Guest guest Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we have received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that survived. So this debate is perhaps not flawless. A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or empirical approach as it is called. Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared up by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory mercury is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun that goes to bed when the full moon rises!). Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, summarily or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if other mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of character! No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, about things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline or body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or think! RR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 Dear friends, I would like to say my few lines supporting 'Not everything in classics works' in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp the inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper perspectives although most of the times the classics in sanskrit literature are found to be in their most original and authentic forms till today. Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of sage Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat and notably Sarvartha Chintamani. I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and correct translation of these works so far. Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and prosperity and the word dosha attached to it also has the all encompassing meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a successful conjugal life. Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge Horoscope has clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all the planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all planets can cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending upon their dispositon) Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the unpatented domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as envisaged by Raman or sage Garga ? Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised subject on moon- sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign and their lords) (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, moon, 5th lord and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the basis..of their airy...firy etc. nature) (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in navamsa and rasi chart) (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems like rajju etc.) (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of a good computer match making software ! It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that nowhere exists. In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness or our own unwillingness to work hard ! if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer ever taking recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good astrologer can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! With regards and best wishes, Mrutyunjay Tripathy , " Rohiniranjan " <rohini_ranjan wrote: > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we have > received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that > survived. > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or empirical > approach as it is called. > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared up > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory mercury > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun that > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, summarily > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if other > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > character! > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, about > things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline or > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or > think! > > RR > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 Mrityunjay-ji, If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept modern sayings or modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel, then I am with you! If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) RR , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " <astrologer_mrutyunjay wrote: > > Dear friends, > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp the > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper perspectives > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit literature are > found to be in their most original and authentic forms till today. > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of sage > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat and > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and correct > translation of these works so far. > > Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and prosperity > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all encompassing > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a successful > conjugal life. > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge Horoscope has > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all the > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all planets can > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending upon their > dispositon) > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the unpatented > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as envisaged > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised subject on moon- > sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign and their > lords) > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, moon, 5th lord > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the basis..of their > airy...firy etc. nature) > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in navamsa and > rasi chart) > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems like > rajju etc.) > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of a good > computer match making software ! > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that nowhere > exists. > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness or our own > unwillingness to work hard ! > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer ever taking > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good astrologer > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! > > With regards and best wishes, > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we > have > > received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that > > survived. > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or > empirical > > approach as it is called. > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared up > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory mercury > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun > that > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, > summarily > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if > other > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > character! > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, > about > > things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline or > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or > > think! > > > > RR > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 Dear RR Ji, Yes. Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle for 5 different perspectives is not bad. But we should test each of them and accept only those interpretations that comes unambigously correct. The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly and we might be faltering on account of our limited power of cognizance. " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " is the most exact word used to describe the modern astrologers giving out of context mystic looking but sometimes intentionally confusing and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of modern artist's paintings that nobody understands ! With regards and best wishes, Mrutyunjay Tripathy 09811971190 (Consultancy out of group is not free) , " Rohiniranjan " <rohini_ranjan wrote: > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept modern sayings > or , then I am with > you! > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > RR > > , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > Dear friends, > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp the > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper perspectives > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit literature are > > found to be in their most original and authentic forms till today. > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of sage > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat and > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and correct > > translation of these works so far. > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and > prosperity > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all encompassing > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a > successful > > conjugal life. > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge Horoscope > has > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all the > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all planets > can > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending upon > their > > dispositon) > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the > unpatented > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as > envisaged > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised subject on moon- > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign and their > > lords) > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, moon, 5th lord > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the basis..of > their > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in navamsa and > > rasi chart) > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems like > > rajju etc.) > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of a good > > computer match making software ! > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that nowhere > > exists. > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness or our > own > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer ever > taking > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good astrologer > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we > > have > > > received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely > > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that > > > survived. > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or > > empirical > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared > up > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory > mercury > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun > > that > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, > > summarily > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if > > other > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > > character! > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, > > about > > > things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline > or > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or > > > think! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 Dear Friends, Jyotish as envisaged in classicals have test of time,place and context.Accordingly Astrology is evolving from classical times. As Shri mrityunjay ji,mentioned Late Shri BVR worked hard and came up with broad understanding and provided interpretation.Even I remember that there is nothing like any planet as the bad and the good one.All planets as per their position,aspect and influnce give results.possibly some results are good as the destiny provides and some might not be good and lead a negative influnce.if such negative things/results are termed as dosha it is not right. Modern Astrology with the tools available now can further be studied and interpretations can be made. As Shri Tripathy ji,you are absolutely correct when you say how people mislead in the case of Mnagalya dosha and kalsarpa dosha. let's carry forward modern astrology and bring harmony and balance in jyotisha.that is what modern Astrology is about vrkrishnan --- On Fri, 2/20/09, Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan Re: Modern Jyotish Friday, February 20, 2009, 12:35 AM Mrityunjay-ji, If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept modern sayings or modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel, then I am with you! If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) RR , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " <astrologer_ mrutyunjay@ ...> wrote: > > Dear friends, > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp the > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper perspectives > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit literature are > found to be in their most original and authentic forms till today. > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of sage > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat and > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and correct > translation of these works so far. > > Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and prosperity > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all encompassing > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a successful > conjugal life. > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge Horoscope has > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all the > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all planets can > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending upon their > dispositon) > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the unpatented > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as envisaged > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensiv e and well organised subject on moon- > sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign and their > lords) > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope... strength of lagna, moon, 5th lord > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the basis..of their > airy...firy etc. nature) > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in navamsa and > rasi chart) > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems like > rajju etc.) > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of a good > computer match making software ! > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that nowhere > exists. > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness or our own > unwillingness to work hard ! > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer ever taking > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good astrologer > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! > > With regards and best wishes, > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > <rohini_ranjan@ > wrote: > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we > have > > received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that > > survived. > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or > empirical > > approach as it is called. > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared up > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory mercury > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun > that > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, > summarily > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if > other > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > character! > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, > about > > things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline or > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or > > think! > > > > RR > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 Then I am with you! The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, not many practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get around to testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, believe in or advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 hours to astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough time to test everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly indicate which ones are based on experience and which ones based on what they read or what sounds logical to them. The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by astrologers who come across as very black and white when describing astrology, remedies and so on but it is not about style, it should be about substance ;-) RR , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " <astrologer_mrutyunjay wrote: > > Dear RR Ji, > > Yes. > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle for 5 different > perspectives is not bad. > > But we should test each of them and > accept only those interpretations that > comes unambigously correct. > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly and we might > be faltering on account of our limited power of cognizance. > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern astrologers giving > out of context mystic looking but sometimes intentionally confusing > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of modern artist's > paintings that nobody understands ! > > With regards and best wishes, > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > 09811971190 > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept modern > sayings > > or , then I am with > > you! > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > RR > > > > , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp the > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper perspectives > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit literature > are > > > found to be in their most original and authentic forms till today. > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of sage > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat and > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and correct > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and > > prosperity > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all encompassing > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a > > successful > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge Horoscope > > has > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all the > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all planets > > can > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending upon > > their > > > dispositon) > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the > > unpatented > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as > > envisaged > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised subject on > moon- > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign and > their > > > lords) > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, moon, 5th > lord > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the basis..of > > their > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in navamsa > and > > > rasi chart) > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems like > > > rajju etc.) > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of a good > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that > nowhere > > > exists. > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness or our > > own > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer ever > > taking > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good > astrologer > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything > that > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that > we > > > have > > > > received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures > that > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or > > > empirical > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now > flared > > up > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory > > mercury > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for > sun > > > that > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, > > > summarily > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these > very > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if > > > other > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > > > character! > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, > > > about > > > > things astrological because we do not have a complete > discipline > > or > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say > or > > > > think! > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 I think what astrologers should do is to neither be fear-mongerers nor ostriches. They should carefully define the poison if there is one and then define conditions that are necessary for proper use and containment. Radiation can creat havoc but it can also treat cancer or reveal parts of the body that are normally not visible and also can be utilized for understanding the mysteries of nature and universe (x-ray crystallography, etc). I hope all this is not sounding too 'mystical?' ;-) RR , vattem krishnan <bursar_99 wrote: > > Dear Friends, > Jyotish as envisaged in classicals have test of time,place and context.Accordingly Astrology is evolving from classical times. > As Shri mrityunjay ji,mentioned Late Shri BVR worked hard and came up with broad understanding and provided interpretation.Even I remember that there is nothing like any planet as the bad and the good one.All planets as per their position,aspect and influnce give results.possibly some results are good as the destiny provides and some might not be good and lead a negative influnce.if such negative things/results are termed as dosha it is not right. > Modern Astrology with the tools available now can further be studied and interpretations can be made. > As Shri Tripathy ji,you are absolutely correct when you say how people mislead in the case of Mnagalya dosha and kalsarpa dosha. > let's carry forward modern astrology and bring harmony and balance in jyotisha.that is what modern Astrology is about > vrkrishnan > > --- On Fri, 2/20/09, Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: > > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan > Re: Modern Jyotish > > Friday, February 20, 2009, 12:35 AM Mrityunjay-ji, > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept modern sayings > or modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel, then I am with > you! > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > RR > > , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " > <astrologer_ mrutyunjay@ ...> wrote: > > > > Dear friends, > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp the > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper perspectives > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit literature are > > found to be in their most original and authentic forms till today. > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of sage > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat and > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and correct > > translation of these works so far. > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and > prosperity > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all encompassing > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a > successful > > conjugal life. > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge Horoscope > has > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all the > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all planets > can > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending upon > their > > dispositon) > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the > unpatented > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as > envisaged > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensiv e and well organised subject on moon- > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign and their > > lords) > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope... strength of lagna, moon, 5th lord > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the basis..of > their > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in navamsa and > > rasi chart) > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems like > > rajju etc.) > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of a good > > computer match making software ! > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that nowhere > > exists. > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness or our > own > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer ever > taking > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good astrologer > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > <rohini_ranjan@ > wrote: > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we > > have > > > received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely > > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that > > > survived. > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or > > empirical > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared > up > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory > mercury > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun > > that > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, > > summarily > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if > > other > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > > character! > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, > > about > > > things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline > or > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or > > > think! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 ||Jai Ramakrishna|| Dear RRji, Personally the " tools " I use for the predictive techniques, are all time-tested, which I can assure of. I have tried many systems(i am being left out with only System's Approach)to see which method gives clarity in predictions, as today people need that prediction, what you call, " Crystal Clarity " . If, something is not replicable & has no clarity, what is the benefit of using that technique? Next comes the question of remedies that " I " advise. Its being pure Parasari, with a hint of Tantrik remedies(not exceeding mantras) & also some Vedic mantras. As again to quote my author " We practise Parasari Jyotish, but dont follow the Parasari Remedies " . I have tried the remedies, but only those which I advise(personally Santan Gopal Mantra, not yet, but through relatives & clients), but remedies through mantras are advised only when there is a ray of hope ....we can convert .5% to 5%. But if situation is pathetic, complete surrender being the final step!! 3-4 yrs before, when I was a novice in astrology(i am nowhere advanced today, I am still a novice today, as everyday I am learning & astrology is such an ocean, people always try to find the sandbase or the seabed, but they ultimately dont get into it!!)I used to advocate only gems, but when I am growing up & will celebrate the Silver Jubilee of my birth anniversary or rather score " quarter century " of this mortal body aka, , in a year, I personally feel that to that Omniscient,Omnipotent & Omnipresent--these are nothing but some molded clay, which was soft ones, but now it has become hard so of no use to restructure...why not pray to that Almighty, who covers everything in this world through " Maayaa " (i.e. Illusion!!). Thank you, . http://gauravastro.150m.com , " Rohiniranjan " <rohini_ranjan wrote: > > Then I am with you! > > The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, not many > practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get around to > testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, believe in or > advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 hours to > astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough time to test > everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly indicate > which ones are based on experience and which ones based on what they > read or what sounds logical to them. > > The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by astrologers who come > across as very black and white when describing astrology, remedies > and so on but it is not about style, it should be about substance ;-) > > RR > > , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > Dear RR Ji, > > > > Yes. > > > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle for 5 > different > > perspectives is not bad. > > > > But we should test each of them and > > accept only those interpretations that > > comes unambigously correct. > > > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly and we might > > be faltering on account of our limited power of cognizance. > > > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern astrologers > giving > > out of context mystic looking but sometimes intentionally confusing > > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of modern artist's > > paintings that nobody understands ! > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > 09811971190 > > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept modern > > sayings > > > or , then I am with > > > you! > > > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > > > RR > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp the > > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper > perspectives > > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit literature > > are > > > > found to be in their most original and authentic forms till > today. > > > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of sage > > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat and > > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and correct > > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya > > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and > > > prosperity > > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all encompassing > > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a > > > successful > > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge > Horoscope > > > has > > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all the > > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all > planets > > > can > > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending upon > > > their > > > > dispositon) > > > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the > > > unpatented > > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as > > > envisaged > > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... > > > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised subject on > > moon- > > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) > > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign and > > their > > > > lords) > > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, moon, 5th > > lord > > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the basis..of > > > their > > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in navamsa > > and > > > > rasi chart) > > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems > like > > > > rajju etc.) > > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of a > good > > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that > > nowhere > > > > exists. > > > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness or > our > > > own > > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer ever > > > taking > > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good > > astrologer > > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything > > that > > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that > > we > > > > have > > > > > received or retained and some of that may not even be > entirely > > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures > > that > > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or > > > > empirical > > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now > > flared > > > up > > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory > > > mercury > > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for > > sun > > > > that > > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, > > > > summarily > > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these > > very > > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, > if > > > > other > > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > > > > character! > > > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or > contra, > > > > about > > > > > things astrological because we do not have a complete > > discipline > > > or > > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say > > or > > > > > think! > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 Dear Gaurav :-) Must be my aging brain but I kind of sense that somehow you felt that my statements were directed at you or anyone else in particular. I may have gone after patterns and if any of those fit your current perception please do not take it personally or feel the need to justify. You are a wonderful human being, what little I know of you or have experienced so there! :-) I generally tend not to go after individuals but 'patterns' and as far as I know, there is no individual who fully fits a given pattern or framework of perception or expression. We all have fragments of patterns that get attacked or seemingly so. I am elaborating all this just to avoid misunderstandings. Most of us tend to 'judge' too quickly, often based on very little information, often because the demand and pressure to judge or mete out a judgment is imperetive, be it our jobs or society or parents or others that control us. It is toxic and can become a habit! It is healthier to just observe passively and dispassionately. Active listening is a buzzword that is rampant in modern culture particularly modern management frameworks. The most important element in the state of 'active listening' is when we can be totally passive and take in, as opposed to trying to speak and express at the same time while we are listening! Again, nothing particularly directed at you or anyone else, just something I felt like sharing. Hopefully someone is listening actively. RR , " " <gaurav.ghosh wrote: > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > Dear RRji, > Personally the " tools " I use for the predictive techniques, are all > time-tested, which I can assure of. > I have tried many systems(i am being left out with only System's > Approach)to see which method gives clarity in predictions, as today > people need that prediction, what you call, " Crystal Clarity " . If, > something is not replicable & has no clarity, what is the benefit of > using that technique? > Next comes the question of remedies that " I " advise. Its being pure > Parasari, with a hint of Tantrik remedies(not exceeding mantras) & also > some Vedic mantras. As again to quote my author > " We practise Parasari Jyotish, but dont follow the Parasari Remedies " . > I have tried the remedies, but only those which I advise(personally > Santan Gopal Mantra, not yet, but through relatives & clients), but > remedies through mantras are advised only when there is a ray of hope > ...we can convert .5% to 5%. But if situation is pathetic, complete > surrender being the final step!! > 3-4 yrs before, when I was a novice in astrology(i am nowhere advanced > today, I am still a novice today, as everyday I am learning & > astrology is such an ocean, people always try to find the sandbase or > the seabed, but they ultimately dont get into it!!)I used to advocate > only gems, but when I am growing up & will celebrate the Silver > Jubilee of my birth anniversary or rather score " quarter century " of > this mortal body aka, , in a year, I personally feel that > to that Omniscient,Omnipotent & Omnipresent--these are nothing but > some molded clay, which was soft ones, but now it has become hard so > of no use to restructure...why not pray to that Almighty, who covers > everything in this world through " Maayaa " (i.e. Illusion!!). > Thank you, > . > http://gauravastro.150m.com > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > Then I am with you! > > > > The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, not many > > practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get around to > > testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, believe in or > > advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 hours to > > astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough time to test > > everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly indicate > > which ones are based on experience and which ones based on what they > > read or what sounds logical to them. > > > > The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by astrologers who come > > across as very black and white when describing astrology, remedies > > and so on but it is not about style, it should be about substance ;-) > > > > RR > > > > , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear RR Ji, > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle for 5 > > different > > > perspectives is not bad. > > > > > > But we should test each of them and > > > accept only those interpretations that > > > comes unambigously correct. > > > > > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly and we might > > > be faltering on account of our limited power of cognizance. > > > > > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > > > > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern astrologers > > giving > > > out of context mystic looking but sometimes intentionally confusing > > > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of modern artist's > > > paintings that nobody understands ! > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > 09811971190 > > > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept modern > > > sayings > > > > or , then I am with > > > > you! > > > > > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp the > > > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper > > perspectives > > > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit literature > > > are > > > > > found to be in their most original and authentic forms till > > today. > > > > > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of sage > > > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat and > > > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and correct > > > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya > > > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and > > > > prosperity > > > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all encompassing > > > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a > > > > successful > > > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge > > Horoscope > > > > has > > > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > > > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all the > > > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all > > planets > > > > can > > > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending upon > > > > their > > > > > dispositon) > > > > > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the > > > > unpatented > > > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as > > > > envisaged > > > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... > > > > > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised subject on > > > moon- > > > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) > > > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign and > > > their > > > > > lords) > > > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, moon, 5th > > > lord > > > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the basis..of > > > > their > > > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in navamsa > > > and > > > > > rasi chart) > > > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems > > like > > > > > rajju etc.) > > > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > > > > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of a > > good > > > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that > > > nowhere > > > > > exists. > > > > > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness or > > our > > > > own > > > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer ever > > > > taking > > > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good > > > astrologer > > > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything > > > that > > > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that > > > we > > > > > have > > > > > > received or retained and some of that may not even be > > entirely > > > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures > > > that > > > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or > > > > > empirical > > > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now > > > flared > > > > up > > > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory > > > > mercury > > > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for > > > sun > > > > > that > > > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, > > > > > summarily > > > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these > > > very > > > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, > > if > > > > > other > > > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > > > > > character! > > > > > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or > > contra, > > > > > about > > > > > > things astrological because we do not have a complete > > > discipline > > > > or > > > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say > > > or > > > > > > think! > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2009 Report Share Posted February 21, 2009 ||Jai Ramakrishna|| Dear Dada, I never took anything personally, nothing has been directed to me/pointed to me, neither. I just cited an example, of Modern Jyotish, as the subject goes, like testing the classical principles & applying them in real life scenarios.. Again...my sincere apologies if there was a misunderstanding, if any--neither has anything been pointed to me/my analysis/predictions... Gaurav. , " Rohiniranjan " <rohini_ranjan wrote: > > Dear Gaurav :-) > > Must be my aging brain but I kind of sense that somehow you felt that > my statements were directed at you or anyone else in particular. I > may have gone after patterns and if any of those fit your current > perception please do not take it personally or feel the need to > justify. You are a wonderful human being, what little I know of you > or have experienced so there! :-) > > I generally tend not to go after individuals but 'patterns' and as > far as I know, there is no individual who fully fits a given pattern > or framework of perception or expression. > > We all have fragments of patterns that get attacked or seemingly so. > I am elaborating all this just to avoid misunderstandings. > > Most of us tend to 'judge' too quickly, often based on very little > information, often because the demand and pressure to judge or mete > out a judgment is imperetive, be it our jobs or society or parents or > others that control us. It is toxic and can become a habit! > > It is healthier to just observe passively and dispassionately. Active > listening is a buzzword that is rampant in modern culture > particularly modern management frameworks. The most important element > in the state of 'active listening' is when we can be totally passive > and take in, as opposed to trying to speak and express at the same > time while we are listening! > > Again, nothing particularly directed at you or anyone else, just > something I felt like sharing. Hopefully someone is listening > actively. > > RR > > > > , " " > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > Dear RRji, > > Personally the " tools " I use for the predictive techniques, are all > > time-tested, which I can assure of. > > I have tried many systems(i am being left out with only System's > > Approach)to see which method gives clarity in predictions, as today > > people need that prediction, what you call, " Crystal Clarity " . If, > > something is not replicable & has no clarity, what is the benefit of > > using that technique? > > Next comes the question of remedies that " I " advise. Its being pure > > Parasari, with a hint of Tantrik remedies(not exceeding mantras) & > also > > some Vedic mantras. As again to quote my author > > " We practise Parasari Jyotish, but dont follow the Parasari > Remedies " . > > I have tried the remedies, but only those which I advise(personally > > Santan Gopal Mantra, not yet, but through relatives & clients), but > > remedies through mantras are advised only when there is a ray of > hope > > ...we can convert .5% to 5%. But if situation is pathetic, complete > > surrender being the final step!! > > 3-4 yrs before, when I was a novice in astrology(i am nowhere > advanced > > today, I am still a novice today, as everyday I am learning & > > astrology is such an ocean, people always try to find the sandbase > or > > the seabed, but they ultimately dont get into it!!)I used to > advocate > > only gems, but when I am growing up & will celebrate the Silver > > Jubilee of my birth anniversary or rather score " quarter century " > of > > this mortal body aka, , in a year, I personally feel > that > > to that Omniscient,Omnipotent & Omnipresent--these are nothing but > > some molded clay, which was soft ones, but now it has become hard so > > of no use to restructure...why not pray to that Almighty, who covers > > everything in this world through " Maayaa " (i.e. Illusion!!). > > Thank you, > > . > > http://gauravastro.150m.com > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > Then I am with you! > > > > > > The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, not > many > > > practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get around to > > > testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, believe in or > > > advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 hours to > > > astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough time to > test > > > everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly > indicate > > > which ones are based on experience and which ones based on what > they > > > read or what sounds logical to them. > > > > > > The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by astrologers who > come > > > across as very black and white when describing astrology, > remedies > > > and so on but it is not about style, it should be about > substance ;-) > > > > > > RR > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear RR Ji, > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle for 5 > > > different > > > > perspectives is not bad. > > > > > > > > But we should test each of them and > > > > accept only those interpretations that > > > > comes unambigously correct. > > > > > > > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly and we > might > > > > be faltering on account of our limited power of cognizance. > > > > > > > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > > > > > > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern astrologers > > > giving > > > > out of context mystic looking but sometimes intentionally > confusing > > > > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of modern > artist's > > > > paintings that nobody understands ! > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > 09811971190 > > > > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > > > > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept modern > > > > sayings > > > > > or , then I am with > > > > > you! > > > > > > > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > Tripathy " > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp > the > > > > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper > > > perspectives > > > > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit > literature > > > > are > > > > > > found to be in their most original and authentic forms till > > > today. > > > > > > > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of > sage > > > > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat > and > > > > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and > correct > > > > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya > > > > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and > > > > > prosperity > > > > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all > encompassing > > > > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a > > > > > successful > > > > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge > > > Horoscope > > > > > has > > > > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > > > > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all > the > > > > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all > > > planets > > > > > can > > > > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending > upon > > > > > their > > > > > > dispositon) > > > > > > > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the > > > > > unpatented > > > > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as > > > > > envisaged > > > > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised subject > on > > > > moon- > > > > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) > > > > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign > and > > > > their > > > > > > lords) > > > > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, moon, > 5th > > > > lord > > > > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the > basis..of > > > > > their > > > > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in > navamsa > > > > and > > > > > > rasi chart) > > > > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems > > > like > > > > > > rajju etc.) > > > > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of > a > > > good > > > > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that > > > > nowhere > > > > > > exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness > or > > > our > > > > > own > > > > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer > ever > > > > > taking > > > > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good > > > > astrologer > > > > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not > everything > > > > that > > > > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish > that > > > > we > > > > > > have > > > > > > > received or retained and some of that may not even be > > > entirely > > > > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on > astrotreasures > > > > that > > > > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation > or > > > > > > empirical > > > > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now > > > > flared > > > > > up > > > > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' > glory > > > > > mercury > > > > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except > for > > > > sun > > > > > > that > > > > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's > influences, > > > > > > summarily > > > > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use > these > > > > very > > > > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once > spotted, > > > if > > > > > > other > > > > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out > of > > > > > > > character! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or > > > contra, > > > > > > about > > > > > > > things astrological because we do not have a complete > > > > discipline > > > > > or > > > > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones > say > > > > or > > > > > > > think! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2009 Report Share Posted February 21, 2009 No problem, Gaurav. I just wanted to make sure because I have generally (not just these days!) found jyotishis of all ages to be rather sensitive people, easily offended -- hence I was just being careful :-) I do not know why they as a class tend to be overly sensitive, in case you are wondering. RR , " " <gaurav.ghosh wrote: > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > Dear Dada, > I never took anything personally, nothing has been directed to > me/pointed to me, neither. > I just cited an example, of Modern Jyotish, as the subject goes, like > testing the classical principles & applying them in real life scenarios.. > Again...my sincere apologies if there was a misunderstanding, if > any--neither has anything been pointed to me/my analysis/predictions... > Gaurav. > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > Dear Gaurav :-) > > > > Must be my aging brain but I kind of sense that somehow you felt that > > my statements were directed at you or anyone else in particular. I > > may have gone after patterns and if any of those fit your current > > perception please do not take it personally or feel the need to > > justify. You are a wonderful human being, what little I know of you > > or have experienced so there! :-) > > > > I generally tend not to go after individuals but 'patterns' and as > > far as I know, there is no individual who fully fits a given pattern > > or framework of perception or expression. > > > > We all have fragments of patterns that get attacked or seemingly so. > > I am elaborating all this just to avoid misunderstandings. > > > > Most of us tend to 'judge' too quickly, often based on very little > > information, often because the demand and pressure to judge or mete > > out a judgment is imperetive, be it our jobs or society or parents or > > others that control us. It is toxic and can become a habit! > > > > It is healthier to just observe passively and dispassionately. Active > > listening is a buzzword that is rampant in modern culture > > particularly modern management frameworks. The most important element > > in the state of 'active listening' is when we can be totally passive > > and take in, as opposed to trying to speak and express at the same > > time while we are listening! > > > > Again, nothing particularly directed at you or anyone else, just > > something I felt like sharing. Hopefully someone is listening > > actively. > > > > RR > > > > > > > > , " " > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > Dear RRji, > > > Personally the " tools " I use for the predictive techniques, are all > > > time-tested, which I can assure of. > > > I have tried many systems(i am being left out with only System's > > > Approach)to see which method gives clarity in predictions, as today > > > people need that prediction, what you call, " Crystal Clarity " . If, > > > something is not replicable & has no clarity, what is the benefit of > > > using that technique? > > > Next comes the question of remedies that " I " advise. Its being pure > > > Parasari, with a hint of Tantrik remedies(not exceeding mantras) & > > also > > > some Vedic mantras. As again to quote my author > > > " We practise Parasari Jyotish, but dont follow the Parasari > > Remedies " . > > > I have tried the remedies, but only those which I advise (personally > > > Santan Gopal Mantra, not yet, but through relatives & clients), but > > > remedies through mantras are advised only when there is a ray of > > hope > > > ...we can convert .5% to 5%. But if situation is pathetic, complete > > > surrender being the final step!! > > > 3-4 yrs before, when I was a novice in astrology(i am nowhere > > advanced > > > today, I am still a novice today, as everyday I am learning & > > > astrology is such an ocean, people always try to find the sandbase > > or > > > the seabed, but they ultimately dont get into it!!)I used to > > advocate > > > only gems, but when I am growing up & will celebrate the Silver > > > Jubilee of my birth anniversary or rather score " quarter century " > > of > > > this mortal body aka, , in a year, I personally feel > > that > > > to that Omniscient,Omnipotent & Omnipresent--these are nothing but > > > some molded clay, which was soft ones, but now it has become hard so > > > of no use to restructure...why not pray to that Almighty, who covers > > > everything in this world through " Maayaa " (i.e. Illusion!!). > > > Thank you, > > > . > > > http://gauravastro.150m.com > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Then I am with you! > > > > > > > > The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, not > > many > > > > practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get around to > > > > testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, believe in or > > > > advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 hours to > > > > astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough time to > > test > > > > everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly > > indicate > > > > which ones are based on experience and which ones based on what > > they > > > > read or what sounds logical to them. > > > > > > > > The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by astrologers who > > come > > > > across as very black and white when describing astrology, > > remedies > > > > and so on but it is not about style, it should be about > > substance ;-) > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay Tripathy " > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear RR Ji, > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle for 5 > > > > different > > > > > perspectives is not bad. > > > > > > > > > > But we should test each of them and > > > > > accept only those interpretations that > > > > > comes unambigously correct. > > > > > > > > > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly and we > > might > > > > > be faltering on account of our limited power of cognizance. > > > > > > > > > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > > > > > > > > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern astrologers > > > > giving > > > > > out of context mystic looking but sometimes intentionally > > confusing > > > > > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of modern > > artist's > > > > > paintings that nobody understands ! > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > 09811971190 > > > > > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept modern > > > > > sayings > > > > > > or , then I am with > > > > > > you! > > > > > > > > > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > > Tripathy " > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to grasp > > the > > > > > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper > > > > perspectives > > > > > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit > > literature > > > > > are > > > > > > > found to be in their most original and authentic forms till > > > > today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra of > > sage > > > > > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka Parijat > > and > > > > > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and > > correct > > > > > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and Mangalya > > > > > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing and > > > > > > prosperity > > > > > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all > > encompassing > > > > > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living a > > > > > > successful > > > > > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge > > > > Horoscope > > > > > > has > > > > > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > > > > > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership of ....all > > the > > > > > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning all > > > > planets > > > > > > can > > > > > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the chart..depending > > upon > > > > > > their > > > > > > > dispositon) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically the > > > > > > unpatented > > > > > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct approach as > > > > > > envisaged > > > > > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota scheme ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > > > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised subject > > on > > > > > moon- > > > > > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on horoscope) > > > > > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon sign > > and > > > > > their > > > > > > > lords) > > > > > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, moon, > > 5th > > > > > lord > > > > > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > > > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the > > basis..of > > > > > > their > > > > > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > > > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in > > navamsa > > > > > and > > > > > > > rasi chart) > > > > > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > > > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other systems > > > > like > > > > > > > rajju etc.) > > > > > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > > > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case of > > a > > > > good > > > > > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules that > > > > > nowhere > > > > > > > exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer laziness > > or > > > > our > > > > > > own > > > > > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a astrologer > > ever > > > > > > taking > > > > > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good > > > > > astrologer > > > > > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of honesty ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not > > everything > > > > > that > > > > > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish > > that > > > > > we > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > received or retained and some of that may not even be > > > > entirely > > > > > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on > > astrotreasures > > > > > that > > > > > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation > > or > > > > > > > empirical > > > > > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now > > > > > flared > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' > > glory > > > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except > > for > > > > > sun > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's > > influences, > > > > > > > summarily > > > > > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use > > these > > > > > very > > > > > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once > > spotted, > > > > if > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out > > of > > > > > > > > character! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or > > > > contra, > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > things astrological because we do not have a complete > > > > > discipline > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones > > say > > > > > or > > > > > > > > think! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2009 Report Share Posted February 21, 2009 Dada, I assume at times these " jyotishis " suffer from some kind of complex---superior or inferior. If Superior, its their ego which is hurt, if it b the latter, then the condition is well-understandable----they always think/presume that they are subject to all kind of hatreds, abuses & wut not... Is this the reason for being sensitive??Or they cant forget their big old daddy, who was being humiliated in the king's court, since he was incompetent in front of her Daughter-in-law for the astro predictions(I think you already got it, about whom I am talking) & may be this is the reason for being so sensitive... I hope you already know that I am not a " jyotishi " (in one of the forums, one did spell by profession as " joytish " !!)by profession, but a Chef (or " Cook " in layman's term), but this " jyotish " is simply backed by my utmost reverence, obsession, passion & of course hobby. May be the service oriented attitude makes me less sensitive, as it being the less emotional to customer " feedback " (which being negative most of the times... ...) & the industry is really hardworking.. Anyways..my " keyboard " being mightier now, I will give it some break for the time being...some battle that i have to fight ahead... Gaurav. , " Rohiniranjan " <rohini_ranjan wrote: > > No problem, Gaurav. I just wanted to make sure because I have > generally (not just these days!) found jyotishis of all ages to be > rather sensitive people, easily offended -- hence I was just being > careful :-) > > I do not know why they as a class tend to be overly sensitive, in > case you are wondering. > > RR > > > , " " > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > Dear Dada, > > I never took anything personally, nothing has been directed to > > me/pointed to me, neither. > > I just cited an example, of Modern Jyotish, as the subject goes, > like > > testing the classical principles & applying them in real life > scenarios.. > > Again...my sincere apologies if there was a misunderstanding, if > > any--neither has anything been pointed to me/my > analysis/predictions... > > Gaurav. > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Gaurav :-) > > > > > > Must be my aging brain but I kind of sense that somehow you felt > that > > > my statements were directed at you or anyone else in particular. > I > > > may have gone after patterns and if any of those fit your current > > > perception please do not take it personally or feel the need to > > > justify. You are a wonderful human being, what little I know of > you > > > or have experienced so there! :-) > > > > > > I generally tend not to go after individuals but 'patterns' and > as > > > far as I know, there is no individual who fully fits a given > pattern > > > or framework of perception or expression. > > > > > > We all have fragments of patterns that get attacked or seemingly > so. > > > I am elaborating all this just to avoid misunderstandings. > > > > > > Most of us tend to 'judge' too quickly, often based on very > little > > > information, often because the demand and pressure to judge or > mete > > > out a judgment is imperetive, be it our jobs or society or > parents or > > > others that control us. It is toxic and can become a habit! > > > > > > It is healthier to just observe passively and dispassionately. > Active > > > listening is a buzzword that is rampant in modern culture > > > particularly modern management frameworks. The most important > element > > > in the state of 'active listening' is when we can be totally > passive > > > and take in, as opposed to trying to speak and express at the > same > > > time while we are listening! > > > > > > Again, nothing particularly directed at you or anyone else, just > > > something I felt like sharing. Hopefully someone is listening > > > actively. > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > , " " > > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > > Dear RRji, > > > > Personally the " tools " I use for the predictive techniques, are > all > > > > time-tested, which I can assure of. > > > > I have tried many systems(i am being left out with only System's > > > > Approach)to see which method gives clarity in predictions, as > today > > > > people need that prediction, what you call, " Crystal Clarity " . > If, > > > > something is not replicable & has no clarity, what is the > benefit of > > > > using that technique? > > > > Next comes the question of remedies that " I " advise. Its being > pure > > > > Parasari, with a hint of Tantrik remedies(not exceeding mantras) > & > > > also > > > > some Vedic mantras. As again to quote my author > > > > " We practise Parasari Jyotish, but dont follow the Parasari > > > Remedies " . > > > > I have tried the remedies, but only those which I advise > (personally > > > > Santan Gopal Mantra, not yet, but through relatives & clients), > but > > > > remedies through mantras are advised only when there is a ray > of > > > hope > > > > ...we can convert .5% to 5%. But if situation is pathetic, > complete > > > > surrender being the final step!! > > > > 3-4 yrs before, when I was a novice in astrology(i am nowhere > > > advanced > > > > today, I am still a novice today, as everyday I am learning & > > > > astrology is such an ocean, people always try to find the > sandbase > > > or > > > > the seabed, but they ultimately dont get into it!!)I used to > > > advocate > > > > only gems, but when I am growing up & will celebrate the Silver > > > > Jubilee of my birth anniversary or rather score " quarter > century " > > > of > > > > this mortal body aka, , in a year, I personally > feel > > > that > > > > to that Omniscient,Omnipotent & Omnipresent--these are nothing > but > > > > some molded clay, which was soft ones, but now it has become > hard so > > > > of no use to restructure...why not pray to that Almighty, who > covers > > > > everything in this world through " Maayaa " (i.e. Illusion!!). > > > > Thank you, > > > > . > > > > http://gauravastro.150m.com > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Then I am with you! > > > > > > > > > > The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, not > > > many > > > > > practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get around > to > > > > > testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, believe in > or > > > > > advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 > hours to > > > > > astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough time > to > > > test > > > > > everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly > > > indicate > > > > > which ones are based on experience and which ones based on > what > > > they > > > > > read or what sounds logical to them. > > > > > > > > > > The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by astrologers > who > > > come > > > > > across as very black and white when describing astrology, > > > remedies > > > > > and so on but it is not about style, it should be about > > > substance ;-) > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > Tripathy " > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RR Ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle for 5 > > > > > different > > > > > > perspectives is not bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > But we should test each of them and > > > > > > accept only those interpretations that > > > > > > comes unambigously correct. > > > > > > > > > > > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly and > we > > > might > > > > > > be faltering on account of our limited power of cognizance. > > > > > > > > > > > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > > > > > > > > > > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern > astrologers > > > > > giving > > > > > > out of context mystic looking but sometimes intentionally > > > confusing > > > > > > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of modern > > > artist's > > > > > > paintings that nobody understands ! > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > 09811971190 > > > > > > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept > modern > > > > > > sayings > > > > > > > or , then I am with > > > > > > > you! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > > > Tripathy " > > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to > grasp > > > the > > > > > > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper > > > > > perspectives > > > > > > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit > > > literature > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > found to be in their most original and authentic forms > till > > > > > today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra > of > > > sage > > > > > > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka > Parijat > > > and > > > > > > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and > > > correct > > > > > > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and > Mangalya > > > > > > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing > and > > > > > > > prosperity > > > > > > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all > > > encompassing > > > > > > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living > a > > > > > > > successful > > > > > > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge > > > > > Horoscope > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > > > > > > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership > of ....all > > > the > > > > > > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning > all > > > > > planets > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the > chart..depending > > > upon > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > dispositon) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically > the > > > > > > > unpatented > > > > > > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct > approach as > > > > > > > envisaged > > > > > > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota > scheme ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > > > > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised > subject > > > on > > > > > > moon- > > > > > > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on > horoscope) > > > > > > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon > sign > > > and > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > lords) > > > > > > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, > moon, > > > 5th > > > > > > lord > > > > > > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > > > > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the > > > basis..of > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > > > > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in > > > navamsa > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > rasi chart) > > > > > > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > > > > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other > systems > > > > > like > > > > > > > > rajju etc.) > > > > > > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > > > > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case > of > > > a > > > > > good > > > > > > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules > that > > > > > > nowhere > > > > > > > > exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer > laziness > > > or > > > > > our > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a > astrologer > > > ever > > > > > > > taking > > > > > > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good > > > > > > astrologer > > > > > > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of > honesty ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not > > > everything > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical > jyotish > > > that > > > > > > we > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > received or retained and some of that may not even be > > > > > entirely > > > > > > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on > > > astrotreasures > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious > observation > > > or > > > > > > > > empirical > > > > > > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, > now > > > > > > flared > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' > > > glory > > > > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets > (except > > > for > > > > > > sun > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's > > > influences, > > > > > > > > summarily > > > > > > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to > use > > > these > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once > > > spotted, > > > > > if > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be > out > > > of > > > > > > > > > character! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro > or > > > > > contra, > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > things astrological because we do not have a complete > > > > > > discipline > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great > ones > > > say > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > think! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2009 Report Share Posted February 21, 2009 No Gaurav I do not know which astrologer you are talking about. I know about the uncanny and uplifting story that gave Varah(a)Mihir(a) [the bracketed (a) to avoid anyone mixing UMM with AAM!] his title but that was a success story! :-) I do not know if jyotishis have a complex or not but I do know that two of the relative modern jyotishis were not really professional jyotishis as in earning their livelihood through what they earned from charging for their readings. The older one was B.V. Raman who brought to light Jyotish not only to Indians who did not pay attention when in school to learning sanskrit but also to the world that knew english better than hindi or sanskrit or other Indian vernacular. I do not believe Raman charged for readings. The second and younger jyotishi is K.N. Rao who after a brilliant and responsible career in Public/Civil Service during which he patiently honed his astrological skills and knowledged then shared far and wide his learnings after retiring from his regular vocation. There were others too that were not professional jyotishis in the strictest sense who contributed a lot to astrology without having to live off it, by the Grace of God. There are many actually who like you are moved by a passion for astrology and obviously it is not for a 'need' but simply because it is destiny! <Strange, eh? Coming from me! ;-)> Destiny, is like that groove that gets cut into a slab of granite through water-of-karma flowing in a focussed and repetitive manner with an aim and dedication! It takes longer but once the groove is cut, there is no escaping or guessing how the water shall flow, no matter how or where one is born or chooses as his or her profession. Be well and continue with your dharma. Blessings, Rohiniranjan , " " <gaurav.ghosh wrote: > > Dada, > I assume at times these " jyotishis " suffer from some kind of > complex---superior or inferior. If Superior, its their ego which is > hurt, if it b the latter, then the condition is > well-understandable----they always think/presume that they are subject > to all kind of hatreds, abuses & wut not... > Is this the reason for being sensitive??Or they cant forget their big > old daddy, who was being humiliated in the king's court, since he was > incompetent in front of her Daughter-in-law for the astro > predictions(I think you already got it, about whom I am talking) & may > be this is the reason for being so sensitive... > I hope you already know that I am not a " jyotishi " (in one of the > forums, one did spell by profession as " joytish " !!)by profession, but > a Chef (or " Cook " in layman's term), but this " jyotish " is simply > backed by my utmost reverence, obsession, passion & of course hobby. > May be the service oriented attitude makes me less sensitive, as it > being the less emotional to customer " feedback " (which being negative > most of the times... ...) & the industry is really hardworking.. > Anyways..my " keyboard " being mightier now, I will give it some break > for the time being...some battle that i have to fight ahead... > Gaurav. > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > No problem, Gaurav. I just wanted to make sure because I have > > generally (not just these days!) found jyotishis of all ages to be > > rather sensitive people, easily offended -- hence I was just being > > careful :-) > > > > I do not know why they as a class tend to be overly sensitive, in > > case you are wondering. > > > > RR > > > > > > , " " > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > Dear Dada, > > > I never took anything personally, nothing has been directed to > > > me/pointed to me, neither. > > > I just cited an example, of Modern Jyotish, as the subject goes, > > like > > > testing the classical principles & applying them in real life > > scenarios.. > > > Again...my sincere apologies if there was a misunderstanding, if > > > any--neither has anything been pointed to me/my > > analysis/predictions... > > > Gaurav. > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Gaurav :-) > > > > > > > > Must be my aging brain but I kind of sense that somehow you felt > > that > > > > my statements were directed at you or anyone else in particular. > > I > > > > may have gone after patterns and if any of those fit your current > > > > perception please do not take it personally or feel the need to > > > > justify. You are a wonderful human being, what little I know of > > you > > > > or have experienced so there! :-) > > > > > > > > I generally tend not to go after individuals but 'patterns' and > > as > > > > far as I know, there is no individual who fully fits a given > > pattern > > > > or framework of perception or expression. > > > > > > > > We all have fragments of patterns that get attacked or seemingly > > so. > > > > I am elaborating all this just to avoid misunderstandings. > > > > > > > > Most of us tend to 'judge' too quickly, often based on very > > little > > > > information, often because the demand and pressure to judge or > > mete > > > > out a judgment is imperetive, be it our jobs or society or > > parents or > > > > others that control us. It is toxic and can become a habit! > > > > > > > > It is healthier to just observe passively and dispassionately. > > Active > > > > listening is a buzzword that is rampant in modern culture > > > > particularly modern management frameworks. The most important > > element > > > > in the state of 'active listening' is when we can be totally > > passive > > > > and take in, as opposed to trying to speak and express at the > > same > > > > time while we are listening! > > > > > > > > Again, nothing particularly directed at you or anyone else, just > > > > something I felt like sharing. Hopefully someone is listening > > > > actively. > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " " > > > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > > > Dear RRji, > > > > > Personally the " tools " I use for the predictive techniques, are > > all > > > > > time-tested, which I can assure of. > > > > > I have tried many systems(i am being left out with only System's > > > > > Approach)to see which method gives clarity in predictions, as > > today > > > > > people need that prediction, what you call, " Crystal Clarity " . > > If, > > > > > something is not replicable & has no clarity, what is the > > benefit of > > > > > using that technique? > > > > > Next comes the question of remedies that " I " advise. Its being > > pure > > > > > Parasari, with a hint of Tantrik remedies(not exceeding mantras) > > & > > > > also > > > > > some Vedic mantras. As again to quote my author > > > > > " We practise Parasari Jyotish, but dont follow the Parasari > > > > Remedies " . > > > > > I have tried the remedies, but only those which I advise > > (personally > > > > > Santan Gopal Mantra, not yet, but through relatives & clients), > > but > > > > > remedies through mantras are advised only when there is a ray > > of > > > > hope > > > > > ...we can convert .5% to 5%. But if situation is pathetic, > > complete > > > > > surrender being the final step!! > > > > > 3-4 yrs before, when I was a novice in astrology(i am nowhere > > > > advanced > > > > > today, I am still a novice today, as everyday I am learning & > > > > > astrology is such an ocean, people always try to find the > > sandbase > > > > or > > > > > the seabed, but they ultimately dont get into it!!)I used to > > > > advocate > > > > > only gems, but when I am growing up & will celebrate the Silver > > > > > Jubilee of my birth anniversary or rather score " quarter > > century " > > > > of > > > > > this mortal body aka, , in a year, I personally > > feel > > > > that > > > > > to that Omniscient,Omnipotent & Omnipresent--these are nothing > > but > > > > > some molded clay, which was soft ones, but now it has become > > hard so > > > > > of no use to restructure...why not pray to that Almighty, who > > covers > > > > > everything in this world through " Maayaa " (i.e. Illusion!!). > > > > > Thank you, > > > > > . > > > > > http://gauravastro.150m.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Then I am with you! > > > > > > > > > > > > The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, not > > > > many > > > > > > practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get around > > to > > > > > > testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, believe in > > or > > > > > > advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 > > hours to > > > > > > astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough time > > to > > > > test > > > > > > everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly > > > > indicate > > > > > > which ones are based on experience and which ones based on > > what > > > > they > > > > > > read or what sounds logical to them. > > > > > > > > > > > > The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by astrologers > > who > > > > come > > > > > > across as very black and white when describing astrology, > > > > remedies > > > > > > and so on but it is not about style, it should be about > > > > substance ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > > Tripathy " > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RR Ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle for 5 > > > > > > different > > > > > > > perspectives is not bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we should test each of them and > > > > > > > accept only those interpretations that > > > > > > > comes unambigously correct. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly and > > we > > > > might > > > > > > > be faltering on account of our limited power of cognizance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern > > astrologers > > > > > > giving > > > > > > > out of context mystic looking but sometimes intentionally > > > > confusing > > > > > > > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of modern > > > > artist's > > > > > > > paintings that nobody understands ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > 09811971190 > > > > > > > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not accept > > modern > > > > > > > sayings > > > > > > > > or , then I am with > > > > > > > > you! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > > > > Tripathy " > > > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able to > > grasp > > > > the > > > > > > > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper > > > > > > perspectives > > > > > > > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit > > > > literature > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > found to be in their most original and authentic forms > > till > > > > > > today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora Shastra > > of > > > > sage > > > > > > > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka > > Parijat > > > > and > > > > > > > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing and > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and > > Mangalya > > > > > > > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round wellbeing > > and > > > > > > > > prosperity > > > > > > > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all > > > > encompassing > > > > > > > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing living > > a > > > > > > > > successful > > > > > > > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to Judge > > > > > > Horoscope > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of Mangalya > > > > > > > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership > > of ....all > > > > the > > > > > > > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( meaning > > all > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the > > chart..depending > > > > upon > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > dispositon) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is not ...specifically > > the > > > > > > > > unpatented > > > > > > > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct > > approach as > > > > > > > > envisaged > > > > > > > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota > > scheme ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > > > > > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised > > subject > > > > on > > > > > > > moon- > > > > > > > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on > > horoscope) > > > > > > > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, moon > > sign > > > > and > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > lords) > > > > > > > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, > > moon, > > > > 5th > > > > > > > lord > > > > > > > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > > > > > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the > > > > basis..of > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > > > > > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th in > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > rasi chart) > > > > > > > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > > > > > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other > > systems > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > rajju etc.) > > > > > > > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > > > > > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of name) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the case > > of > > > > a > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket rules > > that > > > > > > > nowhere > > > > > > > > > exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer > > laziness > > > > or > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a > > astrologer > > > > ever > > > > > > > > taking > > > > > > > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all good > > > > > > > astrologer > > > > > > > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of > > honesty ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not > > > > everything > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical > > jyotish > > > > that > > > > > > > we > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > received or retained and some of that may not even be > > > > > > entirely > > > > > > > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on > > > > astrotreasures > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious > > observation > > > > or > > > > > > > > > empirical > > > > > > > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, > > now > > > > > > > flared > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' > > > > glory > > > > > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets > > (except > > > > for > > > > > > > sun > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's > > > > influences, > > > > > > > > > summarily > > > > > > > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to > > use > > > > these > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once > > > > spotted, > > > > > > if > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be > > out > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > character! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro > > or > > > > > > contra, > > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > things astrological because we do not have a complete > > > > > > > discipline > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great > > ones > > > > say > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > think! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2009 Report Share Posted February 21, 2009 Dada, Certainly I was talking about " Varah(a)Mihir(a) " & the cooked up story of his daughter-in-law, which was prevalent in Bengal,i.e. " Khanaa " (or Lilavati to others...). Still today, people(in Bengal only) swear by her name, when it comes to " Jyotish " . Whenever blessings /good wishes come from a senior, it is certainly " grabbed " easily...as these have long term results...like for any auspicious event,blessings of seniors-be a friend or foe, is certainly needed, as in Mahabharata, when Yudhisthira was seeking his blessings from his uncles/preceptors etc., before starting the war... Gaurav. , " Rohiniranjan " <rohini_ranjan wrote: > > No Gaurav I do not know which astrologer you are talking about. I > know about the uncanny and uplifting story that gave Varah(a)Mihir(a) > [the bracketed (a) to avoid anyone mixing UMM with AAM!] his title > but that was a success story! :-) > > I do not know if jyotishis have a complex or not but I do know that > two of the relative modern jyotishis were not really professional > jyotishis as in earning their livelihood through what they earned > from charging for their readings. The older one was B.V. Raman who > brought to light Jyotish not only to Indians who did not pay > attention when in school to learning sanskrit but also to the world > that knew english better than hindi or sanskrit or other Indian > vernacular. I do not believe Raman charged for readings. The second > and younger jyotishi is K.N. Rao who after a brilliant and > responsible career in Public/Civil Service during which he patiently > honed his astrological skills and knowledged then shared far and wide > his learnings after retiring from his regular vocation. There were > others too that were not professional jyotishis in the strictest > sense who contributed a lot to astrology without having to live off > it, by the Grace of God. > > There are many actually who like you are moved by a passion for > astrology and obviously it is not for a 'need' but simply because it > is destiny! <Strange, eh? Coming from me! ;-)> > > Destiny, is like that groove that gets cut into a slab of granite > through water-of-karma flowing in a focussed and repetitive manner > with an aim and dedication! It takes longer but once the groove is > cut, there is no escaping or guessing how the water shall flow, no > matter how or where one is born or chooses as his or her profession. > > Be well and continue with your dharma. > > Blessings, > > Rohiniranjan > > > , " " > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > Dada, > > I assume at times these " jyotishis " suffer from some kind of > > complex---superior or inferior. If Superior, its their ego which is > > hurt, if it b the latter, then the condition is > > well-understandable----they always think/presume that they are > subject > > to all kind of hatreds, abuses & wut not... > > Is this the reason for being sensitive??Or they cant forget their > big > > old daddy, who was being humiliated in the king's court, since he > was > > incompetent in front of her Daughter-in-law for the astro > > predictions(I think you already got it, about whom I am talking) & > may > > be this is the reason for being so sensitive... > > I hope you already know that I am not a " jyotishi " (in one of the > > forums, one did spell by profession as " joytish " !!)by profession, > but > > a Chef (or " Cook " in layman's term), but this " jyotish " is simply > > backed by my utmost reverence, obsession, passion & of course hobby. > > May be the service oriented attitude makes me less sensitive, as it > > being the less emotional to customer " feedback " (which being negative > > most of the times... ...) & the industry is really hardworking.. > > Anyways..my " keyboard " being mightier now, I will give it some break > > for the time being...some battle that i have to fight ahead... > > Gaurav. > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > No problem, Gaurav. I just wanted to make sure because I have > > > generally (not just these days!) found jyotishis of all ages to > be > > > rather sensitive people, easily offended -- hence I was just > being > > > careful :-) > > > > > > I do not know why they as a class tend to be overly sensitive, in > > > case you are wondering. > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > , " " > > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > > Dear Dada, > > > > I never took anything personally, nothing has been directed to > > > > me/pointed to me, neither. > > > > I just cited an example, of Modern Jyotish, as the subject > goes, > > > like > > > > testing the classical principles & applying them in real life > > > scenarios.. > > > > Again...my sincere apologies if there was a misunderstanding, if > > > > any--neither has anything been pointed to me/my > > > analysis/predictions... > > > > Gaurav. > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Gaurav :-) > > > > > > > > > > Must be my aging brain but I kind of sense that somehow you > felt > > > that > > > > > my statements were directed at you or anyone else in > particular. > > > I > > > > > may have gone after patterns and if any of those fit your > current > > > > > perception please do not take it personally or feel the need > to > > > > > justify. You are a wonderful human being, what little I know > of > > > you > > > > > or have experienced so there! :-) > > > > > > > > > > I generally tend not to go after individuals but 'patterns' > and > > > as > > > > > far as I know, there is no individual who fully fits a given > > > pattern > > > > > or framework of perception or expression. > > > > > > > > > > We all have fragments of patterns that get attacked or > seemingly > > > so. > > > > > I am elaborating all this just to avoid misunderstandings. > > > > > > > > > > Most of us tend to 'judge' too quickly, often based on very > > > little > > > > > information, often because the demand and pressure to judge > or > > > mete > > > > > out a judgment is imperetive, be it our jobs or society or > > > parents or > > > > > others that control us. It is toxic and can become a habit! > > > > > > > > > > It is healthier to just observe passively and > dispassionately. > > > Active > > > > > listening is a buzzword that is rampant in modern culture > > > > > particularly modern management frameworks. The most important > > > element > > > > > in the state of 'active listening' is when we can be totally > > > passive > > > > > and take in, as opposed to trying to speak and express at the > > > same > > > > > time while we are listening! > > > > > > > > > > Again, nothing particularly directed at you or anyone else, > just > > > > > something I felt like sharing. Hopefully someone is listening > > > > > actively. > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " " > > > > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > > > > Dear RRji, > > > > > > Personally the " tools " I use for the predictive techniques, > are > > > all > > > > > > time-tested, which I can assure of. > > > > > > I have tried many systems(i am being left out with only > System's > > > > > > Approach)to see which method gives clarity in predictions, > as > > > today > > > > > > people need that prediction, what you call, " Crystal > Clarity " . > > > If, > > > > > > something is not replicable & has no clarity, what is the > > > benefit of > > > > > > using that technique? > > > > > > Next comes the question of remedies that " I " advise. Its > being > > > pure > > > > > > Parasari, with a hint of Tantrik remedies(not exceeding > mantras) > > > & > > > > > also > > > > > > some Vedic mantras. As again to quote my author > > > > > > " We practise Parasari Jyotish, but dont follow the Parasari > > > > > Remedies " . > > > > > > I have tried the remedies, but only those which I advise > > > (personally > > > > > > Santan Gopal Mantra, not yet, but through relatives & > clients), > > > but > > > > > > remedies through mantras are advised only when there is a > ray > > > of > > > > > hope > > > > > > ...we can convert .5% to 5%. But if situation is pathetic, > > > complete > > > > > > surrender being the final step!! > > > > > > 3-4 yrs before, when I was a novice in astrology(i am > nowhere > > > > > advanced > > > > > > today, I am still a novice today, as everyday I am learning > & > > > > > > astrology is such an ocean, people always try to find the > > > sandbase > > > > > or > > > > > > the seabed, but they ultimately dont get into it!!)I used > to > > > > > advocate > > > > > > only gems, but when I am growing up & will celebrate the > Silver > > > > > > Jubilee of my birth anniversary or rather score " quarter > > > century " > > > > > of > > > > > > this mortal body aka, , in a year, I personally > > > feel > > > > > that > > > > > > to that Omniscient,Omnipotent & Omnipresent--these are > nothing > > > but > > > > > > some molded clay, which was soft ones, but now it has > become > > > hard so > > > > > > of no use to restructure...why not pray to that Almighty, > who > > > covers > > > > > > everything in this world through " Maayaa " (i.e. Illusion!!). > > > > > > Thank you, > > > > > > . > > > > > > http://gauravastro.150m.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Then I am with you! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, > not > > > > > many > > > > > > > practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get > around > > > to > > > > > > > testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, > believe in > > > or > > > > > > > advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 > > > hours to > > > > > > > astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough > time > > > to > > > > > test > > > > > > > everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly > > > > > indicate > > > > > > > which ones are based on experience and which ones based > on > > > what > > > > > they > > > > > > > read or what sounds logical to them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by > astrologers > > > who > > > > > come > > > > > > > across as very black and white when describing astrology, > > > > > remedies > > > > > > > and so on but it is not about style, it should be about > > > > > substance ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > > > Tripathy " > > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RR Ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle > for 5 > > > > > > > different > > > > > > > > perspectives is not bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we should test each of them and > > > > > > > > accept only those interpretations that > > > > > > > > comes unambigously correct. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly > and > > > we > > > > > might > > > > > > > > be faltering on account of our limited power of > cognizance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern > > > astrologers > > > > > > > giving > > > > > > > > out of context mystic looking but sometimes > intentionally > > > > > confusing > > > > > > > > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of > modern > > > > > artist's > > > > > > > > paintings that nobody understands ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > 09811971190 > > > > > > > > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not > accept > > > modern > > > > > > > > sayings > > > > > > > > > or , then I am with > > > > > > > > > you! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > > > > > Tripathy " > > > > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able > to > > > grasp > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper > > > > > > > perspectives > > > > > > > > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit > > > > > literature > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > found to be in their most original and authentic > forms > > > till > > > > > > > today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora > Shastra > > > of > > > > > sage > > > > > > > > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka > > > Parijat > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non-confusing > and > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and > > > Mangalya > > > > > > > > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round > wellbeing > > > and > > > > > > > > > prosperity > > > > > > > > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all > > > > > encompassing > > > > > > > > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing > living > > > a > > > > > > > > > successful > > > > > > > > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to > Judge > > > > > > > Horoscope > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of > Mangalya > > > > > > > > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership > > > of ....all > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( > meaning > > > all > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the > > > chart..depending > > > > > upon > > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > dispositon) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is > not ...specifically > > > the > > > > > > > > > unpatented > > > > > > > > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct > > > approach as > > > > > > > > > envisaged > > > > > > > > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota > > > scheme ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > > > > > > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised > > > subject > > > > > on > > > > > > > > moon- > > > > > > > > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on > > > horoscope) > > > > > > > > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, > moon > > > sign > > > > > and > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > lords) > > > > > > > > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, > > > moon, > > > > > 5th > > > > > > > > lord > > > > > > > > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > > > > > > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the > > > > > basis..of > > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > > > > > > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th > in > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > rasi chart) > > > > > > > > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > > > > > > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other > > > systems > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > rajju etc.) > > > > > > > > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > > > > > > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of > name) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the > case > > > of > > > > > a > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket > rules > > > that > > > > > > > > nowhere > > > > > > > > > > exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer > > > laziness > > > > > or > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a > > > astrologer > > > > > ever > > > > > > > > > taking > > > > > > > > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all > good > > > > > > > > astrologer > > > > > > > > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of > > > honesty ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not > > > > > everything > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical > > > jyotish > > > > > that > > > > > > > > we > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > received or retained and some of that may not > even be > > > > > > > entirely > > > > > > > > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on > > > > > astrotreasures > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious > > > observation > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > empirical > > > > > > > > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of > bias, > > > now > > > > > > > > flared > > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises > in 'full' > > > > > glory > > > > > > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets > > > (except > > > > > for > > > > > > > > sun > > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's > > > > > influences, > > > > > > > > > > summarily > > > > > > > > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like > to > > > use > > > > > these > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! > Once > > > > > spotted, > > > > > > > if > > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would > not be > > > out > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > character! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, > pro > > > or > > > > > > > contra, > > > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > > things astrological because we do not have a > complete > > > > > > > > discipline > > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some > great > > > ones > > > > > say > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > think! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2009 Report Share Posted February 21, 2009 Gaurav, It must be destiny (9th house which is bhagy(a)and hence destiny!( that brought you back to the heavy keyboard so soon ;-) I must, to my chagrin, admit that I have not been paying a lot of attention to Bengali culture and writings of Khana etc who was mentioned by KN Rao too in one of his web-postings :-( You see -- when I was a tiny bengali (?) boy raised in Malwa and visiting Calcutta for the first time in this lifetime back in the late fifties or so -- much older and who should have been supportive and more mature 'relatives' picked on me because I had a strange accent when I spoke bangla ( " They do not SPEAK bangla outside Bengal, Virginia!! " -- But I was just a helpless little tot back then!). It impressed very strongly on me, confusingly back then but getting clearer later one as I grew. Actually it prepared me very well for when I moved to the west many many years later where what I knew was placed in the background as opposed to how I said and pronounced it! Just for a short time, thankfully. I was following my *dharm(a)* :-) Live and learn has been the motto always... Blessings, RR -- , " " <gaurav.ghosh wrote: > > Dada, > Certainly I was talking about " Varah(a)Mihir(a) " & the cooked up story > of his daughter-in-law, which was prevalent in Bengal,i.e. " Khanaa " > (or Lilavati to others...). > Still today, people(in Bengal only) swear by her name, when it comes > to " Jyotish " . > Whenever blessings /good wishes come from a senior, it is certainly > " grabbed " easily...as these have long term results...like for any > auspicious event,blessings of seniors-be a friend or foe, is certainly > needed, as in Mahabharata, when Yudhisthira was seeking his blessings > from his uncles/preceptors etc., before starting the war... > Gaurav. > > , " Rohiniranjan " > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > No Gaurav I do not know which astrologer you are talking about. I > > know about the uncanny and uplifting story that gave Varah(a)Mihir (a) > > [the bracketed (a) to avoid anyone mixing UMM with AAM!] his title > > but that was a success story! :-) > > > > I do not know if jyotishis have a complex or not but I do know that > > two of the relative modern jyotishis were not really professional > > jyotishis as in earning their livelihood through what they earned > > from charging for their readings. The older one was B.V. Raman who > > brought to light Jyotish not only to Indians who did not pay > > attention when in school to learning sanskrit but also to the world > > that knew english better than hindi or sanskrit or other Indian > > vernacular. I do not believe Raman charged for readings. The second > > and younger jyotishi is K.N. Rao who after a brilliant and > > responsible career in Public/Civil Service during which he patiently > > honed his astrological skills and knowledged then shared far and wide > > his learnings after retiring from his regular vocation. There were > > others too that were not professional jyotishis in the strictest > > sense who contributed a lot to astrology without having to live off > > it, by the Grace of God. > > > > There are many actually who like you are moved by a passion for > > astrology and obviously it is not for a 'need' but simply because it > > is destiny! <Strange, eh? Coming from me! ;-)> > > > > Destiny, is like that groove that gets cut into a slab of granite > > through water-of-karma flowing in a focussed and repetitive manner > > with an aim and dedication! It takes longer but once the groove is > > cut, there is no escaping or guessing how the water shall flow, no > > matter how or where one is born or chooses as his or her profession. > > > > Be well and continue with your dharma. > > > > Blessings, > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > , " " > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > Dada, > > > I assume at times these " jyotishis " suffer from some kind of > > > complex---superior or inferior. If Superior, its their ego which is > > > hurt, if it b the latter, then the condition is > > > well-understandable----they always think/presume that they are > > subject > > > to all kind of hatreds, abuses & wut not... > > > Is this the reason for being sensitive??Or they cant forget their > > big > > > old daddy, who was being humiliated in the king's court, since he > > was > > > incompetent in front of her Daughter-in-law for the astro > > > predictions(I think you already got it, about whom I am talking) & > > may > > > be this is the reason for being so sensitive... > > > I hope you already know that I am not a " jyotishi " (in one of the > > > forums, one did spell by profession as " joytish " !!)by profession, > > but > > > a Chef (or " Cook " in layman's term), but this " jyotish " is simply > > > backed by my utmost reverence, obsession, passion & of course hobby. > > > May be the service oriented attitude makes me less sensitive, as it > > > being the less emotional to customer " feedback " (which being negative > > > most of the times... ...) & the industry is really hardworking.. > > > Anyways..my " keyboard " being mightier now, I will give it some break > > > for the time being...some battle that i have to fight ahead... > > > Gaurav. > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > No problem, Gaurav. I just wanted to make sure because I have > > > > generally (not just these days!) found jyotishis of all ages to > > be > > > > rather sensitive people, easily offended -- hence I was just > > being > > > > careful :-) > > > > > > > > I do not know why they as a class tend to be overly sensitive, in > > > > case you are wondering. > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > , " " > > > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > > > Dear Dada, > > > > > I never took anything personally, nothing has been directed to > > > > > me/pointed to me, neither. > > > > > I just cited an example, of Modern Jyotish, as the subject > > goes, > > > > like > > > > > testing the classical principles & applying them in real life > > > > scenarios.. > > > > > Again...my sincere apologies if there was a misunderstanding, if > > > > > any--neither has anything been pointed to me/my > > > > analysis/predictions... > > > > > Gaurav. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Gaurav :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > Must be my aging brain but I kind of sense that somehow you > > felt > > > > that > > > > > > my statements were directed at you or anyone else in > > particular. > > > > I > > > > > > may have gone after patterns and if any of those fit your > > current > > > > > > perception please do not take it personally or feel the need > > to > > > > > > justify. You are a wonderful human being, what little I know > > of > > > > you > > > > > > or have experienced so there! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > I generally tend not to go after individuals but 'patterns' > > and > > > > as > > > > > > far as I know, there is no individual who fully fits a given > > > > pattern > > > > > > or framework of perception or expression. > > > > > > > > > > > > We all have fragments of patterns that get attacked or > > seemingly > > > > so. > > > > > > I am elaborating all this just to avoid misunderstandings. > > > > > > > > > > > > Most of us tend to 'judge' too quickly, often based on very > > > > little > > > > > > information, often because the demand and pressure to judge > > or > > > > mete > > > > > > out a judgment is imperetive, be it our jobs or society or > > > > parents or > > > > > > others that control us. It is toxic and can become a habit! > > > > > > > > > > > > It is healthier to just observe passively and > > dispassionately. > > > > Active > > > > > > listening is a buzzword that is rampant in modern culture > > > > > > particularly modern management frameworks. The most important > > > > element > > > > > > in the state of 'active listening' is when we can be totally > > > > passive > > > > > > and take in, as opposed to trying to speak and express at the > > > > same > > > > > > time while we are listening! > > > > > > > > > > > > Again, nothing particularly directed at you or anyone else, > > just > > > > > > something I felt like sharing. Hopefully someone is listening > > > > > > actively. > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " " > > > > > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > > > > > Dear RRji, > > > > > > > Personally the " tools " I use for the predictive techniques, > > are > > > > all > > > > > > > time-tested, which I can assure of. > > > > > > > I have tried many systems(i am being left out with only > > System's > > > > > > > Approach)to see which method gives clarity in predictions, > > as > > > > today > > > > > > > people need that prediction, what you call, " Crystal > > Clarity " . > > > > If, > > > > > > > something is not replicable & has no clarity, what is the > > > > benefit of > > > > > > > using that technique? > > > > > > > Next comes the question of remedies that " I " advise. Its > > being > > > > pure > > > > > > > Parasari, with a hint of Tantrik remedies(not exceeding > > mantras) > > > > & > > > > > > also > > > > > > > some Vedic mantras. As again to quote my author > > > > > > > " We practise Parasari Jyotish, but dont follow the Parasari > > > > > > Remedies " . > > > > > > > I have tried the remedies, but only those which I advise > > > > (personally > > > > > > > Santan Gopal Mantra, not yet, but through relatives & > > clients), > > > > but > > > > > > > remedies through mantras are advised only when there is a > > ray > > > > of > > > > > > hope > > > > > > > ...we can convert .5% to 5%. But if situation is pathetic, > > > > complete > > > > > > > surrender being the final step!! > > > > > > > 3-4 yrs before, when I was a novice in astrology(i am > > nowhere > > > > > > advanced > > > > > > > today, I am still a novice today, as everyday I am learning > > & > > > > > > > astrology is such an ocean, people always try to find the > > > > sandbase > > > > > > or > > > > > > > the seabed, but they ultimately dont get into it!!)I used > > to > > > > > > advocate > > > > > > > only gems, but when I am growing up & will celebrate the > > Silver > > > > > > > Jubilee of my birth anniversary or rather score " quarter > > > > century " > > > > > > of > > > > > > > this mortal body aka, , in a year, I personally > > > > feel > > > > > > that > > > > > > > to that Omniscient,Omnipotent & Omnipresent--these are > > nothing > > > > but > > > > > > > some molded clay, which was soft ones, but now it has > > become > > > > hard so > > > > > > > of no use to restructure...why not pray to that Almighty, > > who > > > > covers > > > > > > > everything in this world through " Maayaa " (i.e. Illusion!!). > > > > > > > Thank you, > > > > > > > . > > > > > > > http://gauravastro.150m.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Then I am with you! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, > > not > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get > > around > > > > to > > > > > > > > testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, > > believe in > > > > or > > > > > > > > advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 > > > > hours to > > > > > > > > astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough > > time > > > > to > > > > > > test > > > > > > > > everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly > > > > > > indicate > > > > > > > > which ones are based on experience and which ones based > > on > > > > what > > > > > > they > > > > > > > > read or what sounds logical to them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by > > astrologers > > > > who > > > > > > come > > > > > > > > across as very black and white when describing astrology, > > > > > > remedies > > > > > > > > and so on but it is not about style, it should be about > > > > > > substance ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > > > > Tripathy " > > > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RR Ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle > > for 5 > > > > > > > > different > > > > > > > > > perspectives is not bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we should test each of them and > > > > > > > > > accept only those interpretations that > > > > > > > > > comes unambigously correct. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly > > and > > > > we > > > > > > might > > > > > > > > > be faltering on account of our limited power of > > cognizance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern > > > > astrologers > > > > > > > > giving > > > > > > > > > out of context mystic looking but sometimes > > intentionally > > > > > > confusing > > > > > > > > > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of > > modern > > > > > > artist's > > > > > > > > > paintings that nobody understands ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > 09811971190 > > > > > > > > > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not > > accept > > > > modern > > > > > > > > > sayings > > > > > > > > > > or , then I am with > > > > > > > > > > you! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " Mrutyunjay > > > > > > Tripathy " > > > > > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able > > to > > > > grasp > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper > > > > > > > > perspectives > > > > > > > > > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit > > > > > > literature > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > found to be in their most original and authentic > > forms > > > > till > > > > > > > > today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora > > Shastra > > > > of > > > > > > sage > > > > > > > > > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka > > > > Parijat > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non- confusing > > and > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and > > > > Mangalya > > > > > > > > > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round > > wellbeing > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > prosperity > > > > > > > > > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all > > > > > > encompassing > > > > > > > > > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing > > living > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > successful > > > > > > > > > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to > > Judge > > > > > > > > Horoscope > > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of > > Mangalya > > > > > > > > > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership > > > > of ....all > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( > > meaning > > > > all > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the > > > > chart..depending > > > > > > upon > > > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > > dispositon) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is > > not ...specifically > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > unpatented > > > > > > > > > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct > > > > approach as > > > > > > > > > > envisaged > > > > > > > > > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota > > > > scheme ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > > > > > > > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised > > > > subject > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > moon- > > > > > > > > > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on > > > > horoscope) > > > > > > > > > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, > > moon > > > > sign > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > > lords) > > > > > > > > > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, > > > > moon, > > > > > > 5th > > > > > > > > > lord > > > > > > > > > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > > > > > > > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the > > > > > > basis..of > > > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > > > > > > > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th > > in > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > rasi chart) > > > > > > > > > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > > > > > > > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other > > > > systems > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > rajju etc.) > > > > > > > > > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > > > > > > > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of > > name) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the > > case > > > > of > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket > > rules > > > > that > > > > > > > > > nowhere > > > > > > > > > > > exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer > > > > laziness > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a > > > > astrologer > > > > > > ever > > > > > > > > > > taking > > > > > > > > > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all > > good > > > > > > > > > astrologer > > > > > > > > > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of > > > > honesty ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not > > > > > > everything > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical > > > > jyotish > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > we > > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > received or retained and some of that may not > > even be > > > > > > > > entirely > > > > > > > > > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on > > > > > > astrotreasures > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious > > > > observation > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > empirical > > > > > > > > > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of > > bias, > > > > now > > > > > > > > > flared > > > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises > > in 'full' > > > > > > glory > > > > > > > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets > > > > (except > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > sun > > > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's > > > > > > influences, > > > > > > > > > > > summarily > > > > > > > > > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like > > to > > > > use > > > > > > these > > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! > > Once > > > > > > spotted, > > > > > > > > if > > > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would > > not be > > > > out > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > character! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, > > pro > > > > or > > > > > > > > contra, > > > > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > > > things astrological because we do not have a > > complete > > > > > > > > > discipline > > > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some > > great > > > > ones > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > > think! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2009 Report Share Posted February 21, 2009 I am back again! Your last paragraph about Mahabharata and what I read recently from PVR Narasimha Rao recently just clicked! He was speaking about 'acts', 'dramas' and 'roles' that we all play in this lifetime that I call Human Experience! Now, whether raised in Bengal, Malwa, Punjab or Bihar and whether we end up in Delhi, Chennai, Napanee, Los Angeles, Des Moines, San Francisco or Gaya -- one thing that Bongs love is " THEATRE " It is strange because it is more phenotypical than genotypical and subject of my research if Ma allows the funding (breaths!)... " Cultures and Environments prevail over Genes " would be the title of the thesis! RR , " " <gaurav.ghosh wrote: > > Dada, > Certainly I was talking about " Varah(a)Mihir(a) " & the cooked up story > of his daughter-in-law, which was prevalent in Bengal,i.e. " Khanaa " > (or Lilavati to others...). > Still today, people(in Bengal only) swear by her name, when it comes > to " Jyotish " . > Whenever blessings /good wishes come from a senior, it is certainly > " grabbed " easily...as these have long term results...like for any > auspicious event,blessings of seniors-be a friend or foe, is certainly > needed, as in Mahabharata, when Yudhisthira was seeking his blessings > from his uncles/preceptors etc., before starting the war... > Gaurav. > > , " Rohiniranjan " > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > No Gaurav I do not know which astrologer you are talking about. I > > know about the uncanny and uplifting story that gave Varah(a)Mihir (a) > > [the bracketed (a) to avoid anyone mixing UMM with AAM!] his title > > but that was a success story! :-) > > > > I do not know if jyotishis have a complex or not but I do know that > > two of the relative modern jyotishis were not really professional > > jyotishis as in earning their livelihood through what they earned > > from charging for their readings. The older one was B.V. Raman who > > brought to light Jyotish not only to Indians who did not pay > > attention when in school to learning sanskrit but also to the world > > that knew english better than hindi or sanskrit or other Indian > > vernacular. I do not believe Raman charged for readings. The second > > and younger jyotishi is K.N. Rao who after a brilliant and > > responsible career in Public/Civil Service during which he patiently > > honed his astrological skills and knowledged then shared far and wide > > his learnings after retiring from his regular vocation. There were > > others too that were not professional jyotishis in the strictest > > sense who contributed a lot to astrology without having to live off > > it, by the Grace of God. > > > > There are many actually who like you are moved by a passion for > > astrology and obviously it is not for a 'need' but simply because it > > is destiny! <Strange, eh? Coming from me! ;-)> > > > > Destiny, is like that groove that gets cut into a slab of granite > > through water-of-karma flowing in a focussed and repetitive manner > > with an aim and dedication! It takes longer but once the groove is > > cut, there is no escaping or guessing how the water shall flow, no > > matter how or where one is born or chooses as his or her profession. > > > > Be well and continue with your dharma. > > > > Blessings, > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > , " " > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > Dada, > > > I assume at times these " jyotishis " suffer from some kind of > > > complex---superior or inferior. If Superior, its their ego which is > > > hurt, if it b the latter, then the condition is > > > well-understandable----they always think/presume that they are > > subject > > > to all kind of hatreds, abuses & wut not... > > > Is this the reason for being sensitive??Or they cant forget their > > big > > > old daddy, who was being humiliated in the king's court, since he > > was > > > incompetent in front of her Daughter-in-law for the astro > > > predictions(I think you already got it, about whom I am talking) & > > may > > > be this is the reason for being so sensitive... > > > I hope you already know that I am not a " jyotishi " (in one of the > > > forums, one did spell by profession as " joytish " !!)by profession, > > but > > > a Chef (or " Cook " in layman's term), but this " jyotish " is simply > > > backed by my utmost reverence, obsession, passion & of course hobby. > > > May be the service oriented attitude makes me less sensitive, as it > > > being the less emotional to customer " feedback " (which being negative > > > most of the times... ...) & the industry is really hardworking.. > > > Anyways..my " keyboard " being mightier now, I will give it some break > > > for the time being...some battle that i have to fight ahead... > > > Gaurav. > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > No problem, Gaurav. I just wanted to make sure because I have > > > > generally (not just these days!) found jyotishis of all ages to > > be > > > > rather sensitive people, easily offended -- hence I was just > > being > > > > careful :-) > > > > > > > > I do not know why they as a class tend to be overly sensitive, in > > > > case you are wondering. > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > , " " > > > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > > > Dear Dada, > > > > > I never took anything personally, nothing has been directed to > > > > > me/pointed to me, neither. > > > > > I just cited an example, of Modern Jyotish, as the subject > > goes, > > > > like > > > > > testing the classical principles & applying them in real life > > > > scenarios.. > > > > > Again...my sincere apologies if there was a misunderstanding, if > > > > > any--neither has anything been pointed to me/my > > > > analysis/predictions... > > > > > Gaurav. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Gaurav :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > Must be my aging brain but I kind of sense that somehow you > > felt > > > > that > > > > > > my statements were directed at you or anyone else in > > particular. > > > > I > > > > > > may have gone after patterns and if any of those fit your > > current > > > > > > perception please do not take it personally or feel the need > > to > > > > > > justify. You are a wonderful human being, what little I know > > of > > > > you > > > > > > or have experienced so there! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > I generally tend not to go after individuals but 'patterns' > > and > > > > as > > > > > > far as I know, there is no individual who fully fits a given > > > > pattern > > > > > > or framework of perception or expression. > > > > > > > > > > > > We all have fragments of patterns that get attacked or > > seemingly > > > > so. > > > > > > I am elaborating all this just to avoid misunderstandings. > > > > > > > > > > > > Most of us tend to 'judge' too quickly, often based on very > > > > little > > > > > > information, often because the demand and pressure to judge > > or > > > > mete > > > > > > out a judgment is imperetive, be it our jobs or society or > > > > parents or > > > > > > others that control us. It is toxic and can become a habit! > > > > > > > > > > > > It is healthier to just observe passively and > > dispassionately. > > > > Active > > > > > > listening is a buzzword that is rampant in modern culture > > > > > > particularly modern management frameworks. The most important > > > > element > > > > > > in the state of 'active listening' is when we can be totally > > > > passive > > > > > > and take in, as opposed to trying to speak and express at the > > > > same > > > > > > time while we are listening! > > > > > > > > > > > > Again, nothing particularly directed at you or anyone else, > > just > > > > > > something I felt like sharing. Hopefully someone is listening > > > > > > actively. > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " " > > > > > > <gaurav.ghosh@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ||Jai Ramakrishna|| > > > > > > > Dear RRji, > > > > > > > Personally the " tools " I use for the predictive techniques, > > are > > > > all > > > > > > > time-tested, which I can assure of. > > > > > > > I have tried many systems(i am being left out with only > > System's > > > > > > > Approach)to see which method gives clarity in predictions, > > as > > > > today > > > > > > > people need that prediction, what you call, " Crystal > > Clarity " . > > > > If, > > > > > > > something is not replicable & has no clarity, what is the > > > > benefit of > > > > > > > using that technique? > > > > > > > Next comes the question of remedies that " I " advise. Its > > being > > > > pure > > > > > > > Parasari, with a hint of Tantrik remedies(not exceeding > > mantras) > > > > & > > > > > > also > > > > > > > some Vedic mantras. As again to quote my author > > > > > > > " We practise Parasari Jyotish, but dont follow the Parasari > > > > > > Remedies " . > > > > > > > I have tried the remedies, but only those which I advise > > > > (personally > > > > > > > Santan Gopal Mantra, not yet, but through relatives & > > clients), > > > > but > > > > > > > remedies through mantras are advised only when there is a > > ray > > > > of > > > > > > hope > > > > > > > ...we can convert .5% to 5%. But if situation is pathetic, > > > > complete > > > > > > > surrender being the final step!! > > > > > > > 3-4 yrs before, when I was a novice in astrology(i am > > nowhere > > > > > > advanced > > > > > > > today, I am still a novice today, as everyday I am learning > > & > > > > > > > astrology is such an ocean, people always try to find the > > > > sandbase > > > > > > or > > > > > > > the seabed, but they ultimately dont get into it!!)I used > > to > > > > > > advocate > > > > > > > only gems, but when I am growing up & will celebrate the > > Silver > > > > > > > Jubilee of my birth anniversary or rather score " quarter > > > > century " > > > > > > of > > > > > > > this mortal body aka, , in a year, I personally > > > > feel > > > > > > that > > > > > > > to that Omniscient,Omnipotent & Omnipresent--these are > > nothing > > > > but > > > > > > > some molded clay, which was soft ones, but now it has > > become > > > > hard so > > > > > > > of no use to restructure...why not pray to that Almighty, > > who > > > > covers > > > > > > > everything in this world through " Maayaa " (i.e. Illusion!!). > > > > > > > Thank you, > > > > > > > . > > > > > > > http://gauravastro.150m.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Then I am with you! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The problem is that despite strong claims and intentions, > > not > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > practicing astrologers (charging or free) do not get > > around > > > > to > > > > > > > > testing each and every tenet that they use, adopt, > > believe in > > > > or > > > > > > > > advise based upon! In fact even if one were to devote 20 > > > > hours to > > > > > > > > astrology and astrology alone, there would not be enough > > time > > > > to > > > > > > test > > > > > > > > everything. So it is prudent and honest if people clearly > > > > > > indicate > > > > > > > > which ones are based on experience and which ones based > > on > > > > what > > > > > > they > > > > > > > > read or what sounds logical to them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The clouds of confusion are sometimes created by > > astrologers > > > > who > > > > > > come > > > > > > > > across as very black and white when describing astrology, > > > > > > remedies > > > > > > > > and so on but it is not about style, it should be about > > > > > > substance ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Mrutyunjay > > > > Tripathy " > > > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RR Ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Simple interpretation of jyotish classic or principle > > for 5 > > > > > > > > different > > > > > > > > > perspectives is not bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But we should test each of them and > > > > > > > > > accept only those interpretations that > > > > > > > > > comes unambigously correct. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The sages knew the true meanings and wrote accordingly > > and > > > > we > > > > > > might > > > > > > > > > be faltering on account of our limited power of > > cognizance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " modern interpretations of ancient verses as gospel " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is the most exact word used to describe the modern > > > > astrologers > > > > > > > > giving > > > > > > > > > out of context mystic looking but sometimes > > intentionally > > > > > > confusing > > > > > > > > > and vague explanations to classics.. .like that of > > modern > > > > > > artist's > > > > > > > > > paintings that nobody understands ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > 09811971190 > > > > > > > > > (Consultancy out of group is not free) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrityunjay-ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are saying, " Experiment and test and not > > accept > > > > modern > > > > > > > > > sayings > > > > > > > > > > or , then I am with > > > > > > > > > > you! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you meant something else then I am not with you :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In , " Mrutyunjay > > > > > > Tripathy " > > > > > > > > > > <astrologer_mrutyunjay@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to say my few lines supporting > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 'Not everything in classics works' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in my humble experience we are sometimes not able > > to > > > > grasp > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > inherent meanings of jyotish texts in their proper > > > > > > > > perspectives > > > > > > > > > > > although most of the times the classics in sanskrit > > > > > > literature > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > found to be in their most original and authentic > > forms > > > > till > > > > > > > > today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Take the small example of Brihat Parasara Hora > > Shastra > > > > of > > > > > > sage > > > > > > > > > > > Parasara, Brihat Jataka of Varahamihira or Jataka > > > > Parijat > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > notably Sarvartha Chintamani. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot have yet noticed even a 80% non- confusing > > and > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > > translation of these works so far. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another example; take the case of match making and > > > > Mangalya > > > > > > > > > > > Dosha...the word Mangalya meanign all round > > wellbeing > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > prosperity > > > > > > > > > > > and the word dosha attached to it also has the all > > > > > > encompassing > > > > > > > > > > > meaning of ....all those negatively influencing > > living > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > successful > > > > > > > > > > > conjugal life. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Late Dr. BV Raman in Volume-II of his book How to > > Judge > > > > > > > > Horoscope > > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > clearly shown various degree and percentage of > > Mangalya > > > > > > > > > > > Dosha ...arising out of placement and ownership > > > > of ....all > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > planets including ...jupiter, mercury etc. ( > > meaning > > > > all > > > > > > > > planets > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > > cause some sort of manglya dosha ..in the > > > > chart..depending > > > > > > upon > > > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > > dispositon) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Manglya Dosha or Mangala Dosha is > > not ...specifically > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > unpatented > > > > > > > > > > > domain of the planet Mars( Mangala). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But how many of us use the holistic and correct > > > > approach as > > > > > > > > > > envisaged > > > > > > > > > > > by Raman or sage Garga ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sage Gargacharya has the following dasakoota > > > > scheme ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (1)Tara( of 3 varieties including that of nava tara) > > > > > > > > > > > (2)Chandra( Bhakoota...extensive and well organised > > > > subject > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > moon- > > > > > > > > > > > sign matching along with moon's strength based on > > > > horoscope) > > > > > > > > > > > (3)Varna ( the 4 varna classification of lagna, > > moon > > > > sign > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > > lords) > > > > > > > > > > > (4)Bala( strength of horoscope...strength of lagna, > > > > moon, > > > > > > 5th > > > > > > > > > lord > > > > > > > > > > > and jupiter including longevity, health,progeny) > > > > > > > > > > > (5)Mandala( birth constellation relationship on the > > > > > > basis..of > > > > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > > airy...firy etc. nature) > > > > > > > > > > > (6)Bhavanadhipa( Lords of lagna ,7th, 4th and 10th > > in > > > > > > navamsa > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > rasi chart) > > > > > > > > > > > (7)Jati(Deva, Raksha , Manusya etc on navamsa pada) > > > > > > > > > > > (8)Nadi (includes adya, madhya, antya and the other > > > > systems > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > rajju etc.) > > > > > > > > > > > (9)Swara( calculated on the base of birth tithi ?) > > > > > > > > > > > (10)varga (decided on the basis of phonetics of > > name) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I donot find either a good book or leave aside the > > case > > > > of > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > computer match making software ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is easy to avoid hardwork and go for blanket > > rules > > > > that > > > > > > > > > nowhere > > > > > > > > > > > exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In my humble view this is nothing more than sheer > > > > laziness > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > unwillingness to work hard ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if Dr Raman could live an examplary life of a > > > > astrologer > > > > > > ever > > > > > > > > > > taking > > > > > > > > > > > recourse to such frivolous things as KSY, hope all > > good > > > > > > > > > astrologer > > > > > > > > > > > can also do this, at least follow his footsteps of > > > > honesty ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With regards and best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mrutyunjay Tripathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > > > > > > > > <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not > > > > > > everything > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical > > > > jyotish > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > we > > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > received or retained and some of that may not > > even be > > > > > > > > entirely > > > > > > > > > > > > original as I have expressed in an article on > > > > > > astrotreasures > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > > survived. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious > > > > observation > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > empirical > > > > > > > > > > > > approach as it is called. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of > > bias, > > > > now > > > > > > > > > flared > > > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises > > in 'full' > > > > > > glory > > > > > > > > > > mercury > > > > > > > > > > > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets > > > > (except > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > sun > > > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > > > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's > > > > > > influences, > > > > > > > > > > > summarily > > > > > > > > > > > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like > > to > > > > use > > > > > > these > > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! > > Once > > > > > > spotted, > > > > > > > > if > > > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > > > mal-factors too are present then caution would > > not be > > > > out > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > character! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, > > pro > > > > or > > > > > > > > contra, > > > > > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > > > > things astrological because we do not have a > > complete > > > > > > > > > discipline > > > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > > body of knowledge available, despite what some > > great > > > > ones > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > > think! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2009 Report Share Posted February 23, 2009 RRJi,         That reminds me of an old Tamil adage " Neither can you stamp on it as a mere rope, nor dread as a poisonous snake and beat with a stick " But using KSY as a red herring for all evils is not acceptable any more.Moreover, there are many common yogas which are extolled in the classics, but rarely work in practise viz..Gajakesari, Budha Aditya, Sashi Mangala, Anabha, Sunabha, Khemadruma, Vasi, Vesi, Ubhayachari and duryogas like Kendradhipathya dosha, KSY, Papa kartari, Guru chandala & many more.While the yogas in a chart are easily identified, enough care is not taken to analyse the ' yoga bhanghas'. A 'profession in a foreign land' codemned to the 12th house in the classics is one of the the most sought after query by many now!! So with changing times, everything changes except the love for change, which keeps the curious ones busy. Regards SRS --- On Fri, 20/2/09, Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan Modern Jyotish Friday, 20 February, 2009, 8:32 AM is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we have received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that survived. So this debate is perhaps not flawless. A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or empirical approach as it is called. Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared up by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory mercury is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun that goes to bed when the full moon rises!). Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, summarily or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if other mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of character! No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, about things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline or body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or think! RR Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger./invite/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2009 Report Share Posted February 24, 2009 Dear Friends, Classics certainly have many things that were conveyed to us over the years.now yogas a catchy word bother modern jyotish.so we have several reference and questions in our forms on the subject of yogas.yoga bahnga or otherwise can not over look dasha and occurence of events.is it not we who take resposibility to decipher classics and convey to the modern public the utility and effectivenes of jyotisha. If classics happened to be evolving Astrology certainly remains firm and good for future.we as persons(may not be fitting into classic definition of jyotish) try and convey unknowingly certain things and create a desperation in the young minds vrkrishnan --- On Mon, 2/23/09, RAMA SUBRAMANIAN <srs81520 wrote: RAMA SUBRAMANIAN <srs81520 Re: Modern Jyotish Monday, February 23, 2009, 6:28 AM RRJi, That reminds me of an old Tamil adage " Neither can you stamp on it as a mere rope, nor dread as a poisonous snake and beat with a stick " But using KSY as a red herring for all evils is not acceptable any more.Moreover, there are many common yogas which are extolled in the classics, but rarely work in practise viz..Gajakesari, Budha Aditya, Sashi Mangala, Anabha, Sunabha, Khemadruma, Vasi, Vesi, Ubhayachari and duryogas like Kendradhipathya dosha, KSY, Papa kartari, Guru chandala & many more.While the yogas in a chart are easily identified, enough care is not taken to analyse the ' yoga bhanghas'. A 'profession in a foreign land' codemned to the 12th house in the classics is one of the the most sought after query by many now!! So with changing times, everything changes except the love for change, which keeps the curious ones busy. Regards SRS --- On Fri, 20/2/09, Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@ hotmail.com> wrote: Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@ hotmail.com> Modern Jyotish Friday, 20 February, 2009, 8:32 AM is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we have received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that survived. So this debate is perhaps not flawless. A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or empirical approach as it is called. Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared up by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory mercury is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun that goes to bed when the full moon rises!). Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, summarily or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if other mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of character! No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, about things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline or body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or think! RR Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger. / invite/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2009 Report Share Posted February 24, 2009 /*om namo bhagavate narasimhaya*/ Dear SRS , Good point about yoga bhangas. Kalasarpa and kalamrta are very important yogas to analyze and when ignored the whole pivot of chart is missing. It doens mean that this is frightening or its just excuse as some dogmatic people can say. You can excuse or frighten the client with every yoga your mind can imagine. Its better to focus on bhangas, timings and various results of KMY/KSY. Argument that these are not present in CURRENTLY AVAILABLE CLASSICS completely denies the need for the parampara and Guru in Jyotish. This path is dogmatic and invalid. Regards Rafal Gendarz SJC Jyotish Guru -------------- /*Consultations & Pages* http://rohinaa.com rafal/ > > Dear Friends, > Classics certainly have many things that were conveyed to us over the > years.now yogas a catchy word bother modern jyotish.so we have several > reference and questions in our forms on the subject of yogas.yoga > bahnga or otherwise can not over look dasha and occurence of events.is > it not we who take resposibility to decipher classics and convey to > the modern public the utility and effectivenes of jyotisha. > If classics happened to be evolving Astrology certainly remains firm > and good for future.we as persons(may not be fitting into classic > definition of jyotish) try and convey unknowingly certain things and > create a desperation in the young minds > vrkrishnan > > --- On Mon, 2/23/09, RAMA SUBRAMANIAN <srs81520 (AT) (DOT) co.in > <srs81520%40.co.in>> wrote: > > RAMA SUBRAMANIAN <srs81520 (AT) (DOT) co.in > <srs81520%40.co.in>> > Re: Modern Jyotish > > <%40> > Monday, February 23, 2009, 6:28 AM > > RRJi, > That reminds me of an old Tamil adage " Neither can you stamp > on it as a mere rope, nor dread as a poisonous snake and beat with a > stick " But using KSY as a red herring for all evils is not acceptable > any more.Moreover, there are many common yogas which are extolled in > the classics, but rarely work in practise viz..Gajakesari, Budha > Aditya, Sashi Mangala, Anabha, Sunabha, Khemadruma, Vasi, Vesi, > Ubhayachari and duryogas like Kendradhipathya dosha, KSY, Papa > kartari, Guru chandala & many more.While the yogas in a chart are > easily identified, enough care is not taken to analyse the ' yoga > bhanghas'. > A 'profession in a foreign land' codemned to the 12th house in the > classics is one of the the most sought after query by many now!! So > with changing times, everything changes except the love for change, > which keeps the curious ones busy. > Regards > SRS > --- On Fri, 20/2/09, Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@ hotmail.com> wrote: > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@ hotmail.com> > Modern Jyotish > > Friday, 20 February, 2009, 8:32 AM > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we have > > received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that > > survived. > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or empirical > > approach as it is called. > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared up > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory mercury > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun that > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, summarily > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if other > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > character! > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, about > > things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline or > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or > > think! > > RR > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger. > / invite/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2009 Report Share Posted February 24, 2009 Dear Sir, In your posting, different people will see different things and hopefully learn from and go home satisfied with what they learned from what was within already but the posting allowed one to express and bring it out -- and that is what I call Rorschack posting or Thematic Apperception Posting!! Very good! Even if your intention may not have been so or deliberately so, anyway :-) The pretty much across the board pronouncement in ancient jyotish literature about life abroad being a torture, disgrace and hardship, a harbinger of bad times was a desh-kaal-paristhiti thing I suppose. While mental and astral travel may have been child's play back then for Rishis, most of the regular people had access to only slow modes of travel! That is why no one lived in suburbs then but everyone lived downtown (no disrespect intended but was just a satire on modern living! At least in Americas). As mode of travel became easier and faster (irrespective of increasing frequency of lost luggage and in some sad instances planes lost in mid-air) travel has become a lot easier. Yes discrimination and job and language issues are big hurdles and so on, but it is less of a torture on the whole. Mind you, perhaps a larger proportion of people do find a loss in terms of position and respect etc when they move abroad but there are other gains. In general and this is not something I have rigorously surveyed -- 2nd generation immigrants (kids whose parents moved abroad and the kids were born and raised here) depending on the country etc do tend to have better lives than their parents with unusual accents do. I do not want to make it melodramatic by flaunting the poster children of immigration (Schwarzneger and OBama) but there are numerous examples if one were to look. Also there are failure stories, some vividly depicted in movies that may not be real but do capture reality -- and I do not mean the reality of Slumdog Millionnaire! Perhaps each person who is unmarried and dying to go abroad as we all have seen requests from reading seekers must examine their fifth houses! Perhaps that is where lies the secret of their ultimate success abroad or sense of accomplishment! And it would be so much more unselfish to say, " I moved abroad because my children will have a better life! " . Please understand that this used to be the " party line " for many immigrants and in many cases honest statements (based on anecdotal observations of radio and TV shows and casual conversations!) made by the survey participants! But please take it " case-by-case " . As to yogas and so on -- while wisely stated, the 'shy Indian bride " as KNR calls navamsha -- standing next to the bridegroom (rashi kundali) but not uttering one word -- I personally think or have observed is that the icon of " children must be seen but not heard! " are the awasthas. Even Parashara chose not to discuss them almost until he reached the middle of Brihat Parashara Hora Shastra! How interesting!! Rohiniranjan , RAMA SUBRAMANIAN <srs81520 wrote: > > RRJi, >         That reminds me of an old Tamil adage " Neither can you stamp on it as a mere rope, nor dread as a poisonous snake and beat with a stick " But using KSY as a red herring for all evils is not acceptable any more.Moreover, there are many common yogas which are extolled in the classics, but rarely work in practise viz..Gajakesari, Budha Aditya, Sashi Mangala, Anabha, Sunabha, Khemadruma, Vasi, Vesi, Ubhayachari and duryogas like Kendradhipathya dosha, KSY, Papa kartari, Guru chandala & many more.While the yogas in a chart are easily identified, enough care is not taken to analyse the ' yoga bhanghas'. > A 'profession in a foreign land' codemned to the 12th house in the classics is one of the the most sought after query by many now!! So with changing times, everything changes except the love for change, which keeps the curious ones busy. > Regards > SRS > --- On Fri, 20/2/09, Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan > Modern Jyotish > > Friday, 20 February, 2009, 8:32 AM > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we have > > received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that > > survived. > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or empirical > > approach as it is called. > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared up > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory mercury > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun that > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, summarily > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if other > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > character! > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, about > > things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline or > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or > > think! > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger./invite/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 28, 2009 Report Share Posted February 28, 2009                 Dear RRJi,                   Thanks for your take on ‘Videsh jeevan’ vis a vis the 12th house. My observation was mainly to bring out the “changes in perceptions†w.r.t. changing times and the Jyothishi’s compulsions to adapt with time, with out compromising on quality of his output. I entirely agree with the view that the quality of life in foreign soil or anywhere depends on ‘poorva punya’. But, was it the ‘rigors of travel’ combined with lack of faster modes of transport the only criteria for consigning ‘videsh living’ to the 12th? Then what about equally strenuous exercise like ‘Theertha yatra ‘ to holy places and holy dips in sacred waters assigned to the elevated dharma sthana, the 9th? Or the short travels on professional pursuits invariably referred to the 3rd? Then we have ‘chara rashis’, Moon, Watery signs (One may ask why not airy signs as sea travels theses days are few and far between!) and even Sakata yoga of 6/8 position of Jupiter with Moon are to be considered. With due respect, I feel, it is the purpose and the spirit behind the activity which decides the issue. All these boils down to the fact that happiness is not about chasing pots of gold at the end of rainbows in this world of Maaya, . In the ‘war of virtues’,  kaama loses to Artha , dharma lose out to both and moksha ends up losing even it’s deposit!I may sound cynic, but that is generally the reality.RegardsSRS  --- On Wed, 25/2/09, Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan Re: Modern Jyotish Wednesday, 25 February, 2009, 7:16 AM Dear Sir, In your posting, different people will see different things and hopefully learn from and go home satisfied with what they learned from what was within already but the posting allowed one to express and bring it out -- and that is what I call Rorschack posting or Thematic Apperception Posting!! Very good! Even if your intention may not have been so or deliberately so, anyway :-) The pretty much across the board pronouncement in ancient jyotish literature about life abroad being a torture, disgrace and hardship, a harbinger of bad times was a desh-kaal-paristhit i thing I suppose. While mental and astral travel may have been child's play back then for Rishis, most of the regular people had access to only slow modes of travel! That is why no one lived in suburbs then but everyone lived downtown (no disrespect intended but was just a satire on modern living! At least in Americas). As mode of travel became easier and faster (irrespective of increasing frequency of lost luggage and in some sad instances planes lost in mid-air) travel has become a lot easier. Yes discrimination and job and language issues are big hurdles and so on, but it is less of a torture on the whole. Mind you, perhaps a larger proportion of people do find a loss in terms of position and respect etc when they move abroad but there are other gains. In general and this is not something I have rigorously surveyed -- 2nd generation immigrants (kids whose parents moved abroad and the kids were born and raised here) depending on the country etc do tend to have better lives than their parents with unusual accents do. I do not want to make it melodramatic by flaunting the poster children of immigration (Schwarzneger and OBama) but there are numerous examples if one were to look. Also there are failure stories, some vividly depicted in movies that may not be real but do capture reality -- and I do not mean the reality of Slumdog Millionnaire! Perhaps each person who is unmarried and dying to go abroad as we all have seen requests from reading seekers must examine their fifth houses! Perhaps that is where lies the secret of their ultimate success abroad or sense of accomplishment! And it would be so much more unselfish to say, " I moved abroad because my children will have a better life! " . Please understand that this used to be the " party line " for many immigrants and in many cases honest statements (based on anecdotal observations of radio and TV shows and casual conversations! ) made by the survey participants! But please take it " case-by-case " . As to yogas and so on -- while wisely stated, the 'shy Indian bride " as KNR calls navamsha -- standing next to the bridegroom (rashi kundali) but not uttering one word -- I personally think or have observed is that the icon of " children must be seen but not heard! " are the awasthas. Even Parashara chose not to discuss them almost until he reached the middle of Brihat Parashara Hora Shastra! How interesting! ! Rohiniranjan , RAMA SUBRAMANIAN <srs81520@.. .> wrote: > > RRJi, >         That reminds me of an old Tamil adage " Neither can you stamp on it as a mere rope, nor dread as a poisonous snake and beat with a stick " But using KSY as a red herring for all evils is not acceptable any more.Moreover, there are many common yogas which are extolled in the classics, but rarely work in practise viz..Gajakesari, Budha Aditya, Sashi Mangala, Anabha, Sunabha, Khemadruma, Vasi, Vesi, Ubhayachari and duryogas like Kendradhipathya dosha, KSY, Papa kartari, Guru chandala & many more.While the yogas in a chart are easily identified, enough care is not taken to analyse the ' yoga bhanghas'. > A 'profession in a foreign land' codemned to the 12th house in the classics is one of the the most sought after query by many now!! So with changing times, everything changes except the love for change, which keeps the curious ones busy. > Regards > SRS > --- On Fri, 20/2/09, Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@ ...> wrote: > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@ ...> > Modern Jyotish > > Friday, 20 February, 2009, 8:32 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > is at the crossroads of classical and pragmatic. > > > > Not everything that is in the classics works. Not everything that > > works need be found in the fragmentary classical jyotish that we have > > received or retained and some of that may not even be entirely > > original as I have expressed in an article on astrotreasures that > > survived. > > > > So this debate is perhaps not flawless. > > > > A balanced approach would indicate cautious observation or empirical > > approach as it is called. > > > > Polarity would only create pockets and silos of bias, now flared up > > by emotions and as we know, when moon rises in 'full' glory mercury > > is eclipsed as too are jupiter and other planets (except for sun that > > goes to bed when the full moon rises!). > > > > Rather than toss the babies of KSY and Saturn's influences, summarily > > or hastily out with the bathwater, I would like to use these very > > obvious markers as 'alerts' and not subpoenas! Once spotted, if other > > mal-factors too are present then caution would not be out of > > character! > > > > No point in getting all worked up and emotional, pro or contra, about > > things astrological because we do not have a complete discipline or > > body of knowledge available, despite what some great ones say or > > think! > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger. / invite/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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