INTERESTING QUESTION CONTD.

[Guest guest]

The most important tenet of Jyotish to remember is that it is a divine science

that attempts to explain all the forces (material,mental,intellectual and above

all spiritual) that are likely to shape his life along with giving him the

understanding of his capacities to deal with these forces in terms of his

strengths and weaknesses and the times that will be favourable and unfavorable

for dealing with them. It is logical to conclude that a two natives with

identical time of birth and in identical circumstances should have no difference

in the aspects enumerated above. And yet there lives can turn out to be entirely

different.Why? This is because people tend to forget the other most FUNDAMENTAL

tenet of Jyotish that the free will given to him to deal with the matters

signified by the upachaya sthanas(Houses 3,6,10,11) will vary greatly from

native to native and the way he uses this free will, will in turn shape his

future destiny on path to spiritual evolution.

Best regards

Saumil Trivedi

[Guest guest]

Dear Saumil Bhai,

 

A very good observation indeed.

 

Yes why must we forget the progressive efforts of the both natives to

develop or remain a non progressive spectator in course of their lives,

where one of the natives may introspect and try to remove his inherent

flaws through the myriad of ways Pooja, Mantras, Japa, will power etc.

while the other native may just remain a vegetable in the hands of his

destiny not making any attempts to change.

 

The free will is certainly given to man, by the Creator, and everyone

has to use this and chalk out his priorities and make himself a better

person before he meets his abyss on this Earth in the human body. Here

people differ. Some may use the 3rd,6th, 10th and 11th houses for a

divine purpose while others may use this totally for materialistic

gains, thereby creating a difference in their life styles and consequent

habits and course of directions their lives would take.

 

best wishes,

 

Bhaskar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

, " trivedi_saumil "

<saumil.trivedi wrote:

>

> The most important tenet of Jyotish to remember is that it is a divine

science that attempts to explain all the forces

(material,mental,intellectual and above all spiritual) that are likely

to shape his life along with giving him the understanding of his

capacities to deal with these forces in terms of his strengths and

weaknesses and the times that will be favourable and unfavorable for

dealing with them. It is logical to conclude that a two natives with

identical time of birth and in identical circumstances should have no

difference in the aspects enumerated above. And yet there lives can turn

out to be entirely different.Why? This is because people tend to forget

the other most FUNDAMENTAL tenet of Jyotish that the free will given to

him to deal with the matters signified by the upachaya sthanas(Houses

3,6,10,11) will vary greatly from native to native and the way he uses

this free will, will in turn shape his future destiny on path to

spiritual evolution.

> Best regards

> Saumil Trivedi

>

[Guest guest]

Dear BhaskarjiMany thanks for your kind words.In this connection thinking further here are a few more thoughts on the subject.Besides the upachaya sthanas I feel the other most relevant  aspect to consider is Rahu and Ketu . From the perspective of one's

purpose in this life these two points are considered as one's Karmic suction force and the other Karmic distribution force in this lifetime. Now the interesting observation to be made is in the Navamasa  chart (considered in south as a must to be seen for native's prospects in this life)  the navamsa sign lords of Ketu(star lord of ashwini,magha and moola),  Moon(star lord of rohini,hasta and chitra) and Jupiter(star lord of punarvasu,vishakha and purvabhadrapada) are common being  mangal(mesh),shukra(vrishabh),budh(mithun) and chandara(karka).Similar is the case for Rahu,Surya and Shani.

Thus one can hyposthise that Ketu as a karmic suction force point brings the native with a mind that will be attracted to areas to which it relates in the kundli with the wisdom (Guru as a hard disc storage source of all the wisdom gained by the native in previous life cycles).The environment that he is born in and the intensity(a function of his will) with which he pursues these areas will make him evolve further in these areas by way of wisdom that transforms to having vivek(the capacity to discriminate, the ultimate being there is no duality) that he lives every moment to achieve nirvana. 

Going by the same logic Rahu as a karmic distribution point brings the native with the saturnian compulsion to settle accounts by way of paying debts(suffering,loss, separation.mental anguish,chronic disease) or to work out with pesevearance,hard work,endurance,patience,discipline,concentration and tenacity the matters of areas it relates to in the kundli to gain further insight in the matters retrieved by Shani from the hard disc storage of Guru. 

Now coming back to the subject of the interesting question the fundamental reason for lives being widely different for same time births at the same place, besides differing use of the will capacity can be the very fact that the hard disc drive storage of  Guru is storing different sets of data for the above natives and therefore their actions(karma) and hence the results (phala) are bound to be

 different for even persons born at the same time , same place even same parents.Further it could be the case that if one argues that both the natives have identical storage devices because they are running different softwares(will power used differently) the matters retrieved from the hard disc are going to be very different for the two natives. Hence their differing lives. 

Best regardsSaumil Trivedi

good observation indeed.

 

 

Yes why must we forget the progressive efforts of the both natives to

develop or remain a non progressive spectator in course of their lives,

where one of the natives may introspect and try to remove his inherent

flaws through the myriad of ways Pooja, Mantras, Japa, will power etc.

while the other native may just remain a vegetable in the hands of his

destiny not making any attempts to change.

 

The free will is certainly given to man, by the Creator, and everyone

has to use this and chalk out his priorities and make himself a better

person before he meets his abyss on this Earth in the human body. Here

people differ. Some may use the 3rd,6th, 10th and 11th houses for a

divine purpose while others may use this totally for materialistic

gains, thereby creating a difference in their life styles and consequent

habits and course of directions their lives would take.

 

best wishes,

 

Bhaskar.

 

, " trivedi_saumil "

<saumil.trivedi wrote:

>

> The most important tenet of Jyotish to remember is that it is a divine

science that attempts to explain all the forces

(material,mental,intellectual and above all spiritual) that are likely

to shape his life along with giving him the understanding of his

capacities to deal with these forces in terms of his strengths and

weaknesses and the times that will be favourable and unfavorable for

dealing with them. It is logical to conclude that a two natives with

identical time of birth and in identical circumstances should have no

difference in the aspects enumerated above. And yet there lives can turn

out to be entirely different.Why? This is because people tend to forget

the other most FUNDAMENTAL tenet of Jyotish that the free will given to

him to deal with the matters signified by the upachaya sthanas(Houses

3,6,10,11) will vary greatly from native to native and the way he uses

this free will, will in turn shape his future destiny on path to

spiritual evolution.

> Best regards

> Saumil Trivedi

>

 

 

 

 

-- Saumil Trivedi

[Guest guest]

Dear Saumil ji,I have read your posts with great interest and appreciation. Thank you for sharing.If we believe in life after life, and law of karma, we become a function of the peculiar ways in which we are embedded in time and how our memory crucibles resonate with the medley of little pieces we have collected over the years and beyond on which the INTER-BODY energy-exchange is carried in both wave-form and particle-form.

This inter-body exchange, in case of a nativity, would involve his nearest interactions with his surroundings (both biotic and abiotic) as well as the distant and infinite cosmos. The planets, may be indicating the same energy for many born at the same time, but each nativity is a unique refractive and reflective, as well as absorbing surface and the outcome of energy-exchange will then be individual-driven, rather than planet-driven.

Time of birth is one factor which segregates the nativities, but when there is a common time of birth, the birth conditions (family, environment, etc) have to be looked into, if we really find a birth in the same moment. It is like a fine tooth combing then, which we do not need when the births are apart.

Applying the tenet of desh-kaal-patra is most crucial. Some years back when infant mortality was high, a small affliction to 5H would be disastrous for childbirth. Now with better medical facilities, we see natives beget children with hugely malefic 5H. So there is a paradigm shift in results of the same planetary strengths. A person living in a village may die at the slightest disturbance in the transits, whereas one in the city would be saved despite the killer combinations in chart as well as the heavens.

Astrology is more holistic and planets are just a small part of the whole of astrology. That is why the shastras had shown the application of panchanga, nimitta, shakuna, parashna, hora, etc, etc. The use of ashtakvargas, jaimini karakas and dristies, varshphala etc, cannot be haphazard and each serves a special purpose. One can go on adding to this list of focals that we have to delve into various aspects to arrive at REAL conclusions and not fluke predictions.

Hope I have not overstepped. Just sharing some thoughts. Thank youRegardsNeelam

[Guest guest]

Dear NeelamjiIt is my pleasure to  think aloud on this forum and a further  privilege to receive well expressed views. I pray Lord Shiva grants you all the wisdom to fathom his LEELA.

God BlessSaumil TrivediOn Thu, May 7, 2009 at 12:34 PM, neelam gupta <neelamgupta07 wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Saumil ji,I have read your posts with great interest and appreciation. Thank you for sharing.If we believe in life after life, and law of karma, we become a function of the peculiar ways in which we are embedded in time and how our memory crucibles resonate with the medley of little pieces we have collected over the years and beyond on which the INTER-BODY energy-exchange is carried in both wave-form and particle-form.

This inter-body exchange, in case of a nativity, would involve his nearest interactions with his surroundings (both biotic and abiotic) as well as the distant and infinite cosmos. The planets, may be indicating the same energy for many born at the same time, but each nativity is a unique refractive and reflective, as well as absorbing surface and the outcome of energy-exchange will then be individual-driven, rather than planet-driven.

Time of birth is one factor which segregates the nativities, but when there is a common time of birth, the birth conditions (family, environment, etc) have to be looked into, if we really find a birth in the same moment. It is like a fine tooth combing then, which we do not need when the births are apart.

Applying the tenet of desh-kaal-patra is most crucial. Some years back when infant mortality was high, a small affliction to 5H would be disastrous for childbirth. Now with better medical facilities, we see natives beget children with hugely malefic 5H. So there is a paradigm shift in results of the same planetary strengths. A person living in a village may die at the slightest disturbance in the transits, whereas one in the city would be saved despite the killer combinations in chart as well as the heavens.

Astrology is more holistic and planets are just a small part of the whole of astrology. That is why the shastras had shown the application of panchanga, nimitta, shakuna, parashna, hora, etc, etc. The use of ashtakvargas, jaimini karakas and dristies, varshphala etc, cannot be haphazard and each serves a special purpose. One can go on adding to this list of focals that we have to delve into various aspects to arrive at REAL conclusions and not fluke predictions.

Hope I have not overstepped. Just sharing some thoughts. Thank youRegardsNeelam

 

 

 

-- Saumil Trivedi

[Guest guest]

Dear Saumil ji,It is my privilege to be sharing this platform with a knowledgeable person like you. I am just a speck in this LEELA and can't even wish to understand it. I am happy just being a part of it and playing my part in it. Thank you for your good wishes.

On the topic of free will, if I may share. I feel we are overloading a native’s free-WILL.When WILL comes into play, it becomes more of an individualistic approach and on-purpose dealing with situations. Here a native will utilise his WILL, driven by, of course, his samskaras and learning. In this category we can place the results of upchay sthans for WILLING to work and parabdh (9H) for WILLING to do remedies etc. as primary houses, for free-will to make a measurable difference in destiny.

Another situation is more of FREE-WHEELING of soul, I guess, of the native. His environment where he is born is one such issue. Two births at the same time may not be so different as per free will, but Being born in situations not under his direct control.

The former is easier to see and even read from a chart, as to how much elasticity if free-will a native has brought. But the later is more difficult to place in a chart. The chart of  rickshaw pullar and an Ambani can be sorted out only when seen in the light of free-wheeling of the soul, for which we have no way of judging.

Just an idea, if you wish to elaborate. Hope I've been able to put it across properly.RegardsNeelam