Guest guest Posted December 7, 2008 Report Share Posted December 7, 2008 Dear Pandit Arjun ji, If horoscope matching is done only for orthodox family then, does it mean that almost 90% people who are from low level need not need a horoscope match. As i understood from all the lessons i came across, the impact of the planets are equal for king as well as the farmer. Each may be having a poorva punya as well as a shaabha according to their past life. So if there is a kuja dosha in a person, no matter who he is (an orthodox or a unorthodox) he will suffer for that kujadosha in his life. This is just my understanding. please correct me if i am wrong. Is there any twisted meaning in what you have told. I mean you would not have written this mail simply. You must be having some reference. So according to that is there any special reason, why an orthodox persons horoscope should be matched for marriage. Other than this i am more interested to know the second part of this..... why the other 7 types are not considered while they are also getting affected by this. {Note : I am not expecting a reply for this....... I had an important time in my life, a time to take an important decision(Marriage). I was in a confusion regarding horoscope matching. I asked for reference and help in this forum. Since i am not sitting under a roof and learning astrology with them, people never considered me as an astrology student. Well i can understand you guys. You dont want to make this forum a mess....... But we all have life and our life has no CTRL+Z. Hope you guys always keep this in mind.....HATS OFF} Prasad.S.S --- On Sun, 12/7/08, panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004 wrote: panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004 [vedic astrology] horoscopes matching for marriage vedic astrology Sunday, December 7, 2008, 2:50 PM dear friends most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of the boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from one region to another. however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there are eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, asura, gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching is done only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox traditional arranged marriage. in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does not arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the horoscopes do not match. with best wishes and blessings pandit arjun www.rudraksharemedy .com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2008 Report Share Posted December 7, 2008 Panditji, In my ant's view what has gone amiss is the overreliance on kootas (8 and 10). I think many jyotishis took the western term, " syn-astry " too literally and ran with it! Western astrologers on the other hand, took planets other than the 'lights' into consideration but were using a different 'starry background' for that consideration. How many jyotishis when doing a melapak actually look at the relevant indicators such as navamsha, lagnesh, saptamesh, AK, DK, P12, P7, P1, Venus, Mars, L1, L7; their dispositors, dasas, syn-yogas and more...? Present *company* on this erudite forum excepted, of course... Rohiniranjan vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > dear friends > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of the > boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from one > region to another. > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there are > eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, asura, > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching is done > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox traditional > arranged marriage. > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does not > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the horoscopes > do not match. > > with best wishes and blessings > pandit arjun > www.rudraksharemedy.com > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2008 Report Share Posted December 7, 2008 Hmm...! I was curious and did press CTRL and Z and nothing happened or occurred! Please explain...! Rohiniranjan vedic astrology , pra sad <prassad_ss wrote: > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji, > If horoscope matching is done only for orthodox family then, does it mean that almost 90% people who are from low level need not need a horoscope match. As i understood from all the lessons i came across, the impact of the planets are equal for king as well as the farmer. Each may be having a poorva punya as well as a shaabha according to their past life. So if there is a kuja dosha in a person, no matter who he is (an orthodox or a unorthodox) he will suffer for that kujadosha in his life. > This is just my understanding. please correct me if i am wrong. > Is there any twisted meaning in what you have told. I mean you would not have written this mail simply. You must be having some reference. So according to that is there any special reason, why an orthodox persons horoscope should be matched for marriage. > Other than this i am more interested to know the second part of this..... why the other 7 types are not considered while they are also getting affected by this. > > {Note : I am not expecting a reply for this....... I had an important time in my life, a time to take an important decision (Marriage). I was in a confusion regarding horoscope matching. I asked for reference and help in this forum. Since i am not sitting under a roof and learning astrology with them, people never considered me as an astrology student. Well i can understand you guys. You dont want to make this forum a mess....... But we all have life and our life has no CTRL+Z. Hope you guys always keep this in mind.....HATS OFF} > > Prasad.S.S > > --- On Sun, 12/7/08, panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004 > [vedic astrology] horoscopes matching for marriage > vedic astrology > Sunday, December 7, 2008, 2:50 PM dear friends > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of the > boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from one > region to another. > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there are > eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, asura, > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching is done > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox traditional > arranged marriage. > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does not > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the horoscopes > do not match. > > with best wishes and blessings > pandit arjun > www.rudraksharemedy .com > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2008 Report Share Posted December 7, 2008 dear friend your question may be split into two. first is the applicability of planetary influence to all humans alike and hence the necessity of matching horoscopes as a must before marriage. second is the happening of a marriage, performance of a marriage or getting married under this or that situation, notwithstanding the planetary influences. whether the horsocopes match or dont match, marriages under all these seven categories happen. the first part is for the believers and not for the scientists, rationalists, athiests and those having a blend of both east and west. the biggest influence of matchmaking in this category is that marriages are arranged by the parents and, if the horoscopes do not match as per the advice of the astrologer, the marriage proposal is declined even if the proposal seems the best on various parameters on face value. the second part has numerous occassions where the girl is obligated to marry a person in response to a favour done to her, the parents or the guardians perform the marriage as per their obligation or will, the person marrying simply gets her as a result of winning the girls parents and demand the girl (kings do get the queens of all those kingdoms who are won by them), the boy and girl notwithstanding age, caste and religion simply like each other and start livein as married, boy and girl not getting approval from parents get married in registered court or aryasamaj (oft termed as love marriage), the boy buys the girl with gifts or money or favours even if the girl is not interested, the boy rapes the girl and then marries to escape from punishment and other reasons where simply the marriage happens and not through matching the horoscopes. due to the kaliyuga lakshana, marriages arranged throughh traditional matchmaking are in minority and even in that minority, many matches performed after perfectly matched by best astrologers and tying the nuptial knot in the most auspicious muhurta of the year too got broken with divorce, separation or early widowhood due to untimely death of the spouse etc. in view of the above, my mail was throwing light on the utility or futility of matchmaking and am not throwing light on the applicability part at all which, of course, is same to all believers and disbelievers alike. with best wishes and blessings pandit arjun www.rudraksharemedy.com vedic astrology , pra sad <prassad_ss wrote: > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji, > If horoscope matching is done only for orthodox family then, does it mean that almost 90% people who are from low level need not need a horoscope match. As i understood from all the lessons i came across, the impact of the planets are equal for king as well as the farmer. Each may be having a poorva punya as well as a shaabha according to their past life. So if there is a kuja dosha in a person, no matter who he is (an orthodox or a unorthodox) he will suffer for that kujadosha in his life. > This is just my understanding. please correct me if i am wrong. > Is there any twisted meaning in what you have told. I mean you would not have written this mail simply. You must be having some reference. So according to that is there any special reason, why an orthodox persons horoscope should be matched for marriage. > Other than this i am more interested to know the second part of this..... why the other 7 types are not considered while they are also getting affected by this. > > {Note : I am not expecting a reply for this....... I had an important time in my life, a time to take an important decision (Marriage). I was in a confusion regarding horoscope matching. I asked for reference and help in this forum. Since i am not sitting under a roof and learning astrology with them, people never considered me as an astrology student. Well i can understand you guys. You dont want to make this forum a mess....... But we all have life and our life has no CTRL+Z. Hope you guys always keep this in mind.....HATS OFF} > > Prasad.S.S > > --- On Sun, 12/7/08, panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > panditarjun2004 <panditarjun2004 > [vedic astrology] horoscopes matching for marriage > vedic astrology > Sunday, December 7, 2008, 2:50 PM dear friends > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of the > boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from one > region to another. > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there are > eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, asura, > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching is done > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox traditional > arranged marriage. > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does not > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the horoscopes > do not match. > > with best wishes and blessings > pandit arjun > www.rudraksharemedy .com > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2008 Report Share Posted December 7, 2008 dear RRji yes, here we are discussing the utility or applicability part of matching the horoscopes for the believers. you are correct about the various things to be considered in horoscope matching, as detailed in your mail. the old traditional family astrologers used to and do consider all these issues before giving their nod for getting married purely based on horoscopes. the significance of horoscope matching in this manner is that marriage is not performed if the horoscopes do not match. however, these days matchmaking is restricted to referring a table in a panchang or seeing the points in a software and to see the score of gunas and kootas etc. few astrologers check the chart, navamsha, kalatrakarakas venus and jupiter, mangaldosha etc. even after horoscopes are matched, the astrologer checks the running dasa, gochara and other time influencing factors and sometimes marriage is delayed if the timing is not conducive. i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves as manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik header and in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, they are happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear of the fiery mangal. with best wishes and blessings pandit arjun www.rudraksharemedy.com vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " <jyotish_vani wrote: > > Panditji, > > In my ant's view what has gone amiss is the overreliance on kootas (8 > and 10). I think many jyotishis took the western term, " syn-astry " > too literally and ran with it! > > Western astrologers on the other hand, took planets other than > the 'lights' into consideration but were using a different 'starry > background' for that consideration. > > How many jyotishis when doing a melapak actually look at the relevant > indicators such as navamsha, lagnesh, saptamesh, AK, DK, P12, P7, P1, > Venus, Mars, L1, L7; their dispositors, dasas, syn-yogas and more...? > > Present *company* on this erudite forum excepted, of course... > > Rohiniranjan > > > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > dear friends > > > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of the > > boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from one > > region to another. > > > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there are > > eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, > asura, > > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching is > done > > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox traditional > > arranged marriage. > > > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does not > > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the > horoscopes > > do not match. > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > pandit arjun > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2008 Report Share Posted December 7, 2008 Dear Arjunji, I hope you also get a chance to read my response at the Jyotish_remedies site where you reposted your message here that I responded to. I hope my response to you there goes beyond the tradtional and the *tired*! Rohiniranjan vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > dear RRji > > yes, here we are discussing the utility or applicability part of > matching the horoscopes for the believers. > > you are correct about the various things to be considered in > horoscope matching, as detailed in your mail. the old traditional > family astrologers used to and do consider all these issues before > giving their nod for getting married purely based on horoscopes. the > significance of horoscope matching in this manner is that marriage is > not performed if the horoscopes do not match. > > however, these days matchmaking is restricted to referring a table in > a panchang or seeing the points in a software and to see the score of > gunas and kootas etc. few astrologers check the chart, navamsha, > kalatrakarakas venus and jupiter, mangaldosha etc. even after > horoscopes are matched, the astrologer checks the running dasa, > gochara and other time influencing factors and sometimes marriage is > delayed if the timing is not conducive. > > i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their > astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves as > manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik header and > in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got > cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, they are > happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear of the > fiery mangal. > > with best wishes and blessings > pandit arjun > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Panditji, > > > > In my ant's view what has gone amiss is the overreliance on kootas > (8 > > and 10). I think many jyotishis took the western term, " syn- astry " > > too literally and ran with it! > > > > Western astrologers on the other hand, took planets other than > > the 'lights' into consideration but were using a different 'starry > > background' for that consideration. > > > > How many jyotishis when doing a melapak actually look at the > relevant > > indicators such as navamsha, lagnesh, saptamesh, AK, DK, P12, P7, > P1, > > Venus, Mars, L1, L7; their dispositors, dasas, syn-yogas and > more...? > > > > Present *company* on this erudite forum excepted, of course... > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > dear friends > > > > > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of > the > > > boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from > one > > > region to another. > > > > > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there are > > > eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, > > asura, > > > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > > > > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching is > > done > > > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox > traditional > > > arranged marriage. > > > > > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does not > > > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the > > horoscopes > > > do not match. > > > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > > pandit arjun > > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 8, 2008 Report Share Posted December 8, 2008 Arjunji, I would not repost my response to you here as well because then it would become same-o-same-old stuff. So on JR, my request to you (no tongue-in-cheek or posted with sarcasm or with cynicism or arrogance all of which I have been blamed wrongly earlier by high and low -- saying that just to clear the air all around!) is as follows: Please describe and Explain how the following modern conjugal scenarios would fit in those eight categories as described by Sage Manu: 1. Arranged marriage: With or without the occasional preamble where boy and girl are allowed to 'meet' under parental supervision! Or sometimes under slightly lesser 'guard' and with few percentage higher trust that the two will not misbehave and under the assumption that the parents would not either and spring a last minute surprise such as a car or scooter or yacht etc! I have had a personal experience of this in mid 70s when a very close friend of mine was getting married in Nagpur and while we friends (who were closer during the past five years to him than his dad because he lived in a hostel) were part of the very jovial ceremony we were very *obviously* eliminated from the " crucial " meeting when the dowry was being discussed and there were some problems. I have never seen my friend so upset and helpless ever! And we are not talking about some guy with no personal strength or no career ahead of him! And the heart-wrenching thing was that though arranged, he had really grown to like this girl and now their future was hanging on his father's whim! Everything turned out alright, but left a sour taste in this jyotishi's mouth! 2. A young man of indian origin, western raising with great education, carrer and many qualities but who is the sole responsible for carrying the family name (in Indian tradition). The only son, as you must have reckoned I am sure! Parents did not have a very good marriage, though stable (no divorce, just many fights!) and he has been cohabitating with a few prospective mates far too younger than him (increasingly so as he ages, gracefully!) and the indian relatives wait... No kids, by the way! 3. The young western woman who had more 'flings' that we would collectively have the fingers to count! She married once and while staying married and raising a few children realized that the 'husband' was permissive and really did not care much for her as long as she did not come in a dark bottle containing alcohol. Raised by an overcritical mother who raised her daughter to grow up feeling a " nothing " ended up raising one who felt 'nothing'. Many affairs later, many on cyber-reality, she was diagnosed to have Multiple Sclerosis. I have no clue what eventually happened to her but this was a long marriage that did not break. I know for sure that no 'melapak' or synastry was ever done for her and her long-lasting husband! 4. There are so many different variants that boggle the mind and alarm and hopefully *alert* some of us (people of my vintage at least -- baby boomer jyotishas!) who have a very narrow and circumscribed view of what marriage really is in this world of ours! It would make us halt or at least falter for a moment before we try to push the dough into the 6 or 7 or 8 or 10 fixed cookie-cutters and pretend that those are the only options or more importantly *realities* available! Human beings were sent to this reality to grow, expand and evolve and if we try to embark on growth with FIXED options, then we are just living up to the same VISION and mind-set that many chinese parents d to: Small feet are beautiful Tie the feet of daughters while their feet are small and STOP their growth! How much more UNBALANCED can one make others who depend upon one for their growth and development! Rohiniranjan Afterall , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > dear frineds > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of the boy > and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from one region > to another. > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there are eight > types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, asura, > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching is done > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox traditional > arranged marriage. > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does not > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the horsocopes > do not match. > > with best wishes and blessings > pandit arjun > www.rudraksharemedy.com > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 8, 2008 Report Share Posted December 8, 2008 Thanks! So quoting from your posting: " i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves as manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik header and in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, they are happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear of the fiery mangal. " Would you say that that is their " destiny " operating or 'free will'? Either way an important conclusion! Rohiniranjan vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > dear RRji > > yes, here we are discussing the utility or applicability part of > matching the horoscopes for the believers. > > you are correct about the various things to be considered in > horoscope matching, as detailed in your mail. the old traditional > family astrologers used to and do consider all these issues before > giving their nod for getting married purely based on horoscopes. the > significance of horoscope matching in this manner is that marriage is > not performed if the horoscopes do not match. > > however, these days matchmaking is restricted to referring a table in > a panchang or seeing the points in a software and to see the score of > gunas and kootas etc. few astrologers check the chart, navamsha, > kalatrakarakas venus and jupiter, mangaldosha etc. even after > horoscopes are matched, the astrologer checks the running dasa, > gochara and other time influencing factors and sometimes marriage is > delayed if the timing is not conducive. > > i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their > astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves as > manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik header and > in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got > cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, they are > happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear of the > fiery mangal. > > with best wishes and blessings > pandit arjun > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Panditji, > > > > In my ant's view what has gone amiss is the overreliance on kootas > (8 > > and 10). I think many jyotishis took the western term, " syn- astry " > > too literally and ran with it! > > > > Western astrologers on the other hand, took planets other than > > the 'lights' into consideration but were using a different 'starry > > background' for that consideration. > > > > How many jyotishis when doing a melapak actually look at the > relevant > > indicators such as navamsha, lagnesh, saptamesh, AK, DK, P12, P7, > P1, > > Venus, Mars, L1, L7; their dispositors, dasas, syn-yogas and > more...? > > > > Present *company* on this erudite forum excepted, of course... > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > dear friends > > > > > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of > the > > > boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from > one > > > region to another. > > > > > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there are > > > eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, > > asura, > > > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > > > > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching is > > done > > > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox > traditional > > > arranged marriage. > > > > > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does not > > > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the > > horoscopes > > > do not match. > > > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > > pandit arjun > > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 8, 2008 Report Share Posted December 8, 2008 dear RRji destiny is not restricting. freewill and fresh karmas bad or good in this life are to blame. nowhere in the world, people search for a partner purely based on ONE SINGLE PLANET. the ancient scriptures do not propagate the manglik dosha as such as feared out. ancient scriptures only detail individual results of mars giving negative results in 7th and 8th houses which are inauspicious. lagna, 4th and 12th are considered less negative. some astrologers add mars in 2nd house also as mangal dosha. so in all 1,2,4,7,8,12 (half of the houses) with mangal make these people come together as a special identity. many such manglik seeking manglik natives say that they give less consideration to caste, sect and language and give more weightage to manglik dosha. since we already discussed the numerous mangal dosha cancellation rules earlier, it is pertinent to note that these manglik dosha people search for partners only to check the presence of mangal dosha in the other chart. so, yes, horoscope matching is strictly adhered to by these mangliks. with best wishes and blessings pandit arjun www.rudraksharemedy.com vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " <jyotish_vani wrote: > > Thanks! > > So quoting from your posting: > " i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their > astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves as > manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik header and > in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got > cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, they are > happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear of the > fiery mangal. " > > > Would you say that that is their " destiny " operating or 'free will'? > > Either way an important conclusion! > > Rohiniranjan > > > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > dear RRji > > > > yes, here we are discussing the utility or applicability part of > > matching the horoscopes for the believers. > > > > you are correct about the various things to be considered in > > horoscope matching, as detailed in your mail. the old traditional > > family astrologers used to and do consider all these issues before > > giving their nod for getting married purely based on horoscopes. > the > > significance of horoscope matching in this manner is that marriage > is > > not performed if the horoscopes do not match. > > > > however, these days matchmaking is restricted to referring a table > in > > a panchang or seeing the points in a software and to see the score > of > > gunas and kootas etc. few astrologers check the chart, navamsha, > > kalatrakarakas venus and jupiter, mangaldosha etc. even after > > horoscopes are matched, the astrologer checks the running dasa, > > gochara and other time influencing factors and sometimes marriage > is > > delayed if the timing is not conducive. > > > > i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their > > astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves as > > manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik header > and > > in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got > > cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, they > are > > happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear of > the > > fiery mangal. > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > pandit arjun > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > > vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > Panditji, > > > > > > In my ant's view what has gone amiss is the overreliance on > kootas > > (8 > > > and 10). I think many jyotishis took the western term, " syn- > astry " > > > too literally and ran with it! > > > > > > Western astrologers on the other hand, took planets other than > > > the 'lights' into consideration but were using a > different 'starry > > > background' for that consideration. > > > > > > How many jyotishis when doing a melapak actually look at the > > relevant > > > indicators such as navamsha, lagnesh, saptamesh, AK, DK, P12, P7, > > P1, > > > Venus, Mars, L1, L7; their dispositors, dasas, syn-yogas and > > more...? > > > > > > Present *company* on this erudite forum excepted, of course... > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > dear friends > > > > > > > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of > > the > > > > boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from > > one > > > > region to another. > > > > > > > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there > are > > > > eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, > > > asura, > > > > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > > > > > > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching > is > > > done > > > > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox > > traditional > > > > arranged marriage. > > > > > > > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does > not > > > > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the > > > horoscopes > > > > do not match. > > > > > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > > > pandit arjun > > > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 8, 2008 Report Share Posted December 8, 2008 dear RRji your mails are positive and convey some messages which intelligent people understand. hence, as we all have been preaching, we shall react only when someone says that he is hurt by our message. otherwise whether our message conveys any hidden message, moral or sarcasm or advise etc., it is up to the native to deduce. the first example of yours fall under the first category " brahma " which was advised as the best by manu. the second and third examples of yours fall under " gandharva " . according to manu, the son born out of the brahma marriage, will free from the sins of himself and ten generations above and ten generations later. the same formula applies to seven generations in daiva marriage, six generations in prajapatya and three generations in arsha marriage. there are other illustrations which apply when a married couple under any eight way have no son and have only daughters. similarly there are principles which say what happens to those couples who do not get any child at all. but these look primitive and illogical in modern context. however, as you might have observed from my other response to the same thread, majority of the marriages are today happening in the seven categories other than brama marriage and within brahma marriage too, the success rate is not high. hence, believers in shastras (astro bibles) and smritis have many a cue to follow and we can only guide the natives what best they can do according to shastras, if they believe. cherry picking some shastras like bphs and trashing others as outdated is practiced by some. similarly trashing manusmriti and following other smritis is also selective application to suit the native. anyway, my objective of discussing this issue is to highlight the fact that the utility of matchmaking is only for believers who are in minority. with best wishes and blessings pandit arjun www.rudraksharemedy.com , " Rohiniranjan " <rohini_ranjan wrote: > > Arjunji, > > I would not repost my response to you here as well because then it > would become same-o-same-old stuff. > > So on JR, my request to you (no tongue-in-cheek or posted with > sarcasm or with cynicism or arrogance all of which I have been blamed > wrongly earlier by high and low -- saying that just to clear the air > all around!) is as follows: > > Please describe and Explain how the following modern conjugal > scenarios would fit in those eight categories as described by Sage > Manu: > > 1. Arranged marriage: With or without the occasional preamble where > boy and girl are allowed to 'meet' under parental supervision! Or > sometimes under slightly lesser 'guard' and with few percentage > higher trust that the two will not misbehave and under the assumption > that the parents would not either and spring a last minute surprise > such as a car or scooter or yacht etc! I have had a personal > experience of this in mid 70s when a very close friend of mine was > getting married in Nagpur and while we friends (who were closer > during the past five years to him than his dad because he lived in a > hostel) were part of the very jovial ceremony we were very > *obviously* eliminated from the " crucial " meeting when the dowry was > being discussed and there were some problems. I have never seen my > friend so upset and helpless ever! And we are not talking about some > guy with no personal strength or no career ahead of him! And the > heart-wrenching thing was that though arranged, he had really grown > to like this girl and now their future was hanging on his father's > whim! Everything turned out alright, but left a sour taste in this > jyotishi's mouth! > > 2. A young man of indian origin, western raising with great > education, carrer and many qualities but who is the sole responsible > for carrying the family name (in Indian tradition). The only son, as > you must have reckoned I am sure! Parents did not have a very good > marriage, though stable (no divorce, just many fights!) and he has > been cohabitating with a few prospective mates far too younger than > him (increasingly so as he ages, gracefully!) and the indian > relatives wait... No kids, by the way! > > 3. The young western woman who had more 'flings' that we would > collectively have the fingers to count! She married once and while > staying married and raising a few children realized that > the 'husband' was permissive and really did not care much for her as > long as she did not come in a dark bottle containing alcohol. Raised > by an overcritical mother who raised her daughter to grow up feeling > a " nothing " ended up raising one who felt 'nothing'. Many affairs > later, many on cyber-reality, she was diagnosed to have Multiple > Sclerosis. I have no clue what eventually happened to her but this > was a long marriage that did not break. I know for sure that > no 'melapak' or synastry was ever done for her and her long-lasting > husband! > > 4. There are so many different variants that boggle the mind and > alarm and hopefully *alert* some of us (people of my vintage at > least -- baby boomer jyotishas!) who have a very narrow and > circumscribed view of what marriage really is in this world of ours! > It would make us halt or at least falter for a moment before we try > to push the dough into the 6 or 7 or 8 or 10 fixed cookie-cutters and > pretend that those are the only options or more importantly > *realities* available! > > Human beings were sent to this reality to grow, expand and evolve and > if we try to embark on growth with FIXED options, then we are just > living up to the same VISION and mind-set that many chinese parents > d to: > > Small feet are beautiful > Tie the feet of daughters while their feet are small and STOP their > growth! > > How much more UNBALANCED can one make others who depend upon one for > their growth and development! > > Rohiniranjan > > Afterall , " panditarjun2004 " > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > dear frineds > > > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes of the > boy > > and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary from one > region > > to another. > > > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there are > eight > > types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, prajapatya, asura, > > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching is > done > > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox > traditional > > arranged marriage. > > > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does not > > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the > horsocopes > > do not match. > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > pandit arjun > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 8, 2008 Report Share Posted December 8, 2008 Arjun ji, I am one with you, as would any reasonable and sincere astrologer that it does not serve the nativity-client one bit if their request for horoscope compatibility be dismissed with just the melapak and mangal dosh and that too without paying attention to the nature of mars and its horoscope specific role. However the intersting and even intriguing thing I was pondering upon was that there are a fair number of individuals who actually get such cursory matching done and then go ahead and get married. In many cases in addition marriages are very planned and with a lot of rationality that goes into the decision, often in arranged marriages but not necessarily in all of those. So one wonders if in all of these well-planned, well-thought out alliances was destiny working a major role or free-will? As you perhaps recall, I have been of the thought that destiny and free will both play a role in our lives and not necessarily in equal proportions at a given moment or through out one's life. Hence we have the dashas that give us disha and gochar that keeps us moving. Sometimes the choreography fails and the crashed 'dancer' is then brought to some astrohospital or temple of God! RR vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " <panditarjun2004 wrote: > > dear RRji > > destiny is not restricting. freewill and fresh karmas bad or good in > this life are to blame. > > nowhere in the world, people search for a partner purely based on ONE > SINGLE PLANET. > > the ancient scriptures do not propagate the manglik dosha as such as > feared out. ancient scriptures only detail individual results of > mars giving negative results in 7th and 8th houses which are > inauspicious. lagna, 4th and 12th are considered less negative. some > astrologers add mars in 2nd house also as mangal dosha. so in all > 1,2,4,7,8,12 (half of the houses) with mangal make these people come > together as a special identity. many such manglik seeking manglik > natives say that they give less consideration to caste, sect and > language and give more weightage to manglik dosha. > > since we already discussed the numerous mangal dosha cancellation > rules earlier, it is pertinent to note that these manglik dosha > people search for partners only to check the presence of mangal dosha > in the other chart. > > so, yes, horoscope matching is strictly adhered to by these mangliks. > > with best wishes and blessings > pandit arjun > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Thanks! > > > > So quoting from your posting: > > " i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their > > astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves as > > manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik header > and > > in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got > > cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, they > are > > happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear of > the > > fiery mangal. " > > > > > > Would you say that that is their " destiny " operating or 'free will'? > > > > Either way an important conclusion! > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > dear RRji > > > > > > yes, here we are discussing the utility or applicability part of > > > matching the horoscopes for the believers. > > > > > > you are correct about the various things to be considered in > > > horoscope matching, as detailed in your mail. the old > traditional > > > family astrologers used to and do consider all these issues > before > > > giving their nod for getting married purely based on horoscopes. > > the > > > significance of horoscope matching in this manner is that > marriage > > is > > > not performed if the horoscopes do not match. > > > > > > however, these days matchmaking is restricted to referring a > table > > in > > > a panchang or seeing the points in a software and to see the > score > > of > > > gunas and kootas etc. few astrologers check the chart, navamsha, > > > kalatrakarakas venus and jupiter, mangaldosha etc. even after > > > horoscopes are matched, the astrologer checks the running dasa, > > > gochara and other time influencing factors and sometimes marriage > > is > > > delayed if the timing is not conducive. > > > > > > i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their > > > astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves > as > > > manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik header > > and > > > in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got > > > cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, they > > are > > > happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear of > > the > > > fiery mangal. > > > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > > pandit arjun > > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > > > > vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Panditji, > > > > > > > > In my ant's view what has gone amiss is the overreliance on > > kootas > > > (8 > > > > and 10). I think many jyotishis took the western term, " syn- > > astry " > > > > too literally and ran with it! > > > > > > > > Western astrologers on the other hand, took planets other than > > > > the 'lights' into consideration but were using a > > different 'starry > > > > background' for that consideration. > > > > > > > > How many jyotishis when doing a melapak actually look at the > > > relevant > > > > indicators such as navamsha, lagnesh, saptamesh, AK, DK, P12, > P7, > > > P1, > > > > Venus, Mars, L1, L7; their dispositors, dasas, syn-yogas and > > > more...? > > > > > > > > Present *company* on this erudite forum excepted, of course... > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > dear friends > > > > > > > > > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the horoscopes > of > > > the > > > > > boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary > from > > > one > > > > > region to another. > > > > > > > > > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, there > > are > > > > > eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, > prajapatya, > > > > asura, > > > > > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > > > > > > > > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope matching > > is > > > > done > > > > > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox > > > traditional > > > > > arranged marriage. > > > > > > > > > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching does > > not > > > > > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the > > > > horoscopes > > > > > do not match. > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 9, 2008 Report Share Posted December 9, 2008 dear RRji freewill which you are mentioning is something which the native superimposes over all other drivers notwithstanding the odds and sail against the wind with a strong freewill. a jihadi terrorist superimposes his freewill against sanity and consciousness and do it a negative opposite manner. doing fresh good and bad karmas with full knowledge, awareness and consciousness is not just because of destiny or fate or planetary influence. this karma theory makes natives enhance or negate positives and preclude or deterioriate negatives. slightly differing from the above law of karma with consicounsess, sometimes knowingly or unknowingly or out of immaturity or out of lack of foresight and wisdom, natives tend to earn the curses and wrath of gods, parents, gurus and sages. akin to the above, natives can do remedies, do prayers, do worships, do japams, do tapas, do service and do other pleasing acts and get blessings and boons. horoscope or the old audited karmic account statement as was on the date of birth gives a broad macro indication. just like the weather forecast of the meteorological department. in conclusion, yes, astrology is one of the tools or drivers to study the past, present and future. scientists with help from satellite images forecast weather eg. the indian met department forecasts weather for the next 24 hours whereas cnn gives a 5 day weather forecast. similarly astrologers with the help of horoscope images predict past, present and future and the length of forecast too varies like indian and cnn. with best wishes and blessings pandit arjun www.rudraksharemedy.com vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " <jyotish_vani wrote: > > Arjun ji, > > I am one with you, as would any reasonable and sincere astrologer > that it does not serve the nativity-client one bit if their request > for horoscope compatibility be dismissed with just the melapak and > mangal dosh and that too without paying attention to the nature of > mars and its horoscope specific role. > > However the intersting and even intriguing thing I was pondering upon > was that there are a fair number of individuals who actually get such > cursory matching done and then go ahead and get married. In many > cases in addition marriages are very planned and with a lot of > rationality that goes into the decision, often in arranged marriages > but not necessarily in all of those. > > So one wonders if in all of these well-planned, well-thought out > alliances was destiny working a major role or free-will? As you > perhaps recall, I have been of the thought that destiny and free will > both play a role in our lives and not necessarily in equal > proportions at a given moment or through out one's life. Hence we > have the dashas that give us disha and gochar that keeps us moving. > Sometimes the choreography fails and the crashed 'dancer' is then > brought to some astrohospital or temple of God! > > RR > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > dear RRji > > > > destiny is not restricting. freewill and fresh karmas bad or good > in > > this life are to blame. > > > > nowhere in the world, people search for a partner purely based on > ONE > > SINGLE PLANET. > > > > the ancient scriptures do not propagate the manglik dosha as such > as > > feared out. ancient scriptures only detail individual results of > > mars giving negative results in 7th and 8th houses which are > > inauspicious. lagna, 4th and 12th are considered less negative. > some > > astrologers add mars in 2nd house also as mangal dosha. so in all > > 1,2,4,7,8,12 (half of the houses) with mangal make these people > come > > together as a special identity. many such manglik seeking manglik > > natives say that they give less consideration to caste, sect and > > language and give more weightage to manglik dosha. > > > > since we already discussed the numerous mangal dosha cancellation > > rules earlier, it is pertinent to note that these manglik dosha > > people search for partners only to check the presence of mangal > dosha > > in the other chart. > > > > so, yes, horoscope matching is strictly adhered to by these > mangliks. > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > pandit arjun > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > > vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > So quoting from your posting: > > > " i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their > > > astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves > as > > > manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik header > > and > > > in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got > > > cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, they > > are > > > happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear of > > the > > > fiery mangal. " > > > > > > > > > Would you say that that is their " destiny " operating or 'free > will'? > > > > > > Either way an important conclusion! > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > dear RRji > > > > > > > > yes, here we are discussing the utility or applicability part > of > > > > matching the horoscopes for the believers. > > > > > > > > you are correct about the various things to be considered in > > > > horoscope matching, as detailed in your mail. the old > > traditional > > > > family astrologers used to and do consider all these issues > > before > > > > giving their nod for getting married purely based on > horoscopes. > > > the > > > > significance of horoscope matching in this manner is that > > marriage > > > is > > > > not performed if the horoscopes do not match. > > > > > > > > however, these days matchmaking is restricted to referring a > > table > > > in > > > > a panchang or seeing the points in a software and to see the > > score > > > of > > > > gunas and kootas etc. few astrologers check the chart, > navamsha, > > > > kalatrakarakas venus and jupiter, mangaldosha etc. even after > > > > horoscopes are matched, the astrologer checks the running dasa, > > > > gochara and other time influencing factors and sometimes > marriage > > > is > > > > delayed if the timing is not conducive. > > > > > > > > i have seen some natives under the incorrect advice by their > > > > astrologers or with their own understanding, branded themselves > > as > > > > manglik and advertise them for marriage only under manglik > header > > > and > > > > in many cases, they are not manglik and the mangal dosha got > > > > cancelled. even though they miss getting better proposals, > they > > > are > > > > happy to search someone under the same manglik label for fear > of > > > the > > > > fiery mangal. > > > > > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > > > pandit arjun > > > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > > > > > > vedic astrology , " Rohiniranjan " > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Panditji, > > > > > > > > > > In my ant's view what has gone amiss is the overreliance on > > > kootas > > > > (8 > > > > > and 10). I think many jyotishis took the western term, " syn- > > > astry " > > > > > too literally and ran with it! > > > > > > > > > > Western astrologers on the other hand, took planets other > than > > > > > the 'lights' into consideration but were using a > > > different 'starry > > > > > background' for that consideration. > > > > > > > > > > How many jyotishis when doing a melapak actually look at the > > > > relevant > > > > > indicators such as navamsha, lagnesh, saptamesh, AK, DK, P12, > > P7, > > > > P1, > > > > > Venus, Mars, L1, L7; their dispositors, dasas, syn-yogas and > > > > more...? > > > > > > > > > > Present *company* on this erudite forum excepted, of course... > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology , " panditarjun2004 " > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > dear friends > > > > > > > > > > > > most people lay too much emphasis on matching the > horoscopes > > of > > > > the > > > > > > boy and girl before marriage and the ways of matching vary > > from > > > > one > > > > > > region to another. > > > > > > > > > > > > however, members may note that according to manusmriti, > there > > > are > > > > > > eight types of marriage viz. brahma, daiva, arsha, > > prajapatya, > > > > > asura, > > > > > > gandharva, rakshasa and paisacha. > > > > > > > > > > > > out of all these eight types of marriages, horoscope > matching > > > is > > > > > done > > > > > > only in the first form viz. brahma which is the orthodox > > > > traditional > > > > > > arranged marriage. > > > > > > > > > > > > in all other seven forms of marriage, horoscope matching > does > > > not > > > > > > arise, for these seven types of marriage happen even if the > > > > > horoscopes > > > > > > do not match. > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes and blessings > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > www.rudraksharemedy.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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