What are dreams then?

[Guest guest]

If dreams are not to be taken seriously, why do they come. Do

dreams have any spiritual background ?

 

ansuya

[Guest guest]

, ansuya80 <no_reply wrote:

>

> If dreams are not to be taken seriously, why do they come. Do

> dreams have any spiritual background ?

 

 

Dear ansuya,

 

Dreams are certainly an integral part of our life and as per men

of science, the dreams are due to :-

 

1) Settling of mind's memory to arrange the emotions and their

outcomes properly in different categories; or

 

2) to bring out our hidden desires and fulfil them at sub-conscious

level

 

Some also say that the dreams occur to tell us about our past

lives/future lives or to warn us of any forthcoming calamity..or just

to keep the mind busy in sleep.

 

Well dream have always fascinated me and I can say that my

treading on the path of sadhana and birth of this clubs called

sadhana was due to dreams, will not be a false claim. I will say , "

I believe that all the explanations of dreams are true and together

they make an iota of the truth of dreams. "

 

We see dreams because our Anthakarna (innerself) goes to the

astral/causal plane during sleep and as I wrote in one of my earlier

posts, sleep is just like samadhi, the only and the biggest

difference being the Guna bringing samadhi or sleep. In samadhi, we

are over-powered by Sat-guna and we see visions and in sleep we are

over powered by Tam-guna and we see dreams. It is also a fact that

we visit the plane of Astral consciousness during the Samadhi and

sleep…the only difference being the guna which is our guide on the

astral plane.

 

Lucid Dreaming is becoming very popular among the psychiatrists and

they have found many fascinating facts about dreaming…not covered by

science (but by our religion).

 

What is lucid dreaming - A dream where you are seeing a dream but you

are aware that you are watching a dream. There are different stages

of Lucid dreams, but once when we start seeing Lucid dreams, we can

safely say, we are treading into the path of Sadhna. Some people

have inborn capabitlites of going into Lucid dreams without any

sadhana, they observe Lucid dreams. I would say…it is due to their

sadhana in the previous birth….but one thing is sure those who see

Lucid dreams, are certainly higher souls than those who do not …

notwithstanding the social status, brain development or sadhana.

 

In a normal dream, our body numbs (and sleeps)…our faculties are

out of our control…and Tamo guna taking over us..our Viveka

(intelligence) loses power to distinguish/control the Vrittis

(thought waves) and we helplessly see what our mind is doing with the

thought-waves, or how it is reacting to them. But if we are on the

path of sadhna…and have acquired some proficiency….Slowly Tamoguna is

replaced by Satoguna..and our viveka remains with us even while

dreaming. It is here when Lucid dreaming starts. We become master

of dreams…we consciously react to a thought wave and work out on it.

In Lucid dreaming we do not act like a mere Saakshi (spectator) or a

slave…but like a master of our own dreams.

 

In the first stages of Lucid dreaming, we only become aware that we

are watching a dream. We do not have actual control over the

happenings of the dream. We know we are afraid or happy over a

situtation and we know that this is a temporary phase and soon we

will wake up and this will go. This type of Lucid dreaming can be

even without doing any sadhana (due to last birth sadhana)….but with

continued sadhna we can shift our consciousness to second stage of

Lucid dreaming…where we become the master of our dreams…where

miracles happen!!!

 

(To continue……..)

[Guest guest]

, " Aum " <beirut_ka_baba wrote:

> continued sadhna we can shift our consciousness to second stage of

> Lucid dreaming…where we become the master of our dreams…where

> miracles happen!!!

>

> (To continue……..)

 

..

..

There are 100s of books available on dream interpretation and all

of them are based upon one fact -hidden desires. The explanations

given for dreams in those books, may be true for a common person but

certainly not for those who are on the path of sadhna.

 

I remember once i saw a horrible dream. I had just started my Om

sadhna and was unaware of its purgatory effects. In a dream i saw

myself all burnt and wounded and I was wandering on the streets. all

the books I consulted, gave a negative effect of this dream.

Incidental Pandit Ashok jee, head Priest of Gangotri temple, visited

our house the next day. When he met me he asked what happened why I

was so sad. I told him about the dream. His first question was If I

am doing some beeja mantra japa. When i asked him the reason for

asking this he said, " Look dreams have a different meaning if one is

on the path of serious sadhna...dreams have different meaning for a

sadhaka and a different meaning for those who are not doing sadhna.

This particular dream if seen by a non-sadhaka will mean a

distressful future, some loses and bad news BUT for a sadhaka, it

would mean, old bad karma being burnt...injury to the egoistical body

and progress in Sadhna. And his theory was later confirmed by many

higher souls whom i met and by my own experiences.

 

Our inner-self, the sakshi present in us watches us one-pointedly

and notes all our actions. When we are new on the path, HE sends us

certain signals to guide us or warn us on the path. Since we have

not yet developed our faculties to receive the signals directly, HE

passes these signals to us through visions and dreams. If we are

doing any sadhna, we should thus be very open to our dreams. We may

get great hints for our sadhna through our dreams.

 

The best way is to keep a note-book and pen handy near the bed, and

in the morning, we should make a habit of writing details of any

dream we remember. We should write the details of dream, its

approximate duration and whether our sleep was disturbed by the dream

or not. I have noticed that those dream which come as a signal from

our Higher self...always disturb the sleep for some time. It may be

due to great joy found in the dream or some shock we got...but we

will be disturbed. Soon we will have a record of our dreams and we

will be surprised to find how dreams are taking shape, as our sadhna

progresses.

 

There are some dreams which have clear signals/indications about

our sadhna. Like those who are into shakti sadhna will soon see

dreams of lion lionesses or cubs. If the lions are peaceful and are

not attacking us...it would denote our shakti japa is going fine and

Mother is happy with us...if they attack us it would denote there is

some serious fault with our sadhna...mostly concerning purity of

thoughts or wrong way of japa.

 

Similarly dream of flying in the air is also seen by most of the

sadhaka. For a common man it denotes loses and abortion of

plans..but for a sadhaka it means..we are making progress. Dream of

flying for a sadhaka occurs when our Tamo guna reduces and pranic

body is a little free hence it wanders on the astral planes and we

see dreams of flying. However, if we see flying low and seeing

roads, buildings farms etc it may denote we are still attached to

wordly things and some more Vairagya is required.

 

Many sadhaka see snakes too in early days of sadhna. A snake for

a sadhaka denotes bad thought waves. However, if we are doing japa

of Shiva Mantra, seeing snakes is a good sign and denotes progress.

 

If we see dreams in which we listen music of Mridungam, conch or

sea waves...it is a sure sign of progress.

 

If we see a dream in which we are given some advice by some

elderly man/woman...we must follow the advise carefully because it is

our higher self which is trying to tell us something.

 

Seeing ourselves Dead in dreams, is a great sign for a sadhaka.

This normally denotes that a great leap has been achieved by a

sadhaka and soon Universal system will provide us with the second

stage of our sadhna.

 

Visiting a temple/holy place by sadhaka denotes there is need

of more faith (Shraddha) in his sadhna.

 

 

Seeing toilets,excreta or any such dirty things by sadhaka

means there are some bad vrittis still hiding which are hindering the

path of sadhana.

 

so if we start noting down our dreams and keeping an eye over the

progress in sadhna, we will soon be able connect our dreams with our

sadhna and our progress will be faster..when we start working on

these subtle signs and change accordingly

 

 

AUM

[Guest guest]

> There are 100s of books available on dream interpretation and all

> of them are based upon one fact -hidden desires. The explanations

> given for dreams in those books, may be true for a common person but

> certainly not for those who are on the path of sadhna.

 

>

> Visiting a temple/holy place by sadhaka denotes there is need

> of more faith (Shraddha) in his sadhna.

 

 

> lol baba u should write a book- " interpretation of sadhak's dreams "

lol

baba u r right. they always try to indicate something when we ourselves

dont understand. I didnt pay much heed to a very very important dream

and I think it was a grave error.Ofcourse I suffered loss. Now I know.

o.k. tell me this baba. Do all dreams related to God have a subtle

meaning?

What does this dream mean-

u visit the temple unexpectedly and see God there ie God not as an idol

but God himself.You have his darshana which you wanted to have but you

are unable to go closer to him or meet him(a wall also comes inbetween

as u r walking towards him) but u dont complain about it.

[Guest guest]

Hi Aum,

 

My respects to you, and also I have tried to share my knowledge on the

Maha-Vishnu form of my Lord.

 

This should make all things clear and also should establish the basic

of such abilities like dreams and others.

 

Please take time, and read it with peaceful mind.

 

.................................................................

 

Everything , which is eternally existent, are also exhibited, in a

deformed state in this material state, this also applies to our " Dreams " .

 

The key point is in understanding that, We are also not separate form

the potency, but a minute part of it. this is what we actually mean

when we tell we are part of the lord, so is everything else in existence.

 

The first point i would like to bring in front of all my very

beautiful souls, over here is that, Everything which is available in

deformed state here, has been passed on to material universe by lord

himself, as there is no other Link of transfer " to " the material

world, " From " the Spiritual World.

 

Now let us see how this so called dream, has come and how it has

become available to Jiva's in This material universe.

 

and from here on , in the following explanation, i will try to be as

accurate as possible, and my heartily request to all is to pay

attention on each of the words, as i would have placed it with exact

purpose to the best of my limited abilities. and also please note that

whatever is explained below, Is accurately taken from the Sanskrit

verses directly.

 

................

 

The temporary creation of the material manifestation is an exhibition

of the material energy of the Lord. For this management the whole

exhibition the Supreme Lord incarnates Himself as Maha-Vishnu.

 

Now maha-Vishnu is also called as Kaarana-Vasaayi Vishnu. He is so

called because It is in him the real " Kaaraana " Or " Cause " for

material manifestation resides throughout The cycle of this material

manifestation.

 

This knowledge we get from Sloka 1, Stated At end of this explanation.

Those who are well versed with Sanskrit, can Please correct if i am

wrong with my interpretations.

 

The duration of one such exibition is One Kalpa + twilight Period.

this is again a complex subject on its own and will not be explaining

here ( just dont want to confuse all).

 

The real kaarana, buried in him, is the fact due to which he starts to

prespire. And hence defines space and fills it with his Prespiration.

This is called the Cause-al Ocean or the Kaarana Ocean. This is the

Sole reason why the universe or whole material manifest, is based on

" Why " or the Kaarana.

 

Hence why is the most important question for any Jiva, and the

ultimate Answer to any " why " is same. He si the ultimate " Kaarana " of

everything.

 

From Him springs forth the vast expanse of water known as the

spiritual Causal Ocean wherein the material creation takes place.

Maha-Vishnu then reclines in the waters of the Causal Ocean in a state

of divine sleep, called yoga-nidra.

 

Thus, it is said that the universal creation is but the dream of

Maha-Vishnu.

 

Maha-Vishnu Wakes up ( i have briefed the awakening process once per

manifestation, to impregnate His consort Maya, by his glance, this is

the impregnation of consciousness, and is also the start of Material

time. This is the initial Jail setup, where ever existing Jivas like

me and you and all in material universe form Brahma till a small ant,

gets a feeling of limited life.

 

So, Maha-Vishnu in " Divine sleep " or " Yoga Nidra " , With the Kaarana,

or cause burried in him, is breathing.

 

when he breathes out, Form the pores of his body, many universes

sprout, which are the dwelling place for the souls or Jiva's in this

illution, to satisfy there deviated state, where they dont agree that

they are part of the lord, and they are not lords.

 

Then Maha-Vishnu lies down in the Causal Ocean, also called the Viraja

River, which is the border between the spiritual and material worlds.

 

At the time of creation, after the Supreme has been sleeping for some

time, the first emanations from the breathing of Lord Maha-Vishnu are

the personified Vedas who serve Him by waking Him from His mystic

sleep. They begin to enthusiastically sing His glories, pastimes, and

praises, just as a King is awoken in the morning by poets who recite

his heroic deeds.

 

This shows the eternal nature of the Vedas , as they are ever existent

and are responsible to Wake up the lord, and in a way request him to

Impregnate the Eagerly waiting Maya, His nature.

 

They are not merely the writings of men, but they are spiritual

vibrations that exist before and after the material creation, and

which emanate from the Supreme Lord.

 

And this prayer is in a rudimentary form, is " Purusha Suktha " , the

singing of glories of Purusha. He si the real male in the material

manifest, and everything else i feminine in nature. This is without

any doubt.

 

Once the Lord is awoken, He : casts His glance upon the material

energy of maya. This glance is how the Supreme impregnates material

nature with all the original seeds of the living beings.

 

Then maya, the material nature, becomes agitated.25 This functional

expansion of the Lord takes the form as Shiva, known in this activity

as Shambhu. It is Shambhu who carries the living entities in the

glance of the Lord into the material energy.

 

The Maya Charged, with the electrifying energy of the lord, is now

impregnated, But the Material time, which is the derivative of the

Spiritual time, is started when the lord awakes.

 

This is the potency of the Lord, where he Impregnated Maya, with

consciousness, and this process of Impregnation is derived throughout

the material nature and the same i available in the Gross material

nature and even among Humans as a way of giving birth by feminine,

also called as sexual desire, but this is deformed, and it is almost

material, and as in kaliyuga no consciousness is transfered in this

process, in current humans, and not much more than a gross material

content is shared.

 

See how the deformed, sexual desires originate form the spiritual

quality of the lord.

 

Now once the Lord is awaken, Now he turns to support the manifest ,

and once the Jiva's are transfered , He starts his divine dream, which

is nothing but all the things happening in the universe. the total

material manifest itself.

 

So , the total material manifest is nothing but the Dream of the Lord,

but as with all, this dream is dictated and as per Lord wants, that is

his will,

 

And As the sexual desires and the process of impregnation of the

feminine nature is deformed and has entered the material universe,

SIMILARLY, Even the dreaming capability of the Jiva's are also

available in deformed form in our world too.

 

See the differences are also clear, just needs a little thought. The

Lord Drams as per his wish, but we dream without our control on it (

off course, we can again control after meditation and a defined ).

also the next difference is the magnitude.

 

And the lord completed his dream, and with this, he also starts

inhaling, where all the material manifest is absorbed back into his body.

 

Which is the supreme Annihilation.

 

this is a complex Subject, and I am extremely sorry if i have confused

or i have not well represented any topic, anywhere . Kindly bring it

to my notice , I will try to make it clear.

 

.................

 

Sloka 1

 

Further Sloka References ..

 

 

sei maya avalokite sri-sankarsana

purusa-rupa avatirna ha-ila prathama

 

jagrhe paurusam rupam

bhagavan mahad-adibhih

sambhutam sodasa-kalam

adau loka-sisrksaya

 

 

adyo 'vatarah purusah parasya

kalah svabhavah sad-asan-manas ca

dravyam vikaro guna indriyani

virat svarat sthasnu carisnu bhumnah

 

sei purusa virajate karena sayana

'karanabdhisayi' nama jagat-karana

 

" That purusavatara, the first incarnation of purusa, He lies down in

the water of Causal Ocean, and His name is Karanabdhisayi Visnu. "

 

karanabdhi-pare mayara nitya avasthiti

virajara pare paravyome nahi gati

 

pravartate tatra rajas tamas tayoh

sattvam ca misram na ca kala-vikramah

na yatra maya kim utapare harer

anuvrata yatra surasurarcitah

 

.........................

 

 

-- Deito

 

Harirnama Harirnama Harirnama Kevalam.

[Guest guest]

Dear Babaji,

 

What if you meet a form of god in your dream who speaks to you for a very

long time and explains the future of the world and the direction in which it

will head. In your opinion does a dream like this have any spiritual

meaning??

 

Love

 

Bala...

[Guest guest]

, deito01 <no_reply wrote:

 

 

>

> Now maha-Vishnu is also called as Kaarana-Vasaayi Vishnu. He is so

> called because It is in him the real " Kaaraana " Or " Cause " for

> material manifestation resides throughout The cycle of this

>material manifestation.

--------

 

>

> They are not merely the writings of men, but they are spiritual

> vibrations that exist before and after the material creation, and

> which emanate from the Supreme Lord.

----------------

 

>

> See how the deformed, sexual desires originate form the spiritual

> quality of the lord.

--------------

 

That was really wonderful Deito... such a complex subject put in

simple words. AWESOME !!

 

I have marked above the points which made me wonder...how close is

this to Tantra philosophy, the only differencve in nonmenclature of

the supreme.

 

although your explanation does not leave room for further

quetions...but still i would ask one to milk you more of your

knowledge for the benefit of all our awakened souls here.

 

What is the borderline of divinity... i mean is there a border

between divinity and material ? a place or thing we can say that

from here the Divinity ends and Material starts.

 

AUM

[Guest guest]

, " Balachander Govindaraghavan "

<balachand wrote:

 

 

> What if you meet a form of god in your dream who speaks to you for a

very

> long time and explains the future of the world and the direction in

which it

> will head. In your opinion does a dream like this have any spiritual

> meaning??

-------------------------

 

Dear Bala this cant be a dream... this is a vision and whatever god

told will become True...

 

(yr answers are becoming smaller and smaller..the last was Zantra..LOL)

 

--------------------------------

 

Aradhana wrote

 

u visit the temple unexpectedly and see God there ie God not as an idol

but God himself.You have his darshana which you wanted to have but you

are unable to go closer to him or meet him(a wall also comes inbetween

as u r walking towards him) but u dont complain about it.

-------

 

Dear aradhana, this dream is good and shows god's mercy is on you and

it also denotes that you are deliberately keeping you away from

him...means not doing enough to progress which you can.

 

AUM

[Guest guest]

Babaji...

 

I feel very deeply that we should have a joint meditation session....That

would immensely help all sadhaks... As far as the answers getting shorter..

Please forgive me.. I am a little cranky... i fall silent for no apparent

reason and become unable to think and type sometimes...

Am sure this phase too will pass.. will resume my long boring posts

then...

 

love

Bala...

 

On 9/11/07, Aum <beirut_ka_baba wrote:

[Guest guest]

I will try to share what i know, but please everyone note that this

topic should not be considered, objectively.

 

It means to tell that, when i say shore of a river, please do not

think that it is really a river like the ones you see here, it means

that i am describing something magnificent, in terms of

comprehend-able objective quotes, so that the matter takes digestible

form, with normal human intelligence.

 

All obeisances to the supreme, His Lordship. my father, who has

bestowed such a grace on me, that my words make sense to many great

souls. I speak these words resting on my fathers feet.

 

The references form various authoritative sources follow :

 

..................................................

 

As per Veda's the Four Dham's or Abodes of Lord, with 4 natures follow :

 

1.) Devi-dham: The abode of Mayadevi; the material world

 

· Where the living entities go when they give up the desire to serve

Krishna and desire to enjoy separately from the Lord

 

· Meant for fulfilling the living entity's desires and rehabilitation

 

· A temporal place of illusory enjoyment and constant suffering

 

· Conditioned by birth, old age, disease and death

 

· The knowledge of the living entity is covered by ignorance and illusion

 

· False ego makes the living entity identify with the material body

 

· A place of duality and relativity

 

 

 

2.)Mahesa-dham: Lord Siva's abode in the Viraja River (Causal Ocean)

between the material and spiritual worlds. ( as per Rudra purana )

 

· A marginal place between Devi-dham and Hari-dham

 

· Not part of the spiritual world, nor the material world

 

· No opportunity to serve the Supreme Personality of Godhead

 

· For impersonalists who want to merge into the Transcendence

 

· For liberated souls who have not realised the opulence of Hari-dhama

 

· The destination of nirvana, the Buddha philosophy

 

· System of jnana-yoga makes one eligible to enter there.

 

 

3.)Vaikuntha-dham (Hari-dham): the spiritual world

 

· Means " free from anxiety " (Vai-free from; kuntha-anxiety)

 

· Unlimited planets, each being unlimited with a Vishnu-tattva

expansion of the Lord.

 

· Once having gone there, we never return to the material world

 

· Ever-increasing pleasure and love

 

· No artificial lighting — everything is self-illuminating

 

· Ever-fresh, youthful, eternal, immortal

 

· Each planet is predominated by a particular expansion of Narayana

 

· Everyone and everything there is perfect

 

· Everything is made of pure consciousness

 

· Kama-dhenu cows, Kalpa-vrksa wish-fulfilling trees

 

· Described in Srimad-Bhagavatam 3.15.12-24.

 

 

 

4.)Krishnaloka or Goloka-dham

 

· The supreme spiritual planet in Vaikuntha

 

· It is like the whorl of a lotus flower (other planets are the petals)

 

· It emanates the bright rays of effulgence (brahmajyoti) throughout

the entire spiritual world.

 

· Krishna performs wonderful pastimes there and reveals His sweetness.

 

· Every step is a dance, every word is a song

 

.. Only a devotee and NO ONE else can enter here, with any of his

varied skills and potencies.

 

 

 

Now coming to the Boundary of Material and Spiritual World :

 

 

These are extracts from the Madhya Lila :

 

Madhya-lila: Chapter Twenty, Text 268

 

" That original Personality of Godhead, named Sankarsana, first lies

down in the River Viraja, which serves as a border between the

material and spiritual

 

Madhya-lila: Chapter Twenty, Text 269

 

" The Viraja, or Causal Ocean, is the border between the spirituaI and

material worlds. The material energy is situated on one shore of that

ocean, and it cannot enter onto the other shore, which is the

spiritual sky.

 

 

NOW COMES THE POINT OF ATMOST IMPORTANCE WITH RESPECT TO THIS DISCUSSION.

 

Madhya-lila: Chapter Nineteen, Text 153

 

upajiya bade lata 'brahmanda' bhedi' yaya

'viraja', 'brahma-loka' bhedi' 'para-vyoma' paya

 

" As one waters the bhakti-lata-bija, the seed sprouts, and the creeper

gradually grows to the point where it penetrates the walls of this

universe and goes beyond the Viraja River which is lying between the

spiritual world and the material world. It attains brahma-loka, the

Brahman effulgence, and penetrating through that stratum it reaches

the spiritual sky and the spiritual planet Goloka Vrndavana. "

 

The Viraja River is not influenced by jnana, karma, yoga, tapasya,

etc. In a sense, neither rajas nor tamas (the material modes of

passion and ignorance) is present in the Viraja River; only suddha

sattva, (pure goodness), is there. In another sense, sattva, rajas and

tamas are there, but they are murchit (sleeping or lying dormant).

They can wake up at anytime time, however. This means that the jiva

may again fall victim to the material energy even he is situated in

the Viraja River, because there is no positive spiritual activity

there. The bhakti-creeper crosses beyond the Viraja River and

by-passes Brahma-loka. * [see Note 1 at end ] What is Brahma-loka? In

this sloka (upajiya bada lata…) Brahma-loka does not refer to the

residence of Lord Brahma. It refers to the impersonal brahmajyoti. By

brahma-jnana, one may enter and merge in brahma, and at that time he

thinks, " I am brahma. " But bhakti-devi can easily cross over this

brahma-loka, and in fact she does not even see it.

 

The bhakti-creeper then goes to paravyoma, which is beyond even

Siva-loka. Paravyoma, where there is no mixing in brahma, is divided

into two sections. The lower of the two is like Vaikuntha, but is not

actually Vaikuntha, and the jiva can also go there. It is the

Vaikuntha planet within the material world, and it is called

Rama-priya Vaikuntha. In that realm there is seva-sukha-uttara. There,

the devotee wants to serve Lord Narayana, but he also wants the

happiness accrued from the attainment of the four spiritual opulences.

That desire for happiness is not like ours, for the devotees there do

not have material bodies; still, that desire is not pure. In the

higher section there is prema-seva-uttara; the devotee only wants to

serve Narayana with love.

 

There is great aisvarya (opulence) in the Vaikuntha planets: one can

have the same bodily features as Narayana (sarupya), he can live on

the same planet with Him (salokya), he can have equal opulence

(sarsti), and he can have association with the Lord. But a Vaisnava

never wants these four types of liberation; he solely wants to serve.

 

Narayana-loka, Nrsimha-loka, Rama-loka, and many other such lokas are

within the Paravyoma, and the bhakti-creeper passes beyond all of

them. It crosses beyond Narayana-bhakti, Nrsimha-bhakti, and

Ramacandra-bhakti. The devotee will say, " I don't want that, " and

that creeper then goes to Goloka.

 

 

 

Off course all these explanations are absolutely pefect and Have

significance of creation and defines existance, but only can be

understood by those souls who are bestowed with mercy.

 

See them same lines read by a small child, May make a sense that i am

speaking about some place in some forest on this earth isn't it. that

is not innocence, but the jail of limitedness by maya.

 

Time, being my mother, always reminds me at my forehead in between my

eyebrows, that this is temporary and will end, when i cry not being

able to understand something.

 

Now let me discuss the Nature of this Viraja, or the Causal ocean, or

Garbodhaka or the support base of Mahat-Tattva

 

The Divys dEsa PrApthi parva is the eighth of the nine chapters(steps

) of parama padha sOpAna . After crossing the VirajA river during the

journey on the archirAdhi margam , the jeevan undergoes the following

experiences :

 

8.1: " VirajAm vimunchathi tanum sookshmA " :

The Muktha jeevan crosses the amrutha nadhi , Viraja , by its own

sankalpa . This nectarine river flows at the boundary of Sri Vaikunta

.. It is also considered as the boundary of thriguNa and Suddha sathva

.. The thriguNas ( Sathva-Rajas-Tamas ) represent the desert of

prakruthi and forms one side of the river VirajA . On the other bank

is Sri Vaikuntam , which is suddha sattva mayam . The jeeva crosses

this boundary and enters the land of Suddha sattvam and leaves its

sookshma sareera .

 

That is the cleansing power of the " vimala -madhura-surabhi-seethaLa

" ( Blemishless, fragrant , cool and sweet ) VirajA river . After that

purification by VirajA , the AmAnavan ( the appointed divine 0ne )

touches the Jeevan devoid of sookshma sareeram and removes all the

traces of vasanAs ( Karma vAsanais ) .

 

The sthUla sareeram is left behind , when the Jeevan gets out of the

cage of its body via mUrdhanya naadi ; it travels with sookshma

sareeram during its journey on the archirAdhi path. After crossing the

Viraja river , it shakes off its sookshma sareeram and when it is

touched by the amAnavan , it looses all karma vasanAs . The shedding

of the sookshma rUpam is covered by Brahma sUtram 4.2.9 :

 

Sookshmam pramANathsccha tathOpalabdhE :

 

The jeevan attains its atomic svarUpa AvirbhAvam and shines once again

with its natural guNas ( apahatha pApmathvAdi sathya sankalpathva

paryantha guNashtakam -- sinlessness , lasting and changeless youth ,

immortality , freedom from sorrow, hunger , thirst , sathya kaamathvam

and sathya sankalpathvam ) . This is indicated by the Brahma sUtram "

AthmA prakaraNAth " ( 4.4.3) . The Muktha Jeevan now enjoys the

sAdharmyam with the ParamAthmA . It does not get created at the time

of Srushti; it does not suffer at the time of mahA praLayam as

indicated by BhagavAn's words in GeethA :

 

idham jn~Anma upAsrithya mama sAdharmyamAgathA : |

sarkEpi nOpajAyanthE praLayE na vyathanthi cha || ( GitA --14.2 )

 

After crosisng the VirajA river and being touched by the AmAnavan ,

this muktha Jeevan is never sent back to the cruel world of samsAram

again as indicated by the last of the Brahma sUtram :

 

anAvrutthi sabdhAdh anAvrutthi sabdhAdh -- Br.Sutram 4.4.21

 

From here on , the enjoyment of the Muktha jeevan is described as it

entered the Divya dEsam of Sri Vaikuntam .

 

8.2 : Divya dEsa prApthi:

The blessed muktha jeevan shares the world of the Lord ( salOkan ) ;

It enters the kingdom of Sri Vaikuntam , which is " nithya niravadhya

niradhisaya BhOgyam " ( eternal , blemishless and with limitless

bhOgams ) . It is the divine kingdom which has the jyOthi of "

AnyanirapEksha PrakAsam " ( an effulgence , which is not dependent on

any other sources such as Sun or stars , svayam prakAsam ) . It is

beyond the reach of even great yOgis by mind or speech as indicated by

AchArya RaamAnujA in his SaraNAgathi gadhyam ( Parama yOgi vaangh

manasA aparicchEdhyam ) . The muktha jeevan now enters this supremely

divine kingdom of the Lord .

 

 

So with all these, Viraja can be considered as the boundary, But see

the beauty here, after all this i will say that there is nothing more

than the boundary, we are such an insignificant part. We on whole

exist in the Material sky manifested on top of Viraja, and everything

in this sky and material manifest rests on the Maha-Vishnu sleeping in

his Yoga-Nidra or Creative-Sleep with His Divine Dream in the Viraja

or The Causla Ocean.

 

How beautiful. Today must be a great day for me, that all these things

i have reviewed.. about the great Lord.

 

Thanks all for bestowing me this opportunity, this is really a great

place. I would specially like to Thanks Aum, and also Aradhana is

here, very nice to see you flower.

...................................................

 

.....................................................................

 

NOTE 2 : " Outside of the Vaikuntha planets is the impersonal

manifestation of Sri Krsna, which is known as Brahmaloka. On the other

side of Brahmaloka is the spiritual karana-samudra, or Causal Ocean.

The material energy exists on the other side of the Causal Ocean,

without touching it. " (Caitanya-caritamrta Adi-lila ch.5 Intro.)]

 

......................................................................

 

Regards,

 

-- Deito

 

 

 

, " Aum " <beirut_ka_baba wrote:

> What is the borderline of divinity... i mean is there a border

> between divinity and material ? a place or thing we can say that

> from here the Divinity ends and Material starts.

>

> AUM

>

[Guest guest]

, " Balachander Govindaraghavan "

<balachand wrote:

 

>

> I feel very deeply that we should have a joint meditation

session....That

> would immensely help all sadhaks... :

>

 

 

Well that is a brilliant idea Bala !!! I had been nurturing this idea

for long, but due to many things could not bring into practice....so

you take the lead..and let us see what other sadhaka feel

 

AUM

 

PS: Cranky???..LOL same here. why friends tell me i have become more

eccentric after coming to sadhna... is it natural? why it happens ?

can you elaborate ?

[Guest guest]

This is an excellent idea, I will show my Hari temple to you, where

The murthi is made up of pure silver, With the Lotus and leaves

sprouting out, and My Hari, standing on the whorl in his 4 handed

paramathma form.

 

I have decorated the petals of the lotus with a covering of pinkish

silver cloth, and the whorl with yellow.

 

His lotus feet resides on this and He is in pure silk, netted dress,

of yellow color covering till his waist, and also one more piece

flying from his neck, with the beautiful symbol of srivatsa.

 

I bring selected lotus flowers, and than select the very best of

petals and throw them all over the small pond with crystal clear water

smeared with hand, sandle wood. and also there are many silver deepaha

floating on this pond, where the fresh fragrance from the temples own

ghee, completely suddha, form its cow sheds, burn a bright lamp for

the lord.

 

A bright light , like that of the sun, shines behind the Head of the

Lord, and He is covered with walls with uniform opening , with bright

divine light coming form all the sides, He is sparkling. He is

dazling, and he is smiling, and he is so happy and i am resting at his

feet, and when i wake up i continue with abhisekaha.

 

 

many of the cows after taking bath in crystal clear water, come and do

pradakshinaha for the lord, and many other birds sing his glories, and

the temple premises is completely clean with a vast land of plants and

trees.

 

trees with full of fruits, and all tasty and all the special chosen

ones will be mixed with pure honey, and will be offered with love at

the feet of the lord, and as part of abhisekha.

 

isn't this wonderful.

 

-- deito

 

 

 

 

> , " Balachander Govindaraghavan "

> <balachand@> wrote:

>

> >

> > I feel very deeply that we should have a joint meditation

[Guest guest]

Deito...

 

The temple of the heart is always wonderful..... exceedingly wonderful...

 

Those that CAN see will be fortunate....

 

But those that feel are also fortunate....

 

Because... in tamil they say

 

" Or namum or uravamum illarku...1000 tirunamam paadi nam thellanam

kottamo... "

 

Meaning... For one who has no form or name.... we rejoice in HIM with a 1000

names....

 

Bhakthi is indeed a sweet path....

 

Love

 

Bala...

 

 

On 9/12/07, deito01 <no_reply > wrote:

>

> This is an excellent idea, I will show my Hari temple to you,

[Guest guest]

PS: Cranky???..LOL same here. why friends tell me i have become more

eccentric after coming to sadhna... is it natural? why it happens ?

can you elaborate ?

 

 

Babaji...

 

About being cranky.. I dunno.... But in my place they call Shiva...

Pittha...Crazy fellow.... As his children... we must at least be Cranky!!!

Otherwise it is a great injustice...)

 

If you look at it existentially... it is because we gradually loose the

sense of permanent-ness of this earthly plane.. and as a direct

result...appear different to people who have their focus on this plane..

 

Could be... but u never know....!!!Never trust the words of a drunkard and

a crazy fellow!!!!

 

Love

Bala...

[Guest guest]

Humble Obeisances to all. Very good idea. Think over where and how to organise

and start preparations. If in India, I can participate with all Tan-man-dhan.

Abroad, not possible as no passport yet and financially that much sound.

Heartful regards to all. Keshav

 

Balachander Govindaraghavan <balachand wrote: Babaji...

 

>I feel very deeply that we should have a joint meditation >session....That

[Guest guest]

Dearest keshav....

 

It was so nice of you to offer your help.

 

What I was thinking was actually an online session where at a prefixed time

we can all sit for meditation. We can also enable chat to allow people to

share their experiences..

 

Any IT savy person here??? Any idea how to do this???

 

Would be grateful for your help...

 

Love

 

Bala...

[Guest guest]

Dear Bala, Humble Obeisances. This the best idea. One fixed day and time and we

can chat freely on line including all. For that conference facility is required.

Devotees having 'Broad-band' connections can apply for this to their respective

ISPs and once put though, we can cheerfully exchange our views, opinions, and

cast ourselves more beautifully to advance in Sadahan. Heartful regards to all.

 

Balachander Govindaraghavan <balachand wrote: Dearest

keshav....

 

It was so nice of you to offer your help.

 

What I was thinking was actually an online session where at a prefixed time

we can all sit for meditation. We can also enable chat to allow people to

share their experiences..

 

Any IT savy person here??? Any idea how to do this???

 

Would be grateful for your help...

 

Love

 

Bala...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Flying to Bangalore or Bhopal? Search for tickets here.

 

 

[Guest guest]

, deito01 <no_reply wrote:

>

> This is an excellent idea, I will show my Hari temple to you, where

> The murthi is made up of pure silver, With the Lotus and leaves

> sprouting out, and My Hari, standing on the whorl in his 4 handed

> paramathma form.

 

This is wonderful. I can't explain my position reading this post.

 

Jai Gurudev

[Guest guest]

Thankyou my dear Brother, This is may temple of Hari, and i Offer my

Prayers Here, more than anywhere else.. Krsna, is everywhere, whole

existence is Cosmic form of Narayana, May Lord Achyutha Bless me , you

and everyone else.

 

Heartily Welcome to you .. new brother in our Brotherhood. We have

some lovely souls , in there path to realization here, and that makes

for combined and effective effort to accelerate ourselves, with the

energy injected through combined thoughts, Of ignited Minds, and

Desperate Souls for Enlightenment.

 

-- Deito

 

Harirnama Harirnama Harirnama Kevalam.

 

, pradeep8_56 <no_reply wrote:

> This is wonderful. I can't explain my position reading this post.

>

> Jai Gurudev

>

[Guest guest]

> > This is an excellent idea, I will show my Hari temple to you, where

> > The murthi is made up of pure silver, With the Lotus and leaves

> > sprouting out, and My Hari, standing on the whorl in his 4 handed

> > paramathma form

>Dieto I wish to know about your Hari temple. Please describe it to us

brother. A sinful soul like me certainly needs to have a glimpse of

Hari's temple so that i can cleanse my heart of dirt.

 

Aradhana

[Guest guest]

, " i_free_spirit " <i_free_spirit

wrote:

>A sinful soul like me certainly needs to have a glimpse of

>>

 

Dear Aradhana, Why do you call yourself sinful soul. First thing

to remember is that there is nothing called sin.... in the realms of

god...there is only thing which can be called sin, is ignoring God's

love.

 

At this young age, when you should be enjoying the singles and

dating sites, parties, friends, movies and treats...you are busy in

talking about god.

 

I have high regards for those youngester who are on the path of

truth... oldies like me are not that lucky.

 

In Yoga Vashishta when Shri Ram comes to sage Vashishtha for gyan...

he says - Ram when the stomach weakens, the fasting has no spiritual

value..when the youth is gone, there is no value of Brahmcharya.

When all the good karma of many births come together up..one goes on

the path of God...he is luckier than being a king

 

Aum

[Guest guest]

How can a baby's heart have dirt and sin, my dear sister you are..

welcome to my temple of Hari, anytime. I will send you a personal mail

shortly of the things i do there... and the things that happen there..

 

but yes we are all sinful, me and my sister both, else we would have

not been here, but at the same time, we have the hands of our father

on our head, and hardly can anything touch us, and anyways our sins

will be cleansed by his all merciful, divine, touch. So, i am free

form bondage and also i am free form distress and also free from fear

of any material kind in the three worlds. And i know my sister is also

the same.. else i would have not gained the respect i have for her,

neither i would have loved her so much.

 

Thanks for making me know about your existence Aradhana, Hari has made

me meet you, to share things.

 

 

And off course you are Lucky and have done great deeds, and i Agree

with Aum, on This one. See , you can see many people around you who

are really not capable of feeling love for hari, and is always behind

some material things, power etc etc... and in such a case , you are

pure hearted, and you know the importance of lord.. As i told you

before, i am repeating again, i see Hari in you, I respect you .. if

time permits and space doesn't limit, than i would love to throw some

flowers at your feet, my dear sister.

 

 

-- Bro Deito

 

Harirnama Harirnama Harirnama Kevalam.

 

, " i_free_spirit " <i_free_spirit

wrote:

>

A sinful soul like me certainly needs to have a glimpse of

> Hari's temple so that i can cleanse my heart of dirt.

>

> Aradhana

>

[Guest guest]

, deito01 <no_reply wrote:

>

> before, i am repeating again, i see Hari in you, I respect you .. if

> time permits and space doesn't limit, than i would love to throw some

> flowers at your feet, my dear sister.

 

Dear Deito,

 

you see Hari in aradhana only ? what about shanracer and

kumar ? Do you see Kansa there ? LOL. What do you see in me ? i am

sure you dont see Pootna in me

 

For me Hari is either in all or in none. I do not see hari in

them only who appreciate me, but i see Hari more in those who oppose

me. (just kidding dont be angry please)

 

ansuya

[Guest guest]

definitely i am not angry, but this gave a smile on my face.

 

also, aradhana never praises me always, just go through the posts,

there are many disagreements and also many comparitive judgements

and discussions.

 

but this expedites our process of self understanding.

 

and I see Hari, in many of them, and when i see Hari in all,

consider me enlightened.

 

yes, hari is everywhere, and never i can make such a sin , telling

hari is not in so and so objects.

 

when prahladha found hari in his very father, how can i say that.

 

these distinguishing and identification, is due to me being

sufficiently immature and also being bound by the mode os partial

existance.

 

but just because i know this, i cannot see hari in all, to gain that

capability, i need to understand hari, the owner of this duality, at

whose will it was created, by his own sweet grace.

 

god bless all ..

 

-- Deito

 

Harirnama Harirnama Harirnama Kevalam.

 

, ansuya80 <no_reply wrote:

 

> you see Hari in aradhana only ? what about shanracer and

> kumar ? Do you see Kansa there ? LOL. What do you see in me ? i am

[Guest guest]

> but yes we are all sinful, me and my sister both,

> And off course you are Lucky and have done great deeds, and i Agree

> with Aum, on This one.

> flowers at your feet

 

 

lol baba I think you are not happy that there have been no fights

since some days!! I am sinful , thats true. Ignoring love of God is

sinful (in my eyes that is) and I cant say I am not sinful!For God and

the great ones there is no sin but for the wicked ones there is.LOL Its

my free will I will call myself sinful; I am a free spirit!!

 

My thoughts are similar to Deito with respect to the former part of his

post.With respect to the latter where he agrees with you and is talking

about " flowers at the feet " ... Deito bro you have surely done much more

than it would take to inflate my ego lol now bring me back to earth lol

 

LOL.. Anusuya I am sure that you are misunderstanding Dieto on this

one;anyway thanks because your post made me smile too