please see this article posted in KPASTROLOGYGROUP by one Member

[Guest guest]

No body has ever tried to investigate as to what was the level of

information of sages about the Universe, who developed astrological

principles in primitive age and what procedure was adopted to

formulate various principles. Nowadays there are two groups. One

group is in the favour of astrology and argue that astrology is a

science (on the basis of astronomy). Whereas another group (mainly

scientist and others with scientific aptitude) opposes astrology

(predictive) mainly on the basis of failure of predictions.

 

It was/is never highlighted as to what procedure was adopted to

formulate various principles relating to Lordship, Friendship-enmity,

Exalted-debilitated, Aspect, Vinshottary periodicity etc. If we

analyse whole set of principles then following questions may be raised

 

1 What procedure was adopted to allot twelve signs among seven

planets (as Mars is lord of Aries, Scorpio etc.) ?

2 What procedure was adopted to decide that there is enmity and

friendship between some planets (as Sun and Saturn are enemy of each

other) ?

3 What procedure was adopted to decide various aspect (full, quarter

to full, half and quarter), (as planets have full aspect on seventh

house) ?

4 What procedure was adopted to decide that planets are exalted and

debilitated at some degree (as Sun is exalted at 10 deg. of Aries

sign) ?

5 What procedure was adopted to decide that most powerful and hub of

our solar system, Sun has 6 years vinshottary dasha whereas Venus (a

small planet) has 20 years ?

6 What procedure was adopted to allot various constellations between

nine planets with different vinshottary dasha ?

7 What procedure was adopted to decide order of days of a week

(Sunday, Monday etc.) ?

8 What procedure was adopted to decide fixed retrograde motion of

Rahu Ketu (3-11 minute-second per day)?

9 What procedure was adopted to decide that Rahu, Ketu are 180 deg.

apart?

10 What procedure was adopted to decide timings of eclipse ?

 

Thus there may be endless questions, with a final question as to

whether present form of astrology is correct? If some one gave

answers to these questions then he will realise that entire

astrological principles are totally based on wrong concept of

Universe.

 

 

In primitive age it was believed that Earth is in the centre of the

Universe and stationary (it is also believed in all religions).

Beside this it was also believed (you may read any old scriptures)

that Sun is nearer from the Earth, whereas Moon is beyond Sun. All

constellations are situated in between Mercury and Moon. You may be

surprised to know that all astrological principles are actually

fabricated around this concept.

 

At the time of formulating the astrological principles in early

Primitive age, it was the concept that every living being has

capacity to move, whereas lifeless thing cannot move. This religious

philosophy leads sages to classify all so-called planet (Sun, Moon,

Mars etc.) as super living being (Deities). In those days only sages

had social sanction to study religious scriptures. Thus after

prolonged observation of the sky they developed the skill to predict

solar and lunar eclipse, which was the result of so-called grabbing

the Sun and Moon by imaginary shadow planets Rahu and Ketu. They were

also able to predict the timing of eclipse and its duration. They

have devised an ingenious way to offer donations etc. to get them

free from the clutches of Rahu and Ketu, which is still being

followed. It was also religious concept that fate of everybody is pre-

decided according to their deeds. Thus in this situation, it was

common wisdom as to when sages were able to predict the fate of

deities like Sun and Moon then why they could not predict the fate of

King and so on. Thus procedure was devised to formulate various

astrological principles on the basis of the then knowledge of sages

based on scriptures and their celestial observation. These principles

were the key factors for deciding the fate. Procedure adopted to

formulate these principles was never percolated in the Indian society

due to illiteracy and hard barrier to learn such knowledge by other

castes. Subsequently these principles were spread to other

civilisation and later on developed as Western system.

 

 

At that time our sages were neither aware of Uranus, Neptune nor they

were aware that solar and lunar eclipses occurred due to presence of

Moon and shadow of Earth. That's why they have developed the concept

of Rahu and Ketu with retrograde motion of 3'11 " . It was mentioned in

the Grahlaghav that eclipse occurred when Rahu/Ketu came within 14

degree on Amavasya (dark night) or Puranmashi (full Moon). But nobody

will be able to answer that why there was no lunar eclipse when Sun,

Moon and Rahu were at 203.01, 23.01 and 34.43 degree respectively on

08-11-1984 (Rahu was within 11.42 degree) or when Sun, Moon and Ketu

were at 319.74, 139.74 and 150.26 degree respectively on 03-03-1988 (

Ketu was within 10.52 degree). Likewise I find that Solar eclipses

occurred even when difference between Moon and Rahu was more then

14°. Sun and Moon were at 94.24 deg., whereas Rahu was at 79.04 deg.

on 21-07-1982 (Rahu was 15.20 deg. away). Sun and Moon were at 76.49

deg., whereas Rahu was at 91.93 deg. on 02-07-2000 (Rahu was 15.14

deg. away).

 

To give a modern scientific colour to the astrology, you will also

find in many modern astrological books that eclipse occurred at the

intersection point of orbit of the Sun and Moon (though it was not

known to our sages and Rahu Ketu were created on the basis of myth).

Thus it is clear that at the time of full solar eclipse, when Moon

happens to be just over the Sun than Rahu must also be there. But As

per almanac Ketu was shown at 194 and 177 degree on 12-11-1985 and 3-

10-1986 (refer any almanac) respectively when there were full solar

eclipse and position of Sun/Moon were at 206 and 166 degree

respectively. You will agree that when there were full solar eclipses

then on these dates either Rahu or Ketu must be at 206 and 166 degree

respectively, because only then full solar eclipse may possible.

Whereas Ketu was being shown at 194 and 177 degrees in almanac. Thus

there was clear mistake of about 12 and 11 degrees respectively. All

horoscopes are defective in this light and due to this fundamental

positional variation, so called prediction is also effected. If you

want then I can give many more examples.

 

I fully support that astrology (predictive) is not a science but in

primitive age predictive astrology was a mixture of astronomy +

psychology + faith. Because astronomy is a science, psychology

(recently discovered and it was not known in primitive age) played an

important role in handling a person by the astrologer due to immense

faith over astrology+astrologer hence predictive astrology appears to

be correct due to combined effect of all three. You will also agree

with the above observation after going through my original

revolutionary research based book. Because if everything is pre-

decided as was contention of sages then why we may take pains, why we

may try to do some thing, because every thing will take place

according to pre-written destiny. Secondly, there is no question of

modifying that pre-written destiny, because if we try to change only

our fate, even then all attached happening will automatically change

creating a cascading effect, which in turn will change the pre-

written fate of every person. In another case, if destiny is not pre-

written or say pre-defined than it is not possible to detect it.

Because when every Tom, Dick and Harry are changing their destiny due

to worship, good deed etc. then destiny of every one will continue

remain under change. You will agree that astrology is totally based

on mathematical calculation regarding planets, whose transit is fixed

and can never and never be altered. Now when transit or birth chart

cannot be altered it means result of calculation or say prediction is

also fixed. Then how one may change his destiny (if it is ever

prewritten) by adopting some means like offering, ring, vastu etc.

because in that case, if you like to say, then future events will be

altered but how a calculation of planetary transit or linked

prediction can be changed, which is fixed due to birth chart or fixed

transit of planets?

 

Actually PREDICTIVE ASTROLOGY IS NOT A SCIENCE at all. Only astronomy

and psychology (discovered only in last 200 years) were used

unknowingly by our sages for some prediction and it appears correct.

 

Because modern technologies like computer, TV, Newspaper etc. are

being used to spread this myth in the cover up of science with vested

business interest. Hence our mind is filled up in childhood with the

notion that astrology is a science thus it requires a logical

approach to fight this sort of ignorance.

 

I my-self studying astrology since last 35 years and developed

softwares to anyhow conclude correct prediction. But if it is true at

one time then effect of same planetary combination is not true in

other case. It leads me to think afresh logically and systematically

over this subject and I find that Primitive concept (when astrology

was developed) requires full overhauling in view of modern scientific

astronomy, according to which primitive concept of Universe (basis of

astrology) has been totally changed.

 

After lot of research I wrote an original book on astrology " Jyotish -

Kitna sahi kitna galat " in Hindi (330 pages). This book contains the

detailed procedure adopted to formulate these principles on the basis

of the then knowledge about the Universe, which leads our sages to

formulate these principles. On demand from the reader this book was

also published in English with the title " Astrology a science or

myth " (450 pages). If you are interested to know more about the book

or description of various chapters then you may send direct email to

me.

 

My book has vital scientific information in this regard and readers

of the book are fully convinced that astrology (predictive) is bogus,

because procedure adopted to formulate principles was neither logical

nor based on correct information of Universe, solar system.

This original book is also being marketed in USA, UK etc. You may

find about it at many sites. But I am informing you some sites as

follows. I hope you will like to purchase any of the above book from

any book store of your city. If it is not available than you may also

write back to me.

 

http://www.rbookshop.com/unusual_subjects/a/astrology/astrology_812690

5565.htm

http://www.bokklubben.no/samboweb/produkt.do?produktid=1759836

http://www.book-25.co.uk/shop-

price/8126905565/astrology:_a_science_or_myth.html

http://www.randi.org/jr/2006-07/072106gentle.html

 

I think that till now you may rely on astrology but I will like to

request that you may please come forward and try to understand the

basic roots of astrology and I am sure that after reading my book you

may like to fight this ignorance by arming yourself with many solid

arguments as to how all astrological principles were formulated on

wrong footings instead of plainly refusing the astrology.

 

I will like to have your critical comments for further interaction on

my email sanatkumar_jain and do hope that you will also pass on

the contents of this blog to your friends who may also like to come

forward to save the future of youth and may like to contact me.

 

Thanks.

 

Still if you have a faith on astrology then why are you accepting

the challenge for one lakh Rs only and why don't you contact The

James Randi Educational Foundation who offeres a us $1000000 prize to

anyone who can demonstrate that astrology works. His e-mail is

jref and website is http://www.randi.org

 

However if you want to know something more after going through my

earlier blog or otherwise then you are free to contact me for further

interaction on my email

Sanatkumar_jain .

Ph. 0751-2626868

Thanks

sanat

[Guest guest]

This mail is full of rubbish talks written by a person who has done

no studies in our culture or Indian astrology, neither read any good

books or done scientific analysis of the findings or writings therein.

I am ready to face any challenge in astrology, if it comes from a

authentic source and if rewards stand commensurate to the efforts put

in, and also if it betters the cause of astrology.

 

Please forward my above lines to the writer of this Mail and

ask him to prove his authenticity and declaration of rewards

amount on a legal base, and come with the queries, instead of

maligning the name of astrology with all

hum bug mails as under. Ask him to forget about procedures,

why and how,but enjoy the fruits instead.I have the knife

to cut the fruits and offer him. But get the

fruits (Queries) first .

 

 

Bhaskar.

 

 

, " luv " <key2000 wrote:

>

> No body has ever tried to investigate as to what was the level of

> information of sages about the Universe, who developed astrological

> principles in primitive age and what procedure was adopted to

> formulate various principles. Nowadays there are two groups. One

> group is in the favour of astrology and argue that astrology is a

> science (on the basis of astronomy). Whereas another group (mainly

> scientist and others with scientific aptitude) opposes astrology

> (predictive) mainly on the basis of failure of predictions.

>

> It was/is never highlighted as to what procedure was adopted to

> formulate various principles relating to Lordship, Friendship-

enmity,

> Exalted-debilitated, Aspect, Vinshottary periodicity etc. If we

> analyse whole set of principles then following questions may be

raised

>

> 1 What procedure was adopted to allot twelve signs among seven

> planets (as Mars is lord of Aries, Scorpio etc.) ?

> 2 What procedure was adopted to decide that there is enmity and

> friendship between some planets (as Sun and Saturn are enemy of

each

> other) ?

> 3 What procedure was adopted to decide various aspect (full,

quarter

> to full, half and quarter), (as planets have full aspect on

seventh

> house) ?

> 4 What procedure was adopted to decide that planets are exalted and

> debilitated at some degree (as Sun is exalted at 10 deg. of Aries

> sign) ?

> 5 What procedure was adopted to decide that most powerful and hub

of

> our solar system, Sun has 6 years vinshottary dasha whereas Venus

(a

> small planet) has 20 years ?

> 6 What procedure was adopted to allot various constellations

between

> nine planets with different vinshottary dasha ?

> 7 What procedure was adopted to decide order of days of a week

> (Sunday, Monday etc.) ?

> 8 What procedure was adopted to decide fixed retrograde motion of

> Rahu Ketu (3-11 minute-second per day)?

> 9 What procedure was adopted to decide that Rahu, Ketu are 180 deg.

> apart?

> 10 What procedure was adopted to decide timings of eclipse ?

>

> Thus there may be endless questions, with a final question as to

> whether present form of astrology is correct? If some one gave

> answers to these questions then he will realise that entire

> astrological principles are totally based on wrong concept of

> Universe.

>

>

> In primitive age it was believed that Earth is in the centre of the

> Universe and stationary (it is also believed in all religions).

> Beside this it was also believed (you may read any old scriptures)

> that Sun is nearer from the Earth, whereas Moon is beyond Sun. All

> constellations are situated in between Mercury and Moon. You may be

> surprised to know that all astrological principles are actually

> fabricated around this concept.

>

> At the time of formulating the astrological principles in early

> Primitive age, it was the concept that every living being has

> capacity to move, whereas lifeless thing cannot move. This

religious

> philosophy leads sages to classify all so-called planet (Sun, Moon,

> Mars etc.) as super living being (Deities). In those days only

sages

> had social sanction to study religious scriptures. Thus after

> prolonged observation of the sky they developed the skill to

predict

> solar and lunar eclipse, which was the result of so-called grabbing

> the Sun and Moon by imaginary shadow planets Rahu and Ketu. They

were

> also able to predict the timing of eclipse and its duration. They

> have devised an ingenious way to offer donations etc. to get them

> free from the clutches of Rahu and Ketu, which is still being

> followed. It was also religious concept that fate of everybody is

pre-

> decided according to their deeds. Thus in this situation, it was

> common wisdom as to when sages were able to predict the fate of

> deities like Sun and Moon then why they could not predict the fate

of

> King and so on. Thus procedure was devised to formulate various

> astrological principles on the basis of the then knowledge of sages

> based on scriptures and their celestial observation. These

principles

> were the key factors for deciding the fate. Procedure adopted to

> formulate these principles was never percolated in the Indian

society

> due to illiteracy and hard barrier to learn such knowledge by other

> castes. Subsequently these principles were spread to other

> civilisation and later on developed as Western system.

>

>

> At that time our sages were neither aware of Uranus, Neptune nor

they

> were aware that solar and lunar eclipses occurred due to presence

of

> Moon and shadow of Earth. That's why they have developed the

concept

> of Rahu and Ketu with retrograde motion of 3'11 " . It was mentioned

in

> the Grahlaghav that eclipse occurred when Rahu/Ketu came within 14

> degree on Amavasya (dark night) or Puranmashi (full Moon). But

nobody

> will be able to answer that why there was no lunar eclipse when

Sun,

> Moon and Rahu were at 203.01, 23.01 and 34.43 degree respectively

on

> 08-11-1984 (Rahu was within 11.42 degree) or when Sun, Moon and

Ketu

> were at 319.74, 139.74 and 150.26 degree respectively on 03-03-1988

(

> Ketu was within 10.52 degree). Likewise I find that Solar eclipses

> occurred even when difference between Moon and Rahu was more then

> 14°. Sun and Moon were at 94.24 deg., whereas Rahu was at 79.04

deg.

> on 21-07-1982 (Rahu was 15.20 deg. away). Sun and Moon were at

76.49

> deg., whereas Rahu was at 91.93 deg. on 02-07-2000 (Rahu was 15.14

> deg. away).

>

> To give a modern scientific colour to the astrology, you will also

> find in many modern astrological books that eclipse occurred at the

> intersection point of orbit of the Sun and Moon (though it was not

> known to our sages and Rahu Ketu were created on the basis of

myth).

> Thus it is clear that at the time of full solar eclipse, when Moon

> happens to be just over the Sun than Rahu must also be there. But

As

> per almanac Ketu was shown at 194 and 177 degree on 12-11-1985 and

3-

> 10-1986 (refer any almanac) respectively when there were full solar

> eclipse and position of Sun/Moon were at 206 and 166 degree

> respectively. You will agree that when there were full solar

eclipses

> then on these dates either Rahu or Ketu must be at 206 and 166

degree

> respectively, because only then full solar eclipse may possible.

> Whereas Ketu was being shown at 194 and 177 degrees in almanac.

Thus

> there was clear mistake of about 12 and 11 degrees respectively.

All

> horoscopes are defective in this light and due to this fundamental

> positional variation, so called prediction is also effected. If you

> want then I can give many more examples.

>

> I fully support that astrology (predictive) is not a science but in

> primitive age predictive astrology was a mixture of astronomy +

> psychology + faith. Because astronomy is a science, psychology

> (recently discovered and it was not known in primitive age) played

an

> important role in handling a person by the astrologer due to

immense

> faith over astrology+astrologer hence predictive astrology appears

to

> be correct due to combined effect of all three. You will also agree

> with the above observation after going through my original

> revolutionary research based book. Because if everything is pre-

> decided as was contention of sages then why we may take pains, why

we

> may try to do some thing, because every thing will take place

> according to pre-written destiny. Secondly, there is no question of

> modifying that pre-written destiny, because if we try to change

only

> our fate, even then all attached happening will automatically

change

> creating a cascading effect, which in turn will change the pre-

> written fate of every person. In another case, if destiny is not

pre-

> written or say pre-defined than it is not possible to detect it.

> Because when every Tom, Dick and Harry are changing their destiny

due

> to worship, good deed etc. then destiny of every one will continue

> remain under change. You will agree that astrology is totally based

> on mathematical calculation regarding planets, whose transit is

fixed

> and can never and never be altered. Now when transit or birth chart

> cannot be altered it means result of calculation or say prediction

is

> also fixed. Then how one may change his destiny (if it is ever

> prewritten) by adopting some means like offering, ring, vastu etc.

> because in that case, if you like to say, then future events will

be

> altered but how a calculation of planetary transit or linked

> prediction can be changed, which is fixed due to birth chart or

fixed

> transit of planets?

>

> Actually PREDICTIVE ASTROLOGY IS NOT A SCIENCE at all. Only

astronomy

> and psychology (discovered only in last 200 years) were used

> unknowingly by our sages for some prediction and it appears correct.

>

> Because modern technologies like computer, TV, Newspaper etc. are

> being used to spread this myth in the cover up of science with

vested

> business interest. Hence our mind is filled up in childhood with

the

> notion that astrology is a science thus it requires a logical

> approach to fight this sort of ignorance.

>

> I my-self studying astrology since last 35 years and developed

> softwares to anyhow conclude correct prediction. But if it is true

at

> one time then effect of same planetary combination is not true in

> other case. It leads me to think afresh logically and

systematically

> over this subject and I find that Primitive concept (when astrology

> was developed) requires full overhauling in view of modern

scientific

> astronomy, according to which primitive concept of Universe (basis

of

> astrology) has been totally changed.

>

> After lot of research I wrote an original book on

astrology " Jyotish -

> Kitna sahi kitna galat " in Hindi (330 pages). This book contains

the

> detailed procedure adopted to formulate these principles on the

basis

> of the then knowledge about the Universe, which leads our sages to

> formulate these principles. On demand from the reader this book was

> also published in English with the title " Astrology a science or

> myth " (450 pages). If you are interested to know more about the

book

> or description of various chapters then you may send direct email

to

> me.

>

> My book has vital scientific information in this regard and readers

> of the book are fully convinced that astrology (predictive) is

bogus,

> because procedure adopted to formulate principles was neither

logical

> nor based on correct information of Universe, solar system.

> This original book is also being marketed in USA, UK etc. You may

> find about it at many sites. But I am informing you some sites as

> follows. I hope you will like to purchase any of the above book

from

> any book store of your city. If it is not available than you may

also

> write back to me.

>

>

http://www.rbookshop.com/unusual_subjects/a/astrology/astrology_812690

> 5565.htm

> http://www.bokklubben.no/samboweb/produkt.do?produktid=1759836

> http://www.book-25.co.uk/shop-

> price/8126905565/astrology:_a_science_or_myth.html

> http://www.randi.org/jr/2006-07/072106gentle.html

>

> I think that till now you may rely on astrology but I will like to

> request that you may please come forward and try to understand the

> basic roots of astrology and I am sure that after reading my book

you

> may like to fight this ignorance by arming yourself with many

solid

> arguments as to how all astrological principles were formulated on

> wrong footings instead of plainly refusing the astrology.

>

> I will like to have your critical comments for further interaction

on

> my email sanatkumar_jain@ and do hope that you will also pass on

> the contents of this blog to your friends who may also like to come

> forward to save the future of youth and may like to contact me.

>

> Thanks.

>

> Still if you have a faith on astrology then why are you accepting

> the challenge for one lakh Rs only and why don't you contact The

> James Randi Educational Foundation who offeres a us $1000000 prize

to

> anyone who can demonstrate that astrology works. His e-mail is

> jref@ and website is http://www.randi.org

>

> However if you want to know something more after going through my

> earlier blog or otherwise then you are free to contact me for

further

> interaction on my email

> Sanatkumar_jain@ .

> Ph. 0751-2626868

> Thanks

> sanat

>

[Guest guest]

Okay Now I understood.the mail was so long

that I had not read it fully, neither have i now.

I have read the last parts just now, and realised

that the person is not actually

interested in astrology or about it, but just

interested in making a Issue of a Non-issue

and trying to sell the same, through his book.

Why not write straight away a small profile on

his books and price and try to sell,instead of

going round about,I dont understand.

No harm in doing that.

If he is going to talk negative about astrology

on Astrological Forums and try to sell his book,

then he ie never going to succeed in selling a

single copy.

 

What a irony ? On one side we talk otherwise about

the sages, and on the othe side we are taking help

from these same Sages by sales campaingning about

a book on these Forums which run only by good

astrologers on the Forum who work

here due to the sound principles given by the Sages.

The author is now trying to gain hold and standing

on this ground which is existing due to the sages

and their gift of knowledge to us.

 

Not earned enough from the Non-believers ,

so now trying to tap the believers to earn

daily bread, by writing Hate treatises on

venerated sages ? Huh !!!

 

I better stand before a temple with a bowl

in my hand rather than denigrate any ancient

wise men like these. Earning money by spreading

hate about ancestors ? Huh !!! I better do a

Loaders job than to earn money like this.

 

Talking derogatory about Astrology and the Sages,

and trying to sell this talking on those Forums which

exist due to this Astrology and sages ??? Huh !!!

 

Sorry, but not a single Rupee or dollar

earnt this way, should be a source for our

daily bread.

 

Bhaskar.

 

 

, " Bhaskar "

<bhaskar_jyotish wrote:

>

> This mail is full of rubbish talks written by a person who has done

> no studies in our culture or Indian astrology, neither read any

good

> books or done scientific analysis of the findings or writings

therein.

> I am ready to face any challenge in astrology, if it comes from a

> authentic source and if rewards stand commensurate to the efforts

put

> in, and also if it betters the cause of astrology.

>

> Please forward my above lines to the writer of this Mail and

> ask him to prove his authenticity and declaration of rewards

> amount on a legal base, and come with the queries, instead of

> maligning the name of astrology with all

> hum bug mails as under. Ask him to forget about procedures,

> why and how,but enjoy the fruits instead.I have the knife

> to cut the fruits and offer him. But get the

> fruits (Queries) first .

>

>

> Bhaskar.

>

>

> , " luv " <key2000@> wrote:

> >

> > No body has ever tried to investigate as to what was the level of

> > information of sages about the Universe, who developed

astrological

> > principles in primitive age and what procedure was adopted to

> > formulate various principles. Nowadays there are two groups. One

> > group is in the favour of astrology and argue that astrology is a

> > science (on the basis of astronomy). Whereas another group

(mainly

> > scientist and others with scientific aptitude) opposes astrology

> > (predictive) mainly on the basis of failure of predictions.

> >

> > It was/is never highlighted as to what procedure was adopted to

> > formulate various principles relating to Lordship, Friendship-

> enmity,

> > Exalted-debilitated, Aspect, Vinshottary periodicity etc. If we

> > analyse whole set of principles then following questions may be

> raised

> >

> > 1 What procedure was adopted to allot twelve signs among seven

> > planets (as Mars is lord of Aries, Scorpio etc.) ?

> > 2 What procedure was adopted to decide that there is enmity and

> > friendship between some planets (as Sun and Saturn are enemy of

> each

> > other) ?

> > 3 What procedure was adopted to decide various aspect (full,

> quarter

> > to full, half and quarter), (as planets have full aspect on

> seventh

> > house) ?

> > 4 What procedure was adopted to decide that planets are exalted

and

> > debilitated at some degree (as Sun is exalted at 10 deg. of Aries

> > sign) ?

> > 5 What procedure was adopted to decide that most powerful and hub

> of

> > our solar system, Sun has 6 years vinshottary dasha whereas Venus

> (a

> > small planet) has 20 years ?

> > 6 What procedure was adopted to allot various constellations

> between

> > nine planets with different vinshottary dasha ?

> > 7 What procedure was adopted to decide order of days of a week

> > (Sunday, Monday etc.) ?

> > 8 What procedure was adopted to decide fixed retrograde motion of

> > Rahu Ketu (3-11 minute-second per day)?

> > 9 What procedure was adopted to decide that Rahu, Ketu are 180

deg.

> > apart?

> > 10 What procedure was adopted to decide timings of eclipse ?

> >

> > Thus there may be endless questions, with a final question as to

> > whether present form of astrology is correct? If some one gave

> > answers to these questions then he will realise that entire

> > astrological principles are totally based on wrong concept of

> > Universe.

> >

> >

> > In primitive age it was believed that Earth is in the centre of

the

> > Universe and stationary (it is also believed in all religions).

> > Beside this it was also believed (you may read any old

scriptures)

> > that Sun is nearer from the Earth, whereas Moon is beyond Sun.

All

> > constellations are situated in between Mercury and Moon. You may

be

> > surprised to know that all astrological principles are actually

> > fabricated around this concept.

> >

> > At the time of formulating the astrological principles in early

> > Primitive age, it was the concept that every living being has

> > capacity to move, whereas lifeless thing cannot move. This

> religious

> > philosophy leads sages to classify all so-called planet (Sun,

Moon,

> > Mars etc.) as super living being (Deities). In those days only

> sages

> > had social sanction to study religious scriptures. Thus after

> > prolonged observation of the sky they developed the skill to

> predict

> > solar and lunar eclipse, which was the result of so-called

grabbing

> > the Sun and Moon by imaginary shadow planets Rahu and Ketu. They

> were

> > also able to predict the timing of eclipse and its duration. They

> > have devised an ingenious way to offer donations etc. to get them

> > free from the clutches of Rahu and Ketu, which is still being

> > followed. It was also religious concept that fate of everybody is

> pre-

> > decided according to their deeds. Thus in this situation, it was

> > common wisdom as to when sages were able to predict the fate of

> > deities like Sun and Moon then why they could not predict the

fate

> of

> > King and so on. Thus procedure was devised to formulate various

> > astrological principles on the basis of the then knowledge of

sages

> > based on scriptures and their celestial observation. These

> principles

> > were the key factors for deciding the fate. Procedure adopted to

> > formulate these principles was never percolated in the Indian

> society

> > due to illiteracy and hard barrier to learn such knowledge by

other

> > castes. Subsequently these principles were spread to other

> > civilisation and later on developed as Western system.

> >

> >

> > At that time our sages were neither aware of Uranus, Neptune nor

> they

> > were aware that solar and lunar eclipses occurred due to presence

> of

> > Moon and shadow of Earth. That's why they have developed the

> concept

> > of Rahu and Ketu with retrograde motion of 3'11 " . It was

mentioned

> in

> > the Grahlaghav that eclipse occurred when Rahu/Ketu came within

14

> > degree on Amavasya (dark night) or Puranmashi (full Moon). But

> nobody

> > will be able to answer that why there was no lunar eclipse when

> Sun,

> > Moon and Rahu were at 203.01, 23.01 and 34.43 degree respectively

> on

> > 08-11-1984 (Rahu was within 11.42 degree) or when Sun, Moon and

> Ketu

> > were at 319.74, 139.74 and 150.26 degree respectively on 03-03-

1988

> (

> > Ketu was within 10.52 degree). Likewise I find that Solar

eclipses

> > occurred even when difference between Moon and Rahu was more then

> > 14°. Sun and Moon were at 94.24 deg., whereas Rahu was at 79.04

> deg.

> > on 21-07-1982 (Rahu was 15.20 deg. away). Sun and Moon were at

> 76.49

> > deg., whereas Rahu was at 91.93 deg. on 02-07-2000 (Rahu was

15.14

> > deg. away).

> >

> > To give a modern scientific colour to the astrology, you will

also

> > find in many modern astrological books that eclipse occurred at

the

> > intersection point of orbit of the Sun and Moon (though it was

not

> > known to our sages and Rahu Ketu were created on the basis of

> myth).

> > Thus it is clear that at the time of full solar eclipse, when

Moon

> > happens to be just over the Sun than Rahu must also be there. But

> As

> > per almanac Ketu was shown at 194 and 177 degree on 12-11-1985

and

> 3-

> > 10-1986 (refer any almanac) respectively when there were full

solar

> > eclipse and position of Sun/Moon were at 206 and 166 degree

> > respectively. You will agree that when there were full solar

> eclipses

> > then on these dates either Rahu or Ketu must be at 206 and 166

> degree

> > respectively, because only then full solar eclipse may possible.

> > Whereas Ketu was being shown at 194 and 177 degrees in almanac.

> Thus

> > there was clear mistake of about 12 and 11 degrees respectively.

> All

> > horoscopes are defective in this light and due to this

fundamental

> > positional variation, so called prediction is also effected. If

you

> > want then I can give many more examples.

> >

> > I fully support that astrology (predictive) is not a science but

in

> > primitive age predictive astrology was a mixture of astronomy +

> > psychology + faith. Because astronomy is a science, psychology

> > (recently discovered and it was not known in primitive age)

played

> an

> > important role in handling a person by the astrologer due to

> immense

> > faith over astrology+astrologer hence predictive astrology

appears

> to

> > be correct due to combined effect of all three. You will also

agree

> > with the above observation after going through my original

> > revolutionary research based book. Because if everything is pre-

> > decided as was contention of sages then why we may take pains,

why

> we

> > may try to do some thing, because every thing will take place

> > according to pre-written destiny. Secondly, there is no question

of

> > modifying that pre-written destiny, because if we try to change

> only

> > our fate, even then all attached happening will automatically

> change

> > creating a cascading effect, which in turn will change the pre-

> > written fate of every person. In another case, if destiny is not

> pre-

> > written or say pre-defined than it is not possible to detect it.

> > Because when every Tom, Dick and Harry are changing their destiny

> due

> > to worship, good deed etc. then destiny of every one will

continue

> > remain under change. You will agree that astrology is totally

based

> > on mathematical calculation regarding planets, whose transit is

> fixed

> > and can never and never be altered. Now when transit or birth

chart

> > cannot be altered it means result of calculation or say

prediction

> is

> > also fixed. Then how one may change his destiny (if it is ever

> > prewritten) by adopting some means like offering, ring, vastu

etc.

> > because in that case, if you like to say, then future events will

> be

> > altered but how a calculation of planetary transit or linked

> > prediction can be changed, which is fixed due to birth chart or

> fixed

> > transit of planets?

> >

> > Actually PREDICTIVE ASTROLOGY IS NOT A SCIENCE at all. Only

> astronomy

> > and psychology (discovered only in last 200 years) were used

> > unknowingly by our sages for some prediction and it appears

correct.

> >

> > Because modern technologies like computer, TV, Newspaper etc. are

> > being used to spread this myth in the cover up of science with

> vested

> > business interest. Hence our mind is filled up in childhood with

> the

> > notion that astrology is a science thus it requires a logical

> > approach to fight this sort of ignorance.

> >

> > I my-self studying astrology since last 35 years and developed

> > softwares to anyhow conclude correct prediction. But if it is

true

> at

> > one time then effect of same planetary combination is not true in

> > other case. It leads me to think afresh logically and

> systematically

> > over this subject and I find that Primitive concept (when

astrology

> > was developed) requires full overhauling in view of modern

> scientific

> > astronomy, according to which primitive concept of Universe

(basis

> of

> > astrology) has been totally changed.

> >

> > After lot of research I wrote an original book on

> astrology " Jyotish -

> > Kitna sahi kitna galat " in Hindi (330 pages). This book contains

> the

> > detailed procedure adopted to formulate these principles on the

> basis

> > of the then knowledge about the Universe, which leads our sages

to

> > formulate these principles. On demand from the reader this book

was

> > also published in English with the title " Astrology a science or

> > myth " (450 pages). If you are interested to know more about the

> book

> > or description of various chapters then you may send direct email

> to

> > me.

> >

> > My book has vital scientific information in this regard and

readers

> > of the book are fully convinced that astrology (predictive) is

> bogus,

> > because procedure adopted to formulate principles was neither

> logical

> > nor based on correct information of Universe, solar system.

> > This original book is also being marketed in USA, UK etc. You

may

> > find about it at many sites. But I am informing you some sites as

> > follows. I hope you will like to purchase any of the above book

> from

> > any book store of your city. If it is not available than you may

> also

> > write back to me.

> >

> >

>

http://www.rbookshop.com/unusual_subjects/a/astrology/astrology_812690

> > 5565.htm

> > http://www.bokklubben.no/samboweb/produkt.do?produktid=1759836

> > http://www.book-25.co.uk/shop-

> > price/8126905565/astrology:_a_science_or_myth.html

> > http://www.randi.org/jr/2006-07/072106gentle.html

> >

> > I think that till now you may rely on astrology but I will like

to

> > request that you may please come forward and try to understand

the

> > basic roots of astrology and I am sure that after reading my book

> you

> > may like to fight this ignorance by arming yourself with many

> solid

> > arguments as to how all astrological principles were formulated

on

> > wrong footings instead of plainly refusing the astrology.

> >

> > I will like to have your critical comments for further

interaction

> on

> > my email sanatkumar_jain@ and do hope that you will also pass on

> > the contents of this blog to your friends who may also like to

come

> > forward to save the future of youth and may like to contact me.

> >

> > Thanks.

> >

> > Still if you have a faith on astrology then why are you

accepting

> > the challenge for one lakh Rs only and why don't you contact The

> > James Randi Educational Foundation who offeres a us $1000000

prize

> to

> > anyone who can demonstrate that astrology works. His e-mail is

> > jref@ and website is http://www.randi.org

> >

> > However if you want to know something more after going through my

> > earlier blog or otherwise then you are free to contact me for

> further

> > interaction on my email

> > Sanatkumar_jain@ .

> > Ph. 0751-2626868

> > Thanks

> > sanat

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Bhaskarji,

The points raised in the mail still need to be

answered. It is interesting that the rationale for

most of these queries is still wanted.

 

rishi

--- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish wrote:

 

> This mail is full of rubbish talks written by a

> person who has done

> no studies in our culture or Indian astrology,

> neither read any good

> books or done scientific analysis of the findings or

> writings therein.

> I am ready to face any challenge in astrology, if it

> comes from a

> authentic source and if rewards stand commensurate

> to the efforts put

> in, and also if it betters the cause of astrology.

>

> Please forward my above lines to the writer of this

> Mail and

> ask him to prove his authenticity and declaration of

> rewards

> amount on a legal base, and come with the queries,

> instead of

> maligning the name of astrology with all

> hum bug mails as under. Ask him to forget about

> procedures,

> why and how,but enjoy the fruits instead.I have the

> knife

> to cut the fruits and offer him. But get the

> fruits (Queries) first .

>

>

> Bhaskar.

>

>

> , " luv "

> <key2000 wrote:

> >

> > No body has ever tried to investigate as to what

> was the level of

> > information of sages about the Universe, who

> developed astrological

> > principles in primitive age and what procedure was

> adopted to

> > formulate various principles. Nowadays there are

> two groups. One

> > group is in the favour of astrology and argue that

> astrology is a

> > science (on the basis of astronomy). Whereas

> another group (mainly

> > scientist and others with scientific aptitude)

> opposes astrology

> > (predictive) mainly on the basis of failure of

> predictions.

> >

> > It was/is never highlighted as to what procedure

> was adopted to

> > formulate various principles relating to Lordship,

> Friendship-

> enmity,

> > Exalted-debilitated, Aspect, Vinshottary

> periodicity etc. If we

> > analyse whole set of principles then following

> questions may be

> raised

> >

> > 1 What procedure was adopted to allot twelve signs

> among seven

> > planets (as Mars is lord of Aries, Scorpio etc.) ?

> > 2 What procedure was adopted to decide that there

> is enmity and

> > friendship between some planets (as Sun and Saturn

> are enemy of

> each

> > other) ?

> > 3 What procedure was adopted to decide various

> aspect (full,

> quarter

> > to full, half and quarter), (as planets have full

> aspect on

> seventh

> > house) ?

> > 4 What procedure was adopted to decide that

> planets are exalted and

> > debilitated at some degree (as Sun is exalted at

> 10 deg. of Aries

> > sign) ?

> > 5 What procedure was adopted to decide that most

> powerful and hub

> of

> > our solar system, Sun has 6 years vinshottary

> dasha whereas Venus

> (a

> > small planet) has 20 years ?

> > 6 What procedure was adopted to allot various

> constellations

> between

> > nine planets with different vinshottary dasha ?

> > 7 What procedure was adopted to decide order of

> days of a week

> > (Sunday, Monday etc.) ?

> > 8 What procedure was adopted to decide fixed

> retrograde motion of

> > Rahu Ketu (3-11 minute-second per day)?

> > 9 What procedure was adopted to decide that Rahu,

> Ketu are 180 deg.

> > apart?

> > 10 What procedure was adopted to decide timings of

> eclipse ?

> >

> > Thus there may be endless questions, with a final

> question as to

> > whether present form of astrology is correct? If

> some one gave

> > answers to these questions then he will realise

> that entire

> > astrological principles are totally based on wrong

> concept of

> > Universe.

> >

> >

> > In primitive age it was believed that Earth is in

> the centre of the

> > Universe and stationary (it is also believed in

> all religions).

> > Beside this it was also believed (you may read any

> old scriptures)

> > that Sun is nearer from the Earth, whereas Moon is

> beyond Sun. All

> > constellations are situated in between Mercury and

> Moon. You may be

> > surprised to know that all astrological principles

> are actually

> > fabricated around this concept.

> >

> > At the time of formulating the astrological

> principles in early

> > Primitive age, it was the concept that every

> living being has

> > capacity to move, whereas lifeless thing cannot

> move. This

> religious

> > philosophy leads sages to classify all so-called

> planet (Sun, Moon,

> > Mars etc.) as super living being (Deities). In

> those days only

> sages

> > had social sanction to study religious scriptures.

> Thus after

> > prolonged observation of the sky they developed

> the skill to

> predict

> > solar and lunar eclipse, which was the result of

> so-called grabbing

> > the Sun and Moon by imaginary shadow planets Rahu

> and Ketu. They

> were

> > also able to predict the timing of eclipse and its

> duration. They

> > have devised an ingenious way to offer donations

> etc. to get them

> > free from the clutches of Rahu and Ketu, which is

> still being

> > followed. It was also religious concept that fate

> of everybody is

> pre-

> > decided according to their deeds. Thus in this

> situation, it was

> > common wisdom as to when sages were able to

> predict the fate of

> > deities like Sun and Moon then why they could not

> predict the fate

> of

> > King and so on. Thus procedure was devised to

> formulate various

> > astrological principles on the basis of the then

> knowledge of sages

> > based on scriptures and their celestial

> observation. These

> principles

> > were the key factors for deciding the fate.

> Procedure adopted to

> > formulate these principles was never percolated in

> the Indian

> society

> > due to illiteracy and hard barrier to learn such

> knowledge by other

> > castes. Subsequently these principles were spread

> to other

> > civilisation and later on developed as Western

> system.

> >

> >

> > At that time our sages were neither aware of

> Uranus, Neptune nor

> they

> > were aware that solar and lunar eclipses occurred

> due to presence

> of

> > Moon and shadow of Earth. That's why they have

> developed the

> concept

> > of Rahu and Ketu with retrograde motion of 3'11 " .

> It was mentioned

> in

> > the Grahlaghav that eclipse occurred when

> Rahu/Ketu

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Rishiji,

 

What is the prize for answering all that. Any

attempt to do that would need good spare time

and good thought-over rationale and arguments

which could not be torn to shreds by the reader.

To do this one needs ample of spare time. And

if anyone is ready to pay the daily expenses at

the end of the day. then it is certainly worthwhile

answering those queries,which i agree are okay for

a novice, but not for a astrologer.

 

The answers can also be provided by a person who

has no other work to do,and can devote his time

to this for next few days. In fact I would

enjoy answering all those queries, but tell you

frankly they are senseless. because the author

is just trying to create sensationalism nothing else.

We too can create such sensationlism on various matters

on todays current affairs and ask for logic, which

none would be able to reply. But its a waste of time for

us, but good usage of time for the person who wants to

sell his book and his appointed sales persons.

 

Most of the statements written as I mentioned before

are useless, let them first prove what they have

mentioned, then if we find it

appropriate, we shall prove what astrology is.

 

As long as results are fortcoming it does not matter.

I have at least 50 VVIps from India who have been

predicted personally by me over various times, and

they have been given stunning predictions. They

are not fools to believe all this.They are also

not interested in what approach we are taking, or why

astrologer Calls Sun as Sun or gives 20 years

Dasha to venus or call Moola Nakshatra as Moola.

Same goes for others. We have to take a dinner

in a restaurant. Go and take the dinner.

Why to waste our time and others trying to

find out how this item was made and why one

ingredient was put and why not the other ?

What was the logic ?

What is the sense of all this talk.

Only those who want to sell their wares and appear in

limelight, or those who have enought time to waste would

enter into such type of discussions.

 

If theres a good prize at the end of the road,

I will put my presentation for the queries,

otherwise no sense.

 

BTW Nice to hear from you after ages.

 

best wishes,

Bhaskar.

 

 

 

 

, rishi shukla

<rishi_2000in wrote:

>

> Bhaskarji,

> The points raised in the mail still need to be

> answered. It is interesting that the rationale for

> most of these queries is still wanted.

>

> rishi

> --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish wrote:

>

> > This mail is full of rubbish talks written by a

> > person who has done

> > no studies in our culture or Indian astrology,

> > neither read any good

> > books or done scientific analysis of the findings or

> > writings therein.

> > I am ready to face any challenge in astrology, if it

> > comes from a

> > authentic source and if rewards stand commensurate

> > to the efforts put

> > in, and also if it betters the cause of astrology.

> >

> > Please forward my above lines to the writer of this

> > Mail and

> > ask him to prove his authenticity and declaration of

> > rewards

> > amount on a legal base, and come with the queries,

> > instead of

> > maligning the name of astrology with all

> > hum bug mails as under. Ask him to forget about

> > procedures,

> > why and how,but enjoy the fruits instead.I have the

> > knife

> > to cut the fruits and offer him. But get the

> > fruits (Queries) first .

> >

> >

> > Bhaskar.

> >

> >

> > , " luv "

> > <key2000@> wrote:

> > >

> > > No body has ever tried to investigate as to what

> > was the level of

> > > information of sages about the Universe, who

> > developed astrological

> > > principles in primitive age and what procedure was

> > adopted to

> > > formulate various principles. Nowadays there are

> > two groups. One

> > > group is in the favour of astrology and argue that

> > astrology is a

> > > science (on the basis of astronomy). Whereas

> > another group (mainly

> > > scientist and others with scientific aptitude)

> > opposes astrology

> > > (predictive) mainly on the basis of failure of

> > predictions.

> > >

> > > It was/is never highlighted as to what procedure

> > was adopted to

> > > formulate various principles relating to Lordship,

> > Friendship-

> > enmity,

> > > Exalted-debilitated, Aspect, Vinshottary

> > periodicity etc. If we

> > > analyse whole set of principles then following

> > questions may be

> > raised

> > >

> > > 1 What procedure was adopted to allot twelve signs

> > among seven

> > > planets (as Mars is lord of Aries, Scorpio etc.) ?

> > > 2 What procedure was adopted to decide that there

> > is enmity and

> > > friendship between some planets (as Sun and Saturn

> > are enemy of

> > each

> > > other) ?

> > > 3 What procedure was adopted to decide various

> > aspect (full,

> > quarter

> > > to full, half and quarter), (as planets have full

> > aspect on

> > seventh

> > > house) ?

> > > 4 What procedure was adopted to decide that

> > planets are exalted and

> > > debilitated at some degree (as Sun is exalted at

> > 10 deg. of Aries

> > > sign) ?

> > > 5 What procedure was adopted to decide that most

> > powerful and hub

> > of

> > > our solar system, Sun has 6 years vinshottary

> > dasha whereas Venus

> > (a

> > > small planet) has 20 years ?

> > > 6 What procedure was adopted to allot various

> > constellations

> > between

> > > nine planets with different vinshottary dasha ?

> > > 7 What procedure was adopted to decide order of

> > days of a week

> > > (Sunday, Monday etc.) ?

> > > 8 What procedure was adopted to decide fixed

> > retrograde motion of

> > > Rahu Ketu (3-11 minute-second per day)?

> > > 9 What procedure was adopted to decide that Rahu,

> > Ketu are 180 deg.

> > > apart?

> > > 10 What procedure was adopted to decide timings of

> > eclipse ?

> > >

> > > Thus there may be endless questions, with a final

> > question as to

> > > whether present form of astrology is correct? If

> > some one gave

> > > answers to these questions then he will realise

> > that entire

> > > astrological principles are totally based on wrong

> > concept of

> > > Universe.

> > >

> > >

> > > In primitive age it was believed that Earth is in

> > the centre of the

> > > Universe and stationary (it is also believed in

> > all religions).

> > > Beside this it was also believed (you may read any

> > old scriptures)

> > > that Sun is nearer from the Earth, whereas Moon is

> > beyond Sun. All

> > > constellations are situated in between Mercury and

> > Moon. You may be

> > > surprised to know that all astrological principles

> > are actually

> > > fabricated around this concept.

> > >

> > > At the time of formulating the astrological

> > principles in early

> > > Primitive age, it was the concept that every

> > living being has

> > > capacity to move, whereas lifeless thing cannot

> > move. This

> > religious

> > > philosophy leads sages to classify all so-called

> > planet (Sun, Moon,

> > > Mars etc.) as super living being (Deities). In

> > those days only

> > sages

> > > had social sanction to study religious scriptures.

> > Thus after

> > > prolonged observation of the sky they developed

> > the skill to

> > predict

> > > solar and lunar eclipse, which was the result of

> > so-called grabbing

> > > the Sun and Moon by imaginary shadow planets Rahu

> > and Ketu. They

> > were

> > > also able to predict the timing of eclipse and its

> > duration. They

> > > have devised an ingenious way to offer donations

> > etc. to get them

> > > free from the clutches of Rahu and Ketu, which is

> > still being

> > > followed. It was also religious concept that fate

> > of everybody is

> > pre-

> > > decided according to their deeds. Thus in this

> > situation, it was

> > > common wisdom as to when sages were able to

> > predict the fate of

> > > deities like Sun and Moon then why they could not

> > predict the fate

> > of

> > > King and so on. Thus procedure was devised to

> > formulate various

> > > astrological principles on the basis of the then

> > knowledge of sages

> > > based on scriptures and their celestial

> > observation. These

> > principles

> > > were the key factors for deciding the fate.

> > Procedure adopted to

> > > formulate these principles was never percolated in

> > the Indian

> > society

> > > due to illiteracy and hard barrier to learn such

> > knowledge by other

> > > castes. Subsequently these principles were spread

> > to other

> > > civilisation and later on developed as Western

> > system.

> > >

> > >

> > > At that time our sages were neither aware of

> > Uranus, Neptune nor

> > they

> > > were aware that solar and lunar eclipses occurred

> > due to presence

> > of

> > > Moon and shadow of Earth. That's why they have

> > developed the

> > concept

> > > of Rahu and Ketu with retrograde motion of 3'11 " .

> > It was mentioned

> > in

> > > the Grahlaghav that eclipse occurred when

> > Rahu/Ketu

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Bhaskarji,

I suppose Jyotish is the prize. The satisfaction of

understanding symbols of Jyotish is the prize,For it

is not sufficient that the predictions are true and

that individual astrologers can answer the individual

queries.

If we consider, Jyotish to be a consistent universal

set of principles then answers are required,even if

Jyotish is treated as divine revealation yet such

questions need to be addressed and debates encouraged.

While the applications of Jyotish are appreciated,

research in Jyotish is still imperative and research

has to be on fundamentals too not merely technical

innovations.

 

If Jyotish has to take its rightful place, it has to

be consistent with astronomical realities. It has

survived long only for this reason that its principles

have withstood the increasing knowledge base....

I, for one, will be glad to have some of these answers

even if it serves no practical purpose.

 

Thanks for your welcome,events beyond Jyotish have

been dominating life.

Rishi

--- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish wrote:

 

> Dear Rishiji,

>

> What is the prize for answering all that. Any

> attempt to do that would need good spare time

> and good thought-over rationale and arguments

> which could not be torn to shreds by the reader.

> To do this one needs ample of spare time. And

> if anyone is ready to pay the daily expenses at

> the end of the day. then it is certainly worthwhile

> answering those queries,which i agree are okay for

> a novice, but not for a astrologer.

>

> The answers can also be provided by a person who

> has no other work to do,and can devote his time

> to this for next few days. In fact I would

> enjoy answering all those queries, but tell you

> frankly they are senseless. because the author

> is just trying to create sensationalism nothing

> else.

> We too can create such sensationlism on various

> matters

> on todays current affairs and ask for logic, which

> none would be able to reply. But its a waste of time

> for

> us, but good usage of time for the person who wants

> to

> sell his book and his appointed sales persons.

>

> Most of the statements written as I mentioned before

>

> are useless, let them first prove what they have

> mentioned, then if we find it

> appropriate, we shall prove what astrology is.

>

> As long as results are fortcoming it does not

> matter.

> I have at least 50 VVIps from India who have been

> predicted personally by me over various times, and

> they have been given stunning predictions. They

> are not fools to believe all this.They are also

> not interested in what approach we are taking, or

> why

> astrologer Calls Sun as Sun or gives 20 years

> Dasha to venus or call Moola Nakshatra as Moola.

> Same goes for others. We have to take a dinner

> in a restaurant. Go and take the dinner.

> Why to waste our time and others trying to

> find out how this item was made and why one

> ingredient was put and why not the other ?

> What was the logic ?

> What is the sense of all this talk.

> Only those who want to sell their wares and appear

> in

> limelight, or those who have enought time to waste

> would

> enter into such type of discussions.

>

> If theres a good prize at the end of the road,

> I will put my presentation for the queries,

> otherwise no sense.

>

> BTW Nice to hear from you after ages.

>

> best wishes,

> Bhaskar.

>

>

>

>

> , rishi

> shukla

> <rishi_2000in wrote:

> >

> > Bhaskarji,

> > The points raised in the mail still need to be

> > answered. It is interesting that the rationale for

> > most of these queries is still wanted.

> >

> > rishi

> > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish wrote:

> >

> > > This mail is full of rubbish talks written by a

> > > person who has done

> > > no studies in our culture or Indian astrology,

> > > neither read any good

> > > books or done scientific analysis of the

> findings or

> > > writings therein.

> > > I am ready to face any challenge in astrology,

> if it

> > > comes from a

> > > authentic source and if rewards stand

> commensurate

> > > to the efforts put

> > > in, and also if it betters the cause of

> astrology.

> > >

> > > Please forward my above lines to the writer of

> this

> > > Mail and

> > > ask him to prove his authenticity and

> declaration of

> > > rewards

> > > amount on a legal base, and come with the

> queries,

> > > instead of

> > > maligning the name of astrology with all

> > > hum bug mails as under. Ask him to forget about

> > > procedures,

> > > why and how,but enjoy the fruits instead.I have

> the

> > > knife

> > > to cut the fruits and offer him. But get the

> > > fruits (Queries) first .

> > >

> > >

> > > Bhaskar.

> > >

> > >

> > > , " luv "

> > > <key2000@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > No body has ever tried to investigate as to

> what

> > > was the level of

> > > > information of sages about the Universe, who

> > > developed astrological

> > > > principles in primitive age and what procedure

> was

> > > adopted to

> > > > formulate various principles. Nowadays there

> are

> > > two groups. One

> > > > group is in the favour of astrology and argue

> that

> > > astrology is a

> > > > science (on the basis of astronomy). Whereas

> > > another group (mainly

> > > > scientist and others with scientific aptitude)

> > > opposes astrology

> > > > (predictive) mainly on the basis of failure of

> > > predictions.

> > > >

> > > > It was/is never highlighted as to what

> procedure

> > > was adopted to

> > > > formulate various principles relating to

> Lordship,

> > > Friendship-

> > > enmity,

> > > > Exalted-debilitated, Aspect, Vinshottary

> > > periodicity etc. If we

> > > > analyse whole set of principles then following

> > > questions may be

> > > raised

> > > >

> > > > 1 What procedure was adopted to allot twelve

> signs

> > > among seven

> > > > planets (as Mars is lord of Aries, Scorpio

> etc.) ?

> > > > 2 What procedure was adopted to decide that

> there

> > > is enmity and

> > > > friendship between some planets (as Sun and

> Saturn

> > > are enemy of

> > > each

> > > > other) ?

> > > > 3 What procedure was adopted to decide various

> > > aspect (full,

> > > quarter

> > > > to full, half and quarter), (as planets have

> full

> > > aspect on

> > > seventh

> > > > house) ?

> > > > 4 What procedure was adopted to decide that

> > > planets are exalted and

> > > > debilitated at some degree (as Sun is exalted

> at

> > > 10 deg. of Aries

> > > > sign) ?

> > > > 5 What procedure was adopted to decide that

> most

> > > powerful and hub

> > > of

> > > > our solar system, Sun has 6 years vinshottary

> > > dasha whereas Venus

> > > (a

> > > > small planet) has 20 years ?

> > > > 6 What procedure was adopted to allot various

> > > constellations

> > > between

> > > > nine planets with different vinshottary dasha

> ?

> > > > 7 What procedure was adopted to decide order

> of

> > > days of a week

> > > > (Sunday, Monday etc.) ?

> > > > 8 What procedure was adopted to decide fixed

>

=== message truncated ===

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Sir,

 

//I suppose Jyotish is the prize. The satisfaction of

> understanding symbols of Jyotish is the prize,//

 

That is there of course very true. For ones own

self and satisfaction some answers are necessary

though they may not be mandatory.One would like

to delve more into the search for some answers

but priorities in life,mainly economical stability

and sustenance requisites, makes

other matters take the lead, and one though

wishing ,cannot do much about it. At times

therefore one meets the short term targets

with respect to astrology, and once they are

met, he moves on to the other day to day

never ending targets, which never appear to

cease. Thus time passes,life moves on, we grow

older and remain with no time left on

hands toi do actual search which will

quech the thrirst of the soul.

 

 

//> If Jyotish has to take its rightful place, it has to

> be consistent with astronomical realities//

 

Agreed. Astronomical technical progress

and advanced systems of gazing and

gauging the sky, now give us the exact degrees

of Motions of the Planets to the seconds, which

is helpful for the astrologer any day, as

his tools are polished with this info.

Basic Astronomy should definitely be a inetgral

part of the syllabus for any budding astrologer.

Astronomy has a lot to offer to a good astrologer.

 

regards,

Bhaskar.

 

 

 

, rishi shukla

<rishi_2000in wrote:

>

> Bhaskarji,

> I suppose Jyotish is the prize. The satisfaction of

> understanding symbols of Jyotish is the prize,For it

> is not sufficient that the predictions are true and

> that individual astrologers can answer the individual

> queries.

> If we consider, Jyotish to be a consistent universal

> set of principles then answers are required,even if

> Jyotish is treated as divine revealation yet such

> questions need to be addressed and debates encouraged.

> While the applications of Jyotish are appreciated,

> research in Jyotish is still imperative and research

> has to be on fundamentals too not merely technical

> innovations.

>

> If Jyotish has to take its rightful place, it has to

> be consistent with astronomical realities. It has

> survived long only for this reason that its principles

> have withstood the increasing knowledge base....

> I, for one, will be glad to have some of these answers

> even if it serves no practical purpose.

>

> Thanks for your welcome,events beyond Jyotish have

> been dominating life.

> Rishi

> --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish wrote:

>

> > Dear Rishiji,

> >

> > What is the prize for answering all that. Any

> > attempt to do that would need good spare time

> > and good thought-over rationale and arguments

> > which could not be torn to shreds by the reader.

> > To do this one needs ample of spare time. And

> > if anyone is ready to pay the daily expenses at

> > the end of the day. then it is certainly worthwhile

> > answering those queries,which i agree are okay for

> > a novice, but not for a astrologer.

> >

> > The answers can also be provided by a person who

> > has no other work to do,and can devote his time

> > to this for next few days. In fact I would

> > enjoy answering all those queries, but tell you

> > frankly they are senseless. because the author

> > is just trying to create sensationalism nothing

> > else.

> > We too can create such sensationlism on various

> > matters

> > on todays current affairs and ask for logic, which

> > none would be able to reply. But its a waste of time

> > for

> > us, but good usage of time for the person who wants

> > to

> > sell his book and his appointed sales persons.

> >

> > Most of the statements written as I mentioned before

> >

> > are useless, let them first prove what they have

> > mentioned, then if we find it

> > appropriate, we shall prove what astrology is.

> >

> > As long as results are fortcoming it does not

> > matter.

> > I have at least 50 VVIps from India who have been

> > predicted personally by me over various times, and

> > they have been given stunning predictions. They

> > are not fools to believe all this.They are also

> > not interested in what approach we are taking, or

> > why

> > astrologer Calls Sun as Sun or gives 20 years

> > Dasha to venus or call Moola Nakshatra as Moola.

> > Same goes for others. We have to take a dinner

> > in a restaurant. Go and take the dinner.

> > Why to waste our time and others trying to

> > find out how this item was made and why one

> > ingredient was put and why not the other ?

> > What was the logic ?

> > What is the sense of all this talk.

> > Only those who want to sell their wares and appear

> > in

> > limelight, or those who have enought time to waste

> > would

> > enter into such type of discussions.

> >

> > If theres a good prize at the end of the road,

> > I will put my presentation for the queries,

> > otherwise no sense.

> >

> > BTW Nice to hear from you after ages.

> >

> > best wishes,

> > Bhaskar.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > , rishi

> > shukla

> > <rishi_2000in@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Bhaskarji,

> > > The points raised in the mail still need to be

> > > answered. It is interesting that the rationale for

> > > most of these queries is still wanted.

> > >

> > > rishi

> > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > This mail is full of rubbish talks written by a

> > > > person who has done

> > > > no studies in our culture or Indian astrology,

> > > > neither read any good

> > > > books or done scientific analysis of the

> > findings or

> > > > writings therein.

> > > > I am ready to face any challenge in astrology,

> > if it

> > > > comes from a

> > > > authentic source and if rewards stand

> > commensurate

> > > > to the efforts put

> > > > in, and also if it betters the cause of

> > astrology.

> > > >

> > > > Please forward my above lines to the writer of

> > this

> > > > Mail and

> > > > ask him to prove his authenticity and

> > declaration of

> > > > rewards

> > > > amount on a legal base, and come with the

> > queries,

> > > > instead of

> > > > maligning the name of astrology with all

> > > > hum bug mails as under. Ask him to forget about

> > > > procedures,

> > > > why and how,but enjoy the fruits instead.I have

> > the

> > > > knife

> > > > to cut the fruits and offer him. But get the

> > > > fruits (Queries) first .

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Bhaskar.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > , " luv "

> > > > <key2000@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > No body has ever tried to investigate as to

> > what

> > > > was the level of

> > > > > information of sages about the Universe, who

> > > > developed astrological

> > > > > principles in primitive age and what procedure

> > was

> > > > adopted to

> > > > > formulate various principles. Nowadays there

> > are

> > > > two groups. One

> > > > > group is in the favour of astrology and argue

> > that

> > > > astrology is a

> > > > > science (on the basis of astronomy). Whereas

> > > > another group (mainly

> > > > > scientist and others with scientific aptitude)

> > > > opposes astrology

> > > > > (predictive) mainly on the basis of failure of

> > > > predictions.

> > > > >

> > > > > It was/is never highlighted as to what

> > procedure

> > > > was adopted to

> > > > > formulate various principles relating to

> > Lordship,

> > > > Friendship-

> > > > enmity,

> > > > > Exalted-debilitated, Aspect, Vinshottary

> > > > periodicity etc. If we

> > > > > analyse whole set of principles then following

> > > > questions may be

> > > > raised

> > > > >

> > > > > 1 What procedure was adopted to allot twelve

> > signs

> > > > among seven

> > > > > planets (as Mars is lord of Aries, Scorpio

> > etc.) ?

> > > > > 2 What procedure was adopted to decide that

> > there

> > > > is enmity and

> > > > > friendship between some planets (as Sun and

> > Saturn

> > > > are enemy of

> > > > each

> > > > > other) ?

> > > > > 3 What procedure was adopted to decide various

> > > > aspect (full,

> > > > quarter

> > > > > to full, half and quarter), (as planets have

> > full

> > > > aspect on

> > > > seventh

> > > > > house) ?

> > > > > 4 What procedure was adopted to decide that

> > > > planets are exalted and

> > > > > debilitated at some degree (as Sun is exalted

> > at

> > > > 10 deg. of Aries

> > > > > sign) ?

> > > > > 5 What procedure was adopted to decide that

> > most

> > > > powerful and hub

> > > > of

> > > > > our solar system, Sun has 6 years vinshottary

> > > > dasha whereas Venus

> > > > (a

> > > > > small planet) has 20 years ?

> > > > > 6 What procedure was adopted to allot various

> > > > constellations

> > > > between

> > > > > nine planets with different vinshottary dasha

> > ?

> > > > > 7 What procedure was adopted to decide order

> > of

> > > > days of a week

> > > > > (Sunday, Monday etc.) ?

> > > > > 8 What procedure was adopted to decide fixed

> >

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

>

>

>