more about KSY, you need to read > > > carefully > > > > all the five KP-readers and study the old issues of their > > > astrological > > > > magazine as well. There might be some information on KSY hitten > > > somewhere. > > > > > > > > Now I have told you where to start, but I have no wish to serve > the > > > > information to you on a silver-plate. You need to do your own > > > > research, if you really want to find out about this matter. > > > > > > > > This is how I got my knowledge, by deep study, careful research > and > > > > contemplating the results over a period of nearly 30 years. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > , " lalkitabee " > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > > > > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be > > > decided in a > > > > > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in lalkitab > > > without > > > > > any name with some other definations, > > > > > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz no > > > other > > > > > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are in > > > Africa & > > > > > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no > > > contradiction > > > > > about the use of the word " elephant " . In the same way reading > > > about > > > > > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of the > > > text, not > > > > > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep dive > > > into the > > > > > sea. The " read-out " theory cant be assumed without " read-into " > > > > > fundamentals.At other side - " about the fear of general peoples " > > > is a > > > > > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this category of > > > > > fear-generator group. But it > > > > > > > > > > doesn't mean to stop read or learn about this or type of these > > > yogas. > > > > > Today u r saying not to support this Kaal Sarp Yog, after some > > > days > > > > > other will say -not to support VISHKANYA YOG etc. After all how > a > > > > > scholar can stop his readings or researches ? > > > > > Electricity is hazardous , but the theory of > > > > > electricity is not hazardous & reading of this theory can be > > > helpful > > > > > from safety-point of view from electricity. > > > > > With Regards > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > www.lalkitabee.com > > > > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. KP Miglani, > > > > > > > > > > > > There is absolutely NOTHING about Kala Sarpa Yoga in the great > > > Lal > > > > > > Kitab, no matter how much we twist or bend the text. > > > > > > > > > > > > Please always remember, we are supposed to read out of the > > > text, not > > > > > > into the text. After all, we are not the writers of the great > > > Lal > > > > > > Kitab, Pt. Roop Chand Joshi was. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " kpmiglani " > > > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Varun Ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree with you. I was wondering if you have read the > > > section on > > > > > > > Rahu + Ketu in the 1952 edition on page 323 of Arun Sanhita. > > > I do > > > > > > > not have the Urdu edition because I can not read urdu. I do > > > not > > > > know > > > > > > > why, but it sounds to me that the book is talking about the > > > kalsarp > > > > > > > yog in that context. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " varun_trvd " > > > > > > > <varun_trvd@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Miglani ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your point is well taken. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I accept that all planets hemmed by rahu and ketu and > > > half the > > > > > > > > horoscope going empty does give the horoscope a different > > > look. > > > > > > > What > > > > > > > > I am against is the scare that has been caused by this; or > > > > > > > treating > > > > > > > > this placement as a curse. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, it has not been proved beyond doubt that > > > whatever ills, > > > > > > > if > > > > > > > > at all, accrue are because of this placement. Till such > > > time that > > > > > > > > the ills in the horoscope get associated with this > > > placement, I > > > > > > > > would personally like to keep this in the grey area of > > > research. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In academic research all possibilities are examined and > > > > evaluated. > > > > > > > > Those not found tenable are left; they are not dumped. You > > > never > > > > > > > > know some body else comes up with a better explanation > > > later > > > > which > > > > > > > > proves the existence of a Kal Sarp Yog. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can not dump Kal Sarp Yog simply because this placement > > > did not > > > > > > > > find a mention in the classics. In other fields of life > > > there are > > > > > > > > quite a few things which did not find a mention in old > > > texts and > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > a reality today. Therefore we can not dump a thing on the > > > basis > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > classics are silent about it. Similarly I will not accept > > > it > > > > to be > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > reality till such time that it is proved beyond doubt that > > > a Yog > > > > > > > > like Kal Sarp Yog exists and these are the effects of it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefore I do not dump the Kal Sarp Yog as a figment of > > > > > > > > imagination, nor would give more credence then what it > > > deserves. > > > > > > > > When I said that I treat it a matter of grey area > > > research, it > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > that I accept its possible existence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " kpmiglani " > > > > > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Finn and Varun, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I hope you agree that if all the planets are on one side > > > of > > > > Rahu- > > > > > > > > > ketu axis and consequently half the horoscope stays > > > empty, it > > > > > > > > > presents an abnormal distribution of planets. This > > > abnormality > > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > not have gone unnoticed by the great astrology Savants, > > > > > > > including > > > > > > > > > Roopchandra ji. What name was given to this abnormality, > > > or how > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > it understood, or what it was taken to mean could be a > > > > matter of > > > > > > > > > debate. Whatever name we assign to it, it definitely > > > needs our > > > > > > > > > attention. We can not ignore it and sweep it under the > > > carpet. > > > > > > > > > As you both seem to suggest that this so called Kal Sarp > > > Yog > > > > has > > > > > > > > > been used by unscrupulous astrologers to intimidate > > > gullible > > > > > > > > seekers > > > > > > > > > and used as a money spinner, then it becomes all the > > > more > > > > > > > > imperative > > > > > > > > > on our part to bring out the truth such that it explains > > > the > > > > > > > > > phenomenon logically. By just saying that it does not > > > exist is > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > wishing some thing away. The phenomenon of all the > > > planets > > > > > > > hemmed > > > > > > > > > between rahu-ketu does exist, neither of you can deny. > > > Give it > > > > > > > > > whatever name you want, but a plausible well reasoned > > > response > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > expected before dumping it into the waste paper basket. > > > > > > > > > I am sorry if I have hurt any body's feelings, that has > > > never > > > > > > > been > > > > > > > > > my intention. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Finn > > > Wandahl " > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please, I mean nothing personal by this. I agree with > > > you > > > > that > > > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > > statements of Lal Kitab has a number of hidden > meanings > > > > hidden > > > > > > > > > within > > > > > > > > > > them. No doubt about that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I think we should always be very careful that > > > our > > > > > > > great > > > > > > > > > Lal > > > > > > > > > > Kitab is not being misused to support something > > > malefic like > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > general peoples fear, which I think is the case here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my honest opinion this whole Kala Sarpa yoga thing > > > > should be > > > > > > > > > > considered to be within the evil circle of Mercury. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > Finn > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > careful not to > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > , " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > Yes u r absolutly right, Descriptions of planets are > > > > usually > > > > > > > > > based on > > > > > > > > > > > religious cosmology but my explanations are based > > > upon the > > > > > > > > > predective & > > > > > > > > > > > remedial astrology of lalkitab.This is a reading > > > into the > > > > > > > > > text ,to > > > > > > > > > > > search out the vision about kalsarp yog in perview > > > of > > > > > > > > lalkitab.I > > > > > > > > > tried > > > > > > > > > > > to answer - does lalkitab includes kalsarp yog > > > directly or > > > > > > > > > indirectly? > > > > > > > > > > > . & i found it indirect state in lalkitab.(Here i > > > want to > > > > > > > say -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the word > > > > > > > > > > > KAALSARP has been used as a real snake by some > > > astrologers, > > > > > > > In > > > > > > > > > fact this > > > > > > > > > > > word was used to explain a YOG, like gajkesri YOG, > > > sunafaa > > > > > > > > YOG, > > > > > > > > > anafaa > > > > > > > > > > > YOG, etc. .Here the 1st word KAAL = TIME used as > > > KAAL= > > > > > > > HORROR, > > > > > > > > > DEATH ,by > > > > > > > > > > > some half baked quacksalvers.otherwise there r so > > > much > > > > > > > > > horoscopes having > > > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog with a cheerful life.) > > > > > > > > > > > Symbolic imaginations are very useful to > > > > understand to > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > > stream > > > > > > > > > > > of predective & remedial astrology while analyzing > > > any > > > > > > > > > horoscope.But my > > > > > > > > > > > views focused only to the horoscope for the purpose > > > of > > > > > > > > > predective or > > > > > > > > > > > remedial astrology . Im not trying to prove how are > > > rahu > > > > > > > ketu > > > > > > > > > explained > > > > > > > > > > > astronomically or in other style, bcoz whole > > > lalkitab is > > > > > > > based > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > logical predective & logical remedial theory, no > > > other > > > > > > > system > > > > > > > > i > > > > > > > > > found > > > > > > > > > > > like this. Otherwise Rahu ketu r accepted as shadow > > > planets > > > > > > > > > (CHHAYAA > > > > > > > > > > > GRAH)also. I think u wil be agree with my point of > > > > > > > view ,what > > > > > > > > i > > > > > > > > > want to > > > > > > > > > > > say.We cant deny symbolic imaginations while reading > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > This is > > > > > > > > > > > y- in very begining the author of this book Pt. > > > roop Chand > > > > > > > > > Joshi ji > > > > > > > > > > > adviced this book to read as a noval. > > > > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > > > > , " Finn > > > Wandahl " > > > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Descriptions of planets are usually based on > > > religious > > > > > > > > > cosmology, and > > > > > > > > > > > > in many religious texts Rahu is pictured as a big > > > snake > > > > > > > > > swallowing the > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun and causing eclipse to happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is a matter of fact, than in Varaha > > > Mihira's " Brihat > > > > > > > > > Samhita " (6th > > > > > > > > > > > > century AD) the very word " Rahu " is used for > > > eclipse and > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > word > > > > > > > > > > > > " Ketu " is the word for comets and meteors, since > > > comets > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > meteors > > > > > > > > > > > > look like tails when observed in the sky. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However there mere fact that Lal Kitab also > > > describes > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > something like this, cannot be used to > > > legitimate " Kala > > > > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > > > > Yoga " as > > > > > > > > > > > > somehow being linked to Lal Kitab. No way! I think > > > we > > > > > > > should > > > > > > > > > be honest > > > > > > > > > > > > about this - at least to our own good selves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When dealing with the great Lal Kitab, I think we > > > should > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > > careful to read out of the text, not into the > > > text. > > > > > > > > Otherwise > > > > > > > > > we may > > > > > > > > > > > > end up with some serious misunderstandings. At > > > least this > > > > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > > > > > be my own humble opinion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > , " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitabee@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl & Members > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your keen observations r absolutly right that > > > > Nowhere any > > > > > > > > > > > description > > > > > > > > > > > > > with the name as " Kalsarp Yoga " in lalkitab. So > > > we can > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > > > > > > does > > > > > > > > > > > > > not consider Kalsarp yoga. But with humble words > > > I want > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > share > > > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > > own views in this perview..This article was > > > written by > > > > > > > me > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > past in > > > > > > > > > > > > > other group.I think it will be helpfull to under > > > stand > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > topic- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RESPECTED MEMBERS lalkitab accepts Rahu as the > > > > > > > > > > > > > head of snake & ketu as the tail of snake & > > > saturn is > > > > > > > > > elaborated as > > > > > > > > > > > > > snake in lalkitab.As example in the very > > > begining of > > > > > > > > > lalkitab says > > > > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > > > > rahu ketu-- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. EK NE INSAAN KO SIR SE PAKDAA HAI DOOSRE NE > > > PAIR SE. > > > > > > > TO > > > > > > > > > KHUD BA > > > > > > > > > > > > KHUD UNKO JAGAH MIL GAYEE (Means ;- Rahu will be > > > treated > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > head & > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu as tail) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. About saturn - shani khana no 4 addressed as > > > PANI KA > > > > > > > > > SAANP, Shani > > > > > > > > > > > > > khana no.5 as BACHCHEY KHANE WALAA SAANP, Shani > > > khana > > > > > > > no. > > > > > > > > 6 > > > > > > > > > as RAAT > > > > > > > > > > > > KA ANDHAA SAANP. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So much use of this word prooves that saturn is > > > called > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > snake in > > > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now an opinion of mine is that Kalsarp means > > > kal= > > > > > > > > > time ,SAMAY Sarp - > > > > > > > > > > > > > snake. As defination we can say that the cycle > > > of time > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > which all > > > > > > > > > > > > > planets come between Rahu & Ketu in any > > > horoscope will > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > treated as > > > > > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog. It is declared name in Jyotish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At other side when i saw in lalkitab-- i found > > > some > > > > > > > > > discriptions & > > > > > > > > > > > > > definations as below > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.PEHLEY GHARON MAIN DUM KETU HOTE > > > ICHCHHAADHAARI SHANI > > > > > > > > > HOTAA HO > > > > > > > > > > > > > ULAT MAGAR JAB TEVE BAITHA AZDAHAA KHOONI BANTAA > > > HO > > > > > > > (here > > > > > > > > > ajdahaa is > > > > > > > > > > > > > AJGAR SNAKE)SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY > > > MUKHDAA > > > > > > > > (Head) > > > > > > > > > RAHU > > > > > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA HO (Page no. 585 oroginal book 1952) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2.SANICHCHAR KO AGAR SAANP MAANAA JAYE TO USKI > > > DUM KETU > > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE > > > > > > > > > > > > > WALE GHAR MAIN HOGI AUR SIR USKAA RAHU BAITHAA > > > HONE > > > > WALE > > > > > > > > > GHAR MAIN > > > > > > > > > > > > GINAA JAYEGAA YA SANICHCHAR KA SIR RAHU HOGAA AUR > > > > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > > > > KI DUM > > > > > > > > > > > > KETU HOGI > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (PAGE NO. 588 at no. 5 in the chapter of AAM > > > HAALAT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Shani ka swabhav is specially counted by RAHU > > > > KETU in > > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > As > > > > > > > > > > > > > well as at page no. 590 ---MANDI HAALAT MAIN > > > AMOOMAN > > > > > > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE WALE GHAR KE DONO TARAF HEE DAAYAIN > > > (RIGHT) > > > > > > > > > BAAYAIN > > > > > > > > > > > > (LEFT) RAHU KETU BAITHAA HONE KE VAQT UNKAA BHEE > > > MANDAA > > > > > > > ASAR > > > > > > > > > HOGAA. > > > > > > > > > > > > > (after this a chart has been written at page 590 > > > > showing > > > > > > > > BAD > > > > > > > > > effects > > > > > > > > > > > > > of SAANP (Shani) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4.At page no. 623 I saw the defination about bad > > > saturn > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > below > > > > > > > > > > > > > HEADING:- SANICHCHAR KE MANDE ASAR KA RUKH > > > KIDHAR HOGAA > > > > > > > > > > > > > RAHU KO SIR AUR KETU KO DUM (tail) SAMAJHKAR EK > > > SAANP > > > > > > > KEE > > > > > > > > > SHAKAL > > > > > > > > > > > > (shape)BANAYAIN TO RAHU BAITHAA HONE WAALE GHAR SE > > > AAGE > > > > > > > > JAHAAN > > > > > > > > > KAHIN > > > > > > > > > > > > BHI YAANI JIS KHAANE MAIN REKHAA NIKAL KAR SEEDHEE > > > HEE > > > > JAA > > > > > > > > > SAKTEE HO , > > > > > > > > > > > > US GHAR PAR SHANI KA ASAR PADEGAA (Here also > > > pandit ji > > > > > > > > assumed > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > snake).Even this line has been said for saturn > > > khana 8. > > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > > > context also saturn treated as snake & rahu called > > > as > > > > head > > > > > > > & > > > > > > > > > ketu as > > > > > > > > > > > > tail. As said above > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :--- SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA > > > (Head) > > > > > > > RAHU > > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA > > > > > > > > > > > HO. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It means we can create a shape of snake in each > > > > > > > horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Here my only view is that lalkitab already > > > persues Rahu > > > > > > > > ketu > > > > > > > > > as head > > > > > > > > > > > > & tail of Saturn (Snake) & if a horoscope comes > > > befor us > > > > > > > > > including all > > > > > > > > > > > > planets between Rahu & Ketu ,then as per > > > lalkitab ,a > > > > > > > picture > > > > > > > > > appears > > > > > > > > > > > > that all planets controlled at one side (left or > > > > right) by > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > snake > > > > > > > > > > > > (Saturn) placing his head rahu & tail Ketu. So > > > even > > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > > > > does not > > > > > > > > > > > > used the word KALSARP YOG directly.But above said > > > > > > > situation > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > > > gives us an image of Horoscope as Kal = Time or > > > SAMAY & > > > > > > > Sarp > > > > > > > > = > > > > > > > > > Snake > > > > > > > > > > > > Yog,created in horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yaani ki Samay ke ya vaqt ke mutabik sabhi > > > > > > > > > > > > > grah saanp ke sir (head) aur dum (Tail) ko paar > > > nahi > > > > kar > > > > > > > > > sake aur ek > > > > > > > > > > > > > aisa yog ban baithaa jiskaa naam kalsarp yog ke > > > alawaa > > > > > > > aur > > > > > > > > > kuchh > > > > > > > > > > > bolnaa > > > > > > > > > > > > > sateek nahee maaloom hotaa.Bhaley hee laalkitab > > > main > > > > ise > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > naam se > > > > > > > > > > > > > naheen kahaa gayaa hai lekin rahu aur ketu ko to > > > saanp > > > > > > > > > (Saturn) ka > > > > > > > > > > > sir > > > > > > > > > > > > > aur dum kahaa gayaa hai. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All this is my view as per understanding of > > > quotes of > > > > > > > > revered > > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But knowledge & research has no limit.I m owed > > > to all > > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > > > members & there views. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > , " Finn > > > > > > > Wandahl " > > > > > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kala sarpa Yoga and its opposite, the so > called > > > > " Sweet > > > > > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > > > > > > Yoga " , > > > > > > > > > > > > > > are by no means ancient. Both these Yogas were > > > > > > > > introduced > > > > > > > > > by the > > > > > > > > > > > late > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao (Meena) in > > > his > > > > > > > > > book 'Naadi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Joytisha', written somewhere in the 1950-ties. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, Mr. Gopala Krishna Rao never > > > mentioned > > > > > > > anything > > > > > > > > > about an > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Upaya for this Yoga. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kalasarpa Yoga is not being mentioned in any > > > of the > > > > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > > > > > > classics of Hindu astrology. It is also not > > > being > > > > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > > > > > > anywhere > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in our great Lal Kitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I also like to mention that my good friend Mr. > > > K.N. > > > > > > > Rao > > > > > > > > > from Delhi > > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > very critical about Kala Sarpa Yoga, since it > > > has > > > > been > > > > > > > > > misused a > > > > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to scare the people, very much like the way > > > Mangal- > > > > > > > dosha > > > > > > > > > and the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7½-years of Saturn are being used to > exploit > > > people > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > > , " varun_trvd " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > varun_trvd@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Rakesh ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Go to the files section of the following > > > group. > > > > Read > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > article > > > > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kal Sarp yog and its upaya. You will know > > > about our > > > > > > > > > views on it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > > > > , " rakesh.behal " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <rakesh.behal@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i request you all that please > > > discuss > > > > > > > KALSARP > > > > > > > > > YOG what > > > > > > > > > > > lal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kitab > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > says about this and does it really affect > a > > > > person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > waht upayas one can do to get rid of its > > > adverse > > > > > > > > > effects. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rakesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Respected Mr. Wandahl With humble words i want to say- we already know about kaalsarp yog & search out remedies through lalkitab. The axis of Rahu & Ketu is the point in this perview .If we find this axis malefic, we search out its remedies through lalkitab. As example - Ketu in 1st & Rahu in 7th, all other planets between the axis ( in houses no. 2,3,4,5,6). Person having this planetry position has been married bfor the age of 21 & married life is disturbed ,no child has been gotten due to health probs. He comes to me ask remedy & at the age of 25 (Shukkar).I suggest him remedy for Ketu 1st & Rahu 7th as per Lalkitab & seperatly suggest him to throw pair of silver snakes in flowing water. (bcoz Rahu & Ketu r head & tail of the snake (Saturn) as per lalkitab. Tell me - is it unethical? We have to right to search out our solutions from our source as per conditions. Mr. Wndahl, we do not depend to be served in silver plates we r competent on our own.All of us are gathered to do more & more work in astrological fields of lalkitab & views will spread on their own & all we have to do is to make efforts.Im sure readers will be benefitted by ur 30 astrological years. With Regards Pt.Lalkitabee V.Shukla , " Finn Wandahl " <finn.wandahl wrote: > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla, > > Yes, I agree with you that KSY is also a yoga that can be found in the > charts of the people. However, to in order to get the proper knowledge > about Kala Sarpa Yoga you need to look for it in the right places, not > in the wrong places. > > I have already told that no information about KSY can be found in any > of the classical texts. Like I said, KSY was mentioned for the first > time in the book " Naadi Joytisha " (3 vols) by the late hindu > astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao, with the pen-name " Meena " . This is > where I suggest you to focus your attention in the first place. Only > this way you may get the right and truthful information about KSY. > > Like I said earlier, Pt. Gopala Krishna Raho had two disciples, one of > whom was the late Prof. K.S. Krishnamurthi, the founder of the > KP-school, I forgot the name of the other one, except that it was a > Brahmin name, a rather short one, but he is perhaps also worth looking > into. Therefore to find out more about KSY, you need to read carefully > all the five KP-readers and study the old issues of their astrological > magazine as well. There might be some information on KSY hitten somewhere. > > Now I have told you where to start, but I have no wish to serve the > information to you on a silver-plate. You need to do your own > research, if you really want to find out about this matter. > > This is how I got my knowledge, by deep study, careful research and > contemplating the results over a period of nearly 30 years. > > Best regards, > Finn Wandahl > > > , " lalkitabee " > <lalkitabee@> wrote: > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > Kaalsarp yog is also a yog.U r known about -how it can be decided in a > > horoscope. If the same situation may be described in lalkitab without > > any name with some other definations, > > what will u say it ? It can be called Kaalsarp Yog bcoz no other > > word seems adequate for this. As example- elephants are in Africa & > > Asia with some phisical differences. But there is no contradiction > > about the use of the word " elephant " . In the same way reading about > > Kaalsarp Yog in perview of lalkitab ,is a reading out of the text, not > > only into the text. U can bring out pearls after a deep dive into the > > sea. The " read-out " theory cant be assumed without " read-into " > > fundamentals.At other side - " about the fear of general peoples " is a > > defferent scenerio.Not only kaalsarp Yog is in this category of > > fear-generator group. But it > > > > doesn't mean to stop read or learn about this or type of these yogas. > > Today u r saying not to support this Kaal Sarp Yog, after some days > > other will say -not to support VISHKANYA YOG etc. After all how a > > scholar can stop his readings or researches ? > > Electricity is hazardous , but the theory of > > electricity is not hazardous & reading of this theory can be helpful > > from safety-point of view from electricity. > > With Regards > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > V.Shukla > > www.lalkitabee.com > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Mr. KP Miglani, > > > > > > There is absolutely NOTHING about Kala Sarpa Yoga in the great Lal > > > Kitab, no matter how much we twist or bend the text. > > > > > > Please always remember, we are supposed to read out of the text, not > > > into the text. After all, we are not the writers of the great Lal > > > Kitab, Pt. Roop Chand Joshi was. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > , " kpmiglani " > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Varun Ji, > > > > > > > > I agree with you. I was wondering if you have read the section on > > > > Rahu + Ketu in the 1952 edition on page 323 of Arun Sanhita. I do > > > > not have the Urdu edition because I can not read urdu. I do not > know > > > > why, but it sounds to me that the book is talking about the kalsarp > > > > yog in that context. > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " varun_trvd " > > > > <varun_trvd@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Respected Miglani ji, > > > > > > > > > > Your point is well taken. > > > > > > > > > > I accept that all planets hemmed by rahu and ketu and half the > > > > > horoscope going empty does give the horoscope a different look. > > > > What > > > > > I am against is the scare that has been caused by this; or > > > > treating > > > > > this placement as a curse. > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, it has not been proved beyond doubt that whatever ills, > > > > if > > > > > at all, accrue are because of this placement. Till such time that > > > > > the ills in the horoscope get associated with this placement, I > > > > > would personally like to keep this in the grey area of research. > > > > > > > > > > In academic research all possibilities are examined and > evaluated. > > > > > Those not found tenable are left; they are not dumped. You never > > > > > know some body else comes up with a better explanation later > which > > > > > proves the existence of a Kal Sarp Yog. > > > > > > > > > > I can not dump Kal Sarp Yog simply because this placement did not > > > > > find a mention in the classics. In other fields of life there are > > > > > quite a few things which did not find a mention in old texts and > > > > are > > > > > a reality today. Therefore we can not dump a thing on the basis > > > > that > > > > > classics are silent about it. Similarly I will not accept it > to be > > > > a > > > > > reality till such time that it is proved beyond doubt that a Yog > > > > > like Kal Sarp Yog exists and these are the effects of it. > > > > > > > > > > Therefore I do not dump the Kal Sarp Yog as a figment of > > > > > imagination, nor would give more credence then what it deserves. > > > > > When I said that I treat it a matter of grey area research, it > > > > means > > > > > that I accept its possible existence. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " kpmiglani " > > > > > <kpmiglani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Finn and Varun, > > > > > > > > > > > > I hope you agree that if all the planets are on one side of > Rahu- > > > > > > ketu axis and consequently half the horoscope stays empty, it > > > > > > presents an abnormal distribution of planets. This abnormality > > > > > could > > > > > > not have gone unnoticed by the great astrology Savants, > > > > including > > > > > > Roopchandra ji. What name was given to this abnormality, or how > > > > > was > > > > > > it understood, or what it was taken to mean could be a > matter of > > > > > > debate. Whatever name we assign to it, it definitely needs our > > > > > > attention. We can not ignore it and sweep it under the carpet. > > > > > > As you both seem to suggest that this so called Kal Sarp Yog > has > > > > > > been used by unscrupulous astrologers to intimidate gullible > > > > > seekers > > > > > > and used as a money spinner, then it becomes all the more > > > > > imperative > > > > > > on our part to bring out the truth such that it explains the > > > > > > phenomenon logically. By just saying that it does not exist is > > > > > like > > > > > > wishing some thing away. The phenomenon of all the planets > > > > hemmed > > > > > > between rahu-ketu does exist, neither of you can deny. Give it > > > > > > whatever name you want, but a plausible well reasoned response > > > > is > > > > > > expected before dumping it into the waste paper basket. > > > > > > I am sorry if I have hurt any body's feelings, that has never > > > > been > > > > > > my intention. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > > > KP Miglani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please, I mean nothing personal by this. I agree with you > that > > > > > many > > > > > > > statements of Lal Kitab has a number of hidden meanings > hidden > > > > > > within > > > > > > > them. No doubt about that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I think we should always be very careful that our > > > > great > > > > > > Lal > > > > > > > Kitab is not being misused to support something malefic like > > > > the > > > > > > > general peoples fear, which I think is the case here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my honest opinion this whole Kala Sarpa yoga thing > should be > > > > > > > considered to be within the evil circle of Mercury. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > Finn > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > careful not to > > > > > > > , " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > <lalkitabee@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl > > > > > > > > Yes u r absolutly right, Descriptions of planets are > usually > > > > > > based on > > > > > > > > religious cosmology but my explanations are based upon the > > > > > > predective & > > > > > > > > remedial astrology of lalkitab.This is a reading into the > > > > > > text ,to > > > > > > > > search out the vision about kalsarp yog in perview of > > > > > lalkitab.I > > > > > > tried > > > > > > > > to answer - does lalkitab includes kalsarp yog directly or > > > > > > indirectly? > > > > > > > > . & i found it indirect state in lalkitab.(Here i want to > > > > say -- > > > > > > > > > > > the word > > > > > > > > KAALSARP has been used as a real snake by some astrologers, > > > > In > > > > > > fact this > > > > > > > > word was used to explain a YOG, like gajkesri YOG, sunafaa > > > > > YOG, > > > > > > anafaa > > > > > > > > YOG, etc. .Here the 1st word KAAL = TIME used as KAAL= > > > > HORROR, > > > > > > DEATH ,by > > > > > > > > some half baked quacksalvers.otherwise there r so much > > > > > > horoscopes having > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog with a cheerful life.) > > > > > > > > Symbolic imaginations are very useful to > understand to > > > > > any > > > > > > stream > > > > > > > > of predective & remedial astrology while analyzing any > > > > > > horoscope.But my > > > > > > > > views focused only to the horoscope for the purpose of > > > > > > predective or > > > > > > > > remedial astrology . Im not trying to prove how are rahu > > > > ketu > > > > > > explained > > > > > > > > astronomically or in other style, bcoz whole lalkitab is > > > > based > > > > > on > > > > > > > > logical predective & logical remedial theory, no other > > > > system > > > > > i > > > > > > found > > > > > > > > like this. Otherwise Rahu ketu r accepted as shadow planets > > > > > > (CHHAYAA > > > > > > > > GRAH)also. I think u wil be agree with my point of > > > > view ,what > > > > > i > > > > > > want to > > > > > > > > say.We cant deny symbolic imaginations while reading > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > This is > > > > > > > > y- in very begining the author of this book Pt. roop Chand > > > > > > Joshi ji > > > > > > > > adviced this book to read as a noval. > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > , " Finn Wandahl " > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. V. Shukla (Lalkitabee), > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Descriptions of planets are usually based on religious > > > > > > cosmology, and > > > > > > > > > in many religious texts Rahu is pictured as a big snake > > > > > > swallowing the > > > > > > > > > Sun and causing eclipse to happen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is a matter of fact, than in Varaha Mihira's " Brihat > > > > > > Samhita " (6th > > > > > > > > > century AD) the very word " Rahu " is used for eclipse and > > > > the > > > > > > word > > > > > > > > > " Ketu " is the word for comets and meteors, since comets > > > > and > > > > > > meteors > > > > > > > > > look like tails when observed in the sky. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However there mere fact that Lal Kitab also describes > Rahu > > > > > and > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > > something like this, cannot be used to legitimate " Kala > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > Yoga " as > > > > > > > > > somehow being linked to Lal Kitab. No way! I think we > > > > should > > > > > > be honest > > > > > > > > > about this - at least to our own good selves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When dealing with the great Lal Kitab, I think we should > > > > be > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > careful to read out of the text, not into the text. > > > > > Otherwise > > > > > > we may > > > > > > > > > end up with some serious misunderstandings. At least this > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > > be my own humble opinion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " lalkitabee " > > > > > > > > > lalkitabee@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Mr. Wandahl & Members > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your keen observations r absolutly right that > Nowhere any > > > > > > > > description > > > > > > > > > > with the name as " Kalsarp Yoga " in lalkitab. So we can > > > > say > > > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > > > does > > > > > > > > > > not consider Kalsarp yoga. But with humble words I want > > > > to > > > > > > share > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > own views in this perview..This article was written by > > > > me > > > > > in > > > > > > past in > > > > > > > > > > other group.I think it will be helpfull to under stand > > > > the > > > > > > topic- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > LALKITAB & KAALSARP YOG > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RESPECTED MEMBERS lalkitab accepts Rahu as the > > > > > > > > > > head of snake & ketu as the tail of snake & saturn is > > > > > > elaborated as > > > > > > > > > > snake in lalkitab.As example in the very begining of > > > > > > lalkitab says > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > rahu ketu-- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. EK NE INSAAN KO SIR SE PAKDAA HAI DOOSRE NE PAIR SE. > > > > TO > > > > > > KHUD BA > > > > > > > > > KHUD UNKO JAGAH MIL GAYEE (Means ;- Rahu will be treated > > > > as > > > > > > head & > > > > > > > > > Ketu as tail) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. About saturn - shani khana no 4 addressed as PANI KA > > > > > > SAANP, Shani > > > > > > > > > > khana no.5 as BACHCHEY KHANE WALAA SAANP, Shani khana > > > > no. > > > > > 6 > > > > > > as RAAT > > > > > > > > > KA ANDHAA SAANP. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So much use of this word prooves that saturn is called > > > > as > > > > > > snake in > > > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now an opinion of mine is that Kalsarp means kal= > > > > > > time ,SAMAY Sarp - > > > > > > > > > > snake. As defination we can say that the cycle of time > > > > in > > > > > > which all > > > > > > > > > > planets come between Rahu & Ketu in any horoscope will > > > > be > > > > > > treated as > > > > > > > > > > kalsarp yog. It is declared name in Jyotish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At other side when i saw in lalkitab-- i found some > > > > > > discriptions & > > > > > > > > > > definations as below > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.PEHLEY GHARON MAIN DUM KETU HOTE ICHCHHAADHAARI SHANI > > > > > > HOTAA HO > > > > > > > > > > ULAT MAGAR JAB TEVE BAITHA AZDAHAA KHOONI BANTAA HO > > > > (here > > > > > > ajdahaa is > > > > > > > > > > AJGAR SNAKE)SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA > > > > > (Head) > > > > > > RAHU > > > > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA HO (Page no. 585 oroginal book 1952) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2.SANICHCHAR KO AGAR SAANP MAANAA JAYE TO USKI DUM KETU > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE > > > > > > > > > > WALE GHAR MAIN HOGI AUR SIR USKAA RAHU BAITHAA HONE > WALE > > > > > > GHAR MAIN > > > > > > > > > GINAA JAYEGAA YA SANICHCHAR KA SIR RAHU HOGAA AUR > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > KI DUM > > > > > > > > > KETU HOGI > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (PAGE NO. 588 at no. 5 in the chapter of AAM HAALAT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Shani ka swabhav is specially counted by RAHU > KETU in > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > As > > > > > > > > > > well as at page no. 590 ---MANDI HAALAT MAIN AMOOMAN > > > > > > SANICHCHAR > > > > > > > > > BAITHAA HONE WALE GHAR KE DONO TARAF HEE DAAYAIN (RIGHT) > > > > > > BAAYAIN > > > > > > > > > (LEFT) RAHU KETU BAITHAA HONE KE VAQT UNKAA BHEE MANDAA > > > > ASAR > > > > > > HOGAA. > > > > > > > > > > (after this a chart has been written at page 590 > showing > > > > > BAD > > > > > > effects > > > > > > > > > > of SAANP (Shani) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4.At page no. 623 I saw the defination about bad saturn > > > > as > > > > > > below > > > > > > > > > > HEADING:- SANICHCHAR KE MANDE ASAR KA RUKH KIDHAR HOGAA > > > > > > > > > > RAHU KO SIR AUR KETU KO DUM (tail) SAMAJHKAR EK SAANP > > > > KEE > > > > > > SHAKAL > > > > > > > > > (shape)BANAYAIN TO RAHU BAITHAA HONE WAALE GHAR SE AAGE > > > > > JAHAAN > > > > > > KAHIN > > > > > > > > > BHI YAANI JIS KHAANE MAIN REKHAA NIKAL KAR SEEDHEE HEE > JAA > > > > > > SAKTEE HO , > > > > > > > > > US GHAR PAR SHANI KA ASAR PADEGAA (Here also pandit ji > > > > > assumed > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > snake).Even this line has been said for saturn khana 8. > > > > But > > > > > in > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > context also saturn treated as snake & rahu called as > head > > > > & > > > > > > ketu as > > > > > > > > > tail. As said above > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :--- SAANP SHANI DUM(tail) KETU GINTEY MUKHDAA (Head) > > > > RAHU > > > > > > KHUD HOTAA > > > > > > > > HO. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It means we can create a shape of snake in each > > > > horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > Here my only view is that lalkitab already persues Rahu > > > > > ketu > > > > > > as head > > > > > > > > > & tail of Saturn (Snake) & if a horoscope comes befor us > > > > > > including all > > > > > > > > > planets between Rahu & Ketu ,then as per lalkitab ,a > > > > picture > > > > > > appears > > > > > > > > > that all planets controlled at one side (left or > right) by > > > > > the > > > > > > snake > > > > > > > > > (Saturn) placing his head rahu & tail Ketu. So even > > > > lalkitab > > > > > > does not > > > > > > > > > used the word KALSARP YOG directly.But above said > > > > situation > > > > > of > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > gives us an image of Horoscope as Kal = Time or SAMAY & > > > > Sarp > > > > > = > > > > > > Snake > > > > > > > > > Yog,created in horoscope. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yaani ki Samay ke ya vaqt ke mutabik sabhi > > > > > > > > > > grah saanp ke sir (head) aur dum (Tail) ko paar nahi > kar > > > > > > sake aur ek > > > > > > > > > > aisa yog ban baithaa jiskaa naam kalsarp yog ke alawaa > > > > aur > > > > > > kuchh > > > > > > > > bolnaa > > > > > > > > > > sateek nahee maaloom hotaa.Bhaley hee laalkitab main > ise > > > > > is > > > > > > naam se > > > > > > > > > > naheen kahaa gayaa hai lekin rahu aur ketu ko to saanp > > > > > > (Saturn) ka > > > > > > > > sir > > > > > > > > > > aur dum kahaa gayaa hai. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All this is my view as per understanding of quotes of > > > > > revered > > > > > > > > lalkitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But knowledge & research has no limit.I m owed to all > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > members & there views. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pt.Lalkitabee > > > > > > > > > > V.Shukla > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Finn > > > > Wandahl " > > > > > > > > > > <finn.wandahl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Mr. Varun Trivedi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kala sarpa Yoga and its opposite, the so called > " Sweet > > > > > > Sarpa > > > > > > > > Yoga " , > > > > > > > > > > > are by no means ancient. Both these Yogas were > > > > > introduced > > > > > > by the > > > > > > > > late > > > > > > > > > > > Hindu astrologer Gopala Krishna Rao (Meena) in his > > > > > > book 'Naadi > > > > > > > > > > > Joytisha', written somewhere in the 1950-ties. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, Mr. Gopala Krishna Rao never mentioned > > > > anything > > > > > > about an > > > > > > > > > > > Upaya for this Yoga. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kalasarpa Yoga is not being mentioned in any of the > > > > > > traditional > > > > > > > > > > > classics of Hindu astrology. It is also not being > > > > > mentioned > > > > > > > > anywhere > > > > > > > > > > > in our great Lal Kitab. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I also like to mention that my good friend Mr. K.N. > > > > Rao > > > > > > from Delhi > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > very critical about Kala Sarpa Yoga, since it has > been > > > > > > misused a > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > to scare the people, very much like the way Mangal- > > > > dosha > > > > > > and the > > > > > > > > > > > 7½-years of Saturn are being used to exploit people > > > > all > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Finn Wandahl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > , " varun_trvd " > > > > > > > > > > > varun_trvd@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Rakesh ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Go to the files section of the following group. > Read > > > > > the > > > > > > article > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > Kal Sarp yog and its upaya. You will know about our > > > > > > views on it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > / > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varun Trivedi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > , " rakesh.behal " > > > > > > > > > > > > <rakesh.behal@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > i request you all that please discuss > > > > KALSARP > > > > > > YOG what > > > > > > > > lal > > > > > > > > > > > > kitab > > > > > > > > > > > > > says about this and does it really affect a > person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > waht upayas one can do to get rid of its adverse > > > > > > effects. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > rakesh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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