Religion & Spirituality

[Guest guest]

Religion and SpiritualityOf

late, one thing I see quite often see making rounds in philosophical

discussions is, the mix up between the words 'spiritual' and

'religious'. Do they denote the same ? Let us analyze here. What is Spirituality ? This

will be discussed in the Indian context as it was here that the first

seeds of spirituality was sowed at the dawn of creation. Spirituality

can be explained as a person's journey into himself in pursuit of the

secrets about his own self. This has resulted in the famous discovery

by the Hindu Rishis of the 'Atman' (or the Self) many many millennia

ago.They saw, through a series of subtle processes called

as yogic methods, that the Self was the dweller in the sheath of body

with its paraphernalia of senses, mind,and intellect. The process of

inner search was called and the end point was called as

realization. And What is Religion ? As

the seeker refined and refined his search towards this realization, he

saw that his own experiment can be replicated in others too. And the

Rishi started teaching this to others. For this many lifestyle changes

were necessary.Also, the student needed to be put through a

different routine of growth than he previously used to. Over a period

of time, many such Rishis emerged in India . They all emphasized a

lifestyle suitable to self realization. These set of guidelines were

later famously called as religion. Religion is the practical expression

of spirituality in life.Religion and Spirituality- Is there a conflict ?As

we saw, spirituality is the terrain on which religion flourishes. The

stronger the spiritual belief the stronger is the religion. The more

refined the spirituality, the more refined the religion. The universal

the spirituality, the universal the religion.Where did the misunderstanding arise ?Since

time immemorial, there was only one spiritual theory and only one

religion, that is of Sanatana Dharma or Arya Dharma or Vedic Dharma.

They had its roots in Bharat that is India and spread its roots across

the globe. Sanatana Dharma, which came to be called as Hinduism later,

gave its valuable thoughts to Buddhism and Jainism. Buddhism later gave

its ideals to Judaism and Christianity. Islam evolved out of

Christianity and Judaism. So,

there emerged many spiritual theories. The problem with emerging

theories was that they confused religion with spirituality. There was

no clear marking. I would even say that religion predated spirituality

in the case of Christianity and Islam. They adjusted spirituality to

adjust religious practices. For example, Christianity was born as a

refined version of Judaism. But Judaistic religion predated them and as

a result the hold of religion on matters of spirituality was great. In

Al Qoran, one will see only a great deal of commands rather than

descriptions of the Self. Notice that a way to a place is spirituality

and religion is only a map. The

rulers of those times in Israel and Europe found that spreading

religion was more profitable than infusing spirituality. Thus was born

the Church culture. In other words it meant every person had to be a

churchist before he is christist. So religion took a front seat.Not

even that, religion was so inseparably mixed with spirituality that the

Semitic religions became a mixture of these two. This can be told like

this. If one is spiritual, he automatically HAS TO BE religious and

vice versa. There was no escape. And the way to salvation was wholesale. Sentences like "the Church is my body" as being said by Jesus were added to the Bible.The Indian context:The

scene in Bharat was and is totally different. The way to realization,

called yoga, saw each human being as unique with his/her own

ideosyncracies . Thus Hindu Rishis had come to a bold, divine,

unprecedented conclusion that " The path to Realization is Individual".

This is the single, most brilliant , and mind boggling aspect of

Hinduism.As each individual has the freedom to explore his inner self, the aspect of religion became optional or irrelevant.

That

is why you see intensely spiritual people in India, who have conquered

their senses, mind and intellect who are totally devoid of any

religious binding. India then became home to an enormous amount of

Yogis who achieved the ultimate in their own unique ways without the

bondages of religion. Kapila saw the oneness of the Self with the

universe, Vyasa saw the Ultimate in Himself or rather saw himself in

the Absolute, Sankara saw there was no two existences between the

Absolute and the individual.Kannappa Nayanar Saw God by his violent devotion, while the refined Appar saw him with a disciplined devotion. Even

atheism is a legitimate part of Hinduism. The Indian born Nobel

laureate, Sri Chandrasekar, said, "I am a Hindu atheist". In no other

religion does rebels get accommodated. The reason is Hinduism is a

spiritual way first. Second is it is not God centred but has God as the

ultimate achievable. The Hindu can be spiritual without being religious and vice versa. The

Hindu also has a most beautiful religion, which is coloured by an

endless array of cultures, distinguished by an equally endlessly

different human varieties, flavoured by more than a hundred sweet

languages. The Hindu religion- will it reinvent itself ?Since

Hinduism showed such care to its individual member, and since each

member continued to refine his ways to realization, Hinduism was never

a rigid body of ideas. It has, over the period, shown an enormous

ability to reform itself and evolve. All this was because Hinduism was born of an effort at free enquiry.

For example, over two thousand years ago, Hinduism was totally

different than the present one. Vedic thoughts reigned supreme. There

were no temples. People worshipped the Absolute Brahman through Yagyas

.. When this Vedism

developed religious rigidity, great Rishis like Sankara, Maddhwa,

Ramanuja, Appar, Sambandar and a host of saints gave a new way to

Hinduism. When Buddhism had all but swallowed up the whole of India,

Hinduism, invented itself anew. Thus was born the new Vedantic religion

as envisaged by Sankara and others. Temples came up. Gita became a new

beacon light in Hinduism. Hinduism, the resurgent, had such force that

it absorbed Buddhism and Jainism into itself. Over

the period, there have been many unwanted flab like casteism that have

crept into the religion. But as usual, the Hindu diaspora will shrug it

off and march on, giving the world newer directions. J Venkatasubramanianhttp://sanatanavenkat.blogspot.com

--

Posted By Venkatasubramanian to Sanatana Pages at 10/21/2008 04:46:00 PM

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[Guest guest]

Venkat,

 

I salute you for your elucidation of the Hindu faith. It gives out the truth in

the proper perspective. I wish many from other religions who thrive on debunking

the Hindu faith read your post and correct themselves.

 

I want to make one submission. You have said that Buddhism gave its ideals to

Judaism and Christianity. What I have understood is that Judaism shaped itself

on the teachings of Abraham and Abraham is much older than Buddha. I do not on

what basis you are saying that Buddhism gave its ideals to Judaism. Of course,

there are some theories that Jesus, while in India, was greatly influenced by

Buddhism and Vaishnavism and the intensity of human love and bhakti to God in

the teaching of Jesus, as in the New Testament can be attributed to the

influences of Buddhism and Vaishnavism. But, the church will deny all this.

Further, I am not sure if Islam is an offshoot of christianity, as suggested by

you. Prophet Mohammad was not born in christian society. The pre-Mohammed Arab

society was followed a religion, which had the traces of Hindu religion and they

were, in all probability, worshipping idols, as we do. It was this religion that

Prophet Mohammad repudiated

and modelled his teachings on Judaism. He owes his intense monotheism to

Abrahamic religion. Hence, I do not think that he owes anything to Christianity.

Of course, he recognised Jesus as one of the prophets.

 

But, that is all about certain details. I am in complete agreement with you, in

content and spirit of your post. You have rightly emphasised on the individual

freedom that a Hindu enjoys in chartering his own course of spiritual journey.

That explains why a large number of the western liberals flock to this religion.

It should be an eye-opener for all the Indians. They should do more and more

Sadhana and lead a truly spiritual life. They have to be entrenched in their

faith. Steadfastness in faith and practice alone could prove to be befitting

reply to those revile us.

 

At the social level, we need to do a lot more. You said that such slur as

casteism will cast off in course of time. I am afraid we need to do more to get

rid of this slur. Mere lip service to rid yourself of this evil will not help.

We need to give and love all our brethren and prove that it is a folly to leave

our original faith.

 

Hari Om Tat Sat!

 

ulaganathan p

 

 

 

 

Venkat <apexpreci2000

 

Religion and Spirituality

Of late, one thing I see quite often see making rounds in

[Guest guest]

Ulaganathan ji

 

Namaste.

Re the Evolution of religions. I am reading article after article of how

man made works are called word of God.

 

Dr S M Murdoch, calls the Abraham and Sarah duo as Saraswati and Brahma.

She has equated Krishna with the personality of Christ citing

identities (sheperd- cowherd, born under oppression and on

clairvoyance, even names Christ- Krishna)

 

But Will Durant, the historian, says the ethos of the Bible are

essentially Buddhist.

 

I surmise that the Bible was compiled with the Hindu mythology with

Buddhist Philosophy. And as usual the 'word of God' label was given.

 

A friend of mine asked in another group " tell me which religion does

not have its scripture which is not revealed by God ?

 

I have come to accept certain guidelines in telling whether a scripture

is God given (revealed) or not.

1. It should be applicable to all times

2. It should not mention any proper nouns (otherwise it will be time

bound. No God will want His word to be limited in time and hence in

space. Meaning it will die.)

3. Does not contradict itself in any place .

4. Contains no self praise other than what is absolutely necessary

5. Contains no praise of any person

6. Defines truth and untruth in no uncertain terms

 

Swamy Dayananda, has force fully argued that the only scriptures that

answer these criterion are our Vedas. He did not accept the Brahmanas

as Vedas since they were obviously man made and refer to proper nouns.

Please see his work here

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venkat

 

 

 

, ulaganathan p <apunathan wrote:

>

> Venkat,

>

> I salute you for your elucidation of the Hindu faith. It gives out

[Guest guest]

Dear Venkatji,

 

Thanks for the beautiful piece of writing on religion and

spirituality, very well articulated indeed.( I agree with your stand

and I have also said similarly in my blogs. )I am always drawn to the

Swamy Dayananda Saraswati,s rendering of our scriptures and culture.

His penchant for Yaska's(spiritual) interpretation of Vedas than the

usual Sayana's(ritualistic) interpretation, his exposing how some

verses of Vedas were wrongly translated giving ugly meanings and how

Western writers aped it, are all highly illuminating. It is a pity

that the deep rooted vested interest driven orthodoxy killed him at

his young age by giving poison, they did not let him complete the

interpretation of all the Vedas lest it demolish their discredited

interpretation and practices!

 

Keep going Venkatji, may God bless you!

 

Regards,

 

M.S.Thimmappa

 

, Venkat <apexpreci2000 wrote:

>

>

> Religion and Spirituality

>

>

> Of

> late, one thing I see quite often see making rounds in philosophical

> discussions is, the mix up between the words 'spiritual' and

[Guest guest]

, " J.venkatasubramanian "

<apexpreci2000 wrote:

 

> Re the Evolution of religions. I am reading article after article of

>how man made works are called word of God.

 

Namaste,

 

God doesnt personally descend & dictate books. Rather he inspires

others. More accurately, when people reach a certain level of

awareness, they can contact the Pure Spirit & access the Truths

available to it.

 

All works are inspired by God. The poets best rhyme, the artists best

painting, the heart touching book, all were composed when the limited

individual contacted the Universal. Only difference between scriptures

& normal books is, the Saints of Scriptures knew it was God talking

through them, so they didnt take any credit for their works.

 

All these rules of what Scriptues should & shouldnt be are mental-

they are only true on the mental plane. God cannot be grasped by the

mind, so the mind makes up rules of how God " should be " . God has to be

kind, loving, non-egoistical etc, else he cant be God. To which Sri

aurobindo replied " Who are we to tell God what He can or cant be? If

He needs our permission, He can hardly be God! "

 

with love

Shantnu

[Guest guest]

Venkatji,

 

Kindly accept my apologies, for the inadvertent mistake commited by me in making

the salutation to you as 'Venkat', while my intention was to say 'Venkatji'.

This I noticed only on seeing my own mail circulated.

 

As to the Hindu influence on Bible, I am mostly in agreement with you; but the

confusion was only on certain details. I have read a book in Tamil, written by a

Muslim author, who had traced the development of all the religions, wherein he

had particularly drawn our attention to the similarity in such names as

Abraham-Ibrahim-Brahma. His suggestion was that all the three names refer to the

same person. According to him, Brahma had fallen from grace, for he had revolted

against the worship of multi-god heads and championed for monotheism. Hence, the

myth that one of his four heads was severed and that he was removed from the

high position, he enjoyed along Lord Shiva and Lord Vishnu.

 

I wish I could lay my hand on Will Durand to know more about the connection

between Bible and Buddhism. I wonder whether he is referring to the New

Testement as having been influenced by Buddha's teachings or the entire Bible.

As I said earlier, there is a widely held belief that Christ was in India and

was deeply influenced by Buddhism and Vaishnavism. But, you seem to suggest that

Christ himself could be a fiction modelled on Krishna.

 

Thanks for your insightful post.

 

Hari Om Tat Sat

 

ulaganthan p

 

 

 

 

J.venkatasubramanian <apexpreci2000

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Sahntnuji,

 

How very true! All creativity emanates with the contact of the

Universal. And God is beyond the mind's capacity to apprehend. Thanks

for putting it in the way you have put it! Lovely.

 

Regards,

 

M.S.Thimmappa.

 

, shanracer <no_reply wrote: