Jump to content
IndiaDivine.org

Why Disturb God's Plans ?

Rate this topic


Guest guest

Recommended Posts

When God plans to execute as per his blue print why disturb the same.

When God descended the first human, it is was clear that the beginning of the end had started, so why to say and do good things ?

Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

If one tries to know God as described in Gita, one will no doubt discover God as

the Truth of our Existence which is ONE with the Existence of all known and

unknown, sentients, insentients, manifest,

unmanifest. Once the real nature of God is understood, all questions will

evaporate in the light of such knowledge. Such questions arise from the

assumptions, beliefs based on our conditioning of what we have heard, read, and

are told by the society in which we grow up and live. Such beliefs are never

examined.

Upon investigation into nature of God with the grace of God, with help of a

realized Guru, or spiritual friend, or scripture such as Gita, one may discover

that God is not an entity with blue print for everything. God is name we give to

the EXPERIENCE of limitless AWARENESS and joy of just Being which is at the same

time Intelligence and total freedom. God is such freedom at every moment

that cannot be fixed in some distant past and now God is bound by it. Bondage is

only when we identify with our body-mind organism and act as separate

individuals. Look into our own experience of happiness when we say or do good

things, and unhappiness when we

do or say bad things. This is also enough to convince us to realize the truth of

GOd rather than assume such bondage in dispairs!

Namaskar, Pratap

 

-

 

All lives are programmed already and do according to their " nature " svabhav.

origin, operation and destruction are just manifest of the program objectives.

good and bad are perception of individual according to their nature " svabhav " .

God is truth which is not relative from one and another. In the same universe,

there are people who see truth in everything, and others who see conflict in

everything.

regards

Krishna Gopal

-

 

 

As per Gita, God is not a watchman. God has provided us the guiding principles,

but the free lies within us. It is up to us to do our part, our share. We

can't be irresponsible with the attitude

that the God will take care, etc.

Even the myth that if we do good work, then God will guarantee success, is

wrong.

Five factors determine the outcome of all actions (good or bad) as per Gita:

Timing, doer, tools, how tools are applied and fate/providence.

 

However, if we do good, ultimately we are better off (because as per Gita no

good deed goes to waste- even if there is no immediate gain). Likewise, even if

we have immediate success with evil,

God will make sure that they will keep coming back to inferior lives.

However, if we turn to God, God is happy to help. It is for our own welfare we

have to do good.

 

For example we send our kids to college, having brought them ane even paying

tuition. It is child's responsibility to take care of studies, home work,

safety, remain drug free, don't get pregnant or get someone pregnent etc.

 

 

K.S. tAtAchAr

 

-

 

nsk717

 

Narayana, Narayana

 

Gita provides insight into your question " anil nevatia " .We should do

good things only because you can leave the karma phala of the good

deeds but you can't leave the karma phala of the bad deeds and liberate.

i.e. do good deeds and you can liberate easily. This is the only

reason of doing only good deeds. And try to do always only good

deeds.

 

-

 

 

--- anil nevatia <anilkamail wrote:

 

> When God plans to execute as per his blue print why

> disturb the same.

> When God descended the first human, it is was clear

> that the beginning of the end had started, so why to

> say and do good things ?

>

> Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

God's plans are never disturbed, they will continue in their settled system like the ways of light, only human beings have to understand and accept them with settled mind "Asthit Budhi". Then one can enjoy it, other wise it will always be devil's play. Hari Motwani

 

 

 

-----------

 

who are we disturb the gods'plans?. ultimately our say does not work.

what is ordained, that only takes place. But we should make a sincere prayer that my doing or sankalpa should tally with that of God's. Ordinarily when the plans are in a right direction they would definitely see the fulfilment.

after all, god makes the life style for the beings and despatches them in to the world of action.

we say in our worship sriparamesvaraprityartham when that arpana buddhi is there the success is definite. it is not necessary to think that we interfere into the god's mind.

 

It is best not to worry, but do the right thing. the result is automatic and unasked for. When we do right thing fully, God cooperates.

subhameva bhavati.

prabhakar

-----------

 

Interesting message, to know God Gita is one media.

Every culture has its own manifestation of God in its

own sphere being made by the Same God or God Power. He

cannot be different for and bring about a confusion in

Truth. Truth is unique.OK.

 

Paul Ponniah.

 

-----------

 

From: pratapbhattDate: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 15:03:37 -0800Re: Why Disturb God's Plans ?

 

 

 

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!If one tries to know God as described in Gita, one will no doubt discover God as the Truth of our Existence which is ONE with the Existence of all known and unknown, sentients, insentients, manifest,unmanifest. Once the real nature of God is understood, all questions will evaporate in the light of such knowledge. Such questions arise from the assumptions, beliefs based on our conditioning of what we have heard, read, and are told by the society in which we grow up and live. Such beliefs are never examined. Upon investigation into nature of God with the grace of God, with help of a realized Guru, or spiritual friend, or scripture such as Gita, one may discover that God is not an entity with blue print for everything. God is name we give to the EXPERIENCE of limitless AWARENESS and joy of just Being which is at the same time Intelligence and total freedom. God is such freedom at every momentthat cannot be fixed in some distant past and now God is bound by it. Bondage is only when we identify with our body-mind organism and act as separate individuals. Look into our own experience of happiness when we say or do good things, and unhappiness when wedo or say bad things. This is also enough to convince us to realize the truth of GOd rather than assume such bondage in dispairs! Namaskar, Pratap-------------------------All lives are programmed already and do according to their "nature" svabhav. origin, operation and destruction are just manifest of the program objectives. good and bad are perception of individual according to their nature "svabhav". God is truth which is not relative from one and another. In the same universe, there are people who see truth in everything, and others who see conflict in everything. regardsKrishna Gopal-------------------------As per Gita, God is not a watchman. God has provided us the guiding principles, but the free lies within us. It is up to us to do our part, our share. We can't be irresponsible with the attitudethat the God will take care, etc. Even the myth that if we do good work, then God will guarantee success, is wrong.Five factors determine the outcome of all actions (good or bad) as per Gita:Timing, doer, tools, how tools are applied and fate/providence.However, if we do good, ultimately we are better off (because as per Gita no good deed goes to waste- even if there is no immediate gain). Likewise, even if we have immediate success with evil,God will make sure that they will keep coming back to inferior lives.However, if we turn to God, God is happy to help. It is for our own welfare we have to do good.For example we send our kids to college, having brought them ane even paying tuition. It is child's responsibility to take care of studies, home work, safety, remain drug free, don't get pregnant or get someone pregnent etc.K.S. tAtAchAr-------------------------nsk717Narayana, NarayanaGita provides insight into your question "anil nevatia".We should dogood things only because you can leave the karma phala of the gooddeeds but you can't leave the karma phala of the bad deeds and liberate.i.e. do good deeds and you can liberate easily. This is the onlyreason of doing only good deeds. And try to do always only gooddeeds.---------------------------- anil nevatia <anilkamail > wrote:> When God plans to execute as per his blue print why> disturb the same.> When God descended the first human, it is was clear> that the beginning of the end had started, so why to> say and do good things ? > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ? Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail®-get your "fix" Check it out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hari OM!

 

What is the difference between GOD and Man???

 

GOD + EGO = Man

MAN - EGO = GOD.

 

We always consider GOD has an entity which is sperate from us. that is why this whole

issue comes. GOD does not have any blue print for any body??? YOu and I create our

own Blue print (I refere to the small " i " Mr. EGO} not the Big " I " . So all these issues

dissolved if the right attitude and thinking comes... for that also Blessing is very much required

 

Jai Poojya Gurudev!

 

With Love & OM!

 

Krishna Prasad

 

---------

 

To believe that God has surely a plan and that Plan further extends to every detail of our lives is entirely unwarranted and undesirable. It can not be either established or refuted definitively. Therefore a true seeker of truth will not ACCEPT this.

 

It is true that these are mainly acts of faith rather than reason. But many perople in Hinduism and in other faiths too believe the opposite to be true. And yet, with belief in human free will, and non-determinism and part determinism, achieve great spiritual success.

 

Faith in fatalism is one of the greatest cultural ailments that Hinduism has to rid itself of for human progress.

 

P. K. Siddharth

 

 

---------

 

Hello Thinkers,

The following gives reason for my speculation based on

the your statements.

1 God is very much disturbed like a father who feels pained when his children suffer, and searches for the relief. So does God.

2.The word GOD is in the common Noun and can be applied to any one, anything, if he has more or little power or strength. Failure in power to do deeds expected or imagined is lost then the God becomes only past history.

3. If good and bad are only perception then the truth of pain and poverty is false, and man becomes insensible and living is imaginary, which is untrue, for we live and experience pain, joy, hunger and feast and all the paradox.

4.If Karma was real then nothing in nature will ever change, for what is it is because it has to be is.

Very confusing thoughts because we are in a merry go round, with no standing on starting or finishing events. WITH ALL THIS THOUGHT I AM IN WANT?

Goodwill to all,

Paul Ponniah.

 

---------

 

On 1/18/08, hari Motwani <habmeds wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

God's plans are never disturbed, they will continue in their settled system like the ways of light, only human beings have to understand and accept them with settled mind " Asthit Budhi " . Then one can enjoy it, other wise it will always be devil's play. Hari Motwani

 

 

-----------

who are we disturb the gods'plans?. ultimately our say does not work. what is ordained, that only takes place. But we should make a sincere prayer that my doing or sankalpa should tally with that of God's. Ordinarily when the plans are in a right direction they would definitely see the fulfilment. after all, god makes the life style for the beings and despatches them in to the world of action. we say in our worship sriparamesvaraprityartham when that arpana buddhi is there the success is definite. it is not necessary to think that we interfere into the god's mind.

It is best not to worry, but do the right thing. the result is automatic and unasked for. When we do right thing fully, God cooperates. subhameva bhavati. prabhakar -----------

Interesting message, to know God Gita is one media. Every culture has its own manifestation of God in its own sphere being made by the Same God or God Power. He cannot be different for and bring about a confusion in Truth. Truth is unique.OK.

Paul Ponniah.

 

-----------

From:

pratapbhattDate: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 15:03:37 -0800Re: Why Disturb God's Plans ?

 

 

 

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!If one tries to know God as described in Gita, one will no doubt discover God as the Truth of our Existence which is ONE with the Existence of all known and unknown, sentients, insentients, manifest,

unmanifest. Once the real nature of God is understood, all questions will evaporate in the light of such knowledge. Such questions arise from the assumptions, beliefs based on our conditioning of what we have heard, read, and are told by the society in which we grow up and live. Such beliefs are never examined. Upon investigation into nature of God with the grace of God, with help of a realized Guru, or spiritual friend, or scripture such as Gita, one may discover that God is not an entity with blue print for everything. God is name we give to the EXPERIENCE of limitless AWARENESS and joy of just Being which is at the same time Intelligence and total freedom. God is such freedom at every moment

that cannot be fixed in some distant past and now God is bound by it. Bondage is only when we identify with our body-mind organism and act as separate individuals. Look into our own experience of happiness when we say or do good things, and unhappiness when we

do or say bad things. This is also enough to convince us to realize the truth of GOd rather than assume such bondage in dispairs! Namaskar, Pratap-------------------------

All lives are programmed already and do according to their " nature " svabhav. origin, operation and destruction are just manifest of the program objectives. good and bad are perception of individual according to their nature " svabhav " . God is truth which is not relative from one and another. In the same universe, there are people who see truth in everything, and others who see conflict in everything. regardsKrishna Gopal-------------------------

As per Gita, God is not a watchman. God has provided us the guiding principles, but the free lies within us. It is up to us to do our part, our share. We can't be irresponsible with the attitudethat the God will take care, etc. Even the myth that if we do good work, then God will guarantee success, is wrong.Five factors determine the outcome of all actions (good or bad) as per Gita:Timing, doer, tools, how tools are applied and fate/providence.

However, if we do good, ultimately we are better off (because as per Gita no good deed goes to waste- even if there is no immediate gain). Likewise, even if we have immediate success with evil,God will make sure that they will keep coming back to inferior lives.

However, if we turn to God, God is happy to help. It is for our own welfare we have to do good.For example we send our kids to college, having brought them ane even paying tuition. It is child's responsibility to take care of studies, home work, safety, remain drug free, don't get pregnant or get someone pregnent etc.

K.S. tAtAchAr-------------------------nsk717Narayana, NarayanaGita provides insight into your question " anil nevatia " .We should do

good things only because you can leave the karma phala of the gooddeeds but you can't leave the karma phala of the bad deeds and liberate.i.e. do good deeds and you can liberate easily. This is the onlyreason of doing only good deeds. And try to do always only good

deeds.---------------------------- anil nevatia <anilkamail

> wrote:> When God plans to execute as per his blue print why> disturb the same.> When God descended the first human, it is was clear> that the beginning of the end had started, so why to

> say and do good things ? > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Shree Hari Ram Ram Priya Sadhaka, Prasana ke liye dhanyavad! In his discourses, Swamiji Maharaj has expressed a very different viewpoint: If it were true that the blue print is already made then the human life surely loses its meaning and purpose. Gurus and spiritual teachers are not required anymore, do's and don’ts as spelled out in the scriptures will not serve any usefulness either. Certainly, one has a part to play, as the Gitaji (Verse 2/47) says: "Your have the right (choice or freedom) to do action only, but never to the fruit thereof; Let not the fruit of action be your object, nor let your attachment be to inaction". The reason that we do not have choice of fruit is that many factors outside of our control (prarabhda) influence the outcome of actions. God does not interfere with our independence of being able to choose actions. He also does not interfere with the fruits of actions as is explained in Gitaji Verse (5/14): na'datte kasyacit papam, na cai 'va sukrtam vibuh ajnanena 'vrtam jnanam, tena muhyanti jantavah Meaning: Neither the sense of doer-ship nor the nature of actions does the Lord determine for the mankind, nor does He link the actions with their fruits. But it is the personal nature alone that impacts. Now, on the question of "why should we do good actions"? . At the ordinary level, for our existence, consistently we are taking things from the world, we are indebted to the world, as a good citizen we must pay off our debt by working unselfishly. . As explained in Gitaji (Verse 3/9) - "The world is bound by actions other than those performed for the sake of

sacrifice or (Yajna); do therefore, O son of Kunti (Arjuna), perform all actions for that sake (for sacrifice alone), free from attachment". . Out of His mercy we have been granted the rare human birth for the single and the only purpose of realizing God, by not paying attention, we will miss the golden opportunity to attain this goal. Goswami Tulsidasji says in Ramayana: “Kabahuka kari karuna nar dehi, deta isa binu hetu sanehi” Meaning: Rarely, does God, who loves the Jiva without any self interest, graciously bestows on it the human form. . Lord Krishna also says in Gitaji (Verses - 18/45 & 46): "Each man devoted to his own duty

attains perfection. How can one, devoted to his own duty, attain perfection, listen of that now. He from Whom all beings emanate and by Whom all this is pervaded, by worshipping Him through performance of his own duty, man attains perfection". Therefore, it is a must that we do good actions but have to let go the doership of actions. Ram Ram Humble pranam! A sadhakaanil nevatia <anilkamail wrote: When God plans to execute as per his blue print why disturb the same. When God descended the first human, it is was clear that the beginning of the end had started, so why to say and do good things ? Does Gita provide any insight

into this query ?

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

" na'datte kasyacit papam, na cai 'va sukrtam vibuh

ajnanena 'vrtam jnanam, tena muhyanti jantavah "

 

Meaning:

Neither the sense of doer-ship nor the nature of actions does the Lord determine

for the mankind, nor does He link the actions with their fruits. But it is the

personal nature alone that impacts.

 

Please note the verse you quoted here is 5/15 and not 5/14. But your

translation has elements from 5/14. Thus, I have reproduced 5/14 and 5/15, as

well as translation.

I have noted that we don't need to add anything to Gita, other than

some limited explanations here and there. Gita read as such makes

sense more than any explanation! We need scholars only to point us to

right verses plus limited clarification, if needed and move away!!!

 

na ka-rtR-tvam na ka-rmA-Ni

lo-ka-sya sR-ja-ti pra-bhuh |

na ka-rma pha-la-sam-yo-gam

sva-bhA-va-stu pra-va-rta-te ||V-14||

 

5-14: (Arjuna! Know that) God does not enjoin people to act,

nor does God create karma (activities), or the associated rewards of karma. But

all these arise from nature.

 

nA-da-tte ka-sya-chi-tpA-pam

na chai-va su-kR-tam vi-bhuh |

a-jn^A-ne-nA-vR-tam jn^A-nam

te-na mu-hya-nti ja-nta-vah ||V-15||

 

5-15: Furthermore, nor does God partake of anyone's virtue or evil

(which are simply consequence of actions performed by people

in this and past lives). Indeed, knowledge is enveloped by ignorance, thereby

people are deluded (and mistakenly link actions to God).

 

K.S. tAtAchAr

 

---------

Nice rendition by Krishna Prasadji. A slight alteration, may give a better face

of explanation.

 

Man + right ego (ego centered on Self ) = God

Man - wrong ego (ego on other things) = God

 

Ego (aham) is inseparable constituent of any Self - Soul - and to imagine a Self

- Soul - without it, is negating the very Self - Soul.

 

God is not a reversible entity but man only defies to the level of Godhood by

right knowledge, right faith and right conduct; or continues in birth and death

by wrong knowledge, wrong faith and wrong conduct

 

Thanks for providing an opportunity to dwell on Adhyaathmic subject.

 

Welcome for any further clarification.

 

Truth is of Kevalin and the rest are mine.

 

Wishing you all the best for the early dawn of Samykathva.

 

Yours brotherly,

Sreepalan

 

---------

 

--- Krishna Prasad wrote:

 

> Hari OM!

>

> What is the difference between GOD and Man???

>

> GOD + EGO = Man

> MAN - EGO = GOD.

>

> We always consider GOD has an entity which is

> sperate from us. that is why

> this whole

> issue comes. GOD does not have any blue print for

> any body??? YOu and I

> create our

> own Blue print (I refere to the small " i " Mr. EGO}

> not the Big " I " . So all

> these issues

> dissolved if the right attitude and thinking

> comes... for that also Blessing

> is very much required

>

> Jai Poojya Gurudev!

>

> With Love & OM!

>

> Krishna Prasad

 

 

anil nevatia anilkamail wrote: When God plans to

execute as per his blue print why disturb the same. When God descended the first

human, it is was clear that the beginning of the end had started, so why to say

and do good things ? Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Namaskar!

 

my master is verily a great scientist. The whole creation, HIS SKILL only, so perfectly planned that no alteration have ever been needed. Look at your own body (everyone's the same is) and see how perfectly acomplished it is! Has any doctor ever said, no this limb would have been fitted there and that one over here? Imagine the shape of embryo in the womb, who plans, where to fit and why,everything remarkable. Chapter 15 of GITA "PURSHOUTAM YOG", Lord have clearly mentioned the Prikrti like the inverted Banyan three having roots in the plans of the CREATOR. Who can disturb HIS plans, no body. Let's all pray, O my Lord, all your plans be fulfilled, me and we all shall understand thou Leela and be happy with it. PHOOL BHI TERAY--KANTEY BHI TERAY. We are your ignorant child, Bless us with your love & Blessings. Let's bow to his LEELA. Hari Motwani

 

 

From: rkrishp99Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 13:07:08 -0600Re: Why Disturb God's Plans ?

 

 

 

Hari OM!

 

What is the difference between GOD and Man???

 

GOD + EGO = Man

MAN - EGO = GOD.

 

We always consider GOD has an entity which is sperate from us. that is why this whole

issue comes. GOD does not have any blue print for any body??? YOu and I create our

own Blue print (I refere to the small "i" Mr. EGO} not the Big "I". So all these issues

dissolved if the right attitude and thinking comes... for that also Blessing is very much required

 

Jai Poojya Gurudev!

 

With Love & OM!

 

Krishna Prasad

---------

To believe that God has surely a plan and that Plan further extends to every detail of our lives is entirely unwarranted and undesirable. It can not be either established or refuted definitively. Therefore a true seeker of truth will not ACCEPT this.

It is true that these are mainly acts of faith rather than reason. But many perople in Hinduism and in other faiths too believe the opposite to be true. And yet, with belief in human free will, and non-determinism and part determinism, achieve great spiritual success.

Faith in fatalism is one of the greatest cultural ailments that Hinduism has to rid itself of for human progress.

P. K. Siddharth

 

---------

Hello Thinkers, The following gives reason for my speculation based on the your statements. 1 God is very much disturbed like a father who feels pained when his children suffer, and searches for the relief. So does God. 2.The word GOD is in the common Noun and can be applied to any one, anything, if he has more or little power or strength. Failure in power to do deeds expected or imagined is lost then the God becomes only past history. 3. If good and bad are only perception then the truth of pain and poverty is false, and man becomes insensible and living is imaginary, which is untrue, for we live and experience pain, joy, hunger and feast and all the paradox. 4.If Karma was real then nothing in nature will ever change, for what is it is because it has to be is. Very confusing thoughts because we are in a merry go round, with no standing on starting or finishing events. WITH ALL THIS THOUGHT I AM IN WANT? Goodwill to all, Paul Ponniah.

---------

 

On 1/18/08, hari Motwani <habmeds (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote:

 

 

 

 

God's plans are never disturbed, they will continue in their settled system like the ways of light, only human beings have to understand and accept them with settled mind "Asthit Budhi". Then one can enjoy it, other wise it will always be devil's play. Hari Motwani

 

 

-----------

who are we disturb the gods'plans?. ultimately our say does not work. what is ordained, that only takes place. But we should make a sincere prayer that my doing or sankalpa should tally with that of God's. Ordinarily when the plans are in a right direction they would definitely see the fulfilment. after all, god makes the life style for the beings and despatches them in to the world of action. we say in our worship sriparamesvaraprityartham when that arpana buddhi is there the success is definite. it is not necessary to think that we interfere into the god's mind.

It is best not to worry, but do the right thing. the result is automatic and unasked for. When we do right thing fully, God cooperates. subhameva bhavati. prabhakar -----------

Interesting message, to know God Gita is one media. Every culture has its own manifestation of God in its own sphere being made by the Same God or God Power. He cannot be different for and bring about a confusion in Truth. Truth is unique.OK.

Paul Ponniah.

 

-----------

From: pratapbhatt Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 15:03:37 -0800Re: Why Disturb God's Plans ?

 

 

 

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!If one tries to know God as described in Gita, one will no doubt discover God as the Truth of our Existence which is ONE with the Existence of all known and unknown, sentients, insentients, manifest, unmanifest. Once the real nature of God is understood, all questions will evaporate in the light of such knowledge. Such questions arise from the assumptions, beliefs based on our conditioning of what we have heard, read, and are told by the society in which we grow up and live. Such beliefs are never examined. Upon investigation into nature of God with the grace of God, with help of a realized Guru, or spiritual friend, or scripture such as Gita, one may discover that God is not an entity with blue print for everything. God is name we give to the EXPERIENCE of limitless AWARENESS and joy of just Being which is at the same time Intelligence and total freedom. God is such freedom at every moment that cannot be fixed in some distant past and now God is bound by it. Bondage is only when we identify with our body-mind organism and act as separate individuals. Look into our own experience of happiness when we say or do good things, and unhappiness when we do or say bad things. This is also enough to convince us to realize the truth of GOd rather than assume such bondage in dispairs! Namaskar, Pratap-------------------------All lives are programmed already and do according to their "nature" svabhav. origin, operation and destruction are just manifest of the program objectives. good and bad are perception of individual according to their nature "svabhav". God is truth which is not relative from one and another. In the same universe, there are people who see truth in everything, and others who see conflict in everything. regardsKrishna Gopal------------------------- As per Gita, God is not a watchman. God has provided us the guiding principles, but the free lies within us. It is up to us to do our part, our share. We can't be irresponsible with the attitudethat the God will take care, etc. Even the myth that if we do good work, then God will guarantee success, is wrong.Five factors determine the outcome of all actions (good or bad) as per Gita:Timing, doer, tools, how tools are applied and fate/providence. However, if we do good, ultimately we are better off (because as per Gita no good deed goes to waste- even if there is no immediate gain). Likewise, even if we have immediate success with evil,God will make sure that they will keep coming back to inferior lives. However, if we turn to God, God is happy to help. It is for our own welfare we have to do good.For example we send our kids to college, having brought them ane even paying tuition. It is child's responsibility to take care of studies, home work, safety, remain drug free, don't get pregnant or get someone pregnent etc. K.S. tAtAchAr-------------------------nsk717Narayana, NarayanaGita provides insight into your question "anil nevatia".We should dogood things only because you can leave the karma phala of the gooddeeds but you can't leave the karma phala of the bad deeds and liberate.i.e. do good deeds and you can liberate easily. This is the onlyreason of doing only good deeds. And try to do always only good deeds.---------------------------- anil nevatia <anilkamail > wrote:> When God plans to execute as per his blue print why> disturb the same.> When God descended the first human, it is was clear> that the beginning of the end had started, so why to > say and do good things ? > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail®-get your "fix". Check it out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

Loving Divine,

Pranam.

Very beautiful things have been said in response to Anilji's beautiful questions.

Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening for me so would like to share it with you all and hope it would do the same for you too...

The following are not exact words but my understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He explained...

 

We are the creator of our own blue print. Something from Bible might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism. When Adam-Eve were created by God in the very beginning of His creation, they were naked, i.e., they were devoid of body consciousness. When they ate the fruit from the prohibited tree, they became aware of their nakedness, i.e., when they did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the fruits of it, they came down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...' or they became ego centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of the fruits of their action. They became shameful. So really when God descended the first human, the intention was not to end but make it immortal just like Him. We human missed out understanding it. the intention has still remain the same be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body consciousness. As Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me only...

There are three types of actions that determine our blue print. Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

 

One arrow has already left from the bow aimed at a dear. Most of the time the arrow that has left can't be reverted, it sure will attain the result of killing that dear. We don't have any control over that arrow.

Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let go towards the target or we might not. Here the action is in motion, yet we have some control over it to stop it even in the middle and thus stop the fruits of such action.

Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over which we have complete control not to even take it out.

In other words,

 

we have done some actions in past of which we have to bear the consequences. However, He said that if you have taken refuge of an able Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by clapping, diverting the attention of that dear and make him run away before the arrow hits him!!!

Some actions are in progress but as soon as we become aware of our action, we can alter the course of such action.

And in third situation, the actions we would have performed in ignorance could be completely avoided by transforming our lives like roasted seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me you will attain Me only...

 

As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives birth to many actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on multiplying without our knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is very important. So many things can be stop our thoughts before it takes any grosser form. With higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at the source level - not to let them come down even at the thought level. One thought not only impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us and the environment we live in. It not only gives immediate results/pleasure/pain but it carries consequences in future also. It not only affects our present lfve but many lives to come. So one has to be very very careful of their thoughts.

At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind of freedom do we have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow has been tied with a long rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

 

circle around the pole, reduce the length of rope and be miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly affairs, loose the freedom and be miserable

use the freedom of long rope and move around smartly. One almost feels free but one knows that there is still rope tied to a pole.

or be really smart and by break the rope from the pole, cow has enough strength to free herself permanently. Sarvadharmaan parityajya...

Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial in understanding how our blue prints are determined and what type of karmas/actions we should engage in.

humble regards,

always at Thy Divine Feet

On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

 

When God plans to execute as per his blue print why disturb the same. When God descended the first human, it is was clear that the beginning of the end had started, so why to say and do good things ?

Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

-----

 

Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW WOW!!!!!

I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question is, can you

cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to what you say

here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is the blue

print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My Bhagavad Gita is

in Spanish.

Thank you!!! Stay well

" Daniel " Tkach

-----

THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

chatur patel

 

-----

Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

-----

The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in Christian

setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the Bible myth and God.

Classyoga

----

 

 

I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting every logic or

its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible would never be

adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is or what Lord

Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN BHAGAVAD GITA. In

fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their origins in

Indian scriptures.

With best regards,

Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME, UNIVERSAL, SCIENTIFIC

INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation that is this

universe and its mysteries.

With best regards,

vm

Message shortened by Moderator.....

-----

My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I was sharing it to

show how we become the creator of our own blue print which I indicated

in the beginning and I thought the example was appropriate otherwise I

would not have shared.

 

Scriptures are written using mystical language so one can interpret

them according to their level of understanding and spiritual

experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one, the example

inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply drop it ;-)

 

Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are more elaborate

and inclusive in directing our thought process towards God. Those who

will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand other scriptures

too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as they all

talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for showing me the path.

 

with humble regards,

always at Thy Divine Feet

" Manjula Patel "

Message shortened by Moderator.....

-----

 

dear divine souls.

this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to You, manula ji

for puting forwards this mail.

 

jai sri ram

kuldip

-----

, " Manjula Patel " <manjumaa wrote:

>

> Loving Divine,

> Pranam.

> Very beautiful things have been said in response to Anilji's beautiful

> questions.

> Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening for me so would

like to

> share it with you all and hope it would do the same for you too...

> The following are not exact words but my

> understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He explained...

>

> - We are the creator of our own blue print. Something from Bible

> might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism. When Adam-Eve

were created

> by God in the very beginning of His creation, they were naked, i.e.,

> they were devoid of body consciousness. When they ate the fruit

from the

> prohibited tree, they became aware of their nakedness, i.e., when

they

> did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the fruits of

it, they came

> down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...' or they became ego

> centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of the fruits

of their

> action. They became shameful. So really when God descended the

first

> human, the intention was not to end but make it immortal just

like Him. We

> human missed out understanding it. the intention has still

remain the same

> be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body

consciousness. As

> Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me only...

> - There are three types of actions that determine our blue print.

> Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed at a dear. Most

> of the time the arrow that has left can't be reverted, it sure

> will attain

> the result of killing that dear. We don't have any control over

> that arrow.

> - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let go towards

> the target or we might not. Here the action is in motion, yet

> we have some

> control over it to stop it even in the middle and thus stop

the fruits of

> such action.

> - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over which we have

> complete control not to even take it out.

> - In other words,

> - we have done some actions in past of which we have to bear the

> consequences. However, He said that if you have taken refuge

of an able

> Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by clapping,

> diverting the attention of that dear and make him run away

> before the arrow

> hits him!!!

> - Some actions are in progress but as soon as we become aware of

> our action, we can alter the course of such action.

> - And in third situation, the actions we would have performed in

> ignorance could be completely avoided by transforming our lives

> like roasted

> seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me you will attain

Me only...

> - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives birth to many

> actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on multiplying

without our

> knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is very

important. So

> many things can be stop our thoughts before it takes any grosser

form. With

> higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at the source

level - not

> to let them come down even at the thought level. One thought not

only

> impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us and the

environment we

> live in. It not only gives immediate results/pleasure/pain but

it carries

> consequences in future also. It not only affects our present

lfve but many

> lives to come. So one has to be very very careful of their thoughts.

> - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind of freedom do we

> have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow has been tied

with a long

> rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> - circle around the pole, reduce the length of rope and be

> miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly affairs, loose the

> freedom and be miserable

> - use the freedom of long rope and move around smartly. One

> almost feels free but one knows that there is still rope tied

to a pole.

> - or be really smart and by break the rope from the pole,

> cow has enough strength to free herself permanently.

Sarvadharmaan

> parityajya...

>

> Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial in

understanding how

> our blue prints are determined and what type of karmas/actions we should

> engage in.

> humble regards,

> always at Thy Divine Feet

>

> On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail wrote:

>

> > When God plans to execute as per his blue print why disturb the

same.

> > When God descended the first human, it is was clear that the

beginning of

> > the end had started, so why to say and do good things ?

> > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Divine All,

Humble pranams.

Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring words. It is nothing

but praising God / Guru.

The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

 

* Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

* 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by Anilji and I

continued using that word so that he can also relate the answer to his

inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed, why bother? My

response was to say that destiny can be changed with our present

action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of our past action

which we can not change (though some of it can be changed by an able

Guru) but we can change the course of our present and future actions.

* Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma theory.

Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on Karma but

Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

- Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past lives),

 

- Prarabdha (from total accumulation the portion is worked out in

present life),

- Agami (from present life what we keep on adding to Sanchita that

will come to us in future / future

lives) and

- Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out immediately).

 

Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva perspective.

* Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

* How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27, 5:12

* Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

* Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG 17:16

* Impact of karma... BG 18:12

* There are many slokas that reference non-doership of the action

through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can help with the 2nd

and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37 (roasted seed don't

germinate), 41. BG 5:7

 

This might be beneficial and encouraging to my Christian friends to

read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible and Kriya Yoga'.

Hope I have covered your inquiry.

humble regards,

always at Thy Divine Feet

 

Manjula Patel

 

--

 

There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at the way humans are

made, brain, which controls everything is at the top [satvik], heart

which controls physical functioning and emotions is in the centre

[Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom[Tamasik].Can any one

else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender to HIM totally.

G.Vaidyanathan.

--

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> -----

>

> Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW WOW!!!!!

> I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question is, can you

> cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to what you say

> here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is the blue

> print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My Bhagavad Gita is

> in Spanish.

> Thank you!!! Stay well

> " Daniel " Tkach

> -----

> THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> chatur patel

>

> -----

> Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> -----

> The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in Christian

> setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the Bible myth and God.

> Classyoga

> ----

>

>

> I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting every logic or

> its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible would never be

> adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is or what Lord

> Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN BHAGAVAD GITA. In

> fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their origins in

> Indian scriptures.

> With best regards,

> Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME, UNIVERSAL, SCIENTIFIC

> INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation that is this

> universe and its mysteries.

> With best regards,

> vm

> Message shortened by Moderator.....

> -----

> My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I was sharing it to

> show how we become the creator of our own blue print which I indicated

> in the beginning and I thought the example was appropriate otherwise I

> would not have shared.

>

> Scriptures are written using mystical language so one can interpret

> them according to their level of understanding and spiritual

> experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one, the example

> inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply drop it ;-)

>

> Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are more elaborate

> and inclusive in directing our thought process towards God. Those who

> will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand other scriptures

> too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as they all

> talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for showing me the path.

>

> with humble regards,

> always at Thy Divine Feet

> " Manjula Patel "

> Message shortened by Moderator.....

> -----

>

> dear divine souls.

> this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to You, manula ji

> for puting forwards this mail.

>

> jai sri ram

> kuldip

> -----

> , " Manjula Patel " <manjumaa@> wrote:

> >

> > Loving Divine,

> > Pranam.

> > Very beautiful things have been said in response to Anilji's beautiful

> > questions.

> > Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening for me so would

> like to

> > share it with you all and hope it would do the same for you too...

> > The following are not exact words but my

> > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He explained...

> >

> > - We are the creator of our own blue print. Something from Bible

> > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism. When Adam-Eve

> were created

> > by God in the very beginning of His creation, they were naked,

i.e.,

> > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they ate the fruit

> from the

> > prohibited tree, they became aware of their nakedness, i.e., when

> they

> > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the fruits of

> it, they came

> > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...' or they became ego

> > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of the fruits

> of their

> > action. They became shameful. So really when God descended the

> first

> > human, the intention was not to end but make it immortal just

> like Him. We

> > human missed out understanding it. the intention has still

> remain the same

> > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body

> consciousness. As

> > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me only...

> > - There are three types of actions that determine our blue print.

> > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed at a dear. Most

> > of the time the arrow that has left can't be reverted, it sure

> > will attain

> > the result of killing that dear. We don't have any control over

> > that arrow.

> > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let go towards

> > the target or we might not. Here the action is in motion, yet

> > we have some

> > control over it to stop it even in the middle and thus stop

> the fruits of

> > such action.

> > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over which we have

> > complete control not to even take it out.

> > - In other words,

> > - we have done some actions in past of which we have to bear the

> > consequences. However, He said that if you have taken refuge

> of an able

> > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by clapping,

> > diverting the attention of that dear and make him run away

> > before the arrow

> > hits him!!!

> > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as we become aware of

> > our action, we can alter the course of such action.

> > - And in third situation, the actions we would have performed in

> > ignorance could be completely avoided by transforming our lives

> > like roasted

> > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me you will attain

> Me only...

> > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives birth to many

> > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on multiplying

> without our

> > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is very

> important. So

> > many things can be stop our thoughts before it takes any grosser

> form. With

> > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at the source

> level - not

> > to let them come down even at the thought level. One thought not

> only

> > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us and the

> environment we

> > live in. It not only gives immediate results/pleasure/pain but

> it carries

> > consequences in future also. It not only affects our present

> lfve but many

> > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful of their

thoughts.

> > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind of freedom do we

> > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow has been tied

> with a long

> > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of rope and be

> > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly affairs, loose the

> > freedom and be miserable

> > - use the freedom of long rope and move around smartly. One

> > almost feels free but one knows that there is still rope tied

> to a pole.

> > - or be really smart and by break the rope from the pole,

> > cow has enough strength to free herself permanently.

> Sarvadharmaan

> > parityajya...

> >

> > Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial in

> understanding how

> > our blue prints are determined and what type of karmas/actions we

should

> > engage in.

> > humble regards,

> > always at Thy Divine Feet

> >

> > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> >

> > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print why disturb the

> same.

> > > When God descended the first human, it is was clear that the

> beginning of

> > > the end had started, so why to say and do good things ?

> > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans. GOD is said

as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects. Everything is

set and computerised and networked and part of His divine plan.

 

B.Sathyanarayan

 

---

God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print, as someone has

suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this anecdote.

We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay mugs and talked

quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us were in a season

with some unanswered questions in our lives. We talked about

trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and anxiety. It's not

always an easy thing to do.

 

Every day we make a choice to either trust God ... or not. We can

worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can choose to trust

Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and that He will direct

our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.

 

It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really trust God? " Often

with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried lives we say, " No. "

 

Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His Word, the Bible? He

says...

 

" I will instruct you and guide you along the best pathway for your

life. I will advise you and watch your progress, " This is God's plan.

 

The choice you make today to believe those words and trust God will

bring a result in your life...listen...

 

" ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the Lord. So rejoice

in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all those who choose

to obey Him, " the Bible says.

 

Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our lives releases

the peace and the comfort of His love and it will surround

us...holding us secure through the winds of change and uncertainty.

Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing that will be the

by-product of His surrounding love.

 

Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the best pathway for

your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust is a choice we

can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy to countless

believers.

Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in your life.

God's plan never fails.

 

yeshu rathenam

 

---

Hare Krsna!!

Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting that example about

the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks thanks!

 

Daniel

 

---

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Divine All,

> Humble pranams.

> Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring words. It is

nothing

> but praising God / Guru.

> The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

>

> * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by Anilji

and I

> continued using that word so that he can also relate the answer to

his

> inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed, why bother?

My

> response was to say that destiny can be changed with our present

> action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of our past action

> which we can not change (though some of it can be changed by an

able

> Guru) but we can change the course of our present and future

actions.

> * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma theory.

> Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on Karma but

> Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past lives),

>

> - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the portion is

worked out in present life),

> - Agami (from present life what we keep on adding to

Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> lives) and

> - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out immediately).

>

> Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva perspective.

> * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27, 5:12

> * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG 17:16

> * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> * There are many slokas that reference non-doership of the

action

> through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can help with the

2nd

> and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37 (roasted seed don't

> germinate), 41. BG 5:7

>

> This might be beneficial and encouraging to my Christian friends to

> read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible and Kriya

Yoga'.

> Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> humble regards,

> always at Thy Divine Feet

>

> Manjula Patel

>

> -

-

>

> There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at the way humans

are

> made, brain, which controls everything is at the top [satvik],

heart

> which controls physical functioning and emotions is in the centre

> [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom[Tamasik].Can any

one

> else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender to HIM

totally.

> G.Vaidyanathan.

> -

-

>

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > --------------------------------

------

> >

> > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW WOW!!!!!

> > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question is, can

you

> > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to what you

say

> > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is the blue

> > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My Bhagavad

Gita is

> > in Spanish.

> > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > " Daniel " Tkach

> > --------------------------------

------

> > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > chatur patel

> >

> > --------------------------------

------

> > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > --------------------------------

------

> > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in Christian

> > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the Bible myth

and God.

> > Classyoga

> > --------------------------------

-----

> >

> >

> > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting every

logic or

> > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible would

never be

> > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is or what

Lord

> > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN BHAGAVAD GITA.

In

> > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their origins

in

> > Indian scriptures.

> > With best regards,

> > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME, UNIVERSAL,

SCIENTIFIC

> > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation that is

this

> > universe and its mysteries.

> > With best regards,

> > vm

> > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > --------------------------------

------

> > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I was sharing

it to

> > show how we become the creator of our own blue print which I

indicated

> > in the beginning and I thought the example was appropriate

otherwise I

> > would not have shared.

> >

> > Scriptures are written using mystical language so one can

interpret

> > them according to their level of understanding and spiritual

> > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one, the example

> > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply drop it ;-)

> >

> > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are more

elaborate

> > and inclusive in directing our thought process towards God.

Those who

> > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand other

scriptures

> > too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as they

all

> > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for showing me the

path.

> >

> > with humble regards,

> > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > " Manjula Patel "

> > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > --------------------------------

------

> >

> > dear divine souls.

> > this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to You, manula

ji

> > for puting forwards this mail.

> >

> > jai sri ram

> > kuldip

> > --------------------------------

------

> > , " Manjula Patel " <manjumaa@>

wrote:

> > >

> > > Loving Divine,

> > > Pranam.

> > > Very beautiful things have been said in response to Anilji's

beautiful

> > > questions.

> > > Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening for me so

would

> > like to

> > > share it with you all and hope it would do the same for you

too...

> > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He explained...

> > >

> > > - We are the creator of our own blue print. Something from

Bible

> > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism. When Adam-

Eve

> > were created

> > > by God in the very beginning of His creation, they were

naked,

> i.e.,

> > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they ate the

fruit

> > from the

> > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their nakedness,

i.e., when

> > they

> > > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the fruits

of

> > it, they came

> > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...' or they

became ego

> > > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of the

fruits

> > of their

> > > action. They became shameful. So really when God

descended the

> > first

> > > human, the intention was not to end but make it immortal

just

> > like Him. We

> > > human missed out understanding it. the intention has still

> > remain the same

> > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body

> > consciousness. As

> > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me only...

> > > - There are three types of actions that determine our blue

print.

> > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed at a

dear. Most

> > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be reverted,

it sure

> > > will attain

> > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have any

control over

> > > that arrow.

> > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let go towards

> > > the target or we might not. Here the action is in

motion, yet

> > > we have some

> > > control over it to stop it even in the middle and thus

stop

> > the fruits of

> > > such action.

> > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over which

we have

> > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > - In other words,

> > > - we have done some actions in past of which we have to

bear the

> > > consequences. However, He said that if you have taken

refuge

> > of an able

> > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by clapping,

> > > diverting the attention of that dear and make him run

away

> > > before the arrow

> > > hits him!!!

> > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as we become

aware of

> > > our action, we can alter the course of such action.

> > > - And in third situation, the actions we would have

performed in

> > > ignorance could be completely avoided by transforming

our lives

> > > like roasted

> > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me you will

attain

> > Me only...

> > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives birth to

many

> > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on multiplying

> > without our

> > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is very

> > important. So

> > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it takes any

grosser

> > form. With

> > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at the

source

> > level - not

> > > to let them come down even at the thought level. One

thought not

> > only

> > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us and the

> > environment we

> > > live in. It not only gives immediate results/pleasure/pain

but

> > it carries

> > > consequences in future also. It not only affects our

present

> > lfve but many

> > > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful of their

> thoughts.

> > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind of

freedom do we

> > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow has been

tied

> > with a long

> > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of rope and

be

> > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly affairs,

loose the

> > > freedom and be miserable

> > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around smartly.

One

> > > almost feels free but one knows that there is still rope

tied

> > to a pole.

> > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from the pole,

> > > cow has enough strength to free herself permanently.

> > Sarvadharmaan

> > > parityajya...

> > >

> > > Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial in

> > understanding how

> > > our blue prints are determined and what type of karmas/actions

we

> should

> > > engage in.

> > > humble regards,

> > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > >

> > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print why

disturb the

> > same.

> > > > When God descended the first human, it is was clear that the

> > beginning of

> > > > the end had started, so why to say and do good things ?

> > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

 

A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it makes sense and

is useful!

 

My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without knowing God and His

Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some one must be

God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to resolve if

faced with problem after first accepting or rather welcoming it. As

Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I understand it), the

question is what is to be done now that the arrow has left the bow.

We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it in a manner

which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid on us. Rest is

His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

 

Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very important too!

An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one faces works.

What happens in such case is, either problem is solved in one's

favor or even more important than that is one gets strength to face

it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person rather than

his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt him/her. Isn't

this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is fairness in us! This

is the way I see God is changing the blue print or better yet is

modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His total freedom

at every moment of his/her life.

Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of changing His

plan doesn't arise at all.

 

Pratap Bhatt

 

---

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans. GOD is said

> as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects. Everything is

> set and computerised and networked and part of His divine plan.

>

> B.Sathyanarayan

>

> -

--

> God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print, as someone has

> suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this anecdote.

> We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay mugs and talked

> quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us were in a season

> with some unanswered questions in our lives. We talked about

> trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and anxiety. It's

not

> always an easy thing to do.

>

> Every day we make a choice to either trust God ... or not. We can

> worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can choose to

trust

> Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and that He will

direct

> our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.

>

> It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really trust God? " Often

> with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried lives we

say, " No. "

>

> Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His Word, the Bible? He

> says...

>

> " I will instruct you and guide you along the best pathway for your

> life. I will advise you and watch your progress, " This is God's

plan.

>

> The choice you make today to believe those words and trust God will

> bring a result in your life...listen...

>

> " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the Lord. So

rejoice

> in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all those who

choose

> to obey Him, " the Bible says.

>

> Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our lives releases

> the peace and the comfort of His love and it will surround

> us...holding us secure through the winds of change and

uncertainty.

> Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing that will be the

> by-product of His surrounding love.

>

> Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the best pathway for

> your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust is a choice

we

> can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy to countless

> believers.

> Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in your life.

> God's plan never fails.

>

> yeshu rathenam

>

> -

--

> Hare Krsna!!

> Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting that example

about

> the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks thanks!

>

> Daniel

>

> -

--

>

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > Divine All,

> > Humble pranams.

> > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring words. It is

> nothing

> > but praising God / Guru.

> > The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

> >

> > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by Anilji

> and I

> > continued using that word so that he can also relate the answer

to

> his

> > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed, why

bother?

> My

> > response was to say that destiny can be changed with our present

> > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of our past

action

> > which we can not change (though some of it can be changed by an

> able

> > Guru) but we can change the course of our present and future

> actions.

> > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma theory.

> > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on Karma but

> > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past lives),

> >

> > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the portion is

> worked out in present life),

> > - Agami (from present life what we keep on adding to

> Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> > lives) and

> > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out

immediately).

> >

> > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva perspective.

> > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27, 5:12

> > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG 17:16

> > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> > * There are many slokas that reference non-doership of the

> action

> > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can help with the

> 2nd

> > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37 (roasted seed

don't

> > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> >

> > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my Christian friends

to

> > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible and Kriya

> Yoga'.

> > Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> > humble regards,

> > always at Thy Divine Feet

> >

> > Manjula Patel

> >

> > --------------------------------

--

> -

> >

> > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at the way

humans

> are

> > made, brain, which controls everything is at the top [satvik],

> heart

> > which controls physical functioning and emotions is in the centre

> > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom[Tamasik].Can

any

> one

> > else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender to HIM

> totally.

> > G.Vaidyanathan.

> > --------------------------------

--

> -

> >

> > , " sadhak_insight "

> > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > >

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ------

> > >

> > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW WOW!!!!!

> > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question is, can

> you

> > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to what

you

> say

> > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is the

blue

> > > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My Bhagavad

> Gita is

> > > in Spanish.

> > > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ------

> > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > chatur patel

> > >

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ------

> > > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ------

> > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in

Christian

> > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the Bible myth

> and God.

> > > Classyoga

> > > ------------------------------

--

> -----

> > >

> > >

> > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting every

> logic or

> > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible would

> never be

> > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is or what

> Lord

> > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN BHAGAVAD

GITA.

> In

> > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their

origins

> in

> > > Indian scriptures.

> > > With best regards,

> > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME, UNIVERSAL,

> SCIENTIFIC

> > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation that

is

> this

> > > universe and its mysteries.

> > > With best regards,

> > > vm

> > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ------

> > > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I was

sharing

> it to

> > > show how we become the creator of our own blue print which I

> indicated

> > > in the beginning and I thought the example was appropriate

> otherwise I

> > > would not have shared.

> > >

> > > Scriptures are written using mystical language so one can

> interpret

> > > them according to their level of understanding and spiritual

> > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one, the

example

> > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply drop it ;-

)

> > >

> > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are more

> elaborate

> > > and inclusive in directing our thought process towards God.

> Those who

> > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand other

> scriptures

> > > too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as they

> all

> > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for showing me

the

> path.

> > >

> > > with humble regards,

> > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ------

> > >

> > > dear divine souls.

> > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to You,

manula

> ji

> > > for puting forwards this mail.

> > >

> > > jai sri ram

> > > kuldip

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ------

> > > , " Manjula Patel " <manjumaa@>

> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > Pranam.

> > > > Very beautiful things have been said in response to Anilji's

> beautiful

> > > > questions.

> > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening for me

so

> would

> > > like to

> > > > share it with you all and hope it would do the same for you

> too...

> > > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He explained...

> > > >

> > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print. Something

from

> Bible

> > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism. When

Adam-

> Eve

> > > were created

> > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation, they were

> naked,

> > i.e.,

> > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they ate

the

> fruit

> > > from the

> > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their nakedness,

> i.e., when

> > > they

> > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the

fruits

> of

> > > it, they came

> > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...' or they

> became ego

> > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of the

> fruits

> > > of their

> > > > action. They became shameful. So really when God

> descended the

> > > first

> > > > human, the intention was not to end but make it immortal

> just

> > > like Him. We

> > > > human missed out understanding it. the intention has

still

> > > remain the same

> > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body

> > > consciousness. As

> > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me only...

> > > > - There are three types of actions that determine our

blue

> print.

> > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed at a

> dear. Most

> > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be reverted,

> it sure

> > > > will attain

> > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have any

> control over

> > > > that arrow.

> > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let go

towards

> > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is in

> motion, yet

> > > > we have some

> > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle and thus

> stop

> > > the fruits of

> > > > such action.

> > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over

which

> we have

> > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > - In other words,

> > > > - we have done some actions in past of which we have

to

> bear the

> > > > consequences. However, He said that if you have taken

> refuge

> > > of an able

> > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by clapping,

> > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make him run

> away

> > > > before the arrow

> > > > hits him!!!

> > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as we

become

> aware of

> > > > our action, we can alter the course of such action.

> > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would have

> performed in

> > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by transforming

> our lives

> > > > like roasted

> > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me you

will

> attain

> > > Me only...

> > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives birth

to

> many

> > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on

multiplying

> > > without our

> > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is very

> > > important. So

> > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it takes any

> grosser

> > > form. With

> > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at the

> source

> > > level - not

> > > > to let them come down even at the thought level. One

> thought not

> > > only

> > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us and

the

> > > environment we

> > > > live in. It not only gives immediate

results/pleasure/pain

> but

> > > it carries

> > > > consequences in future also. It not only affects our

> present

> > > lfve but many

> > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful of

their

> > thoughts.

> > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind of

> freedom do we

> > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow has

been

> tied

> > > with a long

> > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of rope

and

> be

> > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly affairs,

> loose the

> > > > freedom and be miserable

> > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around

smartly.

> One

> > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is still

rope

> tied

> > > to a pole.

> > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from the

pole,

> > > > cow has enough strength to free herself permanently.

> > > Sarvadharmaan

> > > > parityajya...

> > > >

> > > > Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial in

> > > understanding how

> > > > our blue prints are determined and what type of

karmas/actions

> we

> > should

> > > > engage in.

> > > > humble regards,

> > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > >

> > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print why

> disturb the

> > > same.

> > > > > When God descended the first human, it is was clear that

the

> > > beginning of

> > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do good things ?

> > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Loving Divine,

Humble pranams.

You and Me are as much God as rest of His creation and non-creation

is!!!

with deep love and humble regards,

always at Thy Holy Feet

Manjula Patel

 

---

 

Respected One !,

Namasthe !!!

Yes, Ishwara Chaithanyam is in everyone and everything in equal

measure. Lord Krishna Himself says, " I am the fraud of the

fraudsters " .

It is the DOMINANCE of quality (Guna - Satva, rajas and Tamas) of

the nature that is exposed in one's thoughts/words/deeds.

Let us take everything as a GOD's Plan, as the topic of the

discussions itself suggests.

With best regards,

vm

vavamenon

---

Loving Divine,

Humble pranams.

I respect your sentiments about sanatan dharma.

If we are open to learn and accept God in all - vasudevam sarvam...

I would also accept that whatever rubbish is out there is also

God...!!!

With deep love and regards,

alwasy at Thy Divine Feet.

 

Manjula Patel

---

Respected One,

Namasthe !!!

SATHYAMEVA JAYATHE !!!

Our Great Maharishis have through countless scriptures called every human being

on this earth top SEEK AND REALISE BY EVERY ONE HIMSELF THE " ONE AND ONLY TRUTH

EXPRESSED IN TRILLIONS OF FORMS THOSE CAN BE SEEN WITH OUR NAKED EYES AND THOSE

CANNOT BE SEEN AS THE PARTS OF THIS UNIVERSE, WHICH INCLUDES THE AIR WE BREATHE

AND THE WATER WE DRINK " .

Tell me which other brain than Vyaasa Maharshi (or Valmeeki Maharshi) has given

such infinite scientific knowledge in such a short 700 slokas ?

 

THOSE WERE THE TRUTHS THAT THEY EXPERIENCED, AND ENJOYING THE ETERNAL BLISS, JOY

AND HAPPINESS (not the short-lived pleasures), OUT OF COMPASSION, THEY TRIED TO

GIVE US ALL INHERITORS WHAT THEY EXPERIENCED BY STRUCTURING OUR LIVES IN SUCH A

WAY THAT WE REMAIN CONNECTED TO THE DIVINE EVERY MOMENT OF OUR LIVES.

 

Your assumption that my mail is not related to GITAJI is wrong. My response is

very much about GITA only, because if one truly understands Bhagavad Gita, one

needs not take the help of some misleading and distracting foreign dogma.

Anyone who truly understands Bhagavad Gita understands everything. He remains

connected to Lord Krishna eternally and becomes the best and perfect devotee,

serving everyone else.

 

Bhagavad Gita is the concentrated form of sanatana dharma principles and

traditions / the science of Ishwar, His Creation that is this infinitely

indescribable Universe, the purpose of our lives on this earth, etc., so

beautifully explained through the 1400 plus authoritative scriptures and

countless other interpretations. The Science of Creation as expounded by

Sanatana Dharma, especially the quality of OMNIPRESENCE of Ishwara in each

animate and inanimate part of the Creation (including you and me), with the most

scientific and fool-proof " LAW OF KARMA "

 

For example, in sanatana dharma, the scriptures, the principle of LAW OF KARMA,

YOGA PRACTICISES, etc. have not changed and Ishwar has expressed Himself through

these Vedas and the universe itself.

 

If you are truly looking for the " mystical meanings of the scriptures " , please

read LIFE DIVINE by Ramana Maharishi and also books from Shri Aurobindo to know

about our scriptures.

 

please please please do not dilute the ALL-INCLUSIVE, UNIVERSAL, SCIENTIFIC AND

EXPERIMENTABLE/EXPERIENCEABLE sanatana dharma Principles and Traditions. That

is my only request.

 

I seek your forgiveness for any statement of mine given above being violent in

anyway.

That is my only request.

With best regards,

vm

 

P.S. : If my above email has not answered all your points in your mail, I am

answering them below, point by point :

 

Your Statement : Those who will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand

other scriptures too.

There is no mysticism in GITA, If you understand about the indestructibility of

ATMA which is part of the PARAM-ATMA, and how our ignorance has covered (Avaran)

the ATMA and also by which methods and practicises, we can remove the veil of

ignorance to see, realize and experience the ATMA (SELF) which propels us from

moment to moment. When we experience the ATMA CHAITHANYAM within us, how

blissful we become, which is the eternal nature of our SELF. The

Sat-Chit-Anandam which we are craving for is already within you….

 

Your Statement: I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as they all

talk about only one God.

" ONE GOD " is the only truth that it said in these books, .... yet it's

application is something quite different.

 

Your Statement: I thank my Guruji for showing me the path.

 

For me, this entire universe is a university and I try to learn from anything

and everything that comes across/interacts with me. For me, every source of

knowledge is a teacher and guru. I accepted Lord Krishna as my Guru, then

Vyaasa Deva, Valmeeki Maharishi, then Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, Ramana Maharishi,

and countless others, my parents, teachers in schools and colleges, persons with

whom I have discussed and exchanged knowledge-based spiritual information, and

all my surroundings, etc. I remain eternally indebted to one and all.

Thank you.

Regards,

vm

 

(modified by moderator)

 

---

 

Dear,

According to our vedas there are 84 Lac spices on this earth.

Everything works on Dharma. The karmas one does now reaps the fruits

later, in this birth or next birth. Prarabdha- Agami- Sanchita 3

types of Karma. The prarabdha karma done is the arrow let out of

bow, (said by Adi Sankara in his script Vivekachudamani). Even this

Prarabdha karma gets washed with certain slokas in which the pala

sruthi said.

Saints like Ramana, Sri Ramakrishna, Tukaram, Sakubai, Alwar etc

underwent sufferings due to prarabda karmas. But the differance

between them and us is that the sufferings was never felt by them,

for us a little pain also causes havock. Ex: Saint Ramana had

surgery done on his leg without any anesthisia and anti biotic tabs.

Dear sadaks, please understand that GOD is much above plans,

distrubance etc. Level of GOD is Paramanandham.

One attains HIM only by complete purity of mind and thought, with

constant . Bakthi.

Common sense- To reach divinity or have vision of GOD everyone knows

the difficulty to erase our Dur Gunas. Simply like that can anyone

think of distrubance. But GOD gets distrubed ONLY in circumstances

when HIS Bakthas are distrubed, but not made to distrube. This can

be known from many puranas. Ex: Jada Bharatha when he was to be

given human sacrifice GOD rescued. But Jada Bharatha never cried for

help. So also when Adi Sankara was to be slained.

GOD is said by vedas as " Aprameyam " . means beyond all five senses.

In that case with what anyone can distrube HIM

B.Sathyanarayan.

---

 

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

>

> A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it makes sense and

> is useful!

>

> My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without knowing God and

His

> Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some one must be

> God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to resolve if

> faced with problem after first accepting or rather welcoming it.

As

> Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I understand it),

the

> question is what is to be done now that the arrow has left the

bow.

> We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it in a manner

> which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid on us. Rest is

> His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

>

> Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very important

too!

> An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one faces works.

> What happens in such case is, either problem is solved in one's

> favor or even more important than that is one gets strength to face

> it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person rather than

> his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt him/her. Isn't

> this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is fairness in us! This

> is the way I see God is changing the blue print or better yet is

> modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His total freedom

> at every moment of his/her life.

> Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of changing His

> plan doesn't arise at all.

>

> Pratap Bhatt

>

> -

--

>

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans. GOD is said

> > as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects. Everything

is

> > set and computerised and networked and part of His divine plan.

> >

> > B.Sathyanarayan

> >

> > --------------------------------

--

> --

> > God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print, as someone

has

> > suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this anecdote.

> > We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay mugs and

talked

> > quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us were in a

season

> > with some unanswered questions in our lives. We talked about

> > trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and anxiety. It's

> not

> > always an easy thing to do.

> >

> > Every day we make a choice to either trust God ... or not. We

can

> > worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can choose to

> trust

> > Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and that He will

> direct

> > our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.

> >

> > It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really trust God? "

Often

> > with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried lives we

> say, " No. "

> >

> > Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His Word, the Bible?

He

> > says...

> >

> > " I will instruct you and guide you along the best pathway for

your

> > life. I will advise you and watch your progress, " This is God's

> plan.

> >

> > The choice you make today to believe those words and trust God

will

> > bring a result in your life...listen...

> >

> > " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the Lord. So

> rejoice

> > in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all those who

> choose

> > to obey Him, " the Bible says.

> >

> > Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our lives

releases

> > the peace and the comfort of His love and it will surround

> > us...holding us secure through the winds of change and

> uncertainty.

> > Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing that will be

the

> > by-product of His surrounding love.

> >

> > Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the best pathway

for

> > your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust is a choice

> we

> > can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy to

countless

> > believers.

> > Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in your life.

> > God's plan never fails.

> >

> > yeshu rathenam

> >

> > --------------------------------

--

> --

> > Hare Krsna!!

> > Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting that example

> about

> > the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks thanks!

> >

> > Daniel

> >

> > --------------------------------

--

> --

> >

> > , " sadhak_insight "

> > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Divine All,

> > > Humble pranams.

> > > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring words. It is

> > nothing

> > > but praising God / Guru.

> > > The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

> > >

> > > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> > > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by

Anilji

> > and I

> > > continued using that word so that he can also relate the

answer

> to

> > his

> > > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed, why

> bother?

> > My

> > > response was to say that destiny can be changed with our

present

> > > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of our past

> action

> > > which we can not change (though some of it can be changed by

an

> > able

> > > Guru) but we can change the course of our present and future

> > actions.

> > > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma theory.

> > > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on Karma but

> > > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> > > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past

lives),

> > >

> > > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the portion is

> > worked out in present life),

> > > - Agami (from present life what we keep on adding to

> > Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> > > lives) and

> > > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out

> immediately).

> > >

> > > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva

perspective.

> > > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27, 5:12

> > > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> > > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG 17:16

> > > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> > > * There are many slokas that reference non-doership of the

> > action

> > > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can help with

the

> > 2nd

> > > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37 (roasted seed

> don't

> > > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> > >

> > > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my Christian

friends

> to

> > > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible and Kriya

> > Yoga'.

> > > Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> > > humble regards,

> > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > >

> > > Manjula Patel

> > >

> > > ------------------------------

--

> --

> > -

> > >

> > > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> > > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at the way

> humans

> > are

> > > made, brain, which controls everything is at the top [satvik],

> > heart

> > > which controls physical functioning and emotions is in the

centre

> > > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom[Tamasik].Can

> any

> > one

> > > else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender to HIM

> > totally.

> > > G.Vaidyanathan.

> > > ------------------------------

--

> --

> > -

> > >

> > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > ----------------------------

--

> --

> > ------

> > > >

> > > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW WOW!!!!!

> > > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question is,

can

> > you

> > > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to what

> you

> > say

> > > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is the

> blue

> > > > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My Bhagavad

> > Gita is

> > > > in Spanish.

> > > > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > > ----------------------------

--

> --

> > ------

> > > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > > chatur patel

> > > >

> > > > ----------------------------

--

> --

> > ------

> > > > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > > > ----------------------------

--

> --

> > ------

> > > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in

> Christian

> > > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the Bible

myth

> > and God.

> > > > Classyoga

> > > > ----------------------------

--

> --

> > -----

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting every

> > logic or

> > > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible

would

> > never be

> > > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is or

what

> > Lord

> > > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN BHAGAVAD

> GITA.

> > In

> > > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their

> origins

> > in

> > > > Indian scriptures.

> > > > With best regards,

> > > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME, UNIVERSAL,

> > SCIENTIFIC

> > > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation that

> is

> > this

> > > > universe and its mysteries.

> > > > With best regards,

> > > > vm

> > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > ----------------------------

--

> --

> > ------

> > > > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I was

> sharing

> > it to

> > > > show how we become the creator of our own blue print which I

> > indicated

> > > > in the beginning and I thought the example was appropriate

> > otherwise I

> > > > would not have shared.

> > > >

> > > > Scriptures are written using mystical language so one can

> > interpret

> > > > them according to their level of understanding and spiritual

> > > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one, the

> example

> > > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply drop

it ;-

> )

> > > >

> > > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are more

> > elaborate

> > > > and inclusive in directing our thought process towards God.

> > Those who

> > > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand other

> > scriptures

> > > > too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as

they

> > all

> > > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for showing me

> the

> > path.

> > > >

> > > > with humble regards,

> > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > ----------------------------

--

> --

> > ------

> > > >

> > > > dear divine souls.

> > > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to You,

> manula

> > ji

> > > > for puting forwards this mail.

> > > >

> > > > jai sri ram

> > > > kuldip

> > > > ----------------------------

--

> --

> > ------

> > > > , " Manjula Patel "

<manjumaa@>

> > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > Pranam.

> > > > > Very beautiful things have been said in response to

Anilji's

> > beautiful

> > > > > questions.

> > > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening for me

> so

> > would

> > > > like to

> > > > > share it with you all and hope it would do the same for

you

> > too...

> > > > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He

explained...

> > > > >

> > > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print. Something

> from

> > Bible

> > > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism. When

> Adam-

> > Eve

> > > > were created

> > > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation, they were

> > naked,

> > > i.e.,

> > > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they ate

> the

> > fruit

> > > > from the

> > > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their nakedness,

> > i.e., when

> > > > they

> > > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the

> fruits

> > of

> > > > it, they came

> > > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...' or

they

> > became ego

> > > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of

the

> > fruits

> > > > of their

> > > > > action. They became shameful. So really when God

> > descended the

> > > > first

> > > > > human, the intention was not to end but make it

immortal

> > just

> > > > like Him. We

> > > > > human missed out understanding it. the intention has

> still

> > > > remain the same

> > > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body

> > > > consciousness. As

> > > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me

only...

> > > > > - There are three types of actions that determine our

> blue

> > print.

> > > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed at a

> > dear. Most

> > > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be

reverted,

> > it sure

> > > > > will attain

> > > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have any

> > control over

> > > > > that arrow.

> > > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let go

> towards

> > > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is in

> > motion, yet

> > > > > we have some

> > > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle and

thus

> > stop

> > > > the fruits of

> > > > > such action.

> > > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over

> which

> > we have

> > > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > > - In other words,

> > > > > - we have done some actions in past of which we have

> to

> > bear the

> > > > > consequences. However, He said that if you have

taken

> > refuge

> > > > of an able

> > > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by

clapping,

> > > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make him

run

> > away

> > > > > before the arrow

> > > > > hits him!!!

> > > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as we

> become

> > aware of

> > > > > our action, we can alter the course of such action.

> > > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would have

> > performed in

> > > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by

transforming

> > our lives

> > > > > like roasted

> > > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me you

> will

> > attain

> > > > Me only...

> > > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives

birth

> to

> > many

> > > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on

> multiplying

> > > > without our

> > > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is

very

> > > > important. So

> > > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it takes

any

> > grosser

> > > > form. With

> > > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at

the

> > source

> > > > level - not

> > > > > to let them come down even at the thought level. One

> > thought not

> > > > only

> > > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us and

> the

> > > > environment we

> > > > > live in. It not only gives immediate

> results/pleasure/pain

> > but

> > > > it carries

> > > > > consequences in future also. It not only affects our

> > present

> > > > lfve but many

> > > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful of

> their

> > > thoughts.

> > > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind of

> > freedom do we

> > > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow has

> been

> > tied

> > > > with a long

> > > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of rope

> and

> > be

> > > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly

affairs,

> > loose the

> > > > > freedom and be miserable

> > > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around

> smartly.

> > One

> > > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is still

> rope

> > tied

> > > > to a pole.

> > > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from the

> pole,

> > > > > cow has enough strength to free herself permanently.

> > > > Sarvadharmaan

> > > > > parityajya...

> > > > >

> > > > > Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial in

> > > > understanding how

> > > > > our blue prints are determined and what type of

> karmas/actions

> > we

> > > should

> > > > > engage in.

> > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > >

> > > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print why

> > disturb the

> > > > same.

> > > > > > When God descended the first human, it is was clear that

> the

> > > > beginning of

> > > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do good things ?

> > > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

God's plan cannot be disturbed. God's plan can be viewed under two

different time zones - My Desperate Time (MDT) and God's Own Time (GOT)

 

" I know discouragement comes easy, but I also know things happen when

God is ready for them to happen and not a second sooner. God knows why

he wants things to happen in the order they have to. We just need to

be ready when they come. "

 

One can recognize that there are two different time zones going on

when it comes to correlating God's will and our experience. One I'll

call My Desperate Time (MDT) and the other, God's Own Time (GOT).

 

Most of us run on MDT. MDT defines our reality. It's what we see and

feel always. We are conscious of it the minute we rise up in the

morning until we put our weary heads on the pillow at night. We

measure pleasure and pain by it; we judge our overall state-of-being

by it.

 

God, on the other hand, exists in another time zone entirely. In GOT,

His will is always done, and nothing is ever late. GOT also takes into

account the MDT of everyone, which can often get tangled up. You see

there are as many MDT zones as there are people, and that means they

can often be in conflict. But with God there is never any conflict.

There is only one GOT and as far as He is concerned, everything is

right on schedule.This is God's plan.

 

This is why it is utterly silly to wonder if God has heard our prayers

based on whether or not He has acted in MDT. God always hears our

prayers ? He has most likely already answered them ? he just answered

them in GOT - in God's Own Time.

 

Most of our issues with God are all about time zones. Think about the

hapless Bible character, Job. Job was smack in the middle of MDT all

the while he was suffering, and his best friends were trying to figure

out why God wasn't doing anything in MDT. Well, we know now that God

rarely does; He is always in GOT and we can see that now, in Job's

case, because his life ultimately caught up with GOT. Eventually, all

MDT will be GOT. In fact, that will be what heaven is all about. We

will all be kicking back in God's Own Time.

 

So faith is mostly all about time zones.Have faith in Jesus. When you

pray, know that you were heard, and move ahead, believing in GOT and ,

MDT won't be so desperate -God's Own time and My Desperate Time.

 

yeshu rathenam

--------

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Loving Divine,

> Humble pranams.

> You and Me are as much God as rest of His creation and non-creation

> is!!!

> with deep love and humble regards,

> always at Thy Holy Feet

> Manjula Patel

>

> ---

>

> Respected One !,

> Namasthe !!!

> Yes, Ishwara Chaithanyam is in everyone and everything in equal

> measure. Lord Krishna Himself says, " I am the fraud of the

> fraudsters " .

> It is the DOMINANCE of quality (Guna - Satva, rajas and Tamas) of

> the nature that is exposed in one's thoughts/words/deeds.

> Let us take everything as a GOD's Plan, as the topic of the

> discussions itself suggests.

> With best regards,

> vm

> vavamenon

> ---

> Loving Divine,

> Humble pranams.

> I respect your sentiments about sanatan dharma.

> If we are open to learn and accept God in all - vasudevam sarvam...

> I would also accept that whatever rubbish is out there is also

> God...!!!

> With deep love and regards,

> alwasy at Thy Divine Feet.

>

> Manjula Patel

> ---

> Respected One,

> Namasthe !!!

> SATHYAMEVA JAYATHE !!!

> Our Great Maharishis have through countless scriptures called every

human being on this earth top SEEK AND REALISE BY EVERY ONE HIMSELF

THE " ONE AND ONLY TRUTH EXPRESSED IN TRILLIONS OF FORMS THOSE CAN BE

SEEN WITH OUR NAKED EYES AND THOSE CANNOT BE SEEN AS THE PARTS OF THIS

UNIVERSE, WHICH INCLUDES THE AIR WE BREATHE AND THE WATER WE DRINK " .

> Tell me which other brain than Vyaasa Maharshi (or Valmeeki

Maharshi) has given such infinite scientific knowledge in such a short

700 slokas ?

>

> THOSE WERE THE TRUTHS THAT THEY EXPERIENCED, AND ENJOYING THE

ETERNAL BLISS, JOY AND HAPPINESS (not the short-lived pleasures), OUT

OF COMPASSION, THEY TRIED TO GIVE US ALL INHERITORS WHAT THEY

EXPERIENCED BY STRUCTURING OUR LIVES IN SUCH A WAY THAT WE REMAIN

CONNECTED TO THE DIVINE EVERY MOMENT OF OUR LIVES.

>

> Your assumption that my mail is not related to GITAJI is wrong. My

response is very much about GITA only, because if one truly

understands Bhagavad Gita, one needs not take the help of some

misleading and distracting foreign dogma. Anyone who truly

understands Bhagavad Gita understands everything. He remains

connected to Lord Krishna eternally and becomes the best and perfect

devotee, serving everyone else.

>

> Bhagavad Gita is the concentrated form of sanatana dharma principles

and traditions / the science of Ishwar, His Creation that is this

infinitely indescribable Universe, the purpose of our lives on this

earth, etc., so beautifully explained through the 1400 plus

authoritative scriptures and countless other interpretations. The

Science of Creation as expounded by Sanatana Dharma, especially the

quality of OMNIPRESENCE of Ishwara in each animate and inanimate part

of the Creation (including you and me), with the most scientific and

fool-proof " LAW OF KARMA "

>

> For example, in sanatana dharma, the scriptures, the principle of

LAW OF KARMA, YOGA PRACTICISES, etc. have not changed and Ishwar has

expressed Himself through these Vedas and the universe itself.

>

> If you are truly looking for the " mystical meanings of the

scriptures " , please read LIFE DIVINE by Ramana Maharishi and also

books from Shri Aurobindo to know about our scriptures.

>

> please please please do not dilute the ALL-INCLUSIVE, UNIVERSAL,

SCIENTIFIC AND EXPERIMENTABLE/EXPERIENCEABLE sanatana dharma

Principles and Traditions. That is my only request.

>

> I seek your forgiveness for any statement of mine given above being

violent in anyway.

> That is my only request.

> With best regards,

> vm

>

> P.S. : If my above email has not answered all your points in your

mail, I am answering them below, point by point :

>

> Your Statement : Those who will understand mystism of Gitaji, will

understand other scriptures too.

> There is no mysticism in GITA, If you understand about the

indestructibility of ATMA which is part of the PARAM-ATMA, and how our

ignorance has covered (Avaran) the ATMA and also by which methods and

practicises, we can remove the veil of ignorance to see, realize and

experience the ATMA (SELF) which propels us from moment to moment.

When we experience the ATMA CHAITHANYAM within us, how blissful we

become, which is the eternal nature of our SELF. The Sat-Chit-Anandam

which we are craving for is already within you….

>

> Your Statement: I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as

they all talk about only one God.

> " ONE GOD " is the only truth that it said in these books, .... yet

it's application is something quite different.

>

> Your Statement: I thank my Guruji for showing me the path.

>

> For me, this entire universe is a university and I try to learn from

anything and everything that comes across/interacts with me. For me,

every source of knowledge is a teacher and guru. I accepted Lord

Krishna as my Guru, then Vyaasa Deva, Valmeeki Maharishi, then

Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, Ramana Maharishi, and countless others, my

parents, teachers in schools and colleges, persons with whom I have

discussed and exchanged knowledge-based spiritual information, and all

my surroundings, etc. I remain eternally indebted to one and all.

> Thank you.

> Regards,

> vm

>

> (modified by moderator)

>

> ---

>

> Dear,

> According to our vedas there are 84 Lac spices on this earth.

> Everything works on Dharma. The karmas one does now reaps the fruits

> later, in this birth or next birth. Prarabdha- Agami- Sanchita 3

> types of Karma. The prarabdha karma done is the arrow let out of

> bow, (said by Adi Sankara in his script Vivekachudamani). Even this

> Prarabdha karma gets washed with certain slokas in which the pala

> sruthi said.

> Saints like Ramana, Sri Ramakrishna, Tukaram, Sakubai, Alwar etc

> underwent sufferings due to prarabda karmas. But the differance

> between them and us is that the sufferings was never felt by them,

> for us a little pain also causes havock. Ex: Saint Ramana had

> surgery done on his leg without any anesthisia and anti biotic tabs.

> Dear sadaks, please understand that GOD is much above plans,

> distrubance etc. Level of GOD is Paramanandham.

> One attains HIM only by complete purity of mind and thought, with

> constant . Bakthi.

> Common sense- To reach divinity or have vision of GOD everyone knows

> the difficulty to erase our Dur Gunas. Simply like that can anyone

> think of distrubance. But GOD gets distrubed ONLY in circumstances

> when HIS Bakthas are distrubed, but not made to distrube. This can

> be known from many puranas. Ex: Jada Bharatha when he was to be

> given human sacrifice GOD rescued. But Jada Bharatha never cried for

> help. So also when Adi Sankara was to be slained.

> GOD is said by vedas as " Aprameyam " . means beyond all five senses.

> In that case with what anyone can distrube HIM

> B.Sathyanarayan.

> ---

>

>

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

> >

> > A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it makes sense and

> > is useful!

> >

> > My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without knowing God and

> His

> > Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some one must be

> > God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to resolve if

> > faced with problem after first accepting or rather welcoming it.

> As

> > Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I understand it),

> the

> > question is what is to be done now that the arrow has left the

> bow.

> > We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it in a manner

> > which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid on us. Rest is

> > His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

> >

> > Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very important

> too!

> > An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one faces works.

> > What happens in such case is, either problem is solved in one's

> > favor or even more important than that is one gets strength to face

> > it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person rather than

> > his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt him/her. Isn't

> > this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is fairness in us! This

> > is the way I see God is changing the blue print or better yet is

> > modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His total freedom

> > at every moment of his/her life.

> > Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of changing His

> > plan doesn't arise at all.

> >

> > Pratap Bhatt

> >

> > -

> --

> >

> > , " sadhak_insight "

> > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans. GOD is said

> > > as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects. Everything

> is

> > > set and computerised and networked and part of His divine plan.

> > >

> > > B.Sathyanarayan

> > >

> > > --------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print, as someone

> has

> > > suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this anecdote.

> > > We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay mugs and

> talked

> > > quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us were in a

> season

> > > with some unanswered questions in our lives. We talked about

> > > trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and anxiety. It's

> > not

> > > always an easy thing to do.

> > >

> > > Every day we make a choice to either trust God ... or not. We

> can

> > > worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can choose to

> > trust

> > > Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and that He will

> > direct

> > > our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.

> > >

> > > It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really trust God? "

> Often

> > > with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried lives we

> > say, " No. "

> > >

> > > Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His Word, the Bible?

> He

> > > says...

> > >

> > > " I will instruct you and guide you along the best pathway for

> your

> > > life. I will advise you and watch your progress, " This is God's

> > plan.

> > >

> > > The choice you make today to believe those words and trust God

> will

> > > bring a result in your life...listen...

> > >

> > > " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the Lord. So

> > rejoice

> > > in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all those who

> > choose

> > > to obey Him, " the Bible says.

> > >

> > > Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our lives

> releases

> > > the peace and the comfort of His love and it will surround

> > > us...holding us secure through the winds of change and

> > uncertainty.

> > > Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing that will be

> the

> > > by-product of His surrounding love.

> > >

> > > Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the best pathway

> for

> > > your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust is a choice

> > we

> > > can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy to

> countless

> > > believers.

> > > Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in your life.

> > > God's plan never fails.

> > >

> > > yeshu rathenam

> > >

> > > --------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > Hare Krsna!!

> > > Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting that example

> > about

> > > the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks thanks!

> > >

> > > Daniel

> > >

> > > --------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > >

> > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Divine All,

> > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring words. It is

> > > nothing

> > > > but praising God / Guru.

> > > > The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

> > > >

> > > > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> > > > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by

> Anilji

> > > and I

> > > > continued using that word so that he can also relate the

> answer

> > to

> > > his

> > > > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed, why

> > bother?

> > > My

> > > > response was to say that destiny can be changed with our

> present

> > > > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of our past

> > action

> > > > which we can not change (though some of it can be changed by

> an

> > > able

> > > > Guru) but we can change the course of our present and future

> > > actions.

> > > > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma theory.

> > > > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on Karma but

> > > > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> > > > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past

> lives),

> > > >

> > > > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the portion is

> > > worked out in present life),

> > > > - Agami (from present life what we keep on adding to

> > > Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> > > > lives) and

> > > > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out

> > immediately).

> > > >

> > > > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva

> perspective.

> > > > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > > > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27, 5:12

> > > > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> > > > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG 17:16

> > > > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> > > > * There are many slokas that reference non-doership of the

> > > action

> > > > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can help with

> the

> > > 2nd

> > > > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37 (roasted seed

> > don't

> > > > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> > > >

> > > > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my Christian

> friends

> > to

> > > > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible and Kriya

> > > Yoga'.

> > > > Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> > > > humble regards,

> > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > >

> > > > Manjula Patel

> > > >

> > > > ------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > -

> > > >

> > > > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> > > > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at the way

> > humans

> > > are

> > > > made, brain, which controls everything is at the top [satvik],

> > > heart

> > > > which controls physical functioning and emotions is in the

> centre

> > > > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom[Tamasik].Can

> > any

> > > one

> > > > else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender to HIM

> > > totally.

> > > > G.Vaidyanathan.

> > > > ------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > -

> > > >

> > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > >

> > > > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > > > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW WOW!!!!!

> > > > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question is,

> can

> > > you

> > > > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to what

> > you

> > > say

> > > > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is the

> > blue

> > > > > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My Bhagavad

> > > Gita is

> > > > > in Spanish.

> > > > > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > > > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > > > chatur patel

> > > > >

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in

> > Christian

> > > > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the Bible

> myth

> > > and God.

> > > > > Classyoga

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > -----

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting every

> > > logic or

> > > > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible

> would

> > > never be

> > > > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is or

> what

> > > Lord

> > > > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN BHAGAVAD

> > GITA.

> > > In

> > > > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their

> > origins

> > > in

> > > > > Indian scriptures.

> > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME, UNIVERSAL,

> > > SCIENTIFIC

> > > > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation that

> > is

> > > this

> > > > > universe and its mysteries.

> > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > vm

> > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I was

> > sharing

> > > it to

> > > > > show how we become the creator of our own blue print which I

> > > indicated

> > > > > in the beginning and I thought the example was appropriate

> > > otherwise I

> > > > > would not have shared.

> > > > >

> > > > > Scriptures are written using mystical language so one can

> > > interpret

> > > > > them according to their level of understanding and spiritual

> > > > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one, the

> > example

> > > > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply drop

> it ;-

> > )

> > > > >

> > > > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are more

> > > elaborate

> > > > > and inclusive in directing our thought process towards God.

> > > Those who

> > > > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand other

> > > scriptures

> > > > > too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as

> they

> > > all

> > > > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for showing me

> > the

> > > path.

> > > > >

> > > > > with humble regards,

> > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > >

> > > > > dear divine souls.

> > > > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to You,

> > manula

> > > ji

> > > > > for puting forwards this mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > jai sri ram

> > > > > kuldip

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > , " Manjula Patel "

> <manjumaa@>

> > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > Pranam.

> > > > > > Very beautiful things have been said in response to

> Anilji's

> > > beautiful

> > > > > > questions.

> > > > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening for me

> > so

> > > would

> > > > > like to

> > > > > > share it with you all and hope it would do the same for

> you

> > > too...

> > > > > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He

> explained...

> > > > > >

> > > > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print. Something

> > from

> > > Bible

> > > > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism. When

> > Adam-

> > > Eve

> > > > > were created

> > > > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation, they were

> > > naked,

> > > > i.e.,

> > > > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they ate

> > the

> > > fruit

> > > > > from the

> > > > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their nakedness,

> > > i.e., when

> > > > > they

> > > > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the

> > fruits

> > > of

> > > > > it, they came

> > > > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...' or

> they

> > > became ego

> > > > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of

> the

> > > fruits

> > > > > of their

> > > > > > action. They became shameful. So really when God

> > > descended the

> > > > > first

> > > > > > human, the intention was not to end but make it

> immortal

> > > just

> > > > > like Him. We

> > > > > > human missed out understanding it. the intention has

> > still

> > > > > remain the same

> > > > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body

> > > > > consciousness. As

> > > > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me

> only...

> > > > > > - There are three types of actions that determine our

> > blue

> > > print.

> > > > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed at a

> > > dear. Most

> > > > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be

> reverted,

> > > it sure

> > > > > > will attain

> > > > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have any

> > > control over

> > > > > > that arrow.

> > > > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let go

> > towards

> > > > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is in

> > > motion, yet

> > > > > > we have some

> > > > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle and

> thus

> > > stop

> > > > > the fruits of

> > > > > > such action.

> > > > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over

> > which

> > > we have

> > > > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > > > - In other words,

> > > > > > - we have done some actions in past of which we have

> > to

> > > bear the

> > > > > > consequences. However, He said that if you have

> taken

> > > refuge

> > > > > of an able

> > > > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by

> clapping,

> > > > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make him

> run

> > > away

> > > > > > before the arrow

> > > > > > hits him!!!

> > > > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as we

> > become

> > > aware of

> > > > > > our action, we can alter the course of such action.

> > > > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would have

> > > performed in

> > > > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by

> transforming

> > > our lives

> > > > > > like roasted

> > > > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me you

> > will

> > > attain

> > > > > Me only...

> > > > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives

> birth

> > to

> > > many

> > > > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on

> > multiplying

> > > > > without our

> > > > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is

> very

> > > > > important. So

> > > > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it takes

> any

> > > grosser

> > > > > form. With

> > > > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at

> the

> > > source

> > > > > level - not

> > > > > > to let them come down even at the thought level. One

> > > thought not

> > > > > only

> > > > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us and

> > the

> > > > > environment we

> > > > > > live in. It not only gives immediate

> > results/pleasure/pain

> > > but

> > > > > it carries

> > > > > > consequences in future also. It not only affects our

> > > present

> > > > > lfve but many

> > > > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful of

> > their

> > > > thoughts.

> > > > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind of

> > > freedom do we

> > > > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow has

> > been

> > > tied

> > > > > with a long

> > > > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of rope

> > and

> > > be

> > > > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly

> affairs,

> > > loose the

> > > > > > freedom and be miserable

> > > > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around

> > smartly.

> > > One

> > > > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is still

> > rope

> > > tied

> > > > > to a pole.

> > > > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from the

> > pole,

> > > > > > cow has enough strength to free herself permanently.

> > > > > Sarvadharmaan

> > > > > > parityajya...

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial in

> > > > > understanding how

> > > > > > our blue prints are determined and what type of

> > karmas/actions

> > > we

> > > > should

> > > > > > engage in.

> > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > >

> > > > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print why

> > > disturb the

> > > > > same.

> > > > > > > When God descended the first human, it is was clear that

> > the

> > > > > beginning of

> > > > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do good things ?

> > > > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Namaste,

There is NO you or me or the creation. Geetha Sri Krishna said that he

is the manifestation in all. The 6 Gunas such as jealosy, greed etc

only seperates. Otherwise all are one (Advaitham). In Maha Pralayam

the whole universe goes in Vishnu and again manifests from HIM. This

concept is that all are one and the same.

 

GOD is omnipresent everyone knows. However tuning into His frequency

through total surrender we can change His course. Mother Droupati in

MahaBharat called out to God Bhagavan in distress, but until she

lifted both her hands in total surrender, He did not come to her

rescue. Similarly, mind intellect and action should be perfrectly

aligned to attain HIM. You can receive call on mobile only when,

mobile is switched on, coded to receive calls, battery in power. The

energy from tower is available all over the place in range. But to

receive one needs to be tuned in. One is not differant from Bagavan.

This is said by Saint Tukaram, Adi Sankara, etc

Many Bakthas have called for Bagavan and Bagavan was there. One can

read Baktha Mala Charitha.

 

B.Sathyanarayan

---

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Loving Divine,

> Humble pranams.

> You and Me are as much God as rest of His creation and non-creation

> is!!!

> with deep love and humble regards,

> always at Thy Holy Feet

> Manjula Patel

>

> ---

>

> Respected One !,

> Namasthe !!!

> Yes, Ishwara Chaithanyam is in everyone and everything in equal

> measure. Lord Krishna Himself says, " I am the fraud of the

> fraudsters " .

> It is the DOMINANCE of quality (Guna - Satva, rajas and Tamas) of

> the nature that is exposed in one's thoughts/words/deeds.

> Let us take everything as a GOD's Plan, as the topic of the

> discussions itself suggests.

> With best regards,

> vm

> vavamenon

> ---

> Loving Divine,

> Humble pranams.

> I respect your sentiments about sanatan dharma.

> If we are open to learn and accept God in all - vasudevam sarvam...

> I would also accept that whatever rubbish is out there is also

> God...!!!

> With deep love and regards,

> alwasy at Thy Divine Feet.

>

> Manjula Patel

> ---

> Respected One,

> Namasthe !!!

> SATHYAMEVA JAYATHE !!!

> Our Great Maharishis have through countless scriptures called every

human being on this earth top SEEK AND REALISE BY EVERY ONE HIMSELF

THE " ONE AND ONLY TRUTH EXPRESSED IN TRILLIONS OF FORMS THOSE CAN BE

SEEN WITH OUR NAKED EYES AND THOSE CANNOT BE SEEN AS THE PARTS OF THIS

UNIVERSE, WHICH INCLUDES THE AIR WE BREATHE AND THE WATER WE DRINK " .

> Tell me which other brain than Vyaasa Maharshi (or Valmeeki

Maharshi) has given such infinite scientific knowledge in such a short

700 slokas ?

>

> THOSE WERE THE TRUTHS THAT THEY EXPERIENCED, AND ENJOYING THE

ETERNAL BLISS, JOY AND HAPPINESS (not the short-lived pleasures), OUT

OF COMPASSION, THEY TRIED TO GIVE US ALL INHERITORS WHAT THEY

EXPERIENCED BY STRUCTURING OUR LIVES IN SUCH A WAY THAT WE REMAIN

CONNECTED TO THE DIVINE EVERY MOMENT OF OUR LIVES.

>

> Your assumption that my mail is not related to GITAJI is wrong. My

response is very much about GITA only, because if one truly

understands Bhagavad Gita, one needs not take the help of some

misleading and distracting foreign dogma. Anyone who truly

understands Bhagavad Gita understands everything. He remains

connected to Lord Krishna eternally and becomes the best and perfect

devotee, serving everyone else.

>

> Bhagavad Gita is the concentrated form of sanatana dharma principles

and traditions / the science of Ishwar, His Creation that is this

infinitely indescribable Universe, the purpose of our lives on this

earth, etc., so beautifully explained through the 1400 plus

authoritative scriptures and countless other interpretations. The

Science of Creation as expounded by Sanatana Dharma, especially the

quality of OMNIPRESENCE of Ishwara in each animate and inanimate part

of the Creation (including you and me), with the most scientific and

fool-proof " LAW OF KARMA "

>

> For example, in sanatana dharma, the scriptures, the principle of

LAW OF KARMA, YOGA PRACTICISES, etc. have not changed and Ishwar has

expressed Himself through these Vedas and the universe itself.

>

> If you are truly looking for the " mystical meanings of the

scriptures " , please read LIFE DIVINE by Ramana Maharishi and also

books from Shri Aurobindo to know about our scriptures.

>

> please please please do not dilute the ALL-INCLUSIVE, UNIVERSAL,

SCIENTIFIC AND EXPERIMENTABLE/EXPERIENCEABLE sanatana dharma

Principles and Traditions. That is my only request.

>

> I seek your forgiveness for any statement of mine given above being

violent in anyway.

> That is my only request.

> With best regards,

> vm

>

> P.S. : If my above email has not answered all your points in your

mail, I am answering them below, point by point :

>

> Your Statement : Those who will understand mystism of Gitaji, will

understand other scriptures too.

> There is no mysticism in GITA, If you understand about the

indestructibility of ATMA which is part of the PARAM-ATMA, and how our

ignorance has covered (Avaran) the ATMA and also by which methods and

practicises, we can remove the veil of ignorance to see, realize and

experience the ATMA (SELF) which propels us from moment to moment.

When we experience the ATMA CHAITHANYAM within us, how blissful we

become, which is the eternal nature of our SELF. The Sat-Chit-Anandam

which we are craving for is already within you….

>

> Your Statement: I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as

they all talk about only one God.

> " ONE GOD " is the only truth that it said in these books, .... yet

it's application is something quite different.

>

> Your Statement: I thank my Guruji for showing me the path.

>

> For me, this entire universe is a university and I try to learn from

anything and everything that comes across/interacts with me. For me,

every source of knowledge is a teacher and guru. I accepted Lord

Krishna as my Guru, then Vyaasa Deva, Valmeeki Maharishi, then

Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, Ramana Maharishi, and countless others, my

parents, teachers in schools and colleges, persons with whom I have

discussed and exchanged knowledge-based spiritual information, and all

my surroundings, etc. I remain eternally indebted to one and all.

> Thank you.

> Regards,

> vm

>

> (modified by moderator)

>

> ---

>

> Dear,

> According to our vedas there are 84 Lac spices on this earth.

> Everything works on Dharma. The karmas one does now reaps the fruits

> later, in this birth or next birth. Prarabdha- Agami- Sanchita 3

> types of Karma. The prarabdha karma done is the arrow let out of

> bow, (said by Adi Sankara in his script Vivekachudamani). Even this

> Prarabdha karma gets washed with certain slokas in which the pala

> sruthi said.

> Saints like Ramana, Sri Ramakrishna, Tukaram, Sakubai, Alwar etc

> underwent sufferings due to prarabda karmas. But the differance

> between them and us is that the sufferings was never felt by them,

> for us a little pain also causes havock. Ex: Saint Ramana had

> surgery done on his leg without any anesthisia and anti biotic tabs.

> Dear sadaks, please understand that GOD is much above plans,

> distrubance etc. Level of GOD is Paramanandham.

> One attains HIM only by complete purity of mind and thought, with

> constant . Bakthi.

> Common sense- To reach divinity or have vision of GOD everyone knows

> the difficulty to erase our Dur Gunas. Simply like that can anyone

> think of distrubance. But GOD gets distrubed ONLY in circumstances

> when HIS Bakthas are distrubed, but not made to distrube. This can

> be known from many puranas. Ex: Jada Bharatha when he was to be

> given human sacrifice GOD rescued. But Jada Bharatha never cried for

> help. So also when Adi Sankara was to be slained.

> GOD is said by vedas as " Aprameyam " . means beyond all five senses.

> In that case with what anyone can distrube HIM

> B.Sathyanarayan.

> ---

>

>

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

> >

> > A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it makes sense and

> > is useful!

> >

> > My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without knowing God and

> His

> > Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some one must be

> > God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to resolve if

> > faced with problem after first accepting or rather welcoming it.

> As

> > Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I understand it),

> the

> > question is what is to be done now that the arrow has left the

> bow.

> > We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it in a manner

> > which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid on us. Rest is

> > His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

> >

> > Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very important

> too!

> > An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one faces works.

> > What happens in such case is, either problem is solved in one's

> > favor or even more important than that is one gets strength to face

> > it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person rather than

> > his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt him/her. Isn't

> > this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is fairness in us! This

> > is the way I see God is changing the blue print or better yet is

> > modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His total freedom

> > at every moment of his/her life.

> > Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of changing His

> > plan doesn't arise at all.

> >

> > Pratap Bhatt

> >

> > -

> --

> >

> > , " sadhak_insight "

> > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans. GOD is said

> > > as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects. Everything

> is

> > > set and computerised and networked and part of His divine plan.

> > >

> > > B.Sathyanarayan

> > >

> > > --------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print, as someone

> has

> > > suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this anecdote.

> > > We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay mugs and

> talked

> > > quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us were in a

> season

> > > with some unanswered questions in our lives. We talked about

> > > trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and anxiety. It's

> > not

> > > always an easy thing to do.

> > >

> > > Every day we make a choice to either trust God ... or not. We

> can

> > > worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can choose to

> > trust

> > > Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and that He will

> > direct

> > > our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.

> > >

> > > It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really trust God? "

> Often

> > > with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried lives we

> > say, " No. "

> > >

> > > Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His Word, the Bible?

> He

> > > says...

> > >

> > > " I will instruct you and guide you along the best pathway for

> your

> > > life. I will advise you and watch your progress, " This is God's

> > plan.

> > >

> > > The choice you make today to believe those words and trust God

> will

> > > bring a result in your life...listen...

> > >

> > > " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the Lord. So

> > rejoice

> > > in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all those who

> > choose

> > > to obey Him, " the Bible says.

> > >

> > > Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our lives

> releases

> > > the peace and the comfort of His love and it will surround

> > > us...holding us secure through the winds of change and

> > uncertainty.

> > > Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing that will be

> the

> > > by-product of His surrounding love.

> > >

> > > Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the best pathway

> for

> > > your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust is a choice

> > we

> > > can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy to

> countless

> > > believers.

> > > Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in your life.

> > > God's plan never fails.

> > >

> > > yeshu rathenam

> > >

> > > --------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > Hare Krsna!!

> > > Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting that example

> > about

> > > the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks thanks!

> > >

> > > Daniel

> > >

> > > --------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > >

> > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Divine All,

> > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring words. It is

> > > nothing

> > > > but praising God / Guru.

> > > > The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

> > > >

> > > > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> > > > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by

> Anilji

> > > and I

> > > > continued using that word so that he can also relate the

> answer

> > to

> > > his

> > > > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed, why

> > bother?

> > > My

> > > > response was to say that destiny can be changed with our

> present

> > > > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of our past

> > action

> > > > which we can not change (though some of it can be changed by

> an

> > > able

> > > > Guru) but we can change the course of our present and future

> > > actions.

> > > > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma theory.

> > > > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on Karma but

> > > > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> > > > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past

> lives),

> > > >

> > > > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the portion is

> > > worked out in present life),

> > > > - Agami (from present life what we keep on adding to

> > > Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> > > > lives) and

> > > > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out

> > immediately).

> > > >

> > > > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva

> perspective.

> > > > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > > > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27, 5:12

> > > > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> > > > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG 17:16

> > > > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> > > > * There are many slokas that reference non-doership of the

> > > action

> > > > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can help with

> the

> > > 2nd

> > > > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37 (roasted seed

> > don't

> > > > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> > > >

> > > > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my Christian

> friends

> > to

> > > > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible and Kriya

> > > Yoga'.

> > > > Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> > > > humble regards,

> > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > >

> > > > Manjula Patel

> > > >

> > > > ------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > -

> > > >

> > > > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> > > > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at the way

> > humans

> > > are

> > > > made, brain, which controls everything is at the top [satvik],

> > > heart

> > > > which controls physical functioning and emotions is in the

> centre

> > > > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom[Tamasik].Can

> > any

> > > one

> > > > else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender to HIM

> > > totally.

> > > > G.Vaidyanathan.

> > > > ------------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > -

> > > >

> > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > >

> > > > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > > > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW WOW!!!!!

> > > > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question is,

> can

> > > you

> > > > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to what

> > you

> > > say

> > > > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is the

> > blue

> > > > > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My Bhagavad

> > > Gita is

> > > > > in Spanish.

> > > > > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > > > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > > > chatur patel

> > > > >

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in

> > Christian

> > > > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the Bible

> myth

> > > and God.

> > > > > Classyoga

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > -----

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting every

> > > logic or

> > > > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible

> would

> > > never be

> > > > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is or

> what

> > > Lord

> > > > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN BHAGAVAD

> > GITA.

> > > In

> > > > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their

> > origins

> > > in

> > > > > Indian scriptures.

> > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME, UNIVERSAL,

> > > SCIENTIFIC

> > > > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation that

> > is

> > > this

> > > > > universe and its mysteries.

> > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > vm

> > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I was

> > sharing

> > > it to

> > > > > show how we become the creator of our own blue print which I

> > > indicated

> > > > > in the beginning and I thought the example was appropriate

> > > otherwise I

> > > > > would not have shared.

> > > > >

> > > > > Scriptures are written using mystical language so one can

> > > interpret

> > > > > them according to their level of understanding and spiritual

> > > > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one, the

> > example

> > > > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply drop

> it ;-

> > )

> > > > >

> > > > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are more

> > > elaborate

> > > > > and inclusive in directing our thought process towards God.

> > > Those who

> > > > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand other

> > > scriptures

> > > > > too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as

> they

> > > all

> > > > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for showing me

> > the

> > > path.

> > > > >

> > > > > with humble regards,

> > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > >

> > > > > dear divine souls.

> > > > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to You,

> > manula

> > > ji

> > > > > for puting forwards this mail.

> > > > >

> > > > > jai sri ram

> > > > > kuldip

> > > > > ----------------------------

> --

> > --

> > > ------

> > > > > , " Manjula Patel "

> <manjumaa@>

> > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > Pranam.

> > > > > > Very beautiful things have been said in response to

> Anilji's

> > > beautiful

> > > > > > questions.

> > > > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening for me

> > so

> > > would

> > > > > like to

> > > > > > share it with you all and hope it would do the same for

> you

> > > too...

> > > > > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He

> explained...

> > > > > >

> > > > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print. Something

> > from

> > > Bible

> > > > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism. When

> > Adam-

> > > Eve

> > > > > were created

> > > > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation, they were

> > > naked,

> > > > i.e.,

> > > > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they ate

> > the

> > > fruit

> > > > > from the

> > > > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their nakedness,

> > > i.e., when

> > > > > they

> > > > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the

> > fruits

> > > of

> > > > > it, they came

> > > > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...' or

> they

> > > became ego

> > > > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of

> the

> > > fruits

> > > > > of their

> > > > > > action. They became shameful. So really when God

> > > descended the

> > > > > first

> > > > > > human, the intention was not to end but make it

> immortal

> > > just

> > > > > like Him. We

> > > > > > human missed out understanding it. the intention has

> > still

> > > > > remain the same

> > > > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body

> > > > > consciousness. As

> > > > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me

> only...

> > > > > > - There are three types of actions that determine our

> > blue

> > > print.

> > > > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed at a

> > > dear. Most

> > > > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be

> reverted,

> > > it sure

> > > > > > will attain

> > > > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have any

> > > control over

> > > > > > that arrow.

> > > > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let go

> > towards

> > > > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is in

> > > motion, yet

> > > > > > we have some

> > > > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle and

> thus

> > > stop

> > > > > the fruits of

> > > > > > such action.

> > > > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over

> > which

> > > we have

> > > > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > > > - In other words,

> > > > > > - we have done some actions in past of which we have

> > to

> > > bear the

> > > > > > consequences. However, He said that if you have

> taken

> > > refuge

> > > > > of an able

> > > > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by

> clapping,

> > > > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make him

> run

> > > away

> > > > > > before the arrow

> > > > > > hits him!!!

> > > > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as we

> > become

> > > aware of

> > > > > > our action, we can alter the course of such action.

> > > > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would have

> > > performed in

> > > > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by

> transforming

> > > our lives

> > > > > > like roasted

> > > > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me you

> > will

> > > attain

> > > > > Me only...

> > > > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives

> birth

> > to

> > > many

> > > > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on

> > multiplying

> > > > > without our

> > > > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is

> very

> > > > > important. So

> > > > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it takes

> any

> > > grosser

> > > > > form. With

> > > > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at

> the

> > > source

> > > > > level - not

> > > > > > to let them come down even at the thought level. One

> > > thought not

> > > > > only

> > > > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us and

> > the

> > > > > environment we

> > > > > > live in. It not only gives immediate

> > results/pleasure/pain

> > > but

> > > > > it carries

> > > > > > consequences in future also. It not only affects our

> > > present

> > > > > lfve but many

> > > > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful of

> > their

> > > > thoughts.

> > > > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind of

> > > freedom do we

> > > > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow has

> > been

> > > tied

> > > > > with a long

> > > > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of rope

> > and

> > > be

> > > > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly

> affairs,

> > > loose the

> > > > > > freedom and be miserable

> > > > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around

> > smartly.

> > > One

> > > > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is still

> > rope

> > > tied

> > > > > to a pole.

> > > > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from the

> > pole,

> > > > > > cow has enough strength to free herself permanently.

> > > > > Sarvadharmaan

> > > > > > parityajya...

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial in

> > > > > understanding how

> > > > > > our blue prints are determined and what type of

> > karmas/actions

> > > we

> > > > should

> > > > > > engage in.

> > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > >

> > > > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print why

> > > disturb the

> > > > > same.

> > > > > > > When God descended the first human, it is was clear that

> > the

> > > > > beginning of

> > > > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do good things ?

> > > > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Namasté

 

As Lord Krisna explained to Prince Arjuna, we must exercise our

duty. Trying to change it will be serving only our ego. For that

is the key: God does not think, for God is above the thought

process. We should only find peace through the acceptance that God

is the Enjoyer of all offerings and austerities, as the Infinite Lord of

Creation, above all, and as the Dearest Friend of all. ( " He

finds peace who knows Me as the Enjoyer of all oferings and

austerities, as the Infinite Lord of creation, and as the Dearest

Friend of all " ). Like an ocean trying to absorb all streams as they

come. Like the drop seeking reintegration in that vast ocean.

 

The one true desire that our ego may generate is that of providing

goodness and generosity to all sentient beings. To see if we can

finaly emanate love and feel God´s Love as vehicles for God´s Plans.

 

So we can not change the course set out in the creation process. We

should live it and allow God to see the world through us.

 

Peace and Love

José Rodriguez

 

---

Dear Sadhaks,

Pranam,

It is futile to think that Gods plans can be disturbed. No one has

power to do so. Goswami Tulsidasji wrote in Manas " RAM KINH CHAHAI

SOI HOI, KARE ANYATHA AS NAHI KOI " . So Always say " SIYA RAM JAY RAM

JAY JAY RAM "

JAY SHRI RAM,

Raja Gurdasani

 

---

 

 

 

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> God's plan cannot be disturbed. God's plan can be viewed under two

> different time zones - My Desperate Time (MDT) and God's Own Time

(GOT)

>

> " I know discouragement comes easy, but I also know things happen

when

> God is ready for them to happen and not a second sooner. God knows

why

> he wants things to happen in the order they have to. We just need

to

> be ready when they come. "

>

> One can recognize that there are two different time zones going on

> when it comes to correlating God's will and our experience. One

I'll

> call My Desperate Time (MDT) and the other, God's Own Time (GOT).

>

> Most of us run on MDT. MDT defines our reality. It's what we see

and

> feel always. We are conscious of it the minute we rise up in the

> morning until we put our weary heads on the pillow at night. We

> measure pleasure and pain by it; we judge our overall state-of-

being

> by it.

>

> God, on the other hand, exists in another time zone entirely. In

GOT,

> His will is always done, and nothing is ever late. GOT also takes

into

> account the MDT of everyone, which can often get tangled up. You

see

> there are as many MDT zones as there are people, and that means

they

> can often be in conflict. But with God there is never any conflict.

> There is only one GOT and as far as He is concerned, everything is

> right on schedule.This is God's plan.

>

> This is why it is utterly silly to wonder if God has heard our

prayers

> based on whether or not He has acted in MDT. God always hears our

> prayers ? He has most likely already answered them ? he just

answered

> them in GOT - in God's Own Time.

>

> Most of our issues with God are all about time zones. Think about

the

> hapless Bible character, Job. Job was smack in the middle of MDT

all

> the while he was suffering, and his best friends were trying to

figure

> out why God wasn't doing anything in MDT. Well, we know now that

God

> rarely does; He is always in GOT and we can see that now, in Job's

> case, because his life ultimately caught up with GOT. Eventually,

all

> MDT will be GOT. In fact, that will be what heaven is all about. We

> will all be kicking back in God's Own Time.

>

> So faith is mostly all about time zones.Have faith in Jesus. When

you

> pray, know that you were heard, and move ahead, believing in GOT

and ,

> MDT won't be so desperate -God's Own time and My Desperate Time.

>

> yeshu rathenam

> -

-------

>

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > Loving Divine,

> > Humble pranams.

> > You and Me are as much God as rest of His creation and non-

creation

> > is!!!

> > with deep love and humble regards,

> > always at Thy Holy Feet

> > Manjula Patel

> >

> > --------------------------------

----

> >

> > Respected One !,

> > Namasthe !!!

> > Yes, Ishwara Chaithanyam is in everyone and everything in equal

> > measure. Lord Krishna Himself says, " I am the fraud of the

> > fraudsters " .

> > It is the DOMINANCE of quality (Guna - Satva, rajas and Tamas) of

> > the nature that is exposed in one's thoughts/words/deeds.

> > Let us take everything as a GOD's Plan, as the topic of the

> > discussions itself suggests.

> > With best regards,

> > vm

> > vavamenon

> > --------------------------------

----

> > Loving Divine,

> > Humble pranams.

> > I respect your sentiments about sanatan dharma.

> > If we are open to learn and accept God in all - vasudevam

sarvam...

> > I would also accept that whatever rubbish is out there is also

> > God...!!!

> > With deep love and regards,

> > alwasy at Thy Divine Feet.

> >

> > Manjula Patel

> > --------------------------------

----

> > Respected One,

> > Namasthe !!!

> > SATHYAMEVA JAYATHE !!!

> > Our Great Maharishis have through countless scriptures called

every

> human being on this earth top SEEK AND REALISE BY EVERY ONE HIMSELF

> THE " ONE AND ONLY TRUTH EXPRESSED IN TRILLIONS OF FORMS THOSE CAN

BE

> SEEN WITH OUR NAKED EYES AND THOSE CANNOT BE SEEN AS THE PARTS OF

THIS

> UNIVERSE, WHICH INCLUDES THE AIR WE BREATHE AND THE WATER WE

DRINK " .

> > Tell me which other brain than Vyaasa Maharshi (or Valmeeki

> Maharshi) has given such infinite scientific knowledge in such a

short

> 700 slokas ?

> >

> > THOSE WERE THE TRUTHS THAT THEY EXPERIENCED, AND ENJOYING THE

> ETERNAL BLISS, JOY AND HAPPINESS (not the short-lived pleasures),

OUT

> OF COMPASSION, THEY TRIED TO GIVE US ALL INHERITORS WHAT THEY

> EXPERIENCED BY STRUCTURING OUR LIVES IN SUCH A WAY THAT WE REMAIN

> CONNECTED TO THE DIVINE EVERY MOMENT OF OUR LIVES.

> >

> > Your assumption that my mail is not related to GITAJI is wrong.

My

> response is very much about GITA only, because if one truly

> understands Bhagavad Gita, one needs not take the help of some

> misleading and distracting foreign dogma. Anyone who truly

> understands Bhagavad Gita understands everything. He remains

> connected to Lord Krishna eternally and becomes the best and

perfect

> devotee, serving everyone else.

> >

> > Bhagavad Gita is the concentrated form of sanatana dharma

principles

> and traditions / the science of Ishwar, His Creation that is this

> infinitely indescribable Universe, the purpose of our lives on this

> earth, etc., so beautifully explained through the 1400 plus

> authoritative scriptures and countless other interpretations. The

> Science of Creation as expounded by Sanatana Dharma, especially the

> quality of OMNIPRESENCE of Ishwara in each animate and inanimate

part

> of the Creation (including you and me), with the most scientific

and

> fool-proof " LAW OF KARMA "

> >

> > For example, in sanatana dharma, the scriptures, the principle of

> LAW OF KARMA, YOGA PRACTICISES, etc. have not changed and Ishwar

has

> expressed Himself through these Vedas and the universe itself.

> >

> > If you are truly looking for the " mystical meanings of the

> scriptures " , please read LIFE DIVINE by Ramana Maharishi and also

> books from Shri Aurobindo to know about our scriptures.

> >

> > please please please do not dilute the ALL-INCLUSIVE, UNIVERSAL,

> SCIENTIFIC AND EXPERIMENTABLE/EXPERIENCEABLE sanatana dharma

> Principles and Traditions. That is my only request.

> >

> > I seek your forgiveness for any statement of mine given above

being

> violent in anyway.

> > That is my only request.

> > With best regards,

> > vm

> >

> > P.S. : If my above email has not answered all your points in your

> mail, I am answering them below, point by point :

> >

> > Your Statement : Those who will understand mystism of Gitaji,

will

> understand other scriptures too.

> > There is no mysticism in GITA, If you understand about the

> indestructibility of ATMA which is part of the PARAM-ATMA, and how

our

> ignorance has covered (Avaran) the ATMA and also by which methods

and

> practicises, we can remove the veil of ignorance to see, realize

and

> experience the ATMA (SELF) which propels us from moment to moment.

> When we experience the ATMA CHAITHANYAM within us, how blissful we

> become, which is the eternal nature of our SELF. The Sat-Chit-

Anandam

> which we are craving for is already within you….

> >

> > Your Statement: I am open and respectful of other scriptures

too as

> they all talk about only one God.

> > " ONE GOD " is the only truth that it said in these books, .... yet

> it's application is something quite different.

> >

> > Your Statement: I thank my Guruji for showing me the path.

> >

> > For me, this entire universe is a university and I try to learn

from

> anything and everything that comes across/interacts with me. For

me,

> every source of knowledge is a teacher and guru. I accepted Lord

> Krishna as my Guru, then Vyaasa Deva, Valmeeki Maharishi, then

> Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, Ramana Maharishi, and countless others, my

> parents, teachers in schools and colleges, persons with whom I have

> discussed and exchanged knowledge-based spiritual information, and

all

> my surroundings, etc. I remain eternally indebted to one and all.

> > Thank you.

> > Regards,

> > vm

> >

> > (modified by moderator)

> >

> > --------------------------------

----

> >

> > Dear,

> > According to our vedas there are 84 Lac spices on this earth.

> > Everything works on Dharma. The karmas one does now reaps the

fruits

> > later, in this birth or next birth. Prarabdha- Agami- Sanchita 3

> > types of Karma. The prarabdha karma done is the arrow let out of

> > bow, (said by Adi Sankara in his script Vivekachudamani). Even

this

> > Prarabdha karma gets washed with certain slokas in which the pala

> > sruthi said.

> > Saints like Ramana, Sri Ramakrishna, Tukaram, Sakubai, Alwar etc

> > underwent sufferings due to prarabda karmas. But the differance

> > between them and us is that the sufferings was never felt by

them,

> > for us a little pain also causes havock. Ex: Saint Ramana had

> > surgery done on his leg without any anesthisia and anti biotic

tabs.

> > Dear sadaks, please understand that GOD is much above plans,

> > distrubance etc. Level of GOD is Paramanandham.

> > One attains HIM only by complete purity of mind and thought, with

> > constant . Bakthi.

> > Common sense- To reach divinity or have vision of GOD everyone

knows

> > the difficulty to erase our Dur Gunas. Simply like that can

anyone

> > think of distrubance. But GOD gets distrubed ONLY in

circumstances

> > when HIS Bakthas are distrubed, but not made to distrube. This

can

> > be known from many puranas. Ex: Jada Bharatha when he was to be

> > given human sacrifice GOD rescued. But Jada Bharatha never cried

for

> > help. So also when Adi Sankara was to be slained.

> > GOD is said by vedas as " Aprameyam " . means beyond all five

senses.

> > In that case with what anyone can distrube HIM

> > B.Sathyanarayan.

> > --------------------------------

----

> >

> >

> > , " sadhak_insight "

> > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

> > >

> > > A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it makes sense

and

> > > is useful!

> > >

> > > My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without knowing God

and

> > His

> > > Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some one must be

> > > God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to resolve

if

> > > faced with problem after first accepting or rather welcoming

it.

> > As

> > > Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I understand it),

> > the

> > > question is what is to be done now that the arrow has left the

> > bow.

> > > We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it in a manner

> > > which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid on us.

Rest is

> > > His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

> > >

> > > Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very important

> > too!

> > > An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one faces

works.

> > > What happens in such case is, either problem is solved in one's

> > > favor or even more important than that is one gets strength to

face

> > > it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person rather

than

> > > his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt him/her.

Isn't

> > > this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is fairness in us!

This

> > > is the way I see God is changing the blue print or better yet

is

> > > modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His total

freedom

> > > at every moment of his/her life.

> > > Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of changing

His

> > > plan doesn't arise at all.

> > >

> > > Pratap Bhatt

> > >

> > > ------------------------------

----

> > --

> > >

> > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans. GOD is said

> > > > as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects.

Everything

> > is

> > > > set and computerised and networked and part of His divine

plan.

> > > >

> > > > B.Sathyanarayan

> > > >

> > > > ----------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print, as

someone

> > has

> > > > suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this anecdote.

> > > > We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay mugs and

> > talked

> > > > quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us were in a

> > season

> > > > with some unanswered questions in our lives. We talked about

> > > > trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and anxiety.

It's

> > > not

> > > > always an easy thing to do.

> > > >

> > > > Every day we make a choice to either trust God ... or not. We

> > can

> > > > worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can choose to

> > > trust

> > > > Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and that He will

> > > direct

> > > > our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.

> > > >

> > > > It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really trust God? "

> > Often

> > > > with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried lives we

> > > say, " No. "

> > > >

> > > > Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His Word, the

Bible?

> > He

> > > > says...

> > > >

> > > > " I will instruct you and guide you along the best pathway for

> > your

> > > > life. I will advise you and watch your progress, " This is

God's

> > > plan.

> > > >

> > > > The choice you make today to believe those words and trust

God

> > will

> > > > bring a result in your life...listen...

> > > >

> > > > " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the Lord. So

> > > rejoice

> > > > in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all those who

> > > choose

> > > > to obey Him, " the Bible says.

> > > >

> > > > Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our lives

> > releases

> > > > the peace and the comfort of His love and it will surround

> > > > us...holding us secure through the winds of change and

> > > uncertainty.

> > > > Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing that will

be

> > the

> > > > by-product of His surrounding love.

> > > >

> > > > Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the best

pathway

> > for

> > > > your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust is a

choice

> > > we

> > > > can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy to

> > countless

> > > > believers.

> > > > Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in your

life.

> > > > God's plan never fails.

> > > >

> > > > yeshu rathenam

> > > >

> > > > ----------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > Hare Krsna!!

> > > > Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting that

example

> > > about

> > > > the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks thanks!

> > > >

> > > > Daniel

> > > >

> > > > ----------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > >

> > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Divine All,

> > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring words. It

is

> > > > nothing

> > > > > but praising God / Guru.

> > > > > The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

> > > > >

> > > > > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> > > > > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by

> > Anilji

> > > > and I

> > > > > continued using that word so that he can also relate the

> > answer

> > > to

> > > > his

> > > > > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed, why

> > > bother?

> > > > My

> > > > > response was to say that destiny can be changed with our

> > present

> > > > > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of our past

> > > action

> > > > > which we can not change (though some of it can be changed

by

> > an

> > > > able

> > > > > Guru) but we can change the course of our present and

future

> > > > actions.

> > > > > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma

theory.

> > > > > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on Karma

but

> > > > > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> > > > > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past

> > lives),

> > > > >

> > > > > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the portion

is

> > > > worked out in present life),

> > > > > - Agami (from present life what we keep on

adding to

> > > > Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> > > > > lives) and

> > > > > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out

> > > immediately).

> > > > >

> > > > > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva

> > perspective.

> > > > > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > > > > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27,

5:12

> > > > > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> > > > > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG

17:16

> > > > > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> > > > > * There are many slokas that reference non-doership of

the

> > > > action

> > > > > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can help

with

> > the

> > > > 2nd

> > > > > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37 (roasted

seed

> > > don't

> > > > > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> > > > >

> > > > > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my Christian

> > friends

> > > to

> > > > > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible and

Kriya

> > > > Yoga'.

> > > > > Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > >

> > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > >

> > > > > --------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > -

> > > > >

> > > > > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> > > > > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at the way

> > > humans

> > > > are

> > > > > made, brain, which controls everything is at the top

[satvik],

> > > > heart

> > > > > which controls physical functioning and emotions is in the

> > centre

> > > > > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom

[Tamasik].Can

> > > any

> > > > one

> > > > > else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender to HIM

> > > > totally.

> > > > > G.Vaidyanathan.

> > > > > --------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > -

> > > > >

> > > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > ------

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > > > > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW

WOW!!!!!

> > > > > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question

is,

> > can

> > > > you

> > > > > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to

what

> > > you

> > > > say

> > > > > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is

the

> > > blue

> > > > > > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My

Bhagavad

> > > > Gita is

> > > > > > in Spanish.

> > > > > > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > > > > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > > > > ------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > ------

> > > > > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > > > > chatur patel

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > ------

> > > > > > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > > > > > ------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > ------

> > > > > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in

> > > Christian

> > > > > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the Bible

> > myth

> > > > and God.

> > > > > > Classyoga

> > > > > > ------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > -----

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting

every

> > > > logic or

> > > > > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible

> > would

> > > > never be

> > > > > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is or

> > what

> > > > Lord

> > > > > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN BHAGAVAD

> > > GITA.

> > > > In

> > > > > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their

> > > origins

> > > > in

> > > > > > Indian scriptures.

> > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME, UNIVERSAL,

> > > > SCIENTIFIC

> > > > > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation

that

> > > is

> > > > this

> > > > > > universe and its mysteries.

> > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > vm

> > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > ------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > ------

> > > > > > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I was

> > > sharing

> > > > it to

> > > > > > show how we become the creator of our own blue print

which I

> > > > indicated

> > > > > > in the beginning and I thought the example was

appropriate

> > > > otherwise I

> > > > > > would not have shared.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Scriptures are written using mystical language so one can

> > > > interpret

> > > > > > them according to their level of understanding and

spiritual

> > > > > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one, the

> > > example

> > > > > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply drop

> > it ;-

> > > )

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are

more

> > > > elaborate

> > > > > > and inclusive in directing our thought process towards

God.

> > > > Those who

> > > > > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand other

> > > > scriptures

> > > > > > too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as

> > they

> > > > all

> > > > > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for

showing me

> > > the

> > > > path.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > with humble regards,

> > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > ------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > ------

> > > > > >

> > > > > > dear divine souls.

> > > > > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to You,

> > > manula

> > > > ji

> > > > > > for puting forwards this mail.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > jai sri ram

> > > > > > kuldip

> > > > > > ------------------------

----

> > --

> > > --

> > > > ------

> > > > > > , " Manjula Patel "

> > <manjumaa@>

> > > > wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > > Pranam.

> > > > > > > Very beautiful things have been said in response to

> > Anilji's

> > > > beautiful

> > > > > > > questions.

> > > > > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening

for me

> > > so

> > > > would

> > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > share it with you all and hope it would do the same for

> > you

> > > > too...

> > > > > > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > > > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He

> > explained...

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print.

Something

> > > from

> > > > Bible

> > > > > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism.

When

> > > Adam-

> > > > Eve

> > > > > > were created

> > > > > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation, they

were

> > > > naked,

> > > > > i.e.,

> > > > > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they

ate

> > > the

> > > > fruit

> > > > > > from the

> > > > > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their

nakedness,

> > > > i.e., when

> > > > > > they

> > > > > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the

> > > fruits

> > > > of

> > > > > > it, they came

> > > > > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...' or

> > they

> > > > became ego

> > > > > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of

> > the

> > > > fruits

> > > > > > of their

> > > > > > > action. They became shameful. So really when God

> > > > descended the

> > > > > > first

> > > > > > > human, the intention was not to end but make it

> > immortal

> > > > just

> > > > > > like Him. We

> > > > > > > human missed out understanding it. the intention

has

> > > still

> > > > > > remain the same

> > > > > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body

> > > > > > consciousness. As

> > > > > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me

> > only...

> > > > > > > - There are three types of actions that determine

our

> > > blue

> > > > print.

> > > > > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > > > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed

at a

> > > > dear. Most

> > > > > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be

> > reverted,

> > > > it sure

> > > > > > > will attain

> > > > > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have

any

> > > > control over

> > > > > > > that arrow.

> > > > > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let go

> > > towards

> > > > > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is

in

> > > > motion, yet

> > > > > > > we have some

> > > > > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle and

> > thus

> > > > stop

> > > > > > the fruits of

> > > > > > > such action.

> > > > > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over

> > > which

> > > > we have

> > > > > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > > > > - In other words,

> > > > > > > - we have done some actions in past of which we

have

> > > to

> > > > bear the

> > > > > > > consequences. However, He said that if you have

> > taken

> > > > refuge

> > > > > > of an able

> > > > > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by

> > clapping,

> > > > > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make him

> > run

> > > > away

> > > > > > > before the arrow

> > > > > > > hits him!!!

> > > > > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as we

> > > become

> > > > aware of

> > > > > > > our action, we can alter the course of such

action.

> > > > > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would

have

> > > > performed in

> > > > > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by

> > transforming

> > > > our lives

> > > > > > > like roasted

> > > > > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me

you

> > > will

> > > > attain

> > > > > > Me only...

> > > > > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives

> > birth

> > > to

> > > > many

> > > > > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on

> > > multiplying

> > > > > > without our

> > > > > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is

> > very

> > > > > > important. So

> > > > > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it takes

> > any

> > > > grosser

> > > > > > form. With

> > > > > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at

> > the

> > > > source

> > > > > > level - not

> > > > > > > to let them come down even at the thought level.

One

> > > > thought not

> > > > > > only

> > > > > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us

and

> > > the

> > > > > > environment we

> > > > > > > live in. It not only gives immediate

> > > results/pleasure/pain

> > > > but

> > > > > > it carries

> > > > > > > consequences in future also. It not only affects

our

> > > > present

> > > > > > lfve but many

> > > > > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful

of

> > > their

> > > > > thoughts.

> > > > > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind

of

> > > > freedom do we

> > > > > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow

has

> > > been

> > > > tied

> > > > > > with a long

> > > > > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > > > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of

rope

> > > and

> > > > be

> > > > > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly

> > affairs,

> > > > loose the

> > > > > > > freedom and be miserable

> > > > > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around

> > > smartly.

> > > > One

> > > > > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is

still

> > > rope

> > > > tied

> > > > > > to a pole.

> > > > > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from

the

> > > pole,

> > > > > > > cow has enough strength to free herself

permanently.

> > > > > > Sarvadharmaan

> > > > > > > parityajya...

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial

in

> > > > > > understanding how

> > > > > > > our blue prints are determined and what type of

> > > karmas/actions

> > > > we

> > > > > should

> > > > > > > engage in.

> > > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print

why

> > > > disturb the

> > > > > > same.

> > > > > > > > When God descended the first human, it is was clear

that

> > > the

> > > > > > beginning of

> > > > > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do good

things ?

> > > > > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Namaste to all believers.

 

I have always lived my life as planned by God Almighty.

Now that I have matured I realize that lots of people played around

with my emotions and life. what you all have to say about Insurance

policy plans they made after using me to make lots money for

themselves. I don't think those are God's plan for my life.

I am sure I am not the only victim of these criminally intellegent

non-humans.

Where is God? Is He on vacation?

Does anyone have answers ?

Do not loose faith even if sacrificed. I don't think God would abuse

innocent women.

Shanti to All.

 

Shilpa

 

-

 

Dear Dinine souls,,

 

my humble parnaams..

 

Mr kuldip suri

-

 

 

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Namasté

>

> As Lord Krisna explained to Prince Arjuna, we must exercise our

> duty. Trying to change it will be serving only our ego. For that

> is the key: God does not think, for God is above the thought

> process. We should only find peace through the acceptance that God

> is the Enjoyer of all offerings and austerities, as the Infinite

Lord of Creation, above all, and as the Dearest Friend of all. ( " He

> finds peace who knows Me as the Enjoyer of all oferings and

> austerities, as the Infinite Lord of creation, and as the Dearest

> Friend of all " ). Like an ocean trying to absorb all streams as

they

> come. Like the drop seeking reintegration in that vast ocean.

>

> The one true desire that our ego may generate is that of providing

> goodness and generosity to all sentient beings. To see if we can

> finaly emanate love and feel God´s Love as vehicles for God´s

Plans.

>

> So we can not change the course set out in the creation process.

We

> should live it and allow God to see the world through us.

>

> Peace and Love

> José Rodriguez

>

> -

--

> Dear Sadhaks,

> Pranam,

> It is futile to think that Gods plans can be disturbed. No one has

> power to do so. Goswami Tulsidasji wrote in Manas " RAM KINH CHAHAI

> SOI HOI, KARE ANYATHA AS NAHI KOI " . So Always say " SIYA RAM JAY RAM

> JAY JAY RAM "

> JAY SHRI RAM,

> Raja Gurdasani

>

> -

--

>

>

>

>

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > God's plan cannot be disturbed. God's plan can be viewed under

two

> > different time zones - My Desperate Time (MDT) and God's Own Time

> (GOT)

> >

> > " I know discouragement comes easy, but I also know things happen

> when

> > God is ready for them to happen and not a second sooner. God

knows

> why

> > he wants things to happen in the order they have to. We just need

> to

> > be ready when they come. "

> >

> > One can recognize that there are two different time zones going

on

> > when it comes to correlating God's will and our experience. One

> I'll

> > call My Desperate Time (MDT) and the other, God's Own Time (GOT).

> >

> > Most of us run on MDT. MDT defines our reality. It's what we see

> and

> > feel always. We are conscious of it the minute we rise up in the

> > morning until we put our weary heads on the pillow at night. We

> > measure pleasure and pain by it; we judge our overall state-of-

> being

> > by it.

> >

> > God, on the other hand, exists in another time zone entirely. In

> GOT,

> > His will is always done, and nothing is ever late. GOT also takes

> into

> > account the MDT of everyone, which can often get tangled up. You

> see

> > there are as many MDT zones as there are people, and that means

> they

> > can often be in conflict. But with God there is never any

conflict.

> > There is only one GOT and as far as He is concerned, everything

is

> > right on schedule.This is God's plan.

> >

> > This is why it is utterly silly to wonder if God has heard our

> prayers

> > based on whether or not He has acted in MDT. God always hears our

> > prayers ? He has most likely already answered them ? he just

> answered

> > them in GOT - in God's Own Time.

> >

> > Most of our issues with God are all about time zones. Think about

> the

> > hapless Bible character, Job. Job was smack in the middle of MDT

> all

> > the while he was suffering, and his best friends were trying to

> figure

> > out why God wasn't doing anything in MDT. Well, we know now that

> God

> > rarely does; He is always in GOT and we can see that now, in

Job's

> > case, because his life ultimately caught up with GOT. Eventually,

> all

> > MDT will be GOT. In fact, that will be what heaven is all about.

We

> > will all be kicking back in God's Own Time.

> >

> > So faith is mostly all about time zones.Have faith in Jesus. When

> you

> > pray, know that you were heard, and move ahead, believing in GOT

> and ,

> > MDT won't be so desperate -God's Own time and My Desperate Time.

> >

> > yeshu rathenam

> > --------------------------------

--

> -------

> >

> > , " sadhak_insight "

> > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Loving Divine,

> > > Humble pranams.

> > > You and Me are as much God as rest of His creation and non-

> creation

> > > is!!!

> > > with deep love and humble regards,

> > > always at Thy Holy Feet

> > > Manjula Patel

> > >

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ----

> > >

> > > Respected One !,

> > > Namasthe !!!

> > > Yes, Ishwara Chaithanyam is in everyone and everything in equal

> > > measure. Lord Krishna Himself says, " I am the fraud of the

> > > fraudsters " .

> > > It is the DOMINANCE of quality (Guna - Satva, rajas and Tamas)

of

> > > the nature that is exposed in one's thoughts/words/deeds.

> > > Let us take everything as a GOD's Plan, as the topic of the

> > > discussions itself suggests.

> > > With best regards,

> > > vm

> > > vavamenon

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ----

> > > Loving Divine,

> > > Humble pranams.

> > > I respect your sentiments about sanatan dharma.

> > > If we are open to learn and accept God in all - vasudevam

> sarvam...

> > > I would also accept that whatever rubbish is out there is also

> > > God...!!!

> > > With deep love and regards,

> > > alwasy at Thy Divine Feet.

> > >

> > > Manjula Patel

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ----

> > > Respected One,

> > > Namasthe !!!

> > > SATHYAMEVA JAYATHE !!!

> > > Our Great Maharishis have through countless scriptures called

> every

> > human being on this earth top SEEK AND REALISE BY EVERY ONE

HIMSELF

> > THE " ONE AND ONLY TRUTH EXPRESSED IN TRILLIONS OF FORMS THOSE CAN

> BE

> > SEEN WITH OUR NAKED EYES AND THOSE CANNOT BE SEEN AS THE PARTS OF

> THIS

> > UNIVERSE, WHICH INCLUDES THE AIR WE BREATHE AND THE WATER WE

> DRINK " .

> > > Tell me which other brain than Vyaasa Maharshi (or Valmeeki

> > Maharshi) has given such infinite scientific knowledge in such a

> short

> > 700 slokas ?

> > >

> > > THOSE WERE THE TRUTHS THAT THEY EXPERIENCED, AND ENJOYING THE

> > ETERNAL BLISS, JOY AND HAPPINESS (not the short-lived pleasures),

> OUT

> > OF COMPASSION, THEY TRIED TO GIVE US ALL INHERITORS WHAT THEY

> > EXPERIENCED BY STRUCTURING OUR LIVES IN SUCH A WAY THAT WE REMAIN

> > CONNECTED TO THE DIVINE EVERY MOMENT OF OUR LIVES.

> > >

> > > Your assumption that my mail is not related to GITAJI is wrong.

> My

> > response is very much about GITA only, because if one truly

> > understands Bhagavad Gita, one needs not take the help of some

> > misleading and distracting foreign dogma. Anyone who truly

> > understands Bhagavad Gita understands everything. He remains

> > connected to Lord Krishna eternally and becomes the best and

> perfect

> > devotee, serving everyone else.

> > >

> > > Bhagavad Gita is the concentrated form of sanatana dharma

> principles

> > and traditions / the science of Ishwar, His Creation that is this

> > infinitely indescribable Universe, the purpose of our lives on

this

> > earth, etc., so beautifully explained through the 1400 plus

> > authoritative scriptures and countless other interpretations.

The

> > Science of Creation as expounded by Sanatana Dharma, especially

the

> > quality of OMNIPRESENCE of Ishwara in each animate and inanimate

> part

> > of the Creation (including you and me), with the most scientific

> and

> > fool-proof " LAW OF KARMA "

> > >

> > > For example, in sanatana dharma, the scriptures, the principle

of

> > LAW OF KARMA, YOGA PRACTICISES, etc. have not changed and Ishwar

> has

> > expressed Himself through these Vedas and the universe itself.

> > >

> > > If you are truly looking for the " mystical meanings of the

> > scriptures " , please read LIFE DIVINE by Ramana Maharishi and also

> > books from Shri Aurobindo to know about our scriptures.

> > >

> > > please please please do not dilute the ALL-INCLUSIVE,

UNIVERSAL,

> > SCIENTIFIC AND EXPERIMENTABLE/EXPERIENCEABLE sanatana dharma

> > Principles and Traditions. That is my only request.

> > >

> > > I seek your forgiveness for any statement of mine given above

> being

> > violent in anyway.

> > > That is my only request.

> > > With best regards,

> > > vm

> > >

> > > P.S. : If my above email has not answered all your points in

your

> > mail, I am answering them below, point by point :

> > >

> > > Your Statement : Those who will understand mystism of Gitaji,

> will

> > understand other scriptures too.

> > > There is no mysticism in GITA, If you understand about the

> > indestructibility of ATMA which is part of the PARAM-ATMA, and

how

> our

> > ignorance has covered (Avaran) the ATMA and also by which methods

> and

> > practicises, we can remove the veil of ignorance to see, realize

> and

> > experience the ATMA (SELF) which propels us from moment to

moment.

> > When we experience the ATMA CHAITHANYAM within us, how blissful

we

> > become, which is the eternal nature of our SELF. The Sat-Chit-

> Anandam

> > which we are craving for is already within you….

> > >

> > > Your Statement: I am open and respectful of other scriptures

> too as

> > they all talk about only one God.

> > > " ONE GOD " is the only truth that it said in these books, ....

yet

> > it's application is something quite different.

> > >

> > > Your Statement: I thank my Guruji for showing me the path.

> > >

> > > For me, this entire universe is a university and I try to learn

> from

> > anything and everything that comes across/interacts with me. For

> me,

> > every source of knowledge is a teacher and guru. I accepted Lord

> > Krishna as my Guru, then Vyaasa Deva, Valmeeki Maharishi, then

> > Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, Ramana Maharishi, and countless others, my

> > parents, teachers in schools and colleges, persons with whom I

have

> > discussed and exchanged knowledge-based spiritual information,

and

> all

> > my surroundings, etc. I remain eternally indebted to one and

all.

> > > Thank you.

> > > Regards,

> > > vm

> > >

> > > (modified by moderator)

> > >

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ----

> > >

> > > Dear,

> > > According to our vedas there are 84 Lac spices on this earth.

> > > Everything works on Dharma. The karmas one does now reaps the

> fruits

> > > later, in this birth or next birth. Prarabdha- Agami- Sanchita

3

> > > types of Karma. The prarabdha karma done is the arrow let out

of

> > > bow, (said by Adi Sankara in his script Vivekachudamani). Even

> this

> > > Prarabdha karma gets washed with certain slokas in which the

pala

> > > sruthi said.

> > > Saints like Ramana, Sri Ramakrishna, Tukaram, Sakubai, Alwar

etc

> > > underwent sufferings due to prarabda karmas. But the differance

> > > between them and us is that the sufferings was never felt by

> them,

> > > for us a little pain also causes havock. Ex: Saint Ramana had

> > > surgery done on his leg without any anesthisia and anti biotic

> tabs.

> > > Dear sadaks, please understand that GOD is much above plans,

> > > distrubance etc. Level of GOD is Paramanandham.

> > > One attains HIM only by complete purity of mind and thought,

with

> > > constant . Bakthi.

> > > Common sense- To reach divinity or have vision of GOD everyone

> knows

> > > the difficulty to erase our Dur Gunas. Simply like that can

> anyone

> > > think of distrubance. But GOD gets distrubed ONLY in

> circumstances

> > > when HIS Bakthas are distrubed, but not made to distrube. This

> can

> > > be known from many puranas. Ex: Jada Bharatha when he was to be

> > > given human sacrifice GOD rescued. But Jada Bharatha never

cried

> for

> > > help. So also when Adi Sankara was to be slained.

> > > GOD is said by vedas as " Aprameyam " . means beyond all five

> senses.

> > > In that case with what anyone can distrube HIM

> > > B.Sathyanarayan.

> > > ------------------------------

--

> ----

> > >

> > >

> > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

> > > >

> > > > A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it makes

sense

> and

> > > > is useful!

> > > >

> > > > My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without knowing God

> and

> > > His

> > > > Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some one must

be

> > > > God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to

resolve

> if

> > > > faced with problem after first accepting or rather welcoming

> it.

> > > As

> > > > Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I understand

it),

> > > the

> > > > question is what is to be done now that the arrow has left

the

> > > bow.

> > > > We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it in a

manner

> > > > which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid on us.

> Rest is

> > > > His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

> > > >

> > > > Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very

important

> > > too!

> > > > An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one faces

> works.

> > > > What happens in such case is, either problem is solved in

one's

> > > > favor or even more important than that is one gets strength

to

> face

> > > > it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person rather

> than

> > > > his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt him/her.

> Isn't

> > > > this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is fairness in us!

> This

> > > > is the way I see God is changing the blue print or better yet

> is

> > > > modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His total

> freedom

> > > > at every moment of his/her life.

> > > > Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of changing

> His

> > > > plan doesn't arise at all.

> > > >

> > > > Pratap Bhatt

> > > >

> > > > ----------------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > >

> > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans. GOD is

said

> > > > > as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects.

> Everything

> > > is

> > > > > set and computerised and networked and part of His divine

> plan.

> > > > >

> > > > > B.Sathyanarayan

> > > > >

> > > > > --------------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print, as

> someone

> > > has

> > > > > suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this

anecdote.

> > > > > We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay mugs and

> > > talked

> > > > > quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us were in a

> > > season

> > > > > with some unanswered questions in our lives. We talked

about

> > > > > trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and anxiety.

> It's

> > > > not

> > > > > always an easy thing to do.

> > > > >

> > > > > Every day we make a choice to either trust God ... or not.

We

> > > can

> > > > > worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can choose

to

> > > > trust

> > > > > Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and that He

will

> > > > direct

> > > > > our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.

> > > > >

> > > > > It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really trust

God? "

> > > Often

> > > > > with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried lives we

> > > > say, " No. "

> > > > >

> > > > > Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His Word, the

> Bible?

> > > He

> > > > > says...

> > > > >

> > > > > " I will instruct you and guide you along the best pathway

for

> > > your

> > > > > life. I will advise you and watch your progress, " This is

> God's

> > > > plan.

> > > > >

> > > > > The choice you make today to believe those words and trust

> God

> > > will

> > > > > bring a result in your life...listen...

> > > > >

> > > > > " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the Lord. So

> > > > rejoice

> > > > > in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all those

who

> > > > choose

> > > > > to obey Him, " the Bible says.

> > > > >

> > > > > Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our lives

> > > releases

> > > > > the peace and the comfort of His love and it will surround

> > > > > us...holding us secure through the winds of change and

> > > > uncertainty.

> > > > > Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing that will

> be

> > > the

> > > > > by-product of His surrounding love.

> > > > >

> > > > > Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the best

> pathway

> > > for

> > > > > your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust is a

> choice

> > > > we

> > > > > can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy to

> > > countless

> > > > > believers.

> > > > > Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in your

> life.

> > > > > God's plan never fails.

> > > > >

> > > > > yeshu rathenam

> > > > >

> > > > > --------------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > Hare Krsna!!

> > > > > Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting that

> example

> > > > about

> > > > > the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks thanks!

> > > > >

> > > > > Daniel

> > > > >

> > > > > --------------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > >

> > > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Divine All,

> > > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring words.

It

> is

> > > > > nothing

> > > > > > but praising God / Guru.

> > > > > > The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> > > > > > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by

> > > Anilji

> > > > > and I

> > > > > > continued using that word so that he can also relate the

> > > answer

> > > > to

> > > > > his

> > > > > > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed, why

> > > > bother?

> > > > > My

> > > > > > response was to say that destiny can be changed with our

> > > present

> > > > > > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of our

past

> > > > action

> > > > > > which we can not change (though some of it can be changed

> by

> > > an

> > > > > able

> > > > > > Guru) but we can change the course of our present and

> future

> > > > > actions.

> > > > > > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma

> theory.

> > > > > > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on Karma

> but

> > > > > > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> > > > > > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past

> > > lives),

> > > > > >

> > > > > > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the

portion

> is

> > > > > worked out in present life),

> > > > > > - Agami (from present life what we keep on

> adding to

> > > > > Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> > > > > > lives) and

> > > > > > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out

> > > > immediately).

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva

> > > perspective.

> > > > > > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > > > > > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27,

> 5:12

> > > > > > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> > > > > > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG

> 17:16

> > > > > > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> > > > > > * There are many slokas that reference non-doership

of

> the

> > > > > action

> > > > > > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can help

> with

> > > the

> > > > > 2nd

> > > > > > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37 (roasted

> seed

> > > > don't

> > > > > > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> > > > > >

> > > > > > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my Christian

> > > friends

> > > > to

> > > > > > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible and

> Kriya

> > > > > Yoga'.

> > > > > > Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > -

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> > > > > > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at the

way

> > > > humans

> > > > > are

> > > > > > made, brain, which controls everything is at the top

> [satvik],

> > > > > heart

> > > > > > which controls physical functioning and emotions is in

the

> > > centre

> > > > > > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom

> [Tamasik].Can

> > > > any

> > > > > one

> > > > > > else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender to

HIM

> > > > > totally.

> > > > > > G.Vaidyanathan.

> > > > > > ------------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > -

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ----------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ------

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > > > > > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW

> WOW!!!!!

> > > > > > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question

> is,

> > > can

> > > > > you

> > > > > > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to

> what

> > > > you

> > > > > say

> > > > > > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is

> the

> > > > blue

> > > > > > > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My

> Bhagavad

> > > > > Gita is

> > > > > > > in Spanish.

> > > > > > > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > > > > > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > > > > > ----------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ------

> > > > > > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > > > > > chatur patel

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ----------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ------

> > > > > > > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > > > > > > ----------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ------

> > > > > > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in

> > > > Christian

> > > > > > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the

Bible

> > > myth

> > > > > and God.

> > > > > > > Classyoga

> > > > > > > ----------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > -----

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting

> every

> > > > > logic or

> > > > > > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible

> > > would

> > > > > never be

> > > > > > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is

or

> > > what

> > > > > Lord

> > > > > > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN

BHAGAVAD

> > > > GITA.

> > > > > In

> > > > > > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their

> > > > origins

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > Indian scriptures.

> > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME,

UNIVERSAL,

> > > > > SCIENTIFIC

> > > > > > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation

> that

> > > > is

> > > > > this

> > > > > > > universe and its mysteries.

> > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > vm

> > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > > ----------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ------

> > > > > > > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I

was

> > > > sharing

> > > > > it to

> > > > > > > show how we become the creator of our own blue print

> which I

> > > > > indicated

> > > > > > > in the beginning and I thought the example was

> appropriate

> > > > > otherwise I

> > > > > > > would not have shared.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Scriptures are written using mystical language so one

can

> > > > > interpret

> > > > > > > them according to their level of understanding and

> spiritual

> > > > > > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one,

the

> > > > example

> > > > > > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply

drop

> > > it ;-

> > > > )

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are

> more

> > > > > elaborate

> > > > > > > and inclusive in directing our thought process towards

> God.

> > > > > Those who

> > > > > > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand

other

> > > > > scriptures

> > > > > > > too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too

as

> > > they

> > > > > all

> > > > > > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for

> showing me

> > > > the

> > > > > path.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > with humble regards,

> > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > > ----------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ------

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > dear divine souls.

> > > > > > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to

You,

> > > > manula

> > > > > ji

> > > > > > > for puting forwards this mail.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > jai sri ram

> > > > > > > kuldip

> > > > > > > ----------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ------

> > > > > > > , " Manjula Patel "

> > > <manjumaa@>

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > > > Pranam.

> > > > > > > > Very beautiful things have been said in response to

> > > Anilji's

> > > > > beautiful

> > > > > > > > questions.

> > > > > > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening

> for me

> > > > so

> > > > > would

> > > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > share it with you all and hope it would do the same

for

> > > you

> > > > > too...

> > > > > > > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > > > > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He

> > > explained...

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print.

> Something

> > > > from

> > > > > Bible

> > > > > > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism.

> When

> > > > Adam-

> > > > > Eve

> > > > > > > were created

> > > > > > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation, they

> were

> > > > > naked,

> > > > > > i.e.,

> > > > > > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they

> ate

> > > > the

> > > > > fruit

> > > > > > > from the

> > > > > > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their

> nakedness,

> > > > > i.e., when

> > > > > > > they

> > > > > > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying

the

> > > > fruits

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > it, they came

> > > > > > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...'

or

> > > they

> > > > > became ego

> > > > > > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences

of

> > > the

> > > > > fruits

> > > > > > > of their

> > > > > > > > action. They became shameful. So really when God

> > > > > descended the

> > > > > > > first

> > > > > > > > human, the intention was not to end but make it

> > > immortal

> > > > > just

> > > > > > > like Him. We

> > > > > > > > human missed out understanding it. the intention

> has

> > > > still

> > > > > > > remain the same

> > > > > > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the

body

> > > > > > > consciousness. As

> > > > > > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me

> > > only...

> > > > > > > > - There are three types of actions that determine

> our

> > > > blue

> > > > > print.

> > > > > > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > > > > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed

> at a

> > > > > dear. Most

> > > > > > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be

> > > reverted,

> > > > > it sure

> > > > > > > > will attain

> > > > > > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have

> any

> > > > > control over

> > > > > > > > that arrow.

> > > > > > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let

go

> > > > towards

> > > > > > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is

> in

> > > > > motion, yet

> > > > > > > > we have some

> > > > > > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle

and

> > > thus

> > > > > stop

> > > > > > > the fruits of

> > > > > > > > such action.

> > > > > > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver

over

> > > > which

> > > > > we have

> > > > > > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > > > > > - In other words,

> > > > > > > > - we have done some actions in past of which we

> have

> > > > to

> > > > > bear the

> > > > > > > > consequences. However, He said that if you

have

> > > taken

> > > > > refuge

> > > > > > > of an able

> > > > > > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by

> > > clapping,

> > > > > > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make

him

> > > run

> > > > > away

> > > > > > > > before the arrow

> > > > > > > > hits him!!!

> > > > > > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as

we

> > > > become

> > > > > aware of

> > > > > > > > our action, we can alter the course of such

> action.

> > > > > > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would

> have

> > > > > performed in

> > > > > > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by

> > > transforming

> > > > > our lives

> > > > > > > > like roasted

> > > > > > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me

> you

> > > > will

> > > > > attain

> > > > > > > Me only...

> > > > > > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives

> > > birth

> > > > to

> > > > > many

> > > > > > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on

> > > > multiplying

> > > > > > > without our

> > > > > > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process

is

> > > very

> > > > > > > important. So

> > > > > > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it

takes

> > > any

> > > > > grosser

> > > > > > > form. With

> > > > > > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped

at

> > > the

> > > > > source

> > > > > > > level - not

> > > > > > > > to let them come down even at the thought level.

> One

> > > > > thought not

> > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around

us

> and

> > > > the

> > > > > > > environment we

> > > > > > > > live in. It not only gives immediate

> > > > results/pleasure/pain

> > > > > but

> > > > > > > it carries

> > > > > > > > consequences in future also. It not only affects

> our

> > > > > present

> > > > > > > lfve but many

> > > > > > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful

> of

> > > > their

> > > > > > thoughts.

> > > > > > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind

> of

> > > > > freedom do we

> > > > > > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow

> has

> > > > been

> > > > > tied

> > > > > > > with a long

> > > > > > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > > > > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of

> rope

> > > > and

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly

> > > affairs,

> > > > > loose the

> > > > > > > > freedom and be miserable

> > > > > > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around

> > > > smartly.

> > > > > One

> > > > > > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is

> still

> > > > rope

> > > > > tied

> > > > > > > to a pole.

> > > > > > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from

> the

> > > > pole,

> > > > > > > > cow has enough strength to free herself

> permanently.

> > > > > > > Sarvadharmaan

> > > > > > > > parityajya...

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial

> in

> > > > > > > understanding how

> > > > > > > > our blue prints are determined and what type of

> > > > karmas/actions

> > > > > we

> > > > > > should

> > > > > > > > engage in.

> > > > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print

> why

> > > > > disturb the

> > > > > > > same.

> > > > > > > > > When God descended the first human, it is was clear

> that

> > > > the

> > > > > > > beginning of

> > > > > > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do good

> things ?

> > > > > > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello Ms.shilpa ji,

This is my humble opinion. Please do not worry much about the things

that happened in ur past. Yes..sometimes if we analyze..we feel some

people would have played with our emotions or life. But again, if we

understand the life from God's perspective or from Bhagavad Gita

perspective, nothing matters..what I mean is: all are in this play,

but the degree of expectations may vary with each person. We must

inquire whether there is some expectation in us also? Once we let go

of the expectations in every activity, then nothing will affect us at

all. But, it is difficult ..so, we can try and slowly we realize that

God is with us all the time. And we also understand that all the

answers of our heart will be understood by God's Grace in His own time.

 

What I feel is: If you are able to write this email and ask this

question..even that itself is a miracle from God. So many people in

this world do not even have the tools and facilities that we have and

we are all blessed I can say.

 

Please remember God in a loving way just for the sake of love towards

God and nothing else. Slowly try to do this and u will feel peace and

joy in ur heart irrespective of whatever comes ur way. In Gita, Lord

says: " sarva dharmaan parityagya, mamekam saranam vraja, aham tva

sarva paaphebhyo, mokshyikshyaami mashuchaha " . Leave everything and

SURRENDER onto me completely and I will take care of you and resolve

all your sins.

 

Again, I understand its difficult..but SURRENDER simply once

completely, then He will do the rest of the work. The act of praying,

the prayer itself and your whole SELF surrender to the form of God

that you believe, and soon you feel everything is so wonderful .

 

Regards,

Bharathi

 

-----

Priy aatman,

Pranam,

It is very essential to understand the things happen in our life in a

peculiar way. But may I try to rationalise please?

So many times we do good deeds but in return we get very upsetting

results. It has happened in my life too. And almost in everyones life

I may say. If you read Sadhak sanjivani by Swami Ramsukhdas ji it will

be of great help. Still in short Karma is divided in " Prarabdh Karma,

Sanchit Karma, Kriyaman Karma " and accordingly we pay or receive the

fruits of Karma. Thats bit difficult to absorb because we always keep

our eye on good deeds of ours & try to escape bad deeds of ours.

Well, Another way round " Strange are ways of God to love us. We can

hardly understand but God does love us thats sure. " So I request you

in the name of God that please do not shake your trust on God whatever

happens in our life Good or Bad. Its like love of your mother to you,

She may seem to beat you up or pamper you but She loves you alright. "

Hope this helps.

Always at thy lotus feet,

Raja.

-----

 

If you believe in GOD, even your being used by people for insurance

etc. have to be taken as his plans only, which you and I could not

have changed,even if we wished.

 

Pranams, G.Vaidyanathan.

 

-----

I find that when I trust God with no reservations and turn my life

completely to Him, things work out the way that they should.

I used to have a foot in yesterday, and one in tomorrow....no longer.

I stay in the present moment and life goes the way it is supposed

to....yes things still happen, but they seem less chaotic.

When I stay in today, and in the moment, I can't worry!

 

Ohm Namah Shivaya

Rebecca White

----

I am highly moved by Shilpa' e-mail about criminally intelligent non

humans. Humans have lost their nature and 'pahatah sva bhaavah'

(fallen quality) is a reason for sadhaak jan in protecting ones' true

nature. Dharma and Vyavastha (current state of affairs) are in

conflict, and Shilpa by staying at her true nature (sva bhaav) can

slowly get rid of the current state (vyavastha). At least, I am bent

upon it, and withdrawing from present state (vyavastha) of criminally

intelligent non-humans.

regards

Krishna Gopal

-----

Namaste Shilpa!

 

I can totally relate to what you are feeling. You are not alone! I

have also been a victim of some great calamities within the past few

years, at the hands of the criminally intelligent. That had to happen

to me in order for me to realize that Krishna is my Ishtadevata and to

serve Him only.

 

By serving your Ishtadevata, you will immediately find out that your

feelings of hostility that are warranted have gone away! Just chant

the holy names of the Lord and worship Him and you will immediately

see things get so much better.

 

No, God is absolutely not on vacation, but the freedom that he has

bestowed us with, has lead us to our current state. He is all

merciful. For me, surrendering to Lord Krsna has created the best

life out of nowhere.

 

DP

Haribol!

-----

 

To avoid the future reoccurance of such incidences, and so that the

evil people do not continue to do harm to others as well, it is also

important to report such incidences to the legal authorities for

corrective action

 

NPanda

-----

FEW RESPONSES SHORTENED AND MODIFIED BY THE MODERATOR.

---

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Namaste to all believers.

>

> I have always lived my life as planned by God Almighty.

> Now that I have matured I realize that lots of people played around

> with my emotions and life. what you all have to say about Insurance

> policy plans they made after using me to make lots money for

> themselves. I don't think those are God's plan for my life.

> I am sure I am not the only victim of these criminally intellegent

> non-humans.

> Where is God? Is He on vacation?

> Does anyone have answers ?

> Do not loose faith even if sacrificed. I don't think God would abuse

> innocent women.

> Shanti to All.

>

> Shilpa

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dear Silpa, Namaste,

All that loans due to those people have been paid off by you.

Everything happens on this earth from plants to humans are cause and

effect. God has nothing to do with it.

Example: Duryodana's father was born blind, as he had pierced the eyes

of crane birds in his previous birth.

In Mahabharath A bramin took away a cobler's slippers without his

permission and had to be born as a son to a cobler.

Vaali in Sri Ramayana was killed by Sri Rama for misbehaviour, but the

same Vaali was born as JARA during Sri Krishna` s period and he

pierced an arrow through Sir Krishna's toe. JARA asked Sri Krishna a

boon to go to heavens and was granted by Krishna.

 

Just do good now setting aside the sufferings caused by others, you

will become divine.

 

Yesterday` s action is Today` s results. Today` s actions will be

tomorrow` s results. At present engage in divine dharmic acts, so that

future can be in eternal happiness

 

B.Sathyanarayan

---

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

I am very happy and inspired to read all answers given

by fellow sadhakas to Shilpaji's question! All of them

are worth reading over!

No, It is not God that allows such unfairness and victimize ordinary

people, neither takes vacation! Its people in their ignorance of not

knowing themselves and God act selfishly! They take them to be

independently existing entities " me, mine or ours " apart from

God-Totality! It is not surprising such beliefs lead them to behave

selfishly because " being a separate person " is reality to them!

Totality-God always appears fair, impartial when we act unselfishly.

After all He has to take the interests of all of us into account to

produce just results! I am sure, no one can act selfishly with such

understanding as God is not apart from us together, one integrated

system of laws that works! As suggested in sadhakas answers, please

step out of the mindset of being a victim, the idea that people are

out to get " me " by forgiving them. Then step into the mndset of God

being Fair and just and act from such vantage point to tackle the

problems so others don't be the victims!

Pranaam....Pratap

----

dear Ms Shilpaji.

 

In the Gita it is said to become free of all desires and to do one's

duty . So go on doing your duty with energy and willingness and that

should may bring about an attitude of acceptance moment by moment.

 

light and love are with you always. All the best ,

gokul mehta

----

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Hello Ms.shilpa ji,

> This is my humble opinion. Please do not worry much about the things

> that happened in ur past. Yes..sometimes if we analyze..we feel some

> people would have played with our emotions or life. But again, if we

> understand the life from God's perspective or from Bhagavad Gita

> perspective, nothing matters..what I mean is: all are in this play,

> but the degree of expectations may vary with each person. We must

> inquire whether there is some expectation in us also? Once we let go

> of the expectations in every activity, then nothing will affect us at

> all. But, it is difficult ..so, we can try and slowly we realize that

> God is with us all the time. And we also understand that all the

> answers of our heart will be understood by God's Grace in His own time.

>

> What I feel is: If you are able to write this email and ask this

> question..even that itself is a miracle from God. So many people in

> this world do not even have the tools and facilities that we have and

> we are all blessed I can say.

>

> Please remember God in a loving way just for the sake of love towards

> God and nothing else. Slowly try to do this and u will feel peace and

> joy in ur heart irrespective of whatever comes ur way. In Gita, Lord

> says: " sarva dharmaan parityagya, mamekam saranam vraja, aham tva

> sarva paaphebhyo, mokshyikshyaami mashuchaha " . Leave everything and

> SURRENDER onto me completely and I will take care of you and resolve

> all your sins.

>

> Again, I understand its difficult..but SURRENDER simply once

> completely, then He will do the rest of the work. The act of praying,

> the prayer itself and your whole SELF surrender to the form of God

> that you believe, and soon you feel everything is so wonderful .

>

> Regards,

> Bharathi

>

> -----

> Priy aatman,

> Pranam,

> It is very essential to understand the things happen in our life in a

> peculiar way. But may I try to rationalise please?

> So many times we do good deeds but in return we get very upsetting

> results. It has happened in my life too. And almost in everyones life

> I may say. If you read Sadhak sanjivani by Swami Ramsukhdas ji it will

> be of great help. Still in short Karma is divided in " Prarabdh Karma,

> Sanchit Karma, Kriyaman Karma " and accordingly we pay or receive the

> fruits of Karma. Thats bit difficult to absorb because we always keep

> our eye on good deeds of ours & try to escape bad deeds of ours.

> Well, Another way round " Strange are ways of God to love us. We can

> hardly understand but God does love us thats sure. " So I request you

> in the name of God that please do not shake your trust on God whatever

> happens in our life Good or Bad. Its like love of your mother to you,

> She may seem to beat you up or pamper you but She loves you alright. "

> Hope this helps.

> Always at thy lotus feet,

> Raja.

> -----

>

> If you believe in GOD, even your being used by people for insurance

> etc. have to be taken as his plans only, which you and I could not

> have changed,even if we wished.

>

> Pranams, G.Vaidyanathan.

>

> -----

> I find that when I trust God with no reservations and turn my life

> completely to Him, things work out the way that they should.

> I used to have a foot in yesterday, and one in tomorrow....no longer.

> I stay in the present moment and life goes the way it is supposed

> to....yes things still happen, but they seem less chaotic.

> When I stay in today, and in the moment, I can't worry!

>

> Ohm Namah Shivaya

> Rebecca White

> ----

> I am highly moved by Shilpa' e-mail about criminally intelligent non

> humans. Humans have lost their nature and 'pahatah sva bhaavah'

> (fallen quality) is a reason for sadhaak jan in protecting ones' true

> nature. Dharma and Vyavastha (current state of affairs) are in

> conflict, and Shilpa by staying at her true nature (sva bhaav) can

> slowly get rid of the current state (vyavastha). At least, I am bent

> upon it, and withdrawing from present state (vyavastha) of criminally

> intelligent non-humans.

> regards

> Krishna Gopal

> -----

> Namaste Shilpa!

>

> I can totally relate to what you are feeling. You are not alone! I

> have also been a victim of some great calamities within the past few

> years, at the hands of the criminally intelligent. That had to happen

> to me in order for me to realize that Krishna is my Ishtadevata and to

> serve Him only.

>

> By serving your Ishtadevata, you will immediately find out that your

> feelings of hostility that are warranted have gone away! Just chant

> the holy names of the Lord and worship Him and you will immediately

> see things get so much better.

>

> No, God is absolutely not on vacation, but the freedom that he has

> bestowed us with, has lead us to our current state. He is all

> merciful. For me, surrendering to Lord Krsna has created the best

> life out of nowhere.

>

> DP

> Haribol!

> -----

>

> To avoid the future reoccurance of such incidences, and so that the

> evil people do not continue to do harm to others as well, it is also

> important to report such incidences to the legal authorities for

> corrective action

>

> NPanda

> -----

> FEW RESPONSES SHORTENED AND MODIFIED BY THE MODERATOR.

> ---

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > Namaste to all believers.

> >

> > I have always lived my life as planned by God Almighty.

> > Now that I have matured I realize that lots of people played around

> > with my emotions and life. what you all have to say about Insurance

> > policy plans they made after using me to make lots money for

> > themselves. I don't think those are God's plan for my life.

> > I am sure I am not the only victim of these criminally intellegent

> > non-humans.

> > Where is God? Is He on vacation?

> > Does anyone have answers ?

> > Do not loose faith even if sacrificed. I don't think God would abuse

> > innocent women.

> > Shanti to All.

> >

> > Shilpa

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Loving Divine,

Pranams.

So many things have been said and I agree with Pratapji - they are all worth re-reading and contemplating. Shilpaji, please read all emails associated with this topic itself not the responses to your email only.

 

One can feel the love and care of the group when one reads the messages. Don't you ever think that you are alone in this world. Whether we, the humans are with you or not, God has been and will be always with you. Know, believe and accept this fact - even if you don't want Him, He will be with you - that's how He is!!! It requires deep investigation within.

 

Now I am going to say something which might not be liked but before you reject it my humble request would be please give it a hard look... (God only is talking & listening, however, for communication purposes and to make the point clear I have to use I, you, we, he, they type words but in reality, in the absolute sense, none of this exist. All is Krishna - vasudevam sarvam...)

 

Humble Opinion: when one is upset with God like this, it shows that the person has never understood Him and never surrendered to Him in totality. When one points his/her finger at God, I would like you to become aware that other three fingers are pointed towards you. Shilpaji, I can relate your state of mind right now with Arjuna's in the very 1st Chapter of Shrimad Bhagwat Gita. The difference is in the difficult moment he was ready to surrender and you are going the opposite...!

 

Some thoughts/understanding...

 

Pandavs were abused, cheated, looted, escaped from being crushed/killed/burnt, made victim of fraud, insulted, humiliated, denied of their rights, deprived of their pleasures, punished, their own family members misbehaved, their wife's cloths were snatched in front of every one (including so called dharmaatmaas like Dhrutarashra, Bhishma & their Gurus), their sons were even killed against the warfare laws and so on, the list goes on and on and on... Any word you can think of that happened with you, you will find that it happened with the Pandavas and yet..., and yet Arjuna said very humbly to Lord, I surrender to you, I am confused, please guide me. Ma Kunti said that let us have all the aches and pain, if that makes You (Krishna) stay with us.

Arjuna saw 'my' very own kith & kin will be killed in this war. This attachment, this myness, this compassion at wrong time, for wrong people, in wrong place, made him weak. He started acting like a coward and dropping his 'gaandiv' declared that now he doesn't want to fight. What God teaches? Fight for the right cause - dharma. So like couple of people have already mentioned, I agree it should be reported to police. One needs to follow the practical spirituality and that's what God taught. Remain alert and awakened - the lesson needs to be learned. The situation repeats - look at the lives of Pandavas...

I recommend, please please read the entire Gitaji, understand the true meaning of each sloka, contemplate - internalize them. The mysticism is - more you contemplate, new meanings keep on dawning!!! One may read Gitaji thousands of times but if not implemented, it doesn't do you any good. Reading a menu doesn't satisfy the hunger, one has to act so implement the teachings in life. Do the selfless, rightful action and leave the rest to God - complete surrender - sarvadharmaan parityajya... God was, is and will be with you. It reminds me Mirabai's bhajan - tum sang tod Krisha kon sang jodu??? Even if you want to, you can not leave God, realize it.

 

Please forgive my straight forwardness, the intention is to awake...

My love for you.

humble regards,

always at Thy Divine Feet

 

 

On 2/20/08, sadhak_insight <sadhak_insight wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

Namaste to all believers.I have always lived my life as planned by God Almighty.Now that I have matured I realize that lots of people played around with my emotions and life. what you all have to say about Insurance

policy plans they made after using me to make lots money for themselves. I don't think those are God's plan for my life.I am sure I am not the only victim of these criminally intellegent non-humans.

Where is God? Is He on vacation?Does anyone have answers ?Do not loose faith even if sacrificed. I don't think God would abuse innocent women.Shanti to All.Shilpa -------------------------

Dear Dinine souls,,my humble parnaams..Mr kuldip suri

------------------------- , " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:>> Namasté> > As Lord Krisna explained to Prince Arjuna, we must exercise our> duty. Trying to change it will be serving only our ego. For that> is the key: God does not think, for God is above the thought

> process. We should only find peace through the acceptance that God> is the Enjoyer of all offerings and austerities, as the Infinite Lord of Creation, above all, and as the Dearest Friend of all. ( " He

> finds peace who knows Me as the Enjoyer of all oferings and> austerities, as the Infinite Lord of creation, and as the Dearest> Friend of all " ). Like an ocean trying to absorb all streams as they

> come. Like the drop seeking reintegration in that vast ocean.> > The one true desire that our ego may generate is that of providing> goodness and generosity to all sentient beings. To see if we can

> finaly emanate love and feel God´s Love as vehicles for God´s Plans.> > So we can not change the course set out in the creation process. We> should live it and allow God to see the world through us.

> > Peace and Love> José Rodriguez> > ---------------------------> Dear Sadhaks,> Pranam,> It is futile to think that Gods plans can be disturbed. No one has

> power to do so. Goswami Tulsidasji wrote in Manas " RAM KINH CHAHAI> SOI HOI, KARE ANYATHA AS NAHI KOI " . So Always say " SIYA RAM JAY RAM> JAY JAY RAM " > JAY SHRI RAM,> Raja Gurdasani

> > ---------------------------> > > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:> >> > God's plan cannot be disturbed. God's plan can be viewed under two> > different time zones - My Desperate Time (MDT) and God's Own Time

> (GOT)> >> > " I know discouragement comes easy, but I also know things happen> when> > God is ready for them to happen and not a second sooner. God knows> why> > he wants things to happen in the order they have to. We just need

> to> > be ready when they come. " > >> > One can recognize that there are two different time zones going on> > when it comes to correlating God's will and our experience. One

> I'll> > call My Desperate Time (MDT) and the other, God's Own Time (GOT).> >> > Most of us run on MDT. MDT defines our reality. It's what we see> and> > feel always. We are conscious of it the minute we rise up in the

> > morning until we put our weary heads on the pillow at night. We> > measure pleasure and pain by it; we judge our overall state-of-> being> > by it.> >> > God, on the other hand, exists in another time zone entirely. In

> GOT,> > His will is always done, and nothing is ever late. GOT also takes> into> > account the MDT of everyone, which can often get tangled up. You> see> > there are as many MDT zones as there are people, and that means

> they> > can often be in conflict. But with God there is never any conflict.> > There is only one GOT and as far as He is concerned, everything is> > right on schedule.This is God's plan.

> >> > This is why it is utterly silly to wonder if God has heard our> prayers> > based on whether or not He has acted in MDT. God always hears our> > prayers ? He has most likely already answered them ? he just

> answered> > them in GOT - in God's Own Time.> >> > Most of our issues with God are all about time zones. Think about> the> > hapless Bible character, Job. Job was smack in the middle of MDT

> all> > the while he was suffering, and his best friends were trying to> figure> > out why God wasn't doing anything in MDT. Well, we know now that> God> > rarely does; He is always in GOT and we can see that now, in

Job's> > case, because his life ultimately caught up with GOT. Eventually,> all> > MDT will be GOT. In fact, that will be what heaven is all about. We> > will all be kicking back in God's Own Time.

> >> > So faith is mostly all about time zones.Have faith in Jesus. When> you> > pray, know that you were heard, and move ahead, believing in GOT> and ,> > MDT won't be so desperate -God's Own time and My Desperate Time.

> >> > yeshu rathenam> > ---------------------------> -------> >> > , " sadhak_insight "

> > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:> > >> > > Loving Divine,> > > Humble pranams.> > > You and Me are as much God as rest of His creation and non-> creation

> > > is!!!> > > with deep love and humble regards,> > > always at Thy Holy Feet> > > Manjula Patel> > >> > > -------------------------

--> ----> > >> > > Respected One !,> > > Namasthe !!!> > > Yes, Ishwara Chaithanyam is in everyone and everything in equal> > > measure. Lord Krishna Himself says, " I am the fraud of the

> > > fraudsters " .> > > It is the DOMINANCE of quality (Guna - Satva, rajas and Tamas) of> > > the nature that is exposed in one's thoughts/words/deeds.> > > Let us take everything as a GOD's Plan, as the topic of the

> > > discussions itself suggests.> > > With best regards,> > > vm> > > vavamenon> > > ---------------------------> ----

> > > Loving Divine,> > > Humble pranams.> > > I respect your sentiments about sanatan dharma.> > > If we are open to learn and accept God in all - vasudevam> sarvam...

> > > I would also accept that whatever rubbish is out there is also> > > God...!!!> > > With deep love and regards,> > > alwasy at Thy Divine Feet.> > >> > > Manjula Patel

> > > ---------------------------> ----> > > Respected One,> > > Namasthe !!!> > > SATHYAMEVA JAYATHE !!!> > > Our Great Maharishis have through countless scriptures called

> every> > human being on this earth top SEEK AND REALISE BY EVERY ONE HIMSELF> > THE " ONE AND ONLY TRUTH EXPRESSED IN TRILLIONS OF FORMS THOSE CAN> BE> > SEEN WITH OUR NAKED EYES AND THOSE CANNOT BE SEEN AS THE PARTS OF

> THIS> > UNIVERSE, WHICH INCLUDES THE AIR WE BREATHE AND THE WATER WE> DRINK " .> > > Tell me which other brain than Vyaasa Maharshi (or Valmeeki> > Maharshi) has given such infinite scientific knowledge in such a

> short> > 700 slokas ?> > >> > > THOSE WERE THE TRUTHS THAT THEY EXPERIENCED, AND ENJOYING THE> > ETERNAL BLISS, JOY AND HAPPINESS (not the short-lived pleasures),> OUT

> > OF COMPASSION, THEY TRIED TO GIVE US ALL INHERITORS WHAT THEY> > EXPERIENCED BY STRUCTURING OUR LIVES IN SUCH A WAY THAT WE REMAIN> > CONNECTED TO THE DIVINE EVERY MOMENT OF OUR LIVES.> > >

> > > Your assumption that my mail is not related to GITAJI is wrong.> My> > response is very much about GITA only, because if one truly> > understands Bhagavad Gita, one needs not take the help of some

> > misleading and distracting foreign dogma. Anyone who truly> > understands Bhagavad Gita understands everything. He remains> > connected to Lord Krishna eternally and becomes the best and> perfect

> > devotee, serving everyone else.> > >> > > Bhagavad Gita is the concentrated form of sanatana dharma> principles> > and traditions / the science of Ishwar, His Creation that is this

> > infinitely indescribable Universe, the purpose of our lives on this> > earth, etc., so beautifully explained through the 1400 plus> > authoritative scriptures and countless other interpretations.

The> > Science of Creation as expounded by Sanatana Dharma, especially the> > quality of OMNIPRESENCE of Ishwara in each animate and inanimate> part> > of the Creation (including you and me), with the most scientific

> and> > fool-proof " LAW OF KARMA " > > >> > > For example, in sanatana dharma, the scriptures, the principle of> > LAW OF KARMA, YOGA PRACTICISES, etc. have not changed and Ishwar

> has> > expressed Himself through these Vedas and the universe itself.> > >> > > If you are truly looking for the " mystical meanings of the> > scriptures " , please read LIFE DIVINE by Ramana Maharishi and also

> > books from Shri Aurobindo to know about our scriptures.> > >> > > please please please do not dilute the ALL-INCLUSIVE, UNIVERSAL,> > SCIENTIFIC AND EXPERIMENTABLE/EXPERIENCEABLE sanatana dharma

> > Principles and Traditions. That is my only request.> > >> > > I seek your forgiveness for any statement of mine given above> being> > violent in anyway.> > > That is my only request.

> > > With best regards,> > > vm> > >> > > P.S. : If my above email has not answered all your points in your> > mail, I am answering them below, point by point :

> > >> > > Your Statement : Those who will understand mystism of Gitaji,> will> > understand other scriptures too.> > > There is no mysticism in GITA, If you understand about the

> > indestructibility of ATMA which is part of the PARAM-ATMA, and how> our> > ignorance has covered (Avaran) the ATMA and also by which methods> and> > practicises, we can remove the veil of ignorance to see, realize

> and> > experience the ATMA (SELF) which propels us from moment to moment.> > When we experience the ATMA CHAITHANYAM within us, how blissful we> > become, which is the eternal nature of our SELF. The Sat-Chit-

> Anandam> > which we are craving for is already within you….> > >> > > Your Statement: I am open and respectful of other scriptures> too as> > they all talk about only one God.

> > > " ONE GOD " is the only truth that it said in these books, .... yet> > it's application is something quite different.> > >> > > Your Statement: I thank my Guruji for showing me the path.

> > >> > > For me, this entire universe is a university and I try to learn> from> > anything and everything that comes across/interacts with me. For> me,> > every source of knowledge is a teacher and guru. I accepted Lord

> > Krishna as my Guru, then Vyaasa Deva, Valmeeki Maharishi, then> > Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, Ramana Maharishi, and countless others, my> > parents, teachers in schools and colleges, persons with whom I

have> > discussed and exchanged knowledge-based spiritual information, and> all> > my surroundings, etc. I remain eternally indebted to one and all.> > > Thank you.> > > Regards,

> > > vm> > >> > > (modified by moderator)> > >> > > ---------------------------> ----> > >> > > Dear,

> > > According to our vedas there are 84 Lac spices on this earth.> > > Everything works on Dharma. The karmas one does now reaps the> fruits> > > later, in this birth or next birth. Prarabdha- Agami- Sanchita

3> > > types of Karma. The prarabdha karma done is the arrow let out of> > > bow, (said by Adi Sankara in his script Vivekachudamani). Even> this> > > Prarabdha karma gets washed with certain slokas in which the

pala> > > sruthi said.> > > Saints like Ramana, Sri Ramakrishna, Tukaram, Sakubai, Alwar etc> > > underwent sufferings due to prarabda karmas. But the differance> > > between them and us is that the sufferings was never felt by

> them,> > > for us a little pain also causes havock. Ex: Saint Ramana had> > > surgery done on his leg without any anesthisia and anti biotic> tabs.> > > Dear sadaks, please understand that GOD is much above plans,

> > > distrubance etc. Level of GOD is Paramanandham.> > > One attains HIM only by complete purity of mind and thought, with> > > constant . Bakthi.> > > Common sense- To reach divinity or have vision of GOD everyone

> knows> > > the difficulty to erase our Dur Gunas. Simply like that can> anyone> > > think of distrubance. But GOD gets distrubed ONLY in> circumstances> > > when HIS Bakthas are distrubed, but not made to distrube. This

> can> > > be known from many puranas. Ex: Jada Bharatha when he was to be> > > given human sacrifice GOD rescued. But Jada Bharatha never cried> for> > > help. So also when Adi Sankara was to be slained.

> > > GOD is said by vedas as " Aprameyam " . means beyond all five> senses.> > > In that case with what anyone can distrube HIM> > > B.Sathyanarayan.> > > -------------------------

--> ----> > >> > >> > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!> > > >> > > > A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it makes

sense> and> > > > is useful!> > > >> > > > My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without knowing God> and> > > His> > > > Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some one must

be> > > > God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to resolve> if> > > > faced with problem after first accepting or rather welcoming> it.> > > As

> > > > Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I understand it),> > > the> > > > question is what is to be done now that the arrow has left the> > > bow.

> > > > We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it in a manner> > > > which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid on us.> Rest is> > > > His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

> > > >> > > > Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very important> > > too!> > > > An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one faces> works.

> > > > What happens in such case is, either problem is solved in one's> > > > favor or even more important than that is one gets strength to> face> > > > it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person rather

> than> > > > his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt him/her.> Isn't> > > > this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is fairness in us!> This> > > > is the way I see God is changing the blue print or better yet

> is> > > > modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His total> freedom> > > > at every moment of his/her life.> > > > Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of changing

> His> > > > plan doesn't arise at all.> > > >> > > > Pratap Bhatt> > > >> > > > -------------------------

--> ----> > > --> > > >> > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans. GOD is said> > > > > as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects.

> Everything> > > is> > > > > set and computerised and networked and part of His divine> plan.> > > > >> > > > > B.Sathyanarayan> > > > >

> > > > > ---------------------------> ----> > > --> > > > --> > > > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print, as

> someone> > > has> > > > > suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this anecdote.> > > > > We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay mugs and

> > > talked> > > > > quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us were in a> > > season> > > > > with some unanswered questions in our lives. We talked

about> > > > > trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and anxiety.> It's> > > > not> > > > > always an easy thing to do.> > > > >

> > > > > Every day we make a choice to either trust God ... or not. We> > > can> > > > > worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can choose to> > > > trust

> > > > > Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and that He will> > > > direct> > > > > our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.> > > > >

> > > > > It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really trust God? " > > > Often> > > > > with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried lives we

> > > > say, " No. " > > > > >> > > > > Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His Word, the> Bible?> > > He> > > > > says...

> > > > >> > > > > " I will instruct you and guide you along the best pathway for> > > your> > > > > life. I will advise you and watch your progress, " This is

> God's> > > > plan.> > > > >> > > > > The choice you make today to believe those words and trust> God> > > will> > > > > bring a result in your life...listen...

> > > > >> > > > > " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the Lord. So> > > > rejoice> > > > > in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all those

who> > > > choose> > > > > to obey Him, " the Bible says.> > > > >> > > > > Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our lives> > > releases

> > > > > the peace and the comfort of His love and it will surround> > > > > us...holding us secure through the winds of change and> > > > uncertainty.> > > > > Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing that will

> be> > > the> > > > > by-product of His surrounding love.> > > > >> > > > > Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the best> pathway

> > > for> > > > > your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust is a> choice> > > > we> > > > > can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy to

> > > countless> > > > > believers.> > > > > Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in your> life.> > > > > God's plan never fails.

> > > > >> > > > > yeshu rathenam> > > > >> > > > > ---------------------------> ----> > > --

> > > > --> > > > > Hare Krsna!!> > > > > Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting that> example> > > > about> > > > > the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks thanks!

> > > > >> > > > > Daniel> > > > >> > > > > ---------------------------> ----> > > --> > > > --

> > > > >> > > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Divine All,> > > > > > Humble pranams.> > > > > > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring words.

It> is> > > > > nothing> > > > > > but praising God / Guru.> > > > > > The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:> > > > > >

> > > > > > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.> > > > > > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by> > > Anilji> > > > > and I

> > > > > > continued using that word so that he can also relate the> > > answer> > > > to> > > > > his> > > > > > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed, why

> > > > bother?> > > > > My> > > > > > response was to say that destiny can be changed with our> > > present> > > > > > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of our

past> > > > action> > > > > > which we can not change (though some of it can be changed> by> > > an> > > > > able> > > > > > Guru) but we can change the course of our present and

> future> > > > > actions.> > > > > > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma> theory.> > > > > > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on Karma

> but> > > > > > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:> > > > > > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past> > > lives),> > > > > >

> > > > > > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the portion> is> > > > > worked out in present life),> > > > > > - Agami (from present life what we keep on

> adding to> > > > > Sanchita that will come to us in future / future> > > > > > lives) and> > > > > > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out> > > > immediately).

> > > > > >> > > > > > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva> > > perspective.> > > > > > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > > > > > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27,> 5:12> > > > > > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12> > > > > > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG

> 17:16> > > > > > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12> > > > > > * There are many slokas that reference non-doership of> the> > > > > action> > > > > > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can help

> with> > > the> > > > > 2nd> > > > > > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37 (roasted> seed> > > > don't> > > > > > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> > > > > >> > > > > > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my Christian> > > friends> > > > to> > > > > > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible and

> Kriya> > > > > Yoga'.> > > > > > Hope I have covered your inquiry.> > > > > > humble regards,> > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > >> > > > > > Manjula Patel> > > > > >> > > > > > --------------------------> ----

> > > --> > > > --> > > > > -> > > > > >> > > > > > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST> > > > > > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at the

way> > > > humans> > > > > are> > > > > > made, brain, which controls everything is at the top> [satvik],> > > > > heart> > > > > > which controls physical functioning and emotions is in

the> > > centre> > > > > > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom> [Tamasik].Can> > > > any> > > > > one> > > > > > else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender to

HIM> > > > > totally.> > > > > > G.Vaidyanathan.> > > > > > --------------------------> ----> > > --

> > > > --> > > > > -> > > > > >> > > > > > , " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > ------------------------> ----> > > --

> > > > --> > > > > ------> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.> > > > > > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW

> WOW!!!!!> > > > > > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my question> is,> > > can> > > > > you> > > > > > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that corresponds to

> what> > > > you> > > > > say> > > > > > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And what is> the> > > > blue> > > > > > > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My

> Bhagavad> > > > > Gita is> > > > > > > in Spanish.> > > > > > > Thank you!!! Stay well> > > > > > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > > > > > ------------------------> ----> > > --> > > > --> > > > > ------> > > > > > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > > > > > chatur patel> > > > > > >> > > > > > > ------------------------> ----> > > --

> > > > --> > > > > ------> > > > > > > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..> > > > > > > ----------------------

--> ----> > > --> > > > --> > > > > ------> > > > > > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and teach in> > > > Christian

> > > > > > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the Bible> > > myth> > > > > and God.> > > > > > > Classyoga> > > > > > > ----------------------

--> ----> > > --> > > > --> > > > > -----> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible refuting

> every> > > > > logic or> > > > > > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting bible> > > would> > > > > never be> > > > > > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma " is

or> > > what> > > > > Lord> > > > > > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN BHAGAVAD> > > > GITA.> > > > > In

> > > > > > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have their> > > > origins> > > > > in> > > > > > > Indian scriptures.> > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME, UNIVERSAL,> > > > > SCIENTIFIC> > > > > > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His creation

> that> > > > is> > > > > this> > > > > > > universe and its mysteries.> > > > > > > With best regards,> > > > > > > vm

> > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....> > > > > > > ------------------------> ----> > > --> > > > --

> > > > > ------> > > > > > > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I was> > > > sharing> > > > > it to> > > > > > > show how we become the creator of our own blue print

> which I> > > > > indicated> > > > > > > in the beginning and I thought the example was> appropriate> > > > > otherwise I> > > > > > > would not have shared.

> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Scriptures are written using mystical language so one can> > > > > interpret> > > > > > > them according to their level of understanding and

> spiritual> > > > > > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one, the> > > > example> > > > > > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you simply

drop> > > it ;-> > > > )> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan Dharma are> more> > > > > elaborate

> > > > > > > and inclusive in directing our thought process towards> God.> > > > > Those who> > > > > > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand

other> > > > > scriptures> > > > > > > too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures too as> > > they> > > > > all> > > > > > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for

> showing me> > > > the> > > > > path.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > with humble regards,> > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > " Manjula Patel " > > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....> > > > > > > ----------------------

--> ----> > > --> > > > --> > > > > ------> > > > > > >> > > > > > > dear divine souls.> > > > > > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude to

You,> > > > manula> > > > > ji> > > > > > > for puting forwards this mail.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > jai sri ram

> > > > > > > kuldip> > > > > > > ------------------------> ----> > > --> > > > --> > > > > ------

> > > > > > > , " Manjula Patel " > > > <manjumaa@>

> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Loving Divine,> > > > > > > > Pranam.> > > > > > > > Very beautiful things have been said in response to

> > > Anilji's> > > > > beautiful> > > > > > > > questions.> > > > > > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very enlightening> for me

> > > > so> > > > > would> > > > > > > like to> > > > > > > > share it with you all and hope it would do the same for> > > you

> > > > > too...> > > > > > > > The following are not exact words but my> > > > > > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He> > > explained...

> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print.> Something> > > > from> > > > > Bible> > > > > > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism.

> When> > > > Adam-> > > > > Eve> > > > > > > were created> > > > > > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation, they> were

> > > > > naked,> > > > > > i.e.,> > > > > > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they> ate> > > > the> > > > > fruit

> > > > > > > from the> > > > > > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their> nakedness,> > > > > i.e., when> > > > > > > they

> > > > > > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying the> > > > fruits> > > > > of> > > > > > > it, they came> > > > > > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...'

or> > > they> > > > > became ego> > > > > > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences of> > > the> > > > > fruits

> > > > > > > of their> > > > > > > > action. They became shameful. So really when God> > > > > descended the> > > > > > > first

> > > > > > > > human, the intention was not to end but make it> > > immortal> > > > > just> > > > > > > like Him. We> > > > > > > > human missed out understanding it. the intention

> has> > > > still> > > > > > > remain the same> > > > > > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the body> > > > > > > consciousness. As

> > > > > > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me> > > only...> > > > > > > > - There are three types of actions that determine> our

> > > > blue> > > > > print.> > > > > > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:> > > > > > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed

> at a> > > > > dear. Most> > > > > > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be> > > reverted,> > > > > it sure> > > > > > > > will attain

> > > > > > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have> any> > > > > control over> > > > > > > > that arrow.> > > > > > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let

go> > > > towards> > > > > > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is> in> > > > > motion, yet> > > > > > > > we have some

> > > > > > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle and> > > thus> > > > > stop> > > > > > > the fruits of> > > > > > > > such action.

> > > > > > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver over> > > > which> > > > > we have> > > > > > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > > > > > - In other words,> > > > > > > > - we have done some actions in past of which we> have> > > > to> > > > > bear the

> > > > > > > > consequences. However, He said that if you have> > > taken> > > > > refuge> > > > > > > of an able> > > > > > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by

> > > clapping,> > > > > > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make him> > > run> > > > > away> > > > > > > > before the arrow

> > > > > > > > hits him!!!> > > > > > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as we> > > > become> > > > > aware of> > > > > > > > our action, we can alter the course of such

> action.> > > > > > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would> have> > > > > performed in> > > > > > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by

> > > transforming> > > > > our lives> > > > > > > > like roasted> > > > > > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me> you

> > > > will> > > > > attain> > > > > > > Me only...> > > > > > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought gives> > > birth

> > > > to> > > > > many> > > > > > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on> > > > multiplying> > > > > > > without our

> > > > > > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process is> > > very> > > > > > > important. So> > > > > > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it

takes> > > any> > > > > grosser> > > > > > > form. With> > > > > > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped at> > > the

> > > > > source> > > > > > > level - not> > > > > > > > to let them come down even at the thought level.> One> > > > > thought not

> > > > > > > only> > > > > > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around us> and> > > > the> > > > > > > environment we

> > > > > > > > live in. It not only gives immediate> > > > results/pleasure/pain> > > > > but> > > > > > > it carries> > > > > > > > consequences in future also. It not only affects

> our> > > > > present> > > > > > > lfve but many> > > > > > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful> of> > > > their

> > > > > > thoughts.> > > > > > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what kind> of> > > > > freedom do we> > > > > > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow

> has> > > > been> > > > > tied> > > > > > > with a long> > > > > > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:> > > > > > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of

> rope> > > > and> > > > > be> > > > > > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly> > > affairs,> > > > > loose the

> > > > > > > > freedom and be miserable> > > > > > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around> > > > smartly.> > > > > One

> > > > > > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is> still> > > > rope> > > > > tied> > > > > > > to a pole.> > > > > > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from

> the> > > > pole,> > > > > > > > cow has enough strength to free herself> permanently.> > > > > > > Sarvadharmaan> > > > > > > > parityajya...

> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Hope this additional clarification will be beneficial> in> > > > > > > understanding how> > > > > > > > our blue prints are determined and what type of

> > > > karmas/actions> > > > > we> > > > > > should> > > > > > > > engage in.> > > > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print> why> > > > > disturb the> > > > > > > same.> > > > > > > > > When God descended the first human, it is was clear

> that> > > > the> > > > > > > beginning of> > > > > > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do good> things ?> > > > > > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello

 

Yes in this world everything is Pre determined and HAPPENS as per

GOD'S WILL

 

We only think WE are doing it--when we acheive something and BLAME

it on GOD if it goes the otherway !!

 

GOD is watching us ALL --in fact HE resides in each one of us--HE is

the only one who is available 24 Hours of the day to hear us--So HE

never goes on any holiday

 

Cheers

Good luck

Friend

Parthasarathi BR

---

Dear maa,

 

I do agree that everything is as per divine plan, but practically i

could see so much of contradictions in His creation. The scriptures

say that suffering and joy are based on our karma. But when we

suffer, it is not easy to accept that it is because of my past

actions (purva karma). And what is the use of anybody suffering in

this birth, for what they had done in their previous births? Why

punishment, without knowing for what mistake ? Unless a suffering

ends up with a good lesson or a change, it is worth nothing. kindly

clarify.

 

pranams,

 

Sri hari.

aravanan karan

---

 

God's Plan is executed when we surrender our Plan:

The other day I read about the experience of Sarah Smiley. Sarah was

preparing to descend a 5,ooo foot Rigi Mountain peak in central

Switzerland, her guide told her that she should let him carry her

load. She agreed to give some of it to him, but she kept a few

items. As they made their way down the mountainside, Sarah felt

hindered by her load. Soon she had to stop and rest. When she did,

her guide demanded that she give him everything except her Alpine

walking stick. This time she agreed and transferred the load to his

strong shoulders. Without the extra weight, she made the rest of the

trip with ease.

How often are we like Sarah Smiley!

We sing:

" God cares for you

Through sunshine or shadow

God cares for you. "

Although we sing the song, when we face a difficulty, we carry the

burden ourselves. Instead of putting it on the shoulders of our

guide, God, we lug it around, wearing ourselves out with worry

about why the way is so difficult?

God invites us to cast our cares on Him, and He is strong enough to

shoulder the burden. Let's take God up on the offer. Our pathway

will be easier and our steps lighter when we unload our cares.

Our work is to cast care

God's work is to take care.

 

yeshu rathenam

--

, " Manjula Patel " <manjumaa

wrote:

>

> Loving Divine,

> Pranams.

> So many things have been said and I agree with Pratapji - they are

all worth

> re-reading and contemplating. Shilpaji, please read all emails

associated

> with this topic itself not the responses to your email only.

>

> One can feel the love and care of the group when one

reads the

> messages. Don't you ever think that you are alone in this world.

Whether

> we, the humans are with you or not, God has been and will be

always with

> you. Know, believe and accept this fact - even if you don't want

Him, He

> will be with you - that's how He is!!! It requires deep

investigation

> within.

>

> Now I am going to say something which might not be liked but

before you

> reject it my humble request would be please give it a hard

look... (God

> only is talking & listening, however, for communication purposes

and to make

> the point clear I have to use I, you, we, he, they type words but

in

> reality, in the absolute sense, none of this exist. All is

Krishna -

> vasudevam sarvam...)

>

> Humble Opinion: when one is upset with God like this, it shows

that the

> person has never understood Him and never surrendered to Him in

totality.

> When one points his/her finger at God, I would like you to become

aware that

> other three fingers are pointed towards you. Shilpaji, I can

relate your

> state of mind right now with Arjuna's in the very 1st Chapter of

Shrimad

> Bhagwat Gita. The difference is in the difficult moment he was

ready to

> surrender and you are going the opposite...!

>

> Some thoughts/understanding...

>

> - Pandavs were abused, cheated, looted, escaped from being

> crushed/killed/burnt, made victim of fraud, insulted,

humiliated, denied of

> their rights, deprived of their pleasures, punished, their own

family

> members misbehaved, their wife's cloths were snatched in front

of every one

> (including so called dharmaatmaas like Dhrutarashra, Bhishma &

their Gurus),

> their sons were even killed against the warfare laws and so on,

the list

> goes on and on and on... Any word you can think of that

happened with you,

> you will find that it happened with the Pandavas and yet...,

and yet Arjuna

> said very humbly to Lord, I surrender to you, I am confused,

please guide

> me. Ma Kunti said that let us have all the aches and pain, if

that makes

> You (Krishna) stay with us.

> - Arjuna saw 'my' very own kith & kin will be killed in this

war.

> This attachment, this myness, this compassion at wrong time,

for wrong

> people, in wrong place, made him weak. He started acting like a

> coward and dropping his 'gaandiv' declared that now he doesn't

want to

> fight. What God teaches? Fight for the right cause - dharma.

So like

> couple of people have already mentioned, I agree it should be

reported to

> police. One needs to follow the practical spirituality and

that's what God

> taught. Remain alert and awakened - the lesson needs to be

learned. The

> situation repeats - look at the lives of Pandavas...

> - I recommend, please please read the entire Gitaji, understand

the

> true meaning of each sloka, contemplate - internalize them.

The mysticism

> is - more you contemplate, new meanings keep on dawning!!! One

may read

> Gitaji thousands of times but if not implemented, it doesn't do

you any

> good. Reading a menu doesn't satisfy the hunger, one has to

act so

> implement the teachings in life. Do the selfless, rightful

action and leave

> the rest to God - complete surrender - sarvadharmaan

parityajya... God was,

> is and will be with you. It reminds me Mirabai's bhajan - tum

sang tod

> Krisha kon sang jodu??? Even if you want to, you can not leave

God, realize

> it.

>

> Please forgive my straight forwardness, the intention is to

awake...

> My love for you.

> humble regards,

> always at Thy Divine Feet

>

>

>

>

> On 2/20/08, sadhak_insight <sadhak_insight wrote:

> >

> > Namaste to all believers.

> >

> > I have always lived my life as planned by God Almighty.

> > Now that I have matured I realize that lots of people played

around

> > with my emotions and life. what you all have to say about

Insurance

> > policy plans they made after using me to make lots money for

> > themselves. I don't think those are God's plan for my life.

> > I am sure I am not the only victim of these criminally

intellegent

> > non-humans.

> > Where is God? Is He on vacation?

> > Does anyone have answers ?

> > Do not loose faith even if sacrificed. I don't think God would

abuse

> > innocent women.

> > Shanti to All.

> >

> > Shilpa

> >

> > -------------------------

> >

> > Dear Dinine souls,,

> >

> > my humble parnaams..

> >

> > Mr kuldip suri

> > -------------------------

> >

> > <%40>,

> > " sadhak_insight "

> > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Namasté

> > >

> > > As Lord Krisna explained to Prince Arjuna, we must exercise our

> > > duty. Trying to change it will be serving only our ego. For

that

> > > is the key: God does not think, for God is above the thought

> > > process. We should only find peace through the acceptance that

God

> > > is the Enjoyer of all offerings and austerities, as the

Infinite

> > Lord of Creation, above all, and as the Dearest Friend of all.

( " He

> > > finds peace who knows Me as the Enjoyer of all oferings and

> > > austerities, as the Infinite Lord of creation, and as the

Dearest

> > > Friend of all " ). Like an ocean trying to absorb all streams as

> > they

> > > come. Like the drop seeking reintegration in that vast ocean.

> > >

> > > The one true desire that our ego may generate is that of

providing

> > > goodness and generosity to all sentient beings. To see if we

can

> > > finaly emanate love and feel God´s Love as vehicles for God´s

> > Plans.

> > >

> > > So we can not change the course set out in the creation

process.

> > We

> > > should live it and allow God to see the world through us.

> > >

> > > Peace and Love

> > > José Rodriguez

> > >

> > > -------------------------

> > --

> > > Dear Sadhaks,

> > > Pranam,

> > > It is futile to think that Gods plans can be disturbed. No one

has

> > > power to do so. Goswami Tulsidasji wrote in Manas " RAM KINH

CHAHAI

> > > SOI HOI, KARE ANYATHA AS NAHI KOI " . So Always say " SIYA RAM

JAY RAM

> > > JAY JAY RAM "

> > > JAY SHRI RAM,

> > > Raja Gurdasani

> > >

> > > -------------------------

> > --

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > <%40>,

> > " sadhak_insight "

> > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. God's plan can be viewed

under

> > two

> > > > different time zones - My Desperate Time (MDT) and God's Own

Time

> > > (GOT)

> > > >

> > > > " I know discouragement comes easy, but I also know things

happen

> > > when

> > > > God is ready for them to happen and not a second sooner. God

> > knows

> > > why

> > > > he wants things to happen in the order they have to. We just

need

> > > to

> > > > be ready when they come. "

> > > >

> > > > One can recognize that there are two different time zones

going

> > on

> > > > when it comes to correlating God's will and our experience.

One

> > > I'll

> > > > call My Desperate Time (MDT) and the other, God's Own Time

(GOT).

> > > >

> > > > Most of us run on MDT. MDT defines our reality. It's what we

see

> > > and

> > > > feel always. We are conscious of it the minute we rise up in

the

> > > > morning until we put our weary heads on the pillow at night.

We

> > > > measure pleasure and pain by it; we judge our overall state-

of-

> > > being

> > > > by it.

> > > >

> > > > God, on the other hand, exists in another time zone

entirely. In

> > > GOT,

> > > > His will is always done, and nothing is ever late. GOT also

takes

> > > into

> > > > account the MDT of everyone, which can often get tangled up.

You

> > > see

> > > > there are as many MDT zones as there are people, and that

means

> > > they

> > > > can often be in conflict. But with God there is never any

> > conflict.

> > > > There is only one GOT and as far as He is concerned,

everything

> > is

> > > > right on schedule.This is God's plan.

> > > >

> > > > This is why it is utterly silly to wonder if God has heard

our

> > > prayers

> > > > based on whether or not He has acted in MDT. God always

hears our

> > > > prayers ? He has most likely already answered them ? he just

> > > answered

> > > > them in GOT - in God's Own Time.

> > > >

> > > > Most of our issues with God are all about time zones. Think

about

> > > the

> > > > hapless Bible character, Job. Job was smack in the middle of

MDT

> > > all

> > > > the while he was suffering, and his best friends were trying

to

> > > figure

> > > > out why God wasn't doing anything in MDT. Well, we know now

that

> > > God

> > > > rarely does; He is always in GOT and we can see that now, in

> > Job's

> > > > case, because his life ultimately caught up with GOT.

Eventually,

> > > all

> > > > MDT will be GOT. In fact, that will be what heaven is all

about.

> > We

> > > > will all be kicking back in God's Own Time.

> > > >

> > > > So faith is mostly all about time zones.Have faith in Jesus.

When

> > > you

> > > > pray, know that you were heard, and move ahead, believing in

GOT

> > > and ,

> > > > MDT won't be so desperate -God's Own time and My Desperate

Time.

> > > >

> > > > yeshu rathenam

> > > > -------------------------

> > --

> > > -------

> > > >

> > > > <%

40>,

> > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > You and Me are as much God as rest of His creation and non-

> > > creation

> > > > > is!!!

> > > > > with deep love and humble regards,

> > > > > always at Thy Holy Feet

> > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > >

> > > > > -------------------------

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > >

> > > > > Respected One !,

> > > > > Namasthe !!!

> > > > > Yes, Ishwara Chaithanyam is in everyone and everything in

equal

> > > > > measure. Lord Krishna Himself says, " I am the fraud of the

> > > > > fraudsters " .

> > > > > It is the DOMINANCE of quality (Guna - Satva, rajas and

Tamas)

> > of

> > > > > the nature that is exposed in one's thoughts/words/deeds.

> > > > > Let us take everything as a GOD's Plan, as the topic of the

> > > > > discussions itself suggests.

> > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > vm

> > > > > vavamenon

> > > > > -------------------------

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > I respect your sentiments about sanatan dharma.

> > > > > If we are open to learn and accept God in all - vasudevam

> > > sarvam...

> > > > > I would also accept that whatever rubbish is out there is

also

> > > > > God...!!!

> > > > > With deep love and regards,

> > > > > alwasy at Thy Divine Feet.

> > > > >

> > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > > -------------------------

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > Respected One,

> > > > > Namasthe !!!

> > > > > SATHYAMEVA JAYATHE !!!

> > > > > Our Great Maharishis have through countless scriptures

called

> > > every

> > > > human being on this earth top SEEK AND REALISE BY EVERY ONE

> > HIMSELF

> > > > THE " ONE AND ONLY TRUTH EXPRESSED IN TRILLIONS OF FORMS

THOSE CAN

> > > BE

> > > > SEEN WITH OUR NAKED EYES AND THOSE CANNOT BE SEEN AS THE

PARTS OF

> > > THIS

> > > > UNIVERSE, WHICH INCLUDES THE AIR WE BREATHE AND THE WATER WE

> > > DRINK " .

> > > > > Tell me which other brain than Vyaasa Maharshi (or Valmeeki

> > > > Maharshi) has given such infinite scientific knowledge in

such a

> > > short

> > > > 700 slokas ?

> > > > >

> > > > > THOSE WERE THE TRUTHS THAT THEY EXPERIENCED, AND ENJOYING

THE

> > > > ETERNAL BLISS, JOY AND HAPPINESS (not the short-lived

pleasures),

> > > OUT

> > > > OF COMPASSION, THEY TRIED TO GIVE US ALL INHERITORS WHAT THEY

> > > > EXPERIENCED BY STRUCTURING OUR LIVES IN SUCH A WAY THAT WE

REMAIN

> > > > CONNECTED TO THE DIVINE EVERY MOMENT OF OUR LIVES.

> > > > >

> > > > > Your assumption that my mail is not related to GITAJI is

wrong.

> > > My

> > > > response is very much about GITA only, because if one truly

> > > > understands Bhagavad Gita, one needs not take the help of

some

> > > > misleading and distracting foreign dogma. Anyone who truly

> > > > understands Bhagavad Gita understands everything. He remains

> > > > connected to Lord Krishna eternally and becomes the best and

> > > perfect

> > > > devotee, serving everyone else.

> > > > >

> > > > > Bhagavad Gita is the concentrated form of sanatana dharma

> > > principles

> > > > and traditions / the science of Ishwar, His Creation that is

this

> > > > infinitely indescribable Universe, the purpose of our lives

on

> > this

> > > > earth, etc., so beautifully explained through the 1400 plus

> > > > authoritative scriptures and countless other interpretations.

> > The

> > > > Science of Creation as expounded by Sanatana Dharma,

especially

> > the

> > > > quality of OMNIPRESENCE of Ishwara in each animate and

inanimate

> > > part

> > > > of the Creation (including you and me), with the most

scientific

> > > and

> > > > fool-proof " LAW OF KARMA "

> > > > >

> > > > > For example, in sanatana dharma, the scriptures, the

principle

> > of

> > > > LAW OF KARMA, YOGA PRACTICISES, etc. have not changed and

Ishwar

> > > has

> > > > expressed Himself through these Vedas and the universe

itself.

> > > > >

> > > > > If you are truly looking for the " mystical meanings of the

> > > > scriptures " , please read LIFE DIVINE by Ramana Maharishi and

also

> > > > books from Shri Aurobindo to know about our scriptures.

> > > > >

> > > > > please please please do not dilute the ALL-INCLUSIVE,

> > UNIVERSAL,

> > > > SCIENTIFIC AND EXPERIMENTABLE/EXPERIENCEABLE sanatana dharma

> > > > Principles and Traditions. That is my only request.

> > > > >

> > > > > I seek your forgiveness for any statement of mine given

above

> > > being

> > > > violent in anyway.

> > > > > That is my only request.

> > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > vm

> > > > >

> > > > > P.S. : If my above email has not answered all your points

in

> > your

> > > > mail, I am answering them below, point by point :

> > > > >

> > > > > Your Statement : Those who will understand mystism of

Gitaji,

> > > will

> > > > understand other scriptures too.

> > > > > There is no mysticism in GITA, If you understand about the

> > > > indestructibility of ATMA which is part of the PARAM-ATMA,

and

> > how

> > > our

> > > > ignorance has covered (Avaran) the ATMA and also by which

methods

> > > and

> > > > practicises, we can remove the veil of ignorance to see,

realize

> > > and

> > > > experience the ATMA (SELF) which propels us from moment to

> > moment.

> > > > When we experience the ATMA CHAITHANYAM within us, how

blissful

> > we

> > > > become, which is the eternal nature of our SELF. The Sat-

Chit-

> > > Anandam

> > > > which we are craving for is already within you….

> > > > >

> > > > > Your Statement: I am open and respectful of other

scriptures

> > > too as

> > > > they all talk about only one God.

> > > > > " ONE GOD " is the only truth that it said in these

books, ....

> > yet

> > > > it's application is something quite different.

> > > > >

> > > > > Your Statement: I thank my Guruji for showing me the path.

> > > > >

> > > > > For me, this entire universe is a university and I try to

learn

> > > from

> > > > anything and everything that comes across/interacts with me.

For

> > > me,

> > > > every source of knowledge is a teacher and guru. I accepted

Lord

> > > > Krishna as my Guru, then Vyaasa Deva, Valmeeki Maharishi,

then

> > > > Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, Ramana Maharishi, and countless

others, my

> > > > parents, teachers in schools and colleges, persons with whom

I

> > have

> > > > discussed and exchanged knowledge-based spiritual

information,

> > and

> > > all

> > > > my surroundings, etc. I remain eternally indebted to one and

> > all.

> > > > > Thank you.

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > vm

> > > > >

> > > > > (modified by moderator)

> > > > >

> > > > > -------------------------

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear,

> > > > > According to our vedas there are 84 Lac spices on this

earth.

> > > > > Everything works on Dharma. The karmas one does now reaps

the

> > > fruits

> > > > > later, in this birth or next birth. Prarabdha- Agami-

Sanchita

> > 3

> > > > > types of Karma. The prarabdha karma done is the arrow let

out

> > of

> > > > > bow, (said by Adi Sankara in his script Vivekachudamani).

Even

> > > this

> > > > > Prarabdha karma gets washed with certain slokas in which

the

> > pala

> > > > > sruthi said.

> > > > > Saints like Ramana, Sri Ramakrishna, Tukaram, Sakubai,

Alwar

> > etc

> > > > > underwent sufferings due to prarabda karmas. But the

differance

> > > > > between them and us is that the sufferings was never felt

by

> > > them,

> > > > > for us a little pain also causes havock. Ex: Saint Ramana

had

> > > > > surgery done on his leg without any anesthisia and anti

biotic

> > > tabs.

> > > > > Dear sadaks, please understand that GOD is much above

plans,

> > > > > distrubance etc. Level of GOD is Paramanandham.

> > > > > One attains HIM only by complete purity of mind and

thought,

> > with

> > > > > constant . Bakthi.

> > > > > Common sense- To reach divinity or have vision of GOD

everyone

> > > knows

> > > > > the difficulty to erase our Dur Gunas. Simply like that can

> > > anyone

> > > > > think of distrubance. But GOD gets distrubed ONLY in

> > > circumstances

> > > > > when HIS Bakthas are distrubed, but not made to distrube.

This

> > > can

> > > > > be known from many puranas. Ex: Jada Bharatha when he was

to be

> > > > > given human sacrifice GOD rescued. But Jada Bharatha never

> > cried

> > > for

> > > > > help. So also when Adi Sankara was to be slained.

> > > > > GOD is said by vedas as " Aprameyam " . means beyond all five

> > > senses.

> > > > > In that case with what anyone can distrube HIM

> > > > > B.Sathyanarayan.

> > > > > -------------------------

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > <%

40>,

> > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it makes

> > sense

> > > and

> > > > > > is useful!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without knowing

God

> > > and

> > > > > His

> > > > > > Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some one

must

> > be

> > > > > > God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to

> > resolve

> > > if

> > > > > > faced with problem after first accepting or rather

welcoming

> > > it.

> > > > > As

> > > > > > Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I

understand

> > it),

> > > > > the

> > > > > > question is what is to be done now that the arrow has

left

> > the

> > > > > bow.

> > > > > > We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it in a

> > manner

> > > > > > which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid on

us.

> > > Rest is

> > > > > > His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very

> > important

> > > > > too!

> > > > > > An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one

faces

> > > works.

> > > > > > What happens in such case is, either problem is solved in

> > one's

> > > > > > favor or even more important than that is one gets

strength

> > to

> > > face

> > > > > > it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person

rather

> > > than

> > > > > > his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt

him/her.

> > > Isn't

> > > > > > this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is fairness

in us!

> > > This

> > > > > > is the way I see God is changing the blue print or

better yet

> > > is

> > > > > > modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His

total

> > > freedom

> > > > > > at every moment of his/her life.

> > > > > > Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of

changing

> > > His

> > > > > > plan doesn't arise at all.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Pratap Bhatt

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------

-

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > >

> > > > > > <%

40>,

> > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans. GOD

is

> > said

> > > > > > > as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects.

> > > Everything

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > set and computerised and networked and part of His

divine

> > > plan.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > B.Sathyanarayan

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ----------------------

---

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print, as

> > > someone

> > > > > has

> > > > > > > suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this

> > anecdote.

> > > > > > > We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay

mugs and

> > > > > talked

> > > > > > > quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us were

in a

> > > > > season

> > > > > > > with some unanswered questions in our lives. We talked

> > about

> > > > > > > trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and

anxiety.

> > > It's

> > > > > > not

> > > > > > > always an easy thing to do.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Every day we make a choice to either trust God ... or

not.

> > We

> > > > > can

> > > > > > > worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can

choose

> > to

> > > > > > trust

> > > > > > > Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and that

He

> > will

> > > > > > direct

> > > > > > > our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really trust

> > God? "

> > > > > Often

> > > > > > > with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried

lives we

> > > > > > say, " No. "

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His Word,

the

> > > Bible?

> > > > > He

> > > > > > > says...

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > " I will instruct you and guide you along the best

pathway

> > for

> > > > > your

> > > > > > > life. I will advise you and watch your progress, " This

is

> > > God's

> > > > > > plan.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The choice you make today to believe those words and

trust

> > > God

> > > > > will

> > > > > > > bring a result in your life...listen...

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the

Lord. So

> > > > > > rejoice

> > > > > > > in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all

those

> > who

> > > > > > choose

> > > > > > > to obey Him, " the Bible says.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our

lives

> > > > > releases

> > > > > > > the peace and the comfort of His love and it will

surround

> > > > > > > us...holding us secure through the winds of change and

> > > > > > uncertainty.

> > > > > > > Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing that

will

> > > be

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > by-product of His surrounding love.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the best

> > > pathway

> > > > > for

> > > > > > > your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust

is a

> > > choice

> > > > > > we

> > > > > > > can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy to

> > > > > countless

> > > > > > > believers.

> > > > > > > Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in

your

> > > life.

> > > > > > > God's plan never fails.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > yeshu rathenam

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ----------------------

---

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > Hare Krsna!!

> > > > > > > Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting that

> > > example

> > > > > > about

> > > > > > > the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks

thanks!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Daniel

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ----------------------

---

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > <%

40>,

> > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Divine All,

> > > > > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > > > > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring

words.

> > It

> > > is

> > > > > > > nothing

> > > > > > > > but praising God / Guru.

> > > > > > > > The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> > > > > > > > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email by

> > > > > Anilji

> > > > > > > and I

> > > > > > > > continued using that word so that he can also relate

the

> > > > > answer

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > his

> > > > > > > > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is fixed,

why

> > > > > > bother?

> > > > > > > My

> > > > > > > > response was to say that destiny can be changed with

our

> > > > > present

> > > > > > > > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of

our

> > past

> > > > > > action

> > > > > > > > which we can not change (though some of it can be

changed

> > > by

> > > > > an

> > > > > > > able

> > > > > > > > Guru) but we can change the course of our present and

> > > future

> > > > > > > actions.

> > > > > > > > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma

> > > theory.

> > > > > > > > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate on

Karma

> > > but

> > > > > > > > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> > > > > > > > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past

> > > > > lives),

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the

> > portion

> > > is

> > > > > > > worked out in present life),

> > > > > > > > - Agami (from present life what we keep on

> > > adding to

> > > > > > > Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> > > > > > > > lives) and

> > > > > > > > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out

> > > > > > immediately).

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and satva

> > > > > perspective.

> > > > > > > > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > > > > > > > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG 3:27,

> > > 5:12

> > > > > > > > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> > > > > > > > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG

> > > 17:16

> > > > > > > > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> > > > > > > > * There are many slokas that reference non-doership

> > of

> > > the

> > > > > > > action

> > > > > > > > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can

help

> > > with

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > 2nd

> > > > > > > > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37

(roasted

> > > seed

> > > > > > don't

> > > > > > > > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my

Christian

> > > > > friends

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the Bible

and

> > > Kriya

> > > > > > > Yoga'.

> > > > > > > > Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> > > > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> > > > > > > > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at

the

> > way

> > > > > > humans

> > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > made, brain, which controls everything is at the top

> > > [satvik],

> > > > > > > heart

> > > > > > > > which controls physical functioning and emotions is

in

> > the

> > > > > centre

> > > > > > > > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom

> > > [Tamasik].Can

> > > > > > any

> > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > else do a better job than this. Let us all surrender

to

> > HIM

> > > > > > > totally.

> > > > > > > > G.Vaidyanathan.

> > > > > > > > --------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > <%

40>,

> > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > > > > > > > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW WOW

> > > WOW!!!!!

> > > > > > > > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my

question

> > > is,

> > > > > can

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that

corresponds to

> > > what

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And

what is

> > > the

> > > > > > blue

> > > > > > > > > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish. My

> > > Bhagavad

> > > > > > > Gita is

> > > > > > > > > in Spanish.

> > > > > > > > > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > > > > > > > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > > > > > > > chatur patel

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and

teach in

> > > > > > Christian

> > > > > > > > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept the

> > Bible

> > > > > myth

> > > > > > > and God.

> > > > > > > > > Classyoga

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > -----

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible

refuting

> > > every

> > > > > > > logic or

> > > > > > > > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting

bible

> > > > > would

> > > > > > > never be

> > > > > > > > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana dharma "

is

> > or

> > > > > what

> > > > > > > Lord

> > > > > > > > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN

> > BHAGAVAD

> > > > > > GITA.

> > > > > > > In

> > > > > > > > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible have

their

> > > > > > origins

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > Indian scriptures.

> > > > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME,

> > UNIVERSAL,

> > > > > > > SCIENTIFIC

> > > > > > > > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His

creation

> > > that

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > this

> > > > > > > > > universe and its mysteries.

> > > > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > > > vm

> > > > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings. I

> > was

> > > > > > sharing

> > > > > > > it to

> > > > > > > > > show how we become the creator of our own blue

print

> > > which I

> > > > > > > indicated

> > > > > > > > > in the beginning and I thought the example was

> > > appropriate

> > > > > > > otherwise I

> > > > > > > > > would not have shared.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Scriptures are written using mystical language so

one

> > can

> > > > > > > interpret

> > > > > > > > > them according to their level of understanding and

> > > spiritual

> > > > > > > > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any one,

> > the

> > > > > > example

> > > > > > > > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you

simply

> > drop

> > > > > it ;-

> > > > > > )

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan

Dharma are

> > > more

> > > > > > > elaborate

> > > > > > > > > and inclusive in directing our thought process

towards

> > > God.

> > > > > > > Those who

> > > > > > > > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will understand

> > other

> > > > > > > scriptures

> > > > > > > > > too. I am open and respectful of other scriptures

too

> > as

> > > > > they

> > > > > > > all

> > > > > > > > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for

> > > showing me

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > path.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > with humble regards,

> > > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > dear divine souls.

> > > > > > > > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere Gratitude

to

> > You,

> > > > > > manula

> > > > > > > ji

> > > > > > > > > for puting forwards this mail.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > jai sri ram

> > > > > > > > > kuldip

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

----

> > --

> > > ----

> > > > > --

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > <%

40>,

> > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > <manjumaa@>

> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > > > > > Pranam.

> > > > > > > > > > Very beautiful things have been said in response

to

> > > > > Anilji's

> > > > > > > beautiful

> > > > > > > > > > questions.

> > > > > > > > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very

enlightening

> > > for me

> > > > > > so

> > > > > > > would

> > > > > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > share it with you all and hope it would do the

same

> > for

> > > > > you

> > > > > > > too...

> > > > > > > > > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > > > > > > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what He

> > > > > explained...

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print.

> > > Something

> > > > > > from

> > > > > > > Bible

> > > > > > > > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism.

> > > When

> > > > > > Adam-

> > > > > > > Eve

> > > > > > > > > were created

> > > > > > > > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation,

they

> > > were

> > > > > > > naked,

> > > > > > > > i.e.,

> > > > > > > > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When they

> > > ate

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > fruit

> > > > > > > > > from the

> > > > > > > > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their

> > > nakedness,

> > > > > > > i.e., when

> > > > > > > > > they

> > > > > > > > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of enjoying

> > the

> > > > > > fruits

> > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > it, they came

> > > > > > > > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the doer...'

> > or

> > > > > they

> > > > > > > became ego

> > > > > > > > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the consequences

> > of

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > fruits

> > > > > > > > > of their

> > > > > > > > > > action. They became shameful. So really when God

> > > > > > > descended the

> > > > > > > > > first

> > > > > > > > > > human, the intention was not to end but make it

> > > > > immortal

> > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > like Him. We

> > > > > > > > > > human missed out understanding it. the intention

> > > has

> > > > > > still

> > > > > > > > > remain the same

> > > > > > > > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the

> > body

> > > > > > > > > consciousness. As

> > > > > > > > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain Me

> > > > > only...

> > > > > > > > > > - There are three types of actions that determine

> > > our

> > > > > > blue

> > > > > > > print.

> > > > > > > > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > > > > > > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed

> > > at a

> > > > > > > dear. Most

> > > > > > > > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be

> > > > > reverted,

> > > > > > > it sure

> > > > > > > > > > will attain

> > > > > > > > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have

> > > any

> > > > > > > control over

> > > > > > > > > > that arrow.

> > > > > > > > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let

> > go

> > > > > > towards

> > > > > > > > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is

> > > in

> > > > > > > motion, yet

> > > > > > > > > > we have some

> > > > > > > > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle

> > and

> > > > > thus

> > > > > > > stop

> > > > > > > > > the fruits of

> > > > > > > > > > such action.

> > > > > > > > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver

> > over

> > > > > > which

> > > > > > > we have

> > > > > > > > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > > > > > > > - In other words,

> > > > > > > > > > - we have done some actions in past of which we

> > > have

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > bear the

> > > > > > > > > > consequences. However, He said that if you

> > have

> > > > > taken

> > > > > > > refuge

> > > > > > > > > of an able

> > > > > > > > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by

> > > > > clapping,

> > > > > > > > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make

> > him

> > > > > run

> > > > > > > away

> > > > > > > > > > before the arrow

> > > > > > > > > > hits him!!!

> > > > > > > > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as

> > we

> > > > > > become

> > > > > > > aware of

> > > > > > > > > > our action, we can alter the course of such

> > > action.

> > > > > > > > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would

> > > have

> > > > > > > performed in

> > > > > > > > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by

> > > > > transforming

> > > > > > > our lives

> > > > > > > > > > like roasted

> > > > > > > > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me

> > > you

> > > > > > will

> > > > > > > attain

> > > > > > > > > Me only...

> > > > > > > > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought

gives

> > > > > birth

> > > > > > to

> > > > > > > many

> > > > > > > > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on

> > > > > > multiplying

> > > > > > > > > without our

> > > > > > > > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought process

> > is

> > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > important. So

> > > > > > > > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it

> > takes

> > > > > any

> > > > > > > grosser

> > > > > > > > > form. With

> > > > > > > > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be stopped

> > at

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > source

> > > > > > > > > level - not

> > > > > > > > > > to let them come down even at the thought level.

> > > One

> > > > > > > thought not

> > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people around

> > us

> > > and

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > environment we

> > > > > > > > > > live in. It not only gives immediate

> > > > > > results/pleasure/pain

> > > > > > > but

> > > > > > > > > it carries

> > > > > > > > > > consequences in future also. It not only affects

> > > our

> > > > > > > present

> > > > > > > > > lfve but many

> > > > > > > > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very careful

> > > of

> > > > > > their

> > > > > > > > thoughts.

> > > > > > > > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what

kind

> > > of

> > > > > > > freedom do we

> > > > > > > > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A cow

> > > has

> > > > > > been

> > > > > > > tied

> > > > > > > > > with a long

> > > > > > > > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > > > > > > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of

> > > rope

> > > > > > and

> > > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly

> > > > > affairs,

> > > > > > > loose the

> > > > > > > > > > freedom and be miserable

> > > > > > > > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around

> > > > > > smartly.

> > > > > > > One

> > > > > > > > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is

> > > still

> > > > > > rope

> > > > > > > tied

> > > > > > > > > to a pole.

> > > > > > > > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from

> > > the

> > > > > > pole,

> > > > > > > > > > cow has enough strength to free herself

> > > permanently.

> > > > > > > > > Sarvadharmaan

> > > > > > > > > > parityajya...

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Hope this additional clarification will be

beneficial

> > > in

> > > > > > > > > understanding how

> > > > > > > > > > our blue prints are determined and what type of

> > > > > > karmas/actions

> > > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > should

> > > > > > > > > > engage in.

> > > > > > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue print

> > > why

> > > > > > > disturb the

> > > > > > > > > same.

> > > > > > > > > > > When God descended the first human, it is was

clear

> > > that

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > beginning of

> > > > > > > > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do good

> > > things ?

> > > > > > > > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this query ?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dear Fellow Sadhakas, Namaste!

 

I want to address the issue raised by Karanji as stated in post: " I

do agree that everything is as per divine plan, but practically I

could see so much of contradictions in His creation " .

 

I want to make a point in the spirit of learning. For one who

considers everything happening per divine plan, how can he/her see

contradictions in His creation? This suggests lack of conviction in

divine plan. Is it possible such apparant contradictions in His

creation caused by people He created, and not by Him? Since mankind

has highly developed mind, aren't they more responsible for living

in Peace?

 

I think, if God is viewed separate from His creation, then only

question may be asked: why did He allow contradictions in divine

plan? In a painting, can any painted object such as cow ask question

as to why she is made cow and not the beautiful peacock dancing

against the background of mountain and river? None have access to

know the will of Painter, but if one of them gets it, one will know

the Painter (Intelligence that draws), paint, and painting are the

same, ONE Intelligent creation on display. Please see this point and

inquire hard. Is this true God is separate from His creation? Is it

possible that God is just the spirited name given to all that Is

here manifest in front of us and unmanifest yet? Isn't it more like

I, Pratap, father, son, brother, husband, grandfather, Engineer,

Retiree, etc etc etc.... are all but ONE Being!

 

Let us just suppose for now God is all of us put together-Whole

Existence, mankind, animals, mountains, oceans, forests, insects,

bacterias, all that is known and unknown, all laws of nature, man-

made laws, countries, states, governments etc etc to govern and

guide the entire existence. There is no doubt that there is

Intelligence in such creation for It runs as a whole system, not

just for one individual or species! Obviously to run as a Whole

System there must be a Divine plan or Intelligence through all of

us! When viewed from my point of view, the same intelligence/divine

plan can be seen as contradictions due to assumed limitations

inherent in separation! SO if we realize we are not separate,

independent entities with our own will, our own interests but rather

ONE Intelligence Existence appearing as separate beings, we will

cease to see contradictions! Then this supposition of God being the

Intelligent creation Itself will become our Reality!

 

Namaskars.... Pratap

(Pratap Bhatt)

---

Dear Seekers of Truth:

I read the letters below and I thought I will add my own humble

views in the following :

Hypothesis: What Sun is to the well being and nourishment of the

material world, God (Brahman) is to the well being and nourishment

of the 'Mind Stuff' for the lack of a proper word.

We all see and know that Sun is a giver and also a witness to our

progress but has no " Kartrutva " in the sense of mortal self like me

saying 'I am earning, working etc.' but without the Sun nothing of

the material world exists as we do not have heat, light, food and

noursihment from Moon. So we call him a Pratyaksha Devata (Visible

God), He does not have anything to do with what we do with his

bounty. We can use it and revere him or misuse and kill ourselves

with skin cancer and what not. He is not responible for all the

results of his giving. Most of the early civilizations all over the

world have taken Sun as the God and prayed as if he is the only God.

This analysis helps us clear some of the misconceptions of the God

that is unkown in my humble opinion.

 

Coming to the Unknown God, we can extend our imagination that

without him giving us the Conciousness (Life force) we do not

exist. What we do with that conciousness the disturabance of which

with Prana along with the individual 'Vasanas' creates the mind and

we know the rest of the story how use it, misuse it and do not use

it. The God is not responsible for what we do with our mind. If we

can see the universal conciousness as all pervading etc., experienc

it,and feel it one becomes an evolved person. If we do not want to

think about what is behind our mind and assume it to be my birth

right to whatever I want to do with it (just like the Sun's energy

above) we get into all kinds of problems and sometimes blame the God

for it or praise him for it. He has no Kartutva and he is a Big

Giver with no terms and conditions attached and is a witness to what

all is happening. HE has nothing to do with the 'good' and

bad', 'right or wrong' etc.

 

Having said that, we need all the tools provided by religion,

philosophy, Gurus and what ever our belief systems we follow to make

us realize, experience and live with Bliss with this universal

principle of God. So one can see where I am going with this.

Everybody is right in his own way as there is no one way to reach

that state of Sat Chit Ananda. This is really the beauty of

Sanatana Dharma propounded by Vedas. " Ekam Sat Vipra Bahudha

Vadanti " . This is the reason why we do not have any 'Sinners' and

we do not have any conflict with questions like " If God is all

merciful why did he create Misery, sorrow and all other negative

things going on in the world? " . We say he does not give any one

person less and another person more etc. just like the Sun who does

not discriminate between good and bad people/places etc to give His

energy and he does not also expect anything in return. If we take

less of what he gives he is not happy and if one grabs as much as he

can he is not upset either.

 

Our God is noble to all and does not expect any particular behavior

from us towards Him. Since he gives us all the knowledge and life

force we need to be respectable to Him and pray to give us more

wisdom to realize that state of perfect Bliss which is our nature to

start with before we started thinking and assuming that we are the

doers, thninkers etc.

 

Thanks for letting me share these thoughts that are not mine but

His. I am sorry for the length of this note as words have their own

limitations. All the answers to our questions are in the Great

Bhagavad Gita. The more we assimilate the message of it better we

all be.

Sarve Janah Sukhino Bhantu.

bvempaty

---

Dear Sadaks,

God does not want us to suffer or enjoy in worldly matters. The past

actions (Karmas) done by us have formed the present happenings. We

have predetermined our future. God only wills that one should become

Dharmic and completely balanced mind in pleasures and displeasures

with no desires. ..In Geetha Bagavan said that a person surrendering

to HIM will be taken care off that he reaches HIM.

 

Do service, give food, spend money for noble cause etc all go as

Puniya Karmas and get paid as Boga Sakthi. But if one does meditate

or do bakthi on Bagavan he get HIS daya/Karuniyam. That takes one to

noble birth as a Rishi/saint eventually leading to GOD.

The sufferings such as a parentless child on road, woman misused,

extreme poverty, aged on road side not cared for, people with

chronic diseases undergoing untold pain etc are seen by many of us.

But Budha blessed with riches,health, etc saw these and went in

search of diviness, which most of us never even contemplate. Our

sufferings are nothing or little.

Imagine mother seetha in ravana` s custody, panadavas chased away to

forest after cunningly taking away their riches, Vasudeva and Devaki

the parents of Sri Krishna, prisoned by Kans. King Dasaradhada had

culprit within the family to poison the mind of queen Kaikeyi,

resulting Dasaratha death and Sri Rama Seperation. Harischandra lost

his whole kingdom and was a servant in cremation ground. some saints

sacrifised their lives for love of GOD.

 

Most of us are much blessed and should abstain from crying over our

problems. Instead study lives of great men and learn valuable hints

to live. In fact time is running out. Go searching in oneself to

remove the clouds of anger, jealosy, hatred etc the Vision can be

seen. Everyone of us has that power. But due to these dur gunas

(clouds) the light is not seen. This is said by Bagavan in Geetha,

Saint Ramakrishna, Saint Tukaram, Puranderadoss etc.

What I need is the balanced mind of that Sri Rama while in battle

field telling Ravana (disarmed) to go and come next day after

thinking over. Will anyone just be calm enough with a person who

took his wife.

B.Sathyanarayan

---

Like so many other questions,

this one (who is GOD? What is destiny?, Is he responsible for all?

too is connected with the core question :

Who am I ? or Who are We?

As one begins to understand himself.......these question get

answered

or dissolved one by one or many a time....

 

It is Better to discuss or Seek guidance on contemplating on the

above question. ....

Sushil Jain

---

 

 

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Hello

>

> Yes in this world everything is Pre determined and HAPPENS as per

> GOD'S WILL

>

> We only think WE are doing it--when we acheive something and BLAME

> it on GOD if it goes the otherway !!

>

> GOD is watching us ALL --in fact HE resides in each one of us--HE

is

> the only one who is available 24 Hours of the day to hear us--So

HE

> never goes on any holiday

>

> Cheers

> Good luck

> Friend

> Parthasarathi BR

> -

--

> Dear maa,

>

> I do agree that everything is as per divine plan, but practically

i

> could see so much of contradictions in His creation. The

scriptures

> say that suffering and joy are based on our karma. But when we

> suffer, it is not easy to accept that it is because of my past

> actions (purva karma). And what is the use of anybody suffering in

> this birth, for what they had done in their previous births? Why

> punishment, without knowing for what mistake ? Unless a

suffering

> ends up with a good lesson or a change, it is worth nothing.

kindly

> clarify.

>

> pranams,

>

> Sri hari.

> aravanan karan

> -

--

>

> God's Plan is executed when we surrender our Plan:

> The other day I read about the experience of Sarah Smiley. Sarah

was

> preparing to descend a 5,ooo foot Rigi Mountain peak in central

> Switzerland, her guide told her that she should let him carry her

> load. She agreed to give some of it to him, but she kept a few

> items. As they made their way down the mountainside, Sarah felt

> hindered by her load. Soon she had to stop and rest. When she did,

> her guide demanded that she give him everything except her Alpine

> walking stick. This time she agreed and transferred the load to

his

> strong shoulders. Without the extra weight, she made the rest of

the

> trip with ease.

> How often are we like Sarah Smiley!

> We sing:

> " God cares for you

> Through sunshine or shadow

> God cares for you. "

> Although we sing the song, when we face a difficulty, we carry the

> burden ourselves. Instead of putting it on the shoulders of our

> guide, God, we lug it around, wearing ourselves out with worry

> about why the way is so difficult?

> God invites us to cast our cares on Him, and He is strong enough

to

> shoulder the burden. Let's take God up on the offer. Our pathway

> will be easier and our steps lighter when we unload our cares.

> Our work is to cast care

> God's work is to take care.

>

> yeshu rathenam

> -

-

> , " Manjula Patel " <manjumaa@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Loving Divine,

> > Pranams.

> > So many things have been said and I agree with Pratapji - they

are

> all worth

> > re-reading and contemplating. Shilpaji, please read all emails

> associated

> > with this topic itself not the responses to your email only.

> >

> > One can feel the love and care of the group when one

> reads the

> > messages. Don't you ever think that you are alone in this

world.

> Whether

> > we, the humans are with you or not, God has been and will be

> always with

> > you. Know, believe and accept this fact - even if you don't

want

> Him, He

> > will be with you - that's how He is!!! It requires deep

> investigation

> > within.

> >

> > Now I am going to say something which might not be liked but

> before you

> > reject it my humble request would be please give it a hard

> look... (God

> > only is talking & listening, however, for communication purposes

> and to make

> > the point clear I have to use I, you, we, he, they type words

but

> in

> > reality, in the absolute sense, none of this exist. All is

> Krishna -

> > vasudevam sarvam...)

> >

> > Humble Opinion: when one is upset with God like this, it shows

> that the

> > person has never understood Him and never surrendered to Him in

> totality.

> > When one points his/her finger at God, I would like you to

become

> aware that

> > other three fingers are pointed towards you. Shilpaji, I can

> relate your

> > state of mind right now with Arjuna's in the very 1st Chapter of

> Shrimad

> > Bhagwat Gita. The difference is in the difficult moment he was

> ready to

> > surrender and you are going the opposite...!

> >

> > Some thoughts/understanding...

> >

> > - Pandavs were abused, cheated, looted, escaped from being

> > crushed/killed/burnt, made victim of fraud, insulted,

> humiliated, denied of

> > their rights, deprived of their pleasures, punished, their

own

> family

> > members misbehaved, their wife's cloths were snatched in

front

> of every one

> > (including so called dharmaatmaas like Dhrutarashra, Bhishma

&

> their Gurus),

> > their sons were even killed against the warfare laws and so

on,

> the list

> > goes on and on and on... Any word you can think of that

> happened with you,

> > you will find that it happened with the Pandavas and yet...,

> and yet Arjuna

> > said very humbly to Lord, I surrender to you, I am confused,

> please guide

> > me. Ma Kunti said that let us have all the aches and pain,

if

> that makes

> > You (Krishna) stay with us.

> > - Arjuna saw 'my' very own kith & kin will be killed in this

> war.

> > This attachment, this myness, this compassion at wrong time,

> for wrong

> > people, in wrong place, made him weak. He started acting

like a

> > coward and dropping his 'gaandiv' declared that now he

doesn't

> want to

> > fight. What God teaches? Fight for the right cause -

dharma.

> So like

> > couple of people have already mentioned, I agree it should be

> reported to

> > police. One needs to follow the practical spirituality and

> that's what God

> > taught. Remain alert and awakened - the lesson needs to be

> learned. The

> > situation repeats - look at the lives of Pandavas...

> > - I recommend, please please read the entire Gitaji,

understand

> the

> > true meaning of each sloka, contemplate - internalize them.

> The mysticism

> > is - more you contemplate, new meanings keep on dawning!!!

One

> may read

> > Gitaji thousands of times but if not implemented, it doesn't

do

> you any

> > good. Reading a menu doesn't satisfy the hunger, one has to

> act so

> > implement the teachings in life. Do the selfless, rightful

> action and leave

> > the rest to God - complete surrender - sarvadharmaan

> parityajya... God was,

> > is and will be with you. It reminds me Mirabai's bhajan -

tum

> sang tod

> > Krisha kon sang jodu??? Even if you want to, you can not

leave

> God, realize

> > it.

> >

> > Please forgive my straight forwardness, the intention is to

> awake...

> > My love for you.

> > humble regards,

> > always at Thy Divine Feet

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > On 2/20/08, sadhak_insight <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Namaste to all believers.

> > >

> > > I have always lived my life as planned by God Almighty.

> > > Now that I have matured I realize that lots of people played

> around

> > > with my emotions and life. what you all have to say about

> Insurance

> > > policy plans they made after using me to make lots money for

> > > themselves. I don't think those are God's plan for my life.

> > > I am sure I am not the only victim of these criminally

> intellegent

> > > non-humans.

> > > Where is God? Is He on vacation?

> > > Does anyone have answers ?

> > > Do not loose faith even if sacrificed. I don't think God would

> abuse

> > > innocent women.

> > > Shanti to All.

> > >

> > > Shilpa

> > >

> > > -------------------------

> > >

> > > Dear Dinine souls,,

> > >

> > > my humble parnaams..

> > >

> > > Mr kuldip suri

> > > -------------------------

> > >

> > > <%40>,

> > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Namasté

> > > >

> > > > As Lord Krisna explained to Prince Arjuna, we must exercise

our

> > > > duty. Trying to change it will be serving only our ego. For

> that

> > > > is the key: God does not think, for God is above the thought

> > > > process. We should only find peace through the acceptance

that

> God

> > > > is the Enjoyer of all offerings and austerities, as the

> Infinite

> > > Lord of Creation, above all, and as the Dearest Friend of all.

> ( " He

> > > > finds peace who knows Me as the Enjoyer of all oferings and

> > > > austerities, as the Infinite Lord of creation, and as the

> Dearest

> > > > Friend of all " ). Like an ocean trying to absorb all streams

as

> > > they

> > > > come. Like the drop seeking reintegration in that vast ocean.

> > > >

> > > > The one true desire that our ego may generate is that of

> providing

> > > > goodness and generosity to all sentient beings. To see if we

> can

> > > > finaly emanate love and feel God´s Love as vehicles for God´s

> > > Plans.

> > > >

> > > > So we can not change the course set out in the creation

> process.

> > > We

> > > > should live it and allow God to see the world through us.

> > > >

> > > > Peace and Love

> > > > José Rodriguez

> > > >

> > > > -------------------------

> > > --

> > > > Dear Sadhaks,

> > > > Pranam,

> > > > It is futile to think that Gods plans can be disturbed. No

one

> has

> > > > power to do so. Goswami Tulsidasji wrote in Manas " RAM KINH

> CHAHAI

> > > > SOI HOI, KARE ANYATHA AS NAHI KOI " . So Always say " SIYA RAM

> JAY RAM

> > > > JAY JAY RAM "

> > > > JAY SHRI RAM,

> > > > Raja Gurdasani

> > > >

> > > > -------------------------

> > > --

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > <%

40>,

> > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. God's plan can be viewed

> under

> > > two

> > > > > different time zones - My Desperate Time (MDT) and God's

Own

> Time

> > > > (GOT)

> > > > >

> > > > > " I know discouragement comes easy, but I also know things

> happen

> > > > when

> > > > > God is ready for them to happen and not a second sooner.

God

> > > knows

> > > > why

> > > > > he wants things to happen in the order they have to. We

just

> need

> > > > to

> > > > > be ready when they come. "

> > > > >

> > > > > One can recognize that there are two different time zones

> going

> > > on

> > > > > when it comes to correlating God's will and our

experience.

> One

> > > > I'll

> > > > > call My Desperate Time (MDT) and the other, God's Own Time

> (GOT).

> > > > >

> > > > > Most of us run on MDT. MDT defines our reality. It's what

we

> see

> > > > and

> > > > > feel always. We are conscious of it the minute we rise up

in

> the

> > > > > morning until we put our weary heads on the pillow at

night.

> We

> > > > > measure pleasure and pain by it; we judge our overall

state-

> of-

> > > > being

> > > > > by it.

> > > > >

> > > > > God, on the other hand, exists in another time zone

> entirely. In

> > > > GOT,

> > > > > His will is always done, and nothing is ever late. GOT

also

> takes

> > > > into

> > > > > account the MDT of everyone, which can often get tangled

up.

> You

> > > > see

> > > > > there are as many MDT zones as there are people, and that

> means

> > > > they

> > > > > can often be in conflict. But with God there is never any

> > > conflict.

> > > > > There is only one GOT and as far as He is concerned,

> everything

> > > is

> > > > > right on schedule.This is God's plan.

> > > > >

> > > > > This is why it is utterly silly to wonder if God has heard

> our

> > > > prayers

> > > > > based on whether or not He has acted in MDT. God always

> hears our

> > > > > prayers ? He has most likely already answered them ? he

just

> > > > answered

> > > > > them in GOT - in God's Own Time.

> > > > >

> > > > > Most of our issues with God are all about time zones.

Think

> about

> > > > the

> > > > > hapless Bible character, Job. Job was smack in the middle

of

> MDT

> > > > all

> > > > > the while he was suffering, and his best friends were

trying

> to

> > > > figure

> > > > > out why God wasn't doing anything in MDT. Well, we know

now

> that

> > > > God

> > > > > rarely does; He is always in GOT and we can see that now,

in

> > > Job's

> > > > > case, because his life ultimately caught up with GOT.

> Eventually,

> > > > all

> > > > > MDT will be GOT. In fact, that will be what heaven is all

> about.

> > > We

> > > > > will all be kicking back in God's Own Time.

> > > > >

> > > > > So faith is mostly all about time zones.Have faith in

Jesus.

> When

> > > > you

> > > > > pray, know that you were heard, and move ahead, believing

in

> GOT

> > > > and ,

> > > > > MDT won't be so desperate -God's Own time and My Desperate

> Time.

> > > > >

> > > > > yeshu rathenam

> > > > > -------------------------

> > > --

> > > > -------

> > > > >

> > > > > <%

> 40>,

> > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > > You and Me are as much God as rest of His creation and

non-

> > > > creation

> > > > > > is!!!

> > > > > > with deep love and humble regards,

> > > > > > always at Thy Holy Feet

> > > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------

-

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Respected One !,

> > > > > > Namasthe !!!

> > > > > > Yes, Ishwara Chaithanyam is in everyone and everything

in

> equal

> > > > > > measure. Lord Krishna Himself says, " I am the fraud of

the

> > > > > > fraudsters " .

> > > > > > It is the DOMINANCE of quality (Guna - Satva, rajas and

> Tamas)

> > > of

> > > > > > the nature that is exposed in one's thoughts/words/deeds.

> > > > > > Let us take everything as a GOD's Plan, as the topic of

the

> > > > > > discussions itself suggests.

> > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > vm

> > > > > > vavamenon

> > > > > > ------------------------

-

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > > I respect your sentiments about sanatan dharma.

> > > > > > If we are open to learn and accept God in all - vasudevam

> > > > sarvam...

> > > > > > I would also accept that whatever rubbish is out there

is

> also

> > > > > > God...!!!

> > > > > > With deep love and regards,

> > > > > > alwasy at Thy Divine Feet.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > > > ------------------------

-

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > Respected One,

> > > > > > Namasthe !!!

> > > > > > SATHYAMEVA JAYATHE !!!

> > > > > > Our Great Maharishis have through countless scriptures

> called

> > > > every

> > > > > human being on this earth top SEEK AND REALISE BY EVERY ONE

> > > HIMSELF

> > > > > THE " ONE AND ONLY TRUTH EXPRESSED IN TRILLIONS OF FORMS

> THOSE CAN

> > > > BE

> > > > > SEEN WITH OUR NAKED EYES AND THOSE CANNOT BE SEEN AS THE

> PARTS OF

> > > > THIS

> > > > > UNIVERSE, WHICH INCLUDES THE AIR WE BREATHE AND THE WATER

WE

> > > > DRINK " .

> > > > > > Tell me which other brain than Vyaasa Maharshi (or

Valmeeki

> > > > > Maharshi) has given such infinite scientific knowledge in

> such a

> > > > short

> > > > > 700 slokas ?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > THOSE WERE THE TRUTHS THAT THEY EXPERIENCED, AND

ENJOYING

> THE

> > > > > ETERNAL BLISS, JOY AND HAPPINESS (not the short-lived

> pleasures),

> > > > OUT

> > > > > OF COMPASSION, THEY TRIED TO GIVE US ALL INHERITORS WHAT

THEY

> > > > > EXPERIENCED BY STRUCTURING OUR LIVES IN SUCH A WAY THAT WE

> REMAIN

> > > > > CONNECTED TO THE DIVINE EVERY MOMENT OF OUR LIVES.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your assumption that my mail is not related to GITAJI is

> wrong.

> > > > My

> > > > > response is very much about GITA only, because if one truly

> > > > > understands Bhagavad Gita, one needs not take the help of

> some

> > > > > misleading and distracting foreign dogma. Anyone who truly

> > > > > understands Bhagavad Gita understands everything. He

remains

> > > > > connected to Lord Krishna eternally and becomes the best

and

> > > > perfect

> > > > > devotee, serving everyone else.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Bhagavad Gita is the concentrated form of sanatana dharma

> > > > principles

> > > > > and traditions / the science of Ishwar, His Creation that

is

> this

> > > > > infinitely indescribable Universe, the purpose of our

lives

> on

> > > this

> > > > > earth, etc., so beautifully explained through the 1400 plus

> > > > > authoritative scriptures and countless other

interpretations.

> > > The

> > > > > Science of Creation as expounded by Sanatana Dharma,

> especially

> > > the

> > > > > quality of OMNIPRESENCE of Ishwara in each animate and

> inanimate

> > > > part

> > > > > of the Creation (including you and me), with the most

> scientific

> > > > and

> > > > > fool-proof " LAW OF KARMA "

> > > > > >

> > > > > > For example, in sanatana dharma, the scriptures, the

> principle

> > > of

> > > > > LAW OF KARMA, YOGA PRACTICISES, etc. have not changed and

> Ishwar

> > > > has

> > > > > expressed Himself through these Vedas and the universe

> itself.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > If you are truly looking for the " mystical meanings of

the

> > > > > scriptures " , please read LIFE DIVINE by Ramana Maharishi

and

> also

> > > > > books from Shri Aurobindo to know about our scriptures.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > please please please do not dilute the ALL-INCLUSIVE,

> > > UNIVERSAL,

> > > > > SCIENTIFIC AND EXPERIMENTABLE/EXPERIENCEABLE sanatana

dharma

> > > > > Principles and Traditions. That is my only request.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I seek your forgiveness for any statement of mine given

> above

> > > > being

> > > > > violent in anyway.

> > > > > > That is my only request.

> > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > vm

> > > > > >

> > > > > > P.S. : If my above email has not answered all your

points

> in

> > > your

> > > > > mail, I am answering them below, point by point :

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your Statement : Those who will understand mystism of

> Gitaji,

> > > > will

> > > > > understand other scriptures too.

> > > > > > There is no mysticism in GITA, If you understand about

the

> > > > > indestructibility of ATMA which is part of the PARAM-ATMA,

> and

> > > how

> > > > our

> > > > > ignorance has covered (Avaran) the ATMA and also by which

> methods

> > > > and

> > > > > practicises, we can remove the veil of ignorance to see,

> realize

> > > > and

> > > > > experience the ATMA (SELF) which propels us from moment to

> > > moment.

> > > > > When we experience the ATMA CHAITHANYAM within us, how

> blissful

> > > we

> > > > > become, which is the eternal nature of our SELF. The Sat-

> Chit-

> > > > Anandam

> > > > > which we are craving for is already within you….

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your Statement: I am open and respectful of other

> scriptures

> > > > too as

> > > > > they all talk about only one God.

> > > > > > " ONE GOD " is the only truth that it said in these

> books, ....

> > > yet

> > > > > it's application is something quite different.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Your Statement: I thank my Guruji for showing me the

path.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > For me, this entire universe is a university and I try

to

> learn

> > > > from

> > > > > anything and everything that comes across/interacts with

me.

> For

> > > > me,

> > > > > every source of knowledge is a teacher and guru. I

accepted

> Lord

> > > > > Krishna as my Guru, then Vyaasa Deva, Valmeeki Maharishi,

> then

> > > > > Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, Ramana Maharishi, and countless

> others, my

> > > > > parents, teachers in schools and colleges, persons with

whom

> I

> > > have

> > > > > discussed and exchanged knowledge-based spiritual

> information,

> > > and

> > > > all

> > > > > my surroundings, etc. I remain eternally indebted to one

and

> > > all.

> > > > > > Thank you.

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > vm

> > > > > >

> > > > > > (modified by moderator)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------

-

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear,

> > > > > > According to our vedas there are 84 Lac spices on this

> earth.

> > > > > > Everything works on Dharma. The karmas one does now

reaps

> the

> > > > fruits

> > > > > > later, in this birth or next birth. Prarabdha- Agami-

> Sanchita

> > > 3

> > > > > > types of Karma. The prarabdha karma done is the arrow

let

> out

> > > of

> > > > > > bow, (said by Adi Sankara in his script

Vivekachudamani).

> Even

> > > > this

> > > > > > Prarabdha karma gets washed with certain slokas in which

> the

> > > pala

> > > > > > sruthi said.

> > > > > > Saints like Ramana, Sri Ramakrishna, Tukaram, Sakubai,

> Alwar

> > > etc

> > > > > > underwent sufferings due to prarabda karmas. But the

> differance

> > > > > > between them and us is that the sufferings was never

felt

> by

> > > > them,

> > > > > > for us a little pain also causes havock. Ex: Saint

Ramana

> had

> > > > > > surgery done on his leg without any anesthisia and anti

> biotic

> > > > tabs.

> > > > > > Dear sadaks, please understand that GOD is much above

> plans,

> > > > > > distrubance etc. Level of GOD is Paramanandham.

> > > > > > One attains HIM only by complete purity of mind and

> thought,

> > > with

> > > > > > constant . Bakthi.

> > > > > > Common sense- To reach divinity or have vision of GOD

> everyone

> > > > knows

> > > > > > the difficulty to erase our Dur Gunas. Simply like that

can

> > > > anyone

> > > > > > think of distrubance. But GOD gets distrubed ONLY in

> > > > circumstances

> > > > > > when HIS Bakthas are distrubed, but not made to

distrube.

> This

> > > > can

> > > > > > be known from many puranas. Ex: Jada Bharatha when he

was

> to be

> > > > > > given human sacrifice GOD rescued. But Jada Bharatha

never

> > > cried

> > > > for

> > > > > > help. So also when Adi Sankara was to be slained.

> > > > > > GOD is said by vedas as " Aprameyam " . means beyond all

five

> > > > senses.

> > > > > > In that case with what anyone can distrube HIM

> > > > > > B.Sathyanarayan.

> > > > > > ------------------------

-

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > <%

> 40>,

> > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it

makes

> > > sense

> > > > and

> > > > > > > is useful!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without

knowing

> God

> > > > and

> > > > > > His

> > > > > > > Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some

one

> must

> > > be

> > > > > > > God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to

> > > resolve

> > > > if

> > > > > > > faced with problem after first accepting or rather

> welcoming

> > > > it.

> > > > > > As

> > > > > > > Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I

> understand

> > > it),

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > question is what is to be done now that the arrow has

> left

> > > the

> > > > > > bow.

> > > > > > > We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it in

a

> > > manner

> > > > > > > which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid on

> us.

> > > > Rest is

> > > > > > > His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very

> > > important

> > > > > > too!

> > > > > > > An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one

> faces

> > > > works.

> > > > > > > What happens in such case is, either problem is solved

in

> > > one's

> > > > > > > favor or even more important than that is one gets

> strength

> > > to

> > > > face

> > > > > > > it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person

> rather

> > > > than

> > > > > > > his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt

> him/her.

> > > > Isn't

> > > > > > > this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is fairness

> in us!

> > > > This

> > > > > > > is the way I see God is changing the blue print or

> better yet

> > > > is

> > > > > > > modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His

> total

> > > > freedom

> > > > > > > at every moment of his/her life.

> > > > > > > Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of

> changing

> > > > His

> > > > > > > plan doesn't arise at all.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Pratap Bhatt

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ----------------------

--

> -

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > <%

> 40>,

> > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans.

GOD

> is

> > > said

> > > > > > > > as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects.

> > > > Everything

> > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > set and computerised and networked and part of His

> divine

> > > > plan.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > B.Sathyanarayan

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------------

--

> ---

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print,

as

> > > > someone

> > > > > > has

> > > > > > > > suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this

> > > anecdote.

> > > > > > > > We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay

> mugs and

> > > > > > talked

> > > > > > > > quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us

were

> in a

> > > > > > season

> > > > > > > > with some unanswered questions in our lives. We

talked

> > > about

> > > > > > > > trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and

> anxiety.

> > > > It's

> > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > always an easy thing to do.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Every day we make a choice to either trust God ...

or

> not.

> > > We

> > > > > > can

> > > > > > > > worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can

> choose

> > > to

> > > > > > > trust

> > > > > > > > Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and

that

> He

> > > will

> > > > > > > direct

> > > > > > > > our path in His time ... and it will not be too late.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really

trust

> > > God? "

> > > > > > Often

> > > > > > > > with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried

> lives we

> > > > > > > say, " No. "

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His

Word,

> the

> > > > Bible?

> > > > > > He

> > > > > > > > says...

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > " I will instruct you and guide you along the best

> pathway

> > > for

> > > > > > your

> > > > > > > > life. I will advise you and watch your progress, "

This

> is

> > > > God's

> > > > > > > plan.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > The choice you make today to believe those words and

> trust

> > > > God

> > > > > > will

> > > > > > > > bring a result in your life...listen...

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the

> Lord. So

> > > > > > > rejoice

> > > > > > > > in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all

> those

> > > who

> > > > > > > choose

> > > > > > > > to obey Him, " the Bible says.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our

> lives

> > > > > > releases

> > > > > > > > the peace and the comfort of His love and it will

> surround

> > > > > > > > us...holding us secure through the winds of change

and

> > > > > > > uncertainty.

> > > > > > > > Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing

that

> will

> > > > be

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > by-product of His surrounding love.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the

best

> > > > pathway

> > > > > > for

> > > > > > > > your life frees you from the anxiety of worry. Trust

> is a

> > > > choice

> > > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > can make in a God who has proven Himself trustworthy

to

> > > > > > countless

> > > > > > > > believers.

> > > > > > > > Choose to trust Him today with the question marks in

> your

> > > > life.

> > > > > > > > God's plan never fails.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > yeshu rathenam

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------------

--

> ---

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > Hare Krsna!!

> > > > > > > > Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting

that

> > > > example

> > > > > > > about

> > > > > > > > the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks

> thanks!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Daniel

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------------

--

> ---

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > <%

> 40>,

> > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Divine All,

> > > > > > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > > > > > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring

> words.

> > > It

> > > > is

> > > > > > > > nothing

> > > > > > > > > but praising God / Guru.

> > > > > > > > > The following is in response to Danielji's inquiry:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> > > > > > > > > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email

by

> > > > > > Anilji

> > > > > > > > and I

> > > > > > > > > continued using that word so that he can also

relate

> the

> > > > > > answer

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > his

> > > > > > > > > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is

fixed,

> why

> > > > > > > bother?

> > > > > > > > My

> > > > > > > > > response was to say that destiny can be changed

with

> our

> > > > > > present

> > > > > > > > > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences of

> our

> > > past

> > > > > > > action

> > > > > > > > > which we can not change (though some of it can be

> changed

> > > > by

> > > > > > an

> > > > > > > > able

> > > > > > > > > Guru) but we can change the course of our present

and

> > > > future

> > > > > > > > actions.

> > > > > > > > > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on karma

> > > > theory.

> > > > > > > > > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate

on

> Karma

> > > > but

> > > > > > > > > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> > > > > > > > > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past

> > > > > > lives),

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the

> > > portion

> > > > is

> > > > > > > > worked out in present life),

> > > > > > > > > - Agami (from present life what we keep on

> > > > adding to

> > > > > > > > Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> > > > > > > > > lives) and

> > > > > > > > > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out

> > > > > > > immediately).

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and

satva

> > > > > > perspective.

> > > > > > > > > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > > > > > > > > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG

3:27,

> > > > 5:12

> > > > > > > > > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> > > > > > > > > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG

> > > > 17:16

> > > > > > > > > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> > > > > > > > > * There are many slokas that reference non-doership

> > > of

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > action

> > > > > > > > > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that can

> help

> > > > with

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > 2nd

> > > > > > > > > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37

> (roasted

> > > > seed

> > > > > > > don't

> > > > > > > > > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my

> Christian

> > > > > > friends

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the

Bible

> and

> > > > Kriya

> > > > > > > > Yoga'.

> > > > > > > > > Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> > > > > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> > > > > > > > > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look at

> the

> > > way

> > > > > > > humans

> > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > made, brain, which controls everything is at the

top

> > > > [satvik],

> > > > > > > > heart

> > > > > > > > > which controls physical functioning and emotions

is

> in

> > > the

> > > > > > centre

> > > > > > > > > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom

> > > > [Tamasik].Can

> > > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > else do a better job than this. Let us all

surrender

> to

> > > HIM

> > > > > > > > totally.

> > > > > > > > > G.Vaidyanathan.

> > > > > > > > > ------------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > <%

> 40>,

> > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > > > > > > > > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW

WOW

> > > > WOW!!!!!

> > > > > > > > > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my

> question

> > > > is,

> > > > > > can

> > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that

> corresponds to

> > > > what

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And

> what is

> > > > the

> > > > > > > blue

> > > > > > > > > > print? If I know the term, I know it in Spanish.

My

> > > > Bhagavad

> > > > > > > > Gita is

> > > > > > > > > > in Spanish.

> > > > > > > > > > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > > > > > > > > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > > > > > > > > chatur patel

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > Thanks for the nice explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and

> teach in

> > > > > > > Christian

> > > > > > > > > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept

the

> > > Bible

> > > > > > myth

> > > > > > > > and God.

> > > > > > > > > > Classyoga

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > -----

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible

> refuting

> > > > every

> > > > > > > > logic or

> > > > > > > > > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that quoting

> bible

> > > > > > would

> > > > > > > > never be

> > > > > > > > > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana

dharma "

> is

> > > or

> > > > > > what

> > > > > > > > Lord

> > > > > > > > > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN

> > > BHAGAVAD

> > > > > > > GITA.

> > > > > > > > In

> > > > > > > > > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible

have

> their

> > > > > > > origins

> > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > Indian scriptures.

> > > > > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME,

> > > UNIVERSAL,

> > > > > > > > SCIENTIFIC

> > > > > > > > > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His

> creation

> > > > that

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > this

> > > > > > > > > > universe and its mysteries.

> > > > > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > vm

> > > > > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > My intention was not to hurt any one's feelings.

I

> > > was

> > > > > > > sharing

> > > > > > > > it to

> > > > > > > > > > show how we become the creator of our own blue

> print

> > > > which I

> > > > > > > > indicated

> > > > > > > > > > in the beginning and I thought the example was

> > > > appropriate

> > > > > > > > otherwise I

> > > > > > > > > > would not have shared.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Scriptures are written using mystical language

so

> one

> > > can

> > > > > > > > interpret

> > > > > > > > > > them according to their level of understanding

and

> > > > spiritual

> > > > > > > > > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any

one,

> > > the

> > > > > > > example

> > > > > > > > > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you

> simply

> > > drop

> > > > > > it ;-

> > > > > > > )

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan

> Dharma are

> > > > more

> > > > > > > > elaborate

> > > > > > > > > > and inclusive in directing our thought process

> towards

> > > > God.

> > > > > > > > Those who

> > > > > > > > > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will

understand

> > > other

> > > > > > > > scriptures

> > > > > > > > > > too. I am open and respectful of other

scriptures

> too

> > > as

> > > > > > they

> > > > > > > > all

> > > > > > > > > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji for

> > > > showing me

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > path.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > with humble regards,

> > > > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > > > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > dear divine souls.

> > > > > > > > > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere

Gratitude

> to

> > > You,

> > > > > > > manula

> > > > > > > > ji

> > > > > > > > > > for puting forwards this mail.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > jai sri ram

> > > > > > > > > > kuldip

> > > > > > > > > > ----------------

--

> ----

> > > --

> > > > ----

> > > > > > --

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > <%

> 40>,

> > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > > <manjumaa@>

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > > > > > > Pranam.

> > > > > > > > > > > Very beautiful things have been said in

response

> to

> > > > > > Anilji's

> > > > > > > > beautiful

> > > > > > > > > > > questions.

> > > > > > > > > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very

> enlightening

> > > > for me

> > > > > > > so

> > > > > > > > would

> > > > > > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > > share it with you all and hope it would do the

> same

> > > for

> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > too...

> > > > > > > > > > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > > > > > > > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what

He

> > > > > > explained...

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print.

> > > > Something

> > > > > > > from

> > > > > > > > Bible

> > > > > > > > > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism.

> > > > When

> > > > > > > Adam-

> > > > > > > > Eve

> > > > > > > > > > were created

> > > > > > > > > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation,

> they

> > > > were

> > > > > > > > naked,

> > > > > > > > > i.e.,

> > > > > > > > > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When

they

> > > > ate

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > fruit

> > > > > > > > > > from the

> > > > > > > > > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their

> > > > nakedness,

> > > > > > > > i.e., when

> > > > > > > > > > they

> > > > > > > > > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of

enjoying

> > > the

> > > > > > > fruits

> > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > it, they came

> > > > > > > > > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the

doer...'

> > > or

> > > > > > they

> > > > > > > > became ego

> > > > > > > > > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the

consequences

> > > of

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > fruits

> > > > > > > > > > of their

> > > > > > > > > > > action. They became shameful. So really when

God

> > > > > > > > descended the

> > > > > > > > > > first

> > > > > > > > > > > human, the intention was not to end but make it

> > > > > > immortal

> > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > > like Him. We

> > > > > > > > > > > human missed out understanding it. the

intention

> > > > has

> > > > > > > still

> > > > > > > > > > remain the same

> > > > > > > > > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from the

> > > body

> > > > > > > > > > consciousness. As

> > > > > > > > > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will attain

Me

> > > > > > only...

> > > > > > > > > > > - There are three types of actions that

determine

> > > > our

> > > > > > > blue

> > > > > > > > print.

> > > > > > > > > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > > > > > > > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow aimed

> > > > at a

> > > > > > > > dear. Most

> > > > > > > > > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be

> > > > > > reverted,

> > > > > > > > it sure

> > > > > > > > > > > will attain

> > > > > > > > > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have

> > > > any

> > > > > > > > control over

> > > > > > > > > > > that arrow.

> > > > > > > > > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let

> > > go

> > > > > > > towards

> > > > > > > > > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is

> > > > in

> > > > > > > > motion, yet

> > > > > > > > > > > we have some

> > > > > > > > > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle

> > > and

> > > > > > thus

> > > > > > > > stop

> > > > > > > > > > the fruits of

> > > > > > > > > > > such action.

> > > > > > > > > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver

> > > over

> > > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > we have

> > > > > > > > > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > > > > > > > > - In other words,

> > > > > > > > > > > - we have done some actions in past of which we

> > > > have

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > bear the

> > > > > > > > > > > consequences. However, He said that if you

> > > have

> > > > > > taken

> > > > > > > > refuge

> > > > > > > > > > of an able

> > > > > > > > > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by

> > > > > > clapping,

> > > > > > > > > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make

> > > him

> > > > > > run

> > > > > > > > away

> > > > > > > > > > > before the arrow

> > > > > > > > > > > hits him!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as

> > > we

> > > > > > > become

> > > > > > > > aware of

> > > > > > > > > > > our action, we can alter the course of such

> > > > action.

> > > > > > > > > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would

> > > > have

> > > > > > > > performed in

> > > > > > > > > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by

> > > > > > transforming

> > > > > > > > our lives

> > > > > > > > > > > like roasted

> > > > > > > > > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me

> > > > you

> > > > > > > will

> > > > > > > > attain

> > > > > > > > > > Me only...

> > > > > > > > > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought

> gives

> > > > > > birth

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > many

> > > > > > > > > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps on

> > > > > > > multiplying

> > > > > > > > > > without our

> > > > > > > > > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought

process

> > > is

> > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > important. So

> > > > > > > > > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it

> > > takes

> > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > grosser

> > > > > > > > > > form. With

> > > > > > > > > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be

stopped

> > > at

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > source

> > > > > > > > > > level - not

> > > > > > > > > > > to let them come down even at the thought

level.

> > > > One

> > > > > > > > thought not

> > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people

around

> > > us

> > > > and

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > environment we

> > > > > > > > > > > live in. It not only gives immediate

> > > > > > > results/pleasure/pain

> > > > > > > > but

> > > > > > > > > > it carries

> > > > > > > > > > > consequences in future also. It not only

affects

> > > > our

> > > > > > > > present

> > > > > > > > > > lfve but many

> > > > > > > > > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very

careful

> > > > of

> > > > > > > their

> > > > > > > > > thoughts.

> > > > > > > > > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what

> kind

> > > > of

> > > > > > > > freedom do we

> > > > > > > > > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A

cow

> > > > has

> > > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > tied

> > > > > > > > > > with a long

> > > > > > > > > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > > > > > > > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of

> > > > rope

> > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly

> > > > > > affairs,

> > > > > > > > loose the

> > > > > > > > > > > freedom and be miserable

> > > > > > > > > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around

> > > > > > > smartly.

> > > > > > > > One

> > > > > > > > > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is

> > > > still

> > > > > > > rope

> > > > > > > > tied

> > > > > > > > > > to a pole.

> > > > > > > > > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope from

> > > > the

> > > > > > > pole,

> > > > > > > > > > > cow has enough strength to free herself

> > > > permanently.

> > > > > > > > > > Sarvadharmaan

> > > > > > > > > > > parityajya...

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Hope this additional clarification will be

> beneficial

> > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > understanding how

> > > > > > > > > > > our blue prints are determined and what type of

> > > > > > > karmas/actions

> > > > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > > should

> > > > > > > > > > > engage in.

> > > > > > > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue

print

> > > > why

> > > > > > > > disturb the

> > > > > > > > > > same.

> > > > > > > > > > > > When God descended the first human, it is

was

> clear

> > > > that

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > beginning of

> > > > > > > > > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do

good

> > > > things ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this

query ?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
Guest guest

Dear divine souls,,,

 

 

parnaams!

 

What ever happens, it has to happen, per Universal cause and effect.

Cause created in the Past, manifests in present Life, as experienced

in present joy and pain. It is a part of a master plan.

But everything is not predetermined ! Fate is what happens.

But God has bestowed His FREE WILL on us, and we have control over

our present actions.

 

The real Questions is what Is real Free Will ? whether it truly Exists...?

 

Please provide your insights

thanks

eternal child.

Kuldip Suri

 

------------------------------

Namaste,

One can know the previous birth karmas by proper meditation /

contemplation.

 

Dushasana after the war was over was looked after by Pandavas. Once

Sri Krishna came met Dushasana who asked Bhagavan why he was born

blind. Bhagavan said sit and meditate on it. So Dushasana had a

vision of his previous birth where he blinded a crane. It is upto one

to seek the answers and one can surely get answers.

B.Sathyanarayan

----------------------------

 

 

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Dear Fellow Sadhakas, Namaste!

>

> I want to address the issue raised by Karanji as stated in post: " I

> do agree that everything is as per divine plan, but practically I

> could see so much of contradictions in His creation " .

>

> I want to make a point in the spirit of learning. For one who

> considers everything happening per divine plan, how can he/her see

> contradictions in His creation? This suggests lack of conviction in

> divine plan. Is it possible such apparant contradictions in His

> creation caused by people He created, and not by Him? Since mankind

> has highly developed mind, aren't they more responsible for living

> in Peace?

>

> I think, if God is viewed separate from His creation, then only

> question may be asked: why did He allow contradictions in divine

> plan? In a painting, can any painted object such as cow ask

question

> as to why she is made cow and not the beautiful peacock dancing

> against the background of mountain and river? None have access to

> know the will of Painter, but if one of them gets it, one will know

> the Painter (Intelligence that draws), paint, and painting are the

> same, ONE Intelligent creation on display. Please see this point

and

> inquire hard. Is this true God is separate from His creation? Is it

> possible that God is just the spirited name given to all that Is

> here manifest in front of us and unmanifest yet? Isn't it more like

> I, Pratap, father, son, brother, husband, grandfather, Engineer,

> Retiree, etc etc etc.... are all but ONE Being!

>

> Let us just suppose for now God is all of us put together-Whole

> Existence, mankind, animals, mountains, oceans, forests, insects,

> bacterias, all that is known and unknown, all laws of nature, man-

> made laws, countries, states, governments etc etc to govern and

> guide the entire existence. There is no doubt that there is

> Intelligence in such creation for It runs as a whole system, not

> just for one individual or species! Obviously to run as a Whole

> System there must be a Divine plan or Intelligence through all of

> us! When viewed from my point of view, the same intelligence/divine

> plan can be seen as contradictions due to assumed limitations

> inherent in separation! SO if we realize we are not separate,

> independent entities with our own will, our own interests but

rather

> ONE Intelligence Existence appearing as separate beings, we will

> cease to see contradictions! Then this supposition of God being

the

> Intelligent creation Itself will become our Reality!

>

> Namaskars.... Pratap

> (Pratap Bhatt)

> --

-

> Dear Seekers of Truth:

> I read the letters below and I thought I will add my own humble

> views in the following :

> Hypothesis: What Sun is to the well being and nourishment of the

> material world, God (Brahman) is to the well being and nourishment

> of the 'Mind Stuff' for the lack of a proper word.

> We all see and know that Sun is a giver and also a witness to our

> progress but has no " Kartrutva " in the sense of mortal self like me

> saying 'I am earning, working etc.' but without the Sun nothing of

> the material world exists as we do not have heat, light, food and

> noursihment from Moon. So we call him a Pratyaksha Devata (Visible

> God), He does not have anything to do with what we do with his

> bounty. We can use it and revere him or misuse and kill ourselves

> with skin cancer and what not. He is not responible for all the

> results of his giving. Most of the early civilizations all over

the

> world have taken Sun as the God and prayed as if he is the only

God.

> This analysis helps us clear some of the misconceptions of the God

> that is unkown in my humble opinion.

>

> Coming to the Unknown God, we can extend our imagination that

> without him giving us the Conciousness (Life force) we do not

> exist. What we do with that conciousness the disturabance of which

> with Prana along with the individual 'Vasanas' creates the mind and

> we know the rest of the story how use it, misuse it and do not use

> it. The God is not responsible for what we do with our mind. If

we

> can see the universal conciousness as all pervading etc.,

experienc

> it,and feel it one becomes an evolved person. If we do not want to

> think about what is behind our mind and assume it to be my birth

> right to whatever I want to do with it (just like the Sun's energy

> above) we get into all kinds of problems and sometimes blame the

God

> for it or praise him for it. He has no Kartutva and he is a Big

> Giver with no terms and conditions attached and is a witness to

what

> all is happening. HE has nothing to do with the 'good' and

> bad', 'right or wrong' etc.

>

> Having said that, we need all the tools provided by religion,

> philosophy, Gurus and what ever our belief systems we follow to

make

> us realize, experience and live with Bliss with this universal

> principle of God. So one can see where I am going with this.

> Everybody is right in his own way as there is no one way to reach

> that state of Sat Chit Ananda. This is really the beauty of

> Sanatana Dharma propounded by Vedas. " Ekam Sat Vipra Bahudha

> Vadanti " . This is the reason why we do not have any 'Sinners' and

> we do not have any conflict with questions like " If God is all

> merciful why did he create Misery, sorrow and all other negative

> things going on in the world? " . We say he does not give any one

> person less and another person more etc. just like the Sun who does

> not discriminate between good and bad people/places etc to give His

> energy and he does not also expect anything in return. If we take

> less of what he gives he is not happy and if one grabs as much as

he

> can he is not upset either.

>

> Our God is noble to all and does not expect any particular behavior

> from us towards Him. Since he gives us all the knowledge and life

> force we need to be respectable to Him and pray to give us more

> wisdom to realize that state of perfect Bliss which is our nature

to

> start with before we started thinking and assuming that we are the

> doers, thninkers etc.

>

> Thanks for letting me share these thoughts that are not mine but

> His. I am sorry for the length of this note as words have their own

> limitations. All the answers to our questions are in the Great

> Bhagavad Gita. The more we assimilate the message of it better we

> all be.

> Sarve Janah Sukhino Bhantu.

> bvempaty

> --

-

> Dear Sadaks,

> God does not want us to suffer or enjoy in worldly matters. The

past

> actions (Karmas) done by us have formed the present happenings. We

> have predetermined our future. God only wills that one should

become

> Dharmic and completely balanced mind in pleasures and displeasures

> with no desires. ..In Geetha Bagavan said that a person

surrendering

> to HIM will be taken care off that he reaches HIM.

>

> Do service, give food, spend money for noble cause etc all go as

> Puniya Karmas and get paid as Boga Sakthi. But if one does meditate

> or do bakthi on Bagavan he get HIS daya/Karuniyam. That takes one

to

> noble birth as a Rishi/saint eventually leading to GOD.

> The sufferings such as a parentless child on road, woman misused,

> extreme poverty, aged on road side not cared for, people with

> chronic diseases undergoing untold pain etc are seen by many of us.

> But Budha blessed with riches,health, etc saw these and went in

> search of diviness, which most of us never even contemplate. Our

> sufferings are nothing or little.

> Imagine mother seetha in ravana` s custody, panadavas chased away

to

> forest after cunningly taking away their riches, Vasudeva and

Devaki

> the parents of Sri Krishna, prisoned by Kans. King Dasaradhada had

> culprit within the family to poison the mind of queen Kaikeyi,

> resulting Dasaratha death and Sri Rama Seperation. Harischandra

lost

> his whole kingdom and was a servant in cremation ground. some

saints

> sacrifised their lives for love of GOD.

>

> Most of us are much blessed and should abstain from crying over our

> problems. Instead study lives of great men and learn valuable hints

> to live. In fact time is running out. Go searching in oneself to

> remove the clouds of anger, jealosy, hatred etc the Vision can be

> seen. Everyone of us has that power. But due to these dur gunas

> (clouds) the light is not seen. This is said by Bagavan in Geetha,

> Saint Ramakrishna, Saint Tukaram, Puranderadoss etc.

> What I need is the balanced mind of that Sri Rama while in battle

> field telling Ravana (disarmed) to go and come next day after

> thinking over. Will anyone just be calm enough with a person who

> took his wife.

> B.Sathyanarayan

> --

-

> Like so many other questions,

> this one (who is GOD? What is destiny?, Is he responsible for all?

> too is connected with the core question :

> Who am I ? or Who are We?

> As one begins to understand himself.......these question get

> answered

> or dissolved one by one or many a time....

>

> It is Better to discuss or Seek guidance on contemplating on the

> above question. ....

> Sushil Jain

> --

-

>

>

>

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > Hello

> >

> > Yes in this world everything is Pre determined and HAPPENS as

per

> > GOD'S WILL

> >

> > We only think WE are doing it--when we acheive something and

BLAME

> > it on GOD if it goes the otherway !!

> >

> > GOD is watching us ALL --in fact HE resides in each one of us--HE

> is

> > the only one who is available 24 Hours of the day to hear us--So

> HE

> > never goes on any holiday

> >

> > Cheers

> > Good luck

> > Friend

> > Parthasarathi BR

> >

-

> --

> > Dear maa,

> >

> > I do agree that everything is as per divine plan, but practically

> i

> > could see so much of contradictions in His creation. The

> scriptures

> > say that suffering and joy are based on our karma. But when we

> > suffer, it is not easy to accept that it is because of my past

> > actions (purva karma). And what is the use of anybody suffering

in

> > this birth, for what they had done in their previous births? Why

> > punishment, without knowing for what mistake ? Unless a

> suffering

> > ends up with a good lesson or a change, it is worth nothing.

> kindly

> > clarify.

> >

> > pranams,

> >

> > Sri hari.

> > aravanan karan

> >

-

> --

> >

> > God's Plan is executed when we surrender our Plan:

> > The other day I read about the experience of Sarah Smiley. Sarah

> was

> > preparing to descend a 5,ooo foot Rigi Mountain peak in central

> > Switzerland, her guide told her that she should let him carry her

> > load. She agreed to give some of it to him, but she kept a few

> > items. As they made their way down the mountainside, Sarah felt

> > hindered by her load. Soon she had to stop and rest. When she

did,

> > her guide demanded that she give him everything except her Alpine

> > walking stick. This time she agreed and transferred the load to

> his

> > strong shoulders. Without the extra weight, she made the rest of

> the

> > trip with ease.

> > How often are we like Sarah Smiley!

> > We sing:

> > " God cares for you

> > Through sunshine or shadow

> > God cares for you. "

> > Although we sing the song, when we face a difficulty, we carry

the

> > burden ourselves. Instead of putting it on the shoulders of our

> > guide, God, we lug it around, wearing ourselves out with worry

> > about why the way is so difficult?

> > God invites us to cast our cares on Him, and He is strong enough

> to

> > shoulder the burden. Let's take God up on the offer. Our pathway

> > will be easier and our steps lighter when we unload our cares.

> > Our work is to cast care

> > God's work is to take care.

> >

> > yeshu rathenam

> >

-

> -

> > , " Manjula Patel " <manjumaa@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Loving Divine,

> > > Pranams.

> > > So many things have been said and I agree with Pratapji - they

> are

> > all worth

> > > re-reading and contemplating. Shilpaji, please read all emails

> > associated

> > > with this topic itself not the responses to your email only.

> > >

> > > One can feel the love and care of the group when one

> > reads the

> > > messages. Don't you ever think that you are alone in this

> world.

> > Whether

> > > we, the humans are with you or not, God has been and will be

> > always with

> > > you. Know, believe and accept this fact - even if you don't

> want

> > Him, He

> > > will be with you - that's how He is!!! It requires deep

> > investigation

> > > within.

> > >

> > > Now I am going to say something which might not be liked but

> > before you

> > > reject it my humble request would be please give it a hard

> > look... (God

> > > only is talking & listening, however, for communication

purposes

> > and to make

> > > the point clear I have to use I, you, we, he, they type words

> but

> > in

> > > reality, in the absolute sense, none of this exist. All is

> > Krishna -

> > > vasudevam sarvam...)

> > >

> > > Humble Opinion: when one is upset with God like this, it shows

> > that the

> > > person has never understood Him and never surrendered to Him in

> > totality.

> > > When one points his/her finger at God, I would like you to

> become

> > aware that

> > > other three fingers are pointed towards you. Shilpaji, I can

> > relate your

> > > state of mind right now with Arjuna's in the very 1st Chapter

of

> > Shrimad

> > > Bhagwat Gita. The difference is in the difficult moment he was

> > ready to

> > > surrender and you are going the opposite...!

> > >

> > > Some thoughts/understanding...

> > >

> > > - Pandavs were abused, cheated, looted, escaped from being

> > > crushed/killed/burnt, made victim of fraud, insulted,

> > humiliated, denied of

> > > their rights, deprived of their pleasures, punished, their

> own

> > family

> > > members misbehaved, their wife's cloths were snatched in

> front

> > of every one

> > > (including so called dharmaatmaas like Dhrutarashra, Bhishma

> &

> > their Gurus),

> > > their sons were even killed against the warfare laws and so

> on,

> > the list

> > > goes on and on and on... Any word you can think of that

> > happened with you,

> > > you will find that it happened with the Pandavas and yet...,

> > and yet Arjuna

> > > said very humbly to Lord, I surrender to you, I am confused,

> > please guide

> > > me. Ma Kunti said that let us have all the aches and pain,

> if

> > that makes

> > > You (Krishna) stay with us.

> > > - Arjuna saw 'my' very own kith & kin will be killed in this

> > war.

> > > This attachment, this myness, this compassion at wrong time,

> > for wrong

> > > people, in wrong place, made him weak. He started acting

> like a

> > > coward and dropping his 'gaandiv' declared that now he

> doesn't

> > want to

> > > fight. What God teaches? Fight for the right cause -

> dharma.

> > So like

> > > couple of people have already mentioned, I agree it should

be

> > reported to

> > > police. One needs to follow the practical spirituality and

> > that's what God

> > > taught. Remain alert and awakened - the lesson needs to be

> > learned. The

> > > situation repeats - look at the lives of Pandavas...

> > > - I recommend, please please read the entire Gitaji,

> understand

> > the

> > > true meaning of each sloka, contemplate - internalize them.

> > The mysticism

> > > is - more you contemplate, new meanings keep on dawning!!!

> One

> > may read

> > > Gitaji thousands of times but if not implemented, it doesn't

> do

> > you any

> > > good. Reading a menu doesn't satisfy the hunger, one has to

> > act so

> > > implement the teachings in life. Do the selfless, rightful

> > action and leave

> > > the rest to God - complete surrender - sarvadharmaan

> > parityajya... God was,

> > > is and will be with you. It reminds me Mirabai's bhajan -

> tum

> > sang tod

> > > Krisha kon sang jodu??? Even if you want to, you can not

> leave

> > God, realize

> > > it.

> > >

> > > Please forgive my straight forwardness, the intention is to

> > awake...

> > > My love for you.

> > > humble regards,

> > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > On 2/20/08, sadhak_insight <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Namaste to all believers.

> > > >

> > > > I have always lived my life as planned by God Almighty.

> > > > Now that I have matured I realize that lots of people played

> > around

> > > > with my emotions and life. what you all have to say about

> > Insurance

> > > > policy plans they made after using me to make lots money for

> > > > themselves. I don't think those are God's plan for my life.

> > > > I am sure I am not the only victim of these criminally

> > intellegent

> > > > non-humans.

> > > > Where is God? Is He on vacation?

> > > > Does anyone have answers ?

> > > > Do not loose faith even if sacrificed. I don't think God

would

> > abuse

> > > > innocent women.

> > > > Shanti to All.

> > > >

> > > > Shilpa

> > > >

> > > > -------------------------

> > > >

> > > > Dear Dinine souls,,

> > > >

> > > > my humble parnaams..

> > > >

> > > > Mr kuldip suri

> > > > -------------------------

> > > >

> > > > <%

40>,

> > > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Namasté

> > > > >

> > > > > As Lord Krisna explained to Prince Arjuna, we must exercise

> our

> > > > > duty. Trying to change it will be serving only our ego. For

> > that

> > > > > is the key: God does not think, for God is above the thought

> > > > > process. We should only find peace through the acceptance

> that

> > God

> > > > > is the Enjoyer of all offerings and austerities, as the

> > Infinite

> > > > Lord of Creation, above all, and as the Dearest Friend of

all.

> > ( " He

> > > > > finds peace who knows Me as the Enjoyer of all oferings and

> > > > > austerities, as the Infinite Lord of creation, and as the

> > Dearest

> > > > > Friend of all " ). Like an ocean trying to absorb all streams

> as

> > > > they

> > > > > come. Like the drop seeking reintegration in that vast

ocean.

> > > > >

> > > > > The one true desire that our ego may generate is that of

> > providing

> > > > > goodness and generosity to all sentient beings. To see if

we

> > can

> > > > > finaly emanate love and feel God´s Love as vehicles for

God´s

> > > > Plans.

> > > > >

> > > > > So we can not change the course set out in the creation

> > process.

> > > > We

> > > > > should live it and allow God to see the world through us.

> > > > >

> > > > > Peace and Love

> > > > > José Rodriguez

> > > > >

> > > > > -------------------------

> > > > --

> > > > > Dear Sadhaks,

> > > > > Pranam,

> > > > > It is futile to think that Gods plans can be disturbed. No

> one

> > has

> > > > > power to do so. Goswami Tulsidasji wrote in Manas " RAM KINH

> > CHAHAI

> > > > > SOI HOI, KARE ANYATHA AS NAHI KOI " . So Always say " SIYA RAM

> > JAY RAM

> > > > > JAY JAY RAM "

> > > > > JAY SHRI RAM,

> > > > > Raja Gurdasani

> > > > >

> > > > > -------------------------

> > > > --

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > <%

> 40>,

> > > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. God's plan can be viewed

> > under

> > > > two

> > > > > > different time zones - My Desperate Time (MDT) and God's

> Own

> > Time

> > > > > (GOT)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > " I know discouragement comes easy, but I also know things

> > happen

> > > > > when

> > > > > > God is ready for them to happen and not a second sooner.

> God

> > > > knows

> > > > > why

> > > > > > he wants things to happen in the order they have to. We

> just

> > need

> > > > > to

> > > > > > be ready when they come. "

> > > > > >

> > > > > > One can recognize that there are two different time zones

> > going

> > > > on

> > > > > > when it comes to correlating God's will and our

> experience.

> > One

> > > > > I'll

> > > > > > call My Desperate Time (MDT) and the other, God's Own

Time

> > (GOT).

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Most of us run on MDT. MDT defines our reality. It's what

> we

> > see

> > > > > and

> > > > > > feel always. We are conscious of it the minute we rise up

> in

> > the

> > > > > > morning until we put our weary heads on the pillow at

> night.

> > We

> > > > > > measure pleasure and pain by it; we judge our overall

> state-

> > of-

> > > > > being

> > > > > > by it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > God, on the other hand, exists in another time zone

> > entirely. In

> > > > > GOT,

> > > > > > His will is always done, and nothing is ever late. GOT

> also

> > takes

> > > > > into

> > > > > > account the MDT of everyone, which can often get tangled

> up.

> > You

> > > > > see

> > > > > > there are as many MDT zones as there are people, and that

> > means

> > > > > they

> > > > > > can often be in conflict. But with God there is never any

> > > > conflict.

> > > > > > There is only one GOT and as far as He is concerned,

> > everything

> > > > is

> > > > > > right on schedule.This is God's plan.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > This is why it is utterly silly to wonder if God has

heard

> > our

> > > > > prayers

> > > > > > based on whether or not He has acted in MDT. God always

> > hears our

> > > > > > prayers ? He has most likely already answered them ? he

> just

> > > > > answered

> > > > > > them in GOT - in God's Own Time.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Most of our issues with God are all about time zones.

> Think

> > about

> > > > > the

> > > > > > hapless Bible character, Job. Job was smack in the middle

> of

> > MDT

> > > > > all

> > > > > > the while he was suffering, and his best friends were

> trying

> > to

> > > > > figure

> > > > > > out why God wasn't doing anything in MDT. Well, we know

> now

> > that

> > > > > God

> > > > > > rarely does; He is always in GOT and we can see that now,

> in

> > > > Job's

> > > > > > case, because his life ultimately caught up with GOT.

> > Eventually,

> > > > > all

> > > > > > MDT will be GOT. In fact, that will be what heaven is all

> > about.

> > > > We

> > > > > > will all be kicking back in God's Own Time.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > So faith is mostly all about time zones.Have faith in

> Jesus.

> > When

> > > > > you

> > > > > > pray, know that you were heard, and move ahead, believing

> in

> > GOT

> > > > > and ,

> > > > > > MDT won't be so desperate -God's Own time and My

Desperate

> > Time.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > yeshu rathenam

> > > > > > -------------------------

> > > > --

> > > > > -------

> > > > > >

> > > > > > <%

> > 40>,

> > > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > > > You and Me are as much God as rest of His creation and

> non-

> > > > > creation

> > > > > > > is!!!

> > > > > > > with deep love and humble regards,

> > > > > > > always at Thy Holy Feet

> > > > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > -----------------------

-

> -

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Respected One !,

> > > > > > > Namasthe !!!

> > > > > > > Yes, Ishwara Chaithanyam is in everyone and everything

> in

> > equal

> > > > > > > measure. Lord Krishna Himself says, " I am the fraud of

> the

> > > > > > > fraudsters " .

> > > > > > > It is the DOMINANCE of quality (Guna - Satva, rajas and

> > Tamas)

> > > > of

> > > > > > > the nature that is exposed in one's

thoughts/words/deeds.

> > > > > > > Let us take everything as a GOD's Plan, as the topic of

> the

> > > > > > > discussions itself suggests.

> > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > vm

> > > > > > > vavamenon

> > > > > > > -----------------------

-

> -

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > > > I respect your sentiments about sanatan dharma.

> > > > > > > If we are open to learn and accept God in all -

vasudevam

> > > > > sarvam...

> > > > > > > I would also accept that whatever rubbish is out there

> is

> > also

> > > > > > > God...!!!

> > > > > > > With deep love and regards,

> > > > > > > alwasy at Thy Divine Feet.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > > > > -----------------------

-

> -

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > Respected One,

> > > > > > > Namasthe !!!

> > > > > > > SATHYAMEVA JAYATHE !!!

> > > > > > > Our Great Maharishis have through countless scriptures

> > called

> > > > > every

> > > > > > human being on this earth top SEEK AND REALISE BY EVERY

ONE

> > > > HIMSELF

> > > > > > THE " ONE AND ONLY TRUTH EXPRESSED IN TRILLIONS OF FORMS

> > THOSE CAN

> > > > > BE

> > > > > > SEEN WITH OUR NAKED EYES AND THOSE CANNOT BE SEEN AS THE

> > PARTS OF

> > > > > THIS

> > > > > > UNIVERSE, WHICH INCLUDES THE AIR WE BREATHE AND THE WATER

> WE

> > > > > DRINK " .

> > > > > > > Tell me which other brain than Vyaasa Maharshi (or

> Valmeeki

> > > > > > Maharshi) has given such infinite scientific knowledge in

> > such a

> > > > > short

> > > > > > 700 slokas ?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > THOSE WERE THE TRUTHS THAT THEY EXPERIENCED, AND

> ENJOYING

> > THE

> > > > > > ETERNAL BLISS, JOY AND HAPPINESS (not the short-lived

> > pleasures),

> > > > > OUT

> > > > > > OF COMPASSION, THEY TRIED TO GIVE US ALL INHERITORS WHAT

> THEY

> > > > > > EXPERIENCED BY STRUCTURING OUR LIVES IN SUCH A WAY THAT

WE

> > REMAIN

> > > > > > CONNECTED TO THE DIVINE EVERY MOMENT OF OUR LIVES.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Your assumption that my mail is not related to GITAJI

is

> > wrong.

> > > > > My

> > > > > > response is very much about GITA only, because if one

truly

> > > > > > understands Bhagavad Gita, one needs not take the help of

> > some

> > > > > > misleading and distracting foreign dogma. Anyone who truly

> > > > > > understands Bhagavad Gita understands everything. He

> remains

> > > > > > connected to Lord Krishna eternally and becomes the best

> and

> > > > > perfect

> > > > > > devotee, serving everyone else.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Bhagavad Gita is the concentrated form of sanatana

dharma

> > > > > principles

> > > > > > and traditions / the science of Ishwar, His Creation that

> is

> > this

> > > > > > infinitely indescribable Universe, the purpose of our

> lives

> > on

> > > > this

> > > > > > earth, etc., so beautifully explained through the 1400

plus

> > > > > > authoritative scriptures and countless other

> interpretations.

> > > > The

> > > > > > Science of Creation as expounded by Sanatana Dharma,

> > especially

> > > > the

> > > > > > quality of OMNIPRESENCE of Ishwara in each animate and

> > inanimate

> > > > > part

> > > > > > of the Creation (including you and me), with the most

> > scientific

> > > > > and

> > > > > > fool-proof " LAW OF KARMA "

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > For example, in sanatana dharma, the scriptures, the

> > principle

> > > > of

> > > > > > LAW OF KARMA, YOGA PRACTICISES, etc. have not changed and

> > Ishwar

> > > > > has

> > > > > > expressed Himself through these Vedas and the universe

> > itself.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > If you are truly looking for the " mystical meanings of

> the

> > > > > > scriptures " , please read LIFE DIVINE by Ramana Maharishi

> and

> > also

> > > > > > books from Shri Aurobindo to know about our scriptures.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > please please please do not dilute the ALL-INCLUSIVE,

> > > > UNIVERSAL,

> > > > > > SCIENTIFIC AND EXPERIMENTABLE/EXPERIENCEABLE sanatana

> dharma

> > > > > > Principles and Traditions. That is my only request.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I seek your forgiveness for any statement of mine given

> > above

> > > > > being

> > > > > > violent in anyway.

> > > > > > > That is my only request.

> > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > vm

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > P.S. : If my above email has not answered all your

> points

> > in

> > > > your

> > > > > > mail, I am answering them below, point by point :

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Your Statement : Those who will understand mystism of

> > Gitaji,

> > > > > will

> > > > > > understand other scriptures too.

> > > > > > > There is no mysticism in GITA, If you understand about

> the

> > > > > > indestructibility of ATMA which is part of the PARAM-

ATMA,

> > and

> > > > how

> > > > > our

> > > > > > ignorance has covered (Avaran) the ATMA and also by which

> > methods

> > > > > and

> > > > > > practicises, we can remove the veil of ignorance to see,

> > realize

> > > > > and

> > > > > > experience the ATMA (SELF) which propels us from moment to

> > > > moment.

> > > > > > When we experience the ATMA CHAITHANYAM within us, how

> > blissful

> > > > we

> > > > > > become, which is the eternal nature of our SELF. The Sat-

> > Chit-

> > > > > Anandam

> > > > > > which we are craving for is already within you….

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Your Statement: I am open and respectful of other

> > scriptures

> > > > > too as

> > > > > > they all talk about only one God.

> > > > > > > " ONE GOD " is the only truth that it said in these

> > books, ....

> > > > yet

> > > > > > it's application is something quite different.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Your Statement: I thank my Guruji for showing me the

> path.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > For me, this entire universe is a university and I try

> to

> > learn

> > > > > from

> > > > > > anything and everything that comes across/interacts with

> me.

> > For

> > > > > me,

> > > > > > every source of knowledge is a teacher and guru. I

> accepted

> > Lord

> > > > > > Krishna as my Guru, then Vyaasa Deva, Valmeeki Maharishi,

> > then

> > > > > > Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, Ramana Maharishi, and countless

> > others, my

> > > > > > parents, teachers in schools and colleges, persons with

> whom

> > I

> > > > have

> > > > > > discussed and exchanged knowledge-based spiritual

> > information,

> > > > and

> > > > > all

> > > > > > my surroundings, etc. I remain eternally indebted to one

> and

> > > > all.

> > > > > > > Thank you.

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > vm

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > (modified by moderator)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > -----------------------

-

> -

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear,

> > > > > > > According to our vedas there are 84 Lac spices on this

> > earth.

> > > > > > > Everything works on Dharma. The karmas one does now

> reaps

> > the

> > > > > fruits

> > > > > > > later, in this birth or next birth. Prarabdha- Agami-

> > Sanchita

> > > > 3

> > > > > > > types of Karma. The prarabdha karma done is the arrow

> let

> > out

> > > > of

> > > > > > > bow, (said by Adi Sankara in his script

> Vivekachudamani).

> > Even

> > > > > this

> > > > > > > Prarabdha karma gets washed with certain slokas in

which

> > the

> > > > pala

> > > > > > > sruthi said.

> > > > > > > Saints like Ramana, Sri Ramakrishna, Tukaram, Sakubai,

> > Alwar

> > > > etc

> > > > > > > underwent sufferings due to prarabda karmas. But the

> > differance

> > > > > > > between them and us is that the sufferings was never

> felt

> > by

> > > > > them,

> > > > > > > for us a little pain also causes havock. Ex: Saint

> Ramana

> > had

> > > > > > > surgery done on his leg without any anesthisia and anti

> > biotic

> > > > > tabs.

> > > > > > > Dear sadaks, please understand that GOD is much above

> > plans,

> > > > > > > distrubance etc. Level of GOD is Paramanandham.

> > > > > > > One attains HIM only by complete purity of mind and

> > thought,

> > > > with

> > > > > > > constant . Bakthi.

> > > > > > > Common sense- To reach divinity or have vision of GOD

> > everyone

> > > > > knows

> > > > > > > the difficulty to erase our Dur Gunas. Simply like that

> can

> > > > > anyone

> > > > > > > think of distrubance. But GOD gets distrubed ONLY in

> > > > > circumstances

> > > > > > > when HIS Bakthas are distrubed, but not made to

> distrube.

> > This

> > > > > can

> > > > > > > be known from many puranas. Ex: Jada Bharatha when he

> was

> > to be

> > > > > > > given human sacrifice GOD rescued. But Jada Bharatha

> never

> > > > cried

> > > > > for

> > > > > > > help. So also when Adi Sankara was to be slained.

> > > > > > > GOD is said by vedas as " Aprameyam " . means beyond all

> five

> > > > > senses.

> > > > > > > In that case with what anyone can distrube HIM

> > > > > > > B.Sathyanarayan.

> > > > > > > -----------------------

-

> -

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > <%

> > 40>,

> > > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > A lot has been said on this subject, and all of it

> makes

> > > > sense

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > is useful!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > My add: Can we really disturb God's plan without

> knowing

> > God

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > His

> > > > > > > > Plan? We can of course say whatever happens to some

> one

> > must

> > > > be

> > > > > > > > God's plan, and take great solace in it and move on to

> > > > resolve

> > > > > if

> > > > > > > > faced with problem after first accepting or rather

> > welcoming

> > > > > it.

> > > > > > > As

> > > > > > > > Manjulaji pointed correctly in her analogy(as I

> > understand

> > > > it),

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > question is what is to be done now that the arrow has

> > left

> > > > the

> > > > > > > bow.

> > > > > > > > We can act to the best of our ability to resolve it

in

> a

> > > > manner

> > > > > > > > which is fair, is the only requirement God has laid

on

> > us.

> > > > > Rest is

> > > > > > > > His/Her problem! (Gita: Yogeshu Karmakaushalam....)

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Also Yeshuji has stressed Trust in God, which is very

> > > > important

> > > > > > > too!

> > > > > > > > An unbroken trust in God to take care of problem one

> > faces

> > > > > works.

> > > > > > > > What happens in such case is, either problem is

solved

> in

> > > > one's

> > > > > > > > favor or even more important than that is one gets

> > strength

> > > > to

> > > > > face

> > > > > > > > it regardless of the outcome. God changes the person

> > rather

> > > > > than

> > > > > > > > his/her circumstances or people who may have hurt

> > him/her.

> > > > > Isn't

> > > > > > > > this more of a miracle than otherwise? God is

fairness

> > in us!

> > > > > This

> > > > > > > > is the way I see God is changing the blue print or

> > better yet

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > > modifying the blue print for such devotee out of His

> > total

> > > > > freedom

> > > > > > > > at every moment of his/her life.

> > > > > > > > Now if one knows the meaning of God, the results of

> > changing

> > > > > His

> > > > > > > > plan doesn't arise at all.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Pratap Bhatt

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > ---------------------

-

> --

> > -

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > <%

> > 40>,

> > > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Nobody or anything can disturb GOD and His Plans.

> GOD

> > is

> > > > said

> > > > > > > > > as " Apprameyam " means beyond all senses and objects.

> > > > > Everything

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > set and computerised and networked and part of His

> > divine

> > > > > plan.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > B.Sathyanarayan

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > -------------------

-

> --

> > ---

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > God's plan cannot be disturbed. Is it a blue-print,

> as

> > > > > someone

> > > > > > > has

> > > > > > > > > suggested in this discussion. Let's learn from this

> > > > anecdote.

> > > > > > > > > We sipped the hot, dark coffee from oversized clay

> > mugs and

> > > > > > > talked

> > > > > > > > > quietly about the real issues of life. Both of us

> were

> > in a

> > > > > > > season

> > > > > > > > > with some unanswered questions in our lives. We

> talked

> > > > about

> > > > > > > > > trusting God in the midst of problems, worries and

> > anxiety.

> > > > > It's

> > > > > > > > not

> > > > > > > > > always an easy thing to do.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Every day we make a choice to either trust God ...

> or

> > not.

> > > > We

> > > > > > > can

> > > > > > > > > worry and stew when things are not clear, or we can

> > choose

> > > > to

> > > > > > > > trust

> > > > > > > > > Him. We can choose to believe He is faithful and

> that

> > He

> > > > will

> > > > > > > > direct

> > > > > > > > > our path in His time ... and it will not be too

late.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > It is a challenge to ask ourselves, " Do I really

> trust

> > > > God? "

> > > > > > > Often

> > > > > > > > > with our lips we say, " Yes, " but with our worried

> > lives we

> > > > > > > > say, " No. "

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Do I believe it when God makes a promise in His

> Word,

> > the

> > > > > Bible?

> > > > > > > He

> > > > > > > > > says...

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > " I will instruct you and guide you along the best

> > pathway

> > > > for

> > > > > > > your

> > > > > > > > > life. I will advise you and watch your progress, "

> This

> > is

> > > > > God's

> > > > > > > > plan.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The choice you make today to believe those words

and

> > trust

> > > > > God

> > > > > > > will

> > > > > > > > > bring a result in your life...listen...

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > " ...abiding love surrounds those who trust in the

> > Lord. So

> > > > > > > > rejoice

> > > > > > > > > in him, all those who are His and shout for joy all

> > those

> > > > who

> > > > > > > > choose

> > > > > > > > > to obey Him, " the Bible says.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Choosing to trust God in the confusing times in our

> > lives

> > > > > > > releases

> > > > > > > > > the peace and the comfort of His love and it will

> > surround

> > > > > > > > > us...holding us secure through the winds of change

> and

> > > > > > > > uncertainty.

> > > > > > > > > Our lives will be marked by a joy and a rejoicing

> that

> > will

> > > > > be

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > by-product of His surrounding love.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Choosing to believe that God will guide you in the

> best

> > > > > pathway

> > > > > > > for

> > > > > > > > > your life frees you from the anxiety of worry.

Trust

> > is a

> > > > > choice

> > > > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > > can make in a God who has proven Himself

trustworthy

> to

> > > > > > > countless

> > > > > > > > > believers.

> > > > > > > > > Choose to trust Him today with the question marks

in

> > your

> > > > > life.

> > > > > > > > > God's plan never fails.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > yeshu rathenam

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > -------------------

-

> --

> > ---

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > Hare Krsna!!

> > > > > > > > > Hi Manjula Patel. Thank you very much for posting

> that

> > > > > example

> > > > > > > > about

> > > > > > > > > the arrow. It really changed my life. Thanks thanks

> > thanks!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Daniel

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > -------------------

-

> --

> > ---

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > <%

> > 40>,

> > > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Divine All,

> > > > > > > > > > Humble pranams.

> > > > > > > > > > Thanks to all for their encouraging / inspiring

> > words.

> > > > It

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > nothing

> > > > > > > > > > but praising God / Guru.

> > > > > > > > > > The following is in response to Danielji's

inquiry:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > * Please refer to Madanji's email sent on Jan 19.

> > > > > > > > > > * 'Blue Print' is the word used in original email

> by

> > > > > > > Anilji

> > > > > > > > > and I

> > > > > > > > > > continued using that word so that he can also

> relate

> > the

> > > > > > > answer

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > his

> > > > > > > > > > inquiry. What Anilji meant was, if destiny is

> fixed,

> > why

> > > > > > > > bother?

> > > > > > > > > My

> > > > > > > > > > response was to say that destiny can be changed

> with

> > our

> > > > > > > present

> > > > > > > > > > action. We have to bear the fruits/consequences

of

> > our

> > > > past

> > > > > > > > action

> > > > > > > > > > which we can not change (though some of it can be

> > changed

> > > > > by

> > > > > > > an

> > > > > > > > > able

> > > > > > > > > > Guru) but we can change the course of our present

> and

> > > > > future

> > > > > > > > > actions.

> > > > > > > > > > * Arrow analogy was used to expand further on

karma

> > > > > theory.

> > > > > > > > > > Gitaji (essence of Upanishads) doesn't elaborate

> on

> > Karma

> > > > > but

> > > > > > > > > > Upanishads (Mundaka or Brihadaranyaka ???) do:

> > > > > > > > > > - Sanchita (accumulation of all karma from past

> > > > > > > lives),

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > - Prarabdha (from total accumulation the

> > > > portion

> > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > worked out in present life),

> > > > > > > > > > - Agami (from present life what we keep on

> > > > > adding to

> > > > > > > > > Sanchita that will come to us in future / future

> > > > > > > > > > lives) and

> > > > > > > > > > - Kriyamana (karma that is being worked out

> > > > > > > > immediately).

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Gitaji talks about karma from tamas, rajas and

> satva

> > > > > > > perspective.

> > > > > > > > > > * Be aware of your action... BG 2:47.

> > > > > > > > > > * How one falls into the trap of bondage... BG

> 3:27,

> > > > > 5:12

> > > > > > > > > > * Come to Me... BG 12:8, 12

> > > > > > > > > > * Controlling ones thoughts... BG 6:25, 26, 35, BG

> > > > > 17:16

> > > > > > > > > > * Impact of karma... BG 18:12

> > > > > > > > > > * There are many slokas that reference non-

doership

> > > > of

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > action

> > > > > > > > > > through out Gitaji. BG Chapter 2, 4, 5... that

can

> > help

> > > > > with

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > 2nd

> > > > > > > > > > and 3rd arrow situation. E.g., BG 4:9, 19, 37

> > (roasted

> > > > > seed

> > > > > > > > don't

> > > > > > > > > > germinate), 41. BG 5:7

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > This might be beneficial and encouraging to my

> > Christian

> > > > > > > friends

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > read a comparative book called 'The Torah, the

> Bible

> > and

> > > > > Kriya

> > > > > > > > > Yoga'.

> > > > > > > > > > Hope I have covered your inquiry.

> > > > > > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Manjula Patel

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > -----------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > There is no doubt about it that HE IS THE GREATEST

> > > > > > > > > > SCIENTIST,PHILOSOPHER AND WHAT NOT. If you look

at

> > the

> > > > way

> > > > > > > > humans

> > > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > made, brain, which controls everything is at the

> top

> > > > > [satvik],

> > > > > > > > > heart

> > > > > > > > > > which controls physical functioning and emotions

> is

> > in

> > > > the

> > > > > > > centre

> > > > > > > > > > [Rajasik] and the excretory organs at the bottom

> > > > > [Tamasik].Can

> > > > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > > one

> > > > > > > > > > else do a better job than this. Let us all

> surrender

> > to

> > > > HIM

> > > > > > > > > totally.

> > > > > > > > > > G.Vaidyanathan.

> > > > > > > > > > -----------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > <%

> > 40>,

> > > > " sadhak_insight "

> > > > > > > > > > <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Hare Krsna. Please accept my humble obeisances.

> > > > > > > > > > > I read what Manjulaji wrote and I said WOW WOW

> WOW

> > > > > WOW!!!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > I'll ask some questions later, but for now my

> > question

> > > > > is,

> > > > > > > can

> > > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > > > cite a verse from the Bhagavad Gita that

> > corresponds to

> > > > > what

> > > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > say

> > > > > > > > > > > here? I mean, the examples about the arrow. And

> > what is

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > blue

> > > > > > > > > > > print? If I know the term, I know it in

Spanish.

> My

> > > > > Bhagavad

> > > > > > > > > Gita is

> > > > > > > > > > > in Spanish.

> > > > > > > > > > > Thank you!!! Stay well

> > > > > > > > > > > " Daniel " Tkach

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > > THANKS FOR INFO.GOD BLESS U AND YR FAMILY

> > > > > > > > > > > chatur patel

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for the nice

explanations.G.Vaidyanathan..

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > > The " Babaji " should call himself " Father " and

> > teach in

> > > > > > > > Christian

> > > > > > > > > > > setting. Hindu's and real Babaji do not accept

> the

> > > > Bible

> > > > > > > myth

> > > > > > > > > and God.

> > > > > > > > > > > Classyoga

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > -----

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I can write volumes on the " genesis " of bible

> > refuting

> > > > > every

> > > > > > > > > logic or

> > > > > > > > > > > its lack of it. Let me say in short that

quoting

> > bible

> > > > > > > would

> > > > > > > > > never be

> > > > > > > > > > > adequate for you to explain what " sanatana

> dharma "

> > is

> > > > or

> > > > > > > what

> > > > > > > > > Lord

> > > > > > > > > > > Krishna gave to the world as TOTAL KNOWLEDGE IN

> > > > BHAGAVAD

> > > > > > > > GITA.

> > > > > > > > > In

> > > > > > > > > > > fact, hundreds of stories appearing in bible

> have

> > their

> > > > > > > > origins

> > > > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > > Indian scriptures.

> > > > > > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > Sanatana Dharma is a STAND ALONE / WHOLESOME,

> > > > UNIVERSAL,

> > > > > > > > > SCIENTIFIC

> > > > > > > > > > > INTERPRETATIONS of ISHWARA (Lord Krishna), His

> > creation

> > > > > that

> > > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > > this

> > > > > > > > > > > universe and its mysteries.

> > > > > > > > > > > With best regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > vm

> > > > > > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > > My intention was not to hurt any one's

feelings.

> I

> > > > was

> > > > > > > > sharing

> > > > > > > > > it to

> > > > > > > > > > > show how we become the creator of our own blue

> > print

> > > > > which I

> > > > > > > > > indicated

> > > > > > > > > > > in the beginning and I thought the example was

> > > > > appropriate

> > > > > > > > > otherwise I

> > > > > > > > > > > would not have shared.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Scriptures are written using mystical language

> so

> > one

> > > > can

> > > > > > > > > interpret

> > > > > > > > > > > them according to their level of understanding

> and

> > > > > spiritual

> > > > > > > > > > > experiences. I am not imposing my ideas on any

> one,

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > example

> > > > > > > > > > > inspired me so I shared, if it doesn't to you

> > simply

> > > > drop

> > > > > > > it ;-

> > > > > > > > )

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Yes, I do believe that scriptures of Sanatan

> > Dharma are

> > > > > more

> > > > > > > > > elaborate

> > > > > > > > > > > and inclusive in directing our thought process

> > towards

> > > > > God.

> > > > > > > > > Those who

> > > > > > > > > > > will understand mystism of Gitaji, will

> understand

> > > > other

> > > > > > > > > scriptures

> > > > > > > > > > > too. I am open and respectful of other

> scriptures

> > too

> > > > as

> > > > > > > they

> > > > > > > > > all

> > > > > > > > > > > talk about only one God and I thank my Guruji

for

> > > > > showing me

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > path.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > with humble regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > > > > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > > > > > > > Message shortened by Moderator.....

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > dear divine souls.

> > > > > > > > > > > this is my first msg to you. my sincere

> Gratitude

> > to

> > > > You,

> > > > > > > > manula

> > > > > > > > > ji

> > > > > > > > > > > for puting forwards this mail.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > jai sri ram

> > > > > > > > > > > kuldip

> > > > > > > > > > > ---------------

-

> --

> > ----

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > --

> > > > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > > > > <%

> > 40>,

> > > > " Manjula Patel "

> > > > > > > <manjumaa@>

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Loving Divine,

> > > > > > > > > > > > Pranam.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Very beautiful things have been said in

> response

> > to

> > > > > > > Anilji's

> > > > > > > > > beautiful

> > > > > > > > > > > > questions.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Something I heard from Babaji was very

> > enlightening

> > > > > for me

> > > > > > > > so

> > > > > > > > > would

> > > > > > > > > > > like to

> > > > > > > > > > > > share it with you all and hope it would do

the

> > same

> > > > for

> > > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > > too...

> > > > > > > > > > > > The following are not exact words but my

> > > > > > > > > > > > understanding/interpretation/clicking of what

> He

> > > > > > > explained...

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > - We are the creator of our own blue print.

> > > > > Something

> > > > > > > > from

> > > > > > > > > Bible

> > > > > > > > > > > > might be beneficial here. Beautiful symbolism.

> > > > > When

> > > > > > > > Adam-

> > > > > > > > > Eve

> > > > > > > > > > > were created

> > > > > > > > > > > > by God in the very beginning of His creation,

> > they

> > > > > were

> > > > > > > > > naked,

> > > > > > > > > > i.e.,

> > > > > > > > > > > > they were devoid of body consciousness. When

> they

> > > > > ate

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > fruit

> > > > > > > > > > > from the

> > > > > > > > > > > > prohibited tree, they became aware of their

> > > > > nakedness,

> > > > > > > > > i.e., when

> > > > > > > > > > > they

> > > > > > > > > > > > did their 1st karma with expectation of

> enjoying

> > > > the

> > > > > > > > fruits

> > > > > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > > > it, they came

> > > > > > > > > > > > down to body awareness, i.e., 'i am the

> doer...'

> > > > or

> > > > > > > they

> > > > > > > > > became ego

> > > > > > > > > > > > centric. Thus they have to bear the

> consequences

> > > > of

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > fruits

> > > > > > > > > > > of their

> > > > > > > > > > > > action. They became shameful. So really when

> God

> > > > > > > > > descended the

> > > > > > > > > > > first

> > > > > > > > > > > > human, the intention was not to end but make

it

> > > > > > > immortal

> > > > > > > > > just

> > > > > > > > > > > like Him. We

> > > > > > > > > > > > human missed out understanding it. the

> intention

> > > > > has

> > > > > > > > still

> > > > > > > > > > > remain the same

> > > > > > > > > > > > be immortal like Him freeing ourselves from

the

> > > > body

> > > > > > > > > > > consciousness. As

> > > > > > > > > > > > Bhagwan said if you come to Me you will

attain

> Me

> > > > > > > only...

> > > > > > > > > > > > - There are three types of actions that

> determine

> > > > > our

> > > > > > > > blue

> > > > > > > > > print.

> > > > > > > > > > > > Babaji gives an example of a bow and 3 arrows:

> > > > > > > > > > > > - One arrow has already left from the bow

aimed

> > > > > at a

> > > > > > > > > dear. Most

> > > > > > > > > > > > of the time the arrow that has left can't be

> > > > > > > reverted,

> > > > > > > > > it sure

> > > > > > > > > > > > will attain

> > > > > > > > > > > > the result of killing that dear. We don't have

> > > > > any

> > > > > > > > > control over

> > > > > > > > > > > > that arrow.

> > > > > > > > > > > > - Second arrow is set on the bow, we might let

> > > > go

> > > > > > > > towards

> > > > > > > > > > > > the target or we might not. Here the action is

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > motion, yet

> > > > > > > > > > > > we have some

> > > > > > > > > > > > control over it to stop it even in the middle

> > > > and

> > > > > > > thus

> > > > > > > > > stop

> > > > > > > > > > > the fruits of

> > > > > > > > > > > > such action.

> > > > > > > > > > > > - Third arrow is still sitting in the quiver

> > > > over

> > > > > > > > which

> > > > > > > > > we have

> > > > > > > > > > > > complete control not to even take it out.

> > > > > > > > > > > > - In other words,

> > > > > > > > > > > > - we have done some actions in past of which

we

> > > > > have

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > bear the

> > > > > > > > > > > > consequences. However, He said that if you

> > > > have

> > > > > > > taken

> > > > > > > > > refuge

> > > > > > > > > > > of an able

> > > > > > > > > > > > Guru, He can make the target missed, e.g., by

> > > > > > > clapping,

> > > > > > > > > > > > diverting the attention of that dear and make

> > > > him

> > > > > > > run

> > > > > > > > > away

> > > > > > > > > > > > before the arrow

> > > > > > > > > > > > hits him!!!

> > > > > > > > > > > > - Some actions are in progress but as soon as

> > > > we

> > > > > > > > become

> > > > > > > > > aware of

> > > > > > > > > > > > our action, we can alter the course of such

> > > > > action.

> > > > > > > > > > > > - And in third situation, the actions we would

> > > > > have

> > > > > > > > > performed in

> > > > > > > > > > > > ignorance could be completely avoided by

> > > > > > > transforming

> > > > > > > > > our lives

> > > > > > > > > > > > like roasted

> > > > > > > > > > > > seeds don't even germinate. If you come to Me

> > > > > you

> > > > > > > > will

> > > > > > > > > attain

> > > > > > > > > > > Me only...

> > > > > > > > > > > > - As one seed gives many fruits, one thought

> > gives

> > > > > > > birth

> > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > many

> > > > > > > > > > > > actions - gross or subtle, and thus it keeps

on

> > > > > > > > multiplying

> > > > > > > > > > > without our

> > > > > > > > > > > > knowledge. Becoming aware of our thought

> process

> > > > is

> > > > > > > very

> > > > > > > > > > > important. So

> > > > > > > > > > > > many things can be stop our thoughts before it

> > > > takes

> > > > > > > any

> > > > > > > > > grosser

> > > > > > > > > > > form. With

> > > > > > > > > > > > higher evolution, so many thoughts can be

> stopped

> > > > at

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > source

> > > > > > > > > > > level - not

> > > > > > > > > > > > to let them come down even at the thought

> level.

> > > > > One

> > > > > > > > > thought not

> > > > > > > > > > > only

> > > > > > > > > > > > impacts us but it impacts lot many people

> around

> > > > us

> > > > > and

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > environment we

> > > > > > > > > > > > live in. It not only gives immediate

> > > > > > > > results/pleasure/pain

> > > > > > > > > but

> > > > > > > > > > > it carries

> > > > > > > > > > > > consequences in future also. It not only

> affects

> > > > > our

> > > > > > > > > present

> > > > > > > > > > > lfve but many

> > > > > > > > > > > > lives to come. So one has to be very very

> careful

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > their

> > > > > > > > > > thoughts.

> > > > > > > > > > > > - At one time some one asked Babaji that what

> > kind

> > > > > of

> > > > > > > > > freedom do we

> > > > > > > > > > > > have... He gave another beautiful example. A

> cow

> > > > > has

> > > > > > > > been

> > > > > > > > > tied

> > > > > > > > > > > with a long

> > > > > > > > > > > > rope. This cow has 3 possibilities:

> > > > > > > > > > > > - circle around the pole, reduce the length of

> > > > > rope

> > > > > > > > and

> > > > > > > > > be

> > > > > > > > > > > > miserable, i.e., remain entangled in worldly

> > > > > > > affairs,

> > > > > > > > > loose the

> > > > > > > > > > > > freedom and be miserable

> > > > > > > > > > > > - use the freedom of long rope and move around

> > > > > > > > smartly.

> > > > > > > > > One

> > > > > > > > > > > > almost feels free but one knows that there is

> > > > > still

> > > > > > > > rope

> > > > > > > > > tied

> > > > > > > > > > > to a pole.

> > > > > > > > > > > > - or be really smart and by break the rope

from

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > pole,

> > > > > > > > > > > > cow has enough strength to free herself

> > > > > permanently.

> > > > > > > > > > > Sarvadharmaan

> > > > > > > > > > > > parityajya...

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > Hope this additional clarification will be

> > beneficial

> > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > > understanding how

> > > > > > > > > > > > our blue prints are determined and what type

of

> > > > > > > > karmas/actions

> > > > > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > > > should

> > > > > > > > > > > > engage in.

> > > > > > > > > > > > humble regards,

> > > > > > > > > > > > always at Thy Divine Feet

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > On 1/15/08, anil nevatia <anilkamail@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > When God plans to execute as per his blue

> print

> > > > > why

> > > > > > > > > disturb the

> > > > > > > > > > > same.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > When God descended the first human, it is

> was

> > clear

> > > > > that

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > beginning of

> > > > > > > > > > > > > the end had started, so why to say and do

> good

> > > > > things ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > > Does Gita provide any insight into this

> query ?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

 

Kuldipji is asking:

The real Questions is what Is real Free Will?

whether it truly Exists...?

 

Real Free Will is freedom from having to have Free will! When Our

choices are governed/determined by our Conditioning in terms of

education, beliefs, culture, opinions, desires, fears, likes and

dislikes, how can we have real free will? Conditioning is always

limited due to the identification with body-mind-me sense.

Such conditioning creates an independently existing entity,

doer/enjoyer, and thus loses its real free will!

When one realizes one's true nature being Atman one will have total

Freedom. Free will is not freedom to do anything one likes! It is to

do right thing at right time, considering the well being of all! It is

thus never predetermined because right things are never absolutely

right in all circumstances at all times! This can happen:

IF one takes his/her stand as Atman, Absolute* Existence-

Consciousness-Bliss, one is/has nothing but Freedom. Such freedom is

emnating from Intelligence of Atman-God, so only right actions are

carried out by that person(he/she is really not a person).

One has to see that a person is a conglomerate of thoughts, beliefs,

likes/dislikes, etc., put together from childhood onward. Person is

like a reflection in the mirror of Consciousness whose reality is

Mirror!

 

Reflection is mistaken as a real giving one a false sense of being

an individual, which one is not!

 

Pratap

(Pratap Bhatt)

-

 

 

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Dear divine souls,,,

>

>

> parnaams!

>

> What ever happens, it has to happen, per Universal cause and effect.

> Cause created in the Past, manifests in present Life, as experienced

> in present joy and pain. It is a part of a master plan.

> But everything is not predetermined ! Fate is what happens.

> But God has bestowed His FREE WILL on us, and we have control over

> our present actions.

>

> The real Questions is what Is real Free Will ? whether it truly

Exists...?

>

> Please provide your insights

> thanks

> eternal child.

> Kuldip Suri>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...
Guest guest

It is interesting......the mind looks for a definite answer....this

way or that way.....

Why not go within and know from experience.......

 

experiment.....with the spiritual wisdom.....to know.....

andar ki baat hai.......andar jane se pata lagagi....

 

Sushil Jain

 

dear pratap Bhai,

 

my humble parnaams ...

you have Rightly explained my question Does Free Will Really

Exist ? There is Only Free Will and

That is HIS WILL

To Know or to Experience Free Will, we have to desolve our limited

Ego into the Vast Supreme Brahman...

And there we may Know What is Free Will

my sincere regards..

kuldip Suri

 

 

-

, " sadhak_insight "

<sadhak_insight wrote:

>

> Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

>

> Kuldipji is asking:

> The real Questions is what Is real Free Will?

> whether it truly Exists...?

>

> Real Free Will is freedom from having to have Free will! When Our

> choices are governed/determined by our Conditioning in terms of

> education, beliefs, culture, opinions, desires, fears, likes and

> dislikes, how can we have real free will? Conditioning is always

> limited due to the identification with body-mind-me sense.

> Such conditioning creates an independently existing entity,

> doer/enjoyer, and thus loses its real free will!

> When one realizes one's true nature being Atman one will have total

> Freedom. Free will is not freedom to do anything one likes! It is

to

> do right thing at right time, considering the well being of all!

It is

> thus never predetermined because right things are never absolutely

> right in all circumstances at all times! This can happen:

> IF one takes his/her stand as Atman, Absolute* Existence-

> Consciousness-Bliss, one is/has nothing but Freedom. Such freedom

is

> emnating from Intelligence of Atman-God, so only right actions are

> carried out by that person(he/she is really not a person).

> One has to see that a person is a conglomerate of thoughts,

beliefs,

> likes/dislikes, etc., put together from childhood onward. Person is

> like a reflection in the mirror of Consciousness whose reality is

> Mirror!

>

> Reflection is mistaken as a real giving one a false sense of

being

> an individual, which one is not!

>

> Pratap

> (Pratap Bhatt)

> -

>

>

> , " sadhak_insight "

> <sadhak_insight@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear divine souls,,,

> >

> >

> > parnaams!

> >

> > What ever happens, it has to happen, per Universal cause and

effect.

> > Cause created in the Past, manifests in present Life, as

experienced

> > in present joy and pain. It is a part of a master plan.

> > But everything is not predetermined ! Fate is what happens.

> > But God has bestowed His FREE WILL on us, and we have control

over

> > our present actions.

> >

> > The real Questions is what Is real Free Will ? whether it truly

> Exists...?

> >

> > Please provide your insights

> > thanks

> > eternal child.

> > Kuldip Suri>

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...