Demolished once for all: Aryan Invasion Theory -Virendra Parekh-4 Jan 2009

[Guest guest]

B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN.

website: www.vedascience.com

 

----- Forwarded Message ----kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09 Sunday, January 4, 2009 7:19:38 PM Fwd: [VRI] Demolished once for all: Aryan Invasion Theory -Virendra Parekh-4 Jan 2009

[Guest guest]

=========== =========== =========== ===========

May I take the liberty to point at some loopholes in the socalled

linguistic approach of scholars like Telagheri, although I support and

laud their efforts ?

 

A truly linguistic approach must produce an alternative comparative

linguistics which could counter the ideas propounded in masterpieces

of IE grammararians like Karl Brugmann. Telagheri and other persons of

his school skipped this cardinal issue completely, and what you term

his linguistic approach can be called philological, and not linguistic.

 

I wasted 12 years on IE linguistics and found irrefutable proofs in

favour of the fact that the Vedic language was the source of all IE

languages, but I was dismayed with the lack of any interest in real

linguistics among Indian Homelanders, and found them to be guided more

by nationalism rather than by real linguistics. Eurocentric scholars

are even more chauvinist. Hence, I did not even care to get my

findings written down properly, and thousands of pages of my notes lie

scattered in my storeroom, which I do not try to look into, because no

one is interested in this topic.

 

My most important finding was that 'all' roots of the PIE

(Proto-Indo-European) language were not merely derived from the Vedic

roots, but were exactly same as the Vedic roots, provided we give

equal weight to all branches of the supposed PIE and take statistical

averages for each phoneme individually to decide the structure of

primordial language, instead of imposing our own hypotheses for

influencing the outcome of such inveigationsst, as the Europeanists

have done all along.

 

Secondly, I would like to point out some shortcomings even in the

philological line of reasoning put forth by Telagheri & c.

 

The idea that Saptasindhu signified Indus and its tributaries is a

modern myth. Vyas jee has mentioned in MBh that Saptasindhu flowed

eastwards, but adds figuratively that as a bad omen they started

flowing westwards momentarily when Lord Krishna started his journey

for Hastinapur to prevent a war, signifying an impending failure of

peace talks. This east-flowing Saptasindhu is the cradle of Vedic

civilization, esp of Aryavarta : Kaushiki, Gandaki(Sadaneeraa),

Sarayu, Gomati, Ganga, Yamuna and Saraswati. All these rivers are

mentioned in the RV. Gayatri was revealed to Kaushika Vishvamitra on

the banks of Kaushiki.

 

Gotam Rahugana, the priest of first king of Videha was the rishi of RV

hymns dedicated to Svaraajya (ie, Videha) in first mandala 0f RV.

Nyaaya philosophy was started by his descendants. The ashrama of one

rishi of this lineage existed at modern Gotamkunda near Ahilyasthana

in Darbhanga district.

 

White Yajurveda was revealed to Yajnavalkya. He was born in western UP

but lived in North Bihar. It is an Eoropean propaganda that RV

preceded other Vedas. Almost all hymns of Samaveda are found in RV.

All four Vedas mention each other profusely. Morphological or semantic

comparison of four Vedas do not suggest the type of dating we are

taught by Europeans. This dating is based upon their hatred for yajna.

Hence, Yajurveda had to be proven as a later invention of Indians

after the immigrants settled in India. Europeanists deliberately

forget that that Aristophanes explicitly mentioned in his comedy 'The

Birds' that the ancestors gave oblations to fire which nourished the

gods ; it is a clear evidence of ritualistic yajna among the ancestors

of Greeks.

 

If we leave aside structural linguistics, which is boring topic for

Indian scholars, and come to philology, we would be forced to arrive

at conclusions which will not be palatable to neither Maxmuller's

disciples nor Telagheri's. For instance, 'bhratr' occurs 33 times in

the RV in all its declensions, and in 32 instances it has no

connection with the popular meaning 'brother'. The latter meaning is

probable only once, in the Yama-Yami dialogue in 10th mandala. There

too, Yama is a descendant of Sun. Elsewhere, Bhratar is used for Sun.

Hence, ancient grammarians deduced it from a root which meant " to

shine " . Some persons also tried to relate it to bhr, to bear. But the

Sun shines as well as bears the world, while a brother neither shines

nor bears. It is the father who nears, and later the husband (bhartr).

Similarly, Agni is derived from a root which had no connection with

any physical properties, but was related to the divine property of

Agni-god.

 

This peculiarity of Vedic language was clear to all ancient scholars.

Hence the differentiated Vedic language from Laukika Sanskrita, and

devoted their lives to preserve a language which they believed to be

divine. This belief was not an invention of priests, but has

philological proofs, as I have indicated above. Had the Vedic language

been invented by humans, it would have contained Laukika or worldly

meanings even during the formative phase when words were being formed

from roots.

 

But in an age of evolutionism, who will believe that the ancients were

wiser than us? These evolutionists forget that evolution is never

linear, that all species have come to become extinct, that no specie

was permanent, that Homo Sapiens is not immortal, and the next

higher/lower specie need not be a linear descendant of the present

specie which has ethically degenerated into Homo Idiotes.

 

-VJ

=========== =========== =========== ===========

, venkata krishnan

<bcvk71 wrote:

>

> B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN.

> website: www.vedascience.com

>

>

>

> ----- Forwarded Message ----

> kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09

>

> Sunday, January 4, 2009 7:19:38 PM

> Fwd: [VRI] Demolished once for all: Aryan

Invasion Theory -Virendra Parekh-4 Jan 2009

>

> http://www.vijayvaa ni.com/FrmPublic DisplayArticle. aspx?id=322

> Demolished once for all: Aryan Invasion Theory

> Virendra Parekh

> 4 January 2009

>  

> " An unknown Indian has taken on proponents of the Aryan

invasion/migration theory, demolished their case, and established that

northern India is the original home of the Aryans and the

Indo-European family of languages. The importance of this remarkable

achievement cannot be exaggerated. In course of time, it can compel

the revision of the history not only of Indian but also world

civilization. "

>  

> That was Girilal Jain in his masterful review of Shrikant G.

Talageri's 'Aryan Invasion Theory and Indian Nationalism, ' published

in 1993. Since then, Talageri, a not-so-unknown Indian now, has come

up with two more works. His 'The Rigveda: A Historical Analysis'

(2000) established that Vedic Aryans were inhabitants of the area to

the east of Punjab, traditionally known as AryÄvarta; that the region

of Saptasindhu formed the western periphery of their activities and

that the Aryans migrated from the east to the west within India and

beyond it. For this, he relied solely on a detailed analysis of the

Rigveda.

>  

> His latest book, " The Rigveda and the Avesta: the Final Evidence, "

seeks to prove conclusively beyond all reasonable doubt that India was

the original homeland of the Indo-European family of languages, that

the Rigvedic people were settled in areas around and to the east of

the Sarasvati river in at least the third millennium BCE if not

earlier, that the proto-Iranians who later became Zoroastrians were

settled in the areas to the west of the Vedic Aryans, and that both

started expanding westward around that period.

>  

> As the name of the book suggests, Talageri collects, collates and

compares a massive amount of evidence from the Rigveda and the Avesta

and also marshals undisputed recorded facts from Mesopotamian history

about the Mitanni and the Kassites to support his conclusions. He

relies on non-controversial data such as names of people, animals and

places, and on the provenance and numerical frequency of their

occurrences, rather than subjective interpretations of esoteric texts.

>  

> We teach our children even today as settled facts that nomadic

Aryans invaded/migrated to India around 1500 BCE, destroyed the Indus

Valley culture and began what is known as the Vedic Age, and produced

Rigveda around 1200 BCE. However, this is only a theory, and an

extremely weak one at that.

>  

> That there is not a shred of evidence for it in either the ancient

literature or archaeology, that it is based on nothing more solid than

some striking similarities among the Indo-European languages, that

there is an overwhelming body of solid evidence against it, and that

even the linguistic data supporting it can be better explained by an

alternative opposite theory, has not daunted its proponents who are

deeply entrenched in the academia, media and, worst of all, in politics.

>  

> Originally cooked up by 19th century European scholars to serve the

interests of India's colonial masters, the theory has now been

appropriated by current political ideologies whose sole purpose is to

keep India weak, divided and confused. It is used to deepen and

exploit regional, linguistic and racial cleavages in Indian society,

deny nativity and originality to Hindu civilization, and justify later

invasions: if Aryans came from outside, how can the Hindus cavil at

Muslim or European invaders?

>  

> This is not the first time that the Aryan Invasion Theory has been

disproved. It has been demolished several times over in the past.

Talageri's specialty is that he uses only objective, non-controversial

and verifiable data from ancient texts to support his conclusions.

>  

> Talageri's point of departure is the internal chronology of the

Rigveda. The Rigveda, the oldest book in the world and the most

primary source of knowledge about ancient India, consists of 1028

hymns divided in ten Books, or Mandalas. The composition of these

hymns, their collation and compilation in the present form, must have

been a gradual process stretching over a vast geographical expanse,

spanning several centuries if not millennia, and involving generations

of seers, kings and other actors.

>  

> The Rigveda itself provides strong and massive internal evidence

that all of it was not composed at the same time. There is general

agreement among scholars that Books II to VII, known as family books,

are older, whereas Books I, VIII, IX and X came later. The family

books are composed either entirely (as in the case of Book VI) or

almost entirely (as in Books III and VII) by seers of a single family;

or entirely (as in Books IV and II) by the members of a single family

with a few hymns composed by a family related to them;  and they use

simple meters.

>  

> But among the family books, Book V is regarded as the latest.

Descendants of composers of other family books are composers of hymns

in this Book; and although it belongs to the Atri family, it has

composers from as many as six families. In meters, it uses mainly

four-line Anushtup in preference to the three-line Gayatri which is

more prominent in older family books; the five-line Pankti meter makes

its appearance here. These characteristics become stronger in later

Books. Book I, VIII, IX and X, for instance, each has hymns composed

by seers from many families, and uses not only the five-line Pankti,

but also the six-line Mahapankti and the seven-line Sakvari. And

personalities and events of the earlier Books are referred to as

belonging to the distant past and so on.

>  

> In 'The Rigveda: A Historical Analysis,' Talageri has analysed the

internal evidence in great detail and established the detailed

chronological order of all ten Books as follows: Books VI, III and VII

are the oldest (Early Books), followed by Books II and IV (Middle

Books) and then come Books V, I, VIII, IX and X (Late Books) in that

order.

>  

> However, his argument in the present book is not dependent on this

detailed chronology. The generally accepted division by scholars of

the ten Books into Old Books (II, III, IV, VI, VII), and Late Books

(I, V, VIII, IX and X) is enough to support his argument.

>  

> That argument can be simply stated. Rigveda and Avesta have a lot in

common†" names of people, animals, meters, geography. However, the Early

Books of Rigveda have very little in common with Avesta, while the

Middle Books have a little more. But it is the Late Books of Rigveda

that have a lot in common with Avesta, pointing to a period of

contemporary development.

>  

> Take just one example. The Early Books have few Iranian names: two

related kings (AbhyÄvartin CÄyamÄna, Kavi CÄyamÄna), one priest

(KavaÅŸa) and four tribes (Prthu/PÄrthava, ParÅ›u/PÄrÅ›ava, Paktha and

BhalÄnas). All these names occur only in three hymns; none of these

names of persons or tribes finds any reference in the Middle or Late

Books. The three hymns pertain to the historical battles in the Early

period and these names refer to enemy Iranians then located in the

eastern and central Punjab. Besides, there is a hymn which mentions a

sage UÅ›anÄ and his father Kavi BhÄrgava who played a very important

role in the later mythology built on Indo-Iranian conflicts. All these

names have equivalents in the Avesta.

>  

> In the Middle Books, we find names of four sages, which are not

mentioned at all in the Early Books, but find numerous mentions in the

Middle and the Late Books and are referred to in Avesta as well. They

are: TurvÄ«ti, Gotama, Trita and KrÅ›Änu; in the Avesta they are called

Taurvaeti, Gaotama, Thrita and Keresani. All these personalities are

Vedic and pre-Zoroastrian. TaurvaÄ " ti in the Avesta is an early figure,

the father or the ancestor of Fracya (Yast 13.115). Thrita is

specifically mentioned in Yasna 9.10 as an ancient personality

belonging to a period far earlier to PourushÄspa, the father of

Zarathustra.

>  

> But the main case rests on dozens of names and name-elements common

to the Rigveda and the Avesta. These Vedic name elements like aśva,

ayana, rta, rna, atithi, brhad, ratha, syava, sura, and names such as

Yama, Krishna, Ä€ptya, Vrsni, VarÄha, Vivasvat, Atharvan, KÄshyapa have

their equivalents in the earliest parts of the Avesta, but they are

found exclusively in the Late Books and hymns of the Rigveda, and in

later Vedic and Sanskrit texts.   

>  

> To sum up, the Early and Middle Books have only 8 hymns containing

these name-elements common to Avesta, and all eight of these hymns are

identified as late or interpolated by ancient text Aitareya Brahmana

or by western scholars like Oldenberg. On the other hand, the Late

Books have no fewer than 386 hymns containing such name-elements.

>  

> Apart from names and name-elements, there is the evidence of the

development and use of meters used in various hymns of the different

Books. The earliest hymns in the Avesta, the GÄthÄs, composed by

Zarathustra, use the six-line Mahapankti meter, which is used only in

the Late Books of the Rigveda. On this parameter also, the evidence

points to the same conclusion: the common development of the joint

Indo-Iranian culture represented by these two sacred books took place

in the period of Late Books of Rigveda. The Early and the Middle Books

of Rigveda belong to a period which is older than the period of the

development of this joint culture.

>  

> The next question is: in which area were the Early and the Middle

Books composed? Where were the Vedic Aryans living in the period

before the development of this joint Indo-Iranian culture?

>  

> The geographical evidence of Rigveda is very clear and unambiguous.

It shows that the Vedic Aryans, in the period of the Early and the

Middle books, were inhabitants of interior parts of India, to the east

of river Sarasvati and were only just expanding into and becoming

acquainted with areas further west.

>  

> The geographical horizon of the Rigveda extends from (at least)

western Uttar Pradesh in the east to eastern and southern Afghanistan

in the West. Let us divide it in three regions: the eastern region

comprising the Sarasvati and areas to its east, mainly modern Haryana

and western UP; the western region comprising the Indus and areas to

its west, mainly the Northwest Frontier Province of Pakistan,

Afghanistan and contiguous areas of southern Central Asia; and the

central region comprising Saptasindhu or Punjab between the Sarasvati

and Indus.

>  

> The eastern region is clearly known to the whole of the Rigveda.

Copious references to the rivers such as Sarasvati, Drshadvati,

HariyupiyÄ, YavyÄvati, Ashmanvati, YamunÄ, GangÄ, places such as

IlayÄspada, Kikata, and animals such as elephant, buffalo, peacock and

spotted deer are scattered all over the Rigveda, but particularly in

the Early books.

>  

> In sharp contrast, the western region is totally unknown to the

Early Books, only very newly familiar to the Middle Books, but quite

familiar to the Late Books. The western places (except a solitary

reference to GÄndharva in a late hymn), animals, lakes and mountains

are totally unknown to the Early as well as the Middle Books, and

exactly three rivers are mentioned in Book IV, which represents the

western-most thrust of the Vedic Aryans in the Middle period.

>  

> The late books, on the other hand, are strewn with references to

rivers such as Sindhu, AmitabhÄ, RasÄ, SvetyÄ, KubhÄ, Krumu, Gomati,

Sarayu and SusomÄ; places such as GÄndhÄri, mountains such as Arjikya

and MujÄwat, lakes such as SaryanÄvat, and animals such as Bactrian

camel, Afghan horse, mountain sheep, mountain goat and boar.

>  

> Most interesting are the references to the central region†" the

Saptasindhu or Punjab between Indus and Sarasvati. Very significantly,

the Nadi Sukta lists the rivers from the east to the west. Book VI,

the oldest book, does not know any of the five rivers of Punjab. The

second oldest book, Book III, mentions only the two easternmost

rivers†" VipÄs (Beas) and Sutudri (Sutlej). The third oldest book, Book

VII, mentions Parushni (Ravi), the third river from the east, with

reference to the Battle of Ten Kings in which the non-Vedic enemies

figure as western people of the fourth river Asikni (Chenab). Even the

phrase Saptasindhu first appears in the Middle Books.

>  

> Significantly, Iranian texts also confirm the movement of the Anu-s

(an Aryan clan that later became Iranians) from the east to the west.

The first chapter of Vendidad lists 16 holy lands rendered unfit for

man by Angra Manyu, the evil spirit of Zend Avesta. The first of these

is Airyano Vaejo, bitterly cold and full of snow. If there is doubt

that this refers to Kashmir, the designation of one more land as Hapta

Hindu, that is Sapta-Sindhu (Punjab), should remove it.

>  

> As Girilal Jain had observed, " if it can be established that the

movement of the users of the Indo-European speech in India in ancient

times was from the east to the west and not vice-versa, the

invasion/migration theory, as it has been propounded, cannot stand. "

>  

> After establishing precisely that on the basis of Rigveda and

Avesta, Talageri proceeds to present some more evidence from ancient

Mesopotamia that could help us determine a lower limit for the Vedic

Age. Once we see that the movement of Aryans has been from the east to

the west within India and outside it, even the familiar facts acquire

an altogether different significance.  

>  

> The Mitanni, who ruled northern Iraq and Syria around the 15th

century BCE, spoke Hurrite, a non-Indo-European language unrelated to

Vedic Sanskrit. But their kings and other members of the ruling class

bore names which were corrupted versions of Vedic names: Mittaratti

(MitrÄtithi), Dewatti (DevÄtithi), Subandu (Subandhu), Indarota

(Indrota), Biriamasda (Priyamedha) , to mention a few. In a treaty

with Hittites, they invoked Vedic gods Mitra, Varuna, Indra and

NÄsatyas (AÅ›vins). A Mitanni manual on training of chariot horses by

Kikkuli has words like aika (eka, one), tera (tri, three), panza

(panch, five), satta (sapta, seven) na (nava, nine), vartana(vartana,

turn round in the horse race). Another one has words like Babru

(babhru, brown), parita (palita (grey), pinkara (pingala, red) and so

on. Many centuries must have elapsed between the entry of their Vedic

ancestors into West Asia and this loss of language with just a

super-stratum of Vedic

> words.

>  

> The Kassite conquerors of Mesopotamia (c. 1677 BCE) had a Sun god

Surias, perhaps also Marut and may be even Bhaga (bugas), as also a

personal name Abirattas (Abhiratha).

>  

> What is notable is that the ancestral Vedic names used by the

Mitanni kings, and the one known Kassite name, all belong to the names

which are common to the Avesta and the Late Books of Rigveda. So the

ancestors of the Mitanni and Kassites must have migrated from

northwestern India in the period of the Late Books. This places Late

Books of Rigveda in the late third millennium BCE at the latest. The

Middle and the Early books of Rigveda must have been composed much

earlier. Please note that this is the lower limit for the date of

Rigveda. There is nothing here that precludes a reasonably earlier date.

>  

> This makes the Rigvedic Age contemporaneous with the Indus Valley

culture. Far from being the destroyers of Harappa and Mohenjodaro,

Vedic Aryans turn out to be the architects of those great cities. This

is what Girilal Jain meant when he said that in course of time

Talageri's research can compel the revision of the history not only of

Indian, but also world civilization.

>  

> Talageri's book makes fascinating reading for those who are familiar

with and interested in the subject. That, looked at from the opposite

end, is also the biggest limitation of the book. This book is meant

for scholars and serious students. It is not fit for lay readers; it

cannot be read just for fun. One has to know a great deal about the

subject before one can appreciate the monumental feat of scholarship

the author has accomplished. But one thing can be said with certainty

- even those who do not agree with Talageri's conclusion will not find

it easy to disprove his data and logic and come up with an alternative

explanation.

>  

> The Rigveda and The Avesta: the Final Evidence

> Shrikant Talageri

> Aditya Prakashan, New Delhi, 2008

> Pages: xxxviii + 379

> Price: Rs. 750 (Paperback: Rs. 350)

>  

> Virendra Parekh is Executive Editor, Corporate India, and lives in

Mumbai

>  

>  

>

[Guest guest]

Hare rama krishna

dear Vinay ji

 

thanks for this post ,we expect more frm u and pls write more on this lines so as to remov doubts and confusions of many of us

 

thanks and regrds

 

sunil nair

om shreem mahalaxmai namah

, "vinayjhaa16" <vinayjhaa16 wrote:>> =========== =========== =========== ===========> May I take the liberty to point at some loopholes in the socalled> linguistic approach of scholars like Telagheri, although I support and> laud their efforts ?> > A truly linguistic approach must produce an alternative comparative> linguistics which could counter the ideas propounded in masterpieces> of IE grammararians like Karl Brugmann. Telagheri and other persons of> his school skipped this cardinal issue completely, and what you term> his linguistic approach can be called philological, and not linguistic. > > I wasted 12 years on IE linguistics and found irrefutable proofs in> favour of the fact that the Vedic language was the source of all IE> languages, but I was dismayed with the lack of any interest in real> linguistics among Indian Homelanders, and found them to be guided more> by nationalism rather than by real linguistics. Eurocentric scholars> are even more chauvinist. Hence, I did not even care to get my> findings written down properly, and thousands of pages of my notes lie> scattered in my storeroom, which I do not try to look into, because no> one is interested in this topic.> > My most important finding was that 'all' roots of the PIE> (Proto-Indo-European) language were not merely derived from the Vedic> roots, but were exactly same as the Vedic roots, provided we give> equal weight to all branches of the supposed PIE and take statistical> averages for each phoneme individually to decide the structure of> primordial language, instead of imposing our own hypotheses for> influencing the outcome of such inveigationsst, as the Europeanists> have done all along.> > Secondly, I would like to point out some shortcomings even in the> philological line of reasoning put forth by Telagheri & c.> > The idea that Saptasindhu signified Indus and its tributaries is a> modern myth. Vyas jee has mentioned in MBh that Saptasindhu flowed> eastwards, but adds figuratively that as a bad omen they started> flowing westwards momentarily when Lord Krishna started his journey> for Hastinapur to prevent a war, signifying an impending failure of> peace talks. This east-flowing Saptasindhu is the cradle of Vedic> civilization, esp of Aryavarta : Kaushiki, Gandaki(Sadaneeraa),> Sarayu, Gomati, Ganga, Yamuna and Saraswati. All these rivers are> mentioned in the RV. Gayatri was revealed to Kaushika Vishvamitra on> the banks of Kaushiki. > > Gotam Rahugana, the priest of first king of Videha was the rishi of RV> hymns dedicated to Svaraajya (ie, Videha) in first mandala 0f RV.> Nyaaya philosophy was started by his descendants. The ashrama of one> rishi of this lineage existed at modern Gotamkunda near Ahilyasthana> in Darbhanga district. > > White Yajurveda was revealed to Yajnavalkya. He was born in western UP> but lived in North Bihar. It is an Eoropean propaganda that RV> preceded other Vedas. Almost all hymns of Samaveda are found in RV.> All four Vedas mention each other profusely. Morphological or semantic> comparison of four Vedas do not suggest the type of dating we are> taught by Europeans. This dating is based upon their hatred for yajna.> Hence, Yajurveda had to be proven as a later invention of Indians> after the immigrants settled in India. Europeanists deliberately> forget that that Aristophanes explicitly mentioned in his comedy 'The> Birds' that the ancestors gave oblations to fire which nourished the> gods ; it is a clear evidence of ritualistic yajna among the ancestors> of Greeks.> > If we leave aside structural linguistics, which is boring topic for> Indian scholars, and come to philology, we would be forced to arrive> at conclusions which will not be palatable to neither Maxmuller's> disciples nor Telagheri's. For instance, 'bhratr' occurs 33 times in> the RV in all its declensions, and in 32 instances it has no> connection with the popular meaning 'brother'. The latter meaning is> probable only once, in the Yama-Yami dialogue in 10th mandala. There> too, Yama is a descendant of Sun. Elsewhere, Bhratar is used for Sun.> Hence, ancient grammarians deduced it from a root which meant "to> shine". Some persons also tried to relate it to bhr, to bear. But the> Sun shines as well as bears the world, while a brother neither shines> nor bears. It is the father who nears, and later the husband (bhartr).> Similarly, Agni is derived from a root which had no connection with> any physical properties, but was related to the divine property of> Agni-god.> > This peculiarity of Vedic language was clear to all ancient scholars.> Hence the differentiated Vedic language from Laukika Sanskrita, and> devoted their lives to preserve a language which they believed to be> divine. This belief was not an invention of priests, but has> philological proofs, as I have indicated above. Had the Vedic language> been invented by humans, it would have contained Laukika or worldly> meanings even during the formative phase when words were being formed> from roots.> > But in an age of evolutionism, who will believe that the ancients were> wiser than us? These evolutionists forget that evolution is never> linear, that all species have come to become extinct, that no specie> was permanent, that Homo Sapiens is not immortal, and the next> higher/lower specie need not be a linear descendant of the present> specie which has ethically degenerated into Homo Idiotes.> > -VJ> =========== =========== =========== =========== > , venkata krishnan> bcvk71@ wrote:> >> > B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN.> > website: www.vedascience.com> > > > > > > > ----- Forwarded Message ----> > kishore patnaik kishorepatnaik09@> > > > Sunday, January 4, 2009 7:19:38 PM> > Fwd: [VRI] Demolished once for all: Aryan> Invasion Theory -Virendra Parekh-4 Jan 2009> > > > http://www.vijayvaa ni.com/FrmPublic DisplayArticle. aspx?id=322> > Demolished once for all: Aryan Invasion Theory> > Virendra Parekh> > 4 January 2009> >  > > "An unknown Indian has taken on proponents of the Aryan> invasion/migration theory, demolished their case, and established that> northern India is the original home of the Aryans and the> Indo-European family of languages. The importance of this remarkable> achievement cannot be exaggerated. In course of time, it can compel> the revision of the history not only of Indian but also world> civilization. "> >  > > That was Girilal Jain in his masterful review of Shrikant G.> Talageri's 'Aryan Invasion Theory and Indian Nationalism, ' published> in 1993. Since then, Talageri, a not-so-unknown Indian now, has come> up with two more works. His 'The Rigveda: A Historical Analysis'> (2000) established that Vedic Aryans were inhabitants of the area to> the east of Punjab, traditionally known as AryÄvarta; that the region> of Saptasindhu formed the western periphery of their activities and> that the Aryans migrated from the east to the west within India and> beyond it. For this, he relied solely on a detailed analysis of the> Rigveda.> >  > > His latest book, "The Rigveda and the Avesta: the Final Evidence,"> seeks to prove conclusively beyond all reasonable doubt that India was> the original homeland of the Indo-European family of languages, that> the Rigvedic people were settled in areas around and to the east of> the Sarasvati river in at least the third millennium BCE if not> earlier, that the proto-Iranians who later became Zoroastrians were> settled in the areas to the west of the Vedic Aryans, and that both> started expanding westward around that period.> >  > > As the name of the book suggests, Talageri collects, collates and> compares a massive amount of evidence from the Rigveda and the Avesta> and also marshals undisputed recorded facts from Mesopotamian history> about the Mitanni and the Kassites to support his conclusions. He> relies on non-controversial data such as names of people, animals and> places, and on the provenance and numerical frequency of their> occurrences, rather than subjective interpretations of esoteric texts.> >  > > We teach our children even today as settled facts that nomadic> Aryans invaded/migrated to India around 1500 BCE, destroyed the Indus> Valley culture and began what is known as the Vedic Age, and produced> Rigveda around 1200 BCE. However, this is only a theory, and an> extremely weak one at that.> >  > > That there is not a shred of evidence for it in either the ancient> literature or archaeology, that it is based on nothing more solid than> some striking similarities among the Indo-European languages, that> there is an overwhelming body of solid evidence against it, and that> even the linguistic data supporting it can be better explained by an> alternative opposite theory, has not daunted its proponents who are> deeply entrenched in the academia, media and, worst of all, in politics.> >  > > Originally cooked up by 19th century European scholars to serve the> interests of India's colonial masters, the theory has now been> appropriated by current political ideologies whose sole purpose is to> keep India weak, divided and confused. It is used to deepen and> exploit regional, linguistic and racial cleavages in Indian society,> deny nativity and originality to Hindu civilization, and justify later> invasions: if Aryans came from outside, how can the Hindus cavil at> Muslim or European invaders?> >  > > This is not the first time that the Aryan Invasion Theory has been> disproved. It has been demolished several times over in the past.> Talageri's specialty is that he uses only objective, non-controversial> and verifiable data from ancient texts to support his conclusions.> >  > > Talageri's point of departure is the internal chronology of the> Rigveda. The Rigveda, the oldest book in the world and the most> primary source of knowledge about ancient India, consists of 1028> hymns divided in ten Books, or Mandalas. The composition of these> hymns, their collation and compilation in the present form, must have> been a gradual process stretching over a vast geographical expanse,> spanning several centuries if not millennia, and involving generations> of seers, kings and other actors.> >  > > The Rigveda itself provides strong and massive internal evidence> that all of it was not composed at the same time. There is general> agreement among scholars that Books II to VII, known as family books,> are older, whereas Books I, VIII, IX and X came later. The family> books are composed either entirely (as in the case of Book VI) or> almost entirely (as in Books III and VII) by seers of a single family;> or entirely (as in Books IV and II) by the members of a single family> with a few hymns composed by a family related to them;  and they use> simple meters.> >  > > But among the family books, Book V is regarded as the latest.> Descendants of composers of other family books are composers of hymns> in this Book; and although it belongs to the Atri family, it has> composers from as many as six families. In meters, it uses mainly> four-line Anushtup in preference to the three-line Gayatri which is> more prominent in older family books; the five-line Pankti meter makes> its appearance here. These characteristics become stronger in later> Books. Book I, VIII, IX and X, for instance, each has hymns composed> by seers from many families, and uses not only the five-line Pankti,> but also the six-line Mahapankti and the seven-line Sakvari. And> personalities and events of the earlier Books are referred to as> belonging to the distant past and so on.> >  > > In 'The Rigveda: A Historical Analysis,' Talageri has analysed the> internal evidence in great detail and established the detailed> chronological order of all ten Books as follows: Books VI, III and VII> are the oldest (Early Books), followed by Books II and IV (Middle> Books) and then come Books V, I, VIII, IX and X (Late Books) in that> order.> >  > > However, his argument in the present book is not dependent on this> detailed chronology. The generally accepted division by scholars of> the ten Books into Old Books (II, III, IV, VI, VII), and Late Books> (I, V, VIII, IX and X) is enough to support his argument.> >  > > That argument can be simply stated. Rigveda and Avesta have a lot in> commonâ€"names of people, animals, meters, geography. However, the Early> Books of Rigveda have very little in common with Avesta, while the> Middle Books have a little more. But it is the Late Books of Rigveda> that have a lot in common with Avesta, pointing to a period of> contemporary development.> >  > > Take just one example. The Early Books have few Iranian names: two> related kings (AbhyÄvartin CÄyamÄna, Kavi CÄyamÄna), one priest> (KavaÅŸa) and four tribes (Prthu/PÄrthava, ParÅ›u/PÄrÅ›ava, Paktha and> BhalÄnas). All these names occur only in three hymns; none of these> names of persons or tribes finds any reference in the Middle or Late> Books. The three hymns pertain to the historical battles in the Early> period and these names refer to enemy Iranians then located in the> eastern and central Punjab. Besides, there is a hymn which mentions a> sage UÅ›anÄ and his father Kavi BhÄrgava who played a very important> role in the later mythology built on Indo-Iranian conflicts. All these> names have equivalents in the Avesta.> >  > > In the Middle Books, we find names of four sages, which are not> mentioned at all in the Early Books, but find numerous mentions in the> Middle and the Late Books and are referred to in Avesta as well. They> are: TurvÄ«ti, Gotama, Trita and KrÅ›Änu; in the Avesta they are called> Taurvaeti, Gaotama, Thrita and Keresani. All these personalities are> Vedic and pre-Zoroastrian. TaurvaÄ"ti in the Avesta is an early figure,> the father or the ancestor of Fracya (Yast 13.115). Thrita is> specifically mentioned in Yasna 9.10 as an ancient personality> belonging to a period far earlier to PourushÄspa, the father of> Zarathustra.> >  > > But the main case rests on dozens of names and name-elements common> to the Rigveda and the Avesta. These Vedic name elements like aÅ›va,> ayana, rta, rna, atithi, brhad, ratha, syava, sura, and names such as> Yama, Krishna, Ä€ptya, Vrsni, VarÄha, Vivasvat, Atharvan, KÄshyapa have> their equivalents in the earliest parts of the Avesta, but they are> found exclusively in the Late Books and hymns of the Rigveda, and in> later Vedic and Sanskrit texts.  > >  > > To sum up, the Early and Middle Books have only 8 hymns containing> these name-elements common to Avesta, and all eight of these hymns are> identified as late or interpolated by ancient text Aitareya Brahmana> or by western scholars like Oldenberg. On the other hand, the Late> Books have no fewer than 386 hymns containing such name-elements.> >  > > Apart from names and name-elements, there is the evidence of the> development and use of meters used in various hymns of the different> Books. The earliest hymns in the Avesta, the GÄthÄs, composed by> Zarathustra, use the six-line Mahapankti meter, which is used only in> the Late Books of the Rigveda. On this parameter also, the evidence> points to the same conclusion: the common development of the joint> Indo-Iranian culture represented by these two sacred books took place> in the period of Late Books of Rigveda. The Early and the Middle Books> of Rigveda belong to a period which is older than the period of the> development of this joint culture.> >  > > The next question is: in which area were the Early and the Middle> Books composed? Where were the Vedic Aryans living in the period> before the development of this joint Indo-Iranian culture?> >  > > The geographical evidence of Rigveda is very clear and unambiguous.> It shows that the Vedic Aryans, in the period of the Early and the> Middle books, were inhabitants of interior parts of India, to the east> of river Sarasvati and were only just expanding into and becoming> acquainted with areas further west.> >  > > The geographical horizon of the Rigveda extends from (at least)> western Uttar Pradesh in the east to eastern and southern Afghanistan> in the West. Let us divide it in three regions: the eastern region> comprising the Sarasvati and areas to its east, mainly modern Haryana> and western UP; the western region comprising the Indus and areas to> its west, mainly the Northwest Frontier Province of Pakistan,> Afghanistan and contiguous areas of southern Central Asia; and the> central region comprising Saptasindhu or Punjab between the Sarasvati> and Indus.> >  > > The eastern region is clearly known to the whole of the Rigveda.> Copious references to the rivers such as Sarasvati, Drshadvati,> HariyupiyÄ, YavyÄvati, Ashmanvati, YamunÄ, GangÄ, places such as> IlayÄspada, Kikata, and animals such as elephant, buffalo, peacock and> spotted deer are scattered all over the Rigveda, but particularly in> the Early books.> >  > > In sharp contrast, the western region is totally unknown to the> Early Books, only very newly familiar to the Middle Books, but quite> familiar to the Late Books. The western places (except a solitary> reference to GÄndharva in a late hymn), animals, lakes and mountains> are totally unknown to the Early as well as the Middle Books, and> exactly three rivers are mentioned in Book IV, which represents the> western-most thrust of the Vedic Aryans in the Middle period.> >  > > The late books, on the other hand, are strewn with references to> rivers such as Sindhu, AmitabhÄ, RasÄ, SvetyÄ, KubhÄ, Krumu, Gomati,> Sarayu and SusomÄ; places such as GÄndhÄri, mountains such as Arjikya> and MujÄwat, lakes such as SaryanÄvat, and animals such as Bactrian> camel, Afghan horse, mountain sheep, mountain goat and boar.> >  > > Most interesting are the references to the central regionâ€"the> Saptasindhu or Punjab between Indus and Sarasvati. Very significantly,> the Nadi Sukta lists the rivers from the east to the west. Book VI,> the oldest book, does not know any of the five rivers of Punjab. The> second oldest book, Book III, mentions only the two easternmost> riversâ€"VipÄs (Beas) and Sutudri (Sutlej). The third oldest book, Book> VII, mentions Parushni (Ravi), the third river from the east, with> reference to the Battle of Ten Kings in which the non-Vedic enemies> figure as western people of the fourth river Asikni (Chenab). Even the> phrase Saptasindhu first appears in the Middle Books.> >  > > Significantly, Iranian texts also confirm the movement of the Anu-s> (an Aryan clan that later became Iranians) from the east to the west.> The first chapter of Vendidad lists 16 holy lands rendered unfit for> man by Angra Manyu, the evil spirit of Zend Avesta. The first of these> is Airyano Vaejo, bitterly cold and full of snow. If there is doubt> that this refers to Kashmir, the designation of one more land as Hapta> Hindu, that is Sapta-Sindhu (Punjab), should remove it.> >  > > As Girilal Jain had observed, "if it can be established that the> movement of the users of the Indo-European speech in India in ancient> times was from the east to the west and not vice-versa, the> invasion/migration theory, as it has been propounded, cannot stand."> >  > > After establishing precisely that on the basis of Rigveda and> Avesta, Talageri proceeds to present some more evidence from ancient> Mesopotamia that could help us determine a lower limit for the Vedic> Age. Once we see that the movement of Aryans has been from the east to> the west within India and outside it, even the familiar facts acquire> an altogether different significance.  > >  > > The Mitanni, who ruled northern Iraq and Syria around the 15th> century BCE, spoke Hurrite, a non-Indo-European language unrelated to> Vedic Sanskrit. But their kings and other members of the ruling class> bore names which were corrupted versions of Vedic names: Mittaratti> (MitrÄtithi), Dewatti (DevÄtithi), Subandu (Subandhu), Indarota> (Indrota), Biriamasda (Priyamedha) , to mention a few. In a treaty> with Hittites, they invoked Vedic gods Mitra, Varuna, Indra and> NÄsatyas (AÅ›vins). A Mitanni manual on training of chariot horses by> Kikkuli has words like aika (eka, one), tera (tri, three), panza> (panch, five), satta (sapta, seven) na (nava, nine), vartana(vartana,> turn round in the horse race). Another one has words like Babru> (babhru, brown), parita (palita (grey), pinkara (pingala, red) and so> on. Many centuries must have elapsed between the entry of their Vedic> ancestors into West Asia and this loss of language with just a> super-stratum of Vedic> > words.> >  > > The Kassite conquerors of Mesopotamia (c. 1677 BCE) had a Sun god> Surias, perhaps also Marut and may be even Bhaga (bugas), as also a> personal name Abirattas (Abhiratha).> >  > > What is notable is that the ancestral Vedic names used by the> Mitanni kings, and the one known Kassite name, all belong to the names> which are common to the Avesta and the Late Books of Rigveda. So the> ancestors of the Mitanni and Kassites must have migrated from> northwestern India in the period of the Late Books. This places Late> Books of Rigveda in the late third millennium BCE at the latest. The> Middle and the Early books of Rigveda must have been composed much> earlier. Please note that this is the lower limit for the date of> Rigveda. There is nothing here that precludes a reasonably earlier date.> >  > > This makes the Rigvedic Age contemporaneous with the Indus Valley> culture. Far from being the destroyers of Harappa and Mohenjodaro,> Vedic Aryans turn out to be the architects of those great cities. This> is what Girilal Jain meant when he said that in course of time> Talageri's research can compel the revision of the history not only of> Indian, but also world civilization.> >  > > Talageri's book makes fascinating reading for those who are familiar> with and interested in the subject. That, looked at from the opposite> end, is also the biggest limitation of the book. This book is meant> for scholars and serious students. It is not fit for lay readers; it> cannot be read just for fun. One has to know a great deal about the> subject before one can appreciate the monumental feat of scholarship> the author has accomplished. But one thing can be said with certainty> - even those who do not agree with Talageri's conclusion will not find> it easy to disprove his data and logic and come up with an alternative> explanation.> >  > > The Rigveda and The Avesta: the Final Evidence> > Shrikant Talageri> > Aditya Prakashan, New Delhi, 2008> > Pages: xxxviii + 379> > Price: Rs. 750 (Paperback: Rs. 350)> >  > > Virendra Parekh is Executive Editor, Corporate India, and lives in> Mumbai> >  > >  > >>

[Guest guest]

Dear Vinayji,

 

It is interesting that you have written about Bhagavan Vedavyasa mentioning the eastward-flowing Saptasindhu. But I do not remember to have seen the verse you are referring to and which says :

 

Quote:

 

Vyas jee has mentioned in MBh that Saptasindhu flowed eastwards, but adds figuratively that as a bad omen they started flowing westwards momentarily when Lord Krishna started his journey for Hastinapur to prevent a war, signifying an impending failure of peace talks. This east-flowing Saptasindhu is the cradle of Vedic civilization, esp of Aryavarta : Kaushiki, Gandaki(Sadaneeraa) , Sarayu, Gomati, Ganga, Yamuna and Saraswati.

 

UNQUOTE

 

We know that Saraswati initially flowed to the west and then one of its streams joined Yamuna at Paunta Saheb and flowed to the east together with Yamuna, though another stream of Saraswati continued to flow to the west and is known today as Ghagghar-Hakra. Ganga initially flows to the west and then becomes eastward at Gangadwar. The other four rivers (Kaushiki, Gandaki,Sarayu and Gomati) also probably could have flowed to the west in the beginning but they do flow finally to the east. What actually could have happened, if at all if that happened, was the reverse of what according to you was said by Bhagavan Vedfavyasa.

 

In view of this posssible mess-up (of course not by you and me) I am curious to see the original verses with reference and if that is not possible to have the exact reference, where this appears in the Mahabharata. Can you please help?

 

Regards,

 

Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

--- On Sun, 1/4/09, vinayjhaa16 <vinayjhaa16 wrote:

vinayjhaa16 <vinayjhaa16 Re: Demolished once for all: Aryan Invasion Theory -Virendra Parekh-4 Jan 2009 Date: Sunday, January 4, 2009, 9:40 PM

 

 

=========== =========== =========== ===========May I take the liberty to point at some loopholes in the socalledlinguistic approach of scholars like Telagheri, although I support andlaud their efforts ?A truly linguistic approach must produce an alternative comparativelinguistics which could counter the ideas propounded in masterpiecesof IE grammararians like Karl Brugmann. Telagheri and other persons ofhis school skipped this cardinal issue completely, and what you termhis linguistic approach can be called philological, and not linguistic. I wasted 12 years on IE linguistics and found irrefutable proofs infavour of the fact that the Vedic language was the source of all IElanguages, but I was dismayed with the lack of any interest in reallinguistics among Indian Homelanders, and found them to be guided moreby nationalism rather than by real linguistics. Eurocentric scholarsare even more

chauvinist. Hence, I did not even care to get myfindings written down properly, and thousands of pages of my notes liescattered in my storeroom, which I do not try to look into, because noone is interested in this topic.My most important finding was that 'all' roots of the PIE(Proto-Indo- European) language were not merely derived from the Vedicroots, but were exactly same as the Vedic roots, provided we giveequal weight to all branches of the supposed PIE and take statisticalaverages for each phoneme individually to decide the structure ofprimordial language, instead of imposing our own hypotheses forinfluencing the outcome of such inveigationsst, as the Europeanistshave done all along.Secondly, I would like to point out some shortcomings even in thephilological line of reasoning put forth by Telagheri & c.The idea that Saptasindhu signified Indus and its tributaries is amodern

myth. Vyas jee has mentioned in MBh that Saptasindhu flowedeastwards, but adds figuratively that as a bad omen they startedflowing westwards momentarily when Lord Krishna started his journeyfor Hastinapur to prevent a war, signifying an impending failure ofpeace talks. This east-flowing Saptasindhu is the cradle of Vediccivilization, esp of Aryavarta : Kaushiki, Gandaki(Sadaneeraa) ,Sarayu, Gomati, Ganga, Yamuna and Saraswati. All these rivers arementioned in the RV. Gayatri was revealed to Kaushika Vishvamitra onthe banks of Kaushiki. Gotam Rahugana, the priest of first king of Videha was the rishi of RVhymns dedicated to Svaraajya (ie, Videha) in first mandala 0f RV.Nyaaya philosophy was started by his descendants. The ashrama of onerishi of this lineage existed at modern Gotamkunda near Ahilyasthanain Darbhanga district. White Yajurveda was revealed to Yajnavalkya. He was born in western

UPbut lived in North Bihar. It is an Eoropean propaganda that RVpreceded other Vedas. Almost all hymns of Samaveda are found in RV.All four Vedas mention each other profusely. Morphological or semanticcomparison of four Vedas do not suggest the type of dating we aretaught by Europeans. This dating is based upon their hatred for yajna.Hence, Yajurveda had to be proven as a later invention of Indiansafter the immigrants settled in India. Europeanists deliberatelyforget that that Aristophanes explicitly mentioned in his comedy 'TheBirds' that the ancestors gave oblations to fire which nourished thegods ; it is a clear evidence of ritualistic yajna among the ancestorsof Greeks.If we leave aside structural linguistics, which is boring topic forIndian scholars, and come to philology, we would be forced to arriveat conclusions which will not be palatable to neither Maxmuller'sdisciples nor

Telagheri's. For instance, 'bhratr' occurs 33 times inthe RV in all its declensions, and in 32 instances it has noconnection with the popular meaning 'brother'. The latter meaning isprobable only once, in the Yama-Yami dialogue in 10th mandala. Theretoo, Yama is a descendant of Sun. Elsewhere, Bhratar is used for Sun.Hence, ancient grammarians deduced it from a root which meant "toshine". Some persons also tried to relate it to bhr, to bear. But theSun shines as well as bears the world, while a brother neither shinesnor bears. It is the father who nears, and later the husband (bhartr).Similarly, Agni is derived from a root which had no connection withany physical properties, but was related to the divine property ofAgni-god.This peculiarity of Vedic language was clear to all ancient scholars.Hence the differentiated Vedic language from Laukika Sanskrita, anddevoted their lives to preserve a

language which they believed to bedivine. This belief was not an invention of priests, but hasphilological proofs, as I have indicated above. Had the Vedic languagebeen invented by humans, it would have contained Laukika or worldlymeanings even during the formative phase when words were being formedfrom roots.But in an age of evolutionism, who will believe that the ancients werewiser than us? These evolutionists forget that evolution is neverlinear, that all species have come to become extinct, that no speciewas permanent, that Homo Sapiens is not immortal, and the nexthigher/lower specie need not be a linear descendant of the presentspecie which has ethically degenerated into Homo Idiotes.-VJ=========== =========== =========== =========== ancient_indian_ astrology, venkata

krishnan<bcvk71 wrote:>> B.C.VENKATAKRISHNAN .> website: www.vedascience. com> > > > ----- Forwarded Message ----> kishore patnaik <kishorepatnaik09@ ...>> <>> Sunday, January 4, 2009 7:19:38 PM> Fwd: [VRI] Demolished once for all: AryanInvasion Theory -Virendra Parekh-4 Jan 2009> > http://www.vijayvaa ni.com/FrmPublic DisplayArticle. aspx?id=322> Demolished once for all: Aryan Invasion Theory> Virendra Parekh> 4 January 2009> Â > "An unknown Indian has taken on proponents of the Aryaninvasion/migration theory, demolished their case, and established thatnorthern

India is the original home of the Aryans and theIndo-European family of languages. The importance of this remarkableachievement cannot be exaggerated. In course of time, it can compelthe revision of the history not only of Indian but also worldcivilization. ">  > That was Girilal Jain in his masterful review of Shrikant G.Talageri's 'Aryan Invasion Theory and Indian Nationalism, ' publishedin 1993. Since then, Talageri, a not-so-unknown Indian now, has comeup with two more works. His 'The Rigveda: A Historical Analysis'(2000) established that Vedic Aryans were inhabitants of the area tothe east of Punjab, traditionally known as Ary�varta; that the regionof Saptasindhu formed the western periphery of their activities andthat the Aryans migrated from the east to the west within India andbeyond it. For this, he relied solely on a detailed analysis of theRigveda.>

 > His latest book, "The Rigveda and the Avesta: the Final Evidence,"seeks to prove conclusively beyond all reasonable doubt that India wasthe original homeland of the Indo-European family of languages, thatthe Rigvedic people were settled in areas around and to the east ofthe Sarasvati river in at least the third millennium BCE if notearlier, that the proto-Iranians who later became Zoroastrians weresettled in the areas to the west of the Vedic Aryans, and that bothstarted expanding westward around that period.>  > As the name of the book suggests, Talageri collects, collates andcompares a massive amount of evidence from the Rigveda and the Avestaand also marshals undisputed recorded facts from Mesopotamian historyabout the Mitanni and the Kassites to support his conclusions. Herelies on non-controversial data such as names of people, animals andplaces, and on the

provenance and numerical frequency of theiroccurrences, rather than subjective interpretations of esoteric texts.> Â > We teach our children even today as settled facts that nomadicAryans invaded/migrated to India around 1500 BCE, destroyed the IndusValley culture and began what is known as the Vedic Age, and producedRigveda around 1200 BCE. However, this is only a theory, and anextremely weak one at that.> Â > That there is not a shred of evidence for it in either the ancientliterature or archaeology, that it is based on nothing more solid thansome striking similarities among the Indo-European languages, thatthere is an overwhelming body of solid evidence against it, and thateven the linguistic data supporting it can be better explained by analternative opposite theory, has not daunted its proponents who aredeeply entrenched in the academia, media and, worst of all, in

politics.> Â > Originally cooked up by 19th century European scholars to serve theinterests of India's colonial masters, the theory has now beenappropriated by current political ideologies whose sole purpose is tokeep India weak, divided and confused. It is used to deepen andexploit regional, linguistic and racial cleavages in Indian society,deny nativity and originality to Hindu civilization, and justify laterinvasions: if Aryans came from outside, how can the Hindus cavil atMuslim or European invaders?> Â > This is not the first time that the Aryan Invasion Theory has beendisproved. It has been demolished several times over in the past.Talageri's specialty is that he uses only objective, non-controversialand verifiable data from ancient texts to support his conclusions.> Â > Talageri's point of departure is the internal chronology of theRigveda. The

Rigveda, the oldest book in the world and the mostprimary source of knowledge about ancient India, consists of 1028hymns divided in ten Books, or Mandalas. The composition of thesehymns, their collation and compilation in the present form, must havebeen a gradual process stretching over a vast geographical expanse,spanning several centuries if not millennia, and involving generationsof seers, kings and other actors.> Â > The Rigveda itself provides strong and massive internal evidencethat all of it was not composed at the same time. There is generalagreement among scholars that Books II to VII, known as family books,are older, whereas Books I, VIII, IX and X came later. The familybooks are composed either entirely (as in the case of Book VI) oralmost entirely (as in Books III and VII) by seers of a single family;or entirely (as in Books IV and II) by the members of a single

familywith a few hymns composed by a family related to them; Â and they usesimple meters.> Â > But among the family books, Book V is regarded as the latest.Descendants of composers of other family books are composers of hymnsin this Book; and although it belongs to the Atri family, it hascomposers from as many as six families. In meters, it uses mainlyfour-line Anushtup in preference to the three-line Gayatri which ismore prominent in older family books; the five-line Pankti meter makesits appearance here. These characteristics become stronger in laterBooks. Book I, VIII, IX and X, for instance, each has hymns composedby seers from many families, and uses not only the five-line Pankti,but also the six-line Mahapankti and the seven-line Sakvari. Andpersonalities and events of the earlier Books are referred to asbelonging to the distant past and so on.> Â >

In 'The Rigveda: A Historical Analysis,' Talageri has analysed theinternal evidence in great detail and established the detailedchronological order of all ten Books as follows: Books VI, III and VIIare the oldest (Early Books), followed by Books II and IV (MiddleBooks) and then come Books V, I, VIII, IX and X (Late Books) in thatorder.>  > However, his argument in the present book is not dependent on thisdetailed chronology. The generally accepted division by scholars ofthe ten Books into Old Books (II, III, IV, VI, VII), and Late Books(I, V, VIII, IX and X) is enough to support his argument.>  > That argument can be simply stated. Rigveda and Avesta have a lot incommonâ€"names of people, animals, meters, geography. However, the EarlyBooks of Rigveda have very little in common with Avesta, while theMiddle Books have a little more. But it is the Late Books of

Rigvedathat have a lot in common with Avesta, pointing to a period ofcontemporary development.>  > Take just one example. The Early Books have few Iranian names: tworelated kings (Abhy�vartin C�yam�na, Kavi C�yam�na), one priest(Kavaşa) and four tribes (Prthu/P�rthava, Parśu/P�rśava, Paktha andBhal�nas). All these names occur only in three hymns; none of thesenames of persons or tribes finds any reference in the Middle or LateBooks. The three hymns pertain to the historical battles in the Earlyperiod and these names refer to enemy Iranians then located in theeastern and central Punjab. Besides, there is a hymn which mentions asage Uśan� and his father Kavi Bh�rgava who played a very importantrole in the later mythology built on Indo-Iranian conflicts. All thesenames have equivalents in the Avesta.>  > In the

Middle Books, we find names of four sages, which are notmentioned at all in the Early Books, but find numerous mentions in theMiddle and the Late Books and are referred to in Avesta as well. Theyare: TurvÄ«ti, Gotama, Trita and KrÅ›Ä�nu; in the Avesta they are calledTaurvaeti, Gaotama, Thrita and Keresani. All these personalities areVedic and pre-Zoroastrian. TaurvaÄ"ti in the Avesta is an early figure,the father or the ancestor of Fracya (Yast 13.115). Thrita isspecifically mentioned in Yasna 9.10 as an ancient personalitybelonging to a period far earlier to PourushÄ�spa, the father ofZarathustra.>  > But the main case rests on dozens of names and name-elements commonto the Rigveda and the Avesta. These Vedic name elements like aÅ›va,ayana, rta, rna, atithi, brhad, ratha, syava, sura, and names such asYama, Krishna, Ä€ptya, Vrsni, VarÄ�ha, Vivasvat, Atharvan,

K�shyapa havetheir equivalents in the earliest parts of the Avesta, but they arefound exclusively in the Late Books and hymns of the Rigveda, and inlater Vedic and Sanskrit texts.  >  > To sum up, the Early and Middle Books have only 8 hymns containingthese name-elements common to Avesta, and all eight of these hymns areidentified as late or interpolated by ancient text Aitareya Brahmanaor by western scholars like Oldenberg. On the other hand, the LateBooks have no fewer than 386 hymns containing such name-elements.>  > Apart from names and name-elements, there is the evidence of thedevelopment and use of meters used in various hymns of the differentBooks. The earliest hymns in the Avesta, the G�th�s, composed byZarathustra, use the six-line Mahapankti meter, which is used only inthe Late Books of the Rigveda. On this parameter also, the

evidencepoints to the same conclusion: the common development of the jointIndo-Iranian culture represented by these two sacred books took placein the period of Late Books of Rigveda. The Early and the Middle Booksof Rigveda belong to a period which is older than the period of thedevelopment of this joint culture.> Â > The next question is: in which area were the Early and the MiddleBooks composed? Where were the Vedic Aryans living in the periodbefore the development of this joint Indo-Iranian culture?> Â > The geographical evidence of Rigveda is very clear and unambiguous.It shows that the Vedic Aryans, in the period of the Early and theMiddle books, were inhabitants of interior parts of India, to the eastof river Sarasvati and were only just expanding into and becomingacquainted with areas further west.> Â > The geographical horizon of the Rigveda

extends from (at least)western Uttar Pradesh in the east to eastern and southern Afghanistanin the West. Let us divide it in three regions: the eastern regioncomprising the Sarasvati and areas to its east, mainly modern Haryanaand western UP; the western region comprising the Indus and areas toits west, mainly the Northwest Frontier Province of Pakistan,Afghanistan and contiguous areas of southern Central Asia; and thecentral region comprising Saptasindhu or Punjab between the Sarasvatiand Indus.>  > The eastern region is clearly known to the whole of the Rigveda.Copious references to the rivers such as Sarasvati, Drshadvati,Hariyupiy�, Yavy�vati, Ashmanvati, Yamun�, Gang�, places such asIlay�spada, Kikata, and animals such as elephant, buffalo, peacock andspotted deer are scattered all over the Rigveda, but particularly inthe Early books.>

 > In sharp contrast, the western region is totally unknown to theEarly Books, only very newly familiar to the Middle Books, but quitefamiliar to the Late Books. The western places (except a solitaryreference to G�ndharva in a late hymn), animals, lakes and mountainsare totally unknown to the Early as well as the Middle Books, andexactly three rivers are mentioned in Book IV, which represents thewestern-most thrust of the Vedic Aryans in the Middle period.>  > The late books, on the other hand, are strewn with references torivers such as Sindhu, Amitabh�, Ras�, Svety�, Kubh�, Krumu, Gomati,Sarayu and Susom�; places such as G�ndh�ri, mountains such as Arjikyaand Muj�wat, lakes such as Saryan�vat, and animals such as Bactriancamel, Afghan horse, mountain sheep, mountain goat and boar.>  > Most interesting are the

references to the central regionâ€"theSaptasindhu or Punjab between Indus and Sarasvati. Very significantly,the Nadi Sukta lists the rivers from the east to the west. Book VI,the oldest book, does not know any of the five rivers of Punjab. Thesecond oldest book, Book III, mentions only the two easternmostriversâ€"VipÄ�s (Beas) and Sutudri (Sutlej). The third oldest book, BookVII, mentions Parushni (Ravi), the third river from the east, withreference to the Battle of Ten Kings in which the non-Vedic enemiesfigure as western people of the fourth river Asikni (Chenab). Even thephrase Saptasindhu first appears in the Middle Books.>  > Significantly, Iranian texts also confirm the movement of the Anu-s(an Aryan clan that later became Iranians) from the east to the west.The first chapter of Vendidad lists 16 holy lands rendered unfit forman by Angra Manyu, the evil spirit of Zend

Avesta. The first of theseis Airyano Vaejo, bitterly cold and full of snow. If there is doubtthat this refers to Kashmir, the designation of one more land as HaptaHindu, that is Sapta-Sindhu (Punjab), should remove it.> Â > As Girilal Jain had observed, "if it can be established that themovement of the users of the Indo-European speech in India in ancienttimes was from the east to the west and not vice-versa, theinvasion/migration theory, as it has been propounded, cannot stand."> Â > After establishing precisely that on the basis of Rigveda andAvesta, Talageri proceeds to present some more evidence from ancientMesopotamia that could help us determine a lower limit for the VedicAge. Once we see that the movement of Aryans has been from the east tothe west within India and outside it, even the familiar facts acquirean altogether different

significance.  >  > The Mitanni, who ruled northern Iraq and Syria around the 15thcentury BCE, spoke Hurrite, a non-Indo-European language unrelated toVedic Sanskrit. But their kings and other members of the ruling classbore names which were corrupted versions of Vedic names: Mittaratti(Mitr�tithi), Dewatti (Dev�tithi), Subandu (Subandhu), Indarota(Indrota), Biriamasda (Priyamedha) , to mention a few. In a treatywith Hittites, they invoked Vedic gods Mitra, Varuna, Indra andN�satyas (Aśvins). A Mitanni manual on training of chariot horses byKikkuli has words like aika (eka, one), tera (tri, three), panza(panch, five), satta (sapta, seven) na (nava, nine), vartana(vartana,turn round in the horse race). Another one has words like Babru(babhru, brown), parita (palita (grey), pinkara (pingala, red) and soon. Many centuries must have elapsed between the entry

of their Vedicancestors into West Asia and this loss of language with just asuper-stratum of Vedic> words.> Â > The Kassite conquerors of Mesopotamia (c. 1677 BCE) had a Sun godSurias, perhaps also Marut and may be even Bhaga (bugas), as also apersonal name Abirattas (Abhiratha).> Â > What is notable is that the ancestral Vedic names used by theMitanni kings, and the one known Kassite name, all belong to the nameswhich are common to the Avesta and the Late Books of Rigveda. So theancestors of the Mitanni and Kassites must have migrated fromnorthwestern India in the period of the Late Books. This places LateBooks of Rigveda in the late third millennium BCE at the latest. TheMiddle and the Early books of Rigveda must have been composed muchearlier. Please note that this is the lower limit for the date ofRigveda. There is nothing here that precludes a reasonably

earlier date.> Â > This makes the Rigvedic Age contemporaneous with the Indus Valleyculture. Far from being the destroyers of Harappa and Mohenjodaro,Vedic Aryans turn out to be the architects of those great cities. Thisis what Girilal Jain meant when he said that in course of timeTalageri's research can compel the revision of the history not only ofIndian, but also world civilization.> Â > Talageri's book makes fascinating reading for those who are familiarwith and interested in the subject. That, looked at from the oppositeend, is also the biggest limitation of the book. This book is meantfor scholars and serious students. It is not fit for lay readers; itcannot be read just for fun. One has to know a great deal about thesubject before one can appreciate the monumental feat of scholarshipthe author has accomplished. But one thing can be said with certainty- even

those who do not agree with Talageri's conclusion will not findit easy to disprove his data and logic and come up with an alternativeexplanation.> Â > The Rigveda and The Avesta: the Final Evidence> Shrikant Talageri> Aditya Prakashan, New Delhi, 2008> Pages: xxxviii + 379> Price: Rs. 750 (Paperback: Rs. 350)> Â > Virendra Parekh is Executive Editor, Corporate India, and lives inMumbai> Â > Â >