Guest guest Posted June 14, 2006 Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 Dear Vinita ji, ==> > why talk of " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " - there were half a dozen > fingers pointing in the same direction. <== That is an absurd question since " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " is a statement that should be applied to EVERY result predicted. No result predicted should override this rule. It is at the foundations of astrology, since astrology is a system that tries to predict MOST PROBABLE event or possibility. Only " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " helps us in understanding that 'here the possibility increases, and so this may happen for sure, and so we should predict this result'. Any person, who go against this is violating the fundamentals of astrology, and the responsibility for errors in his predictions does not go neither to the system of astrology, nor to the Rishis. Then he alone becomes responsible for whatever (punaya or papa) he gains through those statements. Always keep this in mind. A sincere student of astrology should be humbly obedient to the words of Rishis, understand the fundamentals, and shouldn't violate basic rules. If we do so then the responsibility is with us and we can't blame anybody or the system for wrong predictions. Violating the " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " rule is a serious offence against the total astrological system - please keep it in mind. Why not many husbands? ---------------------- Clearly put your question is, If multiple initiations are predicted based on some planetary indications about 'twice', then for this horoscope - Why not many husbands? Why can't we predict (why didn't you predict) multiple marriages? Why can't we predict multiple sexual parterres? Why not many illicit relations? Ok. I will address this question in the next mail, and analyze the 7th house of your chart based on the same " Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval " rule. Love, Sreenadh , " vinita kumar " <shankar_mamta wrote: > > Dear Shreenadh, > > I didn't think that I would break the promise of not asking trivial > questions so quickly, but when I read your message again I felt like > responding and also giving feedback. Hope u don't mind. > First some further comments on your analysis: > > 1. One of the prime rules of checking 2 or more > possibilities , " DwiTri samvada bhaval " looks good. > > 2. I liked your interpretation of Punarbhu. All this while I > thought that this was only in the context of marriage. You have > given an interesting twist to the meaning! > > 3. The principle of " Swache Trisamgunam " is the most > interesting of all. My question is that if this principle applies to > multiple gurus, why does it not apply to multiple partners (the > Venus connection) > > 4. You have quoted Mihira about " Dwibharyordhi " in the context > of Venus in Cancer and 2 in the context of Moon in Cancer, " Serkshe > Dwi samgunam " and Saturn aspecting Venus and Moon from Libra also > signifying two. > > 5. While talking of twos u could add one more, but this is not > related to Venus but to Mercury being Swakshetra in the 2nd House / > house of attractions (Chapter 26 Shloka 14 of BPHS) and in Gemini to > boot! > > 6. Another evidence, (for which I think I should acknowledge > Vernaji), is the placement of Ketu ruler of 7th in 2nd!!! > > So why talk of " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " - there were half a dozen > fingers pointing in the same direction. > > Let me share with you that one of the main reasons why I started > digging into astrology some time back was because I became acutely > aware of those half a dozen accusing fingers. > > When I shared my horoscope with others I could sense their > reluctance to be frank with me. I even thought I heard some > snickers. I felt like a fallen woman without having fallen. When I > gave my feedback one person even went to the extent of telling me > that I was telling untruth (a euphemism for lying) – so much for > having Jupiter in the Second House!!!. > > I have shared with u that the Moon MD has brought about a > transformation that I could not have imagined. From a shy, > diffident, unsure person I now feel that I can take on the whole > world. There has also been a flowering of emotions and perhaps there > were possibilities (more imagined than real) which were never > allowed to fructify in the area of relationships / kalatra. The > main reason was that I became extremely conscious of dharma in > marriage. Of course marriage was not a bed of roses – but finding my > way to accept and love my husband the way he is has been a long and > challenging journey. And in more than twenty years of our marriage > nobody can dare raise a finger at my fidelity. > > I personally think that all this has something to do with my Guru's > grace. I also believe in free will. I am convinced now (again with > Gurus's grace) that consciousness and awareness has a big role to > play in making us who we are and what we want to become. > > My questions are: > > 1. Why should I feel so joyous in the MD of Moon when Moon is > debilitated in Navamsa? > 2. Why the principle of multiplicity applicable to Guru did not > happen for Kalatra? > > I have a well formed non-astrological reason to explain 2. But > astrologically don't u think that Saturn is the biggest benefic for > Taurus Lagna and what it allowed to happen for the Guru it stopped > from happening for Kalatra??? > > I shall eagerly await your answer. > > Love, > > Vinita > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 14, 2006 Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 Dear Sreenadh ji, Here's another ignoramus who will be taxing your patience. I have missed a lot but hope to pick up the little bits and pieces that emnate from your posts here. I wanted to know what Vara Hora was. Thankfully, in answer to Vinita ji's post you pointed out that it is Brihat Jataka. Now, here in answering Vinita ji's mail you refer "Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval". I believe that it is some principle in Sanskrit. Could be kind enough to render all Sanskrit words with their translation so that the less privileged persons like me could understand and thus learn. Thank you. David Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Vinita ji,==>> why talk of "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" - there were half a dozen > fingers pointing in the same direction.<==That is an absurd question since "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" is a statement that should be applied to EVERY result predicted. No result predicted should override this rule. It is at the foundations of astrology, since astrology is a system that tries to predict MOST PROBABLE event or possibility. Only "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" helps us in understanding that 'here the possibility increases, and so this may happen for sure, and so we should predict this result'. Any person, who go against this is violating the fundamentals of astrology, and the responsibility for errors in his predictions does not go neither to the system of astrology, nor to the Rishis. Then he alone becomes responsible for whatever (punaya or papa) he gains through those statements. Always keep this in mind. A sincere student of astrology should be humbly obedient to the words of Rishis, understand the fundamentals, and shouldn't violate basic rules. If we do so then the responsibility is with us and we can't blame anybody or the system for wrong predictions. Violating the "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" rule is a serious offence against the total astrological system - please keep it in mind. :)Why not many husbands?----------------------Clearly put your question is, If multiple initiations are predicted based on some planetary indications about 'twice', then for this horoscope -Why not many husbands? Why can't we predict (why didn't you predict) multiple marriages? Why can't we predict multiple sexual parterres? Why not many illicit relations?Ok. I will address this question in the next mail, and analyze the 7th house of your chart based on the same "Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval" rule. :)Love,Sreenadh , "vinita kumar" <shankar_mamta wrote:>> Dear Shreenadh,> > I didn't think that I would break the promise of not asking trivial > questions so quickly, but when I read your message again I felt like > responding and also giving feedback. Hope u don't mind.> First some further comments on your analysis:> > 1. One of the prime rules of checking 2 or more > possibilities , "DwiTri samvada bhaval" looks good.> > 2. I liked your interpretation of Punarbhu. All this while I > thought that this was only in the context of marriage. You have > given an interesting twist to the meaning!> > 3. The principle of "Swache Trisamgunam" is the most > interesting of all. My question is that if this principle applies to > multiple gurus, why does it not apply to multiple partners (the > Venus connection)> > 4. You have quoted Mihira about "Dwibharyordhi" in the context > of Venus in Cancer and 2 in the context of Moon in Cancer, "Serkshe > Dwi samgunam" and Saturn aspecting Venus and Moon from Libra also > signifying two.> > 5. While talking of twos u could add one more, but this is not > related to Venus but to Mercury being Swakshetra in the 2nd House / > house of attractions (Chapter 26 Shloka 14 of BPHS) and in Gemini to > boot!> > 6. Another evidence, (for which I think I should acknowledge > Vernaji), is the placement of Ketu ruler of 7th in 2nd!!!> > So why talk of "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" - there were half a dozen > fingers pointing in the same direction.> > Let me share with you that one of the main reasons why I started > digging into astrology some time back was because I became acutely > aware of those half a dozen accusing fingers. > > When I shared my horoscope with others I could sense their > reluctance to be frank with me. I even thought I heard some > snickers. I felt like a fallen woman without having fallen. When I > gave my feedback one person even went to the extent of telling me > that I was telling untruth (a euphemism for lying) – so much for > having Jupiter in the Second House!!!.> > I have shared with u that the Moon MD has brought about a > transformation that I could not have imagined. From a shy, > diffident, unsure person I now feel that I can take on the whole > world. There has also been a flowering of emotions and perhaps there > were possibilities (more imagined than real) which were never > allowed to fructify in the area of relationships / kalatra. The > main reason was that I became extremely conscious of dharma in > marriage. Of course marriage was not a bed of roses – but finding my > way to accept and love my husband the way he is has been a long and > challenging journey. And in more than twenty years of our marriage > nobody can dare raise a finger at my fidelity.> > I personally think that all this has something to do with my Guru's > grace. I also believe in free will. I am convinced now (again with > Gurus's grace) that consciousness and awareness has a big role to > play in making us who we are and what we want to become.> > My questions are:> > 1. Why should I feel so joyous in the MD of Moon when Moon is > debilitated in Navamsa?> 2. Why the principle of multiplicity applicable to Guru did not > happen for Kalatra?> > I have a well formed non-astrological reason to explain 2. But > astrologically don't u think that Saturn is the biggest benefic for > Taurus Lagna and what it allowed to happen for the Guru it stopped > from happening for Kalatra???> > I shall eagerly await your answer.> > Love,> > Vinita> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 14, 2006 Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 Dear Andrew ji, 'Varahora' is a typo may be vinita ji committed, the actual word is 'Varaha Hora'. This is another name for 'Brihat Jataka'. "Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval". The meaning is well explained in the previous mails. But to state it again. Dwi = 2; Tri = 3 ; Samvada bhaval = indicates/supports the same. "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" = If 2 or 3 (or more) (arguments) supports the same (result), (then only that result should be predicted) It is one of the rules that is very basic to the whole system of predicting results in astrology, since astrology tries to locate the 'most probable results'. This sloka bit, points to the importance of that probabilistic consideration. Each indication in horoscope is like a small wave that reinforces each other to form a big single tide. Love, Sreenadh David Andrews <dprapus wrote: Dear Sreenadh ji, Here's another ignoramus who will be taxing your patience. I have missed a lot but hope to pick up the little bits and pieces that emnate from your posts here. I wanted to know what Vara Hora was. Thankfully, in answer to Vinita ji's post you pointed out that it is Brihat Jataka. Now, here in answering Vinita ji's mail you refer "Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval". I believe that it is some principle in Sanskrit. Could be kind enough to render all Sanskrit words with their translation so that the less privileged persons like me could understand and thus learn. Thank you. David Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Vinita ji,==>> why talk of "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" - there were half a dozen > fingers pointing in the same direction.<==That is an absurd question since "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" is a statement that should be applied to EVERY result predicted. No result predicted should override this rule. It is at the foundations of astrology, since astrology is a system that tries to predict MOST PROBABLE event or possibility. Only "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" helps us in understanding that 'here the possibility increases, and so this may happen for sure, and so we should predict this result'. Any person, who go against this is violating the fundamentals of astrology, and the responsibility for errors in his predictions does not go neither to the system of astrology, nor to the Rishis. Then he alone becomes responsible for whatever (punaya or papa) he gains through those statements. Always keep this in mind. A sincere student of astrology should be humbly obedient to the words of Rishis, understand the fundamentals, and shouldn't violate basic rules. If we do so then the responsibility is with us and we can't blame anybody or the system for wrong predictions. Violating the "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" rule is a serious offence against the total astrological system - please keep it in mind. :)Why not many husbands?----------------------Clearly put your question is, If multiple initiations are predicted based on some planetary indications about 'twice', then for this horoscope -Why not many husbands? Why can't we predict (why didn't you predict) multiple marriages? Why can't we predict multiple sexual parterres? Why not many illicit relations?Ok. I will address this question in the next mail, and analyze the 7th house of your chart based on the same "Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval" rule. :)Love,Sreenadh , "vinita kumar" <shankar_mamta wrote:>> Dear Shreenadh,> > I didn't think that I would break the promise of not asking trivial > questions so quickly, but when I read your message again I felt like > responding and also giving feedback. Hope u don't mind.> First some further comments on your analysis:> > 1. One of the prime rules of checking 2 or more > possibilities , "DwiTri samvada bhaval" looks good.> > 2. I liked your interpretation of Punarbhu. All this while I > thought that this was only in the context of marriage. You have > given an interesting twist to the meaning!> > 3. The principle of "Swache Trisamgunam" is the most > interesting of all. My question is that if this principle applies to > multiple gurus, why does it not apply to multiple partners (the > Venus connection)> > 4. You have quoted Mihira about "Dwibharyordhi" in the context > of Venus in Cancer and 2 in the context of Moon in Cancer, "Serkshe > Dwi samgunam" and Saturn aspecting Venus and Moon from Libra also > signifying two.> > 5. While talking of twos u could add one more, but this is not > related to Venus but to Mercury being Swakshetra in the 2nd House / > house of attractions (Chapter 26 Shloka 14 of BPHS) and in Gemini to > boot!> > 6. Another evidence, (for which I think I should acknowledge > Vernaji), is the placement of Ketu ruler of 7th in 2nd!!!> > So why talk of "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" - there were half a dozen > fingers pointing in the same direction.> > Let me share with you that one of the main reasons why I started > digging into astrology some time back was because I became acutely > aware of those half a dozen accusing fingers. > > When I shared my horoscope with others I could sense their > reluctance to be frank with me. I even thought I heard some > snickers. I felt like a fallen woman without having fallen. When I > gave my feedback one person even went to the extent of telling me > that I was telling untruth (a euphemism for lying) – so much for > having Jupiter in the Second House!!!.> > I have shared with u that the Moon MD has brought about a > transformation that I could not have imagined. From a shy, > diffident, unsure person I now feel that I can take on the whole > world. There has also been a flowering of emotions and perhaps there > were possibilities (more imagined than real) which were never > allowed to fructify in the area of relationships / kalatra. The > main reason was that I became extremely conscious of dharma in > marriage. Of course marriage was not a bed of roses – but finding my > way to accept and love my husband the way he is has been a long and > challenging journey. And in more than twenty years of our marriage > nobody can dare raise a finger at my fidelity.> > I personally think that all this has something to do with my Guru's > grace. I also believe in free will. I am convinced now (again with > Gurus's grace) that consciousness and awareness has a big role to > play in making us who we are and what we want to become.> > My questions are:> > 1. Why should I feel so joyous in the MD of Moon when Moon is > debilitated in Navamsa?> 2. Why the principle of multiplicity applicable to Guru did not > happen for Kalatra?> > I have a well formed non-astrological reason to explain 2. But > astrologically don't u think that Saturn is the biggest benefic for > Taurus Lagna and what it allowed to happen for the Guru it stopped > from happening for Kalatra???> > I shall eagerly await your answer.> > Love,> > Vinita> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 14, 2006 Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 Dear Shreenadh, I think u misunderstood me completely. Where is the question of doubting anything that the maharishis wrote? It would be a reflection of deep, deep ignorance to even think like that. Of course I am ignorant, but not that ignorant to question anything the great rishis have said. If there are many pointers in the same direction, of course the probablity of the event occuring increases. Where is the question of disagreement? But though Mararishis were infallible, could we be fallible in our interpretations? That is the only point I was trying to suggest. Could there be something we are overlooking? Sometimes it is the obvious that strikes us not not what is not obvious. It is in this spirit that i suggested that whether the Guru (Saturn) has intervened and not let the probabilities take effect. I know the interpretation of Saturn in my chart is somewhat difficult since it is exalted as well as retro so that makes it debilitated too. I do respect u a lot and feel humbled by your knowledge of the ancient texts. I also feel grateful for your extreme patience in handling simple questions and devoting so much time and attention to explain things. Its only when interpretations do not tally with real life experiences that one wonders why it is so. All questions emanate from ignorance. But in all this ignorance there is not an iota of doubt about what the rishis said. I was only thinking in terms of whether we are missing something? Or is there something which " lies beyond the stars " and which the gurus know about? Love, Vinita , " Sreenadh " <sreesog wrote: > > Dear Vinita ji, > ==> > > why talk of " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " - there were half a dozen > > fingers pointing in the same direction. > <== > That is an absurd question since " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " is a > statement that should be applied to EVERY result predicted. No result > predicted should override this rule. It is at the foundations of > astrology, since astrology is a system that tries to predict MOST > PROBABLE event or possibility. Only " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " helps us > in understanding that 'here the possibility increases, and so this > may happen for sure, and so we should predict this result'. Any > person, who go against this is violating the fundamentals of > astrology, and the responsibility for errors in his predictions does > not go neither to the system of astrology, nor to the Rishis. Then he > alone becomes responsible for whatever (punaya or papa) he gains > through those statements. Always keep this in mind. A sincere student > of astrology should be humbly obedient to the words of Rishis, > understand the fundamentals, and shouldn't violate basic rules. If we > do so then the responsibility is with us and we can't blame anybody > or the system for wrong predictions. Violating the " Dwi Tri Samvada > bhaval " rule is a serious offence against the total astrological > system - please keep it in mind. > > Why not many husbands? > ---------------------- > Clearly put your question is, If multiple initiations are predicted > based on some planetary indications about 'twice', then for this > horoscope - > Why not many husbands? Why can't we predict (why didn't you predict) > multiple marriages? Why can't we predict multiple sexual parterres? > Why not many illicit relations? > > Ok. I will address this question in the next mail, and analyze the > 7th house of your chart based on the same " Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval " > rule. > Love, > Sreenadh > > > , " vinita kumar " > <shankar_mamta@> wrote: > > > > Dear Shreenadh, > > > > I didn't think that I would break the promise of not asking trivial > > questions so quickly, but when I read your message again I felt > like > > responding and also giving feedback. Hope u don't mind. > > First some further comments on your analysis: > > > > 1. One of the prime rules of checking 2 or more > > possibilities , " DwiTri samvada bhaval " looks good. > > > > 2. I liked your interpretation of Punarbhu. All this while I > > thought that this was only in the context of marriage. You have > > given an interesting twist to the meaning! > > > > 3. The principle of " Swache Trisamgunam " is the most > > interesting of all. My question is that if this principle applies > to > > multiple gurus, why does it not apply to multiple partners (the > > Venus connection) > > > > 4. You have quoted Mihira about " Dwibharyordhi " in the context > > of Venus in Cancer and 2 in the context of Moon in Cancer, " Serkshe > > Dwi samgunam " and Saturn aspecting Venus and Moon from Libra also > > signifying two. > > > > 5. While talking of twos u could add one more, but this is not > > related to Venus but to Mercury being Swakshetra in the 2nd House / > > house of attractions (Chapter 26 Shloka 14 of BPHS) and in Gemini > to > > boot! > > > > 6. Another evidence, (for which I think I should acknowledge > > Vernaji), is the placement of Ketu ruler of 7th in 2nd!!! > > > > So why talk of " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " - there were half a dozen > > fingers pointing in the same direction. > > > > Let me share with you that one of the main reasons why I started > > digging into astrology some time back was because I became acutely > > aware of those half a dozen accusing fingers. > > > > When I shared my horoscope with others I could sense their > > reluctance to be frank with me. I even thought I heard some > > snickers. I felt like a fallen woman without having fallen. When I > > gave my feedback one person even went to the extent of telling me > > that I was telling untruth (a euphemism for lying) – so much for > > having Jupiter in the Second House!!!. > > > > I have shared with u that the Moon MD has brought about a > > transformation that I could not have imagined. From a shy, > > diffident, unsure person I now feel that I can take on the whole > > world. There has also been a flowering of emotions and perhaps > there > > were possibilities (more imagined than real) which were never > > allowed to fructify in the area of relationships / kalatra. The > > main reason was that I became extremely conscious of dharma in > > marriage. Of course marriage was not a bed of roses – but finding > my > > way to accept and love my husband the way he is has been a long and > > challenging journey. And in more than twenty years of our marriage > > nobody can dare raise a finger at my fidelity. > > > > I personally think that all this has something to do with my Guru's > > grace. I also believe in free will. I am convinced now (again with > > Gurus's grace) that consciousness and awareness has a big role to > > play in making us who we are and what we want to become. > > > > My questions are: > > > > 1. Why should I feel so joyous in the MD of Moon when Moon is > > debilitated in Navamsa? > > 2. Why the principle of multiplicity applicable to Guru did not > > happen for Kalatra? > > > > I have a well formed non-astrological reason to explain 2. But > > astrologically don't u think that Saturn is the biggest benefic for > > Taurus Lagna and what it allowed to happen for the Guru it stopped > > from happening for Kalatra??? > > > > I shall eagerly await your answer. > > > > Love, > > > > Vinita > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 14, 2006 Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 In the explanatory notes by B. Suryanarayana Rao of stanza 3 of Brihat Jataka, it is mentioned: " Bhattotpala raises the vital question about the use of this knowledge (hora shastra)of our past and future and says that by knowledge of the future we will be able to read the existing evil influences and we can also adopt remedial measures recommended in the shastras, to alleviate the miseries. He clearly indicates that astrology has no fatalism about its doctrines. It simply reveals the penalties for breaches of proper conduct in the previous states of births, and that it is in man's power to know the evil, and nip it in the bud before it takes root and produces miserable results " . , " vinita kumar " <shankar_mamta wrote: > > Dear Shreenadh, > > I think u misunderstood me completely. Where is the question of > doubting anything that the maharishis wrote? It would be a > reflection of deep, deep ignorance to even think like that. Of > course I am ignorant, but not that ignorant to question anything the > great rishis have said. > > If there are many pointers in the same direction, of course the > probablity of the event occuring increases. Where is the question of > disagreement? > > But though Mararishis were infallible, could we be fallible in our > interpretations? That is the only point I was trying to suggest. > Could there be something we are overlooking? Sometimes it is the > obvious that strikes us not not what is not obvious. > > It is in this spirit that i suggested that whether the Guru (Saturn) > has intervened and not let the probabilities take effect. I know the > interpretation of Saturn in my chart is somewhat difficult since it > is exalted as well as retro so that makes it debilitated too. > > I do respect u a lot and feel humbled by your knowledge of the > ancient texts. I also feel grateful for your extreme patience in > handling simple questions and devoting so much time and attention to > explain things. Its only when interpretations do not tally with real > life experiences that one wonders why it is so. > > All questions emanate from ignorance. But in all this ignorance > there is not an iota of doubt about what the rishis said. I was only > thinking in terms of whether we are missing something? Or is there > something which " lies beyond the stars " and which the gurus know > about? > > Love, > > Vinita > > > > , " Sreenadh " > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > ==> > > > why talk of " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " - there were half a dozen > > > fingers pointing in the same direction. > > <== > > That is an absurd question since " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " is a > > statement that should be applied to EVERY result predicted. No > result > > predicted should override this rule. It is at the foundations of > > astrology, since astrology is a system that tries to predict MOST > > PROBABLE event or possibility. Only " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " helps > us > > in understanding that 'here the possibility increases, and so this > > may happen for sure, and so we should predict this result'. Any > > person, who go against this is violating the fundamentals of > > astrology, and the responsibility for errors in his predictions > does > > not go neither to the system of astrology, nor to the Rishis. Then > he > > alone becomes responsible for whatever (punaya or papa) he gains > > through those statements. Always keep this in mind. A sincere > student > > of astrology should be humbly obedient to the words of Rishis, > > understand the fundamentals, and shouldn't violate basic rules. If > we > > do so then the responsibility is with us and we can't blame > anybody > > or the system for wrong predictions. Violating the " Dwi Tri > Samvada > > bhaval " rule is a serious offence against the total astrological > > system - please keep it in mind. > > > > Why not many husbands? > > ---------------------- > > Clearly put your question is, If multiple initiations are > predicted > > based on some planetary indications about 'twice', then for this > > horoscope - > > Why not many husbands? Why can't we predict (why didn't you > predict) > > multiple marriages? Why can't we predict multiple sexual > parterres? > > Why not many illicit relations? > > > > Ok. I will address this question in the next mail, and analyze > the > > 7th house of your chart based on the same " Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval " > > rule. > > Love, > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , " vinita kumar " > > <shankar_mamta@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Shreenadh, > > > > > > I didn't think that I would break the promise of not asking > trivial > > > questions so quickly, but when I read your message again I felt > > like > > > responding and also giving feedback. Hope u don't mind. > > > First some further comments on your analysis: > > > > > > 1. One of the prime rules of checking 2 or more > > > possibilities , " DwiTri samvada bhaval " looks good. > > > > > > 2. I liked your interpretation of Punarbhu. All this while I > > > thought that this was only in the context of marriage. You have > > > given an interesting twist to the meaning! > > > > > > 3. The principle of " Swache Trisamgunam " is the most > > > interesting of all. My question is that if this principle > applies > > to > > > multiple gurus, why does it not apply to multiple partners (the > > > Venus connection) > > > > > > 4. You have quoted Mihira about " Dwibharyordhi " in the context > > > of Venus in Cancer and 2 in the context of Moon in > Cancer, " Serkshe > > > Dwi samgunam " and Saturn aspecting Venus and Moon from Libra > also > > > signifying two. > > > > > > 5. While talking of twos u could add one more, but this is not > > > related to Venus but to Mercury being Swakshetra in the 2nd > House / > > > house of attractions (Chapter 26 Shloka 14 of BPHS) and in > Gemini > > to > > > boot! > > > > > > 6. Another evidence, (for which I think I should acknowledge > > > Vernaji), is the placement of Ketu ruler of 7th in 2nd!!! > > > > > > So why talk of " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " - there were half a > dozen > > > fingers pointing in the same direction. > > > > > > Let me share with you that one of the main reasons why I started > > > digging into astrology some time back was because I became > acutely > > > aware of those half a dozen accusing fingers. > > > > > > When I shared my horoscope with others I could sense their > > > reluctance to be frank with me. I even thought I heard some > > > snickers. I felt like a fallen woman without having fallen. When > I > > > gave my feedback one person even went to the extent of telling > me > > > that I was telling untruth (a euphemism for lying) – so much for > > > having Jupiter in the Second House!!!. > > > > > > I have shared with u that the Moon MD has brought about a > > > transformation that I could not have imagined. From a shy, > > > diffident, unsure person I now feel that I can take on the > whole > > > world. There has also been a flowering of emotions and perhaps > > there > > > were possibilities (more imagined than real) which were never > > > allowed to fructify in the area of relationships / kalatra. The > > > main reason was that I became extremely conscious of dharma in > > > marriage. Of course marriage was not a bed of roses – but > finding > > my > > > way to accept and love my husband the way he is has been a long > and > > > challenging journey. And in more than twenty years of our > marriage > > > nobody can dare raise a finger at my fidelity. > > > > > > I personally think that all this has something to do with my > Guru's > > > grace. I also believe in free will. I am convinced now (again > with > > > Gurus's grace) that consciousness and awareness has a big role > to > > > play in making us who we are and what we want to become. > > > > > > My questions are: > > > > > > 1. Why should I feel so joyous in the MD of Moon when Moon is > > > debilitated in Navamsa? > > > 2. Why the principle of multiplicity applicable to Guru did not > > > happen for Kalatra? > > > > > > I have a well formed non-astrological reason to explain 2. But > > > astrologically don't u think that Saturn is the biggest benefic > for > > > Taurus Lagna and what it allowed to happen for the Guru it > stopped > > > from happening for Kalatra??? > > > > > > I shall eagerly await your answer. > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > Vinita > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 15, 2006 Report Share Posted June 15, 2006 Dear Vinita ji, In your natal chart, Lagna is Taurus and the 7th house is Scorpio. The Garga hora says "Saptame Vrischiko rasir balavan parikeertita", Meaning in 7th Scorpio is strong. (This issue of reptile signs getting strong at 7th etc was discussed elaborately earlier). Therefore sex drive, husband/wife, sexual partners etc should play a major role in the life of people born in Taurus Lagna (since Sc is the 7th sign). But remember that the above statement does not indicate, whether that role is positive or negative, or whether it is marital relations, illicit relations etc. In your chart the 7th lord is in 8th. The lord of Vivaha stana (marriage) is in mangalya stana (life after marriage). This is generally good considering the above said significance indicated by those houses. But 8th is also a dustana, and so it this placement should also indicate results such as, being away from husband, troubles having a satisfactory married life (especially in sexual matters), etc as well. If Ma is in 8th it indicates, Utras or Vagina related troubles (Troubles/diseases related to pregnancy or excretory organs), heath problems to father, etc as well. Divorce is also indicated by Ma in 8th but the corollary rule is that, such mishap shouldn't be predicted if Ma (in 8th) is the lagna lord or 7th lord. This corollary/supplementary rule applies in your horoscope and so no divorce/widowhood should be predicted for your horoscope based on the placement of Ma in 8th. To emphasis it, Ju aspects (Drishti) Ma as well, making any such results, yapya (hidden), and the malefic results such a placement indicates is converted into benefic results, since the 8th lord aspects 8th giving, good mangalya (i.e. good `life after marriage with husband'). If Ma is in 8th without much bad influence, then Brigu sutra states – "Alpa putravan vata sooladi rogaH dara sukha yuta", Meaning, he/she will have less number of sons (or no sons), will have diseases like rheumatics, body pain etc, and will have a good life with husband/wife. You could see that this is completely true for your horoscope. But we should remember that here the bad result only becomes, yapya (hidden) indicating that you are not completely satisfied with your husband, and still feel alone after having such a husband. (mental widowhood). That is why it is said that the result is only yapya (hidden), that is in reality it is not so, but in subtitle mental level the result exists. To substantiate it the Navamsa of Mo (significator of mind) is in 7th but debilitated. This indicates that you are committed to your husband, and likes him, but yet not satisfied with him! The mutual relation between the 7th lord and moon emphasis this strong mutual relation and commitment between you and your husband. What kind of mutual relation is between the 7th lord Ma and Mo (significator of your mind)? Look at the chart – the Navamsa of Mo is in 7th, and Ma aspects Mo with its special drishti in 8th. Or look at Ve (the lagna lord indicating you) – Ma aspects Ve with its special drishti in 8th and the Navamsa of Ma falls in Lagan. Both this indicate the strong commitment of your husband (7th lord Ma) with you (lagna and lagna lord Ve). But as you could see, you (Ve with lagna lordship) with your sexual urges (6th lordship of Ve) does not have that much a strong relation with 7th (your husband). That means due to unbalanced sexual urges and mental thoughts/interests between you and your husband, you were unable to return the same affection your husband shared with you, but for sure it was a mutually committed married life. The Me and Ju in 2nd emphasis this with a good family life with enough luxury, income, govt. job, and study. So the "Dwi Tri Samvada Bhava indicates" that even though you would liked to have many sexual partners, you denied it due to your commitment towards your husband and his commitment towards you, but still led an unsatisfactory sexual life, always feeling that may be it is not your soul mate. Now coming to Dwi-Tri (2 or 3) indications given by Ve in Cn, and Sa (7th lord from Mo) in Li, which one might correlate with the number of husbands/partners in married life – Ve in Cn is "Dwi bharyaorthi" (One who would `like to have' more than one relation) to fulfill/balance his mental urge for a partner, to fulfill the vacuum he/she would feel inside him. From the above study of 7th house we already know that you will have only one husband, but this urge for completeness is still there remaining unfulfilled. How it would get fulfilled? We should derive the prediction based on these indicators (Ve and Sa) itself. Looking at your chart we see that the Ve is aspected by Sa (the 9th lord from lagna, which is also the 7th lord from Mo). That means to fulfill this mental urge for completeness only you are seeking the guru (9th lord), in a sense getting wedded to the guru (like every true sishya does). This is the prime reason for your deep affection towards your guru, since he fulfill the mental vacuum you feel inside. Please understand that every true student (whether he is man or women) gets wedded to the guru, and it is due to this mental feeling of completeness he derive from his/her guru (who already possess that completeness) only he/she remains a sishya to any guru. This indicates that all these dwi-tri yogas in your horoscope is primarily related to the number of gurus you will have and not related to the number of husbands/sexual partners, though in a way the intend (search for completeness) is the same. Of course, this dwi-tri is applicable some where else as well. For example look at the number of children your mother lost (i.e. the number of brothers/sisters you lost). If Ve is in 3rd Brigu sutra says, "Ati lubdhaH dakshanyavan bhratru vridhiH sankalpasidhiH paschat sahodarabavaH kremena bhratru tatparaH vitta bhogaparaH bhavadhipe balayute uchakshetre bhratru vridhiH dustana papyute bhratrunasaH" Meaning, he/she would be almost a miser (won't like to spend money much), will be kind towards the suffering people, will have many brothers/sisters, will loss brothers/sisters, and may not have younger brothers/sisters (or may loss younger brothers/sisters), will loss brothers/sisters before own death, primarily won't be much interested in own brothers and sisters, but the love/affection towards them will increase as the time (life) goes by. Will learn to experience the luxury and wealth gradually (the miser ness will gradually change), If 3d lord is strong, and is influenced by benefics and malefics will have many brothers/sisters and will loss many brothers/sisters accordingly. Look to see how the dwi-tri rule applies to the number of your lost brothers/sisters. To supplement this prediction, see to the fact that Ma (the significator for brothers and sisters) gets debilitated in the 3rd house of your horoscope, and also that Ma (significator for primarily younger brothers/sisters) is in 6th house (a dustana) from 3rd house, and also that Ju (significator for primarily elder brothers/sisters) is in 12th house (a dustana) from the 3rd house. Also note that Gk (significator of sudden death) is in 11th house (significate elder brothers/sisters) which also happens to be the sign of Ju (significator of elder brothers/sisters). Just see how dwi-tri rule applies here. Not satisfied with the predictions given for "Dwibharyordhi" (One who would `like to have' more than one relation) for Ve in Cn? Just understand the fact that the combination should be in 7th from natal lagna for such a combination to take effect for the native himself. But it certainly applies to someone. To whom? Want to know? The sign Cn is 7th house (wives) from 9th (your father) in your chart. It could indicate how many wives or extra relations your father had. Getting the point? Yap, I know something about your life from your own book, and so say it with confidence that the "Dwi bharyordhi" combination holds good in your chart. This message is getting too long. But the point I am trying to make is that, WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE CONTEXT IN WHICH THE COMBINATIONS APPLY, AND APPLYING RISHI HORA INDICATIONS IN WRONG CONTEXTS WILL LEAD TO WRONG PREDICTIONS, like predicting an immoral life, and many husbands to you. This is the fundamental reason, why the basics are important. The living gurus (living legends) of astrology in Kerala, used to tell us that, we should know the "Prakarana" (context) in which each sloka applies, and without knowing this we could turn astrology into a bundle of confusions. I am sharing this here as well for the benefit of all. This is the fundamental reason for the importance of Dasadhyayi (a Vyakhya of Brihat Jataka in Sanskrit) and Chatura Sundari (A Vyakhya of Krishneeya in Sanskrit). They tell us about the context in which each of those slokas in those texts to be applied, which no other texts does in a convincing manner. This forms one of the primary reasons for the survival of astrology in Kerala too. P.S. Hold your doubts for sometime, I have Taurus Lagna description, and the questions put forward by Pandit ji and RK ji to answer in my plate before proceeding further with other discussions. Love, Sreenadh , "Sreenadh" <sreesog wrote:>> Dear Vinita ji,> ==>> > why talk of "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" - there were half a dozen > > fingers pointing in the same direction.> <==> That is an absurd question since "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" is a > statement that should be applied to EVERY result predicted. No result > predicted should override this rule. It is at the foundations of > astrology, since astrology is a system that tries to predict MOST > PROBABLE event or possibility. Only "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" helps us > in understanding that 'here the possibility increases, and so this > may happen for sure, and so we should predict this result'. Any > person, who go against this is violating the fundamentals of > astrology, and the responsibility for errors in his predictions does > not go neither to the system of astrology, nor to the Rishis. Then he > alone becomes responsible for whatever (punaya or papa) he gains > through those statements. Always keep this in mind. A sincere student > of astrology should be humbly obedient to the words of Rishis, > understand the fundamentals, and shouldn't violate basic rules. If we > do so then the responsibility is with us and we can't blame anybody > or the system for wrong predictions. Violating the "Dwi Tri Samvada > bhaval" rule is a serious offence against the total astrological > system - please keep it in mind. > > Why not many husbands?> ----------------------> Clearly put your question is, If multiple initiations are predicted > based on some planetary indications about 'twice', then for this > horoscope -> Why not many husbands? Why can't we predict (why didn't you predict) > multiple marriages? Why can't we predict multiple sexual parterres? > Why not many illicit relations?> > Ok. I will address this question in the next mail, and analyze the > 7th house of your chart based on the same "Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval" > rule. > Love,> Sreenadh> > > , "vinita kumar" > shankar_mamta@ wrote:> >> > Dear Shreenadh,> > > > I didn't think that I would break the promise of not asking trivial > > questions so quickly, but when I read your message again I felt > like > > responding and also giving feedback. Hope u don't mind.> > First some further comments on your analysis:> > > > 1. One of the prime rules of checking 2 or more > > possibilities , "DwiTri samvada bhaval" looks good.> > > > 2. I liked your interpretation of Punarbhu. All this while I > > thought that this was only in the context of marriage. You have > > given an interesting twist to the meaning!> > > > 3. The principle of "Swache Trisamgunam" is the most > > interesting of all. My question is that if this principle applies > to > > multiple gurus, why does it not apply to multiple partners (the > > Venus connection)> > > > 4. You have quoted Mihira about "Dwibharyordhi" in the context > > of Venus in Cancer and 2 in the context of Moon in Cancer, "Serkshe > > Dwi samgunam" and Saturn aspecting Venus and Moon from Libra also > > signifying two.> > > > 5. While talking of twos u could add one more, but this is not > > related to Venus but to Mercury being Swakshetra in the 2nd House / > > house of attractions (Chapter 26 Shloka 14 of BPHS) and in Gemini > to > > boot!> > > > 6. Another evidence, (for which I think I should acknowledge > > Vernaji), is the placement of Ketu ruler of 7th in 2nd!!!> > > > So why talk of "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" - there were half a dozen > > fingers pointing in the same direction.> > > > Let me share with you that one of the main reasons why I started > > digging into astrology some time back was because I became acutely > > aware of those half a dozen accusing fingers. > > > > When I shared my horoscope with others I could sense their > > reluctance to be frank with me. I even thought I heard some > > snickers. I felt like a fallen woman without having fallen. When I > > gave my feedback one person even went to the extent of telling me > > that I was telling untruth (a euphemism for lying) – so much for > > having Jupiter in the Second House!!!.> > > > I have shared with u that the Moon MD has brought about a > > transformation that I could not have imagined. From a shy, > > diffident, unsure person I now feel that I can take on the whole > > world. There has also been a flowering of emotions and perhaps > there > > were possibilities (more imagined than real) which were never > > allowed to fructify in the area of relationships / kalatra. The > > main reason was that I became extremely conscious of dharma in > > marriage. Of course marriage was not a bed of roses – but finding > my > > way to accept and love my husband the way he is has been a long and > > challenging journey. And in more than twenty years of our marriage > > nobody can dare raise a finger at my fidelity.> > > > I personally think that all this has something to do with my Guru's > > grace. I also believe in free will. I am convinced now (again with > > Gurus's grace) that consciousness and awareness has a big role to > > play in making us who we are and what we want to become.> > > > My questions are:> > > > 1. Why should I feel so joyous in the MD of Moon when Moon is > > debilitated in Navamsa?> > 2. Why the principle of multiplicity applicable to Guru did not > > happen for Kalatra?> > > > I have a well formed non-astrological reason to explain 2. But > > astrologically don't u think that Saturn is the biggest benefic for > > Taurus Lagna and what it allowed to happen for the Guru it stopped > > from happening for Kalatra???> > > > I shall eagerly await your answer.> > > > Love,> > > > Vinita> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2006 Report Share Posted June 16, 2006 Dear Shreenadh, I want to express my heartfelt thanks for your time and effort in delving into the 7th house. Your analysis is broadly satisfying. But more important than that i want to share with u the lessons i have learnt from your posts which are even more satisying. 1. Don't doubt anything that is written in the ancient texts. The rule " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " (If 2,3 or more arguments indicate in the same direction)is one very small example of this. 2. There are dridha karma and adridha karma. The former are inflexible and the latter flexible. (so rule at 1 is more applicable to the former where " the strong results indicated by past karma are sure to happen " - " Avasyamanubhavoktavyam Dridham karma subhasubham " ) 3.Now in predicting Dridha Kama (strong results), we have to analyze 1) Yoga 2) Dasa 3) Gochara (Transit). In each of these we have to look for multiple possibilities. 4.Out of the trine steps Yoga-Dasa-Gochara only the first step (Yoga) has been used for deriving the result of the analysis. 5. Even in this first step several type of errors may occur - * It could be that we haven't seen many combinations. * It could be that we didn't understand them properly. * It could be that we misinterpreted them. 6. The above rules 1-5 apply to ordinary mortals like us. 7. Only yogis / realised masters have the power to change the rythm of time / bend the above rules. And last though not the least: 8. Don't ask silly questions and raise silly doubts ;) Thanks, dear Shreenadh, I enjoyed learning all of the above :) Love, Vinita , " Sreenadh " <sreesog wrote: > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > In your natal chart, Lagna is Taurus and the 7th house is Scorpio. The > Garga hora says " Saptame Vrischiko rasir balavan parikeertita " , > Meaning in 7th Scorpio is strong. (This issue of reptile signs getting > strong at 7th etc was discussed elaborately earlier). Therefore sex > drive, husband/wife, sexual partners etc should play a major role in the > life of people born in Taurus Lagna (since Sc is the 7th sign). But > remember that the above statement does not indicate, whether that role > is positive or negative, or whether it is marital relations, illicit > relations etc. In your chart the 7th lord is in 8th. The lord of Vivaha > stana (marriage) is in mangalya stana (life after marriage). This is > generally good considering the above said significance indicated by > those houses. But 8th is also a dustana, and so it this placement should > also indicate results such as, being away from husband, troubles having > a satisfactory married life (especially in sexual matters), etc as well. > If Ma is in 8th it indicates, Utras or Vagina related troubles > (Troubles/diseases related to pregnancy or excretory organs), heath > problems to father, etc as well. Divorce is also indicated by Ma in 8th > but the corollary rule is that, such mishap shouldn't be predicted > if Ma (in 8th) is the lagna lord or 7th lord. This > corollary/supplementary rule applies in your horoscope and so no > divorce/widowhood should be predicted for your horoscope based on the > placement of Ma in 8th. To emphasis it, Ju aspects (Drishti) Ma as well, > making any such results, yapya (hidden), and the malefic results such a > placement indicates is converted into benefic results, since the 8th > lord aspects 8th giving, good mangalya (i.e. good `life after > marriage with husband'). If Ma is in 8th without much bad > influence, then Brigu sutra states – " Alpa putravan vata sooladi > rogaH dara sukha yuta " , Meaning, he/she will have less number of > sons (or no sons), will have diseases like rheumatics, body pain etc, > and will have a good life with husband/wife. You could see that this is > completely true for your horoscope. But we should remember that here the > bad result only becomes, yapya (hidden) indicating that you are not > completely satisfied with your husband, and still feel alone after > having such a husband. (mental widowhood). That is why it is said that > the result is only yapya (hidden), that is in reality it is not so, but > in subtitle mental level the result exists. To substantiate it the > Navamsa of Mo (significator of mind) is in 7th but debilitated. This > indicates that you are committed to your husband, and likes him, but yet > not satisfied with him! The mutual relation between the 7th lord and > moon emphasis this strong mutual relation and commitment between you and > your husband. What kind of mutual relation is between the 7th lord Ma > and Mo (significator of your mind)? Look at the chart – the Navamsa > of Mo is in 7th, and Ma aspects Mo with its special drishti in 8th. Or > look at Ve (the lagna lord indicating you) – Ma aspects Ve with its > special drishti in 8th and the Navamsa of Ma falls in Lagan. Both this > indicate the strong commitment of your husband (7th lord Ma) with you > (lagna and lagna lord Ve). But as you could see, you (Ve with lagna > lordship) with your sexual urges (6th lordship of Ve) does not have that > much a strong relation with 7th (your husband). That means due to > unbalanced sexual urges and mental thoughts/interests between you and > your husband, you were unable to return the same affection your husband > shared with you, but for sure it was a mutually committed married life. > The Me and Ju in 2nd emphasis this with a good family life with enough > luxury, income, govt. job, and study. So the " Dwi Tri Samvada Bhava > indicates " that even though you would liked to have many sexual > partners, you denied it due to your commitment towards your husband and > his commitment towards you, but still led an unsatisfactory sexual life, > always feeling that may be it is not your soul mate. > > Now coming to Dwi-Tri (2 or 3) indications given by Ve in > Cn, and Sa (7th lord from Mo) in Li, which one might correlate with the > number of husbands/partners in married life – > > Ve in Cn is " Dwi bharyaorthi " (One who would > `like to have' more than one relation) to fulfill/balance his > mental urge for a partner, to fulfill the vacuum he/she would feel > inside him. From the above study of 7th house we already know that you > will have only one husband, but this urge for completeness is still > there remaining unfulfilled. How it would get fulfilled? We should > derive the prediction based on these indicators (Ve and Sa) itself. > Looking at your chart we see that the Ve is aspected by Sa (the 9th lord > from lagna, which is also the 7th lord from Mo). That means to fulfill > this mental urge for completeness only you are seeking the guru (9th > lord), in a sense getting wedded to the guru (like every true sishya > does). This is the prime reason for your deep affection towards your > guru, since he fulfill the mental vacuum you feel inside. Please > understand that every true student (whether he is man or women) gets > wedded to the guru, and it is due to this mental feeling of completeness > he derive from his/her guru (who already possess that completeness) only > he/she remains a sishya to any guru. This indicates that all these > dwi-tri yogas in your horoscope is primarily related to the number of > gurus you will have and not related to the number of husbands/sexual > partners, though in a way the intend (search for completeness) is the > same. > > Of course, this dwi-tri is applicable some where else as > well. For example look at the number of children your mother lost (i.e. > the number of brothers/sisters you lost). If Ve is in 3rd Brigu sutra > says, " Ati lubdhaH dakshanyavan bhratru vridhiH sankalpasidhiH > paschat sahodarabavaH kremena bhratru tatparaH vitta bhogaparaH > bhavadhipe balayute uchakshetre bhratru vridhiH dustana papyute > bhratrunasaH " Meaning, he/she would be almost a miser (won't > like to spend money much), will be kind towards the suffering people, > will have many brothers/sisters, will loss brothers/sisters, and may not > have younger brothers/sisters (or may loss younger brothers/sisters), > will loss brothers/sisters before own death, primarily won't be much > interested in own brothers and sisters, but the love/affection towards > them will increase as the time (life) goes by. Will learn to experience > the luxury and wealth gradually (the miser ness will gradually change), > If 3d lord is strong, and is influenced by benefics and malefics will > have many brothers/sisters and will loss many brothers/sisters > accordingly. Look to see how the dwi-tri rule applies to the number of > your lost brothers/sisters. To supplement this prediction, see to the > fact that Ma (the significator for brothers and sisters) gets > debilitated in the 3rd house of your horoscope, and also that Ma > (significator for primarily younger brothers/sisters) is in 6th house > (a dustana) from 3rd house, and also that Ju (significator for primarily > elder brothers/sisters) is in 12th house (a dustana) from the 3rd house. > Also note that Gk (significator of sudden death) is in 11th house > (significate elder brothers/sisters) which also happens to be the sign > of Ju (significator of elder brothers/sisters). Just see how dwi- tri > rule applies here. > > Not satisfied with the predictions given for > " Dwibharyordhi " (One who would `like to have' more than > one relation) for Ve in Cn? Just understand the fact that the > combination should be in 7th from natal lagna for such a combination to > take effect for the native himself. But it certainly applies to someone. > To whom? Want to know? The sign Cn is 7th house (wives) from 9th (your > father) in your chart. It could indicate how many wives or extra > relations your father had. Getting the point? Yap, I know something > about your life from your own book, and so say it with confidence that > the " Dwi bharyordhi " combination holds good in your chart. > > > > This message is getting too long. But the point I am trying > to make is that, WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE CONTEXT IN WHICH THE > COMBINATIONS APPLY, AND APPLYING RISHI HORA INDICATIONS IN WRONG > CONTEXTS WILL LEAD TO WRONG PREDICTIONS, like predicting an immoral > life, and many husbands to you. This is the fundamental reason, why the > basics are important. The living gurus (living legends) of astrology in > Kerala, used to tell us that, we should know the " Prakarana " > (context) in which each sloka applies, and without knowing this we could > turn astrology into a bundle of confusions. I am sharing this here as > well for the benefit of all. This is the fundamental reason for the > importance of Dasadhyayi (a Vyakhya of Brihat Jataka in Sanskrit) and > Chatura Sundari (A Vyakhya of Krishneeya in Sanskrit). They tell us > about the context in which each of those slokas in those texts to be > applied, which no other texts does in a convincing manner. This forms > one of the primary reasons for the survival of astrology in Kerala too. > > > > P.S. Hold your doubts for sometime, I have Taurus Lagna description, and > the questions put forward by Pandit ji and RK ji to answer in my plate > before proceeding further with other discussions. > > Love, > > Sreenadh > > , " Sreenadh " > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > ==> > > > why talk of " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " - there were half a dozen > > > fingers pointing in the same direction. > > <== > > That is an absurd question since " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " is a > > statement that should be applied to EVERY result predicted. No result > > predicted should override this rule. It is at the foundations of > > astrology, since astrology is a system that tries to predict MOST > > PROBABLE event or possibility. Only " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " helps us > > in understanding that 'here the possibility increases, and so this > > may happen for sure, and so we should predict this result'. Any > > person, who go against this is violating the fundamentals of > > astrology, and the responsibility for errors in his predictions does > > not go neither to the system of astrology, nor to the Rishis. Then he > > alone becomes responsible for whatever (punaya or papa) he gains > > through those statements. Always keep this in mind. A sincere student > > of astrology should be humbly obedient to the words of Rishis, > > understand the fundamentals, and shouldn't violate basic rules. If we > > do so then the responsibility is with us and we can't blame anybody > > or the system for wrong predictions. Violating the " Dwi Tri Samvada > > bhaval " rule is a serious offence against the total astrological > > system - please keep it in mind. > > > > Why not many husbands? > > ---------------------- > > Clearly put your question is, If multiple initiations are predicted > > based on some planetary indications about 'twice', then for this > > horoscope - > > Why not many husbands? Why can't we predict (why didn't you predict) > > multiple marriages? Why can't we predict multiple sexual parterres? > > Why not many illicit relations? > > > > Ok. I will address this question in the next mail, and analyze the > > 7th house of your chart based on the same " Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval " > > rule. > > Love, > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , " vinita kumar " > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Shreenadh, > > > > > > I didn't think that I would break the promise of not asking trivial > > > questions so quickly, but when I read your message again I felt > > like > > > responding and also giving feedback. Hope u don't mind. > > > First some further comments on your analysis: > > > > > > 1. One of the prime rules of checking 2 or more > > > possibilities , " DwiTri samvada bhaval " looks good. > > > > > > 2. I liked your interpretation of Punarbhu. All this while I > > > thought that this was only in the context of marriage. You have > > > given an interesting twist to the meaning! > > > > > > 3. The principle of " Swache Trisamgunam " is the most > > > interesting of all. My question is that if this principle applies > > to > > > multiple gurus, why does it not apply to multiple partners (the > > > Venus connection) > > > > > > 4. You have quoted Mihira about " Dwibharyordhi " in the context > > > of Venus in Cancer and 2 in the context of Moon in Cancer, " Serkshe > > > Dwi samgunam " and Saturn aspecting Venus and Moon from Libra also > > > signifying two. > > > > > > 5. While talking of twos u could add one more, but this is not > > > related to Venus but to Mercury being Swakshetra in the 2nd House / > > > house of attractions (Chapter 26 Shloka 14 of BPHS) and in Gemini > > to > > > boot! > > > > > > 6. Another evidence, (for which I think I should acknowledge > > > Vernaji), is the placement of Ketu ruler of 7th in 2nd!!! > > > > > > So why talk of " Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval " - there were half a dozen > > > fingers pointing in the same direction. > > > > > > Let me share with you that one of the main reasons why I started > > > digging into astrology some time back was because I became acutely > > > aware of those half a dozen accusing fingers. > > > > > > When I shared my horoscope with others I could sense their > > > reluctance to be frank with me. I even thought I heard some > > > snickers. I felt like a fallen woman without having fallen. When I > > > gave my feedback one person even went to the extent of telling me > > > that I was telling untruth (a euphemism for lying) – so much for > > > having Jupiter in the Second House!!!. > > > > > > I have shared with u that the Moon MD has brought about a > > > transformation that I could not have imagined. From a shy, > > > diffident, unsure person I now feel that I can take on the whole > > > world. There has also been a flowering of emotions and perhaps > > there > > > were possibilities (more imagined than real) which were never > > > allowed to fructify in the area of relationships / kalatra. The > > > main reason was that I became extremely conscious of dharma in > > > marriage. Of course marriage was not a bed of roses – but > finding > > my > > > way to accept and love my husband the way he is has been a long and > > > challenging journey. And in more than twenty years of our marriage > > > nobody can dare raise a finger at my fidelity. > > > > > > I personally think that all this has something to do with my Guru's > > > grace. I also believe in free will. I am convinced now (again with > > > Gurus's grace) that consciousness and awareness has a big role to > > > play in making us who we are and what we want to become. > > > > > > My questions are: > > > > > > 1. Why should I feel so joyous in the MD of Moon when Moon is > > > debilitated in Navamsa? > > > 2. Why the principle of multiplicity applicable to Guru did not > > > happen for Kalatra? > > > > > > I have a well formed non-astrological reason to explain 2. But > > > astrologically don't u think that Saturn is the biggest benefic for > > > Taurus Lagna and what it allowed to happen for the Guru it stopped > > > from happening for Kalatra??? > > > > > > I shall eagerly await your answer. > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > Vinita > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2006 Report Share Posted June 16, 2006 Dear Vinita ji, ==> 1. Don't doubt anything that is written in the ancient texts. The rule "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" (If 2,3 or more arguments indicate in the same direction)is one very small example of this. <== You got it wrong. It is not that we shouldn't doubt ANYTHING written in the ancient texts - of course we are free to express our doubts about anything. But it is important to know that in any systematic study, understanding the basic rules, and not violating fundamental logics etc are very very important. Otherwise we would have to leave our paths and restart from scrach each and every momet and won't reach any were in the study. The "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" becomes important since it indicates the importance of probability which is at the foundations of total astrological system itself. It is the paradigm followed for thousands of years, even if that sloka bit existed or not the concept was there, as is evident from hundreds of ancient slokas available to us. Violating or questioning the basic logics hinders further study. Due to this fact only I was stating that. If the basic facts are against logic of course we can question them. But "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" is not is even a fact, but a concept, or basic logical rule or directive. All the other points (lessons?) you mentioned holds good. With a slight modification to the last - ==> 8. Don't ask silly questions and raise silly doubts ;)<== I have another question - are we not here to escape from silly questions and silly doubts and ask "valid questions and valid doubts and clarify them in discussions between us" ? Otherwise we would have been well satisfied with other astrology groups I feel. Look how many members other groups are having, and see how few in number we are. But are don't we enjoy the privacy of not being disturbed by silly questions here (look at the other forums, requests for personal readings, unnecessarily deviating to side tracks, without study or thought posting messages, too many silly conversation like small messages and what not!). Vinita ji, I don't think you ever asked silly questions. But there is a general statement that applies to all. I would like to state it like this: ---------- if any one in this group feels that any question asked by him/her is silly or that with that either he/her is not sharing knowledge with others, or sharing the doubts of at least some of the others as well, may be it is better to reconsider posting them. It applies to all, including the me (I am not an exception), we should be our own moderators and no non-existent moderators will be coming and editing things even if silly questions are asked on the forum, as far as he/she is personally attacking somebody. I think you and me and most of the other members will agree on it, since we want to be a different group, that gives importance to "learning experience" through discussions. Love, Sreenadh vinita kumar <shankar_mamta wrote: Dear Shreenadh,I want to express my heartfelt thanks for your time and effort in delving into the 7th house.Your analysis is broadly satisfying. But more important than that i want to share with u the lessons i have learnt from your posts which are even more satisying.1. Don't doubt anything that is written in the ancient texts. The rule "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" (If 2,3 or more arguments indicate in the same direction)is one very small example of this.2. There are dridha karma and adridha karma. The former are inflexible and the latter flexible. (so rule at 1 is more applicable to the former where "the strong results indicated by past karma are sure to happen" - "Avasyamanubhavoktavyam Dridham karma subhasubham" )3.Now in predicting Dridha Kama (strong results), we have to analyze 1) Yoga 2) Dasa 3) Gochara (Transit). In each of these we have to look for multiple possibilities. 4.Out of the trine steps Yoga-Dasa-Gochara only the first step (Yoga) has been used for deriving the result of the analysis.5. Even in this first step several type of errors may occur -* It could be that we haven't seen many combinations.* It could be that we didn't understand them properly.* It could be that we misinterpreted them.6. The above rules 1-5 apply to ordinary mortals like us.7. Only yogis / realised masters have the power to change the rythm of time / bend the above rules.And last though not the least:8. Don't ask silly questions and raise silly doubts ;);)Thanks, dear Shreenadh, I enjoyed learning all of the above :):)Love,Vinita , "Sreenadh" wrote:>> > Dear Vinita ji,> > In your natal chart, Lagna is Taurus and the 7th house is Scorpio. The> Garga hora says "Saptame Vrischiko rasir balavan parikeertita",> Meaning in 7th Scorpio is strong. (This issue of reptile signs getting> strong at 7th etc was discussed elaborately earlier). Therefore sex> drive, husband/wife, sexual partners etc should play a major role in the> life of people born in Taurus Lagna (since Sc is the 7th sign). But> remember that the above statement does not indicate, whether that role> is positive or negative, or whether it is marital relations, illicit> relations etc. In your chart the 7th lord is in 8th. The lord of Vivaha> stana (marriage) is in mangalya stana (life after marriage). This is> generally good considering the above said significance indicated by> those houses. But 8th is also a dustana, and so it this placement should> also indicate results such as, being away from husband, troubles having> a satisfactory married life (especially in sexual matters), etc as well.> If Ma is in 8th it indicates, Utras or Vagina related troubles> (Troubles/diseases related to pregnancy or excretory organs), heath> problems to father, etc as well. Divorce is also indicated by Ma in 8th> but the corollary rule is that, such mishap shouldn't be predicted> if Ma (in 8th) is the lagna lord or 7th lord. This> corollary/supplementary rule applies in your horoscope and so no> divorce/widowhood should be predicted for your horoscope based on the> placement of Ma in 8th. To emphasis it, Ju aspects (Drishti) Ma as well,> making any such results, yapya (hidden), and the malefic results such a> placement indicates is converted into benefic results, since the 8th> lord aspects 8th giving, good mangalya (i.e. good `life after> marriage with husband'). If Ma is in 8th without much bad> influence, then Brigu sutra states – "Alpa putravan vata sooladi> rogaH dara sukha yuta", Meaning, he/she will have less number of> sons (or no sons), will have diseases like rheumatics, body pain etc,> and will have a good life with husband/wife. You could see that this is> completely true for your horoscope. But we should remember that here the> bad result only becomes, yapya (hidden) indicating that you are not> completely satisfied with your husband, and still feel alone after> having such a husband. (mental widowhood). That is why it is said that> the result is only yapya (hidden), that is in reality it is not so, but> in subtitle mental level the result exists. To substantiate it the> Navamsa of Mo (significator of mind) is in 7th but debilitated. This> indicates that you are committed to your husband, and likes him, but yet> not satisfied with him! The mutual relation between the 7th lord and> moon emphasis this strong mutual relation and commitment between you and> your husband. What kind of mutual relation is between the 7th lord Ma> and Mo (significator of your mind)? Look at the chart – the Navamsa> of Mo is in 7th, and Ma aspects Mo with its special drishti in 8th. Or> look at Ve (the lagna lord indicating you) – Ma aspects Ve with its > special drishti in 8th and the Navamsa of Ma falls in Lagan. Both this> indicate the strong commitment of your husband (7th lord Ma) with you> (lagna and lagna lord Ve). But as you could see, you (Ve with lagna> lordship) with your sexual urges (6th lordship of Ve) does not have that> much a strong relation with 7th (your husband). That means due to> unbalanced sexual urges and mental thoughts/interests between you and> your husband, you were unable to return the same affection your husband> shared with you, but for sure it was a mutually committed married life.> The Me and Ju in 2nd emphasis this with a good family life with enough> luxury, income, govt. job, and study. So the "Dwi Tri Samvada Bhava> indicates" that even though you would liked to have many sexual> partners, you denied it due to your commitment towards your husband and> his commitment towards you, but still led an unsatisfactory sexual life,> always feeling that may be it is not your soul mate.> > Now coming to Dwi-Tri (2 or 3) indications given by Ve in> Cn, and Sa (7th lord from Mo) in Li, which one might correlate with the> number of husbands/partners in married life –> > Ve in Cn is "Dwi bharyaorthi" (One who would> `like to have' more than one relation) to fulfill/balance his> mental urge for a partner, to fulfill the vacuum he/she would feel> inside him. From the above study of 7th house we already know that you> will have only one husband, but this urge for completeness is still> there remaining unfulfilled. How it would get fulfilled? We should> derive the prediction based on these indicators (Ve and Sa) itself.> Looking at your chart we see that the Ve is aspected by Sa (the 9th lord> from lagna, which is also the 7th lord from Mo). That means to fulfill> this mental urge for completeness only you are seeking the guru (9th> lord), in a sense getting wedded to the guru (like every true sishya> does). This is the prime reason for your deep affection towards your> guru, since he fulfill the mental vacuum you feel inside. Please> understand that every true student (whether he is man or women) gets> wedded to the guru, and it is due to this mental feeling of completeness> he derive from his/her guru (who already possess that completeness) only> he/she remains a sishya to any guru. This indicates that all these> dwi-tri yogas in your horoscope is primarily related to the number of> gurus you will have and not related to the number of husbands/sexual> partners, though in a way the intend (search for completeness) is the> same.> > Of course, this dwi-tri is applicable some where else as> well. For example look at the number of children your mother lost (i.e.> the number of brothers/sisters you lost). If Ve is in 3rd Brigu sutra> says, "Ati lubdhaH dakshanyavan bhratru vridhiH sankalpasidhiH> paschat sahodarabavaH kremena bhratru tatparaH vitta bhogaparaH> bhavadhipe balayute uchakshetre bhratru vridhiH dustana papyute> bhratrunasaH" Meaning, he/she would be almost a miser (won't> like to spend money much), will be kind towards the suffering people,> will have many brothers/sisters, will loss brothers/sisters, and may not> have younger brothers/sisters (or may loss younger brothers/sisters), > will loss brothers/sisters before own death, primarily won't be much> interested in own brothers and sisters, but the love/affection towards> them will increase as the time (life) goes by. Will learn to experience> the luxury and wealth gradually (the miser ness will gradually change),> If 3d lord is strong, and is influenced by benefics and malefics will> have many brothers/sisters and will loss many brothers/sisters> accordingly. Look to see how the dwi-tri rule applies to the number of> your lost brothers/sisters. To supplement this prediction, see to the> fact that Ma (the significator for brothers and sisters) gets> debilitated in the 3rd house of your horoscope, and also that Ma> (significator for primarily younger brothers/sisters) is in 6th house> (a dustana) from 3rd house, and also that Ju (significator for primarily> elder brothers/sisters) is in 12th house (a dustana) from the 3rd house.> Also note that Gk (significator of sudden death) is in 11th house> (significate elder brothers/sisters) which also happens to be the sign> of Ju (significator of elder brothers/sisters). Just see how dwi-tri> rule applies here.> > Not satisfied with the predictions given for> "Dwibharyordhi" (One who would `like to have' more than> one relation) for Ve in Cn? Just understand the fact that the> combination should be in 7th from natal lagna for such a combination to> take effect for the native himself. But it certainly applies to someone.> To whom? Want to know? The sign Cn is 7th house (wives) from 9th (your> father) in your chart. It could indicate how many wives or extra> relations your father had. Getting the point? Yap, I know something> about your life from your own book, and so say it with confidence that> the "Dwi bharyordhi" combination holds good in your chart. > > > > This message is getting too long. But the point I am trying> to make is that, WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE CONTEXT IN WHICH THE> COMBINATIONS APPLY, AND APPLYING RISHI HORA INDICATIONS IN WRONG> CONTEXTS WILL LEAD TO WRONG PREDICTIONS, like predicting an immoral> life, and many husbands to you. This is the fundamental reason, why the> basics are important. The living gurus (living legends) of astrology in> Kerala, used to tell us that, we should know the "Prakarana"> (context) in which each sloka applies, and without knowing this we could> turn astrology into a bundle of confusions. I am sharing this here as> well for the benefit of all. This is the fundamental reason for the> importance of Dasadhyayi (a Vyakhya of Brihat Jataka in Sanskrit) and> Chatura Sundari (A Vyakhya of Krishneeya in Sanskrit). They tell us> about the context in which each of those slokas in those texts to be> applied, which no other texts does in a convincing manner. This forms> one of the primary reasons for the survival of astrology in Kerala too.> > > > P.S. Hold your doubts for sometime, I have Taurus Lagna description, and> the questions put forward by Pandit ji and RK ji to answer in my plate> before proceeding further with other discussions. > > Love,> > Sreenadh> > , "Sreenadh"> wrote:> >> > Dear Vinita ji,> > ==>> > > why talk of "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" - there were half a dozen> > > fingers pointing in the same direction.> > <==> > That is an absurd question since "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" is a> > statement that should be applied to EVERY result predicted. No result> > predicted should override this rule. It is at the foundations of> > astrology, since astrology is a system that tries to predict MOST> > PROBABLE event or possibility. Only "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" helps us> > in understanding that 'here the possibility increases, and so this> > may happen for sure, and so we should predict this result'. Any> > person, who go against this is violating the fundamentals of> > astrology, and the responsibility for errors in his predictions does> > not go neither to the system of astrology, nor to the Rishis. Then he> > alone becomes responsible for whatever (punaya or papa) he gains> > through those statements. Always keep this in mind. A sincere student> > of astrology should be humbly obedient to the words of Rishis,> > understand the fundamentals, and shouldn't violate basic rules. If we> > do so then the responsibility is with us and we can't blame anybody> > or the system for wrong predictions. Violating the "Dwi Tri Samvada> > bhaval" rule is a serious offence against the total astrological> > system - please keep it in mind. > >> > Why not many husbands?> > ----------------------> > Clearly put your question is, If multiple initiations are predicted> > based on some planetary indications about 'twice', then for this> > horoscope -> > Why not many husbands? Why can't we predict (why didn't you predict)> > multiple marriages? Why can't we predict multiple sexual parterres?> > Why not many illicit relations?> >> > Ok. I will address this question in the next mail, and analyze the> > 7th house of your chart based on the same "Dwi Tri Samvada Bhaval"> > rule. > > Love,> > Sreenadh> >> >> > , "vinita kumar"> > shankar_mamta@ wrote:> > >> > > Dear Shreenadh,> > >> > > I didn't think that I would break the promise of not asking trivial> > > questions so quickly, but when I read your message again I felt> > like> > > responding and also giving feedback. Hope u don't mind.> > > First some further comments on your analysis:> > >> > > 1. One of the prime rules of checking 2 or more> > > possibilities , "DwiTri samvada bhaval" looks good.> > >> > > 2. I liked your interpretation of Punarbhu. All this while I> > > thought that this was only in the context of marriage. You have> > > given an interesting twist to the meaning!> > >> > > 3. The principle of "Swache Trisamgunam" is the most> > > interesting of all. My question is that if this principle applies> > to> > > multiple gurus, why does it not apply to multiple partners (the> > > Venus connection)> > >> > > 4. You have quoted Mihira about "Dwibharyordhi" in the context> > > of Venus in Cancer and 2 in the context of Moon in Cancer, "Serkshe> > > Dwi samgunam" and Saturn aspecting Venus and Moon from Libra also> > > signifying two.> > >> > > 5. While talking of twos u could add one more, but this is not> > > related to Venus but to Mercury being Swakshetra in the 2nd House /> > > house of attractions (Chapter 26 Shloka 14 of BPHS) and in Gemini> > to> > > boot!> > >> > > 6. Another evidence, (for which I think I should acknowledge> > > Vernaji), is the placement of Ketu ruler of 7th in 2nd!!!> > >> > > So why talk of "Dwi Tri Samvada bhaval" - there were half a dozen> > > fingers pointing in the same direction.> > >> > > Let me share with you that one of the main reasons why I started> > > digging into astrology some time back was because I became acutely> > > aware of those half a dozen accusing fingers.> > >> > > When I shared my horoscope with others I could sense their> > > reluctance to be frank with me. I even thought I heard some> > > snickers. I felt like a fallen woman without having fallen. When I> > > gave my feedback one person even went to the extent of telling me> > > that I was telling untruth (a euphemism for lying) – so much for> > > having Jupiter in the Second House!!!.> > >> > > I have shared with u that the Moon MD has brought about a> > > transformation that I could not have imagined. From a shy,> > > diffident, unsure person I now feel that I can take on the whole> > > world. There has also been a flowering of emotions and perhaps> > there> > > were possibilities (more imagined than real) which were never> > > allowed to fructify in the area of relationships / kalatra. The> > > main reason was that I became extremely conscious of dharma in> > > marriage. Of course marriage was not a bed of roses – but> finding> > my> > > way to accept and love my husband the way he is has been a long and> > > challenging journey. And in more than twenty years of our marriage> > > nobody can dare raise a finger at my fidelity.> > >> > > I personally think that all this has something to do with my Guru's> > > grace. I also believe in free will. I am convinced now (again with> > > Gurus's grace) that consciousness and awareness has a big role to> > > play in making us who we are and what we want to become.> > >> > > My questions are:> > >> > > 1. Why should I feel so joyous in the MD of Moon when Moon is> > > debilitated in Navamsa?> > > 2. Why the principle of multiplicity applicable to Guru did not> > > happen for Kalatra?> > >> > > I have a well formed non-astrological reason to explain 2. But> > > astrologically don't u think that Saturn is the biggest benefic for> > > Taurus Lagna and what it allowed to happen for the Guru it stopped> > > from happening for Kalatra???> > >> > > I shall eagerly await your answer.> > >> > > Love,> > >> > > Vinita> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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