Guest guest Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 Dear Sirs, Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as I am getting different results. with regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 manhrbab wrote: > Dear Sirs, > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as I am > getting different results. > > with regards Hello, As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's with Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free to use whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, 2000, 0h GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude of Spica, as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). -- Regards, François Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2007 Report Share Posted January 17, 2007 Francois, My two cents on this matter! Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, advanced). Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU and another in South India. Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability to determine what astrologers should use or not! RR vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" <alchocoden wrote: > > manhrbab wrote: > > Dear Sirs, > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as I am > > getting different results. > > > > with regards > > Hello, > > As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's with > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free to use > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, 2000, 0h > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude of Spica, > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > -- > Regards, > François > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Dear Sir, Very many thanks for your kind reply. Please help me in casting my daughter's horoscope as I am a novice and tell me how to calculate based on your polar longitude. Details of my daughter Date of Birth: 12 November 1987 Time:17:50hours Place: SriKalahasti (79E42,13N45 Time zone:-5:30INT) India with regards, --- Francois CARRIERE <alchocoden (AT) (DOT) ca> wrote: > manhrbab wrote: > > Dear Sirs, > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India > in casting a > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman > or Yukteswar as I am > > getting different results. > > > > with regards > > Hello, > > As you know, Indian government settled the question > in the 1950's with > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. > But we are free to use > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 > on january 1, 2000, 0h > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the > polar longitude of Spica, > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > -- > Regards, > François > > SARVESHAM SHANTIR BHAVANTU Manoo M.Manohara Babu B-10/60 PTS NTPC Ltd - Ramagundam PO: JYOTHINAGAR Dist:Karimnagar(Andhra Pradesh) INDIA PIN:505215 The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Search Marketing. http://searchmarketing./arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Francois, Add a penny from my side. Interestingly, B.V. Raman was also a member of Lahiri commission. Looks like the decision was not unanimous when they settled for "chitrapaksha ayanamsa" aka Lahiri ayanamsa. As we all know, Mr. Raman created/published his own ayanamsa, later. The reason Indian Govt. created a committee in the first place was to create a civil calender (to declare national holidays, for example)... Regards. Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> vedic astrology Wednesday, January 17, 2007 6:41:25 PM [vedic astrology] Re: Ayanamsha confusion- clarify Francois, My two cents on this matter! Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, advanced). Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU and another in South India. Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability to determine what astrologers should use or not! RR vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" <alchocoden@ ...> wrote: > > manhrbab wrote: > > Dear Sirs, > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as I am > > getting different results. > > > > with regards > > Hello, > > As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's with > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free to use > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, 2000, 0h > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude of Spica, > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > -- > Regards, > François > It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Toolbar. http://tools.search./toolbar/features/mail/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was taken by a committe of Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of India, not by the Govt as such. Recently, the UGC (University Grants commission) has given permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, recognized by it. Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote: Francois, My two cents on this matter! Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, advanced). Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU and another in South India. Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability to determine what astrologers should use or not! RR vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" <alchocoden wrote: > > manhrbab wrote: > > Dear Sirs, > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as I am > > getting different results. > > > > with regards > > Hello, > > As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's with > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free to use > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, 2000, 0h > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude of Spica, > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > -- > Regards, > François > alternate email is raichurar :Location Bombay India Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. Try the free Mail Beta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 - respected gurujis, even i m very confused which ayanamsha to use? mainly in india 3 ayanamsha are given higher importance N.C. lahiri, K.P. and ,, B. V. Raman i have seen that there is a slight variation of degrees and dasha prediction between lahiri and K.P. ayanamsha but big difference when we use raman ayanamsha... generally most horoscopes ( northern india specially) are based on lahiri or K.P. ayanamsh....but can anyone throw some light which ayanamsha has been proved most accurate..because difference in dasha and degrees can create a great impact on predictions... -- In vedic astrology, sridhar k <kopparsa wrote: > > The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was taken by a committe of Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of India, not by the Govt as such. > Recently, the UGC (University Grants commission) has given permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, recognized by it. > > > > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: > Francois, > > My two cents on this matter! > > Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the > only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that > practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been > taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet > with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, > advanced). > > Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the > small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the > sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. > They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > > Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri > ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in > vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not > based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that > Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have > within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should > be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have > astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its > universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU > and another in South India. > > Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of > astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability > to determine what astrologers should use or not! > > RR > > vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" > <alchocoden@> wrote: > > > > manhrbab wrote: > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as > I am > > > getting different results. > > > > > > with regards > > > > Hello, > > > > As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's > with > > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free > to use > > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, > 2000, 0h > > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude > of Spica, > > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > > > -- > > Regards, > > François > > > > > > > > > alternate email is raichurar:Location Bombay India > > > Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > Try the free Mail Beta. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Hello, Thank you for these little gemstones! ;-) -- Regards, François sree ven wrote: > Francois, > Add a penny from my side. > Interestingly, B.V. Raman was also a member of Lahiri commission. > Looks like the decision was not unanimous when they settled for > "chitrapaksha ayanamsa" aka Lahiri ayanamsa. As we all know, Mr. > Raman created/published his own ayanamsa, later. > > The reason Indian Govt. created a committee in the first place was to > create a civil calender (to declare national holidays, for > example)... > > Regards. > > > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> > vedic astrology > Wednesday, January 17, 2007 6:41:25 PM > [vedic astrology] Re: Ayanamsha confusion- clarify > > Francois, > > My two cents on this matter! > > Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the > only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that > practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been > taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet > with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, > advanced). > > Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the > small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the > sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. > They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > > Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri > ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in > vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not > based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that > Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have > within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should > be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have > astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its > universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU > and another in South India. > > Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of > astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability > to determine what astrologers should use or not! > > RR > > vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" > <alchocoden@ ...> wrote: >> >> manhrbab wrote: >>> Dear Sirs, >>> >>> Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a >>> horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as > I am >>> getting different results. >>> >>> with regards >> >> Hello, >> >> As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's > with >> Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free > to use >> whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, > 2000, 0h >> GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude > of Spica, >> as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). >> >> -- >> Regards, >> François >> > It's here! Your new message! > Get new email alerts with the free Toolbar. > http://tools.search./toolbar/features/mail/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 Hello Manohara, To get ayanamasha based on polar longitude of Spica (that is when it culminates, you take midheaven degree as 0 degree Libra), make sure you have an ayanamsha of 22:58:03.422 degree on january 1, 2000 at 0h Greenwich, with your software, such as Jagannatha Hora from PVR Rao. I can send you my parameters file for this software off list. Now. By the same ocasion, I will post the horoscope. Regards, François Manohara Babu wrote: > Dear Sir, > Very many thanks for your kind reply. Please help me > in casting my daughter's horoscope as I am a novice > and tell me how to calculate based on your polar > longitude. > > Details of my daughter > > Date of Birth: 12 November 1987 > Time:17:50hours > Place: SriKalahasti (79E42,13N45 Time zone:-5:30INT) > India > > with regards, > --- Francois CARRIERE <alchocoden (AT) (DOT) ca> wrote: > >> manhrbab wrote: >>> Dear Sirs, >>> >>> Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India >> in casting a >>> horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman >> or Yukteswar as I am >>> getting different results. >>> >>> with regards >> >> Hello, >> >> As you know, Indian government settled the question >> in the 1950's with >> Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. >> But we are free to use >> whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 >> on january 1, 2000, 0h >> GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the >> polar longitude of Spica, >> as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). >> >> -- >> Regards, >> François >> >> > > > SARVESHAM SHANTIR BHAVANTU > > Manoo > > M.Manohara Babu > B-10/60 PTS > NTPC Ltd - Ramagundam > PO: JYOTHINAGAR > Dist:Karimnagar(Andhra Pradesh) INDIA > PIN:505215 > > > > > The fish are biting. > Get more visitors on your site using Search Marketing. > http://searchmarketing./arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Share Posted January 18, 2007 >From what I recall as read in one of the messages by Sri KN Rao, the committee constituted a group of panchaang makers (ephemeris in Indian tradition). I think the conference he was talking about took place in Pune (Poona then). The problem with all these anecdotal accounts is that everyone is quoting from one's memory and many of the facts cannot be verified readily. Does someone have the report that must have been published back then and can someone verify? Otherwise it will soon become a porridge of facts and fiction and everyone will run with whatever they feel is true and valid or which serves their hypothesis and so on. My point still remains is that no survey or poll that is reliable has been conducted so assuming and making bold statements that MOST astrologers use this or that ayanamsha is pure fiction or even an urban myth ;-) Just because govt. of india or their appointees (what was the appointment/nomination process? How rigorous it was?? etc) decided in favour of one value and as someone stated could not decide (!), all these statements are leading to nowhere and so must not be propagated for whatever reason. Astrology may not be science but it is no religion either, so facts need to be examined, particularly where history and demographics are being claimed superficially! RR vedic astrology, sridhar k <kopparsa wrote: > > The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was taken by a committe of Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of India, not by the Govt as such. > Recently, the UGC (University Grants commission) has given permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, recognized by it. > > > > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: > Francois, > > My two cents on this matter! > > Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the > only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that > practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been > taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet > with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, > advanced). > > Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the > small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the > sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. > They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > > Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri > ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in > vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not > based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that > Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have > within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should > be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have > astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its > universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU > and another in South India. > > Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of > astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability > to determine what astrologers should use or not! > > RR > > vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" > <alchocoden@> wrote: > > > > manhrbab wrote: > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as > I am > > > getting different results. > > > > > > with regards > > > > Hello, > > > > As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's > with > > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free > to use > > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, > 2000, 0h > > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude > of Spica, > > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > > > -- > > Regards, > > François > > > > > > > > > alternate email is raichurar:Location Bombay India > > > Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > Try the free Mail Beta. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2007 Report Share Posted January 19, 2007 Some members of the KPSystem carried out a study on about 100 charts, and found that the NEW KPAYANSA gave the best results, based on past incidents. They compared the OLD KP, THE NEW KP, and Laheri Ayanamsa, using the Vimsottari Dasa in all cases. r_maheshwari7 <r_maheshwari7 > wrote: - respected gurujis, even i m very confused which ayanamsha to use? mainly in india 3 ayanamsha are given higher importance N.C. lahiri, K.P. and ,, B. V. Raman i have seen that there is a slight variation of degrees and dasha prediction between lahiri and K.P. ayanamsha but big difference when we use raman ayanamsha... generally most horoscopes ( northern india specially) are based on lahiri or K.P. ayanamsh....but can anyone throw some light which ayanamsha has been proved most accurate..because difference in dasha and degrees can create a great impact on predictions... -- In vedic astrology, sridhar k <kopparsa wrote: > > The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was taken by a committe of Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of India, not by the Govt as such. > Recently, the UGC (University Grants commission) has given permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, recognized by it. > > > > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: > Francois, > > My two cents on this matter! > > Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the > only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that > practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been > taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet > with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, > advanced). > > Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the > small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the > sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. > They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > > Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri > ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in > vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not > based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that > Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have > within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should > be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have > astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its > universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU > and another in South India. > > Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of > astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability > to determine what astrologers should use or not! > > RR > > vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" > <alchocoden@> wrote: > > > > manhrbab wrote: > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as > I am > > > getting different results. > > > > > > with regards > > > > Hello, > > > > As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's > with > > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free > to use > > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, > 2000, 0h > > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude > of Spica, > > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > > > -- > > Regards, > > François > > > > > > > > > alternate email is raichurar:Location Bombay India > > > Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > Try the free Mail Beta. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2007 Report Share Posted January 19, 2007 >From the preface to Indian ephemeris for 1995 a.d ""The ephemeris is based on nirayan or siderial system of calculation. The basis of the nirayana zodiac is the adoption of 285 A.D. as the zero ayanamsa year. This value was adopted by Shri N.C.Laheri in the Ephemeris from 1948. The Calender Reform Committe appointed by the Govt. of India recommended adoption of this ayanamsa by all panchang makers in our country and the Govt.of India also adopted this system of aynamsa in 1953." Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote: From what I recall as read in one of the messages by Sri KN Rao, the committee constituted a group of panchaang makers (ephemeris in Indian tradition). I think the conference he was talking about took place in Pune (Poona then). The problem with all these anecdotal accounts is that everyone is quoting from one's memory and many of the facts cannot be verified readily. Does someone have the report that must have been published back then and can someone verify? Otherwise it will soon become a porridge of facts and fiction and everyone will run with whatever they feel is true and valid or which serves their hypothesis and so on. My point still remains is that no survey or poll that is reliable has been conducted so assuming and making bold statements that MOST astrologers use this or that ayanamsha is pure fiction or even an urban myth ;-) Just because govt. of india or their appointees (what was the appointment/nomination process? How rigorous it was?? etc) decided in favour of one value and as someone stated could not decide (!), all these statements are leading to nowhere and so must not be propagated for whatever reason. Astrology may not be science but it is no religion either, so facts need to be examined, particularly where history and demographics are being claimed superficially! RR vedic astrology, sridhar k <kopparsa wrote: > > The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was taken by a committe of Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of India, not by the Govt as such. > Recently, the UGC (University Grants commission) has given permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, recognized by it. > > > > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: > Francois, > > My two cents on this matter! > > Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the > only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that > practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been > taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet > with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, > advanced). > > Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the > small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the > sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. > They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > > Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri > ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in > vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not > based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that > Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have > within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should > be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have > astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its > universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU > and another in South India. > > Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of > astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability > to determine what astrologers should use or not! > > RR > > vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" > <alchocoden@> wrote: > > > > manhrbab wrote: > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as > I am > > > getting different results. > > > > > > with regards > > > > Hello, > > > > As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's > with > > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free > to use > > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, > 2000, 0h > > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude > of Spica, > > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > > > -- > > Regards, > > François > > > > > > > > > alternate email is raichurar:Location Bombay India > > > Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > Try the free Mail Beta. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2007 Report Share Posted January 19, 2007 Sridhar ji, Surely you could not be missing the point I was trying to make? Yes, recently UGC may have given its blessings to 'start' astrology faculty/curriculum in colleges/universities recognized by it, but that comes in year 2000+! WHY did it take so long, when Lala Lajpat Rai had the gumption to make that happen in that GREAT Institution that he started many many decades ago on pretty much a shoe-string budget and literally a PRAYER as the saying goes? As a VERY PROUD of my EDUCATIONAL HERITAGE and ex-alumnus of Kashi Hindu Vishwavidyalaya (Banaras Hindu University or B.H.U. as it is known to anglophiles and moderns!!) despite its problems and politics in the recent decades which pains me personally inside -- why did it take so long for the UGC (is there a hindi term for UGC? Assuming of course that Hindi is still the Rashtra Bhasha of India! Listen, I am not trying to make trouble or take India Government to task (as if I could from such a distance!). All I am saying is that the fact remains that Jyotish remains a pie in the sky for most Indians even and something still steeped in magic and amulets and mantras and something that they would continue to pay homage to when they are caught between the rock and the hard place, both created by them over a long period of time, over lifetimes even! Much lip-service has been paid to jyotish over centuries or at least decades. When will we JYOTISHIS get serious about it? ONCE we do, as a collective and STRONG group, all the UGCs and vice-chancellors will follow. To that end, three institutions must receive our gratitude. Firstly B.V. Raman and his ICAS, next KN Rao and his Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan and finally Sanjay Rath and his SVJC Organization, in the order of chronology strictly and nothing else in my view. Let us all stick to facts and neither try preaching to the converted in these seemingly large but really small slices of global population and more importantly, let us all try and find commonalities and not differences amongst us or it will take all of us down, sooner than you think! RR <end of sermon -- the soapbox is now available for the next speaker!> vedic astrology, sridhar k <kopparsa wrote: > > The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was taken by a committe of Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of India, not by the Govt as such. > Recently, the UGC (University Grants commission) has given permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, recognized by it. > > > > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: > Francois, > > My two cents on this matter! > > Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the > only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that > practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been > taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet > with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, > advanced). > > Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the > small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the > sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. > They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > > Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri > ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in > vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not > based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that > Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have > within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should > be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have > astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its > universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU > and another in South India. > > Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of > astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability > to determine what astrologers should use or not! > > RR > > vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" > <alchocoden@> wrote: > > > > manhrbab wrote: > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as > I am > > > getting different results. > > > > > > with regards > > > > Hello, > > > > As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's > with > > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free > to use > > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, > 2000, 0h > > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude > of Spica, > > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > > > -- > > Regards, > > François > > > > > > > > > alternate email is raichurar:Location Bombay India > > > Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > Try the free Mail Beta. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2007 Report Share Posted January 20, 2007 Hello Mr Ranjan, There is a question that HAUNT me. we both use an ayanamsha that is less than 30' near. Why, after the translation by Ebenezer Burgess of the Surya Siddhanta, with the correction of Spica at 180°48 (although he believed wrong) and explaining erlier polar longitudes, indian jyotishi did not take tis value? Krushna swears by a near value... Did Lahiri wanted celebrity? A whole page of the Swiss Ephemeris is devoted to Hipparchos who defined a polar "latitide" of Spica (when by midheaven position a star has the same value). It was so obvious... Why, why, why!???... Even near Fagan SVP has the middle of Rohini in culmination!!!... S***!... -- Best regards François Rohiniranjan wrote: > Sridhar ji, > > Surely you could not be missing the point I was trying to make? > > Yes, recently UGC may have given its blessings to 'start' astrology > faculty/curriculum in colleges/universities recognized by it, but that > comes in year 2000+! WHY did it take so long, when Lala Lajpat Rai had > the gumption to make that happen in that GREAT Institution that he > started many many decades ago on pretty much a shoe-string budget and > literally a PRAYER as the saying goes? As a VERY PROUD of my > EDUCATIONAL HERITAGE and ex-alumnus of Kashi Hindu Vishwavidyalaya > (Banaras Hindu University or B.H.U. as it is known to anglophiles and > moderns!!) despite its problems and politics in the recent decades > which pains me personally inside -- why did it take so long for the > UGC (is there a hindi term for UGC? Assuming of course that Hindi is > still the Rashtra Bhasha of India! > > Listen, I am not trying to make trouble or take India Government to > task (as if I could from such a distance!). All I am saying is that > the fact remains that Jyotish remains a pie in the sky for most > Indians even and something still steeped in magic and amulets and > mantras and something that they would continue to pay homage to when > they are caught between the rock and the hard place, both created by > them over a long period of time, over lifetimes even! > > Much lip-service has been paid to jyotish over centuries or at least > decades. When will we JYOTISHIS get serious about it? ONCE we do, as a > collective and STRONG group, all the UGCs and vice-chancellors will > follow. To that end, three institutions must receive our gratitude. > Firstly B.V. Raman and his ICAS, next KN Rao and his Bharatiya Vidya > Bhavan and finally Sanjay Rath and his SVJC Organization, in the order > of chronology strictly and nothing else in my view. > > Let us all stick to facts and neither try preaching to the converted > in these seemingly large but really small slices of global population > and more importantly, let us all try and find commonalities and not > differences amongst us or it will take all of us down, sooner than you > think! > > RR > > <end of sermon -- the soapbox is now available for the next speaker!> > > vedic astrology, sridhar k <kopparsa > wrote: >> >> The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was taken by a committe of > Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of India, not by the Govt > as such. >> Recently, the UGC (University Grants commission) has given > permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, recognized by it. >> >> >> >> Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: >> Francois, >> >> My two cents on this matter! >> >> Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the >> only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that >> practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been >> taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet >> with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, >> advanced). >> >> Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the >> small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the >> sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. >> They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) >> >> Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri >> ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in >> vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not >> based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that >> Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have >> within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should >> be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have >> astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its >> universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU >> and another in South India. >> >> Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of >> astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability >> to determine what astrologers should use or not! >> >> RR >> >> vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" >> <alchocoden@> wrote: >>> >>> manhrbab wrote: >>>> Dear Sirs, >>>> >>>> Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a >>>> horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as >>>> I am getting different results. >>>> >>>> with regards >>> >>> Hello, >>> >>> As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's >>> with Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are >>> free to use whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on >>> january 1, 2000, 0h GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on >>> the polar longitude of Spica, as a possibility taken in the Surya >>> Siddantha). >>> >>> -- >>> Regards, >>> François >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> alternate email is raichurar:Location Bombay India >> >> >> Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. >> Try the free Mail Beta. >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2007 Report Share Posted January 20, 2007 Dear Francois, I am not sure why you ask me this question, for starters :-) Secondly, I am not really sure what you are asking me? About what Lahiri thought or wanted or what Krushna (who?) and Hipparchos and Ebenezer (the only Ebenezer I have heard of is Ebenezer Scrooge -- I think that is one of the western/christian fables but not sure :-( I have never really had a problem with ayanamsha, and I speak very honestly and directly about that. Believe it or not. Maybe I am coming across as being insensitive to those who do have a challenge staring at them in the ayanamsha area or similar entry portals. My apologies if I am sounding insensitive or clueless as to your angst as far as jyotish is concerned in your personal reality. I truly apologize for that. There is a wonderful book titled BIOLOGY OF BELIEF by BRUCE LIPTON. It is not about astrology but really openminded astrology students would find it of personal interest! In the meantime, and in light of my earlier plea/(more than a message) let us all focus individually on our challenges and resolve those rather than think that our next 'AHA' is the final answer for everyone else! RR vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" <alchocoden wrote: > > Hello Mr Ranjan, > > There is a question that HAUNT me. we both use an ayanamsha that is less > than 30' near. Why, after the translation by Ebenezer Burgess of the Surya > Siddhanta, with the correction of Spica at 180°48 (although he believed > wrong) and explaining erlier polar longitudes, indian jyotishi did not take > tis value? Krushna swears by a near value... Did Lahiri wanted celebrity? A > whole page of the Swiss Ephemeris is devoted to Hipparchos who defined a > polar "latitide" of Spica (when by midheaven position a star has the same > value). It was so obvious... Why, why, why!???... Even near Fagan SVP has > the middle of Rohini in culmination!!!... S***!... > > -- > Best regards > François > > Rohiniranjan wrote: > > Sridhar ji, > > > > Surely you could not be missing the point I was trying to make? > > > > Yes, recently UGC may have given its blessings to 'start' astrology > > faculty/curriculum in colleges/universities recognized by it, but that > > comes in year 2000+! WHY did it take so long, when Lala Lajpat Rai had > > the gumption to make that happen in that GREAT Institution that he > > started many many decades ago on pretty much a shoe-string budget and > > literally a PRAYER as the saying goes? As a VERY PROUD of my > > EDUCATIONAL HERITAGE and ex-alumnus of Kashi Hindu Vishwavidyalaya > > (Banaras Hindu University or B.H.U. as it is known to anglophiles and > > moderns!!) despite its problems and politics in the recent decades > > which pains me personally inside -- why did it take so long for the > > UGC (is there a hindi term for UGC? Assuming of course that Hindi is > > still the Rashtra Bhasha of India! > > > > Listen, I am not trying to make trouble or take India Government to > > task (as if I could from such a distance!). All I am saying is that > > the fact remains that Jyotish remains a pie in the sky for most > > Indians even and something still steeped in magic and amulets and > > mantras and something that they would continue to pay homage to when > > they are caught between the rock and the hard place, both created by > > them over a long period of time, over lifetimes even! > > > > Much lip-service has been paid to jyotish over centuries or at least > > decades. When will we JYOTISHIS get serious about it? ONCE we do, as a > > collective and STRONG group, all the UGCs and vice-chancellors will > > follow. To that end, three institutions must receive our gratitude. > > Firstly B.V. Raman and his ICAS, next KN Rao and his Bharatiya Vidya > > Bhavan and finally Sanjay Rath and his SVJC Organization, in the order > > of chronology strictly and nothing else in my view. > > > > Let us all stick to facts and neither try preaching to the converted > > in these seemingly large but really small slices of global population > > and more importantly, let us all try and find commonalities and not > > differences amongst us or it will take all of us down, sooner than you > > think! > > > > RR > > > > <end of sermon -- the soapbox is now available for the next speaker!> > > > > vedic astrology, sridhar k <kopparsa@> > > wrote: > >> > >> The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was taken by a committe of > > Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of India, not by the Govt > > as such. > >> Recently, the UGC (University Grants commission) has given > > permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, recognized by it. > >> > >> > >> > >> Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > >> Francois, > >> > >> My two cents on this matter! > >> > >> Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the > >> only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that > >> practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been > >> taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet > >> with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, > >> advanced). > >> > >> Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the > >> small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the > >> sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. > >> They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > >> > >> Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri > >> ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in > >> vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not > >> based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that > >> Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have > >> within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should > >> be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have > >> astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its > >> universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU > >> and another in South India. > >> > >> Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of > >> astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability > >> to determine what astrologers should use or not! > >> > >> RR > >> > >> vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" > >> <alchocoden@> wrote: > >>> > >>> manhrbab wrote: > >>>> Dear Sirs, > >>>> > >>>> Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > >>>> horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as > >>>> I am getting different results. > >>>> > >>>> with regards > >>> > >>> Hello, > >>> > >>> As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's > >>> with Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are > >>> free to use whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on > >>> january 1, 2000, 0h GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on > >>> the polar longitude of Spica, as a possibility taken in the Surya > >>> Siddantha). > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Regards, > >>> François > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> alternate email is raichurar@:Location Bombay India > >> > >> > >> Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > >> Try the free Mail Beta. > >> > >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2007 Report Share Posted January 20, 2007 it seems to me that the best thing to do is to find out what works in practice in our predictions. if lahiri gives the desired level of accuracy, why not stick to that. one must remember that birth time, lat @ long of place of birth are all approximate. while accuracy is important, it will ultimately be intuition which will help accurate predictions.this is not to deny the importance of accuracy but making a fetish of it could mean rejecting the good when we do not know what is the best and consensus eludes us. the researchers in astrology can ofcourse continue their search. v m rao --- Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote: > Dear Francois, > > I am not sure why you ask me this question, for > starters :-) > > Secondly, I am not really sure what you are asking > me? About what > Lahiri thought or wanted or what Krushna (who?) and > Hipparchos and > Ebenezer (the only Ebenezer I have heard of is > Ebenezer Scrooge -- I > think that is one of the western/christian fables > but not sure :-( > > I have never really had a problem with ayanamsha, > and I speak very > honestly and directly about that. Believe it or not. > > Maybe I am coming across as being insensitive to > those who do have a > challenge staring at them in the ayanamsha area or > similar entry portals. > > My apologies if I am sounding insensitive or > clueless as to your angst > as far as jyotish is concerned in your personal > reality. I truly > apologize for that. > > There is a wonderful book titled BIOLOGY OF BELIEF > by BRUCE LIPTON. It > is not about astrology but really openminded > astrology students would > find it of personal interest! > > In the meantime, and in light of my earlier > plea/(more than a message) > let us all focus individually on our challenges and > resolve those > rather than think that our next 'AHA' is the final > answer for everyone > else! > > RR > > vedic astrology, "Francois > CARRIERE" > <alchocoden wrote: > > > > Hello Mr Ranjan, > > > > There is a question that HAUNT me. we both use an > ayanamsha that is > less > > than 30' near. Why, after the translation by > Ebenezer Burgess of the > Surya > > Siddhanta, with the correction of Spica at 180°48 > (although he believed > > wrong) and explaining erlier polar longitudes, > indian jyotishi did > not take > > tis value? Krushna swears by a near value... Did > Lahiri wanted > celebrity? A > > whole page of the Swiss Ephemeris is devoted to > Hipparchos who > defined a > > polar "latitide" of Spica (when by midheaven > position a star has the > same > > value). It was so obvious... Why, why, why!???... > Even near Fagan > SVP has > > the middle of Rohini in culmination!!!... S***!... > > > > -- > > Best regards > > François > > > > Rohiniranjan wrote: > > > Sridhar ji, > > > > > > Surely you could not be missing the point I was > trying to make? > > > > > > Yes, recently UGC may have given its blessings > to 'start' astrology > > > faculty/curriculum in colleges/universities > recognized by it, but that > > > comes in year 2000+! WHY did it take so long, > when Lala Lajpat Rai had > > > the gumption to make that happen in that GREAT > Institution that he > > > started many many decades ago on pretty much a > shoe-string budget and > > > literally a PRAYER as the saying goes? As a VERY > PROUD of my > > > EDUCATIONAL HERITAGE and ex-alumnus of Kashi > Hindu Vishwavidyalaya > > > (Banaras Hindu University or B.H.U. as it is > known to anglophiles and > > > moderns!!) despite its problems and politics in > the recent decades > > > which pains me personally inside -- why did it > take so long for the > > > UGC (is there a hindi term for UGC? Assuming of > course that Hindi is > > > still the Rashtra Bhasha of India! > > > > > > Listen, I am not trying to make trouble or take > India Government to > > > task (as if I could from such a distance!). All > I am saying is that > > > the fact remains that Jyotish remains a pie in > the sky for most > > > Indians even and something still steeped in > magic and amulets and > > > mantras and something that they would continue > to pay homage to when > > > they are caught between the rock and the hard > place, both created by > > > them over a long period of time, over lifetimes > even! > > > > > > Much lip-service has been paid to jyotish over > centuries or at least > > > decades. When will we JYOTISHIS get serious > about it? ONCE we do, as a > > > collective and STRONG group, all the UGCs and > vice-chancellors will > > > follow. To that end, three institutions must > receive our gratitude. > > > Firstly B.V. Raman and his ICAS, next KN Rao and > his Bharatiya Vidya > > > Bhavan and finally Sanjay Rath and his SVJC > Organization, in the order > > > of chronology strictly and nothing else in my > view. > > > > > > Let us all stick to facts and neither try > preaching to the converted > > > in these seemingly large but really small slices > of global population > > > and more importantly, let us all try and find > commonalities and not > > > differences amongst us or it will take all of us > down, sooner than you > > > think! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > <end of sermon -- the soapbox is now available > for the next speaker!> > > > > > > vedic astrology, sridhar > k <kopparsa@> > > > wrote: > > >> > > >> The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was > taken by a committe of > > > Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of > India, not by the Govt > > > as such. > > >> Recently, the UGC (University Grants > commission) has given > > > permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, > recognized by it. > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > >> Francois, > > >> > > >> My two cents on this matter! > > >> > > >> Though often claimed that 'most' Indian > astrologers use Lahiri, the > > >> only way to determine that would be to poll the > astrologers that > > >> practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such > poll has ever been > > >> taken or published. Even such a poll has not > been taken over internet > > >> with its mixed population of jyotishis > (beginner, intermediate, > > >> advanced). > > >> > > >> Hence I do not believe we should make such a > comment based on the > > >> small sample we may have personally observed. > Particularly if the > > >> sample constitutes people from one school or > closely related schools. > > >> They would obviously tend to use similar > ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > > >> > > >> Secondly, Govt of India may have given its > blessing to Lahiri > > >> ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ > values of ayanamsha in > === message truncated === DR. V M Rao 22, 7th A Main CHBS First Layout Vijayanagar Bangalore-560040 India tel: 09341269290 e-mail: vidyanand23 _________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Security Centre. http://uk.security. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2007 Report Share Posted January 20, 2007 Hello Mr Rao, The main problem has to do with what was use in past. Lahiri, now, we know is a value that was taken as a reference in the 1940's until the recognition of 1953; before, until the 1900's, Revati was understood to be near 29°50 Pisces (so Spica was around 3° Libra) and was one reference (Yukteswar, Birth year - 499 * 54", for instance). BUT Surya Siddhanta define positions in *polar positions*: then, either right ascension (at a specific moment) or culmination give the same results (I tested it many times). That is MY MAIN POINT with "polar longitude" of Spica, which should taken by Krushna Jugalkalini, but He has a different point of view (precession rate, for sure). Doctor Raman once stated that polar longitude (Spica around 0°48 Libra) may be a solution (cf. Frawley's jyotish correspondance course). The main problem is that *we don't have precise horoscopes with degrees* either in western (I tried with Masha'Allah, with degrees in two directions: one may suits positions to what he believes) or in the eastern world. As Robert Hand once said, Ayanamsha is a problem *we have to solve for ourselve*. So you are right is some way ("the desired level of accuracy"). It would be fantastic, if jyotishi understood this simple truth and stopped imposing a specific ayanamsha (theirs) to every one as *the* only true one. We have to understand that some techniques have developped with specific ayanamsha and won't work with other (Krushna's ashtakavarga system's heritage is one). Professor K.N.Rao showed varga to work more efficiently with Lahiri (and I wished he would have not, because of my "ayanamhsa"!), so let us use it if so. In Heavens, there are only stars, and they don't care about us! Let us use them with respect, in with respect of the work of our fellows jyotishi and guru(s) who pass on to use the divine science, that of Light of Life. -- With my best regards, François V.M. Rao wrote: > it seems to me that the best thing to do is to find > out what works in practice in our predictions. if > lahiri gives the desired level of accuracy, why not > stick to that. one must remember that birth time, lat > @ long of place of birth are all approximate. while > accuracy is important, it will ultimately be intuition > which will help accurate predictions.this is not to > deny the importance of accuracy but making a fetish of > it could mean rejecting the good when we do not know > what is the best and consensus eludes us. the > researchers in astrology can ofcourse continue their > search. > > v m rao > --- Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >> Dear Francois, >> >> I am not sure why you ask me this question, for >> starters :-) >> >> Secondly, I am not really sure what you are asking >> me? About what >> Lahiri thought or wanted or what Krushna (who?) and >> Hipparchos and >> Ebenezer (the only Ebenezer I have heard of is >> Ebenezer Scrooge -- I >> think that is one of the western/christian fables >> but not sure :-( >> >> I have never really had a problem with ayanamsha, >> and I speak very >> honestly and directly about that. Believe it or not. >> >> Maybe I am coming across as being insensitive to >> those who do have a >> challenge staring at them in the ayanamsha area or >> similar entry portals. >> >> My apologies if I am sounding insensitive or >> clueless as to your angst >> as far as jyotish is concerned in your personal >> reality. I truly >> apologize for that. >> >> There is a wonderful book titled BIOLOGY OF BELIEF >> by BRUCE LIPTON. It >> is not about astrology but really openminded >> astrology students would >> find it of personal interest! >> >> In the meantime, and in light of my earlier >> plea/(more than a message) >> let us all focus individually on our challenges and >> resolve those >> rather than think that our next 'AHA' is the final >> answer for everyone >> else! >> >> RR >> >> vedic astrology, "Francois >> CARRIERE" >> <alchocoden wrote: >>> >>> Hello Mr Ranjan, >>> >>> There is a question that HAUNT me. we both use an >> ayanamsha that is >> less >>> than 30' near. Why, after the translation by >> Ebenezer Burgess of the >> Surya >>> Siddhanta, with the correction of Spica at 180°48 >> (although he believed >>> wrong) and explaining erlier polar longitudes, >> indian jyotishi did >> not take >>> tis value? Krushna swears by a near value... Did >> Lahiri wanted >> celebrity? A >>> whole page of the Swiss Ephemeris is devoted to >> Hipparchos who >> defined a >>> polar "latitide" of Spica (when by midheaven >> position a star has the >> same >>> value). It was so obvious... Why, why, why!???... >> Even near Fagan >> SVP has >>> the middle of Rohini in culmination!!!... S***!... >>> >>> -- >>> Best regards >>> François >>> >>> Rohiniranjan wrote: >>>> Sridhar ji, >>>> >>>> Surely you could not be missing the point I was >> trying to make? >>>> >>>> Yes, recently UGC may have given its blessings >> to 'start' astrology >>>> faculty/curriculum in colleges/universities >> recognized by it, but that >>>> comes in year 2000+! WHY did it take so long, >> when Lala Lajpat Rai had >>>> the gumption to make that happen in that GREAT >> Institution that he >>>> started many many decades ago on pretty much a >> shoe-string budget and >>>> literally a PRAYER as the saying goes? As a VERY >> PROUD of my >>>> EDUCATIONAL HERITAGE and ex-alumnus of Kashi >> Hindu Vishwavidyalaya >>>> (Banaras Hindu University or B.H.U. as it is >> known to anglophiles and >>>> moderns!!) despite its problems and politics in >> the recent decades >>>> which pains me personally inside -- why did it >> take so long for the >>>> UGC (is there a hindi term for UGC? Assuming of >> course that Hindi is >>>> still the Rashtra Bhasha of India! >>>> >>>> Listen, I am not trying to make trouble or take >> India Government to >>>> task (as if I could from such a distance!). All >> I am saying is that >>>> the fact remains that Jyotish remains a pie in >> the sky for most >>>> Indians even and something still steeped in >> magic and amulets and >>>> mantras and something that they would continue >> to pay homage to when >>>> they are caught between the rock and the hard >> place, both created by >>>> them over a long period of time, over lifetimes >> even! >>>> >>>> Much lip-service has been paid to jyotish over >> centuries or at least >>>> decades. When will we JYOTISHIS get serious >> about it? ONCE we do, as a >>>> collective and STRONG group, all the UGCs and >> vice-chancellors will >>>> follow. To that end, three institutions must >> receive our gratitude. >>>> Firstly B.V. Raman and his ICAS, next KN Rao and >> his Bharatiya Vidya >>>> Bhavan and finally Sanjay Rath and his SVJC >> Organization, in the order >>>> of chronology strictly and nothing else in my >> view. >>>> >>>> Let us all stick to facts and neither try >> preaching to the converted >>>> in these seemingly large but really small slices >> of global population >>>> and more importantly, let us all try and find >> commonalities and not >>>> differences amongst us or it will take all of us >> down, sooner than you >>>> think! >>>> >>>> RR >>>> >>>> <end of sermon -- the soapbox is now available >> for the next speaker!> >>>> >>>> vedic astrology, sridhar >> k <kopparsa@> >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was >> taken by a committe of >>>> Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of >> India, not by the Govt >>>> as such. >>>>> Recently, the UGC (University Grants >> commission) has given >>>> permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, >> recognized by it. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: >>>>> Francois, >>>>> >>>>> My two cents on this matter! >>>>> >>>>> Though often claimed that 'most' Indian >> astrologers use Lahiri, the >>>>> only way to determine that would be to poll the >> astrologers that >>>>> practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such >> poll has ever been >>>>> taken or published. Even such a poll has not >> been taken over internet >>>>> with its mixed population of jyotishis >> (beginner, intermediate, >>>>> advanced). >>>>> >>>>> Hence I do not believe we should make such a >> comment based on the >>>>> small sample we may have personally observed. >> Particularly if the >>>>> sample constitutes people from one school or >> closely related schools. >>>>> They would obviously tend to use similar >> ayanamshas, won't they? :-) >>>>> >>>>> Secondly, Govt of India may have given its >> blessing to Lahiri >>>>> ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ >> values of ayanamsha in >> > === message truncated === > > > DR. V M Rao > 22, 7th A Main > CHBS First Layout > Vijayanagar > Bangalore-560040 India > tel: 09341269290 > e-mail: vidyanand23 > > > > _________ > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new > Security Centre. http://uk.security. 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Guest guest Posted January 20, 2007 Report Share Posted January 20, 2007 and your pragmatic point is? ;-) vedic astrology, sridhar k <kopparsa wrote: > > From the preface to Indian ephemeris for 1995 a.d > > ""The ephemeris is based on nirayan or siderial system of calculation. The basis of the nirayana zodiac is the adoption of 285 A.D. as the zero ayanamsa year. This value was adopted by Shri N.C.Laheri in the Ephemeris from 1948. The Calender Reform Committe appointed by the Govt. of India recommended adoption of this ayanamsa by all panchang makers in our country and the Govt.of India also adopted this system of aynamsa in 1953." > > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: > From what I recall as read in one of the messages by Sri KN Rao, the > committee constituted a group of panchaang makers (ephemeris in Indian > tradition). I think the conference he was talking about took place in > Pune (Poona then). > > The problem with all these anecdotal accounts is that everyone is > quoting from one's memory and many of the facts cannot be verified > readily. > > Does someone have the report that must have been published back then > and can someone verify? Otherwise it will soon become a porridge of > facts and fiction and everyone will run with whatever they feel is > true and valid or which serves their hypothesis and so on. > > My point still remains is that no survey or poll that is reliable has > been conducted so assuming and making bold statements that MOST > astrologers use this or that ayanamsha is pure fiction or even an > urban myth ;-) > > Just because govt. of india or their appointees (what was the > appointment/nomination process? How rigorous it was?? etc) decided in > favour of one value and as someone stated could not decide (!), all > these statements are leading to nowhere and so must not be propagated > for whatever reason. > > Astrology may not be science but it is no religion either, so facts > need to be examined, particularly where history and demographics are > being claimed superficially! > > RR > > vedic astrology, sridhar k <kopparsa@> wrote: > > > > The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was taken by a committe of > Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of India, not by the Govt > as such. > > Recently, the UGC (University Grants commission) has given > permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, recognized by it. > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > > Francois, > > > > My two cents on this matter! > > > > Though often claimed that 'most' Indian astrologers use Lahiri, the > > only way to determine that would be to poll the astrologers that > > practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such poll has ever been > > taken or published. Even such a poll has not been taken over internet > > with its mixed population of jyotishis (beginner, intermediate, > > advanced). > > > > Hence I do not believe we should make such a comment based on the > > small sample we may have personally observed. Particularly if the > > sample constitutes people from one school or closely related schools. > > They would obviously tend to use similar ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > > > > Secondly, Govt of India may have given its blessing to Lahiri > > ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ values of ayanamsha in > > vogue, that was an executive decision and not informed! It was not > > based on expert knowledge of astrology for sure. We all know that > > Govt of India does not hold astrology in high esteem nor does it have > > within its structure astrological expertise to determine what should > > be the most suitable value. Heck -- Govt of India does not even have > > astrology as one of the educational faculties in most of its > > universities or barely supports the very few universities such as BHU > > and another in South India. > > > > Someone from India can give us more recent stats and status of > > astrology vis a vis the Government of India and its right or ability > > to determine what astrologers should use or not! > > > > RR > > > > vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" > > <alchocoden@> wrote: > > > > > > manhrbab wrote: > > > > Dear Sirs, > > > > > > > > Please clarify which Ayanamsha to follow in India in casting a > > > > horoscope Lahari or KP or Fragan-Bradley or Raman or Yukteswar as > > I am > > > > getting different results. > > > > > > > > with regards > > > > > > Hello, > > > > > > As you know, Indian government settled the question in the 1950's > > with > > > Lahiri commision. Now most astrologers use Lahiri. But we are free > > to use > > > whatever suits us. (I use one that was 22:58:03.422 on january 1, > > 2000, 0h > > > GMT, with scientific precession rate, based on the polar longitude > > of Spica, > > > as a possibility taken in the Surya Siddantha). > > > > > > -- > > > Regards, > > > François > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > alternate email is raichurar@:Location Bombay India > > > > > > Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > > Try the free Mail Beta. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2007 Report Share Posted January 20, 2007 Francois, I think the main problem or source of flummoxation and resulting vexation is the fact that there is no fixed and rock stable formula in astrology that applies like a certainty in physics (for simplicity let us say newtonian physics! Even physics has its uncertainties!). If there was for argument a combination or factor that always or nearly always caused an effect or demonstrated an effect then it would be easy to find the one and only ayanamsha. However, the truth is that that is not the case and thus there is a significant 'play' in the system if you catch my drift. Now there would be people who would oppose that view and try to make strong statements that astrological rules are black and white and always applicable, statements always made without demonstration or evidence, of course! Any serious exploration or discussion fizzles out in that kind of milieu! People have been approaching ayanamsha from the wrong end. They shift around the value (scientifically or otherwise!) and try to fit the events with the value of their choice. While pragmatic and quite functional overall, it does not clinch the definitive final answer because in many of these cases, the 'play' that I talked about in the astrological system also allows alternative explanations which fit with different ayanamsha values. If someone has a lot of time and is independently wealthy or superdedicated, this can be explored in great precise manner. I am hopeful that there would be someone like that someday :-) RR vedic astrology, "Francois CARRIERE" <alchocoden wrote: > > Hello Mr Rao, > > The main problem has to do with what was use in past. Lahiri, now, we know > is a value that was taken as a reference in the 1940's until the recognition > of 1953; before, until the 1900's, Revati was understood to be near 29°50 > Pisces (so Spica was around 3° Libra) and was one reference (Yukteswar, > Birth year - 499 * 54", for instance). BUT Surya Siddhanta define positions > in *polar positions*: then, either right ascension (at a specific moment) or > culmination give the same results (I tested it many times). That is MY MAIN > POINT with "polar longitude" of Spica, which should taken by Krushna > Jugalkalini, but He has a different point of view (precession rate, for > sure). > > Doctor Raman once stated that polar longitude (Spica around 0°48 Libra) may > be a solution (cf. Frawley's jyotish correspondance course). The main > problem is that *we don't have precise horoscopes with degrees* either in > western (I tried with Masha'Allah, with degrees in two directions: one may > suits positions to what he believes) or in the eastern world. As Robert Hand > once said, Ayanamsha is a problem *we have to solve for ourselve*. So you > are right is some way ("the desired level of accuracy"). It would be > fantastic, if jyotishi understood this simple truth and stopped imposing a > specific ayanamsha (theirs) to every one as *the* only true one. We have to > understand that some techniques have developped with specific ayanamsha and > won't work with other (Krushna's ashtakavarga system's heritage is one). > Professor K.N.Rao showed varga to work more efficiently with Lahiri (and I > wished he would have not, because of my "ayanamhsa"!), so let us use it if > so. In Heavens, there are only stars, and they don't care about us! Let us > use them with respect, in with respect of the work of our fellows jyotishi > and guru(s) who pass on to use the divine science, that of Light of Life. > > -- > With my best regards, > François > > V.M. Rao wrote: > > it seems to me that the best thing to do is to find > > out what works in practice in our predictions. if > > lahiri gives the desired level of accuracy, why not > > stick to that. one must remember that birth time, lat > > @ long of place of birth are all approximate. while > > accuracy is important, it will ultimately be intuition > > which will help accurate predictions.this is not to > > deny the importance of accuracy but making a fetish of > > it could mean rejecting the good when we do not know > > what is the best and consensus eludes us. the > > researchers in astrology can ofcourse continue their > > search. > > > > v m rao > > --- Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan wrote: > > > >> Dear Francois, > >> > >> I am not sure why you ask me this question, for > >> starters :-) > >> > >> Secondly, I am not really sure what you are asking > >> me? About what > >> Lahiri thought or wanted or what Krushna (who?) and > >> Hipparchos and > >> Ebenezer (the only Ebenezer I have heard of is > >> Ebenezer Scrooge -- I > >> think that is one of the western/christian fables > >> but not sure :-( > >> > >> I have never really had a problem with ayanamsha, > >> and I speak very > >> honestly and directly about that. Believe it or not. > >> > >> Maybe I am coming across as being insensitive to > >> those who do have a > >> challenge staring at them in the ayanamsha area or > >> similar entry portals. > >> > >> My apologies if I am sounding insensitive or > >> clueless as to your angst > >> as far as jyotish is concerned in your personal > >> reality. I truly > >> apologize for that. > >> > >> There is a wonderful book titled BIOLOGY OF BELIEF > >> by BRUCE LIPTON. It > >> is not about astrology but really openminded > >> astrology students would > >> find it of personal interest! > >> > >> In the meantime, and in light of my earlier > >> plea/(more than a message) > >> let us all focus individually on our challenges and > >> resolve those > >> rather than think that our next 'AHA' is the final > >> answer for everyone > >> else! > >> > >> RR > >> > >> vedic astrology, "Francois > >> CARRIERE" > >> <alchocoden@> wrote: > >>> > >>> Hello Mr Ranjan, > >>> > >>> There is a question that HAUNT me. we both use an > >> ayanamsha that is > >> less > >>> than 30' near. Why, after the translation by > >> Ebenezer Burgess of the > >> Surya > >>> Siddhanta, with the correction of Spica at 180°48 > >> (although he believed > >>> wrong) and explaining erlier polar longitudes, > >> indian jyotishi did > >> not take > >>> tis value? Krushna swears by a near value... Did > >> Lahiri wanted > >> celebrity? A > >>> whole page of the Swiss Ephemeris is devoted to > >> Hipparchos who > >> defined a > >>> polar "latitide" of Spica (when by midheaven > >> position a star has the > >> same > >>> value). It was so obvious... Why, why, why!???... > >> Even near Fagan > >> SVP has > >>> the middle of Rohini in culmination!!!... S***!... > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Best regards > >>> François > >>> > >>> Rohiniranjan wrote: > >>>> Sridhar ji, > >>>> > >>>> Surely you could not be missing the point I was > >> trying to make? > >>>> > >>>> Yes, recently UGC may have given its blessings > >> to 'start' astrology > >>>> faculty/curriculum in colleges/universities > >> recognized by it, but that > >>>> comes in year 2000+! WHY did it take so long, > >> when Lala Lajpat Rai had > >>>> the gumption to make that happen in that GREAT > >> Institution that he > >>>> started many many decades ago on pretty much a > >> shoe-string budget and > >>>> literally a PRAYER as the saying goes? As a VERY > >> PROUD of my > >>>> EDUCATIONAL HERITAGE and ex-alumnus of Kashi > >> Hindu Vishwavidyalaya > >>>> (Banaras Hindu University or B.H.U. as it is > >> known to anglophiles and > >>>> moderns!!) despite its problems and politics in > >> the recent decades > >>>> which pains me personally inside -- why did it > >> take so long for the > >>>> UGC (is there a hindi term for UGC? Assuming of > >> course that Hindi is > >>>> still the Rashtra Bhasha of India! > >>>> > >>>> Listen, I am not trying to make trouble or take > >> India Government to > >>>> task (as if I could from such a distance!). All > >> I am saying is that > >>>> the fact remains that Jyotish remains a pie in > >> the sky for most > >>>> Indians even and something still steeped in > >> magic and amulets and > >>>> mantras and something that they would continue > >> to pay homage to when > >>>> they are caught between the rock and the hard > >> place, both created by > >>>> them over a long period of time, over lifetimes > >> even! > >>>> > >>>> Much lip-service has been paid to jyotish over > >> centuries or at least > >>>> decades. When will we JYOTISHIS get serious > >> about it? ONCE we do, as a > >>>> collective and STRONG group, all the UGCs and > >> vice-chancellors will > >>>> follow. To that end, three institutions must > >> receive our gratitude. > >>>> Firstly B.V. Raman and his ICAS, next KN Rao and > >> his Bharatiya Vidya > >>>> Bhavan and finally Sanjay Rath and his SVJC > >> Organization, in the order > >>>> of chronology strictly and nothing else in my > >> view. > >>>> > >>>> Let us all stick to facts and neither try > >> preaching to the converted > >>>> in these seemingly large but really small slices > >> of global population > >>>> and more importantly, let us all try and find > >> commonalities and not > >>>> differences amongst us or it will take all of us > >> down, sooner than you > >>>> think! > >>>> > >>>> RR > >>>> > >>>> <end of sermon -- the soapbox is now available > >> for the next speaker!> > >>>> > >>>> vedic astrology, sridhar > >> k <kopparsa@> > >>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> The decision to use the Lahiri Ayanamsa, was > >> taken by a committe of > >>>> Eminent Astrologers, appointed by the Govt of > >> India, not by the Govt > >>>> as such. > >>>>> Recently, the UGC (University Grants > >> commission) has given > >>>> permission to teach ASTROLOGY in Colleges, > >> recognized by it. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Rohiniranjan <rohini_ranjan@> wrote: > >>>>> Francois, > >>>>> > >>>>> My two cents on this matter! > >>>>> > >>>>> Though often claimed that 'most' Indian > >> astrologers use Lahiri, the > >>>>> only way to determine that would be to poll the > >> astrologers that > >>>>> practice Jyotish in India or worldwide. No such > >> poll has ever been > >>>>> taken or published. Even such a poll has not > >> been taken over internet > >>>>> with its mixed population of jyotishis > >> (beginner, intermediate, > >>>>> advanced). > >>>>> > >>>>> Hence I do not believe we should make such a > >> comment based on the > >>>>> small sample we may have personally observed. > >> Particularly if the > >>>>> sample constitutes people from one school or > >> closely related schools. > >>>>> They would obviously tend to use similar > >> ayanamshas, won't they? :-) > >>>>> > >>>>> Secondly, Govt of India may have given its > >> blessing to Lahiri > >>>>> ayanamsha to cut down the noise created by 33+ > >> values of ayanamsha in > >> > > === message truncated === > > > > > > DR. V M Rao > > 22, 7th A Main > > CHBS First Layout > > Vijayanagar > > Bangalore-560040 India > > tel: 09341269290 > > e-mail: vidyanand23 > > > > > > > > _________ > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new > > Security Centre. http://uk.security. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 The basic problem with ayanamsas is not so much which ayanamsa value to choose but the dilemma: what exactly makes the 12 astrological signs? Where does, for example Libra really begin and end? Some try to find answers in the old classical astrological literature and Vedas, as astronomy clearly does not give clear absers to such astrological questions. But still, do even those people who trust classical authorities know for sure? Did the classical authorities? The truth is that there are NO clear boundaries between the constellations. Various constellations are just man-made interpretations of the night sky. In other words, there are no strict 12 houses or rooms in the zodiac, scientifically speaking. Western astrology solved the dilemma of boundaries between the 12 astrological signs by abandoning the sideareal approach and concentrating on fixed times of the year, Equinoxes and Solstices, instead. Now those are clear boundaries (winter solstice, for example), but the problem is, of course, that in western tropical astrology the connection to the true Zodiac is lost almost completely. Some astrologers abandon both the sidereal and tropical astrology and try to concentrate on true constellations (maybe not just 12 of them). That approach may mean that, for example, signs are not anymore of equal length. See, for example Dr Shepherd Simpson's Astrological History site on the web. If you really want to talk about astrology as a science, or anything even dimly close to science, you would have to start from the very basics and define why and where the Zodiac should be divided into 12 equally long areas. Why just 12 signs? Why not, say, 13 (including the Serpentarius or Ophiuchus constellation of the Zodiac). And what exactly is Zodiac, from what point of view (Sun etc.) is it observed. Why not include the other, non-zodiacical constellations more in the interpretations too? All these questions are are without any strict answers. So, in the end astrology remains a matter of faith, and you may choose what ever ayanamsa (like Tarun Chopra's) or other astrological approach you may please. No one can deny you that right on scientific grounds as all the various approaches (often contradicting each others heavily) are practically equal - scientifically speaking. Or do you disagree, and if so, how do you justify your opinion? (Just wishing that those who say they consider astrology science, would justify their claims in some way.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2007 Report Share Posted March 17, 2007 Ayanamsa or the precision point comes into existence due to the third motion of the earth. The reference point for this motion forms the basis of calculation. It is possible to calculate the correct ayanamsa value with the help of indepth research and a strong financial muscle. The current estimates are based on two factors - a) ones "closeness" in understanding the rationale behind it and b) How successful he or she is in giving an almost accurate prediction. Successful predictions have been made by both Dr. Raman and others using various ayanamsa and hence more stress has to be given to the true understanding of the concept coupled with experiments to support them. Having studied the subject from a very young age, my suggestion would be start understanding/grasping the concepts. When the theory part of learning is over and during implementation, ie actual reading of horoscopes, one can experiment on which gives more accurate results. From my own experience, I found that predictions made using Raman Ayanamsa were remarkably accurate, to the extent of determining the day and while some others failed miserably. Similary, I found that certain travel and related queries could be explained using Lahiri Ayanamsa, while Raman failed. This has always kept me busy - trying to decrypt the code. In a discussion with a good friend of mine, it suddenly stuck to us that one another attribute of the heavenly players could affect the ayanamsa. This when used gave a "yo-yo" effect, but the results have been quite satisfactory. Om Tat Sat, Raman Suprajarama Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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