Exaltation/Debilitation Revisited - Reply to Balaji

April 26, 2005

Dear tw853,

Such things keep happening all the time tw...

It takes all kinds to make this world...

Some have a penchant for being "more loyal than the king..."

In all fairness,in any group, we must learn to take all kinds of people in our stride...in my humble opinion...there I agree with you...!

Yours sincerely,

lyrastro1

tw853 <tw853 wrote:

Dear Balaji,1. This is KP discussion forum as you've said, where serious discussions conducive to the further development of KP are discussed with references of speciic titles and page numbers, which myself and Kanak ji are asking you to show a proof of what you're saying KP. The buden of proof is on your side.2. I'm wondering what is your real motive of making Sandy upset for her contribution in this group because---1) I traced all posts of your Dual (you & Inder) in Jyotish Remedies group and Inder used to make KP analysis, but one time asking Bob Singh, who is asking advice, to give KP (caculated) chart.2) After some time of my lengthy demonstration KP post by MSg #11436 in that group, it's nice to see the Dual in our group. 3) I asked Inder for permission

to repost some of his many many KP practical analysis in the previous group for the benefit of KP learners in this group.4) Sorry, Inder, I don't have time to trace back all your mails again, for examples like kidding by saying you're going to practice Dr. Kar's sub sub theory, am I right or You're right between the Dual without mentioning the real point, in the case of PRINCIPLES OF CUSPAL INTERLINKS by K. Baskaran, who has some intirely diffent basic views from KSK as mentioned in his EPILOGUE of that book pp 200-203.5) You were confused by seeing KSK originals regarding debilitation for the first time as if I'm making confusion.6) Then you asked Shri Raichur about the basic KP idea related to 4-step method, mentioned by A.R. Raichur, B.E., F.I.E. in the above mentioned Baskaran's first book, pp x-xi, which you recommand Inder to buy, and also explained in the same page you mentioned in Astrosecrets &

Krishnamurti Padhdhati, Part 1, in bold letters. 7) Then suddenly you've started saying, in KP group, only KP, no place for exaltation or delibitation, so on even with posting in bold and red letters. 8) No need to backe off ucha and neecha reference mentioned by bold and red letters because NEECHABHANGARAJAYOGA, STHOOADHARMAKARMADHIPAYOGA are mentioned in "The Horoscope of Prof. rishnamurti" by M.G.G. Nayar in Astrosecrets and KP, Part I, 2003, pp 249-271; also in "Notable Persons & Krishnamurti Padhdhati, by K. Hariharan,1993, pp 8-33.3. Dear Inder, please mention what is your exact view, for example "there is no place or place to analyse strength of planets by exaltation or debilitation in KP", and of course if you want to say it's KP, please provide specific KSK or KP references of titles and page numbers, in a short to the point, precise form, not easy type in another group. If you're

saying it's your personal opinion, I've no comment; if yours is KP, I promise you to respond honestly whether it's consistent with KSK or KP references. I never say right or wrong which I don't have authoriy.Thanks and best regards,Best regards,tw , "Balaji G.krishnan" <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:> Dear tw853 and all,> > I have already given the reference told by Great guruji K.S.K himself which clearly explains the views of Great Guruji K.S.K and I am also not denying the fact that ucha and neecha are referred by K.S.K in his articles.> > Please go through all my mails,you can see the substance of my point.> > Exalted planets and debilitated planets can effect only as a indicator and the real analysis about the strength of planets has to go on star of the planet and its aspects,conjuction

and all other significant points as told in his system.> > The root of K.P stands in the star and its disposition and exaltation or debilitation can be considered as an indicator.Many points in traditional are still contradictory,unclear and subject to arguments.> > Thats why Guruji has not stressed much on those topics.More over they are not the real giver of results when you analyse.Exalted planet can give bad results and debilitated planet can give good results.Everything depends on the signification of star and sub of a planet.Even,in all the Astro secrets Part1,2,3> you can see in no articles when analysing the charts these aspects like exaltation or any traditional aspects is not stressed.> > I am also open to do research and welcome new things coming to K.P system and if possible I will also add to that.I love those who do research for the betterment of the system

and I hate those who distract the progress of the system.> > I sincerely feel very bad what sandy has understood and taking these undesirable steps.Anyway,my sincere apologise to her from my side if really it has hurt her feelings or sentiments.I also accept the fact that she has done a wonderful work on K.P in her website and I wish her a successful future.> > Forum is a place of discussion.Some says Yes and some No.But should we windup from the action simply that we are getting NO.In fact,here nobody has said anything bad against anybody and it is all our views and for the betterment of the system,we work.Respected Raichurji,yogesh raoji and punitji has also quite good years of experience in the field and we have argued well and they are not taking any hard decisions.> > In life,we cannot expect to go in one way.> > My understanding on the subject is clear

and the problem here is trying to explain you all.Thats understood.My experience might be very less compared to many here but its not the years that counts the worth but the understanding.I want to be a good friend of all and to the good things around me.If somebody likes it or not,I am sorry thats the wish of the fate.> > With thanks> Balaji.G> > Note:Here,I am not meaning anybody in particular.These are all general views from my heart.> > tw853 <tw853> wrote:> > Dear Balaji,> > Shri Anat Raichur and Sandy are not saying Uchcha, Neecha is > auspacious but about strength of exalted and debelitated planets. > For creditibily of what you're asying is KP, where are your > references from KP Readers? > > > Best regards,> > tw> > > Qoute> > Is not Mercury Neecha?>

> In K.P. there is no use for Uchcha, Neecha, etc. In Sir C.P. > Ramaswamy Iyer's chart, how many planets are Neecha. In the horoscope > of the president of the Income-Tax Tribunal which we saw today are > not Jupiter, Mars, etc.,Neecha. Are there not 3 neechas in your > proprietor's chart (Sun, Moon, and Venus). Whereas you have exalted > Mercury and Mars. What do you do? When we presses the bottom and you > hear the calling bell, you, with your pencil and note-book run to his > room.> > True, Sir. I also wonder why Hindus following traditional sytem say > that Uchchas give very good results. Neechas bring untold miseries. I > think that they start forgetting what they were following all along > and at least now begin to learn your system. > > Unqote> > > > , "Balaji G.krishnan" >

<balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:> > Dear Rangarajanji and all,> > > > To my great guruji sri.K.S.K or to me,defaming anything or stopping > anybody is not the intention rather the essence of science should be > known to all for a better prediction..I would say very accurate > prediction.> > > > When graham bell invented a phone,it is not a cordless.Today,Mobile > phones are available with video display.How.Let we shed the old > things which is not useful or correct and take which gives > success,time-saving,accurate results.> > > > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K and his hundreds of students have done a > laborious research by spending many years and many good things.They > have shown us a path in thier books,articles and message.Then,why we > should again look back.Atleast to respect his system which as I told

> before is a well tested,certified one.If we are given a driving > license by the govt through right means and with right persons,(I > mean all legal),why we should again go for a driving class to learn > the learnt things.> > > > As a lover of astro science,I dont want to hurt anybody's > sentiments or feelings but my strong point here is in K.P forum let > we talk about K.P only and if we can develop something good from here > like judging a match,finding the blood group of a man,etc....Thats > research in the right line.Using K.P anything can be done provided > right understanding of the subject and clear mind.> > > > I cannot intervene in others tastes and preferences.> > > > FOR ALL REF:K.P & ASTROLOGY 1995,A very detailed article written by > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K > > "HOW TO JUDGE A NATIVITY",PAGE NO,47

LAST PARA..> > > > PLS EVERYBODY WHO TALKS ABOUT EXALTATION GO THROUGH THIS.....HAVE A > CLEAR MIND.> > > > > > with regards> > Balaji G> > > > > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m...> wrote:> > > > Dear Balaji,> > I definitely accept your observation that in his early research days> > KSK might have tried many ideas from the traditional system. One of> > the things missing in his Readers is the history and chronology. How> > can one know what he tried earlier but gave up later?> > > > Please understand that all my comments and questions are merely to> > understand KP system better and is not intended to challenge any > idea> > or anyone.> > > > Regards,> > Rangarajan> > > > --- In

, "Balaji G.krishnan"> > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:> > > Dear Rangarajanji and all,> > > > > > We all should understand a point that any newly invented theories > of> > today comes from the old existing principles and also when a correct> > solution has to be find using a system during great guruji's day..> > > > > > just imagine for a while, when transportation is not that much> > good,no computer,no awareness among the public,etc.In these> > situations,guruji taken the traditional astrology and done a great> > research only for a simple reason that to prove astrology is a> > science.A universally applicable system,easy to work and> > understand,etc are some of his goals.> > > > > > So,in early days of his research the articles written by him

gives> > the flavour of traditional approach also.But finally after his > mamoth> > efforts alnog with his devoted students has given a point that "NO> > PLANETS CAN EXALTED OR DEBILITATED AND EVEN IF SO,THIS DOES NOT > AFFECT> > RESULTS AS PER K.P APPROACH".> > > SO,the topic of exaltation,debilitation,Dasaporutham,Mars> > dosha,remedies,gemmology all are handled by him for research purpose> > and finally his findings are that everything is based on karma as> > given in his First reader.The planet Jupiter can kill,defame,spoil a> > man and saturn can bless him with good married life or child in his> > period as per the signification thats what karma of us.> > > > > > Thats what Bhagvat gita says whatever has happened has happened > well.> > > > > > Lord krishna says :"do your duty

and I will decide the results".> > > > > > So dear learned members and Mr.Rangarajan,Please understand the> > essence of K.P and apply it with clear knowledge.> > > > > > With regards> > > Balaji G> > > > > > Kanak Bosmia <kanbosastro@h...> wrote:> > > > > > Dear Rangrajan ji,> > > > > > Givere ferences of prectical example in reader about > > Exaltation/Debilitation .> > > > > > regards> > > > > > kanak> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >"Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy" <ranga@m...> > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Exaltation/Debilitation Revisited -

> Reply> > to Balaji > > > >Mon, 25 Apr 2005 09:01:57 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Balaji, > > > >Although most of us agree that KP System does not seem to stress > > > >exaltation and debilitation, one can find references to these > terms > > > >in KP Readers. For example, see the last para of 6th Reader, > Page > > > >145: > > > >" In K.P. (a) if a planet is exalted but is in the constellation > of > > > >a planet in debilitation, the extent to which it can do either > good > > > >or bad is limited. A container (the planet) may be big but the > > > >content is a cheap affair (lord of the constellation is the > > > >content). But a debilitated planet (small planet) in the > > > >constellation of a

planet in exaltation (costly gems) is similar > to > > > >diamond in a small packet..." > > > > > > > >Doesn't this suggest that KSK attached some value to exaltation > and > > > >debilitation? > > > > > > > >Regards, > > > >Rangarajan > > > > > > > > , "Balaji G.krishnan" > > > ><balaji_g_krishnan> wrote: > > > > > Dear sandy and all, > > > > > > > > > > I am sorry to intervene the discussion going on for a > longtime on > > > >debilitation and exaltation of planets. > > > > > > > > > > One of the major welcoming findings of Great guruji K.S.K > is "no > > > >planet is debilitated or exalted in K.P".Planets gives the

> results > > > >only by source of its star lord...thats why it is called stellar > > > >theory. > > > > > > > > > > More over,you can very well see personally on your own many > charts > > > >having exalted planets gives adverse results and planets > debilitated > > > >gives good results.Why??...Thats the secret of starlord and sub > > > >lord theory. > > > > > > > > > > So,may be as a practitioner of traditional astrology or vedic > > > >astrology,we can use those concepts for our satisfaction but the > > > >truth is that we are not hitting the right spot. > > > > > > > > > > I request all the K.P astrologers again to understand the > > > >foundation rules and findings of great guruji K.S.K and not to

> > > >divert else with other insignificant rules. > > > > > > > > > > K.P is time-tested,well refined and most scientific method in > this > > > >modern world. > > > > > > > > > > Its a message for all true K.P followers and not to hurt > anybody. > > > > > > > > > > With regards > > > > > Balaji G > > > > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sandy, > > > > > Thanks for a nice posting. However, I don't think I > understand > > > >what > > > > > you mean by a debilitated planet offering results "at snails > pace" > > > > > or an exalted planet offering results "quickly". Does this > affect > > >

> > timing then? We normally use conjoined period of the > effective > > > > > significators along with transits to establish timing. I > can't see > > > > > how planetary dignity (its strength as you nicely put it) can > > > >affect > > > > > this. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Rangarajan > > > > > > > > > > , "Sandy Crowther" > > > > > <sandycrowther@a...> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Group, > > > > > > > > > > > > There appears to be some prevailing confusion about exactly > what > > > > > Exaltation > > > > > > and Debilitation actually mean in evaluation of a KP chart. > So > > > > >

below is a > > > > > > brief overview of the planetary interactions, followed by > my > > > > > humble attempt > > > > > > at explaining the effects of exaltation and debilitation, > and > > > > > their usage in > > > > > > KP, according to my understanding of the basic and primary > > > > > teachings of the > > > > > > KP system. > > > > > > > > > > > > What we know already is that a planet moving under the > influence > > > > > of his star > > > > > > lord, will act according to the dictates of that star lord. > With > > > > > that in > > > > > > mind, we are also well aware that the planet will > predominately > > > > > offer the > > > >

> > results of the house in which the star lord is posited, in > > > > > addition to the > > > > > > house(s) owned by the star lord. Then, the planet itself, > offers > > > > > the results > > > > > > of the house it occupies and the house(s) it owns. So > basically > > > > > each planet > > > > > > has a role to play, and both the star lord and the planet > > > >combine > > > > > their > > > > > > influence to determine whether the event will be favorable > or > > > >not. > > > > > ( If > > > > > > unfamiliar with this concept, more examples of how a planet > will > > > > > act can be > > > > > > found in my article > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_How%20does%20the%20dasha%> 20lord% > > > > > 20function.ht > > > > > > m> KP: How Does the Dasha Lord Function?) > > > > > > > > > > > > So what exactly does Exalted or Debilitated infer? > > > > > > Several indicators are simply "givens" in KP, and must not > only > > > >be > > > > > > considered, but must also be both integrated and > synthesized > > > >into > > > > > your > > > > > > analysis before a final determination is made. But > according to > > > > > sizing up an > > > > > > event, only the house results are offered - so where does > that > > > > > leave the > > >

> > > sign effects that the planet is placed in - such as the > planet's > > > > > exalted or > > > > > > debilitated status? Here is where much confusion seems > prevalent > > > > > in KP > > > > > > assessments- especially when a planet is badly placed in > the 8th > > > > > or 12th > > > > > > house, but simultaneously exalted in status. Or when a > planet is > > > > > in a > > > > > > debilitated state, but posited in the benefic 11th house? > How do > > > > > we assess > > > > > > these results? > > > > > > > > > > > > Exaltation and debilitation are "strength" and "weakness" > > > > > indicators > > > > > > respectively, and therefore their specific

job is to give > us an > > > > > idea of how > > > > > > much "muscle" (strength or weakness) the planet carries - > within > > > > > its > > > > > > environment - to carry out its function determined by its > house > > > > > placement. > > > > > > So if a planet is strong due to exaltation, but badly > placed in > > > > > the 12th, > > > > > > the planet does not change its role and become good for the > 12th > > > > > house, but > > > > > > rather the effects are that the planet will not hasten to > > > >quickly > > > > > carry out > > > > > > the functions for his position in any given house, and will > > > > > therefore > > > > > > quickly

bring about loss (or other 12th house function) in > a > > > >very > > > > > timely > > > > > > manner. Why? Because he has the strength to act quickly and > with > > > > > no delay, > > > > > > and he is very comfortable where he is positioned in his > exalted > > > > > status. He > > > > > > works fast because he is in a happy and exalted state - > caring > > > >not > > > > > that he > > > > > > is working quickly to bring about less than fortunate > events. > > > >He's > > > > > just > > > > > > doing his job with the muscle provided to do it with. When > the > > > > > planet has > > > > > > established a set of results that need to be

carried out > due to > > > > > his star > > > > > > level placement, exaltation does not absolve him of the > adverse > > > > > results that > > > > > > need to be carried out, and subsequently make the results > > > > > pleasant. This is > > > > > > simply not the way exaltation and debilitation work, nor is > it > > > > > part of their > > > > > > role as "strength indicators" for a planet. The planets do > not > > > > > give contrary > > > > > > results due to their strength status. > > > > > > So, also, do we judge the effects of a planet posited in a > good > > > > > house but in > > > > > > the state of debilitation. This debilitated planet will > still

> > > > > carry out the > > > > > > positive acts for the house in which he is posited, but his > > > > > strength factor > > > > > > will not allow him to do so quickly or in a timely manner. > So > > > >the > > > > > result is > > > > > > that he will eventually bring the good effects about, but > not in > > > >a > > > > > timely > > > > > > manner or with speed under his wings. He only carries > enough > > > > > strength to > > > > > > respond to his mission in a slow and delayed manner because > he > > > >is > > > > > not happy > > > > > > being posited where he is and at the degree at which he is > > > > > debilitated, but

> > > > > > he has a job to do and will carry it out and do his job, > but NOT > > > > > in a manner > > > > > > contrary to what his position indicates - it will just be > > > >carried > > > > > out at a > > > > > > snails pace. > > > > > > > > > > > > More Apparent "Strength" Confusion: > > > > > > Now the KP confusion I'm seeing frequently, and the catch > to the > > > > > > exaltation/debilitation game is this...Exactly WHEN is a > planet > > > > > considered > > > > > > to be exalted or debilitated? Is is just by being posited > in the > > > > > respective > > > > > > signs of exaltation or debilitation - such as Jupiter is > > > >considered >

> > > > > debilitated simply because he is posited in Capricorn? Or > Venus > > > >is > > > > > > considered exalted just because she is posited in Pisces? > The > > > > > answer to this > > > > > > question is no! There are refinements to strengths and > > > >weaknesses > > > > > that need > > > > > > to be addressed before blanket statements are made due to > > > > > assessing these > > > > > > planetary strengths and weaknesses. For example, is > Jupiter, > > > >when > > > > > posited at > > > > > > 15 Cancer, considered to be in an exalted state? No! Why? > > > >Jupiter > > > > > is exalted > > > > > > at 05 Cancer - not at 15 degrees Cancer. Orbs must be

set > in > > > >place > > > > > and > > > > > > respected for the effects of exalted or debilitated status > to be > > > > > truly > > > > > > effective - sign positions alone are irrelevant when > assessing > > > > > planetary > > > > > > strengths. So to say that a planet is exalted or > debilitated > > > > > simply because > > > > > > it is posited in its sign of exaltation or debilitation is > > > > > incorrect - the > > > > > > degrees of the sign placement are necessary to determine > whether > > > > > that planet > > > > > > is truly in an exalted or debilitated state. According to > my > > > > > understanding, > > > > > > the KP

preferred orb allowance is 50' on either side of its > > > > > exaltation or > > > > > > debilitation degree - (less than a degree). Below is a > Table > > > > > showing the > > > > > > exalted and debilitated placements. I sincerely hope this > > > >further > > > > > clarifies > > > > > > the position of exaltation versus debilitation. (If the > Table > > > > > doesn't > > > > > > transmit, I have also uploaded this to my site at > > > > > > http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_exaltation.debilitation% > > > > > 20revisited.htm > > > > > > (With reference to Navamsha positions, my take on this is > that > > > >in > > > > >

KP, this > > > > > > varga has been used to further refine the strength of a > planet). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Planet > > > > > > Exalted > > > > > > Debilitated > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun > > > > > > 10 Degrees Aries > > > > > > 10 Degrees Libra > > > > > > > > > > > > Moon > > > > > > 03 Degrees Taurus > > > > > > 03 Degrees Scorpio > > > > > > > > > > > > Mars > > > > > > 28 Degrees Capricorn > > > > > > 28 Degrees Cancer > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury > > > > > > 15 Degrees Virgo > > > >

> > 15 Degrees Pisces > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter > > > > > > 05 Degrees Cancer > > > > > > 05 Degrees Capricorn > > > > > > > > > > > > Venus > > > > > > 27 Degrees Pisces > > > > > > 27 Degrees Virgo > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn > > > > > > 20 Libra > > > > > > 20 Degrees Aries > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus > > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus > > > > > > > > > > > >

<sandy@t...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All the Best, > > > > > > > > > > > <http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/40.gif> > Sandy > > > > > > Crowther > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/> http://www.jupitersweb.com > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > >

April 26, 2005

Tw ji/ Inder ji/ Balaji ji,

The point no. 3 is very important to keep the useful discussion going. If we say something pertaining to KP, it MUST be supported by KP references.

In this discussion forum I see individual very important for discussion. We can not afford to lose even a single person as we never know how much we can lose without him/ her. We should avoid everything that can hurt someone to this extent.

Also I request you not to use bold letters as it may upset others.

Regards,

Punit Pandey

On 4/26/05, tw853 <tw853 wrote:

Dear Balaji,1. This is KP discussion forum as you've said, where serious discussions conducive to the further development of KP are discussed with references of speciic titles and page numbers, which myself and Kanak ji are asking you to show a proof of what you're saying KP. The buden of proof is on your side.2. I'm wondering what is your real motive of making Sandy upset for her contribution in this group because---1) I traced all posts of your Dual (you & Inder) in Jyotish Remedies group and Inder used to make KP analysis, but one time asking Bob Singh, who is asking advice, to give KP (caculated) chart.

2) After some time of my lengthy demonstration KP post by MSg #11436 in that group, it's nice to see the Dual in our group. 3) I asked Inder for permission to repost some of his many many KP practical analysis in the previous group for the benefit of KP learners in this group.4) Sorry, Inder, I don't have time to trace back all your mails again, for examples like kidding by saying you're going to practice Dr. Kar's sub sub theory, am I right or You're right between the Dual without mentioning the real point, in the case of PRINCIPLES OF CUSPAL INTERLINKS by K. Baskaran, who has some intirely diffent basic views from KSK as mentioned in his EPILOGUE of that book pp 200-203.

5) You were confused by seeing KSK originals regarding debilitation for the first time as if I'm making confusion.6) Then you asked Shri Raichur about the basic KP idea related to 4-step method, mentioned by A.R. Raichur, B.E., F.I.E. in the above mentioned Baskaran's first book, pp x-xi, which you recommand Inder to buy, and also explained in the same page you mentioned in Astrosecrets & Krishnamurti Padhdhati, Part 1, in bold letters. 7) Then suddenly you've started saying, in KP group, only KP, no place for exaltation or delibitation, so on even with posting in bold and red letters. 8) No need to backe off ucha and neecha reference mentioned by bold and red letters because NEECHABHANGARAJAYOGA, STHOOADHARMAKARMADHIPAYOGA are mentioned in " The Horoscope of Prof. rishnamurti " by M.G.G. Nayar in Astrosecrets and KP, Part I, 2003, pp 249-271; also in " Notable Persons & Krishnamurti Padhdhati, by K. Hariharan,1993, pp 8-33.3. Dear Inder, please mention what is your exact view, for example " there is no place or place to analyse strength of planets by exaltation or debilitation in KP " , and of course if you want to say it's KP, please provide specific KSK or KP references of titles and page numbers, in a short to the point, precise form, not easy type in another group. If you're saying it's your personal opinion, I've no

comment; if yours is KP, I promise you to respond honestly whether it's consistent with KSK or KP references. I never say right or wrong which I don't have authoriy.Thanks and best regards,

Best regards,tw , " Balaji G.krishnan " <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> Dear tw853 and all,> > I have already given the reference told by Great guruji K.S.K himself which clearly explains the views of Great Guruji K.S.K and I am also not denying the fact that ucha and neecha are referred by K.S.K in his articles.> > Please go through all my mails,you can see the substance of my point.> > Exalted planets and debilitated planets can effect only as a indicator and the real analysis about the strength of planets has to go on star of the planet and its aspects,conjuction and all other significant points as told in his system.> > The root of K.P

stands in the star and its disposition and exaltation or debilitation can be considered as an indicator.Many points in traditional are still contradictory,unclear and subject to arguments.> > Thats why Guruji has not stressed much on those topics.More over they are not the real giver of results when you analyse.Exalted planet can give bad results and debilitated planet can give good results.Everything depends on the signification of star and sub of a planet.Even,in all the Astro secrets Part1,2,3> you can see in no articles when analysing the charts these aspects like exaltation or any traditional aspects is not stressed.> > I am also open to do research and welcome new things coming to K.P system and if possible I will also add to that.I love those who do research for the betterment of the system and I hate those who distract the progress of the system.> > I sincerely feel very bad what sandy has understood and taking these undesirable steps.Anyway,my sincere apologise to her from my side if really it has hurt her feelings or sentiments.I also accept the fact that she has done a wonderful work on K.P in her website and

I wish her a successful future.> > Forum is a place of discussion.Some says Yes and some No.But should we windup from the action simply that we are getting NO.In fact,here nobody has said anything bad against anybody and it is all our views and for the betterment of the system,we work.Respected Raichurji,yogesh raoji and punitji has also quite good years of experience in the field and we have argued well and they are not taking any hard decisions.

> > In life,we cannot expect to go in one way.> > My understanding on the subject is clear and the problem here is trying to explain you all.Thats understood.My experience might be very less compared to many here but its not the years that counts the worth but the understanding.I want to be a good friend of all and to the good things around me.If somebody likes it or not,I am sorry thats the wish of the fate.> > With thanks> Balaji.G

> > Note:Here,I am not meaning anybody in particular.These are all general views from my heart.>

> tw853 <tw853> wrote:> > Dear Balaji,> > Shri Anat Raichur and Sandy are not saying Uchcha, Neecha is > auspacious but about strength of exalted and debelitated planets. > For creditibily of what you're asying is KP, where are your > references from KP Readers? > > > Best regards,> > tw> > > Qoute> > Is not Mercury Neecha?

> > In K.P. there is no use for Uchcha, Neecha, etc. In Sir C.P. > Ramaswamy Iyer's chart, how many planets are Neecha. In the horoscope > of the president of the Income-Tax Tribunal which we saw today are > not Jupiter, Mars, etc.,Neecha. Are there not 3 neechas in your > proprietor's chart (Sun, Moon, and Venus). Whereas you have exalted > Mercury and Mars. What do you do? When we presses the bottom and you > hear the calling bell, you, with your pencil and note-book run to his > room.> > True, Sir. I also wonder why Hindus following traditional sytem say > that Uchchas give very good results. Neechas bring untold miseries. I > think that they start forgetting what they were following all along > and at least now begin to learn your system. > > Unqote> > > >

, " Balaji G.krishnan " > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:> > Dear Rangarajanji and all,> > > > To my great guruji sri.K.S.K or to me,defaming anything or stopping > anybody is not the intention rather the essence of science should be > known to all for a better prediction..I would say very accurate > prediction.> > > > When graham bell invented a phone,it is not a cordless.Today,Mobile > phones are available with video display.How.Let we shed the old > things which is not useful or correct and take which gives > success,time-saving,accurate results.> > > > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K and his hundreds of students have done a > laborious research by spending many years and many good things.They > have shown us a path in thier books,articles and message.Then

,why we > should again look back.Atleast to respect his system which as I told > before is a well tested,certified one.If we are given a driving > license by the govt through right means and with right persons,(I > mean all legal),why we should again go for a driving class to learn > the learnt things.> > > > As a lover of astro science,I dont want to hurt anybody's > sentiments or feelings but my strong point here is in K.P forum let > we talk about K.P only and if we can develop something good from here > like judging a match,finding the blood group of a man,etc....Thats > research in the right line.Using K.P anything can be done provided > right understanding of the subject and clear mind.> > > > I cannot intervene in others tastes and preferences.> > > > FOR ALL REF:K.P & ASTROLOGY 1995,A very detailed article written by > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K > > " HOW TO JUDGE A NATIVITY " ,PAGE NO,47 LAST PARA..> > > > PLS EVERYBODY WHO TALKS ABOUT EXALTATION GO THROUGH THIS.....HAVE A > CLEAR MIND.

> > > > > > with regards> > Balaji G> > > > > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m...> wrote:> > > > Dear Balaji,> > I definitely accept your observation that in his early research days> > KSK might have tried many ideas from the traditional system. One of> > the things missing in his Readers is the history and chronology. How> > can one know what he tried earlier but gave up later?

> > > > Please understand that all my comments and questions are merely to> > understand KP system better and is not intended to challenge any > idea> > or anyone.> > > > Regards,> > Rangarajan> > > >

, " Balaji G.krishnan " > > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:> > > Dear Rangarajanji and all,> > > > > > We all should understand a point that any newly invented theories > of> > today comes from the old existing principles and also when a correct> > solution has to be find using a system during great guruji's day..> > > > > > just imagine for a while, when transportation is not that much

> > good,no computer,no awareness among the public,etc.In these> > situations,guruji taken the traditional astrology and done a great> > research only for a simple reason that to prove astrology is a

> > science.A universally applicable system,easy to work and> > understand,etc are some of his goals.> > > > > > So,in early days of his research the articles written by him gives> > the flavour of traditional approach also.But finally after his > mamoth> > efforts alnog with his devoted students has given a point that " NO> > PLANETS CAN EXALTED OR DEBILITATED AND EVEN IF SO,THIS DOES NOT > AFFECT> > RESULTS AS PER K.P APPROACH " .> > > SO,the topic of exaltation,debilitation,Dasaporutham,Mars> > dosha,remedies,gemmology all are handled by him for research purpose

> > and finally his findings are that everything is based on karma as> > given in his First reader.The planet Jupiter can kill,defame,spoil a> > man and saturn can bless him with good married life or child in his> > period as per the signification thats what karma of us.> > > > > > Thats what Bhagvat gita says whatever has happened has happened > well.> > > > > > Lord krishna says : " do your duty and I will decide the results " .

> > > > > > So dear learned members and Mr.Rangarajan,Please understand the> > essence of K.P and apply it with clear knowledge.> > > > > > With regards> > > Balaji G

> > > > > > Kanak Bosmia <kanbosastro@h...> wrote:> > > > > > Dear Rangrajan ji,> > > > > > Givere ferences of prectical example in reader about > > Exaltation/Debilitation .> > > > > > regards> > > > > > kanak> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy " <

ranga@m...> > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Exaltation/Debilitation Revisited - > Reply> > to Balaji > > > >Mon, 25 Apr 2005 09:01:57 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Balaji, > > > >Although most of us agree that KP System does not seem to stress > > > >exaltation and debilitation, one can find references to these > terms > > > >in KP Readers. For example, see the last para of 6th Reader, > Page > > > >145: > > > > " In K.P. (a) if a planet is exalted but is in the constellation > of > > > >a planet in debilitation, the extent to which it can do either > good > > > >or bad is limited. A container (the planet) may be big but the > > > >content is a cheap affair (lord of the constellation is the > > > >content). But a debilitated planet (small planet) in the > > > >constellation of a planet in exaltation (costly gems) is similar > to > > > >diamond in a small packet... " > > > > > > > >Doesn't this suggest that KSK attached some value to exaltation > and > > > >debilitation? > > > > > > > >Regards, > > > >Rangarajan > > > > > > > >

, " Balaji G.krishnan " > > > ><balaji_g_krishnan> wrote: > > > > > Dear sandy and all, > > > > > > > > > > I am sorry to intervene the discussion going on for a > longtime on > > > >debilitation and exaltation of planets. > > > > > > > > > > One of the major welcoming findings of Great guruji K.S.K > is " no > > > >planet is debilitated or exalted in K.P " .Planets gives the > results > > > >only by source of its star lord...thats why it is called stellar > > > >theory. > > > > > > > > > > More over,you can very well see personally on your own many > charts > > > >having exalted planets gives adverse results and planets > debilitated > > > >gives good results.Why??...Thats the secret of starlord and sub > > > >lord theory. > > > > > > > > > > So,may be as a practitioner of traditional astrology or vedic > > > >astrology,we can use those concepts for our satisfaction but the > > > >truth is that we are not hitting the right spot. > > > > > > > > > > I request all the K.P astrologers again to understand the > > > >foundation rules and findings of great guruji K.S.K and not to > > > >divert else with other insignificant rules. > > > > > > > > > > K.P is time-tested,well refined and most scientific method in > this > > > >modern world. > > > > > > > > > > Its a message for all true K.P followers and not to hurt > anybody. > > > > > > > > > > With regards > > > > > Balaji G > > > > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m

....> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sandy, > > > > > Thanks for a nice posting. However, I don't think I > understand > > > >what > > > > > you mean by a debilitated planet offering results " at snails > pace " > > > > > or an exalted planet offering results " quickly " . Does this > affect > > > > > timing then? We normally use conjoined period of the > effective > > > > > significators along with transits to establish timing. I > can't see > > > > > how planetary dignity (its strength as you nicely put it) can

> > > >affect > > > > > this. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Rangarajan > > > > > > > > > > , " Sandy Crowther " > > > > > <sandycrowther@a

....> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Group, > > > > > > > > > > > > There appears to be some prevailing confusion about exactly > what > > > > > Exaltation > > > > > > and Debilitation actually mean in evaluation of a KP chart. > So > > > > > below is a > > > > > > brief overview of the planetary interactions, followed by > my > > > > > humble attempt > > > > > > at explaining the effects of exaltation and debilitation, > and > > > > > their usage in > > > > > > KP, according to my understanding of the basic and primary > > > > > teachings of the > > > > > > KP system. > > > > > > > > > > > > What we know already is that a planet moving under the > influence > > > > > of his star > > > > > > lord, will act according to the dictates of that star lord. > With > > > > > that in > > > > > > mind, we are also well aware that the planet will > predominately > > > > > offer the > > > > > > results of the house in which the star lord is posited, in > > > > > addition to the > > > > > > house(s) owned by the star lord. Then, the planet itself, > offers > > > > > the results > > > > > > of the house it occupies and the house(s) it owns. So > basically > > > > > each planet > > > > > > has a role to play, and both the star lord and the planet > > > >combine > > > > > their > > > > > > influence to determine whether the event will be favorable > or > > > >not. > > > > > ( If > > > > > > unfamiliar with this concept, more examples of how a planet > will > > > > > act can be > > > > > > found in my article > > > > > > <

http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_How%20does%20the%20dasha%> 20lord% > > > > > 20function.ht > > > > > > m> KP: How Does the Dasha Lord Function?) > > > > > > > > > > > > So what exactly does Exalted or Debilitated infer? > > > > > > Several indicators are simply " givens " in KP, and must not > only > > > >be > > > > > > considered, but must also be both integrated and > synthesized > > > >into > > > > > your > > > > > > analysis before a final determination is made. But > according to > > > > > sizing up an > > > > > > event, only the house results are offered - so where does > that > > > > > leave the > > > > > > sign effects that the planet is placed in - such as the > planet's > > > > > exalted or > > > > > > debilitated status? Here is where much confusion seems > prevalent > > > > > in KP > > > > > > assessments- especially when a planet is badly placed in > the 8th > > > > > or 12th > > > > > > house, but simultaneously exalted in status. Or when a > planet is > > > > > in a > > > > > > debilitated state, but posited in the benefic 11th house? > How do > > > > > we assess > > > > > > these results? > > > > > > > > > > > > Exaltation and debilitation are " strength " and " weakness " > > > > > indicators > > > > > > respectively, and therefore their specific job is to give > us an > > > > > idea of how > > > > > > much " muscle " (strength or weakness) the planet carries - > within > > > > > its > > > > > > environment - to carry out its function determined by its > house > > > > > placement. > > > > > > So if a planet is strong due to exaltation, but badly > placed in > > > > > the 12th, > > > > > > the planet does not change its role and become good for the > 12th > > > > > house, but > > > > > > rather the effects are that the planet will not hasten to > > > >quickly > > > > > carry out > > > > > > the functions for his position in any given house, and will > > > > > therefore > > > > > > quickly bring about loss (or other 12th house function) in > a > > > >very > > > > > timely > > > > > > manner. Why? Because he has the strength to act quickly and > with > > > > > no delay, > > > > > > and he is very comfortable where he is positioned in his > exalted > > > > > status. He > > > > > > works fast because he is in a happy and exalted state - > caring > > > >not > > > > > that he > > > > > > is working quickly to bring about less than fortunate > events. > > > >He's > > > > > just > > > > > > doing his job with the muscle provided to do it with. When > the > > > > > planet has > > > > > > established a set of results that need to be carried out > due to > > > > > his star > > > > > > level placement, exaltation does not absolve him of the > adverse > > > > > results that > > > > > > need to be carried out, and subsequently make the results > > > > > pleasant. This is > > > > > > simply not the way exaltation and debilitation work, nor is > it > > > > > part of their > > > > > > role as " strength indicators " for a planet. The planets do > not > > > > > give contrary > > > > > > results due to their strength status. > > > > > > So, also, do we judge the effects of a planet posited in a > good > > > > > house but in > > > > > > the state of debilitation. This debilitated planet will > still > > > > > carry out the > > > > > > positive acts for the house in which he is posited, but his > > > > > strength factor > > > > > > will not allow him to do so quickly or in a timely manner. > So > > > >the > > > > > result is > > > > > > that he will eventually bring the good effects about, but > not in > > > >a > > > > > timely > > > > > > manner or with speed under his wings. He only carries > enough > > > > > strength to > > > > > > respond to his mission in a slow and delayed manner because > he > > > >is > > > > > not happy > > > > > > being posited where he is and at the degree at which he is > > > > > debilitated, but > > > > > > he has a job to do and will carry it out and do his job, > but NOT > > > > > in a manner > > > > > > contrary to what his position indicates - it will just be > > > >carried > > > > > out at a

> > > > > > snails pace. > > > > > > > > > > > > More Apparent " Strength " Confusion: > > > > > > Now the KP confusion I'm seeing frequently, and the catch > to the > > > > > > exaltation/debilitation game is this...Exactly WHEN is a > planet > > > > > considered > > > > > > to be exalted or debilitated? Is is just by being posited > in the > > > > > respective > > > > > > signs of exaltation or debilitation - such as Jupiter is > > > >considered > > > > > > debilitated simply because he is posited in Capricorn? Or > Venus > > > >is > > > > > > considered exalted just because she is posited in Pisces? > The > > > > > answer to this > > > > > > question is no! There are refinements to strengths and > > > >weaknesses > > > > > that need > > > > > > to be addressed before blanket statements are made due to > > > > > assessing these > > > > > > planetary strengths and weaknesses. For example, is > Jupiter, > > > >when > > > > > posited at > > > > > > 15 Cancer, considered to be in an exalted state? No! Why? > > > >Jupiter > > > > > is exalted > > > > > > at 05 Cancer - not at 15 degrees Cancer. Orbs must be set > in > > > >place > > > > > and > > > > > > respected for the effects of exalted or debilitated status > to be > > > > > truly > > > > > > effective - sign positions alone are irrelevant when > assessing > > > > > planetary > > > > > > strengths. So to say that a planet is exalted or > debilitated > > > > > simply because > > > > > > it is posited in its sign of exaltation or debilitation is > > > > > incorrect - the > > > > > > degrees of the sign placement are necessary to determine > whether > > > > > that planet > > > > > > is truly in an exalted or debilitated state. According to > my > > > > > understanding, > > > > > > the KP preferred orb allowance is 50' on either side of its > > > > > exaltation or > > > > > > debilitation degree - (less than a degree). Below is a > Table > > > > > showing the > > > > > > exalted and debilitated placements. I sincerely hope this > > > >further > > > > > clarifies > > > > > > the position of exaltation versus debilitation. (If the > Table > > > > > doesn't > > > > > > transmit, I have also uploaded this to my site at > > > > > > http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_exaltation.debilitation%

> > > > > 20revisited.htm > > > > > > (With reference to Navamsha positions, my take on this is > that > > > >in > > > > > KP, this

> > > > > > varga has been used to further refine the strength of a > planet). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Planet > > > > > > Exalted > > > > > > Debilitated > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun > > > > > > 10 Degrees Aries > > > > > > 10 Degrees Libra

> > > > > > > > > > > > Moon > > > > > > 03 Degrees Taurus > > > > > > 03 Degrees Scorpio > > > > > > > > > > > > Mars > > > > > > 28 Degrees Capricorn > > > > > > 28 Degrees Cancer > > > > > > > > > > > > Mercury > > > > > > 15 Degrees Virgo > > > > > > 15 Degrees Pisces > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter > > > > > > 05 Degrees Cancer > > > > > > 05 Degrees Capricorn > > > > > > > > > > > > Venus > > > > > > 27 Degrees Pisces > > > > > > 27 Degrees Virgo > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn > > > > > > 20 Libra > > > > > > 20 Degrees Aries > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus > > > > > > > > > > > > <sandy@t...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All the Best, > > > > > > > > > > > <

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/40.gif> > Sandy > > > > > > Crowther > > > > > > <

http://www.jupitersweb.com/> http://www.jupitersweb.com > > > > > > <

http://www.jupitersweb.com/> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

April 27, 2005

Dear TW,

1] Balaji of the JR astrogroup and Balaji of this group, I think,

are two different persons. I could not follow your word " duel " .

2]Yes, true I did Chart analysis with KP methods in hundreds of

cases in JR and astroexpert groups. You can take any and post

anywhere, no permission is required as these are no longer my

property.

3]I read KP readers, understood them and try to learn more from

astro groups. However, I find it extemely difficult to refer books

and page numbers again and again. So I may not be able to give you

references as you often give. I appreciate you for your efforts in

giving references etc. But it is really difficult to revisit the

books for seeing/refering smaller issues.

4]If I got some observation/view based on my experience, I try share

it.By mutual discussion we can learn some new things, otherwise

Astrology is infinite as 6 billion people on this earth--eachone is

having seperate chart and fate.

Good wishes.

InderVohra

, " tw853 " <tw853> wrote:

>

> Dear Balaji,

>

> 1. This is KP discussion forum as you've said, where serious

> discussions conducive to the further development of KP are

discussed

> with references of speciic titles and page numbers, which myself

and

> Kanak ji are asking you to show a proof of what you're saying KP.

The

> buden of proof is on your side.

>

> 2. I'm wondering what is your real motive of making Sandy upset

for

> her contribution in this group because---

>

> 1) I traced all posts of your Dual (you & Inder) in Jyotish

Remedies

> group and Inder used to make KP analysis, but one time asking Bob

> Singh, who is asking advice, to give KP (caculated) chart.

>

> 2) After some time of my lengthy demonstration KP post by MSg

#11436

> in that group, it's nice to see the Dual in our group.

>

> 3) I asked Inder for permission to repost some of his many many KP

> practical analysis in the previous group for the benefit of KP

> learners in this group.

>

> 4) Sorry, Inder, I don't have time to trace back all your mails

> again, for examples like kidding by saying you're going to

practice

> Dr. Kar's sub sub theory, am I right or You're right between the

Dual

> without mentioning the real point, in the case of PRINCIPLES OF

> CUSPAL INTERLINKS by K. Baskaran, who has some intirely diffent

basic

> views from KSK as mentioned in his EPILOGUE of that book pp 200-

203.

>

> 5) You were confused by seeing KSK originals regarding

debilitation

> for the first time as if I'm making confusion.

>

> 6) Then you asked Shri Raichur about the basic KP idea related to

4-

> step method, mentioned by A.R. Raichur, B.E., F.I.E. in the above

> mentioned Baskaran's first book, pp x-xi, which you recommand

Inder

> to buy, and also explained in the same page you mentioned in

> Astrosecrets & Krishnamurti Padhdhati, Part 1, in bold letters.

>

> 7) Then suddenly you've started saying, in KP group, only KP, no

> place for exaltation or delibitation, so on even with posting in

bold

> and red letters.

>

> 8) No need to backe off ucha and neecha reference mentioned by

bold

> and red letters because NEECHABHANGARAJAYOGA,

> STHOOADHARMAKARMADHIPAYOGA are mentioned in " The Horoscope of

Prof.

> rishnamurti " by M.G.G. Nayar in Astrosecrets and KP, Part I, 2003,

pp

> 249-271; also in " Notable Persons & Krishnamurti Padhdhati, by K.

> Hariharan,1993, pp 8-33.

>

> 3. Dear Inder, please mention what is your exact view, for

> example " there is no place or place to analyse strength of planets

by

> exaltation or debilitation in KP " , and of course if you want to

say

> it's KP, please provide specific KSK or KP references of titles

and

> page numbers, in a short to the point, precise form, not easy type

in

> another group. If you're saying it's your personal opinion, I've

no

> comment; if yours is KP, I promise you to respond honestly whether

> it's consistent with KSK or KP references. I never say right or

wrong

> which I don't have authoriy.

>

> Thanks and best regards,

>

> Best regards,

>

> tw

>

> , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > Dear tw853 and all,

> >

> > I have already given the reference told by Great guruji K.S.K

> himself which clearly explains the views of Great Guruji K.S.K and

I

> am also not denying the fact that ucha and neecha are referred by

> K.S.K in his articles.

> >

> > Please go through all my mails,you can see the substance of my

> point.

> >

> > Exalted planets and debilitated planets can effect only as a

> indicator and the real analysis about the strength of planets has

to

> go on star of the planet and its aspects,conjuction and all other

> significant points as told in his system.

> >

> > The root of K.P stands in the star and its disposition and

> exaltation or debilitation can be considered as an indicator.Many

> points in traditional are still contradictory,unclear and subject

to

> arguments.

> >

> > Thats why Guruji has not stressed much on those topics.More over

> they are not the real giver of results when you analyse.Exalted

> planet can give bad results and debilitated planet can give good

> results.Everything depends on the signification of star and sub of

a

> planet.Even,in all the Astro secrets Part1,2,3

> > you can see in no articles when analysing the charts these

aspects

> like exaltation or any traditional aspects is not stressed.

> >

> > I am also open to do research and welcome new things coming to

K.P

> system and if possible I will also add to that.I love those who do

> research for the betterment of the system and I hate those who

> distract the progress of the system.

> >

> > I sincerely feel very bad what sandy has understood and taking

> these undesirable steps.Anyway,my sincere apologise to her from my

> side if really it has hurt her feelings or sentiments.I also

accept

> the fact that she has done a wonderful work on K.P in her website

and

> I wish her a successful future.

> >

> > Forum is a place of discussion.Some says Yes and some No.But

should

> we windup from the action simply that we are getting NO.In

fact,here

> nobody has said anything bad against anybody and it is all our

views

> and for the betterment of the system,we work.Respected

> Raichurji,yogesh raoji and punitji has also quite good years of

> experience in the field and we have argued well and they are not

> taking any hard decisions.

> >

> > In life,we cannot expect to go in one way.

> >

> > My understanding on the subject is clear and the problem here is

> trying to explain you all.Thats understood.My experience might be

> very less compared to many here but its not the years that counts

the

> worth but the understanding.I want to be a good friend of all and

to

> the good things around me.If somebody likes it or not,I am sorry

> thats the wish of the fate.

> >

> > With thanks

> > Balaji.G

> >

> > Note:Here,I am not meaning anybody in particular.These are all

> general views from my heart.

> >

> > tw853 <tw853> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Balaji,

> >

> > Shri Anat Raichur and Sandy are not saying Uchcha, Neecha is

> > auspacious but about strength of exalted and debelitated

planets.

> > For creditibily of what you're asying is KP, where are your

> > references from KP Readers?

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> > tw

> >

> > Qoute

> >

> > Is not Mercury Neecha?

> >

> > In K.P. there is no use for Uchcha, Neecha, etc. In Sir C.P.

> > Ramaswamy Iyer's chart, how many planets are Neecha. In the

> horoscope

> > of the president of the Income-Tax Tribunal which we saw today

are

> > not Jupiter, Mars, etc.,Neecha. Are there not 3 neechas in your

> > proprietor's chart (Sun, Moon, and Venus). Whereas you have

exalted

> > Mercury and Mars. What do you do? When we presses the bottom and

> you

> > hear the calling bell, you, with your pencil and note-book run

to

> his

> > room.

> >

> > True, Sir. I also wonder why Hindus following traditional sytem

say

> > that Uchchas give very good results. Neechas bring untold

miseries.

> I

> > think that they start forgetting what they were following all

along

> > and at least now begin to learn your system.

> >

> > Unqote

> >

> > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > Dear Rangarajanji and all,

> > >

> > > To my great guruji sri.K.S.K or to me,defaming anything or

> stopping

> > anybody is not the intention rather the essence of science

should

> be

> > known to all for a better prediction..I would say very accurate

> > prediction.

> > >

> > > When graham bell invented a phone,it is not a

> cordless.Today,Mobile

> > phones are available with video display.How.Let we shed the old

> > things which is not useful or correct and take which gives

> > success,time-saving,accurate results.

> > >

> > > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K and his hundreds of students have done

a

> > laborious research by spending many years and many good

things.They

> > have shown us a path in thier books,articles and

message.Then,why

> we

> > should again look back.Atleast to respect his system which as I

> told

> > before is a well tested,certified one.If we are given a driving

> > license by the govt through right means and with right persons,

(I

> > mean all legal),why we should again go for a driving class to

learn

> > the learnt things.

> > >

> > > As a lover of astro science,I dont want to hurt anybody's

> > sentiments or feelings but my strong point here is in K.P forum

let

> > we talk about K.P only and if we can develop something good from

> here

> > like judging a match,finding the blood group of a

man,etc....Thats

> > research in the right line.Using K.P anything can be done

provided

> > right understanding of the subject and clear mind.

> > >

> > > I cannot intervene in others tastes and preferences.

> > >

> > > FOR ALL REF:K.P & ASTROLOGY 1995,A very detailed article

written

> by

> > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K

> > > " HOW TO JUDGE A NATIVITY " ,PAGE NO,47 LAST PARA..

> > >

> > > PLS EVERYBODY WHO TALKS ABOUT EXALTATION GO THROUGH

THIS.....HAVE

> A

> > CLEAR MIND.

> > >

> > > with regards

> > > Balaji G

> > >

> > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m...> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Balaji,

> > > I definitely accept your observation that in his early

research

> days

> > > KSK might have tried many ideas from the traditional system.

One

> of

> > > the things missing in his Readers is the history and

chronology.

> How

> > > can one know what he tried earlier but gave up later?

> > >

> > > Please understand that all my comments and questions are

merely to

> > > understand KP system better and is not intended to challenge

any

> > idea

> > > or anyone.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Rangarajan

> > >

> > > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > > Dear Rangarajanji and all,

> > > >

> > > > We all should understand a point that any newly invented

> theories

> > of

> > > today comes from the old existing principles and also when a

> correct

> > > solution has to be find using a system during great guruji's

day..

> > > >

> > > > just imagine for a while, when transportation is not that

much

> > > good,no computer,no awareness among the public,etc.In these

> > > situations,guruji taken the traditional astrology and done a

great

> > > research only for a simple reason that to prove astrology is a

> > > science.A universally applicable system,easy to work and

> > > understand,etc are some of his goals.

> > > >

> > > > So,in early days of his research the articles written by him

> gives

> > > the flavour of traditional approach also.But finally after his

> > mamoth

> > > efforts alnog with his devoted students has given a point

that " NO

> > > PLANETS CAN EXALTED OR DEBILITATED AND EVEN IF SO,THIS DOES

NOT

> > AFFECT

> > > RESULTS AS PER K.P APPROACH " .

> > > > SO,the topic of exaltation,debilitation,Dasaporutham,Mars

> > > dosha,remedies,gemmology all are handled by him for research

> purpose

> > > and finally his findings are that everything is based on karma

as

> > > given in his First reader.The planet Jupiter can

> kill,defame,spoil a

> > > man and saturn can bless him with good married life or child

in

> his

> > > period as per the signification thats what karma of us.

> > > >

> > > > Thats what Bhagvat gita says whatever has happened has

happened

> > well.

> > > >

> > > > Lord krishna says : " do your duty and I will decide the

results " .

> > > >

> > > > So dear learned members and Mr.Rangarajan,Please understand

the

> > > essence of K.P and apply it with clear knowledge.

> > > >

> > > > With regards

> > > > Balaji G

> > > >

> > > > Kanak Bosmia <kanbosastro@h...> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Rangrajan ji,

> > > >

> > > > Givere ferences of prectical example in reader about

> > > Exaltation/Debilitation .

> > > >

> > > > regards

> > > >

> > > > kanak

> > > >

> > > > > " Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy " <ranga@m...>

> > > > >

> > > > > Re: Exaltation/Debilitation

Revisited -

> > Reply

> > > to Balaji

> > > > >Mon, 25 Apr 2005 09:01:57 -0000

> > > > >

> > > > >Dear Balaji,

> > > > >Although most of us agree that KP System does not seem to

> stress

> > > > >exaltation and debilitation, one can find references to

these

> > terms

> > > > >in KP Readers. For example, see the last para of 6th

Reader,

> > Page

> > > > >145:

> > > > > " In K.P. (a) if a planet is exalted but is in the

> constellation

> > of

> > > > >a planet in debilitation, the extent to which it can do

either

> > good

> > > > >or bad is limited. A container (the planet) may be big but

the

> > > > >content is a cheap affair (lord of the constellation is the

> > > > >content). But a debilitated planet (small planet) in the

> > > > >constellation of a planet in exaltation (costly gems) is

> similar

> > to

> > > > >diamond in a small packet... "

> > > > >

> > > > >Doesn't this suggest that KSK attached some value to

> exaltation

> > and

> > > > >debilitation?

> > > > >

> > > > >Regards,

> > > > >Rangarajan

> > > > >

> > > > > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > > > ><balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > > > > Dear sandy and all,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I am sorry to intervene the discussion going on for a

> > longtime on

> > > > >debilitation and exaltation of planets.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > One of the major welcoming findings of Great guruji

K.S.K

> > is " no

> > > > >planet is debilitated or exalted in K.P " .Planets gives the

> > results

> > > > >only by source of its star lord...thats why it is called

> stellar

> > > > >theory.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > More over,you can very well see personally on your own

many

> > charts

> > > > >having exalted planets gives adverse results and planets

> > debilitated

> > > > >gives good results.Why??...Thats the secret of starlord

and

> sub

> > > > >lord theory.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > So,may be as a practitioner of traditional astrology or

> vedic

> > > > >astrology,we can use those concepts for our satisfaction

but

> the

> > > > >truth is that we are not hitting the right spot.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I request all the K.P astrologers again to understand

the

> > > > >foundation rules and findings of great guruji K.S.K and not

to

> > > > >divert else with other insignificant rules.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > K.P is time-tested,well refined and most scientific

method

> in

> > this

> > > > >modern world.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Its a message for all true K.P followers and not to hurt

> > anybody.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > With regards

> > > > > > Balaji G

> > > > > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m...> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Sandy,

> > > > > > Thanks for a nice posting. However, I don't think I

> > understand

> > > > >what

> > > > > > you mean by a debilitated planet offering results " at

> snails

> > pace "

> > > > > > or an exalted planet offering results " quickly " . Does

this

> > affect

> > > > > > timing then? We normally use conjoined period of the

> > effective

> > > > > > significators along with transits to establish timing. I

> > can't see

> > > > > > how planetary dignity (its strength as you nicely put

it)

> can

> > > > >affect

> > > > > > this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Rangarajan

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , " Sandy Crowther "

> > > > > > <sandycrowther@a...> wrote:

> > > > > > > Dear Group,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There appears to be some prevailing confusion about

> exactly

> > what

> > > > > > Exaltation

> > > > > > > and Debilitation actually mean in evaluation of a KP

> chart.

> > So

> > > > > > below is a

> > > > > > > brief overview of the planetary interactions, followed

by

> > my

> > > > > > humble attempt

> > > > > > > at explaining the effects of exaltation and

debilitation,

> > and

> > > > > > their usage in

> > > > > > > KP, according to my understanding of the basic and

> primary

> > > > > > teachings of the

> > > > > > > KP system.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > What we know already is that a planet moving under the

> > influence

> > > > > > of his star

> > > > > > > lord, will act according to the dictates of that star

> lord.

> > With

> > > > > > that in

> > > > > > > mind, we are also well aware that the planet will

> > predominately

> > > > > > offer the

> > > > > > > results of the house in which the star lord is

posited,

> in

> > > > > > addition to the

> > > > > > > house(s) owned by the star lord. Then, the planet

itself,

> > offers

> > > > > > the results

> > > > > > > of the house it occupies and the house(s) it owns. So

> > basically

> > > > > > each planet

> > > > > > > has a role to play, and both the star lord and the

planet

> > > > >combine

> > > > > > their

> > > > > > > influence to determine whether the event will be

> favorable

> > or

> > > > >not.

> > > > > > ( If

> > > > > > > unfamiliar with this concept, more examples of how a

> planet

> > will

> > > > > > act can be

> > > > > > > found in my article

> > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_How%20does%20the%

20dasha%

> > 20lord%

> > > > > > 20function.ht

> > > > > > > m> KP: How Does the Dasha Lord Function?)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > So what exactly does Exalted or Debilitated infer?

> > > > > > > Several indicators are simply " givens " in KP, and must

> not

> > only

> > > > >be

> > > > > > > considered, but must also be both integrated and

> > synthesized

> > > > >into

> > > > > > your

> > > > > > > analysis before a final determination is made. But

> > according to

> > > > > > sizing up an

> > > > > > > event, only the house results are offered - so where

does

> > that

> > > > > > leave the

> > > > > > > sign effects that the planet is placed in - such as

the

> > planet's

> > > > > > exalted or

> > > > > > > debilitated status? Here is where much confusion seems

> > prevalent

> > > > > > in KP

> > > > > > > assessments- especially when a planet is badly placed

in

> > the 8th

> > > > > > or 12th

> > > > > > > house, but simultaneously exalted in status. Or when a

> > planet is

> > > > > > in a

> > > > > > > debilitated state, but posited in the benefic 11th

house?

> > How do

> > > > > > we assess

> > > > > > > these results?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Exaltation and debilitation are " strength "

and " weakness "

> > > > > > indicators

> > > > > > > respectively, and therefore their specific job is to

give

> > us an

> > > > > > idea of how

> > > > > > > much " muscle " (strength or weakness) the planet

carries -

> > within

> > > > > > its

> > > > > > > environment - to carry out its function determined by

its

> > house

> > > > > > placement.

> > > > > > > So if a planet is strong due to exaltation, but badly

> > placed in

> > > > > > the 12th,

> > > > > > > the planet does not change its role and become good

for

> the

> > 12th

> > > > > > house, but

> > > > > > > rather the effects are that the planet will not hasten

to

> > > > >quickly

> > > > > > carry out

> > > > > > > the functions for his position in any given house, and

> will

> > > > > > therefore

> > > > > > > quickly bring about loss (or other 12th house

function)

> in

> > a

> > > > >very

> > > > > > timely

> > > > > > > manner. Why? Because he has the strength to act

quickly

> and

> > with

> > > > > > no delay,

> > > > > > > and he is very comfortable where he is positioned in

his

> > exalted

> > > > > > status. He

> > > > > > > works fast because he is in a happy and exalted state -

> > caring

> > > > >not

> > > > > > that he

> > > > > > > is working quickly to bring about less than fortunate

> > events.

> > > > >He's

> > > > > > just

> > > > > > > doing his job with the muscle provided to do it with.

> When

> > the

> > > > > > planet has

> > > > > > > established a set of results that need to be carried

out

> > due to

> > > > > > his star

> > > > > > > level placement, exaltation does not absolve him of

the

> > adverse

> > > > > > results that

> > > > > > > need to be carried out, and subsequently make the

results

> > > > > > pleasant. This is

> > > > > > > simply not the way exaltation and debilitation work,

nor

> is

> > it

> > > > > > part of their

> > > > > > > role as " strength indicators " for a planet. The

planets

> do

> > not

> > > > > > give contrary

> > > > > > > results due to their strength status.

> > > > > > > So, also, do we judge the effects of a planet posited

in

> a

> > good

> > > > > > house but in

> > > > > > > the state of debilitation. This debilitated planet

will

> > still

> > > > > > carry out the

> > > > > > > positive acts for the house in which he is posited,

but

> his

> > > > > > strength factor

> > > > > > > will not allow him to do so quickly or in a timely

> manner.

> > So

> > > > >the

> > > > > > result is

> > > > > > > that he will eventually bring the good effects about,

but

> > not in

> > > > >a

> > > > > > timely

> > > > > > > manner or with speed under his wings. He only carries

> > enough

> > > > > > strength to

> > > > > > > respond to his mission in a slow and delayed manner

> because

> > he

> > > > >is

> > > > > > not happy

> > > > > > > being posited where he is and at the degree at which

he

> is

> > > > > > debilitated, but

> > > > > > > he has a job to do and will carry it out and do his

job,

> > but NOT

> > > > > > in a manner

> > > > > > > contrary to what his position indicates - it will just

be

> > > > >carried

> > > > > > out at a

> > > > > > > snails pace.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > More Apparent " Strength " Confusion:

> > > > > > > Now the KP confusion I'm seeing frequently, and the

catch

> > to the

> > > > > > > exaltation/debilitation game is this...Exactly WHEN is

a

> > planet

> > > > > > considered

> > > > > > > to be exalted or debilitated? Is is just by being

posited

> > in the

> > > > > > respective

> > > > > > > signs of exaltation or debilitation - such as Jupiter

is

> > > > >considered

> > > > > > > debilitated simply because he is posited in Capricorn?

Or

> > Venus

> > > > >is

> > > > > > > considered exalted just because she is posited in

Pisces?

> > The

> > > > > > answer to this

> > > > > > > question is no! There are refinements to strengths and

> > > > >weaknesses

> > > > > > that need

> > > > > > > to be addressed before blanket statements are made due

to

> > > > > > assessing these

> > > > > > > planetary strengths and weaknesses. For example, is

> > Jupiter,

> > > > >when

> > > > > > posited at

> > > > > > > 15 Cancer, considered to be in an exalted state? No!

Why?

> > > > >Jupiter

> > > > > > is exalted

> > > > > > > at 05 Cancer - not at 15 degrees Cancer. Orbs must be

set

> > in

> > > > >place

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > respected for the effects of exalted or debilitated

> status

> > to be

> > > > > > truly

> > > > > > > effective - sign positions alone are irrelevant when

> > assessing

> > > > > > planetary

> > > > > > > strengths. So to say that a planet is exalted or

> > debilitated

> > > > > > simply because

> > > > > > > it is posited in its sign of exaltation or

debilitation

> is

> > > > > > incorrect - the

> > > > > > > degrees of the sign placement are necessary to

determine

> > whether

> > > > > > that planet

> > > > > > > is truly in an exalted or debilitated state. According

to

> > my

> > > > > > understanding,

> > > > > > > the KP preferred orb allowance is 50' on either side

of

> its

> > > > > > exaltation or

> > > > > > > debilitation degree - (less than a degree). Below is a

> > Table

> > > > > > showing the

> > > > > > > exalted and debilitated placements. I sincerely hope

this

> > > > >further

> > > > > > clarifies

> > > > > > > the position of exaltation versus debilitation. (If

the

> > Table

> > > > > > doesn't

> > > > > > > transmit, I have also uploaded this to my site at

> > > > > > > http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_exaltation.debilitation%

> > > > > > 20revisited.htm

> > > > > > > (With reference to Navamsha positions, my take on this

is

> > that

> > > > >in

> > > > > > KP, this

> > > > > > > varga has been used to further refine the strength of

a

> > planet).

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Planet

> > > > > > > Exalted

> > > > > > > Debilitated

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sun

> > > > > > > 10 Degrees Aries

> > > > > > > 10 Degrees Libra

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > 03 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > > 03 Degrees Scorpio

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > 28 Degrees Capricorn

> > > > > > > 28 Degrees Cancer

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > 15 Degrees Virgo

> > > > > > > 15 Degrees Pisces

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jupiter

> > > > > > > 05 Degrees Cancer

> > > > > > > 05 Degrees Capricorn

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Venus

> > > > > > > 27 Degrees Pisces

> > > > > > > 27 Degrees Virgo

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Saturn

> > > > > > > 20 Libra

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Aries

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Rahu

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ketu

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > <sandy@t...>

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > All the Best,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> <http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/40.gif>

> > Sandy

> > > > > > > Crowther

> > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/>

http://www.jupitersweb.com

> > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/>

> > > > > >

April 27, 2005

Dear Inder,

Without studying or referring KSK or KP books how can you learn or

say or discuss KP properly. Here we're seriously studying and

discussing KP real issues for futher edvelopment of KP theories and

methods. You can express your feeling or personal view on which I've

no comment, but without studying or knowing or giving KSK or KP

references, you may be misleading the KP learners with your feeling

or personal view with real KP which will be damaging the lovely

spirit of Guruji KSK. Please read moderator Punit ji's reminder in

this regard.

Best regards,

tw

, " Inder " <indervohra2001>

wrote:

>

> Dear TW,

> 1] Balaji of the JR astrogroup and Balaji of this group, I think,

> are two different persons. I could not follow your word " duel " .

> 2]Yes, true I did Chart analysis with KP methods in hundreds of

> cases in JR and astroexpert groups. You can take any and post

> anywhere, no permission is required as these are no longer my

> property.

> 3]I read KP readers, understood them and try to learn more from

> astro groups. However, I find it extemely difficult to refer books

> and page numbers again and again. So I may not be able to give you

> references as you often give. I appreciate you for your efforts in

> giving references etc. But it is really difficult to revisit the

> books for seeing/refering smaller issues.

> 4]If I got some observation/view based on my experience, I try

share

> it.By mutual discussion we can learn some new things, otherwise

> Astrology is infinite as 6 billion people on this earth--eachone

is

> having seperate chart and fate.

> Good wishes.

> InderVohra

>

> , " tw853 " <tw853> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Balaji,

> >

> > 1. This is KP discussion forum as you've said, where serious

> > discussions conducive to the further development of KP are

> discussed

> > with references of speciic titles and page numbers, which

myself

> and

> > Kanak ji are asking you to show a proof of what you're saying

KP.

> The

> > buden of proof is on your side.

> >

> > 2. I'm wondering what is your real motive of making Sandy upset

> for

> > her contribution in this group because---

> >

> > 1) I traced all posts of your Dual (you & Inder) in Jyotish

> Remedies

> > group and Inder used to make KP analysis, but one time asking

Bob

> > Singh, who is asking advice, to give KP (caculated) chart.

> >

> > 2) After some time of my lengthy demonstration KP post by MSg

> #11436

> > in that group, it's nice to see the Dual in our group.

> >

> > 3) I asked Inder for permission to repost some of his many many

KP

> > practical analysis in the previous group for the benefit of KP

> > learners in this group.

> >

> > 4) Sorry, Inder, I don't have time to trace back all your mails

> > again, for examples like kidding by saying you're going to

> practice

> > Dr. Kar's sub sub theory, am I right or You're right between the

> Dual

> > without mentioning the real point, in the case of PRINCIPLES OF

> > CUSPAL INTERLINKS by K. Baskaran, who has some intirely diffent

> basic

> > views from KSK as mentioned in his EPILOGUE of that book pp 200-

> 203.

> >

> > 5) You were confused by seeing KSK originals regarding

> debilitation

> > for the first time as if I'm making confusion.

> >

> > 6) Then you asked Shri Raichur about the basic KP idea related

to

> 4-

> > step method, mentioned by A.R. Raichur, B.E., F.I.E. in the

above

> > mentioned Baskaran's first book, pp x-xi, which you recommand

> Inder

> > to buy, and also explained in the same page you mentioned in

> > Astrosecrets & Krishnamurti Padhdhati, Part 1, in bold letters.

> >

> > 7) Then suddenly you've started saying, in KP group, only KP, no

> > place for exaltation or delibitation, so on even with posting in

> bold

> > and red letters.

> >

> > 8) No need to backe off ucha and neecha reference mentioned by

> bold

> > and red letters because NEECHABHANGARAJAYOGA,

> > STHOOADHARMAKARMADHIPAYOGA are mentioned in " The Horoscope of

> Prof.

> > rishnamurti " by M.G.G. Nayar in Astrosecrets and KP, Part I,

2003,

> pp

> > 249-271; also in " Notable Persons & Krishnamurti Padhdhati, by

K.

> > Hariharan,1993, pp 8-33.

> >

> > 3. Dear Inder, please mention what is your exact view, for

> > example " there is no place or place to analyse strength of

planets

> by

> > exaltation or debilitation in KP " , and of course if you want to

> say

> > it's KP, please provide specific KSK or KP references of titles

> and

> > page numbers, in a short to the point, precise form, not easy

type

> in

> > another group. If you're saying it's your personal opinion, I've

> no

> > comment; if yours is KP, I promise you to respond honestly

whether

> > it's consistent with KSK or KP references. I never say right or

> wrong

> > which I don't have authoriy.

> >

> > Thanks and best regards,

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> > tw

> >

> > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > Dear tw853 and all,

> > >

> > > I have already given the reference told by Great guruji K.S.K

> > himself which clearly explains the views of Great Guruji K.S.K

and

> I

> > am also not denying the fact that ucha and neecha are referred

by

> > K.S.K in his articles.

> > >

> > > Please go through all my mails,you can see the substance of my

> > point.

> > >

> > > Exalted planets and debilitated planets can effect only as a

> > indicator and the real analysis about the strength of planets

has

> to

> > go on star of the planet and its aspects,conjuction and all

other

> > significant points as told in his system.

> > >

> > > The root of K.P stands in the star and its disposition and

> > exaltation or debilitation can be considered as an

indicator.Many

> > points in traditional are still contradictory,unclear and

subject

> to

> > arguments.

> > >

> > > Thats why Guruji has not stressed much on those topics.More

over

> > they are not the real giver of results when you analyse.Exalted

> > planet can give bad results and debilitated planet can give good

> > results.Everything depends on the signification of star and sub

of

> a

> > planet.Even,in all the Astro secrets Part1,2,3

> > > you can see in no articles when analysing the charts these

> aspects

> > like exaltation or any traditional aspects is not stressed.

> > >

> > > I am also open to do research and welcome new things coming to

> K.P

> > system and if possible I will also add to that.I love those who

do

> > research for the betterment of the system and I hate those who

> > distract the progress of the system.

> > >

> > > I sincerely feel very bad what sandy has understood and taking

> > these undesirable steps.Anyway,my sincere apologise to her from

my

> > side if really it has hurt her feelings or sentiments.I also

> accept

> > the fact that she has done a wonderful work on K.P in her

website

> and

> > I wish her a successful future.

> > >

> > > Forum is a place of discussion.Some says Yes and some No.But

> should

> > we windup from the action simply that we are getting NO.In

> fact,here

> > nobody has said anything bad against anybody and it is all our

> views

> > and for the betterment of the system,we work.Respected

> > Raichurji,yogesh raoji and punitji has also quite good years of

> > experience in the field and we have argued well and they are not

> > taking any hard decisions.

> > >

> > > In life,we cannot expect to go in one way.

> > >

> > > My understanding on the subject is clear and the problem here

is

> > trying to explain you all.Thats understood.My experience might

be

> > very less compared to many here but its not the years that

counts

> the

> > worth but the understanding.I want to be a good friend of all

and

> to

> > the good things around me.If somebody likes it or not,I am sorry

> > thats the wish of the fate.

> > >

> > > With thanks

> > > Balaji.G

> > >

> > > Note:Here,I am not meaning anybody in particular.These are all

> > general views from my heart.

> > >

> > > tw853 <tw853> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Balaji,

> > >

> > > Shri Anat Raichur and Sandy are not saying Uchcha, Neecha is

> > > auspacious but about strength of exalted and debelitated

> planets.

> > > For creditibily of what you're asying is KP, where are your

> > > references from KP Readers?

> > >

> > > Best regards,

> > >

> > > tw

> > >

> > > Qoute

> > >

> > > Is not Mercury Neecha?

> > >

> > > In K.P. there is no use for Uchcha, Neecha, etc. In Sir C.P.

> > > Ramaswamy Iyer's chart, how many planets are Neecha. In the

> > horoscope

> > > of the president of the Income-Tax Tribunal which we saw today

> are

> > > not Jupiter, Mars, etc.,Neecha. Are there not 3 neechas in

your

> > > proprietor's chart (Sun, Moon, and Venus). Whereas you have

> exalted

> > > Mercury and Mars. What do you do? When we presses the bottom

and

> > you

> > > hear the calling bell, you, with your pencil and note-book run

> to

> > his

> > > room.

> > >

> > > True, Sir. I also wonder why Hindus following traditional

sytem

> say

> > > that Uchchas give very good results. Neechas bring untold

> miseries.

> > I

> > > think that they start forgetting what they were following all

> along

> > > and at least now begin to learn your system.

> > >

> > > Unqote

> > >

> > > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > > Dear Rangarajanji and all,

> > > >

> > > > To my great guruji sri.K.S.K or to me,defaming anything or

> > stopping

> > > anybody is not the intention rather the essence of science

> should

> > be

> > > known to all for a better prediction..I would say very

accurate

> > > prediction.

> > > >

> > > > When graham bell invented a phone,it is not a

> > cordless.Today,Mobile

> > > phones are available with video display.How.Let we shed the

old

> > > things which is not useful or correct and take which gives

> > > success,time-saving,accurate results.

> > > >

> > > > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K and his hundreds of students have

done

> a

> > > laborious research by spending many years and many good

> things.They

> > > have shown us a path in thier books,articles and

> message.Then,why

> > we

> > > should again look back.Atleast to respect his system which as

I

> > told

> > > before is a well tested,certified one.If we are given a

driving

> > > license by the govt through right means and with right persons,

> (I

> > > mean all legal),why we should again go for a driving class to

> learn

> > > the learnt things.

> > > >

> > > > As a lover of astro science,I dont want to hurt anybody's

> > > sentiments or feelings but my strong point here is in K.P

forum

> let

> > > we talk about K.P only and if we can develop something good

from

> > here

> > > like judging a match,finding the blood group of a

> man,etc....Thats

> > > research in the right line.Using K.P anything can be done

> provided

> > > right understanding of the subject and clear mind.

> > > >

> > > > I cannot intervene in others tastes and preferences.

> > > >

> > > > FOR ALL REF:K.P & ASTROLOGY 1995,A very detailed article

> written

> > by

> > > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K

> > > > " HOW TO JUDGE A NATIVITY " ,PAGE NO,47 LAST PARA..

> > > >

> > > > PLS EVERYBODY WHO TALKS ABOUT EXALTATION GO THROUGH

> THIS.....HAVE

> > A

> > > CLEAR MIND.

> > > >

> > > > with regards

> > > > Balaji G

> > > >

> > > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m...> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Balaji,

> > > > I definitely accept your observation that in his early

> research

> > days

> > > > KSK might have tried many ideas from the traditional system.

> One

> > of

> > > > the things missing in his Readers is the history and

> chronology.

> > How

> > > > can one know what he tried earlier but gave up later?

> > > >

> > > > Please understand that all my comments and questions are

> merely to

> > > > understand KP system better and is not intended to challenge

> any

> > > idea

> > > > or anyone.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Rangarajan

> > > >

> > > > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > > > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > > > Dear Rangarajanji and all,

> > > > >

> > > > > We all should understand a point that any newly invented

> > theories

> > > of

> > > > today comes from the old existing principles and also when a

> > correct

> > > > solution has to be find using a system during great guruji's

> day..

> > > > >

> > > > > just imagine for a while, when transportation is not that

> much

> > > > good,no computer,no awareness among the public,etc.In these

> > > > situations,guruji taken the traditional astrology and done a

> great

> > > > research only for a simple reason that to prove astrology is

a

> > > > science.A universally applicable system,easy to work and

> > > > understand,etc are some of his goals.

> > > > >

> > > > > So,in early days of his research the articles written by

him

> > gives

> > > > the flavour of traditional approach also.But finally after

his

> > > mamoth

> > > > efforts alnog with his devoted students has given a point

> that " NO

> > > > PLANETS CAN EXALTED OR DEBILITATED AND EVEN IF SO,THIS DOES

> NOT

> > > AFFECT

> > > > RESULTS AS PER K.P APPROACH " .

> > > > > SO,the topic of exaltation,debilitation,Dasaporutham,Mars

> > > > dosha,remedies,gemmology all are handled by him for research

> > purpose

> > > > and finally his findings are that everything is based on

karma

> as

> > > > given in his First reader.The planet Jupiter can

> > kill,defame,spoil a

> > > > man and saturn can bless him with good married life or child

> in

> > his

> > > > period as per the signification thats what karma of us.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thats what Bhagvat gita says whatever has happened has

> happened

> > > well.

> > > > >

> > > > > Lord krishna says : " do your duty and I will decide the

> results " .

> > > > >

> > > > > So dear learned members and Mr.Rangarajan,Please

understand

> the

> > > > essence of K.P and apply it with clear knowledge.

> > > > >

> > > > > With regards

> > > > > Balaji G

> > > > >

> > > > > Kanak Bosmia <kanbosastro@h...> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Rangrajan ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > Givere ferences of prectical example in reader about

> > > > Exaltation/Debilitation .

> > > > >

> > > > > regards

> > > > >

> > > > > kanak

> > > > >

> > > > > > " Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy " <ranga@m...>

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Re: Exaltation/Debilitation

> Revisited -

> > > Reply

> > > > to Balaji

> > > > > >Mon, 25 Apr 2005 09:01:57 -0000

> > > > > >

> > > > > >Dear Balaji,

> > > > > >Although most of us agree that KP System does not seem to

> > stress

> > > > > >exaltation and debilitation, one can find references to

> these

> > > terms

> > > > > >in KP Readers. For example, see the last para of 6th

> Reader,

> > > Page

> > > > > >145:

> > > > > > " In K.P. (a) if a planet is exalted but is in the

> > constellation

> > > of

> > > > > >a planet in debilitation, the extent to which it can do

> either

> > > good

> > > > > >or bad is limited. A container (the planet) may be big

but

> the

> > > > > >content is a cheap affair (lord of the constellation is

the

> > > > > >content). But a debilitated planet (small planet) in the

> > > > > >constellation of a planet in exaltation (costly gems) is

> > similar

> > > to

> > > > > >diamond in a small packet... "

> > > > > >

> > > > > >Doesn't this suggest that KSK attached some value to

> > exaltation

> > > and

> > > > > >debilitation?

> > > > > >

> > > > > >Regards,

> > > > > >Rangarajan

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > > > > ><balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > > > > > Dear sandy and all,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I am sorry to intervene the discussion going on for a

> > > longtime on

> > > > > >debilitation and exaltation of planets.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > One of the major welcoming findings of Great guruji

> K.S.K

> > > is " no

> > > > > >planet is debilitated or exalted in K.P " .Planets gives

the

> > > results

> > > > > >only by source of its star lord...thats why it is called

> > stellar

> > > > > >theory.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > More over,you can very well see personally on your own

> many

> > > charts

> > > > > >having exalted planets gives adverse results and planets

> > > debilitated

> > > > > >gives good results.Why??...Thats the secret of starlord

> and

> > sub

> > > > > >lord theory.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > So,may be as a practitioner of traditional astrology

or

> > vedic

> > > > > >astrology,we can use those concepts for our satisfaction

> but

> > the

> > > > > >truth is that we are not hitting the right spot.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I request all the K.P astrologers again to understand

> the

> > > > > >foundation rules and findings of great guruji K.S.K and

not

> to

> > > > > >divert else with other insignificant rules.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > K.P is time-tested,well refined and most scientific

> method

> > in

> > > this

> > > > > >modern world.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Its a message for all true K.P followers and not to

hurt

> > > anybody.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > With regards

> > > > > > > Balaji G

> > > > > > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m...> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Sandy,

> > > > > > > Thanks for a nice posting. However, I don't think I

> > > understand

> > > > > >what

> > > > > > > you mean by a debilitated planet offering results " at

> > snails

> > > pace "

> > > > > > > or an exalted planet offering results " quickly " . Does

> this

> > > affect

> > > > > > > timing then? We normally use conjoined period of the

> > > effective

> > > > > > > significators along with transits to establish timing.

I

> > > can't see

> > > > > > > how planetary dignity (its strength as you nicely put

> it)

> > can

> > > > > >affect

> > > > > > > this.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > Rangarajan

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , " Sandy Crowther "

> > > > > > > <sandycrowther@a...> wrote:

> > > > > > > > Dear Group,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There appears to be some prevailing confusion about

> > exactly

> > > what

> > > > > > > Exaltation

> > > > > > > > and Debilitation actually mean in evaluation of a KP

> > chart.

> > > So

> > > > > > > below is a

> > > > > > > > brief overview of the planetary interactions,

followed

> by

> > > my

> > > > > > > humble attempt

> > > > > > > > at explaining the effects of exaltation and

> debilitation,

> > > and

> > > > > > > their usage in

> > > > > > > > KP, according to my understanding of the basic and

> > primary

> > > > > > > teachings of the

> > > > > > > > KP system.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > What we know already is that a planet moving under

the

> > > influence

> > > > > > > of his star

> > > > > > > > lord, will act according to the dictates of that

star

> > lord.

> > > With

> > > > > > > that in

> > > > > > > > mind, we are also well aware that the planet will

> > > predominately

> > > > > > > offer the

> > > > > > > > results of the house in which the star lord is

> posited,

> > in

> > > > > > > addition to the

> > > > > > > > house(s) owned by the star lord. Then, the planet

> itself,

> > > offers

> > > > > > > the results

> > > > > > > > of the house it occupies and the house(s) it owns.

So

> > > basically

> > > > > > > each planet

> > > > > > > > has a role to play, and both the star lord and the

> planet

> > > > > >combine

> > > > > > > their

> > > > > > > > influence to determine whether the event will be

> > favorable

> > > or

> > > > > >not.

> > > > > > > ( If

> > > > > > > > unfamiliar with this concept, more examples of how a

> > planet

> > > will

> > > > > > > act can be

> > > > > > > > found in my article

> > > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_How%20does%20the%

> 20dasha%

> > > 20lord%

> > > > > > > 20function.ht

> > > > > > > > m> KP: How Does the Dasha Lord Function?)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > So what exactly does Exalted or Debilitated infer?

> > > > > > > > Several indicators are simply " givens " in KP, and

must

> > not

> > > only

> > > > > >be

> > > > > > > > considered, but must also be both integrated and

> > > synthesized

> > > > > >into

> > > > > > > your

> > > > > > > > analysis before a final determination is made. But

> > > according to

> > > > > > > sizing up an

> > > > > > > > event, only the house results are offered - so where

> does

> > > that

> > > > > > > leave the

> > > > > > > > sign effects that the planet is placed in - such as

> the

> > > planet's

> > > > > > > exalted or

> > > > > > > > debilitated status? Here is where much confusion

seems

> > > prevalent

> > > > > > > in KP

> > > > > > > > assessments- especially when a planet is badly

placed

> in

> > > the 8th

> > > > > > > or 12th

> > > > > > > > house, but simultaneously exalted in status. Or when

a

> > > planet is

> > > > > > > in a

> > > > > > > > debilitated state, but posited in the benefic 11th

> house?

> > > How do

> > > > > > > we assess

> > > > > > > > these results?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Exaltation and debilitation are " strength "

> and " weakness "

> > > > > > > indicators

> > > > > > > > respectively, and therefore their specific job is to

> give

> > > us an

> > > > > > > idea of how

> > > > > > > > much " muscle " (strength or weakness) the planet

> carries -

> > > within

> > > > > > > its

> > > > > > > > environment - to carry out its function determined

by

> its

> > > house

> > > > > > > placement.

> > > > > > > > So if a planet is strong due to exaltation, but

badly

> > > placed in

> > > > > > > the 12th,

> > > > > > > > the planet does not change its role and become good

> for

> > the

> > > 12th

> > > > > > > house, but

> > > > > > > > rather the effects are that the planet will not

hasten

> to

> > > > > >quickly

> > > > > > > carry out

> > > > > > > > the functions for his position in any given house,

and

> > will

> > > > > > > therefore

> > > > > > > > quickly bring about loss (or other 12th house

> function)

> > in

> > > a

> > > > > >very

> > > > > > > timely

> > > > > > > > manner. Why? Because he has the strength to act

> quickly

> > and

> > > with

> > > > > > > no delay,

> > > > > > > > and he is very comfortable where he is positioned in

> his

> > > exalted

> > > > > > > status. He

> > > > > > > > works fast because he is in a happy and exalted

state -

>

> > > caring

> > > > > >not

> > > > > > > that he

> > > > > > > > is working quickly to bring about less than

fortunate

> > > events.

> > > > > >He's

> > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > doing his job with the muscle provided to do it

with.

> > When

> > > the

> > > > > > > planet has

> > > > > > > > established a set of results that need to be carried

> out

> > > due to

> > > > > > > his star

> > > > > > > > level placement, exaltation does not absolve him of

> the

> > > adverse

> > > > > > > results that

> > > > > > > > need to be carried out, and subsequently make the

> results

> > > > > > > pleasant. This is

> > > > > > > > simply not the way exaltation and debilitation work,

> nor

> > is

> > > it

> > > > > > > part of their

> > > > > > > > role as " strength indicators " for a planet. The

> planets

> > do

> > > not

> > > > > > > give contrary

> > > > > > > > results due to their strength status.

> > > > > > > > So, also, do we judge the effects of a planet

posited

> in

> > a

> > > good

> > > > > > > house but in

> > > > > > > > the state of debilitation. This debilitated planet

> will

> > > still

> > > > > > > carry out the

> > > > > > > > positive acts for the house in which he is posited,

> but

> > his

> > > > > > > strength factor

> > > > > > > > will not allow him to do so quickly or in a timely

> > manner.

> > > So

> > > > > >the

> > > > > > > result is

> > > > > > > > that he will eventually bring the good effects

about,

> but

> > > not in

> > > > > >a

> > > > > > > timely

> > > > > > > > manner or with speed under his wings. He only

carries

> > > enough

> > > > > > > strength to

> > > > > > > > respond to his mission in a slow and delayed manner

> > because

> > > he

> > > > > >is

> > > > > > > not happy

> > > > > > > > being posited where he is and at the degree at which

> he

> > is

> > > > > > > debilitated, but

> > > > > > > > he has a job to do and will carry it out and do his

> job,

> > > but NOT

> > > > > > > in a manner

> > > > > > > > contrary to what his position indicates - it will

just

> be

> > > > > >carried

> > > > > > > out at a

> > > > > > > > snails pace.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > More Apparent " Strength " Confusion:

> > > > > > > > Now the KP confusion I'm seeing frequently, and the

> catch

> > > to the

> > > > > > > > exaltation/debilitation game is this...Exactly WHEN

is

> a

> > > planet

> > > > > > > considered

> > > > > > > > to be exalted or debilitated? Is is just by being

> posited

> > > in the

> > > > > > > respective

> > > > > > > > signs of exaltation or debilitation - such as

Jupiter

> is

> > > > > >considered

> > > > > > > > debilitated simply because he is posited in

Capricorn?

> Or

> > > Venus

> > > > > >is

> > > > > > > > considered exalted just because she is posited in

> Pisces?

> > > The

> > > > > > > answer to this

> > > > > > > > question is no! There are refinements to strengths

and

> > > > > >weaknesses

> > > > > > > that need

> > > > > > > > to be addressed before blanket statements are made

due

> to

> > > > > > > assessing these

> > > > > > > > planetary strengths and weaknesses. For example, is

> > > Jupiter,

> > > > > >when

> > > > > > > posited at

> > > > > > > > 15 Cancer, considered to be in an exalted state? No!

> Why?

> > > > > >Jupiter

> > > > > > > is exalted

> > > > > > > > at 05 Cancer - not at 15 degrees Cancer. Orbs must

be

> set

> > > in

> > > > > >place

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > respected for the effects of exalted or debilitated

> > status

> > > to be

> > > > > > > truly

> > > > > > > > effective - sign positions alone are irrelevant when

> > > assessing

> > > > > > > planetary

> > > > > > > > strengths. So to say that a planet is exalted or

> > > debilitated

> > > > > > > simply because

> > > > > > > > it is posited in its sign of exaltation or

> debilitation

> > is

> > > > > > > incorrect - the

> > > > > > > > degrees of the sign placement are necessary to

> determine

> > > whether

> > > > > > > that planet

> > > > > > > > is truly in an exalted or debilitated state.

According

> to

> > > my

> > > > > > > understanding,

> > > > > > > > the KP preferred orb allowance is 50' on either side

> of

> > its

> > > > > > > exaltation or

> > > > > > > > debilitation degree - (less than a degree). Below is

a

> > > Table

> > > > > > > showing the

> > > > > > > > exalted and debilitated placements. I sincerely hope

> this

> > > > > >further

> > > > > > > clarifies

> > > > > > > > the position of exaltation versus debilitation. (If

> the

> > > Table

> > > > > > > doesn't

> > > > > > > > transmit, I have also uploaded this to my site at

> > > > > > > >

http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_exaltation.debilitation%

> > > > > > > 20revisited.htm

> > > > > > > > (With reference to Navamsha positions, my take on

this

> is

> > > that

> > > > > >in

> > > > > > > KP, this

> > > > > > > > varga has been used to further refine the strength

of

> a

> > > planet).

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Planet

> > > > > > > > Exalted

> > > > > > > > Debilitated

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sun

> > > > > > > > 10 Degrees Aries

> > > > > > > > 10 Degrees Libra

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > > 03 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > > > 03 Degrees Scorpio

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > > 28 Degrees Capricorn

> > > > > > > > 28 Degrees Cancer

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > > 15 Degrees Virgo

> > > > > > > > 15 Degrees Pisces

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Jupiter

> > > > > > > > 05 Degrees Cancer

> > > > > > > > 05 Degrees Capricorn

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Venus

> > > > > > > > 27 Degrees Pisces

> > > > > > > > 27 Degrees Virgo

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Saturn

> > > > > > > > 20 Libra

> > > > > > > > 20 Degrees Aries

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Rahu

> > > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Ketu

> > > > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio

> > > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > <sandy@t...>

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > All the Best,

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > <http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/40.gif>

> > > Sandy

> > > > > > > > Crowther

> > > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/>

> http://www.jupitersweb.com

> > > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/>

> > > > > > >

April 27, 2005

Dear TW,

1] Balaji of the JR astrogroup and Balaji of this group, I think,

are two different persons. I could not follow your word " duel " .

2]Yes, true I did Chart analysis with KP methods in hundreds of

cases in JR and astroexpert groups. You can take any and post

anywhere, no permission is required as these are no longer my

property.

3]I read KP readers, understood them and try to learn more from

astro groups. However, I find it extemely difficult to refer books

and page numbers again and again. So I may not be able to give you

references as you often give. I appreciate you for your efforts in

giving references etc. But it is really difficult to revisit the

books for seeing/refering smaller issues.

4]If I got some observation/view based on my experience, I try share

it.By mutual discussion we can learn some new things, otherwise

Astrology is infinite as 6 billion people on this earth--eachone is

having seperate chart and fate.

Good wishes.

InderVohra

, " tw853 " <tw853> wrote:

>

> Dear Balaji,

>

> 1. This is KP discussion forum as you've said, where serious

> discussions conducive to the further development of KP are

discussed

> with references of speciic titles and page numbers, which myself

and

> Kanak ji are asking you to show a proof of what you're saying KP.

The

> buden of proof is on your side.

>

> 2. I'm wondering what is your real motive of making Sandy upset

for

> her contribution in this group because---

>

> 1) I traced all posts of your Dual (you & Inder) in Jyotish

Remedies

> group and Inder used to make KP analysis, but one time asking Bob

> Singh, who is asking advice, to give KP (caculated) chart.

>

> 2) After some time of my lengthy demonstration KP post by MSg

#11436

> in that group, it's nice to see the Dual in our group.

>

> 3) I asked Inder for permission to repost some of his many many KP

> practical analysis in the previous group for the benefit of KP

> learners in this group.

>

> 4) Sorry, Inder, I don't have time to trace back all your mails

> again, for examples like kidding by saying you're going to

practice

> Dr. Kar's sub sub theory, am I right or You're right between the

Dual

> without mentioning the real point, in the case of PRINCIPLES OF

> CUSPAL INTERLINKS by K. Baskaran, who has some intirely diffent

basic

> views from KSK as mentioned in his EPILOGUE of that book pp 200-

203.

>

> 5) You were confused by seeing KSK originals regarding

debilitation

> for the first time as if I'm making confusion.

>

> 6) Then you asked Shri Raichur about the basic KP idea related to

4-

> step method, mentioned by A.R. Raichur, B.E., F.I.E. in the above

> mentioned Baskaran's first book, pp x-xi, which you recommand

Inder

> to buy, and also explained in the same page you mentioned in

> Astrosecrets & Krishnamurti Padhdhati, Part 1, in bold letters.

>

> 7) Then suddenly you've started saying, in KP group, only KP, no

> place for exaltation or delibitation, so on even with posting in

bold

> and red letters.

>

> 8) No need to backe off ucha and neecha reference mentioned by

bold

> and red letters because NEECHABHANGARAJAYOGA,

> STHOOADHARMAKARMADHIPAYOGA are mentioned in " The Horoscope of

Prof.

> rishnamurti " by M.G.G. Nayar in Astrosecrets and KP, Part I, 2003,

pp

> 249-271; also in " Notable Persons & Krishnamurti Padhdhati, by K.

> Hariharan,1993, pp 8-33.

>

> 3. Dear Inder, please mention what is your exact view, for

> example " there is no place or place to analyse strength of planets

by

> exaltation or debilitation in KP " , and of course if you want to

say

> it's KP, please provide specific KSK or KP references of titles

and

> page numbers, in a short to the point, precise form, not easy type

in

> another group. If you're saying it's your personal opinion, I've

no

> comment; if yours is KP, I promise you to respond honestly whether

> it's consistent with KSK or KP references. I never say right or

wrong

> which I don't have authoriy.

>

> Thanks and best regards,

>

> Best regards,

>

> tw

>

> , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > Dear tw853 and all,

> >

> > I have already given the reference told by Great guruji K.S.K

> himself which clearly explains the views of Great Guruji K.S.K and

I

> am also not denying the fact that ucha and neecha are referred by

> K.S.K in his articles.

> >

> > Please go through all my mails,you can see the substance of my

> point.

> >

> > Exalted planets and debilitated planets can effect only as a

> indicator and the real analysis about the strength of planets has

to

> go on star of the planet and its aspects,conjuction and all other

> significant points as told in his system.

> >

> > The root of K.P stands in the star and its disposition and

> exaltation or debilitation can be considered as an indicator.Many

> points in traditional are still contradictory,unclear and subject

to

> arguments.

> >

> > Thats why Guruji has not stressed much on those topics.More over

> they are not the real giver of results when you analyse.Exalted

> planet can give bad results and debilitated planet can give good

> results.Everything depends on the signification of star and sub of

a

> planet.Even,in all the Astro secrets Part1,2,3

> > you can see in no articles when analysing the charts these

aspects

> like exaltation or any traditional aspects is not stressed.

> >

> > I am also open to do research and welcome new things coming to

K.P

> system and if possible I will also add to that.I love those who do

> research for the betterment of the system and I hate those who

> distract the progress of the system.

> >

> > I sincerely feel very bad what sandy has understood and taking

> these undesirable steps.Anyway,my sincere apologise to her from my

> side if really it has hurt her feelings or sentiments.I also

accept

> the fact that she has done a wonderful work on K.P in her website

and

> I wish her a successful future.

> >

> > Forum is a place of discussion.Some says Yes and some No.But

should

> we windup from the action simply that we are getting NO.In

fact,here

> nobody has said anything bad against anybody and it is all our

views

> and for the betterment of the system,we work.Respected

> Raichurji,yogesh raoji and punitji has also quite good years of

> experience in the field and we have argued well and they are not

> taking any hard decisions.

> >

> > In life,we cannot expect to go in one way.

> >

> > My understanding on the subject is clear and the problem here is

> trying to explain you all.Thats understood.My experience might be

> very less compared to many here but its not the years that counts

the

> worth but the understanding.I want to be a good friend of all and

to

> the good things around me.If somebody likes it or not,I am sorry

> thats the wish of the fate.

> >

> > With thanks

> > Balaji.G

> >

> > Note:Here,I am not meaning anybody in particular.These are all

> general views from my heart.

> >

> > tw853 <tw853> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Balaji,

> >

> > Shri Anat Raichur and Sandy are not saying Uchcha, Neecha is

> > auspacious but about strength of exalted and debelitated

planets.

> > For creditibily of what you're asying is KP, where are your

> > references from KP Readers?

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> > tw

> >

> > Qoute

> >

> > Is not Mercury Neecha?

> >

> > In K.P. there is no use for Uchcha, Neecha, etc. In Sir C.P.

> > Ramaswamy Iyer's chart, how many planets are Neecha. In the

> horoscope

> > of the president of the Income-Tax Tribunal which we saw today

are

> > not Jupiter, Mars, etc.,Neecha. Are there not 3 neechas in your

> > proprietor's chart (Sun, Moon, and Venus). Whereas you have

exalted

> > Mercury and Mars. What do you do? When we presses the bottom and

> you

> > hear the calling bell, you, with your pencil and note-book run

to

> his

> > room.

> >

> > True, Sir. I also wonder why Hindus following traditional sytem

say

> > that Uchchas give very good results. Neechas bring untold

miseries.

> I

> > think that they start forgetting what they were following all

along

> > and at least now begin to learn your system.

> >

> > Unqote

> >

> > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > Dear Rangarajanji and all,

> > >

> > > To my great guruji sri.K.S.K or to me,defaming anything or

> stopping

> > anybody is not the intention rather the essence of science

should

> be

> > known to all for a better prediction..I would say very accurate

> > prediction.

> > >

> > > When graham bell invented a phone,it is not a

> cordless.Today,Mobile

> > phones are available with video display.How.Let we shed the old

> > things which is not useful or correct and take which gives

> > success,time-saving,accurate results.

> > >

> > > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K and his hundreds of students have done

a

> > laborious research by spending many years and many good

things.They

> > have shown us a path in thier books,articles and

message.Then,why

> we

> > should again look back.Atleast to respect his system which as I

> told

> > before is a well tested,certified one.If we are given a driving

> > license by the govt through right means and with right persons,

(I

> > mean all legal),why we should again go for a driving class to

learn

> > the learnt things.

> > >

> > > As a lover of astro science,I dont want to hurt anybody's

> > sentiments or feelings but my strong point here is in K.P forum

let

> > we talk about K.P only and if we can develop something good from

> here

> > like judging a match,finding the blood group of a

man,etc....Thats

> > research in the right line.Using K.P anything can be done

provided

> > right understanding of the subject and clear mind.

> > >

> > > I cannot intervene in others tastes and preferences.

> > >

> > > FOR ALL REF:K.P & ASTROLOGY 1995,A very detailed article

written

> by

> > Great Guruji Sri.K.S.K

> > > " HOW TO JUDGE A NATIVITY " ,PAGE NO,47 LAST PARA..

> > >

> > > PLS EVERYBODY WHO TALKS ABOUT EXALTATION GO THROUGH

THIS.....HAVE

> A

> > CLEAR MIND.

> > >

> > > with regards

> > > Balaji G

> > >

> > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m...> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Balaji,

> > > I definitely accept your observation that in his early

research

> days

> > > KSK might have tried many ideas from the traditional system.

One

> of

> > > the things missing in his Readers is the history and

chronology.

> How

> > > can one know what he tried earlier but gave up later?

> > >

> > > Please understand that all my comments and questions are

merely to

> > > understand KP system better and is not intended to challenge

any

> > idea

> > > or anyone.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Rangarajan

> > >

> > > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > > <balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > > Dear Rangarajanji and all,

> > > >

> > > > We all should understand a point that any newly invented

> theories

> > of

> > > today comes from the old existing principles and also when a

> correct

> > > solution has to be find using a system during great guruji's

day..

> > > >

> > > > just imagine for a while, when transportation is not that

much

> > > good,no computer,no awareness among the public,etc.In these

> > > situations,guruji taken the traditional astrology and done a

great

> > > research only for a simple reason that to prove astrology is a

> > > science.A universally applicable system,easy to work and

> > > understand,etc are some of his goals.

> > > >

> > > > So,in early days of his research the articles written by him

> gives

> > > the flavour of traditional approach also.But finally after his

> > mamoth

> > > efforts alnog with his devoted students has given a point

that " NO

> > > PLANETS CAN EXALTED OR DEBILITATED AND EVEN IF SO,THIS DOES

NOT

> > AFFECT

> > > RESULTS AS PER K.P APPROACH " .

> > > > SO,the topic of exaltation,debilitation,Dasaporutham,Mars

> > > dosha,remedies,gemmology all are handled by him for research

> purpose

> > > and finally his findings are that everything is based on karma

as

> > > given in his First reader.The planet Jupiter can

> kill,defame,spoil a

> > > man and saturn can bless him with good married life or child

in

> his

> > > period as per the signification thats what karma of us.

> > > >

> > > > Thats what Bhagvat gita says whatever has happened has

happened

> > well.

> > > >

> > > > Lord krishna says : " do your duty and I will decide the

results " .

> > > >

> > > > So dear learned members and Mr.Rangarajan,Please understand

the

> > > essence of K.P and apply it with clear knowledge.

> > > >

> > > > With regards

> > > > Balaji G

> > > >

> > > > Kanak Bosmia <kanbosastro@h...> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Rangrajan ji,

> > > >

> > > > Givere ferences of prectical example in reader about

> > > Exaltation/Debilitation .

> > > >

> > > > regards

> > > >

> > > > kanak

> > > >

> > > > > " Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy " <ranga@m...>

> > > > >

> > > > > Re: Exaltation/Debilitation

Revisited -

> > Reply

> > > to Balaji

> > > > >Mon, 25 Apr 2005 09:01:57 -0000

> > > > >

> > > > >Dear Balaji,

> > > > >Although most of us agree that KP System does not seem to

> stress

> > > > >exaltation and debilitation, one can find references to

these

> > terms

> > > > >in KP Readers. For example, see the last para of 6th

Reader,

> > Page

> > > > >145:

> > > > > " In K.P. (a) if a planet is exalted but is in the

> constellation

> > of

> > > > >a planet in debilitation, the extent to which it can do

either

> > good

> > > > >or bad is limited. A container (the planet) may be big but

the

> > > > >content is a cheap affair (lord of the constellation is the

> > > > >content). But a debilitated planet (small planet) in the

> > > > >constellation of a planet in exaltation (costly gems) is

> similar

> > to

> > > > >diamond in a small packet... "

> > > > >

> > > > >Doesn't this suggest that KSK attached some value to

> exaltation

> > and

> > > > >debilitation?

> > > > >

> > > > >Regards,

> > > > >Rangarajan

> > > > >

> > > > > , " Balaji G.krishnan "

> > > > ><balaji_g_krishnan> wrote:

> > > > > > Dear sandy and all,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I am sorry to intervene the discussion going on for a

> > longtime on

> > > > >debilitation and exaltation of planets.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > One of the major welcoming findings of Great guruji

K.S.K

> > is " no

> > > > >planet is debilitated or exalted in K.P " .Planets gives the

> > results

> > > > >only by source of its star lord...thats why it is called

> stellar

> > > > >theory.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > More over,you can very well see personally on your own

many

> > charts

> > > > >having exalted planets gives adverse results and planets

> > debilitated

> > > > >gives good results.Why??...Thats the secret of starlord

and

> sub

> > > > >lord theory.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > So,may be as a practitioner of traditional astrology or

> vedic

> > > > >astrology,we can use those concepts for our satisfaction

but

> the

> > > > >truth is that we are not hitting the right spot.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I request all the K.P astrologers again to understand

the

> > > > >foundation rules and findings of great guruji K.S.K and not

to

> > > > >divert else with other insignificant rules.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > K.P is time-tested,well refined and most scientific

method

> in

> > this

> > > > >modern world.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Its a message for all true K.P followers and not to hurt

> > anybody.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > With regards

> > > > > > Balaji G

> > > > > > Rangarajan Krishnamoorthy <ranga@m...> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Sandy,

> > > > > > Thanks for a nice posting. However, I don't think I

> > understand

> > > > >what

> > > > > > you mean by a debilitated planet offering results " at

> snails

> > pace "

> > > > > > or an exalted planet offering results " quickly " . Does

this

> > affect

> > > > > > timing then? We normally use conjoined period of the

> > effective

> > > > > > significators along with transits to establish timing. I

> > can't see

> > > > > > how planetary dignity (its strength as you nicely put

it)

> can

> > > > >affect

> > > > > > this.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > Rangarajan

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , " Sandy Crowther "

> > > > > > <sandycrowther@a...> wrote:

> > > > > > > Dear Group,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > There appears to be some prevailing confusion about

> exactly

> > what

> > > > > > Exaltation

> > > > > > > and Debilitation actually mean in evaluation of a KP

> chart.

> > So

> > > > > > below is a

> > > > > > > brief overview of the planetary interactions, followed

by

> > my

> > > > > > humble attempt

> > > > > > > at explaining the effects of exaltation and

debilitation,

> > and

> > > > > > their usage in

> > > > > > > KP, according to my understanding of the basic and

> primary

> > > > > > teachings of the

> > > > > > > KP system.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > What we know already is that a planet moving under the

> > influence

> > > > > > of his star

> > > > > > > lord, will act according to the dictates of that star

> lord.

> > With

> > > > > > that in

> > > > > > > mind, we are also well aware that the planet will

> > predominately

> > > > > > offer the

> > > > > > > results of the house in which the star lord is

posited,

> in

> > > > > > addition to the

> > > > > > > house(s) owned by the star lord. Then, the planet

itself,

> > offers

> > > > > > the results

> > > > > > > of the house it occupies and the house(s) it owns. So

> > basically

> > > > > > each planet

> > > > > > > has a role to play, and both the star lord and the

planet

> > > > >combine

> > > > > > their

> > > > > > > influence to determine whether the event will be

> favorable

> > or

> > > > >not.

> > > > > > ( If

> > > > > > > unfamiliar with this concept, more examples of how a

> planet

> > will

> > > > > > act can be

> > > > > > > found in my article

> > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_How%20does%20the%

20dasha%

> > 20lord%

> > > > > > 20function.ht

> > > > > > > m> KP: How Does the Dasha Lord Function?)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > So what exactly does Exalted or Debilitated infer?

> > > > > > > Several indicators are simply " givens " in KP, and must

> not

> > only

> > > > >be

> > > > > > > considered, but must also be both integrated and

> > synthesized

> > > > >into

> > > > > > your

> > > > > > > analysis before a final determination is made. But

> > according to

> > > > > > sizing up an

> > > > > > > event, only the house results are offered - so where

does

> > that

> > > > > > leave the

> > > > > > > sign effects that the planet is placed in - such as

the

> > planet's

> > > > > > exalted or

> > > > > > > debilitated status? Here is where much confusion seems

> > prevalent

> > > > > > in KP

> > > > > > > assessments- especially when a planet is badly placed

in

> > the 8th

> > > > > > or 12th

> > > > > > > house, but simultaneously exalted in status. Or when a

> > planet is

> > > > > > in a

> > > > > > > debilitated state, but posited in the benefic 11th

house?

> > How do

> > > > > > we assess

> > > > > > > these results?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Exaltation and debilitation are " strength "

and " weakness "

> > > > > > indicators

> > > > > > > respectively, and therefore their specific job is to

give

> > us an

> > > > > > idea of how

> > > > > > > much " muscle " (strength or weakness) the planet

carries -

> > within

> > > > > > its

> > > > > > > environment - to carry out its function determined by

its

> > house

> > > > > > placement.

> > > > > > > So if a planet is strong due to exaltation, but badly

> > placed in

> > > > > > the 12th,

> > > > > > > the planet does not change its role and become good

for

> the

> > 12th

> > > > > > house, but

> > > > > > > rather the effects are that the planet will not hasten

to

> > > > >quickly

> > > > > > carry out

> > > > > > > the functions for his position in any given house, and

> will

> > > > > > therefore

> > > > > > > quickly bring about loss (or other 12th house

function)

> in

> > a

> > > > >very

> > > > > > timely

> > > > > > > manner. Why? Because he has the strength to act

quickly

> and

> > with

> > > > > > no delay,

> > > > > > > and he is very comfortable where he is positioned in

his

> > exalted

> > > > > > status. He

> > > > > > > works fast because he is in a happy and exalted state -

> > caring

> > > > >not

> > > > > > that he

> > > > > > > is working quickly to bring about less than fortunate

> > events.

> > > > >He's

> > > > > > just

> > > > > > > doing his job with the muscle provided to do it with.

> When

> > the

> > > > > > planet has

> > > > > > > established a set of results that need to be carried

out

> > due to

> > > > > > his star

> > > > > > > level placement, exaltation does not absolve him of

the

> > adverse

> > > > > > results that

> > > > > > > need to be carried out, and subsequently make the

results

> > > > > > pleasant. This is

> > > > > > > simply not the way exaltation and debilitation work,

nor

> is

> > it

> > > > > > part of their

> > > > > > > role as " strength indicators " for a planet. The

planets

> do

> > not

> > > > > > give contrary

> > > > > > > results due to their strength status.

> > > > > > > So, also, do we judge the effects of a planet posited

in

> a

> > good

> > > > > > house but in

> > > > > > > the state of debilitation. This debilitated planet

will

> > still

> > > > > > carry out the

> > > > > > > positive acts for the house in which he is posited,

but

> his

> > > > > > strength factor

> > > > > > > will not allow him to do so quickly or in a timely

> manner.

> > So

> > > > >the

> > > > > > result is

> > > > > > > that he will eventually bring the good effects about,

but

> > not in

> > > > >a

> > > > > > timely

> > > > > > > manner or with speed under his wings. He only carries

> > enough

> > > > > > strength to

> > > > > > > respond to his mission in a slow and delayed manner

> because

> > he

> > > > >is

> > > > > > not happy

> > > > > > > being posited where he is and at the degree at which

he

> is

> > > > > > debilitated, but

> > > > > > > he has a job to do and will carry it out and do his

job,

> > but NOT

> > > > > > in a manner

> > > > > > > contrary to what his position indicates - it will just

be

> > > > >carried

> > > > > > out at a

> > > > > > > snails pace.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > More Apparent " Strength " Confusion:

> > > > > > > Now the KP confusion I'm seeing frequently, and the

catch

> > to the

> > > > > > > exaltation/debilitation game is this...Exactly WHEN is

a

> > planet

> > > > > > considered

> > > > > > > to be exalted or debilitated? Is is just by being

posited

> > in the

> > > > > > respective

> > > > > > > signs of exaltation or debilitation - such as Jupiter

is

> > > > >considered

> > > > > > > debilitated simply because he is posited in Capricorn?

Or

> > Venus

> > > > >is

> > > > > > > considered exalted just because she is posited in

Pisces?

> > The

> > > > > > answer to this

> > > > > > > question is no! There are refinements to strengths and

> > > > >weaknesses

> > > > > > that need

> > > > > > > to be addressed before blanket statements are made due

to

> > > > > > assessing these

> > > > > > > planetary strengths and weaknesses. For example, is

> > Jupiter,

> > > > >when

> > > > > > posited at

> > > > > > > 15 Cancer, considered to be in an exalted state? No!

Why?

> > > > >Jupiter

> > > > > > is exalted

> > > > > > > at 05 Cancer - not at 15 degrees Cancer. Orbs must be

set

> > in

> > > > >place

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > respected for the effects of exalted or debilitated

> status

> > to be

> > > > > > truly

> > > > > > > effective - sign positions alone are irrelevant when

> > assessing

> > > > > > planetary

> > > > > > > strengths. So to say that a planet is exalted or

> > debilitated

> > > > > > simply because

> > > > > > > it is posited in its sign of exaltation or

debilitation

> is

> > > > > > incorrect - the

> > > > > > > degrees of the sign placement are necessary to

determine

> > whether

> > > > > > that planet

> > > > > > > is truly in an exalted or debilitated state. According

to

> > my

> > > > > > understanding,

> > > > > > > the KP preferred orb allowance is 50' on either side

of

> its

> > > > > > exaltation or

> > > > > > > debilitation degree - (less than a degree). Below is a

> > Table

> > > > > > showing the

> > > > > > > exalted and debilitated placements. I sincerely hope

this

> > > > >further

> > > > > > clarifies

> > > > > > > the position of exaltation versus debilitation. (If

the

> > Table

> > > > > > doesn't

> > > > > > > transmit, I have also uploaded this to my site at

> > > > > > > http://www.jupitersweb.com/kp_exaltation.debilitation%

> > > > > > 20revisited.htm

> > > > > > > (With reference to Navamsha positions, my take on this

is

> > that

> > > > >in

> > > > > > KP, this

> > > > > > > varga has been used to further refine the strength of

a

> > planet).

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Planet

> > > > > > > Exalted

> > > > > > > Debilitated

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sun

> > > > > > > 10 Degrees Aries

> > > > > > > 10 Degrees Libra

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Moon

> > > > > > > 03 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > > 03 Degrees Scorpio

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mars

> > > > > > > 28 Degrees Capricorn

> > > > > > > 28 Degrees Cancer

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Mercury

> > > > > > > 15 Degrees Virgo

> > > > > > > 15 Degrees Pisces

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Jupiter

> > > > > > > 05 Degrees Cancer

> > > > > > > 05 Degrees Capricorn

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Venus

> > > > > > > 27 Degrees Pisces

> > > > > > > 27 Degrees Virgo

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Saturn

> > > > > > > 20 Libra

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Aries

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Rahu

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ketu

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Scorpio

> > > > > > > 20 Degrees Taurus

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > <sandy@t...>

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > All the Best,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> <http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/40.gif>

> > Sandy

> > > > > > > Crowther

> > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/>

http://www.jupitersweb.com

> > > > > > > <http://www.jupitersweb.com/>

> > > > > >

April 27, 2005