Guest guest Posted November 2, 2008 Report Share Posted November 2, 2008 Dear Friends, Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology' had indicated (page 38):  " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and     the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet     or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious     bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT KAKSHYA     HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA ,     DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE' I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets. Regards, G.K.GOEL ________________________________ kiran.rama <kiran.rama Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM Re: Death Analysis: Research Data Required Dear Sumitji, There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen many use to correctly predict death. Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc on the same Thanks Kiran ancient_indian_ astrology, " Sumit Bajaj " <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote: > > Dear All, > > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting > deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and > date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for > Accident i would also like to analyse. > > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided. > > -- > Sumit Bajaj > Contact: +91-98300-84593 > astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com > Id: sumitbajaj2000 > Be the first one to try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to http://in.messenger./win/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 2, 2008 Report Share Posted November 2, 2008 Dear Friends, In case , you consider one khara planet ,it will repeat every year. One is required to consider both the khara 's together, for death or death like conditions to occur. This is a rare combination in a native's life and does not occur frequently.  The million dollar question is: 1. If one planet becomes both Kharas 2. In Astakvarga system their are  some differences in   BPHS and Brihat Jatak.Which is to  be followed?  It is good that you wish ti do research on this . It may benefit all of us. Best regards,  G.K.GOEL ________________________________ Sumit Bajaj <sumitbajaj2000 Sunday, 2 November, 2008 3:51:55 PM Re: Re:Khar planets this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the application of the rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned instances may occur even every year in the natives life. So the rule may not be absolute. This is the reason why i wanted the data for research. If anyone there please mail the same.  On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Friends, Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology' had indicated (page 38):  " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and     the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet     or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious     bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT KAKSHYA     HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA ,     DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE' I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets. Regards, G.K.GOEL  ________________________________ kiran.rama <kiran.rama (AT) (DOT) co.in> ancient_indian_ astrology Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Death Analysis: Research Data Required Dear Sumitji, There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen many use to correctly predict death. Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc on the same Thanks Kiran ancient_indian_ astrology, " Sumit Bajaj " <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote: > > Dear All, > > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting > deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and > date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for > Accident i would also like to analyse. > > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided. > > -- > Sumit Bajaj > Contact: +91-98300-84593 > astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com > Id: sumitbajaj2000 > ________________________________ Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. -- Sumit Bajaj Contact: +91-98300-84593 astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger./invite/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 2, 2008 Report Share Posted November 2, 2008 Dear Friends, Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology' had indicated (page 38): " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT KAKSHYA HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA , DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE' I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets. Regards, G.K.GOEL kiran.rama <kiran.rama Sent: Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM Re: Death Analysis: Research Data Required Dear Sumitji,There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen manyuse to correctly predict death.Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc onthe sameThanksKiranancient_indian_ astrology, "Sumit Bajaj"<sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote:>> Dear All,> > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting> deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and> date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for> Accident i would also like to analyse.> > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided.> > -- > Sumit Bajaj> Contact: +91-98300-84593> astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com> Id: sumitbajaj2000> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 2, 2008 Report Share Posted November 2, 2008 this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the application of the rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned instances may occur even every year in the natives life. So the rule may not be absolute. This is the reason why i wanted the data for research. If anyone there please mail the same. On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 wrote: Dear Friends, Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology' had indicated (page 38): " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT KAKSHYA HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA , DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE' I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets. Regards, G.K.GOEL kiran.rama <kiran.rama Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM Re: Death Analysis: Research Data Required Dear Sumitji,There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen manyuse to correctly predict death.Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc onthe same ThanksKiranancient_indian_ astrology, " Sumit Bajaj " <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote:>> Dear All,> > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting> deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and > date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for> Accident i would also like to analyse.> > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided.> > -- > Sumit Bajaj > Contact: +91-98300-84593> astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com> Id: sumitbajaj2000> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593 astrosumitbajaj.blogspot.com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 2, 2008 Report Share Posted November 2, 2008 Vedic Numerology by Shri GV Chaudhary. Published by Bhartiya Vidya Bhuvan. How to calculate the birth date, date of marriage and the date of death are all illustrated with hundreds of examples. But one needs lot of intelligence & knowledge of astrological and astronomical levels to understand this book. I cannot understand it. best wishes, Bhaskar. , "Sumit Bajaj" <sumitbajaj2000 wrote:>> this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the application of the> rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned instances may occur> even every year in the natives life. So the rule may not be absolute.> > This is the reason why i wanted the data for research.> > If anyone there please mail the same.> > > On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel gkgoel1937 wrote:> >> > Dear Friends,> > Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology'> > had indicated (page 38):> > " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and> > the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet> > or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an> > auspicious> > bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT> > KAKSHYA> > HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA ,> > DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE'> >> > I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets.> > Regards,> >> >> > G.K.GOEL> >> >> >> > ------------------------------> > ** kiran.rama kiran.rama > *To:* > > *Sent:* Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM> > *Subject:* Re: Death Analysis: Research Data> > Required> >> > Dear Sumitji,> >> > There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen many> > use to correctly predict death.> >> > Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc on> > the same> >> > Thanks> > Kiran> >> > ancient_indian_ astrology<%40>,> > "Sumit Bajaj"> > <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote:> > >> > > Dear All,> > >> > > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting> > > deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and> > > date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for> > > Accident i would also like to analyse.> > >> > > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided.> > >> > > --> > > Sumit Bajaj> > > Contact: +91-98300-84593> > > astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com> > > Id: sumitbajaj2000> > >> >> >> > ------------------------------> > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now.<http://in.rd./tagline_messenger_6/*http://messenger./invite/>> >> > > >> > > > -- > Sumit Bajaj> Contact: +91-98300-84593> astrosumitbajaj.blogspot.com> Id: sumitbajaj2000> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 2, 2008 Report Share Posted November 2, 2008 This book also contains references to the Vedic era, and many shlokas are mentioned which confirm that the people of Vedic origins were well aware of the 12 divisions in the sky, in that period also. ( One manda buddhi idiot trying to change the calendar , I have many such refeences for him, but I do not intend to waste time on those who throw stones at others, otherwise I can bring all his knowledge of astronomy to naught , with what little I know ) This book also contains the practical use of Nakshatra applications to the highest possible levesl, that is to find the exact date when a person will die, or get married. best wishes, Bhaskar. , "Bhaskar" <rajiventerprises wrote:>> Vedic Numerology by Shri GV Chaudhary. Published by Bhartiya Vidya> Bhuvan. How to calculate the birth date, date of marriage and the date> of death are all illustrated with hundreds of examples. But one needs> lot of intelligence & knowledge of astrological and astronomical levels> to understand this book. I cannot understand it. best wishes,> Bhaskar.> > > > , "Sumit Bajaj"> sumitbajaj2000@ wrote:> >> > this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the application of> the> > rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned instances may> occur> > even every year in the natives life. So the rule may not be absolute.> >> > This is the reason why i wanted the data for research.> >> > If anyone there please mail the same.> >> >> > On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel gkgoel1937@ wrote:> > >> > > Dear Friends,> > > Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology'> > > had indicated (page 38):> > > " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and> > > the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet> > > or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an> > > auspicious> > > bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT> > > KAKSHYA> > > HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA ,> > > DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE'> > >> > > I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara> planets.> > > Regards,> > >> > >> > > G.K.GOEL> > >> > >> > >> > > ------------------------------> > > ** kiran.rama kiran.rama@> > > *To:* > > > *Sent:* Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM> > > *Subject:* Re: Death Analysis: Research> Data> > > Required> > >> > > Dear Sumitji,> > >> > > There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen many> > > use to correctly predict death.> > >> > > Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc on> > > the same> > >> > > Thanks> > > Kiran> > >> > > ancient_indian_ astrology@ .> com<%40>,> > > "Sumit Bajaj"> > > <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear All,> > > >> > > > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting> > > > deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details> and> > > > date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons> for> > > > Accident i would also like to analyse.> > > >> > > > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided.> > > >> > > > --> > > > Sumit Bajaj> > > > Contact: +91-98300-84593> > > > astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com> > > > Id: sumitbajaj2000> > > >> > >> > >> > > ------------------------------> > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them> now.<http://in.rd./tagline_messenger_6/*http://messenger..\> com/invite/>> > >> > >> > >> >> >> >> > --> > Sumit Bajaj> > Contact: +91-98300-84593> > astrosumitbajaj.blogspot.com> > Id: sumitbajaj2000> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 2, 2008 Report Share Posted November 2, 2008 Dear Friends, In case , you consider one khara planet ,it will repeat every year. One is required to consider both the khara 's together, for death or death like conditions to occur. This is a rare combination in a native's life and does not occur frequently. The million dollar question is: 1. If one planet becomes both Kharas 2. In Astakvarga system their are some differences in BPHS and Brihat Jatak.Which is to be followed? It is good that you wish ti do research on this . It may benefit all of us. Best regards, G.K.GOEL Sumit Bajaj <sumitbajaj2000 Sent: Sunday, 2 November, 2008 3:51:55 PMRe: Re:Khar planets this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the application of the rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned instances may occur even every year in the natives life. So the rule may not be absolute. This is the reason why i wanted the data for research. If anyone there please mail the same. On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Friends, Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology' had indicated (page 38): " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT KAKSHYA HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA , DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE' I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets. Regards, G.K.GOEL kiran.rama <kiran.rama (AT) (DOT) co.in>ancient_indian_ astrologySunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM[ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Death Analysis: Research Data Required Dear Sumitji,There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen manyuse to correctly predict death.Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc onthe sameThanksKiranancient_indian_ astrology, "Sumit Bajaj"<sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote:>> Dear All,> > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting> deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and> date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for> Accident i would also like to analyse.> > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided.> > -- > Sumit Bajaj> Contact: +91-98300-84593> astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com> Id: sumitbajaj2000> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Connect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 Lets us take an example... its my own chart... 7th april 1981, 9:58 PM , Kolkata In this case the lord of two kharas (lord of 64th navamsha to moon and lord of 22nd drekkana to asc) is both Venus only. So in this case the Venus will travel every year through a particular point. Whats this particular point i am still not able to understand. Please throw light on this. Thanx On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 wrote: Dear Friends, In case , you consider one khara planet ,it will repeat every year. One is required to consider both the khara 's together, for death or death like conditions to occur. This is a rare combination in a native's life and does not occur frequently. The million dollar question is: 1. If one planet becomes both Kharas 2. In Astakvarga system their are some differences in BPHS and Brihat Jatak.Which is to be followed? It is good that you wish ti do research on this . It may benefit all of us. Best regards, G.K.GOEL Sumit Bajaj <sumitbajaj2000 Sunday, 2 November, 2008 3:51:55 PMRe: Re:Khar planets this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the application of the rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned instances may occur even every year in the natives life. So the rule may not be absolute. This is the reason why i wanted the data for research. If anyone there please mail the same. On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Friends, Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology' had indicated (page 38): " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT KAKSHYA HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA , DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE' I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets. Regards, G.K.GOEL kiran.rama <kiran.rama (AT) (DOT) co.in> ancient_indian_ astrology Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM[ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Death Analysis: Research Data Required Dear Sumitji,There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen manyuse to correctly predict death.Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc on the sameThanksKiranancient_indian_ astrology, " Sumit Bajaj " <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote:>> Dear All,> > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting> deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and > date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for> Accident i would also like to analyse.> > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided.> > -- > Sumit Bajaj > Contact: +91-98300-84593> astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com> Id: sumitbajaj2000> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Connect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger. -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593 astrosumitbajaj.blogspot.com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 Dear Sumit ji,Didn't we have the same discussion earlier in March where you were also involved. I am reproducing below message no. 8694 to refresh your memory. If the same principle has to be discussed, we should move ahead form the point where we left last time. This dictum was discussed and explained to you in detail at that time also. I reproduce one of my posts here which was addressed to you only (other posts in this thread may also be referred to) Dear Sumit ji and others,...Whenever Lord of 22nd drekana from Asc and 64th navamsha from Moon happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious bindu after 2 sodhanas are carried out and if that KAKSHYA happens to be owned by transiting planets, DEATH is unavoidable…. The above statement by CS Patel, is quite valid and even if not applicable verbatim, shows us a way to proceed. I've tried to test it with some cases with good rate of success...22nd Dreshkan from Ascendant and 64th navamsha from moon are two very sensitive points in a chart and hence their lords become sensitive also. Since they are related with 8th house, their affliction results in threat to life. Whenever these points/lords are afflicted, it results in inauspicious results depending upon the severity of affliction. When the affliction is seen in all the three areas: natal chart (promise), dasha (fructification) and transit (delivery) the event becomes almost certain to happen. Some of the factors causing affliction in natal chart could be: Malefics afflicting 22nd Dk and/or 64 navamsh 22dk lord (DkL) or 64 nav lord (NvL) placed in trik houses. Any PAC with lagna/LL with lagna/LL being afflictedLess/no benefic bindus in the sign and particularly in kaksha in which they're placed While in transit, the affliction is caused with: Malefics transiting the 22nd Dk and/or 64 navamsh22dk lord or 64 nav lord going to trik houses in transit. Any PAC with lagna/LL with lagna/LL being afflictedThese lords transiting over a sign and particularly in kaksha where they don't have a benefic pointTransiting in signs/kakshas of marak/trik lords The affliction becomes very severe if the planets are activated in dasha/antar also. Here I am giving an example to show the event: This is the case of a lady who passed away on 18th Nov 2007 Her birth details are: 24.10.1938/8.51/Delh --- scorpio lagna with venus in lagna, jup in 3H, Sat in 5H, ket in 6H, LL mars in 11H, and a conjunction of Sun, moon, mercury and rahu in 12H. In this case 22nd DkL from ascendant as well as moon is Mer and 64 NvL from moon is venus and from asc is mars. While there were other indications also of death, if seen from the 22dkL and 64 nvL we observe the following: Dasha in operation: Dasha at the time of death was ve-mo-me In the natal chart: Mercury is, besides being 22DkL, is also 8L and 11L. Is badly afflicted in natal chart being in 12H with rahu. Venus is also marak being 7L and 12L placed in lagna (afflicts lagna)Mars is the lagna lord himself but also 6L in 11th house and also 64 NvL from ascendant. In the transit: Mercury is transiting over exact natal position in 12H, in kaksha of marak and MD lord Venus. It has no benefic bindu in this kaksha. Venus is transiting over natal LL in virgo, in it own kaksha, but has a bindu there (?) Was it required for venus to be strong (being a maraca)Mars is retrograde, transiting in 8H over 22nd dreshkan, also in kaksha of venus. Here again mars is in kaksha of venus but has a bindu there (?). Shall we again think the mars had to be strong to afflict the 8H.At the time of death, Moon is in aquarius, in exact conjunction with rahu and in trine to the natal rahu-moon conjunction.Mars, moon and mercury are in rahu's nakshatra and venus, the MD lord is in moon's nakshatra.Thus, the possibility of such an event is clearly seen..............................................It is important that we keep our previous learning in mind, or at least start from where we left last time... RegardsNeelam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 Thanx a lot neelamji for reminding the post. In this case restricting only to the CS Pateljis verse, Mercury and Venus being the Kharas, the following deviation is noted: 1. Mercury is not in own Kakshya 2. Astakvarga venus is havign a Bindu for Venus. I would like to discuss the applicability of the pateljis shloka. Whether at some charts, the application occurs again and again in every year , suppose if both the kharas are the same, as in my chart enumerated earlier. My objective is to get into more research into the prediction for deaths. I would request all to provide data with their date of death. Thanx & Regards On 03/11/2008, neelam gupta <neelamgupta07 wrote: Dear Sumit ji,Didn't we have the same discussion earlier in March where you were also involved. I am reproducing below message no. 8694 to refresh your memory. If the same principle has to be discussed, we should move ahead form the point where we left last time. This dictum was discussed and explained to you in detail at that time also. I reproduce one of my posts here which was addressed to you only (other posts in this thread may also be referred to) Dear Sumit ji and others,...Whenever Lord of 22nd drekana from Asc and 64th navamsha from Moon happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious bindu after 2 sodhanas are carried out and if that KAKSHYA happens to be owned by transiting planets, DEATH is unavoidable…. The above statement by CS Patel, is quite valid and even if not applicable verbatim, shows us a way to proceed. I've tried to test it with some cases with good rate of success...22nd Dreshkan from Ascendant and 64th navamsha from moon are two very sensitive points in a chart and hence their lords become sensitive also. Since they are related with 8th house, their affliction results in threat to life. Whenever these points/lords are afflicted, it results in inauspicious results depending upon the severity of affliction. When the affliction is seen in all the three areas: natal chart (promise), dasha (fructification) and transit (delivery) the event becomes almost certain to happen. Some of the factors causing affliction in natal chart could be: Malefics afflicting 22nd Dk and/or 64 navamsh 22dk lord (DkL) or 64 nav lord (NvL) placed in trik houses. Any PAC with lagna/LL with lagna/LL being afflicted Less/no benefic bindus in the sign and particularly in kaksha in which they're placed While in transit, the affliction is caused with: Malefics transiting the 22nd Dk and/or 64 navamsh 22dk lord or 64 nav lord going to trik houses in transit. Any PAC with lagna/LL with lagna/LL being afflicted These lords transiting over a sign and particularly in kaksha where they don't have a benefic point Transiting in signs/kakshas of marak/trik lords The affliction becomes very severe if the planets are activated in dasha/antar also. Here I am giving an example to show the event: This is the case of a lady who passed away on 18th Nov 2007 Her birth details are: 24.10.1938/8.51/Delh --- scorpio lagna with venus in lagna, jup in 3H, Sat in 5H, ket in 6H, LL mars in 11H, and a conjunction of Sun, moon, mercury and rahu in 12H. In this case 22nd DkL from ascendant as well as moon is Mer and 64 NvL from moon is venus and from asc is mars. While there were other indications also of death, if seen from the 22dkL and 64 nvL we observe the following: Dasha in operation: Dasha at the time of death was ve-mo-me In the natal chart: Mercury is, besides being 22DkL, is also 8L and 11L. Is badly afflicted in natal chart being in 12H with rahu. Venus is also marak being 7L and 12L placed in lagna (afflicts lagna) Mars is the lagna lord himself but also 6L in 11th house and also 64 NvL from ascendant. In the transit: Mercury is transiting over exact natal position in 12H, in kaksha of marak and MD lord Venus. It has no benefic bindu in this kaksha. Venus is transiting over natal LL in virgo, in it own kaksha, but has a bindu there (?) Was it required for venus to be strong (being a maraca) Mars is retrograde, transiting in 8H over 22nd dreshkan, also in kaksha of venus. Here again mars is in kaksha of venus but has a bindu there (?). Shall we again think the mars had to be strong to afflict the 8H. At the time of death, Moon is in aquarius, in exact conjunction with rahu and in trine to the natal rahu-moon conjunction. Mars, moon and mercury are in rahu's nakshatra and venus, the MD lord is in moon's nakshatra.Thus, the possibility of such an event is clearly seen.... ...........................................It is important that we keep our previous learning in mind, or at least start from where we left last time...RegardsNeelam -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593 astrosumitbajaj.blogspot.com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 Hi Death cannot be known, except by Mahadeva. regards partha On Sun, Nov 2, 2008 at 6:11 PM, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 wrote: Dear Friends, In case , you consider one khara planet ,it will repeat every year. One is required to consider both the khara 's together, for death or death like conditions to occur. This is a rare combination in a native's life and does not occur frequently. The million dollar question is: 1. If one planet becomes both Kharas 2. In Astakvarga system their are some differences in BPHS and Brihat Jatak.Which is to be followed? It is good that you wish ti do research on this . It may benefit all of us. Best regards, G.K.GOEL Sumit Bajaj <sumitbajaj2000 Sent: Sunday, 2 November, 2008 3:51:55 PM Re: Re:Khar planets this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the application of the rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned instances may occur even every year in the natives life. So the rule may not be absolute. This is the reason why i wanted the data for research. If anyone there please mail the same. On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Friends, Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology' had indicated (page 38): " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT KAKSHYA HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA , DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE' I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets. Regards, G.K.GOEL kiran.rama <kiran.rama (AT) (DOT) co.in>ancient_indian_ astrology Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM[ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Death Analysis: Research Data Required Dear Sumitji,There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen manyuse to correctly predict death.Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc onthe same ThanksKiranancient_indian_ astrology, " Sumit Bajaj " <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote: >> Dear All,> > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting> deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and> date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for > Accident i would also like to analyse.> > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided.> > -- > Sumit Bajaj> Contact: +91-98300-84593> astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com > Id: sumitbajaj2000> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Connect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 Sorry for bringing my own chart for analysis. Lets see through other examples which other group member may post. My objective of raising the Kharas and death analysis is only to sharpen the skill set on predicting dealths. I would request all others also to cite any example they have with whatever method they follow. Thanx & Regards On 03/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 wrote: Dear Bajaj ji , The personal consultations are not approved on this site. It is a sound policy. However your nativity raises a interesting aspect - that is when such transit will be effective. You have a chart of long life , this transit will give result after you attain the age of 72 years. Your birth time may be 10,02 PM . In that case Venus and Saturn will become Khara planets. Regards, G.K.GOELPh: 09350311433Add: L-409, SARITA VIHARNEW DELHI-110 076INDIA Sumit Bajaj <sumitbajaj2000 Monday, 3 November, 2008 9:54:41 AM Re: Re:Khar planets Lets us take an example... its my own chart... 7th april 1981, 9:58 PM , Kolkata In this case the lord of two kharas (lord of 64th navamsha to moon and lord of 22nd drekkana to asc) is both Venus only. So in this case the Venus will travel every year through a particular point. Whats this particular point i am still not able to understand. Please throw light on this. Thanx On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Friends, In case , you consider one khara planet ,it will repeat every year. One is required to consider both the khara 's together, for death or death like conditions to occur. This is a rare combination in a native's life and does not occur frequently. The million dollar question is: 1. If one planet becomes both Kharas 2. In Astakvarga system their are some differences in BPHS and Brihat Jatak.Which is to be followed? It is good that you wish ti do research on this . It may benefit all of us. Best regards, G.K.GOEL Sumit Bajaj <sumitbajaj2000@ gmail.com> ancient_indian_ astrology Sunday, 2 November, 2008 3:51:55 PMRe: [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re:Khar planets this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the application of the rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned instances may occur even every year in the natives life. So the rule may not be absolute. This is the reason why i wanted the data for research. If anyone there please mail the same. On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Friends, Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology' had indicated (page 38): " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an auspicious bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT KAKSHYA HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA , DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE' I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets. Regards, G.K.GOEL kiran.rama <kiran.rama (AT) (DOT) co.in> ancient_indian_ astrology Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM[ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Death Analysis: Research Data Required Dear Sumitji,There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen manyuse to correctly predict death.Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc on the sameThanksKiranancient_indian_ astrology, " Sumit Bajaj " <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote:>> Dear All,> > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting> deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and > date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for> Accident i would also like to analyse.> > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided.> > -- > Sumit Bajaj> Contact: +91-98300-84593> astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com> Id: sumitbajaj2000> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Connect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger. -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593 astrosumitbajaj.blogspot.com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 4, 2008 Report Share Posted November 4, 2008 The book is not there in the market. Its out of print as they say. If anyone has it, please let me know. Thanx & Regards On 02/11/2008, Bhaskar <rajiventerprises wrote: Vedic Numerology by Shri GV Chaudhary. Published by Bhartiya Vidya Bhuvan. How to calculate the birth date, date of marriage and the date of death are all illustrated with hundreds of examples. But one needs lot of intelligence & knowledge of astrological and astronomical levels to understand this book. I cannot understand it. best wishes, Bhaskar. , " Sumit Bajaj " <sumitbajaj2000 wrote: >> this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the application of the> rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned instances may occur> even every year in the natives life. So the rule may not be absolute. > > This is the reason why i wanted the data for research.> > If anyone there please mail the same.> > > On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel gkgoel1937 wrote: > >> > Dear Friends,> > Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology'> > had indicated (page 38):> > " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and > > the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the same planet> > or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point deprived of an> > auspicious> > bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out AND IF THAT > > KAKSHYA> > HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA ,> > DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE'> >> > I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by khara planets.> > Regards, > >> >> > G.K.GOEL> >> >> >> > ------------------------------> > ** kiran.rama kiran.rama > *To:* > > *Sent:* Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM> > *Subject:* Re: Death Analysis: Research Data> > Required> >> > Dear Sumitji,> >> > There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have seen many > > use to correctly predict death.> >> > Following your research, it could be good if you could post a doc on> > the same> >> > Thanks> > Kiran> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology<%40>, > > " Sumit Bajaj " > > <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote:> > >> > > Dear All,> > >> > > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for predicting > > > deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth details and> > > date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the reasons for> > > Accident i would also like to analyse. > > >> > > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided.> > >> > > --> > > Sumit Bajaj> > > Contact: +91-98300-84593> > > astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com > > > Id: sumitbajaj2000> > >> >> >> > ------------------------------> > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now.<http://in.rd./tagline_messenger_6/*http://messenger./invite/> > >> > > >> > > > -- > Sumit Bajaj> Contact: +91-98300-84593> astrosumitbajaj.blogspot.com > Id: sumitbajaj2000> -- Sumit BajajContact: +91-98300-84593 astrosumitbajaj.blogspot.com Id: sumitbajaj2000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 Some moer addition to prior mail.  TC Astrolearner --- On Wed, 12/11/08, Prashant Pandey <praspandey wrote: Prashant Pandey <praspandey [ind. & West. Astrology] Re:Khar planets Indian_Astrology_Group_Daily_Digest Wednesday, 12 November, 2008, 12:15 PM Dear Anthony, I am just writting thing in short, you will get the point. 9*7 + 1 = 64 But in following cases,, we are not getting desired value as multiple of 9 and adding 1. 9*4 = 36 9*8 = 72 9*10 + 6(not 9) = 96.... Now see the difference.. .. I am again saying 64'th Navamsa can not give death...it can only give death like suffering... .68'th will deffinitely give.... In detail i will write later in evening. Regs, Prashant Pandey Indian_Astrology_ Group_Daily_ Digest@grou ps.com, Anthony Goiche <anthony_goiche@ ...> wrote: > > Dear Prashant, >                     Why have you taken only those three Navamsa. >  > Anthony > > --- On Tue, 11/11/08, Prashant Pandey <praspandey@ ...> wrote: > > Prashant Pandey <praspandey@ ...> > [ind. & West. Astrology] Re:Khar planets > Indian_Astrology_ Group_Daily_ Digest@grou ps.com > Tuesday, 11 November, 2008, 11:23 AM Dear Shri Goel Ji, > > Please apply your " In equal house division method†here in > following things. > > 36'th Navamsa from the Moon's Navamsa is Karmabham. > 72'nd Navamsa from the Moon's Navamsa is Vainashika. > 96'th Navamsa from the Moon's Navamsa Is Manas. > > When Malefic planets transit through the above 3 Navamsa the native > suffers from Mental anguish, Loss of wealth, and such diseases which > give much physical pain. > > You will get my point. > > 64'th Navamsa can not give death (as i have checked further in > nadi),, it will only give mental suffering like death. Death will > occur only by 68'th Navamsa concept. > > Maharishi Parashara can not put his stamp on the 64’th Navamsa by > saying that it will give death. I am sure as I always find his > logics very very foolproof. We al read only distorted translation > not real slokas as Shri Narashimha ji has shown it by 7 chara- > karakas scheme slokas. > > There are also some points wrong in Nadi,, i will write if time will > come and if i will remain in astrology as i have to also leave this > one-day. > > Please think my logic behind accepting 68'th Navamsa and disproving > 64'th Navamsa concept for death ( not for mental anguish like death) > > If i get time to write in detail i will write more about 68’th > Navamsa with the help of Nadi. I think above thing is more then > enough for you to get the idea that,, what msg I am communicating > as your basics are very strong and you know from where the > astrological concepts are emerging. Whole astrology is logical like > the investment banking model of finance field. > > Eeven Mantra which we recite are also logical. I also have some clue > that how Mantra affects us, if I would be happy any day then I will > open its logic from my view point. > > Regs, > Prashant Pandey > > Indian_Astrology_ Group_Daily_ Digest@grou ps.com, Gopal > Goel <gkgoel1937@ ...> wrote: > > > > Dear Friends, > > In equal house division method , any Varga > > division falling on Bhava Madya of 8th house assumes > > death inflicting potential and such Varga signs assumes > > dosa which is known as Khar . > > THE 8 TH HOUSE IN EACH VARGA DOES HAVE  MALEFIC POTENTIAL > > FOR THE PORTFOLIO OF THAT VARGA AND SHOULD NOT BE UNDER ESTIMATED. > > > > If a planet is placed in 8th house in D-1 chart and is > simultaneously placed in 4th house in D-9 chart , only then it will > be > > called that such a planet is Placed  IN KHAR NAVAMSA.The Lords of > the signs which > > are placed in 8H in D-3 and 4H in D-9 are called Kharesh. > > This is my understanding. > > Regards, > > > >  G.K.GOEL > > Ph: 09350311433 > > Add: L-409, SARITA VIHAR > > NEW DELHI-110 076 > > INDIA > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > > Prashant Pandey <praspandey@ ...> > > Indian_Astrology_ Group_Daily_ Digest@grou ps.com > > Sunday, 9 November, 2008 7:06:45 PM > > [ind. & West. Astrology] Re:Khar planets > > > > > > Dear Friends, > > There is strong gap in the concept which has been > > provided by all Maharishis related to Khara planet. > > > > Navamsa is Rashi tulya and Rashi is Navamsa tulya,, > > then how the planet sitting in 4'th house or the lord of that > could > > be maraka according to concept illustrated in Navamsa. This > concept > > has also been endorsed by all of Maharishis not at the time of > > Navamsa but also at the time of Nadi concept they have enunciated > > this. > > > > If Navamsa is Rashi tulya then according to this 68'th Navamsa > > should do the work what 64'th Navamsa does. > > > > If anybody has endorsed this concept with some illustrations then > i > > am sure that he would have supported by Nks dashas(Mostly by Vim > > dasha even not by KCD) not by Rashi dasha and with the help of Sun > > as Sun is the karaka of Atman. > > > > 64'th Navamsa can give only mental sufferings like of death but > can > > not give death,, i have also cross-checked this by going further > in > > nadi.64'th Navamsa is connected with 8'th house(in D-1) and 4'th > > house(in D-9) but 68'th is connected both in Navamsa and also in D- > > 1,, with 8'th. > > > > 64'th Navamsa can not be fool-proof tool(Because Navamsa is Rashi > > tulya and Rashi is Navamsa tulya).If 64’th Navamsa is correct then > > concept “Navamsa is Rashi tulya and Rashi is Navamsa tulya†can > not > > function. > > > > Even it is looking that there is some error in 22'nd Drekkana > > concept but i have not cross checked it further with the help of > > Nadi,, if i will find it wrong and will find further its > alternative > > in D-3 then will post my views. > > > > For death,, Shoola chakra is the best tool and also its > conditional > > dasha give some reasonable reliability as it is connected with Sun > > also,, not with Nks only. > > > > I will show problem in 64’th Navamsa concept and working > capability > > of 68’th Navamsa with the examples of Smt. Indira Gandhi,, Shri > > Mahatma Gandhi and Nathu Ram Godse. I will illustrated it with the > > help of those examples because of some reasons as you already know > > why?? > > > > Regs, > > Prashant Pandey > > > > P.S.:- My Dear Friend friend Million dollar question is some thing > > else,, it is not that which you are thinking. > > > > --- In > > Indian_Astrology_ Group_Daily_ Digest@grou > ps.com, " sheevani147 " > > <sheevani147@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Goel ji, > > > > > > Namaste.. > > > > > > The lord of the 64th navamsha is Mars and the lord of the 22nd > > > drekkhana is also Mars by Parashara,Somanatha ,and Jagannatha > > > calculations and shani and rahu by Parivitti-tarya calucations > in > > my > > > rashi chart. > > > > > > The house with the least astavarga point is the 4H pisces,, and > > Mars > > > deposits only 1 bindu in that house all other planets deposit 3- > 5 > > > hindus in this house.. > > > > > > Would I be correct to predict that when Mars is in the 4H > pisces, > > > that is a time I need to be very vigilant.. or shud I be on the > > > lookout during mars transit into cancer(placement in rashi chart) > > > which is my 8 h from lagna and 4 h from moon..( which by recent > > > experience has been a difficult one) > > > > > > How do the dasha effects fit into this? > > > > > > I would be happy to share my birth details, shoud you require > > them.. > > > > > > warmest regards > > > Sheevani > > > > > > > > > Indian_Astrology_ Group_Daily_ Digest@grou ps.com, > Gopal > > > Goel <gkgoel1937@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Friends, > > > > In case , you consider one khara planet ,it will > > > > repeat every year. > > > > One is required to consider both the khara 's together, > > > > for death or death like conditions to occur. This is a rare > > > > combination in a native's life and does not occur frequently. > > > >  > > > > The million dollar question is: > > > > 1. If one planet becomes both Kharas > > > > 2. In Astakvarga system their are  some differences in > > > >   BPHS and Brihat Jatak.Which is to  be followed? > > > >  > > > > It is good that you wish ti do research on this . It may > benefit > > > all of us. > > > > Best regards, > > > >  > > > > G.K.GOEL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > > > > Sumit Bajaj <sumitbajaj2000@ > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology > > > > Sunday, 2 November, 2008 3:51:55 PM > > > > Re: [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re:Khar planets > > > > > > > > > > > > this is a very good rule i have found out. However, the > > application > > > of the rule is yet to be found out from my side. The mentioned > > > instances may occur even every year in the natives life. So the > > rule > > > may not be absolute. > > > > > > > > This is the reason why i wanted the data for research. > > > > > > > > If anyone there please mail the same. > > > > > > > >  > > > > On 02/11/2008, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937@ . co.in> wrote: > > > > Dear Friends, > > > > Mr. C.S PATEL in his book 'Navamsa in Astrology' > > > > had indicated (page 38): > > > >  " Whenever the lord of the 22nd Drekkana from Lagna and > > > >     the Lord of the 64th navamsa from Moon happen to be the > > > same planet > > > >     or when those two Kharas happen to transit a point > > > deprived of an auspicious > > > >     bindu in Astakavarga after two Sodhana are carried out > AND > > > IF THAT KAKSHYA > > > >     HAPPENS TO BE OWNED BY THE TRANSITING KHARA , > > > >     DEATH IS UNAVOIDABLE' > > > > > > > > I hope this will help you the damage which can be done by > khara > > > planets. > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > G.K.GOEL > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > > > > kiran.rama <kiran.rama@ . co.in> > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology > > > > Sunday, 2 November, 2008 1:53:22 PM > > > > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Death Analysis: > > Research > > > Data Required > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sumitji, > > > > > > > > There is something about the 64th navamsa lord that I have > seen > > many > > > > use to correctly predict death. > > > > > > > > Following your research, it could be good if you could post a > > doc on > > > > the same > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > Kiran > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " Sumit > Bajaj " > > > > <sumitbajaj2000@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear All, > > > > > > > > > > Just wanted to research the astrological reasons for > predicting > > > > > deaths. If anyone has the data of people with their birth > > details > > > and > > > > > date of death and reason for death (if possible). Also the > > > reasons for > > > > > Accident i would also like to analyse. > > > > > > > > > > I will be very grateful if the same may be provided. > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Sumit Bajaj > > > > > Contact: +91-98300-84593 > > > > > astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com > > > > > Id: sumitbajaj2000 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Sumit Bajaj > > > > Contact: +91-98300-84593 > > > > astrosumitbajaj. blogspot. com > > > > Id: sumitbajaj2000 > > > > > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > > > http://messenger. / invite/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > http://messenger. / invite/ > > > > > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger. / invite/ > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger./invite/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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