A question about Hathha Yoga ?

July 23, 2008

Dear Shantanuji and sudhakarji and other saints here,

Is Hathha yoga alone sufficient for getting Moksha ? If not which

sadhna is capable of getting Moksha ?

jaya

July 23, 2008

HARE KRISHAN ,HARE RAM

> Dear Shantanuji and sudhakarji and other saints here,

>

> Is Hathha yoga alone sufficient for getting Moksha ? If not which

> sadhna is capable of getting Moksha ?

>

Madem Ji

THANKS FOR A NICE QUESTION

all the sadhanas are capable to get Moksha if it is dedicated to

Lord Sri Krishan . also all the sadhanas are not capable to get

moksha even Bhakti , if it is done for the self only .

HARE KRISHAN ,HARE KRISHAN ,KRISHAN KRISHAN ,HARE HARE ,HARE

RAM ,HARE RAM ,RAM RAM ,HARE HARE

July 23, 2008

, " jitendra kumar " <jtin_ja wrote:

>

> all the sadhanas are capable to get Moksha if it is dedicated to

> Lord Sri Krishan . also all the sadhanas are not capable to get

Jitendarji has given a good answer- any Sadhna, if done with humility

& surrender, is capable of giving Moksha.

Which Sadhna you start with, or which you give main focus to, will

depend on your temprament, & what tradition/Guru you follow. Each of

these Sadhnas tries to start with a different part:

1. Hatha Yoga- Pran(the body in Hatha Yoga is mainly used as a vehicle

to control Pran).

2. Raj Yog- Mind

3. Bhakti- Emotional mind

4. Karma Yog - Physical body

5. Gyan Yog - Buddhi

etc.

Based on your Karma, you will start with one of these techniques, but

a real master should be master of all of them. All are related &

cannot be separated. You cannot do Bhakti with mind while

smoking/drinking/partying with the body. You cannot do Raj Yog if your

body is weak & doesnt allow you to sit for long(which is why Raj Yog

starts with Yama/Niyama & Asan).

Hatha Yoga works with Pran, & tries to raise Kundalni with that.

The difference with Raj Yog is Raj Yog follows the pattern:

Dharana->Dhyan->Samadhi -where Dharana or concentration is the main

thing, & everything else including Asan & Pranayam is the support for

that.

While Hatha Yog follows: Asan->Pranayam->Samadhi

In Hatha Yoga, Pranayam is more important, as it leads to rising of

Kundalni. Hatha Yoga masters have said that when the Kundalni rises,

one hears Anhat Naad(inner sounds), as well as Mantras of the

different Chakras, & this automatically leads to Dharana & Dhyana, so

unlike Raj Yog there is no need to specially concentrate on anything.

As you can see, the final result of both is same: Samadhi.

Note: Both Raj & Hatha Yog only lead to Savikalpa Samadhi. The final

state, Nirvikalpa, only happens with surrender to God, practice &

grace, not personal effort. As such it can be reached by any method,

including Bhakti, although it is better to use a combination of

techniques.

The problem with Hatha Yoga is that it has become body-obsessed. Since

the body is made of Tamoguna, obsession with it leads to dulling of

mind. Thats why, if you do decide to follow Hatha Yoga, make sure the

teacher is highly spiritual & teaches Hatha Yoga under the context of

its Vedic background, & not just a routine for physical excercise.

with love

Shantnu

July 23, 2008

, shanracer <no_reply wrote:

> Note: Both Raj & Hatha Yog only lead to Savikalpa Samadhi. The final

> state, Nirvikalpa, only happens with surrender to God, practice &

> grace, not personal effort. As such it can be reached by any method,

> including Bhakti, although it is better to use a combination of

> techniques.

nice explanation shantnu ji,thanks

i have heard that by observing sakshi bhava one can lead to have

nirvikalpa samadhi. Please let me know is it so?

so hum...

July 23, 2008

, shanracer <no_reply wrote:

>

> 1. Hatha Yoga- Pran(the body in Hatha Yoga is mainly used as a vehicle

> to control Pran).

sir,

witnessing or maintaining sakshi bhava comes under which of above? Who

witness whom in sakshi bhava? only by maintaining high degree of

witnessing can someone reach to nirvikalpa samadhi?

please enlighten, thanks

so hum...

July 23, 2008

Dear Shantnuji,

Very well summarized, very apt and yet comprehensive on the five types

of yoga, thanks.

M.S.Thimmappa.

, shanracer <no_reply wrote:

> Jitendarji has given a good answer- any Sadhna, if done with

July 23, 2008

, " so hum " <jigyaasuu wrote:

>

> witnessing or maintaining sakshi bhava comes under which of above? Who

> witness whom in sakshi bhava? only by maintaining high degree of

> witnessing can someone reach to nirvikalpa samadhi?

>

Sohumji, I think Sakshi Bhaav would be part of Gyan Yog.

Our pure ego, our innate sense of " I " , called Asmita, not related to

any body(physical or other), watches the body, mind & Pran in Sakshi

Bhaav, looking at their changes but not identifying with them.

To reach Nirvikalpa Samadhi, even this weak sense of " I " must vanish.

love

Shantnu

July 24, 2008

, shanracer <no_reply wrote:

> Our pure ego, our innate sense of " I " , called Asmita, not related to

> any body(physical or other), watches the body, mind & Pran in Sakshi

> Bhaav, looking at their changes but not identifying with them.

>

> To reach Nirvikalpa Samadhi, even this weak sense of " I " must vanish.

very well explained, Thanks Shantnuji,

so hum...

July 24, 2008

, jaya_sundram <no_reply wrote:

Hello Jayaji,

Namaste!

Sorry for the delay in replying. Honestly no time to attend my

e-mail, even group ones, at the moment.

Coming to your question, yes, hatha yoga can help to reach

MOKSHA but remember hatha yoga does not mean by-passing any

steps. If that was the case sage Patanjali would not have

talked about Ashtanga Yoga. Every step is important.

Please note when you do Pranayama and the flaming Kundalini

rises, if your body is not prepared for it, then imagine your

body as 40 volt bulb into which more than 1000 volt current

enters, what will happen? so strengthening the body thru asanas

is important.

Meantime i second with what Jeetu Bhai said about humility, this

is very, very important.

Further Shantanuji said about being body obsessed which

unfortunately is very true. In my 23 years of teaching not

one single person was interested in spiritual aspect. All

are only interested in body beautifying aspect. The whole aspect

of spirituality is put down, in fact the word yoga which is

derived from sanskrit root word YUJ meaning to YOKE/JOIN when

i explain, i am told to cut the frills and stay on the main

course.

Anyway please note that even if you whole heartily do Ashtanga

Yoga systematically what ultimately needed is GRACE. And grace

is not something you can get it anyway or bargain for it. But, one

fact remains, many of the Saints have SOULFULLY, literally cried

to God to open the door. It is not God/Ma Shakti whatever you call

is not aware of your earnest cries but a certain plateau is to

be reached before she will open the door. For Aam Admi/Layman,

they do not have burning desire like those saints. In your own

circle have you seen anyone cry ONLY FOR GOD, N E V E R! then how

will God respond? but those humans who persistently pursue their

Sadhana usually experience grace a few days/hours before DEATH

and this is also a grace on the part of God so that virtually all

Karmic load is evacuated and you are actually clean as a whistle

from inside.

Thus as Lord Krishna said, DO YOUR WORK AND DO NOT BOTHER ABOUT

ITS FRUITS is the only alternative left to us. Ofcourse you can

improvise on this by continuing to honestly CRY only for GOD

and then you never know GRACE could flow in ABUNDANCE rather than

a TRICKLE.

With warm wishes,

Sudhakar

HARI OM TAT SAT! Cheers! )

> Dear Shantanuji and sudhakarji and other saints here,

>

> Is Hathha yoga alone sufficient for getting Moksha ? If not which

July 24, 2008

Dear S :-)

Its the consciousness that does the witnessing. But the point is that,

from which perspective.

When the Body works, the Mind thinks and the soul experiences where

does the consciousness reside? If with the Body, it may feel

pain/pleasure; if with the Mind it may feel sadness/exuberance; if

with the soul (atma) it may simply " take a note " of the experience

....which is " witnessing " .

What happens in Nirvikalpa Samadhi??? No one can say - It must be

beyond words and without explanation. Only Geometrically, the

consciousness is not in either of these three points of the

'triangle'...WHAT IS SEEN (Drishya), ONE WHO SEES (Drishta) and THE

ACT OF SEEING (Darshan).

The Consciousness is at the CENTER.

Regards,

Anupam

, " so hum " <jigyaasuu wrote:

> sir,

> witnessing or maintaining sakshi bhava comes under which of above?

July 25, 2008

, " Anupam Shil " <anupamshil wrote:

>

> Dear S :-)

>

> Only Geometrically, the

> consciousness is not in either of these three points of the

>

Very true anupam, conciousness is not in these three points of

triangle, Yes its in the centre, without taking part in any body

function, or mind. As shntnu ji said its pure ego or asmita which is

sakshi as it is not related with body, mind and pran.

what do you think?

so hum...

July 25, 2008

, " so hum " <jigyaasuu wrote:

>

> , " Anupam Shil " <anupamshil@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear S :-)

> >

> > Only Geometrically, the

> > consciousness is not in either of these three points of the

> >

What is this geometry in spirituality. What is the triangle ? will

somebody explain to me ?

jaya

July 25, 2008

, jaya_sundram <no_reply wrote:

> What is this geometry in spirituality. What is the triangle ? will

> somebody explain to me ?

i think geomtery word is used by anupam just for making undersatnd that

tringle of body, mind and soul is not a physical entity. he said

further that the super ego or asmita (as written by shantnu ji) which

is sakshi is beyond that triagle.

hope our learned sadhak here correct me if i am wrong

so hum...

July 25, 2008

HARE KRISHAN , HARE RAM

Only Geometrically, the

> consciousness is not in either of these three points of the

> 'triangle'...WHAT IS SEEN (Drishya), ONE WHO SEES (Drishta) and THE

> ACT OF SEEING (Darshan).

> The Consciousness is at the CENTER.

>

I think Consciousness remain EVERYWHERE in Sakshi Bhav

without consciousness one(Drasta) can not see ,

also without consciousness the matter(drashya) would be converted

in to dark matter and

also no action (darshan) could be performed without consciousness.

also soul would remain same as in sleeping condition without

consciousness .

Yes it is rightly said by Shantanu Sir Ji and SO hum Sir Ji that it

is the act of (observation of everything )BY Pure Ego . and pure

ego do not remains with all these but just watches everything .

But the Question is that WHY PURE EGO DO NOT EXPERIENCE

PAIN /PLEAURE ,SADNESS, ..........................

Thanks in advance to all the Sadhakas .

HARE KRISHAN ,HARE KRISHAN ,KRISHAN KRISHAN ,HARE HARE ,HARE

RAM ,HARE RAM ,RAM RAM ,HARE HARE

July 28, 2008

(This mails somehow returned as Mailer demon, so am sending again)

Dear Jayaji,

Our Ancient Sciences are full of geometry......Yantras as we see are

full of triangles....Shree Yantra having intermingled 9

triangles.....Mahakali Yantra having 5 upside down triangles

magnifying outwards. They depict various aspects/levels of the

consciousness in the subtle body. These points need to be aroused or

energized in relation to the specific sadhana.

For a Primary understanding we can say, the three corners of a

triangle represents....The Object (That is being Experienced), The

Subject (One who Experiences) and Witness (The Experience).

As Sohum very nicely indicated that with force of Prana one is able to

dis-identify oneself either as a subject or object and can witness the

" play " from a third witnessing platform.

These geometries can have much more deeper meanings as well, Bramha

Samhita, I heard explains the 2 intersecting triangles and the petals

commonly found in various Yantras......and some further deeper and