Guest guest Posted September 8, 2006 Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 Rishi ji! As long as it is not my 'toes', Sir ;-) Seriously, though, dear friends, we are (Thank you Tanveer et al!) 5000+ strong and have worked on and around each other's corns and so on. We know each others' sensitive spots on this forum (After all, only a few dozens really have the time or interest to interact and post here and care to read other participants' posts!) so I really fail to see why so much angst has been spilling lately despite some very wise and accomplished participation, like those offered by Arjunji, Ashutoshji, Prafulla, Rishi, Tatvamasiji, Prashantji,etc (where is Vattam Krishnanji? Anyone know of dear Krishnan ji? I do miss him so!!). And I am sure many others, over the years that may just be lurking (internet jargon, not to be taken literally!). When 5000 show up and only 15 post, it tells me plain and simple one thing! ***Jyotish is DYING, if not already dead!*** PROVE ME WRONG!! I DARE YOU ALL, VOCAL AND RETICENT ONES!! RR , "rishi_2000in" <rishi_2000in wrote: > > Prafullaji, > That is the 'spin and the span' of Ranjanji's Jyotisha writings, one > has to be on toes always! > rishi > > , "crystal pages" > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > You are very kind, but for me *this* has always been the reality > that > > I want it to be. > > > > If it has not served **my** dreams, maybe I was the one who was > > distracted! > > > > This may not necessarily be your yard-stick or personal > experience, > > Prafulla! > > > > RR > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > Honest confession - Sometimes, I feel it is worth being selfish > (?) > > > and learn the useful & rare lessons from you. I feel myself > lucky > > for > > > your presence here and in fact, I Joined / resumed this, only > for > > your > > > presence. > > > > > > You are absolutely right..It is jyotish forum, not the forum to > > > discuss religious practices. I just happen to respond to such non > > > jyotish threads. Unfortunately, this jyotish forum is fading its > > > charm, for variety of practices. I wish, forum members can > realize > > > this that there are hardly jyotish discussions on this forum. > This > > has > > > become market place. > > > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > We grew up to come to jyotish to learn not about karma as > being > > the > > > > tree that is way bigger than us, at this time, and > > insurmountable, > > > > but to also see the mangoes that the tree is laden with! Some > > ripe, > > > > others not! The ripe ones we juice for immediate pleasure and > > succour > > > > and the unripe ones we pickle with patience for future > > (lifetimes)! > > > > > > > > And all this time we humans simply bow gratefully to the Deity > of > > our > > > > choice, in this lifetime -- thankful that it is a mango tree > we > > are > > > > up against and not an oak tree or cactus, for obvious reasons!! > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Knowing jyotish a bit, I can only add that - perhaps all > these > > > > plights > > > > > are karmic in nature!! Isn't it ? Unfortunately, it is > > compunding. > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafullaji > > > > > > > > > > > > you have observed in one of your mails that brahmins have > > grabbed > > > > > > cows, lands etc. and exploited all. this can best be > > described > > > > as > > > > > > your personal observation as it is not a fact. > > > > > > > > > > > > in public groups, many members strive to put forth their > > personal > > > > > > views as they observe in their experience and > understanding > > and > > > > > > expect general acceptance. in reality many such > observations > > are > > > > > > aberrations seen in isolation. > > > > > > > > > > > > let me put some facts which none can deny: > > > > > > > > > > > > centuries ago brahmins never worked for a salary or > offered > > any > > > > > > service for a living. they used to fix muhurtams for ALL > > people > > > > in > > > > > > their areas, do karmakanda for ALL people and impart holy > > > > knowledge > > > > > > and discourses to ALL besides maintaining the holiness of > the > > > > > > sanctum sanctorum of the temples and other places of > > > > consecration. > > > > > > kings, panchayat presidents or local landlords used to > offer > > land > > > > > > freely to these brahmins and also food grains and a cow. > in > > all > > > > > > karmakandas or for any auspicious happy occasions, they > are > > > > gifted > > > > > > few items, clothes, money etc. and all such brahmins used > to > > live > > > > > > 100% on donations given by the people VOLUNTARILY. these > > > > brahmins > > > > > > also used to write books, teach the children of ALL people > > and > > > > > > entertain with their lyrical, music and dance skills > > > > > > > > > > > > however, with the pogrom and forced conversion to islam by > > the > > > > > > invading moghuls, brahmins have taken up jobs like > teaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > later on in the last few decades with the rise of > communism > > and > > > > > > patronage by the left parties (it is a different matter > that > > the > > > > > > best communist country russia is now full of churches and > > > > leningrad > > > > > > becomes st. petersberg and many schools turn back to > churches > > but > > > > > > the indian counterparts still engage in anti religious > > propaganda) > > > > > > brahmins have been removed even from the posts of poojaris > as > > > > some > > > > > > state governemnts have started recruiting low caste non > > brahmins > > > > > > unaware of any religious rituals for these holy jobs. > most > > civil > > > > > > servants decades ago used to be brahmins and now due to > > > > reservation, > > > > > > around 90% of government employees are non brahmins. > still a > > > > large > > > > > > hue and cry is made every day for the success of these > > brahmins. > > > > > > seeing the poor plight of these brahmins in minority, > > sometime > > > > ago > > > > > > mulayamsingh offered to consider a 5% reservation for > > brahmins. > > > > > > within my family clan, we have great freedom fighters, > > headmaster > > > > > > and principals, poets, astrologers, doctors of most repute > in > > US > > > > and > > > > > > 100% younger generation are in most successful in IT, > > engineering > > > > or > > > > > > medicine profession and it is no exaggeration if i say > that > > 99% > > > > of > > > > > > these younger intelligent generation are in US. > > > > > > > > > > > > in many cities you would find poor brahmins who have not > > switched > > > > to > > > > > > other intelligent professions are still languishing in > > poverty. > > > > > > every morning i find dozens of karmakandi brahmins > standing > > or > > > > > > sitting on the footpath of the road in front of the > railway > > > > station > > > > > > waiting for some customers to pick them for their daily > > wages. > > > > this > > > > > > is only because they have not adapted to the professions > > which > > > > are > > > > > > in belief as on date and are sticking to a century old > holy > > noble > > > > > > profession which is not only ridiculed by the so called > > educated > > > > > > scientists but also painted bad by the communists. > > > > > > > > > > > > having seen all this, i took it as a challenge for myself > to > > > > leave > > > > > > my lucrative best mnc jobs and serve all the suffering > people > > > > > > through our religious holy ways and most of my customers > are > > non > > > > > > brahmins and many are from other religions as i treat all > > human > > > > > > beings equally as god. > > > > > > > > > > > > prafullaji, your observation may be restricted to few > > individuals > > > > at > > > > > > best, but to say that KARMAKANDI BRAHMINS exploited all is > > far > > > > from > > > > > > truth. > > > > > > > > > > > > in delhi i have seen many bihari non-brahmin migrant > > illiterate > > > > > > workers posing as poojaris and cheating the customers. in > > some > > > > > > temples, the watchmen and sweepers of yesteryears are now > > > > poojaris > > > > > > in the same temples which were built only for landgrabbing > > and to > > > > > > construct shops on all three sides and sell them for huge > > > > monies. > > > > > > most or all of thee landgrabbing mafias and illegal > > construction > > > > are > > > > > > done by non-brahmins. > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally ...? > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am born with just so few neurons, so few abilities, so > > few > > > > > > options, > > > > > > > such a little time and scope to live this lifetime! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do we have the time and ability and luxury of living the > > > > reality > > > > > > of > > > > > > > others who would impose on us their (?) reality and > waste > > the > > > > > > little > > > > > > > time we have in this lifetime? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they even worth the consideration, after what we > have > > seen > > > > so > > > > > > far? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Very well said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I, perhaps could not express the distinction (between > > relgion > > > > > > and > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > practioners). It is not the rituals (or belief > systems) > > > > itself, > > > > > > I > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > commenting about. They are "pure and acceptable" for > each > > > > belief > > > > > > > > system / religion. I am not talking about > > rationalization of > > > > > > some > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > these systems; and agree that they can not be black or > > white > > > > in > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > These are based on faith, so rationalization (for > common > > > > person > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > me) may be little too far stretching of it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The gray area is its practioners (for each belief > > system) - > > > > who, > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > commercial/ vested interests, misuses people's > > very "faith". > > > > and > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > turn, creates lots of difficulties in the life of > masses. > > For > > > > > > > Example > > > > > > > > - Various ritualistic charities to brahmins (cows etc) > in > > > > India > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > been the biggest cause of sufferings in rural India - > > where > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > borrow money to meet such ritualistic needs (including > on > > > > deaths > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the family). These have led to massive exploitation as > > well by > > > > > > > > "karamkandi" brahmans, in the name of religion. > Religion > > > > never > > > > > > > becomes > > > > > > > > source or cause of exploitation, but its practioners > do > > cause > > > > > > some > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > the wrong doings. Had these practices not surfaced in > > India - > > > > > > > perhaps, > > > > > > > > there was no need to religious diversions (like > Jainism, > > > > Budhism, > > > > > > > > Sikhisms, Arya Samaj etc). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Purans / vedas / religious scriptures are not > corrupted, > > its > > > > > > > > practioners are. Since "faith" itself is exploited, > its > > > > > > compliance > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > becomes "gainful" for few. But those quality brahmans > > also do > > > > not > > > > > > > > exist in numbers and those people who can understand > the > > > > rituals > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > true sense also have their own limitations in current > > yuga. > > > > This > > > > > > > often > > > > > > > > leads to misunderstood compliances of the rituals, in > > most > > > > cases > > > > > > > > (which is more harmful). Just attend any yagya, and > > observe > > > > > > > the "short > > > > > > > > cuts" followed - in the name of conveniences. > Charities > > are > > > > > > > collected, > > > > > > > > land mafias uses these sentiments to grab huge lands, > > people > > > > on > > > > > > day > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > day life are asked to do x/y/z for next life for the > > benefits > > > > > > > of "few" > > > > > > > > and so on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People know all these practices as well, but > > somehow "fear" > > > > > > created > > > > > > > > for "next life", makes them vulnerable for > exploitation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > pages" > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There will always be some 'mixing' between different > > belief > > > > > > > systems, > > > > > > > > > let us for instance take jyotish and rituals > > (karmakanda as > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > pointed out, though the rituals can further extend > into > > > > grey > > > > > > > magic > > > > > > > > > and black magic etc). Individuals of different > > background > > > > > > > (religious, > > > > > > > > > cultural, educational etc) will have different > > tolerances > > > > or > > > > > > > > > acceptances of belief systems and the 'degree of > > > > acceptance' > > > > > > > > > or "degree of tolerance" would vary. No one would > > really be > > > > > > > > > completely rational ever by someone else's standards > > (this > > > > is > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > general statement, so no reader should take it > > personally). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A rationalist would have a certain degree or > perimeter > > of > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > which may be rather restricted but more readily > > > > demonstrable > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > rather black and white. As we move into > > more 'accepting' > > > > ways > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > thinking of reality, the perimeter would grow and > the > > > > horizon > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > become less and less sharp and more accpeting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When belief systems interact and clash, individuals > > begin > > > > to > > > > > > > fight, > > > > > > > > > because we all must hold on to our core beliefs in > what > > we > > > > > > > consider > > > > > > > > > reality which is generally very personal though > there > > are > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > commonalities which lead to formation of groups. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beliefs are often at the very core of our sense of > self > > and > > > > > > touch > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > stir emotions, more in some, less in others, but > they > > > > always > > > > > > do. > > > > > > > > > Jyotish falls in one of these perimeters where > reason > > and > > > > > > beliefs > > > > > > > > > meet. It has enough contact with rational and > logical > > > > > > > considerations > > > > > > > > > and thus appeals to 'rationalists' or those who like > to > > > > reason > > > > > > > things > > > > > > > > > out, and also has enough of a mystical/mysterious > > flavour > > > > to > > > > > > > appeal > > > > > > > > > to those whose acceptance of "reality" is more > > forgiving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Both of these groups are observers, not necessarily > > knowers > > > > or > > > > > > > > > certainly not all knowing (hence humans!) and it is > not > > a > > > > > > > question of > > > > > > > > > right or wrong, necessarily. Only God perhaps knows > > what is > > > > > > true > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > what is not or right or wrong -- and I say that > purely > > > > based > > > > > > on > > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > > personal belief ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is the belief system and has little to do > > > > with "Jyotish". > > > > > > > > > > Nevertheless, there is very thin line between > correct > > > > (very > > > > > > > small > > > > > > > > > > population) and wrong ones (very large > population). > > The > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > is - > > > > > > > > > > knowledge of correct rituals, for its > > adherence..which is > > > > > > > missing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People are exploited by "karamkandi" bhramans > (even > > on > > > > > > events > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > deaths), which raises the big question on "purity" > of > > > > > > pursuits? > > > > > > > Even > > > > > > > > > > the people who are "known" in different cities in > > India as > > > > > > > > > > authorities, are just making this their whole > > > > > > time "business". > > > > > > > > > Almost > > > > > > > > > > each temple, priests, remedial astrologers (???) > have > > > > made a > > > > > > > big > > > > > > > > > mess > > > > > > > > > > of faith. No state or city is exception !!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, you are right ..we must do and shall not > bother > > > > about > > > > > > the > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > ones. I wish I could claim (unlike most), that I > know > > the > > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > Ones > > > > > > > > > > !!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your observation is true to some people or some > > temples > > > > > > who > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > doing this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for example, grahan is such a shadowy period > that > > it is > > > > > > > believed > > > > > > > > > > > that even gods shall not have that grahan shadow > > fall > > > > on > > > > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > hence all temples are closed during the grahan > > period, > > > > > > nay, > > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > additional cloth cover is kept as an umbrella > for > > the > > > > > > divine > > > > > > > idol > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > protect from the grahan shadow. however, > kalahasti > > > > temple > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > andhra > > > > > > > > > > > pradesh is keeping the temple not only open > during > > the > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > time > > > > > > > > > > > but also doing special poojas AT MIDNIGHT > (somewhat > > > > > > strage) > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > collecting donations for these special poojas > > during > > > > the > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since all these are expected in kaliyuga, we > shall > > keep > > > > > > doing > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > is right without bothering too much about how > > others > > > > are > > > > > > > doing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If one has interacted with yogis - they will > > > > explicitly > > > > > > > tell > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > that, > > > > > > > > > > > > any of the good charities can be done any > given > > day; > > > > and > > > > > > so > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > prayers. Not because that prayers / charities > on > > > > > > Eclipses > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > lesser > > > > > > > > > > > > relevance, but for the fact that, there are > > > > very "few" > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > knows / practices the correct and "puristic" > > methods > > > > of > > > > > > > > > performing > > > > > > > > > > > > them. and Such people spend most of their time > in > > > > their > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > pursuits > > > > > > > > > > > > (they are too occupied in their "own karma"). > > Most in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in making money ("Dukandari") from > > event > > > > > > driven > > > > > > > > > > > rituals, in > > > > > > > > > > > > every corner of the country on each of these > > > > occasions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , angel > > > > > > <angelgoel@> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can you suggest any particular item for daan > > > > > > > > > > > > > (donation) in this period or next day ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note:- After eclipse,next day (friday > morning), > > do > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > > eat anything without taking bath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > angel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot please. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No Sir. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th Night itself start and same night > ends > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have mentioned eclipse would be only 1 > > hour 33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You may say as per English date since it > > ends > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12.00 midnight > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ie.next English calendar date starts, so > > will > > > > end > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8th morning > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.08 am. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > Manoj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sharma > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jut to clear any confusion, the lunar > > eclipse > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > between the intervening night of > > September 6th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th? Right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > REFERENCE LAHIRIS INDIAN EPHEMERIS > FOR > > 2006 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a.d. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eclipse begins on Thursday September > > 7th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at night 23.35 and ends at same > night > > on > > > > 25.08 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Total Duration One hour 33 minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This will be visible in India, of > > course no > > > > > > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is advised to view this.,except > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scientist-astronomers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri Pandit Arjunji has advised > all > > > > devout > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious people, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of various religions (as added by > me) > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > requested > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to make full use > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of these period, by taking name of > > their > > > > Isht > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Devatas (Japa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and recitation), not to take water > or > > food > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sit on a seperate mat,not touch > > anything, > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bath after this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period is over,then of course go to > > sleep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any Japa done near the ocean (Sea), > near > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rivers (Ganga, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yamuna,Saraswati etc.), in temple, > in > > places > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > great masters have meditated and > gained > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enlightment, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also during period of Grahana > > (Eclipse), has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thousands fold > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of results which normally would > accrue > > to a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if he does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at other times and other places.The > > exact > > > > > > > > > > > > > > figure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > counts , > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > how many thousand fold also has been > > given > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > shastras, I have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > personally read this, but now cannot > > > > remember > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and locate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefor Dear members take advantage > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oppurtunity > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and increase > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your spititual Bank balance, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE > ULTIMATE > > > > > > > > > > > > > > DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE > > BLISS. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2006 Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 Dear Ranjan ji, I wish that, I could have stated earlier on the state of this forum (and glad that it has come from you - not from me; Yes, I second it). But no one is touching anyone's spots. People may perceive this for their own vested interests, but at large - it is in interest of jyotish - that people can come above their vested interests and participate on jyotish. Why do not we all decide that - what should be discussed and how? and we all can agree to. But can we? regards / Prafulla , "crystal pages" <jyotish_vani wrote: > > Rishi ji! > > As long as it is not my 'toes', Sir ;-) > > Seriously, though, dear friends, we are (Thank you Tanveer et al!) > 5000+ strong and have worked on and around each other's corns and so > on. > > We know each others' sensitive spots on this forum (After all, only a > few dozens really have the time or interest to interact and post here > and care to read other participants' posts!) so I really fail to see > why so much angst has been spilling lately despite some very wise and > accomplished participation, like those offered by Arjunji, > Ashutoshji, Prafulla, Rishi, Tatvamasiji, Prashantji,etc (where is > Vattam Krishnanji? Anyone know of dear Krishnan ji? I do miss him > so!!). And I am sure many others, over the years that may just be > lurking (internet jargon, not to be taken literally!). > > When 5000 show up and only 15 post, it tells me plain and simple one > thing! > > ***Jyotish is DYING, if not already dead!*** > > PROVE ME WRONG!! I DARE YOU ALL, VOCAL AND RETICENT ONES!! > > RR > > > > > > > > > > , "rishi_2000in" > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > Prafullaji, > > That is the 'spin and the span' of Ranjanji's Jyotisha writings, > one > > has to be on toes always! > > rishi > > > > , "crystal pages" > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > You are very kind, but for me *this* has always been the reality > > that > > > I want it to be. > > > > > > If it has not served **my** dreams, maybe I was the one who was > > > distracted! > > > > > > This may not necessarily be your yard-stick or personal > > experience, > > > Prafulla! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > Honest confession - Sometimes, I feel it is worth being selfish > > (?) > > > > and learn the useful & rare lessons from you. I feel myself > > lucky > > > for > > > > your presence here and in fact, I Joined / resumed this, only > > for > > > your > > > > presence. > > > > > > > > You are absolutely right..It is jyotish forum, not the forum to > > > > discuss religious practices. I just happen to respond to such > non > > > > jyotish threads. Unfortunately, this jyotish forum is fading its > > > > charm, for variety of practices. I wish, forum members can > > realize > > > > this that there are hardly jyotish discussions on this forum. > > This > > > has > > > > become market place. > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > We grew up to come to jyotish to learn not about karma as > > being > > > the > > > > > tree that is way bigger than us, at this time, and > > > insurmountable, > > > > > but to also see the mangoes that the tree is laden with! Some > > > ripe, > > > > > others not! The ripe ones we juice for immediate pleasure and > > > succour > > > > > and the unripe ones we pickle with patience for future > > > (lifetimes)! > > > > > > > > > > And all this time we humans simply bow gratefully to the > Deity > > of > > > our > > > > > choice, in this lifetime -- thankful that it is a mango tree > > we > > > are > > > > > up against and not an oak tree or cactus, for obvious > reasons!! > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Knowing jyotish a bit, I can only add that - perhaps all > > these > > > > > plights > > > > > > are karmic in nature!! Isn't it ? Unfortunately, it is > > > compunding. > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafullaji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you have observed in one of your mails that brahmins have > > > grabbed > > > > > > > cows, lands etc. and exploited all. this can best be > > > described > > > > > as > > > > > > > your personal observation as it is not a fact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in public groups, many members strive to put forth their > > > personal > > > > > > > views as they observe in their experience and > > understanding > > > and > > > > > > > expect general acceptance. in reality many such > > observations > > > are > > > > > > > aberrations seen in isolation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > let me put some facts which none can deny: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > centuries ago brahmins never worked for a salary or > > offered > > > any > > > > > > > service for a living. they used to fix muhurtams for ALL > > > people > > > > > in > > > > > > > their areas, do karmakanda for ALL people and impart holy > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > and discourses to ALL besides maintaining the holiness of > > the > > > > > > > sanctum sanctorum of the temples and other places of > > > > > consecration. > > > > > > > kings, panchayat presidents or local landlords used to > > offer > > > land > > > > > > > freely to these brahmins and also food grains and a cow. > > in > > > all > > > > > > > karmakandas or for any auspicious happy occasions, they > > are > > > > > gifted > > > > > > > few items, clothes, money etc. and all such brahmins used > > to > > > live > > > > > > > 100% on donations given by the people VOLUNTARILY. these > > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > also used to write books, teach the children of ALL > people > > > and > > > > > > > entertain with their lyrical, music and dance skills > > > > > > > > > > > > > > however, with the pogrom and forced conversion to islam > by > > > the > > > > > > > invading moghuls, brahmins have taken up jobs like > > teaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > later on in the last few decades with the rise of > > communism > > > and > > > > > > > patronage by the left parties (it is a different matter > > that > > > the > > > > > > > best communist country russia is now full of churches and > > > > > leningrad > > > > > > > becomes st. petersberg and many schools turn back to > > churches > > > but > > > > > > > the indian counterparts still engage in anti religious > > > propaganda) > > > > > > > brahmins have been removed even from the posts of > poojaris > > as > > > > > some > > > > > > > state governemnts have started recruiting low caste non > > > brahmins > > > > > > > unaware of any religious rituals for these holy jobs. > > most > > > civil > > > > > > > servants decades ago used to be brahmins and now due to > > > > > reservation, > > > > > > > around 90% of government employees are non brahmins. > > still a > > > > > large > > > > > > > hue and cry is made every day for the success of these > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > seeing the poor plight of these brahmins in minority, > > > sometime > > > > > ago > > > > > > > mulayamsingh offered to consider a 5% reservation for > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > within my family clan, we have great freedom fighters, > > > headmaster > > > > > > > and principals, poets, astrologers, doctors of most > repute > > in > > > US > > > > > and > > > > > > > 100% younger generation are in most successful in IT, > > > engineering > > > > > or > > > > > > > medicine profession and it is no exaggeration if i say > > that > > > 99% > > > > > of > > > > > > > these younger intelligent generation are in US. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in many cities you would find poor brahmins who have not > > > switched > > > > > to > > > > > > > other intelligent professions are still languishing in > > > poverty. > > > > > > > every morning i find dozens of karmakandi brahmins > > standing > > > or > > > > > > > sitting on the footpath of the road in front of the > > railway > > > > > station > > > > > > > waiting for some customers to pick them for their daily > > > wages. > > > > > this > > > > > > > is only because they have not adapted to the professions > > > which > > > > > are > > > > > > > in belief as on date and are sticking to a century old > > holy > > > noble > > > > > > > profession which is not only ridiculed by the so called > > > educated > > > > > > > scientists but also painted bad by the communists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > having seen all this, i took it as a challenge for myself > > to > > > > > leave > > > > > > > my lucrative best mnc jobs and serve all the suffering > > people > > > > > > > through our religious holy ways and most of my customers > > are > > > non > > > > > > > brahmins and many are from other religions as i treat all > > > human > > > > > > > beings equally as god. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prafullaji, your observation may be restricted to few > > > individuals > > > > > at > > > > > > > best, but to say that KARMAKANDI BRAHMINS exploited all > is > > > far > > > > > from > > > > > > > truth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in delhi i have seen many bihari non-brahmin migrant > > > illiterate > > > > > > > workers posing as poojaris and cheating the customers. > in > > > some > > > > > > > temples, the watchmen and sweepers of yesteryears are now > > > > > poojaris > > > > > > > in the same temples which were built only for > landgrabbing > > > and to > > > > > > > construct shops on all three sides and sell them for huge > > > > > monies. > > > > > > > most or all of thee landgrabbing mafias and illegal > > > construction > > > > > are > > > > > > > done by non-brahmins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally ...? > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am born with just so few neurons, so few abilities, > so > > > few > > > > > > > options, > > > > > > > > such a little time and scope to live this lifetime! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do we have the time and ability and luxury of living > the > > > > > reality > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > others who would impose on us their (?) reality and > > waste > > > the > > > > > > > little > > > > > > > > time we have in this lifetime? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they even worth the consideration, after what we > > have > > > seen > > > > > so > > > > > > > far? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > Gang" > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Very well said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I, perhaps could not express the distinction (between > > > relgion > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > practioners). It is not the rituals (or belief > > systems) > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > commenting about. They are "pure and acceptable" for > > each > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > system / religion. I am not talking about > > > rationalization of > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > these systems; and agree that they can not be black > or > > > white > > > > > in > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > These are based on faith, so rationalization (for > > common > > > > > person > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > me) may be little too far stretching of it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The gray area is its practioners (for each belief > > > system) - > > > > > who, > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > commercial/ vested interests, misuses people's > > > very "faith". > > > > > and > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > turn, creates lots of difficulties in the life of > > masses. > > > For > > > > > > > > Example > > > > > > > > > - Various ritualistic charities to brahmins (cows > etc) > > in > > > > > India > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > been the biggest cause of sufferings in rural India - > > > where > > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > > borrow money to meet such ritualistic needs > (including > > on > > > > > deaths > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > the family). These have led to massive exploitation > as > > > well by > > > > > > > > > "karamkandi" brahmans, in the name of religion. > > Religion > > > > > never > > > > > > > > becomes > > > > > > > > > source or cause of exploitation, but its practioners > > do > > > cause > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > the wrong doings. Had these practices not surfaced in > > > India - > > > > > > > > perhaps, > > > > > > > > > there was no need to religious diversions (like > > Jainism, > > > > > Budhism, > > > > > > > > > Sikhisms, Arya Samaj etc). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Purans / vedas / religious scriptures are not > > corrupted, > > > its > > > > > > > > > practioners are. Since "faith" itself is exploited, > > its > > > > > > > compliance > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > becomes "gainful" for few. But those quality brahmans > > > also do > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > exist in numbers and those people who can understand > > the > > > > > rituals > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > true sense also have their own limitations in current > > > yuga. > > > > > This > > > > > > > > often > > > > > > > > > leads to misunderstood compliances of the rituals, in > > > most > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > > (which is more harmful). Just attend any yagya, and > > > observe > > > > > > > > the "short > > > > > > > > > cuts" followed - in the name of conveniences. > > Charities > > > are > > > > > > > > collected, > > > > > > > > > land mafias uses these sentiments to grab huge lands, > > > people > > > > > on > > > > > > > day > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > day life are asked to do x/y/z for next life for the > > > benefits > > > > > > > > of "few" > > > > > > > > > and so on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People know all these practices as well, but > > > somehow "fear" > > > > > > > created > > > > > > > > > for "next life", makes them vulnerable for > > exploitation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > > pages" > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There will always be some 'mixing' between > different > > > belief > > > > > > > > systems, > > > > > > > > > > let us for instance take jyotish and rituals > > > (karmakanda as > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > pointed out, though the rituals can further extend > > into > > > > > grey > > > > > > > > magic > > > > > > > > > > and black magic etc). Individuals of different > > > background > > > > > > > > (religious, > > > > > > > > > > cultural, educational etc) will have different > > > tolerances > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > acceptances of belief systems and the 'degree of > > > > > acceptance' > > > > > > > > > > or "degree of tolerance" would vary. No one would > > > really be > > > > > > > > > > completely rational ever by someone else's > standards > > > (this > > > > > is > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > general statement, so no reader should take it > > > personally). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A rationalist would have a certain degree or > > perimeter > > > of > > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > which may be rather restricted but more readily > > > > > demonstrable > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > rather black and white. As we move into > > > more 'accepting' > > > > > ways > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > thinking of reality, the perimeter would grow and > > the > > > > > horizon > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > become less and less sharp and more accpeting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When belief systems interact and clash, individuals > > > begin > > > > > to > > > > > > > > fight, > > > > > > > > > > because we all must hold on to our core beliefs in > > what > > > we > > > > > > > > consider > > > > > > > > > > reality which is generally very personal though > > there > > > are > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > commonalities which lead to formation of groups. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beliefs are often at the very core of our sense of > > self > > > and > > > > > > > touch > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > stir emotions, more in some, less in others, but > > they > > > > > always > > > > > > > do. > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish falls in one of these perimeters where > > reason > > > and > > > > > > > beliefs > > > > > > > > > > meet. It has enough contact with rational and > > logical > > > > > > > > considerations > > > > > > > > > > and thus appeals to 'rationalists' or those who > like > > to > > > > > reason > > > > > > > > things > > > > > > > > > > out, and also has enough of a mystical/mysterious > > > flavour > > > > > to > > > > > > > > appeal > > > > > > > > > > to those whose acceptance of "reality" is more > > > forgiving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Both of these groups are observers, not necessarily > > > knowers > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > certainly not all knowing (hence humans!) and it is > > not > > > a > > > > > > > > question of > > > > > > > > > > right or wrong, necessarily. Only God perhaps knows > > > what is > > > > > > > true > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > what is not or right or wrong -- and I say that > > purely > > > > > based > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > > > personal belief ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is the belief system and has little to do > > > > > with "Jyotish". > > > > > > > > > > > Nevertheless, there is very thin line between > > correct > > > > > (very > > > > > > > > small > > > > > > > > > > > population) and wrong ones (very large > > population). > > > The > > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > is - > > > > > > > > > > > knowledge of correct rituals, for its > > > adherence..which is > > > > > > > > missing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People are exploited by "karamkandi" bhramans > > (even > > > on > > > > > > > events > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > deaths), which raises the big question > on "purity" > > of > > > > > > > pursuits? > > > > > > > > Even > > > > > > > > > > > the people who are "known" in different cities in > > > India as > > > > > > > > > > > authorities, are just making this their whole > > > > > > > time "business". > > > > > > > > > > Almost > > > > > > > > > > > each temple, priests, remedial astrologers (???) > > have > > > > > made a > > > > > > > > big > > > > > > > > > > mess > > > > > > > > > > > of faith. No state or city is exception !!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, you are right ..we must do and shall not > > bother > > > > > about > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > > ones. I wish I could claim (unlike most), that I > > know > > > the > > > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > Ones > > > > > > > > > > > !!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your observation is true to some people or some > > > temples > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > doing this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for example, grahan is such a shadowy period > > that > > > it is > > > > > > > > believed > > > > > > > > > > > > that even gods shall not have that grahan > shadow > > > fall > > > > > on > > > > > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > > hence all temples are closed during the grahan > > > period, > > > > > > > nay, > > > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > additional cloth cover is kept as an umbrella > > for > > > the > > > > > > > divine > > > > > > > > idol > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > protect from the grahan shadow. however, > > kalahasti > > > > > temple > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > andhra > > > > > > > > > > > > pradesh is keeping the temple not only open > > during > > > the > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > time > > > > > > > > > > > > but also doing special poojas AT MIDNIGHT > > (somewhat > > > > > > > strage) > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > collecting donations for these special poojas > > > during > > > > > the > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since all these are expected in kaliyuga, we > > shall > > > keep > > > > > > > doing > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > > is right without bothering too much about how > > > others > > > > > are > > > > > > > > doing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If one has interacted with yogis - they will > > > > > explicitly > > > > > > > > tell > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > > that, > > > > > > > > > > > > > any of the good charities can be done any > > given > > > day; > > > > > and > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > prayers. Not because that prayers / charities > > on > > > > > > > Eclipses > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > > lesser > > > > > > > > > > > > > relevance, but for the fact that, there are > > > > > very "few" > > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > > knows / practices the correct and "puristic" > > > methods > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > performing > > > > > > > > > > > > > them. and Such people spend most of their > time > > in > > > > > their > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > > pursuits > > > > > > > > > > > > > (they are too occupied in their "own karma"). > > > Most in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in making money ("Dukandari") from > > > event > > > > > > > driven > > > > > > > > > > > > rituals, in > > > > > > > > > > > > > every corner of the country on each of these > > > > > occasions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > angel > > > > > > > <angelgoel@> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can you suggest any particular item for daan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (donation) in this period or next day ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note:- After eclipse,next day (friday > > morning), > > > do > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > > > eat anything without taking bath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > angel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot please. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No Sir. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th Night itself start and same night > > ends > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have mentioned eclipse would be only > 1 > > > hour 33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You may say as per English date since > it > > > ends > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12.00 midnight > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ie.next English calendar date starts, > so > > > will > > > > > end > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8th morning > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.08 am. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > Manoj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sharma > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jut to clear any confusion, the lunar > > > eclipse > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > between the intervening night of > > > September 6th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th? Right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > REFERENCE LAHIRIS INDIAN EPHEMERIS > > FOR > > > 2006 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a.d. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eclipse begins on Thursday > September > > > 7th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at night 23.35 and ends at same > > night > > > on > > > > > 25.08 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Total Duration One hour 33 minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This will be visible in India, of > > > course no > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is advised to view this.,except > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scientist-astronomers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri Pandit Arjunji has advised > > all > > > > > devout > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious people, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of various religions (as added by > > me) > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > requested > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to make full use > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of these period, by taking name of > > > their > > > > > Isht > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Devatas (Japa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and recitation), not to take water > > or > > > food > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sit on a seperate mat,not touch > > > anything, > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bath after this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period is over,then of course go to > > > sleep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any Japa done near the ocean (Sea), > > near > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rivers (Ganga, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yamuna,Saraswati etc.), in temple, > > in > > > places > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > great masters have meditated and > > gained > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enlightment, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also during period of Grahana > > > (Eclipse), has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thousands fold > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of results which normally would > > accrue > > > to a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if he does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at other times and other places.The > > > exact > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > figure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > counts , > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > how many thousand fold also has > been > > > given > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > shastras, I have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > personally read this, but now > cannot > > > > > remember > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and locate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefor Dear members take > advantage > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oppurtunity > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and increase > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your spititual Bank balance, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE > > ULTIMATE > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE > > > BLISS. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2006 Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 I would disagree, Sir, Jyotish is vibrant, alive and kicking. Presently, this forum as also other forums are going through a patch of time wherein knowledge, its applicability are not the focus. But then, Jyotisha transcends time and ages. We find young eager minds willing to explore the depths of Jyotisha waters. We find various ingenious explanations to cover up inadequacies of knowledge. We witness bold experimentation as in all ages. We also observe an irrational fear! Rishi , "crystal pages" <jyotish_vani wrote: > > Rishi ji! > > As long as it is not my 'toes', Sir ;-) > > Seriously, though, dear friends, we are (Thank you Tanveer et al!) > 5000+ strong and have worked on and around each other's corns and so > on. > > We know each others' sensitive spots on this forum (After all, only a > few dozens really have the time or interest to interact and post here > and care to read other participants' posts!) so I really fail to see > why so much angst has been spilling lately despite some very wise and > accomplished participation, like those offered by Arjunji, > Ashutoshji, Prafulla, Rishi, Tatvamasiji, Prashantji,etc (where is > Vattam Krishnanji? Anyone know of dear Krishnan ji? I do miss him > so!!). And I am sure many others, over the years that may just be > lurking (internet jargon, not to be taken literally!). > > When 5000 show up and only 15 post, it tells me plain and simple one > thing! > > ***Jyotish is DYING, if not already dead!*** > > PROVE ME WRONG!! I DARE YOU ALL, VOCAL AND RETICENT ONES!! > > RR > > > > > > > > > > , "rishi_2000in" > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > Prafullaji, > > That is the 'spin and the span' of Ranjanji's Jyotisha writings, > one > > has to be on toes always! > > rishi > > > > , "crystal pages" > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > You are very kind, but for me *this* has always been the reality > > that > > > I want it to be. > > > > > > If it has not served **my** dreams, maybe I was the one who was > > > distracted! > > > > > > This may not necessarily be your yard-stick or personal > > experience, > > > Prafulla! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > Honest confession - Sometimes, I feel it is worth being selfish > > (?) > > > > and learn the useful & rare lessons from you. I feel myself > > lucky > > > for > > > > your presence here and in fact, I Joined / resumed this, only > > for > > > your > > > > presence. > > > > > > > > You are absolutely right..It is jyotish forum, not the forum to > > > > discuss religious practices. I just happen to respond to such > non > > > > jyotish threads. Unfortunately, this jyotish forum is fading its > > > > charm, for variety of practices. I wish, forum members can > > realize > > > > this that there are hardly jyotish discussions on this forum. > > This > > > has > > > > become market place. > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > We grew up to come to jyotish to learn not about karma as > > being > > > the > > > > > tree that is way bigger than us, at this time, and > > > insurmountable, > > > > > but to also see the mangoes that the tree is laden with! Some > > > ripe, > > > > > others not! The ripe ones we juice for immediate pleasure and > > > succour > > > > > and the unripe ones we pickle with patience for future > > > (lifetimes)! > > > > > > > > > > And all this time we humans simply bow gratefully to the > Deity > > of > > > our > > > > > choice, in this lifetime -- thankful that it is a mango tree > > we > > > are > > > > > up against and not an oak tree or cactus, for obvious > reasons!! > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Knowing jyotish a bit, I can only add that - perhaps all > > these > > > > > plights > > > > > > are karmic in nature!! Isn't it ? Unfortunately, it is > > > compunding. > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafullaji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you have observed in one of your mails that brahmins have > > > grabbed > > > > > > > cows, lands etc. and exploited all. this can best be > > > described > > > > > as > > > > > > > your personal observation as it is not a fact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in public groups, many members strive to put forth their > > > personal > > > > > > > views as they observe in their experience and > > understanding > > > and > > > > > > > expect general acceptance. in reality many such > > observations > > > are > > > > > > > aberrations seen in isolation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > let me put some facts which none can deny: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > centuries ago brahmins never worked for a salary or > > offered > > > any > > > > > > > service for a living. they used to fix muhurtams for ALL > > > people > > > > > in > > > > > > > their areas, do karmakanda for ALL people and impart holy > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > and discourses to ALL besides maintaining the holiness of > > the > > > > > > > sanctum sanctorum of the temples and other places of > > > > > consecration. > > > > > > > kings, panchayat presidents or local landlords used to > > offer > > > land > > > > > > > freely to these brahmins and also food grains and a cow. > > in > > > all > > > > > > > karmakandas or for any auspicious happy occasions, they > > are > > > > > gifted > > > > > > > few items, clothes, money etc. and all such brahmins used > > to > > > live > > > > > > > 100% on donations given by the people VOLUNTARILY. these > > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > also used to write books, teach the children of ALL > people > > > and > > > > > > > entertain with their lyrical, music and dance skills > > > > > > > > > > > > > > however, with the pogrom and forced conversion to islam > by > > > the > > > > > > > invading moghuls, brahmins have taken up jobs like > > teaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > later on in the last few decades with the rise of > > communism > > > and > > > > > > > patronage by the left parties (it is a different matter > > that > > > the > > > > > > > best communist country russia is now full of churches and > > > > > leningrad > > > > > > > becomes st. petersberg and many schools turn back to > > churches > > > but > > > > > > > the indian counterparts still engage in anti religious > > > propaganda) > > > > > > > brahmins have been removed even from the posts of > poojaris > > as > > > > > some > > > > > > > state governemnts have started recruiting low caste non > > > brahmins > > > > > > > unaware of any religious rituals for these holy jobs. > > most > > > civil > > > > > > > servants decades ago used to be brahmins and now due to > > > > > reservation, > > > > > > > around 90% of government employees are non brahmins. > > still a > > > > > large > > > > > > > hue and cry is made every day for the success of these > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > seeing the poor plight of these brahmins in minority, > > > sometime > > > > > ago > > > > > > > mulayamsingh offered to consider a 5% reservation for > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > within my family clan, we have great freedom fighters, > > > headmaster > > > > > > > and principals, poets, astrologers, doctors of most > repute > > in > > > US > > > > > and > > > > > > > 100% younger generation are in most successful in IT, > > > engineering > > > > > or > > > > > > > medicine profession and it is no exaggeration if i say > > that > > > 99% > > > > > of > > > > > > > these younger intelligent generation are in US. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in many cities you would find poor brahmins who have not > > > switched > > > > > to > > > > > > > other intelligent professions are still languishing in > > > poverty. > > > > > > > every morning i find dozens of karmakandi brahmins > > standing > > > or > > > > > > > sitting on the footpath of the road in front of the > > railway > > > > > station > > > > > > > waiting for some customers to pick them for their daily > > > wages. > > > > > this > > > > > > > is only because they have not adapted to the professions > > > which > > > > > are > > > > > > > in belief as on date and are sticking to a century old > > holy > > > noble > > > > > > > profession which is not only ridiculed by the so called > > > educated > > > > > > > scientists but also painted bad by the communists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > having seen all this, i took it as a challenge for myself > > to > > > > > leave > > > > > > > my lucrative best mnc jobs and serve all the suffering > > people > > > > > > > through our religious holy ways and most of my customers > > are > > > non > > > > > > > brahmins and many are from other religions as i treat all > > > human > > > > > > > beings equally as god. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prafullaji, your observation may be restricted to few > > > individuals > > > > > at > > > > > > > best, but to say that KARMAKANDI BRAHMINS exploited all > is > > > far > > > > > from > > > > > > > truth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in delhi i have seen many bihari non-brahmin migrant > > > illiterate > > > > > > > workers posing as poojaris and cheating the customers. > in > > > some > > > > > > > temples, the watchmen and sweepers of yesteryears are now > > > > > poojaris > > > > > > > in the same temples which were built only for > landgrabbing > > > and to > > > > > > > construct shops on all three sides and sell them for huge > > > > > monies. > > > > > > > most or all of thee landgrabbing mafias and illegal > > > construction > > > > > are > > > > > > > done by non-brahmins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally ...? > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am born with just so few neurons, so few abilities, > so > > > few > > > > > > > options, > > > > > > > > such a little time and scope to live this lifetime! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do we have the time and ability and luxury of living > the > > > > > reality > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > others who would impose on us their (?) reality and > > waste > > > the > > > > > > > little > > > > > > > > time we have in this lifetime? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they even worth the consideration, after what we > > have > > > seen > > > > > so > > > > > > > far? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > Gang" > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Very well said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I, perhaps could not express the distinction (between > > > relgion > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > practioners). It is not the rituals (or belief > > systems) > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > commenting about. They are "pure and acceptable" for > > each > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > system / religion. I am not talking about > > > rationalization of > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > these systems; and agree that they can not be black > or > > > white > > > > > in > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > These are based on faith, so rationalization (for > > common > > > > > person > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > me) may be little too far stretching of it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The gray area is its practioners (for each belief > > > system) - > > > > > who, > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > commercial/ vested interests, misuses people's > > > very "faith". > > > > > and > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > turn, creates lots of difficulties in the life of > > masses. > > > For > > > > > > > > Example > > > > > > > > > - Various ritualistic charities to brahmins (cows > etc) > > in > > > > > India > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > been the biggest cause of sufferings in rural India - > > > where > > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > > borrow money to meet such ritualistic needs > (including > > on > > > > > deaths > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > the family). These have led to massive exploitation > as > > > well by > > > > > > > > > "karamkandi" brahmans, in the name of religion. > > Religion > > > > > never > > > > > > > > becomes > > > > > > > > > source or cause of exploitation, but its practioners > > do > > > cause > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > the wrong doings. Had these practices not surfaced in > > > India - > > > > > > > > perhaps, > > > > > > > > > there was no need to religious diversions (like > > Jainism, > > > > > Budhism, > > > > > > > > > Sikhisms, Arya Samaj etc). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Purans / vedas / religious scriptures are not > > corrupted, > > > its > > > > > > > > > practioners are. Since "faith" itself is exploited, > > its > > > > > > > compliance > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > becomes "gainful" for few. But those quality brahmans > > > also do > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > exist in numbers and those people who can understand > > the > > > > > rituals > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > true sense also have their own limitations in current > > > yuga. > > > > > This > > > > > > > > often > > > > > > > > > leads to misunderstood compliances of the rituals, in > > > most > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > > (which is more harmful). Just attend any yagya, and > > > observe > > > > > > > > the "short > > > > > > > > > cuts" followed - in the name of conveniences. > > Charities > > > are > > > > > > > > collected, > > > > > > > > > land mafias uses these sentiments to grab huge lands, > > > people > > > > > on > > > > > > > day > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > day life are asked to do x/y/z for next life for the > > > benefits > > > > > > > > of "few" > > > > > > > > > and so on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People know all these practices as well, but > > > somehow "fear" > > > > > > > created > > > > > > > > > for "next life", makes them vulnerable for > > exploitation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > > pages" > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There will always be some 'mixing' between > different > > > belief > > > > > > > > systems, > > > > > > > > > > let us for instance take jyotish and rituals > > > (karmakanda as > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > pointed out, though the rituals can further extend > > into > > > > > grey > > > > > > > > magic > > > > > > > > > > and black magic etc). Individuals of different > > > background > > > > > > > > (religious, > > > > > > > > > > cultural, educational etc) will have different > > > tolerances > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > acceptances of belief systems and the 'degree of > > > > > acceptance' > > > > > > > > > > or "degree of tolerance" would vary. No one would > > > really be > > > > > > > > > > completely rational ever by someone else's > standards > > > (this > > > > > is > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > general statement, so no reader should take it > > > personally). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A rationalist would have a certain degree or > > perimeter > > > of > > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > which may be rather restricted but more readily > > > > > demonstrable > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > rather black and white. As we move into > > > more 'accepting' > > > > > ways > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > thinking of reality, the perimeter would grow and > > the > > > > > horizon > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > become less and less sharp and more accpeting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When belief systems interact and clash, individuals > > > begin > > > > > to > > > > > > > > fight, > > > > > > > > > > because we all must hold on to our core beliefs in > > what > > > we > > > > > > > > consider > > > > > > > > > > reality which is generally very personal though > > there > > > are > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > commonalities which lead to formation of groups. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beliefs are often at the very core of our sense of > > self > > > and > > > > > > > touch > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > stir emotions, more in some, less in others, but > > they > > > > > always > > > > > > > do. > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish falls in one of these perimeters where > > reason > > > and > > > > > > > beliefs > > > > > > > > > > meet. It has enough contact with rational and > > logical > > > > > > > > considerations > > > > > > > > > > and thus appeals to 'rationalists' or those who > like > > to > > > > > reason > > > > > > > > things > > > > > > > > > > out, and also has enough of a mystical/mysterious > > > flavour > > > > > to > > > > > > > > appeal > > > > > > > > > > to those whose acceptance of "reality" is more > > > forgiving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Both of these groups are observers, not necessarily > > > knowers > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > certainly not all knowing (hence humans!) and it is > > not > > > a > > > > > > > > question of > > > > > > > > > > right or wrong, necessarily. Only God perhaps knows > > > what is > > > > > > > true > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > what is not or right or wrong -- and I say that > > purely > > > > > based > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > > > personal belief ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is the belief system and has little to do > > > > > with "Jyotish". > > > > > > > > > > > Nevertheless, there is very thin line between > > correct > > > > > (very > > > > > > > > small > > > > > > > > > > > population) and wrong ones (very large > > population). > > > The > > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > is - > > > > > > > > > > > knowledge of correct rituals, for its > > > adherence..which is > > > > > > > > missing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People are exploited by "karamkandi" bhramans > > (even > > > on > > > > > > > events > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > deaths), which raises the big question > on "purity" > > of > > > > > > > pursuits? > > > > > > > > Even > > > > > > > > > > > the people who are "known" in different cities in > > > India as > > > > > > > > > > > authorities, are just making this their whole > > > > > > > time "business". > > > > > > > > > > Almost > > > > > > > > > > > each temple, priests, remedial astrologers (???) > > have > > > > > made a > > > > > > > > big > > > > > > > > > > mess > > > > > > > > > > > of faith. No state or city is exception !!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, you are right ..we must do and shall not > > bother > > > > > about > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > > ones. I wish I could claim (unlike most), that I > > know > > > the > > > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > Ones > > > > > > > > > > > !!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your observation is true to some people or some > > > temples > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > doing this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for example, grahan is such a shadowy period > > that > > > it is > > > > > > > > believed > > > > > > > > > > > > that even gods shall not have that grahan > shadow > > > fall > > > > > on > > > > > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > > hence all temples are closed during the grahan > > > period, > > > > > > > nay, > > > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > additional cloth cover is kept as an umbrella > > for > > > the > > > > > > > divine > > > > > > > > idol > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > protect from the grahan shadow. however, > > kalahasti > > > > > temple > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > andhra > > > > > > > > > > > > pradesh is keeping the temple not only open > > during > > > the > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > time > > > > > > > > > > > > but also doing special poojas AT MIDNIGHT > > (somewhat > > > > > > > strage) > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > collecting donations for these special poojas > > > during > > > > > the > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since all these are expected in kaliyuga, we > > shall > > > keep > > > > > > > doing > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > > is right without bothering too much about how > > > others > > > > > are > > > > > > > > doing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If one has interacted with yogis - they will > > > > > explicitly > > > > > > > > tell > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > > that, > > > > > > > > > > > > > any of the good charities can be done any > > given > > > day; > > > > > and > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > prayers. Not because that prayers / charities > > on > > > > > > > Eclipses > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > > lesser > > > > > > > > > > > > > relevance, but for the fact that, there are > > > > > very "few" > > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > > knows / practices the correct and "puristic" > > > methods > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > performing > > > > > > > > > > > > > them. and Such people spend most of their > time > > in > > > > > their > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > > pursuits > > > > > > > > > > > > > (they are too occupied in their "own karma"). > > > Most in > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in making money ("Dukandari") from > > > event > > > > > > > driven > > > > > > > > > > > > rituals, in > > > > > > > > > > > > > every corner of the country on each of these > > > > > occasions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > angel > > > > > > > <angelgoel@> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can you suggest any particular item for daan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (donation) in this period or next day ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note:- After eclipse,next day (friday > > morning), > > > do > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > > > eat anything without taking bath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > angel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot please. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No Sir. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th Night itself start and same night > > ends > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have mentioned eclipse would be only > 1 > > > hour 33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You may say as per English date since > it > > > ends > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12.00 midnight > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ie.next English calendar date starts, > so > > > will > > > > > end > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8th morning > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.08 am. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > Manoj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sharma > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jut to clear any confusion, the lunar > > > eclipse > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > between the intervening night of > > > September 6th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th? Right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > REFERENCE LAHIRIS INDIAN EPHEMERIS > > FOR > > > 2006 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a.d. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eclipse begins on Thursday > September > > > 7th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at night 23.35 and ends at same > > night > > > on > > > > > 25.08 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Total Duration One hour 33 minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This will be visible in India, of > > > course no > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is advised to view this.,except > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scientist-astronomers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri Pandit Arjunji has advised > > all > > > > > devout > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious people, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of various religions (as added by > > me) > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > requested > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to make full use > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of these period, by taking name of > > > their > > > > > Isht > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Devatas (Japa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and recitation), not to take water > > or > > > food > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sit on a seperate mat,not touch > > > anything, > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bath after this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period is over,then of course go to > > > sleep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any Japa done near the ocean (Sea), > > near > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rivers (Ganga, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yamuna,Saraswati etc.), in temple, > > in > > > places > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > great masters have meditated and > > gained > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enlightment, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also during period of Grahana > > > (Eclipse), has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thousands fold > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of results which normally would > > accrue > > > to a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if he does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at other times and other places.The > > > exact > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > figure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > counts , > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > how many thousand fold also has > been > > > given > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > shastras, I have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > personally read this, but now > cannot > > > > > remember > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and locate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefor Dear members take > advantage > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oppurtunity > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and increase > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your spititual Bank balance, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE > > ULTIMATE > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE > > > BLISS. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2006 Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 Isn't that sad? And yet so invigorating, so exhilerating!! If my post does not make sense to anyone, it can only be because they did not bother to read yours! RR , "rishi_2000in" <rishi_2000in wrote: > > I would disagree, Sir, Jyotish is vibrant, alive and kicking. > Presently, this forum as also other forums are going through a patch > of time wherein knowledge, its applicability are not the focus. > But then, Jyotisha transcends time and ages. > We find young eager minds willing to explore the depths of Jyotisha > waters. We find various ingenious explanations to cover up > inadequacies of knowledge. > We witness bold experimentation as in all ages. We also observe an > irrational fear! > Rishi > > > > , "crystal pages" > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Rishi ji! > > > > As long as it is not my 'toes', Sir ;-) > > > > Seriously, though, dear friends, we are (Thank you Tanveer et al!) > > 5000+ strong and have worked on and around each other's corns and > so > > on. > > > > We know each others' sensitive spots on this forum (After all, > only a > > few dozens really have the time or interest to interact and post > here > > and care to read other participants' posts!) so I really fail to > see > > why so much angst has been spilling lately despite some very wise > and > > accomplished participation, like those offered by Arjunji, > > Ashutoshji, Prafulla, Rishi, Tatvamasiji, Prashantji,etc (where is > > Vattam Krishnanji? Anyone know of dear Krishnan ji? I do miss him > > so!!). And I am sure many others, over the years that may just be > > lurking (internet jargon, not to be taken literally!). > > > > When 5000 show up and only 15 post, it tells me plain and simple > one > > thing! > > > > ***Jyotish is DYING, if not already dead!*** > > > > PROVE ME WRONG!! I DARE YOU ALL, VOCAL AND RETICENT ONES!! > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "rishi_2000in" > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > Prafullaji, > > > That is the 'spin and the span' of Ranjanji's Jyotisha writings, > > one > > > has to be on toes always! > > > rishi > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > You are very kind, but for me *this* has always been the > reality > > > that > > > > I want it to be. > > > > > > > > If it has not served **my** dreams, maybe I was the one who > was > > > > distracted! > > > > > > > > This may not necessarily be your yard-stick or personal > > > experience, > > > > Prafulla! > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > Honest confession - Sometimes, I feel it is worth being > selfish > > > (?) > > > > > and learn the useful & rare lessons from you. I feel myself > > > lucky > > > > for > > > > > your presence here and in fact, I Joined / resumed this, > only > > > for > > > > your > > > > > presence. > > > > > > > > > > You are absolutely right..It is jyotish forum, not the forum > to > > > > > discuss religious practices. I just happen to respond to > such > > non > > > > > jyotish threads. Unfortunately, this jyotish forum is fading > its > > > > > charm, for variety of practices. I wish, forum members can > > > realize > > > > > this that there are hardly jyotish discussions on this > forum. > > > This > > > > has > > > > > become market place. > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > We grew up to come to jyotish to learn not about karma as > > > being > > > > the > > > > > > tree that is way bigger than us, at this time, and > > > > insurmountable, > > > > > > but to also see the mangoes that the tree is laden with! > Some > > > > ripe, > > > > > > others not! The ripe ones we juice for immediate pleasure > and > > > > succour > > > > > > and the unripe ones we pickle with patience for future > > > > (lifetimes)! > > > > > > > > > > > > And all this time we humans simply bow gratefully to the > > Deity > > > of > > > > our > > > > > > choice, in this lifetime -- thankful that it is a mango > tree > > > we > > > > are > > > > > > up against and not an oak tree or cactus, for obvious > > reasons!! > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Knowing jyotish a bit, I can only add that - perhaps all > > > these > > > > > > plights > > > > > > > are karmic in nature!! Isn't it ? Unfortunately, it is > > > > compunding. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafullaji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you have observed in one of your mails that brahmins > have > > > > grabbed > > > > > > > > cows, lands etc. and exploited all. this can best be > > > > described > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > your personal observation as it is not a fact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in public groups, many members strive to put forth > their > > > > personal > > > > > > > > views as they observe in their experience and > > > understanding > > > > and > > > > > > > > expect general acceptance. in reality many such > > > observations > > > > are > > > > > > > > aberrations seen in isolation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > let me put some facts which none can deny: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > centuries ago brahmins never worked for a salary or > > > offered > > > > any > > > > > > > > service for a living. they used to fix muhurtams for > ALL > > > > people > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > their areas, do karmakanda for ALL people and impart > holy > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > and discourses to ALL besides maintaining the holiness > of > > > the > > > > > > > > sanctum sanctorum of the temples and other places of > > > > > > consecration. > > > > > > > > kings, panchayat presidents or local landlords used to > > > offer > > > > land > > > > > > > > freely to these brahmins and also food grains and a > cow. > > > in > > > > all > > > > > > > > karmakandas or for any auspicious happy occasions, > they > > > are > > > > > > gifted > > > > > > > > few items, clothes, money etc. and all such brahmins > used > > > to > > > > live > > > > > > > > 100% on donations given by the people VOLUNTARILY. > these > > > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > also used to write books, teach the children of ALL > > people > > > > and > > > > > > > > entertain with their lyrical, music and dance skills > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > however, with the pogrom and forced conversion to > islam > > by > > > > the > > > > > > > > invading moghuls, brahmins have taken up jobs like > > > teaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > later on in the last few decades with the rise of > > > communism > > > > and > > > > > > > > patronage by the left parties (it is a different > matter > > > that > > > > the > > > > > > > > best communist country russia is now full of churches > and > > > > > > leningrad > > > > > > > > becomes st. petersberg and many schools turn back to > > > churches > > > > but > > > > > > > > the indian counterparts still engage in anti religious > > > > propaganda) > > > > > > > > brahmins have been removed even from the posts of > > poojaris > > > as > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > state governemnts have started recruiting low caste > non > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > unaware of any religious rituals for these holy jobs. > > > most > > > > civil > > > > > > > > servants decades ago used to be brahmins and now due > to > > > > > > reservation, > > > > > > > > around 90% of government employees are non brahmins. > > > still a > > > > > > large > > > > > > > > hue and cry is made every day for the success of these > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > seeing the poor plight of these brahmins in minority, > > > > sometime > > > > > > ago > > > > > > > > mulayamsingh offered to consider a 5% reservation for > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > within my family clan, we have great freedom fighters, > > > > headmaster > > > > > > > > and principals, poets, astrologers, doctors of most > > repute > > > in > > > > US > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > 100% younger generation are in most successful in IT, > > > > engineering > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > medicine profession and it is no exaggeration if i say > > > that > > > > 99% > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > these younger intelligent generation are in US. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in many cities you would find poor brahmins who have > not > > > > switched > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > other intelligent professions are still languishing in > > > > poverty. > > > > > > > > every morning i find dozens of karmakandi brahmins > > > standing > > > > or > > > > > > > > sitting on the footpath of the road in front of the > > > railway > > > > > > station > > > > > > > > waiting for some customers to pick them for their > daily > > > > wages. > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > is only because they have not adapted to the > professions > > > > which > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > in belief as on date and are sticking to a century old > > > holy > > > > noble > > > > > > > > profession which is not only ridiculed by the so > called > > > > educated > > > > > > > > scientists but also painted bad by the communists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > having seen all this, i took it as a challenge for > myself > > > to > > > > > > leave > > > > > > > > my lucrative best mnc jobs and serve all the suffering > > > people > > > > > > > > through our religious holy ways and most of my > customers > > > are > > > > non > > > > > > > > brahmins and many are from other religions as i treat > all > > > > human > > > > > > > > beings equally as god. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prafullaji, your observation may be restricted to few > > > > individuals > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > best, but to say that KARMAKANDI BRAHMINS exploited > all > > is > > > > far > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > truth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in delhi i have seen many bihari non-brahmin migrant > > > > illiterate > > > > > > > > workers posing as poojaris and cheating the > customers. > > in > > > > some > > > > > > > > temples, the watchmen and sweepers of yesteryears are > now > > > > > > poojaris > > > > > > > > in the same temples which were built only for > > landgrabbing > > > > and to > > > > > > > > construct shops on all three sides and sell them for > huge > > > > > > monies. > > > > > > > > most or all of thee landgrabbing mafias and illegal > > > > construction > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > done by non-brahmins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > pages" > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally ...? > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am born with just so few neurons, so few > abilities, > > so > > > > few > > > > > > > > options, > > > > > > > > > such a little time and scope to live this lifetime! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do we have the time and ability and luxury of living > > the > > > > > > reality > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > others who would impose on us their (?) reality and > > > waste > > > > the > > > > > > > > little > > > > > > > > > time we have in this lifetime? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they even worth the consideration, after what we > > > have > > > > seen > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > far? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Very well said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I, perhaps could not express the distinction > (between > > > > relgion > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > practioners). It is not the rituals (or belief > > > systems) > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > commenting about. They are "pure and acceptable" > for > > > each > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > system / religion. I am not talking about > > > > rationalization of > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > these systems; and agree that they can not be > black > > or > > > > white > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > These are based on faith, so rationalization (for > > > common > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > me) may be little too far stretching of it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The gray area is its practioners (for each belief > > > > system) - > > > > > > who, > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > commercial/ vested interests, misuses people's > > > > very "faith". > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > turn, creates lots of difficulties in the life of > > > masses. > > > > For > > > > > > > > > Example > > > > > > > > > > - Various ritualistic charities to brahmins (cows > > etc) > > > in > > > > > > India > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > been the biggest cause of sufferings in rural > India - > > > > where > > > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > > > borrow money to meet such ritualistic needs > > (including > > > on > > > > > > deaths > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the family). These have led to massive > exploitation > > as > > > > well by > > > > > > > > > > "karamkandi" brahmans, in the name of religion. > > > Religion > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > becomes > > > > > > > > > > source or cause of exploitation, but its > practioners > > > do > > > > cause > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > the wrong doings. Had these practices not surfaced > in > > > > India - > > > > > > > > > perhaps, > > > > > > > > > > there was no need to religious diversions (like > > > Jainism, > > > > > > Budhism, > > > > > > > > > > Sikhisms, Arya Samaj etc). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Purans / vedas / religious scriptures are not > > > corrupted, > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > practioners are. Since "faith" itself is > exploited, > > > its > > > > > > > > compliance > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > becomes "gainful" for few. But those quality > brahmans > > > > also do > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > exist in numbers and those people who can > understand > > > the > > > > > > rituals > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > true sense also have their own limitations in > current > > > > yuga. > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > often > > > > > > > > > > leads to misunderstood compliances of the rituals, > in > > > > most > > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > > > (which is more harmful). Just attend any yagya, > and > > > > observe > > > > > > > > > the "short > > > > > > > > > > cuts" followed - in the name of conveniences. > > > Charities > > > > are > > > > > > > > > collected, > > > > > > > > > > land mafias uses these sentiments to grab huge > lands, > > > > people > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > day > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > day life are asked to do x/y/z for next life for > the > > > > benefits > > > > > > > > > of "few" > > > > > > > > > > and so on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People know all these practices as well, but > > > > somehow "fear" > > > > > > > > created > > > > > > > > > > for "next life", makes them vulnerable for > > > exploitation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > > > pages" > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There will always be some 'mixing' between > > different > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > systems, > > > > > > > > > > > let us for instance take jyotish and rituals > > > > (karmakanda as > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > pointed out, though the rituals can further > extend > > > into > > > > > > grey > > > > > > > > > magic > > > > > > > > > > > and black magic etc). Individuals of different > > > > background > > > > > > > > > (religious, > > > > > > > > > > > cultural, educational etc) will have different > > > > tolerances > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > acceptances of belief systems and the 'degree of > > > > > > acceptance' > > > > > > > > > > > or "degree of tolerance" would vary. No one > would > > > > really be > > > > > > > > > > > completely rational ever by someone else's > > standards > > > > (this > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > general statement, so no reader should take it > > > > personally). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A rationalist would have a certain degree or > > > perimeter > > > > of > > > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > > which may be rather restricted but more readily > > > > > > demonstrable > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > rather black and white. As we move into > > > > more 'accepting' > > > > > > ways > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > thinking of reality, the perimeter would grow > and > > > the > > > > > > horizon > > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > > become less and less sharp and more accpeting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When belief systems interact and clash, > individuals > > > > begin > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > fight, > > > > > > > > > > > because we all must hold on to our core beliefs > in > > > what > > > > we > > > > > > > > > consider > > > > > > > > > > > reality which is generally very personal though > > > there > > > > are > > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > > commonalities which lead to formation of groups. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beliefs are often at the very core of our sense > of > > > self > > > > and > > > > > > > > touch > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > stir emotions, more in some, less in others, but > > > they > > > > > > always > > > > > > > > do. > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish falls in one of these perimeters where > > > reason > > > > and > > > > > > > > beliefs > > > > > > > > > > > meet. It has enough contact with rational and > > > logical > > > > > > > > > considerations > > > > > > > > > > > and thus appeals to 'rationalists' or those who > > like > > > to > > > > > > reason > > > > > > > > > things > > > > > > > > > > > out, and also has enough of a > mystical/mysterious > > > > flavour > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > appeal > > > > > > > > > > > to those whose acceptance of "reality" is more > > > > forgiving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Both of these groups are observers, not > necessarily > > > > knowers > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > certainly not all knowing (hence humans!) and it > is > > > not > > > > a > > > > > > > > > question of > > > > > > > > > > > right or wrong, necessarily. Only God perhaps > knows > > > > what is > > > > > > > > true > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > what is not or right or wrong -- and I say that > > > purely > > > > > > based > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > > > > personal belief ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is the belief system and has little to do > > > > > > with "Jyotish". > > > > > > > > > > > > Nevertheless, there is very thin line between > > > correct > > > > > > (very > > > > > > > > > small > > > > > > > > > > > > population) and wrong ones (very large > > > population). > > > > The > > > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > > is - > > > > > > > > > > > > knowledge of correct rituals, for its > > > > adherence..which is > > > > > > > > > missing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People are exploited by "karamkandi" bhramans > > > (even > > > > on > > > > > > > > events > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > > deaths), which raises the big question > > on "purity" > > > of > > > > > > > > pursuits? > > > > > > > > > Even > > > > > > > > > > > > the people who are "known" in different cities > in > > > > India as > > > > > > > > > > > > authorities, are just making this their whole > > > > > > > > time "business". > > > > > > > > > > > Almost > > > > > > > > > > > > each temple, priests, remedial astrologers > (???) > > > have > > > > > > made a > > > > > > > > > big > > > > > > > > > > > mess > > > > > > > > > > > > of faith. No state or city is exception !!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, you are right ..we must do and shall not > > > bother > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > > > ones. I wish I could claim (unlike most), that > I > > > know > > > > the > > > > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > > Ones > > > > > > > > > > > > !!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your observation is true to some people or > some > > > > temples > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > doing this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for example, grahan is such a shadowy period > > > that > > > > it is > > > > > > > > > believed > > > > > > > > > > > > > that even gods shall not have that grahan > > shadow > > > > fall > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence all temples are closed during the > grahan > > > > period, > > > > > > > > nay, > > > > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > additional cloth cover is kept as an > umbrella > > > for > > > > the > > > > > > > > divine > > > > > > > > > idol > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > protect from the grahan shadow. however, > > > kalahasti > > > > > > temple > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > andhra > > > > > > > > > > > > > pradesh is keeping the temple not only open > > > during > > > > the > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > time > > > > > > > > > > > > > but also doing special poojas AT MIDNIGHT > > > (somewhat > > > > > > > > strage) > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > collecting donations for these special > poojas > > > > during > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since all these are expected in kaliyuga, we > > > shall > > > > keep > > > > > > > > doing > > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > > > is right without bothering too much about > how > > > > others > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > doing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If one has interacted with yogis - they > will > > > > > > explicitly > > > > > > > > > tell > > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > > > that, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > any of the good charities can be done any > > > given > > > > day; > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prayers. Not because that prayers / > charities > > > on > > > > > > > > Eclipses > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > > > lesser > > > > > > > > > > > > > > relevance, but for the fact that, there > are > > > > > > very "few" > > > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > > > knows / practices the correct > and "puristic" > > > > methods > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > performing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > them. and Such people spend most of their > > time > > > in > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > > > pursuits > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (they are too occupied in their "own > karma"). > > > > Most in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in making money ("Dukandari") > from > > > > event > > > > > > > > driven > > > > > > > > > > > > > rituals, in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > every corner of the country on each of > these > > > > > > occasions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > angel > > > > > > > > <angelgoel@> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can you suggest any particular item for > daan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (donation) in this period or next day ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note:- After eclipse,next day (friday > > > morning), > > > > do > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > eat anything without taking bath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > angel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000@> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot please. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No Sir. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th Night itself start and same > night > > > ends > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have mentioned eclipse would be > only > > 1 > > > > hour 33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You may say as per English date > since > > it > > > > ends > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12.00 midnight > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ie.next English calendar date > starts, > > so > > > > will > > > > > > end > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8th morning > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.08 am. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > Manoj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sharma > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jut to clear any confusion, the > lunar > > > > eclipse > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > between the intervening night of > > > > September 6th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th? Right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > REFERENCE LAHIRIS INDIAN > EPHEMERIS > > > FOR > > > > 2006 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a.d. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eclipse begins on Thursday > > September > > > > 7th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at night 23.35 and ends at same > > > night > > > > on > > > > > > 25.08 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Total Duration One hour 33 > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This will be visible in India, > of > > > > course no > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is advised to view this.,except > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scientist-astronomers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri Pandit Arjunji has > advised > > > all > > > > > > devout > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious people, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of various religions (as added > by > > > me) > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > requested > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to make full use > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of these period, by taking name > of > > > > their > > > > > > Isht > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Devatas (Japa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and recitation), not to take > water > > > or > > > > food > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sit on a seperate mat,not touch > > > > anything, > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bath after this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period is over,then of course go > to > > > > sleep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any Japa done near the ocean > (Sea), > > > near > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rivers (Ganga, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yamuna,Saraswati etc.), in > temple, > > > in > > > > places > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > great masters have meditated and > > > gained > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enlightment, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also during period of Grahana > > > > (Eclipse), has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thousands fold > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of results which normally would > > > accrue > > > > to a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if he does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at other times and other > places.The > > > > exact > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > figure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > counts , > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > how many thousand fold also has > > been > > > > given > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > shastras, I have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > personally read this, but now > > cannot > > > > > > remember > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and locate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefor Dear members take > > advantage > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oppurtunity > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and increase > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your spititual Bank balance, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE > > > ULTIMATE > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF > ABSOLUTE > > > > BLISS. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2006 Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 Isn't that life, Sir. Sad yet invigorating and exhilarating. Jyotisha will only be a reflection of the social state. Therefore, it remains unorganised, fluid, selfcentred, ripe for exploitation and yet between the lines there is sanity, hope and people willing to take the Long March.... But we must allow for human infirmities, everyone knows that there are neither free lunches or dinners nor shortcuts....yet....the consumers of Jyotisha seek them and jyotishis prescribe them. , "crystal pages" <jyotish_vani wrote: > > Isn't that sad? > And yet so invigorating, so exhilerating!! > > If my post does not make sense to anyone, it can only be because they > did not bother to read yours! > > RR > > > , "rishi_2000in" > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > I would disagree, Sir, Jyotish is vibrant, alive and kicking. > > Presently, this forum as also other forums are going through a > patch > > of time wherein knowledge, its applicability are not the focus. > > But then, Jyotisha transcends time and ages. > > We find young eager minds willing to explore the depths of Jyotisha > > waters. We find various ingenious explanations to cover up > > inadequacies of knowledge. > > We witness bold experimentation as in all ages. We also observe an > > irrational fear! > > Rishi > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > Rishi ji! > > > > > > As long as it is not my 'toes', Sir ;-) > > > > > > Seriously, though, dear friends, we are (Thank you Tanveer et > al!) > > > 5000+ strong and have worked on and around each other's corns and > > so > > > on. > > > > > > We know each others' sensitive spots on this forum (After all, > > only a > > > few dozens really have the time or interest to interact and post > > here > > > and care to read other participants' posts!) so I really fail to > > see > > > why so much angst has been spilling lately despite some very wise > > and > > > accomplished participation, like those offered by Arjunji, > > > Ashutoshji, Prafulla, Rishi, Tatvamasiji, Prashantji,etc (where > is > > > Vattam Krishnanji? Anyone know of dear Krishnan ji? I do miss him > > > so!!). And I am sure many others, over the years that may just be > > > lurking (internet jargon, not to be taken literally!). > > > > > > When 5000 show up and only 15 post, it tells me plain and simple > > one > > > thing! > > > > > > ***Jyotish is DYING, if not already dead!*** > > > > > > PROVE ME WRONG!! I DARE YOU ALL, VOCAL AND RETICENT ONES!! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "rishi_2000in" > > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Prafullaji, > > > > That is the 'spin and the span' of Ranjanji's Jyotisha > writings, > > > one > > > > has to be on toes always! > > > > rishi > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > You are very kind, but for me *this* has always been the > > reality > > > > that > > > > > I want it to be. > > > > > > > > > > If it has not served **my** dreams, maybe I was the one who > > was > > > > > distracted! > > > > > > > > > > This may not necessarily be your yard-stick or personal > > > > experience, > > > > > Prafulla! > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Honest confession - Sometimes, I feel it is worth being > > selfish > > > > (?) > > > > > > and learn the useful & rare lessons from you. I feel myself > > > > lucky > > > > > for > > > > > > your presence here and in fact, I Joined / resumed this, > > only > > > > for > > > > > your > > > > > > presence. > > > > > > > > > > > > You are absolutely right..It is jyotish forum, not the > forum > > to > > > > > > discuss religious practices. I just happen to respond to > > such > > > non > > > > > > jyotish threads. Unfortunately, this jyotish forum is > fading > > its > > > > > > charm, for variety of practices. I wish, forum members can > > > > realize > > > > > > this that there are hardly jyotish discussions on this > > forum. > > > > This > > > > > has > > > > > > become market place. > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We grew up to come to jyotish to learn not about karma as > > > > being > > > > > the > > > > > > > tree that is way bigger than us, at this time, and > > > > > insurmountable, > > > > > > > but to also see the mangoes that the tree is laden with! > > Some > > > > > ripe, > > > > > > > others not! The ripe ones we juice for immediate pleasure > > and > > > > > succour > > > > > > > and the unripe ones we pickle with patience for future > > > > > (lifetimes)! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And all this time we humans simply bow gratefully to the > > > Deity > > > > of > > > > > our > > > > > > > choice, in this lifetime -- thankful that it is a mango > > tree > > > > we > > > > > are > > > > > > > up against and not an oak tree or cactus, for obvious > > > reasons!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Knowing jyotish a bit, I can only add that - perhaps > all > > > > these > > > > > > > plights > > > > > > > > are karmic in nature!! Isn't it ? Unfortunately, it is > > > > > compunding. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafullaji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you have observed in one of your mails that brahmins > > have > > > > > grabbed > > > > > > > > > cows, lands etc. and exploited all. this can best be > > > > > described > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > your personal observation as it is not a fact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in public groups, many members strive to put forth > > their > > > > > personal > > > > > > > > > views as they observe in their experience and > > > > understanding > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > expect general acceptance. in reality many such > > > > observations > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > aberrations seen in isolation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > let me put some facts which none can deny: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > centuries ago brahmins never worked for a salary or > > > > offered > > > > > any > > > > > > > > > service for a living. they used to fix muhurtams for > > ALL > > > > > people > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > their areas, do karmakanda for ALL people and impart > > holy > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and discourses to ALL besides maintaining the > holiness > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > > > sanctum sanctorum of the temples and other places of > > > > > > > consecration. > > > > > > > > > kings, panchayat presidents or local landlords used > to > > > > offer > > > > > land > > > > > > > > > freely to these brahmins and also food grains and a > > cow. > > > > in > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > karmakandas or for any auspicious happy occasions, > > they > > > > are > > > > > > > gifted > > > > > > > > > few items, clothes, money etc. and all such brahmins > > used > > > > to > > > > > live > > > > > > > > > 100% on donations given by the people VOLUNTARILY. > > these > > > > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > > also used to write books, teach the children of ALL > > > people > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > entertain with their lyrical, music and dance skills > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > however, with the pogrom and forced conversion to > > islam > > > by > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > invading moghuls, brahmins have taken up jobs like > > > > teaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > later on in the last few decades with the rise of > > > > communism > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > patronage by the left parties (it is a different > > matter > > > > that > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > best communist country russia is now full of churches > > and > > > > > > > leningrad > > > > > > > > > becomes st. petersberg and many schools turn back to > > > > churches > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > the indian counterparts still engage in anti > religious > > > > > propaganda) > > > > > > > > > brahmins have been removed even from the posts of > > > poojaris > > > > as > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > state governemnts have started recruiting low caste > > non > > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > > unaware of any religious rituals for these holy > jobs. > > > > most > > > > > civil > > > > > > > > > servants decades ago used to be brahmins and now due > > to > > > > > > > reservation, > > > > > > > > > around 90% of government employees are non brahmins. > > > > still a > > > > > > > large > > > > > > > > > hue and cry is made every day for the success of > these > > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > > seeing the poor plight of these brahmins in minority, > > > > > sometime > > > > > > > ago > > > > > > > > > mulayamsingh offered to consider a 5% reservation for > > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > > within my family clan, we have great freedom > fighters, > > > > > headmaster > > > > > > > > > and principals, poets, astrologers, doctors of most > > > repute > > > > in > > > > > US > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > 100% younger generation are in most successful in IT, > > > > > engineering > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > medicine profession and it is no exaggeration if i > say > > > > that > > > > > 99% > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > these younger intelligent generation are in US. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in many cities you would find poor brahmins who have > > not > > > > > switched > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > other intelligent professions are still languishing > in > > > > > poverty. > > > > > > > > > every morning i find dozens of karmakandi brahmins > > > > standing > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > sitting on the footpath of the road in front of the > > > > railway > > > > > > > station > > > > > > > > > waiting for some customers to pick them for their > > daily > > > > > wages. > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > is only because they have not adapted to the > > professions > > > > > which > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > in belief as on date and are sticking to a century > old > > > > holy > > > > > noble > > > > > > > > > profession which is not only ridiculed by the so > > called > > > > > educated > > > > > > > > > scientists but also painted bad by the communists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > having seen all this, i took it as a challenge for > > myself > > > > to > > > > > > > leave > > > > > > > > > my lucrative best mnc jobs and serve all the > suffering > > > > people > > > > > > > > > through our religious holy ways and most of my > > customers > > > > are > > > > > non > > > > > > > > > brahmins and many are from other religions as i treat > > all > > > > > human > > > > > > > > > beings equally as god. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prafullaji, your observation may be restricted to few > > > > > individuals > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > best, but to say that KARMAKANDI BRAHMINS exploited > > all > > > is > > > > > far > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > truth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in delhi i have seen many bihari non-brahmin migrant > > > > > illiterate > > > > > > > > > workers posing as poojaris and cheating the > > customers. > > > in > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > temples, the watchmen and sweepers of yesteryears are > > now > > > > > > > poojaris > > > > > > > > > in the same temples which were built only for > > > landgrabbing > > > > > and to > > > > > > > > > construct shops on all three sides and sell them for > > huge > > > > > > > monies. > > > > > > > > > most or all of thee landgrabbing mafias and illegal > > > > > construction > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > done by non-brahmins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > > pages" > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally ...? > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am born with just so few neurons, so few > > abilities, > > > so > > > > > few > > > > > > > > > options, > > > > > > > > > > such a little time and scope to live this lifetime! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do we have the time and ability and luxury of > living > > > the > > > > > > > reality > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > others who would impose on us their (?) reality and > > > > waste > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > little > > > > > > > > > > time we have in this lifetime? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they even worth the consideration, after what > we > > > > have > > > > > seen > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > far? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Very well said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I, perhaps could not express the distinction > > (between > > > > > relgion > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > practioners). It is not the rituals (or belief > > > > systems) > > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > > commenting about. They are "pure and acceptable" > > for > > > > each > > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > > system / religion. I am not talking about > > > > > rationalization of > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > these systems; and agree that they can not be > > black > > > or > > > > > white > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > These are based on faith, so rationalization (for > > > > common > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > me) may be little too far stretching of it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The gray area is its practioners (for each belief > > > > > system) - > > > > > > > who, > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > commercial/ vested interests, misuses people's > > > > > very "faith". > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > turn, creates lots of difficulties in the life of > > > > masses. > > > > > For > > > > > > > > > > Example > > > > > > > > > > > - Various ritualistic charities to brahmins (cows > > > etc) > > > > in > > > > > > > India > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > been the biggest cause of sufferings in rural > > India - > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > > > > borrow money to meet such ritualistic needs > > > (including > > > > on > > > > > > > deaths > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > the family). These have led to massive > > exploitation > > > as > > > > > well by > > > > > > > > > > > "karamkandi" brahmans, in the name of religion. > > > > Religion > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > becomes > > > > > > > > > > > source or cause of exploitation, but its > > practioners > > > > do > > > > > cause > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > the wrong doings. Had these practices not > surfaced > > in > > > > > India - > > > > > > > > > > perhaps, > > > > > > > > > > > there was no need to religious diversions (like > > > > Jainism, > > > > > > > Budhism, > > > > > > > > > > > Sikhisms, Arya Samaj etc). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Purans / vedas / religious scriptures are not > > > > corrupted, > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > practioners are. Since "faith" itself is > > exploited, > > > > its > > > > > > > > > compliance > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > > becomes "gainful" for few. But those quality > > brahmans > > > > > also do > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > exist in numbers and those people who can > > understand > > > > the > > > > > > > rituals > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > true sense also have their own limitations in > > current > > > > > yuga. > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > > often > > > > > > > > > > > leads to misunderstood compliances of the > rituals, > > in > > > > > most > > > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > > > > (which is more harmful). Just attend any yagya, > > and > > > > > observe > > > > > > > > > > the "short > > > > > > > > > > > cuts" followed - in the name of conveniences. > > > > Charities > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > collected, > > > > > > > > > > > land mafias uses these sentiments to grab huge > > lands, > > > > > people > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > day > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > day life are asked to do x/y/z for next life for > > the > > > > > benefits > > > > > > > > > > of "few" > > > > > > > > > > > and so on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People know all these practices as well, but > > > > > somehow "fear" > > > > > > > > > created > > > > > > > > > > > for "next life", makes them vulnerable for > > > > exploitation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > > > > pages" > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There will always be some 'mixing' between > > > different > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > systems, > > > > > > > > > > > > let us for instance take jyotish and rituals > > > > > (karmakanda as > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > > pointed out, though the rituals can further > > extend > > > > into > > > > > > > grey > > > > > > > > > > magic > > > > > > > > > > > > and black magic etc). Individuals of different > > > > > background > > > > > > > > > > (religious, > > > > > > > > > > > > cultural, educational etc) will have different > > > > > tolerances > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > > acceptances of belief systems and the 'degree > of > > > > > > > acceptance' > > > > > > > > > > > > or "degree of tolerance" would vary. No one > > would > > > > > really be > > > > > > > > > > > > completely rational ever by someone else's > > > standards > > > > > (this > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > general statement, so no reader should take it > > > > > personally). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A rationalist would have a certain degree or > > > > perimeter > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > > > which may be rather restricted but more readily > > > > > > > demonstrable > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > rather black and white. As we move into > > > > > more 'accepting' > > > > > > > ways > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > thinking of reality, the perimeter would grow > > and > > > > the > > > > > > > horizon > > > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > > > become less and less sharp and more accpeting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When belief systems interact and clash, > > individuals > > > > > begin > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > fight, > > > > > > > > > > > > because we all must hold on to our core beliefs > > in > > > > what > > > > > we > > > > > > > > > > consider > > > > > > > > > > > > reality which is generally very personal though > > > > there > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > > > commonalities which lead to formation of groups. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beliefs are often at the very core of our sense > > of > > > > self > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > touch > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > stir emotions, more in some, less in others, > but > > > > they > > > > > > > always > > > > > > > > > do. > > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish falls in one of these perimeters where > > > > reason > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > beliefs > > > > > > > > > > > > meet. It has enough contact with rational and > > > > logical > > > > > > > > > > considerations > > > > > > > > > > > > and thus appeals to 'rationalists' or those who > > > like > > > > to > > > > > > > reason > > > > > > > > > > things > > > > > > > > > > > > out, and also has enough of a > > mystical/mysterious > > > > > flavour > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > appeal > > > > > > > > > > > > to those whose acceptance of "reality" is more > > > > > forgiving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Both of these groups are observers, not > > necessarily > > > > > knowers > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly not all knowing (hence humans!) and > it > > is > > > > not > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > question of > > > > > > > > > > > > right or wrong, necessarily. Only God perhaps > > knows > > > > > what is > > > > > > > > > true > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > what is not or right or wrong -- and I say that > > > > purely > > > > > > > based > > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > > > > > personal belief ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is the belief system and has little to do > > > > > > > with "Jyotish". > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nevertheless, there is very thin line between > > > > correct > > > > > > > (very > > > > > > > > > > small > > > > > > > > > > > > > population) and wrong ones (very large > > > > population). > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > > > is - > > > > > > > > > > > > > knowledge of correct rituals, for its > > > > > adherence..which is > > > > > > > > > > missing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People are exploited by "karamkandi" bhramans > > > > (even > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > events > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > > > deaths), which raises the big question > > > on "purity" > > > > of > > > > > > > > > pursuits? > > > > > > > > > > Even > > > > > > > > > > > > > the people who are "known" in different > cities > > in > > > > > India as > > > > > > > > > > > > > authorities, are just making this their whole > > > > > > > > > time "business". > > > > > > > > > > > > Almost > > > > > > > > > > > > > each temple, priests, remedial astrologers > > (???) > > > > have > > > > > > > made a > > > > > > > > > > big > > > > > > > > > > > > mess > > > > > > > > > > > > > of faith. No state or city is exception !!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, you are right ..we must do and shall not > > > > bother > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > > > > ones. I wish I could claim (unlike most), > that > > I > > > > know > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > > > Ones > > > > > > > > > > > > > !!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your observation is true to some people or > > some > > > > > temples > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > doing this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for example, grahan is such a shadowy > period > > > > that > > > > > it is > > > > > > > > > > believed > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that even gods shall not have that grahan > > > shadow > > > > > fall > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence all temples are closed during the > > grahan > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > nay, > > > > > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > > additional cloth cover is kept as an > > umbrella > > > > for > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > divine > > > > > > > > > > idol > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > protect from the grahan shadow. however, > > > > kalahasti > > > > > > > temple > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > andhra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pradesh is keeping the temple not only open > > > > during > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > > time > > > > > > > > > > > > > > but also doing special poojas AT MIDNIGHT > > > > (somewhat > > > > > > > > > strage) > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > collecting donations for these special > > poojas > > > > > during > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since all these are expected in kaliyuga, > we > > > > shall > > > > > keep > > > > > > > > > doing > > > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is right without bothering too much about > > how > > > > > others > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > doing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If one has interacted with yogis - they > > will > > > > > > > explicitly > > > > > > > > > > tell > > > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > any of the good charities can be done any > > > > given > > > > > day; > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prayers. Not because that prayers / > > charities > > > > on > > > > > > > > > Eclipses > > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lesser > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > relevance, but for the fact that, there > > are > > > > > > > very "few" > > > > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > knows / practices the correct > > and "puristic" > > > > > methods > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > performing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > them. and Such people spend most of their > > > time > > > > in > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pursuits > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (they are too occupied in their "own > > karma"). > > > > > Most in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in making money ("Dukandari") > > from > > > > > event > > > > > > > > > driven > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rituals, in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > every corner of the country on each of > > these > > > > > > > occasions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > angel > > > > > > > > > <angelgoel@> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can you suggest any particular item for > > daan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (donation) in this period or next day ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note:- After eclipse,next day (friday > > > > morning), > > > > > do > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > eat anything without taking bath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > angel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot please. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No Sir. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th Night itself start and same > > night > > > > ends > > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have mentioned eclipse would be > > only > > > 1 > > > > > hour 33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You may say as per English date > > since > > > it > > > > > ends > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12.00 midnight > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ie.next English calendar date > > starts, > > > so > > > > > will > > > > > > > end > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8th morning > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.08 am. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > Manoj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sharma > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jut to clear any confusion, the > > lunar > > > > > eclipse > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > between the intervening night of > > > > > September 6th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th? Right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > REFERENCE LAHIRIS INDIAN > > EPHEMERIS > > > > FOR > > > > > 2006 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a.d. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eclipse begins on Thursday > > > September > > > > > 7th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at night 23.35 and ends at same > > > > night > > > > > on > > > > > > > 25.08 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Total Duration One hour 33 > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This will be visible in India, > > of > > > > > course no > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is advised to view this.,except > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scientist-astronomers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri Pandit Arjunji has > > advised > > > > all > > > > > > > devout > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious people, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of various religions (as added > > by > > > > me) > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > requested > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to make full use > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of these period, by taking name > > of > > > > > their > > > > > > > Isht > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Devatas (Japa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and recitation), not to take > > water > > > > or > > > > > food > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sit on a seperate mat,not touch > > > > > anything, > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bath after this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period is over,then of course > go > > to > > > > > sleep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any Japa done near the ocean > > (Sea), > > > > near > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rivers (Ganga, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yamuna,Saraswati etc.), in > > temple, > > > > in > > > > > places > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > great masters have meditated > and > > > > gained > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enlightment, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also during period of Grahana > > > > > (Eclipse), has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thousands fold > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of results which normally would > > > > accrue > > > > > to a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if he does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at other times and other > > places.The > > > > > exact > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > figure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > counts , > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > how many thousand fold also has > > > been > > > > > given > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > shastras, I have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > personally read this, but now > > > cannot > > > > > > > remember > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and locate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefor Dear members take > > > advantage > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oppurtunity > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and increase > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your spititual Bank balance, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE > > > > ULTIMATE > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF > > ABSOLUTE > > > > > BLISS. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2006 Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 There are nearly 7 billions that inhabit this world of ours -- there are only a few hundreds or thousands that believe in astrology (check the duplicate membership!) and even if you take those into account that do not have internet, we are conservatively looking at less than 10% (that would be 700 millions! Way beyond your dreams, dear forum members!) that would be astrology club members! Right? So what is the real number like? 70 Millions (1%), 7 millions (0.1%)? Is that an overestimate, even if we pool all astrologies? Jyotish, Western, Burmese, Chinese, Chaldean, Arabic, ??? WE ARE A FLEDGLING MINORITY, DEAR JYOTISH BROTHERS AND SISTERS! And I AM talking to the fifty or SIXTY some who regularly post and read and respond HERE on this 5000+ forum and not the statistics I stopped at in the last paragraph (millions)! WAKE UP! RR , "Prafulla Gang" <jyotish wrote: > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > I wish that, I could have stated earlier on the state of this forum > (and glad that it has come from you - not from me; Yes, I second it). > > But no one is touching anyone's spots. People may perceive this for > their own vested interests, but at large - it is in interest of > jyotish - that people can come above their vested interests and > participate on jyotish. > > Why do not we all decide that - what should be discussed and how? and > we all can agree to. But can we? > > regards / Prafulla > > > , "crystal pages" > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Rishi ji! > > > > As long as it is not my 'toes', Sir ;-) > > > > Seriously, though, dear friends, we are (Thank you Tanveer et al!) > > 5000+ strong and have worked on and around each other's corns and so > > on. > > > > We know each others' sensitive spots on this forum (After all, only a > > few dozens really have the time or interest to interact and post here > > and care to read other participants' posts!) so I really fail to see > > why so much angst has been spilling lately despite some very wise and > > accomplished participation, like those offered by Arjunji, > > Ashutoshji, Prafulla, Rishi, Tatvamasiji, Prashantji,etc (where is > > Vattam Krishnanji? Anyone know of dear Krishnan ji? I do miss him > > so!!). And I am sure many others, over the years that may just be > > lurking (internet jargon, not to be taken literally!). > > > > When 5000 show up and only 15 post, it tells me plain and simple one > > thing! > > > > ***Jyotish is DYING, if not already dead!*** > > > > PROVE ME WRONG!! I DARE YOU ALL, VOCAL AND RETICENT ONES!! > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "rishi_2000in" > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > Prafullaji, > > > That is the 'spin and the span' of Ranjanji's Jyotisha writings, > > one > > > has to be on toes always! > > > rishi > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > You are very kind, but for me *this* has always been the reality > > > that > > > > I want it to be. > > > > > > > > If it has not served **my** dreams, maybe I was the one who was > > > > distracted! > > > > > > > > This may not necessarily be your yard-stick or personal > > > experience, > > > > Prafulla! > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > Honest confession - Sometimes, I feel it is worth being selfish > > > (?) > > > > > and learn the useful & rare lessons from you. I feel myself > > > lucky > > > > for > > > > > your presence here and in fact, I Joined / resumed this, only > > > for > > > > your > > > > > presence. > > > > > > > > > > You are absolutely right..It is jyotish forum, not the forum to > > > > > discuss religious practices. I just happen to respond to such > > non > > > > > jyotish threads. Unfortunately, this jyotish forum is fading its > > > > > charm, for variety of practices. I wish, forum members can > > > realize > > > > > this that there are hardly jyotish discussions on this forum. > > > This > > > > has > > > > > become market place. > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > We grew up to come to jyotish to learn not about karma as > > > being > > > > the > > > > > > tree that is way bigger than us, at this time, and > > > > insurmountable, > > > > > > but to also see the mangoes that the tree is laden with! Some > > > > ripe, > > > > > > others not! The ripe ones we juice for immediate pleasure and > > > > succour > > > > > > and the unripe ones we pickle with patience for future > > > > (lifetimes)! > > > > > > > > > > > > And all this time we humans simply bow gratefully to the > > Deity > > > of > > > > our > > > > > > choice, in this lifetime -- thankful that it is a mango tree > > > we > > > > are > > > > > > up against and not an oak tree or cactus, for obvious > > reasons!! > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Knowing jyotish a bit, I can only add that - perhaps all > > > these > > > > > > plights > > > > > > > are karmic in nature!! Isn't it ? Unfortunately, it is > > > > compunding. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafullaji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you have observed in one of your mails that brahmins have > > > > grabbed > > > > > > > > cows, lands etc. and exploited all. this can best be > > > > described > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > your personal observation as it is not a fact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in public groups, many members strive to put forth their > > > > personal > > > > > > > > views as they observe in their experience and > > > understanding > > > > and > > > > > > > > expect general acceptance. in reality many such > > > observations > > > > are > > > > > > > > aberrations seen in isolation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > let me put some facts which none can deny: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > centuries ago brahmins never worked for a salary or > > > offered > > > > any > > > > > > > > service for a living. they used to fix muhurtams for ALL > > > > people > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > their areas, do karmakanda for ALL people and impart holy > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > and discourses to ALL besides maintaining the holiness of > > > the > > > > > > > > sanctum sanctorum of the temples and other places of > > > > > > consecration. > > > > > > > > kings, panchayat presidents or local landlords used to > > > offer > > > > land > > > > > > > > freely to these brahmins and also food grains and a cow. > > > in > > > > all > > > > > > > > karmakandas or for any auspicious happy occasions, they > > > are > > > > > > gifted > > > > > > > > few items, clothes, money etc. and all such brahmins used > > > to > > > > live > > > > > > > > 100% on donations given by the people VOLUNTARILY. these > > > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > also used to write books, teach the children of ALL > > people > > > > and > > > > > > > > entertain with their lyrical, music and dance skills > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > however, with the pogrom and forced conversion to islam > > by > > > > the > > > > > > > > invading moghuls, brahmins have taken up jobs like > > > teaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > later on in the last few decades with the rise of > > > communism > > > > and > > > > > > > > patronage by the left parties (it is a different matter > > > that > > > > the > > > > > > > > best communist country russia is now full of churches and > > > > > > leningrad > > > > > > > > becomes st. petersberg and many schools turn back to > > > churches > > > > but > > > > > > > > the indian counterparts still engage in anti religious > > > > propaganda) > > > > > > > > brahmins have been removed even from the posts of > > poojaris > > > as > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > state governemnts have started recruiting low caste non > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > unaware of any religious rituals for these holy jobs. > > > most > > > > civil > > > > > > > > servants decades ago used to be brahmins and now due to > > > > > > reservation, > > > > > > > > around 90% of government employees are non brahmins. > > > still a > > > > > > large > > > > > > > > hue and cry is made every day for the success of these > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > seeing the poor plight of these brahmins in minority, > > > > sometime > > > > > > ago > > > > > > > > mulayamsingh offered to consider a 5% reservation for > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > within my family clan, we have great freedom fighters, > > > > headmaster > > > > > > > > and principals, poets, astrologers, doctors of most > > repute > > > in > > > > US > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > 100% younger generation are in most successful in IT, > > > > engineering > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > medicine profession and it is no exaggeration if i say > > > that > > > > 99% > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > these younger intelligent generation are in US. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in many cities you would find poor brahmins who have not > > > > switched > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > other intelligent professions are still languishing in > > > > poverty. > > > > > > > > every morning i find dozens of karmakandi brahmins > > > standing > > > > or > > > > > > > > sitting on the footpath of the road in front of the > > > railway > > > > > > station > > > > > > > > waiting for some customers to pick them for their daily > > > > wages. > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > is only because they have not adapted to the professions > > > > which > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > in belief as on date and are sticking to a century old > > > holy > > > > noble > > > > > > > > profession which is not only ridiculed by the so called > > > > educated > > > > > > > > scientists but also painted bad by the communists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > having seen all this, i took it as a challenge for myself > > > to > > > > > > leave > > > > > > > > my lucrative best mnc jobs and serve all the suffering > > > people > > > > > > > > through our religious holy ways and most of my customers > > > are > > > > non > > > > > > > > brahmins and many are from other religions as i treat all > > > > human > > > > > > > > beings equally as god. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prafullaji, your observation may be restricted to few > > > > individuals > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > best, but to say that KARMAKANDI BRAHMINS exploited all > > is > > > > far > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > truth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in delhi i have seen many bihari non-brahmin migrant > > > > illiterate > > > > > > > > workers posing as poojaris and cheating the customers. > > in > > > > some > > > > > > > > temples, the watchmen and sweepers of yesteryears are now > > > > > > poojaris > > > > > > > > in the same temples which were built only for > > landgrabbing > > > > and to > > > > > > > > construct shops on all three sides and sell them for huge > > > > > > monies. > > > > > > > > most or all of thee landgrabbing mafias and illegal > > > > construction > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > done by non-brahmins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally ...? > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am born with just so few neurons, so few abilities, > > so > > > > few > > > > > > > > options, > > > > > > > > > such a little time and scope to live this lifetime! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do we have the time and ability and luxury of living > > the > > > > > > reality > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > others who would impose on us their (?) reality and > > > waste > > > > the > > > > > > > > little > > > > > > > > > time we have in this lifetime? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they even worth the consideration, after what we > > > have > > > > seen > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > far? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Very well said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I, perhaps could not express the distinction (between > > > > relgion > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > practioners). It is not the rituals (or belief > > > systems) > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > commenting about. They are "pure and acceptable" for > > > each > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > system / religion. I am not talking about > > > > rationalization of > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > these systems; and agree that they can not be black > > or > > > > white > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > These are based on faith, so rationalization (for > > > common > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > me) may be little too far stretching of it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The gray area is its practioners (for each belief > > > > system) - > > > > > > who, > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > commercial/ vested interests, misuses people's > > > > very "faith". > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > turn, creates lots of difficulties in the life of > > > masses. > > > > For > > > > > > > > > Example > > > > > > > > > > - Various ritualistic charities to brahmins (cows > > etc) > > > in > > > > > > India > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > been the biggest cause of sufferings in rural India - > > > > where > > > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > > > borrow money to meet such ritualistic needs > > (including > > > on > > > > > > deaths > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the family). These have led to massive exploitation > > as > > > > well by > > > > > > > > > > "karamkandi" brahmans, in the name of religion. > > > Religion > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > becomes > > > > > > > > > > source or cause of exploitation, but its practioners > > > do > > > > cause > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > the wrong doings. Had these practices not surfaced in > > > > India - > > > > > > > > > perhaps, > > > > > > > > > > there was no need to religious diversions (like > > > Jainism, > > > > > > Budhism, > > > > > > > > > > Sikhisms, Arya Samaj etc). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Purans / vedas / religious scriptures are not > > > corrupted, > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > practioners are. Since "faith" itself is exploited, > > > its > > > > > > > > compliance > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > becomes "gainful" for few. But those quality brahmans > > > > also do > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > exist in numbers and those people who can understand > > > the > > > > > > rituals > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > true sense also have their own limitations in current > > > > yuga. > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > often > > > > > > > > > > leads to misunderstood compliances of the rituals, in > > > > most > > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > > > (which is more harmful). Just attend any yagya, and > > > > observe > > > > > > > > > the "short > > > > > > > > > > cuts" followed - in the name of conveniences. > > > Charities > > > > are > > > > > > > > > collected, > > > > > > > > > > land mafias uses these sentiments to grab huge lands, > > > > people > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > day > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > day life are asked to do x/y/z for next life for the > > > > benefits > > > > > > > > > of "few" > > > > > > > > > > and so on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People know all these practices as well, but > > > > somehow "fear" > > > > > > > > created > > > > > > > > > > for "next life", makes them vulnerable for > > > exploitation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > > > pages" > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There will always be some 'mixing' between > > different > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > systems, > > > > > > > > > > > let us for instance take jyotish and rituals > > > > (karmakanda as > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > pointed out, though the rituals can further extend > > > into > > > > > > grey > > > > > > > > > magic > > > > > > > > > > > and black magic etc). Individuals of different > > > > background > > > > > > > > > (religious, > > > > > > > > > > > cultural, educational etc) will have different > > > > tolerances > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > acceptances of belief systems and the 'degree of > > > > > > acceptance' > > > > > > > > > > > or "degree of tolerance" would vary. No one would > > > > really be > > > > > > > > > > > completely rational ever by someone else's > > standards > > > > (this > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > general statement, so no reader should take it > > > > personally). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A rationalist would have a certain degree or > > > perimeter > > > > of > > > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > > which may be rather restricted but more readily > > > > > > demonstrable > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > rather black and white. As we move into > > > > more 'accepting' > > > > > > ways > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > thinking of reality, the perimeter would grow and > > > the > > > > > > horizon > > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > > become less and less sharp and more accpeting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When belief systems interact and clash, individuals > > > > begin > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > fight, > > > > > > > > > > > because we all must hold on to our core beliefs in > > > what > > > > we > > > > > > > > > consider > > > > > > > > > > > reality which is generally very personal though > > > there > > > > are > > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > > commonalities which lead to formation of groups. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beliefs are often at the very core of our sense of > > > self > > > > and > > > > > > > > touch > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > stir emotions, more in some, less in others, but > > > they > > > > > > always > > > > > > > > do. > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish falls in one of these perimeters where > > > reason > > > > and > > > > > > > > beliefs > > > > > > > > > > > meet. It has enough contact with rational and > > > logical > > > > > > > > > considerations > > > > > > > > > > > and thus appeals to 'rationalists' or those who > > like > > > to > > > > > > reason > > > > > > > > > things > > > > > > > > > > > out, and also has enough of a mystical/mysterious > > > > flavour > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > appeal > > > > > > > > > > > to those whose acceptance of "reality" is more > > > > forgiving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Both of these groups are observers, not necessarily > > > > knowers > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > certainly not all knowing (hence humans!) and it is > > > not > > > > a > > > > > > > > > question of > > > > > > > > > > > right or wrong, necessarily. Only God perhaps knows > > > > what is > > > > > > > > true > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > what is not or right or wrong -- and I say that > > > purely > > > > > > based > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > > > > personal belief ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is the belief system and has little to do > > > > > > with "Jyotish". > > > > > > > > > > > > Nevertheless, there is very thin line between > > > correct > > > > > > (very > > > > > > > > > small > > > > > > > > > > > > population) and wrong ones (very large > > > population). > > > > The > > > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > > is - > > > > > > > > > > > > knowledge of correct rituals, for its > > > > adherence..which is > > > > > > > > > missing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People are exploited by "karamkandi" bhramans > > > (even > > > > on > > > > > > > > events > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > > deaths), which raises the big question > > on "purity" > > > of > > > > > > > > pursuits? > > > > > > > > > Even > > > > > > > > > > > > the people who are "known" in different cities in > > > > India as > > > > > > > > > > > > authorities, are just making this their whole > > > > > > > > time "business". > > > > > > > > > > > Almost > > > > > > > > > > > > each temple, priests, remedial astrologers (???) > > > have > > > > > > made a > > > > > > > > > big > > > > > > > > > > > mess > > > > > > > > > > > > of faith. No state or city is exception !!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, you are right ..we must do and shall not > > > bother > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > > > ones. I wish I could claim (unlike most), that I > > > know > > > > the > > > > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > > Ones > > > > > > > > > > > > !!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your observation is true to some people or some > > > > temples > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > doing this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for example, grahan is such a shadowy period > > > that > > > > it is > > > > > > > > > believed > > > > > > > > > > > > > that even gods shall not have that grahan > > shadow > > > > fall > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence all temples are closed during the grahan > > > > period, > > > > > > > > nay, > > > > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > additional cloth cover is kept as an umbrella > > > for > > > > the > > > > > > > > divine > > > > > > > > > idol > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > protect from the grahan shadow. however, > > > kalahasti > > > > > > temple > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > andhra > > > > > > > > > > > > > pradesh is keeping the temple not only open > > > during > > > > the > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > time > > > > > > > > > > > > > but also doing special poojas AT MIDNIGHT > > > (somewhat > > > > > > > > strage) > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > collecting donations for these special poojas > > > > during > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since all these are expected in kaliyuga, we > > > shall > > > > keep > > > > > > > > doing > > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > > > is right without bothering too much about how > > > > others > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > doing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If one has interacted with yogis - they will > > > > > > explicitly > > > > > > > > > tell > > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > > > that, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > any of the good charities can be done any > > > given > > > > day; > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prayers. Not because that prayers / charities > > > on > > > > > > > > Eclipses > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > > > lesser > > > > > > > > > > > > > > relevance, but for the fact that, there are > > > > > > very "few" > > > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > > > knows / practices the correct and "puristic" > > > > methods > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > performing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > them. and Such people spend most of their > > time > > > in > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > > > pursuits > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (they are too occupied in their "own karma"). > > > > Most in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in making money ("Dukandari") from > > > > event > > > > > > > > driven > > > > > > > > > > > > > rituals, in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > every corner of the country on each of these > > > > > > occasions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > angel > > > > > > > > <angelgoel@> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can you suggest any particular item for daan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (donation) in this period or next day ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note:- After eclipse,next day (friday > > > morning), > > > > do > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > eat anything without taking bath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > angel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot please. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No Sir. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th Night itself start and same night > > > ends > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have mentioned eclipse would be only > > 1 > > > > hour 33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You may say as per English date since > > it > > > > ends > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12.00 midnight > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ie.next English calendar date starts, > > so > > > > will > > > > > > end > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8th morning > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.08 am. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > Manoj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sharma > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jut to clear any confusion, the lunar > > > > eclipse > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > between the intervening night of > > > > September 6th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th? Right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > REFERENCE LAHIRIS INDIAN EPHEMERIS > > > FOR > > > > 2006 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a.d. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eclipse begins on Thursday > > September > > > > 7th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at night 23.35 and ends at same > > > night > > > > on > > > > > > 25.08 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Total Duration One hour 33 minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This will be visible in India, of > > > > course no > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is advised to view this.,except > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scientist-astronomers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri Pandit Arjunji has advised > > > all > > > > > > devout > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious people, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of various religions (as added by > > > me) > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > requested > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to make full use > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of these period, by taking name of > > > > their > > > > > > Isht > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Devatas (Japa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and recitation), not to take water > > > or > > > > food > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sit on a seperate mat,not touch > > > > anything, > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bath after this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period is over,then of course go to > > > > sleep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any Japa done near the ocean (Sea), > > > near > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rivers (Ganga, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yamuna,Saraswati etc.), in temple, > > > in > > > > places > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > great masters have meditated and > > > gained > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enlightment, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also during period of Grahana > > > > (Eclipse), has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thousands fold > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of results which normally would > > > accrue > > > > to a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if he does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at other times and other places.The > > > > exact > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > figure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > counts , > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > how many thousand fold also has > > been > > > > given > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > shastras, I have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > personally read this, but now > > cannot > > > > > > remember > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and locate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefor Dear members take > > advantage > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oppurtunity > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and increase > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your spititual Bank balance, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE > > > ULTIMATE > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE > > > > BLISS. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 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Guest guest Posted September 8, 2006 Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 Respected Sir Rohini Ranjan Ji Jyotish is not dying and will never grow. It will always stay at this position where it is right now. The reason for me to say this is that FUTURE does not completely depend on Horoscope. Many different human, social, divine powers take place in the happening of any future events. These powers are different from planetary affects.... Lord Rama did not seek any astrologer before marrying Sita. Was he Stupid or Were his gurus were stupid ? Draupadi is a "kul-nashini." Why Arjun did not think before showing his prowess in the assembly for marriage ? If he would have come to see an astrologer then India might be having something different history today. If good people at that time could not trust on astrology then how can you expect that people from "Kai-yuga" will trust on it ? So it has to die BUT TILL PEOPLE HAVE UN-ANSWERABLE PAIN AND SUFFERINGS IN THEIR LIFE, ASTROLOGY WILL KEEP ON MOVING. And there is nothing "vibrant,alive," and "kicking." Astrology was never vibrant, alive and kicking and will never be. Remove the pain from this world astrology will go away within a second. How many people come in all these with their birth details and saying that they are enjoying very good health, wealth and fame ? Hope it answer Best Wishes Jagdish crystal pages <jyotish_vani (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote: Isn't that sad? And yet so invigorating, so exhilerating!! If my post does not make sense to anyone, it can only be because they did not bother to read yours! RR , "rishi_2000in" <rishi_2000in wrote: > > I would disagree, Sir, Jyotish is vibrant, alive and kicking. > Presently, this forum as also other forums are going through a patch > of time wherein knowledge, its applicability are not the focus. > But then, Jyotisha transcends time and ages. > We find young eager minds willing to explore the depths of Jyotisha > waters. We find various ingenious explanations to cover up > inadequacies of knowledge. > We witness bold experimentation as in all ages. We also observe an > irrational fear! > Rishi > > > > , "crystal pages" > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Rishi ji! > > > > As long as it is not my 'toes', Sir ;-) > > > > Seriously, though, dear friends, we are (Thank you Tanveer et al!) > > 5000+ strong and have worked on and around each other's corns and > so > > on. > > > > We know each others' sensitive spots on this forum (After all, > only a > > few dozens really have the time or interest to interact and post > here > > and care to read other participants' posts!) so I really fail to > see > > why so much angst has been spilling lately despite some very wise > and > > accomplished participation, like those offered by Arjunji, > > Ashutoshji, Prafulla, Rishi, Tatvamasiji, Prashantji,etc (where is > > Vattam Krishnanji? Anyone know of dear Krishnan ji? I do miss him > > so!!). And I am sure many others, over the years that may just be > > lurking (internet jargon, not to be taken literally!). > > > > When 5000 show up and only 15 post, it tells me plain and simple > one > > thing! > > > > ***Jyotish is DYING, if not already dead!*** > > > > PROVE ME WRONG!! I DARE YOU ALL, VOCAL AND RETICENT ONES!! > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "rishi_2000in" > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > Prafullaji, > > > That is the 'spin and the span' of Ranjanji's Jyotisha writings, > > one > > > has to be on toes always! > > > rishi > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > You are very kind, but for me *this* has always been the > reality > > > that > > > > I want it to be. > > > > > > > > If it has not served **my** dreams, maybe I was the one who > was > > > > distracted! > > > > > > > > This may not necessarily be your yard-stick or personal > > > experience, > > > > Prafulla! > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > Honest confession - Sometimes, I feel it is worth being > selfish > > > (?) > > > > > and learn the useful & rare lessons from you. I feel myself > > > lucky > > > > for > > > > > your presence here and in fact, I Joined / resumed this, > only > > > for > > > > your > > > > > presence. > > > > > > > > > > You are absolutely right..It is jyotish forum, not the forum > to > > > > > discuss religious practices. I just happen to respond to > such > > non > > > > > jyotish threads. Unfortunately, this jyotish forum is fading > its > > > > > charm, for variety of practices. I wish, forum members can > > > realize > > > > > this that there are hardly jyotish discussions on this > forum. > > > This > > > > has > > > > > become market place. > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > We grew up to come to jyotish to learn not about karma as > > > being > > > > the > > > > > > tree that is way bigger than us, at this time, and > > > > insurmountable, > > > > > > but to also see the mangoes that the tree is laden with! > Some > > > > ripe, > > > > > > others not! The ripe ones we juice for immediate pleasure > and > > > > succour > > > > > > and the unripe ones we pickle with patience for future > > > > (lifetimes)! > > > > > > > > > > > > And all this time we humans simply bow gratefully to the > > Deity > > > of > > > > our > > > > > > choice, in this lifetime -- thankful that it is a mango > tree > > > we > > > > are > > > > > > up against and not an oak tree or cactus, for obvious > > reasons!! > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Knowing jyotish a bit, I can only add that - perhaps all > > > these > > > > > > plights > > > > > > > are karmic in nature!! Isn't it ? Unfortunately, it is > > > > compunding. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafullaji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you have observed in one of your mails that brahmins > have > > > > grabbed > > > > > > > > cows, lands etc. and exploited all. this can best be > > > > described > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > your personal observation as it is not a fact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in public groups, many members strive to put forth > their > > > > personal > > > > > > > > views as they observe in their experience and > > > understanding > > > > and > > > > > > > > expect general acceptance. in reality many such > > > observations > > > > are > > > > > > > > aberrations seen in isolation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > let me put some facts which none can deny: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > centuries ago brahmins never worked for a salary or > > > offered > > > > any > > > > > > > > service for a living. they used to fix muhurtams for > ALL > > > > people > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > their areas, do karmakanda for ALL people and impart > holy > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > and discourses to ALL besides maintaining the holiness > of > > > the > > > > > > > > sanctum sanctorum of the temples and other places of > > > > > > consecration. > > > > > > > > kings, panchayat presidents or local landlords used to > > > offer > > > > land > > > > > > > > freely to these brahmins and also food grains and a > cow. > > > in > > > > all > > > > > > > > karmakandas or for any auspicious happy occasions, > they > > > are > > > > > > gifted > > > > > > > > few items, clothes, money etc. and all such brahmins > used > > > to > > > > live > > > > > > > > 100% on donations given by the people VOLUNTARILY. > these > > > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > also used to write books, teach the children of ALL > > people > > > > and > > > > > > > > entertain with their lyrical, music and dance skills > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > however, with the pogrom and forced conversion to > islam > > by > > > > the > > > > > > > > invading moghuls, brahmins have taken up jobs like > > > teaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > later on in the last few decades with the rise of > > > communism > > > > and > > > > > > > > patronage by the left parties (it is a different > matter > > > that > > > > the > > > > > > > > best communist country russia is now full of churches > and > > > > > > leningrad > > > > > > > > becomes st. petersberg and many schools turn back to > > > churches > > > > but > > > > > > > > the indian counterparts still engage in anti religious > > > > propaganda) > > > > > > > > brahmins have been removed even from the posts of > > poojaris > > > as > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > state governemnts have started recruiting low caste > non > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > unaware of any religious rituals for these holy jobs. > > > most > > > > civil > > > > > > > > servants decades ago used to be brahmins and now due > to > > > > > > reservation, > > > > > > > > around 90% of government employees are non brahmins. > > > still a > > > > > > large > > > > > > > > hue and cry is made every day for the success of these > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > seeing the poor plight of these brahmins in minority, > > > > sometime > > > > > > ago > > > > > > > > mulayamsingh offered to consider a 5% reservation for > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > within my family clan, we have great freedom fighters, > > > > headmaster > > > > > > > > and principals, poets, astrologers, doctors of most > > repute > > > in > > > > US > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > 100% younger generation are in most successful in IT, > > > > engineering > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > medicine profession and it is no exaggeration if i say > > > that > > > > 99% > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > these younger intelligent generation are in US. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in many cities you would find poor brahmins who have > not > > > > switched > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > other intelligent professions are still languishing in > > > > poverty. > > > > > > > > every morning i find dozens of karmakandi brahmins > > > standing > > > > or > > > > > > > > sitting on the footpath of the road in front of the > > > railway > > > > > > station > > > > > > > > waiting for some customers to pick them for their > daily > > > > wages. > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > is only because they have not adapted to the > professions > > > > which > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > in belief as on date and are sticking to a century old > > > holy > > > > noble > > > > > > > > profession which is not only ridiculed by the so > called > > > > educated > > > > > > > > scientists but also painted bad by the communists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > having seen all this, i took it as a challenge for > myself > > > to > > > > > > leave > > > > > > > > my lucrative best mnc jobs and serve all the suffering > > > people > > > > > > > > through our religious holy ways and most of my > customers > > > are > > > > non > > > > > > > > brahmins and many are from other religions as i treat > all > > > > human > > > > > > > > beings equally as god. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prafullaji, your observation may be restricted to few > > > > individuals > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > best, but to say that KARMAKANDI BRAHMINS exploited > all > > is > > > > far > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > truth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in delhi i have seen many bihari non-brahmin migrant > > > > illiterate > > > > > > > > workers posing as poojaris and cheating the > customers. > > in > > > > some > > > > > > > > temples, the watchmen and sweepers of yesteryears are > now > > > > > > poojaris > > > > > > > > in the same temples which were built only for > > landgrabbing > > > > and to > > > > > > > > construct shops on all three sides and sell them for > huge > > > > > > monies. > > > > > > > > most or all of thee landgrabbing mafias and illegal > > > > construction > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > done by non-brahmins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > pages" > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally ...? > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am born with just so few neurons, so few > abilities, > > so > > > > few > > > > > > > > options, > > > > > > > > > such a little time and scope to live this lifetime! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do we have the time and ability and luxury of living > > the > > > > > > reality > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > others who would impose on us their (?) reality and > > > waste > > > > the > > > > > > > > little > > > > > > > > > time we have in this lifetime? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they even worth the consideration, after what we > > > have > > > > seen > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > far? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Very well said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I, perhaps could not express the distinction > (between > > > > relgion > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > practioners). It is not the rituals (or belief > > > systems) > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > commenting about. They are "pure and acceptable" > for > > > each > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > system / religion. I am not talking about > > > > rationalization of > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > these systems; and agree that they can not be > black > > or > > > > white > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > These are based on faith, so rationalization (for > > > common > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > me) may be little too far stretching of it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The gray area is its practioners (for each belief > > > > system) - > > > > > > who, > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > commercial/ vested interests, misuses people's > > > > very "faith". > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > turn, creates lots of difficulties in the life of > > > masses. > > > > For > > > > > > > > > Example > > > > > > > > > > - Various ritualistic charities to brahmins (cows > > etc) > > > in > > > > > > India > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > been the biggest cause of sufferings in rural > India - > > > > where > > > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > > > borrow money to meet such ritualistic needs > > (including > > > on > > > > > > deaths > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the family). These have led to massive > exploitation > > as > > > > well by > > > > > > > > > > "karamkandi" brahmans, in the name of religion. > > > Religion > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > becomes > > > > > > > > > > source or cause of exploitation, but its > practioners > > > do > > > > cause > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > the wrong doings. Had these practices not surfaced > in > > > > India - > > > > > > > > > perhaps, > > > > > > > > > > there was no need to religious diversions (like > > > Jainism, > > > > > > Budhism, > > > > > > > > > > Sikhisms, Arya Samaj etc). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Purans / vedas / religious scriptures are not > > > corrupted, > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > practioners are. Since "faith" itself is > exploited, > > > its > > > > > > > > compliance > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > becomes "gainful" for few. But those quality > brahmans > > > > also do > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > exist in numbers and those people who can > understand > > > the > > > > > > rituals > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > true sense also have their own limitations in > current > > > > yuga. > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > often > > > > > > > > > > leads to misunderstood compliances of the rituals, > in > > > > most > > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > > > (which is more harmful). Just attend any yagya, > and > > > > observe > > > > > > > > > the "short > > > > > > > > > > cuts" followed - in the name of conveniences. > > > Charities > > > > are > > > > > > > > > collected, > > > > > > > > > > land mafias uses these sentiments to grab huge > lands, > > > > people > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > day > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > day life are asked to do x/y/z for next life for > the > > > > benefits > > > > > > > > > of "few" > > > > > > > > > > and so on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People know all these practices as well, but > > > > somehow "fear" > > > > > > > > created > > > > > > > > > > for "next life", makes them vulnerable for > > > exploitation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > > > pages" > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There will always be some 'mixing' between > > different > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > systems, > > > > > > > > > > > let us for instance take jyotish and rituals > > > > (karmakanda as > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > pointed out, though the rituals can further > extend > > > into > > > > > > grey > > > > > > > > > magic > > > > > > > > > > > and black magic etc). Individuals of different > > > > background > > > > > > > > > (religious, > > > > > > > > > > > cultural, educational etc) will have different > > > > tolerances > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > acceptances of belief systems and the 'degree of > > > > > > acceptance' > > > > > > > > > > > or "degree of tolerance" would vary. No one > would > > > > really be > > > > > > > > > > > completely rational ever by someone else's > > standards > > > > (this > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > general statement, so no reader should take it > > > > personally). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A rationalist would have a certain degree or > > > perimeter > > > > of > > > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > > which may be rather restricted but more readily > > > > > > demonstrable > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > rather black and white. As we move into > > > > more 'accepting' > > > > > > ways > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > thinking of reality, the perimeter would grow > and > > > the > > > > > > horizon > > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > > become less and less sharp and more accpeting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When belief systems interact and clash, > individuals > > > > begin > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > fight, > > > > > > > > > > > because we all must hold on to our core beliefs > in > > > what > > > > we > > > > > > > > > consider > > > > > > > > > > > reality which is generally very personal though > > > there > > > > are > > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > > commonalities which lead to formation of groups. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beliefs are often at the very core of our sense > of > > > self > > > > and > > > > > > > > touch > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > stir emotions, more in some, less in others, but > > > they > > > > > > always > > > > > > > > do. > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish falls in one of these perimeters where > > > reason > > > > and > > > > > > > > beliefs > > > > > > > > > > > meet. It has enough contact with rational and > > > logical > > > > > > > > > considerations > > > > > > > > > > > and thus appeals to 'rationalists' or those who > > like > > > to > > > > > > reason > > > > > > > > > things > > > > > > > > > > > out, and also has enough of a > mystical/mysterious > > > > flavour > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > appeal > > > > > > > > > > > to those whose acceptance of "reality" is more > > > > forgiving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Both of these groups are observers, not > necessarily > > > > knowers > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > certainly not all knowing (hence humans!) and it > is > > > not > > > > a > > > > > > > > > question of > > > > > > > > > > > right or wrong, necessarily. Only God perhaps > knows > > > > what is > > > > > > > > true > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > what is not or right or wrong -- and I say that > > > purely > > > > > > based > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > > > > personal belief ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is the belief system and has little to do > > > > > > with "Jyotish". > > > > > > > > > > > > Nevertheless, there is very thin line between > > > correct > > > > > > (very > > > > > > > > > small > > > > > > > > > > > > population) and wrong ones (very large > > > population). > > > > The > > > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > > is - > > > > > > > > > > > > knowledge of correct rituals, for its > > > > adherence..which is > > > > > > > > > missing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People are exploited by "karamkandi" bhramans > > > (even > > > > on > > > > > > > > events > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > > deaths), which raises the big question > > on "purity" > > > of > > > > > > > > pursuits? > > > > > > > > > Even > > > > > > > > > > > > the people who are "known" in different cities > in > > > > India as > > > > > > > > > > > > authorities, are just making this their whole > > > > > > > > time "business". > > > > > > > > > > > Almost > > > > > > > > > > > > each temple, priests, remedial astrologers > (???) > > > have > > > > > > made a > > > > > > > > > big > > > > > > > > > > > mess > > > > > > > > > > > > of faith. No state or city is exception !!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, you are right ..we must do and shall not > > > bother > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > > > ones. I wish I could claim (unlike most), that > I > > > know > > > > the > > > > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > > Ones > > > > > > > > > > > > !!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your observation is true to some people or > some > > > > temples > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > doing this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for example, grahan is such a shadowy period > > > that > > > > it is > > > > > > > > > believed > > > > > > > > > > > > > that even gods shall not have that grahan > > shadow > > > > fall > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence all temples are closed during the > grahan > > > > period, > > > > > > > > nay, > > > > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > additional cloth cover is kept as an > umbrella > > > for > > > > the > > > > > > > > divine > > > > > > > > > idol > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > protect from the grahan shadow. however, > > > kalahasti > > > > > > temple > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > andhra > > > > > > > > > > > > > pradesh is keeping the temple not only open > > > during > > > > the > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > time > > > > > > > > > > > > > but also doing special poojas AT MIDNIGHT > > > (somewhat > > > > > > > > strage) > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > collecting donations for these special > poojas > > > > during > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since all these are expected in kaliyuga, we > > > shall > > > > keep > > > > > > > > doing > > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > > > is right without bothering too much about > how > > > > others > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > doing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If one has interacted with yogis - they > will > > > > > > explicitly > > > > > > > > > tell > > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > > > that, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > any of the good charities can be done any > > > given > > > > day; > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prayers. Not because that prayers / > charities > > > on > > > > > > > > Eclipses > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > > > lesser > > > > > > > > > > > > > > relevance, but for the fact that, there > are > > > > > > very "few" > > > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > > > knows / practices the correct > and "puristic" > > > > methods > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > performing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > them. and Such people spend most of their > > time > > > in > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > > > pursuits > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (they are too occupied in their "own > karma"). > > > > Most in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in making money ("Dukandari") > from > > > > event > > > > > > > > driven > > > > > > > > > > > > > rituals, in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > every corner of the country on each of > these > > > > > > occasions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > angel > > > > > > > > <angelgoel@> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can you suggest any particular item for > daan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (donation) in this period or next day ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note:- After eclipse,next day (friday > > > morning), > > > > do > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > eat anything without taking bath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > angel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000@> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot please. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No Sir. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th Night itself start and same > night > > > ends > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have mentioned eclipse would be > only > > 1 > > > > hour 33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You may say as per English date > since > > it > > > > ends > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12.00 midnight > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ie.next English calendar date > starts, > > so > > > > will > > > > > > end > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8th morning > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.08 am. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > Manoj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sharma > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jut to clear any confusion, the > lunar > > > > eclipse > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > between the intervening night of > > > > September 6th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th? Right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > REFERENCE LAHIRIS INDIAN > EPHEMERIS > > > FOR > > > > 2006 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a.d. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eclipse begins on Thursday > > September > > > > 7th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at night 23.35 and ends at same > > > night > > > > on > > > > > > 25.08 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Total Duration One hour 33 > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This will be visible in India, > of > > > > course no > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is advised to view this.,except > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scientist-astronomers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri Pandit Arjunji has > advised > > > all > > > > > > devout > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious people, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of various religions (as added > by > > > me) > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > requested > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to make full use > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of these period, by taking name > of > > > > their > > > > > > Isht > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Devatas (Japa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and recitation), not to take > water > > > or > > > > food > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sit on a seperate mat,not touch > > > > anything, > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bath after this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period is over,then of course go > to > > > > sleep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any Japa done near the ocean > (Sea), > > > near > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rivers (Ganga, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yamuna,Saraswati etc.), in > temple, > > > in > > > > places > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > great masters have meditated and > > > gained > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enlightment, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also during period of Grahana > > > > (Eclipse), has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thousands fold > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of results which normally would > > > accrue > > > > to a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if he does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at other times and other > places.The > > > > exact > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > figure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > counts , > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > how many thousand fold also has > > been > > > > given > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > shastras, I have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > personally read this, but now > > cannot > > > > > > remember > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and locate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefor Dear members take > > advantage > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oppurtunity > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and increase > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your spititual Bank balance, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE > > > ULTIMATE > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF > ABSOLUTE > > > > BLISS. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2006 Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 Dear Sir Prathamesh/Jagdish ji, I hope you are right and Jyotish never grows! I am getting old by the message and simply HATE to have to learn any more! ;-) I have generally refrained from talking about characters from Ramayana and Mahabharata in the past when talking about astrology and modern times for a very simple reason! We need not do so, because these are different times! WE are not living ideal lives but these are the lives we are destined to live. SORRY! Unlike you, and my heart really goes out to you -- Jyotish is vibrant, kicking and alive -- if you will look around, dear friend! But have you really committed to give your all to dance its dance? If not, then you are just a bystander and not a participant! YOU HAVE HEARD OF BYSTANDER INJURY, I PRESUME? ;-) SIMPLY GET INVOLVED and WELCOME if you DO decide to! RR , Prathamesn Chawan <upaoakcrest wrote: > > Respected Sir Rohini Ranjan Ji > > Jyotish is not dying and will never grow. It will always stay at this position where it is right now. > > The reason for me to say this is that FUTURE does not completely depend on Horoscope. Many different human, social, divine powers take place in the happening of any future events. These powers are different from planetary affects.... > > Lord Rama did not seek any astrologer before marrying Sita. Was he Stupid or Were his gurus were stupid ? > > Draupadi is a "kul-nashini." Why Arjun did not think before showing his prowess in the assembly for marriage ? If he would have come to see an astrologer then India might be having something different history today. > > If good people at that time could not trust on astrology then how can you expect that people from "Kai-yuga" will trust on it ? > > So it has to die > > BUT TILL PEOPLE HAVE UN-ANSWERABLE PAIN AND SUFFERINGS IN THEIR LIFE, ASTROLOGY WILL KEEP ON MOVING. > > And there is nothing "vibrant,alive," and "kicking." Astrology was never vibrant, alive and kicking and will never be. > > Remove the pain from this world astrology will go away within a second. > > How many people come in all these with their birth details and saying that they are enjoying very good health, wealth and fame ? > > > Hope it answer > > Best Wishes > > Jagdish > > > > > > > > crystal pages <jyotish_vani wrote: > Isn't that sad? > And yet so invigorating, so exhilerating!! > > If my post does not make sense to anyone, it can only be because they > did not bother to read yours! > > RR > > , "rishi_2000in" > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > I would disagree, Sir, Jyotish is vibrant, alive and kicking. > > Presently, this forum as also other forums are going through a > patch > > of time wherein knowledge, its applicability are not the focus. > > But then, Jyotisha transcends time and ages. > > We find young eager minds willing to explore the depths of Jyotisha > > waters. We find various ingenious explanations to cover up > > inadequacies of knowledge. > > We witness bold experimentation as in all ages. We also observe an > > irrational fear! > > Rishi > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > Rishi ji! > > > > > > As long as it is not my 'toes', Sir ;-) > > > > > > Seriously, though, dear friends, we are (Thank you Tanveer et > al!) > > > 5000+ strong and have worked on and around each other's corns and > > so > > > on. > > > > > > We know each others' sensitive spots on this forum (After all, > > only a > > > few dozens really have the time or interest to interact and post > > here > > > and care to read other participants' posts!) so I really fail to > > see > > > why so much angst has been spilling lately despite some very wise > > and > > > accomplished participation, like those offered by Arjunji, > > > Ashutoshji, Prafulla, Rishi, Tatvamasiji, Prashantji,etc (where > is > > > Vattam Krishnanji? Anyone know of dear Krishnan ji? I do miss him > > > so!!). And I am sure many others, over the years that may just be > > > lurking (internet jargon, not to be taken literally!). > > > > > > When 5000 show up and only 15 post, it tells me plain and simple > > one > > > thing! > > > > > > ***Jyotish is DYING, if not already dead!*** > > > > > > PROVE ME WRONG!! I DARE YOU ALL, VOCAL AND RETICENT ONES!! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "rishi_2000in" > > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Prafullaji, > > > > That is the 'spin and the span' of Ranjanji's Jyotisha > writings, > > > one > > > > has to be on toes always! > > > > rishi > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > You are very kind, but for me *this* has always been the > > reality > > > > that > > > > > I want it to be. > > > > > > > > > > If it has not served **my** dreams, maybe I was the one who > > was > > > > > distracted! > > > > > > > > > > This may not necessarily be your yard-stick or personal > > > > experience, > > > > > Prafulla! > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Honest confession - Sometimes, I feel it is worth being > > selfish > > > > (?) > > > > > > and learn the useful & rare lessons from you. I feel myself > > > > lucky > > > > > for > > > > > > your presence here and in fact, I Joined / resumed this, > > only > > > > for > > > > > your > > > > > > presence. > > > > > > > > > > > > You are absolutely right..It is jyotish forum, not the > forum > > to > > > > > > discuss religious practices. I just happen to respond to > > such > > > non > > > > > > jyotish threads. Unfortunately, this jyotish forum is > fading > > its > > > > > > charm, for variety of practices. I wish, forum members can > > > > realize > > > > > > this that there are hardly jyotish discussions on this > > forum. > > > > This > > > > > has > > > > > > become market place. > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal pages" > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We grew up to come to jyotish to learn not about karma as > > > > being > > > > > the > > > > > > > tree that is way bigger than us, at this time, and > > > > > insurmountable, > > > > > > > but to also see the mangoes that the tree is laden with! > > Some > > > > > ripe, > > > > > > > others not! The ripe ones we juice for immediate pleasure > > and > > > > > succour > > > > > > > and the unripe ones we pickle with patience for future > > > > > (lifetimes)! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And all this time we humans simply bow gratefully to the > > > Deity > > > > of > > > > > our > > > > > > > choice, in this lifetime -- thankful that it is a mango > > tree > > > > we > > > > > are > > > > > > > up against and not an oak tree or cactus, for obvious > > > reasons!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla Gang" > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Knowing jyotish a bit, I can only add that - perhaps > all > > > > these > > > > > > > plights > > > > > > > > are karmic in nature!! Isn't it ? Unfortunately, it is > > > > > compunding. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafullaji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you have observed in one of your mails that brahmins > > have > > > > > grabbed > > > > > > > > > cows, lands etc. and exploited all. this can best be > > > > > described > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > your personal observation as it is not a fact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in public groups, many members strive to put forth > > their > > > > > personal > > > > > > > > > views as they observe in their experience and > > > > understanding > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > expect general acceptance. in reality many such > > > > observations > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > aberrations seen in isolation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > let me put some facts which none can deny: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > centuries ago brahmins never worked for a salary or > > > > offered > > > > > any > > > > > > > > > service for a living. they used to fix muhurtams for > > ALL > > > > > people > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > their areas, do karmakanda for ALL people and impart > > holy > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and discourses to ALL besides maintaining the > holiness > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > > > sanctum sanctorum of the temples and other places of > > > > > > > consecration. > > > > > > > > > kings, panchayat presidents or local landlords used > to > > > > offer > > > > > land > > > > > > > > > freely to these brahmins and also food grains and a > > cow. > > > > in > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > karmakandas or for any auspicious happy occasions, > > they > > > > are > > > > > > > gifted > > > > > > > > > few items, clothes, money etc. and all such brahmins > > used > > > > to > > > > > live > > > > > > > > > 100% on donations given by the people VOLUNTARILY. > > these > > > > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > > also used to write books, teach the children of ALL > > > people > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > entertain with their lyrical, music and dance skills > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > however, with the pogrom and forced conversion to > > islam > > > by > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > invading moghuls, brahmins have taken up jobs like > > > > teaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > later on in the last few decades with the rise of > > > > communism > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > patronage by the left parties (it is a different > > matter > > > > that > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > best communist country russia is now full of churches > > and > > > > > > > leningrad > > > > > > > > > becomes st. petersberg and many schools turn back to > > > > churches > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > the indian counterparts still engage in anti > religious > > > > > propaganda) > > > > > > > > > brahmins have been removed even from the posts of > > > poojaris > > > > as > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > state governemnts have started recruiting low caste > > non > > > > > brahmins > > > > > > > > > unaware of any religious rituals for these holy > jobs. > > > > most > > > > > civil > > > > > > > > > servants decades ago used to be brahmins and now due > > to > > > > > > > reservation, > > > > > > > > > around 90% of government employees are non brahmins. > > > > still a > > > > > > > large > > > > > > > > > hue and cry is made every day for the success of > these > > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > > seeing the poor plight of these brahmins in minority, > > > > > sometime > > > > > > > ago > > > > > > > > > mulayamsingh offered to consider a 5% reservation for > > > > > brahmins. > > > > > > > > > within my family clan, we have great freedom > fighters, > > > > > headmaster > > > > > > > > > and principals, poets, astrologers, doctors of most > > > repute > > > > in > > > > > US > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > 100% younger generation are in most successful in IT, > > > > > engineering > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > medicine profession and it is no exaggeration if i > say > > > > that > > > > > 99% > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > these younger intelligent generation are in US. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in many cities you would find poor brahmins who have > > not > > > > > switched > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > other intelligent professions are still languishing > in > > > > > poverty. > > > > > > > > > every morning i find dozens of karmakandi brahmins > > > > standing > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > sitting on the footpath of the road in front of the > > > > railway > > > > > > > station > > > > > > > > > waiting for some customers to pick them for their > > daily > > > > > wages. > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > is only because they have not adapted to the > > professions > > > > > which > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > in belief as on date and are sticking to a century > old > > > > holy > > > > > noble > > > > > > > > > profession which is not only ridiculed by the so > > called > > > > > educated > > > > > > > > > scientists but also painted bad by the communists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > having seen all this, i took it as a challenge for > > myself > > > > to > > > > > > > leave > > > > > > > > > my lucrative best mnc jobs and serve all the > suffering > > > > people > > > > > > > > > through our religious holy ways and most of my > > customers > > > > are > > > > > non > > > > > > > > > brahmins and many are from other religions as i treat > > all > > > > > human > > > > > > > > > beings equally as god. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prafullaji, your observation may be restricted to few > > > > > individuals > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > best, but to say that KARMAKANDI BRAHMINS exploited > > all > > > is > > > > > far > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > truth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in delhi i have seen many bihari non-brahmin migrant > > > > > illiterate > > > > > > > > > workers posing as poojaris and cheating the > > customers. > > > in > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > temples, the watchmen and sweepers of yesteryears are > > now > > > > > > > poojaris > > > > > > > > > in the same temples which were built only for > > > landgrabbing > > > > > and to > > > > > > > > > construct shops on all three sides and sell them for > > huge > > > > > > > monies. > > > > > > > > > most or all of thee landgrabbing mafias and illegal > > > > > construction > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > done by non-brahmins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > > pages" > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally ...? > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am born with just so few neurons, so few > > abilities, > > > so > > > > > few > > > > > > > > > options, > > > > > > > > > > such a little time and scope to live this lifetime! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do we have the time and ability and luxury of > living > > > the > > > > > > > reality > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > others who would impose on us their (?) reality and > > > > waste > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > little > > > > > > > > > > time we have in this lifetime? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they even worth the consideration, after what > we > > > > have > > > > > seen > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > far? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ranjan ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Very well said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I, perhaps could not express the distinction > > (between > > > > > relgion > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > practioners). It is not the rituals (or belief > > > > systems) > > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > > commenting about. They are "pure and acceptable" > > for > > > > each > > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > > system / religion. I am not talking about > > > > > rationalization of > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > these systems; and agree that they can not be > > black > > > or > > > > > white > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > These are based on faith, so rationalization (for > > > > common > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > me) may be little too far stretching of it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The gray area is its practioners (for each belief > > > > > system) - > > > > > > > who, > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > commercial/ vested interests, misuses people's > > > > > very "faith". > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > turn, creates lots of difficulties in the life of > > > > masses. > > > > > For > > > > > > > > > > Example > > > > > > > > > > > - Various ritualistic charities to brahmins (cows > > > etc) > > > > in > > > > > > > India > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > been the biggest cause of sufferings in rural > > India - > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > > > > borrow money to meet such ritualistic needs > > > (including > > > > on > > > > > > > deaths > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > the family). These have led to massive > > exploitation > > > as > > > > > well by > > > > > > > > > > > "karamkandi" brahmans, in the name of religion. > > > > Religion > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > becomes > > > > > > > > > > > source or cause of exploitation, but its > > practioners > > > > do > > > > > cause > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > the wrong doings. Had these practices not > surfaced > > in > > > > > India - > > > > > > > > > > perhaps, > > > > > > > > > > > there was no need to religious diversions (like > > > > Jainism, > > > > > > > Budhism, > > > > > > > > > > > Sikhisms, Arya Samaj etc). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Purans / vedas / religious scriptures are not > > > > corrupted, > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > practioners are. Since "faith" itself is > > exploited, > > > > its > > > > > > > > > compliance > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > > becomes "gainful" for few. But those quality > > brahmans > > > > > also do > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > exist in numbers and those people who can > > understand > > > > the > > > > > > > rituals > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > true sense also have their own limitations in > > current > > > > > yuga. > > > > > > > This > > > > > > > > > > often > > > > > > > > > > > leads to misunderstood compliances of the > rituals, > > in > > > > > most > > > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > > > > (which is more harmful). Just attend any yagya, > > and > > > > > observe > > > > > > > > > > the "short > > > > > > > > > > > cuts" followed - in the name of conveniences. > > > > Charities > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > collected, > > > > > > > > > > > land mafias uses these sentiments to grab huge > > lands, > > > > > people > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > day > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > day life are asked to do x/y/z for next life for > > the > > > > > benefits > > > > > > > > > > of "few" > > > > > > > > > > > and so on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People know all these practices as well, but > > > > > somehow "fear" > > > > > > > > > created > > > > > > > > > > > for "next life", makes them vulnerable for > > > > exploitation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "crystal > > > > pages" > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Prafulla, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There will always be some 'mixing' between > > > different > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > systems, > > > > > > > > > > > > let us for instance take jyotish and rituals > > > > > (karmakanda as > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > > pointed out, though the rituals can further > > extend > > > > into > > > > > > > grey > > > > > > > > > > magic > > > > > > > > > > > > and black magic etc). Individuals of different > > > > > background > > > > > > > > > > (religious, > > > > > > > > > > > > cultural, educational etc) will have different > > > > > tolerances > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > > acceptances of belief systems and the 'degree > of > > > > > > > acceptance' > > > > > > > > > > > > or "degree of tolerance" would vary. No one > > would > > > > > really be > > > > > > > > > > > > completely rational ever by someone else's > > > standards > > > > > (this > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > general statement, so no reader should take it > > > > > personally). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A rationalist would have a certain degree or > > > > perimeter > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > belief > > > > > > > > > > > > which may be rather restricted but more readily > > > > > > > demonstrable > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > rather black and white. As we move into > > > > > more 'accepting' > > > > > > > ways > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > thinking of reality, the perimeter would grow > > and > > > > the > > > > > > > horizon > > > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > > > become less and less sharp and more accpeting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When belief systems interact and clash, > > individuals > > > > > begin > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > fight, > > > > > > > > > > > > because we all must hold on to our core beliefs > > in > > > > what > > > > > we > > > > > > > > > > consider > > > > > > > > > > > > reality which is generally very personal though > > > > there > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > > > commonalities which lead to formation of groups. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beliefs are often at the very core of our sense > > of > > > > self > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > touch > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > stir emotions, more in some, less in others, > but > > > > they > > > > > > > always > > > > > > > > > do. > > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish falls in one of these perimeters where > > > > reason > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > beliefs > > > > > > > > > > > > meet. It has enough contact with rational and > > > > logical > > > > > > > > > > considerations > > > > > > > > > > > > and thus appeals to 'rationalists' or those who > > > like > > > > to > > > > > > > reason > > > > > > > > > > things > > > > > > > > > > > > out, and also has enough of a > > mystical/mysterious > > > > > flavour > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > appeal > > > > > > > > > > > > to those whose acceptance of "reality" is more > > > > > forgiving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Both of these groups are observers, not > > necessarily > > > > > knowers > > > > > > > or > > > > > > > > > > > > certainly not all knowing (hence humans!) and > it > > is > > > > not > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > question of > > > > > > > > > > > > right or wrong, necessarily. Only God perhaps > > knows > > > > > what is > > > > > > > > > true > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > what is not or right or wrong -- and I say that > > > > purely > > > > > > > based > > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > > > > > personal belief ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pandit Arjun ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is the belief system and has little to do > > > > > > > with "Jyotish". > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nevertheless, there is very thin line between > > > > correct > > > > > > > (very > > > > > > > > > > small > > > > > > > > > > > > > population) and wrong ones (very large > > > > population). > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > > > is - > > > > > > > > > > > > > knowledge of correct rituals, for its > > > > > adherence..which is > > > > > > > > > > missing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > People are exploited by "karamkandi" bhramans > > > > (even > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > events > > > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > > > > > > deaths), which raises the big question > > > on "purity" > > > > of > > > > > > > > > pursuits? > > > > > > > > > > Even > > > > > > > > > > > > > the people who are "known" in different > cities > > in > > > > > India as > > > > > > > > > > > > > authorities, are just making this their whole > > > > > > > > > time "business". > > > > > > > > > > > > Almost > > > > > > > > > > > > > each temple, priests, remedial astrologers > > (???) > > > > have > > > > > > > made a > > > > > > > > > > big > > > > > > > > > > > > mess > > > > > > > > > > > > > of faith. No state or city is exception !!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, you are right ..we must do and shall not > > > > bother > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > > > > > > ones. I wish I could claim (unlike most), > that > > I > > > > know > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > correct > > > > > > > > > > > > Ones > > > > > > > > > > > > > !!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "panditarjun2004" > > > > > > > > > > > > > <panditarjun2004@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear prafulla ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your observation is true to some people or > > some > > > > > temples > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > doing this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for example, grahan is such a shadowy > period > > > > that > > > > > it is > > > > > > > > > > believed > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that even gods shall not have that grahan > > > shadow > > > > > fall > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hence all temples are closed during the > > grahan > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > nay, > > > > > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > > additional cloth cover is kept as an > > umbrella > > > > for > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > divine > > > > > > > > > > idol > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > protect from the grahan shadow. however, > > > > kalahasti > > > > > > > temple > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > andhra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pradesh is keeping the temple not only open > > > > during > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > > time > > > > > > > > > > > > > > but also doing special poojas AT MIDNIGHT > > > > (somewhat > > > > > > > > > strage) > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > collecting donations for these special > > poojas > > > > > during > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > grahan > > > > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > since all these are expected in kaliyuga, > we > > > > shall > > > > > keep > > > > > > > > > doing > > > > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is right without bothering too much about > > how > > > > > others > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > doing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > with best wishes > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pandit arjun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "Prafulla > > > > > > > Gang" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If one has interacted with yogis - they > > will > > > > > > > explicitly > > > > > > > > > > tell > > > > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > any of the good charities can be done any > > > > given > > > > > day; > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > prayers. Not because that prayers / > > charities > > > > on > > > > > > > > > Eclipses > > > > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > lesser > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > relevance, but for the fact that, there > > are > > > > > > > very "few" > > > > > > > > > > people - > > > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > knows / practices the correct > > and "puristic" > > > > > methods > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > performing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > them. and Such people spend most of their > > > time > > > > in > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > own > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pursuits > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (they are too occupied in their "own > > karma"). > > > > > Most in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > lot > > > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in making money ("Dukandari") > > from > > > > > event > > > > > > > > > driven > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rituals, in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > every corner of the country on each of > > these > > > > > > > occasions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > angel > > > > > > > > > <angelgoel@> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can you suggest any particular item for > > daan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (donation) in this period or next day ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Note:- After eclipse,next day (friday > > > > morning), > > > > > do > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > eat anything without taking bath. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > angel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Manoj Sharma <manojsharma662000@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks a lot please. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No Sir. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th Night itself start and same > > night > > > > ends > > > > > > > itself, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have mentioned eclipse would be > > only > > > 1 > > > > > hour 33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You may say as per English date > > since > > > it > > > > > ends > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12.00 midnight > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ie.next English calendar date > > starts, > > > so > > > > > will > > > > > > > end > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8th morning > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.08 am. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > Manoj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sharma > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <manojsharma662000@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jut to clear any confusion, the > > lunar > > > > > eclipse > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > between the intervening night of > > > > > September 6th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7th? Right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Bhaskar <bhaskar_jyotish@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > REFERENCE LAHIRIS INDIAN > > EPHEMERIS > > > > FOR > > > > > 2006 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a.d. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eclipse begins on Thursday > > > September > > > > > 7th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at night 23.35 and ends at same > > > > night > > > > > on > > > > > > > 25.08 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Total Duration One hour 33 > > minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This will be visible in India, > > of > > > > > course no > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > one > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is advised to view this.,except > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scientist-astronomers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri Pandit Arjunji has > > advised > > > > all > > > > > > > devout > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious people, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of various religions (as added > > by > > > > me) > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > requested > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to make full use > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of these period, by taking name > > of > > > > > their > > > > > > > Isht > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Devatas (Japa > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and recitation), not to take > > water > > > > or > > > > > food > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sit on a seperate mat,not touch > > > > > anything, > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bath after this > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > period is over,then of course > go > > to > > > > > sleep > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > after > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any Japa done near the ocean > > (Sea), > > > > near > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > religious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rivers (Ganga, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yamuna,Saraswati etc.), in > > temple, > > > > in > > > > > places > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > great masters have meditated > and > > > > gained > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > enlightment, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also during period of Grahana > > > > > (Eclipse), has > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thousands fold > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > of results which normally would > > > > accrue > > > > > to a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if he does > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at other times and other > > places.The > > > > > exact > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > figure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > counts , > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > how many thousand fold also has > > > been > > > > > given > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > shastras, I have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > personally read this, but now > > > cannot > > > > > > > remember > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and locate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Therefor Dear members take > > > advantage > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > oppurtunity > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and increase > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your spititual Bank balance, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE > > > > ULTIMATE > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF > > ABSOLUTE > > > > > BLISS. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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