Guest guest Posted December 25, 2007 Report Share Posted December 25, 2007 Dear Sreenadh, Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames the grey area? Like mercury is exalted only in first > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If it > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because as per > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that people who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory explanation > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is EFFECTIVELY debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours in Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign would apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? Settle this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we wait till we touch Sign Base! RK , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " <jyothi_b_lakshmi wrote: > > Dear Srinadhji, > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in understanding. > > Regards, > Jyothi > > , " Sreenadh " > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji, > > Exaltation means " Sign of Exaltation " . If Sun is in Aries, > where > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 degree (i.e. > 9.00 > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep exaltation > degree > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets > regarding > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation debilitation > > degrees. > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept of > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note that > none > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=) Yes, > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal chart > reading > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but please > don't > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it in detail > > later when we speak about " Sign Base " result derivation techniques > used > > in 7-fold. > > Love and regards, > > Sreenadh > > --- In , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji, > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted after reading > > > from some books that such planets will behave as debilated. > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within which a > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted only in > first > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If it > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because as per > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that people > who > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory explanation > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can go by their > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. Anyway, I think > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the texts. > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:). > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > Jyothi > > > > > > , " vinita kumar " > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh, > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving conclusions. the > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that they are > > > > localised and may not be universal. > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information from here > and > > > > there rather than from systematic research or readings of > original > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to these > statements. > > > > there are several places where i have come across the statement > > > that > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated planet...but one > has > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is evident > from > > > > the following message: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7 > > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer with 14 > > > academic > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 he also co- > > > > founded > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said > > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the exalted > point > > > > back > > > > > wards and weak if after it > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or even 2 Deg > > > Makara > > > > it > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in kataka > treat > > > > it as > > > > > neeca retro > > > > > and so on<== > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-38/93 > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write-up at: > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-38/93 > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A Rupa > consists > > > > of 60 > > > > Shashtiamsas. > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the largest > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. At 5 > degrees > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 Shashtiamsas or a > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points ( > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ). > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One rupa or 60 > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it occupies its > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero Oochabala. > There > > > is > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the Debilitation > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point ( Ucchabhaga ) , > until > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the Oochabhaga. > Conversely, > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the Exaltation > Point > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached at the > > > > Debilitation Point > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) . > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's longitude and you > get > > > > the > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct it from > 360 > > > > degrees & > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the Oocchabala of the > > > > planet. > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point) * > 60/180 > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 <== > > > > > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming > neechabala > > > on > > > > account of retrogression... > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it should be > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? But then it has > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it should, going by > > > the > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!! > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u r a > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!) > > > > > > > > love, > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > --- In > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji, > > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as debilated. But if I > am > > > > to > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted retro in > 4th) > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the baby stages > of > > > > ones > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 certificates of > Kerala > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last phase of > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted retro can > > > give > > > > > excellent results. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Sreenadh " > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > > > > ==> > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving good > results. > > > > > > <== > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! Retrograde > planets > > > in > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated?!! I don't > think > > > > so. > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a benefic > will > > > > > surely give > > > > > > excellent good results. > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a malefic > then > > > > will > > > > > give > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will cause much > > > > unwantered > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and suffering during > its > > > > > desa as > > > > > > well. > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna - > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th house > from > > > > Taurus > > > > > > Lagna > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & Leghu > > > Jataka > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn CANNOT give > the > > > > full > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in 6th > > > > debilitated > > > > > from > > > > > > 12th from Tarus). > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect " a fairly > > > good > > > > > period " > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the continuation of > > > the > > > > > results > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some special > good > > > > > results > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator of 10th > house, > > > > owns > > > > > 10th > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating service. Thus > a > > > > > native in > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial results of > > > Saturn > > > > > during > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact that it gives > too > > > > much > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much delay only > > > > etc - > > > > > the > > > > > > period can be said only as providing " fairly good results " > and > > > > not > > > > > > excellent. > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be > considered > > > as > > > > in > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet! > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2007 Report Share Posted December 25, 2007 Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji, Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and for all settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how I made such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say " Mercury is exalted in first 15 degrees of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep exaltation point " . The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 degrees and out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation. So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do let me know. Regards, Jyothi , " arkaydash " <arkaydash wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames the grey > area? > > Like mercury is exalted only in first > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If it > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because as per > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that people > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory explanation > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is EFFECTIVELY > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours in > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign would > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? Settle > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we wait > till we touch Sign Base! > > RK > > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > Dear Srinadhji, > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in understanding. > > > > Regards, > > Jyothi > > > > , " Sreenadh " > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji, > > > Exaltation means " Sign of Exaltation " . If Sun is in Aries, > > where > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 degree > (i.e. > > 9.00 > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep exaltation > > degree > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets > > regarding > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation > debilitation > > > degrees. > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept of > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note that > > none > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=) Yes, > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal chart > > reading > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but please > > don't > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it in > detail > > > later when we speak about " Sign Base " result derivation > techniques > > used > > > in 7-fold. > > > Love and regards, > > > Sreenadh > > > --- In > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji, > > > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted after > reading > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as debilated. > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within which a > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted only in > > first > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If it > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because as > per > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that people > > who > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory explanation > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can go by > their > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. Anyway, I think > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the texts. > > > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:). > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > , " vinita kumar " > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving conclusions. > the > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that they are > > > > > localised and may not be universal. > > > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information from > here > > and > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or readings of > > original > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to these > > statements. > > > > > there are several places where i have come across the > statement > > > > that > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated planet...but > one > > has > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is evident > > from > > > > > the following message: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7 > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer with 14 > > > > academic > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 he also > co- > > > > > founded > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said > > > > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the exalted > > point > > > > > back > > > > > > wards and weak if after it > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or even 2 Deg > > > > Makara > > > > > it > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in kataka > > treat > > > > > it as > > > > > > neeca retro > > > > > > and so on<== > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-38/93 > > > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write-up at: > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-38/93 > > > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A Rupa > > consists > > > > > of 60 > > > > > Shashtiamsas. > > > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the largest > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. At 5 > > degrees > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 Shashtiamsas or > a > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points ( > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ). > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One rupa or 60 > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it occupies > its > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero Oochabala. > > There > > > > is > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the > Debilitation > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point ( Ucchabhaga ) , > > until > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the Oochabhaga. > > Conversely, > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the Exaltation > > Point > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached at the > > > > > Debilitation Point > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) . > > > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's longitude and > you > > get > > > > > the > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct it from > > 360 > > > > > degrees & > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the Oocchabala of > the > > > > > planet. > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point) * > > 60/180 > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 <== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming > > neechabala > > > > on > > > > > account of retrogression... > > > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it should be > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? But then it > has > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it should, going > by > > > > the > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!! > > > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u r a > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!) > > > > > > > > > > love, > > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as debilated. But if > I > > am > > > > > to > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted retro > in > > 4th) > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the baby > stages > > of > > > > > ones > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 certificates of > > Kerala > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last phase > of > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted retro > can > > > > give > > > > > > excellent results. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " Sreenadh " > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > > > > > ==> > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving good > > results. > > > > > > > <== > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! Retrograde > > planets > > > > in > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated?!! I don't > > think > > > > > so. > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a benefic > > will > > > > > > surely give > > > > > > > excellent good results. > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a malefic > > then > > > > > will > > > > > > give > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will cause much > > > > > unwantered > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and suffering > during > > its > > > > > > desa as > > > > > > > well. > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna - > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th house > > from > > > > > Taurus > > > > > > > Lagna > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & Leghu > > > > Jataka > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn CANNOT > give > > the > > > > > full > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in 6th > > > > > debilitated > > > > > > from > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus). > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect " a > fairly > > > > good > > > > > > period " > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the continuation > of > > > > the > > > > > > results > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some > special > > good > > > > > > results > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator of 10th > > house, > > > > > owns > > > > > > 10th > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating service. > Thus > > a > > > > > > native in > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial results of > > > > Saturn > > > > > > during > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact that it > gives > > too > > > > > much > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much delay > only > > > > > etc - > > > > > > the > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing " fairly good > results " > > and > > > > > not > > > > > > > excellent. > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be > > considered > > > > as > > > > > in > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet! > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2007 Report Share Posted December 25, 2007 Dear RK ji, Exaltation means " Sign of Exaltation " . Considering the whole sign as exaltation is NOT 'my' opinian - but of Daksha Prajapati as he puts it in Brihat Prajaptya; and I love to agree with the sages, especially when it is they who created this system. Read the mail again - I never mentioned that retrograde will make any planet debilitated or even similar to debilitated. Exalted planet is 'Exalted'; And the planet in 'deep exaltation degree' is in 'deep exaltation' - that is all to it. Straight and simple. Love and regards, Sreenadh , " arkaydash " <arkaydash wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames the grey > area? > > Like mercury is exalted only in first > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If it > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because as per > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that people > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory explanation > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is EFFECTIVELY > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours in > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign would > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? Settle > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we wait > till we touch Sign Base! > > RK > > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > Dear Srinadhji, > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in understanding. > > > > Regards, > > Jyothi > > > > , " Sreenadh " > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji, > > > Exaltation means " Sign of Exaltation " . If Sun is in Aries, > > where > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 degree > (i.e. > > 9.00 > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep exaltation > > degree > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets > > regarding > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation > debilitation > > > degrees. > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept of > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note that > > none > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=) Yes, > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal chart > > reading > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but please > > don't > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it in > detail > > > later when we speak about " Sign Base " result derivation > techniques > > used > > > in 7-fold. > > > Love and regards, > > > Sreenadh > > > --- In > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji, > > > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted after > reading > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as debilated. > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within which a > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted only in > > first > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If it > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because as > per > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that people > > who > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory explanation > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can go by > their > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. Anyway, I think > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the texts. > > > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:). > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > , " vinita kumar " > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving conclusions. > the > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that they are > > > > > localised and may not be universal. > > > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information from > here > > and > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or readings of > > original > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to these > > statements. > > > > > there are several places where i have come across the > statement > > > > that > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated planet...but > one > > has > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is evident > > from > > > > > the following message: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7 > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer with 14 > > > > academic > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 he also > co- > > > > > founded > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said > > > > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the exalted > > point > > > > > back > > > > > > wards and weak if after it > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or even 2 Deg > > > > Makara > > > > > it > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in kataka > > treat > > > > > it as > > > > > > neeca retro > > > > > > and so on<== > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-38/93 > > > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write-up at: > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-38/93 > > > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A Rupa > > consists > > > > > of 60 > > > > > Shashtiamsas. > > > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the largest > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. At 5 > > degrees > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 Shashtiamsas or > a > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points ( > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ). > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One rupa or 60 > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it occupies > its > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero Oochabala. > > There > > > > is > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the > Debilitation > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point ( Ucchabhaga ) , > > until > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the Oochabhaga. > > Conversely, > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the Exaltation > > Point > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached at the > > > > > Debilitation Point > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) . > > > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's longitude and > you > > get > > > > > the > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct it from > > 360 > > > > > degrees & > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the Oocchabala of > the > > > > > planet. > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point) * > > 60/180 > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 <== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming > > neechabala > > > > on > > > > > account of retrogression... > > > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it should be > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? But then it > has > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it should, going > by > > > > the > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!! > > > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u r a > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!) > > > > > > > > > > love, > > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as debilated. But if > I > > am > > > > > to > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted retro > in > > 4th) > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the baby > stages > > of > > > > > ones > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 certificates of > > Kerala > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last phase > of > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted retro > can > > > > give > > > > > > excellent results. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " Sreenadh " > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > > > > > ==> > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving good > > results. > > > > > > > <== > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! Retrograde > > planets > > > > in > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated?!! I don't > > think > > > > > so. > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a benefic > > will > > > > > > surely give > > > > > > > excellent good results. > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a malefic > > then > > > > > will > > > > > > give > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will cause much > > > > > unwantered > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and suffering > during > > its > > > > > > desa as > > > > > > > well. > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna - > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th house > > from > > > > > Taurus > > > > > > > Lagna > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & Leghu > > > > Jataka > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn CANNOT > give > > the > > > > > full > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in 6th > > > > > debilitated > > > > > > from > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus). > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect " a > fairly > > > > good > > > > > > period " > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the continuation > of > > > > the > > > > > > results > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some > special > > good > > > > > > results > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator of 10th > > house, > > > > > owns > > > > > > 10th > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating service. > Thus > > a > > > > > > native in > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial results of > > > > Saturn > > > > > > during > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact that it > gives > > too > > > > > much > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much delay > only > > > > > etc - > > > > > > the > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing " fairly good > results " > > and > > > > > not > > > > > > > excellent. > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be > > considered > > > > as > > > > > in > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet! > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2007 Report Share Posted December 25, 2007 Dear Jyothi ji, I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or even I may not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is due to this very fact that I always request people to depend on the "originals", i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts. Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but the opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts it in Brihat Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha vyakhya of Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the best reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas. By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is one of the worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a practical astrologer. :=) Love and regards,Sreenadh , "jyothi_b_lakshmi" <jyothi_b_lakshmi wrote:>> Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji,> > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and for all > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how I made > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna Jataka > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say "Mercury is exalted in first 15 degrees > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep exaltation point". > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 degrees and > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation.> > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do let me > know.> > Regards,> Jyothi > > > > > > > , "arkaydash" > arkaydash@ wrote:> >> > Dear Sreenadh,> > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames the grey > > area?> > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first> > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this> > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If it> > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because as > per> > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that people> > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory explanation> > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused.> > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is EFFECTIVELY > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours in > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign would > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? Settle > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we wait > > till we touch Sign Base!> > > > RK> > > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi" > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Srinadhji,> > > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in > understanding.> > > > > > Regards,> > > Jyothi> > > > > > , "Sreenadh" > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > >> > > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji,> > > > Exaltation means "Sign of Exaltation". If Sun is in Aries, > > > where> > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 degree > > (i.e. > > > 9.00> > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep > exaltation > > > degree> > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets > > > regarding> > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation > > debilitation> > > > degrees.> > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept > of> > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note > that > > > none> > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=) > Yes, > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal chart > > > reading> > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but please > > > don't> > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it in > > detail> > > > later when we speak about "Sign Base" result derivation > > techniques > > > used> > > > in 7-fold. > > > > Love and regards,> > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear Vinithaji,> > > > >> > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted after > > reading> > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as debilated.> > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within which > a> > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted only > in > > > first> > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this> > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If > it> > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because > as > > per> > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that > people > > > who> > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > explanation> > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can go by > > their> > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. Anyway, I > think> > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the > texts.> > > > >> > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:).> > > > >> > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > Jyothi> > > > >> > > > > , "vinita > kumar"> > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh,> > > > > >> > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving > conclusions. > > the> > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that they > are> > > > > > localised and may not be universal.> > > > > >> > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information from > > here > > > and> > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or readings of > > > original> > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to these > > > statements.> > > > > > there are several places where i have come across the > > statement> > > > > that> > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated planet...but > > one > > > has> > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is > evident > > > from> > > > > > the following message:> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7> > > > > > >> > > > > > > ==>Milan> > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer with 14> > > > > academic> > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 he also > > co-> > > > > > founded> > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said> > > > > > >> > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the > exalted > > > point> > > > > > back> > > > > > > wards and weak if after it> > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or even 2 > Deg> > > > > Makara> > > > > > it> > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in > kataka > > > treat> > > > > > it as> > > > > > > neeca retro> > > > > > > and so on<==> > > > > > >> > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-38/93> > > > > >> > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write-up at:> > > > > >> > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-38/93> > > > > >> > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A Rupa > > > consists> > > > > > of 60> > > > > > Shashtiamsas.> > > > > >> > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala> > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the > largest> > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. At 5 > > > degrees> > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 Shashtiamsas > or > > a> > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points ( > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ).> > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One rupa or > 60> > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it > occupies > > its> > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero Oochabala. > > > There> > > > > is> > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the > > Debilitation> > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point ( > Ucchabhaga ) , > > > until> > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the Oochabhaga. > > > Conversely,> > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the > Exaltation > > > Point> > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached at the> > > > > > Debilitation Point> > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) .> > > > > >> > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's longitude and > > you > > > get> > > > > > the> > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct it > from > > > 360> > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the Oocchabala > of > > the> > > > > > planet.> > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala> > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point) * > > > 60/180> > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 <==> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming > > > neechabala> > > > > on> > > > > > account of retrogression...> > > > > >> > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it should be> > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? But then > it > > has> > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it should, > going > > by> > > > > the> > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!!> > > > > >> > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u r a> > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!)> > > > > >> > > > > > love,> > > > > > vinita> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji,> > > > > > >> > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as debilated. But > if > > I > > > am> > > > > > to> > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted retro > > in > > > 4th)> > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the baby > > stages > > > of> > > > > > ones> > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 certificates > of > > > Kerala> > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last > phase > > of> > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted retro > > can> > > > > give> > > > > > > excellent results.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > , "Sreenadh"> > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji,> > > > > > > > ==>> > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving good > > > results.> > > > > > > > <==> > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! Retrograde > > > planets> > > > > in> > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated?!! I > don't > > > think> > > > > > so.> > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > benefic > > > will> > > > > > > surely give> > > > > > > > excellent good results.> > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > malefic > > > then> > > > > > will> > > > > > > give> > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will cause much> > > > > > unwantered> > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and suffering > > during > > > its> > > > > > > desa as> > > > > > > > well.> > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna -> > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th > house > > > from> > > > > > Taurus> > > > > > > > Lagna> > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & > Leghu> > > > > Jataka> > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn CANNOT > > give > > > the> > > > > > full> > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in 6th> > > > > > debilitated> > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus).> > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect "a > > fairly> > > > > good> > > > > > > period"> > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the > continuation > > of> > > > > the> > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some > > special > > > good> > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator of 10th > > > house,> > > > > > owns> > > > > > > 10th> > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating service. > > Thus > > > a> > > > > > > native in> > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial results > of> > > > > Saturn> > > > > > > during> > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact that it > > gives > > > too> > > > > > much> > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much delay > > only> > > > > > etc -> > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing "fairly good > > results" > > > and> > > > > > not> > > > > > > > excellent.> > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be > > > considered> > > > > as> > > > > > in> > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet!> > > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2007 Report Share Posted December 25, 2007 Dear Sir, You may be right. I just assumed the popular authors to be correct as there are rare chances of their interpretation going wrong. I checked books by other authors, NE Muthuswamy has also said the same(Merucury is exalted within 15 degrees, 16-20-Moola trikona and the rest swakshetra). So I thought I will ensure about that. Thank you for clarifying that exalted retro is not equal to debilated. Regards, Jyothi , " Sreenadh " <sreesog wrote: > > Dear Jyothi ji, > I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or even I may > not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is due to this > very fact that I always request people to depend on the " originals " , > i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts. > Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but the > opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts it in Brihat > Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha vyakhya of > Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the best > reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas. > By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is one of the > worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a practical > astrologer. :=) > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji, > > > > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and for all > > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how I made > > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna Jataka > > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say " Mercury is exalted in first 15 degrees > > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep exaltation point " . > > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 degrees and > > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation. > > > > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do let me > > know. > > > > Regards, > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " arkaydash " > > arkaydash@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames the grey > > > area? > > > > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If it > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because as > > per > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that people > > > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory explanation > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. > > > > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted > > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is EFFECTIVELY > > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours in > > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign would > > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? Settle > > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we wait > > > till we touch Sign Base! > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > --- In , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, > > > > > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in > > understanding. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > , " Sreenadh " > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji, > > > > > Exaltation means " Sign of Exaltation " . If Sun is in Aries, > > > > where > > > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 degree > > > (i.e. > > > > 9.00 > > > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep > > exaltation > > > > degree > > > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets > > > > regarding > > > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation > > > debilitation > > > > > degrees. > > > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept > > of > > > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note > > that > > > > none > > > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=) > > Yes, > > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal chart > > > > reading > > > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but please > > > > don't > > > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it in > > > detail > > > > > later when we speak about " Sign Base " result derivation > > > techniques > > > > used > > > > > in 7-fold. > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > --- In > > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted after > > > reading > > > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as debilated. > > > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within which > > a > > > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted only > > in > > > > first > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after this > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? If > > it > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because > > as > > > per > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that > > people > > > > who > > > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > > explanation > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can go by > > > their > > > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. Anyway, I > > think > > > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the > > texts. > > > > > > > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:). > > > > > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > , " vinita > > kumar " > > > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving > > conclusions. > > > the > > > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that they > > are > > > > > > > localised and may not be universal. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information from > > > here > > > > and > > > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or readings of > > > > original > > > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to these > > > > statements. > > > > > > > there are several places where i have come across the > > > statement > > > > > > that > > > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated planet...but > > > one > > > > has > > > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is > > evident > > > > from > > > > > > > the following message: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan > > > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer with 14 > > > > > > academic > > > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 he also > > > co- > > > > > > > founded > > > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the > > exalted > > > > point > > > > > > > back > > > > > > > > wards and weak if after it > > > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or even 2 > > Deg > > > > > > Makara > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in > > kataka > > > > treat > > > > > > > it as > > > > > > > > neeca retro > > > > > > > > and so on<== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology- 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write-up at: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology- 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A Rupa > > > > consists > > > > > > > of 60 > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala > > > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the > > largest > > > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. At 5 > > > > degrees > > > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 Shashtiamsas > > or > > > a > > > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points ( > > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ). > > > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One rupa or > > 60 > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it > > occupies > > > its > > > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero Oochabala. > > > > There > > > > > > is > > > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the > > > Debilitation > > > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point ( > > Ucchabhaga ) , > > > > until > > > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the Oochabhaga. > > > > Conversely, > > > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the > > Exaltation > > > > Point > > > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached at the > > > > > > > Debilitation Point > > > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's longitude and > > > you > > > > get > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct it > > from > > > > 360 > > > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the Oocchabala > > of > > > the > > > > > > > planet. > > > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala > > > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point) * > > > > 60/180 > > > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 <== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming > > > > neechabala > > > > > > on > > > > > > > account of retrogression... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it should be > > > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? But then > > it > > > has > > > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it should, > > going > > > by > > > > > > the > > > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u r a > > > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love, > > > > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as debilated. But > > if > > > I > > > > am > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted retro > > > in > > > > 4th) > > > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the baby > > > stages > > > > of > > > > > > > ones > > > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 certificates > > of > > > > Kerala > > > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last > > phase > > > of > > > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted retro > > > can > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > excellent results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > , " Sreenadh " > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > > > > > > > ==> > > > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving good > > > > results. > > > > > > > > > <== > > > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! Retrograde > > > > planets > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated?!! I > > don't > > > > think > > > > > > > so. > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > benefic > > > > will > > > > > > > > surely give > > > > > > > > > excellent good results. > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > malefic > > > > then > > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will cause much > > > > > > > unwantered > > > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and suffering > > > during > > > > its > > > > > > > > desa as > > > > > > > > > well. > > > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna - > > > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th > > house > > > > from > > > > > > > Taurus > > > > > > > > > Lagna > > > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & > > Leghu > > > > > > Jataka > > > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn CANNOT > > > give > > > > the > > > > > > > full > > > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in 6th > > > > > > > debilitated > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus). > > > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect " a > > > fairly > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > period " > > > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the > > continuation > > > of > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some > > > special > > > > good > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator of 10th > > > > house, > > > > > > > owns > > > > > > > > 10th > > > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating service. > > > Thus > > > > a > > > > > > > > native in > > > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial results > > of > > > > > > Saturn > > > > > > > > during > > > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact that it > > > gives > > > > too > > > > > > > much > > > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much delay > > > only > > > > > > > etc - > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing " fairly good > > > results " > > > > and > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > excellent. > > > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be > > > > considered > > > > > > as > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet! > > > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 26, 2007 Report Share Posted December 26, 2007 Dear Jyoti ji, NE Muthuswami was a good friend of me, and I am thankful to him for publishing many of my books as well. But I know well that Muthuswami sir learned astrology after his retirement, by listening to the classes conducted through his own efforts as well near Ayurveda collage, and the classes were taken by my guru P.R.Nambyar. (Many popular astrolgers of trivandrum such as Dharmaraja Iyer, Krishnan Nair, Attukal Radhakrishnan and many more are all the students of PR Nambyar sir only) Muthuswamy sir being a far elderly person than Nambyar sir, and also because Muthuswami sir knew Sanskrit fairly well by then, he never publically mentioned that he learned astrology in this way, and also by reading books, and NEITHR from a practical astrologer NOR by practicing astrology. Thus for sure anyone who are trying to learn astrology through his books are in a mess. Muthuswamy sir is revered as a good organizer/coordinator, publisher of books, author of a Jyotisha Nikhandu, as one who transilated many books from Sanskrit and Hindi to Malayalam; but NOT as a practical astrologer, who has practical knowledge about when/where/how to USE/APPLY the information given in the ancient texts. Being an individual who was in close contact with NE Mutuswamy sir, with full regard and reverence, but with sincerity, I can say it. Sunil ji was a student of Mutuswami sir for some time, and he too can share some info regarding this - confirming or negating my opinion. Hope this helps.Love and regards,Sreenadh , "jyothi_b_lakshmi" <jyothi_b_lakshmi wrote:>> Dear Sir,> > You may be right. I just assumed the popular authors to be correct as > there are rare chances of their interpretation going wrong. I checked > books by other authors, NE Muthuswamy has also said the same(Merucury > is exalted within 15 degrees, 16-20-Moola trikona and the rest > swakshetra). So I thought I will ensure about that. Thank you for > clarifying that exalted retro is not equal to debilated. > > Regards,> Jyothi> > , "Sreenadh" > sreesog@ wrote:> >> > Dear Jyothi ji,> > I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or even > I may> > not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is due to > this> > very fact that I always request people to depend on the "originals",> > i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts.> > Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but the> > opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts it in > Brihat> > Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha vyakhya of> > Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the best> > reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas.> > By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is one of > the> > worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a practical> > astrologer. :=)> > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji,> > >> > > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and for all> > > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how I made> > > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna Jataka> > > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say "Mercury is exalted in first 15 > degrees> > > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep exaltation > point".> > > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 degrees > and> > > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation.> > >> > > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do let me> > > know.> > >> > > Regards,> > > Jyothi> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > , "arkaydash"> > > arkaydash@ wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames the > grey> > > > area?> > > >> > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first> > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after > this> > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? > If it> > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because > as> > > per> > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that > people> > > > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > explanation> > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused.> > > >> > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted> > > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is > EFFECTIVELY> > > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours in> > > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > >> > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign > would> > > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? > Settle> > > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we > wait> > > > till we touch Sign Base!> > > >> > > > RK> > > >> > > >> > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear Srinadhji,> > > > >> > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in> > > understanding.> > > > >> > > > > Regards,> > > > > Jyothi> > > > >> > > > > , "Sreenadh"> > > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji,> > > > > > Exaltation means "Sign of Exaltation". If Sun is in Aries,> > > > > where> > > > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 > degree> > > > (i.e.> > > > > 9.00> > > > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep> > > exaltation> > > > > degree> > > > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets> > > > > regarding> > > > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation> > > > debilitation> > > > > > degrees.> > > > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept> > > of> > > > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note> > > that> > > > > none> > > > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=)> > > Yes,> > > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal > chart> > > > > reading> > > > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but > please> > > > > don't> > > > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it in> > > > detail> > > > > > later when we speak about "Sign Base" result derivation> > > > techniques> > > > > used> > > > > > in 7-fold. > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > --- In> > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji,> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted after> > > > reading> > > > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as > debilated.> > > > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within > which> > > a> > > > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted > only> > > in> > > > > first> > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after > this> > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? > If> > > it> > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, > because> > > as> > > > per> > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that> > > people> > > > > who> > > > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory> > > explanation> > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can go > by> > > > their> > > > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. Anyway, I> > > think> > > > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the> > > texts.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:).> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > >> > > > > > > , "vinita> > > kumar"> > > > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh,> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving> > > conclusions.> > > > the> > > > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that > they> > > are> > > > > > > > localised and may not be universal.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information > from> > > > here> > > > > and> > > > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or readings > of> > > > > original> > > > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to these> > > > > statements.> > > > > > > > there are several places where i have come across the> > > > statement> > > > > > > that> > > > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated > planet...but> > > > one> > > > > has> > > > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is> > > evident> > > > > from> > > > > > > > the following message:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > ==>Milan> > > > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer > with 14> > > > > > > academic> > > > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 he > also> > > > co-> > > > > > > > founded> > > > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the> > > exalted> > > > > point> > > > > > > > back> > > > > > > > > wards and weak if after it> > > > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or even > 2> > > Deg> > > > > > > Makara> > > > > > > > it> > > > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in> > > kataka> > > > > treat> > > > > > > > it as> > > > > > > > > neeca retro> > > > > > > > > and so on<==> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-> 38/93> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write-up > at:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-> 38/93> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A > Rupa> > > > > consists> > > > > > > > of 60> > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala> > > > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the> > > largest> > > > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. > At 5> > > > > degrees> > > > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 > Shashtiamsas> > > or> > > > a> > > > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points (> > > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ).> > > > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One rupa > or> > > 60> > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it> > > occupies> > > > its> > > > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero > Oochabala.> > > > > There> > > > > > > is> > > > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the> > > > Debilitation> > > > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point (> > > Ucchabhaga ) ,> > > > > until> > > > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the Oochabhaga.> > > > > Conversely,> > > > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the> > > Exaltation> > > > > Point> > > > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached > at the> > > > > > > > Debilitation Point> > > > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) .> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's longitude > and> > > > you> > > > > get> > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct it> > > from> > > > > 360> > > > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the > Oocchabala> > > of> > > > the> > > > > > > > planet.> > > > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala> > > > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > Point) *> > > > > 60/180> > > > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 > <==> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming> > > > > neechabala> > > > > > > on> > > > > > > > account of retrogression...> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it > should be> > > > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? But > then> > > it> > > > has> > > > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it should,> > > going> > > > by> > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!!> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u r > a> > > > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!)> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > love,> > > > > > > > vinita> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > --- In> > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji,> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as debilated. > But> > > if> > > > I> > > > > am> > > > > > > > to> > > > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted > retro> > > > in> > > > > 4th)> > > > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the baby> > > > stages> > > > > of> > > > > > > > ones> > > > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 > certificates> > > of> > > > > Kerala> > > > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last> > > phase> > > > of> > > > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted > retro> > > > can> > > > > > > give> > > > > > > > > excellent results.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > --- In> > > , "Sreenadh"> > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji,> > > > > > > > > > ==>> > > > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving > good> > > > > results.> > > > > > > > > > <==> > > > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! Retrograde> > > > > planets> > > > > > > in> > > > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated?!! I> > > don't> > > > > think> > > > > > > > so.> > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a> > > benefic> > > > > will> > > > > > > > > surely give> > > > > > > > > > excellent good results.> > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a> > > malefic> > > > > then> > > > > > > > will> > > > > > > > > give> > > > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will cause > much> > > > > > > > unwantered> > > > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and suffering> > > > during> > > > > its> > > > > > > > > desa as> > > > > > > > > > well.> > > > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna -> > > > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th> > > house> > > > > from> > > > > > > > Taurus> > > > > > > > > > Lagna> > > > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & > > > Leghu> > > > > > > Jataka> > > > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn > CANNOT> > > > give> > > > > the> > > > > > > > full> > > > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in > 6th> > > > > > > > debilitated> > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus).> > > > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect "a> > > > fairly> > > > > > > good> > > > > > > > > period"> > > > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the> > > continuation> > > > of> > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some> > > > special> > > > > good> > > > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator of > 10th> > > > > house,> > > > > > > > owns> > > > > > > > > 10th> > > > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating > service.> > > > Thus> > > > > a> > > > > > > > > native in> > > > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial > results> > > of> > > > > > > Saturn> > > > > > > > > during> > > > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact that > it> > > > gives> > > > > too> > > > > > > > much> > > > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much > delay> > > > only> > > > > > > > etc -> > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing "fairly good> > > > results"> > > > > and> > > > > > > > not> > > > > > > > > > excellent.> > > > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be> > > > > considered> > > > > > > as> > > > > > > > in> > > > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet!> > > > > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2007 Report Share Posted December 28, 2007 Dear RKDashji, Thank you for the clarification. Srinadhji has clarified that Retrograde + exalted is not equal to debilated. If you ask me how to test his ability to declare so, :)I dont know. As an author of so many books, as a person who has read the original texts, when compared to me who has only read a few astro books that are all translations, let me assume he is correct until somebody else come and prove it is otherwise. I know you were just joking about fighting with Srinadhji, but still let me say, I have an aversion towards non-stop threads if they give signals of conflicts. As of now, Srinadhji has made his stand clear. So I thought I will keep silence:)(somebody has to put an end ultimately). Though I dont wish to fight, it would be good if we know from where this notion of exalted retro = debilated came. If no texts say so, we can rule out the existence of such a rule, once and for all. By the way, Srinadhji has suggested his opinion about the authors of the books by reading which I studied the ABC of astrology. So I am now in a doubt, what if many of my understanding are wrong??(. Regards, Jyothi , rk dash <arkaydash wrote: > > Dear Jyothi, > I was about to tell you your Me is in the swakshetra portion: 21 to 30 degree Virgo. Your Me, which is at 29 degree, however gnerates a veritable wellspring of yogas. So how do we test the ability of Sreenadh to declare that this retrogression is not pulling the planet down? If you are content with Sreenadh's reply I will not instigate you to fight him (on my behalf). > > Now, you have bhadra yoga (OK, lakshna, rare qualities as per Goel Saab) taking place in 4th, house of learning, caused by 4th lord. Not just that your lagna lord is gnerating this yoga. With third lord (planet king) that makes you, industrious, intrepid, pure- hearted, clear headed, quite learned. And good at communcation. Debilitated effects of Me would not be putting you up here. > > RK > > > jyothi_b_lakshmi <jyothi_b_lakshmi wrote: > Dear Sir, > > You may be right. I just assumed the popular authors to be correct as > there are rare chances of their interpretation going wrong. I checked > books by other authors, NE Muthuswamy has also said the same (Merucury > is exalted within 15 degrees, 16-20-Moola trikona and the rest > swakshetra). So I thought I will ensure about that. Thank you for > clarifying that exalted retro is not equal to debilated. > > Regards, > Jyothi > > , " Sreenadh " > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > Dear Jyothi ji, > > I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or even > I may > > not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is due to > this > > very fact that I always request people to depend on the " originals " , > > i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts. > > Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but the > > opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts it in > Brihat > > Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha vyakhya of > > Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the best > > reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas. > > By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is one of > the > > worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a practical > > astrologer. :=) > > Love and regards, > > Sreenadh > > > > --- In , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji, > > > > > > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and for all > > > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how I made > > > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna Jataka > > > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say " Mercury is exalted in first 15 > degrees > > > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep exaltation > point " . > > > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 degrees > and > > > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation. > > > > > > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do let me > > > know. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " arkaydash " > > > arkaydash@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames the > grey > > > > area? > > > > > > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after > this > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? > If it > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because > as > > > per > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that > people > > > > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > explanation > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. > > > > > > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted > > > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is > EFFECTIVELY > > > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours in > > > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > > > > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign > would > > > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? > Settle > > > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we > wait > > > > till we touch Sign Base! > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in > > > understanding. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > , " Sreenadh " > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji, > > > > > > Exaltation means " Sign of Exaltation " . If Sun is in Aries, > > > > > where > > > > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 > degree > > > > (i.e. > > > > > 9.00 > > > > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep > > > exaltation > > > > > degree > > > > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets > > > > > regarding > > > > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation > > > > debilitation > > > > > > degrees. > > > > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept > > > of > > > > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note > > > that > > > > > none > > > > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=) > > > Yes, > > > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal > chart > > > > > reading > > > > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but > please > > > > > don't > > > > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it in > > > > detail > > > > > > later when we speak about " Sign Base " result derivation > > > > techniques > > > > > used > > > > > > in 7-fold. > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > --- In > > > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted after > > > > reading > > > > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as > debilated. > > > > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within > which > > > a > > > > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted > only > > > in > > > > > first > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after > this > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? > If > > > it > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, > because > > > as > > > > per > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that > > > people > > > > > who > > > > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > > > explanation > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can go > by > > > > their > > > > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. Anyway, I > > > think > > > > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the > > > texts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " vinita > > > kumar " > > > > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving > > > conclusions. > > > > the > > > > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that > they > > > are > > > > > > > > localised and may not be universal. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information > from > > > > here > > > > > and > > > > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or readings > of > > > > > original > > > > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to these > > > > > statements. > > > > > > > > there are several places where i have come across the > > > > statement > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated > planet...but > > > > one > > > > > has > > > > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is > > > evident > > > > > from > > > > > > > > the following message: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan > > > > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer > with 14 > > > > > > > academic > > > > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 he > also > > > > co- > > > > > > > > founded > > > > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the > > > exalted > > > > > point > > > > > > > > back > > > > > > > > > wards and weak if after it > > > > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or even > 2 > > > Deg > > > > > > > Makara > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in > > > kataka > > > > > treat > > > > > > > > it as > > > > > > > > > neeca retro > > > > > > > > > and so on<== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology- > 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write- up > at: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology- > 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A > Rupa > > > > > consists > > > > > > > > of 60 > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala > > > > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the > > > largest > > > > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. > At 5 > > > > > degrees > > > > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 > Shashtiamsas > > > or > > > > a > > > > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points ( > > > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ). > > > > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One rupa > or > > > 60 > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it > > > occupies > > > > its > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero > Oochabala. > > > > > There > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the > > > > Debilitation > > > > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point ( > > > Ucchabhaga ) , > > > > > until > > > > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the Oochabhaga. > > > > > Conversely, > > > > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the > > > Exaltation > > > > > Point > > > > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached > at the > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point > > > > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's longitude > and > > > > you > > > > > get > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct it > > > from > > > > > 360 > > > > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the > Oocchabala > > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > > planet. > > > > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala > > > > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > Point) * > > > > > 60/180 > > > > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 > <== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming > > > > > neechabala > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > account of retrogression... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it > should be > > > > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? But > then > > > it > > > > has > > > > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it should, > > > going > > > > by > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u r > a > > > > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love, > > > > > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as debilated. > But > > > if > > > > I > > > > > am > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted > retro > > > > in > > > > > 4th) > > > > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the baby > > > > stages > > > > > of > > > > > > > > ones > > > > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 > certificates > > > of > > > > > Kerala > > > > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last > > > phase > > > > of > > > > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted > retro > > > > can > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > excellent results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > , " Sreenadh " > > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > > > > > > > > ==> > > > > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving > good > > > > > results. > > > > > > > > > > <== > > > > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! Retrograde > > > > > planets > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated?!! I > > > don't > > > > > think > > > > > > > > so. > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > > benefic > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > surely give > > > > > > > > > > excellent good results. > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > > malefic > > > > > then > > > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will cause > much > > > > > > > > unwantered > > > > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and suffering > > > > during > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > desa as > > > > > > > > > > well. > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna - > > > > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th > > > house > > > > > from > > > > > > > > Taurus > > > > > > > > > > Lagna > > > > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & > > > Leghu > > > > > > > Jataka > > > > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn > CANNOT > > > > give > > > > > the > > > > > > > > full > > > > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in > 6th > > > > > > > > debilitated > > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus). > > > > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect " a > > > > fairly > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > period " > > > > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the > > > continuation > > > > of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some > > > > special > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator of > 10th > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > owns > > > > > > > > > 10th > > > > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating > service. > > > > Thus > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > native in > > > > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial > results > > > of > > > > > > > Saturn > > > > > > > > > during > > > > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact that > it > > > > gives > > > > > too > > > > > > > > much > > > > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much > delay > > > > only > > > > > > > > etc - > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing " fairly good > > > > results " > > > > > and > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > excellent. > > > > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be > > > > > considered > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet! > > > > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why delete messages? Unlimited storage is just a click away. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2007 Report Share Posted December 28, 2007 Jyothi, Many such junk notions come about. That explains our need to purge our understanding from time to time. I like fight fight when it is with Sreenadh Yes thread can terminate. RKjyothi_b_lakshmi <jyothi_b_lakshmi wrote: Dear RKDashji,Thank you for the clarification. Srinadhji has clarified that Retrograde + exalted is not equal to debilated. If you ask me how to test his ability to declare so, :)I dont know. As an author of so many books, as a person who has read the original texts, when compared to me who has only read a few astro books that are all translations, let me assume he is correct until somebody else come and prove it is otherwise. :)I know you were just joking about fighting with Srinadhji, but still let me say, I have an aversion towards non-stop threads if they give signals of conflicts. As of now, Srinadhji has made his stand clear. So I thought I will keep silence:)(somebody has to put an end ultimately). Though I dont wish to fight, it would be good if we know from where this notion of exalted retro = debilated came. If no texts say so, we can rule out the existence of such a rule, once and for all. By the way, Srinadhji has suggested his opinion about the authors of the books by reading which I studied the ABC of astrology. So I am now in a doubt, what if many of my understanding are wrong??(. Regards,Jyothi , rk dash <arkaydash wrote:>> Dear Jyothi,> I was about to tell you your Me is in the swakshetra portion: 21 to 30 degree Virgo. Your Me, which is at 29 degree, however gnerates a veritable wellspring of yogas. So how do we test the ability of Sreenadh to declare that this retrogression is not pulling the planet down? If you are content with Sreenadh's reply I will not instigate you to fight him (on my behalf). > > Now, you have bhadra yoga (OK, lakshna, rare qualities as per Goel Saab) taking place in 4th, house of learning, caused by 4th lord. Not just that your lagna lord is gnerating this yoga. With third lord (planet king) that makes you, industrious, intrepid, pure-hearted, clear headed, quite learned. And good at communcation. Debilitated effects of Me would not be putting you up here.> > RK> > > jyothi_b_lakshmi <jyothi_b_lakshmi wrote:> Dear Sir,> > You may be right. I just assumed the popular authors to be correct as > there are rare chances of their interpretation going wrong. I checked > books by other authors, NE Muthuswamy has also said the same(Merucury > is exalted within 15 degrees, 16-20-Moola trikona and the rest > swakshetra). So I thought I will ensure about that. Thank you for > clarifying that exalted retro is not equal to debilated. > > Regards,> Jyothi> > , "Sreenadh" > <sreesog@> wrote:> >> > Dear Jyothi ji,> > I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or even > I may> > not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is due to > this> > very fact that I always request people to depend on the "originals",> > i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts.> > Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but the> > opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts it in > Brihat> > Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha vyakhya of> > Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the best> > reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas.> > By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is one of > the> > worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a practical> > astrologer. :=)> > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji,> > >> > > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and for all> > > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how I made> > > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna Jataka> > > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say "Mercury is exalted in first 15 > degrees> > > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep exaltation > point".> > > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 degrees > and> > > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation.> > >> > > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do let me> > > know.> > >> > > Regards,> > > Jyothi> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > , "arkaydash"> > > arkaydash@ wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames the > grey> > > > area?> > > >> > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first> > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after > this> > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? > If it> > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, because > as> > > per> > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that > people> > > > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > explanation> > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused.> > > >> > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted> > > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is > EFFECTIVELY> > > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours in> > > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > >> > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign > would> > > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? > Settle> > > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we > wait> > > > till we touch Sign Base!> > > >> > > > RK> > > >> > > >> > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear Srinadhji,> > > > >> > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in> > > understanding.> > > > >> > > > > Regards,> > > > > Jyothi> > > > >> > > > > , "Sreenadh"> > > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji,> > > > > > Exaltation means "Sign of Exaltation". If Sun is in Aries,> > > > > where> > > > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 > degree> > > > (i.e.> > > > > 9.00> > > > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep> > > exaltation> > > > > degree> > > > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets> > > > > regarding> > > > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation> > > > debilitation> > > > > > degrees.> > > > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept> > > of> > > > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note> > > that> > > > > none> > > > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=)> > > Yes,> > > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal > chart> > > > > reading> > > > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but > please> > > > > don't> > > > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it in> > > > detail> > > > > > later when we speak about "Sign Base" result derivation> > > > techniques> > > > > used> > > > > > in 7-fold. > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > --- In> > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji,> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted after> > > > reading> > > > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as > debilated.> > > > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within > which> > > a> > > > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted > only> > > in> > > > > first> > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after > this> > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? > If> > > it> > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, > because> > > as> > > > per> > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that> > > people> > > > > who> > > > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory> > > explanation> > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can go > by> > > > their> > > > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. Anyway, I> > > think> > > > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the> > > texts.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:).> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > >> > > > > > > , "vinita> > > kumar"> > > > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh,> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving> > > conclusions.> > > > the> > > > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that > they> > > are> > > > > > > > localised and may not be universal.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information > from> > > > here> > > > > and> > > > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or readings > of> > > > > original> > > > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to these> > > > > statements.> > > > > > > > there are several places where i have come across the> > > > statement> > > > > > > that> > > > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated > planet...but> > > > one> > > > > has> > > > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is> > > evident> > > > > from> > > > > > > > the following message:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > ==>Milan> > > > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer > with 14> > > > > > > academic> > > > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 he > also> > > > co-> > > > > > > > founded> > > > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the> > > exalted> > > > > point> > > > > > > > back> > > > > > > > > wards and weak if after it> > > > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or even > 2> > > Deg> > > > > > > Makara> > > > > > > > it> > > > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in> > > kataka> > > > > treat> > > > > > > > it as> > > > > > > > > neeca retro> > > > > > > > > and so on<==> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-> 38/93> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write-up > at:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-Astrology-> 38/93> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A > Rupa> > > > > consists> > > > > > > > of 60> > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala> > > > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the> > > largest> > > > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. > At 5> > > > > degrees> > > > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 > Shashtiamsas> > > or> > > > a> > > > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points (> > > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ).> > > > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One rupa > or> > > 60> > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it> > > occupies> > > > its> > > > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero > Oochabala.> > > > > There> > > > > > > is> > > > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the> > > > Debilitation> > > > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point (> > > Ucchabhaga ) ,> > > > > until> > > > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the Oochabhaga.> > > > > Conversely,> > > > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the> > > Exaltation> > > > > Point> > > > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached > at the> > > > > > > > Debilitation Point> > > > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) .> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's longitude > and> > > > you> > > > > get> > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct it> > > from> > > > > 360> > > > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the > Oocchabala> > > of> > > > the> > > > > > > > planet.> > > > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala> > > > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > Point) *> > > > > 60/180> > > > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 > <==> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming> > > > > neechabala> > > > > > > on> > > > > > > > account of retrogression...> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it > should be> > > > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? But > then> > > it> > > > has> > > > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it should,> > > going> > > > by> > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!!> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u r > a> > > > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!)> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > love,> > > > > > > > vinita> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > --- In> > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji,> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as debilated. > But> > > if> > > > I> > > > > am> > > > > > > > to> > > > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted > retro> > > > in> > > > > 4th)> > > > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the baby> > > > stages> > > > > of> > > > > > > > ones> > > > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 > certificates> > > of> > > > > Kerala> > > > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last> > > phase> > > > of> > > > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted > retro> > > > can> > > > > > > give> > > > > > > > > excellent results.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > --- In> > > , "Sreenadh"> > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji,> > > > > > > > > > ==>> > > > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving > good> > > > > results.> > > > > > > > > > <==> > > > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! Retrograde> > > > > planets> > > > > > > in> > > > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated?!! I> > > don't> > > > > think> > > > > > > > so.> > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a> > > benefic> > > > > will> > > > > > > > > surely give> > > > > > > > > > excellent good results.> > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a> > > malefic> > > > > then> > > > > > > > will> > > > > > > > > give> > > > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will cause > much> > > > > > > > unwantered> > > > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and suffering> > > > during> > > > > its> > > > > > > > > desa as> > > > > > > > > > well.> > > > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna -> > > > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th> > > house> > > > > from> > > > > > > > Taurus> > > > > > > > > > Lagna> > > > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & > > > Leghu> > > > > > > Jataka> > > > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn > CANNOT> > > > give> > > > > the> > > > > > > > full> > > > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in > 6th> > > > > > > > debilitated> > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus).> > > > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect "a> > > > fairly> > > > > > > good> > > > > > > > > period"> > > > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the> > > continuation> > > > of> > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some> > > > special> > > > > good> > > > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator of > 10th> > > > > house,> > > > > > > > owns> > > > > > > > > 10th> > > > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating > service.> > > > Thus> > > > > a> > > > > > > > > native in> > > > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial > results> > > of> > > > > > > Saturn> > > > > > > > > during> > > > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact that > it> > > > gives> > > > > too> > > > > > > > much> > > > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much > delay> > > > only> > > > > > > > etc -> > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing "fairly good> > > > results"> > > > > and> > > > > > > > not> > > > > > > > > > excellent.> > > > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be> > > > > considered> > > > > > > as> > > > > > > > in> > > > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet!> > > > > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >> > > > > > > > Why delete messages? Unlimited storage is just a click away.> Now you can chat without downloading messenger. Click here to know how. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 29, 2007 Report Share Posted December 29, 2007 Of course, since i don't know the subject i cannot pick up a fight with Shreenu (just want a change from calling him Shreenadhji but still i would like to fight with him sometimes. Now Shreenu ji, are there not branches and branches of astrology? Now Shreehuji, aren't there some other pundits who too have studied astrology from a guru or from ancient texts...maybe not the same texts as u have???? Now shreenuji, how is it that degrees are important only for varga charts and not for anything else...? why then categorise planets as in baala avastha, or as vriddha, or as asta, etc., etc....but then u will tell me that there is no truth in such things and that these are mere distortions that have crept into ancient texts thru manipulations! Now shreenuji, are chara karakas which rely only on degrees, also bakwas not backed by authentic texts???? if i know u, u will only laugh at these questions. But look, i tried my best to pick up a fight with u, Shreenuji but then u have a very logical answer too...these are not part of the construct that u have studied!!!! actually i am still not convinced, Shreenuji, why degrees do not matter at all in a sign...when the entire astrology is based on degrees??? but then not having studied a single shloka in sanskrit from an original text, its an unequal fight, isn't it???? love, veenu , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " <jyothi_b_lakshmi wrote: > > Dear RKDashji, > > Thank you for the clarification. Srinadhji has clarified that > Retrograde + exalted is not equal to debilated. If you ask me how to > test his ability to declare so, :)I dont know. As an author of so > many books, as a person who has read the original texts, when > compared to me who has only read a few astro books that are all > translations, let me assume he is correct until somebody else come > and prove it is otherwise. > > I know you were just joking about fighting with Srinadhji, but > still let me say, I have an aversion towards non-stop threads if they > give signals of conflicts. As of now, Srinadhji has made his stand > clear. So I thought I will keep silence:)(somebody has to put an end > ultimately). Though I dont wish to fight, it would be good if we know > from where this notion of exalted retro = debilated came. If no texts > say so, we can rule out the existence of such a rule, once and for > all. > > By the way, Srinadhji has suggested his opinion about the authors of > the books by reading which I studied the ABC of astrology. So I am > now in a doubt, what if many of my understanding are wrong??(. > > Regards, > Jyothi > > > , rk dash > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > Dear Jyothi, > > I was about to tell you your Me is in the swakshetra portion: 21 > to 30 degree Virgo. Your Me, which is at 29 degree, however gnerates > a veritable wellspring of yogas. So how do we test the ability of > Sreenadh to declare that this retrogression is not pulling the planet > down? If you are content with Sreenadh's reply I will not instigate > you to fight him (on my behalf). > > > > Now, you have bhadra yoga (OK, lakshna, rare qualities as per > Goel Saab) taking place in 4th, house of learning, caused by 4th > lord. Not just that your lagna lord is gnerating this yoga. With > third lord (planet king) that makes you, industrious, intrepid, pure- > hearted, clear headed, quite learned. And good at communcation. > Debilitated effects of Me would not be putting you up here. > > > > RK > > > > > > jyothi_b_lakshmi <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > Dear Sir, > > > > You may be right. I just assumed the popular authors to be correct > as > > there are rare chances of their interpretation going wrong. I > checked > > books by other authors, NE Muthuswamy has also said the same > (Merucury > > is exalted within 15 degrees, 16-20-Moola trikona and the rest > > swakshetra). So I thought I will ensure about that. Thank you for > > clarifying that exalted retro is not equal to debilated. > > > > Regards, > > Jyothi > > > > , " Sreenadh " > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Jyothi ji, > > > I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or even > > I may > > > not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is due > to > > this > > > very fact that I always request people to depend on > the " originals " , > > > i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts. > > > Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but the > > > opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts it in > > Brihat > > > Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha vyakhya > of > > > Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the best > > > reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas. > > > By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is one of > > the > > > worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a > practical > > > astrologer. :=) > > > Love and regards, > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > --- In > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji, > > > > > > > > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and for > all > > > > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how I > made > > > > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna Jataka > > > > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say " Mercury is exalted in first 15 > > degrees > > > > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep exaltation > > point " . > > > > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 degrees > > and > > > > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation. > > > > > > > > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do let > me > > > > know. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " arkaydash " > > > > arkaydash@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames > the > > grey > > > > > area? > > > > > > > > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after > > this > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? > > If it > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, > because > > as > > > > per > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that > > people > > > > > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > > explanation > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. > > > > > > > > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted > > > > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is > > EFFECTIVELY > > > > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours > in > > > > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign > > would > > > > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? > > Settle > > > > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we > > wait > > > > > till we touch Sign Base! > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in > > > > understanding. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " Sreenadh " > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji, > > > > > > > Exaltation means " Sign of Exaltation " . If Sun is in Aries, > > > > > > where > > > > > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 > > degree > > > > > (i.e. > > > > > > 9.00 > > > > > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep > > > > exaltation > > > > > > degree > > > > > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets > > > > > > regarding > > > > > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation > > > > > debilitation > > > > > > > degrees. > > > > > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept > > > > of > > > > > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note > > > > that > > > > > > none > > > > > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=) > > > > Yes, > > > > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal > > chart > > > > > > reading > > > > > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but > > please > > > > > > don't > > > > > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it > in > > > > > detail > > > > > > > later when we speak about " Sign Base " result derivation > > > > > techniques > > > > > > used > > > > > > > in 7-fold. > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted > after > > > > > reading > > > > > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as > > debilated. > > > > > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within > > which > > > > a > > > > > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted > > only > > > > in > > > > > > first > > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether > after > > this > > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as > exalted? > > If > > > > it > > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, > > because > > > > as > > > > > per > > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that > > > > people > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > > > > explanation > > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can > go > > by > > > > > their > > > > > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. > Anyway, I > > > > think > > > > > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the > > > > texts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " vinita > > > > kumar " > > > > > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving > > > > conclusions. > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that > > they > > > > are > > > > > > > > > localised and may not be universal. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information > > from > > > > > here > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or > readings > > of > > > > > > original > > > > > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to > these > > > > > > statements. > > > > > > > > > there are several places where i have come across the > > > > > statement > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated > > planet...but > > > > > one > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is > > > > evident > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > the following message: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan > > > > > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer > > with 14 > > > > > > > > academic > > > > > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 > he > > also > > > > > co- > > > > > > > > > founded > > > > > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the > > > > exalted > > > > > > point > > > > > > > > > back > > > > > > > > > > wards and weak if after it > > > > > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or > even > > 2 > > > > Deg > > > > > > > > Makara > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in > > > > kataka > > > > > > treat > > > > > > > > > it as > > > > > > > > > > neeca retro > > > > > > > > > > and so on<== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic- Astrology- > > 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write- > up > > at: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic- Astrology- > > 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A > > Rupa > > > > > > consists > > > > > > > > > of 60 > > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala > > > > > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the > > > > largest > > > > > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. > > At 5 > > > > > > degrees > > > > > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 > > Shashtiamsas > > > > or > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points ( > > > > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ). > > > > > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One > rupa > > or > > > > 60 > > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it > > > > occupies > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero > > Oochabala. > > > > > > There > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the > > > > > Debilitation > > > > > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point ( > > > > Ucchabhaga ) , > > > > > > until > > > > > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the > Oochabhaga. > > > > > > Conversely, > > > > > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the > > > > Exaltation > > > > > > Point > > > > > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached > > at the > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point > > > > > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's > longitude > > and > > > > > you > > > > > > get > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct > it > > > > from > > > > > > 360 > > > > > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the > > Oocchabala > > > > of > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > planet. > > > > > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala > > > > > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > > Point) * > > > > > > 60/180 > > > > > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 > > <== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming > > > > > > neechabala > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > account of retrogression... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it > > should be > > > > > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? But > > then > > > > it > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it > should, > > > > going > > > > > by > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u > r > > a > > > > > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love, > > > > > > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > , " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as > debilated. > > But > > > > if > > > > > I > > > > > > am > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted > > retro > > > > > in > > > > > > 4th) > > > > > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the > baby > > > > > stages > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > ones > > > > > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 > > certificates > > > > of > > > > > > Kerala > > > > > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last > > > > phase > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted > > retro > > > > > can > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > excellent results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > , " Sreenadh " > > > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > > > > > > > > > ==> > > > > > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving > > good > > > > > > results. > > > > > > > > > > > <== > > > > > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! > Retrograde > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated?!! > I > > > > don't > > > > > > think > > > > > > > > > so. > > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > > > benefic > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > > surely give > > > > > > > > > > > excellent good results. > > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > > > malefic > > > > > > then > > > > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will > cause > > much > > > > > > > > > unwantered > > > > > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and > suffering > > > > > during > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > desa as > > > > > > > > > > > well. > > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna - > > > > > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th > > > > house > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > Taurus > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna > > > > > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & > > > > Leghu > > > > > > > > Jataka > > > > > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn > > CANNOT > > > > > give > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > full > > > > > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in > > 6th > > > > > > > > > debilitated > > > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus). > > > > > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect " a > > > > > fairly > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > period " > > > > > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the > > > > continuation > > > > > of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some > > > > > special > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator > of > > 10th > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > owns > > > > > > > > > > 10th > > > > > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating > > service. > > > > > Thus > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > native in > > > > > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial > > results > > > > of > > > > > > > > Saturn > > > > > > > > > > during > > > > > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact > that > > it > > > > > gives > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > > much > > > > > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much > > delay > > > > > only > > > > > > > > > etc - > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing " fairly good > > > > > results " > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > excellent. > > > > > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet! > > > > > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why delete messages? Unlimited storage is just a click away. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 30, 2007 Report Share Posted December 30, 2007 Dear Vinita deedi, First of all, I liked the new name u selected for me :=) Now to the points -==>> Now Shreehuji, aren't there some other pundits who too have studied > astrology from a guru or from ancient texts...maybe not the same > texts as u have????<== Yes, there are many - but the texts available to us (any asto scholar anywhere in india) are so few in number - and is generally most of them available to me as well. But this does not apply to secret nadi techniques, and the traditional knowledge directly imparted from the guru-sishya paramparas. Thus it is not in the c0mmonly available texts but in the traditions that knowledge hide and seek currently. :=) We need to codify (but in writing with explanations) all those available systems too - as far as we access and study them. ==>> how is it that degrees are important only for varga > charts and not for anything else...? why then categorise planets as > in baala avastha, or as vriddha, or as asta, etc., etc....<== Degree ARE important - but NOT IN considering CONCJUNCTION/ASPECT - because they apply to planet in a SIGN; That was the point I made. Avastas ARE important - and there are several other such methodologies as well - BUT they too fell WITHIN 7-Fold! Note that "avesta" determination and prediction is part of Sign-Planet Base. Only the degree of planet in the Sign, and the planet itself would be considered. ==>> are chara karakas which rely only on degrees, also > bakwas not backed by authentic texts????<== Chara karkas are important and supported by 2 authentic texts such as BPHS and Jaimini sutra - and the methodology is part of Parasara School - though not supported by Other Rishi horas. I am NOT against sage told methods - who ever it be; even if it is Yavaneswara or Parasara; but more in support of the main stream - i.e. Arsha school. Skanda-Vasishta-Kausika-Daksha-Saunaka etc and the texts they wrote are all part of this school. There are too many who are in support of BPHS and Jaimini (but not even understanding them) - but there is only a few who are in support of Arsha system and tries to preserve it - even that is the best useful in practical astrology and the most used. So I am to preserve the things at the verge of extinction - that to daily corroborated plump body of BPHS, which is not much of use in practical astrology. :=) But I am not against it and I am of the opinion that some sincere one should come forward to systematically study and analyze the methodologies proposed by BPHS and Jaimini Sutra in a coherent way. If my primary efforts are completed - even I may take-up this task - because I appreciate every ORIGINAL systems that are "useful in practical astrology". Love and regards,Sreenadh , "vinita kumar" <shankar_mamta wrote:>> Of course, since i don't know the subject i cannot pick up a fight > with Shreenu (just want a change from calling him Shreenadhji > > but still i would like to fight with him sometimes. > > Now Shreenu ji, are there not branches and branches of astrology? > Now Shreehuji, aren't there some other pundits who too have studied > astrology from a guru or from ancient texts...maybe not the same > texts as u have????> > Now shreenuji, how is it that degrees are important only for varga > charts and not for anything else...? why then categorise planets as > in baala avastha, or as vriddha, or as asta, etc., etc....but then u > will tell me that there is no truth in such things and that these > are mere distortions that have crept into ancient texts thru > manipulations! > > Now shreenuji, are chara karakas which rely only on degrees, also > bakwas not backed by authentic texts????> > if i know u, u will only laugh at these questions. But look, i tried > my best to pick up a fight with u, Shreenuji > > but then u have a very logical answer too...these are not part of > the construct that u have studied!!!!> > actually i am still not convinced, Shreenuji, why degrees do not > matter at all in a sign...when the entire astrology is based on > degrees???> > but then not having studied a single shloka in sanskrit from an > original text, its an unequal fight, isn't it????> > love,> veenu> > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi" > jyothi_b_lakshmi@ wrote:> >> > Dear RKDashji,> > > > Thank you for the clarification. Srinadhji has clarified that > > Retrograde + exalted is not equal to debilated. If you ask me how > to > > test his ability to declare so, :)I dont know. As an author of so > > many books, as a person who has read the original texts, when > > compared to me who has only read a few astro books that are all > > translations, let me assume he is correct until somebody else come > > and prove it is otherwise. > > > > I know you were just joking about fighting with Srinadhji, but > > still let me say, I have an aversion towards non-stop threads if > they > > give signals of conflicts. As of now, Srinadhji has made his stand > > clear. So I thought I will keep silence:)(somebody has to put an > end > > ultimately). Though I dont wish to fight, it would be good if we > know > > from where this notion of exalted retro = debilated came. If no > texts > > say so, we can rule out the existence of such a rule, once and for > > all. > > > > By the way, Srinadhji has suggested his opinion about the authors > of > > the books by reading which I studied the ABC of astrology. So I am > > now in a doubt, what if many of my understanding are wrong??(. > > > > Regards,> > Jyothi> > > > > > , rk dash > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Jyothi,> > > I was about to tell you your Me is in the swakshetra portion: > 21 > > to 30 degree Virgo. Your Me, which is at 29 degree, however > gnerates > > a veritable wellspring of yogas. So how do we test the ability of > > Sreenadh to declare that this retrogression is not pulling the > planet > > down? If you are content with Sreenadh's reply I will not > instigate > > you to fight him (on my behalf). > > > > > > Now, you have bhadra yoga (OK, lakshna, rare qualities as per > > Goel Saab) taking place in 4th, house of learning, caused by 4th > > lord. Not just that your lagna lord is gnerating this yoga. With > > third lord (planet king) that makes you, industrious, intrepid, > pure-> > hearted, clear headed, quite learned. And good at communcation. > > Debilitated effects of Me would not be putting you up here.> > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > jyothi_b_lakshmi <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > Dear Sir,> > > > > > You may be right. I just assumed the popular authors to be > correct > > as > > > there are rare chances of their interpretation going wrong. I > > checked > > > books by other authors, NE Muthuswamy has also said the same> > (Merucury > > > is exalted within 15 degrees, 16-20-Moola trikona and the rest > > > swakshetra). So I thought I will ensure about that. Thank you > for > > > clarifying that exalted retro is not equal to debilated. > > > > > > Regards,> > > Jyothi> > > > > > , "Sreenadh" > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear Jyothi ji,> > > > I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or > even > > > I may> > > > not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is > due > > to > > > this> > > > very fact that I always request people to depend on > > the "originals",> > > > i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts.> > > > Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but > the> > > > opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts it > in > > > Brihat> > > > Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha > vyakhya > > of> > > > Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the best> > > > reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas.> > > > By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is one > of > > > the> > > > worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a > > practical> > > > astrologer. :=)> > > > Love and regards,> > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji,> > > > >> > > > > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and > for > > all> > > > > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how > I > > made> > > > > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna > Jataka> > > > > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say "Mercury is exalted in first 15 > > > degrees> > > > > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep > exaltation > > > point".> > > > > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 > degrees > > > and> > > > > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation.> > > > >> > > > > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do > let > > me> > > > > know.> > > > >> > > > > Regards,> > > > > Jyothi> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > , "arkaydash"> > > > > arkaydash@ wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames > > the > > > grey> > > > > > area?> > > > > >> > > > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first> > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether > after > > > this> > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as > exalted? > > > If it> > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, > > because > > > as> > > > > per> > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is > that > > > people> > > > > > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > > > explanation> > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused.> > > > > >> > > > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last > quoted> > > > > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is > > > EFFECTIVELY> > > > > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly > yours > > in> > > > > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > > > >> > > > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation > sign > > > would> > > > > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation > sign? > > > Settle> > > > > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should > we > > > wait> > > > > > till we touch Sign Base!> > > > > >> > > > > > RK> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji,> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in> > > > > understanding.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > , "Sreenadh"> > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji,> > > > > > > > Exaltation means "Sign of Exaltation". If Sun is in > Aries,> > > > > > > where> > > > > > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 > > > degree> > > > > > (i.e.> > > > > > > 9.00> > > > > > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep> > > > > exaltation> > > > > > > degree> > > > > > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other > planets> > > > > > > regarding> > > > > > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation> > > > > > debilitation> > > > > > > > degrees.> > > > > > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the > concept> > > > > of> > > > > > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also > note> > > > > that> > > > > > > none> > > > > > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal > horoscopes :=)> > > > > Yes,> > > > > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in > natal > > > chart> > > > > > > reading> > > > > > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - > but > > > please> > > > > > > don't> > > > > > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss > it > > in> > > > > > detail> > > > > > > > later when we speak about "Sign Base" result derivation> > > > > > techniques> > > > > > > used> > > > > > > > in 7-fold. > > > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > --- In> > > > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji,> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted > > after> > > > > > reading> > > > > > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as > > > debilated.> > > > > > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only > within > > > which> > > > > a> > > > > > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is > exalted > > > only> > > > > in> > > > > > > first> > > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether > > after > > > this> > > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as > > exalted? > > > If> > > > > it> > > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro=debilated will not work, > > > because> > > > > as> > > > > > per> > > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is > that> > > > > people> > > > > > > who> > > > > > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory> > > > > explanation> > > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one > can > > go > > > by> > > > > > their> > > > > > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. > > Anyway, I> > > > > think> > > > > > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by > the> > > > > texts.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:).> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > , "vinita> > > > > kumar"> > > > > > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh,> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving> > > > > conclusions.> > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is > that > > > they> > > > > are> > > > > > > > > > localised and may not be universal.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of > information > > > from> > > > > > here> > > > > > > and> > > > > > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or > > readings > > > of> > > > > > > original> > > > > > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to > > these> > > > > > > statements.> > > > > > > > > > there are several places where i have come across > the> > > > > > statement> > > > > > > > > that> > > > > > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated > > > planet...but> > > > > > one> > > > > > > has> > > > > > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as > is> > > > > evident> > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > the following message:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan> > > > > > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an > engineer > > > with 14> > > > > > > > > academic> > > > > > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at > 55 > > he > > > also> > > > > > co-> > > > > > > > > > founded> > > > > > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach > the> > > > > exalted> > > > > > > point> > > > > > > > > > back> > > > > > > > > > > wards and weak if after it> > > > > > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or > > even > > > 2> > > > > Deg> > > > > > > > > Makara> > > > > > > > > > it> > > > > > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 > min in> > > > > kataka> > > > > > > treat> > > > > > > > > > it as> > > > > > > > > > > neeca retro> > > > > > > > > > > and so on<==> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-> Astrology-> > > 38/93> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another > write-> > up > > > at:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlewisdom.com/Article/Vedic-> Astrology-> > > 38/93> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. > A > > > Rupa> > > > > > > consists> > > > > > > > > > of 60> > > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala> > > > > > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For > instance,the> > > > > largest> > > > > > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees > Cancer. > > > At 5> > > > > > > degrees> > > > > > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 > > > Shashtiamsas> > > > > or> > > > > > a> > > > > > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points (> > > > > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ).> > > > > > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One > > rupa > > > or> > > > > 60> > > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it> > > > > occupies> > > > > > its> > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero > > > Oochabala.> > > > > > > There> > > > > > > > > is> > > > > > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the> > > > > > Debilitation> > > > > > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point (> > > > > Ucchabhaga ) ,> > > > > > > until> > > > > > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the > > Oochabhaga.> > > > > > > Conversely,> > > > > > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the> > > > > Exaltation> > > > > > > Point> > > > > > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is > reached > > > at the> > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point> > > > > > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) .> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's > > longitude > > > and> > > > > > you> > > > > > > get> > > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, > deduct > > it> > > > > from> > > > > > > 360> > > > > > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the > > > Oocchabala> > > > > of> > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > planet.> > > > > > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala> > > > > > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > > > Point) *> > > > > > > 60/180> > > > > > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > Point ) / 3 > > > <==> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala > becoming> > > > > > > neechabala> > > > > > > > > on> > > > > > > > > > account of retrogression...> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it > > > should be> > > > > > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!!? > But > > > then> > > > > it> > > > > > has> > > > > > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it > > should,> > > > > going> > > > > > by> > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!!> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? > (So u > > r > > > a> > > > > > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!)> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > love,> > > > > > > > > > vinita> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > --- In> > > > > > > > , "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji,> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as > > debilated. > > > But> > > > > if> > > > > > I> > > > > > > am> > > > > > > > > > to> > > > > > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord > (exalted > > > retro> > > > > > in> > > > > > > 4th)> > > > > > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the > > baby> > > > > > stages> > > > > > > of> > > > > > > > > > ones> > > > > > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 > > > certificates> > > > > of> > > > > > > Kerala> > > > > > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that > last> > > > > phase> > > > > > of> > > > > > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if > exalted > > > retro> > > > > > can> > > > > > > > > give> > > > > > > > > > > excellent results.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > --- In> > > > > , "Sreenadh"> > > > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji,> > > > > > > > > > > > ==>> > > > > > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) > giving > > > good> > > > > > > results.> > > > > > > > > > > > <==> > > > > > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! > > Retrograde> > > > > > > planets> > > > > > > > > in> > > > > > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as > debilitated?!! > > I> > > > > don't> > > > > > > think> > > > > > > > > > so.> > > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a> > > > > benefic> > > > > > > will> > > > > > > > > > > surely give> > > > > > > > > > > > excellent good results.> > > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a> > > > > malefic> > > > > > > then> > > > > > > > > > will> > > > > > > > > > > give> > > > > > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will > > cause > > > much> > > > > > > > > > unwantered> > > > > > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and > > suffering> > > > > > during> > > > > > > its> > > > > > > > > > > desa as> > > > > > > > > > > > well.> > > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna -> > > > > > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th> > > > > house> > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > Taurus> > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna> > > > > > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha > Ratnakara & > > > > > Leghu> > > > > > > > > Jataka> > > > > > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - > Saturn > > > CANNOT> > > > > > give> > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > full> > > > > > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted > in > > > 6th> > > > > > > > > > debilitated> > > > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus).> > > > > > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only > expect "a> > > > > > fairly> > > > > > > > > good> > > > > > > > > > > period"> > > > > > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the> > > > > continuation> > > > > > of> > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front > some> > > > > > special> > > > > > > good> > > > > > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the > significator > > of > > > 10th> > > > > > > house,> > > > > > > > > > owns> > > > > > > > > > > 10th> > > > > > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating > > > service.> > > > > > Thus> > > > > > > a> > > > > > > > > > > native in> > > > > > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial > > > results> > > > > of> > > > > > > > > Saturn> > > > > > > > > > > during> > > > > > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact > > that > > > it> > > > > > gives> > > > > > > too> > > > > > > > > > much> > > > > > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after > much > > > delay> > > > > > only> > > > > > > > > > etc -> > > > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing "fairly > good> > > > > > results"> > > > > > > and> > > > > > > > > > not> > > > > > > > > > > > excellent.> > > > > > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT > be> > > > > > > considered> > > > > > > > > as> > > > > > > > > > in> > > > > > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet!> > > > > > > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why delete messages? Unlimited storage is just a click away.> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2007 Report Share Posted December 31, 2007 Dear All, To my knowledge any planet retrogade in the birth chart will give results during current/transit when it becomes retrogade. Thus it implies that it will not give results ( whatever they may be) in forward motion. Thus a planet in exalation in transit will give adverse/vipreet results to the native when it goes retrogade and during time/duration of being retrogade unless,in the native's birt chart that precise planet is retrogade. A planet if retrogade and exalated in birthchart will give results during its backward motion, including in its house of exalation in cuurent transit. Phew ! --- On Sun, 30/12/07, vinita kumar <shankar_mamta wrote: vinita kumar <shankar_mamta Re: Exalted retro, a grey area Date: Sunday, 30 December, 2007, 1:26 AM Of course, since i don't know the subject i cannot pick up a fight with Shreenu (just want a change from calling him Shreenadhji :)but still i would like to fight with him sometimes. Now Shreenu ji, are there not branches and branches of astrology? Now Shreehuji, aren't there some other pundits who too have studied astrology from a guru or from ancient texts...maybe not the same texts as u have????Now shreenuji, how is it that degrees are important only for varga charts and not for anything else...? why then categorise planets as in baala avastha, or as vriddha, or as asta, etc., etc....but then u will tell me that there is no truth in such things and that these are mere distortions that have crept into ancient texts thru manipulations! Now shreenuji, are chara karakas which rely only on degrees, also bakwas not backed by authentic texts????if i know u, u will only laugh at these questions. But look, i tried my best to pick up a fight with u, Shreenuji ;)but then u have a very logical answer too...these are not part of the construct that u have studied!!!!actually i am still not convinced, Shreenuji, why degrees do not matter at all in a sign...when the entire astrology is based on degrees???but then not having studied a single shloka in sanskrit from an original text, its an unequal fight, isn't it????love,veenuancient_indian_ astrology, "jyothi_b_lakshmi" <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ ...> wrote:>> Dear RKDashji,> > Thank you for the clarification. Srinadhji has clarified that > Retrograde + exalted is not equal to debilated. If you ask me how to > test his ability to declare so, :)I dont know. As an author of so > many books, as a person who has read the original texts, when > compared to me who has only read a few astro books that are all > translations, let me assume he is correct until somebody else come > and prove it is otherwise. > > I know you were just joking about fighting with Srinadhji, but > still let me say, I have an aversion towards non-stop threads if they > give signals of conflicts. As of now, Srinadhji has made his stand > clear. So I thought I will keep silence:)(somebody has to put an end > ultimately). Though I dont wish to fight, it would be good if we know > from where this notion of exalted retro = debilated came.. If no texts > say so, we can rule out the existence of such a rule, once and for > all. > > By the way, Srinadhji has suggested his opinion about the authors of > the books by reading which I studied the ABC of astrology. So I am > now in a doubt, what if many of my understanding are wrong??(. > > Regards,> Jyothi> > > ancient_indian_ astrology, rk dash > <arkaydash@> wrote:> >> > Dear Jyothi,> > I was about to tell you your Me is in the swakshetra portion: 21 > to 30 degree Virgo. Your Me, which is at 29 degree, however gnerates > a veritable wellspring of yogas. So how do we test the ability of > Sreenadh to declare that this retrogression is not pulling the planet > down? If you are content with Sreenadh's reply I will not instigate > you to fight him (on my behalf). > > > > Now, you have bhadra yoga (OK, lakshna, rare qualities as per > Goel Saab) taking place in 4th, house of learning, caused by 4th > lord. Not just that your lagna lord is gnerating this yoga. With > third lord (planet king) that makes you, industrious, intrepid, pure-> hearted, clear headed, quite learned. And good at communcation. > Debilitated effects of Me would not be putting you up here.> > > > RK> > > > > > jyothi_b_lakshmi <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote:> > Dear Sir,> > > > You may be right. I just assumed the popular authors to be correct > as > > there are rare chances of their interpretation going wrong. I > checked > > books by other authors, NE Muthuswamy has also said the same> (Merucury > > is exalted within 15 degrees, 16-20-Moola trikona and the rest > > swakshetra). So I thought I will ensure about that. Thank you for > > clarifying that exalted retro is not equal to debilated. > > > > Regards,> > Jyothi> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "Sreenadh" > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Jyothi ji,> > > I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or even > > I may> > > not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is due > to > > this> > > very fact that I always request people to depend on > the "originals",> > > i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts.> > > Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but the> > > opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts it in > > Brihat> > > Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha vyakhya > of> > > Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the best> > > reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas.> > > By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is one of > > the> > > worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a > practical> > > astrologer. :=)> > > Love and regards,> > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji,> > > >> > > > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and for > all> > > > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how I > made> > > > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna Jataka> > > > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say "Mercury is exalted in first 15 > > degrees> > > > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep exaltation > > point".> > > > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 degrees > > and> > > > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation.> > > >> > > > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do let > me> > > > know.> > > >> > > > Regards,> > > > Jyothi> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "arkaydash"> > > > arkaydash@ wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames > the > > grey> > > > > area?> > > > >> > > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first> > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether after > > this> > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as exalted? > > If it> > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro= debilated will not work, > because > > as> > > > per> > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that > > people> > > > > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > > explanation> > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused.> > > > >> > > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last quoted> > > > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is > > EFFECTIVELY> > > > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly yours > in> > > > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > > >> > > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation sign > > would> > > > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation sign? > > Settle> > > > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should we > > wait> > > > > till we touch Sign Base!> > > > >> > > > > RK> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Srinadhji,> > > > > >> > > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in> > > > understanding.> > > > > >> > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > >> > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "Sreenadh"> > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji,> > > > > > > Exaltation means "Sign of Exaltation". If Sun is in Aries,> > > > > > where> > > > > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 > > degree> > > > > (i.e.> > > > > > 9.00> > > > > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep> > > > exaltation> > > > > > degree> > > > > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other planets> > > > > > regarding> > > > > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation> > > > > debilitation> > > > > > > degrees.> > > > > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the concept> > > > of> > > > > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also note> > > > that> > > > > > none> > > > > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal horoscopes :=)> > > > Yes,> > > > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in natal > > chart> > > > > > reading> > > > > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - but > > please> > > > > > don't> > > > > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss it > in> > > > > detail> > > > > > > later when we speak about "Sign Base" result derivation> > > > > techniques> > > > > > used> > > > > > > in 7-fold. > > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > --- In> > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji,> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted > after> > > > > reading> > > > > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as > > debilated.> > > > > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only within > > which> > > > a> > > > > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is exalted > > only> > > > in> > > > > > first> > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether > after > > this> > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as > exalted? > > If> > > > it> > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro= debilated will not work, > > because> > > > as> > > > > per> > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is that> > > > people> > > > > > who> > > > > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory> > > > explanation> > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one can > go > > by> > > > > their> > > > > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. > Anyway, I> > > > think> > > > > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by the> > > > texts.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:).> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "vinita> > > > kumar"> > > > > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh,> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving> > > > conclusions.> > > > > the> > > > > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is that > > they> > > > are> > > > > > > > > localised and may not be universal.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of information > > from> > > > > here> > > > > > and> > > > > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or > readings > > of> > > > > > original> > > > > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to > these> > > > > > statements.> > > > > > > > > there are several places where i have come across the> > > > > statement> > > > > > > > that> > > > > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated > > planet...but> > > > > one> > > > > > has> > > > > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as is> > > > evident> > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > the following message:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan> > > > > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an engineer > > with 14> > > > > > > > academic> > > > > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at 55 > he > > also> > > > > co-> > > > > > > > > founded> > > > > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach the> > > > exalted> > > > > > point> > > > > > > > > back> > > > > > > > > > wards and weak if after it> > > > > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or > even > > 2> > > > Deg> > > > > > > > Makara> > > > > > > > > it> > > > > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 min in> > > > kataka> > > > > > treat> > > > > > > > > it as> > > > > > > > > > neeca retro> > > > > > > > > > and so on<==> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > http://www.articlew isdom.com/ Article/Vedic-Astrology-> > 38/93> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another write-> up > > at:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > http://www.articlew isdom.com/ Article/Vedic-Astrology-> > 38/93> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. A > > Rupa> > > > > > consists> > > > > > > > > of 60> > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala> > > > > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For instance,the> > > > largest> > > > > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees Cancer. > > At 5> > > > > > degrees> > > > > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 > > Shashtiamsas> > > > or> > > > > a> > > > > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points (> > > > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ).> > > > > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One > rupa > > or> > > > 60> > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it> > > > occupies> > > > > its> > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero > > Oochabala.> > > > > > There> > > > > > > > is> > > > > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the> > > > > Debilitation> > > > > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point (> > > > Ucchabhaga ) ,> > > > > > until> > > > > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the > Oochabhaga.> > > > > > Conversely,> > > > > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the> > > > Exaltation> > > > > > Point> > > > > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is reached > > at the> > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point> > > > > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) .> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's > longitude > > and> > > > > you> > > > > > get> > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, deduct > it> > > > from> > > > > > 360> > > > > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the > > Oocchabala> > > > of> > > > > the> > > > > > > > > planet.> > > > > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala> > > > > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > > Point) *> > > > > > 60/180> > > > > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation Point ) / 3 > > <==> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala becoming> > > > > > neechabala> > > > > > > > on> > > > > > > > > account of retrogression. ..> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it > > should be> > > > > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!! ? But > > then> > > > it> > > > > has> > > > > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it > should,> > > > going> > > > > by> > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!!> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? (So u > r > > a> > > > > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!)> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > love,> > > > > > > > > vinita> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > --- In> > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "jyothi_b_lakshmi"> > > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji,> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as > debilated. > > But> > > > if> > > > > I> > > > > > am> > > > > > > > > to> > > > > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord (exalted > > retro> > > > > in> > > > > > 4th)> > > > > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the > baby> > > > > stages> > > > > > of> > > > > > > > > ones> > > > > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 > > certificates> > > > of> > > > > > Kerala> > > > > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that last> > > > phase> > > > > of> > > > > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if exalted > > retro> > > > > can> > > > > > > > give> > > > > > > > > > excellent results.> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > Jyothi> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > --- In> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "Sreenadh"> > > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji,> > > > > > > > > > > ==>> > > > > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) giving > > good> > > > > > results.> > > > > > > > > > > <==> > > > > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! > Retrograde> > > > > > planets> > > > > > > > in> > > > > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as debilitated? !! > I> > > > don't> > > > > > think> > > > > > > > > so.> > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a> > > > benefic> > > > > > will> > > > > > > > > > surely give> > > > > > > > > > > excellent good results.> > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a> > > > malefic> > > > > > then> > > > > > > > > will> > > > > > > > > > give> > > > > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will > cause > > much> > > > > > > > > unwantered> > > > > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and > suffering> > > > > during> > > > > > its> > > > > > > > > > desa as> > > > > > > > > > > well.> > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna -> > > > > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th> > > > house> > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > Taurus> > > > > > > > > > > Lagna> > > > > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha Ratnakara & > > > > Leghu> > > > > > > > Jataka> > > > > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - Saturn > > CANNOT> > > > > give> > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > full> > > > > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted in > > 6th> > > > > > > > > debilitated> > > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus).> > > > > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only expect "a> > > > > fairly> > > > > > > > good> > > > > > > > > > period"> > > > > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the> > > > continuation> > > > > of> > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front some> > > > > special> > > > > > good> > > > > > > > > > results> > > > > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the significator > of > > 10th> > > > > > house,> > > > > > > > > owns> > > > > > > > > > 10th> > > > > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating > > service.> > > > > Thus> > > > > > a> > > > > > > > > > native in> > > > > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial > > results> > > > of> > > > > > > > Saturn> > > > > > > > > > during> > > > > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact > that > > it> > > > > gives> > > > > > too> > > > > > > > > much> > > > > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after much > > delay> > > > > only> > > > > > > > > etc -> > > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing "fairly good> > > > > results"> > > > > > and> > > > > > > > > not> > > > > > > > > > > excellent.> > > > > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT be> > > > > > considered> > > > > > > > as> > > > > > > > > in> > > > > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet!> > > > > > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > Why delete messages? Unlimited storage is just a click away.> >> Share files, take polls, and discuss your passions - all under one roof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2007 Report Share Posted December 31, 2007 Dear Goelji, MAny thanks for your informative message. i am looking forward to your subsequent messages in this regard. warm regards, vinita , Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937 wrote: > > Dear Vinita Kumar and other Friends, > Astrology does not belong to any particular person , this is a very useful branch of knoweldge and extend its help to huminity in all walks of life. > Then there is no scope ti fight on the basic princples of astrology , which were developed over past 5000 - 6ooo years by the persons of great repute and wisdom. > I will make an attempt to explain various issues one by one in my successive mails. > Topic of this mail - Exaltation , Mooltrikona and own house of planets > > There is a general dictum that a planet in Exaltation gives full auspicious results , in Mooltrikona 75%. Own house 50%. > Sun - Own sign and Mooltrikona is Leo , Exaltation is Aries. > There is no problem if Sun in Aries, but if Sun is placed in leo , should it be considered in own or mooltrikona sign. > IN SUCH A SITUATION TEXTS GIVES US DIRECTION: > In case Sun is placed in 1st 20 degree of Leo it is considered as if it is placed in its Mooltrikona sign and rest of the portion of sign is > considered as if it is placed in its Own sign.The Sun is lord of sign Leo. > Let us take the case of Mercury: > It owns Gemini and Virgo . Virgo is its own ,mooltrikona as well as exaltation sign. If Mercury is placed in Virgo , upto 15deg is its exaltation , next 5deg is mooltrikona . > and rest is own sign.Thus basically this rule is devised to know the degree of auspicious results when Mercury is placed in sign Virgo. > For calculating duration Dsaa periods in char dasa's etc , or longevity , WHOLE SIGN VIRGO IS CONSIDERED AS EXALTATION SIGN. > Moon : > Taurus is its exaltation sign upto 3deg and rest of the sign is considered as its mooltrikona , when Moon is placed in Taurus. > Otherwise Taurus is considered its exaltation sign and Cancer is only considered its own sign( In the case of all other planets Mooltrikona sign also acts > as their own sign also) > EVERY RULE IS GIVEN FOR SPECIFIC USE AND PURPOSE. > In my next mail , I will try to explain some nice features on inter friendship of planets . All of you know it , still it is quite interesting to discuss. > In my subsequent mail , I will try to explain the secrets of retrograde planets. > Regards > > G.K.GOEL > Ph: 09350311433 > Add: L-409, SARITA VIHAR > NEW DELHI-110 076 > INDIA > > > > > chiranjiv mehta <vchiranjiv > > Monday, 31 December, 2007 1:25:42 PM > Re: Re: Exalted retro, a grey area > > Dear All, > To my knowledge any planet retrogade in the birth chart will give results during current/transit when it becomes retrogade. Thus it implies that it will not give results ( whatever they may be) in forward motion. > Thus a planet in exalation in transit will give adverse/vipreet results to the native when it goes retrogade and during time/duration of being retrogade unless,in the native's birt chart that precise planet is retrogade.. > A planet if retrogade and exalated in birthchart will give results during its backward motion, including in its house of exalation in cuurent transit. > Phew ! > --- On Sun, 30/12/07, vinita kumar <shankar_mamta@ ..co. uk> wrote: > > vinita kumar <shankar_mamta@ .co. uk> > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Exalted retro, a grey area > ancient_indian_ astrology > Sunday, 30 December, 2007, 1:26 AM > > > Of course, since i don't know the subject i cannot pick up a fight > with Shreenu (just want a change from calling him Shreenadhji > > but still i would like to fight with him sometimes. > > Now Shreenu ji, are there not branches and branches of astrology? > Now Shreehuji, aren't there some other pundits who too have studied > astrology from a guru or from ancient texts...maybe not the same > texts as u have???? > > Now shreenuji, how is it that degrees are important only for varga > charts and not for anything else...? why then categorise planets as > in baala avastha, or as vriddha, or as asta, etc., etc....but then u > will tell me that there is no truth in such things and that these > are mere distortions that have crept into ancient texts thru > manipulations! > > Now shreenuji, are chara karakas which rely only on degrees, also > bakwas not backed by authentic texts???? > > if i know u, u will only laugh at these questions. But look, i tried > my best to pick up a fight with u, Shreenuji > > but then u have a very logical answer too...these are not part of > the construct that u have studied!!!! > > actually i am still not convinced, Shreenuji, why degrees do not > matter at all in a sign...when the entire astrology is based on > degrees??? > > but then not having studied a single shloka in sanskrit from an > original text, its an unequal fight, isn't it???? > > love, > veenu > > ancient_indian_ astrology@ . com, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ ...> wrote: > > > > Dear RKDashji, > > > > Thank you for the clarification. Srinadhji has clarified that > > Retrograde + exalted is not equal to debilated. If you ask me how > to > > test his ability to declare so, :)I dont know. As an author of so > > many books, as a person who has read the original texts, when > > compared to me who has only read a few astro books that are all > > translations, let me assume he is correct until somebody else come > > and prove it is otherwise. > > > > I know you were just joking about fighting with Srinadhji, but > > still let me say, I have an aversion towards non-stop threads if > they > > give signals of conflicts. As of now, Srinadhji has made his stand > > clear. So I thought I will keep silence:)(somebody has to put an > end > > ultimately). Though I dont wish to fight, it would be good if we > know > > from where this notion of exalted retro = debilated came.. If no > texts > > say so, we can rule out the existence of such a rule, once and for > > all. > > > > By the way, Srinadhji has suggested his opinion about the authors > of > > the books by reading which I studied the ABC of astrology. So I am > > now in a doubt, what if many of my understanding are wrong??(. > > > > Regards, > > Jyothi > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, rk dash > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Jyothi, > > > I was about to tell you your Me is in the swakshetra portion: > 21 > > to 30 degree Virgo. Your Me, which is at 29 degree, however > gnerates > > a veritable wellspring of yogas. So how do we test the ability of > > Sreenadh to declare that this retrogression is not pulling the > planet > > down? If you are content with Sreenadh's reply I will not > instigate > > you to fight him (on my behalf). > > > > > > Now, you have bhadra yoga (OK, lakshna, rare qualities as per > > Goel Saab) taking place in 4th, house of learning, caused by 4th > > lord. Not just that your lagna lord is gnerating this yoga. With > > third lord (planet king) that makes you, industrious, intrepid, > pure- > > hearted, clear headed, quite learned. And good at communcation. > > Debilitated effects of Me would not be putting you up here. > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > jyothi_b_lakshmi <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > You may be right. I just assumed the popular authors to be > correct > > as > > > there are rare chances of their interpretation going wrong. I > > checked > > > books by other authors, NE Muthuswamy has also said the same > > (Merucury > > > is exalted within 15 degrees, 16-20-Moola trikona and the rest > > > swakshetra). So I thought I will ensure about that. Thank you > for > > > clarifying that exalted retro is not equal to debilated. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Jyothi > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " Sreenadh " > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi ji, > > > > I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or > even > > > I may > > > > not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is > due > > to > > > this > > > > very fact that I always request people to depend on > > the " originals " , > > > > i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts. > > > > Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but > the > > > > opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts it > in > > > Brihat > > > > Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha > vyakhya > > of > > > > Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the best > > > > reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas. > > > > By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is one > of > > > the > > > > worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a > > practical > > > > astrologer. :=) > > > > Love and regards, > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > --- In > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji, > > > > > > > > > > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and > for > > all > > > > > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check how > I > > made > > > > > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna > Jataka > > > > > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say " Mercury is exalted in first 15 > > > degrees > > > > > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep > exaltation > > > point " . > > > > > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 > degrees > > > and > > > > > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation. > > > > > > > > > > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, do > let > > me > > > > > know. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology@ . com, " arkaydash " > > > > > arkaydash@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi frames > > the > > > grey > > > > > > area? > > > > > > > > > > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first > > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether > after > > > this > > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as > exalted? > > > If it > > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro= debilated will not work, > > because > > > as > > > > > per > > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted.. The problem is > that > > > people > > > > > > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > > > explanation > > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. > > > > > > > > > > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last > quoted > > > > > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is > > > EFFECTIVELY > > > > > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly > yours > > in > > > > > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation > sign > > > would > > > > > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation > sign? > > > Settle > > > > > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why should > we > > > wait > > > > > > till we touch Sign Base! > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in > > > > > understanding. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > ancient_indian_ astrology, " Sreenadh " > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji, > > > > > > > > Exaltation means " Sign of Exaltation " . If Sun is in > Aries, > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that 10 > > > degree > > > > > > (i.e. > > > > > > > 9.00 > > > > > > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep > > > > > exaltation > > > > > > > degree > > > > > > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other > planets > > > > > > > regarding > > > > > > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep exaltation > > > > > > debilitation > > > > > > > > degrees. > > > > > > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the > concept > > > > > of > > > > > > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. Also > note > > > > > that > > > > > > > none > > > > > > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal > horoscopes :=) > > > > > Yes, > > > > > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in > natal > > > chart > > > > > > > reading > > > > > > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - > but > > > please > > > > > > > don't > > > > > > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will discuss > it > > in > > > > > > detail > > > > > > > > later when we speak about " Sign Base " result derivation > > > > > > techniques > > > > > > > used > > > > > > > > in 7-fold. > > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro exalted > > after > > > > > > reading > > > > > > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as > > > debilated. > > > > > > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only > within > > > which > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is > exalted > > > only > > > > > in > > > > > > > first > > > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether > > after > > > this > > > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as > > exalted? > > > If > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro= debilated will not work, > > > because > > > > > as > > > > > > per > > > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem is > that > > > > > people > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > > > > > explanation > > > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one > can > > go > > > by > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. > > Anyway, I > > > > > think > > > > > > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said by > the > > > > > texts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > ancient_indian_ astrology, " vinita > > > > > kumar " > > > > > > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving > > > > > conclusions. > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is > that > > > they > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > localised and may not be universal. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of > information > > > from > > > > > > here > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or > > readings > > > of > > > > > > > original > > > > > > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness to > > these > > > > > > > statements. > > > > > > > > > > there are several places where i have come across > the > > > > > > statement > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated > > > planet...but > > > > > > one > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement as > is > > > > > evident > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > the following message: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? 28/7 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan > > > > > > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an > engineer > > > with 14 > > > > > > > > > academic > > > > > > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at > 55 > > he > > > also > > > > > > co- > > > > > > > > > > founded > > > > > > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach > the > > > > > exalted > > > > > > > point > > > > > > > > > > back > > > > > > > > > > > wards and weak if after it > > > > > > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka or > > even > > > 2 > > > > > Deg > > > > > > > > > Makara > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 > min in > > > > > kataka > > > > > > > treat > > > > > > > > > > it as > > > > > > > > > > > neeca retro > > > > > > > > > > > and so on<== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlew isdom.com/ Article/Vedic- > Astrology- > > > 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another > write- > > up > > > at: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlew isdom.com/ Article/Vedic- > Astrology- > > > 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in Rupas. > A > > > Rupa > > > > > > > consists > > > > > > > > > > of 60 > > > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala > > > > > > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For > instance,the > > > > > largest > > > > > > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees > Cancer. > > > At 5 > > > > > > > degrees > > > > > > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 > > > Shashtiamsas > > > > > or > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points ( > > > > > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ). > > > > > > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets One > > rupa > > > or > > > > > 60 > > > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when it > > > > > occupies > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero > > > Oochabala. > > > > > > > There > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from the > > > > > > Debilitation > > > > > > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point ( > > > > > Ucchabhaga ) , > > > > > > > until > > > > > > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the > > Oochabhaga. > > > > > > > Conversely, > > > > > > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the > > > > > Exaltation > > > > > > > Point > > > > > > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is > reached > > > at the > > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point > > > > > > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's > > longitude > > > and > > > > > > you > > > > > > > get > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, > deduct > > it > > > > > from > > > > > > > 360 > > > > > > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the > > > Oocchabala > > > > > of > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > planet. > > > > > > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala > > > > > > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > > > Point) * > > > > > > > 60/180 > > > > > > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > Point ) / 3 > > > <== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala > becoming > > > > > > > neechabala > > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > account of retrogression. .. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so it > > > should be > > > > > > > > > > debilitated according to the first statement!!! ? > But > > > then > > > > > it > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it > > should, > > > > > going > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? > (So u > > r > > > a > > > > > > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love, > > > > > > > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as > > debilated. > > > But > > > > > if > > > > > > I > > > > > > > am > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord > (exalted > > > retro > > > > > > in > > > > > > > 4th) > > > > > > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just the > > baby > > > > > > stages > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > ones > > > > > > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 > > > certificates > > > > > of > > > > > > > Kerala > > > > > > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within that > last > > > > > phase > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if > exalted > > > retro > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > excellent results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " Sreenadh " > > > > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > ==> > > > > > > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) > giving > > > good > > > > > > > results. > > > > > > > > > > > > <== > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! > > Retrograde > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as > debilitated? !! > > I > > > > > don't > > > > > > > think > > > > > > > > > > so. > > > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > > > > benefic > > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > > > surely give > > > > > > > > > > > > excellent good results. > > > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > > > > malefic > > > > > > > then > > > > > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but will > > cause > > > much > > > > > > > > > > unwantered > > > > > > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and > > suffering > > > > > > during > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > desa as > > > > > > > > > > > > well. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna - > > > > > > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and 10th > > > > > house > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > Taurus > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna > > > > > > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha > Ratnakara & > > > > > Leghu > > > > > > > > > Jataka > > > > > > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - > Saturn > > > CANNOT > > > > > > give > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > full > > > > > > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. (exalted > in > > > 6th > > > > > > > > > > debilitated > > > > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus). > > > > > > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only > expect " a > > > > > > fairly > > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > period " > > > > > > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the > > > > > continuation > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job front > some > > > > > > special > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the > significator > > of > > > 10th > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > owns > > > > > > > > > > > 10th > > > > > > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating > > > service. > > > > > > Thus > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > native in > > > > > > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the beneficial > > > results > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > Saturn > > > > > > > > > > > during > > > > > > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the fact > > that > > > it > > > > > > gives > > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > > > much > > > > > > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after > much > > > delay > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > > > etc - > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing " fairly > good > > > > > > results " > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > excellent. > > > > > > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde CANNOT > be > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet! > > > > > > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- --- > > > Why delete messages? Unlimited storage is just a click away. > > > > > Share files, take polls, and discuss your passions - all under one roof. > > > > Do you get hundreds of mails everyday? Delete none. Go to http://in.rd./tagline_mail_9/*https://edit.india./c onfig/eval_register > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2007 Report Share Posted December 31, 2007 dear mehta ji, this is the first time i have come across such a unique explanation of the effect of retro planets. is there any text to back this??? warm regards, vinita Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2008 Report Share Posted January 1, 2008 Dear Goel ji, Yes, that was really an informative mail. Thanks. Love and regards, Sreenadh , " vinita kumar " <shankar_mamta wrote: > > Dear Goelji, > > MAny thanks for your informative message. i am looking forward to > your subsequent messages in this regard. > > warm regards, > vinita > , Gopal Goel > <gkgoel1937@> wrote: > > > > Dear Vinita Kumar and other Friends, > > Astrology does not belong to any particular person , this is a > very useful branch of knoweldge and extend its help to huminity in > all walks of life. > > Then there is no scope ti fight on the basic princples of > astrology , which were developed over past 5000 - 6ooo years by the > persons of great repute and wisdom. > > I will make an attempt to explain various issues one by one in my > successive mails. > > Topic of this mail - Exaltation , Mooltrikona and own house of > planets > > > > There is a general dictum that a planet in Exaltation gives full > auspicious results , in Mooltrikona 75%. Own house 50%. > > Sun - Own sign and Mooltrikona is Leo , Exaltation is Aries. > > There is no problem if Sun in Aries, but if Sun is placed in > leo , should it be considered in own or mooltrikona sign. > > IN SUCH A SITUATION TEXTS GIVES US DIRECTION: > > In case Sun is placed in 1st 20 degree of Leo it is considered > as if it is placed in its Mooltrikona sign and rest of the portion > of sign is > > considered as if it is placed in its Own sign.The Sun is lord of > sign Leo. > > Let us take the case of Mercury: > > It owns Gemini and Virgo . Virgo is its own ,mooltrikona as well > as exaltation sign. If Mercury is placed in Virgo , upto 15deg is > its exaltation , next 5deg is mooltrikona . > > and rest is own sign.Thus basically this rule is devised to know > the degree of auspicious results when Mercury is placed in sign > Virgo. > > For calculating duration Dsaa periods in char dasa's etc , or > longevity , WHOLE SIGN VIRGO IS CONSIDERED AS EXALTATION SIGN. > > Moon : > > Taurus is its exaltation sign upto 3deg and rest of the sign is > considered as its mooltrikona , when Moon is placed in Taurus. > > Otherwise Taurus is considered its exaltation sign and Cancer is > only considered its own sign( In the case of all other planets > Mooltrikona sign also acts > > as their own sign also) > > EVERY RULE IS GIVEN FOR SPECIFIC USE AND PURPOSE. > > In my next mail , I will try to explain some nice features on > inter friendship of planets . All of you know it , still it is quite > interesting to discuss. > > In my subsequent mail , I will try to explain the secrets of > retrograde planets. > > Regards > > > > G.K.GOEL > > Ph: 09350311433 > > Add: L-409, SARITA VIHAR > > NEW DELHI-110 076 > > INDIA > > > > > > > > > > chiranjiv mehta <vchiranjiv@> > > > > Monday, 31 December, 2007 1:25:42 PM > > Re: Re: Exalted retro, a grey > area > > > > Dear All, > > To my knowledge any planet retrogade in the birth chart will give > results during current/transit when it becomes retrogade. Thus it > implies that it will not give results ( whatever they may be) in > forward motion. > > Thus a planet in exalation in transit will give adverse/vipreet > results to the native when it goes retrogade and during > time/duration of being retrogade unless,in the native's birt chart > that precise planet is retrogade.. > > A planet if retrogade and exalated in birthchart will give results > during its backward motion, including in its house of exalation in > cuurent transit. > > Phew ! > > --- On Sun, 30/12/07, vinita kumar <shankar_mamta@ ..co. uk> > wrote: > > > > vinita kumar <shankar_mamta@ .co. uk> > > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Exalted retro, a grey area > > ancient_indian_ astrology > > Sunday, 30 December, 2007, 1:26 AM > > > > > > Of course, since i don't know the subject i cannot pick up a fight > > with Shreenu (just want a change from calling him Shreenadhji > > > > but still i would like to fight with him sometimes. > > > > Now Shreenu ji, are there not branches and branches of astrology? > > Now Shreehuji, aren't there some other pundits who too have > studied > > astrology from a guru or from ancient texts...maybe not the same > > texts as u have???? > > > > Now shreenuji, how is it that degrees are important only for varga > > charts and not for anything else...? why then categorise planets > as > > in baala avastha, or as vriddha, or as asta, etc., etc....but then > u > > will tell me that there is no truth in such things and that these > > are mere distortions that have crept into ancient texts thru > > manipulations! > > > > Now shreenuji, are chara karakas which rely only on degrees, also > > bakwas not backed by authentic texts???? > > > > if i know u, u will only laugh at these questions. But look, i > tried > > my best to pick up a fight with u, Shreenuji > > > > but then u have a very logical answer too...these are not part of > > the construct that u have studied!!!! > > > > actually i am still not convinced, Shreenuji, why degrees do not > > matter at all in a sign...when the entire astrology is based on > > degrees??? > > > > but then not having studied a single shloka in sanskrit from an > > original text, its an unequal fight, isn't it???? > > > > love, > > veenu > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology@ . > com, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > Dear RKDashji, > > > > > > Thank you for the clarification. Srinadhji has clarified that > > > Retrograde + exalted is not equal to debilated. If you ask me > how > > to > > > test his ability to declare so, :)I dont know. As an author of > so > > > many books, as a person who has read the original texts, when > > > compared to me who has only read a few astro books that are all > > > translations, let me assume he is correct until somebody else > come > > > and prove it is otherwise. > > > > > > I know you were just joking about fighting with Srinadhji, > but > > > still let me say, I have an aversion towards non-stop threads if > > they > > > give signals of conflicts. As of now, Srinadhji has made his > stand > > > clear. So I thought I will keep silence:)(somebody has to put an > > end > > > ultimately). Though I dont wish to fight, it would be good if we > > know > > > from where this notion of exalted retro = debilated came.. If no > > texts > > > say so, we can rule out the existence of such a rule, once and > for > > > all. > > > > > > By the way, Srinadhji has suggested his opinion about the > authors > > of > > > the books by reading which I studied the ABC of astrology. So I > am > > > now in a doubt, what if many of my understanding are wrong??(. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, rk dash > > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi, > > > > I was about to tell you your Me is in the swakshetra portion: > > 21 > > > to 30 degree Virgo. Your Me, which is at 29 degree, however > > gnerates > > > a veritable wellspring of yogas. So how do we test the ability > of > > > Sreenadh to declare that this retrogression is not pulling the > > planet > > > down? If you are content with Sreenadh's reply I will not > > instigate > > > you to fight him (on my behalf). > > > > > > > > Now, you have bhadra yoga (OK, lakshna, rare qualities as per > > > Goel Saab) taking place in 4th, house of learning, caused by 4th > > > lord. Not just that your lagna lord is gnerating this yoga. With > > > third lord (planet king) that makes you, industrious, intrepid, > > pure- > > > hearted, clear headed, quite learned. And good at communcation. > > > Debilitated effects of Me would not be putting you up here. > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > jyothi_b_lakshmi <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > You may be right. I just assumed the popular authors to be > > correct > > > as > > > > there are rare chances of their interpretation going wrong. I > > > checked > > > > books by other authors, NE Muthuswamy has also said the same > > > (Merucury > > > > is exalted within 15 degrees, 16-20-Moola trikona and the rest > > > > swakshetra). So I thought I will ensure about that. Thank you > > for > > > > clarifying that exalted retro is not equal to debilated. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " Sreenadh " > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi ji, > > > > > I cannot go and correct all the texts in the universe - or > > even > > > > I may > > > > > not be correct at times; because I am no authority. This is > > due > > > to > > > > this > > > > > very fact that I always request people to depend on > > > the " originals " , > > > > > i.e. the Rishi horas, the quotes from age-old ancient texts. > > > > > Considering the whole sign as exalted is not my opinion, but > > the > > > > > opinion of Daksha Prajapati (student of Skanda) as he puts > it > > in > > > > Brihat > > > > > Prajaptya. Since you are from Kerala, refer to Hridyapdha > > vyakhya > > > of > > > > > Brihat Jataka by Kaikulangara Ramavaryar. It is one of the > best > > > > > reference you can get regarding the ancient Rishi Horas. > > > > > By the ways - Sampoorna Jataka Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair, is > one > > of > > > > the > > > > > worst texts I have ever seen; it seems that he was NEVER a > > > practical > > > > > astrologer. :=) > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RKDashji,Srinadhji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, it would be really helpful if Srinadhji can once and > > for > > > all > > > > > > settle this. I revisited the books I have read to check > how > > I > > > made > > > > > > such a mistake in understanding. But the books (Sampoorna > > Jataka > > > > > > Ganitham by Dr.PS Nair) say " Mercury is exalted in first > 15 > > > > degrees > > > > > > of Mercury and out of that 15th degree is the deep > > exaltation > > > > point " . > > > > > > The book doesnt say Mercury is exalted in the entire 30 > > degrees > > > > and > > > > > > out of that first 15 is the deep exaltation. > > > > > > > > > > > > So my confusion resurfaces. Any scholars have an answer, > do > > let > > > me > > > > > > know. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology@ . > com, " arkaydash " > > > > > > arkaydash@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > > Why don't you quickly clarify this as Sister Jyothi > frames > > > the > > > > grey > > > > > > > area? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Like mercury is exalted only in first > > > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises whether > > after > > > > this > > > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as > > exalted? > > > > If it > > > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro= debilated will not work, > > > because > > > > as > > > > > > per > > > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted.. The problem is > > that > > > > people > > > > > > > who wrote down all these rules never gave a satsifactory > > > > explanation > > > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why can't you remove the word 'eternally' from the last > > quoted > > > > > > > sentence from our sister? Would you say Jyothi's Me is > > > > EFFECTIVELY > > > > > > > debilitated while, say, Einstein's in Pi (and possibly > > yours > > > in > > > > > > > Scorpio for some other reason) is as good as exalted? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, you mean all the 30 degrees of the exaltation > > sign > > > > would > > > > > > > apply in pulling down a retro planet in its exaltation > > sign? > > > > Settle > > > > > > > this for once and all, for this forum at least. Why > should > > we > > > > wait > > > > > > > till we touch Sign Base! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for the info. I guess, it was my mistake in > > > > > > understanding. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " Sreenadh " > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyotiji and Vinta ji, > > > > > > > > > Exaltation means " Sign of Exaltation " . If Sun is in > > Aries, > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > ever it be in Aries- it is exalted. It is just that > 10 > > > > degree > > > > > > > (i.e. > > > > > > > > 9.00 > > > > > > > > > to 10.00) is the maximum degree of exaltation or deep > > > > > > exaltation > > > > > > > > degree > > > > > > > > > of Sun in Aries. Same holds true for all the other > > planets > > > > > > > > regarding > > > > > > > > > their exaltation debilitation Signs and deep > exaltation > > > > > > > debilitation > > > > > > > > > degrees. > > > > > > > > > It is only for the Moola triknona concept that the > > concept > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > particular degrees span within the sign applies. > Also > > note > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > none > > > > > > > > > use this Moolatrikona concept much in natal > > horoscopes :=) > > > > > > Yes, > > > > > > > > > Moolatrikona concept can be intuitively applied in > > natal > > > > chart > > > > > > > > reading > > > > > > > > > and prasna as done by many traditional astrologers - > > but > > > > please > > > > > > > > don't > > > > > > > > > divert the discussion into this, since we will > discuss > > it > > > in > > > > > > > detail > > > > > > > > > later when we speak about " Sign Base " result > derivation > > > > > > > techniques > > > > > > > > used > > > > > > > > > in 7-fold. > > > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinithaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even I had so much of confusions about retro > exalted > > > after > > > > > > > reading > > > > > > > > > > from some books that such planets will behave as > > > > debilated. > > > > > > > > > > Especially when there is a range of degrees only > > within > > > > which > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > planet is said to be exalted. (Like mercury is > > exalted > > > > only > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > first > > > > > > > > > > 15 degrees). So again this confusion arises > whether > > > after > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > specified range, can't a planet be considered as > > > exalted? > > > > If > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > cannot, then exalted+retro= debilated will not > work, > > > > because > > > > > > as > > > > > > > per > > > > > > > > > > that rule the planet is not exalted. The problem > is > > that > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > wrote down all these rules never gave a > satsifactory > > > > > > explanation > > > > > > > > > > themselves. So we are eternally confused. Each one > > can > > > go > > > > by > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > experience, but as you said, it varies globally. > > > Anyway, I > > > > > > think > > > > > > > > > > retrograde planets gain strength as is again said > by > > the > > > > > > texts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BTW, my mercury is in 29 degrees:). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " vinita > > > > > > kumar " > > > > > > > > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Jyothi and Shreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > actually, i too rely on experience for deriving > > > > > > conclusions. > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > trouble with such derivations, u will agree, is > > that > > > > they > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > localised and may not be universal. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since i have picked up bits and pieces of > > information > > > > from > > > > > > > here > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > there rather than from systematic research or > > > readings > > > > of > > > > > > > > original > > > > > > > > > > > texts it is difficult to attribute correctness > to > > > these > > > > > > > > statements. > > > > > > > > > > > there are several places where i have come > across > > the > > > > > > > statement > > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > an exalted retro planet acts as a debilitated > > > > planet...but > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > to introduce some refinement in this statement > as > > is > > > > > > evident > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > > the following message: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gbp_kumar > > > > > > > > > > > > Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:31:47 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: How Retrogate Planet work? > 28/7 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>Milan > > > > > > > > > > > > one of my Gurus late sri K. ashwatappa an > > engineer > > > > with 14 > > > > > > > > > > academic > > > > > > > > > > > > records/degrees] learnt sanskrit, astrology at > > 55 > > > he > > > > also > > > > > > > co- > > > > > > > > > > > founded > > > > > > > > > > > > ICAS with BV RAMAN said > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > treat planets strong , benefic till they reach > > the > > > > > > exalted > > > > > > > > point > > > > > > > > > > > back > > > > > > > > > > > > wards and weak if after it > > > > > > > > > > > > say Guru if retro after 3 deg or 5 deg kataka > or > > > even > > > > 2 > > > > > > Deg > > > > > > > > > > Makara > > > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > > > is good, but if he is reterro before 2d eg 59 > > min in > > > > > > kataka > > > > > > > > treat > > > > > > > > > > > it as > > > > > > > > > > > > neeca retro > > > > > > > > > > > > and so on<== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlew isdom.com/ Article/Vedic- > > Astrology- > > > > 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is somewhat in contradiction with another > > write- > > > up > > > > at: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.articlew isdom.com/ Article/Vedic- > > Astrology- > > > > 38/93 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==>The strengths of planets are measured in > Rupas. > > A > > > > Rupa > > > > > > > > consists > > > > > > > > > > > of 60 > > > > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1) Exaltation Strength - Occhabala > > > > > > > > > > > Occhabala is the Exaltation strength. For > > instance,the > > > > > > largest > > > > > > > > > > > planet Jupiter is deeply exalted at 5 degrees > > Cancer. > > > > At 5 > > > > > > > > degrees > > > > > > > > > > > Cancer, Jupiter attains a full strength of 60 > > > > Shashtiamsas > > > > > > or > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > Rupa. All planets have certain Exaltation points > ( > > > > > > > > Oochabhagas ) & > > > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Points ( Neechabhagas ). > > > > > > > > > > > When a planet occupies its Oochabhaga, it gets > One > > > rupa > > > > or > > > > > > 60 > > > > > > > > > > > Shashtiamsas of Oochabala. On the contrary, when > it > > > > > > occupies > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point( Neechabhaga ), there is Zero > > > > Oochabala. > > > > > > > > There > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > a gradual increase of Exaltation Strength from > the > > > > > > > Debilitation > > > > > > > > > > > Point ( Neechabhaga) to the Exaltation Point ( > > > > > > Ucchabhaga ) , > > > > > > > > until > > > > > > > > > > > at last the Bala reaches its maximum at the > > > Oochabhaga. > > > > > > > > Conversely, > > > > > > > > > > > there is a gradual decrease of Oochabala from the > > > > > > Exaltation > > > > > > > > Point > > > > > > > > > > > to the Debilitation Point till the minimum is > > reached > > > > at the > > > > > > > > > > > Debilitation Point > > > > > > > > > > > ( Neechabhaga ) . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Deduct the Debilitation Point from a planet's > > > longitude > > > > and > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > get > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > Oocchabala. If it is in excess of 180 degrees, > > deduct > > > it > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > 360 > > > > > > > > > > > degrees & > > > > > > > > > > > divide the difference by 3. This will give the > > > > Oocchabala > > > > > > of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > planet. > > > > > > > > > > > This is the formula for Occhabala > > > > > > > > > > > Oochabala = (Planet's Longitude - Its > Debilitation > > > > Point) * > > > > > > > > 60/180 > > > > > > > > > > > = ( Planet's Longitude - Its Debilitation > > Point ) / 3 > > > > <== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This does not mention anything abt. oochabala > > becoming > > > > > > > > neechabala > > > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > account of retrogression. .. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For me retro saturn is placed at 9* libra....so > it > > > > should be > > > > > > > > > > > debilitated according to the first > statement!!! ? > > But > > > > then > > > > > > it > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > given me good results during antardashas, as it > > > should, > > > > > > going > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > second statement and by Shreenadh!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can u check the degree of your Mercury, Jyothi? > > (So u > > > r > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > Gemini?!...i am not surprised!) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love, > > > > > > > > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " jyothi_b_lakshmi " > > > > > > > > > > > <jyothi_b_lakshmi@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Srinadhji, Vinitaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do not know if exalted retro behaves as > > > debilated. > > > > But > > > > > > if > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > am > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > say my experience, I had Mercury, 4th lord > > (exalted > > > > retro > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > 4th) > > > > > > > > > > > > dasa till 4 years. Though 3-4 years are just > the > > > baby > > > > > > > stages > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > ones > > > > > > > > > > > > education, I had got 2 silver medals and 2 > > > > certificates > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > Kerala > > > > > > > > > > > > govt (each for studies and drawing) within > that > > last > > > > > > phase > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > mercury. So I think as you said, benefic if > > exalted > > > > retro > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > excellent results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Jyothi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " Sreenadh " > > > > > > > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==> > > > > > > > > > > > > > retro exalted planet (and therefore neech) > > giving > > > > good > > > > > > > > results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > <== > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh!! That is really something new to me! > > > Retrograde > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > exaltation should be considered as > > debilitated? !! > > > I > > > > > > don't > > > > > > > > think > > > > > > > > > > > so. > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > > > > > benefic > > > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > > > > surely give > > > > > > > > > > > > > excellent good results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Retrograde planet in exaltation, if it is a > > > > > > malefic > > > > > > > > then > > > > > > > > > > > will > > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > > good results by the end of the dasa, but > will > > > cause > > > > much > > > > > > > > > > > unwantered > > > > > > > > > > > > > trouble, hard work, wandering (travel) and > > > suffering > > > > > > > during > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > > desa as > > > > > > > > > > > > > well. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to Sa in 6th for Taurus Lagna - > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Sa is yogakaraka because it owns 9th and > 10th > > > > > > house > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > > Taurus > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna > > > > > > > > > > > > > * But many classics such as Bhavartha > > Ratnakara & > > > > > > Leghu > > > > > > > > > > Jataka > > > > > > > > > > > > > presents a corollary and indicate that - > > Saturn > > > > CANNOT > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > full > > > > > > > > > > > > > results as yogakaraka for Tarus laga. > (exalted > > in > > > > 6th > > > > > > > > > > > debilitated > > > > > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12th from Tarus). > > > > > > > > > > > > > Combining these two points we can only > > expect " a > > > > > > > fairly > > > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > > period " > > > > > > > > > > > > > in the Antar dasa of Saturn; i.e. Almost the > > > > > > continuation > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > > > > the native was experiencing. On the Job > front > > some > > > > > > > special > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > > results > > > > > > > > > > > > > can be expected because, Sa is the > > significator > > > of > > > > 10th > > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > owns > > > > > > > > > > > > 10th > > > > > > > > > > > > > house, and is placed in 6th house indicating > > > > service. > > > > > > > Thus > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > native in > > > > > > > > > > > > > service will definitely receive the > beneficial > > > > results > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > Saturn > > > > > > > > > > > > during > > > > > > > > > > > > > this period. But otherwise owning to the > fact > > > that > > > > it > > > > > > > gives > > > > > > > > too > > > > > > > > > > > much > > > > > > > > > > > > > travel, hard word, efforts fructifying after > > much > > > > delay > > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > > > > etc - > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > period can be said only as providing " fairly > > good > > > > > > > results " > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > > excellent. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note: The exalted planet in retrograde > CANNOT > > be > > > > > > > > considered > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > debilitation. It IS an Exalted planet! > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- --- > > > > Why delete messages? Unlimited storage is just a click away. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Share files, take polls, and discuss your passions - all under one > roof. > > > > > > > > Do you get hundreds of mails everyday? Delete none. Go to > http://in.rd./tagline_mail_9/*https://edit.india./c > onfig/eval_register > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2008 Report Share Posted January 1, 2008 Dear RKji, I think there are few things that are getting blown up: 1) Astrology belongs to everyone and there are NO individual owners. We all agree. 2) Yes there are rules laid down in the astro_classics, and nobody has contested it 3) Nobody has arrogated to that level as stated in your original email. For this group clearly mentioned again and again that there are NO gurus - but only students of astrology, learning with heart, NOT with a intent -MIND. 4) I myself has not read many astro_literature of the same is in south-indian libraries, do not know the process of accessing them and partly for want to time. 5) " Jyotish Group " mentions on its home page that the group has been graced by Sri K.N. Rao, but it was the same Sri K.N. Rao who said in the same group one day, when he was fighting the Astrology education case in Supreme Court, NO one in the group has offered their services or help whatsoever. i.e. expression of help. 6) Jyotish Group does have some noble hearted members including Bhaskar. 7) It is NOT my intent to paint them black, but to highlight the hypocrisy of Indians in general. 8) If somebody has done some good work in bringing out astro_literature and is willing to share it across without any restrictions, why indulge in individual slanging ? 9) Let the subject of astrology be our focus, rather than the individuals. Example : Sri K.N. Rao seldom said anything against Mr. Finn Wandahl, though he differed with him on few occassions - for a single point that Mr. Finn has done sufficiently well in promoting astrology. Similarly, Sri K.N. Rao never said a word against Late Sri B.V. Raman except on technical reasons of Ayanamsa issues, where everybody is entitled to uphold their own personal reasons. 10) Find contesting points on the " subject " should it deviate or express something contradicting to well known or accepted norms Example: Some controversy of Rahu/Ketu aspects. Few consider only dispositor theory, but respected exponents like Late Sri Sitaram Jha have considered special aspects, in their published books. 11) The astro_literature is so huge that would take alteast 10 years in just reading them. That is what I realized during my personal association with Late Sri C.S. Patel after looking at his persona library, though he has written only 5 books, what knowledge went into those 5 books is beyond many many peoples imagination. 12) So my concluding request to members is NOT to get influenced by anyone other than by sheer sujbect itself. Do not be conduits or messengers of other. Go by your own convinctions and debate on them where necessary. By doing so, you may forget or lose your own character one day. What is our contribution to the subject of astrology, that we start casting aspersions on others ?? I myself against self proclaimed Visionaries or Gurus. Let the space provided by corporation, be used intelligently than to satisfy our personal whims & fancies. With regards, Sreeram_Srinivas , rk dash <arkaydash wrote: Dear Group: The point made by Goel Saab is of great salience. There are rules/features about planets that are for longevity calculation pupose, eg. It is easy go about throwing one's weight after reading astrology for seven or ten years, arrogating to oneself the 'know-it-all' wisdom of a rishi. Let's hear the prabudhha. And humbly. RK Gopal Goel gkgoel1937 wrote: Dear Vinita Kumar and other Friends, Astrology does not belong to any particular person , this is a very useful branch of knoweldge and extend its help to huminity in all walks of life. Then there is no scope ti fight on the basic princples of astrology , which were developed over past 5000 - 6ooo years by the persons of great repute and wisdom. I will make an attempt to explain various issues one by one in my successive mails. Topic of this mail - Exaltation , Mooltrikona and own house of planets There is a general dictum that a planet in Exaltation gives full auspicious results , in Mooltrikona 75%. Own house 50%. Sun - Own sign and Mooltrikona is Leo , Exaltation is Aries. There is no problem if Sun in Aries, but if Sun is placed in leo , should it be considered in own or mooltrikona sign. IN SUCH A SITUATION TEXTS GIVES US DIRECTION: In case Sun is placed in 1st 20 degree of Leo it is considered as if it is placed in its Mooltrikona sign and rest of the portion of sign is considered as if it is placed in its Own sign.The Sun is lord of sign Leo. Let us take the case of Mercury: It owns Gemini and Virgo . Virgo is its own ,mooltrikona as well as exaltation sign. If Mercury is placed in Virgo , upto 15deg is its exaltation , next 5deg is mooltrikona . and rest is own sign.Thus basically this rule is devised to know the degree of auspicious results when Mercury is placed in sign Virgo. For calculating duration Dsaa periods in char dasa's etc , or longevity , WHOLE SIGN VIRGO IS CONSIDERED AS EXALTATION SIGN. Moon : Taurus is its exaltation sign upto 3deg and rest of the sign is considered as its mooltrikona , when Moon is placed in Taurus. Otherwise Taurus is considered its exaltation sign and Cancer is only considered its own sign( In the case of all other planets Mooltrikona sign also acts as their own sign also) EVERY RULE IS GIVEN FOR SPECIFIC USE AND PURPOSE. In my next mail , I will try to explain some nice features on inter friendship of planets . All of you know it , still it is quite interesting to discuss. In my subsequent mail , I will try to explain the secrets of retrograde planets. Regards G.K.GOEL Ph: 09350311433 Add: L-409, SARITA VIHAR NEW DELHI-110 076 INDIA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.