Guest guest Posted December 16, 2005 Report Share Posted December 16, 2005 Hi again Fraser, Still looking at this chart, if you cross check Navamsa with Rasi, you will see that Venus is there stronger than the Sun in the Navamsa. So the Sun becomes weaker because it is in the 12th and Venus stronger because it is in the house of GAINS. Jupiter on the other hand becomes weaker, so I would say his/her initial education may have been troubled maybe because of travelling abroad? 4th also signifies comforts and homeland - as you said he/she lives/lived abroad... The case with Venus it is like there is good and bad factors, but looking at the Navamsa I think we can infer that Venus would eventually win and the Sun would only take him/her abroad. Not sure my reading is correct, but anyway... Just wanted to say about the Navamsa. Regards, Rui. On 16/12/05, siha <siha wrote: > > Hello Mr. Fraser, > > I add my replies/comments to your questions in your message appended below. > > Best wishes, > > > > > - > " fraser " <fraser > > Friday, December 16, 2005 11:13 PM > Re: no education > > > Mr Choudhry > Sir, > The native's education was completed at a distant place. > OK. SINCE SECOND LORD IS EXALTED AND WELL PLACED IN THIS CHART, THOUGH WEAK > DUE TO COMBUSION, THE CHART SHOWS EDUCATION. > But, with such strong opposing factors in the chart - > which pinciple of SA should be used to predict the outcome? > PRINCIPLES, NO DOUBT, ARE MANY BUT WITH EXPERIENCE ONE LEARNS TO > SYNCHRONISE. > when has the 5th house for higher learning been introduced in SA? > IT MUST BE MORE THAN TEN YEARS. > what should be the order of delineations as per SA, as a standard > rule to follow. > SECOND, FIFTH AND TENTH HOUSES RULE PROFESSIONAL EDUCATION. I THINK EVEN IN > THE LAST COUPLE OF WEEKS WHEN REFERENCE WAS BROUGHT TO JUPITER RULING > EDUCATION THE FIFTH HOUSE WAS MENTIONED FOR HIGHER EDUCATION. > Thanks for your posts. > Regards, > fraser > > > > > > , <siha> wrote: > > > > > > Hello Mr. Fraser, > > > > There are only two things which are helping in this chart - the > first is the > > exalted lord of the second house and the second is the support > garnered by > > the strong Mars for the person. > > > > Tell me something about the financial status of his parents and > whether he > > completed education at his native place or at a distant place. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > - > > " fraser " <fraser@p...> > > > > Friday, December 16, 2005 10:48 PM > > Re: no education > > > > > > Mr. Choudhry, > > Sir, > > All that you have said is all that I saw in the chart applying SA > > principles, BUT this native has had a good primary education and > > college and is a MBA. There has been NO obstructions, losses nor > > delays of any kind. > > Please explain, what are we missing here. > > Thank you, Sir. > > Regards, > > Fraser > > > > > > , <siha> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hello dear Raj, Fraser, Rui and list members, > > > > > > Fourth house rules school education. > > > Fifth rules college and professional education. > > > The exact impact of eighth lord on the weak fourth lord causes > > obstructions. > > > Second lord rules professional education. > > > The influence of 12th lord on the lord of the second house > (exalted > > but > > > weak) takes the person to foreign lands/distant place for > > education. > > > Impact of Rahu on the weak/badly placed Moon the eleventh lord > > makes the > > > person manipulative for earnings. > > > Well placed exalted Mars helps in support for pursuing studies. > > > Operating main periods in this chart also indicate obstructions, > > losses and > > > delays. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > " RAJ " <rajshekhar.sharma@g...> > > > > > > Friday, December 16, 2005 10:18 PM > > > Re: Re: no education > > > > > > > > > Hello Rui > > > > > > I am not at all disagree, I Just failed to understand. But my > dear > > I am > > > helpless, I am a very very slow learner not as fast as you. Let us > > both wait > > > for the guidance. > > > > > > Raj > > > - > > > rupamede > > > > > > Friday, December 16, 2005 10:05 PM > > > Re: Re: no education > > > > > > > > > Raj > > > I gave my answer clealy. You did not agree. So me too am waiting > > for > > > the Masters. > > > Rui. > > > > > > On 16/12/05, RAJ <rajshekhar.sharma@g...> wrote: > > > > Rui > > > > > > > > It was not a question, who can answer? The question was where > > is the > > > answer? > > > > > > > > Further, I love to remain silent so that I can learn from the > > Masters > > > and I am waiting. > > > > > > > > Raj > > > > - > > > > rupamede > > > > > > > > Friday, December 16, 2005 9:31 PM > > > > Re: Re: no education > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj, > > > > Having had such a in depth look into this chart can you > > answer Fraser > > > then? > > > > Rui. > > > > > > > > > > > > On 16/12/05, RAJ <rajshekhar.sharma@g...> wrote: > > > > > Hello Rui > > > > > > > > > > It was not like replying on anyone's lines. If you peruse > > the mail > > > thoroughly you will find that I have explained on your following > > points > > > > > " BUT my point had nothing to do with 5th house > > significations, which > > > > > > according to SA are not connected to Education - or are > > they??? > > > > > > Education I think should be 2nd, 4th and 9th - please > > correct me > > > if I > > > > > > am wrong... > > > > > " > > > > > > > > > > First, 5th house does have a say in one's education. > > > > > > > > > > Second, the key elements to be taken care of while > > analysing > > > educational pursuits as per SA. > > > > > > > > > > Further you analysed > > > > > " The Auspicious 5th house PLUS Benefic Jupiter would help > > already > > > > > > strong 8th lord Mars giving this person Research > > abilities to > > > > > > compensate for the lack of normal good education > > indications in > > > the > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > > > " > > > > > As per SA weak planets fail to support their general and > > functional > > > significations. Jupiter, though benefic, is not only debilitated > > but also > > > under close influence of MMP Mars, Note Mars is MOST MALEFIC > > PLANET. So > > > though it can provide the native with general and functional > > signfications > > > of Mars, I don't see any relation to education in this context. > As > > per your > > > version, mere taking birth in Virgo Lagna secures good education > > because > > > Jupiter will remain a benefic planet ruling 4th house of > education. > > > > > > > > > > Further you analysed > > > > > " Then the Moon placed in the MEP point in the 8th STRONG > > house of > > > Mars > > > > > > aspecting **MEP** of **2nd house of higher education** > > would also > > > > > > have influence no matter how weak it is - **still is a > > benefic** > > > on > > > > > > the MEP and as from a strong house - so I do see some > > good > > > > > > indications after all... > > > > > " > > > > > Moon is weak on three grounds > > > > > > > > > > placed in 8th house > > > > > in fant > > > > > close to the Sun > > > > > > > > > > So concluding on the basis of such a weak Moon and Malefic > > Mars, > > > that the native can accomplish desirable education without any > > shortcomings > > > is beyond SA principles and that too during the following periods: > > > > > > > > > > Venus/Jupiter from Jan 1988 to Sept 1990 (15-17 years of > > age) > > > > > Here both these planets are weak and afflicted > > > > > > > > > > Venus/Saturn from Sept 1990 to Nov 1993 (17-20 years of > age) > > > > > Venus is weak and afflicted while Saturn is a malefic > > afflicting > > > Mercury, a secondary karaka for education. > > > > > > > > > > Venus/Mercury from Nov 1993 to Sept 1996 (20-23 years of > > age) > > > > > Again the sub-period lord Mercury is ill placed and > > afflicted. > > > > > > > > > > Submiting a question in response to a question should have > > been > > > avoided. > > > > > > > > > > As far as your point of Mars strength being 8th lord > ruling > > occult > > > and research work is concerned, I do agree with the strength point > > of view. > > > But if this is taken into account as a general principle then what > > > combinations could disturb or destroy the educational pursuits of > a > > native. > > > Fraser was asking whether the native can have good education with > > these > > > combinations if yes how? > > > > > > > > > > I hope you can understand my point. > > > > > > > > > > Raj > > > > > - > > > > > rupamede > > > > > > > > > > Friday, December 16, 2005 8:02 PM > > > > > Re: Re: no education > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello Raj, > > > > > Thank you for your reply but also you, like Fraser, seem > > to be > > > > > consistingly overlooking my reading of the influence of > > Mars and > > > the > > > > > 8th house significations, but I will not insist. > > > > > On the other hand the chart I have put forward if you > > care to > > > > > examinetti you will see why I am giving such an > > importance to the > > > 8th > > > > > lord. > > > > > 22/04/1973 at 14.13 in Wurzburg Germany > > > > > Rui. > > > > > > > > > > On 16/12/05, RAJ <rajshekhar.sharma@g...> wrote: > > > > > > Hello Rui > > > > > > > > > > > > Hope I am not intervening. > > > > > > > > > > > > As per my understanding of astrology 5th house does > > rule > > > education specifically higher education involving intellectual > > capabilities. > > > Following is the copy of what has been provided on professor's > site. > > > > > > V House > > > > > > Represents intelligence, emotions, discernment and > > > discrimination, intellectual and mental talents, memory, creative > > > intelligence, emotional happiness, love, romance, lover, > > speculative gains > > > from investments, organizational ability, success, progeny, > > children, > > > knowledge, wisdom, higher learning, training, > > > > > > > > > > > > Further, even if 2nd 4th and 9th houses are > considered > > for > > > higher learning; you may like to consider that 2nd lord Venus is > > closely > > > combust and afflicted by Sun, 4th Lord Jupiter is debilitated and > > afflicted > > > by MMP. > > > > > > > > > > > > you may also like to peruse the basic astrological > > infrastructre > > > required to check the education, which has been given as under (as > > per prof > > > SHRI VKC's web-site > > > > > > > > > > > > In addition to the traditional methods of assessing > > educational > > > accomplishments, i.e.,the strength of the vidya sthana, (second > and > > fourth > > > houses), significators for education (Mercury) and intelligence > > (Jupiter) > > > and the strength of the Moon, the following factors also call for > > > consideration. > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Planetary periods between the ages of 16 and 24 > > years. > > > As, irrespective of the strength of the house and significator of > > education, > > > the unfavorable operating planetary periods will retard the > > progress of > > > education, both academic and professional. > > > > > > 2. As the results of one's educational > > accomplishments are > > > filtered through the tenth house, this, together with operating > > planetary > > > periods, also determines the area of vocation,i.e., whether it is > > medicine, > > > engineering, general, administration, analytical, a routine job, > > etc. > > > > > > 3. The second house rules status and its > > relationship with > > > the ascendant, third house, tenth house, etc., as also the planets > > placed in > > > the second house. A strong ninth house has roots for rewarding > the > > native > > > for his efforts in life. > > > > > > > > > > > > The weak and afflicted planets in their dasa/bhukti > > between the > > > age of 16 to 24 years do not allow the person to (1) acquire > > education > > > suitable for successful vocation; (2) get a suitable job; and (3) > > settle > > > properly in life. Similarly, exalted and strong planets give an > > impetus to > > > the academic pursuits of a person. > > > > > > > > > > > > As you can see that strength of Jupiter, Mercury and > > Moon along > > > with the strength of 2nd and 4th house besides the operational > > period > > > during 16 to 24 years of age is to be taken into consideration. > > > > > > > > > > > > As in this case, 2nd lord venus is weak and afflicted, > > 4th lord > > > Jupiter is deb. and afflicted by MMP, Mercury is ill-placed and > > afflicted by > > > Saturn, Moon is weak being infant, close to the Sun and in 8th > > house, and > > > the native concerned was under dasa of combust and afflicted Venus > > till > > > 1997; the educational pursuits of the native concerned could not > > flourish. > > > > > > > > > > > > And if alone Moon, which is weak on two grounds, can > > supercede > > > all these factors simply because it is placed close to MEP, then > it > > will be > > > Okay that the native would have had good education. > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > RPM > > > > > > > > > > > > Friday, December 16, 2005 5:11 PM > > > > > > Re: no education > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fraser, > > > > > > > > > > > > I know that as you say: " Is not Mars the Lord of the > > 8thHouse > > > and > > > > > > malefic " and " It should spoil the 5th house > > significations, > > > cause its > > > > > > not MT house. " plus " SA does not allow Saturn to > > defend this > > > 5th > > > > > > house and the close affliction to Jupiter, that Mars > > creates, > > > takes > > > > > > care of any good out of this house. " > > > > > > > > > > > > BUT my point had nothing to do with 5th house > > significations, > > > which > > > > > > according to SA are not connected to Education - or > > are they??? > > > > > > Education I think should be 2nd, 4th and 9th - please > > correct > > > me if I > > > > > > am wrong... > > > > > > The Auspicious 5th house PLUS Benefic Jupiter would > > help > > > already > > > > > > strong 8th lord Mars giving this person Research > > abilities to > > > > > > compensate for the lack of normal good education > > indications in > > > the > > > > > > chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > Then the Moon placed in the MEP point in the 8th > > STRONG house > > > of Mars > > > > > > aspecting **MEP** of **2nd house of higher > education** > > would > > > also > > > > > > have influence no matter how weak it is - **still is > a > > > benefic** on > > > > > > the MEP and as from a strong house - so I do see > some > > good > > > > > > indications after all... > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, Rui. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , rupamede > > <rupamede@g...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fraser, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am pressed for time now, but I can give u the > > following > > > chart for > > > > > > > discussion about the 8th house effects and how I > > believe that > > > from > > > > > > > experiance I am right in saying what I said about > > the chart > > > you put > > > > > > > forward for discussion yesterday. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 22/04/1973 at 14.13 in Wurzburg Germany > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What do you think this woman is doing? Only strong > > planet is > > > Saturn > > > > > > > and especially Mercury (2nd lord of higher > > education) is very > > > weak > > > > > > > debilitated and in the 8th. So what do you think > her > > > profession > > > > > > would > > > > > > > be? Could she ever succeed? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mars, 9th lord also significator for education, is > > in malefic > > > 6th. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, Rui. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 16/12/05, fraser <fraser@p...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello Rui, > > > > > > > > Is not Mars the Lord of the 8thHouse and malefic. > > > > > > > > It should spoil the 5th house significations, > > cause its not > > > MT > > > > > > house. > > > > > > > > SA does not allow Saturn to defend this 5th > house. > > > > > > > > and the close affliction to Jupiter, that Mars > > creates, > > > takes > > > > > > care of > > > > > > > > any good out of this house. > > > > > > > > I want to see SA principles applied and a > > systematic > > > delineation > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > reach to an 'interpretation'/'prediction'. > > > > > > > > I want to go beyond unfounded 'guesswork', that I > > am so > > > good at. > > > > > > > > According to me this chart makes the case for no > > education > > > or very > > > > > > > > little education. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Fraser. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " RPM " > > <rupamede@g...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello Fraser, > > > > > > > > > In my humble opinion she may be inclined > towards > > research > > > due > > > > > > to the > > > > > > > > > good placement of Mars in the auspicious 5th > > house AND > > > conjunct > > > > > > > > > Functional Benefic Jupiter. Other than that, I > > cannot see > > > any > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > indications, but maybe I am not looking deep > > enough. Or > > > maybe I > > > > > > am > > > > > > > > > trying to be a bit too positive and to see > > things where > > > they do > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > exist - that could be too... > > > > > > > > > Regards, Rui. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " fraser " > > <fraser@p...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Rui, > > > > > > > > > > so are you saying she is educated or are you > > saying she > > > is > > > > > > not. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Fraser. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , rupamede > > > <rupamede@g...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Fraser, > > > > > > > > > > > This is a great example of a chart where > > only the > > > Malefics > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > good shape!!! > > > > > > > > > > > For education, I can only see one way and > > that is if > > > we > > > > > > look at > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > 8th house of Research. Lord Mars is > conjunct > > Jupiter > > > in the > > > > > > > > > > auspicious > > > > > > > > > > > 5th house. Then the Moon is on the MEP of > > the 8th of > > > > > > Research. > > > > > > > > Would > > > > > > > > > > > this help this native? Since this person > was > > born in > > > 1973, > > > > > > we > > > > > > > > should > > > > > > > > > > > know by now whether he/she was successful > or > > not... > > > This is > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > guess > > > > > > > > > > > anyway and I would be interested to know > > what our > > > dear > > > > > > > > Professor and > > > > > > > > > > > our list friends think too. > > > > > > > > > > > Best wishes, Rui. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 15/12/05, fraser <fraser@p...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello LIST, Mr. Choudhry, Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > Could someone please throw some light on > > the > > > education > > > > > > > > prospects > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > > this chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > So far this is what I see. Is there any > > hope that > > > this > > > > > > native > > > > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > > > > get a good education at all. > > > > > > > > > > > > � Venus, (lord of 2nd house) is combust > > and > > > afflicted by > > > > > > > > malefic > > > > > > > > > > Sun. > > > > > > > > > > > > � Lagna lord Mercury is in 6th house, > > and afflicted > > > by > > > > > > > > malefic > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn. > > > > > > > > > > > > � 10th house Lord, Mercury in 6th > house, > > and > > > afflicted > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > malefic > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn. > > > > > > > > > > > > � Jupiter, the Lord of 4th house is > > debilitated and > > > > > > > > afflicted by > > > > > > > > > > MMP > > > > > > > > > > > > Mars. > > > > > > > > > > > > -------- > > > > > > > > > > > > DOB: Apr 4,1973 > > > > > > > > > > > > TOB: 5:17PM TimeZone: -5:30 > > > > > > > > > > > > 77E13 28N40 > > > > > > > > > > > > Ascendant 03:31 > > > > > > > > > > > > ------ > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Fraser. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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