Guest guest Posted May 23, 2006 Report Share Posted May 23, 2006 Namaste, I wanted start a new discussion. How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there. I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th lord. # male graha influence = # male issues, etc. Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. .... P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel class people have no more than two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2006 Report Share Posted May 23, 2006 dear pandit ji namaste my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows: 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or female sign. 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets. 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered giving less and delayed children. 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet is in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus in 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum number of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature (underdeveloped) babies. 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned. 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child from 9H etc. 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also denotes children and have given how many children each planet in 3rd house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not mentioning them. 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of children. 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those cases also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and their gender. with best wishes pandit arjun , Panditji <navagraha wrote: > > Namaste, > > I wanted start a new discussion. > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there. > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th lord. # male > graha influence = # male issues, etc. > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > ... > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel class > people have no more than two. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 24, 2006 Report Share Posted May 24, 2006 Dear Panditji, There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to give the correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, because we can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state some of the popular methods that are in use. Number of children ------------------ 1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. The remaining number will give the number of children. 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th lord. 3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) the 5th house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in the 5th house can give the total number of children. But if the planet is in own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is in exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This method is very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules connected with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th and aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of children. 4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and 5th lord can indicate the number of children. But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to be any systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, amounts, persentage etc, that gives correct results. Male/Female determination ------------------------- We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and planets. Love, Sreenadh , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > dear pandit ji > namaste > > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows: > > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or > female sign. > > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets. > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered > giving less and delayed children. > > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet is > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus in > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum number > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > (underdeveloped) babies. > > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned. > > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child > from 9H etc. > > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also > denotes children and have given how many children each planet in 3rd > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not > mentioning them. > > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of > children. > > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those cases > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and > their gender. > > with best wishes > pandit arjun > > , Panditji > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > Namaste, > > > > I wanted start a new discussion. > > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there. > > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th > lord. # male > > graha influence = # male issues, etc. > > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > ... > > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel > class > > people have no more than two. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 24, 2006 Report Share Posted May 24, 2006 Namaste Panditarjun ji, Thanks. I am not too sure about # 7 and #9. #7: 1st child from 5 , second from 9 etc will put 4th from 11 and 1st from lagna. There is something not quite add up. I do agree with 9th lord dasha for women or lagna lord dasha , As lagna lord is capable of giving results of any house and so too the 9th lord. #9: I have no idea how one can use saptamsha, except for looking for strengths of the said karaka or 5th lord in rashi in saptamsha. Thanks for your views. .... On 5/23/06, panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004 wrote: dear pandit jinamastemy understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows:1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or female sign.2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets.3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered giving less and delayed children.4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet is in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus in 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum number of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet.5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature (underdeveloped) babies.6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned.7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child from 9H etc. 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also denotes children and have given how many children each planet in 3rd house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not mentioning them. 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of children.10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those cases also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and their gender. with best wishespandit arjun , Panditji <navagraha wrote:>> Namaste,> > I wanted start a new discussion.> > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there. > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue.> > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th lord. # male> graha influence = # male issues, etc. > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this.> > ...> > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel class> people have no more than two.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 24, 2006 Report Share Posted May 24, 2006 Namaste Sreenadhji, When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you mean. Thanks .... On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji,There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to give the correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, because we can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state some of the popular methods that are in use.Number of children------------------1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. The remaining number will give the number of children. 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th lord.3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) the 5th house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in the 5th house can give the total number of children. But if the planet is in own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is in exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This method is very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules connected with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th and aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of children.4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and 5th lord can indicate the number of children.But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to be any systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, amounts, persentage etc, that gives correct results. Male/Female determination-------------------------We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and planets.Love,Sreenadh , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote:>> dear pandit ji> namaste> > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows:> > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or > female sign.> > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets.> > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered > giving less and delayed children.> > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet is > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus in > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum number > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > (underdeveloped) babies.> > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned.> > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child > from 9H etc.> > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also > denotes children and have given how many children each planet in 3rd > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not > mentioning them.> > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of > children.> > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those cases > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and > their gender.> > with best wishes> pandit arjun > > , Panditji > <navagraha@> wrote: > >> > Namaste,> > > > I wanted start a new discussion.> > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there.> > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th > lord. # male> > graha influence = # male issues, etc.> > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > ...> > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel > class> > people have no more than two.> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2006 Report Share Posted May 25, 2006 Dear Panditji, => > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it > has traversed 6 placed.<= Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta Lagna the 5th lord Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a sthira sign Navamsa counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is in the 4th Navamsa. So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in number - Li, Sc, Sg and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and should be discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which indicates 2 male children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are placed in those signs that also discarded) I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This is the normal using style of this method. (If you want to use this method this much is the authentic portion. What is given below is part of some traditional advice) ----------------------------- But there is some thing special as well. Which can make it complex. Normally it is discarded. It is given below. The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't know the exact ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart from the two ancient methods - 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it is in 3rd Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method 2) Always strarting from Aries They give the following possibilities also for counting - They say - "Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa neecha va", meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - 1) From its sign of exaltation 2) From its own sign 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. 4) From its sign of debilitation. If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are adviced to follow this, as per the situation and intution. -- => When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. <= Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum of 3 issues - it is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also present there. In some situations, we may have to multiply the the total number of children we calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet or exaltation of planets. => > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is > this what you mean. <= Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a problem. Think of the situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries Lagna can we say that no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna will cause untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), but it can give issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). What would be your openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? That Sa neither will contribute to the total nor will cause death of child even though it is 8th lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. Love, Sreenadh Panditji <navagraha wrote: Namaste Sreenadhji, When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you mean. Thanks ... On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji,There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to give the correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, because we can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state some of the popular methods that are in use.Number of children------------------1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. The remaining number will give the number of children. 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th lord.3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) the 5th house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in the 5th house can give the total number of children. But if the planet is in own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is in exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This method is very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules connected with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th and aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of children.4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and 5th lord can indicate the number of children.But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to be any systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, amounts, persentage etc, that gives correct results. Male/Female determination-------------------------We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and planets.Love,Sreenadh , "panditarjun2004" <panditarjun2004 wrote:>> dear pandit ji> namaste> > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows:> > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or > female sign.> > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets.> > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered > giving less and delayed children.> > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet is > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus in > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum number > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > (underdeveloped) babies.> > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned.> > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child > from 9H etc.> > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also > denotes children and have given how many children each planet in 3rd > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not > mentioning them.> > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of > children.> > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those cases > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and > their gender.> > with best wishes> pandit arjun > > , Panditji > <navagraha@> wrote: > >> > Namaste,> > > > I wanted start a new discussion.> > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there.> > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th > lord. # male> > graha influence = # male issues, etc.> > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > ...> > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel > class> > people have no more than two.> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2006 Report Share Posted May 25, 2006 Thanks Sreenadhji, In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) is it because li and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it because of badhaka sign for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this counting ?) What about counting for Char and dwiswabhav rashis ? Where does the counting begin ? .... On 5/24/06, sree nadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji, => > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it > has traversed 6 placed.<= Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta Lagna the 5th lord Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a sthira sign Navamsa counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is in the 4th Navamsa. So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in number - Li, Sc, Sg and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and should be discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which indicates 2 male children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are placed in those signs that also discarded) I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This is the normal using style of this method. (If you want to use this method this much is the authentic portion. What is given below is part of some traditional advice) ----------------------------- But there is some thing special as well. Which can make it complex. Normally it is discarded. It is given below. The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't know the exact ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart from the two ancient methods - 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it is in 3rd Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method 2) Always strarting from Aries They give the following possibilities also for counting - They say - " Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa neecha va " , meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - 1) From its sign of exaltation 2) From its own sign 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. 4) From its sign of debilitation. If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are adviced to follow this, as per the situation and intution. -- => When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. <= Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum of 3 issues - it is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also present there. In some situations, we may have to multiply the the total number of children we calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet or exaltation of planets. => > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is > this what you mean. <= Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a problem. Think of the situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries Lagna can we say that no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna will cause untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), but it can give issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). What would be your openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? That Sa neither will contribute to the total nor will cause death of child even though it is 8th lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. Love, Sreenadh Panditji <navagraha wrote: Namaste Sreenadhji, When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you mean. Thanks .... On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji,There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to give the correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, because we can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state some of the popular methods that are in use.Number of children------------------1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. The remaining number will give the number of children. 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th lord.3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) the 5th house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in the 5th house can give the total number of children. But if the planet is in own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is in exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This method is very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules connected with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th and aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of children.4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and 5th lord can indicate the number of children.But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to be any systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, amounts, persentage etc, that gives correct results. Male/Female determination-------------------------We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and planets.Love,Sreenadh , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote:>> dear pandit ji> namaste> > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows:> > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or > female sign.> > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets. > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered > giving less and delayed children.> > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet is > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus in > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum number > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > (underdeveloped) babies.> > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned.> > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child > from 9H etc.> > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also > denotes children and have given how many children each planet in 3rd > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not > mentioning them.> > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of > children.> > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those cases > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and > their gender.> > with best wishes> pandit arjun > > , Panditji > <navagraha@> wrote: > >> > Namaste,> > > > I wanted start a new discussion.> > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there.> > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th > lord. # male> > graha influence = # male issues, etc.> > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > ...> > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel > class> > people have no more than two.> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2006 Report Share Posted May 25, 2006 Dear Panditji, => > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) is it because li > and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? <= Yes. => > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it because of badhaka sign > for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this counting ?) <= No - it is not conected to the badhaka concept. Navamsa couting technique is a simplefied version of Rx9 maths that is fundamental to Navamsa. I will explain. For Aries how many Navamsas are there? 9 right? For Aries Navamsha count starts from Aries and ends in Sg. So where shold the counting of Navamsha for Tarus should start? From the next sign Cp right? This Cp is the 9th from Tarus, that is just co-insidance. So for Tarus the conting starts from Cp and ends in Virgo, sice only 9 amsas are there. The next sign is Ge. For geminy from where the counting should start? The sign next to Virgo - right? So fo Ge the counting starts from Libra. Now Libra is the 5th from Gemini, that is just co-insidance. So the actual concept behind is : Navamsa is the 9th paripriti (harmonic) of Rasi. If anyone what to find in which sign navamsa falls he can simply use the formula R x9 as well. Fro example, If Mo is in 7th degree of Aries, then, 7 deg x 9 = 63 deg Every body knows that a sign is 30 deg and there fore 63 deg should fall in Gemini. Or in otherwords 7 deg aries is the 3rd Navamsa and it, ranges from 6 deg 40 min to 10 deg 00 min in Aries, and is alotted to Gemini for navamsa rulership. This kind of mixing of the charecteristics of the signs is the fundamental concept behind astrology. That is why parasara said about Hora - "Parivritti dwayam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet" Hora is the second harmonic of Rasi (R x 2) And about Drekkana - "Parivritti treyam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet" Drekkana is the third harmonic of Rasi (R x 3) Yes, this kind of mixing of the charecteristics of Rasis is the concept behind Dwadasa varga system.And Navamsa is the 9th Varga Love, Sreenadh Panditji <navagraha wrote: Thanks Sreenadhji, In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) is it because li and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it because of badhaka sign for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this counting ?) What about counting for Char and dwiswabhav rashis ? Where does the counting begin ? ... On 5/24/06, sree nadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji, => > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it > has traversed 6 placed.<= Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta Lagna the 5th lord Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a sthira sign Navamsa counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is in the 4th Navamsa. So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in number - Li, Sc, Sg and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and should be discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which indicates 2 male children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are placed in those signs that also discarded) I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This is the normal using style of this method. (If you want to use this method this much is the authentic portion. What is given below is part of some traditional advice) ----------------------------- But there is some thing special as well. Which can make it complex. Normally it is discarded. It is given below. The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't know the exact ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart from the two ancient methods - 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it is in 3rd Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method 2) Always strarting from Aries They give the following possibilities also for counting - They say - "Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa neecha va", meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - 1) From its sign of exaltation 2) From its own sign 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. 4) From its sign of debilitation. If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are adviced to follow this, as per the situation and intution. -- => When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. <= Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum of 3 issues - it is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also present there. In some situations, we may have to multiply the the total number of children we calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet or exaltation of planets. => > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is > this what you mean. <= Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a problem. Think of the situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries Lagna can we say that no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna will cause untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), but it can give issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). What would be your openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? That Sa neither will contribute to the total nor will cause death of child even though it is 8th lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. Love, Sreenadh Panditji <navagraha wrote: Namaste Sreenadhji, When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you mean. Thanks ... On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji,There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to give the correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, because we can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state some of the popular methods that are in use.Number of children------------------1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. The remaining number will give the number of children. 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th lord.3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) the 5th house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in the 5th house can give the total number of children. But if the planet is in own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is in exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This method is very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules connected with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th and aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of children.4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and 5th lord can indicate the number of children.But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to be any systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, amounts, persentage etc, that gives correct results. Male/Female determination-------------------------We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and planets.Love,Sreenadh , "panditarjun2004" <panditarjun2004 wrote:>> dear pandit ji> namaste> > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows:> > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or > female sign.> > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets. > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered > giving less and delayed children.> > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet is > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus in > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum number > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > (underdeveloped) babies.> > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned.> > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child > from 9H etc.> > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also > denotes children and have given how many children each planet in 3rd > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not > mentioning them.> > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of > children.> > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those cases > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and > their gender.> > with best wishes> pandit arjun > > , Panditji > <navagraha@> wrote: > >> > Namaste,> > > > I wanted start a new discussion.> > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there.> > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th > lord. # male> > graha influence = # male issues, etc.> > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > ...> > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel > class> > people have no more than two.> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2006 Report Share Posted May 25, 2006 Thanks. Yes, Navansha in each sign starts Same sign for chara 9th from the sign in sthir and 5th from the sign in dwiswabaha. Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the navashas traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? This technique like you said is not foolproof, and will not work if one had more than 7-8 kids. As number of navashas traversed will be 12 max and then when one takes out malefic signs and malefic planets out of it, it would be tough to get more than a few kids. P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. Also,lets discuss the SAV points to do the same calculations On 5/25/06, sree nadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji, => > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) is it because li > and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? <= Yes. => > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it because of badhaka sign > for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this counting ?) <= No - it is not conected to the badhaka concept. Navamsa couting technique is a simplefied version of Rx9 maths that is fundamental to Navamsa. I will explain. For Aries how many Navamsas are there? 9 right? For Aries Navamsha count starts from Aries and ends in Sg. So where shold the counting of Navamsha for Tarus should start? From the next sign Cp right? This Cp is the 9th from Tarus, that is just co-insidance. So for Tarus the conting starts from Cp and ends in Virgo, sice only 9 amsas are there. The next sign is Ge. For geminy from where the counting should start? The sign next to Virgo - right? So fo Ge the counting starts from Libra. Now Libra is the 5th from Gemini, that is just co-insidance. So the actual concept behind is : Navamsa is the 9th paripriti (harmonic) of Rasi. If anyone what to find in which sign navamsa falls he can simply use the formula R x9 as well. Fro example, If Mo is in 7th degree of Aries, then, 7 deg x 9 = 63 deg Every body knows that a sign is 30 deg and there fore 63 deg should fall in Gemini. Or in otherwords 7 deg aries is the 3rd Navamsa and it, ranges from 6 deg 40 min to 10 deg 00 min in Aries, and is alotted to Gemini for navamsa rulership. This kind of mixing of the charecteristics of the signs is the fundamental concept behind astrology. That is why parasara said about Hora - " Parivritti dwayam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " Hora is the second harmonic of Rasi (R x 2) And about Drekkana - " Parivritti treyam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " Drekkana is the third harmonic of Rasi (R x 3) Yes, this kind of mixing of the charecteristics of Rasis is the concept behind Dwadasa varga system.And Navamsa is the 9th Varga Love, Sreenadh Panditji <navagraha wrote: Thanks Sreenadhji, In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) is it because li and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it because of badhaka sign for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this counting ?) What about counting for Char and dwiswabhav rashis ? Where does the counting begin ? .... On 5/24/06, sree nadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji, => > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it > has traversed 6 placed.<= Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta Lagna the 5th lord Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a sthira sign Navamsa counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is in the 4th Navamsa. So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in number - Li, Sc, Sg and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and should be discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which indicates 2 male children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are placed in those signs that also discarded) I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This is the normal using style of this method. (If you want to use this method this much is the authentic portion. What is given below is part of some traditional advice) ----------------------------- But there is some thing special as well. Which can make it complex. Normally it is discarded. It is given below. The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't know the exact ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart from the two ancient methods - 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it is in 3rd Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method 2) Always strarting from Aries They give the following possibilities also for counting - They say - " Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa neecha va " , meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - 1) From its sign of exaltation 2) From its own sign 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. 4) From its sign of debilitation. If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are adviced to follow this, as per the situation and intution. -- => When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. <= Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum of 3 issues - it is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also present there. In some situations, we may have to multiply the the total number of children we calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet or exaltation of planets. => > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is > this what you mean. <= Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a problem. Think of the situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries Lagna can we say that no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna will cause untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), but it can give issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). What would be your openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? That Sa neither will contribute to the total nor will cause death of child even though it is 8th lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. Love, Sreenadh Panditji <navagraha wrote: Namaste Sreenadhji, When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you mean. Thanks .... On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji,There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to give the correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, because we can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state some of the popular methods that are in use.Number of children------------------1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. The remaining number will give the number of children. 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th lord.3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) the 5th house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in the 5th house can give the total number of children. But if the planet is in own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is in exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This method is very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules connected with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th and aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of children.4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and 5th lord can indicate the number of children.But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to be any systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, amounts, persentage etc, that gives correct results. Male/Female determination-------------------------We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and planets.Love,Sreenadh , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote:>> dear pandit ji> namaste> > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows:> > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or > female sign.> > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets. > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered > giving less and delayed children.> > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet is > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus in > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum number > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > (underdeveloped) babies.> > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned.> > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child > from 9H etc.> > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also > denotes children and have given how many children each planet in 3rd > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not > mentioning them.> > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of > children.> > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those cases > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and > their gender.> > with best wishes> pandit arjun > > , Panditji > <navagraha@> wrote: > >> > Namaste,> > > > I wanted start a new discussion.> > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there.> > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th > lord. # male> > graha influence = # male issues, etc.> > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > ...> > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel > class> > people have no more than two.> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2006 Report Share Posted May 25, 2006 Dear Panditji, Any amsa should be a continuous counting from Aries. As you can see in the case of Navamsa it is clear. => > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the navashas > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? <= You mean the countining mentioning Chara-sthira-dwiswabhava variation. I thik there is probably a sloka in Prasnamarga. (Have to check) The counting is just a technique to get Navamsa position in an easy method and it is not necessory that Rishi horas should mention them, even after stating that is 1/9th of a sign (Navamsa). We can see planty of places where navamsa is used in Rishi horas. I will give some examples in some other mail, quoting those slokas. => > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. <= Not much difference - It is the same method used to find the number of children. One just need to change the significator, house etc - that is all. => > Also,lets discuss the > SAV points to do the same calculations <= I am not an expert in SAV and is still in search, who created this Ashtavarga system? If you discuss it I will listen. Love, Sreenadh , Panditji <navagraha wrote: > > Thanks. > > Yes, Navansha in each sign starts > > Same sign for chara > 9th from the sign in sthir and > 5th from the sign in dwiswabaha. > > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the navashas > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? > > This technique like you said is not foolproof, and will not work if one had > more than 7-8 kids. As number of navashas traversed will be 12 max and then > when one takes out malefic signs and malefic planets out of it, it would be > tough to get more than a few kids. > > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. Also,lets discuss the > SAV points to do the same calculations > > > On 5/25/06, sree nadh <sreesog wrote: > > > > Dear Panditji, > > => > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) is it > > because li > > > and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > <= > > Yes. > > > > => > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it because > > of badhaka sign > > > for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this counting ?) > > <= > > > > No - it is not conected to the badhaka concept. Navamsa couting technique > > is a simplefied version of Rx9 maths that is fundamental to Navamsa. I will > > explain. > > For Aries how many Navamsas are there? 9 right? For Aries Navamsha count > > starts from Aries and ends in Sg. So where shold the counting of Navamsha > > for Tarus should start? From the next sign Cp right? This Cp is the 9th from > > Tarus, that is just co-insidance. So for Tarus the conting starts from Cp > > and ends in Virgo, sice only 9 amsas are there. The next sign is Ge. For > > geminy from where the counting should start? The sign next to Virgo - right? > > So fo Ge the counting starts from Libra. Now Libra is the 5th from Gemini, > > that is just co-insidance. So the actual concept behind is : > > Navamsa is the 9th paripriti (harmonic) of Rasi. > > If anyone what to find in which sign navamsa falls he can simply use > > the formula > > R x9 as well. > > Fro example, If Mo is in 7th degree of Aries, then, > > 7 deg x 9 = 63 deg > > Every body knows that a sign is 30 deg and there fore 63 deg should fall > > in Gemini. Or in otherwords 7 deg aries is the 3rd Navamsa and it, ranges > > from 6 deg 40 min to 10 deg 00 min in Aries, and is alotted to Gemini > > for navamsa rulership. > > > > This kind of mixing of the charecteristics of the signs is the fundamental > > concept behind astrology. That is why parasara said about Hora - > > " Parivritti dwayam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > Hora is the second harmonic of Rasi (R x 2) > > And about Drekkana - > > " Parivritti treyam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > Drekkana is the third harmonic of Rasi (R x 3) > > Yes, this kind of mixing of the charecteristics of Rasis is the concept > > behind Dwadasa varga system.And Navamsa is the 9th Varga > > Love, > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha* wrote: > > > > Thanks Sreenadhji, > > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) is it > > because li and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it because of > > badhaka sign for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this > > counting ?) > > > > What about counting for Char and dwiswabhav rashis ? Where does the > > counting begin ? > > > > ... > > > > > > On 5/24/06, sree nadh <sreesog wrote: > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > => > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs > > > traversed by 5th > > > > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in > > > dhanu navansha, it > > > > has traversed 6 placed. > > > <= > > > Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta Lagna the 5th lord > > > Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a sthira sign Navamsa > > > counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is in the 4th Navamsa. > > > So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in number - Li, Sc, Sg > > > and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and should be > > > discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which indicates 2 male > > > children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are placed in those > > > signs that also discarded) > > > I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This is the normal > > > using style of this method. (If you want to use this method this much is the > > > authentic portion. What is given below is part of some traditional advice) > > > ----------------------------- > > > But there is some thing special as well. Which can make it complex. > > > Normally it is discarded. It is given below. > > > The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't know the exact > > > ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart from the two ancient > > > methods - > > > 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it is in 3rd > > > Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method > > > 2) Always strarting from Aries > > > They give the following possibilities also for counting - > > > They say - " Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa neecha > > > va " , meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - > > > 1) From its sign of exaltation > > > 2) From its own sign > > > 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. > > > 4) From its sign of debilitation. > > > If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are adviced to follow > > > this, as per the situation and intution. > > > -- > > > => > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. > > > <= > > > Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum of 3 issues - it > > > is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also present there. In some > > > situations, we may have to multiply the the total number of children we > > > calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet or exaltation of > > > planets. > > > > > > => > > > > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute > > > to the total, is > > > > this what you mean. > > > <= > > > Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a problem. Think of the > > > situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries Lagna can we say that > > > no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa > > > Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna will cause > > > untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), but it can give > > > issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). What would be your > > > openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? That Sa neither will > > > contribute to the total nor will cause death of child even though it is 8th > > > lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. > > > > > > Love, > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha* wrote: > > > > > > Namaste Sreenadhji, > > > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed > > > by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and > > > in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. > > > > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th > > > house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you mean. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to give the > > > > correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, because we > > > > can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state some of > > > > the popular methods that are in use. > > > > > > > > Number of children > > > > ------------------ > > > > 1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by > > > > malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. The > > > > remaining number will give the number of children. > > > > 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th lord. > > > > 3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) the 5th > > > > house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in the 5th > > > > house can give the total number of children. But if the planet is in > > > > own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is in > > > > exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This method is > > > > very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules connected > > > > with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th and > > > > aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of > > > > children. > > > > 4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and 5th > > > > lord can indicate the number of children. > > > > > > > > But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to be any > > > > systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, amounts, > > > > persentage etc, that gives correct results. > > > > > > > > Male/Female determination > > > > ------------------------- > > > > We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and planets. > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " panditarjun2004 " > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > dear pandit ji > > > > > namaste > > > > > > > > > > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows: > > > > > > > > > > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female > > > > > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or > > > > > female sign. > > > > > > > > > > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, > > > > > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets. > > > > > > > > > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered > > > > > giving less and delayed children. > > > > > > > > > > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet > > > > is > > > > > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H > > > > > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H > > > > > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus > > > > in > > > > > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum > > > > number > > > > > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the > > > > > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > > > > > > > > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > > > > > (underdeveloped) babies. > > > > > > > > > > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number > > > > > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number > > > > > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned. > > > > > > > > > > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child > > > > > from 9H etc. > > > > > > > > > > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also > > > > > denotes children and have given how many children each planet in > > > > 3rd > > > > > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not > > > > > mentioning them. > > > > > > > > > > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of > > > > > children. > > > > > > > > > > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the > > > > > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the > > > > > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and > > > > > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those > > > > cases > > > > > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and > > > > > their gender. > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > , Panditji > > > > > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > I wanted start a new discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > > > > > > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th > > > > > lord. # male > > > > > > graha influence = # male issues, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel > > > > > class > > > > > > people have no more than two. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2006 Report Share Posted May 25, 2006 dear sreenadh ji the way you explain rules in simple and easily understandable way makes you an ideal teacher. if and when you decide to teach astrology, i would be your first student. could you please advise is there any way to figure out the total number of children for a 'man' from one wife or two wives or how many children from each wife. for example, one person has two wives. he begets three children from 1st wife and two children from the second wife. does his chart suggests that he would be having a total of five children along with the genders of the children. what if a person like osama bin laden having a dozen wives and several dozens of children. does that big figure fits in the formulae mentioned by you. with best wishes pandit arjun , " Sreenadh " <sreesog wrote: > > Dear Panditji, > Any amsa should be a continuous counting from Aries. As you can see > in the case of Navamsa it is clear. > => > > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the navashas > > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? > <= > You mean the countining mentioning Chara-sthira-dwiswabhava > variation. I thik there is probably a sloka in Prasnamarga. (Have to > check) > The counting is just a technique to get Navamsa position in an easy > method and it is not necessory that Rishi horas should mention them, > even after stating that is 1/9th of a sign (Navamsa). > We can see planty of places where navamsa is used in Rishi horas. I > will give some examples in some other mail, quoting those slokas. > > => > > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. > <= > Not much difference - It is the same method used to find the number > of children. One just need to change the significator, house etc - > that is all. > > => > > Also,lets discuss the > > SAV points to do the same calculations > <= > > I am not an expert in SAV and is still in search, who created this > Ashtavarga system? If you discuss it I will listen. > > Love, > Sreenadh > , Panditji > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > Thanks. > > > > Yes, Navansha in each sign starts > > > > Same sign for chara > > 9th from the sign in sthir and > > 5th from the sign in dwiswabaha. > > > > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the navashas > > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? > > > > This technique like you said is not foolproof, and will not work if > one had > > more than 7-8 kids. As number of navashas traversed will be 12 max > and then > > when one takes out malefic signs and malefic planets out of it, it > would be > > tough to get more than a few kids. > > > > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. Also,lets > discuss the > > SAV points to do the same calculations > > > > > > On 5/25/06, sree nadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > => > > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and > Sg) is it > > > because li > > > > and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > > <= > > > Yes. > > > > > > => > > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it > because > > > of badhaka sign > > > > for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this > counting ?) > > > <= > > > > > > No - it is not conected to the badhaka concept. Navamsa couting > technique > > > is a simplefied version of Rx9 maths that is fundamental to > Navamsa. I will > > > explain. > > > For Aries how many Navamsas are there? 9 right? For Aries > Navamsha count > > > starts from Aries and ends in Sg. So where shold the counting of > Navamsha > > > for Tarus should start? From the next sign Cp right? This Cp is > the 9th from > > > Tarus, that is just co-insidance. So for Tarus the conting > starts from Cp > > > and ends in Virgo, sice only 9 amsas are there. The next sign is > Ge. For > > > geminy from where the counting should start? The sign next to > Virgo - right? > > > So fo Ge the counting starts from Libra. Now Libra is the 5th > from Gemini, > > > that is just co-insidance. So the actual concept behind is : > > > Navamsa is the 9th paripriti (harmonic) of Rasi. > > > If anyone what to find in which sign navamsa falls he can > simply use > > > the formula > > > R x9 as well. > > > Fro example, If Mo is in 7th degree of Aries, then, > > > 7 deg x 9 = 63 deg > > > Every body knows that a sign is 30 deg and there fore 63 deg > should fall > > > in Gemini. Or in otherwords 7 deg aries is the 3rd Navamsa and > it, ranges > > > from 6 deg 40 min to 10 deg 00 min in Aries, and is alotted to > Gemini > > > for navamsa rulership. > > > > > > This kind of mixing of the charecteristics of the signs is the > fundamental > > > concept behind astrology. That is why parasara said about Hora - > > > " Parivritti dwayam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > > Hora is the second harmonic of Rasi (R x 2) > > > And about Drekkana - > > > " Parivritti treyam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > > Drekkana is the third harmonic of Rasi (R x 3) > > > Yes, this kind of mixing of the charecteristics of Rasis is the > concept > > > behind Dwadasa varga system.And Navamsa is the 9th Varga > > > Love, > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha@>* wrote: > > > > > > Thanks Sreenadhji, > > > > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) > is it > > > because li and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > > > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it > because of > > > badhaka sign for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic > behind this > > > counting ?) > > > > > > What about counting for Char and dwiswabhav rashis ? Where does > the > > > counting begin ? > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > On 5/24/06, sree nadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > => > > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of > signs > > > > traversed by 5th > > > > > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer > and in > > > > dhanu navansha, it > > > > > has traversed 6 placed. > > > > <= > > > > Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta Lagna the > 5th lord > > > > Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a sthira > sign Navamsa > > > > counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is in the > 4th Navamsa. > > > > So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in number - > Li, Sc, Sg > > > > and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and should > be > > > > discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which indicates > 2 male > > > > children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are placed > in those > > > > signs that also discarded) > > > > I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This is the > normal > > > > using style of this method. (If you want to use this method > this much is the > > > > authentic portion. What is given below is part of some > traditional advice) > > > > ----------------------------- > > > > But there is some thing special as well. Which can make it > complex. > > > > Normally it is discarded. It is given below. > > > > The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't know > the exact > > > > ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart from the > two ancient > > > > methods - > > > > 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it is in > 3rd > > > > Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method > > > > 2) Always strarting from Aries > > > > They give the following possibilities also for counting - > > > > They say - " Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa neecha > > > > va " , meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - > > > > 1) From its sign of exaltation > > > > 2) From its own sign > > > > 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. > > > > 4) From its sign of debilitation. > > > > If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are adviced > to follow > > > > this, as per the situation and intution. > > > > -- > > > > => > > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number > by 2 , if > > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number > contributed by > > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues > if in 5th > > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. > > > > <= > > > > Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum of 3 > issues - it > > > > is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also present > there. In some > > > > situations, we may have to multiply the the total number of > children we > > > > calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet or > exaltation of > > > > planets. > > > > > > > > => > > > > > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not > contribute > > > > to the total, is > > > > > this what you mean. > > > > <= > > > > Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a problem. > Think of the > > > > situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries Lagna can > we say that > > > > no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp > for Virgoa > > > > Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa > Lagna will cause > > > > untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), but it > can give > > > > issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). What > would be your > > > > openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? That Sa > neither will > > > > contribute to the total nor will cause death of child even > though it is 8th > > > > lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha@>* wrote: > > > > > > > > Namaste Sreenadhji, > > > > > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs > traversed > > > > by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in > cancer and > > > > in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. > > > > > > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by > 2 , if > > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number > contributed by > > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues > if in 5th > > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural malefic > is in 5th > > > > house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you > mean. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > > There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to > give the > > > > > correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, > because we > > > > > can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state > some of > > > > > the popular methods that are in use. > > > > > > > > > > Number of children > > > > > ------------------ > > > > > 1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by > > > > > malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. > The > > > > > remaining number will give the number of children. > > > > > 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th > lord. > > > > > 3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) > the 5th > > > > > house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in > the 5th > > > > > house can give the total number of children. But if the > planet is in > > > > > own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is > in > > > > > exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This > method is > > > > > very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules > connected > > > > > with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th > and > > > > > aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of > > > > > children. > > > > > 4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and > 5th > > > > > lord can indicate the number of children. > > > > > > > > > > But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to > be any > > > > > systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, > amounts, > > > > > persentage etc, that gives correct results. > > > > > > > > > > Male/Female determination > > > > > ------------------------- > > > > > We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and > planets. > > > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > , " panditarjun2004 " > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > dear pandit ji > > > > > > namaste > > > > > > > > > > > > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as > follows: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are > female > > > > > > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a > male or > > > > > > female sign. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. > moon, > > > > > > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving > planets. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are > considered > > > > > > giving less and delayed children. > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which > planet > > > > > is > > > > > > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon > in 5H > > > > > > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury > in 5H > > > > > > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. > venus > > > > > in > > > > > > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give > maximum > > > > > number > > > > > > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son > if the > > > > > > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > > > > > > (underdeveloped) babies. > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of > 5H, number > > > > > > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly > number > > > > > > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned. > > > > > > > > > > > > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third > child > > > > > > from 9H etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd > house also > > > > > > denotes children and have given how many children each > planet in > > > > > 3rd > > > > > > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and > hence not > > > > > > mentioning them. > > > > > > > > > > > > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the > number of > > > > > > children. > > > > > > > > > > > > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen > in the > > > > > > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and > not the > > > > > > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy > and > > > > > > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in > those > > > > > cases > > > > > > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children > and > > > > > > their gender. > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > , Panditji > > > > > > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I wanted start a new discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be > there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house > and 5th > > > > > > lord. # male > > > > > > > graha influence = # male issues, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most > middel > > > > > > class > > > > > > > people have no more than two. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2006 Report Share Posted May 25, 2006 Namaskaar Sri ArjunI have offered place for starting of classes in Delhi whenever Sri Sreenadh is back here. He still waits for everyone's response. I hope the classes can start.Thanks and Regards BharatOn 5/25/06, panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004 wrote: dear sreenadh ji the way you explain rules in simple and easily understandable way makes you an ideal teacher. if and when you decide to teach astrology, i would be your first student. could you please advise is there any way to figure out the total number of children for a 'man' from one wife or two wives or how many children from each wife. for example, one person has two wives. he begets three children from 1st wife and two children from the second wife. does his chart suggests that he would be having a total of five children along with the genders of the children. what if a person like osama bin laden having a dozen wives and several dozens of children. does that big figure fits in the formulae mentioned by you. with best wishes pandit arjun , " Sreenadh " <sreesog wrote: > > Dear Panditji, > Any amsa should be a continuous counting from Aries. As you can see > in the case of Navamsa it is clear. > => > > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the navashas > > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? > <= > You mean the countining mentioning Chara-sthira-dwiswabhava > variation. I thik there is probably a sloka in Prasnamarga. (Have to > check) > The counting is just a technique to get Navamsa position in an easy > method and it is not necessory that Rishi horas should mention them, > even after stating that is 1/9th of a sign (Navamsa). > We can see planty of places where navamsa is used in Rishi horas. I > will give some examples in some other mail, quoting those slokas. > > => > > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. > <= > Not much difference - It is the same method used to find the number > of children. One just need to change the significator, house etc - > that is all. > > => > > Also,lets discuss the > > SAV points to do the same calculations > <= > > I am not an expert in SAV and is still in search, who created this > Ashtavarga system? If you discuss it I will listen. > > Love, > Sreenadh > , Panditji > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > Thanks. > > > > Yes, Navansha in each sign starts > > > > Same sign for chara > > 9th from the sign in sthir and > > 5th from the sign in dwiswabaha. > > > > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the navashas > > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? > > > > This technique like you said is not foolproof, and will not work if > one had > > more than 7-8 kids. As number of navashas traversed will be 12 max > and then > > when one takes out malefic signs and malefic planets out of it, it > would be > > tough to get more than a few kids. > > > > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. Also,lets > discuss the > > SAV points to do the same calculations > > > > > > On 5/25/06, sree nadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > => > > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and > Sg) is it > > > because li > > > > and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > > <= > > > Yes. > > > > > > => > > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it > because > > > of badhaka sign > > > > for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this > counting ?) > > > <= > > > > > > No - it is not conected to the badhaka concept. Navamsa couting > technique > > > is a simplefied version of Rx9 maths that is fundamental to > Navamsa. I will > > > explain. > > > For Aries how many Navamsas are there? 9 right? For Aries > Navamsha count > > > starts from Aries and ends in Sg. So where shold the counting of > Navamsha > > > for Tarus should start? From the next sign Cp right? This Cp is > the 9th from > > > Tarus, that is just co-insidance. So for Tarus the conting > starts from Cp > > > and ends in Virgo, sice only 9 amsas are there. The next sign is > Ge. For > > > geminy from where the counting should start? The sign next to > Virgo - right? > > > So fo Ge the counting starts from Libra. Now Libra is the 5th > from Gemini, > > > that is just co-insidance. So the actual concept behind is : > > > Navamsa is the 9th paripriti (harmonic) of Rasi. > > > If anyone what to find in which sign navamsa falls he can > simply use > > > the formula > > > R x9 as well. > > > Fro example, If Mo is in 7th degree of Aries, then, > > > 7 deg x 9 = 63 deg > > > Every body knows that a sign is 30 deg and there fore 63 deg > should fall > > > in Gemini. Or in otherwords 7 deg aries is the 3rd Navamsa and > it, ranges > > > from 6 deg 40 min to 10 deg 00 min in Aries, and is alotted to > Gemini > > > for navamsa rulership. > > > > > > This kind of mixing of the charecteristics of the signs is the > fundamental > > > concept behind astrology. That is why parasara said about Hora - > > > " Parivritti dwayam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > > Hora is the second harmonic of Rasi (R x 2) > > > And about Drekkana - > > > " Parivritti treyam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > > Drekkana is the third harmonic of Rasi (R x 3) > > > Yes, this kind of mixing of the charecteristics of Rasis is the > concept > > > behind Dwadasa varga system.And Navamsa is the 9th Varga > > > Love, > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha@>* wrote: > > > > > > Thanks Sreenadhji, > > > > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) > is it > > > because li and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > > > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it > because of > > > badhaka sign for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic > behind this > > > counting ?) > > > > > > What about counting for Char and dwiswabhav rashis ? Where does > the > > > counting begin ? > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > On 5/24/06, sree nadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > => > > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of > signs > > > > traversed by 5th > > > > > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer > and in > > > > dhanu navansha, it > > > > > has traversed 6 placed. > > > > <= > > > > Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta Lagna the > 5th lord > > > > Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a sthira > sign Navamsa > > > > counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is in the > 4th Navamsa. > > > > So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in number - > Li, Sc, Sg > > > > and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and should > be > > > > discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which indicates > 2 male > > > > children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are placed > in those > > > > signs that also discarded) > > > > I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This is the > normal > > > > using style of this method. (If you want to use this method > this much is the > > > > authentic portion. What is given below is part of some > traditional advice) > > > > ----------------------------- > > > > But there is some thing special as well. Which can make it > complex. > > > > Normally it is discarded. It is given below. > > > > The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't know > the exact > > > > ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart from the > two ancient > > > > methods - > > > > 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it is in > 3rd > > > > Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method > > > > 2) Always strarting from Aries > > > > They give the following possibilities also for counting - > > > > They say - " Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa neecha > > > > va " , meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - > > > > 1) From its sign of exaltation > > > > 2) From its own sign > > > > 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. > > > > 4) From its sign of debilitation. > > > > If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are adviced > to follow > > > > this, as per the situation and intution. > > > > -- > > > > => > > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number > by 2 , if > > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number > contributed by > > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues > if in 5th > > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. > > > > <= > > > > Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum of 3 > issues - it > > > > is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also present > there. In some > > > > situations, we may have to multiply the the total number of > children we > > > > calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet or > exaltation of > > > > planets. > > > > > > > > => > > > > > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not > contribute > > > > to the total, is > > > > > this what you mean. > > > > <= > > > > Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a problem. > Think of the > > > > situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries Lagna can > we say that > > > > no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp > for Virgoa > > > > Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa > Lagna will cause > > > > untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), but it > can give > > > > issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). What > would be your > > > > openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? That Sa > neither will > > > > contribute to the total nor will cause death of child even > though it is 8th > > > > lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha@>* wrote: > > > > > > > > Namaste Sreenadhji, > > > > > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs > traversed > > > > by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in > cancer and > > > > in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. > > > > > > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by > 2 , if > > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number > contributed by > > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues > if in 5th > > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural malefic > is in 5th > > > > house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you > mean. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > > There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to > give the > > > > > correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, > because we > > > > > can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state > some of > > > > > the popular methods that are in use. > > > > > > > > > > Number of children > > > > > ------------------ > > > > > 1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by > > > > > malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. > The > > > > > remaining number will give the number of children. > > > > > 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th > lord. > > > > > 3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) > the 5th > > > > > house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in > the 5th > > > > > house can give the total number of children. But if the > planet is in > > > > > own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is > in > > > > > exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This > method is > > > > > very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules > connected > > > > > with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th > and > > > > > aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of > > > > > children. > > > > > 4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and > 5th > > > > > lord can indicate the number of children. > > > > > > > > > > But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to > be any > > > > > systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, > amounts, > > > > > persentage etc, that gives correct results. > > > > > > > > > > Male/Female determination > > > > > ------------------------- > > > > > We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and > planets. > > > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " panditarjun2004 " > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > dear pandit ji > > > > > > namaste > > > > > > > > > > > > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as > follows: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are > female > > > > > > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a > male or > > > > > > female sign. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. > moon, > > > > > > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving > planets. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are > considered > > > > > > giving less and delayed children. > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which > planet > > > > > is > > > > > > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon > in 5H > > > > > > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury > in 5H > > > > > > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. > venus > > > > > in > > > > > > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give > maximum > > > > > number > > > > > > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son > if the > > > > > > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > > > > > > (underdeveloped) babies. > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of > 5H, number > > > > > > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly > number > > > > > > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned. > > > > > > > > > > > > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third > child > > > > > > from 9H etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd > house also > > > > > > denotes children and have given how many children each > planet in > > > > > 3rd > > > > > > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and > hence not > > > > > > mentioning them. > > > > > > > > > > > > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the > number of > > > > > > children. > > > > > > > > > > > > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen > in the > > > > > > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and > not the > > > > > > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy > and > > > > > > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in > those > > > > > cases > > > > > > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children > and > > > > > > their gender. > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > , Panditji > > > > > > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I wanted start a new discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be > there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house > and 5th > > > > > > lord. # male > > > > > > > graha influence = # male issues, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most > middel > > > > > > class > > > > > > > people have no more than two. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 namaste bharat ji before we talk of sreenadh ji's classes, i wish to put few of my observations: 1. institutions like ICAS, Bharatiya Vidya Bhawan and SJC have contributed a lot in spreading the light of jyotish to aspiring astro students since ages. however, they are institutes and lessons are taught like a curriculum. few individual heroes of modern jyotish too have produced thousands of students on their own. 2. jyotish is such a kind of subject that it cannot be taught like other subjects or read from books. it is best learnt in a two way interface or in a open house discussion between many students. in such manner a student get answers to all his 1001 doubts and learn the subject FULLY without any gaps. 3. sreenadh ji and his group is found as one such source where there is no nonsense which creeps in other groups and jyotish alone is discussed here SERIOUSLY in a friendly manner with everyone trying to be as humble a student to learn as much. there is another such serious group but i found so much sycophancy and if the so called gurus does not have answers, the queries are just ignored and even the reminders are just ignored whereas in this group, all queries get answered and if one does not have an answer members strive to search for an answer and if he fails to find one, he would go to the extent of exploring new logics/answers or invent new logics/answers and put before the audience. unlike the gurukool system, unlike the school type sysem, this free open house way of spreading jyotish or learning jyotish is ideal for today's man. in case sreenadh ji cant find time for your noble idea of a free class in delhi, it would be a better idea if we all collectively start learning the jyotish again " from scratch " with all our 1001 doubts getting cleared in that learning process. with best wishes pandit arjun , " Bharat Hindu Astrology " <hinduastrology wrote: > > Namaskaar Sri Arjun > > I have offered place for starting of classes in Delhi whenever Sri Sreenadh > is back here. He still waits for everyone's response. > > I hope the classes can start. > > Thanks and Regards > Bharat > > > > On 5/25/06, panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > > > dear sreenadh ji > > > > the way you explain rules in simple and easily understandable way > > makes you an ideal teacher. if and when you decide to teach > > astrology, i would be your first student. > > > > could you please advise is there any way to figure out the total > > number of children for a 'man' from one wife or two wives or how > > many children from each wife. > > > > for example, one person has two wives. he begets three children > > from 1st wife and two children from the second wife. does his chart > > suggests that he would be having a total of five children along with > > the genders of the children. what if a person like osama bin laden > > having a dozen wives and several dozens of children. does that big > > figure fits in the formulae mentioned by you. > > > > > > with best wishes > > pandit arjun > > > > , " Sreenadh " > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > Any amsa should be a continuous counting from Aries. As you can > > see > > > in the case of Navamsa it is clear. > > > => > > > > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the > > navashas > > > > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? > > > <= > > > You mean the countining mentioning Chara-sthira-dwiswabhava > > > variation. I thik there is probably a sloka in Prasnamarga. (Have > > to > > > check) > > > The counting is just a technique to get Navamsa position in an > > easy > > > method and it is not necessory that Rishi horas should mention > > them, > > > even after stating that is 1/9th of a sign (Navamsa). > > > We can see planty of places where navamsa is used in Rishi horas. > > I > > > will give some examples in some other mail, quoting those slokas. > > > > > > => > > > > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. > > > <= > > > Not much difference - It is the same method used to find the > > number > > > of children. One just need to change the significator, house etc - > > > that is all. > > > > > > => > > > > Also,lets discuss the > > > > SAV points to do the same calculations > > > <= > > > > > > I am not an expert in SAV and is still in search, who created > > this > > > Ashtavarga system? If you discuss it I will listen. > > > > > > Love, > > > Sreenadh > > > , Panditji > > > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Thanks. > > > > > > > > Yes, Navansha in each sign starts > > > > > > > > Same sign for chara > > > > 9th from the sign in sthir and > > > > 5th from the sign in dwiswabaha. > > > > > > > > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the > > navashas > > > > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? > > > > > > > > This technique like you said is not foolproof, and will not work > > if > > > one had > > > > more than 7-8 kids. As number of navashas traversed will be 12 > > max > > > and then > > > > when one takes out malefic signs and malefic planets out of it, > > it > > > would be > > > > tough to get more than a few kids. > > > > > > > > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. Also,lets > > > discuss the > > > > SAV points to do the same calculations > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/25/06, sree nadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > > => > > > > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li > > and > > > Sg) is it > > > > > because li > > > > > > and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > > > > <= > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > => > > > > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is > > it > > > because > > > > > of badhaka sign > > > > > > for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this > > > counting ?) > > > > > <= > > > > > > > > > > No - it is not conected to the badhaka concept. Navamsa > > couting > > > technique > > > > > is a simplefied version of Rx9 maths that is fundamental to > > > Navamsa. I will > > > > > explain. > > > > > For Aries how many Navamsas are there? 9 right? For Aries > > > Navamsha count > > > > > starts from Aries and ends in Sg. So where shold the counting > > of > > > Navamsha > > > > > for Tarus should start? From the next sign Cp right? This Cp > > is > > > the 9th from > > > > > Tarus, that is just co-insidance. So for Tarus the conting > > > starts from Cp > > > > > and ends in Virgo, sice only 9 amsas are there. The next sign > > is > > > Ge. For > > > > > geminy from where the counting should start? The sign next to > > > Virgo - right? > > > > > So fo Ge the counting starts from Libra. Now Libra is the 5th > > > from Gemini, > > > > > that is just co-insidance. So the actual concept behind is : > > > > > Navamsa is the 9th paripriti (harmonic) of Rasi. > > > > > If anyone what to find in which sign navamsa falls he can > > > simply use > > > > > the formula > > > > > R x9 as well. > > > > > Fro example, If Mo is in 7th degree of Aries, then, > > > > > 7 deg x 9 = 63 deg > > > > > Every body knows that a sign is 30 deg and there fore 63 deg > > > should fall > > > > > in Gemini. Or in otherwords 7 deg aries is the 3rd Navamsa > > and > > > it, ranges > > > > > from 6 deg 40 min to 10 deg 00 min in Aries, and is alotted to > > > Gemini > > > > > for navamsa rulership. > > > > > > > > > > This kind of mixing of the charecteristics of the signs is the > > > fundamental > > > > > concept behind astrology. That is why parasara said about > > Hora - > > > > > " Parivritti dwayam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > > > > Hora is the second harmonic of Rasi (R x 2) > > > > > And about Drekkana - > > > > > " Parivritti treyam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > > > > Drekkana is the third harmonic of Rasi (R x 3) > > > > > Yes, this kind of mixing of the charecteristics of Rasis is > > the > > > concept > > > > > behind Dwadasa varga system.And Navamsa is the 9th Varga > > > > > Love, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha@>* wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Thanks Sreenadhji, > > > > > > > > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and > > Sg) > > > is it > > > > > because li and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it > > > because of > > > > > badhaka sign for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic > > > behind this > > > > > counting ?) > > > > > > > > > > What about counting for Char and dwiswabhav rashis ? Where > > does > > > the > > > > > counting begin ? > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/24/06, sree nadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > > > => > > > > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number > > of > > > signs > > > > > > traversed by 5th > > > > > > > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in > > cancer > > > and in > > > > > > dhanu navansha, it > > > > > > > has traversed 6 placed. > > > > > > <= > > > > > > Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta Lagna > > the > > > 5th lord > > > > > > Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a > > sthira > > > sign Navamsa > > > > > > counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is in > > the > > > 4th Navamsa. > > > > > > So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in > > number - > > > Li, Sc, Sg > > > > > > and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and > > should > > > be > > > > > > discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which > > indicates > > > 2 male > > > > > > children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are > > placed > > > in those > > > > > > signs that also discarded) > > > > > > I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This is > > the > > > normal > > > > > > using style of this method. (If you want to use this method > > > this much is the > > > > > > authentic portion. What is given below is part of some > > > traditional advice) > > > > > > ----------------------------- > > > > > > But there is some thing special as well. Which can make > > it > > > complex. > > > > > > Normally it is discarded. It is given below. > > > > > > The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't > > know > > > the exact > > > > > > ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart from > > the > > > two ancient > > > > > > methods - > > > > > > 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it is > > in > > > 3rd > > > > > > Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method > > > > > > 2) Always strarting from Aries > > > > > > They give the following possibilities also for counting - > > > > > > They say - " Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa neecha > > > > > > va " , meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - > > > > > > 1) From its sign of exaltation > > > > > > 2) From its own sign > > > > > > 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. > > > > > > 4) From its sign of debilitation. > > > > > > If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are > > adviced > > > to follow > > > > > > this, as per the situation and intution. > > > > > > -- > > > > > > => > > > > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the > > number > > > by 2 , if > > > > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number > > > contributed by > > > > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 > > issues > > > if in 5th > > > > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. > > > > > > <= > > > > > > Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum of 3 > > > issues - it > > > > > > is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also present > > > there. In some > > > > > > situations, we may have to multiply the the total number of > > > children we > > > > > > calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet or > > > exaltation of > > > > > > planets. > > > > > > > > > > > > => > > > > > > > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not > > > contribute > > > > > > to the total, is > > > > > > > this what you mean. > > > > > > <= > > > > > > Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a problem. > > > Think of the > > > > > > situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries Lagna > > can > > > we say that > > > > > > no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp > > > for Virgoa > > > > > > Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa > > > Lagna will cause > > > > > > untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), but > > it > > > can give > > > > > > issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). > > What > > > would be your > > > > > > openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? That Sa > > > neither will > > > > > > contribute to the total nor will cause death of child even > > > though it is 8th > > > > > > lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. > > > > > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha@>* wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Sreenadhji, > > > > > > > > > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of > > signs > > > traversed > > > > > > by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in > > > cancer and > > > > > > in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. > > > > > > > > > > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number > > by > > > 2 , if > > > > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number > > > contributed by > > > > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 > > issues > > > if in 5th > > > > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural > > malefic > > > is in 5th > > > > > > house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you > > > mean. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > > > > There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to > > > give the > > > > > > > correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, > > > because we > > > > > > > can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to > > state > > > some of > > > > > > > the popular methods that are in use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Number of children > > > > > > > ------------------ > > > > > > > 1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs > > owned by > > > > > > > malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are > > placed. > > > The > > > > > > > remaining number will give the number of children. > > > > > > > 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of > > 5th > > > lord. > > > > > > > 3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects > > (Drishti) > > > the 5th > > > > > > > house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed > > in > > > the 5th > > > > > > > house can give the total number of children. But if the > > > planet is in > > > > > > > own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it > > is > > > in > > > > > > > exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This > > > method is > > > > > > > very difficult to apply properly, due to many special > > rules > > > connected > > > > > > > with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in > > 5th > > > and > > > > > > > aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the > > number of > > > > > > > children. > > > > > > > 4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) > > and > > > 5th > > > > > > > lord can indicate the number of children. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems > > to > > > be any > > > > > > > systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, > > > amounts, > > > > > > > persentage etc, that gives correct results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Male/Female determination > > > > > > > ------------------------- > > > > > > > We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs > > and > > > planets. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > , " panditarjun2004 " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear pandit ji > > > > > > > > namaste > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as > > > follows: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are > > > female > > > > > > > > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a > > > male or > > > > > > > > female sign. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving > > planets. > > > moon, > > > > > > > > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving > > > planets. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are > > > considered > > > > > > > > giving less and delayed children. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out > > which > > > planet > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. > > moon > > > in 5H > > > > > > > > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. > > mercury > > > in 5H > > > > > > > > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 > > sons. > > > venus > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give > > > maximum > > > > > > > number > > > > > > > > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives > > son > > > if the > > > > > > > > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male > > planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give > > premature > > > > > > > > (underdeveloped) babies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of > > > 5H, number > > > > > > > > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and > > lastly > > > number > > > > > > > > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, > > third > > > child > > > > > > > > from 9H etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd > > > house also > > > > > > > > denotes children and have given how many children each > > > planet in > > > > > > > 3rd > > > > > > > > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and > > > hence not > > > > > > > > mentioning them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the > > > number of > > > > > > > > children. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be > > seen > > > in the > > > > > > > > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children > > and > > > not the > > > > > > > > father. this is based on various reasons. also in > > bigamy > > > and > > > > > > > > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in > > > those > > > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of > > children > > > and > > > > > > > > their gender. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Panditji > > > > > > > > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I wanted start a new discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will > > be > > > there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing > > issue. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th > > house > > > and 5th > > > > > > > > lord. # male > > > > > > > > > graha influence = # male issues, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when > > most > > > middel > > > > > > > > class > > > > > > > > > people have no more than two. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 Dear Sreenadhji, This reply of yours answers many of my doubts too. Thanks Sreenadhji for your knowledge sharing in very simple and understandable way. Regards, Kannan , sree nadh <sreesog wrote: > > Dear Panditji, > => > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) is it because li > > and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > <= > Yes. > > => > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it because of badhaka sign > > for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this counting ?) > <= > > No - it is not conected to the badhaka concept. Navamsa couting technique is a simplefied version of Rx9 maths that is fundamental to Navamsa. I will explain. > For Aries how many Navamsas are there? 9 right? For Aries Navamsha count starts from Aries and ends in Sg. So where shold the counting of Navamsha for Tarus should start? From the next sign Cp right? This Cp is the 9th from Tarus, that is just co-insidance. So for Tarus the conting starts from Cp and ends in Virgo, sice only 9 amsas are there. The next sign is Ge. For geminy from where the counting should start? The sign next to Virgo - right? So fo Ge the counting starts from Libra. Now Libra is the 5th from Gemini, that is just co-insidance. So the actual concept behind is : > Navamsa is the 9th paripriti (harmonic) of Rasi. > If anyone what to find in which sign navamsa falls he can simply use the formula > R x9 as well. > Fro example, If Mo is in 7th degree of Aries, then, > 7 deg x 9 = 63 deg > Every body knows that a sign is 30 deg and there fore 63 deg should fall in Gemini. Or in otherwords 7 deg aries is the 3rd Navamsa and it, ranges from 6 deg 40 min to 10 deg 00 min in Aries, and is alotted to Gemini for navamsa rulership. > > This kind of mixing of the charecteristics of the signs is the fundamental concept behind astrology. That is why parasara said about Hora - > " Parivritti dwayam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > Hora is the second harmonic of Rasi (R x 2) > And about Drekkana - > " Parivritti treyam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > Drekkana is the third harmonic of Rasi (R x 3) > Yes, this kind of mixing of the charecteristics of Rasis is the concept behind Dwadasa varga system.And Navamsa is the 9th Varga > Love, > Sreenadh > > > > > Panditji <navagraha wrote: > Thanks Sreenadhji, > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li and Sg) is it because li and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is it because of badhaka sign for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind this counting ?) > > What about counting for Char and dwiswabhav rashis ? Where does the counting begin ? > > ... > > > On 5/24/06, sree nadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji, > => > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th > > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it > > > has traversed 6 placed. > <= > Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta Lagna the 5th lord Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a sthira sign Navamsa counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is in the 4th Navamsa. So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in number - Li, Sc, Sg and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and should be discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which indicates 2 male children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are placed in those signs that also discarded) > I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This is the normal using style of this method. (If you want to use this method this much is the authentic portion. What is given below is part of some traditional advice) > ----------------------------- > But there is some thing special as well. Which can make it complex. Normally it is discarded. It is given below. > The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't know the exact ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart from the two ancient methods - > 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it is in 3rd Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method > 2) Always strarting from Aries > They give the following possibilities also for counting - > They say - " Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa neecha va " , meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - > 1) From its sign of exaltation > 2) From its own sign > 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. > 4) From its sign of debilitation. > If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are adviced to follow this, as per the situation and intution. > -- > => > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. > > <= > Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum of 3 issues - it is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also present there. In some situations, we may have to multiply the the total number of children we calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet or exaltation of planets. > > => > > > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is > > this what you mean. > > <= > Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a problem. Think of the situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries Lagna can we say that no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for Virgoa Lagna will cause untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), but it can give issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). What would be your openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? That Sa neither will contribute to the total nor will cause death of child even though it is 8th lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. > > Love, > Sreenadh > > > > > Panditji <navagraha wrote: > Namaste Sreenadhji, > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of signs traversed by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in cancer and in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the number by 2 , if in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the number contributed by itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 issues if in 5th house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does not contribute to the total, is this what you mean. > > Thanks > > ... > > > On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Panditji, > There are many methods, but most of them does not seems to give the > correct result, may be also due to the influence of will, because we > can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to state some of > the popular methods that are in use. > > Number of children > ------------------ > 1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs owned by > malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are placed. The > remaining number will give the number of children. > 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead of 5th lord. > 3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects (Drishti) the 5th > house + the total number of benefic planets that is placed in the 5th > house can give the total number of children. But if the planet is in > own house you need to multiply the number by two and if it is in > exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. [This method is > very difficult to apply properly, due to many special rules connected > with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed in 5th and > aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the number of > children. > 4) The number of planets placed between 5th house (=sign) and 5th > lord can indicate the number of children. > > But in general, in total astrology, there does not seems to be any > systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, amounts, > persentage etc, that gives correct results. > > Male/Female determination > ------------------------- > We have to depend on Male/Female classification of signs and planets. > > Love, > Sreenadh > > > , " panditarjun2004 " > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > dear pandit ji > > namaste > > > > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is as follows: > > > > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs are female > > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it has a male or > > female sign. > > > > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving planets. moon, > > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female giving planets. > > > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house are considered > > giving less and delayed children. > > > > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out which planet > is > > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. moon in 5H > > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. mercury in 5H > > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 sons. venus > in > > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give maximum > number > > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also gives son if the > > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male planet. > > > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give premature > > (underdeveloped) babies. > > > > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the sign of 5H, number > > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and lastly number > > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned. > > > > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, third child > > from 9H etc. > > > > 8. some researchers have written books stating that 3rd house also > > denotes children and have given how many children each planet in > 3rd > > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this and hence not > > mentioning them. > > > > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating the number of > > children. > > > > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be seen in the > > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives children and not the > > father. this is based on various reasons. also in bigamy and > > polygamy a man begets children from several wives and in those > cases > > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of children and > > their gender. > > > > with best wishes > > pandit arjun > > > > , Panditji > > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > I wanted start a new discussion. > > > > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues will be there. > > > > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing issue. > > > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th house and 5th > > lord. # male > > > graha influence = # male issues, etc. > > > > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > > > ... > > > > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age when most middel > > class > > > people have no more than two. > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 Dear Arjun ji, That was very good observations and I agree with it. Love, Sreenadh , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > namaste bharat ji > > before we talk of sreenadh ji's classes, i wish to put few of my > observations: > > 1. institutions like ICAS, Bharatiya Vidya Bhawan and SJC have > contributed a lot in spreading the light of jyotish to aspiring > astro students since ages. however, they are institutes and lessons > are taught like a curriculum. few individual heroes of modern > jyotish too have produced thousands of students on their own. > > 2. jyotish is such a kind of subject that it cannot be taught like > other subjects or read from books. it is best learnt in a two way > interface or in a open house discussion between many students. in > such manner a student get answers to all his 1001 doubts and learn > the subject FULLY without any gaps. > > 3. sreenadh ji and his group is found as one such source where there > is no nonsense which creeps in other groups and jyotish alone is > discussed here SERIOUSLY in a friendly manner with everyone trying > to be as humble a student to learn as much. there is another such > serious group but i found so much sycophancy and if the so called > gurus does not have answers, the queries are just ignored and even > the reminders are just ignored whereas in this group, all queries > get answered and if one does not have an answer members strive to > search for an answer and if he fails to find one, he would go to the > extent of exploring new logics/answers or invent new logics/answers > and put before the audience. > > unlike the gurukool system, unlike the school type sysem, this free > open house way of spreading jyotish or learning jyotish is ideal for > today's man. > > in case sreenadh ji cant find time for your noble idea of a free > class in delhi, it would be a better idea if we all collectively > start learning the jyotish again " from scratch " with all our 1001 > doubts getting cleared in that learning process. > > with best wishes > pandit arjun > > , " Bharat Hindu > Astrology " <hinduastrology@> wrote: > > > > Namaskaar Sri Arjun > > > > I have offered place for starting of classes in Delhi whenever Sri > Sreenadh > > is back here. He still waits for everyone's response. > > > > I hope the classes can start. > > > > Thanks and Regards > > Bharat > > > > > > > > On 5/25/06, panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > dear sreenadh ji > > > > > > the way you explain rules in simple and easily understandable way > > > makes you an ideal teacher. if and when you decide to teach > > > astrology, i would be your first student. > > > > > > could you please advise is there any way to figure out the total > > > number of children for a 'man' from one wife or two wives or how > > > many children from each wife. > > > > > > for example, one person has two wives. he begets three children > > > from 1st wife and two children from the second wife. does his > chart > > > suggests that he would be having a total of five children along > with > > > the genders of the children. what if a person like osama bin > laden > > > having a dozen wives and several dozens of children. does that > big > > > figure fits in the formulae mentioned by you. > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > , " Sreenadh " > > > > > > <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > Any amsa should be a continuous counting from Aries. As you > can > > > see > > > > in the case of Navamsa it is clear. > > > > => > > > > > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the > > > navashas > > > > > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? > > > > <= > > > > You mean the countining mentioning Chara-sthira-dwiswabhava > > > > variation. I thik there is probably a sloka in Prasnamarga. > (Have > > > to > > > > check) > > > > The counting is just a technique to get Navamsa position in an > > > easy > > > > method and it is not necessory that Rishi horas should mention > > > them, > > > > even after stating that is 1/9th of a sign (Navamsa). > > > > We can see planty of places where navamsa is used in Rishi > horas. > > > I > > > > will give some examples in some other mail, quoting those > slokas. > > > > > > > > => > > > > > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. > > > > <= > > > > Not much difference - It is the same method used to find the > > > number > > > > of children. One just need to change the significator, house > etc - > > > > that is all. > > > > > > > > => > > > > > Also,lets discuss the > > > > > SAV points to do the same calculations > > > > <= > > > > > > > > I am not an expert in SAV and is still in search, who created > > > this > > > > Ashtavarga system? If you discuss it I will listen. > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > Sreenadh > > > > , Panditji > > > > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > Yes, Navansha in each sign starts > > > > > > > > > > Same sign for chara > > > > > 9th from the sign in sthir and > > > > > 5th from the sign in dwiswabaha. > > > > > > > > > > Is this kind of counting done anywhere where the use of the > > > navashas > > > > > traversed is mentioned in tha classics ? > > > > > > > > > > This technique like you said is not foolproof, and will not > work > > > if > > > > one had > > > > > more than 7-8 kids. As number of navashas traversed will be > 12 > > > max > > > > and then > > > > > when one takes out malefic signs and malefic planets out of > it, > > > it > > > > would be > > > > > tough to get more than a few kids. > > > > > > > > > > P.S. Lets do the same exercise for number of siblings. > Also,lets > > > > discuss the > > > > > SAV points to do the same calculations > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/25/06, sree nadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > > > => > > > > > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( > Li > > > and > > > > Sg) is it > > > > > > because li > > > > > > > and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > > > > > <= > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > => > > > > > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( > Is > > > it > > > > because > > > > > > of badhaka sign > > > > > > > for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the logic behind > this > > > > counting ?) > > > > > > <= > > > > > > > > > > > > No - it is not conected to the badhaka concept. Navamsa > > > couting > > > > technique > > > > > > is a simplefied version of Rx9 maths that is fundamental to > > > > Navamsa. I will > > > > > > explain. > > > > > > For Aries how many Navamsas are there? 9 right? For Aries > > > > Navamsha count > > > > > > starts from Aries and ends in Sg. So where shold the > counting > > > of > > > > Navamsha > > > > > > for Tarus should start? From the next sign Cp right? This > Cp > > > is > > > > the 9th from > > > > > > Tarus, that is just co-insidance. So for Tarus the > conting > > > > starts from Cp > > > > > > and ends in Virgo, sice only 9 amsas are there. The next > sign > > > is > > > > Ge. For > > > > > > geminy from where the counting should start? The sign next > to > > > > Virgo - right? > > > > > > So fo Ge the counting starts from Libra. Now Libra is the > 5th > > > > from Gemini, > > > > > > that is just co-insidance. So the actual concept behind > is : > > > > > > Navamsa is the 9th paripriti (harmonic) of Rasi. > > > > > > If anyone what to find in which sign navamsa falls he > can > > > > simply use > > > > > > the formula > > > > > > R x9 as well. > > > > > > Fro example, If Mo is in 7th degree of Aries, then, > > > > > > 7 deg x 9 = 63 deg > > > > > > Every body knows that a sign is 30 deg and there fore 63 > deg > > > > should fall > > > > > > in Gemini. Or in otherwords 7 deg aries is the 3rd > Navamsa > > > and > > > > it, ranges > > > > > > from 6 deg 40 min to 10 deg 00 min in Aries, and is > alotted to > > > > Gemini > > > > > > for navamsa rulership. > > > > > > > > > > > > This kind of mixing of the charecteristics of the signs is > the > > > > fundamental > > > > > > concept behind astrology. That is why parasara said about > > > Hora - > > > > > > " Parivritti dwayam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > > > > > Hora is the second harmonic of Rasi (R x 2) > > > > > > And about Drekkana - > > > > > > " Parivritti treyam tesham meshadou kremaso vadet " > > > > > > Drekkana is the third harmonic of Rasi (R x 3) > > > > > > Yes, this kind of mixing of the charecteristics of Rasis > is > > > the > > > > concept > > > > > > behind Dwadasa varga system.And Navamsa is the 9th Varga > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha@>* wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks Sreenadhji, > > > > > > > > > > > > In your example of navansh, you said 2 male children ( Li > and > > > Sg) > > > > is it > > > > > > because li and Sg are odd and hence male signs ? > > > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, For sthir sign the counting starts from 9th ( Is > it > > > > because of > > > > > > badhaka sign for sthir rashi is 9th from it ? What the > logic > > > > behind this > > > > > > counting ?) > > > > > > > > > > > > What about counting for Char and dwiswabhav rashis ? Where > > > does > > > > the > > > > > > counting begin ? > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/24/06, sree nadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > > > > => > > > > > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the > number > > > of > > > > signs > > > > > > > traversed by 5th > > > > > > > > lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord is in > > > cancer > > > > and in > > > > > > > dhanu navansha, it > > > > > > > > has traversed 6 placed. > > > > > > > <= > > > > > > > Yes. But well I would calrify. Think that for Ta > Lagna > > > the > > > > 5th lord > > > > > > > Me is in Aq, and the Me Navamsa is in Cp. Since Aq is a > > > sthira > > > > sign Navamsa > > > > > > > counting starts from 9th sign Li, which means that Me is > in > > > the > > > > 4th Navamsa. > > > > > > > So the navamsa that should be considered are total 4 in > > > number - > > > > Li, Sc, Sg > > > > > > > and Cp. Out of this Sc and Cp are owned by malifics and > > > should > > > > be > > > > > > > discarded. The remaining are Li and Sg navamsas which > > > indicates > > > > 2 male > > > > > > > children.(We need to see Li and Sg, if any malifics are > > > placed > > > > in those > > > > > > > signs that also discarded) > > > > > > > I think this method is pretty simple and clear. This > is > > > the > > > > normal > > > > > > > using style of this method. (If you want to use this > method > > > > this much is the > > > > > > > authentic portion. What is given below is part of some > > > > traditional advice) > > > > > > > ----------------------------- > > > > > > > But there is some thing special as well. Which can > make > > > it > > > > complex. > > > > > > > Normally it is discarded. It is given below. > > > > > > > The problem with this method is - The ancients (don't > > > know > > > > the exact > > > > > > > ref) give a single rule for counting of Navmsa. Apart > from > > > the > > > > two ancient > > > > > > > methods - > > > > > > > 1) Normal number of Navamsa (If planet in 9th degree it > is > > > in > > > > 3rd > > > > > > > Navamsa etc) - Well agreed and standard method > > > > > > > 2) Always strarting from Aries > > > > > > > They give the following possibilities also for counting - > > > > > > > They say - " Sweche va, swaketre va, swa skane va, swa > neecha > > > > > > > va " , meaning this counting of of Navasa can be - > > > > > > > 1) From its sign of exaltation > > > > > > > 2) From its own sign > > > > > > > 3) From the sign in which the planet is placed. > > > > > > > 4) From its sign of debilitation. > > > > > > > If the standard method fails or seems to fail we are > > > adviced > > > > to follow > > > > > > > this, as per the situation and intution. > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > => > > > > > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the > > > number > > > > by 2 , if > > > > > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the > number > > > > contributed by > > > > > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 > > > issues > > > > if in 5th > > > > > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. > > > > > > > <= > > > > > > > Yes. An exalted planet aspecting 3 can give a maximum > of 3 > > > > issues - it > > > > > > > is the normal meaning. But the other meaning is also > present > > > > there. In some > > > > > > > situations, we may have to multiply the the total number > of > > > > children we > > > > > > > calculated with 2 or 3, depending on own house placemnet > or > > > > exaltation of > > > > > > > planets. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > => > > > > > > > > If an exalted natural malefic is in 5th house he does > not > > > > contribute > > > > > > > to the total, is > > > > > > > > this what you mean. > > > > > > > <= > > > > > > > Yes. But this benefic malific clasification is a > problem. > > > > Think of the > > > > > > > situation when Su is in Leo (its own house) for Aries > Lagna > > > can > > > > we say that > > > > > > > no children would be born? But the exalted Ma in 5th > sign Cp > > > > for Virgoa > > > > > > > Lagna it is true. The exalted Ma in 5th sign Cp for > Virgoa > > > > Lagna will cause > > > > > > > untimely death of child (since it is 8th lord as well), > but > > > it > > > > can give > > > > > > > issues as well (Ma is consider karaka for son by some!). > > > What > > > > would be your > > > > > > > openion about exalted Sa placed in 5th for Ge Lagna? > That Sa > > > > neither will > > > > > > > contribute to the total nor will cause death of child > even > > > > though it is 8th > > > > > > > lord. Thus it goes. Too many specila rules. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Panditji <navagraha@>* wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Sreenadhji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When you say navansha of 5th lord, meaning the number of > > > signs > > > > traversed > > > > > > > by 5th lord from the rashi position ? i.e. If 5th lord > is in > > > > cancer and > > > > > > > in dhanu navansha, it has traversed 6 placed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When you say if the graha is in own sign multiply the > number > > > by > > > > 2 , if > > > > > > > in exaltation multiply by 3. Do you mean multiply the > number > > > > contributed by > > > > > > > itself by 2 or 3. That is any planet can at most give 3 > > > issues > > > > if in 5th > > > > > > > house or aspecting the 5th house. If an exalted natural > > > malefic > > > > is in 5th > > > > > > > house he does not contribute to the total, is this what > you > > > > mean. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 5/24/06, Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Panditji, > > > > > > > > There are many methods, but most of them does not > seems to > > > > give the > > > > > > > > correct result, may be also due to the influence of > will, > > > > because we > > > > > > > > can stop preganacy at any time. But still I will try to > > > state > > > > some of > > > > > > > > the popular methods that are in use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Number of children > > > > > > > > ------------------ > > > > > > > > 1) Count the navamsa of the 5th lord. Avoid the signs > > > owned by > > > > > > > > malific planets, and the signs in which malifics are > > > placed. > > > > The > > > > > > > > remaining number will give the number of children. > > > > > > > > 2) The same method as told above taking the Ju instead > of > > > 5th > > > > lord. > > > > > > > > 3) The total number of bebefic planets that aspects > > > (Drishti) > > > > the 5th > > > > > > > > house + the total number of benefic planets that is > placed > > > in > > > > the 5th > > > > > > > > house can give the total number of children. But if the > > > > planet is in > > > > > > > > own house you need to multiply the number by two and > if it > > > is > > > > in > > > > > > > > exaltation you need to multiply the number by three. > [This > > > > method is > > > > > > > > very difficult to apply properly, due to many special > > > rules > > > > connected > > > > > > > > with]. But as arjun ji pointed out, the planets placed > in > > > 5th > > > > and > > > > > > > > aspecting 5th has much importance in determining the > > > number of > > > > > > > > children. > > > > > > > > 4) The number of planets placed between 5th house > (=sign) > > > and > > > > 5th > > > > > > > > lord can indicate the number of children. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But in general, in total astrology, there does not > seems > > > to > > > > be any > > > > > > > > systematic and generally applied to calculate numbers, > > > > amounts, > > > > > > > > persentage etc, that gives correct results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Male/Female determination > > > > > > > > ------------------------- > > > > > > > > We have to depend on Male/Female classification of > signs > > > and > > > > planets. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > , " panditarjun2004 " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear pandit ji > > > > > > > > > namaste > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > my understanding (open to correction or addition) is > as > > > > follows: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. all odd signs are male signs and all even signs > are > > > > female > > > > > > > > > signs. so the 5th house is first seen whether it > has a > > > > male or > > > > > > > > > female sign. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. sun, mars, jupiter are reckoned as male giving > > > planets. > > > > moon, > > > > > > > > > venus, mercury and saturn are reckoned as female > giving > > > > planets. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. taurus, leo, virgo and scorpio signs in 5th house > are > > > > considered > > > > > > > > > giving less and delayed children. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. the number of children is obtained by finding out > > > which > > > > planet > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > in 5th house. for example sun in 5H gives one son. > > > moon > > > > in 5H > > > > > > > > > gives one daughter. mars in 5H gives three sons. > > > mercury > > > > in 5H > > > > > > > > > gives two daughters. jupiter in 5H can give up to 5 > > > sons. > > > > venus > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > 5H can give up to 7 daughters. saturn in 5H can give > > > > maximum > > > > > > > > number > > > > > > > > > of 8 daughters. in rare cases, saturn in 5H also > gives > > > son > > > > if the > > > > > > > > > 5th lord is a male planet and is aspected by a male > > > planet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. rahu can cause miscarriages while ketu can give > > > premature > > > > > > > > > (underdeveloped) babies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. to arrive at the total number of children the > sign of > > > > 5H, number > > > > > > > > > of planets in 5H, number of planets aspecting 5H and > > > lastly > > > > number > > > > > > > > > of planets in conjunction with 5th lord are reckoned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7. first child is seen from 5H, second child from 7H, > > > third > > > > child > > > > > > > > > from 9H etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8. some researchers have written books stating that > 3rd > > > > house also > > > > > > > > > denotes children and have given how many children > each > > > > planet in > > > > > > > > 3rd > > > > > > > > > house gives. but i dont know the logic behind this > and > > > > hence not > > > > > > > > > mentioning them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9. D-7 or saptamamsha is also seen for calculating > the > > > > number of > > > > > > > > > children. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10. lastly, in my experience all the above are to be > > > seen > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > mother's chart for it is the mother who gives > children > > > and > > > > not the > > > > > > > > > father. this is based on various reasons. also in > > > bigamy > > > > and > > > > > > > > > polygamy a man begets children from several wives > and in > > > > those > > > > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > > also each mother's chart is seen for the number of > > > children > > > > and > > > > > > > > > their gender. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > Panditji > > > > > > > > > <navagraha@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I wanted start a new discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How can we judge from a kundali how many issues > will > > > be > > > > there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have never gotten a good reading of this vexing > > > issue. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are things like looking at influence on 5th > > > house > > > > and 5th > > > > > > > > > lord. # male > > > > > > > > > > graha influence = # male issues, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Has anyoner done a comprehensive study of this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. It may be a moot point in this day and age > when > > > most > > > > middel > > > > > > > > > class > > > > > > > > > > people have no more than two. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 Dear Sreenadh ji and list members, I feel that everyone posting a message or replying to a message must bear in mind that the subject heading deals with the subject posted. This is particularly important if someday someone wants to pull up matters concerning a certain subject and you find correspondence unrelated to that subject is pulled up owing to the wrong subject heading. This could be frustrating because a lot of us do not have the time to weed out information unrelated to the subject being searched. David Sneak preview the all-new .com. It's not radically different. Just radically better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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